I DO use Konqeror from time to time. For example, when I read email in Kmail, I can either copy a link to the clipboard and paste it in mozilla or I can just click it and see the link in konqueror. I usually click it and see the link in Konqueror, becuase Konqueror loads a lot faster. After they start running, I find Konqueror "feels" slow, although I haven't exactly done any benchmarking.
Just change your preferences for text/html in the file associations and put your favorite browser on top of the list. Then kmail will open the links in your emails with that browser.
Also the only slight dependency is qt, which is crossplatform (Windows, Unix, OS X, embedded). As Apple [and Atheos] shows, it is easy to write wrapper to get rid of even that dependency.
Re:I was hoping they would wait.
on
New Red Hat Beta
·
· Score: 2
I think Redhat is still dumb as shit regarding KDE. Both X and GNOME-2.2 have not yet been released as stable versions, so they could very well have added KDE-3.1rc6. It is so stable that I regret compiling with debug enabled to get backtraces. So far in one month of heavy use I have had not a single KDE program segfault on me!
But in the end, Redhat will have to include KDE-3.1 or they will lose market share to SuSE. Too bad, they have already lost all their KDE competence with their crippled version in Redhat-8.0. Bero quit Redhat over this. See http://slashdot.org/articles/02/09/25/2042208.shtm l?tid=110
Bullshit many directives are not implemented in national European laws. What happens then?
Easy: The directive becomes law by itself if applicable and/or -- as software producer -- you can sue any nation that has failed to implement the directive for any damages.
Basically people who have no clue of the European Union (like CmdrTaco, Kr3m3Puff...) should reacd up on the legal system we have here.
OpenOffice and StarOffice are virtually identical.
The only differences are license, fonts, cliparts, templates, dictionaries, thesasaurus and better hyphenation in SO-6. The speed of both should pretty much be identical on both systems.
giFT just has not yet had a stable release, even though it works very good already. In the long run, I expect it to be able to support the 10s of thousands of users kazaa or gnutella have. In fact just try it, you'd be surprised.
Also, from the fact that you use kazaa, I presume, that you use windows, which is not an option for me. In fact it makes you look like a fool on/..
http://gift.sourceforge.net/ " What is giFT, you ask? giFT is a modular daemon capable of abstracting the communication between the end user and specific filesharing protocols (peer-to-peer or otherwise). The giFT project differs from many other similar projects in that it is a distribution of a standalone (platform-independent) daemon, a library for client/frontend development, and our own homegrown network OpenFT. "
This is a great network, where you find many oggs, downloads actually work (up to 600kb/s!!) and finding files is really fast. Lots of altruists are using it. Plus: You have to compile it from CVS, which prevents idiots from using the network. On the average each user shares 8 GB!
> Apart from showing that KDE is, to all intents and purposes, a dead man walking?:-) Wow, I right now picture a big zombie crushing a little Gnome. KDE development is becoming faster and faster.
> KDE is *only* the default for loser distros > with bugger all market share. Red Hat and > Mandrake both fully support GNOME, and that > accounts for the vast bulk of Linux > installations. Sun and HP both use GNOME as > their default commerical desktop. KDE is a > minority zealot's desktop... used only by the > loud mouth obnoxious shouters who fill up > slashdot and various other Linux sites with > ill-conceived garbage.
Interesting. I am saying Redhat is the only one defaulting to GNOME. You tell me Mandrake _supports_ Gnome. KDE's newsreader knode already accounts for 5 % of the German usenet posts! Redhat is actually holding back Desktop linux use in the USA by using Gnome. SuSE is dominating Europe, that's why people here are adopting the linux desktop already.
> KDE is way behind GNOME is important matters such as i18n, accessiblity, component > architecture, bindings... but hey, KDE supports faked alpha blended menus... whoopee...
Hmm. I think the only thing where Gnome leads is accessibility. Must make it easier for people like you:-) KDE is translated into more languages than GNOME [Reason: Americans know only english], has icon themes, has a component architecture that is actually used in the software [dcop,kparts], has language bindings for java, python, perl, C and C# and uses hardware accelerated alpha blending via the render extension. You are either stupid or lying.
>> Seriously, how many people use Solaris on a Desktop? 10000?
> No-one you know... you see, it's used by people who have something called "real jobs". Scientific > research and such... in other words, work which doesn't involve wearing a paper hat and a name > tag.
Solaris on the desktop is used by people with more money than brains. Like government institutions and big companies.
KDE is the leading linux Desktop worldwide and only Redhat's stubbornness has kept GNOME alive in the USA. KDE-3.1 will be released today or tomorrow and it is much more advanced than any other Desktop I have tried including GNOME-2, which is very hard to customize. All desktop distributions except for Redhat default to KDE.
Do you really think that just because GNOME is used on all new Solaris company Desktops, a single KDE linux user will switch to GNOME? Seriously, how many people use Solaris on a Desktop? 10000? Maybe? How many of these people will contribute to free software?
KDE is GPL software, just like linux and QT is GPL software just like linux. Maybe we should relicense the kernel to LGPL so that Sun, MS and IBM can use it better? Don't you notice how ridiculous this is?
We have to fight Microsoft or Linux and all other free software will die. Microsoft has a long history of destroying any competitor and we are their alleged number one competitor.
We need to have a large user base to get a) Broad public support to thwart any legal attempts by MS to make free software illegal. b) To get support for common hardware and software. c) To keep a steady supply of new developers and contributors.
If the way to achieve a large user base is minimizing the costs of switching from MS to free software, then we have to do it. Doing this will not take away the old and tried unix tool chain.
> KDE uses an html renderer (and hence - the > related libraries) in its file navigator. > Having a browser in memory is resource wasteful > - this is why Win 3.1 and Win95 are so much faster.
Bullshit. Konqueror the filemanager does NOT I repeat NOT use an html renderer at all. Your statment was true for kfm. This was KDE-1.x, about three years ago.
If you do not use Konqueror for viewing html, khtml or kmozilla will not be loaded.
The speed difference comes from several factors. 1) Features. KDE has unicode support, i8n support, previewing, theming, is network transparent, loadable plugins.... Windows 95 is just crap compared to it.
2) Compiler and Linker. GCC is slow. The Linkers are slow. gcc favours correctness above speed. This is changing already with gcc-3.2.
3) Optimization pressure. There is noone willing to optimize for P100 with 8 MB ram, when a machine with Duron 800 and 256 MB ram costs less then 250 . Time is better spent on removing bugs and adding features than for optimizing for obsolete hardware.
Finally, KDE has become faster and faster. Optimizing too early gives shitty design. It is the last step. KDE-3.1.x is a lot faster than KDE-1.x or 2.x or even 3.0 on a slow PC with enough (dirt cheap) memory. KDE3.x is more than fast enough on a PII-300 with 128 MB ram.
I am just about to put bogofilter in my mail filtering system. I am thinking about combining this baby with spamassassin, as described here: http://www.randomhacks.net/2002/09/23/#usin g-bogof ilter-with-spam-assassin
I will use the pass through option and I can use spamassassin to protect against false positives and to adjust the sensitivity.
BTW: Does anyone know if the number of SPAM and nonSPAM have to be about equivalent or is this accounted for? I have 4000 spam mails in a folder, but just about 500 nonspam mails.
OK, here is a prime example of what you get when you have a corrupted legal system. MS does not have to do any thing. The only things they are not allowed to do are prohibited BY LAW anyways. As a monopoly, you can not discriminate against competitors. There are NO and I repeat NO sanctions if MS does not follow this code of conduct. The only thing that will happen is that the code of conduct can be extended by two (2!) years. Hardly deterring, if you don't follow it in the first place. The loopholes are so big that only the largest companies can even think about using anything from MS.
My only hope is that the European Commission will fine MS and punish them hard enough for their behaviour to get an effect.
The Honorable Mrs. K-K should retire. She did not even have a small grasp of the matters at hand or she was pressured to her decision. This is a shame for the American Legal system.
Ah, ok, I misunderstood. Well, if you already own Word, why not use it, if you must or want? SuSE does not sell it, AFAICS, so you have to get it yourself.
I would prefer lyx, OOo, kword and gvim any day...
The only proprietary thing in the new SuSE edition is the Arconis NTFS repartitioner. I don't see the point though, because if I am using a reliable wine, why do I still need a Windows partition?
Codeweavers make all their source code availble under LGPL at http://www.winehq.com. The only proprietary bits in Crossover Office are some configurations settings and an installation wizard with icons.
Crime 2 the kicker, why does it have to be a direct port of the start menu, (which sucks when you think about it) for example, when you push the k the first icons presented are logoff and shutdown, this is terrible design, someone could trigger a shutdown dialog by sloppy clicking on the K, hell even windows XP corrected this, (why they don't remove these and place them with the applets I have no idea, that seemed the most corret solution to me, and this is how I hack it to work like).
I think you can remove the start/logout buttons from the kde menue in the kicker menue in the kicker configuration. They are certainly also available as applet for kicker.
> Did they finally fix all of the bugs from the 3.0 release?
They fixed thousands of bugs. Especially usability bugs, those are hard to fix. Check out an overview here
http://bugs.kde.org/reports.cgi?product=-All-&outp ut=show_chart&datasets=RESOLVED%3A&datasets=CLOSED %3A&datasets=FIXED%3A&datasets=WORKSFORME%3A&links =1&banner=1&quip=0
The data is incomplete due to the recent switch to bugzilla.
> Have they made 3.x a little more backwards compatible from 2.x?
Who is still using KDE-2.x? KDE-3.0 was released months ago. Many of the old settings have no equivalent anymore, e.g. the filter format in kmail changed.
> ESPECIALLY the documentation ) is half-assed at best
That is true. Go ahead and write some, it will be included.
> Set up the KDE so that when the many, many programs that core dump do their usual crash I'm > able to automatically send that to the KDE people without having to run a 20-minute wizard.
Huh? This is already done ATM. backtracing without debugging symbols is senseless anyways.
> Write your fucking desktop program so that people upgrading can do so seamlessly and painlessly
Why don't you stop insulting the people donating software to you? Shut your mouth or help the project.
Gimp may be older than KDE, but the gimp toolkit is younger. The first versions of gimp were motif based. GTK is a motif replacement library. The first stable relase was in 1998, two years after KDE was founded.
From the Changelog of gtk-1.00:
Mon Apr 13 19:16:22 PDT 1998 Shawn T. Amundson
* Released GTK+ 1.0.0
See here http://www.gimp.org/~sjburges/gimp-history.html
"The GIMP had a lot of neat stuff attached to its first public release, version 0.54, (January 1996). It had a plug-in system, so developers could make separate programs to add to GIMP without breaking anything in the main distribution. It had some basic tools to do drawing, and channel operations. It had an undo feature the likes of which was not found in any known image manipulation program. It had loyal users swearing by it. It was protected by the GPL. And it had a cool name.
But all was not well with the GIMP. It had rather frequent crashes, that could be caused by plug-ins or problems in the main code. It had a dependency on Motif for its GUI toolkit, which made efficient distribution to a lot of users impossible."
> There is nothing "modern" about a mess of configuration files in ~/.kde.
Don't you think e.g. ksycoca is a cool idea? Isn't automatic updating a good idea?
> Maybe KDE should then also implement the "obsolete motif dnd specification".
Maybe motif should rather adapt to the rest of the world and implement the xdnd STANDARD agreed upon by all other X11 developers?
http://www.newplanetsoftware.com/xdnd/
>And why does DCOP seem to start up for everything if very few applications actually ever need high-bandwidth inter-client communication?
Most KDE apps are scriptable via dcop. dcop is actually used in the KDE desktop. dcop is also not high bandwidth, that is mcop (of the artsd).
> If the KDE folks had put their mind to it, they could have figured out how to do high performance communications through an X11 server without opening sockets behind my back--it's not rocket science.
I am pretty sure, that they gave a lot of thought to these issues.
See this part of the dcop documentation:
"KDE[1] already has[had!] an extremely simple IPC mechanism called KWMcom, which is (was!) used for communicating between the panel and the window manager for instance. It is about as simple as it gets, passing messages via X Atoms. For this reason it is limited in the size and complexity of the data that can be passed (X atoms must be small to remain efficient) and it also makes it so that X is required."
Look here for references: http://developer.kde.org/documentatio n/library/kde qt/dcop.html http://developer.kde.org/documentati on/other/rpc-t echnologies.html
Concerning gimp DnD: Why does KDE dragging work with xmms? Why can I drag from and to nautilus. Maybe because there IS a bug in gimp? http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22286 If you don't believe me, check mozilla's bug database: http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cg i?id=161824
Evidently, gimp is triggering a bug in gtk's xdnd implementation, or it might still use the old obsolete motif dnd specification.
> Handling of defaults, resources, command line > options, event bindings, widget trees?
You prefer xrdb to modern resource handling? commandline options? Like what? Which X convention exists regarding event binding?
> inter-client communication (via a separate server rather than the X server)
Bullshit. DCOP is a simple IPC/RPC mechanism built to operate over sockets. Either unix domain sockets or tcp/ip sockets are supported. DCOP is built on top of the Inter Client Exchange (ICE) protocol, which comes standard as a part of X11R6 and later.
artsd is superior by far than the enlightenment sound daemon. gnome considered using it, but then dropped the idea. gstreamer is not yet finished, but arts support is already available.
Gnome and other applications that were formerly listed in its menus seem to have disappeared
Run kappfinder and it will add any applications in it's database for you. Alternative:
run "ln -s/opt/gnome2/share/applications/.kde/share/applnk/GNOME" or the equivalent. Gnome does not add the KDE menues by default.
KDE's drag-and-drop does not interoperate fully with non-KDE apps
Where? Please give an example.
Many gnome applications do not encode the URLS as specified in the Rfcs and this can lead to problems...
KDE flaunts many X11 conventions
Which? Give some examples. It works fine here. KDE-3.1b2 works seamlessly with the only gnome application I use (pybliographer) and all other X11 apps I know.
If you try to start up a KDE application under a non-KDE desktop, it starts up big, noisy background processes.
Gnome apps do the same on KDE. nautilus e.g. starts esd, gconfd-2, nautilus-throbber, bonobo-activation-server and medusa-idled. Also these KDE applications are started on demand, are shared by all KDE apps you use and they disappear automatically after you quit the last KDE program, unlike some of the gnome processes.
I think you should provide at least some examples before you accuse KDE of not playing fair with other programs. Are you just fudding?
First let me say, that GNOME1/2 are part of SuSE-8.1. This part of your post is wrong. All other things you said are missing in KDE are there.
-themeable login manager
KDM is themable. How often do you log in? Does Gnome force you to log in more then once a week?
-flexible bitmap themes that allow you to tweak window behavior into something that you want
No tweaking necessary, kwin is configured by GUI. Just rightclick on the title bar and configure it. Support for the old gtk-bitmap themes has not been ported to the new qt3-theming engine yet, that is true. Most of them are low quality anyways, so KDE has just about 10 nice and fast coded themes.
-granular control over the look-and-feel of the environment (multiple toolbars, drag and drop launchers, etc...)
Sounds like a cereal to me... What is missing? toolbars? drag and drop? What are you talking about in KDE that can not be configured? I think you have no idea what you are talking about at all.
-a more standarized approach to where binaries go: '/usr/local/bin' rather than '/opt/kde' (Of course it would be better if things were more like '/usr/local/kde', but thene again I compile everything I use.)
This is depending on your distribution. On SuSE Gnome is in/opt/gnome2 for example. Just set the KDEDIR where you want it before compiling it, e.g./usr/local/kde or even home/eno2001/I/have/no/clue/about/kde/ if you want.
If you really have to use Redhat, do as intended and use GNOME. Redhat has no competence regarding KDE configuration, in fact they fired their only dedicated KDE developer, who provided the KDE release packages in his spare time!
Redhat is not an option for me, I am in love with KDE since 0-Beta2. GNOME just feels slimy and hacked together to me.
This is very important! People keep bitching about Anti-Aliased Font support, well why is RedHat the only including an advanced utility? Fonts are 99% of your visual aspect of your desktop, good looking fonts make a BIG difference. (side note, Mosfet Liquid engine/theme is a must..)
When the next official X release comes out with support for XFT2 and the next official qt release comes out with support for it, then SuSE will put them in the supplementary version of your favorite mirror. SuSE does not ship beta versions of core componentes like glibc or X.
SuSE has been antialiased (XFT1) for more than a year now, KDE3 offers a good way to install fonts, I do not know what is missing exactly. I think Eugenia did not know about kcmfontconfig. No problem here (SuSE-8.0).
Slashdot Mirror
Just change your preferences for text/html in the file associations and put your favorite browser on top of the list. Then kmail will open the links in your emails with that browser.
Jesus H. Christ! How can anyone claim that khtml ist not crossplatform?
h tml
It can be used without X (kde no X = kdenox, in CVS), without unix even, as Atheos shows.
Nobody remember Konqembedded?
http://www.konqueror.org/embedded.
Also the only slight dependency is qt, which is crossplatform (Windows, Unix, OS X, embedded). As Apple [and Atheos] shows, it is easy to write wrapper to get rid of even that dependency.
I think Redhat is still dumb as shit regarding KDE. Both X and GNOME-2.2 have not yet been released as stable versions, so they could very well have added KDE-3.1rc6. It is so stable that I regret compiling with debug enabled to get backtraces. So far in one month of heavy use I have had not a single KDE program segfault on me!
m l?tid=110
But in the end, Redhat will have to include KDE-3.1 or they will lose market share to SuSE. Too bad, they have already lost all their KDE competence with their crippled version in Redhat-8.0. Bero quit Redhat over this. See http://slashdot.org/articles/02/09/25/2042208.sht
Bullshit many directives are not implemented in national European laws. What happens then?
...) should reacd up on the legal system we have here.
Easy: The directive becomes law by itself if applicable and/or -- as software producer -- you can sue any nation that has failed to implement the directive for any damages.
Basically people who have no clue of the European Union (like CmdrTaco, Kr3m3Puff
OpenOffice and StarOffice are virtually identical.
The only differences are license, fonts, cliparts, templates, dictionaries, thesasaurus and better hyphenation in SO-6. The speed of both should pretty much be identical on both systems.
giFT just has not yet had a stable release, even though it works very good already. In the long run, I expect it to be able to support the 10s of thousands of users kazaa or gnutella have. In fact just try it, you'd be surprised.
/..
Also, from the fact that you use kazaa, I presume, that you use windows, which is not an option for me. In fact it makes you look like a fool on
GNU Internet File Transfer
http://gift.sourceforge.net/
" What is giFT, you ask? giFT is a modular daemon capable of abstracting the communication between the end user and specific filesharing protocols (peer-to-peer or otherwise). The giFT project differs from many other similar projects in that it is a distribution of a standalone (platform-independent) daemon, a library for client/frontend development, and our own homegrown network OpenFT. "
This is a great network, where you find many oggs, downloads actually work (up to 600kb/s!!) and finding files is really fast. Lots of altruists are using it. Plus: You have to compile it from CVS, which prevents idiots from using the network. On the average each user shares 8 GB!
>> It actually has no importance at all to KDE.
:-) Wow, I right now picture a big zombie crushing a little Gnome. KDE development is becoming faster and faster.
:-) KDE is translated into more languages than GNOME [Reason: Americans know only english], has icon themes, has a component architecture that is actually used in the software [dcop,kparts], has language bindings for java, python, perl, C and C# and uses hardware accelerated alpha blending via the render extension. You are either stupid or lying.
> Apart from showing that KDE is, to all intents and purposes, a dead man walking?
> KDE is *only* the default for loser distros
> with bugger all market share. Red Hat and
> Mandrake both fully support GNOME, and that
> accounts for the vast bulk of Linux
> installations. Sun and HP both use GNOME as
> their default commerical desktop. KDE is a
> minority zealot's desktop... used only by the
> loud mouth obnoxious shouters who fill up
> slashdot and various other Linux sites with
> ill-conceived garbage.
Interesting. I am saying Redhat is the only one defaulting to GNOME. You tell me Mandrake _supports_ Gnome.
KDE's newsreader knode already accounts for 5 % of the German usenet posts! Redhat is actually holding back Desktop linux use in the USA by using Gnome. SuSE is dominating Europe, that's why people here are adopting the linux desktop already.
> KDE is way behind GNOME is important matters such as i18n, accessiblity, component
> architecture, bindings... but hey, KDE supports faked alpha blended menus... whoopee...
Hmm. I think the only thing where Gnome leads is accessibility. Must make it easier for people like you
>> Seriously, how many people use Solaris on a Desktop? 10000?
> No-one you know... you see, it's used by people who have something called "real jobs". Scientific
> research and such... in other words, work which doesn't involve wearing a paper hat and a name
> tag.
Solaris on the desktop is used by people with more money than brains. Like government institutions and big companies.
It actually has no importance at all to KDE.
KDE is the leading linux Desktop worldwide and only Redhat's stubbornness has kept GNOME alive in the USA. KDE-3.1 will be released today or tomorrow and it is much more advanced than any other Desktop I have tried including GNOME-2, which is very hard to customize. All desktop distributions except for Redhat default to KDE.
Do you really think that just because GNOME is used on all new Solaris company Desktops, a single KDE linux user will switch to GNOME? Seriously, how many people use Solaris on a Desktop? 10000? Maybe? How many of these people will contribute to free software?
KDE is GPL software, just like linux and QT is GPL software just like linux. Maybe we should relicense the kernel to LGPL so that Sun, MS and IBM can use it better?
Don't you notice how ridiculous this is?
We have to fight Microsoft or Linux and all other free software will die. Microsoft has a long history of destroying any competitor and we are their alleged number one competitor.
We need to have a large user base to get
a) Broad public support to thwart any legal attempts by MS to make free software illegal.
b) To get support for common hardware and software.
c) To keep a steady supply of new developers and contributors.
If the way to achieve a large user base is minimizing the costs of switching from MS to free software, then we have to do it. Doing this will not take away the old and tried unix tool chain.
> KDE uses an html renderer (and hence - the
> related libraries) in its file navigator.
> Having a browser in memory is resource wasteful
> - this is why Win 3.1 and Win95 are so much faster.
Bullshit. Konqueror the filemanager does NOT I repeat NOT use an html renderer at all. Your statment was true for kfm. This was KDE-1.x, about three years ago.
If you do not use Konqueror for viewing html, khtml or kmozilla will not be loaded.
The speed difference comes from several factors.
1) Features. KDE has unicode support, i8n support, previewing, theming, is network transparent, loadable plugins....
Windows 95 is just crap compared to it.
2) Compiler and Linker. GCC is slow. The Linkers are slow. gcc favours correctness above speed. This is changing already with gcc-3.2.
3) Optimization pressure. There is noone willing to optimize for P100 with 8 MB ram, when a machine with Duron 800 and 256 MB ram costs less then 250 . Time is better spent on removing bugs and adding features than for optimizing for obsolete hardware.
Finally, KDE has become faster and faster. Optimizing too early gives shitty design. It is the last step.
KDE-3.1.x is a lot faster than KDE-1.x or 2.x or even 3.0 on a slow PC with enough (dirt cheap) memory. KDE3.x is more than fast enough on a PII-300 with 128 MB ram.
I am just about to put bogofilter in my mail filtering system. I am thinking about combining this baby with spamassassin, as described here:n g-bogof ilter-with-spam-assassin
http://www.randomhacks.net/2002/09/23/#usi
I will use the pass through option and I can use spamassassin to protect against false positives and to adjust the sensitivity.
BTW: Does anyone know if the number of SPAM and nonSPAM have to be about equivalent or is this accounted for? I have 4000 spam mails in a folder, but just about 500 nonspam mails.
1988 or something and I really recommend the following roguelike to all NH fans:
http://www.dungeoncrawl.org/
It is very nice and refreshingly different from nethack. Still complex enough, to keep you interested. Give it a try.
OK, here is a prime example of what you get when you have a corrupted legal system. MS does not have to do any thing. The only things they are not allowed to do are prohibited BY LAW anyways. As a monopoly, you can not discriminate against competitors. There are NO and I repeat NO sanctions if MS does not follow this code of conduct. The only thing that will happen is that the code of conduct can be extended by two (2!) years. Hardly deterring, if you don't follow it in the first place. The loopholes are so big that only the largest companies can even think about using anything from MS.
My only hope is that the European Commission will fine MS and punish them hard enough for their behaviour to get an effect.
The Honorable Mrs. K-K should retire. She did not even have a small grasp of the matters at hand or she was pressured to her decision. This is a shame for the American Legal system.
Ah, ok, I misunderstood. Well, if you already own Word, why not use it, if you must or want?
SuSE does not sell it, AFAICS, so you have to get it yourself.
I would prefer lyx, OOo, kword and gvim any day...
The only proprietary thing in the new SuSE edition is the Arconis NTFS repartitioner. I don't see the point though, because if I am using a reliable wine, why do I still need a Windows partition?
Codeweavers make all their source code availble under LGPL at http://www.winehq.com. The only proprietary bits in Crossover Office are some configurations settings and an installation wizard with icons.
Crime 2 the kicker, why does it have to be a direct port of the start menu, (which sucks when you think about it) for example, when you push the k the first icons presented are logoff and shutdown, this is terrible design, someone could trigger a shutdown dialog by sloppy clicking on the K, hell even windows XP corrected this, (why they don't remove these and place them with the applets I have no idea, that seemed the most corret solution to me, and this is how I hack it to work like).
I think you can remove the start/logout buttons from the kde menue in the kicker menue in the kicker configuration. They are certainly also available as applet for kicker.
> Did they finally fix all of the bugs from the 3.0 release?
p ut=show_chart&datasets=RESOLVED%3A&datasets=CLOSED %3A&datasets=FIXED%3A&datasets=WORKSFORME%3A&links =1&banner=1&quip=0
They fixed thousands of bugs. Especially usability bugs, those are hard to fix.
Check out an overview here
http://bugs.kde.org/reports.cgi?product=-All-&out
The data is incomplete due to the recent switch to bugzilla.
> Have they made 3.x a little more backwards compatible from 2.x?
Who is still using KDE-2.x? KDE-3.0 was released months ago. Many of the old settings have no equivalent anymore, e.g. the filter format in kmail changed.
> ESPECIALLY the documentation ) is half-assed at best
That is true. Go ahead and write some, it will be included.
> Set up the KDE so that when the many, many programs that core dump do their usual crash I'm
> able to automatically send that to the KDE people without having to run a 20-minute wizard.
Huh? This is already done ATM. backtracing without debugging symbols is senseless anyways.
> Write your fucking desktop program so that people upgrading can do so seamlessly and painlessly
Why don't you stop insulting the people donating software to you? Shut your mouth or help the project.
Gimp may be older than KDE, but the gimp toolkit is younger. The first versions of gimp were motif based. GTK is a motif replacement library.
The first stable relase was in 1998, two years after KDE was founded.
From the Changelog of gtk-1.00:
Mon Apr 13 19:16:22 PDT 1998 Shawn T. Amundson
* Released GTK+ 1.0.0
See here http://www.gimp.org/~sjburges/gimp-history.html
"The GIMP had a lot of neat stuff attached to its first public release, version 0.54, (January 1996). It had a plug-in system, so developers could make separate programs to add to GIMP without breaking anything in the main distribution. It had some basic tools to do drawing, and channel operations. It had an undo feature the likes of which was not found in any known image manipulation program. It had loyal users swearing by it. It was protected by the GPL. And it had a cool name.
But all was not well with the GIMP. It had rather frequent crashes, that could be caused by plug-ins or problems in the main code. It had a dependency on Motif for its GUI toolkit, which made efficient distribution to a lot of users impossible."
> There is nothing "modern" about a mess of configuration files in ~/.kde.
o n/library/kde qt/dcop.htmli on/other/rpc-t echnologies.html
Don't you think e.g. ksycoca is a cool idea? Isn't automatic updating a good idea?
> Maybe KDE should then also implement the "obsolete motif dnd specification".
Maybe motif should rather adapt to the rest of the world and implement the xdnd STANDARD agreed upon by all other X11 developers?
http://www.newplanetsoftware.com/xdnd/
>And why does DCOP seem to start up for everything if very few applications actually ever need high-bandwidth inter-client communication?
Most KDE apps are scriptable via dcop. dcop is actually used in the KDE desktop. dcop is also not high bandwidth, that is mcop (of the artsd).
> If the KDE folks had put their mind to it, they could have figured out how to do high performance communications through an X11 server without opening sockets behind my back--it's not rocket science.
I am pretty sure, that they gave a lot of thought to these issues.
See this part of the dcop documentation:
"KDE[1] already has[had!] an extremely simple IPC mechanism called KWMcom, which is (was!) used for communicating between the panel and the window manager for instance. It is about as simple as it gets, passing messages via X Atoms. For this reason it is limited in the size and complexity of the data that can be passed (X atoms must be small to remain efficient) and it also makes it so that X is required."
Look here for references:
http://developer.kde.org/documentati
http://developer.kde.org/documentat
Concerning gimp DnD:
g i?id=161824
Why does KDE dragging work with xmms? Why can I drag from and to nautilus. Maybe because there IS a bug in gimp?
http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22286
If you don't believe me, check mozilla's bug database:
http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.c
Evidently, gimp is triggering a bug in gtk's xdnd implementation, or it might still use the old obsolete motif dnd specification.
> Handling of defaults, resources, command line
> options, event bindings, widget trees?
You prefer xrdb to modern resource handling? commandline options? Like what? Which X convention exists regarding event binding?
> inter-client communication (via a separate server rather than the X server)
Bullshit. DCOP is a simple IPC/RPC mechanism built to operate over sockets. Either unix domain sockets or tcp/ip sockets are supported. DCOP is built on top of the Inter Client Exchange (ICE) protocol, which comes standard as a part of X11R6 and later.
it uses its own audio output
artsd is superior by far than the enlightenment sound daemon. gnome considered using it, but then dropped the idea. gstreamer is not yet finished, but arts support is already available.
Gnome and other applications that were formerly listed in its menus seem to have disappeared
Run kappfinder and it will add any applications in it's database for you. Alternative: run "ln -s /opt/gnome2/share/applications/ .kde/share/applnk/GNOME" or the equivalent. Gnome does not add the KDE menues by default.
KDE's drag-and-drop does not interoperate fully with non-KDE apps
Where? Please give an example. Many gnome applications do not encode the URLS as specified in the Rfcs and this can lead to problems...
KDE flaunts many X11 conventions
Which? Give some examples. It works fine here. KDE-3.1b2 works seamlessly with the only gnome application I use (pybliographer) and all other X11 apps I know.
If you try to start up a KDE application under a non-KDE desktop, it starts up big, noisy background processes.
Gnome apps do the same on KDE. nautilus e.g. starts esd, gconfd-2, nautilus-throbber, bonobo-activation-server and medusa-idled. Also these KDE applications are started on demand, are shared by all KDE apps you use and they disappear automatically after you quit the last KDE program, unlike some of the gnome processes.
I think you should provide at least some examples before you accuse KDE of not playing fair with other programs. Are you just fudding?
First let me say, that GNOME1/2 are part of SuSE-8.1. This part of your post is wrong. All other things you said are missing in KDE are there.
-themeable login manager
KDM is themable. How often do you log in? Does Gnome force you to log in more then once a week?
-flexible bitmap themes that allow you to tweak window behavior into something that you want
No tweaking necessary, kwin is configured by GUI. Just rightclick on the title bar and configure it. Support for the old gtk-bitmap themes has not been ported to the new qt3-theming engine yet, that is true. Most of them are low quality anyways, so KDE has just about 10 nice and fast coded themes.
-granular control over the look-and-feel of the environment (multiple toolbars, drag and drop launchers, etc...)
Sounds like a cereal to me... What is missing? toolbars? drag and drop? What are you talking about in KDE that can not be configured? I think you have no idea what you are talking about at all.
-a more standarized approach to where binaries go: '/usr/local/bin' rather than '/opt/kde' (Of course it would be better if things were more like '/usr/local/kde', but thene again I compile everything I use.)
This is depending on your distribution. On SuSE Gnome is in /opt/gnome2 for example. Just set the KDEDIR where you want it before compiling it, e.g. /usr/local/kde or even home/eno2001/I/have/no/clue/about/kde/ if you want.
If you really have to use Redhat, do as intended and use GNOME. Redhat has no competence regarding KDE configuration, in fact they fired their only dedicated KDE developer, who provided the KDE release packages in his spare time!
Redhat is not an option for me, I am in love with KDE since 0-Beta2. GNOME just feels slimy and hacked together to me.
When the next official X release comes out with support for XFT2 and the next official qt release comes out with support for it, then SuSE will put them in the supplementary version of your favorite mirror. SuSE does not ship beta versions of core componentes like glibc or X.
SuSE has been antialiased (XFT1) for more than a year now, KDE3 offers a good way to install fonts, I do not know what is missing exactly. I think Eugenia did not know about kcmfontconfig. No problem here (SuSE-8.0).