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Some devices just cannot be bought without MS Windows installed on them. I could not source a new laptop without it, for instance.

Really? I don't know that you tried very hard.

http://www.pctorque.com/ sells Sager laptops without an OS. They are Clevo laptops, which are the same lappy that Alienware sells. They now have SLI on the lappy too.... drool....

Here is a link to one of the reseller of this awesome 'desktop laptop'
http://www.pctorque.com/sager-9750-gaming-computer s.php
I've ordered one, and can't wait to run Linux in 64bit on this dual-core system.

There is a full thread on the NotebookForum about this laptop at
http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?t=952 31

Eh, hinges on your definition of huge, noisy, and hot. I own one, or at least one based from the same model. It's more quiet than the desktops next to me during normal use, really.
It's louder than your average notebook, and definitely heavier (Mine weighs in at 11 lbs.) but it's not too bad when you counterbalance what you get out of having it. It's hot compared to desktops, but compared to competing P4 laptops, especially the Dell P4 laptops (The 8000 series) this thing is on ice. Mine is idling at 41c at the moment, and it maxes out at 60c, where the fans will throttle and run it back down to 50 or 40, depending on the temperature of the room you're in. Contrasting this with my friend's vaio, which idles at 50-60c and gets close to 70c before it starts chopping out, and my friend's inspiron 1150 (a far unfair comparison, but we're talking processors here,) which he runs with a box fan under it to keep his celeron cool, my D900T is fairly cool.

Concerning small laptops, perhaps the other clevo notebooks, such as sager's NP5720or an NP3880 would be more up your alley? (Note the prices shown are direct from sager, who usually sells through resellers, so those prices are higher than you'd actually buy for. try buying from places like PCTorque or DiscountNotebooks if you want to actually buy a sager notebook.)
Clevo designed the d900T for a very narrow market. My friends have commented that they too would probably be happier with a laptop that was thinner and perhaps less powerful rather than something like mine, which is all a matter of taste. The people this notebook caters to are the people who need a high performance notebook capable of matching up with high end desktops while still maintaining the form factor that makes it feasable to transport with you. (And this notebook does match desktops, in everything other than hard drive space, thanks to the 2.5in form factor. However, the D900T does have a RAID controller supporting RAID 0 and RAID 1 with two hard drives, and supports SATA drives as well.)
The laptop supports most all high end moble graphics cards, from the vanilla 6800go and mobilityX800 to the 7800GTXgo and the quadroFX1400go(for people doing 3D intensive 3D modeling, rather than gaming.)
Obviously, this laptop doesn't seem to be quite what you want, which is fine, but if you want a powerful notebook that can match up with high-end desktops, you're looking at it. Or at least it's older sibling. The newest clevo notebook, the D900k or NP9750, is based off of the same chasis, but with an AMD socket 939 motherboard, which of course means compatibility up to the FX-57 and a64x24800+, which will put a new performance crown up for notebooks when it's released.

But like I said, if performance and power aren't *CRUCIAL* to you, then you'd probably be happier with a lower-priced and lower-powered and lower-weighted mid-range notebook, such as dell's inspiron 9300 or the above-noted sager NP5720 and NP3880. Notebooks are a strange thing, because everyone has something they look for in them. Finding what someone likes in their notebooks is half of getting to know them for me.
Oh, and as a last note, I own this notebook and do have a girlfriend. The end IS nigh.

You can get one of these through PC Torque for under $3,000. It's also a Sager 9890.

You can get one of these through PC Torque for under $3,000. It's also a Sager 9890.

At Sager:

http://www.sagernotebook.com/pages/web_specials.ht ml

At PCTorque:

http://www.pctorque.com/sager-laptops.php

A sample desktop screenshot, wsxga:

http://public.fotki.com/Marspoet/desktops/windowma ker02.html

Place where people talk about them:

http://www.notebookforums.com/

....at least for a while. these guys sell p4s that go up to 3.8 mhz now, and you can get intel x86-64 up to 3.6 mhz now. Not only that, but the sagers now offer upgradeable video card slots.

I don't need ultramobile. I need something that I can put on a table in the living room, or dining room, or take it somewhere else with a table and an outlet. I'm not one of the guys in the commercials sitting in the park with my pup surfing the web

PC Torque (a Sager notebook reseller) lets you choose to purchase with or without the Microsoft tax.

http://www.pctorque.com/

They also run a popular forum site that covers multiple notebook vendors (Sager, Alienware, Dell, etc.), and has an active general area for discussion about running Linux on notebooks:

http://notebookforums.com/

My Sager 5600matched this machine 2 years ago for ~$200? more. It's been running each release of RH (well, 7.2, 8, 8.1B, 9, FC1, FC2) since I've owned it, nary a problem.

The specs on this machine are underwhelming. The Radeon 9000 is so, um, 2001. Save for a few weeks more and pick up one of these to get your TV tuner, etc., too.

My Sager 5600matched this machine 2 years ago for ~$200? more. It's been running each release of RH (well, 7.2, 8, 8.1B, 9, FC1, FC2) since I've owned it, nary a problem.

The specs on this machine are underwhelming. The Radeon 9000 is so, um, 2001. Save for a few weeks more and pick up one of these to get your TV tuner, etc., too.

I bought my laptop (no OS or, more importantly, no stupid windows sticker on it) from here.

Get yourself a Sager Notebook from PC Torque and save yourself a couple thousand dollars.

• Call or email them.
• A real live tech who builds the computers will call or email you back!

I noticed that the current alienware laptops look different - I don't know if they are from a new supplier now or just redesigned - but the earlier Alienware laptops were just rebadged clevos. Identical laptops were available under the Sager brand for considerably less - but without the hype or bright colors.

...or you get something that's nearly identical to an Alienware for far less...
check out Sager notebooks, a good site for them is Pc Torque. This particular company even allows you to order it without an operating system.

You'll notice that the cases are completely identical (Sager and Alienware). A lot of them seem to buy the base components from one company. If you remember Liebermann Computers (a lot of people thought they might be a hoax with some of their products), even their laptops look the same.

You'll get the same specs, and probably practically the same system for far cheaper. Bottom line: Alienware is not a good price/performance ratio, especially for notebooks.

I just bought one of these:

Sager np5680

And for under $2000, you get almost exactly the same machine. Its a highly respected brand, also, they just don't have the marketing fluff of Dell or the other big guys.

The only difference I see, is the video card (9600 vs. 9700), and no DVI out on the Sager. For $1K, you can keep your DVI :)

Add in Win XP as an os, to add $250, and you are still $1k cheaper. Or go free, with Linux, your choice.

I got my 5680 a couple weeks ago. You should see how nice 1600x1200 is on these UXGA screens, but these emachines are damn cheap and powerful - add another 515 Meg of ram in there of course. And they also have the ATI Radeon 9600 Mobile in there too, which is very fast. You can run any game at 1280x1024 with highest settings - maybe even 1600x1200 too(probably quake3). i've been playing UT2003 and Neverwinter nights on very high settings. It looks great.

I got my Sager 5680 a couple weeks ago. You should see how nice 1600x1200 is on these UXGA screens, but these emachines are damn cheap and powerful - add another 515 Meg of ram in there of course. And they also have the ATI Radeon 9600 Mobile in there(not sure if it's the pro or not, which mine has too).

So I'm looking the 5680-V right here and my figures aren't matching yours. To make the Sager match the PB's default configuration it costs $2608, plus $30 shipping.

Sager 5680-V

UXGA Wide Angle View 15" LCD (This is probably their equivalent to what you consider the PB's "odd" display).
3.2ghz CPU
512mb RAM
80gb 4200
2X DVD-R/CD-RW
Windows XP Home
Internal Wireless
Bluetooth

15" Powerbook Default Configuration

1.2ghz CPU
512mb RAM
80gb HD (4200 RPM)
SuperDrive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
OS X 10.2 Jaguar
Built in Wireless & Bluetooth
Free Ground Shipping

$2599 Standard Price
$2299 Educational Discount (which if you know anyone who's a student or teacher, isn't hard to get).

Mind you the Powerbook will easily get 4 hours or longer doing more than just word processing. Being one inch thick, and only 5.6lbs, you can actually CARRY it with one hand quite comfortably. At 12lbs your machine wouldn't even feel comfortable sitting on my lap, and that's before it starts to heat up. The fans alone on that thing are hideous.

The Sager machine also lacks the backlit keyboard and I didn't see any mention of Firewire 800. I'm assuming it has USB 2.0, but since the organization of their page is so awful, I didn't bother investigating further. They claim to offer a warranty and tech support, but I'd take that as a grain of salt, since the page looks incredibly unprofessional.

The trackpad and keyboard positioning on the unit appear to be very uncomfortable as well. Buying a laptop is about portability not cramming as much as you can into one case. I want a laptop, not extra luggage.

Now tell me which one will give you more processing power for the buck.

It's hard to say. If I installed Linux on the Sager it might give me more CPU power for my money, but certainly not with Windows XP installed. A 'secure' Windows XP install means installing an anti-virus, a pop-up blocker, and a decent firewall. Then of course, assuming I don't manually stop them, spyware invested apps like Real Player attempt to stay resident, alongside Winamp and Winzip. I can disable all these things, but I shouldn't have to and don't have to in OS X. So yeah, you may have more CPU power than me, but the resources you waste to have OS X's basic functionality even it all out. Not to mention I don't have to deal with dirty registries and a whole plethora of other Windows issues. You can load Photoshop faster, I can get more done overall, and my system doesn't look like a piece of shit -- all at the same time.

The much-hyped Alienware laptops are actually made by a compny (can't remember the name) that are also sold as Sager's for much less, and the Sager's can be bought without an OS. However, they don't come in fruity colors like the Alienware.

Sager laptop

Alienware

Cnet user reviews (an funny mix of people pointing out that you can get the Sager for cheaper, and Alienware fans who can't seem to understand that)

My win2000 box augered into the ground last week. I'd love for it to stay crashed, but I need financial software.

In the mean time, I've been using Ximian Gnome, Evolution, and Open Office to get to all my stuff on my network shares. I've also purchased a new notebook from <plug> PC Torque</plug>, and plan to put a Debian woody on it, again, with Ximian. This time though, I'm hooking it up to my client's network - read Exchange, NT Domains, MS Office documents, you know the drill.

I know there are still issues in getting this to work easily enough for the average MBA, but I don't see any holes in the quilt. And with a little training and some pilot testing, getting the small businesses to turn over is looking more and more possible. Big business has always been stubborn - look at how long the old Wangs stuck around.

Whatever criticisms might be doled out, one thing is certain: the takeover is imminent. There's just too much energy being pumped into open source for it to fail.

You ask for it, you got it: 17" lappie w/ numeric keypad.

Sager laptop owner forums

Sager reseller

It may be a somewhat unknown brand, but I have been totally blown away with it. Check out the specs and the forums.

If you like those, but not the price, you should check out the Sager's. Look familiar? ;-) Some vendors will even sell them in the "pretty colors". Looks like one of the vendors has started a forum for discussions about the platform.

Someone had a pretty detailed review of his purchase of his Sager from one of the vendors, but that page seems to be unavailable at the moment. Here's the Google cache of it, tho.

Anyway, I don't have the dosh to be a customer, happy or otherwise, so consider this more of an FYI than a recommendation... ;-)

You should realize though that most of these companies purchase the hardware from companies like Sager (Linux forum) and Compal, and those companies also supply the big-name guys like Compaq, HP, Dell, and Toshiba. So when you find some no-name laptop, it is usually equivalent to some branded laptop that never touched the hands of HP/Compaq/Toshiba/Dell. (And figuring out exactly *which* brand-name laptop it is equivalent to can be extremely difficult) Some of the below claim to manufacture their own notebooks, but what this means is that they buy them from Saeger/Compal or someone else, and put in a hard drive/CPU/RAM, which is why you will find identical looking cases at several of these vendors.

If you find a HP/Compaq/Toshiba/Dell/IBM/Sony branded laptop that has linux preinstalled, it means that the vendor paid for windows and removed it. I do not list them below because I think this is a despicable and deceptive practice. These manufacturers do not (yet) sell no-os or linux laptops. (But please, call them and ask!! The squeaky wheel gets the grease!) Also if you order a no-OS laptop, please request linux to be installed anyway, and tell them you'll pay for it! Let them know there is demand!

1. Linux-preinstalled laptops
2. ASA Computers
3. ASLab (Linux Forum)
4. American Computer
5. Cyclox
6. Kachina Tech (positively ancient laptops -- K6 and PII)
7. QLI Tech
8. Workstation 2000

1. No-os laptops
2. ARM Computer
3. Chem USA
4. Mtech Laptops (these guys outright lied to me about what they could deliver, in order to get my order, were not able to deliver the laptop, and I had to cancel my order -- which took 3 months to process and they kept $5 for the priviledge -- do not do business with them)
5. PC Torque
6. Power Notebooks (very good customer service according to Reseller Ratings) (Linux forum)
7. Xtreme Notebooks

-- Bob