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http://history.howstuffworks.com/world-war-ii/the-atomic-bomb-and-the-surrender-of-japan.htm
The Japanese navy had been destroyed in Leyte Gulf. Japan could no longer import the grain, coal, oil, and vital raw materials needed to sustain its war effort because a large part of its merchant marine had been destroyed and because it was under a tight air and sea blockade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketsu_Go
By August 1945, the Imperial Japanese Navy (IJN) had ceased to be an effective fighting force. The only Japanese major warships in fighting order were six aircraft carriers, four cruisers, and one battleship, none of which could be adequately fueled. They could "sustain a force of twenty operational destroyers and perhaps forty submarines for a few days at sea."[20]

http://www.city-data.com/forum/history/223273-what-would-have-happened-if-we.html
"Japan in turn was preparing for the invasion, Ketsu-Go. They had been preparing since 1944. They actually had no shortage of suicide aircraft, thousand of cheap planes, essentially flying bombs. Their plan was to launch massive kamakaze aircraft attacks (from hidden airstrips) at allied vessels to smash the invasion fleet. They estimated they could attack and damage 800 vessels in one strike. If a landing was achieved, the first one in November was aimed at Kyushu, Japan had some 800,000 soldiers to fight. These aren't woman and children, but hard core fanatical soldiers. Organized divisions, tank brigades. etc. They had already stockpiled supplies and ammo. Beyond the beaches, Japan is rocky and mountainous, a natural defendable fort."

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This was total war. We were already killing civilians. They were killing civilians (and raping them, using them as human batteries/slaves). Both sides were killing without quarter and taking no prisoners.
They didn't understand about fallout (and given chernobyl and the 600ish excess deaths in 60 years - I feel like we grossly overweight fallout risk. Cigarette smoking and driving automobiles during that 1945-2010 have probably produced more deaths than fallout).

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There's a lot more on Ketsu Go here:
http://www.fas.org/irp/eprint/arens/chap4.htm
Note the bit on the Subs.

---

Read the articles. The lives saved were based on calculations from known battles. They were cold bloodedly estimating the casulties per square mile and per day based on what the japanese had already done. The japanese had 15 divisions, in hardened defense positions and pretty much knew exactly where the americans had to land so it was at least as bad as D-day.

"The Battle of Okinawa, the very last pitched battle against Japan, ran up 72,000 casualties in 82 days, of whom 12,510 were killed or missing. (This is conservative, because it excludes several thousand U.S. soldiers who died after the battle indirectly from their wounds.) The entire island of Okinawa is 464 square miles; to take it, therefore, cost the United States 407 soldiers (killed or missing) for every 10 square miles of island.

If the U.S. casualty rate during the invasion of Japan had only been 5 percent as high per square mile as it was at Okinawa, the United States would still have lost 297,000 soldiers (killed or missing)."

I don't really respect our modern politicians and think they are a bunch of lying scumbags. But I do respect those military and political men of world war 2. It was way too serious for the kinds of games we see them playing today.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/attachments/automotive/49602d1253739037-manliest-suv-all-time-now-everyone.gif

What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had too close a resemblance to actual US currency...

Have you ever actually seen a Liberty Dollar? Among other things, they're (a) made of silver, unlike any current US coin; (b) much larger than any current US coin; (c) printed with a different design; (d) labeled with a different motto; (e) have "libertydollar.org" on the back; etc. In short, they are nothing like any current US currency. Here's a picture, in case you don't believe me: Liberty Dollar.

...and were being advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were legal tender.

There was some trouble with individual Liberty Dollars users not specifically stating that they were paying with real money, as opposed to legal tender, but to the best of my knowledge the organization itself never advertised Liberty Dollars as legal tender, and in fact went out of its way to point out the difference and advise its customers not to label it as such. What would be the point, after all, of taking valuable silver coins and passing them off as worthless legal tender?

Perhaps pecause being a lesbian in Los Angeles, CA (pop. 9,862,049) is very different from being a lesbian in Moss Landing, CA (pop. 304)? Not everyone is as broad minded as big city folks.

Or just ignore it, and when you get a tax bill, just pay the damned thing.

This is exactly what they are doing. However, no one is sending them a bill, because they don't know what is being purchased by whom, for the which I am glad. They don't need to know. Unless you are advocating that Amazon should be sending each tax district an itemized list of everything you bought.

Keep in mind, that Amazon might be able to afford to keep up with all of this, but there are lots of people who sell online who can't.

BTW I don't disagree that it happens.. In fact I think this is the core constituency, so to speak, of the Great ObamaCare Bill. Who will benefit? I think it'll be that unsung fastest growing and most profitable segment of the healthcare industry, corporate-owned hospital chains.

I explain my reasoning here:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/11630712-post402.html

Its Denmark. I live here and I see the males completely emasculated - sorry guys but it’s the truth. It’s a feminist society.

For details read:
http://www.rense.com/general79/brave.htm
http://www.city-data.com/forum/world/398666-denmark-sucks-happiest-nation-my-ass.html

Frank Deceased is now friends with: Wormy Maggot.

Frank Deceased Is it dark in here, or is it just me?

Frank Deceased has shared a link: http://www.city-data.com/forum/religion-philosophy/139511-purgatory-fact-fiction.html

Frank Deceased /face melt

Frank Deceased sure is quiet down here

Thanks. Missed that episode. :)

According to this link, median home price didn't even break $120k at the height of the bubble in Springfield Kentucky.

So why are we already spending tons on health care?

Because we don't have a free market in health care.

Higher than the supposedly expensive Canadian healthcare (which is at around 3K a person).

Yet we have Canadians who can afford to to come to the US to get health care, including surgery. Medical care in Canada is rationed.

The reason health, medical, care is so expensive in the US is because we do not have a free market in medicine.

You either accept that those with no insurance will be turn away and left to fend for them selves or you give basic coverage and reduce the paperwork and control the price inflation of health care.

Making the market in medicine freer will drive costs down. Then for those who still can not afford insurance have the policy issuers contribute to a fund that will cover them. A non-profit like Blue Cross and Blue Shield can run the fund. With a million people looking for private insurance policy issuers will be doing what they can to lower premium costs, as well as different types of policies. A family of four or a single person may only want catastrophic coverage but have Health Savings Accounts for ordinary medical expenses while others may want insurance that covers everything.

Falcon

Does Detroit qualify as a city? Not that the GP should move there but I heard the population all moved out to the suburbs and has now dropped from 2 million to less than a million.

You wanted http://www.city-data.com/city/Bozeman-Montana.html

And yes, the housing costs vs income are insane, driven skyward thanks to the unholy symbiosis of realtors and Californians who don't know the price of anything, but have lots of money to burn after selling their $500k shack in the Bay area. Consequently, native Montanans, making fair Montana wages, can no longer afford to buy a home in their own state.

I don't know if this is a very accurate site, but I think I have used it before. Check out the stats on income and house prices... it's insane! City-Data for Montana City

Wrong city. Try Bozeman.

I don't know if this is a very accurate site, but I think I have used it before. Check out the stats on income and house prices... it's insane! City-Data for Montana City

Wrong city. Try Bozeman.

I don't know if this is a very accurate site, but I think I have used it before. Check out the stats on income and house prices... it's insane! City-Data for Montana City

Yes, it certainly is a total piece of crap because it doesn't suit your lifestyle.
Of course, forget about it in the US, except maybe in Oregon.

Then it isn't a lifestyle issue after all.

Or at least not one that can't be shoved aside by a one-liner.

Youngstown, New York is a small village about one mile square in size at the mouth of the Niagara River - historically, a satellite of the river, the lake, and Fort Niagara.

It's business district is and always has been microscopic. In 1900 your grandmother could have walked the whole length of it in under five minutes.

She would have been rightfully wary of the raucous saloon known then and now as The Stone Jug.

A man went to the Jug to do his serious boozing - and bruising.

But there was also a substantial three story brick department store, a drugstore and corner grocery - and that is really the point of this story.

You can't shop for quality in a world like this. You can't shop for variety in a world like this. You can't shop for bulk in world like this. You can't shop for price in a world like this.

You can shop the Sears catalog.

But that isn't the same as listening to the piano or trying on the pair of shoes.

Niagara Falls is a half hour south by the electric line. Downtown Buffalo at least ninety minutes with transfers, if your timing is flawless.

Managing kids and parcels will be hellish.

Imagine that you doing this in February for the authentic upstate experience.

The downtown merchant's home delivery service may be available. But it is not going to be fast and it is not going to be cheap.

Interesting, thanks -- I'll give it a read later (just got in the door and am worn out).

Don't know of any way to send private messages here, but you can go to my homepage and use an email link there.

City-data.com forums have private messages, I'm Reziac there too. I hang out in the Montana forums a lot. Check out the thread about "Why are some people so mad?" Also check out the "Montana to secede" thread in the "Politics and other controversies" segment.

Um... guess have 'em here.. http://www.city-data.com/forum/montana/268463-montana-secede-new-post.html and http://www.city-data.com/forum/montana/44408-why-some-people-so-mad-new-post.html

Interesting, thanks -- I'll give it a read later (just got in the door and am worn out).

Don't know of any way to send private messages here, but you can go to my homepage and use an email link there.

City-data.com forums have private messages, I'm Reziac there too. I hang out in the Montana forums a lot. Check out the thread about "Why are some people so mad?" Also check out the "Montana to secede" thread in the "Politics and other controversies" segment.

Um... guess have 'em here.. http://www.city-data.com/forum/montana/268463-montana-secede-new-post.html and http://www.city-data.com/forum/montana/44408-why-some-people-so-mad-new-post.html

The system that you describe...trial by a jury of your peers, clear rules, people expected to keep their word. It sounds nice, but are you sure that we don't have it already?

Absolutely CERTAIN.
....However, just because I'm sure doesn't mean I'm right.

Allow my to explain my perspective, and lets see if anyone can show me my errors or assumptions.

Your first condition, "trial by a jury of your peers" depends largely on your definition of "peer".
According to Legal definition

"A peer is a person's equal. The U.S. Constitution guarantees criminal defendants a "jury of one's peers," which means an impartial group of citizens from the judicial district (e.g. county) in which the defendant lives."

Let's break this down further.
"A peer is a person's equal": I am a college educated male, between the ages of 25-35. I am fairly well versed in current events, active in the local community, and own my own business.
I think that it's safe to say that my equal would be best defined by these same demographics.
If it was possible, I would prefer to be judged by people with an equivalent intelligence level as well, but lets not get picky.

"an impartial group of citizens from the judicial district (e.g. county) in which the defendant lives": I live in the state capital of Louisiana (southern usa). According to Wikipedia "As of the census of 2000" "The per capita income for the city was $18,512. About 18.0% of families and 24.0% of the population were below the poverty line"
Since 2000, these numbers have worsened, the current poverty rate is above 25% according to the 2007 census. link
Also, better than 20% of our local population never finished high school. Census data
Additionally, I have been called for jury duty, as have many of my friends and associates. As a rule, the people who are educated, intelligent, and successful are removed from the jury pool in the first or second round. I understand that this is anecdotal evidence, but it's fairly common to wind up with a jury of the lowest common denominator. Intelligent, educated people are hard to convince, and hard to manipulate, which makes a lawyers job harder. Unfortunately out legal system doesn't weigh issues on thier own merits, but on the ability of the lawyers to argue instead.

So, what do you think the chances are of my having a jury of my equals?

Your second condition, "clear rules" is easier to define.
Clear rules would mean that the average American could read and understand exactly what was expected of them, the punishments involved, and how the legal system operated, in enough detail as to be able to successfully sue or defend themselves in court.

Or to make things even simpler, simply define the rules in such a way that the average American can at least understand what is going on in court, and participate in their own defense.

According to many different research groups, the US has a deplorable literacy rate. I'm not going to write a full analysis here, but there is a fairly good one Here
To summarize, 50% of our population reads at less than a 7th grade level.
So, what in the world makes people think that the average American can read, parse, and cross reference 1000's of obscure words, hundreds of referenced precedents, and actually understand it?

As for your last requirement, "people expected to keep their word" this is subjective, and the parent was referring to people with "integrity" not just honesty.
Unfortu

There's a lot more "sedition" on City-data forums... check out http://www.city-data.com/forum/politics-other-controversies/264003-montana-talks-leaving-union-over-gun.html

"After a little while, of course, you'll pay an additional fee if you *don't* take this feature."

In most states, insurance is a competitive, open industry, so no one can get away with raising prices without good reason (I had about eight choices when I signed up for insurance in California). I think what you mean to say is once enough car owners opt-in, those who refuse to opt-in still won't receive the now-standard discount. Logic dictates that safety devices, which ultimately should decrease the payouts from insurance companies, would only lower mean insurance costs.

"how come everyone's auto insurance keeps going up, *never* down."

Actually, car insurance costs had been, before this year, decreasing for some time (e.g., in 2007: http://www.city-data.com/forum/florida/161382-auto-insurance-costs.html) due to lowered payouts. I believe prices increased in 2008 - I'm not sure why.

And in Denver 85 is common. The high altitude reduces knocking. Here's an interesting post about octane, power, air density, etc:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/denver/249519-85-octane-gas-post2724050.html#post2724050

Well let's see. Here is the former board of AIG. This is going to be a quick Google of each one, and may not be correct or comprehensive.

M. Bernard Aidinoff: Democrat

Pei-yuan Chia: Democrat

Marshall A. Cohen: Can't tell. He appears to be Canadian, maybe he's not active here politically.

William S. Cohen: Democrat (2 out of 3 to Dems, also was Clinton's Sec of Defense)

Martin S. Feldstein: Republican

Ellen V. Futter: couldn't find any evidence.

Stephen L. Hammerman: Democrat (mixes it up some, likes Rudy as he was NYC police commissioner, but mostly Dems)

Carla A. Hills: mixed

Richard C Holbrooke: Democrat

Fred H. Langhammer: Republican (actually this is pretty mixed, but recently leans Republican)

George L. Miles, Jr: Republican

Morris W. Offit: Democrat

Martin J. Sullivan: Democrat

Michael H. Sutton: Democrat

Edmund S. W. Tse: Can't tell. Also not originally American.

Robert B. Willumstad: Can't tell.

Frank G. Zarb: Democrat

I believe that's 9 Democrats, 3 Republicans, and 5 unknown. I don't have time to do WaMu at the moment, but you're welcome to.

Well let's see. Here is the former board of AIG. This is going to be a quick Google of each one, and may not be correct or comprehensive.

M. Bernard Aidinoff: Democrat

Pei-yuan Chia: Democrat

Marshall A. Cohen: Can't tell. He appears to be Canadian, maybe he's not active here politically.

William S. Cohen: Democrat (2 out of 3 to Dems, also was Clinton's Sec of Defense)

Martin S. Feldstein: Republican

Ellen V. Futter: couldn't find any evidence.

Stephen L. Hammerman: Democrat (mixes it up some, likes Rudy as he was NYC police commissioner, but mostly Dems)

Carla A. Hills: mixed

Richard C Holbrooke: Democrat

Fred H. Langhammer: Republican (actually this is pretty mixed, but recently leans Republican)

George L. Miles, Jr: Republican

Morris W. Offit: Democrat

Martin J. Sullivan: Democrat

Michael H. Sutton: Democrat

Edmund S. W. Tse: Can't tell. Also not originally American.

Robert B. Willumstad: Can't tell.

Frank G. Zarb: Democrat

I believe that's 9 Democrats, 3 Republicans, and 5 unknown. I don't have time to do WaMu at the moment, but you're welcome to.

Well let's see. Here is the former board of AIG. This is going to be a quick Google of each one, and may not be correct or comprehensive.

M. Bernard Aidinoff: Democrat

Pei-yuan Chia: Democrat

Marshall A. Cohen: Can't tell. He appears to be Canadian, maybe he's not active here politically.

William S. Cohen: Democrat (2 out of 3 to Dems, also was Clinton's Sec of Defense)

Martin S. Feldstein: Republican

Ellen V. Futter: couldn't find any evidence.

Stephen L. Hammerman: Democrat (mixes it up some, likes Rudy as he was NYC police commissioner, but mostly Dems)

Carla A. Hills: mixed

Richard C Holbrooke: Democrat

Fred H. Langhammer: Republican (actually this is pretty mixed, but recently leans Republican)

George L. Miles, Jr: Republican

Morris W. Offit: Democrat

Martin J. Sullivan: Democrat

Michael H. Sutton: Democrat

Edmund S. W. Tse: Can't tell. Also not originally American.

Robert B. Willumstad: Can't tell.

Frank G. Zarb: Democrat

I believe that's 9 Democrats, 3 Republicans, and 5 unknown. I don't have time to do WaMu at the moment, but you're welcome to.

Well let's see. Here is the former board of AIG. This is going to be a quick Google of each one, and may not be correct or comprehensive.

M. Bernard Aidinoff: Democrat

Pei-yuan Chia: Democrat

Marshall A. Cohen: Can't tell. He appears to be Canadian, maybe he's not active here politically.

William S. Cohen: Democrat (2 out of 3 to Dems, also was Clinton's Sec of Defense)

Martin S. Feldstein: Republican

Ellen V. Futter: couldn't find any evidence.

Stephen L. Hammerman: Democrat (mixes it up some, likes Rudy as he was NYC police commissioner, but mostly Dems)

Carla A. Hills: mixed

Richard C Holbrooke: Democrat

Fred H. Langhammer: Republican (actually this is pretty mixed, but recently leans Republican)

George L. Miles, Jr: Republican

Morris W. Offit: Democrat

Martin J. Sullivan: Democrat

Michael H. Sutton: Democrat

Edmund S. W. Tse: Can't tell. Also not originally American.

Robert B. Willumstad: Can't tell.

Frank G. Zarb: Democrat

I believe that's 9 Democrats, 3 Republicans, and 5 unknown. I don't have time to do WaMu at the moment, but you're welcome to.

Well let's see. Here is the former board of AIG. This is going to be a quick Google of each one, and may not be correct or comprehensive.

M. Bernard Aidinoff: Democrat

Pei-yuan Chia: Democrat

Marshall A. Cohen: Can't tell. He appears to be Canadian, maybe he's not active here politically.

William S. Cohen: Democrat (2 out of 3 to Dems, also was Clinton's Sec of Defense)

Martin S. Feldstein: Republican

Ellen V. Futter: couldn't find any evidence.

Stephen L. Hammerman: Democrat (mixes it up some, likes Rudy as he was NYC police commissioner, but mostly Dems)

Carla A. Hills: mixed

Richard C Holbrooke: Democrat

Fred H. Langhammer: Republican (actually this is pretty mixed, but recently leans Republican)

George L. Miles, Jr: Republican

Morris W. Offit: Democrat

Martin J. Sullivan: Democrat

Michael H. Sutton: Democrat

Edmund S. W. Tse: Can't tell. Also not originally American.

Robert B. Willumstad: Can't tell.

Frank G. Zarb: Democrat

I believe that's 9 Democrats, 3 Republicans, and 5 unknown. I don't have time to do WaMu at the moment, but you're welcome to.

I've wondered about that too. How does someone with $3000/month income get into a $3000/month mortgage?? Oh, adjustable rates. THIS year it's just $1000. NEXT year, it'll be $3000. You'll get a raise by then, won't you??

From your previous post, "We stopped seeing homes as a place to live, and starting seeing them as a way to make a quick buck by "flipping" them after some minor improvements."

No shit. And the upshot is that now ordinary people on ordinary wages can no longer afford to buy an ordinary house, and often can't afford to RENT it either.

Check out these threads for how it affects real people in real life:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/montana/44408-why-some-people-so-mad.html

This is the same mentality as everywhere tho -- CEOs are doing the same thing with business. Get in, "improve" the bottom line, grab that golden parachute, get out before the "improvements" collapse the business; take your very selective resume to the next company, rinse and repeat. It's just flipping for businesses.

No one seems content with steady and stable anymore. Gotta have "growth" or they're not happy.

I have to agree. Believe it or not, Comcast is the BEST of the BEST where I live (and believe me, I've looked long and hard). The DSL (Qwest) SUCKS. Hard. I was paying the same price for 2 Mbps down/384 Kbps up with Qwest as I am for 8 Mbps down/640 kbps up (and I'm getting those speeds, too). And Qwest and Comcast are the ONLY options as far as consumer-priced broadband is concerned.

If FIOS were available, I'd be there, posthaste. But it isn't, and apparently won't be for quite some time (something about Qwest being the ILEC in the area and Verizon having no plans for service in Colorado - of which, of course, I can't seem to find any recent references to using Google).

I guess the Magic Lantern article wasn't enough for you then?

How to legally spy on your employees and Spy cover up

Major employers such as Delta Air Lines and Google have fired employees for what they put on their own blogs. Ellen Simonetti, a Delta flight attendant, says she was fired in October 2004 after she posted pictures of herself in her uniform in suggestive poses on her blog.

"Employees should know that your employer is looking over your shoulder. If they catch you, they're canning you," says Nancy Flynn, executive director of The ePolicy Institute and author of Blog Rules. "You can be fired for anything, even for blogging right at home in your jammies."

Spy software can be used at work or at home to spy on employees and is marketed as so and Boeing used it like that.

Good grief. Apart from suggesting that WaHo is a good experience, I couldn't find one thing positive in any of your posts on this subject. Odd that you would mention them in a post about how unhealthy the State of Georgia is, but I'll just disregard that part - WaHo is a guilty sin. At any rate, I'm sorry your time here was so awful.

I've lived in a number of different cities through the years (Denver, Syracuse, St.Louis, LA, ...) Outside of New York City, I've never found a domestic public transit system that took me to even half the places I wanted to go. For that matter, as good as BART is, I don't think they're much better than MARTA. Certainly one of Atlanta's problems, as you pointed out, is sprawl. A lot of people (not just white) during the 80s and early 90s decided suburbanite living was the way to go. Even with that exodus, we've also seen the population of the metro area grow from 2.9M in 1990, to 5.2M in 2007. It's hard for any city to absorb that kind of growth without major infrastructure overhauls. Some overhauls are still taking place, and some of them look pretty darned cool.

I love living here. It's as good as anywhere else I've lived, and more often than not, better. (Well, Denver would have to be excluded from that list, but how can you compete with *that*?) Yeah, there are some pretty stupid laws on the books, and we could use a new Governer, but these are things that can be changed. Had you stayed, you could have helped...

I'll think of you the next time I'm out on the AT. ;)

I live in Va, on the south side of the river. What the post and tfa fail to mention is that the area where his congregation are is a heavy drug crime related area.
search Wickham Ave

Some more interesting data, the average income in this area is less than half the states average income. Income and home value tables

With numbers like these the problem is not video games or violent music, the true problem is socio-economical.

which is slightly bigger than New Jersey

He would describe a math proof by how many cans of beer he drank before finishing the proof. (no kidding).

I had a final exam in a sculpture class which consisted of all of us drinking beer. The pile of empties when we were done was art. Because we said so!

Note that the linked wikipedia article has a shitload of statues (some of them actually great works of art, like the naked man with the small penis that gay guy Michelangelo di Lodovico Buonarroti Simoni carved) but very little sculpture as is done today.

But I digress, sorry, I'm bad about that.

-mcgrew

and he told me that a massive transmission cable went down by aligator alley

The real story is that a bunch of electrons were pulled-over by a cop in Waldo for going c in a 25mph zone.
http://www.city-data.com/forum/florida/5365-moved-waldo-florida-speed-trap.html

I realize I live in a nanny state that attempts to dictate everything we do while appearing to be liberal

Yea, I live in Minneapolis. That's something that bothered me when I moved here, that it was a Blue State and no alcohol was allowed to be sold on Sundays. Where I moved from it was left up to the local governments, the city I lived outside of banned alcohol sells on Sundays but the county allowed it.

1. $100/mo buys a LOT of electricity and heat for someone living in a small apartment or basement suite. So we're not talking about someone living in a cold, unlit cave.

Let's get some datapoints with a google search.

http://www.homeabc.net/Other/2550-3-other.html
http://www.city-data.com/forum/dallas/116643-average-electricity-bill-3bdrm-apartment.html
http://message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=23384
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C0CE1DC153EF932A05756C0A966958260
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/sub/524170732.html

Arlington, 3bdrm: Multiple people saying >$200/mo
Vegas: 2bdrm, $150/mo
2bdrm house, location unknown, $60/mo
Florida 2bdrm apt, 17 years ago: $60/mo. Adjusting for inflation, $100/mo
2bdrm apt, location unknown, $150-$200/mo
2bdrm, location unknown: $80/mo
2bdrm, location unknown: $75-$90/mo
2bdrm, NC, using central air (more efficient): $60/mo
Boston, Unknown size: $40/mo
Irving, TX, 2bdrm: $300-$450/mo (poorly insulated and sealed)
"Average NYC apartment": $40/mo
Boston: $55/mo

Summary: Insulation is more important to size, and the further south you live (to an extent) in the US, the worse your bill will be because you tend to be relying on inefficient (but cheap) window units and are dealing with a lot of summer heat. Let's pretend that this covers electricity *and* gas, not just electricity. Looks like the average is around $50/mo up north and perhaps $180/mo down south. Crummy housing with low rent tends to be smaller but also less well insulated and sealed, so let's stick with these numbers.

Let's do the same for water:

http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-5812161/Unclog-your-plumbing-budget-the.html
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C0CE3D71130F932A35754C0A966958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all
http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2004/JosephSabatelle.shtml

One says the average is 80-150 gal/day, the other says 220 gal/day. Looks like water's typically around 2 tenths of a penny per liter. Going with an average 150gal/day at that price, that's $1.20/day, or $36/mo. Let's say only $40 with sewage added in.

Overall summary: A person in a hellhole up north wouldn't have to skimp. A person in a hellhole down south would be way overbudget and have to skimp like crazy.

2. People making minimum wage rarely buy healthcare, especially if they're healthy, as is being assumed here. If they become seriously ill, they're just fucked. It's sad, but true.

Thank you for making my point for me as to why so many of the poor don't own cars. It can be a choice between your health and transportation.

3. Furniture, TVs, etc, can all be acquired at no cost for anyone who actually knows other people.

Great plan. Because the poor are famous for giving away furniture, right? Lots of free furniture opportunities in Compton, right? The poor spend all their time hobknobbing, right?

Yes, you can get free furniture. But it's an unreliable source. The poor make do with whatever they can get. If "whatever they can get" is nothing, then they make do with nothing. If "whatever they can get" is falling apart, then they make use of that, too. One insidious problem is that the less money you have, the more you need. For example, if you'

There are, however other religious nuts who insist on ignoring both science and the pope.

Don't leave a job unfinished - two down but many more to go!

Yeah... misconceptions are hard to overcome. Besides, aren't there a lot of smart people in Huntsville, AL? Something about NASA...

Here is a link to the distribution of income in Batavia town. Your suggestion that it's a hoity-toity area is probably spot on.

"North Dakota, which is populated nearly exclusively by Viking stock"

Nah... In North Dakota, the Vikings lose to the Germans (30% to 44%).

http://www.city-data.com/states/North-Dakota-Ethni c-groups.html

Unlike Minnesota where the Vikings lose to.. Well, everyone. :)

Richmond is statistically the second most dangerous city in California, surpassing Oakland in 2004, and was named the 8th most dangerous city in the country. For every 100,000 people there were 38.3 murders, 50.4 rapes, 485.8 robberies, 512 assaults, 1110.7 burglaries, 3497.4 counts or larceny and 2471.4 thefts of vehicles. Richmond had 40 murders in 2006. The record of 62 homicides occurred in 1991.

Research suggests the county population is quite well off as compared to other counties. http://www.city-data.com/county/Contra_Costa_Count y-CA.html

At what point does this cross over from "poor school district" to clever constituents trying to get out of a deal?

I doubt this would happen in, say, compton CA.http://www.city-data.com/city/Compton-Californi a.html

Thankfully My Hicksville is more Urban with a population of more than 40k+
http://www.city-data.com/city/Hicksville-New-York. html

Forgive my lack of American knowledge but would there not be someone somewhere who knows what these ZIP+5 codes correspond to?

I'm sorry, I'm trying to understand your question here.

Did you mean a website that provides zip code information and statistics such as what's 90210 like?

Or did you mean a site that explained what a zip code+4 is?

I'm genuinely asking, not being a smart ass. The links are provided to answer the question if that's actually what you meant.

Forgive my lack of American knowledge but would there not be someone somewhere who knows what these ZIP+5 codes correspond to?

I'm sorry, I'm trying to understand your question here.

Did you mean a website that provides zip code information and statistics such as what's 90210 like?

Or did you mean a site that explained what a zip code+4 is?

I'm genuinely asking, not being a smart ass. The links are provided to answer the question if that's actually what you meant.

well, gotta say, Las Cruces could really use the jobs (Median household income in 2005: $29,363, Percentage of residents living in poverty in 2005: 27.5%) , but not sure how many have the technical chops to swing a decent job there...potential local labor force is largely unskilled - although it is near White Sand Missle Range, Los Alamos, and NMSU-Las Cruces. Could pick worse locations.

http://www.city-data.com/county/Dona_Ana_County-NM .html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Las-Cruces-New-Mexic o.html

well, gotta say, Las Cruces could really use the jobs (Median household income in 2005: $29,363, Percentage of residents living in poverty in 2005: 27.5%) , but not sure how many have the technical chops to swing a decent job there...potential local labor force is largely unskilled - although it is near White Sand Missle Range, Los Alamos, and NMSU-Las Cruces. Could pick worse locations.

http://www.city-data.com/county/Dona_Ana_County-NM .html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Las-Cruces-New-Mexic o.html