---I'm a physicist (working on my PhD), but I've had one nagging question about hawking radiation noone's been able to answer (satisfactorially)
I'm a lowly EE student:) I think I understand though.
---So, the process of hawking radiation can be thought of as a particle/anti-particle pair being created near the event horizon. Suppose that one of them is juusssttt close enough to the event horizon that it falls in and the other one remains outside. We assume that (to conserve total energy) the antiparticle falls in, annihilates a regular particle trapped within the black hole and the regular particle that was just far enough away escapes. From the outside, it appears the black hole is radiating mass.
Not quite. The particle/anti-particle is actually created from the vacuum. Quantum physics allows for virtual particles to exist as a form of catalyst, however that energy debt must be paid no matter what.
Lets say one has a controlled black hole. If one was to watch the event horizon, you would see virtual particles swarming in and around the black hole. If the pair falls in, the net energy is 0. This is the case we dont care about because energy/mass is conserved. The other case is where 1 falls in and the other is ejected into space. In that case, the black hole did "eject" mass, but the energy debt must be paid. Because of that, the black hole must pay to create the pair via its own energy.
We call this effect where the black hole pays energy to create "real" virtual particles Hawking Radiation.
---A) I would think that there would be an equal probability distribution of which particle is closer to the event horizon. However, if that were the case then there would be an equal probability that normal/anti particles would fall in, and that would cause the black holes to not evaporate. We know they do, so I don't know how to rectify that. What makes the antiparticle more likely to be closer to the event horizon?
That's where you are mistaken. Overall energy is lowered when 1/2 of the pair is absorbed by the black hole. Once the black holes lose enough energy (some critical value), they explode violently. What we dont know is what exactly happens in a black hole, nor do we know what form of matter/energy is in there, but we do know that the energy debt must be paid.
---B) Suppose you were able to accrete enough antimatter that you could produce a black hole with it. Virtual particles are created on the outside. In this instance, the normal particles must fall in and the anti-particles must escape to conserve total energy. How does that happen? How can the particles see beyond the event horizon to know that's what's within?
I think you're getting hung up on matter and antimatter. They're all quarks. They all combine somehow with U, D, U-bar and D-bar, and even if they did annihilate and release energy, the energy is still trapped. And since the event horizon seems to be a sort of heisenberg shield, I dont think they need ever "collide".
That's why we're studying them cause traveling 100+ Ly is impossible for us now.
DRM isnt the super-breakable trick everyone claims here on slashdot.
One could devise a DRM which procesess all state information within a signed VM. You have multiple exterior checks on the container to guarantee integrity, and once processing the VM, the VM itself checks itself. And if one was to go massively paranoid, a service could be required that satellite service for exterior verification.
Look at this in similar terms of Xen running SElinux with communication via satellite.
Is it crackable? Of course. Will you be found out? Most likely.
Yuo just wait... The next movie player will require a network connection to play videos and music. Blu-ray already uses the VM schematic. All they need is a continuously on connection. All they need is SSH or something similar and the thing'll be damn near unhackable. One would probably have to hook up to the TV lcd chips to record a signal.
You could do what I did when I was in high school: another modem user had no firewall and had c: shared. I went in and put a text file on his desktop saying he needed a firewall or disable sharing. No names, no identifying information. Just a little 100 byte text file saying how his financial data was all in the open.
Some people only respond after they're scared. I did nothing evil.
For those that use this as a reason to NOT use the GPL...
What would have happened if they instead used a copy of WinNT4.0 without paying Microsoft? Microsoft would want blood, and would extract it via the BSA.
The creators of Busybox just want you to host the changes you've done to it. They wanted no money.
In other words: What would $proprietary_software_manufacturer do?
The only problem to run Win2k is on a laptop with Wifi. There's no coherent Wifi subsystem to do what one can do in WinXP. XP's system pales in comparison to Ubuntu though. Nothing can beat iwconfig/ifconfig/iptables combo... except for pf.
If one has a Linux-liked wifi card, switch to Ubuntu. Its worth the trouble.
---I bought XP Pro last year (January 07), and as a "special" got Vista Pro upgrade for "free" (plus $10 shipping and handling), so I went ahead and got it simply because I knew eventually I'd be using it. It's been sitting in my drawer since then.
That's because Vista is the next Windows ME. It's just like that XP MCE. It takes 2 GHz just to run the gui, regardless the tv tuner card and transcoding.
When it comes down to it, Vista runs slow and is anti-user. That's enough a reason for me not to like it.
---So the question is, from what I understand, if you turn off all the extras, Vista is not that bad.
I'm currently running Ubuntu 8.04 on my T61 thinkpad and it runs like a charm. Everything just works, from Wifi to graphics. I didnt have to download a single driver, compile 1 kernel, or do much of anything else. With Ubuntu (and every other linux) you can turn off CPU and power hungry apps. Compiz eating 9w? Turn it off. Dont need those server processes? Shut em down. Need a minimalist desktop? Install Enlightenment.
BTW: I have an Ipod Nano v2 that wouldnt work properly with Windows XP, or should I say with Windows Itunes. I have a library of 100k+ songs and itunes crashes out at around 10k. I looked for a windows program that could categorize my music, and found nothing good. I come on Linux and lo and behold: Amarok. Auto-configures to my ipod, scans an unlimited amount of songs into a MySQL db. It just works.
Windows used to have that "It Just Works" mentality, but they went down the path of "we know better than user, so they can bugger off". The heyday for Microsoft was around Win2k, where once getting drivers set up, just worked. At that time, I thought that Microsoft did it right. I even saw that cleanliness of 2k was almost equal to OSX.
---I don't suppose I can get an unbiased assessment on slashdot, though. Is it really that buggy? More than XP?
Yeah, it is. Their idea of security is to nag the user. I had this problem on a machine for a client. He was used to 2k or XP with 2k interface. When his machine craped out, he went to a Vista box, much to his chagrin. He's a PhD in religious studies so he's damned sharp, but he doesnt do computer maintenance, yet he heard that Vista was bad (not from me). I ended turning those damned security prompts, and trying to configure the machine as it was in 2k. The theming modules that claimed to mimic Win2k didnt do it at all, as it just changed color schemes around. Also, according to him, the machine seems sluggish compared to his 800MHz P3 he had prior. He's also running 2G ram, so there's no reason for that.
The kicker is his machine said it went to unregistered mode (or whatever) when I wasnt around. Annoying as hell, having to deal with Microsoft helpstaff. After dealing with all of this, I'm prepared to recommend Ubuntu for ease of use and Just Working.
As a personal note: I dont have any HD gear for my computers, nor am I currently running Vista. I havent experienced any of the hardware disabling "features" as said that Vista has. I only have a laptop that is capable of running Vista, and Ubuntu is here. I only comment from having to maintain a few Vista machines and the steps I had to take to make them usable.
But Im not trying to get out of "readnotify" gunk. I use pine on my server because I can read it via a 56k modem. I dont need to download big nasties or anything else. All I need is PuTTY or ubuntu's ssh.
All my mails are there on the server for my easy pickings. No stupid stuff, and damned fast.
I use pine on my server all the time. That means I dont do any JS or image loading. How is downloading text from a mailserver going to "autodelete", "report" or other nefarious activities?
If they had my login/pass it'd be a different story, which could be gotten by ANSI injection in mail, but that would require a lot of assumptions, including platform server resides upon. We've seen those hacks before, including ones that echo rm -rf / \cr\lf
And I never understood how that could be considered a logical fallacy.
If somebody lies due to invalid evidence and backs it up, we can show it was the evidence, not the person. If somebody lies because they were paid to do so, we can rest assured that they will most likely do it again. If somebody is a habitual liar, we can be sure they will lie again.
In cases 2 and 3, we need to actively doubt anything said and check with a neutral third party. To do anything but that makes no sense.
Only in journal writing (science journals) do we not need consider the author as we can assume that they are telling the truth because they give enough evidence that we can recreate said journal writing.
Fine. Get approval from your superiors. Be prepared to hang if there's any way to get that data back and the drives are out of your hands.
As long as I work for IT in a company, I advocate keeping the largest and shredding/shooting/detonating the rest. These days, with Sarbanes Oxley and HIPPA in effect, it's not worth the liability.
Everybody who benefits out of Linux is good for us all. In the least, it promotes open standards that everybody can communicate with. In the best, it provides a platform we all can use free, in spirit and in money. We are all richer for it, regardless if somebody uses it to make money.
This is the true spirit of communism: working together for the benefit of all. Who'da figured that a bunch of software geeks would successfully create a utopia where so many others have failed?
---It's not free, you have to pay for all the hard drive space to store your mp3s.
That's no excuse. You have to pay for power, network connection, and hardware to get streaming DRM mp3s. At least I can store them.
---With ubiquitous wireless broadband looming,
Gyhahaha!
---drm allows people to charge you for providing a service, rather then charge you to provide music.
Yeah, pay for the songs again and again. Uh huh. Makes sense.
---I have tens of thousands of mp3's myself, but I can only listen to one at a time (maybe two:). MP3's only work on devices that play mp3's.
I have months of songs (4 months, 3 weeks). I can play them one a time per connection. I have computers in every room serving whatever media I wish for. DRM is incompatible with that. Therefore, I do not consider any products with DRM, as I see them out of the market place.
Also, nearly every audio related device can play MP3's in one media or another (microSD to usb HDD to DVD with mp3s). MP3's are universal, unlike FLAC or OGG, to my dismay.
---Radio's don't work to play anything, just to listen to whatever is already playing.
Bzzt. They decode FM and AM signals:P But that's me, the ham operator speaking.
---And your DRM protected music can be played just fine on any device. Just make a recording of the file being played. They gotta make sound to get it in your ears, so you'll always be able to play it again.
That's not playing DRM files on ANY device. Anybody can hassle through line level recording to get past DRM on audio. I'd rather just dl it from piratebay. And if I do that, why even pay for some temp license?
Destroy them. If they stored what you describe, you do not want proprietary information leaking out. Especially, if you are the one that is in charge of "doing something with said HD's". Safer to destroy them.
Of course, all slashdotters would say either build an array or donate. In reality, the company should keep the biggest for desktop usage and shred the rest.
Safer for you and the company in terms of liability.
Here's the problem: DRM based stuff works only on certain hodgepodge of devices. MP3 works everywhere.
I can download/trade to get MP3's that work anywhere. Even my phone can play mp3s.
Junky DRM service works only when on internet (most likely streamed drm) and only works on ordained players
And 50$ a year sounds ok, but why even the drm? They play those songs on the radio, evidently they arent worth that much. Even the Sat radio guys have unique content.
Perhaps DRM can work as a model in terms of "pain to do what we dont allow", but free is always a solution to these. Whether you agree with that idea, it does exist, and solutions that are >0$ must deal with them one way or another.
People may lie, either intentionally or unintentionally, yet consider the importancy "facts". Questioning a fact that my be false is as good as calling that person a liar, even if they received that fact on a chain email.
It is only good to confront false facts to people that intentionally tell them, and only on situations you can burn bridges.
Other than that, I let most things that people tell me go in 1 ear, out the other.
---The people suggesting that we should just inject noise or background patterns are being ridiculous. Why sacrifice communication quality when there are BETTER ways to fix it? DO IT RIGHT.
Injecting "noise" makes sense for me. Why so?
We use a salt for our hashes, dont we? The "noise" would be the same thing. Consider this: during negotiation, we have chaotic noise formulas in which we propagate the variables so that each side knows the noise transform. We then add the noise after digitalization but before encryption. Then the other side knows the inverse formula, decrypts it, and subtracts the noise.
Given pseudo-random numbers for the chaotic noise formula, it would give different encrypted data for the same exact voice (if we used a mp3 to exactly play something). Effectively, a voice salt.
Slashdot Mirror
---I'm a physicist (working on my PhD), but I've had one nagging question about hawking radiation noone's been able to answer (satisfactorially)
I'm a lowly EE student :) I think I understand though.
---So, the process of hawking radiation can be thought of as a particle/anti-particle pair being created near the event horizon. Suppose that one of them is juusssttt close enough to the event horizon that it falls in and the other one remains outside. We assume that (to conserve total energy) the antiparticle falls in, annihilates a regular particle trapped within the black hole and the regular particle that was just far enough away escapes. From the outside, it appears the black hole is radiating mass.
Not quite. The particle/anti-particle is actually created from the vacuum. Quantum physics allows for virtual particles to exist as a form of catalyst, however that energy debt must be paid no matter what.
Lets say one has a controlled black hole. If one was to watch the event horizon, you would see virtual particles swarming in and around the black hole. If the pair falls in, the net energy is 0. This is the case we dont care about because energy/mass is conserved. The other case is where 1 falls in and the other is ejected into space. In that case, the black hole did "eject" mass, but the energy debt must be paid. Because of that, the black hole must pay to create the pair via its own energy.
We call this effect where the black hole pays energy to create "real" virtual particles Hawking Radiation.
---A) I would think that there would be an equal probability distribution of which particle is closer to the event horizon. However, if that were the case then there would be an equal probability that normal/anti particles would fall in, and that would cause the black holes to not evaporate. We know they do, so I don't know how to rectify that. What makes the antiparticle more likely to be closer to the event horizon?
That's where you are mistaken. Overall energy is lowered when 1/2 of the pair is absorbed by the black hole. Once the black holes lose enough energy (some critical value), they explode violently. What we dont know is what exactly happens in a black hole, nor do we know what form of matter/energy is in there, but we do know that the energy debt must be paid.
---B) Suppose you were able to accrete enough antimatter that you could produce a black hole with it. Virtual particles are created on the outside. In this instance, the normal particles must fall in and the anti-particles must escape to conserve total energy. How does that happen? How can the particles see beyond the event horizon to know that's what's within?
I think you're getting hung up on matter and antimatter. They're all quarks. They all combine somehow with U, D, U-bar and D-bar, and even if they did annihilate and release energy, the energy is still trapped. And since the event horizon seems to be a sort of heisenberg shield, I dont think they need ever "collide".
That's why we're studying them cause traveling 100+ Ly is impossible for us now.
Well said.
Most of us are willing to accept this hateful rhetoric, and there's always a few who do find the answers. Good Job.
DRM isnt the super-breakable trick everyone claims here on slashdot.
One could devise a DRM which procesess all state information within a signed VM. You have multiple exterior checks on the container to guarantee integrity, and once processing the VM, the VM itself checks itself. And if one was to go massively paranoid, a service could be required that satellite service for exterior verification.
Look at this in similar terms of Xen running SElinux with communication via satellite.
Is it crackable? Of course. Will you be found out? Most likely.
Yuo just wait... The next movie player will require a network connection to play videos and music. Blu-ray already uses the VM schematic. All they need is a continuously on connection. All they need is SSH or something similar and the thing'll be damn near unhackable. One would probably have to hook up to the TV lcd chips to record a signal.
And where do you derive the x10 rule from? Rules of marketing from what I understood is to extract a maximum amount of money from as many as you can.
Traditional rules also said that the customer was always right. With recent days, DRM and lack of service says otherwise.
You could do what I did when I was in high school: another modem user had no firewall and had c: shared. I went in and put a text file on his desktop saying he needed a firewall or disable sharing. No names, no identifying information. Just a little 100 byte text file saying how his financial data was all in the open.
Some people only respond after they're scared. I did nothing evil.
It's only restrictive depending if you are a coder vs end user.
If Im an end user, I can install it anywhere, copy it anywhere, give it to my friends without worry, hack it.... The list goes on.
Most of the restrictions only exist to ensure community efforts. After all, you got it for free, so submit your changes you sell for free.
For those that use this as a reason to NOT use the GPL...
What would have happened if they instead used a copy of WinNT4.0 without paying Microsoft? Microsoft would want blood, and would extract it via the BSA.
The creators of Busybox just want you to host the changes you've done to it. They wanted no money.
In other words: What would $proprietary_software_manufacturer do?
Then tell me the answers:
Who is MS's customers?
What is MS's core business plan?
What incentive is there to encourage MS to do well?
Warren Buffet knows the answers. And that's why he strongly recommends to Not Buy MS.
No, E17 is still a resource hog, dont get me wrong. It just isnt a hog when compared to WinVista, or XP.
Xfce does work rather well too. I just prefer K or Gnome. I dont want to futz around when I need to get real work done.
The only problem to run Win2k is on a laptop with Wifi. There's no coherent Wifi subsystem to do what one can do in WinXP. XP's system pales in comparison to Ubuntu though. Nothing can beat iwconfig/ifconfig/iptables combo... except for pf.
If one has a Linux-liked wifi card, switch to Ubuntu. Its worth the trouble.
---I bought XP Pro last year (January 07), and as a "special" got Vista Pro upgrade for "free" (plus $10 shipping and handling), so I went ahead and got it simply because I knew eventually I'd be using it. It's been sitting in my drawer since then.
That's because Vista is the next Windows ME. It's just like that XP MCE. It takes 2 GHz just to run the gui, regardless the tv tuner card and transcoding.
When it comes down to it, Vista runs slow and is anti-user. That's enough a reason for me not to like it.
---So the question is, from what I understand, if you turn off all the extras, Vista is not that bad.
I'm currently running Ubuntu 8.04 on my T61 thinkpad and it runs like a charm. Everything just works, from Wifi to graphics. I didnt have to download a single driver, compile 1 kernel, or do much of anything else. With Ubuntu (and every other linux) you can turn off CPU and power hungry apps. Compiz eating 9w? Turn it off. Dont need those server processes? Shut em down. Need a minimalist desktop? Install Enlightenment.
BTW: I have an Ipod Nano v2 that wouldnt work properly with Windows XP, or should I say with Windows Itunes. I have a library of 100k+ songs and itunes crashes out at around 10k. I looked for a windows program that could categorize my music, and found nothing good. I come on Linux and lo and behold: Amarok. Auto-configures to my ipod, scans an unlimited amount of songs into a MySQL db. It just works.
Windows used to have that "It Just Works" mentality, but they went down the path of "we know better than user, so they can bugger off". The heyday for Microsoft was around Win2k, where once getting drivers set up, just worked. At that time, I thought that Microsoft did it right. I even saw that cleanliness of 2k was almost equal to OSX.
---I don't suppose I can get an unbiased assessment on slashdot, though. Is it really that buggy? More than XP?
Yeah, it is. Their idea of security is to nag the user. I had this problem on a machine for a client. He was used to 2k or XP with 2k interface. When his machine craped out, he went to a Vista box, much to his chagrin. He's a PhD in religious studies so he's damned sharp, but he doesnt do computer maintenance, yet he heard that Vista was bad (not from me). I ended turning those damned security prompts, and trying to configure the machine as it was in 2k. The theming modules that claimed to mimic Win2k didnt do it at all, as it just changed color schemes around. Also, according to him, the machine seems sluggish compared to his 800MHz P3 he had prior. He's also running 2G ram, so there's no reason for that.
The kicker is his machine said it went to unregistered mode (or whatever) when I wasnt around. Annoying as hell, having to deal with Microsoft helpstaff. After dealing with all of this, I'm prepared to recommend Ubuntu for ease of use and Just Working.
As a personal note: I dont have any HD gear for my computers, nor am I currently running Vista. I havent experienced any of the hardware disabling "features" as said that Vista has. I only have a laptop that is capable of running Vista, and Ubuntu is here. I only comment from having to maintain a few Vista machines and the steps I had to take to make them usable.
But Im not trying to get out of "readnotify" gunk. I use pine on my server because I can read it via a 56k modem. I dont need to download big nasties or anything else. All I need is PuTTY or ubuntu's ssh.
All my mails are there on the server for my easy pickings. No stupid stuff, and damned fast.
I use pine on my server all the time. That means I dont do any JS or image loading. How is downloading text from a mailserver going to "autodelete", "report" or other nefarious activities?
If they had my login/pass it'd be a different story, which could be gotten by ANSI injection in mail, but that would require a lot of assumptions, including platform server resides upon. We've seen those hacks before, including ones that echo rm -rf / \cr\lf
Mine runs on hot air!
Just put Cowboy Neal at the exhaust!
booo hyuck. Ill be here all day.
And I never understood how that could be considered a logical fallacy.
If somebody lies due to invalid evidence and backs it up, we can show it was the evidence, not the person.
If somebody lies because they were paid to do so, we can rest assured that they will most likely do it again.
If somebody is a habitual liar, we can be sure they will lie again.
In cases 2 and 3, we need to actively doubt anything said and check with a neutral third party. To do anything but that makes no sense.
Only in journal writing (science journals) do we not need consider the author as we can assume that they are telling the truth because they give enough evidence that we can recreate said journal writing.
Fine. Get approval from your superiors. Be prepared to hang if there's any way to get that data back and the drives are out of your hands.
As long as I work for IT in a company, I advocate keeping the largest and shredding/shooting/detonating the rest. These days, with Sarbanes Oxley and HIPPA in effect, it's not worth the liability.
So?
Everybody who benefits out of Linux is good for us all. In the least, it promotes open standards that everybody can communicate with. In the best, it provides a platform we all can use free, in spirit and in money. We are all richer for it, regardless if somebody uses it to make money.
This is the true spirit of communism: working together for the benefit of all. Who'da figured that a bunch of software geeks would successfully create a utopia where so many others have failed?
---It's not free, you have to pay for all the hard drive space to store your mp3s.
:). MP3's only work on devices that play mp3's.
:P But that's me, the ham operator speaking.
That's no excuse. You have to pay for power, network connection, and hardware to get streaming DRM mp3s. At least I can store them.
---With ubiquitous wireless broadband looming,
Gyhahaha!
---drm allows people to charge you for providing a service, rather then charge you to provide music.
Yeah, pay for the songs again and again. Uh huh. Makes sense.
---I have tens of thousands of mp3's myself, but I can only listen to one at a time (maybe two
I have months of songs (4 months, 3 weeks). I can play them one a time per connection. I have computers in every room serving whatever media I wish for. DRM is incompatible with that. Therefore, I do not consider any products with DRM, as I see them out of the market place.
Also, nearly every audio related device can play MP3's in one media or another (microSD to usb HDD to DVD with mp3s). MP3's are universal, unlike FLAC or OGG, to my dismay.
---Radio's don't work to play anything, just to listen to whatever is already playing.
Bzzt. They decode FM and AM signals
---And your DRM protected music can be played just fine on any device. Just make a recording of the file being played. They gotta make sound to get it in your ears, so you'll always be able to play it again.
That's not playing DRM files on ANY device. Anybody can hassle through line level recording to get past DRM on audio. I'd rather just dl it from piratebay. And if I do that, why even pay for some temp license?
If you had a well paying job in IT, would you risk the liability on "scrubbing the HDD's well"?
I wouldnt.
Destroy them. If they stored what you describe, you do not want proprietary information leaking out. Especially, if you are the one that is in charge of "doing something with said HD's". Safer to destroy them.
Of course, all slashdotters would say either build an array or donate. In reality, the company should keep the biggest for desktop usage and shred the rest.
Safer for you and the company in terms of liability.
Here's the problem: DRM based stuff works only on certain hodgepodge of devices. MP3 works everywhere.
I can download/trade to get MP3's that work anywhere. Even my phone can play mp3s.
Junky DRM service works only when on internet (most likely streamed drm) and only works on ordained players
And 50$ a year sounds ok, but why even the drm? They play those songs on the radio, evidently they arent worth that much. Even the Sat radio guys have unique content.
Perhaps DRM can work as a model in terms of "pain to do what we dont allow", but free is always a solution to these. Whether you agree with that idea, it does exist, and solutions that are >0$ must deal with them one way or another.
Well, to add to that, I follow yet another rule.
People may lie, either intentionally or unintentionally, yet consider the importancy "facts". Questioning a fact that my be false is as good as calling that person a liar, even if they received that fact on a chain email.
It is only good to confront false facts to people that intentionally tell them, and only on situations you can burn bridges.
Other than that, I let most things that people tell me go in 1 ear, out the other.
---The people suggesting that we should just inject noise or background patterns are being ridiculous. Why sacrifice communication quality when there are BETTER ways to fix it? DO IT RIGHT.
Injecting "noise" makes sense for me. Why so?
We use a salt for our hashes, dont we? The "noise" would be the same thing. Consider this: during negotiation, we have chaotic noise formulas in which we propagate the variables so that each side knows the noise transform. We then add the noise after digitalization but before encryption. Then the other side knows the inverse formula, decrypts it, and subtracts the noise.
Given pseudo-random numbers for the chaotic noise formula, it would give different encrypted data for the same exact voice (if we used a mp3 to exactly play something). Effectively, a voice salt.
I dont have a party hat.
All I have is a cloak and a wizard hat.
You DO know that I'm the reason why the admins changed to those damned bubble links, right?
;)
I posted in response to an admin post. Next day, Bubble links. And it's a riot to hear all the whiners about that link