Apple's 2018 iPhones Are Rumored To Not Include Headphone Dongle In the Box (theverge.com)

Apple will reportedly ditch the 3.5mm to Lightning port headphone dongle with this year's iPhone models. Apple notoriously dropped the headphone jack from the iPhone 7 in 2016. It has included a headphone adapter with every iPhone since to help curb public unease. The Verge reports: The research note claims that Cirrus Logic, a supplier for the dongle has "confirmed" that it won't be included in the box alongside the new iPhones. Apple has been trying to transition away from wired headphones entirely with its AirPods and lineup of wireless Beats headphones, so the move isn't entirely surprising. The dongle was always meant as a stopgap while customers adjusted to the new, headphone jack-less reality that Apple imposed on the world. Apple will almost certainly continue to sell the dongle -- which costs $9 -- separately for users who still want it. But if the report is true (which, again, remains to be seen), it's hard to imagine that customers will take the news well. The Barclays research note was first spotted by Mac Rumors.

Comments

Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Wireless is the way to go, let's not get stuck in the past like old folk but move forward.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Never

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Are wireless headphones even safe? AFAIK, studies haven't found a link between cellphone use and brain tumors, but wireless headphones are much closer to the brain and for much longer, and probably haven't had as much study as cellphones have.
Plus, Bluetooth audio codecs aren't even lossless.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Wireless is the way to go, let's not get stuck in the past like old folk but move forward.

1) What is your beef with "old folk" ? I am 62 years old and I GUARANTEE I could kick your ass in hand to hand combat. And frankly I would enjoy
        doing so, because you sound like a stupid arrogant prick who would benefit from learning some respect for others.

2) "Old" people know things they have learned based on experience. Obviously you have not yet learned that life lesson yet. With respect to electronic devices, new does NOT equate to "better". The foremost goal of a company like Apple is to SELL STUFF. And of course idiots like you gobble that shit up like it was steak. But make no mistake, it IS shit.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Thatâ(TM)s my concern too. The product is phantastic but i need to see a proper study that demonstrates safety to feel comfortable wearing them.

Re:Perfect

[Time_Ngler]

I wouldn't be worried. First, they are receivers, not transmitters. Second, they have to communicate all of 3 feet. That's quite a difference from a cell phone that has to transmit to a cell tower miles away.

Re:Perfect

[Time_Ngler]

Charge my phone, charge my watch, and now my headphones, too? That's FOUR things to keep track of how much charge they have! How could I ever be expected to remember to do that, let alone want to?

Also, what about forgetting they're in and going for a swim, or a shower? What about bumping into someone or tripping down the stairs and losing them forever?

What if I want headphones that have noise cancellation, or want earbud types? How much do I want to spend on specialized headphones that also have bluetooth machinery inside? With wired sets you could just plug them in and they were guaranteed to work. Now, what if the bluetooth implementations between the phone and the special headphones I got are incompatible?

They suck!

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

âoeTheyâ(TM)re receivers, not transmitters.â

You have never seen the AirPods, right?

They transmit whenever you take them out, our double tap on them.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey now, the past had all the great gadgetry that was built to last and could be easily serviced and tinkered with. Those old Western Electric model 500 phones were both a rock solid communication device and a rock solid self defense implement.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Idiot. Replacing something that isn't broken by something that is ten times more expensive, easy to lose and is another thing that has to be charged is not progress. Nothing wrong with adding the option to use wireless but to remove all ways to do otherwise is just stupid.

Re:Perfect

[fluffernutter]

Give me wireless headphones with a battery that doesn't degrade faster than the electronics in the headphone and I would agree with you. I'm no environmental crusader, but it seems obvious that we should not be buying disposable electronics.

Re:Perfect

[fluffernutter]

Live for your Apple product, HUMAN!

Re:Perfect

[blindseer]

Are wireless headphones even safe?

Compared to the threat of getting a headphone cord wrapped around your neck? Yes, wireless headphones are safe.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

I know Kung-Fu.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Easy there old timer, what did the doctor say about getting all worked up about those damn kids and their iThingamajigs?

Re:Perfect

[blindseer]

Maybe instead of throwing a fit over not being able to find the right kind of Bluetooth headset you STFU and buy the $10 adapter for a 1/8 inch headset plug.

If charging up these electronics is such a problem then maybe you should just do without them.

These are First World problems, people! Get a grip and maybe even marvel at all the technology that's available to you now.

Re:Perfect

[Artem S. Tashkinov]

BlueTooth maximum power: 100mW for class 1 devices (e.g. laptops) and just 2.5mW for most common class 2 devices (e.g. cell phones and BT headphones).

CellPhones maximum RF transmit power: 2W (when reception is good it should be less than that).

IOW, the average BT RF power is three orders of magnitude lower than of the cellphone under non-optimal conditions.

Re: Perfect

[ShanghaiBill]

Thatâ(TM)s my concern too.

Sigh. We really need better science education. Or are this many people just failing to absorb basic facts and thinking skills?

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

I have to charge the key fob for my BMW with USB. It's getting totally out of hand.

If they made all these devices with wireless charging I wouldn't mind as much.

Re: Perfect

[ShanghaiBill]

Hey now, the past had all the great gadgetry that was built to last

Indeed. There are Model-T Fords more than a century old, but you never see 100 year old Teslas.

Survivorship Bias

Re:Perfect

[Pseudonym]

Also, what about forgetting they're in and going for a swim, or a shower? What about bumping into someone or tripping down the stairs and losing them forever?

I always figure that anyone who think wireless peripherals are a good idea have no kids. Kids are pretty good at looking after the phone itself, but peripherals should be considered disposable.

I lost count how many times earbuds have been lost or destroyed by various means; death by laundry cycle is a very common one. I'd be upset about this if they cost more than $10 to replace.

Re:Perfect

[Time_Ngler]

> These are First World problems, people! Get a grip and maybe even marvel at all the technology that's available to you now.

Reading people's complaints about First World problems is also a First World problem. So I suggest you get a grip, sir!

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe instead of throwing a fit over not being able to find the right kind of Bluetooth headset you STFU and buy the $10 adapter for a 1/8 inch headset plug.

Or maybe he buys a non-Crapple device instead, calls you up, and tells *you* to STFU.

But you won't hear him because your Crapple wireless headphones need a recharge.

Oh, and can you guess what happens to those Crapple wireless headphones when there's a nearby lightning strike? My friend knows. Lightning struck a tree on the property next door to his house and every one of the Crapple wireless headphones (wife & kids) in his house got toasted, even the ones sitting in drawers unconnected. After that, he switched brands to devices that still support wired headphones.

Crapple seems intent on "innovating" itself right out of business.

Re: Perfect

[PolygamousRanchKid]

There are Model-T Fords more than a century old, but you never see 100 year old Teslas.

. . . I'm sure Rei has one, and will prove you wrong . . .

Re:Perfect

[Static]

Can't address the first items, but there are Bluetooth dongles for receiving audio that you can plug in whatever headphones you like. They tend to target people with high-end headphones and as such have very good DACs of their own, but you can use them however you like. Even with cheap off-brand earbuds.

Re: Perfect

[Joce640k]

You meant 'courageous', surely.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

You forgot about connecting the phone to your home/car aux. How are we supposed to do that now?

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

At a retail price of US $1,024.50 you'd think they'd include the dongle.
But wait, there's more - the dongle is DCMA protected and lists for US $39.95.

CAP === 'combers'

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

I am 62 years old and I GUARANTEE I could kick your ass in hand to hand combat.

Is someone opening a book on this fight?

Re:Perfect

[Paradise Pete]

wireless headphones are much closer to the brain and for much longer

They don't do a lot of transmitting, do they? Certainly nothing compared to cell phones.

Re:Perfect

[q_e_t]

Kung Po is more my style.

Re: Perfect

[q_e_t]

I believe bluetooth receivers that can then transmit to a car aux have been invented, on the basis that I have one. And one for home audio connection.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

They are RECEIVERS.

Re: Perfect

[that this is not und]

There is a handshake. Part of the time they are transmitting.

Re: Perfect

[that this is not und]

Rei has a spot of two month old Elon spunk on her blue dress. (bagged and put away in her closet!)

Re:Perfect

[Iwastheone]

(Are wireless headphones even safe?) No, for security they are not. They were never meant to be secure by design from the get go.

Security company Armis has found a collection of eight exploits, collectively called BlueBorne, that can allow an attacker access to your phone without touching it. The attack can allow access to computers and phones, as well as IoT devices.

“Armis believes many more vulnerabilities await discovery in the various platforms using Bluetooth. These vulnerabilities are fully operational, and can be successfully exploited, as demonstrated in our research. The BlueBorne attack vector can be used to conduct a large range of offenses, including remote code execution as well as Man-in-The-Middle attacks.

“BlueBorne affects pretty much every device we use. Turns that Bluetooth into a rotten black one. Don’t be surprised if you have to go see your security dentist on this one,” said Ralph Echemendia, CEO of Seguru.

As you can see from this video, the vector allows the hacker to identify a device, connect to it via Bluetooth, and then begin controlling the screen and apps. It’s not completely secretive, however, because in activating the exploits you “wake up” the device.

The complex vector begins by finding a device to hack. This includes forcing the device to give up information about itself and then, ultimately, release keys and passwords “in an attack that very much resembles heartbleed,” the exploit that forced many web servers to display passwords and other keys remotely.

The next step is a set of code executions that allows for full control of the device. “This vulnerability resides in the Bluetooth Network Encapsulation Protocol (BNEP) service, which enables internet sharing over a Bluetooth connection (tethering). Due to a flaw in the BNEP service, a hacker can trigger a surgical memory corruption, which is easy to exploit and enables him to run code on the device, effectively granting him complete control,” write the researchers.

Finally, when the hacker has access they are able to begin streaming data from the device in a “man-in-the-middle” attack. “The vulnerability resides in the PAN profile of the Bluetooth stack, and enables the attacker to create a malicious network interface on the victim’s device, re-configure IP routing and force the device to transmit all communication through the malicious network interface. This attack does not require any user interaction, authentication or pairing, making it practically invisible.”

Windows and iOS phones are protected and Google users are receiving a patch today. Other devices running older versions of Android and Linux could be vulnerable.

How do you stay safe? Keep all of your devices updated regularly and be wary of older IoT devices. In most cases the problems associated with BlueBorne vectors should be patched by major players in the electronics space but less popular devices could still be vulnerable to attack.

“New solutions are needed to address the new airborne attack vector, especially those that make air gapping irrelevant. Additionally, there will need to be more attention and research as new protocols are using for consumers and businesses alike. With the large number of desktop, mobile, and IoT devices only increasing, it is critical we can ensure these types of vulnerabilities are not exploited,” wrote Armis.

https://techcrunch.com/2017/09...

Re: Perfect

[Joce640k]

Sigh. You really need to watch more George Carlin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Re:Perfect

[Joce640k]

It's not the power, it's the wavelength.

Re:Perfect

[Ol Olsoc]

Charge my phone, charge my watch, and now my headphones, too? That's FOUR things to keep track of how much charge they have!

Ermagherd! Ferst wherld Preerblerms!

Jeebuz, then just don't buy an Apple, and don't buy wireless earbuds for an Android while you are at it.

If the rumor is true - and we have the Apple haters hoping beyond hope that it is true, than its pretty likely that Apple found out that the adapter was pretty much unused.

I used mine exactly once, just to try it out. Now it sits in the desk drawer.

But I use Bluetooth except in the cases where I use studio headsets. And why I would need studio headsets on a smartphone is a mystery. Of course even then I have to use a 1/4 inch to 1/8th inch adapter to plug into the lightning adapter.

Which I'd have to use it on my Androids as well. Either way, an adapter. So I use Bluetooth on my Androids as well.

Why? Because I didn't get a wireless smartphone to have to use wires on it.

Re:Perfect

[Godwin O'Hitler]

Because the wires run all the way back to the the record factory. Riiiight.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

I'll worry when they use X-rays or gamma rays for transmission.

Re:Perfect

[svirre]

Safety != Security

Safety is keeping the world unharmed by your device
Security is keeping the device unharmed by the world (Or rather the attackers inhabiting it)

Re:Perfect

[Revek]

Odds are the 62 year old will play to win and the other has a glass brain.

Re:Perfect

[Revek]

To further expand the 62 year old grew up when kids had to be tough. Now you little SJW darlings are not prepared for a real fight.

Re:Perfect

[Iwastheone]

From the onset of Bluetoooth it has never been secure, even when 'off'. It has always been an attack vector to gain access to a smart/dumb phone. NSA crap. Welcome to this modern world. :/

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

It's power and wavelength.

Re:Perfect

[Ol Olsoc]

Because the wires run all the way back to the the record factory. Riiiight.

I dunno - any environment I'll be listening to music with a shitty smartphone will be impossible to achieve anything like fidelity. So I don't worry about any issues like that.

Occam's explains all of this. Few people who like Apple products care about the little adapter - that's what it is, an adapter. A dongle is something else indeed, but those who are fans of Chevies, H^H^H^H^H^H^H Androids - sorry about that - just find it a talking point. You aren't likely to ever buy aniPhone, but it's oh so much fun to bitch about them. For all the excuses of why it is so damn critical to have that superannuated 18th inch ( that's 3.5 mm for the metric-only crowd) phone jack, the simple answer is that you hate apple Products, so it is yet another unforgivable assult on your finely tuned sensibilities.

Meanwhile, myself and a lot of others simply use Bluetooth like we have for years. It even works on Android phones and tablets.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

"Live for your Apple product, HUMAN!"

Respect their courage! ... charge my tablet, charge my laptop, ...

Re:Perfect

[freeze128]

It seems much more likely that you would be hit by a car because you're listening to headphones while crossing the street, than you are to actually die from strangulation by headphones. If that's the case, then wireless headphones are just as dangerous.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Go out your head in a microwave, defeat the interlock, and get back to us on that...

Re:Perfect

[freeze128]

Apple Exec: "Our products are good, and people like them, but we need to create a constant revenue stream. We need to start selling disposable electronics."

Re:Perfect

[Khyber]

"First, they are receivers, not transmitters."

That isn't how Bluetooth works at all, dumbass. Do you know what pairing is? That's a transmit/receive operation. Bluetooth REQUIRES BOTH.

Whomever modded you up needs to have their mod privileges revoked.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

RECEIVERS do not TRANSMIT

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Perhaps the only battery that could do that is an LiFePO4 that is oversized for the application, since cycle life increases as depth of discharge decreases. It would be too big for a marketing department to approve it.

A replaceable rechargeable battery in the headphones would also do the trick, I think.

Re: Perfect

[LynnwoodRooster]

Go out your head in a microwave

WTF is only his head gay, WTF would his microwave care?

Re:Perfect

[MikeMo]

Mom? Is that you?

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

How do they pair with the phone? How do they let the phone know they're present, operational, and waiting for audio? How do they let the phone know you've just pressed the pause button? Idiot, they're not just receivers, they're also transmitters. The lack of understanding of technology on this tech site recently is fucking astounding.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

How about when you find out that there aren't actually batteries in the wireless headphones?

Re:Perfect

[reboot246]

There's a lot of truth in what you say. I'm 65 and I've been in about three dozen real fights in my life, most of them before I was 25. I've been knocked out a couple of times and also knocked out the other guy a couple of times. I came way too close to killing a guy in college with my bare hands. That was my last fight because I realized the damage I could do to another human being. Nowadays I wouldn't fight if you paid me, and I've learned that revenge is safer and more satisfying.

Remember, when us "old" people were young, there was no protection from bullies. It was either learn to defend yourself or suffer the consequences. You learned fast.

Re: Perfect

[sound vision]

Doing without them is exactly the plan. My headphones ain't broke, why fix them? I know Apple needs to reach the next -illion on their scorecard, but I am a businessman too. Following that, when I make a purchase, my concerns are more along the lines of utility, reliability, cost-effectiveness...

Re:Perfect

[Ingenium13]

Bluetooth uses 2.4 GHz, just like wifi can. Wifi power is often in the range of 100-200 mW. Some LTE bands are 2.3Ghz and 2.5 Ghz.

2.4 Ghz is non ionizing. If you're concerned about absorbing heat from it, it's comparable to the head from a small LED. It's insignificantly small.

Re:Perfect

[BronsCon]

It's also the distance and duration. An earbud in your ear is putting half its power directly into your head (the other half is directed away from you). Not only is more than half of a phone's power radiated away from your head (through the back and sides, that power is spread over a larger area simply by the fact that the antenna is larger. Then, you factor in distance, taking into account the fact that electromagnetic radiation propagates through 3d space, and you quickly find that the amount of radiation reaching any part of the body is less than that of the earbuds.

Quick math:
Earbuds: 2.5mw x 2 = 5mw
Divide by 2 to account for roughly half the radiation being directed away from you = 2.5mw
The portion of the earbud that goes into your ear is going to have a surface area of roughly 1 square centimeter. There are two of them, so we divide by that to determine exposure per square centimeter: 2.5/2 = 1.25mW

Non-ideal phone: 2000mw x 1 = 2000mw
Only radiation emitted from one of six faces of the device reaches the head: 2000/6 = 333.3mw
The dimensions of that face (we'll use an iPhone 8, not even the + model, to make it more fair to Artem's argument) are 6.73cm by 13.84cm, yielding a surface area of 93.1432cm^2. We'll round this down to 90 to account for the rounded corners. 333.3/90 = 3.7mw per cm^2
Now, to remain fair to Artem's argument (and keep the math simple, since there are too many viariables, such as the angle at which you're holding the phone, the size of your head, and the exact distance at which you hold it), we'll ignore that a portion of that is going to radiate around your head. This is fine by me, we're talking worst case, after all. Now, if you hold the phone 1cm from your ear, that puts it 2cm from the closest part of your cheek, and at least 3cm away from the farthest. Following the law of inverse squares, at 1cm you get 3.7^0.5mw, or 1.92mw per cm^2; at 2cm you get 1.92^0.5mw, or 1.39mw per cm^2; and at 3cm you get 1.39^0.5mw, or 1.18mw per cm^2.
If we assume the average ear is roughly oval and roughly 2.5x3.5cm, we get an area of roughly 24cm^2. Since the ear is a 3d structure, we'll halve this and say 12cm^2 of the phone is 1cm away, and assume half of the remaining surface (90 - 12 = 78; 78/2 = 39) is 2cm away and the rest (39) is 3cm away, we get the following:
(12 * 1.92) + (39 * 1.39) + (39 * 1.18) = 123.27mw reaching you head, spread over 90cm^2, which yields an average of 123.27/90 = 1.37mw per cm^2.

Right, so under the absolute worst case conditions, and with estimates and assumptions favoring Artem's argument, that phone is dumping a whole 0.12mw (e.g. rounding error) more into your head, despite its transmit power being orders of magnitude higher.

As for duration: The average phone user will have their phone to their ear for an hour a day (most are much less, a handful are much more, but it averages out to an hour), while the average headphone user will have them on for 4 hours.

Roughly equal exposure assuming roughly equal exposure duration; but the headphone users will see roughly 4x the exposure in the real world.

Now, we've got studies linking cellphone radiation and ADHD. I haven't read them, I don't know how conclusive they are, but I'm assuming not very since they seem to be relatively early studies. They're enough, however, to suggest that EM radiation may not be as harmless as we all think; and that's at frequencies that aren't right next to the one your microwave uses to boil water. Bluetooth is your microwave's little cousin. As you so astutely point out, that matters; a lot.

Yes, more research is needed. Right now, I don't believe they're unsafe, but I don't have enough data to be meaningfully certain of that; I simply don't use them because they sound like shit to me. Yes, even Apt-X and (because most of my music is not encoded in AAC, so there are re-encoding artifacts that are very audible) AAC. That's fine for a noisy

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

You lose power with distance, and a microwave has enough power at the right wavelength to be harmful at a good distance. How about you try it.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

While I'll back you up with your second point, one life lesson that seems to have escaped you is that you don't post messages threatening physical harm to others in a public forum nowadays.

Just sayin'

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

kung pao chicken?

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Seriously? You’re 62 years old? This is modded insightful?

Oh yeah? Well my dad can beat up your dad! Na na na na na nah stick your head in doo doo.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

This kind of tech ignorance is apple target market.

Re:Perfect

[fluffernutter]

Since they don't seem to have room for that in a phone any longer, I won't hold my breath.

Re:Perfect

[fluffernutter]

That actually sounds like pretty bad design. Any key fob I have gets a watch battery and lasts for two or three years. I'm surprised BMW would make their owners put up with something like that. We need key hooks by the front door with USB plugs now?

Re:Perfect

[fluffernutter]

Yup, us too. We went back to buying overstock 'stock' Samsung phone headphones. They work for what the kids need them for and are the only ones we found that are comfortable for them.

Re:Perfect

[Spamalope]

Wait until you need to keep track of which headphones Apple allows to work with this phone. Remember ipod docks? Remember that each new iPhone/pod refused to work unless you bought a brand new dock - each with it's own licensing fee to Apple? How soon before the headphones have to be Apple licensed to work, or are in a reduced quality mode etc? One more generation of devices or sooner?

Re: Perfect

[fluffernutter]

Most cars have bluetooth now, unfortunately this will give you the bluetooth limitation for sound quality. My vehicle's phone plugs in via USB but the audio still goes through bluetooth. I'm pretty pissed about that.

Re:Perfect

[Artem S. Tashkinov]

Your analysis could be spot on, except ... some people don't use earbuds (like me - I only use wireless headphones) and then earbuds' antennas are usually outside. Case in point: Apple AirPods Teardown - check out step 9.

Re:Perfect

[BronsCon]

You still have closer proximity with AirPods. The antenna is in the piece that hangs down, which rests against your earlobe. Same power, same distance, dissipation is going to be 1/6 rather than 1/2, but over 1/6 the surface area, so double the dose per cm^2. AirPods are actually worse in that regard.

Wireless cans (and good on you for using those, earbuds are shit to begin with) are going to give you about 1/4 the radiation at he point where the antenna resides. Offset by the fact that you likely use them 4x longer than the average phone user would use their phone, it's a wash...

...

... until you factor in frequency.

We, as a society, still have much to learn in this field. It may well be perfectly safe, but it may well not be. Don't discount that simply because the aggregate transmit power is lower than phone (which we're still not sure are safe) because, as demonstrated, the dosage is the same; in some cases, even higher.

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

Indeed. The ignorant, and the people who must work with or for them. I own Macs because my clients use them and I have to make sure the work I do for them works on their platform of choice.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Short answer: because they are transceivers.

Re:Perfect

[kenai_alpenglow]

Correct. so you remove the "remove-your-genes-from-being-so-stupid" from both sides, leaving the strangulation-by-headphone being more likely to kill you then tumor-by-bluetooth.

Re:Perfect

[sglewis100]

Wait until you need to keep track of which headphones Apple allows to work with this phone. Remember ipod docks? Remember that each new iPhone/pod refused to work unless you bought a brand new dock - each with it's own licensing fee to Apple? How soon before the headphones have to be Apple licensed to work, or are in a reduced quality mode etc? One more generation of devices or sooner?

So far, I believe the list is... all Bluetooth headphones. And any wired headphone with a dongle. Oh, and any wired headphones plugged into a Bluetooth transceiver, also available for about ten bucks on Amazon. Feel free to bookmark this compatibility list.

I mean... I get it.. Apple took away the headphone port, and now want to take away the dongle. But you have to know in your heart that they thought about it, researched it, and came to the conclusion that the number of people who will no longer buy an iPhone over this issue is small enough to not care about.

Re:Perfect

[sglewis100]

DMCA protected and lists for US $39.95 is code for it's $9.00 at the Apple Store and as cheap as $5.80 for a two pack of third party on Amazon. Also, they have phones other than the iPhone X for a bit less money. And an entire universe of phones running Android if you really are not a fan of their stuff.

Re: Perfect

[wolf12886]

EE here. They're definetly safer than holding your cellphone up to your head. Short range bluetooth (class 2) runs up to 2.5mw. A cellphone by comparison can transmit up to 3w aka 1200x more powerful.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

What you forget is that >99% of the time bluetooth headphones are not transmitting, because their primary purpose is to receive the audio transmission and convert it to sound. So perhaps divide your calculated exposure by 100?

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

If that's how you and Apple feel, then why does the iPhone still have a Lightning port? They need to get with the times and have wireless charging. Even my old ass LG G3 from 2014 has wireless charging.

Of course, I disagree and see the value in having wired connections. What is the point of a phone having a pretty good DAC and audio quality if it all goes to shit because you have to use lossy Bluetooth audio compression?

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh, so my headphones just magically tell my phone that they are present and ready to pair? The buttons just magically tell my phone to play/pause, skip tracks and adjust volume?

I agree that they are very low power and unlikely to be dangerous, but saying that they aren't transmitters is stupid.

Re: Perfect

[datavirtue]

I heard that Apple will not be including a phone the next iPhone box. This will make it so much easier for iPhone customers to function and have a normal, uplifting life. Pure genius.

Re: Perfect

[datavirtue]

Was that science? You're fired!

Re: Perfect

[datavirtue]

Ruined a $250 set of water proof Bluetooth headphones...in water.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Smartphones are microcomputers for people who can't afford a real one. This is going to include people who live with no running water, no electricity (in the usual sense. They'll do with solar panel or maybe muscle power) and 4G LTE as their only computer networking option.
So yes, charging while playing music may be important. Music playback can be pretty important in a social setting. You can get a 12V class D amplifier (~90% power efficiency) with bass/treble controls for less than $20 and hifi quality, plug any old or new passive speakers into it (4 ohms to 8 ohms). It only has analog wired inputs. The result is loud and high quality such that it'll do for a gathering of 50 people.
If everything is on battery you'll save considerable power by not running two bluetooth radios, on top of being able to top up or maintain the phone battery.

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

What grim maths/science. A lot more that 1/6th of the radiation from a phone next to your head goes into your head.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

> also there's another motorcycle dealer down the street also an entire universe of vehicles
Good for them and whoever you're talking to.

We'll be over here discussing the gyp.

Re:Perfect

[serviscope_minor]

1) What is your beef with "old folk" ? I am 62 years old and I GUARANTEE I could kick your ass in hand to hand combat.

What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I'm the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You're fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that's just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little "clever" comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn't, you didn't, and now you're paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You're fucking dead, kiddo.

1) What is your beef with "old folk" ? I am 62 years old and I GUARANTEE I could kick your ass in hand to hand combat.

Also, what on earth does that have to do with wireless headphones, or wired ones for that matter?

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Wireless is the way to go, let's not get stuck in the past like old folk but move forward.

1) What is your beef with "old folk" ? I am 62 years old and I GUARANTEE I could kick your ass in hand to hand combat.

Blanket guarantees are sort of dangerous. I remember phoning while at some climbers' meeting and then explaining apologetically that I was sort of the LaTeX support for my ex. Immediately a climber pipped up and stated "oh, I know something who'd be better than you". Which piqued my interest since I was pretty sure that I'd have met anybody in Germany qualifying for that description or at least corresponded. Turns out that the guy in question had written his PhD thesis with LaTeX. Well... I was amused. Climbers should actually be used to "check first, brag later".

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

That'd be what I was getting at. A receiver that also transmits is called a transceiver; the idiot I was replying to was insistent that bluetooth headphones were only receivers.

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

Wow, I should buy Apple stock shortly before the release, and sell shortly after. Launch day profits will be phenomenal, which will shoot the stock through the roof, but I expect it to tank shortly after.

If only what you said were true... and I had enough cash on hand to buy a few thousand shares.

Re:Perfect

[BronsCon]

What you are forgetting is that they're actually constantly transmitting acknowledgment packets so the device knows they're still there. If you have a pair with removable batteries, try pulling the battery sometime while they're playing music, and count how long it takes the phone to realize they're no longer there and stop playback. It's almost instantaneous, because there is a constant flow of ACK packets (to borrow a term from the TCP stack) being sent.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Odds are the 62 year old will play to win and the other has a glass brain.

Not sure about the other guy, but I ( I am the OP ) will use street fighting techniques to make sure it's over very quickly.

John Steinbeck said : "Never pick a fight with an old man - if he cannot beat you he might just kill you".

John Steinbeck was a smart man.

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

Actually, it's a lot less. The antenna is behind the screen, which acts as a shield. I was being polite and ignoring that fact in order to give Artem's argument a fighting chance. Now, back when we had flip phones with external antennae, you would have been correct.

Re:Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills.

.
.

And then you woke up, surrounded by empty Cheetos bags and your dirty underwear, with WoW on the screen of your basement computer.

Here's a clue for you, junior :

A person who has graduated from BUD/S doesn't talk about what they have done like you are trying to do. REAL badasses don't need to talk.

Re:Perfect

[serviscope_minor]

A person who has graduated from BUD/S doesn't talk about what they have done like you are trying to do. REAL badasses don't need to talk.

  o
/|\ <-- you
/\

. <-- the joke

I mean wow, you managed to not have the joke go flying over your head and yet you still managed not to get it. I guess being oblivious is an AC special skill?

PS you missed the bit about "gorilla warfare".

Re: Perfect

[Anonymous Coward]

Three dozen fights before 25? Sounds like you're both an asshole and a shitty fighter. You're a terrible bragger.

Re:Perfect

[Macdude]

If you have a pair with removable batteries, try pulling the battery sometime while they're playing music, and count how long it takes the phone to realize they're no longer there and stop playback.

How long would you expect them to continue operating after pulling the battery if they weren't transmitting ACK packets?

Re: Perfect

[BronsCon]

Read what I wrote... The phone reacts immediately.

Re:Perfect

[BronsCon]

To clarify, I would expect the headphones to stop working as soon as power is removed, because I'm not an idiot. I would also expect the phone to continue trying to send audio to them until it realizes they're no longer there (e.g. until it doesn't receive an ack packet in time), and that's precisely what it does. When the bluetooth headphones disconnect, the phone either stops playback altogether, or reverts to its internal speaker. Because ack packets are being sent constantly, this is almost immediate, as well.

I also, perhaps foolishly, expect that people here will have some reading comprehension. Now, if you re-read what you quoted, and use those reading comprehension skills I'm sure you learned in 3rd grade, you'll note that I'm talking about how long the phone continues trying to send audio to the headphones after you remove their battery, not how long the headphones stay on.

What's so bad...

[Arzaboa]

.. about a company pushing 7 billion or so new headphones with the right jack? That's a whole lot of jobs.

--
'Forty Two' - D. Adams

Re:What's so bad...

[Anonymous Coward]

.. about a company pushing 7 billion or so new headphones with the right jack? That's a whole lot of jobs.

--

-

The problem is the jobs are in China. I'm not from China, are you ? Or are you just an Apple shill ? Either way, fuck you.

Re:What's so bad...

[Anonymous Coward]

From someone who was dumb enough to buy a phone without a headphone jack. Fuck you.

It's the most goddamn inconvenient thing I've ever had to deal with. I was in a car ride with someone and they asked me to play some music from my library and then I looked at the 3.5mm audio cable they had and my phone and went, "aw fuck". This is happening to me all the time. I need a dongle to hook it up wherever I go. I have a bluetooth adapter, I /had/ more than one dongle, then I lost it, now I just have the one that sits in my car so at least I can have music there.

I will never, ever be buying a phone without a headphone jack ever again. It was quite literally one of the worst purchases I've ever made.

Re:What's so bad...

[Anonymous Coward]

It's COURAGE! THe COURAGE to plunder anyone foolish enough to be a customer!

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[Anonymous Coward]

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Re:BlogLinking Info

[Khyber]

Can't promote a site when it won't load, dipshit. First thing to do - find real hosting that isn't from Africa.

Headphone dongle

[beep54]

Not to worry! You will be able to purchase it through the Apple Store for somewhat under $500!

How I loathe iOS

[Anonymous Coward]

But I refuse to switch to Android and have Google vacuum every ounce of my personal data.

I consider Apple the lesser of 2 evils.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[Artem S. Tashkinov]

Step 1: find a phone compatible with LineageOS.

Step 2: buy it and install LineageOS/MicroG.

Now Google doesn't vacuum anything.

Also: you can perfectly use your Android phone without any modification/alteration and have none of your data shared with Google (except APKs which Google will regularly scan for malware): do not login, disable Google backup, do not use built-in Google applications like Google Play, Google Chrome, Google Music, etc. Even if you use these apps and features, Google will not identify you since you're not logged in.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[AHuxley]

Encrypted wireless link with extra DRM to ensure only the one owner can ever listen.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[fluffernutter]

Personally I would rather own my phone. I don't use it for anything I don't want Google to see unless I can obfuscate it.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[Anonymous Coward]

Step 1: find a phone compatible with LineageOS.

Step 2: buy it and install LineageOS/MicroG.

Now Google doesn't vacuum anything.

Also: you can perfectly use your Android phone without any modification/alteration and have none of your data shared with Google (except APKs which Google will regularly scan for malware): do not login, disable Google backup, do not use built-in Google applications like Google Play, Google Chrome, Google Music, etc. Even if you use these apps and features, Google will not identify you since you're not logged in.

That's nice an all, but this guy is using an Apple device, so there is no way he'd be capable of any of that.

More importantly, he's probably got Google maps on his Apple phone tracking his every move and various websites tracking everything he reads anyway.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[Rockoon]

Encrypted wireless link with extra DRM to ensure only the one owner can ever listen.

This is what concerns me. When you get all the way down to it, wireless means public. It does not matter that it cannot be decrypted now if it can still be decrypted sooner or later, and pretty much nobody can be sure that none of the devices in their home arent already slurping up and transmitting every bit of bluetooth it can to a 3 letter agency, corporation, or creepy neighbor.

Re: How I loathe iOS

[Evtim]

Aren't we talking about music here? Get a proper DAC device and a pair of proper phones...

My low end audiophile set is Cowon Plenue D and Sennheiser IE80. I dare you to find a phone that can achieve such sound.
And with all the loudness wars and compressions people have not had decent sound in their ears for a long time...even when paying 1000 bucks for it...

Re: How I loathe iOS

[sound vision]

Step 1 may be the hardest here, especially if you add the qualifier that it needs to be affordable.

Something tells me I won't find anything that isn't either 10 to 15 times more expensive than my current phone, or significantly less durable... probably both at the same time, really.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[Anonymous Coward]

Even if you use these apps and features, Google will not identify you since you're not logged in.

Are you sure?
I've been using Android phones since 2013, but I've never had a Google account.
I've always been curious what information Google tracks on an Android device with no Google account.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[rainer_d]

I have no problem that Google is tracking all this stuff. Apple is, too.
What Apple does not do is take all the data and make it available so ads can be better targeted at me.

Google has no "I don't want you to resell my data" subscription - if it had, it would probably be very expensive and open up the public's eyes on just how much money they make of the average consumer.

Apple has its hardware. That hardware has a price. I pay it, and I'm done. If Google ever has a model similar to that, I can compare the prices.

Re:How I loathe iOS

[jwhyche]

Apple does the exact same thing. What makes you think they are any better than google?

Re:How I loathe iOS

[Anonymous Coward]

Step 1: find a phone compatible with LineageOS.

Step 2: buy it and install LineageOS/MicroG.

Now Google doesn't vacuum anything.

Also: you can perfectly use your Android phone without any modification/alteration and have none of your data shared with Google (except APKs which Google will regularly scan for malware): do not login, disable Google backup, do not use built-in Google applications like Google Play, Google Chrome, Google Music, etc. Even if you use these apps and features, Google will not identify you since you're not logged in.

How I wish that phones would be SOLD that way to begin with and how I wish that Fuchsia would just go away

Apple is Apple

[Artem S. Tashkinov]

It's natural: selling such a dongle separately increases your profits.

Re:Apple is Apple

[ShanghaiBill]

It's natural: selling such a dongle separately increases your profits.

It is also a win for consumers, since most of iPhone buyers already have wireless headphones, and don't need another adapter.

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

Lol no. Most iPhone owners do not have wireless headphones.

Re:Apple is Apple

[AmiMoJo]

I bet even more of them already have wired headphones.

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

It is also a win for consumers, since most of iPhone buyers already have wireless headphones, and don't need another adapter.

Are these lightning adapters? Maybe the new phone will have USB-C

Re:Apple is Apple

[squiggleslash]

You mean "It's also a neutral for some iPhone buyers, since many, perhaps most of iPhone buyers, already have wireless headphones that they like and prefer to wired headphones, and only plan to listen to music via the headphones, so won't necessarily need an adapter"?

Adding the adapter does not harm iPhone buyers who have no plans to use wired audio equipment in the slightest.

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

This is an utterly moronic idea. Apple sold 30 billion dollars worth of iPhones this quarter alone, which is a 20% increase since this time last year. And you think Apple would endanger that by deliberately making their iPhones worse so they could make money selling dongles? Are you completely innumerate? Exactly how much money do you think Apple stand to make from selling dongles?

Apple are getting rid of the dongle because they don't think it's necessary any more. They aren't doing it because they think it's still necessary and want to make money selling dongles. That's utter madness that doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. The amount of money they could make by doing so is a tiny drop in the bucket compared with the iPhone market, they aren't going to trade iPhone sales for dongle sales.

Re:Apple is Apple

[fluffernutter]

How does having a jack on a phone prevent people from using Bluetooth?

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

I predict 2019 iPhones won't even come with a charger of any kind

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

Lol no. Most iPhone owners do not have wireless headphones.

LOL yes most iPhone owners DO have wireless headphones. -- also no citation

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

It is also a win for consumers, since most of iPhone buyers already have wireless headphones, and don't need another adapter.

How the hell could you POSSIBLY know whether this is true ?

Like so many of your posts, this is utter bullshit.

Re: Apple is Apple

[Green Mountain Bot]

Sure, when Apple does it in their stores, it's praised as a courageous way to increase profits. But when I try to sell dongle in the alley behind the bar, the DA says I'm committing an indecent act.

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL no owners of ANY phone have wireless headphones...they're a figment of everyone's imagination and don't actually exist. --also no citation

Re:Apple is Apple

[Anonymous Coward]

how courages of Apple, that they can keep screwing their customers

Meaning...

[hcs_$reboot]

"You had 2 years to adapt and purchase new bluetooth equipment - you have to catch up!".

Re:Meaning...

[Anonymous Coward]

Wired beats wireless in most endeavours. Listening to music from a device you are in the immediate proximity of is certainly one of them.

Still to use mine

[seoras]

I've had my iPhone X almost year now and I've not used the dongle yet.
I do own the Air Pods which are excellent for all my music and phone call needs.
I will use the dongle next month though when I fly home to the UK from NZ.
My trusty Etymotic (.com) in ear plugs need a jack.
I've been using them 20 years and they are superb. I keep the dongle in the Etymotic's pouch.
As long as there's the option of a dongle I'm happy.

Re:Still to use mine

[AmiMoJo]

Your wireless headphones won't last 20 years. The non replaceable battery will become useless in a few years and of course inductive charging means you can't simply plug the charger in while you wear them.

Re:Still to use mine

[seoras]

Yes, I expect them to not last. I also expect the wireless tech to get even better so replacing them will be desirable at some point.
If I get 3 or 4 years I'll be happy.
I've never worn out the battery on them yet. They last for hours.
The only real gotcha is they are easily lost.
Luckily I seem to be born with an ear shape that holds them very well.
I don't fly often so even though I've had the Etymotic's 20 years I've probably only used them a few dozen times.

Re:Still to use mine

[thegarbz]

I've had my iPhone X almost year now and I've not used the dongle yet.

Cool story. I don't have an iPhone but if I did I would use the dongle daily, like I do on my Galaxy.

I've tried your fancy airpods. Combining something without a cord with something that falls out of ears, and sound like garbage isn't a decent alternative. Plus I guarantee they will be either lost, broken, or have a dead battery while you still have your Etymotics (the things I plug in my Galaxy daily).

Re:Still to use mine

[Anubis IV]

As someone who has dabbled in Bluetooth headphones, this is exactly the reason I’ve never purchased a high-end Bluetooth set, yet have had several decent wired ones over the years. Why would I pay more for an otherwise-identical model that has an expiration date, thanks to its use of non-replaceable batteries? I don’t care as much on electronics that are unlikely to last long enough for the battery to become a concern, but good headphones can last decades, so those batteries need to be replaceable.

Re:Still to use mine

[Khyber]

The tech doesn't matter when the compression on BTA sucks and always will.

Re:Still to use mine

[Anonymous Coward]

You have very low standards or requirements if the AirPods are satisfying your voice calls needs. They are a POS gadget that pick up audio from the surroundings and have a battery life measured in tens of minutes, not hours.

Re: Still to use mine

[Anonymous Coward]

Please explain this or link to an article explaining "Bluetooth audio compression". I've seen people say this about 1000 times but not once has anyone ever provided an explanation of what exactly they mean by Bluetooth audio compression or how it lossifies further to degrade the audio.

Re: Still to use mine

[fluffernutter]

Bluetooth basically compresses to MP3 during transmission. You're only ever going to get MP3 quality, even if your source is an original recording. If you buy all the Apple shiny shiny I believe you get AAC which is better, but if I use it in my truck I might as well be playing MP3. Furthermore, Bluetooth was designed for telephone calls and not music. There is no standard protocol (Sony has their own audio codec over Bluetooth) so you are locked into the vendor if you want top quality. my second google result on "Bluetooth audio quality" explains it.

Re:Still to use mine

[seoras]

Aww, did I upset you by saying I use and like an Apple product and that it works well?
Poor wee, anonymous coward, you. :)
"tens of minutes" was the bit that had me laughing out loud. Thanks for the entertainment!

Re: Still to use mine

[Khyber]

"Please explain this or link to an article explaining "Bluetooth audio compression""

Bluetooth degrades the transmission format to something akin to MP3. You can clearly hear this the second you introduce any FX like pitch shifting in your audio player. The music goes from fairly smooth to UTTER SHIT in a split second.

I'm an audio engineer by hobby, with over 10 years in handling digital pitch-shifting FX (since the SB Live! card came out, actually.) Get on my level or shut the fuck up, child.

Re: Still to use mine

[Khyber]

"but if I use it in my truck I might as well be playing MP3"

Well, let's be honest. Most car audio systems are utter garbage in the first place. You'd be lucky to get MP3 quality (even at 128kbit) over the wires after decoding and decompression.

Re: Still to use mine

[fluffernutter]

Yet I bought a premium vehicle, part of that being the sound system.. and then getting stuck with bluetooth sucks because it kills everything.

But still comes with wired headphones

[Anonymous Coward]

But there'll still be the lightning EarPods in the box. Seems like a weird thing to omit from the article. Or was is deliberately trying to be sensationalist, I wonder?

Re:But still comes with wired headphones

[blindseer]

But there'll still be the lightning EarPods in the box. Seems like a weird thing to omit from the article.

Yes, weird.

Or was is deliberately trying to be sensationalist, I wonder?

I don't wonder at all.

Re:But still comes with wired headphones

[fluffernutter]

Great.. a set of headphones that doesn't work with anything but one device.

Re:But still comes with wired headphones

[LynnwoodRooster]

Well, don't overlook the crappy sound quality, that has to count for something!

Re:But still comes with wired headphones

[BronsCon]

... or sound all that great. Better than the $2 pairs that come with most phones, but garbage compared to the AKGs that came with my S8, and complete shit compared to anything I'd buy (the same applies to the AKGs, by the way). In fact, all the lightning (or USB, for that matter) headphones I've encountered in the $200 price range have been complete shit compared to the $170 headphones I use daily; the same is said of bluetooth, as well.

Funny how that works out, no? A $200 price point used to mean speakers and cans worth $200. Now, $190 of that goes to the radio, the DAC, the amplifier, the battery to power it all, and the "new shiny", and you're left with $10 headphones. For 20x the price.

Progress.

Re:But still comes with wired headphones

[Anonymous Coward]

Probably $20 of radio, DAC, (CPU somewhere), amplifier and battery. The rest you're paying for is the barrier to entry to produce headphones with such redundant computer/electronics hardware. Certifications, tooling, engineering, advertising, profit.

If $200 headphones are complete shit I guess it would be possible to have better ones at $70 (or more, $100?), if they're made in some place like Shenzhen. They know how to do electronics at least.

Oh well look at what I've found. Bluetooth receiver with headphone amp plus analog out plus digital out.
http://www.smsl-audio.com/productshow.asp?id=113
With a damn normal knob for volume.
After all we can agree to keep all the crap external to the headphones, quoting you "the radio, the DAC, the amplifier, the battery"
This is exactly where I want to get at with audio electronics from China. This brand is well reputed, all works great unless you use a terrible and noisy power supply.

(they're not in the business of making headphones. so, an electronics company would have to partner with a headphone company, and miniaturize, and only one of them gets to claim credit, and it can only be worse quality or more expensive)

Re:But still comes with wired headphones

[BronsCon]

Oh well look at what I've found. Bluetooth receiver with headphone amp plus analog out plus digital out.

Yup, and it's only about $60. Not super portable looking, though, and yet another thing to charge; it also doesn't appear to support Apt-X or AAC, so we're back to crap audio quality, not that Apt-X is the greatest and for anything that's not already AAC (and fed straight to the bluetooth stack, rather than being re-encoded) AAC just means more compression artifacts -- and re-compression artifacts are audible.

Tim Cook is a Jew

[Anonymous Coward]

A trillion dollar company but no dongle for you.

I don't know that apple consumers care

[batkiwi]

My wife and I are android people. We trade off upgrade years.
I got the Pixel 1.
She got the Pixel 2, no headphone jack. It took her 6 months to notice, because we haven't owned non-bluetooth headphones in years, apart from some "studio" ones I use when doing music and never go near a phone anyways (and have a 1/4" jack).

You mean to tell me...

[gaiageek]

... the 2017 iPhone actually included a free accessory? Holy shit, that IS amazing news.

Re:You mean to tell me...

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't get greedy. One year was enough time to replace all your headsets.

Re:You mean to tell me...

[Iwastheone]

I've owned Koss over ear headphones for over 29 years. No tiny batteries that wear out within a year, no connection problems with bluetooth (which is an attack vector, look up "bluetooth hacks".). Call me an old fart, GetOffMyLawn type of guy, I stick with what works. Screw these companies who keep trying to sell us the new tech that needs to be replaced every year or so. Easy to lose earbuds, my Koss headphones sound great and I always know where they are. So there.

Re:You mean to tell me...

[RandomFactor]

If you aren't buying new things regularly, you are just a support expense.

Re:You mean to tell me...

[Spamalope]

Think different, think disposable quality (same high price though).

Be sure to have some eco friendly marketing though!

Doesn't anyone get quality headphones that sound great and last anymore? You know you can do better than beats right?

Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we're dealing with a bad ass over here.

Re:Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL!!

He's like EVERYONE else on the internet!! He's a buff tough guy with a keyboard!!

Re:Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

YOU are like everyone else on the Internet. A tough guy with a big mouth. You would shut your big mouth in person and we both know it. So stop sounding like an asshole just because you have the safety of a keyboard to hide behind.

Re: Watch out guys...

[that this is not und]

It's almost like there's a natural attraction of certain personality types to forums like this one.

Re: Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

Yup.

-Lana Kane

Re: Watch out guys...

[datavirtue]

Do you want to get hit by an old keyboard? No? Then watch your fucking mouth!

Re:Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we're dealing with a bad ass over here.

Better a badass than a dumbass like you, you pathetic cock-gobbling retard.

they cost 9 bucks now..

[Anonymous Coward]

as a 'replacement' for something included that you may have lost...

they'll cost 29 bucks once they're no longer included for 'free' to nudge you a little towards 100+ dollar wireless headsets.

and, the old existing ones that were 'free' will not work with the new models.. to nudge you a little harder towards those fucking horrible wireless pieces of shit.

Re:they cost 9 bucks now..

[Tough Love]

I'm so pleased with my Moto G6+, great value. I can see getting their flagship next cycle. I don't need to mention whether this one has a 3.5mm jack, right?

Re: they cost 9 bucks now..

[Anonymous Coward]

No. Because Motorola is crap.

More courage!

[Anonymous Coward]

Lol bend over and take it

Re:More courage!

[Tough Love]

Ah, that's what Tim Cook meant, thanks for clarifying, he just wants to give you his "courage".

Re: More courage!

[Anonymous Coward]

I will take his courage over getting fucked by google and the shitty os known as android. The drones here like you who are all google slaves deserve what you get which is no privacy and data theft. Enjoy your commie asshole fucking android shitholes.

Re: More courage!

[Tough Love]

triggered?

Re: More courage!

[Anonymous Coward]

Why do you troll? I never understood why trolls like to add a comment like this one. You do know that doing harm is easy, so easy that anyone can do it, but actually helping others takes work. So please stop trolling.

Re: More courage!

[Tough Love]

Why do you troll?

What you call "trolling" others call "well earned criticism". We both know that Apple's headphone decision had nothing to do with courage and everything to do with selling those overpriced Beats headphones.

Re: More courage!

[Anonymous Coward]

OMG, such a flashback to the Apple vs. Atari vs. Commodore flamewars!

They will have to include headphones.

[xxxLCxxx]

They will have to include headphones though, as it is becoming mandatory in an increasing number of countries due to harmful radiation.
This presentation explains this rather well:
"The truth about mobile phone and wireless radiation" -- Dr Devra Davis

Likely to get bombed by spammers/trolls. =>

So what?

[Anonymous Coward]

The only people paying the premium for this year's device are the ones that have last year's device already and thus the dongle. Admittedly, they want to sell last year's device _with_ the dongle, but then they are Apple fanboys and have all the wireless headphones one can buy for it.

This will hit the resale feasability of old devices. But it will take years before that leads to an "I don't need a new iPhone this year" effect on fanbois, and by then the product manager has got his retirement paid for.

What about FM Radio?

[TheRealQuestor]

Wasn't there a thing a while back about handset makers are required to unlock the fm radio on these things and without the wired headphones what are they going to use for an antenna now?

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

INTERNAL ANTENNA

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yours may be internal, but mine most def is external.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

Boys have a penis, girls have a vagina.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

But now girls can have a penis and boys can have a vagina.

My embearded professor told me that.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Duds]

They're also required to use Micro USB charging in the EU and Apple apparently are allowed to skirt that by selling an adapter.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Iwastheone]

My moto e4 has a radio app that works, but not with earbuds. Not a problem since I use wired headphones that serves as an antenna wire. I do weep for the future generations who are getting trained to accept the new way of paying extra for everything.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[TheRealQuestor]

Apple's new logo... Paying more and getting less since 1976....The Apple Way...

Re:What about FM Radio?

[thegarbz]

No problem, just unlock the FM functionality. No one said you had to actually be able to tune in a station with it.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

Thanks for the tip.

Re: What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple phones do not contain an FM tuner. There is nothing to unlock.

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

These things have antennas built in, that's how they can connect to WiFi, etc

Re:What about FM Radio?

[Anonymous Coward]

This is the difference between a artificial/commercial limitation and a technical limitation. Artificially crippling a device is general frowned upon by consumer rights organisation so get routinely targeted in the EU but if things are a genuine technical limitation they are more forgiving.

Headphone snob here...

[cormandy]

Although I havenâ(TM)t tried Beats, I am invested in a pair of Shure SE535s which I love, and which have the 3.5mm connector and need a reasonable amount of ampification to sound great. Sorry apple, but I very much miss the old headphone jack... May I add that as I have no choice but to use the lightening to 3.5mm analogue converter dongle, has anyone performed a study on the quality of audio coming out of it?

Re:Headphone snob here...

[Tough Love]

Welcome to Android :)

Re:Headphone snob here...

[LynnwoodRooster]

The audio coming out of the Lightning adapter will always be the same. Apple mandates than ANY analog audio adapter for the Lightning connector must use the Lightning Audio Module (LAM), that is designed and built and sourced only from Apple. You must also include the iAP2 chip, and the appropriate licensing. And then it must be built at only an Apple-approved manufacturer. Meaning - you're always going to have the same audio quality AND the same manufacturing quality (and the ~$13 minimum price paid for the LAM, iAP2, and licensing - that's the "Apple Tax" for making a wired headphone adapter for the Lightning port).

The way around it is to use a Lightning camera adapter, that turns the Lightning port into a "generic" USB port. THEN you can use external USB DACs like those from Audioquest (the Dragonfly red is pretty sweet). Of course, now instead of just a dongle, you are carrying a dongle AND a DAC. But hey - it's Apple.

If you want a really good audio platform, consider the LG V30. That thing sounds - and measures - phenomenally when you turn on the built-in quad DACs and high-current output amplifier. As good as most $1000 digital audio players. And it will play all high res formats as well as MQA - unlike any iOS device.

Re:Headphone snob here...

[Anonymous Coward]

That's the conclusion I've come to -- I'll be ditching Apple and moving to Android. I hate, loathe, and despise Google, mind you, but Apple is no longer making anything that I can use the way I want.

Re:Headphone snob here...

[johnlenin1]

I've been quite happy with my Shure Bluetooth adapter. It would do the trick for your SE535s.

Re:Headphone snob here...

[Anonymous Coward]

Although I havenâ(TM)t tried Beats, I am invested in a pair of Shure SE535s which I love, and which have the 3.5mm connector and need a reasonable amount of ampification to sound great. Sorry apple, but I very much miss the old headphone jack...

May I add that as I have no choice but to use the lightening to 3.5mm analogue converter dongle, has anyone performed a study on the quality of audio coming out of it?

Sure makes a lightning cable for those headphones. No dongle required. So much for being a headphone snob and not knowing that small detail. And the connectors from the ear pieces to the cable are actually usable with many other cables as well.

Bluetooth is pretty good

[cerberusss]

Around the iPhone 4, I found out that my earbuds were often stuttering and failing due to the cable strands breaking. I switched to Bluetooth. It hasn't been flawless to be sure, but the comfort of cordless/wireless sound is so awesome that I also want it everywhere else.

To be sure, I'd call it pretty good but not great. For instance, while there's plenty of choice among earbuds, I'm still looking for a bluetooth version of the Sennheiser HD 558. The ear cups are easily the biggest (inside diameter 2.75" or 7 cm) and I haven't found a $100 replacement of those.

Another problem is that all this Bluetooth stuff requires micro-USB. While great at its time, I now really want USB-C to charge.

Re:Bluetooth is pretty good

[Static]

There are Bluetooth dongles for receiving audio and using your existing headphones. They have been aiming at people with high-end headphones, so their DACs are really good. But you can use whatever you like with them. An EarStudio is the one I use, but there are others.

Re:Bluetooth is pretty good

[hcs_$reboot]

8 of 14 people found this answer helpful.
Jack connected headphones render usually better than BT.
BT device is one more thing to charge / power.
Cannot charge an iPhone while the lightning 2 jack is used.
Tl;dr give us back the jack.

Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we're dealing with yet ANOTHER bad ass over here.

Can they get rid of the charger next?

[blindseer]

Does anyone reading this not have a pile of USB chargers by now? I know I do. I don't need another in the box with the phone. If I do need a charger then I'd like a choice between getting the tiny 5 watt charger or the bigger 30 watt charger.

Maybe even leave out the painfully short 1 meter cable, I'd prefer the 2 meter cable instead. I'd buy a 3 meter cable if I could find one. I'd also like the choice between USB-A and USB-C instead of Apple making that choice for me.

I know that with most any new electronic device I'll need to buy accessories. This may be because the accessories that come with are the wrong size/length/shape, have the wrong connector, or simply be not included. I plan for that and make that part of my budget for the device.

I bought a new display a few months ago, and it came with a VGA cable in the box. Thanks for nothing, I'll just toss that cable in a box with the rest of the VGA cables I'll be taking to the recycling center. What a waste. Apple has to know that at some point people will have moved on from the 1/8 inch connector. Maybe they picked that time too soon. Better than being too late and seeing cables and adapters ending up being tossed out unused.

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[Tough Love]

Does anyone reading this not have a pile of USB chargers by now? I know I do. I don't need another in the box with the phone.

Speak for yourself. I find that each phone generation wants a beefier charger. More battery capacity, faster charging. Give me a charger that's tailored to the phone, thanks. Switching power supply technology keeps improving, so each USB charger generation ends up about the same size, and a bit more efficient, nice.

Apple can keep removing things that people need and want, I don't care, in fact it's amusing. I get my electronics from somebody else.

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's all nice and good. Until you have a device but no way to use it because all those chargers have different USB ports and output various different current/voltages. Maybe the only one with a fitting connector is some chintzy POS that will burn your house down if you keep it running unsupervised. Or you only have DVI-D single link but you need DVI-I dual link. Or you have HDMI cables for A,B,D but you need C.

I have a big box of cables but rarely is there something that has the right connectors because every standard has so many subtypes, which is made exponentially worse by the fact that cables have two of the damn things.

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[JaredOfEuropa]

I for one am quite happy with my pile of USB chargers. Because before those were the norm, every phone would come with its own proprietary charger, which often weren't interchangable between different phones even from the same brand. Now, if a charger breaks (it happens), just get another from the pile. And they are useful for powering other stuff like Pi's.

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[fluffernutter]

For one thing, Apple repeatedly says you are on your own if you don't use the correct Apple approved accessory. For another thing, how many powerbars full of USB chargers and I supposed to have?

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[fluffernutter]

I'm guessing you don't own an iPhone, with it's non-interchangable lightning port (even with a newer macbook).

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[JaredOfEuropa]

I do own an iPhone. And use Apple chargers to power other USB stuff, or charge the phone from a non Apple charger using the lightning cable. You still need the special cable but the chargers are pretty much interchangable.

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[freeze128]

I volunteer at a non-profit that recycles and repurposes electronics and computers. Your unneeded VGA cable is a great help for us. Sometimes we get monitors with NO cables, and we can make use of your VGA cable. Even if we cannot, we can recycle it for it's base components (Copper). If you decide not to donate your cables to a recycler, they can often be given to friends and family members who can make use of them. There is really no need to just throw it in the trash.

Re:Can they get rid of the charger next?

[fluffernutter]

Ok well nothing like compromising on your beliefs by supporting a company that half-asses it.

Only OK if it had Usb-C jack

[beerlord1]

I don't mind dropping the headphone jack - but I'm not going to buy headphones just for use on an iPhone, that I can't use with my laptop/PC.

So I've stuck with the iPhone 6S, and will just have to hope that it never breaks.

Got to get more money per follower

[Tough Love]

Apple has to get more money per follower, it's the only way to hold the stock up. Come on, don't be stingy, Apple needs your retirement savings more than you do! What are you, selfish?

Missing the plug

[DrYak]

Exact reverse thing noticed here.

I and most of my friends own good speaker sets in our home.

Up until recently, playing music (e.g.: at a party) basically meant plugging the cable into the jack of whatever device (the hosts' laptop, the smartphone of whomever has a nicr playlist the want to share).

Now suddenly, there is a bunch of people who simply cannot plug their music. Those with the "courageous" iPhones, or with the Chinese copycats that decided to follow the trend without muxh thinking.

(Okay, for some idiots with weird musical taste, you're actually happy that they can't subject their music to all the innocent bystanders)

Now its fumbling around to find the adequate dongle (Lightning, USB-C) to plug into (and hope the device still has enough battery).
Or trying to find which service to use to share the music (oh, you're using Spotify? But I have all my playlist on Apple music / ad youtube playlists).
Or you need to buy a cheap BT receiver module, except you don't want to pay 500â for it, so you get it from aliexpress and now need to hope that it will work as intended.
Or you need to buy a new set of speakers with built in Bluetooth receiver, that will cost more and be less durable and shittier than the one you have.

(and then hope that the Bluetooth connection will work as intended).

Re: Missing the plug

[Anonymous Coward]

Xiaomi/Mi products have great value for money and their products are of great quality. They also make a lot of products, not just audio BT receivers. I'm not a shill or chinese, but I am a xiaomi fan (not quite a fanboy yet).

Re: Missing the plug

[Artem S. Tashkinov]

Their phones are great (in terms of bang for the buck).

Their OS (MIUI) is an abomination and iOS wannabe.

Their MIUI QA is horrible. Regular critical bugs. Bugs which remain for months. Regressions which totally disable certain functions of your phone.

Re:Missing the plug

[Ol Olsoc]

Now suddenly, there is a bunch of people who simply cannot plug their music. Those with the "courageous" iPhones, or with the Chinese copycats that decided to follow the trend without muxh thinking.

Explain. I could plug into my iphone directly. If I wanted to.

Now its fumbling around to find the adequate dongle (Lightning, USB-C) to plug into (and hope the device still has enough battery).

So you are the person in all of those infomercials that can't do anything, and needs some hot new product.

But perhaps I am being cruel. In professional and high end audio, where what y'all call "Dongles" are actualy adapters, said adapter is roughly as troublesome as putting socks on in the morning.

My compatriots and I have plastic divider boxes with all manner of adapters.

tl;dr for that paragraph - First order first world problem.

Or trying to find which service o use to share the music (oh, you're using Spotify? But I have all my playlist on Apple music / ad youtube playlists).

Um, wouldn't the music source be figured out by the device that is playing the music?

Or you need to buy a cheap BT receiver module, except you don't want to pay 500â for it, so you get it from aliexpress and now need to hope that it will work as intended.

SRSLY? Dude, your bridge too far list is beginning to sound ridiculous.

Or you need to buy a new set of speakers with built in Bluetooth receiver, that will cost more and be less durable and shittier than the one you have.

(and then hope that the Bluetooth connection will work as intended).

Um... yeah, right.

I have a couple of BT receiver/speakers, one for the wife and one for me. They were mid-range, not the cheapest, but not the most expensive by far.

Pairing is ridiculously easy. My wife, who is one of the least technically proficient people I know, easily pairs hers with her laptop, smartphone, or tablet, depending on what she wants to use at the moment. Takes maybe 5 seconds. they even sound okay. Nothing special, but they aren't designed for sound studio use.

But it is too hard for you?

Reading what you write, I suspect that you are forming your opinions based on some of the cheapest stuff around, as well as listening to people who simply hate anything new and their righteous hatred justifies simply making shit up.

If you don't want an iphone - don't get one. If you want to use the 5 dollar headset from Big Lots, or a studio headset, by all means do - warning, you'll need an adapter - or dongle as you call them for most studio quality headphones.

But your infomercial style list is simply laughable - stick to real facts, not bizzare problems like where the music provider comes from.

Can't be helped, needs posting.

[Anonymous Coward]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XSC_UG5_kU

$9 for that?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Fuck you, Apple.

Heroic!

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple have gone a long way, from being courageous to heroic!
Keep up the good work apple...

if this trend continues..

[sheramil]

There will come an iphone with no physical ports, no buttons, no screen... just an off-beige slab of plastic that you buy, and charge, which tracks your movements. The perfect product.

Re:if this trend continues..

[Anonymous Coward]

There will come an iphone with no physical ports, no buttons, no screen... just an off-beige slab of plastic...

and it will have dimensions of 1 by 4 by 9.

Re:if this trend continues..

[drinkypoo]

There will come an iphone with no physical ports, no buttons, no screen... just an off-beige slab of plastic that you buy, and charge, which tracks your movements. The perfect product.

You jest, but if they actually took away all the holes (though not the screen,) that might actually be justification for not having a headphone port. Actually removing all of the ports would make it easier to make a sealed device. This half-assed removal of some ports that other vendors have figured out how to include on their thin phones is the part that makes no goddamned sense.

And on aircraft, Apple?

[chrism238]

Is Apple aware that many airlines won't let you use wireless headphones and devices during flight? Or does Apple just wish us to be "courageous"?

Re:And on aircraft, Apple?

[MikeMo]

Remember that the phones will still include a set of Lightning ear buds.

Wireless headphones haven't matured yet.

[Qbertino]

I tried the wireless thing with some decent mid-range Bluetooth noise cancelling headphones for 170 Euros. It was a drag. Flaky connections breaking down after 30 minutes, increased charging hell with smartphone, tablet, notebook and then headset, sub par Bluetooth connectivity on Linux and Chromebooks, etc.

I replaced the mobile wireless attempt with a regular wired headset without noise cancelling. It's a small step back again put it's feasible for everyday usage opposite wireless. At least in my experience. Maybe in 10 years I'll try it again.

Bottom line: Wireless audio isn't there yet. For professional mics maybe, but not for mobile everyday devices. We probably need a more stable standard than Bluetooth and better signal and power efficiency until this concept is usable.

Re:Wireless headphones haven't matured yet.

[Daralantan]

Sounds like something was wrong with the headphones or Bluetooth for it to be that bad. I use my headphones every time I go to the gym, and listen to them for 55-75 minutes or so. I'm often leaving the phone near the squat rack and walking 20ish feet away to the water fountain or doing loaded carries walking across the whole gym and rarely ever have connection issues unless I go a long ways and go around a corner.

That being said I did also get water damage to my phone, and rather than replace it right away I used it for 3-4 more weeks..... And one of the issues it had was Bluetooth no longer worked beyond 5-7 feet very well. But as soon as I got a new phone it was fine. Granted, I do have a 1 second or so delay like in the comment below this one... just not issues with connection breaking.

IT Crowd meets John Wick

[geekmux]

Are wireless headphones even safe?

Compared to the threat of getting a headphone cord wrapped around your neck? Yes, wireless headphones are safe.

The "threat" of strangulation by headphone has me visualizing a mash-up between IT Crowd and John Wick for some reason.

I mean c'mon, strangling evil hipsters by their old-fashioned cords would be one hell of a signature move for a super-nerd assassin...

Re: IT Crowd meets John Wick

[Anonymous Coward]

Old fashioned cords yes. Modern headphone cords are flimsy shit. Go on, take an old pair and try to pull the cord apart with your bare hands: should be relatively easy to do. That shit aint stranglin no one.

Re: IT Crowd meets John Wick

[Anonymous Coward]

Assassin? More like common troll. I told many a hipster "No one has strangled himself yet with those retro braided cord earphones." On to the next suicidal victim...

Audio lag

[ruddk]

So far, the Bluetooth headset I have used with the iPhone have had the most terrible latency. The audio sometimes is a full second behind. A work I got a Plantronics noise canceling set and they are unusable while watching YouTube videos using Bluetooth. I had another pair from a different manufacturer and it was equally bad.
The same goes for the Bluetooth connection to my car, a Panasonic head unit.
Isn’t there someone in the protocol to counter the lag? I thought I read something about that somewhere.

Re:Audio lag

[hcs_$reboot]

Jobs focused on quality. Cook focuses on margin. Cannot have both.

Re:Audio lag

[yabos]

I think it's your head phones that cause the lag. In my old car I had a cheap $30 bluetooth AUX adapter and when I played music or whatever in my car there was no lag. With the exact same phone but in my "new"(2010) car(Mazda), there's a delay of a couple seconds now. Same phone, different car. I think the car/headphones have some buffer or something that causes the delay. My same phone works fine with some cheap bluetooth earbuds as well. I watch videos no problem. So something with the bluetooth implementations in some devices seems to cause delays sometimes.

Re:Audio lag

[LynnwoodRooster]

Bluetooth audio does not have a specification limit for latency, and it's quite common to have 200+ msec of latency in a Bluetooth audio stream. There is a solution - AptX LL (Low Latency) which is around 20 msec. Of course, that requires the use of a CSR/Qualcomm Bluetooth chip - and iOS does not support those (interestingly enough, though, macOS does support them).

You could also use an Avnera stack, which is used in pretty much all gaming headphones and lots of TVs (like Vizio, Samsung, LG) that is built for Now, for those will will counter "Airpods! W1! Apple! Teh Betterz!", here's some interesting data on existing Bluetooth latency with a selection of headphones, and here's the same guy running the same test with the Airpods - and the latency is even worse (upwards of 300 msec).

Re:Audio lag

[Anonymous Coward]

And those apple earpods are stupid looking to boot.

Re:Audio lag

[BronsCon]

You can, Jobs certainly did, it's just that Cook is only focusing on margin. That's short-term thinking and, eventually, people will realize the brand is nothing more than a name now. It won't kill Apple, but it will hurt them the same way it hurt Sony, and countless other before them.

Re:Audio lag

[BronsCon]

Lucky. It's 3 seconds in the 2012 models.

Re:Audio lag

[Known Nutter]

Jobs focused on quality. Cook focuses on margin. Cannot have both.

Yes you can.

Quality, budget, schedule. Pick two.

Re: Audio lag

[that this is not und]

We had a dork intern running around at work with an earpiece a decade ago. He was 'with it' and we were old farts. He, however, was the dork with the earpiece.

Who cares?

[Anonymous Coward]

As someone likely to buy the next iPhone, I sure donâ(TM)t. If I want to use headphones, which is rare anyway, I sure donâ(TM)t want to have to deal with a wire. Iâ(TM)ll be using wireless headphones, thanks. But Iâ(TM)m a lot more likely to be sending itâ(TM)s output to a wireless speaker anyway.

No headphone jack? No problem. No dongle? No problem.

Re: Who cares?

[that this is not und]

The problem is you haven't gone into the settings of your iGadget and checked the box that fixes the punctuation character bug.

Exactly

[Anonymous Coward]

I have an eco-drive watch, so I never have to deal with batteries. I have big ass Bluetooth headphones for around the house, that last for a week on a charge, but when I am outside, it is 100% wired, because I donâ(TM)t want to be out of battery.

All I know is that there is a mental disorder that needs to be defined, for folks that get a case of steamy panties over others being upset over the loss of the 3.5mm plug.

Of course

[Anonymous Coward]

The 3.5 mm plug only disappeared when Apple had a product to profit from it. Supply chain genius scared up the timing, but the original move was 100% for Apple profit, not âoecourageâ

Re:Of course

[Spamalope]

How soon before it only works with an Apple licensed headphone too, just like they did with the docks?

That's nothing...

[LordHighExecutioner]

...years ago I ordered an Iphone from a chinese reseller, and in the box there was just the earphone.

Re:That's nothing...

[hcs_$reboot]

You are a lucky buyer.

Re:That's nothing...

[Anonymous Coward]

...years ago I ordered an Iphone from a chinese reseller, and in the box there was just the earphone.

Imagine the disappointment had you ordered a 2018 iPhone.

Acceptance

[StormReaver]

it's hard to imagine that customers will take the news well.

Seriously!? Has the writer not paid attention to the Apple customer profile for the last 20 years? Not only will Apple customers take the abuse well, they will drop their pants, bend over, and ask to be anally abused with 1 grit sandpaper. Then they will kindly ask Apple to include rougher sandpaper (and charge an extra $80 for it), because 1 grit isn't edgy enough.

Re:Acceptance

[hcs_$reboot]

I would reduce the time span to 6 years, not 20, though.

Re:Acceptance

[Anonymous Coward]

For now maybe. With Jobs gone it's only a matter of time before the masses abandon Apple. Jobs built huge momentum though so it will take time to come back and bite them.

Re:Acceptance

[daftna]

I was a loyal Apple user since the 80's. Counter to what was said a lot here in the earlier age of OS X it was basically a really good GUI over FreeBSD and was really stable and easy for me to use. It "Just worked". However, I have completely lost faith in the Apple brand over the last few years. They have moved from making good products to just making good profits. All of my computers and devices seem to arbitrarily slow down. You can't upgrade one piece of the software without upgrading the whole thing which then breaks your old hardware and you have to buy the new, crappier hardware with the same frickin specs as the old hardware. I'd rather just buy the new software that should obviously work on my slightly-older hardware. Their biggest lock-in is iMessage but hopefully one of my computers can continue to sync my phone as I move to Linux (still distro shopping). I haven't upgraded my phone OS in years because I see my friends dealing with more and more issues. It's unfortunate because the software used to be the big selling point. It was so stable and both easy to use and also easy to tweak. The other day I went to ftp an image to a webserver (that doesn't have SFTP enabled) and I learned that apple had removed ftp for 'security reasons'. this is OUTGOING ftp .. not incoming!! and who, that knows how to use the command line, doesn't know the security risk already? I use computers professionally and they seem to be making shiny toys that aren't really meant to do anything except grocery lists and checking the stock market. If they wanted graphic designers they wouldn't dump FTP. If they wanted music professionals they wouldn't make compatibility such a chore. Pro tools is my "killer app" and it runs better on Windows now. I loved your products for 30 years, Apple, but you betrayed me by wasting my time in all the preventable troubleshooting I've had to endure in the past 5 years.

Re:Acceptance

[PPH]

Really? People still visit Karl Marx's tomb*.

*You have to pay to visit it.

Re:Acceptance

[chispito]

For now maybe. With Jobs gone it's only a matter of time before the masses abandon Apple. Jobs built huge momentum though so it will take time to come back and bite them.

Phasing out the 3.5mm jack is the most Jobsian move Apple have made since his passing.

Re:Acceptance

[Anonymous Coward]

It’s true, I put up with a lot of BS from Apple. That goes for workstations/laptops (employer supplied for the last 10 years) and phones (4S and now SE). They aren’t terrible. They are mostly pretty good. But they are not amazing either.

After 10 years I still feel like I am fighting a low grade war against OSX and many of its desktop conventions. iOS is better, but still constrained in ways that annoy me on a regular basis.

Their saving grace is hardware quality and the fact that even if they don’t do exactly what I want, they generally do their thing well with minimum fuss.

I could happily adapt to Linux on the desktop for both work and personal use. That is, if I could find it paired seamlessly with premium hardware that I can milk for 4+ years, as I have been able with Apple.

OTOH, Android is just plain inferior on every front. There is nothing going on there that is more appealing to me than iOS. If I can’t replace my SE with a model that has a headphone jack, that would be one thing, but a minor one. If I couldn’t replace
It with another $99 (carrier subsidized) iPhone, that would be a major hassle, but I still willing to pay a premium to avoid Android/Google.

Re:Acceptance

[Anonymous Coward]

Not only will Apple customers take the abuse well, they will drop their pants, bend over, and ask to be anally abused with 1 grit sandpaper. Then they will kindly ask Apple to include rougher sandpaper (and charge an extra $80 for it), because 1 grit isn't edgy enough.

I fault the rounded corners.

Re: Acceptance

[that this is not und]

It doesn't sound like you have used any Android devices at all. What qualifies you to have such a strong position about Android?

Re:Acceptance

[Waccoon]

Not that it's my business what people like and how they choose to spend their money... but I get a kick out of all the people who bitch about the new MacBooks being garbage compared to the old ones, but they still run out to dealers to buy them by the truckload.

Re:Acceptance

[Anonymous Coward]

it's hard to imagine that customers will take the news well.

Seriously!? Has the writer not paid attention to the Apple customer profile for the last 20 years? Not only will Apple customers take the abuse well, they will drop their pants, bend over, and ask to be anally abused with 1 grit sandpaper. Then they will kindly ask Apple to include rougher sandpaper (and charge an extra $80 for it), because 1 grit isn't edgy enough.

Exactly, I think most existing Apple customers are suffering from Stockholm syndrome and they might also enjoy being abused economically, practically, emotionally, physically and maybe also any other way... The can be no other logical explanation. I mean, why would anyone otherwise willingly keep buying Apple equipment and keep taking abuse? It's the same thing when it comes to Games Workshop and their product line, the exact same thing.

Music makers gonna be pissed

[Anonymous Coward]

The only way to get instantaneous playback on the instruments on these Apple devices has been plugging it to amplifier.

Are they going to be able to quarantee lag-free playback using the hundreds of apple music apps using the Bluetooth.

I think not!

Re:Music makers gonna be pissed

[mmmVenison]

Using anything that is not hard-wired for pro audio is a waste of time. I can't even listen to music on a cell phone no matter how good the headphones/buds are, the quality is terrible. Even making a voice call makes me cringe because of how bad it sounds. Yes, I still listen to vinyl, still use a hardwired landline to make phone calls. All cell phones have going for them is convenience and the cache that certain models have managed to attach to themselves as being status badges.

When in doubt -- cheap out: the new Apple

[sandbagger]

I'm an old Apple hand but this really is self-interest masquerading as a feature. Headphones with wires are not only incredibly inexpensive, but guaranteed to work barring physical damage and aren't immediately devalued by irreplaceable battery cycle degradation.

 

No surprise, Apple hates high quality audio

[LynnwoodRooster]

iOS does not support AptX, AptX HD, nor LDAC (all of which are much higher quality audio than AAC or SBC). Note that at least macOS supports the AptX codecs.

iOS does not support any files higher than 24/48, meaning all the new, high res and enhanced (like MQA) audio is DOA for your iPhone and iPad. Sure, you CAN maintain downgraded copies to handle, but now you have to double your library.

Apple doesn't really care about audio, at least from a portable standpoint. It's no surprise they would kill off the dominant connection mode - that also guarantees the highest audio quality (the DACs in most cellphones are typically MUCH better than what you get in a headphone; lots of AKM and ADI in cellphones, not so much in portable products). They don't really care about music - so if YOU care about music, then why pay attention to Apple?

Shut UP

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm so sick of you wired headphone people crying, if bluetooth isn't good enough for you, get a decent PMP or phone that still has a jack.

And yet...

[Anonymous Coward]

...everyone goes after Google for being a monopoly, while completely ingoring Apple's anti-consumer, anti-competitive behavior.

Re:And yet...

[registrations_suck]

You're free not to buy Apple's products. Go by something from a manufacturer that is more to your liking. What's the problem?

Apple's 2017 Q3 iPhone sales market share was around 19%. Apple is hardly a monopoly here. It's not even CLOSE! If you don't like its products, buy someone else's.

Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we're dealing with a smart ass over here.

iPhone 2020 & 2021

[shubus]

iPhone for 2020 said to have no battery and for 2021 the screen will finally be removed. Onward and upward, Apple!

rumor

[Anonymous Coward]

there's a rumor going around that I won't buy any more Apple things

Anyone else notice....

[Anonymous Coward]

Anyone else notice the way the first third or so of the comments mostly sound like Apple shills talking about how great of a thing this, how this is "a win for consumers" (miss me with that shit, nothing that requires people to buy wireless headphones that are exponentially more expensive than wired ones is a win), how great bluetooth headphones are and how shitty wired headphones are, all while doing some product placement? And then how the rest of the comments are heavy on people's long term disappointment in Apple, it's shitty business practices, and it's intentional crippling of good technology to slang it's own garbage? Funny how that works...

Re: Anyone else notice....

[that this is not und]

This is Slashdot. We nerds have always for the most part hated Apple.

They have had some mainstream market success, and some non-nerds have infiltrated the site. Apple has always been about fashion and proprietary, and a small high-paying segment of the market.

I remember dealing with the Apple types going back to the dinkyscreen mac era. It's always been the same.

Those who don't take the news well...

[nospam007]

...can have mine and those of a couple of hundred million other users who don't need it.

Finally

[Anonymous Coward]

Can we stop pretending that you don't want to listen to my music?

good idea... less waste

[Anonymous Coward]

From an e-waste perspective, I think this is a good idea. They (and Samsung and everyone else) should quit bundling the headphones and the power plug too. I've got quite a few of each that I've never used.

Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we're dealing with still another bad ass here.

Wires are better

[speedlaw]

Having recently rented a few late model cars, in every one of them, the "Aux in" with the classic 3.5 mm plug sounded better than the bluetooth. Apple Phone.

Their Courage is Courageous

[Anonymous Coward]

What other company displays such courageousity?

Well, there is Facebook. They like to courage their users right up the bum, too.

And Google.

And Microsoft.

Boy, it seems like the entire tech industry likes to eff over their customers now. In the past, tech companies loved their users and only tried to eff each other over.

I wonder if, one day, people will wake up and realize they don't need this crap? That the tech industry has become little more than the fashion industry? That they really don't need to keep up with the Kardashians.

Watch out guys...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we're dealing with a bad ass here.

Dongles

[stooo]

Dongles !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
I need Dongles !

Don't worry

[Not-a-Neg]

Myself and almost everyone else that bought an iPhone 7 still has their dongle sitting new in the box. We will sell you ours for the same price as replacements that are sold at retail. Gotta love how Apple stuff retains value in the aftermarket. Actually, wait about a month and I will have an iPhone 7 to sell you as well since I'm ditching iOS for Android and almost have the iPhone paid off.