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Synaptic Dropped From Ubuntu 11.10
An anonymous reader links to a story at Techie Buzz according to which (quoting): "When Canonical started developing the Ubuntu Software Center, I knew that a time will come when it will completely replace Synaptic. The Software Center is a noob-friendly replacement for Synaptic where users can discover new applications more easily. Unexpectedly, Canonical has decided that it is time for the Software Center to replace Synaptic as well. So, in the next daily build of Ubuntu 11.10, Synaptic will no longer be installed by default. The Ubuntu Software Center still lacks many important features that are present in Synaptic."
What's up with the purple bass clef?
I could stand Unity, but this is too much.
In soviet russia the government regulates the companies.
As long as you can install it from the Software Center, I don't see a problem. Did they need the space for something else on the ISO?
There is a war going on for your mind.
The Debian users are going to be pissed..
So. First there is dpkg. Upon dpkg stands APT, for your greater ease and convenience. Upon APT stands synaptic, for your GUI-based package management needs.
Yeah, I'm just not really surprised that somebody might attempt to replace the easy, graphical, user-friendly tool at the end of this particular chain with one that they believe is easier, more user-friendly, or whatever. The tool being deprecated essentially filled the same niche, and the whole lot rests upon the same fundamental architecture.
I think its a good decision. The public for which Ubuntu is intended has no use whatsoever for Synaptic. Other users are an apt-get away from it, and I think thats just fine.
Disclaimer: I never liked synaptic, mainly because for me its interface rendered it totally unuseful because it was hideous and not really well designed, plus it was easier for me to just apt-get.
I still use apt-get because its faster, but I think anyone can just pick up the software center and use it, unlike synaptic which I think is very confusing for noobs or even newcomers which are familiar with apt tools.
Does anyone really use synaptic instead of the software center for a GUI view?
I normally stick to aptitude, but have used the software center some and am just not sure what losing synaptic would harm. Anything that is only found there is likely software no GUI user will really ever need.
As long as it can still be installed easily, it shouldn't be a big problem.
If you want it, you've got it.
$ sudo apt-get install synaptic
Done.
When they started doing this kind of fascist crap I just moved to Gentoo.
Fell in love with it the first day[1].
[1]Let's call it a week, as it was a while before it was fully installed and configured!
Have you heard about SoylentNews?
apt-get and aptitude users won't as they don't know how to use synaptic; at least I don't.
I do NOT use Unity.
Making it harder by making it simpler.
not so much. At least, not for the average user.
Honestly, what is installed by default is the noob-selection, so a noob-grade packet manager is perfectly adequate. As long as you can "apt-get install" the other packet managers, where is the problem?
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
Honestly I don't use either Synaptic or the Software Center. I do it all on the command-line using apt-cache and apt-get.
So far I can work around all of Canonical's crazy decisions. I forced myself to quit using Gnome 2.32 (aka Ubuntu Classic) and use Xfce instead to prepare for 11.10. I have to say that I have gotten used to Xfce and really like it.
I really don't feel like migrating my home boxes from Ubuntu unless I absolutely have to do so. The day Ubuntu prevents me from working around their craziness is the day I finally jump ship.
So uninstall Unity or just use what ever window manager you used before and apt-get synaptic.
Defaults are for noobs.
I started using Ubuntu about 3 years ago with 8.04. At one point, I upgraded to 9.04. Now I am living comfortable on 10.04. Across those three years and three editions I have heard Ubuntu talk about changing it's primary display configuration engine (X/Xorg to Wayland), it's default browser (Firefox to Chrome), its network managment utility (I'll admit, this one needed fixing), and a host of other tweaks. Now Ubuntu wants to ditch Synaptic for the Ubuntu Software Center.
I get that software moves fast, and buggy software needs to be fixed and replaced with less-buggy software. But wholesale gutting of some of the fundamental portions of an OS (as seen from the user side) every 6 months to a year is a little extreme. What was wrong with Synaptic that it needs replacing? I like it. It seems pretty sraightforward and functional.I don't mean to gripe, but does Canonical really need to replace utilities that its users have gotten used to when the original utilities worked equally well (Pidjin to Empathy? etc.).
Yeah, yeah, I can just install all of the old legacy sofware that I like, but it just seems so odd to uproot basic default utilities so regularly.
Motorcycles, Robots, Space Gossip and More!
The excuse given for dropping Synaptic is to make space on the CD, but I remember reading somewhere fairly trustworthy that 11.04 would be the last release as a CD ISO, and the next release (11.10) would be a DVD iso.
Continuing to require Ubuntu to only be released as a CD-sized ISO is a backward step IMHO. At least also provide a DVD image. They've already pushed the size limit of the ISO so much that you can't even use conventional 650mb CDRs or even 80 minute CD/RWs, you specifically need an 80-minute CDR.
These days CDR has been practically obsoleted by DVD+/-R(W) and writeable blu-ray. I wish Ubuntu would make the jump. I personally find it very inconvenient to have to keep a stock of 80 minute blank CDRs around just for ubuntu releases. It feels as bad as having to keep floppy disks around. Everything else I do I use blank DVDs or blu-rays for.
It seems to me a more likely reason for dropping Synaptic is that the marketing minds behind Ubuntu are gradually eliminating support for those pesky power users. If true this is the same massively broken thinking that makes Windows such a pain in the ass to use for anyone trying to do anything remotely technical. I mean what the F*** are they thinking with that horribly inefficient unity interface?
Having the power to efficiently and directly do what I need to with as few keystrokes/clicks as possible, and avoiding being forced to use a series of dumbed-down and limited tools that automatically assume you're ignorant and stupid is why I chose to use Linux over Windows in the first place. Unfortunately the road Ubuntu is on seems to be remarkably similar to Microsoft in assuming users can't possibly know enough to be trusted with a powerful tool.
Any more dumbing down of Ubuntu and I for one will be dropping it.
Its the future, I've seen it. In fact I'm typing this on it.
Seriously, Synaptic might not be that useful for some people but when I first came to Linux, it saved my life a few times.
I didn't know enough to be comfortable using apt-get at the time. It eases the learning curve.
Defaults are for people who expect things to work out of the box.
That's why we have cool expressions like Plug'N'Play, Out Of The Box, and Default.
Having to change things is what we call "a tinkerer's dream" or "Hacker's toolbox."
Sure, you can do it.
But it's a barrier to adoption.
Don't hit "REPLY". That's the newb way. View the source, figure out the link, and go use CURL. That's not the newb way.
E
Things do work out of the box, so those people will not be disappointed at all. They are just not to your preference.
This is not breaking anything, only changing the default.
As much as I love Ubuntu, I get the feeling that Canonical has "jumped the shark".. First going to Unity, which IMO sucks majorly, and now dropping Synaptic.. Even if its still available, if its not the default package manager, the development of it will *eventually* stop..
THANK YOU, Edward Snowden!! Americans owe you a debt of gratitude (whether they know it or not..)
I thought Unity sucked the first time I saw it. It still has defects, but having used it for a couple of months, it works, and it's not too bad.
Synaptic as always worked fine, and doesn't need replacing. But if Canonical is changing it for something else, they need to make sure they don't lose functionality, otherwise they'll lose their best marketing tool — the people who like Ubuntu and proselytise it well.
Unfortunately, Canonical is going the way of so many companies, becoming arrogant and thinking they know best, regardless. They need to develop some humility.
If you know about it, you know how to install it.
I admit it wouldn't be a dealbreaker for me, it's easy enough to get Synaptic back... but it's still an annoyance. I'm one of those people who unfortunately can't download 650MB+ of an .ISO on a whim (have a low-cap ISP so I have to wait until nearly midnight before the caps temporarily go away). The idea of downloading a DVD-sized .ISO makes me cringe. So it'd far sooner be the increasing size that prevents me from snagging Ubuntu... except it already has, since my monitor complains about "no signal" during the installation process. With ol' reliable Gnome 2 fading away, looks like I'll have to go with some XFCE flavor of Ubuntu or a different distribution.
Ideally the distribution I'd want is one with Gnome 2, a browser, common stuff I wouldn't think to look for (like wireless connectivity and working with NTFS drives), and a Debian package repository. That way I could choose all the stuff I want. But as far as I know, no distribution exists for that. You're always going to be stuck with a bunch of default software. Nice for most people. But it's more stuff I have to uninstall later.
I'm not an Ubuntu user, but this seems like a good move to me.
It'll make the system more approachable for new users, and anyone who needs the fancy extra features shouldn't be using a GUI in the first place.
Serious linux geeks do package management from the command line.
Um, I'm sorry. Is the Linux community still under the impression that any of their distros are used by noobs? Sillly Linux folks.
You can make Linux more user friendly than a Mac if you want, but that won't make "noobs" flock to it. By virtue of them being a noob prevents them from reformatting their perfectly working Windows computer and throwing Linux on there. It takes at least a Linux fanboy friend/relative to do that.
>If you want it, you've got it.
>$ sudo apt-get install synaptic
No. The reality and the point is that each new generation won't know about it, but will use the new shiny default "tool." Synaptic use will thus go down.
Equally, good software enforces best practices. While the dream of an Ubuntu Desktop is one thing, lowering the complexity of the software installation process lowers the intelligence bar for using *nix, which in the end, lowers the chance that the users will ever get as far as #, much less #sudo apt-get.
Any more dumbing down of Ubuntu and I for one will be dropping it.
If you're worried about dumbing down then you shouldn't have ever been using Ubuntu in the first place.
The kind of people I know IRL who hate Ubuntu's more recent decisions are usually the kind of folks who don't get how most folks work. Unity is absolutely fantastic to everyone I know who is not trying to pretend to be a l337 power user or keep up their street cred in conversations. For people who need to get stuff done and hate using poor interfaces, Ubuntu has done the right thing every time. GIMP is hard to use and not something a novice would enjoy anyway. Synaptic has always been an ugly cluttered mess and it has zero advantage over CLI tools. Shotwell is just as good as any other photo program. Gwibber is meh and isn't really all that good looking but it is solid and it hurts nobody to have social networking apps built in. Empathy's only weakness is lack of OTR and someone who knows what OTR is can figure out how to install Pidgin. Canonical is very savvy and most "nerds" I know simply are not. Their computers are very idiosyncratic, they talk down to "normal people" in technical conversations, and advertise regularly how iconoclastic they are to prove their individuality. We fucking get it already. Stop complaining about Ubuntu: IT. IS. FREE. It is non-compulsory. It is the most successful attempt to bring free software to the masses because it does exactly the opposite of what an anti-social pompous prick would do when designing computer software: it really emphasizes the human element.
They want to goto a "Linux appstore" and download angry birds. Maybe even download "20in1 Hack Tools" and join lulzsec too heheh.
..but not 'dropped' from the repositories. Somewhat misleading inflammatory suggestion we have here.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Another "x dropped from Ubuntu" post, another mass ragequit from the hive mind.
Ten years ago, nobody complained about the default installation profile of Linux distributions. If you were geeky enough to use Linux, then you knew how to use package managers and could maybe even configure and make something from source. Now everyone wants their preferred DE and pre-selected apps handed to them on a platter, as if they reinstalled their OS every fucking week. If the default package list is a deal breaker for you when choosing a distribution, then you need to reevaluate why you are using Linux to begin with. And no, you probably won't find yourself welcome in the Gentoo/LFS communities either because they dropped this grievance long ago.
What I want out of a Linux distro:
(1) Something Debian based (mainly due to my familiarity with apt and Debian systems)
(2) Something with modern enhancements for a desktop system (e.g. pre-patched font libraries so they have proper hinting and don't look like ass)
(3) Something which supports PPA or other external repos so I can remain as up to day as possible with the latest software (official repos are frozen bar security updates).
(4) Something which has out-of-the-box functionality for power users as well as regular users (there's no reason why you can't have both). No reason why you should have to live with a neutered DE like Unity when it should be more configurable for example.
It's a pity that Ubuntu is moving away from this. Every version seems to require further post-configuration from it before I'm satisfied - out-of-the-box settings are no longer optimal. On the other hand, Debian lacks PPAs and I have no idea how to get good looking font rendering compiled on that thing. Linux Mint is the closest option so far, but I'd prefer a straight Ubuntu distro for reasons of compatibility. All these changes between Ubuntu versions seem to be less about genuine improvements and more of a test to see what new features stick, and use the community as beta testers. And worst of all, Mark S has shown no interest in listing to the community. Global menus would be fine if they didn't frigging HIDE all the time, yet the automatic hiding feature will remain apparently despite wide complaints.
I WANT to use Linux, but I hate this shit of not finding something I like.
I've used Ubuntu Linux for some years now. I've tried many, many other flavors of Linux but Ubuntu is still my favorite. I saw the comment about Unity, I hate it as well. It is not simple, not intuitive, and just basically sucks on many levels. I do use Synaptic as I find The Software Center pretty much useless and the number of programs I've installed from it, I can count on one hand. It looks like some kind generic trash program in my opinion and the number of programs available thru it are extremely limited. (I've even had programs that would not work thru it and addresses it refused to accept and keys it refused to use.) Yes Synaptic can be harder to learn but is a much more complete program and I prefer it over the Software Center by a extremely wide margin. That said, yes I also use apt-get and apt-update as well. The program selection that can be used with it is huge. Far larger than Synaptic or The Software Center. But you have to add addresses, keys and know the proper procedures to implement it properly. Which is not a easy feat for many new Linux users. I for one will be adding Synaptic back into my 11.10 Ubuntu install when it comes online. OK rant off. :)
I'm old, not dead. Well that's my 2 cents worth, your mileage may vary. I say what I think, not what you want to hear.
Why should we care if users get as far as $ sudo apt-get? The point is that they're on the platform. You can't ask for both mass-market acceptance and exposed complexity. If you keep the exposed complexity, the mass market won't want it. At least Shuttleworth seems to get this. I know that everyone's down on Ubuntu lately for "changing things" but, honestly, if they've done due diligence and run these changes past some focus groups full of people who haven't used Linux before, they're probably going to get more adoption out of the changes.
If the UI is simpler, it's still *possible* to get the old UI back, and they get more adoption out of it, that's awesome. It means more market penetration for Linux.
Users who want more power will search the web and find tutorials. The tutorials will tell them about other software or the command line, and they'll either retain and explore, or they'll give up. Either way, many of these users are the ones who wouldn't have tried Linux before Ubuntu and, as Ubuntu keeps getting simpler to use, they're the ones who will recommend Ubuntu to all the people that we haven't reached.
I'm fine with Ubuntu being "dumbed down" as long as I can smarten it up from the command line.
P.S. Why would you bother to sudo from a root shell? (# is root, $ is user)
I switched to Kubuntu from Ubuntu back at 9.10. I kept using Synaptic until just recently.
More Slashdot prattle about Ubuntu.
Canonical has made many drastic changes in the last few releases. The Software Center has been around for a while now. "Add/Remove Software" (gnome-app-install) was, arguably, replaced a little earlier than it should have. You might have complained or heard others complain about the switch. At that point of time, I felt that add/remove should have remained the default for one more cycle. However, the Software Center improved very rapidly and it wasn't very long after the switch that it was hard to argue against removing "Add/Remove Software". The Software Center is now miles ahead of its predecessor.
Unity seems to be following the same course. Many had argued waiting at least one more release cycle before making Unity default. However, I think that Canonical sees this as an opportunity understand the direction in which people want to see Unity go, giving Canonical enough time to iron out issues and make Unity acceptable, at the very least, if not elegant and beautiful by the time they release the LTS.
Canonical seems to be focusing its efforts on getting finished products into LTS releases by prematurely including (and making default) new software and concepts in regular releases giving them a larger audience to test their proposed ideas. Come December/January, Canonical will have a very good idea as where Unity, the Software Center and their other new products are going to be so that they can be confident of making 12.04 a polished and finished release. While this may not work out exactly as expected, it appears as if this is the basic idea behind their planning and development.
is that it doesn't list all the aps Synaptic does
At that point, you just switch to Debian.
Why? They still have "dselect" with its intuitive interface (s /), not to mention this "aptitude" thing that I keep hearing about.
Why do we need all these different GUIs anyway?
It's interesting to read the responses to this post... the consensus of which seems to be, "Who cares? You can always install it".
In the past, I've seen Slashdot go ape-shit because the window controls were moved from the right to the left. People are incensed about an auto-hide launcher bar on the left side of the screen. Then Canonical basically replaces their decent apt wrapper with a dumbed-down version of the Apple App Store... and people barely shrug.
I just don't get it anymore. I'm in my mid-30's, and feel like an old man. I simply don't understand OS or UI design best practices in the year 2011, or how people today come about the preferences that they have. Personally, I'm the opposite from the majority here. Bring on the appley-googley imitation crap if you must... I adjust pretty quickly to minor cosmetic changes intended to keep things fresh. However, I get frustrated by rapid changes to the defaults of actual system management.
If there were a distribution which leveraged Ubuntu's excellent apt repository, yet was intended for power users (rather than dumbed-down even further like Mint), then I would jump ship in 5 minutes. Yeah, I can change all this stuff manually in Ubuntu... but defaults matter. Why would I want to spend a freaking hour trying to make every new install act like Hardy Heron?
Piss on the people who have been using the distro forever a little more, why doncha?
This signature has Super Cow Powers
I am not upgrading Ubuntu from 10.04 anymore, I am a gentooer henceforth, its getting too bureaucratic.
This bothers me for so many obvious reasons. Linux, at least in my opinion, shouldn't be "easy" to use, at least not in the traditional sense of the word. Using Linux should require a degree of technical skill, even the kind that can be gleaned from simply using `man`. I really don't want to see an influx of people who think they're "cool" because they run Ubuntu. I guess there's always UNIX, *BSD and the Gentoo- and Arch-like distributions, but... eh. It just doesn't feel right.
"...the number of UNIX installations has grown to 10, with more expected..." - Dennis Ritchie/Ken Thompson, 1972
It's been a while since I've used Ubuntu; but I don't know what the fuss is. Whenever I was on Ubuntu, I'd try synaptic, get disgusted, and then drop down to the console and use apt-get. Did Synaptic get more comprehensive and efficient while I was gone?
What does surprise me is the vitriol that's being spewed about it here. If you feel a compelling need to think of yourself as some sort of hardcore Linux geek, just get yourself another distro. As a hardcore Linux geek, you should know they're out there (you might even know where to get them). Ubuntu is not intended for the hardcore user (it's hardly a bare-bones distro) - quite the opposite, in fact.
And I have to admit I'm confused by all the Linux wizards here who are so hardcore they feel they must have Synaptic, but are simultaneously outraged by the fact that they have to type 'sudo apt-get install' into a terminal in order to get it.
sudo apt-get remove ubuntu*
The squashfs image that is casper/filesystem.squashfs is already compressed with LZMA. Even initrd is compressed with LZMA. I would guess compressing the whole iSO would not shrink it by much more...
I ain't broken why fix it. Non sense.
There is a masterplan at work here.
The casual and noob users will be offered something really simple, with everything set up by default - so they can get accustomed to new platform. This is a ticket in. When you get more experienced, than you can start tweaking it or move to another distro.
Dumb it down even more. Remove anything than 3-year-old can't use. 2 apps for music playback? One to many. Video player? Works with any kind of format that you can throw at it. If not, do a next->next->finish upgrade. More games by default. Simplify, simplify, simplify. Rinse. Repeat.
Goal? Make it more easy than Mac to use. SCSB (Start Computer, Shutdown Brain) users are a market to aim for
The search function in Synaptic is better !!!
Making room in the ISO is not a valid argument, because USB drives and SD cards have replaced CD burning long ago. Even the poorest people have SD or USB drives now, becasue they use computers of others instead of owning them.
make install > installpkg > zypper > synaptic
àà®à¥à®à¾à¦ààYà¥àà àà
I like Debian, except for a few things:
Their decision to lock one to gnome, and not offering KDE. There was one that offered GNUSTEP, which was okay, but the installation didn't install one as root, and then add users, which is what I'm comfortable w/. I do wish they offered all the GUI frontends, and let us choose which ones to install and use.
Their decision to go w/ Iceweasel, instead of Firefox. Totally needless. Again, why not offer Firefox, Konqueror, Opera, Chrome, Epiphany and any others, and let users decide? Oh, and instead of forking Firefox into IceWeasel, why not fix what's wrong w/ Epiphany in the first place, such as the inability to stage RSS on the toolbar like Firefox can?
Their decision to restrict one to apt. I like apt, but some packages are offered only in rpm. So why not have something that can fetch and install any linux item irrespective of how it's packaged? Oh, and please, not the tar & make install stuff!
How is the Debian Hurd project coming along? In fact, why not now replace the Hurd w/ a microkernel model, using either L4 or Minix 3 as the base microkernel?
i thought this already happened a few versions ago. there was certainly talk of it happening around when the buttons switched from upper right to upper left (9.10?). ive been using ubuntu since 5.10 but for the past few years i just use ubuntu minimal and build from there. i still use synaptic for finding packages rather than apt-get search and its one of the first gui tools i install after the DE/WM.
There are many types of ubuntu users - some like it for the vast repositories and reliability, others for the full out-of-the-box desktop experience. its probably a good thing to focus on the software center, what with every operating system having some kind of repository/app store nowadays.
The Software Center was originally called the Software Store.
That is because Cononical want to use Ubuntu to sell software. They quickly renamed it, but too late; the cat was out of the bag.
I have non technical friends who use Ubuntu and the Synaptic Package Manager without problems. I can only imagine that those on this forum who claim that it is a challenge for noobs either have stupid friends or are Cononical boosters.
"The Ubuntu Software Center still lacks many important features that are present in Synaptic"
Im pretty sure Synaptic will be only an "apt-get" away. Lets not forget the target audience Ubuntu is aiming for here. Ubuntu is definitely the way in
for new Linux adopters and so the more complicated software such as synaptic will be replaced with newbie friendly stuff.
Old hands like me and probably a fair percentage of slashdot readers are also using ubuntu because they have gone through the gentoo / slackware phase , customising or rolling their own linux. We just want something that works (tm) gives us all the linux goodness we have come to love. Its no big deal for us to
"sudo apt-get install synaptic" really is it? Every one wins linux newbies get something they can get along with. and us Linux afficionados get to have our cake and eat it.
Electronic Music Made Using Linux http://soundcloud.com/polyp
ohhh you are talking about the software center; i thought you mean synaptics.
Non-noobs use apt directly.
Can you type sudo apt-get install synaptic? I love synaptic, the Software Center can not compare to it`s features. Please Canonical, leave it in the repository and then it is available when someone does want it.
liberare massarum ex ignorantia, clausa descendit molestie.
Then there is a different class of users who want complete control over their package management, including the ability to install random developer libraries, add new sources and so on. These people like synaptic because it is a searchable full list of available packages. Someone looking to install headers for something, or to figure out another package's dependencies can do it from a nice GUI. I realise the second group of people are probably capable of figuring out how to install Synaptic for themselves.
Therefore I think it is reasonable for Ubuntu to dump Synaptic but recognize it MUST be offered from their app store also through the command line, e.g. apt-get install synaptic. I also think this must come with a concession (or perhaps a reality check) from Ubuntu - fix Unity. Unity's proto-app store integration is fucking horrible and it needs to be configurable and preferably rewritten. At the minute Unity makes it hard enough to find the apps on my box without the added insult of recommending apps from the store that I was never looking for in the first place and eating up screen space for this useless info. Unity needs to let me disable this - I want want to browse apps from an app store I want an explicit, discrete button / icon I can click on for this purpose. Otherwise get out of my face and stop phoning home.
When Canonical started developing the Ubuntu Software Center, I knew that a time will come when it will completely replace Synaptic.
[...]
Unexpectedly, Canonical has decided that it is time for the Software Center to replace Synaptic as well.
Say what?
As long as you have a shell with apt-get, you don't need anything gui, correct?
On one hand, I understand that they want to move forward. On the other, there are certain tools which you want to keep. Synaptic the most used system tool in my gui toolbag.
On the other hand, I don't want a fucking Mac, completely divorced from the OS. If I want a fucking Mac, I'll buy a fucking Mac. If I'm going to INSTALL a new OS on a computer, don't assume I'm a noob. If you are installing a 3rd party OS, sure, make the software center front and center. But assume I have a fucking clue how to burn an ISO, or netboot, setup my own wifi for updates, etc. Synaptic is one of the reasons I use Ubuntu! I found other systems to be lacking. And I honestly use Software Center. But I also like customizing, and build packages, and use synaptic to download dependencies quickly, without looking up a name or installing crap with a lib-* apt-get command.
And if you don't like customizing, WTF are you doing with Ubuntu in the first place? And if this is for OEM installs, WTF do you need to remove a package that they are perfectly capable of removing themselves? We're talking about a DOWNLOADED operating system. Make it as user friendly as you want, and quibble over LibreOffice, but don't start removing tools. Are you going to remap any request for nano or pico to gedit now?
Sorry, I just find this bullshit. Unlike Unity, which I understand, I don't understand this at all. It's not a space issue, and because of the new interface, if I type "Software", Software Center is already the number one choice, not Synaptic. And it adds an additional step for me on installs.
I already have stopped at 10.04 for corporate installs. Now I'll be stopping at 11.04 on personal installs. I'm sorry, but Software Center is NOT SUFFICIENT! It is a step BACKWARDS!
I8-D
and I'm fine. End of story.
Being increasingly unhappy with the quality of and direction of Ubuntu development, this may be the final straw.
Just remember; change for the sake of change is not a good thing.
Realize also that Ubuntu is working to become a enterprise desktop replacement. Anyone working in the IT support side knows that the end users knowledge of windows is one of the biggest issues. Things break, everyone has windows at home and they "know" what they are doing so they change the background or any of 1000 different things and now some business application no longer works correctly. If the interface only has exactly what the user needs and it is setup such that they really cannot break it then IT essentially wins. IT an work to help the business be more innovative rather than focusing on just break fix.
Many of us use Ubuntu because we like their innovation but also the fact they are grounded on one of the most conservative and stable Linux distros out there (Debian for those who dont know which one I am talking about). As long as they give the power users the ability to reconfigure the items they want while still meeting the Ubuntu goal of simplified user interface they should be fine. I would almost recommend Ubuntu addon to their install a power user install that lets someone choose their desktop and other basic apps at the beginning rather than having to wait until the system is built. Also I think a home user versus office environment install. That way the games could be removed or certain apps that allow the user to focus on their job rather than angry birds :)
Lastly I think it would be key for Ubuntu to built out a install server for clients (maybe they have it but I have not seen it) where you could create a gold image and have install server to install other systems. The one key element would be the ability to patch that gold image as updates were approved and that could be used to update other clients machines.
On top of that, hard drives are much, much faster, you can rewrite them millions of times, and can store 1TB or so on a single drive, instead of tiny 25GB chunks requiring you to swap out media.
So if you wanted to send 10 to 20 GB of data to a family member, how would you do it? Buy a USB flash drive and mail that? Buy a USB hard drive and hope he or she mails it back? Send it over the Internet and reimburse him or her for huge data transfer overages billed by the ISP? Mailing a BD or a few DVDs starts to sound good here.
These days CDR has been practically obsoleted by DVD+/-R(W)
Say your ISP lets you transfer 5 GB per month. Now are you going to want to download a 0.7 GB CD image or a 4 GB DVD image?
And nobody even mentions the real motivation: to push more proprietary software on users.
Synaptic to me was just a GUI alternative to aptitude. So I agree with this decision, GUI installers should be simple and easy for the end user, and aptitude as an alternative for people like me who want the extra features. Put it this way, I really never used synaptic it always just made sense to hit up aptitude. Software center is nice simply because of screen shots and ratings, I can review apps that I'm unfamiliar with, such as new games, before installing.
... I don't really care. If we do lose that we just switch to another distro. over 33% of our systems (about 250 boxes) now run linux, and we are expected to manage all of them remotely, which is easy with the CLI tools and scripting.
Unity is bad enough by itself! It makes it extremely difficult to get to the tools you need to do quite a lot of things. I was hoping that it would get better in the future, but this announcement has me thinking that is not going to happen, and those things are just going to get buried deeper than they are now! We know that the "Classic" option is going away soon and it looks like the dumbing down isn't going to stop till Ubuntu is only fit to run on a smart phone touch screen! Mint Linux is looking better everyday, as they have said they are not going the Unity route and are keeping a desktop GUI that you can actually do things with, without having to resort to CLI all the time! As I am pretty much CLI illiterate and don't have the type of memory that can remember long path names and obscure commands and switchs and the syntax that needs to be typed in perfectly to get things done that way, Mint is going to be a life saver for me! sudo nautilus is what I use to set permissions on files, so you can figure just how much I dislike the CLI!!!
I don't think the Ubuntu simplification train stops here.
But it might be a good train for the majority of passengers.
Me, I changed trains too.
I'm on the "Rolling Train" of Linux Mint Debian Editiion.
Check it out at:
http://www.linuxmint.com/download_lmde.php
It can grow if it needs to.
"Needs to" according to whose estimation? Some people think they need it to grow for various reasons; others behind capping ISPs need it not to grow.
We could use rewriteable media.
You already can; it's called a USB flash drive or SD card. See Installation/FromUSBStick.