Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft to Introduce GBA-competitor?
An anonymous reader writes "It seems that Nintendo will have a competition in the handheld market soon. ZDnet has an article that says Microsoft's plan to introduce a 'Media Pad' which includes among other things 'serve as a portable game player in conjunction with Microsoft's Xbox video game console.' So I guess the news I heard regarding their interest in the portable industry will soon come true, the question is, can they take the crown from Nintendo?"
They get Mario Kart Advance. Damn, that game is just too good.
This is just a brainstorm-produced idea, not based in reality, but imagine if Microsoft found some way to interface their portable not only with the Xbox, but also with PS2 and GCN? I think the best thing about the GBA is that if you go to a friend's house who has a GCN, you can just plug in as another controller with your portable. Imagine if MS's new device could plug into them all... it's not like the consoles don't already have 3rd party controllers...
~ now you know
Based on the information in the article, i doubt that this will be actual competition for the GBA. The device seems to be more of a next-generation PDA than a portable game system. It is likely that it will be far more expensive than the GBA and will cater to an entirely different market.
Still, it is encouraging to see renewed interest in the handheld gaming industry, which has been so long dormant.
lysergically yours
Intel got exclusive rights to StrongARM
since GBA is just a ARM7 + custom sound off the APB then it would not be hard to do the same sort of thing
differant enough that nitendo cant sue and developers have to recompile
but easy enought that you could have a compiler switch do all the work (except the sound and that could be redone easy enough)
really its just a way for intel to push StrongARM and StronARM2 aka Xscale
regards
john jones
So I guess the news I heard regarding their interest in the portable industry will soon come true, the question is can they take the crown from Nintendo.
Nintendo fought off both Sega and Sony, two big companies. Sony forced Sega to go software only, but we still see nintendoes everywhere. The GB audience is little kids. They know "Game Boy" better than anything MS puts out.
This article is just a slashdot crack at MS, though. "Lets point out the monopoly" article! The way the slashdot community fights with Microsoft is funny, and has quite a pattern. 'Do whatever it takes' is generally the big picture. It isn't about crappy software lately, because the government saw some monopoly qualities, that's what slashdot looks into heavily. The truth is, most people that use linux exclusively hasn't even tried Win2K, which has yet to crash or bluescreen on me. Netscape on linux, and mozilla on linux crashes more than anything on win2k for me. But I'm talking to closed minds here.
Its going to be funny when the monopoly talks die down and people start attacking MS's quality to find its stronger than the last time they used it, so their arguements are moot. Sure, XP has bugs (all new OS's do. Try and tell me that Linux 1.0 didn't crash or have bugs.), and X-Box has its share, but it is the first console released under MS's name. But by the time the monopoly craze goes away, I think you'll be surprised at where MS will be.
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
While Nintendo currently have the hand-held crown it stopped accepting developers for the GBA a long time ago claiming that 400 was enough. From the handful of decent titles I'd guess it isn't.
Microsoft will at least get those developers wanting to do handheld games but blocked-out by Nintendo.
Like the GBA it would almost certainly use an ARM chip as that's the only supported processor for Windows 'CE' 2002.
[)amien
I recokon this will have less and less of an impact here in Europe.
Handheld "consoles" are going out of fassion in favour of mobile phones that are incresingly having better games built in. Some already offer basic multi-player 'online' games. Unless M$ gets into the movile phone market, I won't predict too much.
Anyone quoted by a reporter knows how little they understand
Don't believe what you read is the truth.
Microsoft entering Gameboy's territory. This seems so crazy to me. Sure the XBox can get the older gamers, but I don't see a lot of them playing with GBAs. I saw three little kids in carts this weekend playing their GBAs and I think that shows that the GBA is really for younger kids. The XBox is really geared to an older audience, wherease the GBA and the Gamecube have offerings for a younger audience.
I haven't seen a viable comepetitor to the Gameboy in long time. Last I saw was the Sega Game thingy and maybe that Playstation portable some guy hacked together. Now Gameboy has a huge library of established hits to really provide a barrier to new entries. Any new entrants to the portable game console market are in for a rough time.
I guess this is what you do with a $36 Billion dollar war chest. They're gonna need it.
To me it looks more like a Universal Remote / Terminal / Control Every God Damn Thing In The House than a dedicated game machine. Somehow I doubt Nintindo has much to worry about. It sounds like the form factor is going to be more tablet like, and that's not the most ergonomic thing to play portable games on (not to mention its going to be huge compared to GBA... Etch-a-sketch huge). And its not like you're going to be able to drop $100 for one for each of the kids. Plus, how happy are you going to be when you lose some functionality of your MS TV Thingy when the nipper's taken its remote control to school to play a little Halo during his lunch hour?
The DC memory cartridges that you can stick in the controller to hold save games can also hold mini-games downloaded from the DC console (which some DC games had right on the disc). Then you can play these little games on a little monochrome screen with a Gameboy like unit (direction + button A + button B). Really, it was kind of pathetic, but cool in a weird way.
;)
I hope this isn't what they have in mind.
Please mod this post only if you think others should/n't read this. I have enough ego^H^H^Hkarma. Thanks!
the question is can they take the crown from Nintendo
I seriously doubt it. Nintendo is particularly GOOD at what they do, especially when it comes to handhelds. Just look at the staying power of the original gameboy. Even to this day, they're still selling, pretty much the original gameboy (with much improved battery life, size, screen, etc)..
Competition is always good, but MS' product will need to completely blow away the GBA (and then some) to compete -- let's not forget that the original 4 colour gameboy sompletely outsold Sega's technologically superior (at the time)Gamegear.
...handheld emulation. I've got some of that on my Jornada 720, but not much.
I'd love to see Nintendo/Sony/Microsquish/Whatever come out with a hand-held unit that runs a version of Mame, and the company goes out and buys licenses to all those old arcade games I love. Package'em half-a-dozen to a cartridge (yeah, you'll get one popular one [Pac-Man], a couple of so-so, then three scrubs, but it'll get the cash revenue going). Think: zero development costs, small license/media costs, and profits all around.
That would be sweet. Now throw in GB/GBA/NES/SNES emulation as well - hoody hoo! (Ok, why should Nintendo license their old games to MS? Because they aren't selling many of the old ones nowadays, are they?)
Anyone think this has a chance?
It was only a matter of time before they started doing this. There are no more general-user niches to fill in software anymore that Microsoft doesn't already have. Moreover, you can't really pirate hardware like you can software.
Plus, if Linux is going to do anything it's push down the OS cost and also the cost of general server aps, potentially to the point of them being so close to free that MS can't make much money off them at the point of sale.
The move to hardware is a bit of a no-brainer. I'm surprised it took them this long to realize it. What'll be scary is if they succeed in using this to enforce new software protocols. THAT would be scary.
-------------------------------------------------
charlton heston is more of a man than yo
Hmmm...
.NET in the article. It occurs to me that this device could well be made to provide Office Suite functions in a proprietary way only through the use of .NET. I just can't help but think of Microsoft's recent forays into hardware as a grand scheme to enforce use of their software...
on a second read-through i noticed a somewhat sinister mentioning of
buyers beware.
lysergically yours
I remember ten years ago working at a Babbages, playing California Games on an Atari Lynx. Backlit, 4096 colors, and a hell of alot of fun.
I'd be willing to pump more batteries in the damn thing if it meant I could see the screen.
The GBA is completely unusable (including with the aftermarket add on front lights) in anything but very bright conditions, which is something that I think they should be a little more truthful about (i.e. in the commercial where the guy is playing in a church: Fat chance).
Before you Slashbots out there start droning away the thoughts of The Hive, just a word of caution: Don't scoff at the stuff Microsoft does(except maybe Bob ;) ). That'll only make them more likely to succeed. Take it ultimately as a serious threat to your freedom and respond to it as such.
In my humble opinion, I was expecting a very "big" announcement from Apple (Steve Jobs) today -- it looks like MS has, once again, taken over.
Karma stuck at 50? Add 2-5 inches.. err.. 2-5x Karmas Count to your pen1es.. err.. Karma all naturally and private
I don't know about other people's connectivity, but my cable modem connection is a bit flaky at times. Reguardless of how valuable or useful it may be, is Microsoft going to solve the problem bad ISP's? How is the average consumer going to know the cause is the ISP and not the device?
The idea of a mobile computing device that acts as a game, computer and universal remote is pretty cool. High end audio, video, entertainment systems are similar though very expensive.
Are people willing to reboot their DSL/Cable modem to get their universal remote to work, or will they pick up the other remote?
"The GB audience is little kids. They know "Game Boy" better than anything MS puts out."
I disagree about that.
I'm getting to the point of being annoyed with people immediately saying "Nintendo == Kids".
There are plenty of games that are just plain fun. Who cares what your friends think if you play a nintendo game if it's fun?
I own a Gamecube, and a Gameboy Advance (That I bought because of the linking feature with the gamecube) and I don't regret it.
I'm a 23 year old computer game enthusiast. I own Super Mario Kart advance, Super Mario advance, Doom, and even Monster Rancher advance.
In short, if it's fun play it. If your worried about what your friends think, don't. But don't call it "kiddie" which really doesn't mean anything.
I don't think that MS would have any serious trouble taking Nintendo's portable crown here. The GBA is, IMHO, several years behind the times. Remember the Sega portable? Now that was ahead of it's time. The color was great, and you could even get a TV adapter for it. If MS wanted to make a serious run at the GBA, I can all but guarantee victory. At least, it'll be a lot easier than the console market.
Synergy is your friend
And join the rest of us here in the real world. Microsoft will never produce anything to take the "crown" away from Nintendo in the portable market. Also, GameCube, given 1 or maybe even 2 years to mature, will prove itself as the dominant game console. Anyone who's played the consoles knows this. Oh and no, playing PIKIMIN or whatever in a Wal-Mart doesn't count. I'm talking about comparing comparable games, like Madden or Crazy Taxi, both released on several systems.
~ now you know
Nintendo owns the handheld market. The Game Boy has more games than any other system currently out (PS2 included), and has all of Nintendo's mascots. The GBA is cheap and has great games. (Nintendo made the most money of any video game publisher in 2000, too, even with the release of the PS2 and Dreamcast, all because of the Game Boy Color).
I think the XBOX has a shot at taking the older gamers, but the handhend will remain Nintendo's for a long time.
I'm getting to the point of being annoyed with people immediately saying "Nintendo == Kids".
I never said that Nintendo==Kids. I said that the audience that nintendo strives for for the gameboy is kids. I had an N64, and I think Nintendo has the best games ever (every game is fun, regardless of the title).
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
I wonder if these people will change their focuse when this is released. :)
Everywhere you look MSFT decide to make something for that arena, from handhelds to of course desktops.
Only exception is Linux...
Matt
Given the size of the X-Box controller, will this be another controller that only works for people with hands the size of Andre the Giant's hands?
--
"Open source is good." - Steve Jobs
"Open source is evil." - Microsoft
Bill
The GBA has a beautiful (if dim) display, fantastic graphic capabilities for its size, runs on 2 AA batteries, and cost me $90. This vaporware device from MS isn't even close, and I don't think it's intended to be.
:-( And profit margins can't be too great with Visor units nearing the $100 mark. Then again, we know MS isn't always interested in short term profitability--not that they should be. If taking a loss for a couple years rewards them with 75% market share 3 or 4 years down the line, it's worth it. Witness IE--they provided it for free simply to blow the (admittedly poor) competition into oblivion. They've been >80% successful in this endeavor.
I have to agree that it looks like an attempt to get into the PDA market. Honestly, I'm surprised it's taken MS this long to make a push for it. A device like this would be convenient, popular, and completely proprietary. One has to wonder if they're a bit late getting into the market, though. Most people who want a PDA already have one--except me.
Wait and see, wait and see, I s'pose...
One of the reasons that I became a lawyer was to avoid ever having to hire one. -SPYvSPY
Unless they fall asleep at the wheel, the screen has to be better. My eyes almost fell out after a short time of playing with the GBA.
I'm a 23 year old computer game enthusiast. I own Super Mario Kart advance, Super Mario advance, Doom, and even Monster Rancher advance.
In short, if it's fun play it. If your worried about what your friends think, don't. But don't call it "kiddie" which really doesn't mean anything.
Friends?
By the Sega Portable, I assume you are referring to the "Game Gear."
It wasn't ahead of its time in the least, seeing that it was almost the exact same thing as the Sega Master System, only smaller.
The handheld system, IMO, that was ahead of its time was the Atari Lynx, as it was a 16-Bit handheld in the era of 16-Bit home consoles.
Game Gear and Game Boy were both 8-Bit systems.
Really, both the Game Gear and Lynx were superior
to the original Game Boy in just about everything
but battery life, but I'd say that only the Lynx
was "ahead of its time."
There was also a portable version of the Turbo
Grafx 16, IMO... but I don't know much about it.
I don't remember if it did have a backlit screen.
Sega later did release the "Nomad," which was essentially the same as the Genesis and also the "Genesis CD-X" which was a console that combined
the Genesis and Sega CD into one unit that was
about the size of a portable music CD player for the day, only about twice as thick.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
First: I'm not antiMS. I really don't like windows, and I really don't like MS's business practices, but that doesn't mean that I think all their products are bad: I like their hardware, I like their games, I think IE is a good browser, etc. So don't take this as a blind antiMS rant.
But I am absolutely sick of Microsoft expanding into so many territories. Why? Because they don't care about what they already produced.
Windows, it has a huge reputation of being unstable, but MS doesn't really do anything about it being unstable. Since they have basically control over the desktop market, they really don't bother to care about the end user.
Xbox, I have heard nothing but complaints about this thing. The 40% defunct rate, the horrible controllers. I remember hearing about how bad the controllers were from many different articles when Xbox was first debuted at E3 or wherever. And yet microsoft didn't care enough to change them.
/shrug.
I don't know. I'm done ranting.
"when life gets complicated, I like to take a nap in a tree and wait for dinner" - Hobbes.
Yes, mine are fine how are yours?
Link up Super Circuit brings back the days of the good old Super Mario Kart on SNES.
On the Gamecube we have Super Smash Bros. Melee, arguably one of the best party games ever.
I saw three little kids in carts this weekend playing their GBAs and I think that shows that the GBA is really for younger kids.
Yeah, I'm sure that's a representative sample. Man, the logic in these posts keeps getting wackier and wackier. Well, I was playing my GBA this weekend, and I think that shows that the GBA is really for 20 somethings.
--Steven
With a name liked "MediaPad" they will not be taking the handheld gaming market from GameBoy Advanced any time soon.
What twelve year old kid is going to want to own a MediaPad?
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I support spreading santorum
(sarcasm) This is what we do. We all just give up. We capitulate to microsoft universal rule. Every product everywhere shall be microsoft produced. Eliminate all competition for microsoft. Maybe then they will reach that ever-elusive goal of actually releasing a product to the market that works. (/sarcasm) ... oops.. seems the sarcasm section should have ended one sentence earlier...
What could Microsofts weakness be? What do SONY and Microsoft have in common that Nintendo does not?
Their first priority is to DRM and content control. Microsoft is betting on BIG deals with the RIAA and MPAA member companies. Put simply they can't piss them off.
So what should Nintendo do? Simple. Modify the gamecube to play DVDs from any region. Make sure the DVD decoding is totally controled by one EASILY removable chip that is accessable by simply lifting a simple panel.
Won't the MPAA sue? You bet they will and it will be great for Nintendo. When the MPAA sues Nintendo they should convert to region based chips to signify cooperation.
This is a quadrupal win for Nintendo.
- They get free advertising as the "hackers" console
- They have an easily upgradable (to region free) chip
- They have a referance chip to reverse engineer. If Nintendo does it right there will be a half dozen aftermarket upgrades in a month.
- They have plausable deniability.
Now the DVD argument is moot. And the vaster game base from Xbox is countered by a hassle free, region free, dvd player built into Game Cube. Kick in the name recognition and Nintendo can relax and watch Microsoft DRM itself out of existance.I'd buy a GameCube DVD, wouldn't you?
Novel theory: Modern Man evolved from psychopath
Now if they can just make a screen that's not as reflecitve as the GBA screen so I can see what I am playing.
http://www.kubuntu.org/
"Microsoft anonunced that it will 500,000 units avalible for the launch....."
1 Mo later...
Inital reports of the microsoft mobile gaming device is a success, they were all sold out within a 3 weeks of inital release, unfortunatly, 450,000 were returned as defective units
I will bend your mind with my spoon
I dropped my $30 or so for Super Mario Advanced, which is a graphically improved Mario Brothers (yeah, the OLD arcade game that got rereleased on the NES later), and a slightly tweaked Super Mario Brothers 2.
Super Mario Advanced is the same Mario Brothers game for multiplayer, with Super Mario World as the mario game.
Mario Kart Advanced is a rerelease of the SNES Super Mario Kart.
I bought Dragon Warrior I & II for the Game Boy Color (to play on my GBA), rereleases of the old NES games.
The NES/SNES games are being rereleased for the GBC/GBA. Some GB (pre-color) are still on the market. I almost grabbed my first generation ones when visiting my folks, but figured I'd rather not sour their memory by replaying them. (Some NES/SNES games have had their memory ruinned for me by emulation)...
Unlike other companys, Nintendo doesn't truly abandon software... they rerelease it for handhelds later on. I'm sure that the Game Boy Super Advanced will be 3D and have N64 ports, and the Game Boy Super Duper Advanced will have some Game Cube ports.
Regardless, as another post set, the GBA is a great handheld for older gamers. It has 2D side-scrollers, RPGs, etc. All the games (and STYLE of games) that you loved on a NES/SNES are being released here, while the gaming market has moved on.
My parents loved the Atari, and would play my NES while I was asleep and found it frustrating. They couldn't handle the finger twitching of the NES.
I find that my Gamecube pushes my reflexes, and I doubt that I'll be able to keep up for much longer. When my kids are playing their systems 2 generations from now, I'm going to feel over the hill, while I did really well on my NES/SNES/SMS/S-Genny... N64 I was average, and now I'm over the hill.
Oh well,
Alex
P.S. If you live in a city and commute on a subway... GBA is great.
How will microsoft ever top the famous ding of the gameboy starting up? I mean, I've heard it so many times, it's music to my ears.
Ding... Ahh.. I've had my fix for the day.
=================
Unix is very user friendly, it's just picky about who its friends are.
What about price? They said this will be larger than a Pocket PC, but smaller than a tablet PC.
... I think there's a 27" flat HDTV you can get for less than that now -- throw in a nice DVD player to make it an even G. That's also as much or less than your joe sixpack PC.
Pocket PCs are $500 still, and tablet PCs are expected to run up to $2000 a whack. What's this puppy going to cost you? $1000? Too much
This is also more than just a gaming device too.
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I see no evidence that Nintendo is interested in anything other than TV and handheld game machines. They are not interested in DVD's, MP3's, the web or other multimedia/general computing unlike Microsoft. Granted, Microsoft has dipped it's feet in the game industry with the X-Box, but everyone who's reviewed it has something negative to say and with good reason.
Microsoft focused on the fastest processor, most amount of memory, lots of storage (for caching and game saves) which is important in the computer market but not necessarily in the game market. Console Game players are interested in the playability/funness factor of a game over the graphics/specs of the game. Take Halo (Xbox) for example, it's nice looking and could be lots of fun, but it just screams for a mouse and keyboard. It needs lots of buttons (all the time) and it needs a FPS movement that only a mouse in "mouselook" mode can really deliver on. Where as if you look at Luigi's Mansion (GameCube) you use very few controls (all the time) and it's movement is very natural for a "gamepad" controller, it would not be natural for a keyboard and mouse. Microsoft's mistake is taking what they know about computers and trying to apply that to a console, whereas Nintendo has been in business since 1951 and started selling video games in 1971, in that tine they have learned a thing or two about making a fun, playable game. This is one market Microsoft will NOT dominate in.
Nothing for end users? Used XP? It's great and very stable. It runs on my Thinkpad T23 I use for work that hasn't been turned off in 3 months. It finally blue screened the other day when Shockwave had a fight with the video driver (bad vid driver..way old driver). Try again. Not everyone still runs Win95.
40% defunct rate on XBox? WTF?! There was a story the other day where less than 1% were defective. That's about right. They only shipped like 1.5 million of them. Bet you couldn't get them all perfect either.
The idea of a company is to make money. That's it. It's not to make the world a happy place. If you don't like what they sell, don't buy. Sorry Slashdot, but people need money to pay bills and get food. I'd like to honestly know how many Slashdot posters are living on their parent's dime at college.
I bought a Cube the day they came out and love it. I didn't buy an XBox because I didn't think they'd do well. Well, my wife got me one for Christmas and I LOVE IT. It just seems to be a better overall system than the Cube. I love Nintendo, remember many days playing my NES. I collect consoles and have almost every one ever made....
But, the XBox is good. It does DVD. Almost every game supports widescreen. It has Dolby Digital sound. Why oh why does the Cube not do Dolby Digital? You haven't lived until you've played Halo with DD5.1. It uses it better than almost any movie....
The article is pretty insiteful and true to boot.
It's like the saying "That which doesn't kill us, makes us stronger". So yes, eaxh build gets better and better - Just because Nintendo has a brand name doesn't mean that a contender can't come in and make a name for themselves. Microsoft has come under fire and is watched under a magnifying glass now.
Would this same article have appeared here id AOL/Time Warner were to come out with their own versions of a hand held?
Sure, it's Microsoft, but I think the days of monopolistic methods by them are over - too many critics out there to pull any shenenagins again - I look forward to the competition coming up on handhelds - it's better for the consumer in the long term.
_ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
Yeah, the stuff about content control was amusing. Since when has that been an issue with consoles? Oh, he means from now on!! Speculation! We`ll see.
Think about who plays the GBA right now. I see them mostly in the hands of kids between 7 and 12 years old. These kids are not going to care enough about the extra features Microsoft wants to have in this device. If Microsoft sells them at huge losses to compete with the $90 price of a GBA, they can do that. But even then, they will have to recover the cost somehow, which means game costs will be higher than the $20-40 for GBA games. Sure, some spoiled brats can afford that or whine enough to get their parents to buy it. But most parents are going to put their foot down. Older kids might steel some market share from Nintendo, but as it stands right now, Microsoft isn't likely to steal the portable audience from Nintendo.
The Xbox tends to be an enterteinment center, capable of doing games, DVD, Internet and more. The Gamecube does only games, but does them nicely.
Same is with Mira vs. GBA. Mira tends to do many home-entertainment things. GBA is for playing.
See? Same difference. I think Nintendo will do fine, for the time being.
Sigged!
Of course the collarilary to their "wins" would be that they would never be allowed to sell such a device (could never get the DVD licenses for a device with easily removable regioning), they would defeat their copy-protections measures which depends partly on only having those little disks, and people would contiunally break the panel and the easily removable chips pushing or fry the whole system with untrusted third party mod-chips which would push their support costs sky high. Yea great move. Nintendo has better things to do then completely tank the Gamecube. Besides who says the market cannot support three similar systems. None of the companies are bad finically like Sega was and all are determined to stay in the market. It may not of worked in the past but past performance of the market is no indication of future results. Or so says the SEC.
If you've played the Quake port to the iPaq, you'd be wondering why this hasn't happened sooner. The graphics capability on the iPaq BLOWS the GBA away. Even with the GameShark, the GBA's screen is practically useless anywhere other than standing on the sun. Games, schmames. It's all in the development effort. If its easier to build games for XBox, the games will come. As that freaky voice guy said in Field of Dreams, 'If you build it, they will come'. If MS can one-up the GBA with better graphics capability, you'll be certain to see a catalogue of games grow behind it.
I'm just waiting for MS to buy out Nintendo and port all of the games to X-Paq/XBox/XPad. Maybe Sega had the right idea all along...
I think the big problem with this idea is that anyone who thinks of portable gaming will immediately think "Gameboy", even the old folks, because that's been the standard since 1985 and it's still going today. Market recognition is a huge factor in this.
As a little anecdote, I walked into a Future Shop yesterday with a buddy to buy his PS2. This guy doesn't follow the news much, but still he loves games and rents stuff all the time. Well this 'buddy' thought the XBox was compatible with both PS2 and GCN software.. why ? because that's what he heard from his idiot coworkers and friends, and there was little or no media coverage to bring light on the new console.
We see PS2 ads all over the place : TV, movie theatres, and they have large displays in most stores. The Gamecube might not need that much publicity, since Nintendo is an established household name wherever kids are to be found, going hand-in-hand with Pokemon. But Microsoft ? We know M$, but does my mother-in-law know M$ ? Hell no, she probably thinks Windows _IS_ the computer, and that it's made by Dell or Compaq. Why does she not understand this ? Because you don't see many Microsoft products at Mallwart, Costco or any other non-PC store. Gates' company may very well be a cornerstone of modern computing, but outside that realm they are the new kid on the block for every other market segment.
That's why they have no chance of dethroning Nintendo, not today.. perhaps in ten or fifteen years.
-Billco, Fnarg.com
This doesn't sound like the XBOY, of which there have been some rumors circulating for about a year now. This sounds bigger.. But the way the Slashdot article puts it "GBA competitor".. I don't know. The original ZDNet article makes it sound more like a super powered remote control or PDA - not a handheld game console..
At this rate, we'll need another dozen years or so before appropriate legislation is forthcoming. Bill Gates as the Rockerfeller of the Desktop is not a pleasant a picture as some would like. And yet there are many who are sentimental and nostalgic for those times, which were not bad if you were upperclass.
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
If they give it a backlit screen.... yes
Yes, that was funny. Yes, IE is dominant, but Netscape is still around. No, that was not relevant, in any way, to the discussion about game consoles.
~ now you know
Nintendo has already sold several million gamecubes both in the USA and Asia, the launch sales alone have ensures that Nintendo will do well from the cube.
Why on earth would nintendo redo the cube from the start to include DVD playback (everything from a new box up), bringing with it the rampant piracy problems the ps1 did suffer from the and ps2 is starting to have.
Nintendo need only one thing to carry on doing well for years to come - games, and they make great ones at nice profit margins for them.
Microsoft are spending $500Million at marketing the X-Box? Sony are still out-selling them today with the 18month old PS2 selling at the same pricepoint as X-box, and the Gamecube is outselling it worldwide too im sure since Nintendo successfully carried out a launch in both Asia and the USA when Microsoft obviously hasn't heard of other continents yet.
People forget the largest computer games market in the world is Japan, and there the X-box hasn't made a scratch yet. It will be 2 years or more before anyone knows the real winners in this round of the console wars, but right now the winner is Sony - profitable with PS2, everything from this point onwards is just extra cash for them. Whether Microsoft managed to scrape back the initial outlay they have done is probable, but not a certainty.
"The barrier to entry is very high, so new competitors will be few and far between"
What about Indrema?
(see subject of this post)
"After seeing their latest offerings (the N64 and Gamecube) lose money hand over fist,"
N64, perhaps (but keep in mind even then they were able to hold their own even with no real third-party developers). But GameCube?
"Nintendo finally learned that their core competency was in creating mediocre handheld gaming systems,"
"Finally?" Nintendo has known since at least the early N64 era that Game Boy is its bread and butter and has gone after intrusions into the market with a vengeance. Towards the end of the N64's life-cycle in Japan, we saw all sorts of accessories to connect the Game Boy Color to the N64, from the Transfer Pak that came out with Pokemon Stadium in the US to the cable that connects the game link port on the GBC to a controller port on the N64 (attatching the GBA to the GameCube isn't a new idea).
And also note that the GBA is their first backwards-compatible anything. Again, trying to tap into their bread-and-butter.
"and blaming a dearth of features on the "compromises" they needed to make in order to accomodate the handheld form factor."
It's not just the form factor they were trying to fit into, but the price factor as well. iPaqs are real nice and have all sorts of bells and whistles, but they also cost over five times as much. It's enough to make you want to play it but not so much you're afraid of breaking it.
And these "compromises" has given us a 32-bit system that does 2-D graphics better even than a Sega Saturn (let alone a PSX). It fits in the palm of my hand and it costs less than a PS One. Not too shabby in my book.
"Unfortunately, Nintendo's poor business sense and lack of R&D has finally caught up to them. They are fighting an 800-lb gorilla that has billion$ of dollars to spend on dominating every area of the market that it enters. And it looks like Microsoft is about to release a very versatile, multipurpose handheld device that will blow all of Nintendo's offerings right out of the water."
If Microsoft is an 800# gorilla, then when it comes to handhelds Nintendo must me a man with a machine gun. This isn't the console market, where the dominant player rotates every generation. We're talking about Game Boy, the Ali of the gaming world. I can think of no less than seven handheld systems offered by six different companies with all sorts of advantages (both real an imagined) that got smacked down by Game Boy and smacked down HARD! The closest thing to a second place I've seen in the field is Sega's Game Gear, and half the people that have posted here don't even remember its name.
And even before anybody thought of a hand-held video game system (where "anybody" means Gumpei Yokoi), guess who dominated the hand-held electronic games market? That's right, still Nintendo and their Game & Watch line. They've been around so long that the associated patent on a plus-shaped directional pad terminated only shortly before Sega made their Dreacast controller.
In today's world, when was the last time you saw a dominant anything that's been on the throne for over a decade? If you ask me, Microsoft would have a better chance of breaking into the CPU business. At least we've seen that there's room for competition there.
I have tried Win2K, it took several hours to install, due to it freezing randomly while trying to load drivers for every piece of PC hardware in existence (so it seemed anyway) and then was massively unstable whenever I tried to use it, ending up with me installing Win98 back over it. My machine is a stock PIII-500, bought at the end of 1999, without any esoteric hardware at all, and after the hassles I had and the financial loss of buying said junk and it being useless to me I refuse ever to give Microsoft my money again.
Does a Christian soccer team even need a goalkeeper?
agreed on all points.
_______
2B1ASK1
And Microsoft is releasing this handheld for free? Or giving it away with every copy of Windows?
Neglecting the lessons of history is one thing, but learning the difference between history and the present is also important.
Ahem.
I think there is an argument to be made that having a de facto monopoly and engaging in monopolistic (read unreasonable) business practices are not always the same thing. And I don't expect the monopolistic business practices, such as they are to go away any time soon. Although, I'll agree with you that trying to open new markets is not necessarily a monopolistic business practice; and it's also true that even if they deserved it, MS probably will not ever get a fair shake here on /.
I do agree that the last few iterations of commercial varieties of Windows have made massive strides in reliability. Of course, the security is pretty bad as is demonstrated about every few days.
Netscape on Linux, yeah, that's been disappointing since the days of 3.0; but Konqueror and Opera both run very nicely and Opera is downright fast.
Oops
Second, win2000 does crash. My wife crashed it last night with just a single instance of realplayer running. Granted it didn't 'blue screen' but accepting no input and just plain freezing is not quite the advancement in stability you talk about. I will concede that MS has done better with 2000 and I assume with XP as well. But guess what? So has linux. Linux bashers used it 1-2 years ago and they still cry 'no-user-friendly-apps'. Guess what? Linux has evolved faster than anything out there including windows. You talked about Netscape and Mozilla... Ever tried Galeon? Konqueror (in it's new incarnation) ? Just as windows has evolved to be more 'stable' (as you say), Linux has just gotten better. Try evolution..., galeon..., staroffice...
And yes I dual boot to win2000. Actually, I have it on my laptop. The last time I used it was quite a while ago. Why? well, I can't get a lot of features in IE that i get in galeon. Tabbed-view. Bookmark-management..
You are right, Linux proponents can't always use "it's more stable" arguement to the same affect as before. But Linux is still a lot more stable. Windows is just catching up. And on the flip side, Windows-proponents can't use the "It's non use-friendly" arguement anymore. In fact, everytime i boot to windows, i feel boxed-in with the lack of tools and options that i boot right back to linux. you should give a recent distribution a try. you'll be surprized.
(This is so off-topic it's silly. But I'm posting it anyway.)
The simple fact is, however, that Microsoft is not only a monopoly, but a maker of horrid products.
I agree that their products are pretty unpleasant-- ugly, clumsy, tasteless-- but I think the quality argument is getting weaker and weaker across the board.
I've been using a Windows 2000 system on my desk at work for over a year. The OS has never crashed in that time.
I own an iBook that I've had since September. I've been running OS X on it since that time, and it hasn't crashed on me, either.
I also have a dual-processor G4 at work. It's never crashed, either.
It's not all that hard to find a Windows or a Mac OS computer these days that has never crashed. The classic argument for Linux-- it doesn't crash-- isn't a very strong one these days.
In fact, in my world, Linux is less reliable than Windows 2000 or OS X. I spent several hours last week debugging a USB problem on one of my coworker's workstations. Whenever he plugged in his USB-serial adapter, the machine would kernel panic. Turns out some driver modules were loading in the wrong order. Yes, it's good that I had everything I needed to fix it myself. But it's bad that I had to.
I'm not trashing Linux in particular; I'm just saying that PC-class software quality overall has improved dramatically in the past two years. I think Linux advocates are going to need a new killer argument.
"Xbox has two things that Game cube dosn't. DVD playback capability,"
Customers that want DVD playback capability as well as GameCube games can get the Panasonic Q. And like the PS2 (and UNLIKE the XBox), it will play DVDs out of the box.
"and an easy, low effort revenue stream for successful Win PC game makers."
As has been repeated ad nauseum, there is no such thing as an easy way to transition from PC to console game writing. No patches, no add-ons, no expansion packs, not even a real operating system. Making a dent in the console world requires a different philosophy than in the PC world. Once a game is released, it had better be self-contained and done.
Besides, how many PC gamers do you know of that, if given the chance, would buy an Xbox and however many games instead of a shiny new PC?
Some day MS will have control over your PC, TV, Game Console, Remote, Handheld, Frig, Toaster, Oven, Car, toys, and much more.
Microsoft continues it's monopolistic ways by developing new technologies that they themselves may not make, but what will run it? The OS.
So many people still continue to over look this nightmare while Microsoft's tentacles continue to plunge into new areas feeding a machine that may never be over powered.
I don't understand how some folks can set back and say that we are just flaming MS. This is truly something that should scare anyone. Not only as a consumer, but a human.
Just think, this may be some what OT, but how much of our information is passed through Microsoft software. One company in the world that in some way touches your life, whether you like it our not.
I look at it as a cause. I'll use Linux, play my PS2, and maybe this weekend buy a GBA.
God Moving Over the Face of Waters
What does BSOD look like on a 2" LCD?
Give me my freedom, and I'll take care of my own security, thank you.
Isn't that a monopoly?
Think about what you wish for...
No, that isn't what *I* wish for. Neither do I want M$ on every desktop. I simply want a software market free of underhanded manipulation. I want to buy a PC with either (or neither) OS without wondering what signed-in-blood contracts MS may have or had with the OEM's
I want a market where the competition truly is on quality, not who can throw the largest bribes around.
I've said before in many posts I happen to like Microsoft's products. Just not their practices.
GTRacer
- Think you're in shape? Try DDR on Catastrophic...
Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
I am not saying that a Palm could be competion to a GBA, but they could have easily given a nod to the gaming market and it wouldn't have hurt it in any way that I can see.
Yes I know that you can use the other buttons, but that is really a sloppy solution to a simple problem.
Lasers Controlled Games!
The device seems to be more of a PDA to rival the Palm and others than a rival to the Gameboy. Its primary focus is not gameplay. Even MS themselves says in the article:
As such, Mira would mirror many functions of personal digital assistants (PDAs), such as devices based on Microsoft's Pocket PC operating sytem.
Most people would die sooner than think; in fact, they do.
Hmmm.. a noisy hand held device that remotely talks to my computer. Yep, if i get one I'm calling it Ziggy.
"Derp de derp."
With the $100 price difference between the Cube and the xbox, we were able to buy a DVD player in addition to our Cube and still rack up a total price of less than the xbox alone would have cost. Not to mention that to some gamers (or their parents) $200 seems a lot more reasonable than $300 - for a system without games. In addition, many people had DVD players before the purchased a game system, meaning they don't even need to use the DVD playback option on their game systems.
Most people would die sooner than think; in fact, they do.
Though this device appears to be more of a PDA than a game machine, it makes sense from MS's pov to come out with sich a thing.
I'm betting a version of this, configured more as a game handheld will follow.
Microsoft's domination of the software industry depends on their being able to cut off the "air supply" of compeditors. Leaving the handheld market to Nintendo gives them revenue that they can use to fund their competition (game cube) to the MS X Box.
It's just an application of MS's playbook in the PC industry. This is why MS makes Mac apps, since people DO use Macs, they MUST have them using MS Office, not another app that might end up ported to `Doze and compete.
This is why MS is fighting Linux tooth and nail. They can't afford it getting too large, so that it's a big enough market to fund non-MS app software development.
=== The price of freedom is eternal vigilance
I wonder if the device will sport a version of the Microsoft eBook reader. The REB-1100 is nice for portability, but the .rb format is not common. It would be nice to have a portable device that could read eBooks in a more common (though microsoft) format.
-- Minds are like parachutes... they work best when open.
Don't scoff at the stuff Microsoft does(except maybe Bob ;) )
Hey, now - I liked Bob! It was the best damned screensaver ever for Windows!
Sounds like conspiracy to commit fraud against the MPAA, or conspiracy to circumvent the DMCA to me.
I think a better plan would be to get more games that appeal to a wider range of people, & don't charge an arm and a leg for them.
The (Hopefully) Great Slashdot Blackout Apr 21-27
So they launch something that's *tied to* the xbox, that's just a terminal for the xbox, and that doesn't fit in a pocket (or so the zdnet article says), and it's a 'GBA competitor'? Perhaps people could read the articles before posting them, and before commenting on them?
I apologize for the lack of a signature.
Personally, I'm fed up of random lusers from the interent....
Coming from an AC, that statement seems to lack a certain credibility....
Intel got exclusive rights to StrongARM
Nintendo got exclusive rights to Atlantis
since GBA is just a ARM7 + custom sound off the APB
Wrong. The GBA programming model includes a 16.78 MHz ARM7TDMI, plus custom chips that do DMA (that is, hardware-accelerated memcpy()), legacy tone generation, sound FIFOing, pulse-width modulation, and background and sprite scrolling, scaling, and rotation. (Read More...)
different enough that nitendo cant sue and developers have to recompile but easy enought that you could have a compiler switch do all the work
Sorry, it's not as easy as a recompile of a program that uses the Allegro library. The graphics subsystems may be too different. AFAIK, Windows CE devices use only a dumb frame buffer; GBA has six modes, three character graphics modes (some include affine mapping) with up to 128 sprites on top, and three framebuffer modes with up to 128 sprites on top.
(except the sound and that could be redone easy enough)
Heck, Nintendo even calls the GBA's FIFO-based sound system "Direct Sound," no relation to Microsoft's DirectSound.
Will I retire or break 10K?
I have been waiting for two years for a rechargable color pocket pc that does MP3 & "real" games. That's everything. Those are all the "killer apps" I need for a portable (assuming 6gb+ of storage) Hell, make it a phone as well, and I'm in heaven. One device to rule them all!
Link up Super Circuit brings back the days of the good old Super Mario Kart on SNES.
And some of the bugs in both implementation and specification.
On the Gamecube we have Super Smash Bros. Melee
I agree that SSB2 is the best thing since SSB1 (the Mario Party games suck eggs), but unlocking half the hidden stuff requires unlocking all the hidden characters, and one of the characters requires playing 1,000 Vs. matches at 5 minutes a piece. Is this just a way to get players to buy more controllers when they wear out?
Will I retire or break 10K?
I'd buy a plain old GameCube too, and already have. A surprising number of people don't give a rat's ass about DVD on a game console. Nintendo is still doing what it has always done, build a solid gaming console. Nintendo knows their market and caters to them.
the question is, can they take the crown from Nintendo?
Yeah, easy - just build a color screen you can play without a light.
I'm a 2000 man.
region free is marginally useful for those who live in the United States. Most movies come out first in the USA anyways and are reasonably cheap.
So what should Nintendo do? Simple. Modify the
gamecube to play DVDs from any region. Make sure
the DVD decoding is totally controled by one
EASILY removable chip that is accessable by simply
lifting a simple panel.
How is this simple? What you're suggesting would require a COMPLETE redesign of the Cube hardware.
That's a nice little pipe dream you have there, but it's not going to happen. If you want a DVD player, buy a DVD player. Don't expect Nintendo to spend millions on R&D for a Gamecube 2.0 and risk making an enemy of Big Media just so you don't have to spend $200 for a separate DVD unit at Best Buy.
While Nintendo currently have the hand-held crown it stopped accepting developers for the GBA a long time ago claiming that 400 was enough. From the handful of decent titles I'd guess it isn't.
Just because you can't sign up for Wario World (Nintendo's official developer support program) doesn't mean you can't develop GBA games and get published with one of the Tier-B publishers. If you want to get into GBA development, get yourself VisualBoyAdvance and GCC targeted for ARM7TDMI and start hacking. Then you can try your games on hardware with an MBV2 cable or Flash Advance Linker from Lik-Sang
Like the GBA it would almost certainly use an ARM chip as that's the only supported processor for Windows 'CE' 2002.
ARM or MIPS or PowerPC or x86 makes little difference compared to the graphics chip. Nintendo's GBA supports up to 128 sprites on top of four layers of scrolling, two layers of scrolling and one layer of rotation, two layers of rotation, or a bitmap. IIRC, Windows CE devices have only a bitmap and no hardware sprites, not even one for a mouse pointer because most of them are pen-based.
Will I retire or break 10K?
How do you go from:
serve as a portable game player in conjunction with Microsoft's Xbox video game console.
to:
Nintendo will have a competition in the handheld market soon.
Even when you read the article, it is pretty clear that this device is more a tablet PC than a portable gaming system. Comparing the media pad to the GBA is like comparing my desktop PC to my PS2, it just doesn't make sense. And they don't compete with each other either.
The media pad will have to be coupled with the Xbox in order to function as a gaming system, and even that won't be its intended target. They plan to use it to provide some PDA functions and add functionality to interactive TV apps and other weird things.
There are two kinds of people in the world: Those with good memory.
For the past few months, I've been alternately using Win2K and Redhat 7.2 on my Thinkpad A20m. After upgrading my Win partition from 98 to 2K, I will say that I have experienced much greater stability with 2K. However, the installation process was horrific, and Win2K did not detect my ethernet card or my modem during installation. Redhat 7.1, which I had installed a bit earlier, detected my ethernet card during the installation process, and I was easily able to install a patch for my winmodem. Today, my 2K partition still does not recognize my modem, despite many hours of struggle with drivers. I gladly use linux for my day-to-day work online and use Opera for crash-free browsing. I have given Win2K much of my time and given it a fair chance; I do not use it often because it is just not as good as linux, not because I have some unsubstantiated anti-MS bias.
And for the record, I've spent lots of time playing SSX Tricky with my brother on his Game Cube, and I've fallen in love with Nintendo all over again. I never had a Game Boy as a kid, but am seriously contemplating getting a GBA when I can spare the cash. It's just a great system for people of any age.
"Equal bytes for women!"
Microsoft are spending $500Million at marketing the X-Box? Sony are still out-selling them today with the 18month old PS2 selling at the same pricepoint as X-box, and the Gamecube is outselling it worldwide too im sure since Nintendo successfully carried out a launch in both Asia and the USA when Microsoft obviously hasn't heard of other continents yet.
The PS2 will always be #1 this round, it's got such a head start and massive game library it'd be impossible to say otherwise.
However, you say the Gamecube is selling it worldwide: Is that really fair? Xbox isn't available outside North America. Where the Xbox and Gamecube and PS2 compete, the most up to date numbers are:
PS2: 6.6 Million
Xbox: 1.3 Million
Gamecube: 1.2 Million
Microsoft will demonstrate on Monday a tablet-shaped device that will serve as a bridge between the TV, the PC and the company's .Net services, according to sources familiar with the plans. These sources also say that no one will care, as everyone is watching theMacworld Keynote after Sunday's press leak of the new iMac.
--Dan
It doesn't matter how many colors you can display if the graphics don't look hand-drawn and the animation isn't smooth and fluid.
I have some problems with device.
It simply does too much! Its a cross between one of the expensive LCD remotes, a palm pilot, xbox control, a gameboy advance, and shopping kit all in one.
This device is going to be similar to windows media player. If you want to do anything you'll have to wade through an advertisment. Why is this a problem? Well I've already paid for my media, why do I have to pay to watch it again? Not to mention the fact that many bugs are introduced by quirky internet response and malicious users.
As for the remote control part of it, this is a remote that literatly doesn't want you to change that channel. Imagine channel surfing, but you remote is too busy downloading content on Jennifer Somebody's sweater. I don't care about her sweater, and frankly I don't want you sending information to someone that I am looking at her sweater (added spyware, whoppie!)!
This device is going to be bulky, expensive and with advertising, and if were lucky spyware. Microsoft I hope you fall on your ass on this one.
Rob
the console crown. I really really hope the MS comes out on top in this war. Since the nintendo 8 bit gamers have been forced to watch in envy as japan is ALLWAYS first to get the NEWEST GAMES and systems. How many times did you read a gamepro, EGM or other similiar magazine, seen a game that looked totally awesome but it was going to be released japan first? It really pisses me off to the point WHERE I GOT TO TYPE IN CAPS.
I miss the good ol days when an american company was king of the console hill (i.e. atari) and i'm not very paticular who is trying to become the next american console king, even if it is LUCIFER in the eyes of the slash crew.
The XBox is already a region free DVD player. Good idea, though.
Nintendo has been in business since 1891. They originally made playing cards. ( and yes I'm picking nits).
11 was a racehorse
12 was 12
1111 Race
12112
This article was completely misrepresented by the slasdot summary. After reading the device, it sounds nothing like a GBA, or a GBA competitor. Maybe slashdot users don't know what Terminal Services is.
The device is based on Terminal Services. For all you linux users out there, it means its just a DISPLAY for processes running on another device. Think of it as a dumb X-Windows display.
Sure, it might show incredible graphics that are rendered on the XBOX 6 feet away from you, because its just painting the pixels, it doesn't need the fancy 3D hardware, etc. But my point is, the XBOX will have to be 6 feet away! This isn't a device you would take to school, take on a plane, take everywhere that you take a gameboy.
From the article:
"Microsoft's Terminal Server software shifts many computing functions off the device and onto other computers--owned either by the individual or by a service provider. Consumers can't really use a Mira device without a persistent connection to a more powerful computer."
The only way it could come close to competing with the portability of the GBA (which is the whole reason you use a GBA), is if it uses a constant connection to a nationwide wireless network. Then you are talking monthly fees.
Not a competitor in my book.
Yeah, sure GBA is great, when you can actually see whats on the screen.
That's because early games' palettes didn't correct for the GBA display's gamma of 4. Newer games compensate for this with a lookup table.
I want a fuckin' backlight.
"Fuckin" and "back" I can't help you with, but "light" is coming very soon. Watch this site for updates.
Will I retire or break 10K?
If and when I need a PDA, I'll get a Palm. Right now, my Blackberry's PDA capabilities are sufficient. The GBA is fun. I enjoy playing Golden Sun, an amazing game. I don't expect to do work on my GBA... I have a laptop, I may get the Samsung Cell Phone/Palm IIIc combo, but who knows.
Not everything in life needs to do work. Sometimes I want to relax, and IR Chess seems less fun and relaxing than Golden Sun.
To each their own...
Alex
The PS2 will always be #1 this round, it's got such a head start and massive game library it'd be impossible to say otherwise.
Very true the US numbers don't look as good. I am more concerned with my US options as a US person.
Thanks everyone for responding. I said what I said with some scepticism myself.
A few things from the comments so far....
Yes what I said was speculation, if it wasn't it would be history.
I am assuming the 2 console rule. Which means PS2 has one of the slots down cold. The other is up for grabs. Since Xbox is going after grownups and Game Cube for kids, they are not competing heavily yet. They will start competing eventually though, it's just a matter of time before somebody starts that fight. This will go to round two.
When they do start competing heavily, it will be to late for Nintendo to start this moving.
If Nintendo's lawyers say they can't do an inital release region free they can still make the chip physically very modular and use a commonly understood unencrypted flash protocol to program it. Then the aftermarket will take care of the last step. Voltage/burnout problems are not unworkable. Don't underestimate the virute of customizability even for customers who don't understand what the good part of customization is. The key here is plausible denyability. The current lack of DVD ability is the perfect guise for reconstruction.
DVDs are exploding. In the past two months Blockbuster dumped half it's VHS section and balanced out DVD's and VHS for floorspace. In another year some things will be dvd only. People without geek budgets will need players.
Novel theory: Modern Man evolved from psychopath
Yeah, the GBA with its whopping 256 simultaneous colors on screen is far better than the Saturn and PSX that only supported a piddly 16.8 million.
Wrong. GBA has 32,768 colors (five bits each of red, green, and blue) in bitmap modes, and it can display more than 256 simultaneous colors even in character modes using blending modes. Besides, how many colors do you need in a cel game?
Yes, GBA is very powerful for 2-D graphics. It has 128 simultaneous sprites with 32 rotation/scaling specifications, plus up to four character background layers (less with background rotation/scaling).
3-D isn't everything.
Will I retire or break 10K?
It's not unfair in that the previous post stated that Nintendo had no chance and we're about to lose everything.
For that to happen, Microsoft will have to break Nintendos hold on the Japanese market, something they haven't even dared enter yet.
If Microsoft is an 800# gorilla, then when it comes to handhelds Nintendo must me a man with a machine gun.
Don't you mean a plumber in overalls that can jump a rolling barrel in a single bound?
---- Just another spud server.
Many reasons which include but are not limited to:
1) GBA is $90
Microsoft can't produce anything decent at the price.
2) GBA batteries last a _long_ time.
MS's will most likely be backlit and that will eat the batteries.
3) What does MS know about portable gaming? Nintendo's got the track record.
4) Who doesn't know what a game boy is?
Its got name recognition equal to nintendo. Both are sysnonimous with gaming.
5) Nintendo's got way to far a head start, as there will be a sequel to GBA and it will also be revolutionary.
Care to disagree/agree?
I seem to recall you posting basically this exact same thing a few months ago... I'm not real sure, but I would say almost upfront, you cut'n'pasted most of that out of your old post.
ok wise ass... my windows xp just rebooted itself for no reason because I selected the desktop properties... and continues to do so everytime I try to select the desktop properties.
Oooh, ooh, who's the princess?
-DG
Run a pencil-and-paper RPG campaign with your far-off friends: Gametable!
No patches, no add-ons, no expansion packs, not even a real operating system. Making a dent in the console world requires a different philosophy than in the PC world. Once a game is released, it had better be self-contained and done.
And why did MS include a harddrive with the system. Probably just for these things that the PC developers would want to do. I really think that the harddrive is the end of the nice,easy and rarely crashing consoles.
I really can't wait.
When I see someone walking down the street with one of these things, I'm gonna smash it into little pieces all over the place.
Get your Unix fortune now!
If Mozilla and Netscape are crashing there's something wrong with your setup. Firstly, don't use Netscape, because it sucks, secondly, try running Mozilla from bash with debug flags on, it may tell you what's going wrong.
Sure, XP has bugs (all new OS's do. Try and tell me that Linux 1.0 didn't crash or have bugs.)
Windows XP is NOT a new operating system it is merely the latest VERSION of Windows. You'd think that after a decade or more of programming operating systems, Microsoft could get something right. A default install of XP leaves it's associated PC fully open to remote attack. From a company with as much experience and money to throw around as Microsoft, this is inexcusable.
But I digress. Microsoft will have as hard a time grappling the Handheld market away from Nintendo as Nintendo would have grappling the Operating System market away from Microsoft. Not even the video-game-kingdom-stealing likes of Sony could out do Nintendo in the handheld market. From what the article says, though, the device mentioned doesn't even sound like a direct competitor.
Looks can be deceiving. Or CAN they?
"And these "compromises" has given us a 32-bit system that does 2-D graphics better even than a Sega Saturn (let alone a PSX). It fits in the palm of my hand and it costs less than a PS One. Not too shabby in my book. "
:(
The Sega Saturn is unrivalled still as far as 2D tile map/sprite-based hardware goes.
The PSX didn't really have much "2D capability." AFAIK, you could just peek/poke the frame buffer (which was internal to the GPU), or draw sprites with polygons. But the Saturn on the other hand, had support for 4 background layers, tons of sprites, sprite effects (warping with vertices, rotation, scaling), rotating backgrounds, various interesting palette effects, several color modes (including 8-bit palettized, and a 2048-color palettized mode [or some number similar to that, maybe 1024], 16, and 24-bit), etc., etc.
Technical shortcomings of the Saturn were its relatively poor 3D capability compared to the PSX, insane complexity, lack of hardware sound compression (the Saturn's sound unit was very nice, but the lack of hardware compression meant developers chose low sampling rates for sound effects), and perhaps too little RAM (1 or 1.5MB.)
The dual CPU set up isn't all that great either. AFAIK, both CPUs cannot share memory well, and the only way to get both CPUs running at full speed is to have one of them executing only from 4KB of cache RAM.
But despite all these faults, the system excels at 2D. The only way to outdo it nowadays is either with a frame buffer (thanks to CPU power nowadays -- the Saturn had linear frame buffer support, but a 25MHz SH-2 isn't adequate for tons of drawing) or polygons set up to function as 2D sprites.
Rayman Advance and Klonoa: Empire of Dreams score on both counts.
The question is, can MSFT deliver the functionality of the Game Boy Advance?
They can crank out a box that specs out as a GBA competitor. But it won't BE a GBA competitor, because they don't grok kids gaming.
This is why Nintendo does well. They do grok kids gaming. You may hate Pokemon, you may not like Pimkin, but kids love them. The buttons are where they need to be - you don't get tired - the carts work easily.
The people who brought you xBox are giving you a PC solution for Game playing. And that's why it's a distant third in the game title sales. And why it will stay that way. They don't grok gamers. They never have.
And they lose money each box they sell. Nintendo makes money on every box they sell, which means they can sell games cheap. Cause the games are where the bucks are - so kids can buy more games. You may think it's nuts to buy the Pikachu Yellow version of Pokemon, the Red, the Blue, the Crystal, the Silver, the Gold - but it means they make money on each sale at Nintendo.
Microsoft thinks they'll get it all in one (flawed) release. And fix the bugs later. Nintendo thinks they'll make sure it works first, and save the extra things for future releases.
So, in short, MSFT will fail at this one too.
Of course, what do I know, I hold stock in both MSFT and Nintendo, among other companies. MSFT makes money due to dominance, holdings, and cash flow - the game business is not profitable, except with pro forma (fake) accounting methods. Nintendo makes money with this.
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--- Will in Seattle - What are you doing to fight the War?
it's much more than that and much less than that all at once.
this was pointless even mentioning the GBA. it's not a competitor. not even close.
let's take a close look at "Mira."
it's useless without network connectivity. it can't play games unless it's hooked up to an xbox. it can't be a PC unless it's hooked up to a desktop machine.
if you've got an xbox and a 29" TV, why would you hook up a tablet to play games on a smaller screen where controls would be fiddly because you're busy trying to hold the screen and the controller?
maybe you can hook up to your xbox via a wireless lan so you can play your game while you're taking a crap. but nobody is that hardcore addicted to any game to not pause when you need to lay a cable.
it really comes down to being a really expensive fashion accessory. it's completely redundant because it has no capacity of it's own.
if you want a portable games console, get a GBA.
if you want a portable PC for doing business stuff, get a pocket pc or a laptop.
if you want a remote control for your tv, get a remote control for your tv.
this offers nothing new or special for anyone except those who have to have all the latest toys regardless of their usefulness.
it should probably also be mentioned that a lot of companies are writing console style arcade games for pocket pcs. ipaq seems to be the most popular, but I don't like the layout of the directional arrows and with the bulge in the middle, it's not comfortable for game playing.. but I'm sure there will be new popcket pcs coming out which are more suited to this in the future..
rayman is currently available on pocketpc.. more will follow.
The reason girls and Windows users don't understand UNIX is because all the documentation is in Man files.
"I think so, Brain, but 'instant karma' always gets so lumpy." - Pinky
"Decepticons FOREVER!!!" - Ravage
I cheated to get Mewtwo. I just started an indefinite length match with two human players and left the machine on all night. Bang. There's your 20 hours.
1000 Vs. matches(any kind, any length) is probably the *alternate* way of unlocking a character or two.
The ZDNet article says the device will cost around $2,000. A GBA costs $90. Now, do you think Microsoft will be able to sell millions of these things when the GBA is $90?
To make this claim is pure hype-generation. It seems this "pad thing" hasn't even been finalized for production so I'm sure it would be 2-3 years away. Now, even if the Xbox has a fairly good life span it will be old by the time this "pad thing" comes out.
You don't GET a STOP error by default in XP... at least so I've been told by an XP user.
N64 lost money hand over fist? I'd like to see that sales data. Last year, one of the systems last, Nintendo made twice as much in software revenue as the nearest game publisher, EA, and several times as much as Sony.
Gamecube just came out and is selling very well, as is the software. Poor business sense? Yeah ok.
They may not have as much as MS, but Nintendo does have a few billion in cash as well. They're just being more conservative with it. Why do all that marketing when you can't put enough consoles on shelves?
Those "proprietary" plugs are just USB ports in disguise.
Which character would [require 1000 Vs games]? ... Mr. Game & Watch can be unlocked by beating classic mode, adventure more, or target test with all of the other twenty-four characters.
I was referring to Mr G&W. I've found some characters whose target test absolutely stumps me (e.g. Young Link). Even then, unlocking all the stages...
Will I retire or break 10K?
The big problem is that for a game to boot up on a GBA, the ROM has to have the correct header information, which includes code copyrighted by Nintendo (part of which is the NINTENDO logo that appears when you turn on the GBA with a kart in)
It's copyrighted, but copying it does not constitute infringement. From the Sega v. Accolade decision, if a game console checks for a magic cookie in the software, even the 14 KB magic cookie in the Dreamcast boot sector, copying the magic cookie for interoperability counts as Fair Use(TM). Just make sure you follow the Bleem developers' example and display "CORRECTION: This software is not licensed by Nintendo" once your code gets control.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Good!
Even blowing away the original NES and Gameboy sales quarters. They are MAKING MONEY off each HARDWARE unit of the GameCube which MS and Sony are NOT.
I did not know that Nintendo is making money on the consoles.
They are LOSING money in hopes to sell more systems and the games will rake the lost revune back. This is what a lot of console makers do .. The system is not their money maker, it's the games. Well, Nintendo has BOTH money makers with the Gamecube. DVD playerback was never an option.
If you look at the PS2 and XBox they have so many compatability issues it's not even funny. Who would want a DVD player that doesn't play hardly any movies? Akira doesnt work on ANY of them. Even after Sonys 4 software ROM revisions for their DVD player Akira STILL hangs.
That sucks.
If you look at the lists for both systems there are countless awesome movies that just dont work. THATS why Nintendo didnt chose DVD playback. Trying to keep a console compatable for movies (Which isnt even the point of a console!) is a frustrating business.
I imagine that would be very expensive for them to maintain. That doesn't mean it would be too expensive to make it worth their while though.
Nintendo has already claimed the crown, IMO. I have 1 friend with an XBox, and know 3 others with a Gamecube, and 2 with PS2s. The fact that my friends are asking me to bring my Gamecube to their apts to play Super Smash Bro's tells me something: Sony and MS have no hope when Zelda/Mario/Metroid are out within the year.
As long as GTA3 is out for PS2 only there will be buyers. As for Microsoft...
I agree almost everything you said except I don't understand one thing...
With such insightful comments why are you an AC?
Novel theory: Modern Man evolved from psychopath