Slashdot Mirror
CERN Wants a New Particle Collider Three Times Larger Than the LHC
Daniel_Stuckey writes "Not content with the 27-kilometer-round Large Hadron Collider, researchers at CERN have their sights set on a new beast of a particle collider that could have a circumference of 80 to 100 kilometers. The nuclear research organization announced that it was hatching plans for an ambitious successor to the LHC with an international study called the Future Circular Colliders program, which will kick off with a meeting next week. The idea is to consider different hadron collider designs similar to the existing LHC but more powerful — much more powerful. CERN wrote it was looking for a collider 'capable of reaching unprecedented energies in the region of 100 TeV.' The existing LHC will reach a maximum of around 14 TeV."
But before they use that collider they'll want to get it out of Beta first.
Breakfast served all day!
so all of the old LHC users can complain about the new LHC
OK, let's build bigger one!
What's ironic for me is that the articles over the last couple of days have been a lot more interesting to me than in recent weeks, while I fully support the FUCK BETA protest, it's a real shame that we're missing out on some interesting discussion.
In a cybernetic fit of rage she pissed off to another age...
(Hans Moleman is inside a phone booth at the bird sanctuary with birds attacking him.)
Hans Moleman: (into the phone) Hello, I need the largest seed bell you have. (pause) No, that's too big.
My point is that some things can be too big: but not a supercollider.
Humorbot 5.0: So I said, "Super-collider? I just met her!" [audience laughs] And then they built the super collider.
Also insert here some observation about theoretical maximum energies, public misunderstandings and political obstacles.
So where will everybody be next week?
Hacker news ...?
Lobste.rs
Reddit
Also, has someone volunteered to put up a slashcott update site (maybe with statistics on how well/poorly the site is doing during the blockade?)
Just curious.
"Beware of bugs in the above code; I have only proved it correct, not tried it." -- Donald Knuth
US5722418
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US5644363
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GoogleGlass
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Acceptance
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If history is any sort of an indicator, any rights we sell today, our children must buy back with blood tomorrow
And a new pair of roller skates, and a new girl friend, and a new life.
Very good.
Will soon be hosted at AltSlashdot.org or a site linked through that domain.
It will be for the Nerds, by the Nerds, focusing on the Stuff That Really Matters: The community that makes the comments the best part of Slashdot.
The name will change to avoid any trademark problems. The new domain will be linked through AltSlashdot.org for as long as practical.
Some have suggested encouraging Bruce Perens to resurrect Technocrat.net for the third time. With all due respect to Bruce, the problem with that is he has shown he is not a reliable host. He has twice deleted that site without warning and without providing access to the archives. I don't think we want to get burned a third time.
This is old news, and was reported on this very site last year: http://science.slashdot.org/story/13/11/13/1451221/physicists-plan-to-build-a-bigger-lhc
Yeah, all those lousy research scientists are just in it for the big money and don't produce anything useful.
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
"Not content with the profitability of Slashdot, researchers at DICE have their sights set on a new beast of a website that could have a negative content impact of 80 to 100 percent. The “leading provider of specialized websites” announced that it was hatching plans for an horrendous successor to Slashdot.org with an experimental rollout, which was quickly shit upon by the Slashdot community, resulting in an “apology” this week. The idea is to consider different Slashdot designs that will result of greater monetization of contributed assets— much more money. DICE wrote it was looking for a major redesign in order to create a website more accessible and shareable by a wider audience. "The existing site is fine. Fuck beta."
And yet, the number of on-topic comments hasn't increased, either. It's not that people are getting accustomed to beta, it's that they're leaving.
We're locked into the current two-party system by the very nature of first-past-the-poll voting. We're more-or-less locked into Youtube by its sheer mass: your average Joe doesn't have the server space or $$ to hold all that video content like Google does.
We're not locked into slashdot. We have nostalgic feelings for it, but that's all.
Everything is better with chainsaws.
People hate change... I don't get it.
I'm trying beta right now. I can read the articles. Read the comments. Post a comment, obviously... what's the big deal other than hating change?
Well... maybe I'll see the issue when I click "preview"...
Didn't we almost had it? See Superconducting Super Collider This was proposed in 1983 and cancelled in 1992 after spending 2 billion USD.
the nested blocks? I can see that getting annoying at enough levels down...
They're calling it FCC. (Future Circular Colliders). What a stupid choice. I mean its bound to cause some confusion that could have very easily been avoided.
I realise the FCC (Federal Communications Commission) isn't a global organization but you'd think CERN would have the brains and foresight to avoid reuse of already long established and very well-known acronyms.
just keep getting smaller and smaller?
Reminds me of reading a site on the phone where the blocks would eventually get so small that only a single word is shown on each line. okay...that's annoying.
Yeah, I had thought about becoming a charged particle detector technician because it's a lifestyle of high rollers, fast cars, and fast women. Didn't you know that quantum mechanics eat steak?
I think they could put this new super large particle collider in the whitespace left by Beta.
Made to order for a 40 TeV collider! Halfway to 100 TeV, triple the energy of LHC! Save billions in construction!
http://www.amusingplanet.com/2...
Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do. (Isaac Asimov)
I can only picture that someone who looks like Dr. Evil (from the Austin Powers series) commissioning the construction of this "bigger, better" supercollider :|
See. They sized it at 27 kilometers. If the had made it 27 miles instead it would be much more powerfuler.
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
It's like an unpaid internship, but forever!
10 PRINT CHR$(205.5+RND(1)); : GOTO 10
.... suck more than slashdot beta?
BETA is clearly about monetization. The kids today - the next generation of consumers - expect a trendy style that slashdot doesn't exhibit. Dice is clearly interested in attracting a larger "audience" and they can't afford to have these new consumers visit the site, decide that it's not hip enough or it looks "old", and move on never to return. That has to be the thinking behind BETA.
And the reason they want to increase their "audience share" is simple: The more people visit the site the more they can charge for advertising space. It really is that simple. They want to turn slashdot into a profit generator and the community be damned. They will happily throw all of us under the bus if it means they can acquire hordes of retards whose idea of insightful commentary consists of nothing more than "+1", or "Like" or (as we used to loathe in the days of AOHeLl: "Me too!"
Like broadcast television and several other advertising models, they want to turn US into the PRODUCT that they sell to ADVERTISERS.
Greedy sleazebags. I eagerly await Boycott Week from Feb 10th through the 17th. My only use of slashdot that week will be using the name on other sites to see how much the traffic drops off. More widespread dissemination of the BOYCOTT week needs to happen this weekend before it's scheduled to start on Monday. The only way to get through to marketeers and corporatist assholes is to hit 'em where it hurts: in their wallet. A boycott has the potential to show them just how low their "brand" can sink when they piss off their loyal userbase.
They Should consider building a dual purpose atom accelerator (Lepton Accelerator). One purpose would be research of the particles by colliding them. The secondary purpose would be defense of the earth from meteorites. Once you accelerate a ton of atoms to the speed of light you, then, can direct the accelerated beam towards meteorite and destroy it. This new accelerator can be valuable defense installation. Also easier to justify the funds needed and take them from military budgets. I can see that in 50 years we will be building particle accelerator with the radius of the earth, 6378 kilometers or circumference of 40,000 kilometeres. Based on my approximate calculations, if current technologies are used we could achieve 21 PeV or 20734 TeV in such accelerator.
The Moonriders will save us.
Damn shame we didn't build one in Texas when we had the chance.
- Zav - Imagine a Beowulf cluster of insensitive clods...
It has to be at least .... 3 times as large!
Here's the compelling reason... to ruin it. Other sites have done it, so why not slashdot?
Yahoo! news: ruined
Yahoo! mail: ruined
Google groups: ruined
iOS: ruined with iOS7
windows: ruined with 8/8.1
ms office: ruined by ribbons
Even *I* want a collider 3x as powerful as the most powerful particle accelerator the world has yet seen, and I'm not even a physicist.
I like to imagine the kilometers of stainless steel gleaming in the harsh mercury vapor illumination; the drifting swirls of escaped cryogenic vapors; the sound of my evil laughter echoing in the vast subterranean chamber. If those things don't inspire you, there must be something inhuman about you.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
And yet, the number of on-topic comments hasn't increased, either. It's not that people are getting accustomed to beta, it's that they're leaving.
We're locked into the current two-party system by the very nature of first-past-the-poll voting. We're more-or-less locked into Youtube by its sheer mass: your average Joe doesn't have the server space or $$ to hold all that video content like Google does.
We're not locked into slashdot. We have nostalgic feelings for it, but that's all.
And low UIDs. Any replacement site will have to allow UID porting
It seems that the Texas location is fair game again.
There are not too many places where a 100Km circle can be scribed
and not slice through hills, mountains, and towns.
My personal preference for spending billions and billions
on research would best be an expansion and repurposing
of the US federal compute center (NSA, FBI, DHS) in Utah
to be a national and global climate center research center.
There is a real need to understand the climate changes man made
or not and understand what needs to happen.
We could plant merlot grapes in Norway or in the Sahara so they
would be ready when the climate changes to favor them. If that
was not enough reason we could look at fields of corn sugar production
moving to Brazil.
Food, fuel, water -- changes natural or not need to be understood.
Perhaps if we were to grind Gibraltar into chunks that could be trucked
a short distance so we could close off the entrance to the Mediterranean
by reducing that thermal mass the Sahara could be made to bloom (or not).
The reality is that food production is a lot harder than a couple zucchini plants
that are so easy to coax into abundance.
Then there is insulation, flood planes, mosquito born maladies.
Recall that there are still vast areas of Africa that are want to kill
you with insect born diseases.
Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't. Mark Twain.
I can't tell if you're telling the truth because I can't see the YouTube comments any more ...
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
wont' help.l they will just want one 3X bigger than THAT next. (I build high energy accelerators, we always want more...)
On the topic, though, I thought next generation accelerators would be linear to avoid radiational losses.
Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
"Dad, I wanna 100-foot-tall pony!"
Table-ized A.I.
I doubt the Physics community will trust the US Government to be a critical partner any project that big until the institutional memory of the SSC budget axe goes away. We are just over 20 years into what I expect to be a 40-60 year wait for that to happen.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
What is their goal? LHC was to find the Higgs boson. Now they have it (though I am not sure it has any consequence), what is the next goal?
Today I Learned: TTSIA!!
Slashdot Valentines Beta Massacre: iT WORKED! The boycotts killed Beta!!
These geniuses can build CERN, but they can't install it on the moon? I understand, it's the math; right? And CERN types don't really work with the math? CERN types are more big picture folks, right?
Each generation of these circular accelerators just gets bigger and bigger (yes, for technical reasons like electron energy dissipation as it moves fast in a circle). Physicists should stop doing this incremental size-increase crap and just go for the maximum. The incremental approach would appear to cost more money in the long run.
Wouldn't the optimal path to increase the speed of matter as rapidly as possible be a straight line? Perhaps it's impractical, but they could conceivably build an accelerator that wrapped the surface of Earth. Go for the gold or go home. :)
Buy your next Linux PC at eightvirtues.com
It's always been like this. Every change in the layout has been met with lots of shouting and "We hate you" etc. Eventually it dies down and nobody cares anymore.
There are two things about the beta I don't like: the stupid pictures that come with every article, and the enormous amount of white space to the right of the comments. For the rest it's fine with me, just as the old layout is fine with me.
-- Cheers!
will you fucking twats take your complaints about the beta to the correct forum instead of infecting all the articles with your trivial childish comments
"The hands that help are better far than lips that pray." - Robert Ingersoll (1833-1899)
Send them to CERN and launch them like particles, that should remove defects.
Makes me wonder why CERN doesnt anticipate their future desires and build one TEN times bigger so they can save money and real estate. When they get one thats 3 times bigger theyll only want another bigger one, then a bigger one. CUT TO THE CHASE, build it 10 times bigger so you dont have a country full of super colliders and no where to farm, swim, drive, live, etc.
Think ahead, Jeez! Probably get a better break on raw materials buying in bigger bulk anyway. Youd think theyd put someone SMART in charge of this to begin with. What, a bunch of physicists, engineers and kitchen help and no-one can CAD up the dream machine? COME ON!
*Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
NO.
. . . it is all Web page redesign and Marketing.
Wait...you mean...APK was right?!
"Those who consume the bulk of goods are those who make them. We must never forget this secret of our prosperity."
The excuse that "they are not going to destroy the Universe" is based on cosmic rays having energies way beyond what a ring circling the planet could achieve, although I guess the luminosity is low and that is why we are not swallowed up by a black hole?
But Dyson's point is that these mega projects are throwing bucks/Euros after diminishing returns as the interesting stuff is probably still outside your reach. He thought that people should be considering novel concepts rather than just making what we have bigger . . . and more expensive.
Thats the upgrade. This is the successor.
"The space elevator will be built about 50 years after everyone stops laughing." - Arthur C. Clarke ~1980
THANK YOU. It seems that if beta doesn't drive people away, the incessant whining about it the comments of every article will.
They'd better get the name of it right: I presume, previous to the LHC, there have been a Small and a Medium so Xtra Large might be good - plus there's plenty of room for further, bigger colliders.
But if they leap straight in with "Mega" or "Super Ginormous" - well, they're gonna run out of names for future colliders pretty damn quick.
"Quite Big" is nicely understated; but in this age of superlative madness, where everything is "Giga", and "Ultra" - even though it's the first iteration of a product - and people who manage to walk across a room without blinding themselves with a spoon are labelled "Heroes"...
Well, they'll probably call it the "Omega Class, Hyper-lightspeed, Super-massive, Multi-yottabyte Particle Annihilator"
And then, when they want a bigger one, they'll be fucked - like Beta should be.
while (true != false) process_more_stupid_code();
You sound like my grandpa. The train to the future just left and you're still at the station. Get used to the fact that change is constant, embrace it, or be left behind. Resistance is futile!
MOD parent up! I don't have mod points today - which is slightly unusual.
Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"