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Zazzle.com Thinks Depictions of Pi Are Protected Intellectual Property
Byteme writes: "A number of Zazzle.com users have had their art and products removed from the site after a man named Paul Ingrisano was granted a trademark for 'Pi Productions' using a logo that consists of this freely available version of the pi symbol from the Wikimedia website combined with a period. He made infringement claims against several websites, and Zazzle took down many clothing products that featured designs using the pi symbol. When users called them on it, they locked a public forum thread and said they're evaluating Ingrisano's complaint."
i better get to work on my "/." logo copy right
God invented Pi. don't get his lawyers into this...
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
If the trademark has a period, and the clothing designs etc do not, how does Dazzle justify that being a trademark infringement?
Because if that is legal, I am going to trademark ng on red signs with STOP on them and sue the gov't for using something too similar.
while(1) attack(People.Sandy);
My PI hole sez no. (don't ask what my CORN hole sez)
https://tsdrapi.uspto.gov/ts/c...
Lets kill 2 birds with 1 stone.
1. Fuck that guy.
2. Lets switch to Tau http://tauday.com http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tau
(pi)ssant capitalists... anything to make a buck.
The original deep link to USPTO.GOV is broken. Are we talking about registration# 4473631? That specifically covers the stylized "pi mathematical symbol followed by a period." There is no exclusive right given for the symbol pi by itself or in other contexts.
NOT.
(For those of you who think that crony capitalism is the same thing as capitalism, you'd better go and review the difference between free trade and coercive prohibitions on free trade.)
That's a lotta textbook publishers to sue right there. They have deep pockets.
Fraternities ... mathematicians ... physicists ... the universe.
Whatever moron gave a trademark on the symbol for pi should be staked to an anthill.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
There is a lot of (justifiable) outrage at the troll/pirate who filed the copyright. Frankly, it's ridiculous that it was granted in the first place. But this shocked disbelief at Zazzle or other sites for not accepting the risk of possibly infringing on a copyright claim is just as ridiculous.
TFA mentioned affected customers of the Zazzle service filing a class-action lawsuit to re-coup lost revenue. Granted, I haven't read the Zazzle terms of service, but unless there is some sort of contract in place, people seem to be forgetting that as an independent business, Zazzle is under no obligation to print any of your crappy t-shirts. That's the free market at work.
Just as when YouTube pulls content, they are making a decision to save themselves a potentially expensive hassle by pissing off some of their customer base. If people don't like it, the answer is to find another platform, not try to resort to a lawsuit.
his initials, Paul Ingrisano
Paul Ingrisano also owns "I 3" ..... Yeah ok.
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
This guy is seriously in need of a Streisand-ing. Can we find contact info and/or a review page we can hit?
.... and claiming omega as a trademark! :-D
What's a good Greek letter for a beer brewery to claim? (Salty Cowdawg Brewery)
R. Schlafly (1994) obtained U.S. Patent 5373560 on the following two primes (expressed in hexadecimal notation):
98A3DF52AEAE9799325CB258D767EBD1F4630E9B
9E21732A4AFB1624BA6DF911466AD8DA960586F4
A0D5E3C36AF099660BDDC1577E54A9F402334433
ACB14BCB
and
93E8965DAFD9DFECFD00B466B68F90EA68AF5DC9
FED915278D1B3A137471E65596C37FED0C7829FF
8F8331F81A2700438ECDCC09447DC397C685F397
294F722BCC484AEDF28BED25AAAB35D35A65DB1F
D62C9D7BA55844FEB1F9401E671340933EE43C54
E4DC459400D7AD61248B83A2624835B31FFF2D95
95A5B90B276E44F9.
Too bad the general public is too apathetic to see how completely retarded patenting a common mathematical symbol is when the dam thing has been in use for THOUSANDS of years prior.
Reference:
* http://mathworld.wolfram.com/P...
This guy is seriously trademarking the common shorthand for "I love" next: I 3
First Pi (with a period after it) and now I 3. What other common symbols will he attempt to trademark? LOL? RTFA? HTTP?
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
You can't copyright or patent math, but it seems you can trademark it!
1. Lock down post of people bitching.
2. Sue people posting bad reviews on Yelp.
3. Keep fighting.
4. Pretend they've never heard of Barbra Streisand.
5. Keep pretending.
6. Get quiet.
7. Wait.
8. Public apology.
9. Repeat in two years.
Art!
Zazzle.com. A web site that I've never heard of before, but won't ever be visiting...
The filing for the trademark can be found searching google using:
Ingrisano site:.uspto.gov
Introducing my new trademark:
Zazzle.
http://i.imgur.com/XmlkzKv.png
Notice the period on the end... it makes it unique! I will be contacting Zazzle shortly about taking down their entire website.
The judge should void the trademark and decree that he have " JACKASS " tattooed on his forehead as a warning to others. Also for the nimrod that approved such a flimsy trademark claim in the first place.
(n/t)
That specifically covers the stylized "pi mathematical symbol followed by a period."
Oh dear. I guess we'll have to fix all textbooks to remove infringing uses of pi at the end of a sentence..
Example of infringing use:
The ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter is .
Non-infringing alternatives:
The ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter is ! :)
The ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter is
, what the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter is.
This could be the event that moves us all to a Tau-based economy!
So all i need to do is copyright the most commonly used letter, and i'm set for life.
I officially, in public forum, claim the letter E, and any commonly known permutations of it, as my own, and i reserve all rights for its use. Pay up suckers.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Angie's List tried to use threats of a lawsuit to bully me into removing REFERENCES TO THEM from the Internet because I had bad things to say about their double-dipping legalized extortion business model. Companies actually think that they own the things they trademark, as if they can control who says their name. Trademark abuse is a rampant thing, but most people who face it don't say anything publicly because of the fear of actually being sued. I don't have a solution but I can definitely say that Angie's List can shove it up their asses.
Ma Bell, "AT&T" to the unwashed, used a symbol of a bell in a cricle. They never trade marked it. Then some jack ass trade marked it. AT&T lost the case. I think wistle butt just may a leg to stand on, if a letter can be trade marked.
Um. Try a few millennium earlier. Try ~800 BCE...
All your homework are belong to us.
My first thought was the decimal approximation done up in some artsy way that would be copyrightable. A non-simple spiral, non-common calligraphy styles, that sort of thing.
Paul Ingrisano
1933 73rd street
Brooklyn, NY 11204
Apperently, he's an arteeest.
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
Better to own the domain, anyways. That's why I own I8-D.com. I leave the interpretation of my art up to my audience... is it a smiley face... or something more insidious!
I8-D
That thief owes me money!
Seriously, this patent thing is getting way out of hand.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Then some jack ass trade marked it. AT&T lost the case.
I would like to read up on this case. Links or citations of news, magazine, or journal articles about the the case would be useful. Contemporary references would be best. If those aren't available, court case information or the equivalent information if it was decided by the USPTO or then-equivalent agency would be helpful.
Thanks.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
10. Letter of Protest
Third Parties may use the form to object to the registration of a mark currently pending in the USPTO if they provide a basis for refusing registration during ex parte examination. Issues such as prior use or fraud are not grounds for accepting a letter of protest. You must attach objective evidence to the letter of protest to be forwarded to the examining attorney unless you are only citing a prior pending application or registration. In those cases, you do not need to attach copies of documents already in the USPTO data base. You may just provide the relevant serial numbers or registration numbers. Please note: Arguments or information in the letter itself are never forwarded for consideration by the examining attorney. The USPTO will deny any letter of protest that merely presents purely adversarial arguments or is otherwise inappropriate.
A letter of protest must be filed no later than thirty (30) days after the date of publication or the USPTO will deny it as untimely. The USPTO will grant a letter of protest filed after publication only where publication of the mark constituted clear error because the evidence provided establishes a prima facie case for refusal of registration. A letter of protest may not be filed for registered marks; instead, a petition to cancel a registered mark must be filed with the Trademark Trial and Appeal Board. For further information, see TMEP 1715 et seq.
You may also use this form to file a Petition to the Director to review the denial of a Letter of Protest. Using the Letter of Protest form rather than the 2.146 Petition to the Director form will ensure that the petition does not become part of the public record. You must comply with the requirements for filing a Petition to the Director including the submission of the $100 petition fee. 37 C.F.R. 2.146. You may include authorization to charge the fee to a USPTO Deposit Account or submit a completed credit card authorization form with your filing.
I jumped through the preview, but thanks for the correction
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
I can understand how many in this community would think that because a trademark (or copyright) has been registered, the registrant has "carte blanche" to use it and prohibit others from using it. That is, after all, how domain registrations work...
What a registration really is is the filing and recognition of a CLAIM to ownership rights. The USPTO does do a search to make a determination of its own as to whether the registrant has any rights in a trademark, but that is far, far from conclusive. There are examples in the caselaw where some unknown guy out in the middle of Iowa has been using an unregistered trademark, someone else comes along later registering that same or a similar trademark (innocently and coincidentally), and the registrant can't stop the little guy from continuing his use. What the registration does is to put the world on notice of the intent of the registrant to use the registered trademark, and give him an avenue against parties who come along later wanting to use it. The registrant still has to prove in court that it has ownership rights, EVEN THOUGH it has registered the trademark.
So this "PI." trademark could be attacked in a number of ways. It could be that the registrant really hasn't used (or continued to use) it in the marketplace. The symbol is arguably so generic that trademark rights cannot be had. Sometimes trademark rights are restricted to one field of use, and others get to use it for something else. And, from the example above, it could be that the alleged infringers started using the symbol before the registrant did.
So what our legal system prescribes is that Zazzle and their suppliers go consult with their own attorneys, competent in trademark law, and decide whether they need to change their products. That's what lawyers are for...
Fuck overpriced Zazzle. I go to Spreadshirt.
Nope, god used 3 as a value of Pi in his holy scripture and as far as I know the bible does not mention explicitly the magnitude in any way, you need to infer the value from the episode of the sea furniture thing (spoiler alert: is 1.4 cubits short :p)
I'm friends with some artists, and the problem with Zazzle (and many other sites like them) is that actually stolen content gets submitted all the time, and they probably got sick of getting 1000 emails from an artist and all of that artist's fans for someone effectively stealing a design and submitting it as their own.
This guy doesn't have a leg to stand on, but it doesn't mean that nobody ever has a reason to complain. The reality is that the internet is a place where people try and pass things off as their own constantly. That's bad enough, but when someone starts making money off of your art--your original, actual art--it becomes really damaging to you. People start thinking YOUR design is the fake, even though it's the original. It sucks.
So yeah, this is lame and bit lazy, but not immediately responding to an infringement notice is also lame and lazy.
...the domain PaulIngrisanoIsADirtyCuntbag.com
... and copyright... these guys are trying to rent seek on the oddest things.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
I've been through dozens of these kind of "requests' myself, and you know what?
No one ever, ever blames google for stealing and displaying people's intellectual property. It's always the little guy getting shitted on.
Google cache, and the pre-display of photos is just fine for Google, but for anyone else on the internet you're not allowed to display anything of that nature for fair use.
Fuck all of you dumb assholes for giving Google a free pass in regards to copyright/intellectual property and the display of it.
The trademark registration was transferred to the baby Bells upon divestiture. A short time later, the judge handling the divestiture ruled that AT&T had to stop using it because it was owned by the regional Bell operating companies (baby Bells).
It isn't a patent. It is a registration for Pi-period as a trademark for Athletic Apparel and Footwear. That doesn't stop someone from registering Pi-period as a trademark for some other kind of product or service. If you want, you can make Pi-period brand soft drinks, or Pi-period brand anything -- other than athletic apparel and footware. You might want to avoid Pi-period as a trademark for something that is too close to Athletic Apparel and Footware. Pi-period brand cola, OK. Pi-period brand stop watches, maybe not. You would think that if Zazzle is going to take down user-submitted content because of trademark infringement claims, they would get a clue about how trademark law works.
Linky
TL;DR
Basically, there's an inner measurement and an outer measurement, and we're not given the thickness, Or it was understood at the time. Something like that.
I get why people are mad at Zazzle but they have little choice but to take down the offending material or be exposed to a huge liability lawsuit. The problem begins and ends with the granting of the trademark and our legal system.
We give out trademarks like candy and are forced to deal with the consequences of this.
The law is clear that safe harbor only applies when site comply with takedown requests.
Lets keep God out of it too; his people are crazy.
that stupidity isn't painful. Add to that, greed.
sexual excitement.
There is a balance in trademarks between distinctiveness and familiarity. Perhaps the guy with the "Pi." mark should be required to make his mark more distinctive. I could go for that.
Perhaps the trademark examiner should have applied a higher standard for distinctiveness than he did...
That sounds like it's only for marks that are pending, not for those already granted. And who hears about them before something idiotic is granted.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
Perhaps Paul Ingrisano thinks this is an good way to get publicity for himself and his business. If he does, IMHO, it's the dumbest marketing concept of the year.
The USPTO hires lawyers straight from law school to make decisions that may or may not impede commerce. This is simply one of the bonehead approvals they have granted.
Another bonehead example is a patent the USPTO granted that caused the demise of the show "The Philanthropist." The show used Bing in the show to appear as advertisements. The USPTO lawyer must have either been very young and thought he or she knew everything or simply ignored (like the PI approving lawyer) previous art and the public domain. If you watch the old Lucy shows along with other TV shows of the era, not to mention radio shows, blatant advertising was scripted into the shows. That's where we get the term "soap opera."
In this case, the symbol (PI) is too easily confused with the symbol followed by a period (PI.). IMHO, the lawyer should be fired and the trademark stricken.
Hopefully someone will have the money to challenge it in court and win a few millions dollars from an idiot's attempt at cheesy marketing.
The author of the related article apparently has no idea of a purpose of a trademark. It's not a copyright and doesn't imply "ownership." You don't "own" and can't buy or sell a trademark, the way you could do so with a copyright or patent. Coke, for example, couldn't sell it's stylized red-and-white "Coke" logo to Pepsi for use on Pepsi-Cola. The issue in trademark infringement is not use of someone else's creative work -- it's the likelihood that a likelihood that the use will be a source of confusion. Two identical marks, for example, could be used to identify two different products made by two different companies, if there was no chance that the usage would cause confusion. This happens if, for example, the products are very different, are sold in different markets, or are sold in non-overlapping geographical areas.
One merely registers a mark to record that a relationship exists between a product and a source of the product. Many, if not most, marks use content that already exists and, in some cases, may be in part copyrighted. That's not a constraint. The issue here, as raised by the article, is caused by the author's unfamiliarity with the subject matter.
So, bottom line is that, as is generally the case with Slashdot's stories about abuse of the intellectual property system, this one is mostly BS. Getting your IP news from Slashdot is like learning about climatology from Rush Limbo. The vehemence of an opinion here often seems to be inversely related to its credibility.
Nothing to see here, just move on...
How can one trademark a letter? How about we band together and trademark the letter "i" and then take every company from Microsoft over iRobot to Apple (iMac, iPod, iPhone) to court for violating out trademark. One billion dollars please per infraction!
And don't forget the college fraternities!
http://www.pi314.us/products
Let's all take a moment to give moral support to this artist who is having his IP so mercilessly stolen. Also to congratulate him on all of his designs that are entirely derivative of other trademarks. Fucking unbelievable.
http://paulingrisano.com/