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hoary_0.9.90b1-powerpc.iso runs ok on my g4 pb, but at 640x480 instead of the native 1024x768

Its by far the best live linux ppc cd I've tried (which are most (if not all) of them)

afaik you cant install from here, but i havent looked properly.

The diskless setup was fairly easy using Debian: Debian Diskless. However, the actual kernel configuration was initially a pain as I used 2.6.9 vanilla kernel w/ LIRC backported manually and IVTV drivers manually compiled for the PVR-250. What I'd suggest is to do a minimal local setup first using something like Fedora Core 3 as it should support the hardware out-of-the-box and MythTV is available from ATrpms. Then copy the working installation over to a NFS share, configure dhcpd on the server to support PXE, copy the kernel and possible initrd images to the tftpboot directory and that's about it. Please note that nfsroot support must be compiled into the client kernel and the NIC of the client must support PXE booting. That is something missing from cheap motherboards.

Anaconda must be viable. Could the next version use it?

The only thing that confuses me at current is why my Firefox is only avaiable up to version 0.9.3, even in 'testing'...

The latest version is in Debian Experimental. It is possible to install it. I don't know what is holding it up from releasing into Unstable, but there are two things I can think of: Debian takes great care to do the right thing with cross-platform and international versions, and Debian takes great care with the packaging. If 0.10 made changes that affected the localisation, or if 0.10 made changes that affected the Firefox plugins, that could cause problems that would keep the package in Experimental. (Debian actually packages the plugins for Firefox! If Firefox breaks the plugin spec, and old plugins won't work, Debian won't update Firefox until they get new versions of all the plugins; when you do finally get an update to Firefox, all your plugins will automatically update, which is nice.)

There is some black magic you can invoke to get Experimental packages; it is explained here. (That page is about GNOME 2.8, which is in Experimental right now, but the same trick would work for Firefox.) Or you could go here and download the package, and use "dpkg -i" to manually install just that package.

Note that if you just use x86 or PowerPC, you can install Ubuntu Linux, and Ubuntu has packaged 0.10 so you will get it. It also has GNOME 2.8, Evolution 2.0, and just generally cutting-edge software. Ubuntu is planning a 6-month upgrade cycle, so they should be on top of new software as it comes out. Ubuntu is built on top of Debian, so all the basic Debian goodness is there. I'm using Ubuntu and I love it.

steveha

The debian amd64 port is still fairly experimental, but it works. It builds off the official i386 packages (almost) as often as the official packages do so there's no problem with being behind. The only thing is that a handfull of packages don't compile properly for amd64 so they're waiting for someone to patch them. As far as 32-bit applications, you have a bit of compatibility using the ia32-libs package, but it really doesn't work all that well.

So if you like debian, want the bleeding edge and don't mind a few quirks and lack of 32-bit application support (like I do) go for it. Otherwise just use normal i386 Debian or another AMD64 port.

Links: file repository, docs, wiki, and mailing list.

Free as in "FREE GAY SEX"

There's a new DEBINA-forum, which awaits your trolling: forums.debian.net

When are they getting with the times and making a decent graphical installer?

From http://wiki.debian.net/?DebianInstallerFAQ :

Question 5: Is the DebianInstaller going to be graphical in nature? / Is there any prebuilt/downloadable graphical DebianInstaller?

Answer: The DebianInstaller will not be graphical by nature, but modularity is a key in its design. It would allow the use of different kinds of frontends, including those of a graphical nature.

There is a project underway to create a GTK frontend to the installer. For more information on the current status of this frontend see here. Unfortunately the project hasn't seen much activity lately.

When are they getting with the times and making a decent graphical installer?

From http://wiki.debian.net/?DebianInstallerFAQ :

Question 5: Is the DebianInstaller going to be graphical in nature? / Is there any prebuilt/downloadable graphical DebianInstaller?

Answer: The DebianInstaller will not be graphical by nature, but modularity is a key in its design. It would allow the use of different kinds of frontends, including those of a graphical nature.

There is a project underway to create a GTK frontend to the installer. For more information on the current status of this frontend see here. Unfortunately the project hasn't seen much activity lately.

When are they getting with the times and making a decent graphical installer?

From http://wiki.debian.net/?DebianInstallerFAQ :

Question 5: Is the DebianInstaller going to be graphical in nature? / Is there any prebuilt/downloadable graphical DebianInstaller?

Answer: The DebianInstaller will not be graphical by nature, but modularity is a key in its design. It would allow the use of different kinds of frontends, including those of a graphical nature.

There is a project underway to create a GTK frontend to the installer. For more information on the current status of this frontend see here. Unfortunately the project hasn't seen much activity lately.

When are they getting with the times and making a decent graphical installer?

From http://wiki.debian.net/?DebianInstallerFAQ :

Question 5: Is the DebianInstaller going to be graphical in nature? / Is there any prebuilt/downloadable graphical DebianInstaller?

Answer: The DebianInstaller will not be graphical by nature, but modularity is a key in its design. It would allow the use of different kinds of frontends, including those of a graphical nature.

There is a project underway to create a GTK frontend to the installer. For more information on the current status of this frontend see here. Unfortunately the project hasn't seen much activity lately.

"Apt-Secure" has a nice sense of "which package sources are trusted". That means, APT maintains a list of places to get packages from. Some of these sources are trusted, and their packages can be cryptographically verified to be truly from those sources.

If there's a new version of a package from an "untrusted" source, it'll ask you if you're sure you want to upgrade that package.

I think it's silly to have package go and upgrade themselves, especially where each package has it's own way to perform the upgrade, and you have to trust each vendor's security implementation (instead of a single central one). A bunch of packages running off and upgrading themselves, each with its own security model (if any) is a great way to open yourself up to a man-in-the-middle attack several times a day. The OS should handle this in a consistent, secure way that the administrator can understand.

peace,

isaac

http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanb/documents/quotingguide. html
http://dui.debian.net/dui/TopPosting
http://www.caliburn.nl/topposting.html

One of the most irritating things for me is when somebody asks me a question and quotes my e-mail, which contains the answer. The original message is always at the bottom, which indicates that the topposter didn't read it.

There have been some interesting developments though over the past few months.

I keep a livejournal which I post to, but to be honest thats mostly to organize social stuff - as a lot of people in the same area to me have accounts and we can use it for all kinds of things that you could use email/phones for.

Sure sometimes I post code snippets and things, but 95% of the readership are people in the same city as me, who aren't computery types at all.

One of the more interesting developments recently has been the creation of "Planets", aggregated blogs from multiple people all involved in one thing.

So, for example, I find Debian Planet very useful - as it allows me to learn about the real lives of Debian developers in a way that you just don't see from reading mailing list posts.

To see the blogs of those involved and commenting, go here.
See Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho and Joey Hess in particular. Anthony Towns (the Release Manager in question) has also blogged on the issue.

I'll stick with planet.debian.net. The people aggregated there have to deal with the the public and software at the same time. There's people working on the installer, the GUI people, and an embedded guy. Every one of these people actually maintains software for the Debian project, not just someone who's paid to be a "Technical Evangelist."

Debian-Junior
Debian-Med
Debian-Edu
DeMuDi
Debian-Desktop
Debian-Lex
Debian-NP
Debian-Accessibility

Debian-Junior
Debian-Med
Debian-Edu
DeMuDi
Debian-Desktop
Debian-Lex
Debian-NP
Debian-Accessibility

I think that the idea of a Perpetual Gift Computer System would also be an expression of this new paradigm.
The Simputer is designed for community ownership and would be an ideal candidate for becoming a PerpetualGift.

I posted just after you in this thread on the same subject. We both posted at 2004.03.30 7:32. How's that for synchronicity?

Ah, synchronicity..

I just started a discussion on the DebianWiki about the legal and technical implementation of making a computer system into a perpetual gift. That would be a more personal and specific way of making hardware free for the user, although not for the first owner of the system.

IANAL so I need help on wording the legal contract. For you lawyers, paralegals and armchair philosophers out there; If you feel like doing some constructive legal work for the Debian project I welcome your advice. I think this idea has a lot of potential not only for a gift between friends but as a way of donating computer systems to charity and ensuring that they will remain gifts after they are no longer useful to the recipient organization.

This brings to mind the vision of an admin staying up late and GPG signing the contracts for a one kilobox donation. *shudder*

PerpetualGift

1. Running network programs under a separate user account does not absolve you of the need to make backups.

4, 5. Yes, I trust Debian. I have been running the experimental branch of Apt, which checks cryptographically signed binaries (signed together as a "Release"), for months now--see this announcement and the explanation for more details.

Once KDE 3.1.5 makes it into testing, 3.2 will go into unstable. See KDE 3.1.5/3.2 Status Update - 20040219 and Information about Debian KDE packages

I've been using unofficial KDE 3.2 CVS debs for about 4 months. I'm loving it. For all those who are wondering about Debian/KDE, 3.2.0 will enter unstable when 3.1.5 enters testing. First, however, 3.2.0 will be in experimental. If you can't wait, however, fear not. At the Debian/KDE FAQ there are instructions to get KDE 3.2 whether you be on stable, unstable or (for some fool reason) testing. It only involves adding one or two APT sources and dist-upgrading. If you run into problems, come to #debian-kde on irc.freenode.net and ask around. The folks there are really helpful.

Excellent article. Please also take a peek at the Skolelinux project, aka. DebianEdu

Help test apt-secure.

I would suggest following the instructions on the debian/kde wiki for installing 3.1.X on Sid -- you have to install one package manually and then the rest go like clockwork.

apt-secure uses strong cryptographic methods to verify the authenticity of packages in the archive. It may be the default apt-get for sarge, depending on man-power issues.

There's not much of the server side implemented yet -- only a dummy server that answers all search requests with "nothing found", but the protocol decoding etc. is all there.

Bay Area Debian is having a shotgun meeting in Berkeley tonight. I'll be bringing Debian-swirl-iced sugar cookies, and hopefully some folks from the Sacramento area. ;^)

-bill!

Debian has been running a sub-project called DebianEdu for some time now. You can read up on the project at the above link or from the mailing lists.

The Debian Desktop's project wiki has more details about the project's goals and proposals. It sounds like they are following some of the Red Hat 8.0 lead and trying to create a more unified, task-based system. Their proposals are more than just a new GUI.

It's not a replacement for either X as a windowing system or Gnome/KDE as desktop environments. It's more of a bringing together of what is available to a tighter binding so that a user can say "I want x type of desktop" (say, developer or a user) and Debian will create such an environment.
Additionally, any environment which wishes to be included as a DebianDesktop must meet a minimum set of requirements.

Locations which explain it fair better than I probably have are:
DebianDesktop
Debian Desktop Wiki
Debian Desktop Project Goals
Debian Desktop Tenets

It's not a replacement for either X as a windowing system or Gnome/KDE as desktop environments. It's more of a bringing together of what is available to a tighter binding so that a user can say "I want x type of desktop" (say, developer or a user) and Debian will create such an environment.
Additionally, any environment which wishes to be included as a DebianDesktop must meet a minimum set of requirements.

Locations which explain it fair better than I probably have are:
DebianDesktop
Debian Desktop Wiki
Debian Desktop Project Goals
Debian Desktop Tenets

It's not a replacement for either X as a windowing system or Gnome/KDE as desktop environments. It's more of a bringing together of what is available to a tighter binding so that a user can say "I want x type of desktop" (say, developer or a user) and Debian will create such an environment.
Additionally, any environment which wishes to be included as a DebianDesktop must meet a minimum set of requirements.

Locations which explain it fair better than I probably have are:
DebianDesktop
Debian Desktop Wiki
Debian Desktop Project Goals
Debian Desktop Tenets

It's not a replacement for either X as a windowing system or Gnome/KDE as desktop environments. It's more of a bringing together of what is available to a tighter binding so that a user can say "I want x type of desktop" (say, developer or a user) and Debian will create such an environment.
Additionally, any environment which wishes to be included as a DebianDesktop must meet a minimum set of requirements.

Locations which explain it fair better than I probably have are:
DebianDesktop
Debian Desktop Wiki
Debian Desktop Project Goals
Debian Desktop Tenets

TeXmacs!=Emacs. In TeXmacs, WYSIWYG. I just thought I'd mention that, although I must admit my original post was a bit stupid (i.e. 8-year-olds don't yet need the features of LaTeX). Thus, in an attempt to vindicate myself, I'll mention the DebianEdu and Debian Jr. projects. Even if the original poster didn't intend to use Debian, these projects could provide ideas of what to include.

Wouldn't it be simpler to accomplish the same
thing with task packages? Why a whole seperate distro? I mean the base system would be the same, only difference should be the additional packages installed. Seems pretty silly to me.

From a package managing perspective, the sub-projects of Debian are just that - tasks or meta-packages selection a subset of the packages already in the distrobution.

However, from an application point of view, a sub-project tends to involve some commitment to package various software appropiate for the sub-project.

Hence, DebianEdu isn't really a new distribution - as a project it's a commitment to provide applications useful for education, as well as provide educational institutions with easy installation of those applications. So the users that install Debian GNU/{Linux,Hurd,{Net,Free}BSD} will often also install a lot of packages from DebianEdu without really realising it.

Also note, that there's a great deal of intrest from all the developers in Debian to make the release cycle a lot shorter. The problem is, that Debian believes that stable means just that: rock-solid-will-not-crash-in-a-million-years, while other distros seems to think that stable means: oh-chrashes-from-time-to-time-but-it's-still-bette r-than-the -OS-that-shall-remain-nameless. In that respect, Pogeny Debian GNU/Linux was a Good Thing(tm) and to bad it didn't last. However, you can always run testing or even unstable if you really need to and have a proper internet connection (for all those cutting-edge updates).

Stability is a good thing for industry (just consider how many have actually switch from Windoze2K to WindozeXP, and similar MacOS9 to MacOSX), and I'm glad to see at least one GNU/Linux distro understanding that.

The problem is, as I see it, that most GNU/Linux users are still hackers/nerds/geeks/<fill-in-your-favorite-nicknam e> and those boys and girls want the cutting-edge stuff: 'What! Only GCC 3.1.4? But GCC 3.1.4epsilon is already out as of one haour ago! I want it now!'; However, most users do not care if they have the latest (and greatest?) Abiword or KOffice installation. They want something that Just Works(tm).

Please note that I'm a Debian GNU/{Linux,Hurd} user - not a Debian Developer (though I intent to become one soon). Hence the above is not necessarily how the Debian people see it - it's my understanding of the situation. I.e., entirely my own opinion.

Me & my gf got two chihuahuas called Nano and Pico (think metric, not editors). They fit nicely on a keyboard.

See some MPEG mevies or JPEGs.

(I can't believe I'm voluntarily subjecting that server to the slashdot effect..)

--Tv

Me & my gf got two chihuahuas called Nano and Pico (think metric, not editors). They fit nicely on a keyboard.

See some MPEG mevies or JPEGs.

(I can't believe I'm voluntarily subjecting that server to the slashdot effect..)

--Tv

Me & my gf got two chihuahuas called Nano and Pico (think metric, not editors). They fit nicely on a keyboard.

See some MPEG mevies or JPEGs.

(I can't believe I'm voluntarily subjecting that server to the slashdot effect..)

--Tv

Me & my gf got two chihuahuas called Nano and Pico (think metric, not editors). They fit nicely on a keyboard.

See some MPEG mevies or JPEGs.

(I can't believe I'm voluntarily subjecting that server to the slashdot effect..)

--Tv

Indeed. A release-critical bug is a bug that makes the _package_ unfit for release, which doesn't imply a release can't be made.

There are several resources providing details on current release critical bugs, in the base and standard packages, as well as Wichert's overview.

Indeed. A release-critical bug is a bug that makes the _package_ unfit for release, which doesn't imply a release can't be made.

There are several resources providing details on current release critical bugs, in the base and standard packages, as well as Wichert's overview.

Hmm... you're right. :)

I am running Potato, and the KDE off of kde.debian.net... and I assumed it was the latest one ('cause it says 2.x on their web page).

I never bothered to check what version I had (I don't actually run it; I just use kword and konqueror).

I've lost my entire debian system twice due to using the unstable version.

By upgrading to the latest unstable software on a daily basis, my system was completely trashed.

First it was a glibc problem (I don't remember what), then it was an overwritten file that caused me to not be able to log in. I had to re-install the whole system, and I've used Debian Stable ever since.

There are some ways you can make Debian Stable a lot more modern than you might think...

kde.debian.net gives you the latest KDE...

Ximian offers the latest gnome for Debian potato (stable)...

and gnulpr offers a printing system (easily set up) that can be installed through apt with debian stable.

Yes, there is! (Ignore all the people who say there isn't... it's extremely easy to do.)

Check out KDE.DEBIAN.NET. They have apt lines for Potato (stable) for the latest KDE release.

This is Andrew "Netsnipe" Lau from the MashPotato/B> Project,currently being hosted at LinuxGiant until Raja is well enough to move it over to SourceForge, who is hosting our project. Thanks semis for getting the post in early. Most of the crew are volunteers from the official #debian IRC channel at irc.debian.org. MashPotato's aim is to provide all users of Debian with comprehensive live IRC support and an ongoing website. Over the upcoming months, the MashPotato site will be loaded with the latest tips, guides and Debian news, but currently our priority is to help out new and old Debian GNU/Linux users getting a hang of Potato and Woody as well.
Here's an excerpt from a post that was made on the Debian-user mailing list:

We here at #debian, the official IRC channel of Debian have decided that when Potato 2.2 does officially become stable, that we will provide the most comprehensive Debian GNU/Linux support service that we can to users both new and old. However, being the official IRC room, #debian will be overwhelmed with literally hundreds of users seeking installation and configuration help. The task would be quite daunting for regulars there as we already handle several dozen help requests a day.
Hence, the Potato release now has a dedicated IRC tech support crew nicknamed the Mobile Array of Support Helpers for Potato (MashPotato) which serve around the clock for users around the world. To make things easier, we will also divert users to different channels from #debian to for example #mashpotato and #mashpotato-X, #mashpotato-sound, #mashpotato-gnome. However, we will be lacking in numbers of people to answer the multitudes of help. To sign up for the roster list for MashPotato, just come into #debian and type in "apt roster" for further details, and return over the next few days for more details. You don't need to be using Potato, but any Debian-based help provided will be greatly appreciated.

So if you've got any troubles whatsoever with Debian GNU/Linux, Potato or Woody, then hop into #debian or #mashpotato hosted on any IRC server that's part of the OpenProject IRC Network> and we'll be glad to help you.

MashPotato - Mobile Array of Support Helpers for Potato