There's a very simple fix for this. Dump the treadmill, dump the numbers, and make gameplay fun
City of Heroes is an interesting case for MMOs, because it literally is nothing but a treadmill. There's no other style of gameplay in the game other than combat for levels, yet somehow it's ridiculous fun and addictive, moreso than many other MMOs on the market today.
Personally, I think this can be attributed to the fact that they focused on this singular gameplay element and refined it so well that you never really notice that you're only ever doing one thing during your entire time playing. With a good group of strangers or good friends the hours can fly by like nothing, all the while everyone's having a pretty darn good time of things. I think that the level treadmill, when done right, can be a respectable tool for advancement in the game if the situations involved are balanced and challenging.
That's a pretty unnecessary statement. I'd venture to say he's played them enough to know full well what the phrase "level grind" means. Well enough to understand why some people will spend real world money on preleveled characters to skip the whole process.
Personally, I play several MMOs, and I'm the type who levels his character through the conventional means, grinding away. Because for ME, it's about experiencing the game the developers created -- that's FUN to me. But for some, it's not. *shrug*
Sorry, you sir need to get into a new business. The one you are currently in sucks for you, sucks for the game, and sucks for the people playing the games. MMORPG's are NOT a job. People who are spending real money for in-game advantage through third parties should be shot in the street for being so stupid.
The best argument I've heard thus far FOR the practice of buying MMO items and money is that some people simply don't have the time to play as much as others. To some it's not a big deal to spend some cash to get themselves to the point where the powergamers already are at. I'm not saying I agree with the tactics of the fraudulent bunch out there, but I don't think executing people for legitimately spending their money as they see fit is a valid argument either.
You know I thought the same thing, but I was floored by how much they IMPROVED the audio. It's right up to snuff with the visuals. Those guys are truly pioneers in the gaming industry, it's a pity Uru Live flopped.:(
Anyone who's ever played the Myst series of games knows that audio is at the forefront of the experience, never off at the sidelines. I recently picked up Uru, the now not-so-online sequel to Myst. I have to say, it has some of the most immersive audio I've ever experienced with a game since Riven. A ton of work had to have gone into it to get all the distinct sounds, write the music, and put it all into a package that supports EAX so well you can close your eyes and just listen to the ambience.
Just my opinion, but I think there are a rare few developers out there that already have this down pat.
I agree that's the strong point to be made about this production team. I honestly contend that with any movie made by these fellows, I go into it expecting an effects reel with a shred of a plot. And I always seem to come out of it pleased, in that there's usually some excellent concepts, imagery, and occasionally some surprises. Nowadays if I go to a theater and come out of a movie with a better opinion of it than when I went in, I'm happy.
I read a lot of anti-EA sentiments in this thread. A lot of people speaking about how EA rapes game developers, their talent and their franchises. About how everything they put out is trash, incrementally updated yearly to milk money from everyone... and I have to wonder one thing: why are they still in business? Why do people persist on purchasing their games? It's obvious from reading this thread that a large segment of the/. community (a decent sized subset of the gamers, I'd venture) have a serious dislike for products that have the EA stamp on them, and yet people are still buying their games in droves.
Witness the case of a friend of mine, who's extremely anti-EA in conversation, but then secretly enjoys Tiger Woods 2003 (and 2002, and in fact 2001...). What gives?
From what I'm hearing from people I know who have them, it's a device that tries to be a lot of things and does none of them well. It's actually a very good idea really, given the penchant of vendors now to cram as many devices into a single unit as they can and the obvious consumer acceptance of the practice.
Personally I'm one of those types that will carry around four things if each of them does what they do well. My cell phone's great, I have an iPod for music, and a GBA-sp for gaming. The biggest problem with the n-gage I can see is a total rush to market. Had Nokia actually pulled their crap together and worked on a device that wasn't such a hack job they might have had a worthwhile gadget to buy.
So where's my motivation to avoid using P2P software now? Considering I'm being imposed up on to pay up whether I pirate music now or not, the very act of buying CD-Rs means I'm supporting a recording industry even if I use those CD-Rs to back up documents. Why should I buy music or movies legitimately anymore?
Yes, EVE is a pretty timesinky game but I have to ask: were you going it solo? I found solo play in EVE to be a little like watching paint dry or grass grow. It's DEFINITELY a group game, no matter how much they insist you can play it however you like. With a corporation you can do more together faster than you can soloing, which helps everyone advance faster to the more interesting aspects of the game. Eventually I myself cancelled my subscription to EVE as well, but I gave it a decent number of months.
In the end it was the fact that the people I played with only logged in to start a new skill to train and I found myself playing solo. I suppose I could have gone and found myself another corp in the game to play with but I'd hoped to keep things together with people I knew in real life. That's not to say that EVE isn't a fantastic game, there's certainly lots to do; the question is indeed as you put it, what motivation is there to do it?
Since I only buy the extended editions of the LotR movies, they're not getting a double-dip from me at all. You can buy only the theatrical release if you wish, while I'll buy the extended edition. That's why there's TWO editions -- one for people who prefer the theatrical version, and one for people who prefer to see the theatrical version plus all the stuff that was cut out for length. In that respect, am I still "eating it up" if I choose to buy the single edition I prefer?
If you read up on that article you'll find that Microsoft isn't actually producing the hardware, merely the software. 3rd party hardware vendors will be doing the design and manufacturing.
... is for one moron at a convention to stand up with a bullhorn and yell "DELETE ALL MESSAGES IN INBOX, DELETE ALL DOCUMENTS, DELETE ALL PROGRAMS, CALL 911" to ruin it for everone.
*wistful rememberance of the good old days ensues*
I loved TW2002. It was immensely enjoyable. But the game that clinched widespread multiplayer online gaming for me was Barren Realms Elite. The whole concept of inter-BBS combat was a blast. I remember belonging to a league that was Canada vs. Australia, with each side enchanging massive blows to the other with thousands of units each day. It was massively fun.:)
These lists are an attempt to define a list of excellent games that you'd be better off having played
Based on what? What someone else says or suggests? That might be right a percentage of the time, but not all the time. You yourself say FPS games make you motion sick, yet you enjoyed Halo without necessitating the play of Dule or Quake. And that's exactly the point I was trying to make.:)
The thing about your final paragraph is that there are those who enjoy those gaames like TSO and YDKJ, a LOT of people. What will those people get out of a gaming canon?:)
Ok, while this is a great list, I question a few things. First off the list is very subjective, as what one person considers to be a canon-worth game might make another's stomach turn. Second, why does someone have to have an appreciation for any game on that list to call themselves a serious gamer?
I don't need to have played and loved Street Fighter 2 to play Soul Calibur 2 and enjoy it. In fact I might consider it more enjoyable maybe than the guy who's been playing fighting games for years and only compares his SC2 experience to the games that have come before.
Then again I could be entirely off my rocker on this, so feel free to respond in kind.:) I'm just not entirely confident you can equate a gaming canon to a literary one, since there's more to great games than good storytelling/writing, and that greater complexity makes this concept more subjective. Just my 2c!
The use of real world money in a virtual MMOG is not unique or new with There. Project Entropia has been doing this for what, a year now? That's not to say it's a GOOD game per se, I've heard from several that it's actually very horrible (mostly because you have to shell out real world cash to get anywhere).
Oh come on. First, this isn't a screenshot from a release version. Second, the screenshot's meant to show off some new interface concepts -- and I'm willing to bet, all at the same time. You can make explorer pretty wasteful in space usage with every version of Windows, but you can get rid of it if you want. Chances are very good they turned on everything under the sun for the purposes of that shot.
I think it's trying to get across that if you try to transfuse someone's blood with POWDER, the results will be less than ideal. Mix with liquid first.:)
I can't read any more of that article. What a pompous prick. He seems to epitomize the forum troll, in that he thinks he speaks for everyone who's playing that game -- nay, ALL games. He thinks that his suggestions of how the game should be improved should all be taken into consideration immediately and implemented into the games because his perception of the game is seemingly the only right one. And like all others like him out there like him, the games are better off when he comes and goes like that first level gained.
Slashdot Mirror
We'll just get the cast from Star Trek (TOS) to act stupidly illogical to confuse and overload the robots.
City of Heroes is an interesting case for MMOs, because it literally is nothing but a treadmill. There's no other style of gameplay in the game other than combat for levels, yet somehow it's ridiculous fun and addictive, moreso than many other MMOs on the market today.
Personally, I think this can be attributed to the fact that they focused on this singular gameplay element and refined it so well that you never really notice that you're only ever doing one thing during your entire time playing. With a good group of strangers or good friends the hours can fly by like nothing, all the while everyone's having a pretty darn good time of things. I think that the level treadmill, when done right, can be a respectable tool for advancement in the game if the situations involved are balanced and challenging.
That's a pretty unnecessary statement. I'd venture to say he's played them enough to know full well what the phrase "level grind" means. Well enough to understand why some people will spend real world money on preleveled characters to skip the whole process.
Personally, I play several MMOs, and I'm the type who levels his character through the conventional means, grinding away. Because for ME, it's about experiencing the game the developers created -- that's FUN to me. But for some, it's not. *shrug*
The best argument I've heard thus far FOR the practice of buying MMO items and money is that some people simply don't have the time to play as much as others. To some it's not a big deal to spend some cash to get themselves to the point where the powergamers already are at. I'm not saying I agree with the tactics of the fraudulent bunch out there, but I don't think executing people for legitimately spending their money as they see fit is a valid argument either.
Go back and read the FULL POST.
You know I thought the same thing, but I was floored by how much they IMPROVED the audio. It's right up to snuff with the visuals. Those guys are truly pioneers in the gaming industry, it's a pity Uru Live flopped. :(
Anyone who's ever played the Myst series of games knows that audio is at the forefront of the experience, never off at the sidelines. I recently picked up Uru, the now not-so-online sequel to Myst. I have to say, it has some of the most immersive audio I've ever experienced with a game since Riven. A ton of work had to have gone into it to get all the distinct sounds, write the music, and put it all into a package that supports EAX so well you can close your eyes and just listen to the ambience.
Just my opinion, but I think there are a rare few developers out there that already have this down pat.
All that cash spent on marketing and they couldn't produce a website for people who don't use Flash? :/
I agree that's the strong point to be made about this production team. I honestly contend that with any movie made by these fellows, I go into it expecting an effects reel with a shred of a plot. And I always seem to come out of it pleased, in that there's usually some excellent concepts, imagery, and occasionally some surprises. Nowadays if I go to a theater and come out of a movie with a better opinion of it than when I went in, I'm happy.
This is a teeny bit off-topic I suppose but...
/. community (a decent sized subset of the gamers, I'd venture) have a serious dislike for products that have the EA stamp on them, and yet people are still buying their games in droves.
I read a lot of anti-EA sentiments in this thread. A lot of people speaking about how EA rapes game developers, their talent and their franchises. About how everything they put out is trash, incrementally updated yearly to milk money from everyone... and I have to wonder one thing: why are they still in business? Why do people persist on purchasing their games? It's obvious from reading this thread that a large segment of the
Witness the case of a friend of mine, who's extremely anti-EA in conversation, but then secretly enjoys Tiger Woods 2003 (and 2002, and in fact 2001...). What gives?
From what I'm hearing from people I know who have them, it's a device that tries to be a lot of things and does none of them well. It's actually a very good idea really, given the penchant of vendors now to cram as many devices into a single unit as they can and the obvious consumer acceptance of the practice.
Personally I'm one of those types that will carry around four things if each of them does what they do well. My cell phone's great, I have an iPod for music, and a GBA-sp for gaming. The biggest problem with the n-gage I can see is a total rush to market. Had Nokia actually pulled their crap together and worked on a device that wasn't such a hack job they might have had a worthwhile gadget to buy.
So where's my motivation to avoid using P2P software now? Considering I'm being imposed up on to pay up whether I pirate music now or not, the very act of buying CD-Rs means I'm supporting a recording industry even if I use those CD-Rs to back up documents. Why should I buy music or movies legitimately anymore?
Yes, EVE is a pretty timesinky game but I have to ask: were you going it solo? I found solo play in EVE to be a little like watching paint dry or grass grow. It's DEFINITELY a group game, no matter how much they insist you can play it however you like. With a corporation you can do more together faster than you can soloing, which helps everyone advance faster to the more interesting aspects of the game. Eventually I myself cancelled my subscription to EVE as well, but I gave it a decent number of months.
In the end it was the fact that the people I played with only logged in to start a new skill to train and I found myself playing solo. I suppose I could have gone and found myself another corp in the game to play with but I'd hoped to keep things together with people I knew in real life. That's not to say that EVE isn't a fantastic game, there's certainly lots to do; the question is indeed as you put it, what motivation is there to do it?
Since I only buy the extended editions of the LotR movies, they're not getting a double-dip from me at all. You can buy only the theatrical release if you wish, while I'll buy the extended edition. That's why there's TWO editions -- one for people who prefer the theatrical version, and one for people who prefer to see the theatrical version plus all the stuff that was cut out for length. In that respect, am I still "eating it up" if I choose to buy the single edition I prefer?
I told the sun last night that those eight beef soft taco supremes were a bad idea. But did he listen to me? NOOOooooo.
If you read up on that article you'll find that Microsoft isn't actually producing the hardware, merely the software. 3rd party hardware vendors will be doing the design and manufacturing.
... is for one moron at a convention to stand up with a bullhorn and yell "DELETE ALL MESSAGES IN INBOX, DELETE ALL DOCUMENTS, DELETE ALL PROGRAMS, CALL 911" to ruin it for everone.
I loved TW2002. It was immensely enjoyable. But the game that clinched widespread multiplayer online gaming for me was Barren Realms Elite. The whole concept of inter-BBS combat was a blast. I remember belonging to a league that was Canada vs. Australia, with each side enchanging massive blows to the other with thousands of units each day. It was massively fun. :)
Based on what? What someone else says or suggests? That might be right a percentage of the time, but not all the time. You yourself say FPS games make you motion sick, yet you enjoyed Halo without necessitating the play of Dule or Quake. And that's exactly the point I was trying to make. :)
The thing about your final paragraph is that there are those who enjoy those gaames like TSO and YDKJ, a LOT of people. What will those people get out of a gaming canon? :)
Ok, while this is a great list, I question a few things. First off the list is very subjective, as what one person considers to be a canon-worth game might make another's stomach turn. Second, why does someone have to have an appreciation for any game on that list to call themselves a serious gamer?
:) I'm just not entirely confident you can equate a gaming canon to a literary one, since there's more to great games than good storytelling/writing, and that greater complexity makes this concept more subjective. Just my 2c!
I don't need to have played and loved Street Fighter 2 to play Soul Calibur 2 and enjoy it. In fact I might consider it more enjoyable maybe than the guy who's been playing fighting games for years and only compares his SC2 experience to the games that have come before.
Then again I could be entirely off my rocker on this, so feel free to respond in kind.
The use of real world money in a virtual MMOG is not unique or new with There. Project Entropia has been doing this for what, a year now? That's not to say it's a GOOD game per se, I've heard from several that it's actually very horrible (mostly because you have to shell out real world cash to get anywhere).
Apple steals from MS, MS steals from Apple, everyone steals from everyone. Time to get over it.
Oh come on. First, this isn't a screenshot from a release version. Second, the screenshot's meant to show off some new interface concepts -- and I'm willing to bet, all at the same time. You can make explorer pretty wasteful in space usage with every version of Windows, but you can get rid of it if you want. Chances are very good they turned on everything under the sun for the purposes of that shot.
I think it's trying to get across that if you try to transfuse someone's blood with POWDER, the results will be less than ideal. Mix with liquid first. :)
I can't read any more of that article. What a pompous prick. He seems to epitomize the forum troll, in that he thinks he speaks for everyone who's playing that game -- nay, ALL games. He thinks that his suggestions of how the game should be improved should all be taken into consideration immediately and implemented into the games because his perception of the game is seemingly the only right one. And like all others like him out there like him, the games are better off when he comes and goes like that first level gained.