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Microsoft Needs a Catch-Up Artist

The New York Times says that what Microsoft needs now isn't just a CEO, but a catch-up artist, to regain the footing that it had a few years ago as the biggest name in software. There's a lot of catching up, too: An anonymous reader reminds us that a year ago, Vanity Fair gave a scathing review of Steve Ballmer's performance:"Once upon a time, Microsoft dominated the tech industry; indeed, it was the wealthiest corporation in the world. But since 2000, as Apple, Google, and Facebook whizzed by, it has fallen flat in every arena it entered: e-books, music, search, social networking, etc., etc. Talking to former and current Microsoft executives, Kurt Eichenwald finds the fingers pointing at C.E.O. Steve Ballmer, Bill Gates's successor, as the man who led them astray."

406 comments

  1. Why catch-up? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    (Ketchup?!)

    No, microsoft doesn't need to catch up because it isn't behind. They have everything, what it doesn't have is something that is different, innovativ and without spyware.

    1. Re:Why catch-up? by smittyoneeach · · Score: 1

      For ketchup, they should get John Kerry. Given that MS is jacked up, and Kerry himself is a total jack-up artist, the resulting double negative will certainly have Redmond conquering the market, STAT.
      For OS/2 applications.

      --
      Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
    2. Re:Why catch-up? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That would be Microsoft Linux 8)

  2. Lead, don't follow. by Ed+The+Meek · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Microsoft needs to learn to lead and stay ahead of the trends. They're continuing to rely on old technology that's past it's time - like Office.

    1. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're right, excel does not help me with my twitter posting, nor does it help me use my phone at every possible moment.

      Microsoft should use self-determination to be the next facebook/Google+/twitter/flickr/instagram/AOL thingy.

    2. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As you type within in an Office app yourself - for shame.

    3. Re:Lead, don't follow. by WaywardGeek · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Since I graduated from college in 1986, Microsoft has been a place where great minds go to die. They were the hottest employer, and it sickens me to see how little Microsoft has allowed their amazing talent to produce. They had, and continue to have, essentially a monopoly on the desktop OS market. They don't need innovation to remain on top, and could even be damaged by it, so it's no wonder that they wouldn't let their great minds produce much of consequence. If Windows Me didn't convince you that Microsoft is anti-innovation, certainly Windows Vista and Windows 8 should make it clear.

      That said, I have no problem with companies being the best company in their field. Microsoft's market is shrinking, and it's not their fault. They remain the dominant PC OS, even with crappy Windows 8. Few would argue with my claim that Sun Microsystems was the best workstation vendor ever, but when cheap x86 CPUs began to have enough power for most users, Sun's market went away.

      Most people think it's stupidity for companies to remain the best in their market while their market shrinks, but I don't feel that way. There's always another company ready to take over a new market, and a company without the PC OS baggage is going to do a lot better. That's the way it should be.

      --
      Celebrate failure, and then learn from it - Nolan Bushnell
    4. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Dahamma · · Score: 2

      Since I graduated from college in 1986, Microsoft has been a place where great minds go to die. They were the hottest employer, and it sickens me to see how little Microsoft has allowed their amazing talent to produce.

      That's so true... except in one business: Xbox. It seems that's the only area of the company right now where they are really letting people innovate. Of course, we'll see how that works out for the XBOne - not all innovations turn out to be *good* ideas... but at least they have in fact listened to their customers and reversed their decisions on several unpopular features, as embarrassing as that was for them...

    5. Re:Lead, don't follow. by the_B0fh · · Score: 1

      Has Xbox turned net positive yet? I know it's finally making money, but has it reached ROI point yet?

    6. Re:Lead, don't follow. by 0123456 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Has Xbox turned net positive yet? I know it's finally making money, but has it reached ROI point yet?

      Not as far as I'm aware.

      And the 'innovation' would mostly appear to be locking in users and spying on them.

    7. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Goody · · Score: 4, Insightful

      They're continuing to rely on old technology that's past it's time - like Office.

      Please tell us what new technology replaces a spreadsheet program, a word processor, a presentation tool, and a personal/workgroup relational database.

      --
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    8. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Redundant

      They're continuing to rely on old technology that's past it's time - like Office.

      Please tell us what new technology replaces a spreadsheet program, a word processor, a presentation tool, and a personal/workgroup relational database.

      A web browser.

    9. Re: Lead, don't follow. by Ed+The+Meek · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You think a good business strategy is to rely on making minuscule changes to spreadsheets and word processors - expecting - consumers to buy the new version?? Why would anyone want Office 2010 when Office 2007 is capable of doing more than 99% of existing users care about? All this while OpenOffice (completely free) is capable of meeting the needs of 99% of spreadsheet and word processing users. Seriously? You think there's a big $$$ future in the continued development and deployment of Office 2011, 2012....2024? Seriously? Okay, now I've told you. And that's free from me to you... ;)

    10. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Xbox is Microsoft's attempt at being a consumer brand in your living room. So here's the real ROI:

      - How many Xbox owners bought a Zune?
      - How many Xbox owners bought a Windows Phone?
      - How many Xbox owners bought a Windows Tablet?

      There was a lot of discussion about how the iPod was Apple's "gateway device" that had a "halo effect". But as far as I can tell, XBox's halo is nearly invisible.

      I'd guess the next CEO comes in with a more enterprise/IT focus and XBox is dead after this generation.

    11. Re:Lead, don't follow. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      Also on the hardware side, Xbox is still in the red. Yes they make money on licensing but their competitor Nintendo has made profit on the Wii almost from the start. Realistically MS has just bought market share.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    12. Re:Lead, don't follow. by symbolset · · Score: 1

      If it doesn't turn a net profit after five years it isn't a business. It's a hobby.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    13. Re:Lead, don't follow. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

      Except the small business owner at my local restaurant doesn't use Excel, Word, Powerpoint, or SQL server day in and day out. It used to be his POS system had to be an expensive Windows machine. Now he uses Square and an iPad/Android. Small businesses make up a good part of the economy and they are turning to MS less and less. I think he even uses Libre Office as it was free.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    14. Re:Lead, don't follow. by chmod+a+x+mojo · · Score: 1

      If Windows Me didn't convince you that Microsoft is anti-innovation, certainly Windows Vista and Windows 8 should make it clear.

      Um, is there something I'm missing here? All of the MS OS's you listed had major changes, varying from kernel to radical UI changes.

      ME - loss of the ability to boot to DOS without the GUI ( it was something to do with the kernel wasn't it? I only used ME for the time it took me to locate a 2K CD )
      Vista - kernel rewrite, drivers in user-space so dodgy vid / sound drivers usually don't BSOD any more, actually starting to have thoughts of security starting. Aero.
      8 - Metro.... enough said.

      If you had said 95 > 98 > 98SE I would agree, other than USB not all too much changed between them that I can personally remember.

       

      --
      To err is human; effective mayhem requires the root password!
    15. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Osgeld · · Score: 2

      poorly, and software being presented in a browser is not the browser itself

    16. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      They are definitely not net positive over the *entire* Xbox 360 run, but the Xbox 360 hardware, software licensing, and Xbox Live are a very profitable business in the last couple years.

      If MS was planning on closing down the whole Xbox/entertainment business unit tomorrow, that would be a failure, but they aren't - they are building a long term business, and MANY long term businesses (and almost all companies in general) spend more than they make for some period of time.

      There is a reason MS and Sony are using lower cost AMD x86 CPU/GPUs, etc - that combined with dirt cheap prices for RAM, BD drives, and 500GB HDDs these days means the estimated BOM costs for both consoles is less then their MSRP, so neither company is planning on selling them for a loss this time.

      And as far as innovation... I have to admit the new Kinect is pretty impressive. And I say that having developed software for the first generation Kinect, which for the most part was a piece of crap (basically a really cool combination of technology that just wasn't good enough in practice to be useful).

    17. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      If you mean "profitable after 5 years" you'd at least have an argument (with plenty of exceptions). If you really mean *net* profit over 5 years then I guess pretty much the entire tech industry is just a bunch of hobbyists...

    18. Re:Lead, don't follow. by symbolset · · Score: 1

      For Windows PCs, pretty much, yeah. Windows PCs have no profit net. Even with crudware and Microsoft comarketing incentives the average OEM loses money any given year, making it up with their other business lines like software or services, servers, networking or storage. It's not my definition. It's the IRS.

      The IRS presumes that an activity is carried on for profit if it makes a profit during at least three of the last five tax years, including the current year — at least two of the last seven years for activities that consist primarily of breeding, showing, training or racing horses.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    19. Re:Lead, don't follow. by tsa · · Score: 2

      Many people here forget that Innovations aren't always successful. MS has put quite a few innovations on the market:
      MS Bob
      The stupid paper clip
      That table on which you can move windows around with your hands
      MS Outlook
      Kinect
      WP 7
      Windows 8
      I would say only two of them were successful: Outlook and the Kinect.

      --

      -- Cheers!

    20. Re:Lead, don't follow. by InsGadget · · Score: 1

      As far as I know, almost every game console in history was sold at a loss. Money is made in game licensing, etc.

    21. Re:Lead, don't follow. by 1s44c · · Score: 2

      Microsoft research was always an exercise is keeping the best new people out of the hands of the competition. Other than that it didn't really do anything.

    22. Re:Lead, don't follow. by 1s44c · · Score: 1

      If it doesn't turn a net profit after five years it isn't a business. It's a hobby.

      Or it's an attack on the competition to reduce their profitability.

    23. Re:Lead, don't follow. by 1s44c · · Score: 1

      Openoffice and a proper database?

    24. Re:Lead, don't follow. by symbolset · · Score: 1

      That's what Bing is about. It's not working out.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    25. Re:Lead, don't follow. by inasity_rules · · Score: 1

      No, ME was basically windows 98 done wrong, and a complete dead end. You're thinking of a NT based OS.

      --
      I have determined that my sig is indeterminate.
    26. Re:Lead, don't follow. by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      Perl.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    27. Re:Lead, don't follow. by gtall · · Score: 1

      That's not entirely true; they have a very good reputation in security research. It doesn't all make it into their products because when you are a marketing company, that's what happens. However, their research on security is published in all the major journals and conferences and it does influence the entire area.

      The only company I can think of where MS would like to starve of researchers is Google. Apple doesn't do much, Samsung can get theirs but I don't think they use many. They mainly use Apple as a bird-dog...not unlike Ballmer and Gates.

    28. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, that's traditionally how its worked. The issue with the Xbox line is not that Microsoft lost money on each unit sold - more that they took so long to turn a profit. The approach at Microsoft seems to be overly reliant on income from the Windows and Office businesses.

      It's not a bad strategy - we know that most startups begin life in the red and continue that way until they break even or fail. Microsoft can afford to run red ink for a very long time. As an investor, it becomes of question of how much long-term value is being created, and at what cost?

      Bing is pretty expensive, last year losing around half a billion dollars per quarter. At what point do they stop pouring money down the hole? Microsoft is very much a "me to" type of company, that will try to brute-force its way in to existing markets. They've had little success in creating or defining markets - it's just not what they do. Unfortunately they're not much better at grabbing a slice of existing markets.

      Microsoft is the rich kid in town who isn't particularly good at anything, but thinks he can buy his way in to the top-flight of anything. He wants to be the best baseball player - great, he'll hire a coach and the best equipment, but will after spending a great deal of money remain mediocre. The next week he fancies his chances of being a soapbox derby champ, so he has engineers from McLaren come in to help him build his racer - he finishes somewhere in the middle of the pack. Maybe after a few years he'll be winning races, but to what end? Will his earnings cover the earlier losses, and could that money spent have been better invested elsewhere?

    29. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Connie_Lingus · · Score: 1

      how laughable...MS Office is the ultra cash-cow for them! a WSJ weekend edition article says Office made them over $20BILLION in profit last year.

      while i totally agree that they need to innovate in many ways, just discarding the number 1 profit making application and the entrenched user base it commands for "must-change-NOW" sakes would be the stupidest business move ever..

      --
      never bring a twinkie to a food fight.
    30. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      Since I graduated from college in 1986, Microsoft has been a place where great minds go to die. They were the hottest employer, and it sickens me to see how little Microsoft has allowed their amazing talent to produce.

      Yep- it's been observed many times over the years that MS have countless smart people working for them, yet little of that ever translates into real innovation. A while back, I cherry-picked a very insightful 2010 article which touched on MS's key failures in this area.

      --
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    31. Re:Lead, don't follow. by TheSkepticalOptimist · · Score: 1

      Come on, really, office is still one of the most widely used apps in the corporate world. So many people think Microsoft is dead because they didn't catch on to the tablet market right away, but I mean Microsoft's Office division along with their other enterprise products is the reason why the company still exists and still earns billions in a quarter.

      I agree Microsoft dropped the ball with consumers, but they are still king in the corporate world. Without Microsoft most corporate IT would be stuck in the stone age with a haphazard collection of products from various companies that don't work well together.

      --
      I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
    32. Re: Lead, don't follow. by Ed+The+Meek · · Score: 1

      You're missing my point. I have no problem with Office. But a there's a huge difference between allowing a cash cow to run its course - and depending on it for the future. Outside of Office, Windows and Xbox, what does Microsoft have going for it? Bing? that's laughable! Alternatives are becoming more readily available every day. You can't rely on the past and stay on top in the future. People pointing to the success of Office to defend the current Microsoft business strategy is the kind of thinking that's gotten MS into this position.

    33. Re: Lead, don't follow. by Ed+The+Meek · · Score: 1

      So let Office run its course. But depending on it for the future hardly seems like a solid business strategy. People use office because its what they've always used - what they're familiar with and MS has played that game very well - but there's no future in it.

    34. Re:Lead, don't follow. by toddestan · · Score: 1

      ME had a some innovative new features. Such as System Restore, UPnP, Automatic Update, a rewritten TCP/IP stack, Windows Image Acquisition, the on-screen keyboard, and such. The problem was that these features were supposed to be introduced in a new consumer version of the NT line (what we now know as Windows XP Home), but since XP wasn't ready yet they attempted to backport these features into Windows 98 and the result was pretty much as you would expect.

    35. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's funny. Amazon didn't turn a net profit for 7 years.

      Maybe you should head down to their head office and berate them about their stupid hobby.

    36. Re:Lead, don't follow. by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Many people here forget that Innovations aren't always successful. MS has put quite a few innovations on the market:
      MS Bob
      The stupid paper clip
      That table on which you can move windows around with your hands
      MS Outlook
      Kinect
      WP 7
      Windows 8
      I would say only two of them were successful: Outlook and the Kinect.

      You forgot Windows ME/Phone/Mobile

      The Surface (the original Surface, before they repurposed the name for that stupid tablet) that table where you can move windows around with your hands was actually a really innovative product that could have been successful. But Microsoft refused to promote it, and it remains only a curiosity and TV prop. Although I don't have proof, I strongly suspect that the reason Microsoft did not promote it is that it did not match the business plan of "Windows everywhere", being a substantially different interface from everything else they had done.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    37. Re: Lead, don't follow. by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      > You think a good business strategy is to rely on making minuscule changes to spreadsheets and word processors - expecting - consumers to buy the new version??

      Listen to this, he speaks the truth. Back in the bad old days we paid hundreds to upgrade to the new version of Office in the hopes that basic features would finally work. Now that they do, there's no overriding reason to buy the next version. So after the market saturates, sales would inevitably plummet. (I'm still using Office 2000... works fine.) Microsoft got used to the profits it made while their software was on the steep end of the curve. Now that the curve has flattened out, they're lost. A more foresighted company would have seen this coming and moved into other applications. (snerk)

      To state it more simply, buying pricy upgrades for minor GUI changes is not money well spent. Especially since the free alternatives are getting more sophisticated.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    38. Re:Lead, don't follow. by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Perl.

      You have a problem. You decide to use Perl. Now you have two problems.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    39. Re:Lead, don't follow. by tsa · · Score: 1

      I think I forgot more than ME/Phone/Mobile but the list I came up with just popped into my head.
      About the table: it was really innovative and a useful product. I once used it in a museum and it's very responsive and easy to use. Maybe the reason that MS didn't promote it was that is was/is not something that is very useful in a business. It could make a very cool coffee table though.

      --

      -- Cheers!

    40. Re: Lead, don't follow. by 4partee · · Score: 1

      Repeatedly paying for the same thing is called renting.

    41. Re:Lead, don't follow. by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      I think I forgot more than ME/Phone/Mobile but the list I came up with just popped into my head.
      About the table: it was really innovative and a useful product. I once used it in a museum and it's very responsive and easy to use. Maybe the reason that MS didn't promote it was that is was/is not something that is very useful in a business. It could make a very cool coffee table though.

      I have to disagree. Having it built in to conference tables would streamline brainstorming sessions and other types of collaborative efforts to a high degree. I think corporations (at least some of them) would have snapped at it. And then Apple would have cloned it. :-)

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    42. Re: Lead, don't follow. by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Repeatedly paying for the same thing is called renting.

      Well said. At a very high rate, for value received.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    43. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You would be correct if the tech industry were organized as sole proprietorships or simple partnerships.

      Conversely, I would *love* to see a cite where the IRS declared an actual corporation to be a hobby...

    44. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Meski · · Score: 1

      Xbox is to Microsoft as the IBMPC was to IBM.

    45. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Meski · · Score: 1

      Yes, I wanted the table. But fuck, I want the Corning house. (& car) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Cf7IL_eZ38

    46. Re: Lead, don't follow. by mjwx · · Score: 1

      You think a good business strategy is to rely on making minuscule changes to spreadsheets and word processors - expecting - consumers to buy the new version??

      Actually it is.

      This is where Microsoft makes it's billions.

      First off, stop thinking like a consumer and start thinking like a business customer. You dont buy a copy of office for life as a business customer, you buy a license thats valid for 1 year. You have 500 users, so you negotiate for 500 office licenses (yes, without VLK's managing this many copies of office would be an absolute nightmare) as well as all the other stuff you need (windows, SQL, Exchange).

      This is how you make your money, you dont sell once off copies, you sell continually renewing licenses for the same product. In this scenario you want to advance the product just enough to get middle managers (purchasing officers) excited but not enough to get conservative upper management (people with the authority to purchase) afraid.

      Microsoft making radical changes to their core products (Windows, Office) that will be noticed by the people who sign the cheques has already hurt them and their monopoly wont hold forever if they continue to piss off their core customers.

      So making incremental, minuscule changes is _EXACTLY_ what Microsoft needs to do to remain profitable and grow. They dont need to be hip and cool, they just need to be good enough that the cost of switching to a competitor is high enough that it's not worth considering.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    47. Re:Lead, don't follow. by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      Cheaper stuff. It used to be that Microsoft Word and Excel were very good, and most competitors lagged. Some time about ten years ago, computers and software became generally Good Enough. Since then, even if MS Office is ahead of the competition, the competition has been getting better and approaching Good Enough.

      It'd be better to say that Microsoft was continuing to rely on superiority (as well as lock-in, but they still have that), and that superiority has either gone away or largely become irrelevant.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    48. Re:Lead, don't follow. by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Yes, I wanted the table. But fuck, I want the Corning house. (& car)
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Cf7IL_eZ38

      Yes. You notice how the display is *not* a crowd of primary color squares that don't clearly indicate what application they represent?

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    49. Re:Lead, don't follow. by WaywardGeek · · Score: 1

      I think your point and one post earlier basically point out that there is innovation at Microsoft, "deep down in the woodwork" as the previous poster said. I wholeheartedly agree, and can point out a few places I'm blown away: Microsoft's HTK (HMM Tool Kit) is keey to research in speech recognition, and Microsoft massively innovated in accessible computing, which is actually a big deal for me personally. Bill Gates made it happen. There are probably thousands of such examples.

      I think one reason there is so much under-the-radar innovation at Microsoft is that they have all these amazing people who live to innovate. If they can't place their mark on the flagship OS product, at least they can sneak in some innovation here and there. However,when we take a look at the desktop environments they shipped... someone over there (Ballmer?) was a bit too high on something?

      --
      Celebrate failure, and then learn from it - Nolan Bushnell
    50. Re:Lead, don't follow. by Meski · · Score: 1

      Yes, but who in their right mind would use a riot of primary colour squares? :^)

  3. Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    They are no longer embracing and extending. They were never really leaders. They only took other ideas and muscled their way into market dominance.

    1. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 4, Insightful

      In other words, Ballmer was the symptom, not the problem.

    2. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      yes. exactly. microsoft has always been shit. nothing they ever did was ever the most secure, the most cost effective,
      the more usable, the highest performance, the most attractive.

      they never excelled at anything, but somehow managed to become the defacto standard for computing, and
      distorted generations of young minds.

      so now that the market has finally lurched forward and no one wants to buy that useless crap anymore
      we are supposed to cry?

      they could take all that money and do a thousand interesting things, but they are so inbred and willfully ignorant
      they are just going to spend it down until the scrap is at market value.

    3. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'm more cynical than this, I actually think that the proprietary nature of the software, Gate's aggressive tendencies, and just shear, damn luck - giving them an unenviable market position - constained the company. No matter what talent and good aspirations they could pour in, the constraints managed to stop MS from producing what the employees were actually capable of if, for instance, they had all worked on free software in many competing companies. My favourite MS example is picturing Bill Gates, the one person in the world who could easily demand a better browser, using Internet Explorer 6 as his web browser for *5 years*. Good business requires consequences for treating your customers badly and making poor decisions. Monopolies by definition never pay the true price for their follies, but everyone else, include its employees, shareholders and CEOs pay in the reduced access to quality goods and services.

      The histories of MS and Apple are stories of the same nature as stories of centralized economies and micromanaging workaholic leaders where the economics got so messed up that good people couldn't make anything better inside the system, only through more open models were they able to achieve their potential and get back to good business.

    4. Re:Hugging and Stretching by symbolset · · Score: 2

      Remember, the process is Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. Implied is the prevention of progress you don't control: to burn the fields that feed your enemy, and everybody is your enemy.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    5. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I always liked Microsoft, since back in the day on my 8086 with MS-DOS 1.0 up to now with Windows 8 Pro. Many other people do too, which is why they became dominant on the desktop. For us, they were all of the things that you claim they aren't.

    6. Re: Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Few people remember Apple invented Office (was on Lisa), and gave it to MS when their developers went nuts because the OS vender was competing with them. It took MS 2-3 years (too lazy to research) to put out 1.0

      They also took the overall Windows concept from Apple (that bought it from xerox). Not that both made significant changes, yet copied the best small refinements from each other.

      Before that they copied DOS from someone.

      Still, back then Gates could see the future, and new what to build. Ballmer didn't know a good idea when you showed him a working copy. If he reacted as swiftly as Gates, Android probably would not have significant market share.

    7. Re:Hugging and Stretching by epine · · Score: 4, Interesting

      they never excelled at anything

      Bullshit. They excelled in maintaining backwards compatibility with BINARY legacy applications coded with all kinds of brutal behaviours under the hood. Often almost beyond the bounds of reason. This was one of the big reasons Apple had so much trouble clawing itself back into the game. MS worked very hard never to give visionary CIOs a good pretext to clean house of horror show legacy applications.

      Embrace, extend, and eternalise.

    8. Re: Hugging and Stretching by geoffaus · · Score: 1

      Pretty sure from Paul Allen's book that MS got the idea for word from a guy from PARC that interviewed with them and that they subsequently hired to develop it for them. Also with Dos ibm asked for an OS and they told them to talk to Digital Research but DR screwed up the meeting with IBM and IBM came back to MS asking if they could do it. Paul then had the idea of buying QDOS since it would give them a head start since time was very limited until the launch of the IBM pc. I think they ended up hiring the developer of QDOS too

      --
      As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a reference to Godwin's Law approaches 1
    9. Re:Hugging and Stretching by evilviper · · Score: 1

      They excelled in maintaining backwards compatibility with BINARY legacy applications coded with all kinds of brutal behaviours under the hood.

      They sure TRIED, and recognized the benefits, but they certainly didn't excel. I knew every new version of Windows was going to break a modest number of apps I'd been using, and would need to find more modern alternatives.

      Some apps held up just fine, many did not. First specific example that comes to mind is Netscape Navigator... Windows 98 managed to make the damn thing segfault rather than start-up, and downloading the new version through a dial-up modem was unpleasant.

      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    10. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not only that, but MS is no longer going up against the incompetent. Apple is not going to roll over and hand over their lead the way they did in the past. Google is not going to roll over and hand them the mobile market they way the spreadsheet was given up to MS. RedHat is not going to give up the server market easily. MS has to actually compete through technology rather than bludgeon and trick their competition. It is a different world for MS, and it is one they never had to deal with in the past. They need a superior kind of monkey, and their cookie cutter hiring practices have left them in limbo.

    11. Re:Hugging and Stretching by bogjobber · · Score: 1

      I hear they are pretty good at making money. Which is sort of the point of a corporation, no?

    12. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      I always liked Microsoft

      Care to elaborate on your reasons for this?

      Many other people do too, which is why they became dominant on the desktop.

      MS became dominant on the desktop because they were placed in a dominant position when they first got the contract to supply the OS for the IBM PC, (*) then were smart enough to leverage that advantage to retain and build on their dominant position in the market.

      For us, they were all of the things that you claim they aren't.

      Again, you say something, but don't explain- let alone provide support- for this opinion.

      (*) This was an unremarkable machine in terms of design- most built from off-the-shelf-parts, but was guaranteed to sell because it had the IBM nameplate on it. (Back then "no-one ever got fired for buying IBM".) MS bought in a 16-bit workalike/knockoff of the 8-bit 1970s CP/M OS called QDOS ("Quick and Dirty Operating System") and that became the first version of PC-DOS (later MS-DOS); just as unremarkable as the hardware, and dated even then.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    13. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      nothing they ever did was ever the most secure, the most cost effective,
      the more usable, the highest performance, the most attractive.

      Perhaps not (though I disagree), but you also (likely) don't drive either a motorcycle (high acceleration and mileage) or an F350 (tons of torque, go where you want)- you drive a fairly optimized balance between all the deciding factors. As far as security, usability, performance, and aesthetics, Windows (7) hits a damned-good balance (you've buried your head if you disagree). It may not be the same balance of things you value (why you presumably don't run it), but it's a good one none-the-less.

    14. Re:Hugging and Stretching by Zaelath · · Score: 1

      If they went to the kind of effort to find workaround to make an old version of nutscrape work on 98 they would be dumb as a bag of rocks.

      What they DID do was rather amazing:

      http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000054.html

      Windows 95? No problem. Nice new 32 bit API, but it still ran old 16 bit software perfectly. Microsoft obsessed about this, spending a big chunk of change testing every old program they could find with Windows 95. Jon Ross, who wrote the original version of SimCity for Windows 3.x, told me that he accidentally left a bug in SimCity where he read memory that he had just freed. Yep. It worked fine on Windows 3.x, because the memory never went anywhere. Here's the amazing part: On beta versions of Windows 95, SimCity wasn't working in testing. Microsoft tracked down the bug and added specific code to Windows 95 that looks for SimCity. If it finds SimCity running, it runs the memory allocator in a special mode that doesn't free memory right away. That's the kind of obsession with backward compatibility that made people willing to upgrade to Windows 95.

      That kind of thing made me love 95, I had a lot of software that ran just fine on it, and I didn't have dodgy hardware that made it crashy for some people...

      Anyway, you should porbably come up with a better counter-example than "outdated browser that was arguably worse than the horrible IE that came with 98".

  4. Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business also by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    A few key points MS needs to digest:

    1) They completely neutered their Small Business Server selection, and now to get anything remotely comparable you're looking at a cost-per-core set up. I recently ran into this setting up a medical practice. In the past I had used SBS with the premium add-on to get access to SQL Server Standard for certain software packages. Of course, I can still get licenses for it, but if their business model is moving in that direction, I'm moving away from using their product. I'm finding that certain flavors of Ubuntu are much more suited to what my clients need, and at a price you can't beat. (Zentyal for those that are curious).

    2) Get rid of the MS/Windows Tax. Force OEMs to hand out CoAs so that their customers can re-install the OS if need be, rather than using restore media. It's complete BS that customers of big PC manufacturers can't re-install the same (albeit blank) OS that came on a PC they just bought, rather we're forced to go through an uninstall bloat/crap-ware from PC's individually. I don't care what agreements are in place already, shoving this crap down our throat won't help business.

    3) Stop screwing IT businesses all over. This is more of a general comment, but killing Technet is a good example of things you really shouldn't do.

  5. The article missed one main thing by the_B0fh · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Microsoft never produced anything for the user. If there were any benefits, it was a by product. Microsoft tried to please the producers.

    Apple did it the other way round. Apple made things for the end users. True, they had very specific ideas of what the end users can and cannot do, but ultimately, the UI, the way to do things, the way things are done, are all planned and implemented with the end user in mind.

    6 weeks before the original iphone launched, Jobs said - no plastic screen, use gorilla glass - why? Because your keys in your pocket would scratch the screen. How many other executives would stop production to do that?

    1. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interesting point of view taking into account all the planned obsolescence in apple products.

    2. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... yep, and the fact that both of those companies insist on claiming that they know what's best for their users is exactly why the majority of devices sold today run a Google OS.

    3. Re:The article missed one main thing by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Microsoft is a B2B company, not a B2C company. They have a huge team that goes out to businesses and researches what they want and need. This is how many 'useless' function got into Word, because some people do use them.

      It's a strategy that works really well when companies know what they want. It works less well when companies aren't sure. That's where Apple excels, they were able to see that people would use a tablet, where business people couldn't give you a cost/profit breakdown on their likelihood of buying a tablet.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    4. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      No, the reason why the majority of the devices today run Google OS is because Apple was contractually obligated to AT&T/Singular up until 2011.. thats almost 4 years. Android solved that OEM problem.

    5. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yeah, no, not even close. Turns out that not being able to change absolutely every little setting to their personal preference is not a deal-breaker for the vast majority of people.

      The reason why Android does so well because it comes on cheap phones that the vast majority of the world (the bits not contained in North America/Europe) can afford to buy. If Apple sold a $99-$199 phone with cheap plastic screens, cheap plastic cases, and cheap components, the rest of the world and poorer parts of North America and Europe would actually have a choice on their hands about what to buy.

      Android's NA/EU sales primarily come from high-end devices that compete directly with Apple's devices while not being Apple. The reason MS wasn't able to copy that success with the same strategy is that they had an unproven device that, by the numbers, wasn't as good as the high-end offerings that were already in their later iterations, with an OS that was still suffering from first-gen problems.

    6. Re:The article missed one main thing by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      Microsoft is a B2B company, not a B2C company. They have a huge team that goes out to businesses and researches what they want and need.

      So how did they end up with a tablet interface on desktop PCs? Which businesses 'wanted and needed' that?

    7. Re:The article missed one main thing by FuzzNugget · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Only iPhone users would be dumb enough to (a) keep their keys and phone in the same pocket and (b) not use a screen protector.

    8. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      They were hoping to shut down BYOB iPads by giving IT departments a substitute product which is "a PC".

      But, IT departments don't like Windows 8 either.

    9. Re:The article missed one main thing by JDG1980 · · Score: 1

      Microsoft is a B2B company, not a B2C company.

      Which is why Win8/Metro was such a dumb idea. Businesses hate it.

    10. Re:The article missed one main thing by Goody · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Show me a three year old PC that holds the same percent value that a three year old Mac does, or a three year old smartphone versus an iPhone.

      --
      Tired of being "punished" by the Slashdot $rtbl since 2002. I'm now over at http://soylentnews.org/ .
    11. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Android phone users do it all the time because they can throw the phone away and buy another cheap one.

    12. Re:The article missed one main thing by Pulzar · · Score: 1

      6 weeks before the original iphone launched, Jobs said - no plastic screen, use gorilla glass - why? Because your keys in your pocket would scratch the screen. How many other executives would stop production to do that?

      It wasn't 6 weeks. It was at least 6 months, maybe more. The story goes that he put the order sometime in 2006, before Gorilla Glass was even ready for production, and iPhone came out in June of 2007.

      In places I've worked, executives stopped production all the time, for all kinds of reasons. The good ones were the one that saw the problems ahead of time and didn't have to stop anything, but adjust well before the production began. I believe that's what Jobs did in this case, too.

      --
      Never underestimate the bandwidth of a 747 filled with CD-ROMs.
    13. Re:The article missed one main thing by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Yes, and that is one of many reasons it was a dumb idea.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    14. Re:The article missed one main thing by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      None, which is why there was a huge fight between the executives at Microsoft when it happened. They were moving away from how they had always done things.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    15. Re:The article missed one main thing by ridley4 · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Looks like someone never tried an iOS upgrade on an older iDevice...

    16. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, the reason why the majority of the devices today run Google OS is because Google followed the same path as early Windows in allowing their OS to run on multiple devices by other companies, while Apple followed the same path as early Apple in only allowing their OS to run on their own devices within their small walled garden. And the results in the Mobile Phone OS market will be exactly the same as the results in the Desktop OS market.

    17. Re:The article missed one main thing by VortexCortex · · Score: 1

      PC != MS; A three year old Mac is a three year old PC. I run GNU/Linux on them all. Additionally, In terms of computation power the three year old non-apple computer will cost less for the same power. Indeed, you can buy two ore three or four for the same price. Can you even imagine trouncing that lone Mac with a Beowulf Cluster of these!?

    18. Re:The article missed one main thing by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

      The thing about Jobs which made him an anti-Ballmer was Jobs was involved with each product. And his word was final. Ballmer seemed to defer many of the decisions to someone else and not step in when MS was about to make a mistake. For example, Vista was originally not supposed to run on certain Intel chipsets (the 915 I think) because the video chip couldn't handle Aero. That meant millions of Intel boards that were not Vista compatible. Someone underling (and no one will fess up) reversed course and allowed Vista Basic to be Vista Compatible/Ready (I can't ever remember the confusing terminology) very late in the process.

      This pissed off HP because they had planned for their line to be Vista compatible and avoided ordering many 915 chipsets. It gave an advantage to their competitors who could not offer Vista when before they could only run XP on cheaper 915 chipsets. MS also failed horribly to clearly define the difference to the consumer. Many consumers (including a MS VP) bought machines which were barely capable of running Vista. What did Ballmer do? Nothing. The main person that appeared to bitch about it was Allchin who correctly predicted it was cause major problems.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    19. Re:The article missed one main thing by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      A whole bunch of OEMs building gray boxes and scrabbling over razor thin and ever decreasing margins while Apple caters to the high end and walks away with a highly disproportionate piece of the entire industry's profits? That's not much of a prediction, it's already happened.

    20. Re:The article missed one main thing by lxs · · Score: 1

      The value they hold is about equal, but the old Apple products do fetch a higher price.

    21. Re:The article missed one main thing by aliquis · · Score: 1

      On the other hand someone surely asked for something which you know, kinda worked with using your fingers and more inprecise than a mouse or stylus.

    22. Re: The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes and no. The mobile market is more like the gaming market. In early PC days compatibility issues drive everyone to a single vender. 2-3 gaming vendors can thrive at different levels of market share depending on how they are doing now.

      Same for phones, they lack the compatibility issues, so 2-3 will thrive. You are right that Apple went for the high end, and something was going to fill the low end. No way was Apple ever going to dominate, and I don't think they have ever had more than 20% market share. Ever.

      But in the US Android has actually peaked, and is now losing market share. This is not true world wide where phone subsidies do not exist. This is why we will see a cheaper iPhone, but never a low end iPhone. Windows phones are starting to gain traction in some countries.

      There is room for all 3. There market share will continue to vary. Unless Apple and MS really screw up, Android will likely never have the dominance Windows had.

    23. Re:The article missed one main thing by Telvin_3d · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Looks like someone never tried an iOS upgrade on an older iDevice...

      Older than what? Apple has industry leading backwards compatibility on their mobile devices. Hell, plenty of android devices are effectively end-of-life six months after they come out. The latest iOS build is backwards compatible back to the 3GS, which launched just over 4 years ago. Try to find ANY 4 year old android that supports Jelly Bean.

    24. Re: The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Keys are bad, but screen protectors are just dumb. You lose the feel of the screen, the anti-smudge coating, and Gorilla glass rarely scratches (but when it breaks, it shatters).

    25. Re:The article missed one main thing by 0123456 · · Score: 2

      I believe the point was that old iPhone users regularly complain that they upgraded to the latest and greatest operating system and now their phone feels like a 386 running XP.

    26. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Microsoft tried to please the producers.
      Ha, I wish. Time and time again, internal staff are told "You're not the customer." whenever constructive criticism is offered about how crap various products is.

    27. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I still have a 3Gs, I still get upgrades of iOS.
      It was released in June 2009, it is now over 4 years old.

    28. Re:The article missed one main thing by Osgeld · · Score: 1

      How many other executives would stop production to do that?

      oh thank jesus jobs for that great innovation!

    29. Re:The article missed one main thing by Osgeld · · Score: 0

      heh, the only reason old shitty used mac's cost so much is cause some dumbass paid 3x market value for one when it was new

      you really think your core2 17 inch imac is honestly worth 600$ in 2013?

      mac users do

    30. Re:The article missed one main thing by Swampash · · Score: 2

      Interesting point of view taking into account all the planned obsolescence in apple products.

      Planned obsolescence? Apple products last for ever. I still get productive work done on a Powermac built in 2001.

    31. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      A whole bunch of OEMs building gray boxes and scrabbling over razor thin and ever decreasing margins while Apple caters to the high end and walks away with a highly disproportionate piece of the entire industry's profits? That's not much of a prediction, it's already happened.

      I've never understood why users cheer for tech companies having obscene profit margins, that are coming out of the consumes pockets. If you are an Apple-investor or high-ranking employee, so you are rolling in money because of it, I can understand. And I can understand that companies need to have healthy economy to continue to build and be there for the future, but for companies like Apple they are so far beyond that in the profit they extract from their users that it is ridiculous. I know they do because they can, that is fine. People cheering while bleeding for it puzzles me more.

    32. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 1

      My 386 IS running XP you insensitive clod!

      --
      Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
    33. Re:The article missed one main thing by evilviper · · Score: 2

      with an OS that was still suffering from first-gen problems.

      Microsoft has been developing Windows CE since 1996. Windows Phone is hardly a first-gen product. I've seen Windows CE-powered smart phones around for a LONG time (and everybody hated them). Microsoft has ZERO excuse for being run over by iPhone and Android.

      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    34. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I guess you missed the whole Power PC era

    35. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The reason why Android does so well because it comes on cheap phones that the vast majority of the world (the bits not contained in North America/Europe) can afford to buy.

      On top of which Samsung makes most of those NON-HighEnd phones. As soon as they roll out Tizen on those lower ends phones, that will decimate most of the Android market. You rarely see Samsung Galaxy numbers compared to the iPhone, or the other high end versions of other manufactures. The rest is just cheap smartphones that are a replacement for the feature phones.

    36. Re:The article missed one main thing by toddestan · · Score: 1

      Show me a 5-year old Mac where you can get parts without salvaging parts out of another old Mac. Show me a 7-year-old Mac where you can run new software without installing Linux or Windows.

    37. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's the point: they didn't know so they guessed based on rumor and blue-sky. The market shows so far they've guess wrong.

    38. Re:The article missed one main thing by danomac · · Score: 1

      Microsoft is a B2B company, not a B2C company.

      Yep, and look where that got Blackberry/Research In Motion.

    39. Re:The article missed one main thing by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Oh, that I may do as poorly as RIM: making billions of dollars before going out of business.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    40. Re:The article missed one main thing by the_B0fh · · Score: 1

      Actually while that complain was true of iOS 5, the iPhone 3GS users who upgraded to iOS 6 said they got better performance.

    41. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But you don't need to sell a 3 year old PC. ;)

    42. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because Ballmer forgot who and where he was and tried to make a consumer focused program. And actually, businesses only hate it because modern end users are so stupid that the idea of pressing the 'Win/Super' key to see the desktop is, and then having your business applications on the desktop - or the metro bar which is just a reskinned start bar really, the folder structure is identical - is baffling to them. Funnily enough the evidence is even in this /. article. All of the first posts were business oriented.

    43. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Windows CE, and Windows Mobile (before 7) are business products through and through and are actually selling decently even now. The difference is that they are selling in non-phone embedded devices. At the store where I work all the non-POS scanners run and older emulator (of god knows what) on a Windows Mobile 5.5 OS. At school we had a array of PDAs in Science classes that ran WM 6.5 to use the more detailed sensors in the workplace (From EM spectrum to dB) and saved money on the hardware as 5 sensors could run off a single set of processing hardware (although the connectivity and probably the processing grunt for them to run simultaneously wasn't there). There's countless more in scientific fields, far more than there is iPhones and iPads because they are cheaper and can actually have real code run on them rather than being constantly plagued by consumer based problems like AppStore Qualification, GUI constraints, managed code, modifiable User/Kernel restrictions. And it's all familiar Windows to code with under the hood. I'm not saying that you couldn't port these applications and drivers to iOs for example, I'm saying that writing it for iOS would have taken more time, effort, money, had a higher initial cost, non-customisable hardware, code that is weak, buggy and soft on many levels, and a constant thirst for the internet as if a business really wants to add another potential attack vector and hardware cost simply because their vendors are too busy making things shiny to write solid and relatively hole-free code and supply offline update methods on the rare occasion they don't.

    44. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just because a Volkswagen holds value better than a BMW doesn't make it the better car.

      And yes, Volkswagens do hold value better than BMWs.

    45. Re:The article missed one main thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lol.

      Okay, that's why you killed off 32bit AU this year, X11 last year (10.8), Rosetta the year before (10.7), Classic Environment (10.6) a year or two before. Apple's products may last forever (in whatever limited form that old hardware bounds you to), but try getting old software to run on a new Mac and you're screwed. And by old I only mean maybe 2 years. Apple software NEEDS constant updates because Apple write sloppy code relentlessly and don't document it very well if at all. They also do a lot of ripping out of even slightly legacy features. This forces developers to constantly update and gives the end users a feeling that they are being looked after and better supported on OS X. The reality is that it's just devs trying to make up for Apple consistently messing with them. It's a wonder they all take it so willingly.

    46. Re:The article missed one main thing by Dabido · · Score: 1

      Actually, I met the lead anthropologist for Microsoft at a conference many years ago. She said they have about 7 anthropologist who work at MS, and their job is to make the product work for people. ie good user interfaces etc for the average person off the street. She was brought on board at MS when Windows 95 came out, and she told a story about how she brought in some average people off the street to test loading Win 95 from scratch, and not one of them could get it to load. The engineers/developers asked where she got all the stupid people from, and she pointed out that they weren't stupid, they just weren't technical as they weren't IT.

      Knowing that she and many other anthropologists are working for MS to get their interfaces working for humans makes me wonder if they've accidentally picked up too much tech knowledge, if they're just failing to do their jobs, if they get pushed aside in favour of release dates, or just get ignored by the tech people. Food for thought.

      --
      Sure enough, the cow costume was hanging up next to the superhero outfit and sailors uniform. (S,Spud)
    47. Re:The article missed one main thing by the_B0fh · · Score: 1

      Fucking ribbon with it's peekaboo menu items? On such unimportant shit like "search" in outlook? They lost the game somewhere alright.

  6. dump the money losers by alen · · Score: 3, Interesting

    dump bing and the rest of the money losing businesses that have no hope of turning a profit in the next decade
    get the research people to concentrate on stuff that improves current products or present some kind of business plan for any project that is in research

    wait for the next tech change cycle. these come every 10 years or so. we had the mainframe to PC cycle in the 80's. the rise of servers in the 90's. the internet in the 90's. and the last one was the rise of mobile. MS lost the current cycle but there is another one coming soon. smart watches and other similar tech is out there and people are buying it. what is missing is the one product that will take the most popular wished for features and put them together in a simple and easy to use device

    1. Re: dump the money losers by __aazsst3756 · · Score: 2

      It's better to look at your total bottom line, not individual profit centers. This is actually part of the problem at MS. It is OK for one business to lose money, as long as it supports something else. Note that iTunes used to lose money, or barely break even, but they make money on devices. Amazon gives away the hardware to make money on content. Google loses money on search, gives away hardware, so they can make money on ads and selling data on its users. All 3 sound strategies. If they broke everything into a profit center that has to make money like most companies do, they would not be leading in their perspective fields.

    2. Re:dump the money losers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      'tis time for the rise of Embedded Linux :)

    3. Re:dump the money losers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't seem to understand how important the Bing _division_ is to Microsoft. That's where their entity stuff is, their speech-to-text, their audio and object recognition... Bing is much more than just the search engine that doesn't perform as well as Google.com - it's their entire knowledge division, and the ability to serve that information through to the rest of the divisions at Microsoft and third-party devs is pretty valuable... it's just that the other teams are the ones making the profit off of the work that comes out Bing.

  7. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by alen · · Score: 4, Informative

    the small business model is to push them to azure, not to have on premise servers. big money expense and big operational maintenance expense

  8. They need to get Windows right first by umafuckit · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yes, perhaps MS have "fallen flat" in search, social networks, etc. What's really unforgivable, however, are the Vista and Win8 debacles; those are cases where MS screwed up on home turf. The perception that they're having trouble getting their OS right must be tainting their efforts in other spheres. I reckon the XBox is relatively isolated from the Windows aura, as it's almost a brand in its own right (you never hear the term "Microsoft XBox"). Other things, such as search and phones, are harder to dissociate from Windows. Microsoft's real problem right now is that they're not "cool." It's that intangible quality that they need to foster in order to hit the upswing with consumers.

    1. Re:They need to get Windows right first by Teckla · · Score: 2

      I reckon the XBox is relatively isolated from the Windows aura, as it's almost a brand in its own right (you never hear the term "Microsoft XBox").

      Don't worry, Microsoft is working hard to give the Xbox a bad reputation, too.

      Unreliable hardware; forced advertisements; you can't use IE or Netflix on Xbox without paying the Xbox Gold Live tax; not to mention all their missteps with Xbone (despite their frantic backpedaling).

      The reputation of the Xbox is slowly but surely moving in the same direction that Vista and Windows 8 took.

    2. Re:They need to get Windows right first by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

      And this is after the reversals on the "features" that gamers disliked at E3.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    3. Re:They need to get Windows right first by Tyler+Eaves · · Score: 1

      People actually expected something from Win8? Are they not aware of the pattern?

      WIndows 3.11 - Good
      Windows 95 - Kinda shit
      WIndows 98 - Good
      Windows ME - Really shit
      Windows XP - Good
      Windows Vista - Crappy
      Windows 7 - Good
      WIndows 8 - Blech

      --
      TODO: Something witty here...
    4. Re:They need to get Windows right first by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're not "cool" because they suck. They tried to make Zune cool, but no self respecting 13 year old wanted one, even if it was free.

    5. Re:They need to get Windows right first by jsepeta · · Score: 1

      don't forget WinME and Bob. Sometimes Microsoft has TERRIBLE ideas that anyone with half a brain could say, "no, don't make that product."

      --
      Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
  9. Fluffy story by hoboroadie · · Score: 0

    Looks like a cut-and-paste from Microsoft's PR department to me.
    Somebody probably wants to unload a few shares on the volatility.

    --
    They feared that it could be used to suppress protest or support unpopular rule.
    1. Re:Fluffy story by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Okay, maybe the second Friendly Article from Vanity Fair has a leetle substance, backstory for youngsters &c. -hoboroadie

  10. Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by bug_hunter · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There seems to be a lot of looking at Bill Gates with rose coloured glasses.
    As far as I've been able to tell, Microsoft is still trying to do the same thing as it's always done since it's inception. Wait for others to define a market, then try to buy or muscle your way into it with a "good enough" product.
    Just now with Microsoft's OS monopoly not being an effective control mechanism, and the barrier of entry for other companies not being too high, "good enough" doesn't convince anybody anymore.

    From reading the article the main difference between Bill and Steve on recent issues was that Bill resigned to the fact that they were already too late on things like music players and phones and he wouldn't have even tried getting in.
    Microsoft couldn't be turned around easily, it's too much of a change to its ethos. Could a better CEO really have got them into other markets propely, or would a better CEO just doubled down on OS/Office/Business Services and saved a bit of money but had no other impact? Maybe Balmer-Microsoft needed to try and flail around in every market as a first step in a (long) transition period where Microsoft comes out the other side as a company with a bit more humility, creativity and modern vision.
    Interested to hear opinions.

    --
    It's turtles all the way down.
    1. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 1

      There seems to be a lot of looking at Bill Gates with rose coloured glasses.
      As far as I've been able to tell, Microsoft is still trying to do the same thing as it's always done since it's inception. Wait for others to define a market, then try to buy or muscle your way into it with a "good enough" product.

      Then perhaps they should poach somebody from Samsung?

      --
      Only to idiots, are orders laws.
      -- Henning von Tresckow
    2. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Bill Gates was paranoid as fuck. The whole reason they had Windows CE and Windows Mobile was "to prevent someone doing to us what we did to IBM."

      If Gates was running the company, they would have started cloning the iPhone the day after Apple announced it. Instead Fat Ballmer dismissed the whole idea and sat around doing nothing for 2 years. He also did the exact same thing with Google and internet advertising, costing MSFT multi-billions.

    3. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by deviated_prevert · · Score: 5, Interesting
      I agree with your assessment. One huge problem was and is how they approached communication dev environments. The huge security issues with activeX dependent routines and how "explorer" could become a dangerous interface. We had tonnes of poorly written code using microsoft's development enviroments. Heck every other few weeks there are still "critical security updates for .net framwork".

      By creating boat loads of dumb software writers that churned out code for XP that depended upon insecure networking interfaces they have done little more than create a huge resentment in the industry. It is still the case today that most large firms have to run large amounts of legacy activeX code on their intranet in "XP" mode that requires routines that would hose them if they were exposed to the internet.

      XP was a great system for locking in customers and the huge problem it created was the fact that getting out of the trap of relying upon insecure software it created is too expensive for a large number of companies. Banks and many institutions still run XP terminals for this very reason, their internal software routines are all based upon core code that is not at all suited for a secure OS like Windows 7 that actually has sensible limited user privilege settings.

      Microsoft screwed up their big hit operating system XP's UAC so badly that a culture of writing core routines without consideration of UAC became the norm. Then when things screwed up the IT guys and gals had to run out and sell the bosses on add on security controls from someone other than Microsoft. This is why the snake oil sales of security software exploded in the first place.

      Vista tried to fix this problem but focused on Palladium. Windows 7 got multi-user privilege going properly to a certain extent but still relies upon .net code that can and does leave holes in because those who code for it are largely ignorant of how to secure things. Secure Computing or Palladium does not at all address these problems and the move to so called "trusted computing" has backfired on Microsoft. Most savvy IT managers know this and tell their bosses that moving past XP will not actually gain any real security benefits because of legacy activeX and .net code. The lack of sensible security methods in the first place within the windows networking code base has created a whale floundering on the beach.

      Microsoft's core business is ripe for the picking and I would not at all be surprised if we do not see some company or group of companies gang up and beat them up. A joint venture between hardware and software companies could do it. Who knows just maybe IBM will get it's revenge by releasing a killer db, office suite, server combo that can run old XP code sand boxed faster than a windows server. LOL

      Just maybe Ballmer's legacy will be the complete ruin of the once stellar bunch of corporate software raiders that Microsoft was. Problem is they have run out of ideas and truly innovative companies to usurp. We are currently at a technology bubble interface. The only advances will be things like HP's low power Moonshot servers. Unless something really shocking like Microsoft merging with Intel and actually starting to produce real physical product they are really in trouble this time around.

      There will be huge mergers soon in the tech industry, one that might shock everybody might be IBM an HP. Or the complete purchase of Dell by Microsoft, or as stated a merger between Microsoft and Intel. INTERESTING TIMES AHEAD and there will be blood on the floor of the stock exchange to be certain.

      --
      This message was not sent from an iPhone because Peter Sellers really was a deviated prevert without a dime for the call
    4. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by alen · · Score: 1

      bill gates was also the one who insisted on a "common user experience". or putting a desktop GUI onto their mobile devices even though it sucked.

    5. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Xiaran · · Score: 2

      Gates was also the one that almost missed the internet boat. They caught up but only via their existign dominance.

    6. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      Don't forget the MS OS/2 2.0 fiasco, or why did it take 10 years after the 386 was introduced before 32-bit programming became popular:

      http://yuhongbao.blogspot.ca/2012/12/about-ms-os2-20-fiasco-px00307-and-dr.html

      (notice the mention of DR-DOS in the end)

    7. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If Windows Mobile was actively being developed, they could have quickly fixed the UI. .(That's what Google did with Android.) The issue was Ballmer didn't think it was a priority, he simply didn't care about mobile.

      They also did the same thing with web browsers -- intentionally giving up their mindshare lead and 90% marketshare to save a few $$$ on headcount.

    8. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thanks for reminding us that Ballmer wasn't always an incompetent moron. He lead the IBM account and ended up fucking the world's largest computer company upside-down and sidewise. The whole OS/2 strategy was pure brilliance on his & Gates' part.

      PS: please stop spamming your blog

    9. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      Well, the unethical tactics was not so good.

    10. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      PS: please stop spamming your blog

      Sorry for that, there has several mentions of OS/2 recently, and I want to refer to the blog post instead of typing it up again.
      And there is a reason why I mentioned DR-DOS at the end of the blog post, BTW.

    11. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What was unethical about it? Stealing a monopoly from a convicted monopolist?

      Thank Xenu that IBM never achieved total power in the PC industry, as it would have been 10x worse that what Microsoft gave us -- the entire hardware stack would have been covered with patents and IBM would never have allowed PC servers. And therefore Linux, Google, etc would have never gotten off the ground.

      Fortunately the good guys won due to the "unethical" acts from bright competent men such as Ballmer. Thanks again for reminding us how Microsoft saved the PC from your dystopian IBM Monopolist ideal.

    12. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      I linked "Microsoft Munchkins" in the blog article for that reason, and keep in mind that is only one example.

    13. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And that link is incomprehensible to anyone who wasnt a hardcore OS2 Teamer.

      If you really are mad about some "unethical" FUD posted to CompuServe twenty-five years ago, I'd suggest you move on. That kind of thing happens 1000s a day on the modern Internet. Stuff that's far worse gets posted about iOS/Android always and meanwhile you're still boo-hooing about OS/2

      But more importantly, you are a IBM Monopolist Cocksucker, you have *nothing* in common with the MS dissidents who post on these sites. Just go away somewhere and quietly suckoff a mainframe and stop spamming your OS2 2.0 blog.

    14. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      If you really are mad about some "unethical" FUD posted to CompuServe twenty-five years ago, I'd suggest you move on.

      I know it is too late, but my point is that these unethical tactics were worse than working with IBM on OS/2, and I am not defending this JDA. I can dig out other sources if you like.

    15. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      For example, look at the infamous kill OS/2 multi-boot antitrust exhibit. Doesn't matter if MS actually did it, if they were desperate enough to think about such tactics, that proves my point.

    16. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      Posted the same link in a different thread, and got a different response: http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=4126317&cid=44667241

    17. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      1: MS needs to get rid of the 10 settings repositories (Registry, COM+, COM, WMI, WBEM, DDE, Etc) and needs to replace them with a new system that does the following:

      A: Creates a standard resource space for each application or service that mimics VM's. These resource spaces dynamically increase or decrease depending on requests to the kernel. On the disk they are contained in Virtual Volumes; in memory by virtual memory, and in the processor by virtual processes. User configurable Settings are stored within a virtual metadata file. This includes an application space and user space module (user space means the user will see a folder of all their save games for all their games, but the data is actually stored in the virtual volume).

      B: Binary Dependancy Management. Binaries are used uni-directionally between apps; When an app calls a binary, it's loaded into memory. If multiple apps use that binary, it's loaded into memory once. Apps cannot modify a binary, and if they do (you provide them with permission), that binary is both exempted from patching (the software designer is now responsible for making sure they're supporting the most recent version, a copy is stored in the VM and in the OS), and may have it's access to other OS resources revoked (e.g. reading files) depending on the config.

      C: These Mini-VM's can be configured to emulate legacy environments. E.G. WinXP, Win7, Win2000, DOS, etc. Each app has it's own WBEM, it's own WMI, it's own Registry, etc.

      D: A standard metadata registry that is broken up on a per-app per-service basis (per VM since everything's contained in VM's). GPO's and ADMX files correspond to these metadata items. Global variables are stored in this registry.

      2: Needs to un-fuck the user interface; intuitive user interfaces work like the thing you are using works. No more renaming control panel objects every fucking windows edition or burying options 50 fucking menu's down; Renaming "Networking" to "Network and sharing" to make you feel all special pisses me off to no fucking end. These are bad design decisions. The person who came up with them needs to be FIRED. The UI needs to be simplified on a per-app, per-service basis.

      3: Bring back the start menu.

      4: Simplify the licensing model.

      Complex licensing maximizes profit and political correctness at the expense of making your users, administrators, and people in general hate you.
      Simple licensing is inviting.

      5: Invite users to try before you buy while at the same time reducing costs.

      Re-open tech net.

      Create "Lab" Versions of Windows that are useful for demonstrations (and can be enabled full-on with an unlock key).

      E.G. Terminal services that is fully clusterable\usable but you can get to have 5 users at once to use it and a 180 day activation period.

      Cripple AD so you only get 20 user and computer accounts loaded at once.

      Cripple web services so it can only host 50mb of webpages.

      This is fucking easy to do. FFS.

      6: Version windows in an intelligent fashion.

      Windows needs to be broken into major versions (Basic, Professional, Enterprise, Ultimate).

      And pay-per add-on packs (Media, Mobile, Accessibility, Productivity, Security, Remote access, Office E-mail, Office Basic, Office Enterprise).

      7: Introduce sanity into their versioning and certification model.

      MS Technet subscription for $150 a year gets you crippled versions of windows and access to enterprise software as well as exam discounts.

      Every 3 months MS releases a service pack. This contains stable patches and feature updates (since we all know MS loves to release patches that break the OS, some businesses may decide to update several months behind.

      Every 2 years MS releases a new R2 version of the OS. This updates the OS so it stays current. (e.g. if AES gets broken, it adds AES 2.0. If file browser is broken, new file browser.) Patches for Non-R2 editions cease. Minor incremental features are added in such a way you don't hose th

    18. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How gets so much bullshit rated so high?

      1) There is almost no business software out there, that can't be made to run on Windows 7 in any way. If all compatibility modes fail, there is still visualization. Most corporations aren't moving, because there is no need to, their stuff works right now.
      2) There never was UAC in XP in the first place, so how could they have messed it up? The problem of XP is simply: Either everybody is already administrator or there are so many local exploits, that it isn't hard to run your code in one of the many privileged modes...
      3) There is no single fucking reason why .net code cannot be secure in itself... The whole thing about .net is that managed code can be much more secure than native code in the first place.
      4) What parts of Native Windows 7 are written in .net and holding it back in regards of security?
      5) Sandboxing a Windows XP environment is actually possible right now and isn't hard in any way. Just fire up an XP instance in VirtualBox, VMWare or whatever hypervisor you want: done. We don't need another killer db, office suite, server combo for that...

    19. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by evilviper · · Score: 2

      the main difference between Bill and Steve on recent issues was that Bill resigned to the fact that they were already too late on things like music players and phones and he wouldn't have even tried getting in.

      Microsoft was one of the earliest forces in PDAs, smartphones, and tablets. They had very early projects to develop the technology, they knew it was coming, but no amount of a lead could get their foot in the door. Their offerings were just such committee-designed crap that nobody wanted it. Microsoft failed miserably at coming up with anything new or innovating, so here they are, today, high-tech roadkill.

      WinCE dates back to 1996 and they were just about giving it away. Up until recently, they were nearly the only recognizable name in the PDA/Smartphone/tablet space, so EVERYTHING was running WinCE, no matter how hard you looked for something else. They had EVERY advantage, and squandered it all.

      I can't really blame them for missing the MP3 boat... That's hardware, and Microsoft doesn't do hardware. That said, playing MP3s (and Oggs) and low-res videos was one of the first killer-apps for WinCE PDAs. It's amazing that they never put together a decent media player for the platform (ala iTunes), nor developed good power management for such purposes, nor pushed manufacturers to build-in multimedia features that might have led to something with a CompactFlash hard drive that pre-dated the iPod. I guess Microsoft saw portable devices as gadgets that wouldn't impact their big profitable PC market, so they didn't put hardly any effort behind it.

      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    20. Re:Didn't he just keep up the status quo? by lightknight · · Score: 1

      Dude, just try and fix the security thing in the Enterprise. It's Hell on Earth.

      You end up giving people too many permissions, or too little. Business wants things to happen, doesn't understand anything until after they are robbed; on the other hand, bureaucracy doesn't understand the need to move while people are still around and maintaining some level of interest in their job. Add in the whole human angle, where humans are, let's be honest, very capable, if motivated to, breaking something...and you have a problem.

      Some places think giving everyone permissions / access to the company web server isn't going far enough...some companies think that giving software developers carte blanche rights to install whatever software they want on their laptops without forms signed in triplicate is going too far.

      --
      I am John Hurt.
  11. Artist my ass by djupedal · · Score: 2
    These are the questions hanging over Balmer - you can't tell us that catching up has anything to do with them:
    • How can you be that far off what consumers want?
    • Was it that you're not listening to your team?
    • Was it because the team was afraid to give you advice?
    • Was it because the team saw a different reality?
    • Or was it that the team lacked the skill set to anticipate the failure (and who takes the blame for that?)?
    1. Re:Artist my ass by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      These are the questions hanging over Balmer - you can't tell us that catching up has anything to do with them:

      • How can you be that far off what consumers want?

      By not caring what customers want and relying on a market dominance position, enabling them to dictate what people want, whether they want or not.

      Simple as that.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  12. So what they're saying is by Spy+Handler · · Score: 5, Interesting

    MS should hire Elon Musk as CEO?

    1. Re:So what they're saying is by symbolset · · Score: 2

      I would prefer Leo Apothaker, Carly Fiorina, Stephen Elop, Jim Balsillie, Jerry Yang, Ron Johnson (of JC Penney) and Susan G. Komen - for about 9-18 months each. Any order will do. At the end of that we might be safe.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    2. Re:So what they're saying is by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      If you put Musk in charge of Microsoft, he would hall all R&D efforts and redirect the budget into Windows Mind, a new brain-wave-controlled PC/smartphone OS that literally works without your lifting a finger. Windows Mind 1.0 would arrive in 2027, at $1M per seat, and promise to change the world by 2040; along the way, Musk kills time by engaging in flamewars with a blogger whose copy of Windows Mind won't stop googling for child porn web sites, and open-sourcing his back-of-the-envelope calculations that show cancer can be cured for $6B. In 2044, Xbox Two featuring Kinect Mind enters the market, but is quickly pulled when people discover it's communicating users' thoughts to the NSA.

      In the meantime, we're stuck with Windows 8.1.x for decades because Musk can't be bothered with something so boring as maintaining an existing product line. Most people move to Macs by 2016; the rest start using Wine, which finally achieves complete compatibility with Windows ME in 2034, with a roadmaps showing it will run Metro binaries by 2100. Buoyed by this milestone, ReactOS successfully runs and completes Solitaire in 2038, raising everyone's hopes that it will mature into a true Windows successor within the millenium.

    3. Re:So what they're saying is by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A pasty face South African cocksucker with an ego the size of Jupiter? NO, THANK YOU. And fuck you for even suggesting something so asinine.

  13. urp by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sorry.... I have problems with any tech writer that either doesn't know what linux is or ignores it on purpose.

  14. Microsoft has always focused on development tools by jfdavis668 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    But somewhere left the developers behind. They started to treat them as people who supported Microsoft, instead of the other way around.

  15. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by theskipper · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Which boils down to...they need a product focused person. Someone like Marissa Mayer. A seriously good read no matter how you feel about her turnaround methodology at Yahoo:

    http://www.businessinsider.com/marissa-mayer-biography-2013-8

    It's hard to imagine they'll find a single person to undo the last 13 years of stagnation at MSFT but it could happen. I suspect Yahoo will be the turnaround case study in B-school five years from now. Not Microsoft.

  16. But how did he manage to survive? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I agree that it's going to be dead boring for a while until the writers get Balmer's retirement out of their systems.

    But there is one little point I'd like someone to try to explain --- how come that he was never kicked out? The tea lady would have done a better job for the company. And yet, he wasn't thrown out on his ass for complete and total inability to stop the downward spiral, despite it being obvious within 18 months.

    How the hell did he manage to avoid the fate so richly deserved?

    1. Re:But how did he manage to survive? by Belial6 · · Score: 1

      Gates left because the company peaked and was about to start a downward spiral. Not the other way around.

    2. Re:But how did he manage to survive? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not about Gates, it's about the company after Gates.

      The company was in a downward spiral with Gates gone, sure, but that's why it needed a competent CEO to level off the downturn and make it head back up.

      Ballmer did neither. He might as well not have been there for all the effect he had. He provided people with plenty of things to joke about, but zero results. That suggests that he did not understand the basis of Microsoft's success, and so he addressed only things that were irrelevant.

    3. Re:But how did he manage to survive? by symbolset · · Score: 2

      Gates left because he won. He dropped out of college and turned his hobby into the largest pile of privately acquired wealth on Earth. He was the Alpha Geek. Game over.

      He could sit there atop his treasure like Smaug and wait for a hero to come, or he could parley it into a new game - and that is what he is on about now. His "Giving Pledge" had rounded up commitments of well over $125 Billion for charity by August 2010, making him also the most successful philanthropist in all of human history - the Alpha Giver - as well. By now that pile of giving may be higher than Microsoft's entire market capitalization. If he keeps at it the pile may swell so much that it is never beaten. He's got his eye on banishing Malaria and many other ills that have always plagued mankind to the pages of history - forever - saving untold millions of lives throughout all the rest of human history.

      Compared to that running a company is small potatoes.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    4. Re: But how did he manage to survive? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Despite the down spiral, he was still making money.

    5. Re:But how did he manage to survive? by ruir · · Score: 3

      Hi don't know really which part of the story you missed about his family being millionaire, his mother being influential in Washington, and IBMs president being a friend of his mother Despite everything, I take my hat to Mr. Gates as a shrewd businessman, if the not the most one of the 80s. Pity they based their entire business model into asphyxiating the competition and not really innovating. What I don't buy the tale of his "hobby success", and "visionary" approach.

    6. Re:But how did he manage to survive? by hlavac · · Score: 1

      Ballmer was systematically destroying potential competition within the company for years now to keep that job. He killed the company by doing it.

  17. Getting out of this mess by BenJeremy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Microsoft spent millions every year researching things like user interfaces.

    They threw it all away in a short-sighted quest to shove their way into the revenue stream of walled markets.

    I think a return to basics - provide value to their best customers (Corporate IT) - through improving productivity and offering stable development environments to encourage those customers to invest in a Microsoft ecosystem.

    At this very moment, the only thing tying corporations to the "Microsoft Ecosystem" are Windows 7, Windows Server 2008 and pretty much everything pre-2012. Admins don't need "Modern UI" interfaces on their server boxes. Developers don't need monochrome toolbar buttons and screaming menus. Desktop users don't need to gestures to do their daily work. All of those mis-steps has IT departments across the country realizing that while they do not WANT to put the effort into leaving that ecosystem, Microsoft has left them with no choice - So now the decision is to move to something slightly less familiar (Linux and OSX), or move to something WILDLY unfamiliar (Windows 8, Server 2012, etc...) - which makes more sense? so It departments are no longer beholden to Microsoft, thanks to Microsoft's own stupid decisions.

    Get back to what worked. Mobile and Desktop are separate markets, which is why Apple didn't paste the iOS UI onto OSX, and why Android isn't a desktop operating system. Stop trying so hard for convergence in the UI when we aren't even close, technologically, to making that happen. Stop forcing your customers to face painful training budgets and re-writing legacy apps just to fit into your executive's superfluous decisions to bully them into the Metro UI with the idea that it would somehow magically sell millions of mobile devices with "Windows 8" (more like "Tiles 1"). That effort failed spectacularly, by any measure, so step back, lick your wounds, and give the customers what they want, instead of shoving what YOU want down their throats.

    1. Re:Getting out of this mess by VortexCortex · · Score: 1

      Microsoft spent millions every year researching things like user interfaces.

      That explains why MS Windows looked pretty much like the design that Xerox-PARC showed both MS and Apple... And why deviating from that design after all those millions of dollars of research went so well for them?

      Sorry, the toxic inter-company competitive bureaucracy in MS makes them as dumb as a box of rocks if that's what you get for decades of UI research.

      Here, I'll fucking do them the favor: You ask the users how to improve the OS in the sticking points: Stop patronizing and make that "Windows $W was my idea" commercial real. Then you post different UI changes in public beta and get user response, nixing shit that's horrible no matter who's ugly baby it is. This way you get proper market research and don't roll out a fucking flop. Additionally, it costs less since you divert that waste on flops into creating new innovative directions that pay for themselves.

      They threw it all away in a short-sighted quest to shove their way into the revenue stream of walled markets.

      There is absolutely zero reason Windows 8 couldn't have looked and worked like Windows7 and kept the app market as well. So, they didn't give up the UI for the app market (Linux has had the "app store" co-existing with X11 for a long time).

      So now the decision is to move to something slightly less familiar (Linux and OSX), or move to something WILDLY unfamiliar (Windows 8, Server 2012, etc...) - which makes more sense? so It departments are no longer beholden to Microsoft, thanks to Microsoft's own stupid decisions.

      The only sane thing to do is use a POSIX OS: Those who do not understand POSIX will re-implement it poorly. See BASH vs Power Shell, oh look a command line interface... like you get when you start typing on the interface formally known as Metro...

      Here's how MS fixes everything. Use Linux or BSD. All those OS changes are essentially at the application level anyway. Just re-skin a standard POSIX OS that everyone already tested. Embracing BSD will let MS create the closed source walled garden bullshit so they can get right back to Extending and Extinguishing the FLOSS world. The proprietary file formats and protocols MS uses to create vendor lock in will run fine on GNU/Linux already...

      I mean, why duplicate all that work if others have already done it and will keep doing it? I do experimental OS development, and there are some things (like stack smashing and code pointer protection (via privilege ring)) that modern OSs would benefit from greatly, but the current OSs have vastly incompatible designs. There's a reason why new more secure OSs aren't adopted right away -- New code means New Bugs. MS could simply stop re-inventing the wheel and just do the body work, like we're always blaming Apple of doing.

      Get back to what worked. Mobile and Desktop are separate markets

      More General purpose hardware always wins. Mechanical Pinball games lost to Programmable Arcade Cabinets lost to Game Consoles which are set to lose to PCs (PS4 & XBone are AMD x64 PCs) and will be transforming into Mobiles as compute power increases (consoles have always been weaker than PCs for the duration of their lives). The same goes for the Mechanical Adding Machines which lost to Digital Calculators lost to Mainframe Computers w/ terminals lost to Microcomputers which are transforming into Mobiles. Dedicated hardware like Arcades and Super Computers still exist, and so will Desktop computers, to suit the smaller markets that need such things. Most consumers don't need a Super Computer, sadly, most won't need a traditional desktop power-house either.

      The trend is smaller and faster and more general purpose (a smart phone is a pocket PC that makes phone calls). Slot your phone into your big screen monitor use it with a wireless keyboard and mouse that charges by induction, ej

    2. Re:Getting out of this mess by benjymouse · · Score: 1

      The only sane thing to do is use a POSIX OS: Those who do not understand POSIX will re-implement it poorly. See BASH vs Power Shell, oh look a command line interface... like you get when you start typing on the interface formally known as Metro...

      POSIX is based on 1970 era ideas of operating systems. While you can argue that it is time tested, there are also many areas where the designs are showing the age. Todays hardware is radically different from what could even be imagined just 20 years ago.

      The Windows stack is much better positioned to make efficient use of resources in an increasingly parallel and (not least) asynchronous world. Asynchronicity in POSIX is a meager story, so much so that Linux had to go invent epoll to avoid inefficient busy polling*. Meanwhile Windows NT always had callback/event based asynchronous/overlapped IO built in.

      But perhaps more importantly, Microsoft is quietly transitioning the APIs and guiding developers use to asynchronous programming patterns. Traditionally only select types of applications would use asynchronous programming patterns. Think database servers and other server-type of applications where the added complexity was justified by the need to scalability and performance. But asynchronous programming techniques was frequently deemed too complex for ordinary applications, web applications and the like, even though they could benefit from it. The problem was the balance between complexity and effect.

      Witness Windows Runtime where any operation that may take more than 50ms is offered as an asynchronous operation exclusively, i.e. developers are guided to use asynchronicity. That would be bad if it wasn't for Microsofts innovations in bringing asynchronicity up from to the application developers. Programming languages like C#, VB.NET and F# now allows application developers to take direct advantage of inherently asynchronous APIs.

      Asynchronicity is not multi-threading. Traditionally developers has solved asynchronous requirements by spinning up a thread (or use one from a pool) and have the thread do the waiting. While it seemingly worked ok (for a while), it is a waste of resources when all the thread does it is block waiting for an IO request to complete. As more and more applications need to interact more and more with external resources, this waste of resources become massive.

      Unlike the Linux kernel, the Windows kernel implement overlapped/asynchronous IO (disk/network/...) using the reactive pattern (IO completion ports). Think DMA: As a developer you instruct the OS to fill a buffer with bytes received from a network stream. You *offload* the operation to the OS (which will quite possibly use DMA internally) and you don't hear from the OS again until the operation completes (or fails), i.e. no context switches back and forth. The POSIX doesn't even specify anything like that. Linix has epoll which is the proactive pattern: The OS will tell you when there are bytes ready to be read, but it cannot take responsibility for the entire logical operation. This creates more context switches.

      POSIX is hopelessly outdated, and transitioning to POSIX in an age where every POSI" OS has had to implement extra mechanisms just to compete and take advantage of modern hardware, would be stupid. Windows kernel and development stack is much better positioned to meet the challenges of massively asynchronous applications.

      --
      Reading slashdot one-liner: (irm http://rss.slashdot.org/Slashdot/slashdot).rdf.item | fl title,desc*
    3. Re:Getting out of this mess by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      AMEN. But its worse than unfamiliar interfaces, it is counter-productive interfaces and approaches. When I am trying to do something on a server there may be a whole series of programs that have to be used. Forcing me to go from one full screen panel, then three steps to get to the next one, just wasted my time. And because most server access is via remote desktop, most of the cute shortcuts to waving the cursor around the corner in the hopes that the 'charm bar' would pop up, dont work. And losing highly productive and cost-effective packages like Small Business Server was nuts. Sure, in Redmond or other bastions of technocracy, local fibre makes the cloud a wonderful thing. Out here in eastern Canada, a reliable, high speed Internet connection is a dream -- at any price. Being cloud-based simply means sometimes you cant get there at all -- very third world, I admit, but the reality. And when migrating a trivial Active Directory domain takes several times longer than keying it in from scratch (ignoring multiple restores due to internal errors in the process) there is something seriously wrong. Did no one ever test this stuff? And who thought ring tones on a server was a good idea? Don't know about anyone else, but I worship stuff that works... and MS has been working hard to break everything they did right that works. So I am writing this on a Ubuntu laptop, check my email on an Android/gmail device. Got a bunch of linux VMs downstairs on ESX (wishing for VMS...). Not as a curiosity but as learning exercises for a future where MS solutions are unusable and no longer cost-effective.

      MS does not need a catchup artist, but someone who listens to their customers and takes them places they want to go.

    4. Re: Getting out of this mess by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree with most of what you say, but I see so many people on sites like Slashdot saying that IT departments are running away from Microsoft and looking at alternatives. I just don't see it happening, certainly not in my department or on other websites that I read. Its not true to suggest that Linux is only slightly less familiar and Windows 8 is drastically unfamiliar. We're not just talking about an operating systems start menu interface. We're talking about all of the applications that users need to run. Windows 8 is pretty much the same as Windows 7 in that respect. Moving users to Linux would require drastically more work in finding similar applications, or configuring Windows applications to run on Linux on top of using a new interface. Not to mention learning to configure Linux make it do what Active Directory and such does for IT departments. Training users is annoying but preferable to replacing an entire ecosystem and training users on top of that. and even more preferable is just waiting longer and continuing to use Windows 7. My company only just switched to it and office 2010 late last year.Windows 8 is barely on our radar!

  18. Catch-up because by tuppe666 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    (Ketchup?!)

    No, microsoft doesn't need to catch up because it isn't behind. They have everything, what it doesn't have is something that is different, innovativ and without spyware.

    Microsoft in the suddenly relevant, consumer, mobile, socially linked, always connected, future now...behind in market share, mindshare, technology both hardware and software with a poisonous brand, a stench of repeated failure, leaving its OEM Slaves and hostages as expendable casualties...even though they suddenly have to compete.

    1. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They should hire Andy Rubin. That would shut a lot of people up, and lead to some awesome products.

    2. Re:Catch-up because by poetmatt · · Score: 1

      what makes you think Andy Rubin wants to work for MS?

      fallacy.

    3. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There is a bit of a difference between working for and running. Maybe your right and he would prefer to work for Eric than take hold of a multi billion dollar company himself, my gut feeling is your wrong.

    4. Re:Catch-up because by hairyfeet · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Oh bullshit, put somebody with a brain in the big chair and they could slaughter, all the tools are there, its just Ballmer has his one track mind locked so hard on Cupertino it was a miracle he could walk in a straight line!

      Hell put ME in the big chair and i could double the stock price just using good old fashioned common sense. First people hate metro or are afraid to buy a new unit because what if they hate Metro too? I'd tell them "Not a problem, anybody that buys ANY copy of Win 8, OEM, upgrade, whatever, if you try it and don't like it? We'll trade your key for the equivalent Windows 7 key so you have nothing to lose"...BAM! You just fixed the windows 8 problem right there. Fuck win 8.1, roll it into a service pack and call it a day, this ain't 93 and .1s look douchey, instead OS releases will be once every 3 for consumer (and they have the option of going back up to 2 releases, just swap the key) and 6 for business who will have the option of going back one release. Metro will NOT be default, it will be OPTIONAL and we'll buy out ModernMix and integrate it so if you want to use metro apps on the desktop? then do so, its YOUR PC and YOU get to choose what and how it runs.

      Next we need more income coming in and to fix the mobile problem, okay not a big deal. For the income we start rolling out services Joe and Jane can actually use and give a fuck about, leave the appstore crapstore junk for mobile. Instead imagine getting a CC sized key, pops into any USB, and lets you have a secure remote session with your home PC from work or vice versa? Not a problem when using MSFT servers for the middle man and we'd make that shit more simple to use than your average ATM. For the home users we peer with groups like Akamai (cut down on latency and the risk you'll hit your cap) and we start cutting deals with networks and movie houses, you'll be able to buy bundles or ala cart Internet entertainment with the goal to be to get everything anybody could possibly want available as a stream and if you want to buy it? Just click the button and its yours, and it'll all integrate with Windows Media Center so ANY desktop or laptop with an HDMI out is now an instant HTPC, no setting up or hassles, just plug and go.

      Finally as for mobile too long as the mobile division been crippled by Ballmer and Gates, first trying to jam a teeny tiny desktop onto phones and then trying to jam phones onto desktops, that shit WILL end under me. Instead we spin off WinPhone who will now be called ModernOS, it will have the ability to run BOTH Android AND WinPhone apps, and the ONLY connection with the desktop is a "it must work simply" mantra. which means if you choose WinPhone over Android you WILL see the benefits, everything from being able to remote access and even track your phone from your desktop to streaming from your PC to your ModernPhone to even using it as a remote for your desktop or laptop, thus making the HTPC idea even nicer. Your SO wants to watch that twilight crap while the game is on? Slap on some phones connected to your ModernPhone and screen the game from one of our channels to your phone!

      See how fricking easy it would be to make money with MSFT if they didn't have a CEO with his head up his ass? And this is just what I could come up with off the top of my head, if I gave it any real thought I could come up with dozens more...ohh, get ready for some gold....how about an innovation bounty? Instead of the employees backstabbing each other with that stack crap instead we offer a bounty on innovation, you come up with a great product YOU get a cut of every sale, be that in software or hardware, give the employees a reason to really bust ass for the company again. i could go on all day as the raw materials ARE there, its the leadership that has been throwing everything away trying to be Cupertino North.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    5. Re:Catch-up because by mcneely.mike · · Score: 0

      As a linux user, I liked Ballme... Ballmer (sorry).

      You, sir, have ideas and I don't like it... not at all. Nope. Please do not hand your resume in to MSFT, and I hope you're not in contention for the 'chair' (if there are any left after Ballmer's tantrums). :)

      --
      soylentnews.org Go there to enjoy the people!
    6. Re:Catch-up because by Xiaran · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I am the head of a US TV network and you are in your first meeting with me. You want to offer ala cart TV content to just anyone? Are you mad? I already have agreements about exclusivity with regional TV stations. And there is just no fucking way I am going to let you allow that shit out of the US... do you have any *fucking* idea about the agreements we have with overseas networks? Your fucking dreaming! Get the fuck out of my office and come back when you are prepared to be more reasonable like netflix, apple and google!

    7. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      what makes you think Andy Rubin wants to work for MS?

      Money.

    8. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hell put ME in the big chair and i could double the stock price just using good old fashioned common sense.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHwegwXwwHs

    9. Re:Catch-up because by metalmaster · · Score: 2

      the MSiah cometh..... no, but seriously im sure each of these ideas(as awesome as they may sound) are impossible to execute. A.) There's so much red tape that even our most awesome cutting implements wouldnt get through it. B.) They are simply impractical from a developer standpoint. It's easy to throw out idea after idea, but it means nothing until you put it in motion.

    10. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      All Windows 8 needs is a detection mechanism in the installer. If it detects a touchscreen, Metro is default, if not then classic desktop is default. Of course there should be an option within Windows itself to switch the default as well.

    11. Re:Catch-up because by Mycroft_VIII · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "So we just buy your network, or at least a large enough interest in it to replace whomever we need to to make things happen. Our Way"

      Mycroft

      --
      https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
    12. Re:Catch-up because by BitZtream · · Score: 2

      Buying the network doesn't release the network from its contractual obligations, try again.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    13. Re:Catch-up because by war4peace · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Boom headshot.

      Yes, there's plenty people with plenty great ideas, and then they get tangled in politics and realize it's impossible.

      We have a saying around here (roughly translated): On your way to god, the saints will eat you alive.

      --
      ...gis sdrawkcab (usually not responding to ACs; don't bother posting as AC)
    14. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Everything is negotiable. Oops, our last Silverlight update seems to have broken everything, so sorry about that. Fortunately we bought Adobe and pushed an update to support Flash,,, oh wait Flash, all of a sudden doesn't work. Sorry... We're soo sorry.

    15. Re: Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't really understand, metro was put there so the store and ads would be front and center, there is no good reason to remove metro start screen.

    16. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you become CEO, I'll buy MS stock.

    17. Re:Catch-up because by mark99 · · Score: 1

      He does know how to swear like Gates (at least like he used to). And he does have a newish vision.

      Kind of light on Enterprise though. MSFT needs someone who can do both. It is a tall order.

    18. Re:Catch-up because by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      First people hate metro or are afraid to buy a new unit because what if they hate Metro too? I'd tell them "Not a problem, anybody that buys ANY copy of Win 8, OEM, upgrade, whatever, if you try it and don't like it? We'll trade your key for the equivalent Windows 7 key so you have nothing to lose"...BAM! You just fixed the windows 8 problem right there.

      But...the tablet and app store is where the money's at, not those stuffy old corporations who only do boring real work!

      --
      No sig today...
    19. Re:Catch-up because by sydneyfong · · Score: 1

      Interesting... where do you live?

      --
      Don't quote me on this.
    20. Re:Catch-up because by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      They should hire Andy Rubin. That would shut a lot of people up, and lead to some awesome products

      If you'd said that while he was still at Google, I'd have agreed...

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    21. Re:Catch-up because by kelemvor4 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      what makes you think Andy Rubin wants to work for MS?

      Money.

      Funny that this concise and most likely accurate post got down voted.

    22. Re:Catch-up because by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

      Microsoft cannot be fixed overnight. It took 15 years to break it that way.

      There are established organizations and cultures that have kingdoms built and armies amassed - built and based on the status quo.

      You could bring Steve Jobs back from the dead and put him in charge. He'd still spend five years tunneling like John Henry through a mountain made of shit - with constant fighting off seditious "leaders" - before a glimpse of daylight would be seen.

      Microsoft product and engineering are built around "feature teams". What does that mean? Well, the "Start" menu was owned by a few such teams. Look what this did! The NT4/95 menu works right. That stopped working for them, around the time XP shipped. It only got worse...

      --
      "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
      Never been known to fail..."
    23. Re:Catch-up because by bzipitidoo · · Score: 2

      Oh come now. Ballmer is so bad even a monkey or a vacant chair would do a better job as CEO.

      What's wrong with MS, and what to do about it isn't that hard to see, and hairyfeet touches on a good bit of it. Change the corporate culture, starting with elimination of stack ranking. Don't dictate to the users by taking away the start button "for their own good". Ditto with the arrogant insult to our intelligence they try to call Windows Genuine "Advantage". And then there was that whole OOXML fiasco. It was such a blatantly obvious and very dirty attempt to derail ODF. MS barely tried to make a case for OOXML on the merits, because they knew very well that it didn't have any. Instead, they played dirty, bribing and leaning on the standards voters. No organization, however big and powerful, can ever afford to wallow in filth. It's easy to see though that their entire approach to standardizing file formats is a reflection of the treachery within.

      Developers trying to use their dogfood will eventually run into marketing hype where one expects documentation. For the most part, the documentation is okay, but sometimes you're trying to find out what something is and what it does, and all you get is empty verbiage about how this "powerful" product will "spark your imagination" and "increase your productivity". Just makes MS look even more stupidly treacherous and arrogant. They don't call a spade a spade. And they can't even muster a bit of cunning anymore. Those are hardly the only problems. Think that their penchant for rearrangement stops with their menus? They keep changing their APIs around. They don't fix bugs in a timely manner, instead they are more likely to roll out a whole new library with a totally different API that may or may not work better. All the more infuriating when you realize they do some of that solely to break competitors' products.

      Not that MS was once a model tech company. They got hauled into court and convicted, but that didn't impress them in the least. They were not persuaded to mend their ways. They've always been ruthlessly competitive, but largely forgiven because people liked their stuff, and that because it mostly worked. Now, when people don't like MS's products, because their stuff doesn't work so well any more, all those problems they've managed to keep swept under the rug all these years are stinking worse than ever. I'm seeing users chuck their Wintel boxes and switch to MacIntoshes. 15 years ago, in those college labs that were about 50-50 on PCs and Macs, the Macs would sit there, unused and unloved, even when the PCs were all taken and had a waiting list. I wonder what I would see now in those labs? Forlorn PCs and a line for Macs?

      --
      Intellectual Property is a monopolistic, selfish, and defective concept. It is "tyranny over the mind of man"
    24. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your (sic) a *fucking* (sic) idiot!

    25. Re:Catch-up because by JasoninKS · · Score: 1

      Well put. MS was the big dog and got comfortable on top. They keep adding bells and whistles that no one uses into Office while most people just want, as has been said, just simply works. Their OS is bloated, but some of that is holding onto 10-15 year old back compatibility. Every other OS version has been a crap-fest since 2000. I use both PC and Mac and have for years. At this point the Macs give me less issues.

      Apple is headed the same way though. Getting comfortable on top and Google isn't afraid to blast a few shots across their bow. A couple decades from now perhaps it will be Google on top with some upstart barking at them.

    26. Re:Catch-up because by lightknight · · Score: 1

      Of course, because mindshare / word of mouth / buzz / flash in the pan / eyeballs / and likes are more important than putting out a product that your customers (corporate and home / small-business) would consider, I don't know, 'useful' in the 'Oh God, I did not know something like that existed, it's expensive, but it scratches an itch that I did not know could be scratched, and makes it go away forever without notice' kind of way.

      --
      I am John Hurt.
    27. Re:Catch-up because by aurizon · · Score: 1

      Microsoft = Kodak, died a long time ago, but scattered brains kept it moving until the rot made it fall down and the flies got at it...

    28. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Russian?

    29. Re:Catch-up because by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      I didn't touch on enterprise because frankly that one is beyond simple to fix. First we could through the maze of bullshit that is Windows licenses, we make that shit simple with language a third grader could read. Second all the extra tier shit is gone, you got SMB, corporate, and datacenter, that's it. And the differences will be spelled out simply so anybody can take 2 minutes and decide what is right for your business. Your business grows and need to go up a tier? We'll take your old keys for 100% credit on the next tier, so ALL you pay is the difference.

      That is just the start, MSFT has fucked up so much I could go on all damned day but just those changes would have IT guys across the country cheering my name at the top of their lungs and would go a long way towards fixing the mess.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    30. Re:Catch-up because by Sollord · · Score: 1

      When did he leave Google? I know he moved from the Android team but I don't recall him leaving the company

    31. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am the head of a US TV network and you are in your first meeting with me. You want to offer ala cart TV content to just anyone? Are you mad? I already have agreements about exclusivity with regional TV stations. And there is just no fucking way I am going to let you allow that shit out of the US... do you have any *fucking* idea about the agreements we have with overseas networks? Your fucking dreaming! Get the fuck out of my office and come back when you are prepared to be more reasonable like netflix, apple and google!

      Your view - and the industry's - of 'a la carte' is twisted. I don't give a fuck if Disney wants to bundle 25 channels together. What I would* want as a consumer is the option to drop Disney altogether (and then I just have channels from Viacom, Fox, Turner...). If Disney or someone wants to raise prices 50%, "sure, go ahead as we just take your price, divide by 0.7, and if the end users drop your ass, 'oh well'!".

      It is not the agreements with one company that are the main problem, but the collusion between companies.

      Anyway, I cancelled my Dish a couple years ago and now have internet only and OTA HDTV (aka free TV). Don't miss it and when/if I do, there are torrents out there.

    32. Re:Catch-up because by Meski · · Score: 1

      Oh come now. Ballmer is so bad even a monkey or a vacant chair would do a better job as CEO.

      monkeys, vacant chairs. Will there be flying chairs? A flying chair screen saver? (kind of an Oz/Balmer/Toaster combo)

    33. Re:Catch-up because by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Sure it can, don't like my ideas? there is your pink slip, don't let the door hit ya on the way out. First thing you'd have to do is clear out all of Ballmer's little yes men and lickspittles, wouldn't be hard to do, not with the board scared pissless of Apple and me telling them we are gonna be the big dog again.

      The problem with MSFT is Ballmer has been laser locked on Cupertino and Wall Street instead of putting boots on the ground to make damned sure he knew the pulse of his customers, any retailer can tell you that when you don't know WTF your customers want you are dead meat. Instead he just tried to "me too" his way out of the problem and wasted nearly a decade being the half ass ersatz instead of making good products, again a killer.

      The ONE thing they should have taken from Jobs is "you don't have to beat the other guy to win". Jobs knew this, he didn't try to beat MSFT at their own game, instead he made up a new game and MSFT ended up (foolishly) playing their game by their rules and got bitchslapped for it. Instead of killing themselves to make a shitty ARM device nobody wants they SHOULD have been on the horn with Intel and AMD and doing everything they could to integrate as tight as they could with the latest chips so that MSFT software would be beyond reproach when it came to X86, what did they do instead? They were so focused on ARM that AMD had to actually DROP an innovative feature, the "per core PowerNow" that would drop ONLY cores that weren't in use thus minimizing power usage because Vista would just ignore what the chip was telling it and pile on work on the sleeping core, slowing down the system and causing it to waste instead of save power, inexcusable.

      Now you have both Intel and AMD coming out with ULV chips and who are they talking up? Android. MSFT should have had their products running so fucking good on X86 that even thinking of running anything else would have gotten you laughed at, but they let PHBs and marketing drones run the company and all you got was bling and bloat. First thing I would do is clear house and then lay out EXACTLY what needed to be done and then get to it, too much time wasted to be wasting more on red tape, cut the bull and get back to making MSFT the best products you can buy for computers and go from there.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    34. Re:Catch-up because by Xiaran · · Score: 2

      Dude... that is not my view. That is an illustration of the problem. My comment was an appeal to people to be smarter.

    35. Re: Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Even Russian saints, the handful resurrected after Communism, are not that carnivorous! Probably some country where they take religion seriously...

    36. Re:Catch-up because by darenw · · Score: 1

      If only Head of Microsoft were an elected office! You've got my vote.

    37. Re:Catch-up because by hawkinspeter · · Score: 1

      USA's appalling education showing again.

      --
      You're a temporary arrangement of matter sliding towards oblivion in a cold, uncaring universe
    38. Re:Catch-up because by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Errrr... then couldn't you have picked a smarter "illustration"?

  19. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Unfortunately I can't recommend cloud based products to my clients. Having a hard dependency on network connectivity to the internet is a non-starter for most people.

    That's where that business model fails. For the most part though, the "Servers" I see in use throughout most businesses could be whittled down to an i5 or an i7 with some fakeraid. Anyone trying to sell anything more than an extremely low range xeon server to someone with 4-5 employees, with the only hard requirements being a database which will never be over taxed along with network storage is doing a disservice to their customers.

  20. The Future is Now by tuppe666 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Microsoft needs to learn to lead and stay ahead of the trends..

    That is already well and good...you should put a one in from of it and a Profit??? somewhere. The point is the future is already here consumer portable electronics , tablets smartphones Smart TV and watches, and Internet Giants in Retail; Search and Social...and Microsoft has failed or doesn't have a product in those market places.

    1. Re:The Future is Now by real-modo · · Score: 4, Interesting

      From a business point of view, Microsoft's hope is Asia. The OECD is fully saturated with Microsoft product, but there's huge growth potential in Asia. (Growth potential, mind. MS will have to work very hard to realise that potential.)

      Microsoft needs a CEO who understands China, and a 2IC who knows the rest of East and South Asia. Someone(s) less important can mind the shop in the OECD. Who in Microsoft could take on the big roles?

      *crickets chirping...*

      Ballmer's biggest failure, one that has gotten very few pixels, is succession planning. It's the core, number one duty of a CEO: to grow his staff to the point where they can run the business. Ballmer sucked at it.

    2. Re:The Future is Now by Livius · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Insecure dictators have a history of making sure there's no-one available to replace them, as part of their strategy to avoid being replaced.

    3. Re:The Future is Now by NatasRevol · · Score: 2

      He drove away half a dozen of his obvious replacements.

      --
      There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
    4. Re:The Future is Now by slick7 · · Score: 1

      Microsoft needs to learn to lead and stay ahead of the trends..

      That is already well and good...you should put a one in from of it and a Profit??? somewhere. The point is the future is already here consumer portable electronics , tablets smartphones Smart TV and watches, and Internet Giants in Retail; Search and Social...and Microsoft has failed or doesn't have a product in those market places.

      Catch-up artist or Con-artist?
      What is needed is someone, anyone, to advance technology. Not just MSFT or APPL. Monopoly is fun, monopolies suck.

      --
      The mind conceives, the body achieves, the spirit manifests.
    5. Re:The Future is Now by 1s44c · · Score: 1

      Insecure dictators have a history of making sure there's no-one available to replace them, as part of their strategy to avoid being replaced.

      Very true. Where are my mod points today?

    6. Re:The Future is Now by roc97007 · · Score: 2

      > From a business point of view, Microsoft's hope is Asia. The OECD is fully saturated with Microsoft product, but there's huge growth potential in Asia. (Growth potential, mind. MS will have to work very hard to realise that potential.)

      The problem is Asia doesn't fit Microsoft's business model. They're already used to relatively cheap devices running free (as in beer) software. Microsoft would be going head-to-head with free OS and free office suites and other applications. What price do you think Microsoft should charge for their OS and office suites in order to compete? Anyone?

      Microsoft may continue to sell stuff in the US and perhaps Europe, but the business model has changed in a very basic way, and the business model of multi-hundred-dollar operating systems and office suites is chugging along mostly on inertia these days.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    7. Re:The Future is Now by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Insecure dictators have a history of making sure there's no-one available to replace them, as part of their strategy to avoid being replaced.

      Oh, brilliant point. So, a successful replacement, if such a thing were still possible, must come from outside the company.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    8. Re:The Future is Now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "No one" is two words, just like "a lot". Don't worry, everyone gets it wrong. Can't be bothered I guess.

    9. Re:The Future is Now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft needs a CEO who understands China, and a 2IC who knows the rest of East and South Asia. Someone(s) less important can mind the shop in the OECD. Who in Microsoft could take on the big roles?

      Qi Lu?

    10. Re:The Future is Now by Meski · · Score: 1

      > From a business point of view, Microsoft's hope is Asia. The OECD is fully saturated with Microsoft product, but there's huge growth potential in Asia. (Growth potential, mind. MS will have to work very hard to realise that potential.)

      The problem is Asia doesn't fit Microsoft's business model. They're already used to relatively cheap devices running free (as in beer) software. Microsoft would be going head-to-head with free OS and free office suites and other applications. What price do you think Microsoft should charge for their OS and office suites in order to compete? Anyone?

      Microsoft may continue to sell stuff in the US and perhaps Europe, but the business model has changed in a very basic way, and the business model of multi-hundred-dollar operating systems and office suites is chugging along mostly on inertia these days.

      Didn't Gates make some comment about preferring that they pirate MS s/w to others? I can't find a cite for it now.

    11. Re:The Future is Now by real-modo · · Score: 1

      It's not (really) the OS, and Office is a sunset product: it's Active Directory and Exchange ... and possibly Skype (points to Ballmer for that purchase). The consumer market is lost, but there's still huge potential in 'enterprise' software in Asia.

      The market is small now because most Asian business are pretty paper-based. But that will (must) change. As I said, Microsoft needs someone who understands all this and can morph AD, Exchange and Skype into products that these businesses will buy and use as they 'level up' in management practise. (And as well MS needs to get SQL Server based ERP, CRM, and vertical market apps to be popular in Asia.)

      I agree that this is quite a different business model for Microsoft. (They'll have to be nice to their VARs. Inconceivable!) Chances of MS making the transition? I wouldn't put any money on it.

    12. Re:The Future is Now by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      I think you're right.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
  21. Merge with Yahoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    and let them do a reverse takeover of MS (this happens from time to time in American business). So the next MS CEO would be a woman most recently photographed stylishly dressed upside down on a couch.

    We know the price, it's $45 billion.

    1. Re:Merge with Yahoo by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Well, she can only be more attractive than Mr. Armpit, so I approve!

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Merge with Yahoo by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 1

      Kim Kardashian for CEO?

      --
      Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
  22. Apple kisses babies by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    Microsoft tried to please the producers.Apple did it the other way round. Apple made things for the end users

    Ironically Apple recently found guilty of forming a cartel with publishing companies forcing up the price of books to its customers...and everyone else.

    1. Re:Apple kisses babies by the_B0fh · · Score: 1

      You might actually want to read up on the facts of the case. Or, actually reading the lawsuit, and Apple's response to it.

    2. Re:Apple kisses babies by aliquis · · Score: 0

      Apple's response to it.

      Reminds me of Apple benchmarks.

      Like iMac GTX 675m 1GB vs Dell 520m 512MB and then declare the mac clearly superior to a PC for gaming.

  23. Throw money at the problem. by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    dump bing and the rest of the money losing businesses that have no hope of turning a profit

    I think one of the problems Microsoft had was its focus on profits. The reality is its current products revolve around its increasingly unimportant Monopoly...much as you personally might benefit from focussing on them, and that is not healthy.

  24. What Microsoft really needs... by jkrise · · Score: 1, Interesting

    is a person who can tell everyone else to get lost; and release all MS software on a truly FOSS license model. Not the shared source license model, nor the Microsoft Permissive License model.

    If RedHat can make a billion dollars on Free Sotware that is used less than Windows; Microsoft can exponentially increase the use of their software with a FOSS compliant license that puts the onus of innovation on the developers and producers; rather than on itself. The community is thousands of times more powerful than a corporation.

    Intel miserably failed by not licensing its technology to others; unlike ARM which has been a roaring success. So much so, IBM is now licensing the Power architecture to others. And Intel is taking down Microsoft and Apple along with them down the death spiral.

    Lesser control leads to greater adoption, greater innovation and greater profits in the medium and long term. Microsoft's future CEO has to decide which one is more important - ideology or profits - he can't choose both.

    --
    If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
    1. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by ruir · · Score: 1

      Are they taking Apple? Apple has already mutated into 3 different platforms, and are already migrating to a 4th (hello iPhone and iPads). Intel is a very convenient (cheap) partner at the moment, but I would be much surprised if they have already ARM versions in-house. If they managed to keep the Intel project going for a decade till they launched it

    2. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by ruir · · Score: 1

      wouldn't. English not being my mother tongue, I am making this mistake too many times.

    3. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No. It's not their business model. I used to say that Apple should sell their OS and stop being dicks about people installing it on other hardware. Same deal. "Apple is a hardware company" they'd tell me. In this case, "Microsoft is a software company". Sorry; but Red Hat and any other FOSS vendor is not a software company. They're creating the software as a loss leader, and selling something else--hardware, services, hosting, support, whatever. Saying that any FOSS organization is a software company is like saying that a motel is a mint-candy, soap, and coffee company.

      Microsoft makes an operating system. Lots of other people make hardware to go with it, and it's understood that you have to write your drivers to work with this ONE operating system. Same deal with people that write software for it. Yep, it's a monopoly; but a lot of people prefer that ecosystem and in order for it to work, Microsoft has to be a dick, just like Apple has to be a dick for their ecosystem to work.

      We really don't see any large dick-free ecosystems playing these days. Everybody fucks you in their own special way. Build a system that makes money of services and support... and you can be guaranteed it'll be designed to require service and support. blah, blah, blah... same old crap on Slashdot.

      They ain't openen' all their shit. It's fundamentally not their business model. It'd be like Apple throwing open the store and letting you install OSX on your PC.

    4. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      How can Microsoft "exponentially increase the use of their software" when it's already got a majority share? I guess if the exponent is a fraction....

      Microsoft has been trying to migrate to being a software services company, which is what they'd have to be if they open sourced their products. They've been failing miserably. As for open source, it does wonderfully at things where "the community" has an interest. That's why Apache and server versions of Linux have done so well. It does miserably at things that require skills that "the community" doesn't have so much of an interest in, such as design. That's why open source hasn't done well on end user machines, unless some corporation has added in the interface, as Google and Apple did.

      The open source community has done some great things, but they are not all powerful. They have very well defined weaknesses. Those weaknesses happen to match up with the areas where Microsoft still makes money.

    5. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by jkrise · · Score: 1

      How can Microsoft "exponentially increase the use of their software" when it's already got a majority share?

      Microsoft has a microscopic minority share in tablets, smartphones - form factors where new money is made; and new mindshare and marketshare is needed. The desktop has well and truly stabilised - and ARM based computers running Ubuntu will mean both "Intel Outside" and "Windows Closed".

      --
      If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
    6. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Oh right, you mean tablets and smartphones, which are completely dominated by two open source operating systems that didn't really get anywhere until two gigantic companies adopted them, made them over, and added lots of proprietary bits.

      Microsoft isn't doing poorly in mobile devices because Windows isn't open source. They're doing poorly because they were late to the party and even later with a mobile version of Windows that didn't suck.

    7. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by jkrise · · Score: 1

      until two gigantic companies adopted them, made them over, and added lots of proprietary bits.

      That description fits Microsoft as well - they can make proprietary shims and make them mandatory with Windows; but the core OS could be open-sourced to promote innovation by the community.

      --
      If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
    8. Re:What Microsoft really needs... by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Why? Darwin and the Linux kernel are both developed by small groups of mostly (entirely?) paid professionals with tightly controlled membership. So is the Windows kernel.

  25. Re:Overlooked successes of MS in last 13 years by 0123456 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    How are any of them 'successes'?

    Xbox has still lost money over its lifetime.
    Office? People would happily be using whatever version of Office Microsoft churned out, there was no demand to switch to a new version.
    Windows 7? If Microsoft were still pumping out upgraded versions of Windows XP, they'd be selling more than they are of Windows 8.

    Microsoft should have called Windows and Office done years ago, and moved most of the developers off to new products. Then they might still be relevant.

  26. Catch up artist? by bmo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    " The New York Times says that what Microsoft needs now isn't just a CEO, but a catch-up artist, "

    No, they've been doing that for the entire history of the company, coming in late to every successful idea long after the competition does. They used to be able to "cut off the oxygen" of their competitors, but they can't do that anymore. Not since they tried to do it to Google and failed utterly.

    --
    BMO - Unfortunately, Ballmer is leaving before he's finishing the job of killing the company.

    1. Re:Catch up artist? by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      How did they 'cut off the oxygen' with their first products? You seem to think they were always a massive company that owned the market. They didn't get that until the 90s at least.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    2. Re:Catch up artist? by bmo · · Score: 1

      And total failure to read the first sentence.

      Bye.

      --
      BMO

    3. Re:Catch up artist? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm so stupid I've gone beyond copying my username into the bottom of the body of my post, and started copying my username into the middle of the body of my post. Anyone else think I'm an ass besides me?

      --
      BMO - I am a retarded simpleton

  27. Fresh thinking by Natales · · Score: 3, Insightful

    What bothers me is that Microsoft has really good engineers but lacks a clear strategic direction. Their massive amount of legacy code plus some seriously bad "assumptions" about what the users want have sustained their decline in the last 10 years. It's a sad state of affairs, having used their products since Windows 1.0 when they were "the rebels".

    I know it's just my opinion, but given their deep pockets, they should create an incubator unit or a completely separate start-up with huge funding for a re-acquisition later on (similar to what Cisco is doing with Insieme). The purpose of this group should be to go back to their roots, and re-think the way people and companies are expected to interact with computers in the next 10-20 years timeframe, and create a brand new OS with no legacy code, and anticipating the challenges and threats that will evolve overtime as much as possible.

    I've always wondered why airplanes and MRI machines can have "mission critical" OSs and software while we all have to deal with crashes and uncertainty. They have the capability to create and bring to market a practical, usable EAL-7 OS. We know it has been done before, but Microsoft has the capability to make it commercially viable for everyone. And this is only ONE of the things they could do.

    1. Re:Fresh thinking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Airplanes and MRI machines perform very specific and narrow functions whereas your PC is a huge swiss army knife.

      This isn't to say that desktop OSes couldn't be improved significantly, but it's a tremendous undertaking and it would likely require significant diminishment of the user experience to achieve full compliance.

    2. Re:Fresh thinking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      No, as an ex-softie I can tell you (sadly) that the "really good engineers" left eons ago. Many of them were my mentors. Ballmer did a *lot* of damage to the technical culture there.

      Btw, engineering is a completely different discipline from software development. There is no such thing as a "software engineer" just as there is no such thing as a "sanitation engineer". It's "programmer" and "garbage man", respectively. Though sometimes us old-time programmers feel like garbage men when we clean up trash code written by the juniors...

    3. Re:Fresh thinking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They do have such a thing. It's called Microsoft Research.

      They came up with Singularity.

    4. Re:Fresh thinking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Windows 1.0 were "the rebels?" It sucked big time! The only reason it beat out GeoWorks and others were that MS paid developers to come out with MS only versions of program code. After a while of losing so much money/investing so much money/ MS started killing off others. Heck, remember when they used to give away Mag lights to anyone who tried their software in a store?

    5. Re:Fresh thinking by benjymouse · · Score: 1

      Mark Russinovich (practically reverse engineered the Windows kernel and wrote books about it even before joining MS)
      Scott Guthrie (a techie succeeding in a management position, apparently winning a lot of respect by his employees),
      Scott Hanselmann,
      Anders Hejlsberg (created C# and still oversees it's development, latest with true async continuation support)
      Jeffrey Snower (created the vision driving PowerShell with his Monad Manifesto and actually saw it through, completing with Desired State Configuration in PowerShell 4)
      Don Symes (F# fame),
      Don Box,
      Neal Gafter (previously of Java fame)
      Dave Cutler (yes, he apparently still works for MS)

      I was really, really sad to see Erik Meier go. That was a colossal loss. But Microsoft is not short of outstanding engineers.

      --
      Reading slashdot one-liner: (irm http://rss.slashdot.org/Slashdot/slashdot).rdf.item | fl title,desc*
    6. Re:Fresh thinking by CodeBuster · · Score: 1

      I've always wondered why airplanes and MRI machines can have "mission critical" OSs and software while we all have to deal with crashes and uncertainty.

      The mission critical embedded systems use a much simpler OS than your desktop or server on a fixed hardware and software platform with certified drivers. You have to deal with crashes and uncertainty because you want unlimited choice of hardware and software with lots of servers and other arbitrarily selected apps running. The MRI machine or the Aircraft control system are purpose built for a single job which they do well, they're not general purpose computing devices or at least they're not configured to serve as such even though they might share some commodity chips with them.

  28. Windows 9 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Design the next version of Windows independently from whatever they're putting on mobile/Xbox, build it around making people more productive in virtual reality. That would be forward thinking, imo.

  29. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Now you slave your knowledge lacking clients to something only you can support - I don't that relationship lasting long. You because your just as bad as MS, just on a infinitely smaller scale...and them - they will go out of business because they are clearly bad decision makers allowing you to do it to them.

  30. Microsoft and the catch-up artist .. by dgharmon · · Score: 1

    "The New York Times says that what Microsoft needs now isn't just a CEO, but a catch-up artist, to regain the footing that it had a few years ago as the biggest name in software."

    Without the WinTEL monopoly and the onerous lock-in contracts with the OEMs, Microsoft is just another tech company ..

    --
    AccountKiller
    1. Re:Microsoft and the catch-up artist .. by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Not really. Just like IBM they'll need quite a while to get accustomed to not being able to dictate their contracts at will. It almost sank big blue (and would have if that oil tanker had not had even more floating power than MS does).

      Whether they survive depends on how quickly they adapt to it, whether they understand that they should find their place and not try to gobble up every market they find. If they continue, well, I will probably not shed a tear.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Microsoft and the catch-up artist .. by symbolset · · Score: 1

      Big Blue pulled off a miracle and survived. That never happens. It's not going to happen for Microsoft. It's great being Caesar, but the retirement plan really sucks.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    3. Re:Microsoft and the catch-up artist .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have you dealt with IBM recently? They still do that. And if you are a software vendor and have the audacity to recommend your customer that they move away from IBM, they will call your CEO to explain that his engineers (i.e. you) are idiots and are out to ruin the business of your customer.

      I know, I've been there.

    4. Re:Microsoft and the catch-up artist .. by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Believe it or not, but that is already the "humble" version of IBM. In their heydays they wouldn't have called your CEO, they would simply have terminated contracts with your company, made sure everyone knew that "badmouthing" them sank your company and that YOU are responsible for it.

      Rest assured, nobody would dare to speak up against them anymore.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    5. Re:Microsoft and the catch-up artist .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (original poster here) So I have heard. In our case (and this was very recently) they also threatened us that they knew certain key people at some of our other customers. In other words, they suggested that they would call them and suggest that they drop us as a vendor.

      That company's sales methods makes even Oracle look like the good guys.

  31. Too late, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Too late, but imagine it wasn't, and these are the changes:

    1) app stores for ALL software that can run on Microsoft platforms.
    2) a COMPLETE depreciation of Metro/RT/New-UI on desktop class versions of the Windows OS
    3) FULL windows on ARM, and a massive push for ARM based desktop/laptop systems with the same focus as the previous x86 based PCs
    4) free Metro/RT/New-UI OS for tablets/phones, with money made exclusively from the app-stores and ads.
    5) active encouragement for 'RT' based tables being as cheap as the Android-based ones.
    6) Extreme depreciation of the NSA Kinect sensor system, allowing the vastly inferior Xbox One to be priced LOWER that the vastly more powerful PS4
    7) Immediate project to design the Xbox Two- compatible with the Xbox One, but with GPU hardware at least at PS4 levels- for release Xmas 2014.
    8) an END to all propaganda and coercion that attempts to force users to upgrade from ANY version of Windows from XP onwards.
    9) official support of ALL API systems from ALL versions of Windows 8 (including new 'versions' of DirectX) on Windows 7 as well. Windows 7 64-bit is the 'new' XP- the MS OS of choice for people with brains, and the OS that such people are willing to stick with for the foreseeable future.
    10) an OFFICIAL recognition that policies under Ballmer had made all intelligent MS customers desperately wish for a Linux-based alternative to the Windows ecosystem that was actually worth using.

    Even as Tablets become dominant, Desktop/Work-horse PCs are going nowhere. So many of us need a place to do REAL computer work, and Windows has provided that place for so long now. But serious Windows users need a strong vanilla environment that "just works", not "flavour of the month" shit like RT. If MS wishes to work the high gimmick markets, it should NOT be at the expense of the traditional work-horse PC.

    How can Microsoft be so MORONIC that it charges for RT. Only a vicious cretin like Ballmer could fail to see the advantage of having ultra-cheapo RT tablets from China all pointing their users at MS app-stores and MS ad servers. With Android, you can pay tens of dollars, or hundreds of dollars for your Tablet. The choice is in the hands of the consumers. With Microsoft, every RT tablet is insanely over-priced shit, with lousy quality control, praised only by tech journalists with a large MS cheque in their back pockets.

    And if Ballmer hadn't agreed to the massive pay-off from Intel, Windows 8 would be currently running on ARM based desktops/laptops, building a customer market in readiness for the release of true mains powered ARM parts that will rival Intel in CPU performance, and thrash Intel in GPU performance and memory bandwidth.

    But as I said, it's too late by maybe a couple of years now. Microsoft will be in panic response mode as the Xbox One flops, Windows 8 continues to flop, and the rise of Android continues unabated. Microsoft's corporate desktop business is mostly lost once Google releases the desktop version of Android. Microsoft needed to begin the transition to much cheaper computing based on ARM, and cut the umbilical cord that has joined it to Intel since the beginning of the age of the Windows-based PC. Intel CANNOT survive against ARM. Microsoft did have a much better chance surviving against Android (and Linux).

  32. Ballmer is just a scapegoat by ruir · · Score: 4, Insightful

    In my opinion Ballmer is an operational that was promoted in the wrong time. The problems of Microsoft are symptomatic of a larger disease, and Ballmer is just a scapegoat. Truth to be said, the only product I can remember of being their truly innovation, is Microsoft Basic. The rest was a matter of having the right influence, a matter at time on their side, the right partners, sheer luck, buying what they needed at the right time. It is a known fact after all this years, that DOS was bought to seal a business Gates mom got with his influence, power and political cloud. The fact that consumers preferred a cheaper machine 20 years behind its time just because it had a IBM sticker, and the misguided monopoly that ensued for 3 decades, was a pure stroke of luck. that movement is losing momentum IMO. They had also terrible problems of judgment. The worst of all, was basing their business model in the dominance of the Wintel platform. I don't know for how long their Office platform will hold waters - for instance in a couple of years iWork from Apple will be a real competitor (it already is, minus the Pages utility). They failed to see the Internet coming, and had to buy Internet Explorer. The Zune (music player) was a commercial failure. Windows CE based hardware is/was a terrible flop. Windows 8 and Surface, a customer PR disaster. Their phone platform, despite how many billions they throw at it - 2 billions to Nokia alone, product placement in holywood series, is a product nobody want to touch. They killed their excellent TechNet offering which was the staple of many Microsoft houses. Androids are iPhones are the trojans that are showing whole generations they are not depending anymore on WIntel compatibles to handle their data - either work, emails, documents, spreadsheets. Mac is also making inroads in several faculties. Linux has gained corporate acceptance. VMWare is the king of virtualisation platforms, and XEN a close second The cat is out of the bag it is not mandatory to use IBM compatible/Microsoft products, specially in corporate environments, and the terrible news for MS is this a very different world from the 80s, and customer loyalty isnt up what it used to be.

    1. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Customer loyalty is something you earn.

      Care to tell us any one action of MS that should make me consider that they might probably have a chance of coming close to deserving it?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by Osgeld · · Score: 0

      I dont know what this rant is, but its mostly wrong on almost every level

    3. Re: Ballmer is just a scapegoat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL "political cloud"

    4. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why?

    5. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by jsepeta · · Score: 1

      didn't Bill Gates steal some of the code used in Microsoft Basic?

      Word 4 for MacOS was a masterpiece. the only feature they've added since then that I've needed was hyperlinking, in version 5.

      --
      Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
    6. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by ruir · · Score: 1

      What I do remember it was Paul Allen writing the Basic code, and Bill Gates taking the credits, as far as the story goes. Bill Gates has been a businessman from the start.

    7. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by ruir · · Score: 1

      To better clarify it. What I do believe Microsoft Basic was a partnership and I strongly suspect Gates put the money and Allen the coding skills. I clearly remember reading of them writing Microsoft Basic for the 8080 *before* the chip itself was available in the market, in a simulation running a time-shared mainframe. Processor time in mainframe systems was expensive, and fairly well paid. And for that kind of work, you need at least a couple of months. You would need connections and *money*, which the Gates family obviously had.

    8. Re:Ballmer is just a scapegoat by ruir · · Score: 1

      However something does not fit in this story. Having writing a emulator for an 8-bit computer I know it takes some months. Albeit I do not want to compare my (former) coding abilities to Mr. Allen, the work is far from trivial. I wonder wether they were able to get their hands on a prototype, but had to give another explanation, as it would not be seen with good eyes by other players.

  33. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 2

    3) Stop screwing IT businesses all over.

    Right, that's gonna happen...

    --
    Only to idiots, are orders laws.
    -- Henning von Tresckow
  34. Microsoft is where they should be! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Microsoft did not get into a position of market dominance by having better products, they got there by underhanded methods. They are now where they should be.

    A former user of Lotus 1-2-3, DR-DOS, OS/2, and WordPerfect

    1. Re:Microsoft is where they should be! by yuhong · · Score: 1

      Yea, MS turned what was originally the OS/2-386 project into an entire fiasco:
      http://yuhongbao.blogspot.ca/2012/12/about-ms-os2-20-fiasco-px00307-and-dr.html

    2. Re:Microsoft is where they should be! by ruir · · Score: 2

      It had to. They never intended it to work, just take the better ideas for themselves. OS/2 was a superior product in every way to Windows 3.x. Alas, Windows before Windows 95 was a sad joke.

    3. Re:Microsoft is where they should be! by yuhong · · Score: 1

      They never intended it to work, just take the better ideas for themselves.

      See no evidence for that, they only turned it into a fiasco after Win3.0 released.

  35. The worst thing is, they had some half good ideas. by gallondr00nk · · Score: 1

    MS had some great ideas, but absolutely screwed it up in terms of execution. I occasionally still use a PocketPC from the turn of the millenium and it is genuinely well designed. One example is the design spec for the PPC put a scroll wheel on one side, which means you can hold it in one hand, clicking through pages on Microsoft Reader with the wheel.

    If the PocketPC PDAs had used a finger touch screen while at the same time been marketed as a gaming and media player, rather than as purely a business tool I imagine they would have sold like crazy. Instead, it had a calander application and Office.

  36. .02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by hardgeus · · Score: 2

    As sacrilege as it sounds...just give up on Windows. It's over. Nobody cares. The base OS is a commodity at this point, and most good programmers prefer a Unix style environment. Lots of command-line tools, powerful shell scripts, and a world of open source tools.

    In my opinion, where Microsoft is still heads-and-shoulders above the competition is in their middle-ware layers. Office is good. Office is really really good. When you really need to use a solid word processor or spreadsheet, the various, splintered openLibreWhateverOffices are just shit. When the files become complex, they can barely open up their own output without corruption.

    SQL Server: Good. IIS, C# and .NET development? Good.

    In my opinion, they need to focus on all of the good software they have written, and abandon Windows.

    Perhaps Windows and these products are too coupled? OK, fine. Open Source Windows. Do it. Systems are too large and complex to steal these days. Who has forked Darwin and cut out Apple's profits? Maybe something exists, but who cares.

    TLDR;

    Make Windows Open Source

    1. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ruir · · Score: 1

      The truth is Office is bloated. At the moment the only truly product is has still no genuine competition because it managed to kill the competition with their market stronghold in the windows 95, is Office. Excel nowadays got really good competitors, unless you are heavily into accounting/macro usage. Office for Mac is intentionally crippled to give a leverage to the Windows OS and it is a shame. SQLServer is a robust product, however is too heavy, unwieldy and power hungry. From the two evils, I would prefer to go to Oracle, or for smaller projects MySQL. Often people make a mistake of using Gorillas like Oracle or SqlServer to power corporate sites. Apache and newer competitors beat the living daylights out of IIS. I have strong security concerns of deploying IIS servers. C# and .NET, my developer friends say it is the best thing next to sliced bread. Given the track records of Microsoft killing or changing the core functionality of products, I doubt I will ever invest my time on them. I would make a further comment. Are really they able to open source Windows? How much code was taken from the Linux/BSD project without proper acknowledgements? How much code all intellectual property of others? How many bad code coming from DOS days is there?

    2. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by JDG1980 · · Score: 1

      The truth is Office is bloated.

      MS Office is "bloated" because it has a lot of features you don't use, but someone else does. You'd be surprised just how many businesses have Excel or Access "programs" as a major part of their daily workflows. This is why MS Office's competitors haven't made much headway.

    3. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      most good programmers prefer a Unix style environment. Lots of command-line tools, powerful shell scripts, and a world of open source tools

      No true scottsman, anyone?

      I'm a good programmer, and I prefer developing with the tools available on Windows. I've been using Linux going on 20 years now in some capacity or other, and I love it as an operating system for a router, file server, media centre, web server, etc.

      But the one thing that has always been second-rate in Linux is the user interface. The command-line tools and powerful shell scripts you cite are used as a crutch; an excuse for having a buggy, minimally functional, shitty GUI. Linux developers don't care about user experience because everything can be done in scripts, so there is never enough time spent on polish. Polish matters. (I think we are in agreement here.)

      Nowhere is this more obvious to me than in development tools. Forgetting Microsoft's faults for one moment, Visual Studio is far and away the best IDE on the planet - no exceptions. The only way to get the same power in Linux is to cobble together 20 - 30 different applications and scripts, and then putz around with some horrible development workflow where you're constantly context-switching between tools. Usability-wise its a mess.

      Few of these tools could be considered comparable to the VS offering - the VS debugger in particular is far superior to gdb in terms of usability. Eclipse is slow and bloated. Either that or you have to devote years of your life to becoming some EMACS wizard, and for what? VS is still superior.

      The Windows development environment is just better. I'm far enough in my career now that I have no inclination to spend my time fighting with a load of tools where usability is an after-thought, if that. I'm getting older. I don't have time. It's just too hard to get stuff done in Linux.

    4. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      Whereas, after eight years developing on Linux, I can't imagine going back to developing on an abomination like Windows. Even though Visual Studio was far more robust than Eclipse.

    5. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by real-modo · · Score: 1

      You've missed Microsoft's two really big corporate apps: Active Directory and Exchange.

      SQL server? Plenty of alternatives, although the choice is made on the basis of CRM and accounting apps rather than the DBMS.

      IIS? Meh. If you're running it because of Sharepoint, there are Salesforce.com and Yammer and others. C# and .NET? Plenty of alternatives.

      Agree that Word and Excel are good...but most office workers, it turns out, can get by with a textarea in a web form when they need to write something outside of Outlook. [Rest of response (about Excel and Powerpoint) deleted, because it was boring.]

      But Active Directory has no serious competition. For corporate email, neither does Exchange.

      No way is Microsoft going to open-source Windows. Windows licenses are a large chunk of its revenues, and while it can limit AD and Exchange to running on Windows, Microsoft is not going to give up that money. Nor should it.

    6. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by InfiniteLoopCounter · · Score: 1

      That you like Visual Studio by Microsoft is your opinion, except you seem to spout it as fact.

      Here's another possible take -- most programming is done to reinvent terrible UIs to yet another accounting/business program that has no real benefit for people in general. The real important stuff happens in scientific programming, where you need tools to program in parallel, solving complex maths problems, for custom hardware and so on. This stuff is generally run on Linux because it is the easiest to devlop on, has remote management tools built in, etc.

      Hence, I can assume that the AC parent is either a chemist or a programmer in some sort of business.

    7. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      "Office for Mac is intentionally crippled to give a leverage to the Windows OS and it is a shame."

      How so? Lack of Access? Short lived lack of visual basic scripting?

      I've always thought lack of Access was a *definite* advantage, and Microsoft happened to remove VBS right before all the macro viruses came out. They've since put it back in, I think.

      I've always found Office for Mac much more pleasant to use than the Windows one. Faster, more compatible and more likely to leave your damned figures where you damned well put them.

    8. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Do chemists like Windows and visual studio? All the scientists I've ever met who use computers for more than word processing wouldn't touch either. Science is one of the few areas where you go to download some software and it works on everything *except* Windows.

    9. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by symbolset · · Score: 1

      The truth is that formatting a document is a solved problem. It has been a solved problem for 25 years. For a long time we rewarded Microsoft for moving the buttons by buying the same software over again, but we are starting to wise up to the fact that there is no real difference except for the moved buttons. Grown wise to this they're trying to shift to a subscription model but we are mostly not buying it.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    10. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Original AC here.

      "Real important stuff" is a matter of perspective, don't you think? Why are complex maths problems the only "important" thing that can be done in programming or the only thing that "benefits people in general"? Is the use of custom hardware some sort of yard-stick for importance now?

      I'm not disagreeing with you when you say these problems are easier to solve in Linux. I'm not disagreeing that the state of scientific computing in general on Windows needs improvement. Certainly, complex problems are important for us as a species to solve. I am a maths major so I am not simply paying lip service to you (though I suppose you have no reason to believe that).

      I'm disagreeing with the notion that anything outside this very narrow spectrum of computing is not important. It's another "no true scottsman" fallacy. As if anything done in the world outside of academic research is worth contempt and scorn. The problem is for all of that research to take place, a framework of civilisation must exist. There are problems within this framework which are not scientific in nature but which certainly are worth solving.

      Your example of accounting software is good. Society doesn't run without taxes. Taxes can't be collected without knowing what people earn. Tracking what 350 million people earn is a huge task, particularly with the unfathomable complexity of the system that we have for people who don't spend their lives working with it. If only some sort of "software" were available that "counted" some of this for us. That might free people to spend less of their time on the upkeep of this civilisation framework and more time being productive in other areas.

      The accounting software problem may not currently be well-solved, but that doesn't mean it isn't a problem worth solving. That doesn't mean it has no benefit for people in general.

      I am a programmer in some sort of business. Businesses are important. Frankly, most of the people in the world don't care about complex maths problems. They care about stuff which makes their lives easier or transfers the burden of managing certain aspects of life. Why? It improves their life, and the idea that problems of quality of life aren't important is manifestly dishonest.

    11. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 1
      It was a solved problem (Wordperfect) then MS came along and unsolved it.

      Nowadays, outside the USA, people are beginning to understand the significance of having a file format that is independent of the application. (odt). I would sell my MS shares if I had not already done so.

      --
      Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
    12. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by InfiniteLoopCounter · · Score: 1

      My point, in a roundabout way, was that you were asserting your opinion as fact, like here:

      Nowhere is this more obvious to me than in development tools. Forgetting Microsoft's faults for one moment, Visual Studio is far and away the best IDE on the planet - no exceptions.

      and so on and so on...

      So I gave another opinion to show how it is important to try and pick up where your biases are when you write. Sure business is important in the scheme of things, but sometimes business people, like everyone else, gets caught in their own little bubble and extrapolates their narrow range of experiences from their field to everyone else as well. Oh, and you just have to have to pick on the chemists from time to time.

    13. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ruir · · Score: 1

      The interface is or used to be more pleasant, truth indeed. However the interface doesnt really obey to Apple Human Interface guidelines, all the Mac functionalities don't work like dragging images from other applications, and Office is unwieldy and slow. I avoid using it as much as i can, and have to concede Office 2004 for Mac despite all limitations had a more intuitive interface.

    14. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ruir · · Score: 1

      Yeah, and lets not forget how Microsoft killed the market for WordPerfect and Lotus in the word processing arena, pushing out to the market a defective product (Windows 95), and putting the patches together with using secret APIs into Microsoft Word.

    15. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Ah, so it's crippled relative to another Mac app. Yeah, I agree with that. I'd love to use Pages, except it's a bit weak on the change tracking and reference management side. Office for Mac seems less unwieldy, slow and frustrating than the Windows version though.

    16. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ruir · · Score: 2

      Word is the only app is still use from Office; OmniGraffle is a very decent implementation of Visio, and Keynote beats powerpoint any day. The only complaint I got about numbers is that it doesn't read some excel files, and does not read excel password protected files at all, but we all know it is the way Microsoft tries that people don't migrate to the competition. I do agree Pages is a toy at the moment, however I do hope Apple works in that. We all know MS was dragging is feet into launching the Intel version of Office for Mac, and Apple used iWork as a leverage point.

    17. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ruir · · Score: 1

      However let me add, the problem with the interaction of Office with the rest of the Mac system is a very real one. Thats where Mac excels, or why many people choses Mac/OSX over Linux. And Microsoft is either deliberately ruining their experience, or is doing a very shoddy job porting Office.

    18. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      On the contrary, about one in a thousand is the rate of properly formatted documents I see now days. If you're setting a font or font size in your document, you're doing it wrong.

      Formatting documents is so far from solved its not even funny. All we have now is the ability for people to make hideous docs with all sorts of shitty custom fonts, sizes and colors applied rather than proper formatting, such as just tagging the title as a title and headings as headings and leaving the actual display style out of the document.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    19. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Agree on Omnigraffle and Keynote. I'm a scientist and I make figures and posters in Omnigraffle while everyone else uses Powerpoint. I still use Excel occasionally, mostly to touch up other people's spreadsheets before loading them with a real language (Python linked to R).

      You can drag and drop things into Word, you just don't want to because it works so poorly. I haven't used Windows Word in a while, but when I did it worked just as badly on Windows. You'd drag an image into your document and Word would decide you wanted a ridiculously low resolution version of it. Maybe Microsoft finally fixed it on Windows and just never bothered to port the fix to the Mac.

    20. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by lgw · · Score: 1

      Eclipse pisses me off because it has so much damn potential. It should be better then MSVS, but it fails hard at polish, and as you say that matters - a lot. It shouldn't seem bloated, but the lack of organization throughout, both of the feature ui and of the project you're working on, make the problem worse than it needs to be. and it's annoyingly slow.

      Neither of those problems is likely to be fixed, sadly. Open source seems to never get better polish, nor will it ever stop being a mess performance-wise. MSVS seems on a downward path to me, but there aren't any good alternatives for what it's good at. If there were, I suspect it would start getting better again.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    21. Re:.02 from someone who hasn't been a C, E, or O by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Who has forked Darwin and cut out Apple's profits? Maybe something exists, but who cares.

      Free/Net BSD is superior to Darwin because that's what Darwin was taken from.

      The thing is (and the thing the Apple fanboy's hate said) is that Apple only open sourced what they absolutely had to to prevent violating the licensing agreement. All the things that differentiate OS X from *BSD are locked up in proprietary licenses, most notably, the GUI.

      So without the GUI there's no incentive to use Darwin over Free/Net BSD. Forking Darwin instead of forking FreeBSD would be like reinventing a reinvented and incomplete wheel. If you're going to fork BSD, why not do it at the source?

      Awaiting the angry flames from Apple fanboys.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  37. Apple lost :) by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    You might actually want to read up on the facts of the case. Or, actually reading the lawsuit, and Apple's response to it.

    Lol I did, July 10, 2013, U.S. District Court for the Southern District of New York decision found that Apple conspired to fix the prices of e-books in the United States. They were so obviously guilty. It was even published in Jobs book. ebook prices went up...Apple was found guilty.

    1. Re:Apple lost :) by jsepeta · · Score: 1

      but the judge was wrong. companies should be free to set their own prices, and if apple has decided that they want all publishers to sell products for the same price, those companies are free to sell their wares with apple or elsewhere. just like with iTunes: when the labels did such a crappy job of managing MP3 sales for years, apple suggested a reasonable price, which became the industry standard. they weren't initially wielding any monopoly power -- it just happened to be the price that users were most willing to pay.

      --
      Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
  38. The problem is in their business strategy by Opportunist · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And that it doesn't work anymore.

    Their creed was "embrace - extend - extinguish". It worked like a charm with open source technologies and technologies developed by small companies. They noticed something caught on, they hopped on the train, claimed it, blew a shitload of money into it, "added" to it so it was no longer compatible with the original stuff, turned their broken design into the de-facto standard by virtue of their market position and finally everyone was "inferior" because they were "incompatible".

    And that doesn't work with companies like Apple and Google who themselves play that game, and they really excel at it. AND on top of that, they needn't wait for someone to come up with a new technology people actually want: They can create it themselves, because they also know something about design.

    And marketing, of course, but marketing has never been the weak spot of MS. But here's the other reason why they are falling behind more and more: Design. And their lack of it. When "the masses" started to join the IT world, design suddenly became important. While we might not care about rounded corners and whether our boxes blend nicely into our living room, the average Joe out there does. Yes, their crap doesn't have any better specs than MS' stuff does, but it LOOKS better and it WORKS easier.

    And MS may be much, but designers, they are not. Neither designers of nifty looking gadgets nor designers of intuitive interfaces.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    1. Re:The problem is in their business strategy by Swampash · · Score: 1

      And that it doesn't work anymore.

      Their creed was "embrace - extend - extinguish". It worked like a charm with open source technologies and technologies developed by small companies. They noticed something caught on, they hopped on the train, claimed it, blew a shitload of money into it, "added" to it so it was no longer compatible with the original stuff, turned their broken design into the de-facto standard by virtue of their market position and finally everyone was "inferior" because they were "incompatible".

      And that doesn't work with companies like Apple and Google who themselves play that game, and they really excel at it

      Google yes, but Apple? Apple doesn't embrace and extend, it says "we have decided this is what you can have, buy it or get fucked".

    2. Re:The problem is in their business strategy by Tablizer · · Score: 1

      When "the masses" started to join the IT world, design suddenly became important. While we might not care about rounded corners and whether our boxes blend nicely into our living room, the average Joe out there does.

      If the engineering and UI is good, design can take a back seat. HP used to be successful by delivering reliability at a reasonable price and it propelled them to the top.

      If we look at it in terms of these categories:

      1. Style
      2. Reliability
      3. User Interface
      4. Price

      To survive you have to excel at one and be at least average in two of the other three. Getting the reputation of excelling in one of these categories can create a large niche via word-of-mouth.

      Price is about the only thing MS excelled at, but they are no longer competitive there, partly because of OSS, and they failed to master another category as a replacement.

      Thus, you don't have to master style, but you better be good in something.

  39. Re:Overlooked successes of MS in last 13 years by colinrichardday · · Score: 1

    Microsoft should have called Windows and Office done years ago

    Which would have made life much easier for the WINE and OpenOffice.org/LibreOffice developers.

  40. Not Fallen Flat with Everthing by meustrus · · Score: 1

    Since 2000? They didn't fall flat in everything. They did pretty well the XBox, not to mention their success with Windows XP.

    --
    I sometimes ask revealing, often ignorant-seeming questions. Maybe they're harder to answer than you think.
    1. Re:Not Fallen Flat with Everthing by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      Except the Xbox has lost money over its lifetime.

      There's no real competition in game consoles, not because the Xbox is so good, but because companies can't make money there.

  41. OS X and Windows are the only good DEs out there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I disagree. The Windows Desktop Environment and OS X are the only two good Desktop Environments out there. ONLY Windows will work well on the many different chipsets, sound cards, wifi adapters, cellular modems, Printers, Scanners, Cameras, bluetooth headsets, and others out there. Microsoft has thousands of programmers, working on all those dull subsystems that few care about. GNU/FOSS still has trouble with sound cards, and changing monitor resolution. Good luck finding power saving settings. OS X requires Apple, and Apple compatible hardware. That $100 bucks for a Desktop Windows license saves a lot of heartache on weird peripherals, and can run all sorts of programs. Only Microsoft can do that.

  42. Re:OS X and Windows are the only good DEs out ther by 0123456 · · Score: 0

    Maybe you should try a Linux distribution that's less than twenty years old.

    As for 'Windows Desktop Environment' being good, any chance of that went away with Windows 8.

  43. Re:The worst thing is, they had some half good ide by Darkness404 · · Score: 1

    Exactly, there were some great ideas, but the execution was terrible. The scroll wheel was one of my favourites too, I keep waiting for an Android phone to put a wheel like that instead of their volume keys, a volume rocker isn't the same.

    Unfortunately either the hardware side or the software side was lacking.

    --
    Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
  44. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by thetoastman · · Score: 1

    Unfortunately I can't recommend cloud based products to my clients. Having a hard dependency on network connectivity to the internet is a non-starter for most people.

    I agree with this. While it's nice, and I recommend cloud servers for a lot of use cases, office infrastructure is currently not one of them. My major issue is not that the ISPs are not reliable, cost effective, or secure.

    My major issue is one of network connectivity. "Business class" broadband ISP offerings in the US are pretty awful, which is why I put business class in quotes. Either service or speed (and often both) are incompatible with business requirements. Talking to first (and often second) level support is pointless once you explain to them that you're trying to run an office of 4-5 developers utilizing a cloud-based configuration management, issue tracking, and continuous build environment.

    Individual connections actually seem much better. If you're going to move to a cloud-based infrastructure for the above use case, it's probably better to have everyone work from home, access protected resources via VPN, and use a distributed configuration management model to minimize connectivity down time.

    The push by Microsoft towards SkyDrive and Microsoft Live accounts is also a really bad decision for consumers given the state of broadband in the US. Who's to say that Microsoft won't shut down these services in the future when/if it's no longer profitable.

  45. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't think I'd use Yahoo's "turn around" as a positive model for anyone.
    I use it more of a things to avoid doing model.

  46. Catch-up artist? No. by JDG1980 · · Score: 1

    MS doesn't need a "catch-up artist"; they need a rollback artist. They just need to roll back the dumb mistakes of the last couple of years. Announcing that Win9 will be based on Win7 (and thus that Win8 was a mistake which won't be repeated) would win them back quite a bit of the goodwill they lost. Adding back the option to use menus instead of the Ribbon in MS Office might help, as well. (I actually like the MS Office Ribbon now that I've gotten used to it, but many long-time users with experience with the old menu system hate it, and their preferences should be respected, too.)

    MS's sales pitch should be something along these lines: "Apple products are nice toys for home users, but when you need to get real work done, you come to us." Their competitive advantage is in the business world, where they get to sell lots of different products because they interoperate well and maintain backward compatibility. Focus on that and stop chasing consumer fads.

  47. Consistency by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think what Microsoft needs is consistency... They have everything but nothing is well integrated.

    They have three popular platforms with millions of users : Windows, Xbox and Skype.

    It's nice to have a stand-alone app like Skype to make calls but this should be an integrated feature of a bigger service like a social network, just like hangout is integrated in Google+. Where is the Microsoft social network offering ?

    Well, they have the Xbox platform, with Xbox Music, Xbox Video and Xbox Games, it's starting to look like Google's Play stores. But what about Windows Store, in which you can find apps but also games and movies ?

    I have a Skype profil, a Messenger profil and an Xbox profil. 3 profiles but still no real social network service ?

    Microsoft have the Windows Phone and the Surface tablet, why not the Windows tablet or the Surface phone ? On them, you will find Xbox apps. So why not naming every devices the Xbox device ?

    I just hope Microsoft will open their eyes and fix the fragmentations and inconsistencies I see across all Microsoft services.

  48. buy up some 3rd party software and add it to 8 by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 2, Informative
  49. In 2010, I sent Balmer the following snail mail: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Steve Ballmer
    CEO
    MicroSoft Corporation
    One Microsoft Way
    Redmond, WA 98052-6399

    Dear Mr. Ballmer;

    Recently read your remarks on MS's response to Apple's iPad. It appears you're still on the downward road.

    You're busy, so am I. So in few words, if you want a real chance of success in the iPad space, do this:

    1. Buy an iPad for every single MS employee;
    2. Send them out with a brief mission statement : "Do something better than this. Start over. Throw away whatever in MS' past doesn't serve. Get me your ideas asap. We're starting in 90 days with the best you can think of. Get going.";
    3. Screen the ideas using people not more than 30 years old, and finish the screen 7 days after the 90 day brainstorm period;
    4. Support what your screening team chooses;
    5. Write checks, stay out of the way.

    You can't make the future without breaking from the past. Good luck.

    Regards,"

    Got a response from a MS functionary that, to my regret, I didn't save. Nonresponsive, of course.

  50. What if Ballmer and Gates had not been such dicks? by bryanbrunton · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Purely as an exercise in alternate reality, it is interesting to wonder how the computing landscape would have been different, most certainly superior to state of affairs now, if Ballmer and Gates had not been such conniving, backstabbing dicks.

    The company would almost certainly be an order of magnitude wealthier, more respected and better positioned in the marketplace, if those two guys hadn't felt it necessary to throw the company's weight around by executing the many well known monopolistic and consumer-unfriendly practices that they are so well known for.

    If anything, the strategic failure of Microsoft as a company to set itself against so many others in the industry, is missing from the debate about the good and bad aspects of Steve Ballmer's legacy.

    Microsoft was consumed with a truly psychotic fantasy of Netscape (a fucking web browser company) rising and dominating the computing landscape. That is just one example where the mendacity-wrought Ballmer and Gates, helped in no way the financial bottom line of MS by just being dicks, almost just because they couldn't help it.

    It is fairly easy to posit that a good amount of the effort behind the rise of Linux was simply due to a common reaction against the back alley tactics deployed by Microsoft. And if Linux is not as developed as it was in 2008, does Google have something upon which to build Android? Something which can be released and developed under the GNU license? And that is just one potential hypothetical.

  51. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by fermion · · Score: 2
    It is going to be a generational change, starting with providing resources to current developing developers. If not, they will see a near total irrelevance in a generation.

    Back in that late 80's I was installing a vertical market application, networking among about 8 machines. The application was Unix native, but had recently been ported to MS Windows. Though Unix was our first choice, the cost was multiples of the MS Windows installation, maybe 5-10X as much when all costs were factored in, so the Unix option was a non starter.

    I imagine for many small businesses that were started, or restarting, like we were, the MS option is now the expensive route. You have the costs of managing licenses, the cost of acquiring development tools(I know that some are free, but other provide real professional tools for free), and the constant threat that MS can come in a close down a business for an audit. This is why while I spent the 90's using MS tools, by the end of that decade their constant harassment made me think it was not worth the complications unless backed by major corporation. Don't get me wrong, the MS tools are good and the products useful, but the cost and restrictions are out of place in the current IT environment.

    So here is what MS needs to do. If they insist on selling the OS, make it $100 and only sell one version. Give away some services with the OS, such as online storage. Up sell not by offering different levels of the OS, but by offering levels of services.

    MS insistence that Visual Studio is worth $500 is going to be death of them. Give away the tools. If they want to put a non-commercial restriction on it and have a $100 charge per product to distribute, or $500 for unlimited, that might be a good compromise. MS is not going to capture a generation who can develop for free on Android and Mac OS by charging for the tools.

    The fall of Unix is really the analogy here. I worked on an ATT Unix PC for a year, and it was beautiful. I would have loved for such a machine to have become the standard. I also worked on Irix, which was a wonderful interface. But like current MS products, they were just, on balance, too expensive.

    --
    "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
  52. Re: No "catch-up artist" will be allowed in there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ballmer knew all of that was going to happen, but he doesn't have the ability or desire to get personally involved. So he does what a lot of consultants do when out of their element: milk it for as long as possible, then bail out for some cash.

  53. Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock in a by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock in and lack of choice mainly the lack of a good mid range desktop.

    What they have is mini laptop in a desktop case with on board video, laptop cpu's and high prices next to other desktop systems.

    The mac pro is about $1000+ over priced and has been that way for some time with old video cards.

    The imac have gotten harder to work on and are the only AIO that make it hard to get to the HDD.

  54. Blame DoJ by MouseTheLuckyDog · · Score: 2

    This really started to happen 15-20 years ago. Microsoft totally missed the internet and only manage to reassert dominance by "cutting off Netscapes air supply" and subverting Java. Had MS not done so the present situation would have been the situation back then.

    They did it blatantly enough to attract the attention of DoJ. Given the DoJs action as tepid as they were and the EUs action, Microsoft was limited in how forcefully they could respond this time.

    The techniques that in the past were most effective for Microsoft were no longer available. The smartest thing that Bill Gates ever did was: he saw the end was coming and got out before the downturn and left Ballmer holding the bag. Had Gates not left we would still be seeing the same thing happening, probably even worse because Ballmer has probably cleaned things up a bit on the business side.

    What Microsoft needs is someone to come and clean house.
    They have certain advantages, lots of cash, a well established code base. Market dominance in certain areas. What they need to do is restructure their development infrastructure, and not rely on being able to leverage their dominance in one area into another.

    1. Re:Blame DoJ by bryanbrunton · · Score: 1

      Microsoft gained nothing by destroying Netscape and limiting adoption of Java. They lost hundreds of millions in legal fees, and then billions went out door to the EU. Microsoft was going to make their money. They had the desktop monopoly. Apple will never gain much desktop market share with their pricing structure. Java was a joke, a complete user interface travesty. They could have fired everyone on the IE team, and licensed Netscape, and it wouldn't have affected one bit the Office and Windows money train that was coming down the tracks.

      It doesn't matter one iota which web browser a windows machine is using. Microsoft already got paid. Browsers are commodities. Ballmer and Gates were such paranoid dicks, and non-technologists, that they couldn't see that.

    2. Re:Blame DoJ by Swampash · · Score: 1

      This really started to happen 15-20 years ago. Microsoft totally missed the internet...

      Bingo, we have a winner

  55. They need to stop acting as if they owned the worl by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In my view, historically, Microsoft were never great innovators. But they used to be great at running a software business - looking at Lotus, Ashton-Tate, and so on, and then doing what those companies had already done but better. They need to go back to doing that. Swallow all pride and make software for iPhone/iPad and Android, iMac, Linux, whatever platforms exist. Windows too, of course. If they want to thrive they need to champion integration at all levels across as many platforms as possible. Nobody is going to buy something over anything else just because it came from Microsoft - it needs to be substantially better in some way.

  56. An example of how Wall Street fucks with us all. by MarkvW · · Score: 1

    Microsoft's great strength (after MS-DOS), was buying cool stuff and leveraging that cool stuff with its operating system predominance.

    It's moronic to think that Microsoft should ever deviate from that basic strategy because it remains so profitable.

    But on the other hand, our Wall Street Overlords demand constant stock performance growth, while spurning even the idea of dividends (the middlemen needs their $$$!).

    Kind of a screwy world.

  57. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Plus the total lack of any decent server products. Yeah, there's a "server" version of OSX, but what hardware are you supposed to run it on? I need a rack-mount, server-grade product with environmental monitoring, redundancy, lights-out management, etc. Mac minis and even Mac Pros don't cut it there.

  58. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by rtb61 · · Score: 1

    Sounds more like M$ needs to break into two parts. The old core windows and office and tighten up on costs whilst screwing as much income as possible for as long as possible as Linus continues to chew away at it's market.

    MSN and gaming (and all the cash) needs to get out on it's own well away from the disastrous rank and yank which eats away at creativity like a cancer instead promoting the plotters and schemers (it's mental focus idiots, either they are focused on creative output or on career advancement). That's where the real failure is MSN was way way ahead of Google at one stage and was progressively screwed over by incompetence. It's brand devalued by Live and of all things bloody Bing (B for Ballmer how stupidly egoistic can people become).

    From a rebuilt MSN comes the new direction and the new products, it's all about the 'N', networking, connecting the pieces and the pieces that get connected.

    --
    Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
  59. No, Let Them Die by utkonos · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'm not sure why people here want M$ to change their act and get back in the game. I for one am quite happy with M$ being irrelevant and staying that way. Do any of you really want M$ to catch up and become dominant again?

  60. They don't need a catch up artist... by norite · · Score: 1

    They need a miracle. A farking huge one, at that.

    --
    -- Fuck Beta
  61. If Windows were free I still wouldn't want it by PeterM+from+Berkeley · · Score: 1

    Can you IMAGINE how horrible the Windows source base must be?

    Sorry, if I'm going to commit to an open source OS project, it'll never be Windows. I'd work with Linux or one of the BSDs.

    MS can release Windows as FOSS all they want, I'll never adopt it.

    --PM

    1. Re:If Windows were free I still wouldn't want it by symbolset · · Score: 1

      Although I can imagine it I prefer not to subject my psyche to such terror, so I don't imagine it. Some of it has leaked, and I pity the poor fools who bothered to read it. There are things you can't unsee.

      --
      Help stamp out iliturcy.
    2. Re:If Windows were free I still wouldn't want it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When sections of the XP source code were accidentally released to the public the code itself looked fine from a professional standpoint. The problem was at the architexture level.

    3. Re:If Windows were free I still wouldn't want it by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      My sources say its pretty nice actually. I've not seen it myself, but it kind of has to be non-shitty to accomplish what they do, even if you don't realize that.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
  62. Bills company by bigtreeman · · Score: 1

    It was Bills company, when he went Microsoft went.
    Everyone has seen Steve Ballmer in action
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGvHNNOLnCk
    what did we expect???

    It's natural attrition, who cares, lets see what tomorrow brings.
    Maybe a real, caring company will come to the fore.

    --
    Go well
  63. Is Marketing a Weak Spot at MS? by TaoPhoenix · · Score: 1

    I'd argue that just maybe Marketing is a weak spot.

    Here's a couple of angles:

    1. Check out the Windows names: 3, 3.11, 95, 98, 2000, Me, XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1 and/or Blue.

    2. They insist on putting Microsoft & Windows _____ jammed into all their marketing stuff. And they like "cluttered" ad copy. Here's one spoof:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUXnJraKM3k

    3. Only they know what they think they are doing with Metro/New-UI. The Windows 7 codebase was fair enough, aka the cleaned up Vista. So the Metro UI decision is in many ways "Marketing", because they are trying to convince people to do ... something.

    --
    My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
  64. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

    I think Apple quite rightly decided that nobody is going to buy a luxury server. When you want a server you buy some functional hardware and install Linux on it. Macs work quite nicely with Linux servers.

  65. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2

    The mac pro is about $1000+ over priced and has been that way for some time with old video cards.

    Since the Mac Pro doesn't have a price yet, this is a rather bold statement. As for old video cards, it's a workstation. It uses dual workstation class FirePro GPUs. It doesn't use Radeons or GeForce cards, those cards are wimpy consumer ones.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  66. Re:In 2010, I sent Balmer the following snail mail by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Your method has an extreme emphasis on ideas. Ideas aren't actually all that difficult. http://www.forbes.com/2004/11/04/cx_gk_1104artofthestart.html

  67. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

    The Mac Mini server exists because Apple sells a crap load of them. Colocation services use them because they use little space and don't require massive cooling. Small Businesses use them for the same reason. They don't need to install a server room with racks for a file and print server. For $1000, stick one on Bill's desk and you're done.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  68. Re: Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's only the first or second inning. We do not yet know the outcome.

  69. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Barlo_Mung_42 · · Score: 1

    They wouldn't just down their Azure services (which Skydrive etc lives on) even if it were not profitable because they've made it an integral part of their platform. Also, Azure is one of their billion+ dollar business so that's another reason not to worry.
    This cloud stuff really is more than a fad.

  70. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As for old video cards, it's a workstation. It uses dual workstation class FirePro GPUs. It doesn't use Radeons or GeForce cards, those cards are wimpy consumer ones.

    You do realise that those 'workstation class' cards are probably just 'wimpy consumer ones' with a different BIOS, right?

    That's how we used to distinguish between our consumer and mid-range pro cards back when I was working for a GPU company. While the mid-range pro cards were binned to run at a higher clock speed to the consumer boards, only the high-end pro cards actually had different chips on them.

  71. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Funny
    lol at this quote from the article:

    Mayer’s lateness [, as much as 45 minutes,] was a pain, sure. But by the early fall of 2012, Mayer’s staff had grown used to it. In fact, they were actually glad when she’d show up late to a meeting, because that meant at least she hadn’t blown it off entirely.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  72. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Developing for Apple is generally not free.

  73. Do a rewrite based on Unix like Apple did. by Marrow · · Score: 1

    Apple had their MacOS, and they abandoned it for a complete rethink. Microsoft should do the same. Microsoft should create a new OS based on Linux. With their own Graphics system, but use Linux as a base.

  74. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

    You do realise that those 'workstation class' cards are probably just 'wimpy consumer ones' with a different BIOS, right?

    Really they must do some amazing in BIOS. Like put in ECC memory where none existed. What BIOS command does that?

    That's how we used to distinguish between our consumer and mid-range pro cards back when I was working for a GPU company. While the mid-range pro cards were binned to run at a higher clock speed to the consumer boards, only the high-end pro cards actually had different chips on them.

    So for a workstation, everyone should just use Core i5s or Core i7s right? No need to use Xeons at all.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  75. Re: Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You can develop and distribute for OS X for free.

  76. Windows 7 is quite good, and that's the problem. by Animats · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Microsoft's big problem is simply that Windows 7 is quite good. Business desktops use it, they work fine, they crash rarely, and they get the job done. Microsoft conquered the driver quality problem by forcing drivers to pass the Static Driver Verifier, a proof of correctness system which looks at source code to see if it can buffer-overflow, make improper calls, or otherwise crash the kernel. That took care of about half of crashes. The other half, from Microsoft's own code, were handled by a system which classifies core dumps by commonality, so they can collect core dumps with the same cause, then find and fix the problem. So Microsoft conquered the big problem that business cares about - Making It Work.

    Businesses see no need to "upgrade". Certainly not to Windows 8. Or Office N+1. It won't help the business.

    Microsoft struggles with being "cool". Apple does well with "cool", but nobody else does. It's not clear it will help in the post-Jobs era. (Olivetti once made beautiful office machines. It didn't help them. Most major museums of modern art have some Olivetti products, but few offices did.)

    What really made the iPod work was deals with the music industry. Something that many people miss is why Jobs was able to pull that off. Jobs was also CEO of Pixar, and thus, as a major film studio head, at the top of the Hollywood hierarchy. So he was able to deal with the music industry from a position of superiority. That's what made iTunes. (The hierarchy in Hollywood is very real, and very rigid. Ask anybody in the industry.) That's what re-launched Apple. The Mac was below 10% market share, and was stuck there for years, even after Jobs took over again.

    There's room for a breakthrough in user interfaces. The rectangular grid of single-purpose icons is lame. We can be sure that breakthrough will not come from the open source community.

  77. kudos to Vanity Fair by epine · · Score: 2

    I read that article yesterday. It's an extremely well done article. Unfortunately, it doesn't actually say what the summary claims.

    At the center of the cultural problems was a management system called âoestack ranking.â Every current and former Microsoft employee I interviewedâ"every oneâ"cited stack ranking as the most destructive process inside of Microsoft, something that drove out untold numbers of employees.

    When the millionaire mint ran dry, the problems began:

    And so, the bureaucratization of Microsoft began. Some executives traced the change to the ascension of Ballmer, but in truth Microsoftâ(TM)s era of fast cash was almost certainly the actual driving force.

    Empowered by a dysfunctional incentive culture instigated by His Billness, though some defend it.

    The Case for Stack Ranking of Employees

    From the posts I read, the stack ranking at Microsoft is political and not based on valid accepted metrics that define performance. But Iâ(TM)m inclined to fault the measurement system more than stack ranking.

    What a complete idiot. He presumes that such a metric must exist, and completely misses the boat on absolute rather than relative performance norms. As soon as the norms become relative, you're tying your sneakers to outrun your team mate. If that's not political, I don't know what is. There are people who might not be star performers by any specific metric, but who enhance the productivity of any team they join. Guess what other company adopted stack ranking? Enron.

    I believe I once read an essay by Drucker where he said if the person who was worth hiring in the first place is underperforming, most likely that person's boss has failed to put that person into the right context.

    And software is the worst of all industries to institute such metrics. Any crank an employee can turn at 1000 rpm is better off scripted. The surest route to efficiency is repetition (the athletic model from he cherry picks his favourite aspects). Human repetition is bad repetition, yet metrics never catch up to non-repetitive cultures.

  78. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The reason for pushing customers to Azure, is to provide a steady and recurring income for Microsoft. Customers will still need some kind of on-premise server, and what they save in 'expense' and 'operational maintenance', will be spent in networking and internet (troughput, capacity, reliability, ...).

    IT businesses will have to change from a break-fix model to a services model.

    In essence, they are cutting out the middle man...

  79. Re:Windows 7 is quite good, and that's the problem by bytesex · · Score: 2

    Good call. Nobody ever says Android is cool (in the way that Apple products are), but they're still at 70% of their market. So 'coolness' isn't it.

    --
    Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
  80. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nice try, Marissa Mayer.

    I expect Yahoo to go down even further. She doesn't understand the most basic things. For example, if you force developers to work from their cubicles, yes you solved the problems of slackers. And yes, you also alienated great developers. It's a typical extrovert failure, she fails basic knowledge about dopamine vs adrenaline driven persons. So Yahoo will still not be able to attract top developers, only mediocre, because Mayer is basically stupid and thinks everybody operates like she does. She is a simpleton who will waste many billions of Yahoo value.

  81. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Revenue has tanked at Yahoo since 2010, she has fired a few workers to compensate and? Big buzz, nothing big has changed really, they are the portal they used to be, the frontpage is a bit more sluggish to load, the strange plain looking logo, the iconic old company seams to be gone, don't know, but my bet is, it will sink further..

  82. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 2

    Damn right there is no need for Xeons. Real men use Sparc64.

    --
    Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
  83. Re:What if Ballmer and Gates had not been such dic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Microsoft was consumed with a truly psychotic fantasy of Netscape (a fucking web browser company) rising and dominating the computing landscape. That is just one example where the mendacity-wrought Ballmer and Gates, helped in no way the financial bottom line of MS by just being dicks, almost just because they couldn't help it."

    The great irony is that although netscape is dead, IE isn't the monopoly MS wanted. Everyone is moving to using safari or chrome on tablet devices for casual browsing, and even on the PC it's chrome or firefox as the web browser of choice.

    IE is old old news, and the old lock ins that kept it in place are rapidly dwindling. The browser was the wrong battle, the real battle was for what people browsed for. Hence the rise of google, facebook etc. And those services are designed to be browser agnostic.

  84. M$ is tied to the popularity of the PC by evanh · · Score: 1

    M$ got a free ride on the way up to consumerism but now has to tighten the belt a little and be satisfied more with businesses than consumers.

    The Web changed everything for M$, and Apple for that matter. Apple would be dead by now if the Web hadn't turned up when it did.

    1. Re:M$ is tied to the popularity of the PC by Z00L00K · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately Microsoft has misunderstood the users and instead of keeping with a decent UI that is familiar they have jumped around all over the place with experimental design. Starting with Vista it's now hard to see the borders of windows which often results in the wrong window being selected whenever a resize is needed. The Metro UI is almost causing sysadmins to want to commit suicide - at least until the command prompt can be found.

      And Microsoft has been collecting usage statistics from users to see what they shall do when developing new interfaces, however any security conscious user is turning off that feature - which means that they only get statistics from the stupid users and not from all users. But they did fail to understand that they got the majority of their statistics from the stupid users and we did end up with the most stupid user interface since Windows 1.0 - which is Metro.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
  85. The obvious choice is by sturle · · Score: 3, Funny

    Stephen Elop. No doubt. Their platform is burning!

  86. cant happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    nsa and mpaa are up ther ebutts so far its over for them ....anyone doing business with them does it cause they want to help the mpaa and nsa

  87. MSFT can always dig up steve jobs by FudRucker · · Score: 1

    zombie jobs running microsoft

    --
    Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
  88. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe, but most desktop users doesn't really need workstation GPUs. It's a bit silly to say it's a bold statement to say the Mac Pro is overpriced just because *this* generation Mac Pro isn't priced yet. There have been several models, and for most desktop work, they are grossly overpriced. I think the bigger issue for Apple in the enterprise is the lack of a proper server.

  89. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

    Most people see that since the older Mac Pros had upgradeable part, it must be a desktop. A Mac Pro is not a desktop. It's a workstation. If you actually price it with other workstations, it's competitive. Apple doesn't want the enterprise server market. I think they simply didn't sell enough XServes to keep them going. A Mac Mini with server software has selling.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  90. Gates really shoul return by Cito · · Score: 1

    In a similar way Jobs did when he returned to save Apple from going under, Bill Gates should turn over his "Husband & Wife" philanthropy company solely over to his wife. And return to Microsoft as it's savior.

    I know in 90's Bill always got hate, even the icon for Microsoft on Slashdot was of Bill dressed like a Borg, but he totally kept the billions coming in. And watching a couple hours of the entire 12 hour deposition he was involved in that is posted to YouTube in it's entirety shows his unique genius. But that Bill is what Microsoft needs now.

    Yes, people would draw comparisons to Steve Jobs' return to Apple which he saved his company from complete failure. But my opinion of course I would totally love to see Bill Gates return and take it back over and put Microsoft back on track.

    But that's just my opinion, I've always been a Gates "fanboi"

  91. Re:Windows 7 is quite good, and that's the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't know open source seems to produce at least one new interface every year each of which seem to be completely new and mostly unusable, but one of these days someone might accidental stumble onto something that works just by the shear number of interfaces they are creating... I don't know if that's the strategy behind 20 window managers and 10 desktops or if the whole OSS community has ADD but it's fun to watch.

  92. Microsoft NEEDS to break up by jsepeta · · Score: 1

    If Microsoft were divided into 4-5 separate companies, it wouldn't be difficult to find a CEO who could handle those individual pieces. The stockholders should be happy with the stock split, and the divisions that are used to competing against each other (http://www.wired.com/business/2013/08/steve-ballmer-steps-down/) would be free to work as hard as they want to develop their own products without being distracted by office politics.

    --
    Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
  93. Re:Apple OSX only down fall is the hardware lock i by jsepeta · · Score: 1

    and the old workstation design of the old Mac Pro still is one of the best PC designs EVER. 4 internal drive bays where the drives just slide into the SATA connectors - GENIUS. ram daughter cards are a dumb idea, but how many pc's have 8 slots for RAM? not nearly enough.

    --
    Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
  94. Re:What if Ballmer and Gates had not been such dic by jsepeta · · Score: 3, Insightful

    or, Gates & Ballmer understood that web apps could destroy the need for a Windows operating system. which, in many cases, it finally has. GMail vs. Outlook, Google Docs vs. MS Office, Spotify vs. iTunes, Salesforce vs. a zillion proprietary non-web-based products... the examples are too many to mention.

    --
    Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
  95. Dear MS. Learn when to copy. Learn when to invent. by gestalt_n_pepper · · Score: 1

    Apple does some things really well. Everyone finds their interface easy, right down to text selection behavior. Do that to the extent the law allows.

    People like iPhones and their features. Copy to the extent the law allows.

    After you've got these *basics* down, concentrate on innovating something that's really cool, not just different. Focus on better AI. Focus on a better google glass (Microsoft contact lenses?). Focus on neural and speech I/O. Focus on autonomous mobile servant gadgets that work. Focus on better 3d printers.

    And remember, even Microsoft can use Linux to build things. Pick a flavor of Linux and brand it as Microsoft's. The Zorin distro isn't bad and the work's already done for you. Start there.

    --
    Please do not read this sig. Thank you.
  96. Re:Overlooked successes of MS in last 13 years by ruir · · Score: 2

    You don't get it, do you? Linux and free alternatives were born due to their shady policies. Their policies of going out of their way to create incompatibilities with competing products or already established standards haven't gone unnoticed, and for most professionals, the burden of the problem is on their side. Plus, had they diverted all this energy to actually produce new offerings, it could be they weren't between a rock and a hard place now.

  97. Catchup Artist? by fast+turtle · · Score: 1

    MS does not need a god damn catchup artist. What they need is a CEO that can Lead the Company w/o wasting resources as Balmer has trying to kill Google and treating the end-users as thiefs as the Win7 installer does.

    IMO the Win7 installer reached the needed balance between Paranoia and usefulness as you can use any Win7 install media and not have to worry about activiation until after critical updates are downloaded so long as you have a key that passes activation - as all OEM systems should.

    In the case of Win8, what I feel MS needs to do is force the OEM's to provide a link on the desktop to grab a legal download of the Win8 installer from MS that can be kept up to date by simply grabing a new image. They're already offering a Digital Download that needs the Activiation key before it will download/install so why not force the OEM's (or do it themselves in the Windows Activation Screen) to provide a link to the installer that can be updated as needed? Ensures that people have an installer that's as current as the last time it was updated by MS (critical updates and service packs) since this reduces how many non-updated systems are out there. Yes there are idiots who wont update due many reasons (lack of a connection being a big issue) so an updated installer would be a god send for them.

    --
    Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown
  98. WORD! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    why would anybody think a M$ renaissance could be a good thing for anyone but their executives & shareholders?

    I generally avoid the word "evil" as I don't like appealing to emotion & frankly it's kind of lazy but in the case of companies like M$, Goldman, Monsanto, etc whose "rap sheets" need to be gzipped just to fit on a blueray (oh, yeah - forgot about Sony) it almost becomes necessary to keep a post short enough to be read. I avoid M$ products & services not out of some sense of moral obligation but out of a pragmatic reality that every $ I give them fuels countless net negatives against consumers, innovative would-be competitors & the overall industry.

    simply stated: they are EVIL! again, not necessarily in the "moral" sense but in the practical "every $ I put in their pockets will be used to kill products/services I might want" sense (*cough!* SCO!!! *cough*). it's in their DNA! sorry to say for their employees/shareholders (of which I'm almost certainly one via funds) consumers, the industry & society in general would be better off without them...

  99. Re:What if Ballmer and Gates had not been such dic by bryanbrunton · · Score: 0

    Web apps have not destroyed the need for a Windows operating system. Smart phones and tablets are not winning/selling because they have web apps. They are winning because they have a innovative touch interface designed for the hardware, and a huge amount of non-web app software. The browser is just another application which is installed on the phone/tablet, an application which usually takes back seat to a custom app.

    Gmail and Yahoo Mail were going to succeed if accessed via Internet Explorer or via Netscape.

    In the battle to place the box under the desk, Microsoft still reigns supreme. And web apps have nothing to do with that market. The battle to place the phone in the pocket isn't being decided by which web browser is on the phone.

  100. Twelve months of the same article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This speculation about a possible successor will be repeated billions of times over the next 12 months. The news media couldn't ask for better filler.

  101. Why Not Sue? by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

    Microsoft is legend for its lawsuits, why not sue for "Catch Up?"

    Another idea, how about hiring Meg Whitman, she's done wonders for HP.

  102. Re:Overlooked successes of MS in last 13 years by colinrichardday · · Score: 1

    Linux and free alternatives were born due to their shady policies.

    No, Linus didn't like Windows, but it wasn't the politics.

    Plus, had they diverted all this energy to actually produce new offerings, it could be they weren't between a rock and a hard place now.

    and what would these new offerings be?

  103. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by sribe · · Score: 1

    Force OEMs to hand out CoAs so that their customers can re-install the OS if need be, rather than using restore media.

    You seem to be under the impression that the "restore media" garbage was the idea of the OEMs. It was not. It was Microsoft who forced the OEMs to stop providing real OS install disks.

  104. Hire Stephen Elop by hardeep1singh · · Score: 1

    He is the guy who can turn things around for Microsoft. After all, he's probably the only one outside the company who believes in Microsoft strategy. Nokia shareholders will not mind at all.

  105. Re:Licensing, Lack of Options, Screwing business a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Flavors of Linux now come in flavors? Are you sure you got the right flavor of Zentyal?

    Sheesh.

  106. they need... by RockinRoller · · Score: 0

    A bankruptcy attorney. simply as that.

  107. Re:Overlooked successes of MS in last 13 years by ruir · · Score: 1

    Are you sure about it wasnt the politics? Speaking from my personal experience, I didn't pursue Windows development and was actually searching for some decent alternatives for almost a decade due to technical shortcomings AND politics. I had the luck to understand early on I could not count on Microsoft to provide me with a solid and stable, familiar platform over time. Mind you, over time. By the time I finished my faculty project (hey, I worked at a software house before), I understood Microsoft had no interest in keeping their development API and their associated graphic libraries stable, but change them frequently enough, to disable the capability of people creating emulations or linking simulations libraries for other platforms (and sell a lot of training in the process) By luck, I could almost say my private and work life was on a route of collision with a solution. But it took me a decade and half to find a capable solution to the desktop, and almost another decade to find the hardware matching with it that feels it is fairly fast enough for my liking. What those offerings could be? A stable, decent enough platform, a better browser, some more quality software, and software that does not break with other platforms ( something they devote a lot of energy to make sure it happens ).

  108. Why is this Modded Insightful? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe you don't understand Microsoft's core business. Their ancient product strategy is selling an operating system for multipurpose computer devices.

    Maybe you are an x-box user or something?? Their device case isn't any better or worse than what Nintendo built and Microsoft sold a ton of those.

    Your obsession with "design" has very little to do with market success. Good enough sells well. Lots of pretty devices created that were never successful.

  109. There would have been two other dicks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There would have been two other dicks taking their place.

    Maybe Apple would have collapsed at the end of OS 9 like they nearly did and we would all still be using IBM hardware?

  110. just die already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    10 minutes after plugging in a new keyboard and mouse, the system finally recognized is, and then proceeds to bring a splash screen in front of everything I'm using and holds it there for more than a minute.

    I don't want that shit, I just want to type and use the mouse I plugged in!

  111. Re:Overlooked successes of MS in last 13 years by colinrichardday · · Score: 1

    Linus was never a Windows® developer; he simply didn't like the stuff on his 386.

    What those offerings could be? A stable, decent enough platform

    And once they have that platform? XP and 7 were stable and decent enough, but how does Microsoft continue to make money from them?

    a better browser

    Better, in what way? More standards compliant? Faster? Smaller footprint? Ties people even more to Microsoft?

    some more quality software

    Software that does what?

  112. Another lame microsoft story by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    next on /., a disgruntled M$ employee shamefully masturbates with a hand puppet while tending his resignation, carefully observing as the semen leaps through the air and inside the puppet's mouth, causing the puppet to dance.

    another day, another week, another month and year, another M$ story. another "don't use M$ it sucks" comment, another reply about the reply to the M$ post, a thread unravels once, twice, three times and more.

    If M$ can't rub out *nix from computers through any method of hardware enforcement, they'll likely buy up OEMs.

    Shuttleworth made a mistake in closing bug #1. How many B&M stores pushing new systems are selling something other than Apple and Windows? Go ask the employees about *nix at your local generic computer store and most of them will look like you just fucked them in the ass.

    The Windows monopoly remains, and once [or before] the OEMs start rolling out *nix, the OEMs will fall one by one, either bought by M$, another company owned by M$, and extinguished or eroded by M$ drones to keep the OEMs selling M$ c0ca1ne.

  113. china via good products by globaljustin · · Score: 1

    Speaking of insecure dictators...China is no one's answer. It is one big problem. China's leaders understand this...population, pollution, growth, carrying capacity, etc

    I know China was big in the popular literature (Friedman in his NYtimes Editorials loved talking about it) as the 'next big thing' but really conquering China is done via making a good product.

    Sure you need region-specific marketing but "China" is not a strategy...unless you are Goldman Sachs.

    This isn't market manipulation, this is technology. China is just a factor in the production/distribution/sales equation.

    From a business point of view, making the best product and rewarding your stakeholders is where the 'growth potential' is for Microsoft.

    basically M$ would have to change most of the things they have chosen to define themselves with...they'd have to basically eat Linux and become some Microsoft/Linux hybrid that is interoperable and respects user privacy.

    they'd have to fully reimagine their entire business model and definition of 'success' from a statistical and social standpoint, and be willing to get rid of virtually any personnel or project or business mode of operation...

    In my mind that's not actually asking alot...it's the same stuff anyone would have to do in order for Microsoft to "Catch Up"

    You can call it 'catching up' or 'Bayesian business model' or 'just common sense business' or 'making money' or 'making products people want' but in the end the solution is the same.

    Microsoft just has to be willing to do it.

    --
    Thank you Dave Raggett
  114. profit != innovation by globaljustin · · Score: 1

    the only area of the company right now where they are really letting people innovate

    Parent makes a great point, and your Xbox exception is interesting but I must disagree with the notion that Microsoft has 'innovated' with Xbox.

    Profitable, yes. Fun to play, yes. 'Innovation'....no.

    Overall, M$ made Xbox the same way they got Windows and DOS...they copied something successful and Wal-Mart-ized it, using their market share as leverage.

    Xbox came along at a time when the speed wars of the 80s and 90s were plateauing, product differentiation decreased, the demand for games to be easier to develop across platforms was getting hard to ignore.

    People like EA didn't want to have a different Dev team for each box for each yearly version of Madden. The differences between consoles were dwindling.

    Also: gamers were aging.

    In this context, any functional competitive box could enter the market. If it sold, EA and the like would eventually be **begging** to make a game for it. It's more units for EA and other game publishers to sell. No real major R&D was necessary, as the processing power needed for a 'next gen' game platform was on par with what you were seeing advertised at Best Buy in a desktop PC. Gamers were familiar with M$, aging out of Nintendo (always the lovable outlier!), and bored with Playstation.

    Credit M$ for seeing an opportunity to expand into a new market and jumping on it...but still, not 'innovation' just following the pack.

    So all in all I have to say GP's point stands about M$...they of course have 'innovated' but it's at a smaller level.

    IMHO, say what you want, but the .wma format was a great next step in music compression...of course M$ ruined it by trying to make it proprietary and lock it down, but .wma sounded great and the files were small.

    Also, the High Capacity Color Barcode is cooler than QR Codes...but again...of course...it didn't catch on b/c M$ locks it down.

    So I'm a M$ hater as much as the next, but they did have some good people working on a few good projects. That's where the 'innovation' happened. Deep down in the woodwork.

    Profit != Innovation

    Both are good, but you won't get either if you don't know the difference!!!

    --
    Thank you Dave Raggett
    1. Re:profit != innovation by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Parent makes a great point, and your Xbox exception is interesting but I must disagree with the notion that Microsoft has 'innovated' with Xbox.

      Profitable, yes. Fun to play, yes. 'Innovation'....no.

      Overall, M$ made Xbox the same way they got Windows and DOS...they copied something successful and Wal-Mart-ized it, using their market share as leverage.

      Xbox came along at a time when the speed wars of the 80s and 90s were plateauing, product differentiation decreased, the demand for games to be easier to develop across platforms was getting hard to ignore.

      I'm not saying deciding to sell a console in itself was innovative, and I'm not pro-Microsoft or Xbox... I buy a game console when there is something I want to use it for/play that none of the others have... in fact, right now given how similar the XBOne and PS4 look, until there are some amazing XB exclusives I'll probably just get the PS4 for now. But there were clearly a number of innovative things MS has done for Xbox over the years... a few of them:

        * since they approached it as a software company, they made the development tools, APIs, and dev process MUCH easier to work with (if you want to debate me on this, note I have developed for 360, PS3, and have a PS4 and XBOne in the office now - I don't need to hear second hand opinions). Ironically this is not so much an issue with the latest gen, there are some things about Sony's dev env I like better now)
        * they really pushed online console gameplay and community/friends/etc - whatever you think about its monthly fees, XBox Live is hugely successful and popular... they have in fact done a pretty good job on party chat, game matchmaking/invites, sharing, etc.
        * also XBox Live related, they really pushed DLC into the mainstream - and it's paid off, it's made XBLive a lot of money over the last few years
        * Kinect, while still flawed in many ways, was definitely innovative - in fact, as an almost stunning move on MS's part (given how bad they are at this usually), they actually took something interesting being developed in their MS Research group and productized it. And now with XBOne they have fixed many of the issues - the new Kinect does some crazy cool things, I'm looking forward to some GOOD apps that use it, not the crap that was made for XB 360 Kinect.
        * We'll have to see how it works out, but they have really bet a lot of the XBOne's success on it being a complete entertainment hub in the living room. Like you said, innovation != profit - in this case we'll see if their bet pays off.

      Anyway - I'd argue they came into the fairly stagnant console industry and approached it from a different perspective, resulting in some interesting developments. Which again ironically is what is hurting them in other markets like desktop and mobile - others are coming in with new perspectives and MS can't figure out how to change theirs.

    2. Re:profit != innovation by globaljustin · · Score: 1

      yo, thanks for the response...I appreciate your experience...I don't really 'disagree' with anything you said, but I think our point of contention is the definition of 'innovation'

      You listed these:

      * since they approached it as a software company, they made the development tools, APIs, and dev process MUCH easier to work with (if you want to debate me on this, note I have developed for 360, PS3, and have a PS4 and XBOne in the office now - I don't need to hear second hand opinions). Ironically this is not so much an issue with the latest gen, there are some things about Sony's dev env I like better now)
          * they really pushed online console gameplay and community/friends/etc - whatever you think about its monthly fees, XBox Live is hugely successful and popular... they have in fact done a pretty good job on party chat, game matchmaking/invites, sharing, etc.
          * also XBox Live related, they really pushed DLC into the mainstream - and it's paid off, it's made XBLive a lot of money over the last few years
          * Kinect, while still flawed in many ways, was definitely innovative - in fact, as an almost stunning move on MS's part (given how bad they are at this usually), they actually took something interesting being developed in their MS Research group and productized it. And now with XBOne they have fixed many of the issues - the new Kinect does some crazy cool things, I'm looking forward to some GOOD apps that use it, not the crap that was made for XB 360 Kinect.
          * We'll have to see how it works out, but they have really bet a lot of the XBOne's success on it being a complete entertainment hub in the living room. Like you said, innovation != profit - in this case we'll see if their bet pays off.

      I can categorize your 'innovations' into two industry-standard, essential, run-of-the-mill, first year undergrad-level **business operations**

      1. making technology systems more interoperable (your points 1 and 5)
      2. marketing (your points 2 and 3)

      What I'm saying is, what you call 'innovation' is actually the same stuff businesses do as a standard method of operation.

      It's not at all, in any way, problem solving by adapting new ideas or approaches.

      Language is the pitfall! Just because some CEO guy makes a speech and says "We're going to approach gaming like a **software company**" and then do the same thing everyone else in American business always does...bottleneck features to lock down users...and collect private data for marketing.

      My definition of 'innovation' isn't too strict either. I allow for marketing to be 'innovative'...my example is how Steve Jobs used his clout from his success at Pixar to finally convince the RIAA to sell music online. Forget the iPod...

      THAT was innovative marketing...it solved a problem (dumbass out of touch RIAA) with a new approach...using Jobs' star power to overwhelm their misgivings about piracy.

      Now, your point #4, Kinex...I can allow it. I'm sure that the dev team had to do some innovative thinking to make such a complex system work so smoothly.

      The **concept** is not new!!! Power Glove!!!

      However, I acknowledge the innovations needed in the engineering to make it happen.

      That's a credit to those individual team members...who was probably having to fight against the grain to make some of their improvements.

      If you read the stories of former M$'ers, they often describe just such a scenario.

      M$ doesn't get credit for innovation done **in spite of** it's corporate policy and behavior!!!

      --
      Thank you Dave Raggett
    3. Re:profit != innovation by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Taking existing concepts or technology and applying them in new ways or to new businesses or markets is also innovation. There are dozens of examples in science, engineering, philosophy, literature, etc where someone was able to use their different perspective (mostly with existing ideas and techniques) and apply them to other (often intellectually stagnant) fields with great results. One fun example is Freakonomics...

      The **concept** is not new!!! Power Glove!!!

      This is a good example of what I mean - saying the concept of Kinect isn't innovative because someone in the past created a device that can (sort of) control a game via moving around is about as accurate as saying the automobile wasn't innovative because people had been getting around in horse drawn carriages for centuries. Innovation, research, writing, art, etc - most endeavors requiring creativity and thought theses are not giant new concepts created from whole cloth, they are small but important adaptations on the huge existing body of human work. Innovation isn't dead, it's just become very specialized.

      M$ doesn't get credit for innovation done **in spite of** it's corporate policy and behavior!!!

      Of course they do. It is what it is, and opinions (however justified) about their (mis)management shouldn't change that.

  115. MS needs a completely new market by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    MS needs to take advantage of "The Matthew Effect" by beginning research and development in an area that noone significant is working on. For example, Biological Computing. Research into engineering living systems for computation and interface...

  116. Re:OS X and Windows are the only good DEs out ther by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Only Microsoft can do that.

    well if you meant to say that they will certify a hardware device and then when you upgrade to the next os version, they will tell you the very same device is not certified or compatible. well, then I would agree. how many printers were bought because of windows XP, then because of Vista? then most people just use a tablet and not windows at all.

    yes, only Microsoft can do that

  117. Solution... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Buy Yahoo!. Promote Marissa to CEO of the whole shebang.

  118. Innovate don't replicate by zodwallopp · · Score: 1

    Catchup my ass, who wants a second rate product. You've tried and failed, now go back to the creative types in your heard and make something amazing.

  119. Not Ballmer's fault ... his inheritance by IwantToKeepAnon · · Score: 1

    Ballmer didn't start the fire (apologies to Billy Joel), he inherited it. For decades there has been no other choice and users sat by and watched MS either buy out or pound the competition to dust. They banked up a LOT of "un-goodwill", they've been in the red as far as goodwill is concerned for ages.

    Now that there are valid alternatives, they are reaping what they sowed. Fair enough.

    Anybody read Dune and God Emperor of Dune? Put a strangle hold on a population long enough and as soon as the grip starts to slip, BAM! They're gone.

    --
    "Happy families are all alike; every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way." -- Anna Karenina by Leo Tolstoy
    1. Re:Not Ballmer's fault ... his inheritance by IwantToKeepAnon · · Score: 1

      Forgot to finish my thought. How does MS recover from all the badwill? Can they?

      The MS brand is becoming (or already is) poison. They need to split up all functions into subsidiaries and let them brand themselves w/o the MS moniker (except in the fine legal print). Leave the MS name for the OS only.

      --
      "Happy families are all alike; every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way." -- Anna Karenina by Leo Tolstoy
  120. innovation = everything by globaljustin · · Score: 1

    M$ doesn't get credit for innovation done **in spite of** it's corporate policy and behavior!!!

    Of course they do. It is what it is, and opinions (however justified) about their (mis)management shouldn't change that.

    Ok...ok...ok then...

    What can a tech company do that makes profit that is **not** innovation in your definition?

    It appears that, by your definition, a business could say copy an innovative OS from a competitor, slap a new name on it and it is, by your definition, "innovation"...if it sells.

    So define this in the negative for me: What can a tech company do that is **not** innovation if a new product makes a profit?

    --
    Thank you Dave Raggett
    1. Re:innovation = everything by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      It appears that, by your definition, a business could say copy an innovative OS from a competitor, slap a new name on it and it is, by your definition, "innovation"...if it sells.

      Well, like you said in your earlier post, innovation is not just technology. Your comment is obviously referring to MS's early success with DOS... which of course wasn't their innovation, but the way they sold it (ie. license an OS for a fairly small per unit cost on a cheap computer that would sell in the millions) sure was! ;) Before DOS, software was usually sold by IBM with a hugely expensive support contract or as near one-offs by hobbyists...

      So define this in the negative for me: What can a tech company do that is **not** innovation if a new product makes a profit?

      Well, I was very specific about the things I claimed were innovation with the Xbox, and by no means have all of them directly led to a profit. As far as something that (to me) doesn't seem innovative in pretty much any way... how about take the exact same product and make it cheaper by paying your employees 20% of the company that invented it (our outsourcing your own products for the same increased margin). There isn't a lot of innovation coming out of China at the moment (well, beyond innovations in industrial espionage and malware...) There are tons of middlemen who just take someone's risks and ideas and build them - it's not sexy or innovative, but often profitable...

    2. Re:innovation = everything by globaljustin · · Score: 1

      how about take the exact same product and make it cheaper (via biz structure)......There isn't a lot of innovation coming out of China at the moment

      there we go...that's an answer, thank you

      so, a 'cheap knock-off' would be fully non-innovative? fair?

      if yes, then you really just proved my point for me. at some point it is about the quality of the product in your definition. that means you agree with my contention that X microsoft product would *not* be innovative if it met certain criteria related to other products on the market (the things that make it a 'cheap knock off').

      the only difference is, as I said a few posts ago, your own personal notions of where that line is...

      as far as this discussion goes you can call it a stalemate if that makes you feel better...M$ is *not* an innovator in any way and to use a reductive definition, as you do, only causes confusion and bad choices in the marketplace...when you use reductive definitions it becomes anarchy and hype rules the day

      innovation is a complex concept...it seems you aren't comfortable with that complexity...the survival of our industrial demands we draw a line between true 'innovation' and standard business growth tactics.

      if no, then I really do not understand your concept of innovation. please state it in a different way perhaps?

      --
      Thank you Dave Raggett
  121. Re:No "catch-up artist" will be allowed in there by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The market has spoken and your ideas are worthless. Sorry.