Slashdot Mirror
1st Cup Of Coffee: Hardening Your Arteries
mikewhittaker writes "A recent article on The Times refer to a report which indicates that the intake of caffeine from a single coffee can have adverse effects on your arteries and heart." Actually, it goes so far to say that the first cup of coffee is the worst. Of course, basically, anything you do is bad for at some level, so I guess it's choosing your poisons.
slow day?
Shift happens. Fire it up.
The more coffee you drink, the less dangerous each cup is. Therefore, drinking more coffee is even better for you.
;-)
Drink up. Yiiiiipppeeeeeee!!!!!
-Vic
So skip the first cup of coffee and go right to the second.
They did it again ! Sometimes the study says "cofee bad", the next day another one claims "coffe good". With so many divergent results, how can one still trust any of those studies ?
-- javaDragon is an instance of JavaDragon.
a single coffee can have adverse effects on your arteries and heart.
Whew. That was close. Glad I switched to espresso!
Lawrence Lessig is my personal hero.
I'm not a coffee drinker - it's too bitter (even mocha tastes weird) and I haven't gotten used to it yet.
I like chocolate. Chocolate's great. The sugar'll probably be Very Bad for me later, though. No win.
What about tea?
That's why I drink tea!
Besides, I can't stand the taste of coffee, unless diluted (like a coffee coolatta, etc).
*BLEGH*
another "quality" nivelo9 comment
It's easy to test out the health effects of caffeine - just give it up for a month.
Every 6 months or so, I quit caffeine cold turkey - no soda, no coffee, etc. The first 3-4 days are miserable - headaches, fatigue, etc. After that I start feeling much better, sleeping better, having more energy, etc. It's pretty clear that I feel better and healthier without that morning copy of coffee.
Of course, then some deadline pops up and I'm back to drinking 2 cups of coffee and a six pack of diet coke per day. What drives me nuts is that I know better - I've been through this cycle at least 5 times. Thanks God I never started smoking! If I have this much trouble giving up caffeine, I can't imagine what nicotine would do to me.
** The opinions expressed here are my own, and do not reflect those of my employers - past, present, or future**
It is rather a shame that society (North American society) is so obsessed now with risk aversion!
Everything we do has good and bad affects. Coffee makes you feel good but shortens life. Good choice for each to make. Wine lessens cardiovascular degeneration but increases the chance of liver ailments. Flying gets you tere quickly but you can fall. Peanuts are wholesome food but can kill one in a million. In the USA, only the negative part of each of these equations is being seen. Playgrounds have no swigs here anymore becuase they too can be dangerous.
Well, I for one will not worry. I make my own choices. I take calculated risks. I am aware that it all ends in tears anyway: no-one lives over 110 years and anyway, by 80, half of us have Alzheimers. Best enjoy the three score years and ten I'd say.
Would talk more but must be off for a coffee.
---
BDOS ERR ON A:>
Really?
That's interesting... hmmm I will have to think about that and get back to you...
If you actually read this article, the study only confirms that for a few hours after consuming a cup of coffee, your heart is placed under more stress. In and of itself, this does not appear to be very significant. Any vigorous physical activity will also raise your heartrate, constrict your arteries, and put your heart under more stress. It says NOTHING about long-term health consequences, which is really the main issue here.
I recall reading several years ago that at that time, the long-term health consequences of coffee were unclear. Some adverse affects were sometimes suggested in studies, but it turns out there are tremendous confounding factors -- coffee drinkers often tend to eat lots of donuts, be less active, and so on. When the initial population of patient participants was selected as healthy health care professionals, little or no adverse affects were observed for moderate (up to a couple of cups a day) intakes of coffee.
Bob
Science, like Nature, must also be tamed, with a view turned towards its preservation.
Eh, of course playgrounds never had "swigs" in the first place. Swings, yes.
---
BDOS ERR ON A:>
Don't know if you American folks have them, but there is a coffee restaurant called "the Second Cup" up here. Guess we know how they got their name now; attractive mottos like "Go anywhere else and you will die a slow and painful death" become effective if this news is publicized!
I am suprised that there isnt more attention being paid to the excess consumption of water. A sudden change in elctrolites could cause a person's cells to burst. Why arent there any warning labels on bottle water?
Imagine if you will:
Reefer: "Yeah, dude, I got this nasty shit from Columbia!"
Stoner: "Yo dude, gimme some of that..."
Reefer: "Ya gotta swollow 2 oz of those coffee grounds with hot water, dude!"
Stoner: "Cooooollllll... my parents will never figure it out! Sweet! I'll pay ya $2000 for it!"
Karma whorin' since 1999
What a crazy article! Since the article doesn't cite a source, one can conclude that the research hasn't been published yet.
And since the research hasn't been published, one can assume that the study has not been peer reviewed - or even hasn't been accepted as worthy science.
So therefore, no one knows if this study is the next greatest find, or just a piece of crap designed to grab headlines.
I suspect the later.
... is Bob Marley singing "One Cup of Coffee." (Dunno if that was a Marley original -- anyone?)
...
...
Of course, he died of cancer at an early age, but still
And there's KD Lang's cover of Black Coffee on one of those "Just Say [X]" Sire Records samplers, too.
Coffee may not be to everyone's taste or good for the circulatory system, but its redolence has a powerful effect. Nothing like late-night coffee and blueberry pie
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
Cheers,
vic
When you get old your bones will become weak and brittle. Hard arteries will actually hold up your body when your bones fail. You heard it hear first.
I'll have plenty of time to sleep when im dead.
The European Society of Cardiology (referenced in the Times' article) are having their conference this week.
No mention of coffee - except for the generously long breaks that they're getting...
No more coffee means no more reading Slashdot first thing in the morning.
This, of course, would improve workplace productivity in the key IT depts around the nation.
Therefore, a ban on coffee will lead to increased productivity and a rise in economic output, thereby solving the nations economic woes.
Therefore, drinking coffee is the cause of the current economic downturn.
But none of you have read this because you all just gave up coffee.
Nothing wrong with this logic.
There's no point in worrying about things harming you. If you listen to stuff like this, you will soon find that you cannot eat or drink anything, or go anywhere. Life is dangerous, we have to accept that.
(Of course, for the same caffeine effect on people, you would need to drink 40 cups of coffee. Get crackin'.)
Security through promiscuity is no better than security through obscurity.
They'll just say "I told you so!".
There was another article today on Reuters Health pointing out that coffee was chock full of antioxidants.
So it's all a wash.
--- Will in Seattle - What are you doing to fight the War?
Bollocks. Link should have been http://www.escardio.org/VPO/scheduleconference.htm
let me point out that this article claims the study advises at the end says that one should switch to decaffeinated coffee- so is it the caffeine in the coffee that's causing the artery hardening, etc?
to establish that it's the caffeine, then a control study should have been done with decaffeinated coffee. even better, another study should be conducted in which the effects of no-doz or other purified caffeine pills are measured relative to placebo pills.
and if it is *just* the caffeine, then clearly the advisory should be applied toward all caffeinated drinks. just such jolt, or cola, or tea.
in short, i think that either the reporting of this science or the science itself is a bit sloppy. this must have been funded by some anti-coffee foundation.
Studies also confirm that swallowing saliva in small amounts over a long period of time causes cancer. It could also be a major factor in the aging process. Also, nearly 100 percent of all people recently diagnosed with death were habitual breathers until moments before the onset of death.
Bah!
When I was a hardcore frappuccino junkie my heart felt really weak. The best approach is to get up much earlier in the day and do some excerises.
Alright - I'll admit that I'm hopelessly addicted to caffeine. I take it in all forms, normal coffee (three heaped spoonfuls), espresso (the same), tea (brewed for at least 3 minutes) and last but not least Irn-Bru.
I don't think Irn-Bru is available in America, but in Scotland, it's our unofficial national beverage. Plus, it's also got more caffeine in it than any other fizzy drink. I drink this stuff by the bottle load, normally accompanied by my friends when we're watching a DVD, playing Quake, or just cos I'm desperate for another glass.
It's freakin' typical that my favourite drinks all turn out to be lethal.
Sure, for alot of people thats really Bad. But if you're very active and healthy, it's not.
-
have the sheißplatz for inspecting ones feces? Now I would call that going too far for health...
-
* Turkish Proverb: "Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death,
and sweet as love."
* Sheikh Abd-al-Kadir (1587): "No one can understand the truth until
he drinks of coffee's frothy goodness."
* Sir James MacKintosh (18th century philosopher): "The powers of a
man's mind are directly proportional to the quantity of coffee he
drank."
* Johann Sebastian Bach (1732, an aria from his 'Kaffee-Kantate'):
"Ah! How sweet coffee tastes! Lovlier than a thousand kisses,
sweeter than muscatel wine! I must have my coffee..."
* David Letterman (Esquire Interview Fall '94): "If it wasn't for
coffee, I'd have no discernible personality at all."
* Chris Egolf (1993): "This damn pot is too fucking slow!"
* Wise New York City Homeless Man (1996, to Chris Egolf): "Son, you
need to get some coffee in you so people know you're alive!"
At the intersection of computation and biology.
If I can drink booze to stave off the effects of caffeine, then logically there must be something to stave off the effects of the booze, and so on...
Hah! I'll take up every vice and live forever! =)
"Where shall the word be found, where will the word resound? Not here, there is not enough silence." -T.S. Eliot
Drink up! Yippeee...! Er...
Scene closes with programmer's workmates, each with coffee in hand, shaking their heads sadly as paramedics bear away a sheet-covered object on a stretcher.
My point: less harmful is not the same as harmless.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Charalambos Vlachopoulos presented this (or related) information earlier this year
5 9- 160.htm
... denoting increase of aortic stiffness
http://www.congressreview.com/cardio/orlando/11
http://www.congressreview.com/2525v.htm
Methods: We studied 20 healthy volunteers (50±16 yrs) in a randomized, double-blind, crossover fashion (250 mg of caffeine orally -equivalent to 2-3 cups of coffee- and placebo
Results: Caffeine led to an acute increase in pulse wave velocity
> ... should consider switching to a
> decaffeinated coffee or stop drinking it.
>
> The findings showed that the first cup had the
> most significant effect because caffeine levels
> in the blood had dropped during the night. The
> second and third cups caused only marginally
> worse hardening of the arteries.
So drinking Coca-Cola is out too?
I think they should ban coffee, with the same force of prohibition that they ban marijuana.
It makes exactly as much sense.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
I gave up regular coffee again about 6 months ago. This time I weened myself off of it by mixing decaf with regular coffee. Each week I would increase the amount of decaf in the mix by half a tablespoon. After about a month, I was drinking strictly decaf. There's still some caffeine in decaf but not enough to keep me awake at night. This method allowed me to avoid the effects of quiting cold turkey, which really suck.
Frylock: That's not a toy!
Master Shake: You say that about everything you own. You should own toys. They're fun.
This is Proof positive that either God does not exist, or if he does exist, he hates me.
Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power - Benito Mussoli
(The above comment violated the postercomment compression filter. Comment aborted)
But, there has been some studies that show that coffee drinkers are less likely to get bladder cancer. Probably because there is nothing in the bladder long enough to cause cancer. Beer may work that way too, but you don't have the side affect of wanting to climb a transmission tower and piss on high voltage wires.
Fight Spammers!
And in an unrelated PR move today:
Sun Microsystems has announced that its computer language "Java" was indeed named after the Indonesian island, and NOT after a type of coffee. "Coffee is bad for people, we would never encourage anything like that", said Sun's representative.
I've never started the coffee habit, though have had the occasional mountain dew/coke/pepsi to power my all-nighters.
I find that getting jogging for a little in the morning helps he feel pretty good for the day...of course, that 30-minute nap in the afternoon really helps out, too.
One article I read on a plane between US and Europe was praising the benefits of the nap, and was of course, encouraging the corporate-types to endorse the practices (instead of just work-work-work-work until you drop). There was something about a 30 minute nap making people much more productive than if they drank two cups of coffee.
The other point was that if you were taking a nap, that it should be in increments of 30-minutes (i.e. don't wake-up at 45-minutes or 75 minutes, etc.). This is due to the sleep cycles that the body goes through. You end-up waking in the middle of a deep cycle, and you just want to keep-on-sleeping.
Geez, I love naps....
three times before I figured out that it didn't mean "a coffee can", because I was trying to figure out how to drink from multiple cans instead.
Well, let them be stupid; anyone can post stuff to the internet. But I do hope the Slashdot staff show better judgement in the future before linking to "scientific results" presented in this shoddy a manner.
If word gets out and coffee starts getting regulated... well my GOD MAN! IT'LL MEAN THE END OF TECHNOLOGY! C'mon folks, you know as well as I do that technology subsists on caffine and sugar.
well... that and innovation from MS. *snicker!*
Ctimes2
My cube. My friend. My solace. My prison.
...in another 6 months they'll release a study claiming that coffee could help prevent cancer. It'll all balance out. Yeah, I know this is a bit jaded, but what do you expect after years of studies claiming that such-n-such harms you, followd by another round of studies claimng that such-n-such is good for you?
As a general rule, you need at least a lifetime to really figure it out. Some of this stuff *should* be obvious. Did we really need the surgeon general to tell us that chronic smoke inhalation isn't good for us? For centuries people have witnessed others who drank themselves to death, so we pretty much knew excessive alcohol consumption wasn't good either.
In modern times, the 1st world has developed the ability to feed itself so that gluttony is now affordable. But that's one of the 7 deadly sins, so once again it should have occured to us that eating 6 big macs for breakfast and never exercising wasn't such a good idea.
Most everything else is so subtle that you just shouldn't worry about it.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Well, this study reports that coffee is a rich source of antioxidants.
Sept 5, 2001: LONDON (Reuters) - Coffee beats green tea by containing four times the amount of health-boosting antioxidants, which can assist in preventing or postponing the onset of degenerative diseases, according to a new study.
...
Antioxidants reduce the effects on the human body of harmful substances known as free radicals which may be a major contributor to cardiovascular disease, cancer, cataracts and decline of the immune and nervous system.
...for nearly 80 years. If I can live as long as him, I couldn't really give a rat's ass what coffee does to my arteries.
I'm really not convinced that coffee's as dangerous as these people would have you believe.
--Life may have no meaning, or, even worse, it may have a meaning of which you disapprove.
...of people who worry about studies. I bet they all drop dead by 40.
My mother is hugely addicted to tea. Growing up, I remember how she had to have her morning cup and a cup of tea just to wake up from a nap. I decided then that I would never let myself get dependent on the stuff.
I do drink coffee or have a coke sometimes when I'm in "crunch mode". This could be a big exam when I was in college, a major deadline at work or some serious night-time driving. One thing that not consuming any caffeine has done to me is made my hypersensitive to the stuff. So if I have a single coke any time after noon, I can't sleep well at night - regardless of how tired I am.
I had a point when I began this post but missed it somewhere.
Mmmm.. Donuts
...I was in a convenience store, and the fat woman at the counter ahead of me (about two pick handles across the arse) asked for "A Diet Coke and a Hershey bar".
I suppose the one was to compensate for the effects of the other. Made my day.
jmp
Of course, basically, anything you do is bad for at some level, so I guess it's choosing
:)
your poisons.
Well.... maybe a cost-benefit analysis is a better way of looking at it. Is coffee REALLY that important to you? Great, take it and take the health impacts. For most people, though, it just might be worth it to quit.
And there are lots of enjoyable things that don't do you much harm. Find one, make that your habit. I'm currently enjoying being hydrated.
Of course, I still consume enough cheese that if I didn't exercise, I would become the Kraft Blimp
Tweet, tweet.
well, soda can be used to clean toilets. perhaps that first cup isn't as bad as they think....
Looks like it is time to invest in the production of coffee IV's. After all, if its that first cup that is killing us, why not simply always imbibe coffee?
Keep the pots a-brewin', plug your little coffee IV in for bedtime, and we'll be a healthier society!
But what really killed me was my 63rd bong hit. You should stop at 62.
I stopped long ago relying on all the alarmist calls to decide on what's good for me.
'The findings showed that the first cup had the most significant effect because caffeine levels in the blood had dropped during the night.'
There's a no-brainer. Drink a maintenance dose when you get up to pee in the middle of the night.
Hey Hemos, who learnt you your english?
No matter where you go... there you are.
Just out of curiosity... what was this supposed to prove? That you can cut and paste? Or get modded down? How l33t, man.
My other car is first.
http://www.holymtn.com/tea/caffeine_content.htm
You'll see that it takes approx. 3 12oz Mt. Dews to equal the caffeine in 1 5oz cup of Drip, regular coffee.
And other amazing things.
"Would it kill you to put down the toilet seat?" -- Maya Angelou
Ok... here's the deal with coffee. Being a programmer, I drink a lot of coffee. I'm not bringing this topic up because I'm strange... this is serious. Usually after my first major caffeine hit in the morning, I get the "coffee shits". Strange thing about the coffee shits is that it only happens once! Once the event has occurred, I'm safe to drink as much coffee as I want without further problems. Its almost as if the colon has crossed some kind of hidden barrier into a state of caffeine dependence.
Ever wonder why drinking cofee usually results in a major colon explosion?
I've consulted a number of medical information sources trying to find the exact biological cause of "the coffee shits"... mostly because I'd like to know what kind of pressures are put on my body from caffeine intake.
Never once did I ever think that perhaps my arteries were at stake too! In fact, I always thought coffee was good for my body in a way... being all natural and everything.
Aside from the arteries problem, anybody have any biological insight into the coffee shits?
Skiers and Riders -- http://www.snowjournal.com
How many of you would step onto an airliner where the pilot hasn't had his cup of coffee?
What if he missed some radio instructions or got confused because he wasn't completely alert?
What if those instructions were to keep him from flying into the side of a mountain?
There are worse things out there than dying from a cup of coffee. In some cases, a cup of coffee might actually be good for you.
It isn't how long you live, it's what you do with your life while you got it that counts. Have you done enough stuff that if you had to die tomorrow, you could say you've lived enough? If you can't, get out there, and do enough stuff until you can. Let the neo-puritans worry about living longer in misery. Or sleepiness.
Have you seen the icon on their software?
"Anybody remotely interesting is mad, in some way or another" - Doctor Who
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010905/sc/food_c offee_antioxidants_dc.html
:)
It must be true, I found it on the Internet
I've seen quite a few programmers, and I'm thinking
;)
a good percentage will be adversely affected by
coffee LONG before they reproduce (and no, this
has nothing to do with the quantity of coffee they drink)
A year spent in artificial intelligence is enough to make one believe in God.
Based upon all the studies that is about it.
Used to have real sticky shit. Dropped coffee and now the shit isn't sticky. Certainly a reason to stop.
The cream you put into the coffee is probably more harmful to you in the long run than the caffeine content!
You're Just Jealous Because The Voices Are Talking To Me.
My arteries should be harder than granite by now...'scuse me, my mug is empty again.
http://pebkac.net
I quit drinking caffeinated sodas and took up
:)
sprite and others a while back because I was
getting bad headaches on the weekend (when I
usually dont drink my first coke until 5pm or so).
now i'm back to caffeine and resist quitting because
I don't want to be like non-caffeine people when
it comes to drinking a single soda at 9pm and
not being able to sleep.
tolerance can be a very, very good thing
nothing quite like drinking a nice big coke at 11:30 pm
and then hitting the sack!
A year spent in artificial intelligence is enough to make one believe in God.
"that's why we should change the filter every month"
"But won't that take out some of the flavor"
"We wouldn't want that, now would we?"
"No sir, I think I'll post the results on slashdot. Everyone should know that the caffeine won't clog your arteries; the shit cake in the filter will."
That's correct, we should change the filter every month and only once to economize!"
"Right you are, CowBoyNeil"
"I'm glad we caught it too, Hemos, now go post it like it was somone else's study and not our own. I'll be back on Saturday, my roto-rooter operating will require me to recover on a hospital bed for about days. L8er."
"Goodbye, for great Allah. Bring Caffeine justice!"
You gotta start activating that bullshit filter, friend.
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
...the worst thing to be addicted to is boasting about your addictions, or boasting about your lack thereof.
"If today you hear His voice, harden not your heart"
Or something like that...
Posted from the wireless couch.
heh, how amazing, yet another artificial stimulate has been found to have a negative effect upon the human body. Wow, who'd have ever thunk it, huh? Sheesh, talk about predictable, I have always maintaned that coffee was sooner or latter going to be found to have some sort of detremental effect on the human body, I guess that the effect was just discovered a bit eariler then I had guessed.
Need help treating your acne? Come here!
You must check out Too Much Coffee Man!!
Large print giveth, and the small print taketh away
As a student in 4th year cognitive science / neuroscience I've taken the standard undergraduate pharmaceutical courses. Caffine has a cognitive effect through the inhibition of adenosine. Adenosine normally inhibits dopamine release but when you inhibit the inhibitor you upregulate the amount of dopamine release. The higher levels of dopamine in the brain -- specifically the prefrontal cortex -- is what marks you think clearer/better. (I'll leave out an explain of why for the time being.) Many drugs have their cognitive effects through upper dopamine such as methylphenidate (ie. Ritalin), amphetamine (ie. speed, Dexadrine, etc...) and cocaine. Unfortunately, dopamine also has an effect outside the brain -- it acts as a vasoconstrictor, i.e. is causes your blood vescles and arteries to tighten up. Tighter blood vesicles are harder to pump blood through and thus you heart has to work harder thus raising your blood vesicle. And as we know high blood pressure is a major risk factor in heart disease. Thus really this study is nothing we didn't know 20 years ago.
-ben houston (ben@exocortex.org)
Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada
heh, how amazing, yet another artificial stimulant has been found to have a negative effect upon the human body. Wow, who'd have ever thunk it, huh? Sheesh, talk about predictable, I have always maintained that coffee was sooner or later going to be found to have some sort of detrimental effect on the human body, I guess that the effect was just discovered a bit eariler than I had guessed.
A nice cold shower and a little exercise really gets you going in the morning...
oh and meth, lots of meth.
Since I have no idea where the study was published, I can't comment on the methodology, etc. However, I do have to wonder how this research can be groundbreaking.
People with preexisting heart problems who are at risk for arrhythmias or recurrent myocardial infarctions are already warned not to take caffeine. Any stimulant will increase heart rate and blood pressure. Most people with problems know this an ignore this just as those with lung/heart problems ignore our advice to stop smoking.
An interesting side note, those people who suffer from migraine headaches often experience them most severely on the weekends, when they no longer take caffeine, which can work wonders...
Invicta{HOG}
Isn't that the case with every addiction, the more, the worse, and yet the better to fix the addiction?
The Surgeon General simply needs to put a warning label on every can, bag, bottle or carton of products that contain caffeine. That's what they did for tobacco products, and it solved the whole thing, didn't it?
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
i'll just skip the first cup and start with my second.
I guess it would make sense then that the US Government should sue Coffee farmers now too. After all, cigarettes are bad for you and we can sue "Big Tobacco" right? Maybe we should be suing Big Coffee now too. I can see it now. Starbucks sued because they sell coffee to young adults and intentionally increase the addictive caffeine per cup (Espresso).
I personally gave up coffee months ago. I knew there we health side effects. It's been known for years. I gave up smoking over a year ago for similar reasons. It really is a matter of chosing your poisons. People don't need to be protected from themselves. I just hate when Big Government (Socialist Liberals) tries to profit from the personal choices of some idiots in the populus.
Just trying to get people thinking about this so we don't have another Tobacco lawsuit on our hands.
I am MuchTall
Why not invent a caffine patch that maintains the caffine in your blood system over (but no enough to keep you awake) so your first cup wont be so unhealthy
Drink it up, you fad following sheepish caffiene addicted yuppies! Hope you die faster!
Hey, if coffee hardens your blood, then just drink alcohol to thin it out again!
Isn't it nice when two vices cancel each other out?
why are you reading this? Every post here is useless, including this one. Not a single post has anything useful, yet they are all moderated up, oh this one is interesting, yeah its interesting that the person made a bad joke, oh informative, oh thats nice that that guy drinks 4 cups a day, informed me about something i didn't want to know.
garbage
...the caffeine sampler at thinkgeek.com in honor of this story.
Are you trying to say that my ritual 3 cigarettes and 4 cups of coffee at 5 in the morning is bad for me???
But that's okay... I clean out my arteries with a few beers at noon.
"Madness and Genius are separated solely by Degrees of Success." -Unknown
there are people who have caught on to this long before us: balance of "energies"--if you will, a representation of the consequences of our actions--has been a central focal point of several eastern religions since time immemorial. more recently, a practitioner of wicca once told me that their religion is about finding a balance between "good" and "bad" things.
it's interesting to contrast how christianity, and by extension (the influence is there whether or not we like it), most of american and western culture, believe in an "ultimate good" which is to be achieved--whose achievement is happiness.
it seems like such a static view of the world to me: a slow trudge toward some unreachable goal rather than a flow of plusses and minuses.
me, i'll have my coffee *and* my wine!
Recursion (n): See recursion
Really, caffeine is bad for you? Next thing you know they are going to be telling us smoking is bad too.
What a waste of research money. Is cancer still a problem?
can i just drink some artery lube or something
and forget about it?
cause i really really hate the headaches.
and the nausea
and the twitching
The opening sounds as if our author is a user/addict of some hardcore drug. Low and behold, his drug is caffeine. Quite an excellent read!
Berto
- The findings showed that the first cup had the most significant effect because caffeine levels in the blood had dropped during the night. The second and third cups caused only marginally worse hardening of the arteries.
Therefore, just have an I.V. drip giving you caffeine all night, and your caffeine levels won't drop! Problem Solved.Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
a plethora of studies is showing that longevity is not increased by aversion to risky behavior and coffeee has yet to be proven /that/ risky. The difference seems to be the quality of life in the last five to ten years or so. Eat right, exercise, don't over infdulge in vices, and you'll live at most a six months to a year longer, but the lsst five will be enjoyable.
The question you need ot ask yourself is this: do I wnat go out like: 1) the losers who sue tobacco companies after years on oxygen from emphysema becauyse of their own weakenss or 2) liek Christian Bernard who died bu the hotel pool probably smiling while ogling some 19 yearold in a bikini (he took care of himself). In sum: mortality is a given--get over it. It's how you live that will determine how you die: choose wisely. ANd above all enjoy it while you are here.
Telling me it's going to kill me without telling me why
healyourchurchwebsite.com - WWJB?
Oh, hogwash.
This is precisely the lazy outlook that has been infesting TV journalism (especially on the local level) for years now. "Gee, Biff, now those wacky scientists are saying cholesterol is good for you! Didn't they just say it was bad! Oh pshaw, I'll just ignore it all! Tee hee!"
The serious, respected newspapers of this country (NYT, WP, WSJ, LAT, MH) will always couch these kinds of "latest research" reports in plenty of CONTEXTUAL writing explaining how this fits into the larger body of scientific knowledge. Is this a revolutionary new finding? Has it been corroborated? If it appears to refute earlier results, does it really, or is that not the correct conclusion to draw? All these questions are normally left unanswered in your hometown paper, which is just dumping the press releases straight from the fax machine into the news hole without any actual editorial involvement.
Just keep this in mind as the last of the independent newspapers get bought up by public companies and start to shift to "news you can use" and big color photos.
www.fair.org, dude.
One simple rule for its versus it's
I drink a lot of Dew, The Juice of the Gods. I suppose that's a bad thing too.
The Times article says, "[This study by European Society of Cardiology in Stockholm] is the first to measure the effect of coffee on arteries."
r y_old?uid=11509481&form=6&db=m&Dopt=b
Oops. The following study by Department of Pharmacology and Therapeutics, Trinity Centre for Health Sciences and Hypertension Clinic, St James's Hospital, Dublin, Ireland, was published last month:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/htbin-post/Entrez/que
Hypertension 2001 Aug;38(2):227-31
Acute effect of caffeine on arterial stiffness and aortic pressure waveform.
Mahmud A, Feely J
Department of Pharmacology and Therapeutics, Trinity Centre for Health Sciences and Hypertension Clinic, St James's Hospital, Dublin, Ireland.
Caffeine acutely increases blood pressure and peripheral vascular resistance, in part because of sympathetic stimulation. Its effects on large artery properties are largely unknown. In a double-blind crossover study, 7 healthy subjects 26+/-2.6 years of age (mean+/-SEM) were studied for 90 minutes while in the supine position on 2 occasions separated by a week in random order after ingestion of 250 mL caffeinated (150 mg) and decaffeinated (2 mg) coffee. Compared with baseline, arterial stiffness measured by carotid femoral pulse wave velocity increased progressively from 7.2+/-0.41 to 8.0+/-0.6 m/s (P0.05) at 90 minutes after caffeine intake, an effect that may be independent of changes in blood pressure. In addition, arterial wave reflection, measured by applanation tonometry from the aortic pressure waveform, also increased from -5.7+/-7.6% to 5.28%+/-5.6 (P0.01). No such changes were seen with decaffeinated coffee intake. Although the integral of the brachial systolic and diastolic blood pressure values over the 90 minutes was larger (P0.05) after caffeinated than decaffeinated coffee intake, the effect on aortic systolic and diastolic blood pressures was more pronounced (P0.05) than on the brachial artery. These results show a significant effect of caffeine intake on arterial tone and function and suggest that caffeine acutely increases arterial stiffness.
Publication Types:
Clinical trial
Randomized controlled trial
PMID: 11509481, UI: 21400656
-nukebuddy
I'm not going to deny that coffee is addictive. But, you should take into account that you are probably severly dehydrated when you are drinking 2 cups of coffee and a 6-pack of coke a day. Most Americans are chronically dehydrated. If you just cut out most of the coffee and cokes, and drank a lot of water, you would feel a lot better. And still have your morning cup of joe! That's what I do.
It looks like Microsoft will go to any length to get rid of Java!
Kind thoughts do not change the world
This is no big deal, unless you have high blood pressure, because the effect is very temporary. The article said "one cup hardened the blood vessels for at least two hours". It's not like you are going to need bypass surgery or something.
If you have average blood pressure, or (as I do) slightly low blood pressure, then have some coffee to celebrate the news!
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I just grind and snort the beans...
Well I get to work for about 8:45 am. The people who come in at 8 am make fresh coffiee. But its cold by 8:45. But at 8:45 am, I am lucky I can walk SO I drink It aneway. After the First cup of coffiee, Then I make up a nice fresh pot of coffiee for the rest of the programers that get there at 9 am. So I have to agree, the first Cup is the worst, But hell, I can't do without it.
And since its only the first cup that is the bad one, the following 6 cups of coffiee go down great
my 2 cents plus 2 more
I'm 17.
During years between 15-17 I consumed an obnoxious amount of coke. I would at least go through a 2 liter a day. It wasn't good at all.
At one point my best friend and I (on a PHP programming spree of course) consued FOUR 2 liter bottles of coke in a 6 hour period.
During the winter of this past year I went to go Ice Skating. I was just running to the rink when all of a sudden my heart went crazy. Going 1 thousand beats per minute it felt like. I honestly thought I was having a heart attack.
My best friend felt my chest.
"Oh my god dude. We need to get help."
Well, I sat there for a few minutes and took a few deep breaths.
Ah, there we go. Kicked back in normal.
Over the period of the next 3 or 4 months, my heart would go out of beat reguraly. It would throw extra beats in here and there. It really scared me bad.
Meanwhile, to try and get it off of my mind, I drank coke and worked on the computer. Dumb mistake.
I went to the doctor and he put me on a heart monitor just to make sure my heart was acting weird. It was.
I went to the local hospital and got an EKG done. Everything _looked_ fine which was a good sign.
The doctor there says to me:
"You drink much caffeine son?"
"Well, yes, I do."
"Stop. Drinking too much caffeine causes extra electrical reactions in your heard and that is what is throwing your heart out of beat."
Man was I relieved to know what was going on.
I stopped drinking caffeine and within a week I felt back to normal again.
Thank God.
I haven't had caffeine since last November. I feel better than ever and am glad to not drink it. It's easy not to have any these days. Just say no.
hah.
Alex
Duh. Nicotine would make you a cool counter-culture rebel, or possibly one of the many rugged cowboys who live in flavour country.
C'mon, kid -- the first pack is on me . . . .
You can be highly psychologically addicted, but as far as physical addictions go, caffine is a really easy one to break. Oh, and as for smoking, my advice is to smoke a pipe. I've never seen a cigarette smoker derive as much enjoyment from a cigarette as I get from my pipe, and the time it takes means that I generally smoke about once every 2-4 weeks, never allowing myself to become addicted. Also, by puffing instead of inhaling, my lung cancer risk is also cut to near zero. It's a wonderful way to relax, if done correctly.
"The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
I have long suspected that Starbucks is, in fact, putting some sort of illegal substances in those things.
It's the only way I can think of to explain the fact that I don't just crave any coffee, but that mocha frappacino is exactly what I must have.
I've tried all the fake ones from other coffee shops... and nothing is the same. Anyone know what's in these things? Crack? I told a cop to go check them out once, but he just ignored me.
My Webcomic: Asylum on 5th Street
Ummm, ok. So never mind all those doctor recommendations to exercise and eat vegetables and fruits. Those are bad for you too. Hahahahaha! Existance is futile!
Donate background CPU time to fight cancer.
These sites are pretty annoying right wing rants, but the basic idea fuelling them is right - that there is money to be made by creating panic, and that's why newspapers (and "scientists") do it.
Film at 11
Anything good is either illegal, immoral, or fattening.
I never smoked, but I've been an addict and it's no fun. Just don't do a Barney Gumble and replace your cigs with six double tall mocha lattes!
"We kill to cure, with cures that kill" - Skinny Puppy
Can anyone recommend any good alternatives? I would like to give up caffiene, I am a very clean living person and apart from a glass of organic white wine of an evening, my morning and afternoon cup of coffee is my vice. I tried rosehip tea, but that just doesn't turn the gears for me. Any suggestions?
"We kill to cure, with cures that kill" - Skinny Puppy
You're crazy!
Dude, it's not a "giving up stuff" contest! I'm a clean living vegan, but I don't wear a badge or anything! Much less do I rub it in people's faces. If tehy want to screw their bodies up with animal flesh or drugs, it's their tough. I just silently preach with my bright eyes, near-limitless energy, clear skin and slim-for-life figure.
"We kill to cure, with cures that kill" - Skinny Puppy
Dude, I would never presume to rubbish anyone's beliefs, but why no sex? I always considered (monogamous) sex a very important part of the mental health aspect of a clean lifestyle. It promotes love, it's beautiful, and great excersise (espescially if you take up a Yoga) and it very gently releases your stress. Screw this premarital thing, though. I don't see rabbit chapels in my part of town, so I won't have that double standard!
"We kill to cure, with cures that kill" - Skinny Puppy
First, addictions are not "a liberal myth", they are documented and recognized by the World Health Organization as a sickness.
Be glad you could give up smoking, scientific evidence shows that people with addiction to nicotine just can't.
Big Tobacco was not sued because they made people addict, they are being sued because they lied about the addictive nature of their product, that is a huge difference. Liars should sued specialy if those lies harm people.
I don't know about caffeine, but if it is addictive and companies profitting from coffee products were also lying about an aledged addictivness of caffeine, then there would be plenty of justification to seek legal action against caffeine related industries.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Here in Europe theres a quote wich translates like this:
If it doesnt kill you, itll make you harder.
At least your arteries. heh.
[alarm clock. wakes up groggy]
[pours a cup of coffee]
[reads morning Slashdot stories]
Oh, shit!
[dies]
If the study showed that coffee hardened arteries, then it stands to reason that this will affect genital blood flow and cause erectile dysfunction (ED) in men and clitoral dysfunction in women.
I think cigarettes are one of the the leading causes of ED because they harden blood vessels. If the blood vessels harden, they are less likely to expand when filling with blood. Thus limp dick.
Think about that while your sucking down that next cup of coffee and puffing on that cig.
I'm not too worried since I had my first cup of coffee over 30 years ago. If it really caused that much damage I'd be dead by now.
:wq
thank God I only drink Coke ...
Pretty soon they'll tell you that sleeping is bad for your health too.
The day Microsoft creates a product that doesn't suck, it will be known as the Microsoft Vaccuum Cleaner!
I have to say that this is one of the reasons I'm happy to be young and foolish. My blood pressure's nice and low anyway. Caffeine forever!
Wierd! Me too! I theorize that the rise in blood pressure combined with the sugar and cream I liberally add (coffee is bitter!) inadvertently send the signal to my colon that it's time to excrete by suggesting to my brain that I've just had an adrenaline rush: time to dump 'n' run!. Sugar level in blood and blood pressure rise suddenly: what else is it supposed to think?
Well, that's what I get for having a highly interconnected neural network as my CPU 8^P.
DNA is a Turing machine. You, however, being dynamic and emergent, are not.
Hey, now that was prophetic signature!