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RIAA Almost Down To Pre-Napster Revenues

Third time's the charm. Napster came out in 1999, and the Recording Industry Association of America had two great revenue statements for that year and the next. But now that CD sales finally are down year-to-year, at long last they get the chance to blame Napster for their woes. There's just one thing wrong...

...they don't have Napster to kick around anymore.

For yesterday's press release, the RIAA commissioned a survey by a research firm to prove that music-downloading is to blame, but all they tell us about it is that "23 percent of surveyed music consumers say they are not buying more music because they are downloading or copying their music for free." No more details provided, no link to the survey's raw numbers. So what does this mean? I guess 77 percent are buying more music because they're downloading it for free?

To put the new sales figures in perspective, a look at the big picture will be helpful. Free music-trading software had been in serious trouble since mid-2000. Despite indications that music-trading was helping sell CDs, the labels forced Napster to implement a name-blocking scheme. We ran a story in March 2001 pointing out that its traffic had fallen by 60%.

Then SF Gate ran a nice story last August, pointing out that declining RIAA sales seemed to mirror Napster downloads:

"At this point last year, with Napster in full swing, record sales were up 8 percent from the previous year. This year, sales of new albums -- not including established catalog titles -- are down 8 percent. That's quite a pendulum swing."

Sure, other file-trading software has taken Napster's place, but at this point it's fun just to watch the industry limp around after shooting itself in the foot.

Not that it's really hurting money-wise. All this week's numbers mean is that the RIAA's total revenue has declined almost to 1998 levels. In 1998 they made $13.71 billion; after peaking in the mid-$14-billions, last year they made $13.74 billion.

This probably is due party to the crummy economy, partly to their failure to find any new sound to co-opt and mainstream recently, and partly to lack of big artists releasing megahits like they did in 1999. You know music officially sucks when the labels have to pay someone $28million not to sing.

Oh, and partly due to the RIAA raising CD prices by $1.16, which is $0.25 over and above inflation (which has been higher than wage growth lately anyway). CDs are 94% of their revenue. Most industries, faced with declining sales, try lowering their prices. Not this one.

I've got two pieces of advice for the RIAA.

The first is to stop pissing off your own artists so much that they blow off the Grammys and throw their own party just to stick it to you. The musicians and singers are the ones making you rich. I know you think they're all interchangeable, but if you alienate them enough, when a new technology gives them an edge, they'll drop you like yesterday's sound.

The second is to reread Robert Heinlein's very first story Life-Line:

"There has grown up in the minds of certain groups in this country the notion that because a man or corporation has made a profit out of the public for a number of years, the government and the courts are charged with the duty of guaranteeing such profit in the future, even in the face of changing circumstances and contrary to public interest. This strange doctrine is not supported by statute or common law. Neither individuals nor corporations have any right to come into court and ask that the clock of history be stopped, or turned back."

222 of 720 comments (clear)

  1. Stupid... by SamMichaels · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is stupid...maybe the reduction in sales is due to paying $18 for a CD...because back when sales were up, it was $14.

    1. Re:Stupid... by Cyno · · Score: 2, Interesting


      Its not old news. This is hot-off-the-press and should be posted on the front page of slashdot for the next year. If the RIAA and record labels keep getting bad press maybe one day we'll watch their profits get cut in half to under $7 billion. That's still $7 billion above and beyond the cost of producing those CDs and paying off their artists. Seems to me like the artists should be getting that cash anyway.
      I haven't bought a CD in almost a year. I used to not buy them at all, but while napster was going I figured I'd buy a few since all my friends where sharing their music with me and giving me mp3s. Now I'm boycotting again because most of my friends moved out of the area and even tho I have broadband I'm not interrested in downloading non-free music. There's too much negative land type stuff out there for free now, and every day more and more free music gets released. Hell, even all my stuff will be free... it'll just take me some time before any of it sounds very good. But the important thing for all of us to remember is music is fun.

    2. Re:Stupid... by leviramsey · · Score: 2

      There's a lot of parasites in the RIAA, as with any media company. I'm sorry, but the media industry (print, online, motion picture, audio, et al) is the most featherbedded industry on the planet. They make the Teamsters look efficient, fer chrissakes!

      Look at any magazine's employee list (it's generally near the front of the magazine). How many of the people listed contribute anything to the content. How many dot-coms went under because they figured "this is like print," we can have people who write two articles a week?

      The RIAA labels' net after royalties, marketing, and manufacturing is about $4 per CD. Do the math yourself. In general: $1.00/CD manufacturing, $1/CD in royalties, $3.75 in marketing. On a CD which wholesales for between $8-10. Just because you pay $16 at the store doesn't make $16 going into the RIAA's coffers. In addition, all those albums which only sell 10,000 copies have 20,000+ CDs pressed for the first run. Why? Because the RIAA labels have no idea what'll sell. When it comes to new talent, they throw the music on the wall and see what sticks. This is why established artists (think Metallica, Limp Bizkit, NSync, the Rolling Stones) and catalog artists (Pink Floyd, Zeppelin, the Beatles) can get such huge royalties. The labels are reasonably sure that Metallica can put out an album of utter crap and go platinum on name recognition alone. Of course, such "sure things" sometimes aren't so sure (see Mariah Carey for example).

  2. Stupider by tiltowait · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It costs less to make a CD than a casette tape. So why do CDs and DVDs cost more than tapes? Because it's what 'they' think the market will bear... wankers.

    1. Re:Stupider by Bloodwine · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I don't mind DVD's being a bit more expensive than VHS tapes. Atleast not the DVD's that is packed full of extras. Not to mention it probably takes alot of effort on the studios part to get some of the older movies looking good on DVD.

      CD's on the other hand don't really offer much over cassettes other than superior sound quality and the ability to skip back and forth to songs. DVD's do this and more.

      I don't buy cassettes anymore, but I wonder if CD's made cassettes any more inexpensive? I know VHS tapes have gotten alot cheaper to buy now that everybody is pushing DVD's. Of course it's interesting that they do that since as you mentioned it's more expensive to make cassettes.

    2. Re:Stupider by st0rmshad0w · · Score: 2

      True. Very true.

      And whats worse is the way they spin the whole situation. They manufacture CRAP "bands" like Brittany and N'SYNC, etc. They insist you are licensing the music, but won't replace damaged media. And they blame the whole "we're losing money because of illegal copies" on file sharing services instead of the purely digital format they release music on (CDDA). File copying and sharing whould still go on with the internet.

    3. Re:Stupider by jspaleta · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Where did I read this.....was it /....or maybe cnet?

      Anyways...DVD's are at a turning point and there is a split in the ranks of the movie studies about how to handle DVD's inthe future. Extra bonus material is starting to cost way too much becuase actors and directors are starting to have pay for that bonus material getting written into contracts. So that extra 3 hours of behind th scense footage is now going to start costing studios real money to produce becuase the talent knows thats a revenue stream for the studies and they want a fair cut.

      Also the licensing deal with BlockBuster is coming up for renewal....and it looks like BlockBuster isnt going to renew. The deal let blockbuster get advanced distribution of movies for rental before they were available for commercial sale...and the studies got a percentage of the rental take. Now it seems both sides of that deal are backing off. The studies think getting titles out quicker for sale is a good idea...and blockbuster is looking at the lower cost of stocking DVD making up for any lost revenue garnished by having a rental only window before full release. Both the studies and BlockBuster think they can make more money by selling cheaper...

      More interesting still Warner Bros. is looking very hard at dropping the price of their DVD catalog through the floor...the idea being to get people to buy a DVD like they buy magazines in places like Walmart. Part of the reason is a lessoned learned trying to watching the record studies fight to keep control. If the price is low and reasonable...do people have less incentive still and more incentive to pony up the money....it seem like someone in the movie buz has woken up to the reality of file swapping...its always going to be there, the question is can you encourage people to buy instead of steal. If the DMCA is the stick....are $3 DVD's sitting in the checkout racks of your local Walmart the carrot?

      -jef

    4. Re:Stupider by Safety+Cap · · Score: 2
      I know VHS tapes have gotten alot cheaper to buy now that everybody is pushing DVD's.

      DVDs are better for viewing, but they sure aren't better for recording... yet. I can pick up a 10 pack of VHS tapes at Sams Club for $4.99 and tape a few months of whatever on my $80 recorder. Can't do that yet with DVDs. We may not ever be able to do that once digital TV comes out...

      --
      Yeah, right.
    5. Re:Stupider by Carpathius · · Score: 2, Informative

      I can't tell you what the cost of pressing CDs when the run is in the thousands or tens of thousands, but a few years back I produced a CD for my brass quintet.

      A run of 500 CDs from Sony would cost us $680, a run of 1000 CDs from Sony cost us $750. We took the run of a thousand, knowing we had *no* chance of selling that many, but also realising that the additional cost was worth the chance we might sell over 500.

      Total cost of producing the CD was in the range of $2000, which included digital recording and digital mastering.

      Duplication costs are cheap -- I'd bet by now you could get them down to $0.50 or less for a really large run.

      I can't see why CDs can't sell for about $7. Even $10. But at the prices they go for now, I buy *very* few artists that I don't already enjoy.

      Sean.

    6. Re:Stupider by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Also the licensing deal with BlockBuster is coming up for renewal....and it looks like BlockBuster isnt going to renew. The deal let blockbuster get advanced distribution of movies for rental before they were available for commercial sale...and the studies got a percentage of the rental take.

      AIR, the licensing deal only covered tapes - and BB gave up a good chunk of revenue for teh early distribution rights. I think BB has discovered:

      a) They can make more money off of DVDs because they have to share less and used DVDs are worth more than used tape - which allows them to recoup more (if not all) of the purchase cost.

      b) There is very little competition to worry about, so first access to new movies doesn't provide enough return to warrant the profit sharing arrangement.

      c) As studios drop DVD prices, BB cost of goods gos down as well - and there are probably enough people who will pay $2 to rent a DVD rather than buy one for $5 - especially when they know BB will dump used ones for $3 after a few months. That really has to scare studios, because it mean sthey have a very small window to sell DVDs before the off-rental units start to cut into new sales. So the studios are caught in a double whammy - lower prices mean less revenue up front, and a shorter period where new DVDs have no competition from used ones.

      --
      I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
    7. Re:Stupider by VAXman · · Score: 2

      It costs less to make a CD than a casette tape. So why do CDs and DVDs cost more than tapes?

      Because people are willing to pay more for CD's. Or did you flunk out of Econ 101?

    8. Re:Stupider by Mahrin+Skel · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Well, if you want to imagine a "Black Helicopters" scenario, try this one: The RIAA members raised their prices during a consumer spending crunch *knowing* it would hurt sales, so that they could use the resulting drop in sales as "proof" that music-sharing had to be stopped.

      After all, it didn't hurt them very much, and it's far more effective political ammo than the same money spent on "Public Awareness" campaigns.

      --Dave Rickey

  3. Downloading Music by blargityblorg · · Score: 5, Funny

    I have to admit that for the first time I began to believe the music industry had a point about piracy when I saw a grey haired woman pushing 60 in the coffee shop talking to her friend about all the music she'd downloaded on the weekend using Kaaza.

    1. Re:Downloading Music by pacc · · Score: 2, Insightful


      If I ever catch anyone downloading a whole album off me, I cut them off.

      Admirable, and you never ever downloaded a whole album from someone else either.

    2. Re:Downloading Music by Rogerborg · · Score: 5, Interesting
      • I have to admit that for the first time I began to believe the music industry had a point about piracy when I saw a grey haired woman pushing 60 in the coffee shop talking to her friend about all the music she'd downloaded on the weekend using Kaaza.

      Pop quiz (pun intended):

      How much had did that lady spend on music last year before discovering Kazaa?

      If your answer was "zero", explain how the RIAA can have "lost" any money from her non purchases this year.

      You know, when the Soviet Union was coming apart from within, and they finally admitted that it was farcical to try and control demand for products, we all nodded smugly and went "Uh huh, but of course". We laughed at the notion that you can decide how many and what color of cheap plastic toothbrushes to make five years in advance, on the basis that people will only demand the shoddy, expensive products that you produce.

      Strangely, we blithely ignored the fact that the same model was alive and well in the USA with music. A (de facto) single huge conglomerate decided how many albums we would buy, and the "artists", the content, and the price, all in advance. They expected that demand would match the predetermined supply.

      And then we learned the Soviet lesson. Street vendors started selling toothbrushes more cheaply than the state shops. Some of them were even better quality than (gasp) the cheap plastic state approved ones. It was illegal, but they were massively popular. And over here, we started to see guys on the corner giving music away. It was illegal, sure, but it was undeniably popular. We, the People wanted it.

      Strangely, the Russians (nee Soviets) adapted. They deregulated. They said to the toothbrush sellers "Go ahead, supply the demand. Come in out of the cold, run the shops, pay taxes. Everybody wins."

      We haven't got there yet. We're still at the stage of trying to stamp out street corner trading by making street corners illegal. It's farcical, and it will look increasingly so with hindsight. We need to take a look at the Russian model: if you criminalise demand, all you are doing is spending a lot of time, effort and money into turning a lot of people into criminals. Far better to bring it in out of the cold, ask We, the People what we actually want, and come to a fair compromise.

      Please don't respond with the childish "We want free music, so there can't be any compromise.". Russians want free toothbrushes, but they're happy to settle for paying for convenient access to a wider choice of better toothbrushes. Similarly, we want free music, but at the moment, our choice is free music, expensive CD's, or a tiny selection of expensive and crippled digital tracks. Give us the opportunity to buy only the tracks we want, in high quality, without idiotic content control, and without paying for the priveledge of having them marketed to us, and we might find out that we actually still like buying music after all.

      --
      If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
    3. Re:Downloading Music by thumbtack · · Score: 4, Informative

      While you got a funny moderation, actually it's the truth...Ask your parents or even your grandparents what music they like or was their favorite when they were your age. Then do a search on your favorite filesharing program. Keep it to one of the simple to operate clients such as Morpheus. You will find the music they told you about. Now, I hardly think that the "average" filesharer whos ripping Korn, Dave Matthews, U2, or Britney for that matter, is ripping Tony Bennett, Engelbert Humperdink or Wayne Newton, Tommy Dorsey, or Bing Crosby to MP3 or any other format.

      46% off all filesharers are over 35, and 18% are over 45.

      What is interesting is the market data that can be gleaned from those two seemingly innocuous numbers. These are people with an income and that have disposable income to spend. The conclusion has to be reached that the market is not meeting the needs of the consumer, and they find a way to meet those wants and desires.

    4. Re:Downloading Music by Starship+Trooper · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think the big problem with your theory is that you can't copy toothbrushes. Nor are "street corner merchants" like Kaaza making cheaper toothbrushes; they're copying other people's toothbrushes.

      If we created a P2P tool that had a real referral system and a way of promoting new music, that would be one thing. Instead, we have a system where you must know what you're looking for before you find it. We still learn what music we want to hear from the Radio and from MTV; we just use P2P technology to get it cheaper/for free.

      P2P should be replacing the advertising channels. Instead it's trying to replace the retail channels.

      And that really is illegal.

      --
      Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
    5. Re:Downloading Music by jmu1 · · Score: 2

      The sad thing is this is not isolated to the recording industry... it is in the movie industry, the agriculture industry... they all make up their minds that they are going to make a large sum more then needed of a product and then hold their hands out to the government when they want more money for what they don't sell... if corn isn't selling, you pick another produce. Don't just keep planting corn or (here) peanuts and expect the government to step in and take the money from the people that didn't want to buy your product. Du-huh!

    6. Re:Downloading Music by Starship+Trooper · · Score: 3, Insightful
      "people who liked X also liked Y..." I haven't used Kazaa (sp?) or any P2P file-sharing system but do any of them work like this?

      No, none of them work like this. In fact, in every single P2P program, you must know the name of the artist you are searching for before you can search for them. Great for downloading Metallica. Terrible for downloading DistroThorque, the metal band down the street desperately trying to be heard.

      Imagine instead a system that didn't store the name of the song or artist. You'd know the name once you got the file, but you wouldn't be allowed to search by it. What would you be able to search by? Assosciated METADATA. Any user could add non-title related MetaData to the song, like: "Punk", "If you liked X(opaqueid) you'll like this", "heavy tempo", "new york scene", etc.

      What are the advantages of this system?

      1. It puts major labels and underground on a level playing field
      2. The RIAA would have to track down copyrighted music by listening to every song on the network (if the network contains any stolen music at all). Good luck.
      3. It allows people to actually discover new music instead of copying what MTV tells them they should hear

      To me, that's the promise of P2P.
      Now I should just go write it (-;
      --
      Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
    7. Re:Downloading Music by Rogerborg · · Score: 2
      • the big problem with your theory is that you can't copy toothbrushes

      It's not a perfect analogy, but the lesson is about supply and demand. How about telling people how to make mouthwash for 2 roubles a gallon then? That's "replacing the retail channels".

      • We still learn what music we want to hear from the Radio and from MTV; we just use P2P technology to get it cheaper/for free

      And that would suggest more sharing would lead to lower sales. The figures don't back that up. They rather suggest that sharing follows and supplements retail sales of high quality originals, just like it's done since reel-to-reel copies of vinyl.

      • P2P should be replacing the advertising channels. Instead it's trying to replace the retail channels. And that really is illegal.

      One of us has been smoking too much crack. When the fuck did "replacing a retail channel" become illegal? When were markets legally protected? Don't anti-trust laws exist to stop that? Didn't the Napster judge just give some scathing comments about the music business running a cartel on distribution?

      What is illegal is making copies of copyrighted material. I don't dispute that for a second. But we have to keep this totally separate from the market arguments. The RIAA likes to imply that the sanctity of existing channels is inviolate and god given. They trot this out and go on the offensive to avoid answering the simple question of when they're going to change their model to direct, cheap, convenient sales of single tracks. "Because that's the way it's always been, and we have to put all of our resorces into preserving the status quo and quoshing all alternatives" is not an answer, and they have no legal or moral grounds for demanding that hard copy sales must increase year-on-year simply because that's the way they want to supply them. Sheesh.

      --
      If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
    8. Re:Downloading Music by dattaway · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Sure it will work. Its all about marketing. The RIAA isn't marketing. They are demanding through the use of force. They are trying to sell by beating people with a stick, rather than appealing to their good senses.

      There are many profit motivated people who are trying to appeal to the masses with free music. The RIAA does not want any of that and wants us to believe that free music/software/beer will never work and will be the end of entertainment. Uh huh.

    9. Re:Downloading Music by weave · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I do think you've hit this one. I'm 42. When I was a teen, I had squat for cash and would have to resort to copying cassettes, LPs, and ah er, 8-tracks from friends onto blanks. No real income lost, I didn't have the money to spend. When I got older, that scene was old. Far easier just to buy the tapes or CDs I wanted. Then as I got older, my opportunities to listen to and get aquainted to new music went down the toilet. I stopped buying CDs period. I'd go into a record store and besides some old fossils like Rolling Stones that are still around, I had no idea what was for sale.

      Then when file sharing popped up, I had friends ICQ'ing me tunes "hey listen to this", I'd listen, like it, then go buy the CDs. I *do* rip them to my house's file server and copy them to work to listen there. Point being, exposure through alternate channels has caused me to start buying CDs again.

      Some stuff I've purchased recently (remember, I'm 42) includes, Rage, Limp Bizkit, Dream Theater, Dishwalla, Satriani, and a bunch of others I would have never been exposed to any other way...

      Remember, I'm an old fart. We don't listen to music on the radio when in the car, we listen to lame right-wing talk show hosts or motivational tapes trying to convince ourselves that we still have "it." So how do we get exposed to new music?

    10. Re:Downloading Music by proxybyproxy · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I think the big problem with your theory is that you can't copy toothbrushes.

      Give that 10 years and we will see when digital fabbers become affordable. Might as well keep these inevitable challenges in mind...

      --

      Hurra for Knark!
    11. Re:Downloading Music by dboyles · · Score: 2

      I'm a little late to be adding comments that I expect to get read, but this is what jumped out at me:

      How much had did that lady spend on music last year before discovering Kazaa?

      If your answer was "zero", explain how the RIAA can have "lost" any money from her non purchases this year.


      I didn't go to a movie last night, but if I really want to see a movie that's out and I download it instead of paying to see it, that's lost revenue. The key is that the past is not a definite indication of the future. Sure, you could say that it's unlikely that she would have bought that music (assuming she didn't buy any last year), but it's far from impossible.

      --
      -- "Complacency is a far more dangerous attitude than outrage." -Naomi Littlebear
    12. Re:Downloading Music by lazn · · Score: 2, Insightful

      One of the earlier great minds (forget who) said this:

      If you and I each have a apple (toothbrush), and we share apples, afterwards, we each only have one apple. BUT if we share ideas, afterwards, we each have two ideas.

      No matter how much we try to make music, movies, performances, etc. into physical items, they are not, when it comes down to it they are ideas.

      Before the technology existed to record music, it was always performed. Mozart, Bach, Beethoven, the traveling bard etc. They got paid for their performance, recordings of their work did not exist. AND in general current artists make their money performing, the record contracts are just marketing contracts, not income.

      The fact that due to a technological quirk artist's performances TEMPORARILY became physical commodities doesn't mean that this is the way things SHOULD be. They never used to be physical commodities, and again, they no longer are. This is the way of things, live with it.

      ==>Lazn

    13. Re:Downloading Music by electroniceric · · Score: 2, Insightful
      The problem is that you still need an editor. There are a lot of bands down the street that really do suck, and people spend years at record companies listening demos tapes, throwing them away, and going to puke.

      Record companies do two things at once:

      • They filter out crappy content. Not endorsing who or what they filter out, but some of it needs to happen - there are lot of BAD bands out there. Just like a newspaper gives you more coherence than a web forum, a record label gives you more coherence than MP3.com.
      • People don't listen to music just because they like the sound. The listen to it because it's "cool" - a necessarily slippery idea. A big part of teen America's identity is wrapped up in what music one listens to. Record companies are trying to get out music that people (who they see only as buyers) will identify with. This is very manipulative, so the record industry, which is clearly both money-focused and bloated, is always trampling on the sacred territory of identity.

      So I applaud your idea - yes P2P music should focus on the type of music, rather than relying on the artist branding that's been built mostly be the marketing of the record companies. But how do you make it cool, generate that buzz that makes me want not just to listen but to be a part of it? Keep on it, hopefully something cool will come out.

    14. Re:Downloading Music by Stormie · · Score: 2

      While you got a funny moderation, actually it's the truth...Ask your parents or even your grandparents what music they like or was their favorite when they were your age. Then do a search on your favorite filesharing program. Keep it to one of the simple to operate clients such as Morpheus. You will find the music they told you about.

      Truly. Last Christmas, my wife went looking for christmas music via Limewire (we'd just moved house and our Christmas CDs were in storage). It took no time at all to find Bing Crosby singing about a million carols..

      It's not all teenagers sharing Metallica MP3s..

    15. Re:Downloading Music by einTier · · Score: 2
      Good Point.


      Here's my deal, and how music sharing could help now and in the future. First, let me say that I hate paying for intellectual property, and I pirate -- a lot. However, I also purchase a lot. If you come to my house, you'll find several hundred CDs, almost that many DVDs, a literal ton of VHS tapes, some laserdiscs, some cassettes, and shelf upon shelf of books.


      The reason I buy is because many times the store bought copy is better. Reading a book on the computer screen hurts my head, and printing it out (expensive) isn't as good as having a properly bound book in my hands. DVDs typically have nice menus, or extras, or the quality is better than I can download. Even when I can download an exact copy, it still goes on a CD-R, and never looks as good as the store bought version. Besides, having my CD collection displayed alongside my DVD collection says something about me and my tastes, much as the art on my walls does. I enjoy people digging through my collection and saying "wow, I didn't know you had/enjoyed/listened to this."


      At one time, when I was in college, pirating was easy. I had the free time to search newsgroups and lurk on IRC and make friends with the people who ran in pirated media. I did not have money, so it made sense at the time -- though I still purchased media when I could. However, as I've gotten older, I have less time but more money. I no longer have those friends that traffic in illicit goods, because I'm no longer "known". I don't find out the new sites or the hot servers, and I don't find it's worth the time and effort to go find them -- I'll go buy LOTR for $20 instead.


      And, I did buy more music with Napster, even though I was pirating more music than ever before. A 128kbps mp3 is certainly good enough for 90% of my listening, but there are times when I want that extra quality, and I will pay for it. There's some music I like to hear a couple of times, but I'm never going to actually buy -- at any price. And, it does allow me to look at artists that I'm curious about -- but have never heard before. When I was in college, I used to spend hours at the used CD store just listening to music I hadn't heard. When I was in high school, I lamented the fact that I was buying ten cassettes only to find that only four of them were any good -- and I didn't have the money to spend. I remember not buying many CDs (some of which I later found out were excellent) because I just didn't know if I would enjoy them. There was no "try before you buy", just "buy and get screwed". I bought more with Napster just because I was exposed to more. I was able to expand into genres (such as jazz) that I'd been interested in for years, but was having trouble finding an "introduction".


      I'm 28 now. I file share. I pirate. But I spend a ton of money on intellictual property. I pirate because I could spend my entire income and still not be able to see all the movies I want to see, listen to all the music I want to hear, read all the books I want to read, or play all the games I want to play. File sharing gives me a solution to that problem, but it will never be a replacement.

      --
      -------------------------------------------------- $665.95 -- retail price of the beast.
    16. Re:Downloading Music by Dwonis · · Score: 2
      Damnit!

      Cute, but ineffective.

      Just because you want free music doesn't give you the right to violate the rights of the artists who create that music!

      What rights would those be? The right to dictate what people may and may not do in their own homes?

    17. Re:Downloading Music by darkonc · · Score: 2
      If we created a P2P tool that had a real referral system and a way of promoting new music, that would be one thing. Instead, we have a system where you must know what you're looking for before you find it.

      Obviously you didn't use napster (or at least you didn't use it the way that I did). I would, quite often, find myself downloading a piece of music 'just for the hell of it' that I would never consider downloading if I were paying for it.

      Granted I was looking for something that I (sometimes vaguely) knew, but what I found was sometimes an entirely different matter.

      Also: I can tell the difference between an MP3 and a real CD -- even on a (relatively decent) car stereo. If I want the full quality version of a song I like, I'll still go out and buy a CD. (or hunt vinyl).

      --
      Sometimes boldness is in fashion. Sometimes only the brave will be bold.
    18. Re:Downloading Music by Pogue+Mahone · · Score: 2
      And that really is illegal.

      Never forget that it's only illegal as long as the law says so, and the law will stop saying so when the people demand that it shuts up.

      I'm a firm believer in reasonable copyright laws, but the "copyright industry" is really pushing too far. If they don't watch their steps, the whole tottering edifice will come tumbling down and everyone will be worse off for it.

      --
      Every bloody emperor has his hand up history's skirt [Peter Hammill/VdGG]
    19. Re:Downloading Music by Dwonis · · Score: 2

      There is no double-standard. At least in my mind, the GPL exists to be in direct competition with closed, proprietary, non-free software. If software copyrights ceased to exist, there would be little need for the GPL.

  4. The economy blows by Bob+Abooey · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Plain and simple. People cut out the little extras when things go bad and CD's fall into that category. Plus most new music just friggin blows anyways. Really.

    --

    All the best,
    --Bob

    1. Re:The economy blows by RadioheadKid · · Score: 2

      Exactly right. Stop at the parent post there is nothing more to discuss. I know I don't buy CD's anymore, not because I don't want to, it's just too much of an expense to justify, (except maybe a Radiohead CD ;) ), I've cut down on my book buying, my magazine subscriptions, etc...Not because of downloading, but because of money. Things are a lot tighter these days.

      --
      "Karma can only be portioned out by the cosmos." -Homer Simpson
    2. Re:The economy blows by FortKnox · · Score: 2

      Partly true, but I'd like to make the point of these statistics jaime has brought to our attention mean squat!
      The would only matter if you saw how much was bought with napster, and how much was bought AT THE SAME TIMEPERIOD without napster.
      Of course, you can't do it, so the whole point is moot.

      --
      Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
    3. Re:The economy blows by Chasuk · · Score: 2

      What does "things are a lot tighter these days" even mean? The vast majority of USians make exactly the same amount now as they made pre-911 (cue portentous sound F/X), or maybe even a bit more, and yet I hear shit like this all of the time.

      It seems to me, perhaps naively, that the market is controlled by a couple of people who make pronouncements on the economy, and then en masse the population swings to fulfill these predictions, muttering sagely about "bull markets" or "things are a lot tighter these days" without having any fucking clue what these slogans mean.

      Would someone with a real understanding of economic theory please elucidate?

    4. Re:The economy blows by RadioheadKid · · Score: 2

      "these days" is not refering to post 9/11, but instead the past year. I know a lot of people, including myself, who have gotten laid off, had to get a lower paying job or not gotten their usual bonuses or raises, and lost a lot of money in the stock market. This can definetly change your spending habits. These are facts, not slogans or cliches, that's the way it is for many people. Things are tighter, and its not perception, my bank account says so...

      --
      "Karma can only be portioned out by the cosmos." -Homer Simpson
  5. Napster = CD sales by Bravo_Two_Zero · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's a hard truth for the recording industry to accept, but as a friend of mine said, "when you're into Napster, you're into music." I have to say I bought a few dozen CDs during the Napster era. I've purchased one since the downfall (and that was a gift). Here's hoping the artists get more joy out of the RIAA than ordinary users like us.

    --


    Amateurs discuss tactics. Professionals discuss logistics.

    1. Re:Napster = CD sales by Havokmon · · Score: 2
      I have to say I bought a few dozen CDs during the Napster era. I've purchased one since the downfall (and that was a gift).

      Hmmm, Personally, I don't know if I would go that far.. But as I think about it, I admit I was at least CONSIDERING buying music during the Napster era.

      So it went like this:
      Age: # CD's
      12-16 12
      16-20 3 (plus LZ box set)
      20-26 0
      26-28 0+Napster,
      but because of Napster, I was listening to more music than ever, and I ALMOST bought some Megadeth CD's..
      Why didn't I buy? Strangely, I thought a 10 year old Megadeth CD at Wal-Mart shouldn't cost me $12.

      --
      "I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
    2. Re:Napster = CD sales by Havokmon · · Score: 2
      So hit a pawn shop and buy it for about $4. Or how about off the net for about ninety-seven cents [amazon.com]?

      If you'd rather pirate than pay, that's fine, just don't use the price point as an excuse, because that doesn't really wash. Surely there are places other than Wal-Mart to buy your music, for God's sake.

      Maybe, but I doubt that the people who went looking for CD's last year aren't looking this year.

      I'd bet most of the loss of revenue is from people who happen to be in a Wal-Mart or Best Buy, and go "Hey!, I got a song from them on Napster."

      Yeah I'm cheap, that IS my excuse. Most of my DVD's are under $20, but they have value; I don't see them in crisp clarity for free on Sci-Fi.
      No, I won't buy a music CD when there are 4 decent radio stations in the area.

      If I had the motivation to go FIND a cheap CD, I'd just record the song off the radio..

      --
      "I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
    3. Re:Napster = CD sales by Deagol · · Score: 2
      Yup. When the first lawsuit hit mp3.com, my CD collection was at around 325. I then swore off new music. I began buying from secondspin.com, as used sales do not contribute to the labels.

      As more lawsuits came along, I got disgusted with the whole thing, and stopped listening to the radio while in the car, and tuned into NPR.

      Accept for those 4-5 artists whom I think have talent, and will always buy from them, I haven't bought any current music in 4 years.

      My collection stands at around 350 now. That's 25 CDs in 4 years! I once bought that many a month, when I was really into my collection.

      However, I did find Shakira's Laundry Service in its entirety on P2P, which I cleaned up and burned to CD for my wife (who saw her on Oprah or Rosie or something).

      Same for Movies. I love movies, but rarely ever go to them anymore, ever since the 2600 lawsuit began. My only DVD is a used Matrix DVD, bought online. I actually feel pangs of guit about breaking my boycott when I take my kids to the dollar flick. How's that for conviction?

    4. Re:Napster = CD sales by jpellino · · Score: 2

      here here!

      I bought plenty of albums when I could hear new stuff on Napster - haven't bought much since. Don't hear enough innovation and new discs to make me head to HMV or Amazon for that matter. And the dozen radio stations in CT come in four flavors - top 40 (say no more), urban ("aaaiiiiight?"), classic rock (own most of it), npr (zzzzz). Woo-hoo.

      The 30-sec blips on CDNOW just don't do it - neither do the headsets at HMV etc - where you can hear all you want of the dozen discs THEY want you to hear.

      My fav chain record shop was "Hear" music - they would put any disc you wanted on your listening station - but the logistics defeated them - can't have enough listening stations to move the numbers that the biggies can and pay premium mall rents.

      I don't know what business school the RIAA went to - they need to work on more basic things - like reading a graph and being able to see where lines cross.

      Until then, they deserve what they get.

      Did they officially give up on getting royalties from used record shops? Forgot about that one.

      --
      "Win treats sysadmins better than users. Mac treats users better than sysadmins. Linux treats everyone like sysadmins."
  6. Re:Economy by Bloodwine · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The MPAA is blaming everything and anything that can record television (but not the economy). Remember, Jack Valenti, head of the MPAA, was the genius in the 80's that was saying that VHS would destroy Hollywood and the movie industry.

    Maybe it's just me Jack, but I beleive VHS not only helped the movie industry, but it also provided a new revenue stream (rentals).

    Of course now he is at it again trying to control the digital medium while arguing that it will destroy Hollywood. Wow, what a visionary!

  7. How about the source material?! by InterruptDescriptorT · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Go watch MTV or MTV2 for a while.

    Tell me you instantly want to go out and buy the albums groups are hawking. The music is either pablum for the teen masses, a la Britney Spears, pseudo-intellectual neo-sensitive grunge like Creed, or mindless, repetitive breakbeats with woman singing, 'ooh, ooh baby' underneath it.

    Not inspiring, is it? There's good music being made, but it's not being marketed. Maybe the RIAA hasn't got it through their inscrutable little heads that people don't want the same shit they've been given for decades! People want intelligent, thought-provoking, emotionally engaging music. Meanwhile, this crap is pushed on it, and frankly, I think the CD consumer is starting to wise up and decide it's just not worth the $15 to buy the CD.

    Good job, RIAA. Keep it comin'. Meanwhile, I'll find my niche music in the corners of the Internet where you'll never find it hiding.

    --
    Karma: Excellent Birds (mostly as a result of listening to Laurie Anderson)
    1. Re:How about the source material?! by ZaMoose · · Score: 2

      I really enjoyed System of a Down's Toxicity this year. IMNSHO, it's one of the only decent albums to come out in recent memory even worth listening to. I mean, what other group have you listened to lately that features lyrics like

      "All research and successful drug policy show
      That treatment should be increased,
      And law enforcement decreased,
      While abolishing mandatory minimum sentences"

      "Drug money is used to rig elections,
      And train brutal corporate sponsored
      Dictators around the world."

      to a hard rock beat? Yeah, it's weird, but it's truly funny to hear it shouted over crunching guitars.

      Too bad their website sucks...

      --
      I wish I had a kryptonite cross, because then you could keep Dracula and Superman away.
    2. Re:How about the source material?! by G-funk · · Score: 5, Insightful

      People want intelligent, thought-provoking, emotionally engaging music.

      No. YOU want "intelligent, thought-provoking, emotionally engaging music". People, as a whole, want Britney Spears. Or to be more correct, they want the cd of the music they keep hearing on the radio / video hits. The big boys know this, and they love it. Whatever they feed us, we as a group eat up. Until this changes, the RIAA/MPAA will just tighten their grip on the public and their devices.

      --
      Send lawyers, guns, and money!
    3. Re:How about the source material?! by the_rev_matt · · Score: 2
      Not really true. The labels (and tv and movie studios) put out what some idiot in a corner office decides people want.


      There were several shows in production based on dot-com premises (mostly sit-coms) that were canned when the executives started losing money from their d-c investments. The shows weren't cancelled because they didn't think people would want to see them, but because the execs were pissed about the market and associated the shows with their financial losses. I've heard from lots of actors/writers/grips/cameramen/etc who said that there's still plenty of interest on the part of the employees and the audience, but some jackass multi millionare VP took this stupid shit personally.

      --
      this is getting old and so are you

      blog

    4. Re:How about the source material?! by graybeard · · Score: 5, Funny

      There is music on MTV?

      When did that start?

    5. Re:How about the source material?! by Controlio · · Score: 2

      As simple and repetitive as this post sounds, it's really true. The "mainstream" radio stations seem to have a total catalog of about 9 new songs, and 15 old songs that have been played to death. Just the other day I was flipping through the Detroit-area radio stations in amazement that everything I was hearing either sounded exactly the same, or was played 100 times before. I have actually logged incidents where I've heard the same song 3 times in 2 hours on one station, and heard it another 2 times on a different T40 station in that same timeframe.

      The industry is killing themselves. They are offering absolutely no incentive to sound any different than everybody else. It's quite clear where they're putting all of their marketing money. Why? Because it's the same list of 10 artists that you see or hear from about 80x a day in every possible medium. Hell, if I couldn't get enough Brittney in radio, now she does just about every TV commercial, AND you can see her movie! Kill me.

      The only hope is in the alternative or partially underground radio stations that still have a very nice rotation of new artists and sounds. I swear, if it wasn't for CIMX 88.7FM in Detroit, I wouldn't even know about any of the new artists. No one else plays their music. I hear a smaller portion of the new music on WRIF 101.1FM, but only the real mainstream hard rock (since they do a lot of classic rock too).

      But it's obvious that there is NO marketing money being spent on anything but teenie pop at the moment. This makes for absolutely no incentive for an artist who isn't a pop rapper, boy band or jail bait to release a record now... since the recording industry makes sure you make NO money off of record sales, do you think they're going to put any significant force behind a tour for you? Hell no... and that's one of the only ways you can actually make any money as an artist. Without a tour, you're not much better off than a cashier at Target's yearly salary. So if I was an artist, I sure as hell wouldn't want to release anything now - I could end up IN DEBT to the record company because they won't promote anything that doesn't sound like everything else!

      So why are record sales down? Because the prices are outrageous, the recording industry has killed the best music advertising medium ever created, and the fact that they aren't releasing anything NEW or INNOVATIVE. I'm really glad that they're making people look at the numbers, this is the perfect opportunity to force people to look at the fact that it's the marketing morons' fault, and not the technology. The technology was the only thing helping the music industry thrive when the executives were making every moronic decision in the book. Hey, maybe the reason no one buys your CDs anymore is because NO ONE CAN LISTEN TO THEM thanks to all of this new "copy protection" nonsense you're trying to cram down our throats!!! Not to mention the fact that if the industry would take the artificial price bloat out of CDs (which never gets to the artist anyways), you could easilly buy CDs from any consumer end point for $9 a pop. It's damn near criminal that they're allowed to charge what they do for music.

      It's the industry's own stupidity and greed that's killing music, and I hope someone FINALLY rubs their face in it publicly.

    6. Re:How about the source material?! by The+Night+Watchman · · Score: 2

      people don't want the same shit they've been given for decades

      Actually, it's quite surprising how many people really do want the same shit they've been listening to for decades. Look at your average boy-band/Britney/Christina fan. Generally, they tend to be early adolescent girls, and judging by the marketing schemes these "artists" use, it's clear that it's the image they're selling, rather than the music. And really, it's the image that will sell. The fact that they're singing and dancing is just incidental. It's not the music, it's the whole phenomenon. It's the social aspect of it, where liking these bands versus hating them helps define those lines of social stratification we loved so much in junior high school. To quote Ferris Bueller, "It's stupid and childish, but then again, so is high school."

      Most people to whom the MTV generation of music is being marketed don't want to go out on a limb, take a chance, and risk buying an album that they may be ostracized later for admitting they like. It's all about fitting in, being cool, and following one's fellow lemmings to the end. That's not to say that most people in our society are like that, but they do have a rather loud voice and a significant presence in the media.

      If you look at it, really, music hasn't changed all that much, at least culturally. It's just become more of a business over the years.

      The first boy band, at least as we think of the term, was the Beatles. Of course, among their many differences from today's counterparts are the ideas that they wrote their own songs, could actually sing well, play their own instruments (when was the last time you saw N'Sync pick up a guitar?), and write thought-provoking, insightful, clever tunes. Of course, there was a sizeable subset of Beatles fans that didn't care about all that. They just screamed and pulled their hair when they saw their heroes on stage, and then years later discovered new dimensions to the music that most 12 or 13-year-olds don't pick up or notice.

      It isn't until the past 25 years or so that music has begun migrating toward outright commercialism, where the image is more important than the substance. There's an article on the Irish Times about some observations regarding boy bands and the like. It's a pretty good read. For my part, I'll stop rambling.

      /* Steve */

      --
      "Every jumbled pile of person has a thinking part that wonders what the part that isn't thinking isn't thinking of"-TMBG
    7. Re:How about the source material?! by ukyoCE · · Score: 2

      99.5% of the music created today is not pop/rock crap, I don't think. But 99.5% of the music marketed by the RIAA(ie anything on the radio or tv) definetly is.

      Then again you did say "manufactured", which is a good verb for the sort of music the RIAA keeps putting out.

    8. Re:How about the source material?! by JMZero · · Score: 2

      Well of course we don't want to pay for it. But we would. I do sometimes, when I want a better quality recording than MP3 provides.

      The problem is that the legal alternative is so much poorer than the illegal one.

      Free /$18
      Instant /long trip to the mall

      vs.

      Good quality/Slightly better quality
      Guilt /Slightly less guilt

      If they narrowed the difference a little, I'd buy a lot of music.

      -Dave

      .

      --
      Let's not stir that bag of worms...
    9. Re:How about the source material?! by AsylumWraith · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Listen to some Bad Religion. They've been putting out lyrics like that for 20 years over a hard rock/punk beat. And doing a very good job at it.

      The funny thing is, if I may go out on a tangent, is that their *worst* albums were on Atlantic Records, while their best albums were on their indie label, Epitaph. Kinda makes you think.

    10. Re:How about the source material?! by the_2nd_coming · · Score: 2

      Korn will be out soon.....

      --



      I am the Alpha and the Omega-3
    11. Re:How about the source material?! by Ian+Schmidt · · Score: 2

      I think they meant "M2", although even that's started downhill now. We'll have reached the apogee of corporate programming when they have to launch "M3" that shows only videos.

    12. Re:How about the source material?! by DrCode · · Score: 2

      No kidding. I realized that the music had gotten really bad when my teenage daughter, who used to listen to the 'alternative rock' station, started switching the radio to the 'oldies' channel.

    13. Re:How about the source material?! by room101 · · Score: 2

      Why can't the people just decide.

      Lets see, there is a problem with music distribution, so we decide that we don't want it anyway? That is pretty stupid. That doesn't fix anything. Anyone remeber Aesop from grade school. There was this little story about a fox wanting some grapes, but they were growing too high up for him to reach. The fox tried and tried to get the grapes, but to no avail. When he decided that he was never going to get the grapes, he says "those grapes where probably sour, so I don't really want them," and he left. This is the fable of "sour grapes". This is exactly what this view promotes: there is this problem with something we want, so we will act like we didn't want it in the first place.

      Yes, there is plenty of crappy music out there, but, there is always someone out there buying it. Would it get bought if there were a better selection? maybe, maybe not. But saying that nothing is worth buying doesn't prove anything about the current system.

      --
      room101 -- how much can you stand before they break you?
      (they always break you eventually)
    14. Re:How about the source material?! by tswinzig · · Score: 2

      Tell me you instantly want to go out and buy the albums groups are hawking. The music is either pablum for the teen masses, a la Britney Spears, pseudo-intellectual neo-sensitive grunge like Creed...

      Creed has sold 20 million albums. They tied the record for number of weeks at #1 after debuting at #1 in album sales for their latest album (8 weeks), and their newest album is selling faster than their last album, which itself is certified 10x multiplatinum. Their concerts are continuously sold out all across the nation.

      Apparantly not everyone agrees with you about the quality of Creed's music, or whether it's worth buying the album vs. downloading it off a P2P network.

      --

      "And like that ... he's gone."
  8. CEO Pay increase by Midnight+Thunder · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If MPAA member companies are making less money it is probably because the CEOs are making more than ever - not verified, but they always seem to be making more money than the little guy that they fire when things get tough.

    One thing that is interesting to notes is that food recipes are available all the time, but people still go to restaurants. Or, are we going to get restaurants blaming Napster next time people don't eat at them?

    --
    Jumpstart the tartan drive.
    1. Re:CEO Pay increase by atta1 · · Score: 2, Funny

      So if I can buy the sheet music I should just play the songs myself and then I wouldn't have to buy the cd? The only way that analogy works is if I could download and steak and a baked potato from some p2p network.

      --
      "The avalanche has already started. It is too late for the pebbles to vote" -- Kosh
    2. Re:CEO Pay increase by Dr.+Awktagon · · Score: 2

      One thing that is interesting to notes is that food recipes are available all the time, but people still go to restaurants.

      Yeah really, I have burner here in the kitchen...

  9. Duh... by sporty · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I was unemployed for 3 months. What was the biggest luxary I had spent money on? Seeing lord of the rings. Yes. That was my biggest luxary spending. Well, that and food.

    With ~5.6% people unemployed, and cut backs of course... WHERE DO YOU THINK WE WILL GET THE MONEY TO BUY $18 CD'S!!

    Thank God I'm into older stuff now. At least those are a little cheaper...

    --

    -
    ping -f 255.255.255.255 # if only

    1. Re:Duh... by Neuracnu+Coyote · · Score: 2, Interesting

      ~5.6% unemployed in the general population, let's not forget. 2 years ago, if you worked in tech and didn't have a job, it was because you weren't looking. Now unemployment in the tech sector is all the way up to 9% in some metro areas. With numbers like that, how can they expect computer geeks to throw away money for their favorite music? This is the wrong economy to be stiffing consumers in.

      --
      --
  10. Meanwhile by Vanders · · Score: 5, Informative

    In the UK, CD sales are up Again. Are they going to tell us people don't use P2P systems in the UK now?

    1. Re:Meanwhile by SETY · · Score: 2

      The UK is not in a recession.
      The US (and NA, Japan, most of the EU, etc) all are in a recession.
      I would guess CD sales are 80% a function of how much disposible income someone has and 20% a function of file shring and other things.....

    2. Re:Meanwhile by tjwhaynes · · Score: 2

      What is the average price for a new cd in the UK, assuming 1.43 conversion rate to US dollar? I'm just curious.

      Depends where you buy them. If you want to get fleeced, you buy them at HMV and you'll not have much change from UKP16.

      However, support your local independant record store and you can usually find CDs (mainstream) for less than UKP10. Most of the ones I bought were between UKP6 and UKP11.

      Cheers,

      Toby Haynes

      --
      Anything I post is strictly my own thoughts and doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the opinions of IBM.
    3. Re:Meanwhile by GregWebb · · Score: 2

      Where you buyin' those £10 CDs from, boyo?

      Seriously, as a music buyer (yes, shoot me if you want, can't remember the last music I bought from an even remotely recent band so I'm at least helping to swing the demographics against Britney Spears...) I can't routinely get CDs for less than £11-12 in the _sales_. Chart stuff tends to sit at £12-13, older albums at £15-16. So, I watch the sales like a hawk and buy the old stuff when it hits the price of the chart stuff...

      If you have maths to back up unit price falling, I'd love to see it. IME the standard selling price has been pretty constant for the last 3-4 years (before that I didn't buy many CDs so can't comment) while the sale price (the point where they seem to sell most CDs, a decent percentage of UK record chains are on permanent sale) has gone _up_ by £2-3 in that period.

      What a surprise, at this price point I buy less CDs... I'd strongly suspect that at £10 each I spend more on music than I do at £12 and the stuff I buy has already paid off its production so we're just looking at (physical) production and stocking fees, guys. UK record execs - you are losing out from the current prices.

      --

      Greg

      (Inside a nuclear plant)
      Aaaarrrggh! Run! The canary has mutated!

  11. Get a fork, this goose is almost cooked by thumbtack · · Score: 5, Informative

    So far this year: Rick Boucher asks the RIAA and IFPI to explain how their copy protection schemes work and raises the question if the copy protection is illegal under Audio Home Recording Act of 1996.
    On January 9th, the RIAA lays off 16 employees, including Karen Allen, their "Internet Evangelist"
    The Recording Artists Coalition announced fund raising concerts to take place the night before the Grammy's to raise money to fight the recording industry for fair contracts and accounting oversight. The concerts sell out.
    The Department of Justice investigation into antitrust issues continues.
    The EFF steps up to defend Morpheus as having substantial non-infringing uses.
    The Supreme Court decides to hear the case of Eldred vs. Ashcroft (started out as Eldred vs. Reno) to determine if the retroactive Copyright Term Extension Act is constitutional.
    The Second District Court of Appeals reinstates the Chambers vs. Warner Brothers Case saying the judge considered evidence he shouldn't have. (this is the watershed case for older artists)
    Webcasting rates are set, most likely sending almost every webcaster offline, including non profit and college stations. Rates are retroactive to 1998. The webcasters have 30 days to pay after the rates are adopted.
    Suncomm (Media Cloque) and Charley Pride's record label settle the consumer case brought by consumers over "protected CDs", agreeing to clearly label the CD as incompatible with DVD player, Computer CD Players and portable CD players.
    Napster Judge Marilyn Hall Patel hands the RIAA a stunning defeat in a surprising turn around, by allowing Napster to do discovery on the copyrights the RIAA says they own, appoints a "Special Master" and gives the RIAA three weeks to prove they own the copyrights and that they are in fact "work for hire". (which the Recording Artists Coalition says they aren't) She also allows discovery on possible misuse of those copyrights to stifle competition to MusicNet and PressPlay.
    Filesharing is at an all time high.
    The RIAA releases figures showing that CD shipments are down 10.3%, but sales are only down 2.3 % in dollars.
    Five songwriters file suit in LA District Court over record club sales and lack of accounting oversight.
    California Senator Kevin Murray plans to introduce a bill this year to penalize record labels that purposely underpay royalties, this is in addition to the bill on the 7 year contract limitation. THE EFF and 4 law school clinics launch chillingeffects.org to educate internet users to their rights online.
    RIAA forms the California Music Coalition to fight against artists rights. Organizing support from people who are subject to the 7 year contract limitation in CA., the same rights the artists want.

  12. What the RIAA really wants by diabolus_in_america · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The RIAA continues to harp on declining profits and the disasterous effects of Napster and other P2P sites because their agenda, I think, from day one has been to get some sort of legislation that gives them the power of a Federal agency, while maintaining their for-profit status.
    It may sound strange or conspiracy minded, but look at the way most of their press releases are written. Their releases make liberal use of the words, such as "piracy" and "illegal."
    The RIAA is not just looking for the courts to shut down any site that they deem a danger to their continued profitability. They are looking for the government to give them to the power to do something about it themselves.

    1. Re:What the RIAA really wants by Rogerborg · · Score: 5, Insightful
      • The RIAA continues to harp on declining profits and the disasterous effects of Napster and other P2P sites because their agenda, I think, from day one has been to get some sort of legislation that gives them the power of a Federal agency, while maintaining their for-profit status [...] Their releases make liberal use of the words, such as "piracy" and "illegal."

      You forgot to mention that they are protecting the National Economy (ergo, the Free Market, ergo the Free World), and (in the case of the MPAA) they're beseiged by filthy foreign pirates flooding the country with stolen DVD's and such.

      I agree with you absolutely, and have done since about 1995, when them DMCA was just a glint in a crack addled lobbyist's eye. Back then, this was crazy talk. When the DMCA passed, we gasped and laughed and thought it would never stand, and largely missed the point that the DMCA was never the final goal, just a means to generate very public failed attempts to stop the Evil Pirates. We couldn't imagine anything worse than the DMCA, so we (largely) assumed that this was as bad as it could get, and that we could beat the DMCA by fighting it.

      Then the SSSCA arrived, put a toe in the water, and slunk off to wait for the propaganda to soften us up. I think that was the catalyst that prompted a lot of people to realise the long term plan.

      Hear this clearly: the music industry lobbyists aren't stupid. Greedy, ruthless, soulless. But not stupid. They know they can't control the market given current technology. They know they can't stop street corner swapping by making street corners (P2P services) illegal. The goal from day 1 has been to demonstrate that they can't control it, because of that pesky old assumption of innocence thing.

      So, here comes the SSSCA. While we debate whether the DMCA was too far, the lobbyists whisper in their bought politicians' ears that the debate is really how much further should we go?. If we let people have hardware that allows them to copy data, of course they're going to copy it. I mean, politicians are corrupt and greedy, record industry lobbyists are corrupt and greedy, so everybody must be corrupt and greedy. Offer a roofied starlet to a Senator, and the question isn't "Should I fuck her up the ass?", it's "Can I fuck her up the ass without getting caught?". Why should Joe Public be different?

      I personally think that the RIAA must be really pissed off with P2P figures right now. I mean, they never intended to win the case against Napster. The whole idea was to show that it was unwinnable, that they needed extra powers. Their lawyers got out of hand, and forgot the goal. And now we see that P2P figures match CD sales. They can't spin it otherwise. They want to show P2P taking off while sales plummet, but we just stupidly keep on buying the CD's when there's anything decent to buy, and only sharing music when it's worth sharing. Damn our honesty!

      Oh, what's the use? We've been over this so many times. Our politicians are so endemically corrupt that we've stopped even caring. The SSSCA will be bought and forced on us before Joe Sixpack knows what's happening. A small core of us will say "Told you so," but that'll be cold comfort.

      Hey ho. Buy the biggest drives you can, while you can. Stock up on blank CD's and DVD's. Enjoy our brief Golden Age of being given the choice of "easy and cheap but criminal" or "restrictive and expensive but legal" music purchases, before it becomes a choice between expensive crippleware or nothing. Hey fucking ho.

      --
      If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
  13. My advice for musicians by e-gold · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Go *around* the RIAA quintopoly. Scott McCloud's cartoons "I Can't Stop Thinking" five and six have some ideas (which for some reason REALLY anger some folks). I have worked for tips before, it's not always the best living, but it pays the rent and tips of a reasonable size are a lot more palatable than overpriced CDs to consumers, and a lot better than nothing for musicians.

    Anyway, lots of technology exists that could easily stop the bottleneck that limits feedback between consumers & the music business. I know, because I sell (some of) it for a living...
    JMR

    --
    Try e-gold - (contact me). I'm NOT e-
    1. Re:My advice for musicians by alfredw · · Score: 2

      Quintopoly? Interesting, but I think the word you're looking for is:

      Cartel

      Webster's 10th Ed says:
      2 : a combination of independent commerical or industrial enterprises designed to limit competition or fix prices

      Sound like anyone we know? :)

      --
      In Soviet Russia, sig types you!
  14. what's the conclusion by mark_lybarger · · Score: 2

    maybe download coresponds positivly to album sales?

    maybe more people are using gnutella/morpheous (the hard core thieves are anyway probably not the most average consumer. everyone i knew who downloaded music during the napster days is still downloading via other methods. hell, lots of people d/l'd tons of music pre-napster on usenet.

    maybe having a $13.74B revenue stream gives the RIAA a little money to pay teams of lawyers to do some creative shit to get them publicity and keep the business alive

    or maybe, mariah carey isn't really worth $28M. an over 30 wacked out singer like her should be at most a club singer.

  15. Classical Music by wiredog · · Score: 4, Insightful
    In the past year I've "discovered" Mozart, Listz (sp?) Beethoven, Copland, and other composers of orchestral music, and I'm listening to some opera. There's hundreds of years of differing styles and composers. I listen to DC101 or WHFS for about 1 week every three months to see if anything new or interesting is on (usually not) and then go back to WETA.

    Thank God for NPR.

    1. Re:Classical Music by Darth+Maul · · Score: 2

      You're obviously in the DC area. I highly recommend WGMS 103.5. Best commercial classical station in the country (one of the only that is not a public station!)

      --
      --- witty signature
    2. Re:Classical Music by oni · · Score: 2

      Excellent point!
      Not only is classical music cheaper (I recently picked up several different composers for $2.99 per CD) it's also better for you.

      And if you haven't tried it, playing classical in the background while you program is just as fulfilling as that techno stuff you have now (admit it, we all do).

      And as an added benefit to the younger (male) geeks out there, knowledge and appreciation of classical art makes you appear cooler to chics. In college I rarely had a date, but I could approach any girl in any class and ask her to the symphony or the ballet with about an 80% success rate. Disclamer: I rarely got second dates due in part to the ache, braces, and poor conversation skills.

      Thank God for NPR.

      My only beef with NPR is that they (the local station were I live) play way to much baroque music. I really enjoy Mozart, Beethoven, Rachmaninoff - pretty much anything from the romantic era, but I can't get into Bach.

    3. Re:Classical Music by Ded+Bob · · Score: 2

      I agree with you. Little has come out that impresses me as much as those fellows. Most of the mainstream music I have heard sounds like men whining into a microphone. I do like Enya and Adiemus.

      As for interesting classical, Debussey's Pictures at an Exhibition is a good piece. It sounds like it is story being told with music.

      The hard part is finding the best rendition of a piece of music. Which orchestra has not done 1812 Overture? Also, the orchestra can go up and down in quality over the years.

      The one thing I am really interested in is a story I saw on 60 Minutes or some other program like that several years ago. It showed a vault of music composed during the Soviet Union locked up for one reason or another. I think it had about 50,000 or more pieces of music. A lot of it was classical style. I would love to know what happened to it.

  16. Blame DeCSS! by Shoten · · Score: 5, Funny

    I don't know about the rest of the world, but I know that I'm not buying much music these days because I'm so busy duplicating DVDs left and right. Well, that and exporting strong encryption :)

    --

    For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
  17. Business Plan by ronc_LAemigre · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Let's see you keep raising prices even though costs of production are declining (particularly the switch from LPs to CDs years ago) even when everyone knows what the real cost of raw materails is. You cheat all of the artists on royalty payments. You try to stop or price out of existence every streaming radio station. YOu insist upon a tax on all blank recordable media in Europe, and try the same in the US. Shutdown Napster and half-heartedly have some of your members set up bad "replacements". Effectively kill the singles market, insisting that everyone buy full albums from one-hit wonders.
    And, then you are shocked and apalled that everyone is sharing Digital copies?

    --
    --- Ron
  18. RIAA can blame congress on this one... by sdo1 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Congress passed the 1996 Telecommunications Act which, among other things, deregulated the airwaves. That put control of a majority of the big-market radio stations in the hands of a small number of companies. DJs are no longer DJs, they're "radio personalities". Playlists come from corporate and they're narrower than ever. As a result, the music that gets played is homogenous in the extreme. Oh, by the way, one company in that mix controls the majority of concert promotions too (Clear Channel Communications).

    So why are CD sales off? Maybe because music that's on the radio is so weak and generic. Because the bands that get promoted are done so from on high in a corporate boardroom. The record companies have always managed things from above, but before the great airwave merger-fest started in 1996, they still had to work with local DJs and concert promoters and that invariably meant more variety. Now they all work in a harmonious corporate union and the result is music that more or less sucks.

    They want a scapegoat? They need to look at this slick machine they've created.

    -S

    --
    --- What parts of "shall make no law", "shall not be infringed", and "shall not be violated" don't you understand?
    1. Re:RIAA can blame congress on this one... by SamMichaels · · Score: 5, Informative

      Oh, by the way, one company in that mix controls the majority of concert promotions too (Clear Channel Communications).

      One thing to add is that since Cheap Channel bought SFX Entertainment, they've been choking out "competitor" stations for concerts (I work for a Cumulus Media station).

      Isn't it in the best interest of the artist to get as much exposure as possible? Too much corporate scandal and politics...we exist FOR the artist..not BECAUSE of the artist.

    2. Re:RIAA can blame congress on this one... by thesolo · · Score: 3, Informative

      Oh, by the way, one company in that mix controls the majority of concert promotions too (Clear Channel Communications).

      Clear Channel controls a lot more than just concert promotions. Check out a list of all the Radio Stations, TV Stations, and other things they own here: http://www.cjr.org/owners/clearchannel.asp.

      It's really quite scary. No wonder smaller artists cant get played on the majority of radio stations...

  19. I'm surprised they haven't whinged about... by verloren · · Score: 2, Funny

    second hand CDs. I get most of my music from a local branch of CD Warehouse (A cutting edge site - their Y2K testing report is on the front page!) for between $8 - $10. My local and other stores like it are always busy, and not a penny goes to the RIAA! It's a damned outrage!

  20. why am i to blame ? by mirko · · Score: 2

    I download loads of music but only songs that I already have on vinyl records.
    (or also GPL'ed music)
    I spent a lot of money on these records years ago so I don't accept being called a pirate.
    Am I wrong ?

    --
    Trolling using another account since 2005.
  21. When Napster Was Around I bought CD's by wazzzup · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Back when I was in college in my 20's I bought a lot of CD's. Now I'm in my 30's and I don't buy near as many CD'sas I did when I was in my 20's. There was, however, a brief increase in my CD buying when Napster was around. I hate all of our local radio stations so I'd look at the playlists of websites that played music I did like. I couldn't hear the music though. With Napster, I had the ability to preview the songs which usually then meant going on to Amazon.com and buying the CD's. Now, for one reason or another, Napster is gone and I just don't buy CD's anymore. I know I could use Limewire or some other sharing program but I don't. I can say for a fact that Napster caused me to buy more CD's. My friends have similar testimonies.

  22. cd prices out of a hat? by Interfacer · · Score: 2, Interesting

    why does the same cd cost 13$ in the us of a, 18$ in belgium, and (not kidding) 30$ in the uk? ...

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  25. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 3, Informative

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  26. Solution for falling record sales... by psxndc · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Similar to the one I posted about the "only 2 out of 10 movies are profitable" comment Valenti made about movies:

    Make less crap.

    I'm not going to buy an $18 dollar CD dammit. I'll buy two $12 dollar ones though. Make less crap, drop the cost of the CD, and I'll buy more. As a finger to the man, I'll just use etree for now (though the RIAA get kickbacks for CD-R sales so I lose either way). I've bought all the CD's of the artists I want to buy for now. Nothing appealing has come out lately.

    psxndc

    --

    The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.

    1. Re:Solution for falling record sales... by erasmus_ · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This is especially true since there is no return policy on opened music in most stores, such as Best Buy. You're absolutely right, I can see myself bying a ton more music if it was $8 per cd or even less and I could return if I didn't like it within let's say 10 days and exchange for another cd.

      Now I'm sure some people would choose to use this for piracy, but I know lower prices would be a great incentive to try new stuff, and be less likely to regret and return something not quite good if I didn't spend as much money on it.

      It's hard to justify spending $15 when you really only know one song, and there is no listening station for that artist. So you go, ok, I'll go home and download this album, and see if I like it. But then if you do, you already have it downloaded so there is less incentive to go _back_ to the store and buy it. Lower prices would greatly increase impulse purchases of music.

      --
      Please subscribe to see the more insightful version of th
    2. Re:Solution for falling record sales... by psxndc · · Score: 2
      Even beyond that, I wouldn't mind not being able to return a CD (like it is now) with only 2 or 3 good songs if I had only paid $8 dollars for it. If I'm paying almost $20, the whole album better be pretty damn good. What I also don't understand is why can mom and pop stores charge at most $13 for a CD, but Recordtown has specials for $16 (regular price being $18)?? I realize there's more infrastructure supporting Recordtown et al, but necessary to make a $2-$5 more profit per CD sold? C'mon.

      psxndc

      --

      The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.

    3. Re:Solution for falling record sales... by donglekey · · Score: 2

      They said that only 2 out of 10 movies are profitable when released in the theatres, which is pretty believable. There is also video, DVD, pay per view, rent, buy, movie channels, network TV, and on and on and on. Any decent movie (very few out right now) should be able to make its money back.

      Although I almost exclusivly listen to music on my computer, I do buy a CD right when it comes out occasionally. Most of the music I listen to I can't even find in music stores though, so how am I supposed to get it? I don't have a credit card. Am I going to get a credit card to order a CD for $18 supporting an organization which I completly dispise, only to have it come a few days later when I could just download it in five minutes? Fuck NO. Online music had helped me branch out into music I actually like. The RIAA doesn't want diversity in music eighther, just another shortcut. All stores sell the same stuff, and I don't want any of it.

    4. Re:Solution for falling record sales... by brad3378 · · Score: 3, Interesting
      &gt I'm not going to buy an $18 dollar CD dammit. I'll buy two $12 dollar ones though.

      Maybe they would sell more if record companies sold those "various artists" CDs a little sooner in the marketing cycle.

      Think of it this way: How do bands get popular?
      Exposure:

      Opening for other bands

      playing local shows

      Press releases

      Radio Play

      Etc.

      Limp Bizkit (arguably) became popular by opening for Korn Shows. They had direct exposure to the market they were targeting.

      Now, Try applying the same philosophy to CDs. Maybe have a subscription service where every week I get mailed the latest Aerosmith / Beastie Boys hits and mix in a few new bands I've never heard of. (Same philosophy as: Customers who liked AC/DC also liked &lt Band Name&gt )
      Give your customers more choices or their wallets will make their own.

      --

  27. RIAA is missing the point... by mystery_bowler · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The mass market of consumers owns a CD player and likely has one in their car. The mass market consumers do not own MP3 players that they use over their home stereo or in their car or even as a portable device for that matter. So despite the large number of "casual" Internet users that became proficient at downloading a few MP3s via a file sharing service (re: Napster), most people still bought CDs.

    I think what the RIAA is missing here is that the people who really download lots and lots of MP3s are never going to spend the money to buy this music in the first place. Case and point: I really wanted Tenacious D's album so I bought the CD. A good friend of mine kinda likes Tenacious D, but not enough to buy the album, so he downloaded the MP3s he likes. Since he never would have bought the CD in the first place, you can't really count him as lost revenue. He would have never bought the CD.

    It would be interesting to me to find out how many people who used Napster (and still use Morpheus, et al) that never intended to buy the CDs in the first place. Removing them from the equation would provide a more accurate look at what the RIAA lost/gained.

    --

    My sigs always suck.
    1. Re:RIAA is missing the point... by cavemanf16 · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Music stores had a really great idea a while ago: Burn any song onto a single CD, and we'll package it all up nicely and sell it to you. Unfortunately, due to the high cost the RIAA imposed on how much each song cost, those 'mixed' CD's that people could create at the store was prohibitively too expensive ($25 on avg IIRC). Why would I want to pay $25 for a CD with 15 songs on it, when I can go home, lose a little quality (hardly noticeable to the avg human ear though), and burn 20 songs onto a CD that cost me ~$0.25 using all the music I already owned or could borrow from friends?

      The music industry lost big time here, because honestly, it IS NOT costing them more money to duplicate a CD onto another CD. Had they charged $0.25/song, and say $5.00 per CD made, those 'make your own CD' kiosks would mean I could create a CD of ~15 songs at a BestBuy using a bunch of CD's I didn't own, but wouldn't purchase anyways (one hit wonder artists), and net the artists, producers, and distributors an extra $8.75 that they would not have otherwise made off of me.

      Oh yes, and P2P systems and Napster popularity came *AFTER* the 'mix your own CD' kiosks. [sarcasm]I wonder why...[/sarcasm]

  28. CD Prices by Captain+Large+Face · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In the UK, it is not uncommon to find some newer CDs retailing in record shops for up to 17GBP (24USD).

    Since the average wage in the UK is approximately 18000GBP (25500USD) per annum, the average worker has to work two hours to be able to afford an album.

    At this rate, not many people can afford to buy a CD unless they know they're going to like it. P2P services allow people to listen to music before they buy it, to ensure that what they're buying is to their taste.

    Perhaps if CDs didn't cost so much, people would make more impulse purchases of popular music, rather than relying on Napster and it's relatives.

  29. Just Maybe..... by 101010 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Yeah it's a slow economy, CD prices are too high, but who else is tired of listening to cookie cutter "bands" of every shape and size. We've got boy groups, girl groups, angry rap groups, angry teenagers, angry old guys, "serious artists", and the plague of all plagues, Yoko Ono, but mostly we've got spoiled celebrities with more money than talent producing CD's that maybe, just maybe might have 1 decent song on it. All this so they can get together at least once a month at an "awards show" and tell eash other how wonderful they are and remind the rest of us poor saps how stupid, pitiful, and wrong we are because I don't want to give up more of my paycheck to the government to support some "program" they think is the scourge of the planet. This concludes our rant for today.

  30. You aren't paying for the media. by WindowsTroll · · Score: 2, Informative

    Yes it costs less to make a CD than a cassette, but that does not mean that the CD should be cheaper to the end user. Given a choice between a cassette and CD, if you have both a cassette player and a CD player, almost everyone will choose the CD. And since this is the case, there is more inherent value in a CD, so in a free market, the CD will cost more.

    But, why would you choose a CD over a cassette? A cassette tape will stretch each time it is played - and rewound. Although you might not initially notice it, after 20, 30 or perhaps 40 times you listen to it, the tape will slightly stretch, and its ability to accurately reproduce the fidelity of the original recording goes down. As for a CD, play it all you want - its quality does not change. Because of the properties of the two different media, the CD has more value. And as in all things in a free market, if it has more value, you will pay more for it.

    --
    "Microsoft has made computing accessible to a population who would otherwise not be able to use computers" - B. Kernigha
    1. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by jandrese · · Score: 2

      Isn't that monopoly behavior? In the free market things that are cheaper to manufacture and more popular are supposed to go down in price. Granted the record companies don't have to play by the rules because they have a limited monopoly (only 70 years and counting so far), on the content.

      --

      I read the internet for the articles.
    2. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by mattdm · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The simple point is that media of any sort is limited in supply.

      Except of course digital media. The "supply" isn't limited by any "natural" market forces, so the industry needs laws to artificially make it so.

      But you know that. :)

    3. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by cduffy · · Score: 2

      Perhaps, but what's supposed to happen is that new companies are supposed to enter the field when they see others making a profit, driving the supply up and moving the total profit/loss towards equilibrium.

    4. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by stinky+wizzleteats · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yes it costs less to make a CD than a cassette, but that does not mean that the CD should be cheaper

      It's funny that Henry Ford somehow missed out on this economic wisdom.

      Every day I read about how and why those on the supply side should be permitted special circumstances or protections just because none of us can see how Capitalism can survive in an age of free exhange of ideas. Perhaps Capitalism would be better served (as always) by embracing change rather than the ridiculous contortions we seem to think it needs to succeed.

    5. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by csbruce · · Score: 2

      Yes it costs less to make a CD than a cassette, but that does not mean that the CD should be cheaper to the end user.

      Well, lower reproduction costs indeed would be passed on to the consumer if music wasn't a monopolized industry.

    6. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by krogoth · · Score: 2

      It is actually limited by bandwidth. I'll leave the details to someone who needs karma.

      --

      They that quote Benjamin Franklin on liberty and safety deserve neither.
    7. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by mattdm · · Score: 2

      that's not a supply issue -- it's a demand issue.

    8. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by mattdm · · Score: 2

      Then what pray tell is the /. effect?

      Largely irrelevant. I'll assume you're talking about the general problem of bandwidth, not just the site-getting-linked-and-stomped phenomenon. There might be issues like this in the initial release of some content if the infrastructure for that release is badly planned, but beyond the first stage or so, the limiting-factor bandwidth is paid for by the consumers. This makes this an issue of demand, not of supply.

      And you need to clarify "digital". CDs are digital, and any physical media has a limited supply, both of the media itself and due to the logistics of shipping it.

      By "digital", I mean literally that -- "existing in digital form". I'm not really interested in the media on which that form happens to be stored. If it's CD-Rs or hard drive space, again, the issue is one of demand, not supply. (Of course, in turn creating demand for real world products -- the hard drives and blank optical media.)

    9. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by sqlrob · · Score: 2
      There might be issues like this in the initial release of some content if the infrastructure for that release is badly planned, but beyond the first stage or so, the limiting-factor bandwidth is paid for by the consumers. This makes this an issue of demand, not of supply.

      You just combined supply and demand into demand only. If the demand outstrips the ability to provide it, that's an issue with supply. Replace "limiting factor bandwidth" with "factory and logistics" and "content" with "PS2" or some other B&M item and you'll see what I mean.

    10. Re:You aren't paying for the media. by mattdm · · Score: 2

      You just combined supply and demand into demand only.

      Yes, that's pretty much what I'm saying: the supply isn't an issue.

      If the demand outstrips the ability to provide it, that's an issue with supply.

      With digital content in its natural state, it is simply next to impossible for this to happen. It's only when one starts making up laws or other constraining mechanisms that "providing it" gets into the picture.

      Replace "limiting factor bandwidth" with "factory and logistics" and "content" with "PS2" or some other B&M item and you'll see what I mean.

      I'm not sure how I'll see what you mean by using an inappropriate analogy. The entire point is that there's a considerable difference between digital information and real-world products which involve "factories and logistics".

  31. RIAA and copyright law by aphor · · Score: 2

    The RIAA has to do something even if it is the wrong thing because if the courts ever accept the claim that people freely violated the copyright on a recording and that RIAA or the artist knew about it and did nothing, the recording goes into the public domain with no copyrights.

    If that happens even once, the RIAA will get dropped like a fresh turd by everyone in the industry. (It's really an old crusty turd)

    --
    --- Nothing clever here: move along now...
    1. Re:RIAA and copyright law by TheLink · · Score: 2

      Huh? Where does this apply?

      I know that sort of thing can work for trademarks but copyrights??? I don't think so.

      --
    2. Re:RIAA and copyright law by aphor · · Score: 2

      Copyright law is civil law. The reason is this: the court system refuses to make copyright infringement suits the way to make money off copyrights. If they did, copyright holders would entrap people and then sue them. This is the legal system's way of giving those punks the finger.

      *ucknut. Don't take my word for it, ask a lawyer, or better yet DO THE RESEARCH YOURSELF. Did you ever wonder WHY it works like that for trademarks? What makes them so different from other IP? Is that difference relevant?

      --
      --- Nothing clever here: move along now...
  32. CD buying frenzy! by Ender+Ryan · · Score: 5, Interesting
    When music was easy to find online, I could hear about a new album, find and download it in under 15 minutes.

    If I liked it, I would usually go and buy it just to have a nice hard copy of it, even better if it has lyrics and band pics etc. Everyone I know with the money to spare would do the same.

    Now that I can never find music anymore, I simply don't buy CDs anymore. I haven't bought a CD in months, and the last one I bought was a Christmas present for my fiancee.

    Someone please tell me, just how the fuck am I supposed to find music when I have no interest int he type of music that gets radio play? Even if I was interested in that type of music, most stations play the same 20 songs 10 times every day, for months and months at a time.

    Abso-fucking-lutely ri-fucking-diculous!

    --
    Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
    1. Re:CD buying frenzy! by Tet · · Score: 2
      Someone please tell me, just how the fuck am I supposed to find music when I have no interest int he type of music that gets radio play?

      Precisely. And just to make it worse, here in the UK we don't even have genre-specific radio stations like the rest of the world. We have a grand total of one (yep, ONE) radio station dedicated to playing rock. And they only broadcast a low power signal that has a 6 mile radius or so. Sure, they also stream over the net, but they stopped using RealAudio last year, and are now WMP only :-( But given that the UK rock press doesn't even cover the rock music I listen to in print, the chances of it getting radio play are nil. I read about new bands on the net, and try and download some of their stuff to listen to. If I like it, I go out and buy it. The RIAA don't have a clue.

      --
      "The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
  33. Re:Economy by Cyno · · Score: 3, Insightful


    Just wait until he has all that copy protection built into your OS (XP), TVs, and DVD players (DVD/DVD2), www.intel.com, etc. And has streaming services using up all our bandwidth on the net. You just wait 'til he breaks all our backs (building this technology) just to use it to squeeze those extra few pennies out of our teenagers. Heh, you don't know Jack. www.2600.com

    I wish old, filthy-rich, ugly people like him could be forced to retire.

  34. Streaming Music by Anml4ixoye · · Score: 2
    I for one don't use the music sharing software like I used to. I have an MP3 player in my truck, and routinely make trips that are 11 hours each way. MP3s are a Godsend for that. But when I am at home or at work, I listen to streaming music from Live 365 which is so much better then my MP3 collection. Don't get me wrong, I have nearly 20 gigs of MP3s (owning about 70% of the respective albums with most of the rest being songs you just can't buy), but the streaming music has a broader selection, *I* get to pick what I want to listen to, and I don't have to lug around my MP3 collection.


    Good luck getting me to buy a CD. I would rather pay for a streaming service that has that variety anyday.

  35. P2P services bigger than ever by bmarklein · · Score: 2, Informative

    As much as people may want to believe this, there's a pretty obvious flaw with the argument that file swapping = CD sales - namely, that even though Napster is shut down, new file swapping services are bigger than Napster ever was.

  36. Who cares about RIAA revenues? by Tom7 · · Score: 3, Insightful


    Seriously, who cares if the RIAA is making more or less money as a result of Napster? I would actually prefer that they make less money...

    Either way, they are going to be raising CD prices and chasing down the file sharing services. They are scared, and they want to remain in control.

    For context, I have over 300 CDs... most are from independent labels. (I've recorded a *ton* of music myself; over 15 albums and a thousand songs...)

    I like to think that I am listening to music made by people who do it because they love music, not because they want to make money. In fact, I typically think that artists shouldn't be selling CDs at all. It seems to me that if they want people to hear their music, they should make it as widely available as possible! To me, that means putting it on the internet, or at least giving a license for others to do so for you. (An exception is these low-run CDs that people sell at their shows, which typically cost only about $5 to $10; this is often more convenient for the purchaser than trying to find obscure songs on the internet.)

    Some people will say stuff like, "artists deserve to be paid!". I say, artists deserve to be paid for live performance, or for commissions, but nobody deserves to be paid for duplication (essentially free) of a recording that already exists. Furthermore, if music is primarily a *job* for an artist, then his work is more craft than art, and I say that's a good reason not to care about it as much. (Do you think of yourself as a consumer or a fan? Do you purchase products or appreciate their beauty?)

    So my solution is to buy music when it's most convenient (rarely), to download lots of free music by amateurs at mp3.com and other places, and to make my own free music. If every music lover did this, boy, would the world be a better place!

    Living in a RIAA-free world is good; it feels moral (even if it is not always legal), and it pisses the right people off.

  37. When did that happen? by BlackGriffen · · Score: 2

    "Webcasting rates are set, most likely sending almost every webcaster offline, including non profit and college stations. Rates are retroactive to 1998. The webcasters have 30 days to pay after the rates are adopted."

    When the hell was this done, and by whom? Last I checked, you could get the Quicktime streaming server for free, and then it was just a question of bandwidth...

    BlackGriffen

    1. Re:When did that happen? by CaptainSuperBoy · · Score: 3, Informative

      When the hell was this done, and by whom?

      Last week, by The US Copyright Office.

    2. Re:When did that happen? by bryan1945 · · Score: 3, Informative

      As pointed out, it happened a few weeks ago. Also, it has nothing to do with QT, it has to do with royalties on what you are streaming, ie. songs and/or commercials. Best part of that deal was that radio stations that streamed their material also had to pay (above and beyond their on-air royalties) for their webcasted content.

      --
      Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
    3. Re:When did that happen? by LMCBoy · · Score: 2

      See also Cringely's article on it.

      --
      Liberal (adj.): Free from bigotry; open to progress; tolerant of others.
  38. Intelligent, thought provoking, etc. by Hrothgar+The+Great · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Intelligent, thought-provoking, emotionally engaging...

    Discipline Global Mobile

    I guarantee you that anything that comes from there is all three of those things.

  39. Costs? by bjorky · · Score: 5, Informative

    People are precisely right on CD costs. Whenever you look at a breakdown of the costs on a CD, companies throw in all these extra costs, like marketing/promotion, record company cut, and artists cut....

    Here's how the marketing budget is being wasted: 1) On an average of at least once a week, the music shop where I work receives an OVERNIGHTED package of promo materials for us to put up in our store... usually consisting of 1 poster, and usually of someone mostly obscure, or of someone who would not move in sufficient quantity for us to warrant putting up a poster 2) We received probably 3-7 promotional packages a day containing posters, promo flats, giveaway CD samplers, value-adds and other things that cost the store $0, but instead come out of the marketing budget 3) Additionally, we also receive promos of a lot of things that usually go into a nice box to never be heard, or sold to another store for their used stock. All of these materials contribute to your higher CD costs, but you don't even like these bands.

    Another question that's been on my mind for a while is: Well, once the CD has gone out of its initial print run, why don't prices drop because they don't need to promote it anymore, it's part of the back-catalog then? Well, not really... manufacturers are more keen on cutting-out and dropping from the catalog older releases by an artist rather than moving them to mid-price.

    And one more thing: There are great artists out there on nice independent labels that know how to manage their money and don't squander it on useless promotion nor to line the executive's pockets. Case in point: The White Stripes, on Detroit's Sympathy for the Record Industry label... Releases ~$13, excellent rock reminiscent of early Zeppelin... Hell, there are a whole litany of these artists featured in Coalition of Independent Music Stores stores... find your local store at www.cimsmusic.com

    --

    "Defenestration" is to throw out of a window; what's a word for throwing 'Windows' out of something?
  40. Its NOT about CD sales at all by dnoyeb · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If napster lives, "the people" will choose the stars, not the recording industry. The RIAA knows and is not comfortable about this.

    Now artists will be able to command MORE money.

    Today, I watch RAP on TV and hear it on the radio and realize they are forcing complete garbage on me. 95% of RAP is total trash. Yet they still sell this trash because they force it down your throat.

    This is what the RIAA wants.
    1. they go find a no name artist.
    2. Sign him/her to an abusive contract that he/she will agree to out of desperation or necessity.
    3. He/she drops a hit record and the RIAA takes all the profits (see 2).
    4. By the time he gets name recognition and can sign a quality contract, the RIAA wants him to be washed up so they can push their NEW no name artists.

    So its not about CD sales at all. Its about power. Its just like any other industry. If you can flood the market with artists, their salaries will drop. But napster will allow us to filter to the songs and artists we like, and IGNORE the trash we dont, sending salaries for those artists who remain right back up.

  41. The Napster fight *hurt* RIAA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Wish I didn't have to post this anonymously 'cause I can back this up, but people might get in trouble...

    I actually know pretty well an investigator for the RIAA. His focus happens to be commercial piracy. You know the oversees manufacturers that most of us can understand wanting to go after. However, as an employee of the RIAA he's been an extremely interesting source of information for me through this whole debacle.

    Most recently this friend filled me in on the current budgetary crisis taking hold within RIAA. According to him projects are getting shutdown left and right and they've literaly been running on zero budget for the past quarter. All fiscal year funds were spend at the end of Q3 (which as I understood ended in Dec. '01). The reason is apparently that they blew their wad on the Napster fight and the actual (the people who make the product) recording industry is losing interest. The labels aren't willing to cough up more dough for the lawyers.

    The situation is so bad that when I mentioned Morpheus et al. to this guy he predicted that RIAA would reach a closed agreement of some kind that would make it look as if action was taken but in reality simply premitted them to back away without a court battle which they can't afford to fight. He doesn't think they can afford to pursue matter. In addition to the project cuts they've had layoffs for the first time in the 5+ years he's been there.

    The RIAA is hurt. Now's the time for someone to go on the offensive against them. I'm really hoping a case presents itself that the "good guys" can get behind and take right to RIAA. IF my source is at all correct, they will have to back down.

  42. $49 million dollars for M Carey by DrSkwid · · Score: 2

    and you wonder why we feel like ripping them off

    Star spangled idiots can keep their hands out of my kid's piggy bank.

    To quote Colonel Kurtz

    I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream. That's my nightmare. Crawling, swiftly, along the edge of a straight... razor... and surviving.

    "It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror. Horror has a face, and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies."

    "I've seen the horrors, horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me, you have a right to do that, but you have no right to judge me."

    "Then I realized they were stronger than we. They have the strength, the strength to do that. If I had 10 divisions of those men, then our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling, without passion, without judgment."

    "We must kill them. We must incinerate them. Pig after pig. Cow after cow. Village after village. Army after army."

    --
    There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
    1. Re:$49 million dollars for M Carey by DrSkwid · · Score: 2

      what the FUCK are you rambling about?!

      The RIAA clients make an obscene profit from their racket, the only way to hurt these people is in the pocket, that's the free market. The Corporate puppets pretending to be government by and for the people want to bleed us dry. The products are not the Records, they are the consumers.

      The Maria Carey story made me very fucking angry. $50 million for less than a year's work. Fuck that. Just for singing a few shitty songs. The schools and hospitals are crumbling around us and all they can do is flaunt their decadence.

      A big fuss is made when a charity night gets a few million in donations. And she get's that much every few fucking days and there must be a few hundred pop people liek that.

      Bill Hicks almost got it right when he said "I want my rock stars dead".

      My twist is "I want YOUR pop stars dead!"

      --
      There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
  43. RIAA stopped my buying of music by Pedrito · · Score: 2

    I can't speak for anyone else, but I e-mailed the RIAA and most of the major labels saying that if they continued their course with Napster, that I'd stop buying CDs. Haven't bought a single one since. I used to download songs off Napster and if I liked the song, I'd buy the CD for my car. Now I just download the songs I like and cut my own CDs. The RIAA shot themselves in the foot as far as I'm concerned.

    I'm more than happy to buy from indie labels, but I won't buy a CD from a major label anytime in the forseeable future.

  44. My Letter to the RIAA by hobbestcat · · Score: 2, Interesting
    This is what I sent to the RIAA throught their handy commnet section:

    Your recent press release regarding the drop in CD sales was quite interesting but I believe you have missed the mark.

    The music distribution industry used to be viewed as a neutral party in music. BMI was BMI. Listeners, like myself, would show some label loyalty but the true loyalty was to the musician.

    When the music distribution industry decided to use an iron fist policy towards Napster and other file sharing systems, they became an evil force to many people.

    The musicians complained about how little revenue they get from the distributors for their work. Every user of Napster was punished equally even if they used the P2P sharing for the good of music industry. The music distribution industry turned what was an excellent marketing opportunity into a PR nightmare.

    Now, most consumers, view music distributors as evil power mongers who profit from others labors. The consumers view the attack on Napster as power grab not an anti-piracy fight.

    If only you could roll back the clock and take a more pro-active, productive and positive roll in music sharing; the consumer might be willing to contribute to your bottom line.

    As a final comment, I have downloaded music to check out new groups. I have owned pirated music... for while. If I liked what I heard, I bought the CD. If I didn't like it, I deleted the MP3. I discovered several new groups that I would not have know about if Napster hadn't existed. And, most importantly, I bought their CDs.

    Now there are fewer ways for me to find music that I enjoy and I feel no compulsion to "support the music distribution industry". I look for bands who sell their music directly from their own web sites. I will buy from the band and help the band. The middle man - especially when they have shown their ugly greed - is no longer necessary and should be eliminated for almost all music exchanges.

    Sincerely.

  45. I guess I have a different perspective... by Jon+Shaft · · Score: 5, Interesting
    I guess I have a different perspective than most people on Slashdot. I work for a student residence hall helpdesk at a large University. Part of my job is to go on appointments to students rooms to work on their systems. There are people here who can barely turn their computer on and operate it, yet they're downloading like crazy on morpheous and kazaa. Just last week a sorority girl told me - " I love downloading music, I haven't bought any cds since I got the computer" ... you have to remember Slashdot is geared towards the geeky type. Many of us like buying the cds to support the artist and just to get the nice labeling and pamphlet inside it.


    Things are very different. My school had to implement and upload/download limit on internet1 traffic whlie they go over the options on how to control this problem. (Most likely they'll be using a packateer...) The problem has been caused due to music/movie etc transfers on morpheous and kazaa. Becasue of our schools privacy policy and unrestrictive content, the school doesn't want to censor or block any incoming material or outgoing. They don't monitor content. Into the first couple weeks of the semester, before the bandwitdh restrictions, the network was soo saturated to the point that i1 traffic was .39k/sec. Most of the dormitory lans here (Yes, in the process of being upgraded though) we're saturated with traffic just because of the sheer file transfers on the LAN itself... I used to think the p2p thing was a great tool in finding music, but like many other good things... a lot of people abuse and it makes it lose it's appeal...


    Hell, if Sorority Sarah can burn the new N'SYNC album on her Compaq, she's not going to buy it.

    --

    Who's the black private dick, who's a sex machine for all the chicks?

    1. Re:I guess I have a different perspective... by droleary · · Score: 4, Funny

      Hell, if Sorority Sarah can burn the new N'SYNC album on her Compaq, she's not going to buy it.

      The negative consequences being?

    2. Re:I guess I have a different perspective... by Rogerborg · · Score: 4, Insightful
      • Just last week a sorority girl told me - " I love downloading music, I haven't bought any cds since I got the computer" ... you have to remember Slashdot is geared towards the geeky type. Many of us like buying the cds to support the artist and just to get the nice labeling and pamphlet inside it.

      Fully fledged bastard of a good point. The amazing thing is that there is any debate about this at all on fora like Slashdot. For the majority of people, it's simply not wrong. If it were wrong, it would be hard to do, or there would be a threat of punishment. It isn't and there isn't, so it must be OK, right? Or, like, The Authorities would stop it, or something (assuming they even get that far in their thought processes).

      And yet... and yet... the metrics don't support that. We see P2P use and CD sales rise and fall in unison. We (being geeks) assume that the P2P sharing drives enthusiasm for buying CD's. The RIAA selectively misrepresents the figures to "prove" that sharing kills sales.

      Is there a simpler answer?

      That there is no cause-effect from sharing to sales? That it's all the other way around, just like it's been for the past fifty years or so? When there's a lot of good music around, CD sales go up, and that drives extra traffic in P2P sharing. When the music sucks, sales drop, and people don't even care enough to share.

      Both the RIAA and the geek brigade have agenda to show that P2P drives sales (down and up respectively), but (anecdotes aside) there's no direct evidence to support that. Perhaps CD purchasers are buying music using the same criteria that they have for the past fifty some years: does it suck? How much does it cost? Do I want my own good quality CD, or a shitty MP3/analogue tape/reel to fucking reel copy from my friend?

      Anecdotes aside, copying has always been extra to shelf sales. The figures seem to indicate that's still the case. People who are going to buy music are still buying it, even though they don't have to.

      --
      If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
    3. Re:I guess I have a different perspective... by tester13 · · Score: 2

      So you are saying that geeks are more likely to support artists then "Sorority Sarah". Whose the snob now?

    4. Re:I guess I have a different perspective... by Reziac · · Score: 2

      You're forgetting something:

      Most college kids don't have the spare funds to go out and buy all those CDs. They do already have the computer, since that's become a necessity of college life.

      These kids eventually grow up and become CONSUMERS, with real jobs and disposable income and a desire to own the real thing now that they can afford it. (I don't know anyone who both downloads music *and* can afford to buy CDs, who doesn't have an ever-growing wallfull of CDs. And these aren't geeks, they're regular people.)

      But make 'em feel pinched as kids by taking away their primary pipeline (the one they can presently afford) -- and when they become consuming adults, they'll resent and resist buying that CD. And then you've lost a whole generation of market.

      --
      ~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
    5. Re:I guess I have a different perspective... by night_flyer · · Score: 2

      I was a college kid once, and I didnt have any money either, so I traded music with my friends...

      Oh by the way, this was before CDs and the internet could be connected to on a 300 baud modem

      whats the difference?

      --


      Thanks to file sharing, I purchase more CDs
      Thanks to the RIAA, I buy them used...
    6. Re:I guess I have a different perspective... by Spoing · · Score: 2
      Hell, when I went to college (back when programming ment touching two live wires together), I had a box of tapes -- all 100% copies. No originals. (Comes from having to decide between eating mac&cheese or putting $1.50 of gas in the car.)

      When I graduated, paid off my student loans, I started to buy music.

      This past year has convinced me that neither are totally ethical actions unless you know the seller.

      Along those lines, I'm still amazed that one friend -- an ex-professional rock band member -- still gets ticked off that people are able to make backups of music CDs. The same person will ask me, without any reservations, to come over and install some commercial software on his machine. When I say gladly, if he buys it, he immediately looses interest.

      --
      A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
  46. Support your local record store by dedair · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If you really want to stick it to the man, buy all of your CD's used. Most of the time you can get a CD for less than $8, and I find they are generally in great condition. Not only does your money go directly back into your community, but it does not find it's way into the deep pockets of the RIAA

    --
    ---> suck it
  47. Bach by wiredog · · Score: 2

    Until you've sat in the front row of the Kennedy Center and heard the Bach organ concertos on that monster organ, you haven't lived.

    1. Re:Bach by gorilla · · Score: 2

      I'd have to agree with this, or indeed any decent organ. There is NO stereo system in the world which can reproduce an organ.

  48. Re:vinyl! by HerringFlavoredFowl · · Score: 2

    Besides, we all know nothing good has come out of the RIAA in the last 15 years ;-)

    TastesLikeHerringFlavoredChicken

    --
    TastesLikeHerringFlavoredChicken
  49. You're fooling yourselves by schnitzi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm a little befuddled by the tack that free music advocates are taking against the RIAA -- denying that song swapping will cause a decline in CD sales.

    Of course it will cause a decline. It may not have yet, but the CD's days are numbered. Why? They're an obsolete technology. They're clunky. They require packing and shipping. They hold a limited amount of music. They're prone to loss and scratches. If you think song swapping won't accelerate the decline in sales, you're fooling yourselves.

    The record companies see the writing on the wall, and are trying to milk as much money out of CD sales before their collapse. Of course they're going to whine about everything that can even be perceived as a drop in sales; it's just part and parcel of doing everything they can do to receive court decisions sympathetic to their financial interests.

    --



    I object to that article, and to the next reply.
    1. Re:You're fooling yourselves by wizkid · · Score: 2, Insightful


      I disagree with what your saying dramatically. How do you know what music/albums you like? The radio these days only plays what's on there playlists, which of course are the albums that have just been released, or re-released on cdrom.

      To listen to all the songs on an album to figure out if you want to buy it or not, you have to listen to it at the music store (I don't have time for this) or download it.

      Currently, I'm boycotting the music and video industry, because of DCMA and the RIAA policies on digital media. So I only get stuff from the internet right now unless the artist is not a member of the RIAA communists. So yes, in my case it is effecting there business. But that's only because THEY ARE STUPID. If they get a clue, I will start spending money on albums again.

      --
      I take no responsibility for what I say. Even though I'm never wrong :)
    2. Re:You're fooling yourselves by SilentChris · · Score: 2
      "Currently, I'm boycotting the music and video industry, because of DCMA and the RIAA policies on digital media."

      And how many out there, besides a few rabid free music advocates, are doing this? A dozen? A hundred at max? Do you even think the average teenager/college student knows what the RIAA is?

      People download music because they want to sample it, true. But the sample often stays indefinitely.

      It's akin to when people were swapping tapes of their favorite bands. So you got a bootleg of a Led Zepelin concert. What are you the chances you're going to buy the studio tape, considering most of the songs you like are already on your bootleg? Unless you're a diehard fan of the band, how much are you going to want to buy that boxset of music you already have? Not very much.

      The RIAA is correct to a point: they definitely *are* losing some money to downloads. But they were losing it to tapes too, and other means. What's needed is a way to sample and then permanently download singles for very low prices. If they want to make them copy-protected that's fine - as long as there's no time limit on the final product, and I can choose what songs I want.

    3. Re:You're fooling yourselves by brad3378 · · Score: 2

      I'm a little befuddled by the tack that free music advocates are taking against the RIAA -- denying that song swapping will cause a decline in CD sales.

      Bullshit.
      If that philosphy is true, then why doesn't the RIAA attack FM radio broadcasts? If the RIAA had its way they'd bill me for using my radio. I highly doubt that they're willing to give up the exposure they get from commercial radio.

      --

  50. How Columbia solves this problem by yerricde · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Extra bonus material is starting to cost way too much becuase actors and directors are starting to have pay for that bonus material getting written into contracts.

    Columbia/Sony lately has been solving this problem by leaving out bonus DVD features, allowing mastering to greatly increase the bitrate for the primary video signal, making the DVD look as good as a 480-line picture can provide. See Columbia's Flash site for details.

    --
    Will I retire or break 10K?
  51. If Assumption Correct then... by Lysander+Luddite · · Score: 2

    If your assumption is correct that Napster users are "into music" and presumably buying more, then why aren't sales UP? After all, the new P2P services are supposedly more popular than Napster at its height.

    No the cause for a slight downturn in sales (in the UK sales are up 5%) are:

    1. a weakened US economy wherein a large amount of people are unemployed or underemployed
    2. a year in which big name artists didn't release material
    3. the fractured music market. This is the REAL legacy of Napster. With Napster and other P2P services people were exposed to more variety in music. People want more variety in their music purchases. Unfortunately, distribution doesn't favor the small guys, you need to search for it. P2P makes it easy and conveinent for lazy Americans to get smaller artists' works more easily than before.

    Look, I made $11K last year (thanks dot com economy). I didn't download an illegal song file (thanks epitonic) and yet I bought 7 CDs last year. I'm just more choosy what I buy and can preview artists and genres more easily thanks to music streams. But recent royalty moves there may dry that option as players simply cannot afford the royalties demanded.

    1. Re:If Assumption Correct then... by Lysander+Luddite · · Score: 2

      Thank you for the civil and well-reasoned reply. I also do not think that CD sales are attributable to anything other than normal market fluctuation. I do have another obervation and question for yout hough.

      You state: "That had to translate into CD sales since copying music works has never been a real chore."

      That is true, but remember the price of a CD-R unit has declined tremendously during the past 2-3 years. I think that price drop is what made copying much easier, not the technology or product (CD, cassette etc) itself. Once a recording technology gets to the $100 - $150 range they tend to gain mass acceptance (exclusing other factors like built in limitations of course)

      Thanks again for a nice reply and cool head.

  52. YOU're part of the problem by nanojath · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "This strange doctrine is not supported by statute or common law."


    The problem with this Heinlein quote is that the RIAA's beef, however much we may vilify them (and they are unquestionably vile), IS supported by statute and common law. There are few people less supportive of the Content Kings than me but if I have to say it a million times I will: as long as all we're doing is trying to justify the violation of copyright law, which is what downloading copyrighted music or burning a copyrighted CD that you do not own UNQUESTIONABLY is, we will NEVER make progress in changing things to a better system.


    Legitimate consumer and legal beefs with the RIAA are plentiful:


    * Do the Content Kings REALLY own the copyright to specifc recordings, or should many have reverted to the authors?


    * Does the way the "legitimate" online music businees operates qualify as monopolistic practices?


    * Is the DMCA constitutional, or is it in fact an example of "prior restraint," illegalizing the POTENTIAL uses of legitimate tools?


    * Copy-protection schemes that produce "CDs" that do not follow CD specs, do not play in the range of equipment the consumer has reasonably come to expect, and reduces the versatility of the product.


    * Treatment of artists, overpricing, the endless extension of copyrights... All these and more are totally valid points of attack. You wanna burn CDs, download free music? Be my guest. Hell, I speed. But stop this nonsense that somehow the courts and corporations should recognize our "right" to violate copyright law. Every argument like this just strengthens their case and makes the further legislation of information tools that much more likely.

    --

    It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries

  53. Re:Are you kidding? by Rader · · Score: 2

    Cool. I saw Chuck Berry at his Blueberry Hill restaurant/club in St. Louis.

  54. Jamie, by Starship+Trooper · · Score: 2

    First off, thanks for taking the time to write a real Editorial. It's nice to see some actual value-added besides linking a tidbit of news.

    Second, I personally believe that both the record industry and yourself are guilty of confusing correlation with causality. You wrote:

    "At this point last year, with Napster in full swing, record sales were up 8 percent from the previous year. This year, sales of new albums -- not including established catalog titles -- are down 8 percent. That's quite a pendulum swing."

    So, we have a correlation. Let me give you another one. Men who shave with electric razors are 17% more likely to develop facial cancer. There happens to be no causal relationship between the two. Men who shave with electric razors usually have more money and live in cities, where all cancer rates are higher. But when you hear that statistic, you can get all kinds of bad ideas. If you mistake correlation with causality.

    I think the record industry's attempts at hand waving and implying causality are shameful. Let's not be party to the same offense. CD sales could be entirely fluctuating based on the amount of disposable income consumers have. Which, given the recent trend for unemployment and financial collapse, is going down. The truth is, no one has researched the causality behind the trend, so we don't really know.

    The one thing we can say for certain is that Napster did not in any discernible "cause & effect" way effect total revenue for the recording industry before it was destroyed.

    And that's a message worth getting out.

    --
    Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
  55. Simple question... by Rogerborg · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why do we get defensive every time the RIAA trots out the "falling sales, evil pirates, end of civilisation as we know it" line?

    Why don't we respond with: "Yeah, sales are down, and it's your fault, you soulless reptiles. What the fuck are you going to do about it? I hate your over engineered muzak, and the dead eyed meat puppets that mime to it, and your old fashioned distribution system, and the fact that most of the cost of an album goes to weaels in marketing and legal, up the noses of desparately unhappy borderline morons in G-strings, or in <strike>bribes </strike> campaign contributions. Fix it, and fix it now, or get the hell out of the way and let someone else have a go at supplying the demand rather than trying to control it through an abusive monopoly."

    Oh wait, I just said it.

    --
    If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
  56. Clear Channel's monopoly feeds RIAA's by yerricde · · Score: 2

    Perhaps, but what's supposed to happen is that new companies are supposed to enter the field when they see others making a profit, driving the supply up and moving the total profit/loss towards equilibrium.

    In the United States, the FCC's monopoly on broadcasting prevents this. It's hard for a new independent radio station to get a broadcasting license in the consumer FM band (88.1 to 107.9 MHz), and without a sizable number of independent radio stations, radio listeners hear what Clear Channel wants them to hear, and the RIAA member labels pay a puppet promoter to pay Clear Channel to play RIAA music and only RIAA music. These bribes come most often not in the form of cold hard cash but in free non-conforming promotional discs and free tickets to live performances.

    --
    Will I retire or break 10K?
  57. response by figment · · Score: 2
    Ok i'm not affiliated w/ the RIAA, in fact i really dont like them, but i also really dont like when /. puts out this biased crap with flawed logic. Here's a response to a few things jamie said:

    • The SF gate story: who cares, correlation in no way indicates causation. Bad economy coupled with releases that didnt have mass market appeal (a lot of r&b it seems) could easily explain it regardless of napster.
    • I guess 77 percent are buying more music because they're downloading it for free?
      Great. If 77% are buying one more cd, while the 23% are buying 8 less cds, then you have a net loss. This figure cited proves nothing.
    • Most industries, faced with declining sales, try lowering their prices. Not this one.
      Of course not. Music demand is highly inelastic, they can maximize revenue by raising prices, not lowering. Crack dealers (also in an inelastic industry) do not lower prices to increase revenue.
    • You know music officially sucks when the labels have to pay someone $28 million not to sing.
      Or it could be that Mariah has enough personal problems that it would be cheaper for them to pay the 28million than to keep her under her much more expensive contract. Unfortunately Mariah has fallen down from her huge-popularties of the late 80s early 90s, and her sony contract was priced assuming her massive popularity. Sony was merely cutting their losses on her, and is in no way indicitive of the rest of the music released.

      Also, every "napster helps sales" argument i have seen is purely anecdotal, or if not, it lacks the numbers needed to prove anything. Furthermore all these surveys have a high bias (people feel more compelled to say they buy more music, than buying less). If you were from say Gallup and flagged me down on the street asking me if i bought more/same/less of music after using napster, of course i would say more, as i wouldnt want (napster|kazaa|morpheus) to go away.
  58. Nope by Lysander+Luddite · · Score: 2

    Listen to the February 26 broadcast of Marketplace (www.markeplace.org). It's in Real Audio. The last story is a peice written by a teen girl about the Grammys, but it really, really applies to this article and your reply.

  59. RE: That will work! by King_TJ · · Score: 2

    I've been saying for years that the software industry as well as the movie and music industry need to adopt this sales strategy. In all cases, you're talking about something that costs you *very* little to replicate, once you spend the money up-front for the initial production.

    The movie industry has already been doing this anyway, in the theaters. They spend millions to make the movie, and then they re-coup the costs and (typically) start earning a profit by selling movie tickets, one at a time, for under $10 each.

    They need to come to grips with the fact that all of these "intellectual property" products are not necessary for anyone's survival... They're merely impulse buys and entertainment value. If it costs too much, people will pass on it.

    Even items that *are* necessary for survival (groceries) are sold at razor-thin margins, and the profit is made in sheer volume of sales. It's a proven viable business model - and they need to start using it!

  60. All I know is this: by decipher_saint · · Score: 2

    When I was activly downloading mp3s I was sampling a more varied musical diet than I normally had access to (via the radio), if I liked the music enough I would go out and buy the CD. In 2000 (my most active mp3 downloading year) I bought roughly 80 CDs, in 2001 (my least active mp3 downloaing year, so far) I bought 7.

    --
    crazy dynamite monkey
  61. Not every record company is a RIAA member by sph · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Why complain about RIAA, when there's no need to buy *their* CDs, yet you can still buy CDs. Not every record company is a member. Here is a complete list of members. If the CD you're buying is from a company/label not listed, then it's not from RIAA. Simple.

    Big part of my CD collection is released by labels that are not members. Of course, it's not your average pop and radio hits, but a bit more marginal stuff, like progressive rock and metal. Labels like InsideOut, Nuclear Blast and Magna Carta release some *good* music instead of financially calculated products. These bands still have some talent and creativity, they don't even have to be MTV-ready. Small labels also often give way more freedom and flexibility to the bands.

    And yes, I buy something like 100-200 CDs a year, paying perhaps $16 for most new CDs and $6-$10 for budget releases and used discs. Oh what a poor student I am. Get a job if you can't afford it, or live without CDs. Music is not required for survival.

  62. Listen to the radio... by dasmegabyte · · Score: 2

    How is listening to the radio (indepedent radio...ups to WEQX) any different from Napster's evils?

    Back before radio became the bastion of independent producers and huge coglomerates, it was THE place to steal music. Long before napster, long before CDs, there was a device known as the tape recorder. Quality wasn't great, and like Margaret Cho all my old music has my mom yelling at me in the background from when I held the Sharp handheld tape recorder up to the old crystal radio my dad built in high school. But it's how we got it. My friends would trade copies of Wierd Al on 90 minute tapes, selling them on the schoolyard. One friend spent all week making "ultimate mixes" for field trips.

    And we had access to every great song ever. Our network was sneakernet, but through it you could get anything. Springstein? Matt Bonaparte's sister's best friend's dad has the whole collection. Dylan? That wierd kid whose family never mows the lawn has a complete set on vinyl and will trade it for a pudding cup.

    Before tapes, people would trade records at parties. Before records, people taught each other songs. Jesus, music is *ABOUT* trading, it's about making friends. My wife and I used to make out to stoner rock, we met at a coffehouse folk show. Our first date was to a midnight Beatles Anthology party. Most of my friends were met at concerts and shows.

    Somebody mentioned something about the best acts nowadays not being marketed, or certainly overshadowed by handsome total crap bands willing to trade their integrity for a pay day. Music trading is the only way most bands will get any exposure. Have you heard of the Atomic Numbers? MC Paul Barman? Queens of the Stone Age and Dream Theatre have great new albums out, did you know about them? I found all of these acts through music trading, through my 13 exobyte, 100,000 user WinMX network set. I've met good friends there.

    And last month, I spent $300 on CDs.

    --
    Hey freaks: now you're ju
  63. MTV, radio, downloads, and pay-for-stream by jimfrost · · Score: 4, Interesting
    We still learn what music we want to hear from the Radio and from MTV; we just use P2P technology to get it cheaper/for free.

    I dunno about you, but I gave up on MTV, it just sucks too much. I also don't listen to the radio too much, it's just more of the same crap that's on MTV. If you want to find a new artist who's any good, about the worst place to do it is MTV or the radio.

    Mostly I find new music from referral from friends. "Hey, check this out." That used to be done by going out to a bar and listening to a band, something I don't really have the time for these days. These days someone sends me an MP3 clip. And you know what? If I like it, I first try to see if I can buy it straight from the artist (many many small bands sell them off their own websites). If I can't do that, I try Amazon. Because you can bet your bottom dollar that the cool stuff isn't at Best Buy.

    Outside of those kinds of referrals, I've subscribed to an actual (gasp) pay-for-stream service, RealOne. Their commercial-free genre-based streaming system is worth $10/month; terrific for background noise.

    But having used RealOne for a few months now, I can see places where their model is seriously incomplete. For one, if I like a clip it's a pain to go listen to it again or to go listen to the whole album. There's no way I can forward a reference to the clip to someone so they can hear it too. There's a link to Amazon to buy the album, but no way to buy it and get it on MP3 immediately and the album delivered later.

    These companies really need to use a mixed model to build a strong business. You need streaming content for "browsing". You need referral services for audience building. You need purchasing features for retail. And, this being the internet, you need immediate gratification so that when you buy the album, you have it /now/. And if they're going to charge CD prices for MP3 content, they're going to have to send the CD too.

    --
    jim frost
    jimf@frostbytes.com
  64. Music that doesn't blow by Jeppe+Salvesen · · Score: 2

    Most new music blows. Let's list a few albums you might want to check out, cuz they don't blow.

    Joe Henry - Scar
    Grant Lee Phillips - Mobilize
    Aphex Twin - DrukQs
    Tomahawk - Tomahawk (new Mike Patton project. rawk. really.)
    St Germain - (forgot album title)

    --

    Stop the brainwash

  65. Why the Uk is not in a recession... by El+Camino+SS · · Score: 2


    Why is it not in a recession?

    Because it was the only major player in Europe that didn't try to link their standard currency of exchange with Italy, and a whole bunch of other weak markets. Italy? Italy is a place that has currency almost as strong as Germany in the early 30s.

  66. Re:maryjane by radja · · Score: 3, Funny

    >drug war anyone?

    No thank you, I'm rolling a joint.

    //rdj, the flying dutchman

    --

    No one can understand the truth until he drinks of coffee's frothy goodness.
    --Sheikh Abd-Al-Kadir, 1587
  67. Re: How can you speak for "people as a whole"? by King_TJ · · Score: 2

    All I can do is listen, attentively, to what most people say that I encounter in daily life. From that (rather unscientific, but I think still pretty valid) information, I find very *few* people who like pop-rock like Brittney Spears.

    I think they're generatng most of their sales on the "under age 15" crowd with that type of music. When you think about it, this only makes sense. Younger kids haven't lived long enough to be exposed to enough music to realize how cliche and "canned" that stuff is. Instead, they're drawn-in by all of the hype and glamour, and then they buy the CDs.

    If that's all you focus on, as a record company, though - you eventually get looked upon just like a toy company; great for the kiddies, but not relevant to the rest of us.

    Real, quality, music is meant to be so much more. Did any of the great classical composers concern themselves with what the teenagers thought of their image? Did any of the jazz greats cater to pre-teens? I think not. Instead, they composed music from their heart and soul - as much for their own satisfaction as for anyone else's. Either you appreciated the work that went into it, or you didn't - but there was no effort to "market" it to a particular crowd.

    The recording industry would serve themselves much better in the long run if they'd stick to the business of recording/archiving/documenting all musicians that come to them with respectably well-done material.

  68. Man, oh man... Scott McCloud's stuff hits home. by Svartalf · · Score: 2

    You need to go read the Scott McCloud links if you haven't- it's my opinion that he hits things squarely on the head of the nail for everything that RIAA and MPAA's member orgs crank out as well as e-books, etc.

    --
    I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
  69. New music does blow by cybrthng · · Score: 2

    I agree, todays music is so processed and milked out of the same ol' it just SUCKS.

    I don't think the RIAA realized it was still cheaper to spend 11.99 on a cd at best buy for most people then to acquire a decent cd burner, a decent cd burner software package and a stack of cd's very affordably.

    Heck, it was hard enough, and still is hard enough to find good quality, complete songs. Now that my choices are limited more i don't discover new artists or new releases since i can't even bother.

    They made purchasing and hearing new music just that much harder, and most people who buy cd's and spend TONS of money on music aren't the typical Nstink or britney spears fan.

    Personally the only thing i'm awaiting from Britney spears is her playboy appearence.

    I hope the RIAA continues to loose money, they had the largest FREE advertising

  70. Aqua! by BitwizeGHC · · Score: 2

    They've broken up now, but the techno-pop band "Aqua" (famous here for "Barbie Girl") was one of my faves. They had some of the most incredibly vapid lyrics imaginable, but it was almost like a self-conscious parody of pop music, kinda like how Beavis and Butt-head, a show about two idiots, had quite intelligent subtexts running through it.

    Aqua also takes potshots at other aspects of our culture: their track "Halloween" condenses the entire plot of "Scream"-style teen horror flicks into a three minute song; "Freaky Friday" is ostensibly a send-up of the sad lyrics of country music, and has more disasters than Alanis's "Ironic", etc.

    80's New Wave kitsch (e.g., Devo) sort of falls into the same category for me.

    On the more serious side, I tend to like Meat Loaf (and any music by Jim Steinman), Queen, Styx, Darude, Chicane, Paul Oakenfold, even Mozart. :)

    In general, I tend to like music with texture to it. Today's pop music really is like soda pop: too sugary, goes flat and stale quickly.

    --
    N4st0r, trixx0r h0bb1tz0rz! Th3y st0l3 0ur pr3c10uzz!
  71. Stop Buying CDs! by oneself · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The sad truth is that the artist are the ones who can really change
    things in the music industry. The main reason is that they ARE the
    music industry, they create the music. The problem is that they are
    too use to using the record companies to sell their music. I think
    that we was music fans and consumers need to explain to the artists
    that they need to find a new way of selling their music. They are not
    going to do this if the current method is generating $13B a year.
    They are, however, going to rethink things if sales drop let's say
    %90. Then they will have no choice but to come up with an
    alternative. Not to mention the RIAA won't have any more money to pay
    high-waged lawyers to harass companies ushering in the new era.


    The important thing to remember is that artists will always make art
    and art fans will always adore it. Anything else is just packaging,
    it is replaceable, and will be replaced.

  72. Re:The price of CD's should go up by walt-sjc · · Score: 2

    Except one flaw in your logic. The ARTIST is getting screwed. They are NOT getting more money. The people really makeing the bucks are the labels and RIAA.

    Best Buy, Walmart, and Target got into trouble selling discounted CD's. The record companies got pissed, as they want prices to stay high. In retaliation, they withheld co-marketing dollars which is a big deal to stores. That's the money that helps pay for advertising, instore signage, display cases, etc. BB sued. I don't recall the outcome, but BB won one part, but may have been overturned in a later appeal. Anyone know? I believe this was what caused prices to drop from the $19 to $14, but it doesn't surprise me that they are raising prices again.

  73. They want to become a federally protected entity by El+Camino+SS · · Score: 2


    You are right. The truth of the matter is that technology, up to this point, has produced economic benefit off of every industry it has ever touched, ususally for the purchaser (I know I can successfully argue this point in generalities, and not specific this software blah blah). These guys just want all the money possible. They want you to mortgage your house so you can have the priveledge of playing a cover song on your own guitar in the privacy of your own home.

    With porn, alcohol, cigarettes, movies, and music... (anything with a ridiculously high profit margin) is going to have an army of "extra cash floating around you" lawyers that will pit bull you to death. These people (in the industries above) are the most amazing liars I have ever seen. The best part about it, they don't need to lie personally, they get good lawyers to do it for the money.

    Great Example: These are the kind of people that said that the movie Forrest Gump lost money. Riiiight. Cocksuckers. Brilliant accounting cocksuckers. But cocksuckers nonetheless.

    I had to pay my taxes... they didn't after making huge profits off of that?!? It was a well-loved, Best Picture of the Friggin' Year! If I was a IRS agent, I would have personally audited the entire fucking studio for a stunt like that. I would have audited the Gate Security Guard's wallet for that kind of bullshit.

    Just because you appear like you make bad business decisions doesn't mean you pay zero taxes.

    That is why I say download all you want.

    Too bad their little state controlled monopoly plans are going extinct, and will never work. Tear down KaZaA... somegthing else will pop up even faster than last time. Its free music Whack-A-Mole.

  74. The Economy? by Geeyzus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Hmmm... as much as I do think Napster boosted record sales, I would tend to think that the economy hitting a low lately has also affected record sales (as well as sales of, well, everything else), so many factors play into this, not just Napster. just a thought...

    Mark

  75. 77% buying more is just plain stupid by sleight · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If 23% are buying less because they are downloading more for free, that just means that the other 77% of "music consumers" could be a) buying more because they download more, b) buying more for reasons having nothing to do with downloading music off of the net, or c) buying less for reasons that have nothing to do with downloading music off of the net.

    Shall we explore option "C"?

    Here in the U.S. we're currently in a recession. Be it enough to say that when people fear for their financial stability, they tend to buy luxuries, like music, less frequently.

    Perhaps sales have dropped simply because people aren't willing to spend money on music and, instead, are just holding onto their cash?

  76. Music Industry out to lunch by bodland · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Lets face it the music industry is going through the suckiest period in years. Boy band soda pop crap, teen girls dressed like transvestite hookers selling pepsi is not music. It really isn't! there is no melody anymore just vocal gymnastics over samples. The 11 year olds are even catching on that it sucks.

    The baby boomers built the music industry and if they actually started marketing to the baby boomers again they would see a renewed financial gain. But NO! They have a formula that works and no one is going to wrest control of music from these sleaze ball cheese ball pedaphile producers. Listening to World Cafe on NPR shows what quality of music is out there.

    One of the hottest selling albums of the year: The soundtrack from "O Brother Where Art Thou" sold millions with no radio airplay or promotion. It slaps the face of the music industry because it was made by outsiders. This is exactly wht the industry DOSE'NT want. Music that is cheap to make using songs that are public domain and traditional. That would encourage more people to possibly pick up instruments and start entertaining themselves. And that would be really bad for Pepsi, Coke, Britteny and that fat slob guy in Florida who created n.sync. So if the RIAA moans about lack of sales and tries to blame it on piracy they are just clueless. They won't admit they screwed up in selling SODA to pre-teens rather than making music.

    I tell my 11 year old daughter that some acts really suck in that they:
    1. Don't play an instrument
    2. Lip synch live perfromances
    3. Use sex appeal more than talent
    4. Can't write there own material.
    5. Auditioned for the part
    6. Will never be see them in a small club

    So if the RIAA whines about declining sales maybe they should get out the "music whore suckometer" and take a reading. They'll see its way in the red.

    1. Re:Music Industry out to lunch by Suicyco · · Score: 2


      Or perhaps Frank sucked just as much as nsync. It was corporate marketed media crap and the people who think he was some kind of genius are the same people who glamorize puff daddy or the kennedy's. People who are spoon fed their culture. Those people were told that Frank was some kind of singing genius. I personally think high school freshman choir singers have more talent, but thats just me. Its the same story over and over. James Dean. Marilyn Monroe. Elvis. Crap Crap Crap. Not trolling here just an observation that you hinted at. This isn't a new culutural phenomena, not at all. Its a tried and true formula for making money. The sheeple of western nations love the fantasy of what is spoon fed to them. Thats why people love Bill Gates and Microsoft. Thats why people hate Osama Bin Laden. Thats why people watch baseball. Its all a big distraction to keep you from realizing you are just a slave in a big machine that profits a select few. And the few crumbs we do have we give right back in order to further inflate our fantasy idolization of what we can never have. And then we go buy another lottery ticket and talk about what we would do if we won.

    2. Re:Music Industry out to lunch by MtViewGuy · · Score: 2

      The baby boomers built the music industry and if they actually started marketing to the baby boomers again they would see a renewed financial gain.

      I can cite a great example of what you described: the success of the Beatles' One CD not long ago.

      Why did that CD become a Number One seller according to the Billboard charts for over a month? Maybe because they marketed the CD to the massively huge Baby Boomer crowd?

  77. Another reason CD sales are down by c=sixty4 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I went into a record store yesterday, and saw a record I actually wanted to buy. The conversation with the clerk went something like this:

    "Is this CD copy protected?"

    "I don't know. They don't label all that are."

    "The only CD player I have is in my computer. If this is copy protected, I will not be able to play it. I will have bought what is for all intents and purpouses a shiny piece of metal. Can I at least try this to see if I can play this?"

    "Sorry, but if the case has been opened, there are no refunds."

    Yes, that will encourage more record sales.

    --
    "The good die first." "Most of us are morally ambiguous, which explains our random dying patterns." --- MST3K
    1. Re:Another reason CD sales are down by x136 · · Score: 2

      So go to your local used CD shop to see if it's copy protected (aka "broken"). Look at the number of used CDs.

      "OK, let's see, this CD has 5 used copies, this one has 3, this one has 12, this one has 8, this one has 65."

      Can you pick the copy protected CD out of that lineup? :)

      (Sure, that particular CD could just suck, but either way, you don't want it.)

      --
      SIGFEH
  78. Re:i stopped buy CDs because of RIAA, not fileshar by Buran · · Score: 2

    I won't buy another CD as long as my money supports an industry that got me thrown off one of my online RPGs.

    Yes, that's right, kids. Mentioning Audiogalaxy is against their AUP. "Please log off now." Uh huh. And this is how they treat their STAFF (yes, I'm an unpaid volunteer)? Gee, thanks. I guess this means the two-week paid vacation is out of the question, too?

    By the way, for the foreseeable future, that RPG is off my login list, too. I won't support anything, free or not, that bows down and worships the big toe of the RIAA, MPAA, or anyone else who has no sense of right and wrong. I have no qualms about it. Want me back? Get off your marble altar to St. Rosen and St. Valenti.

    And for god's sakes, go and read the First Amendment.

  79. Most albums are more than a collection of songs by jcsehak · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I can't think of any CD, except compilations of old blues sides, that is just a collection of songs. People don't buy songs, they buy albums, which are organized to generate a 15-75 min. musical experience. There's something satisfying about popping a CD into a player and just hitting play, knowing you're getting the artist's vision exactly as it was intended. With Napster, if I downloaded an album, lots of times the tracks were wierd versions of the ones on the album. I bought Kid A AFTER having downloaded it from Napster and burned it to CD! Why? 3 reasons: a) to make sure I got the "official" music of the CD b) to support the band, and c) to enjoy the packaging.

    This "clunky packaging" you talk about has the potential to enhance the musical experience by a lot. The Kid A booklet is this fat thing with some very interesting pictures. The Moby booket includes five or six annoying essays by him and a bunch of narcisisstic pictures of himself, but I enjoyed it anyway. I can remember back in high school listening to the Cure's Disinitegration over and over again, reading along with the lyrics in the booklet. Somehow, when I download a CD, I feel like I'm not getting everything.

    Here's to hoping that P2P will encourage labels and artists to spend more time and money developing unique and interesting packaging that complements and enhances the music.

    --

    c-hack.com |
  80. Invalid moral argument by El+Kevbo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I am frustrated by people who use the "fact" that Napster and other file-sharing apps strengthen CD sales as moral justification for using file sharing apps against the will of the artists. The fact that you're more willing to buy their music doesn't mean that you (should) have the ability to completely ignore their wishes with regard to distribution of said music.

    Let me try to give an example to clarify my frustration with this argument. Let's say that I decide to break into your house one day while you're away. I discreetly pick the lock and walk right in. I don't take anything, but I've still violated your privacy and the sanctity of your home. When I'm arrested for breaking and entering later on that day, I can't complain to the police, "But dude, I vaccumed! Look, I even washed your dishes!! C'mon man, I did something good for you! You ungrateful lout!"

    I see that as the same as people violating the copyrights of musicians and then telling those same musicians, "Shut up about your damn rights. We're buying your albums so that gives *us* the right to decide how to distribute your music!"
    In essence, the artists are being told to not worry about their rights because they're making more money. I hope that we can all see the foolishness of that.

    Please note that I'm not accusing the RIAA of actually representing the artists or their wishes. I find them as morally repugnant and repulsive as most Napster users.

    Kevin

    1. Re:Invalid moral argument by DarkProphet · · Score: 2

      OK, I can actually understand with your argument. However, the RIAA is far from being a good neighbor itself. The DMCA severely limits citizen's freedoms to do even absolutely legitimate things. The RIAA certainly had something to do with the DMCA, and whose money did they use to do it? Their customers'.

      Also, there is a big difference between sticking it to the RIAA and sticking it to the artists. If I download some music from Green Day, and decide to attend thier next concert (or buy thier merchandise), Green Day is gonna come out rosier than thier record label. The artist ends up with more money, and the record label gets fucked.

      So why do that to the record label? Its really simple. It is near-impossible for an artist to be heard from coast-to-coast without recording with a major label. Back in the day, this used to be because record labels helped advertise artists and handle the distribution of music. These days, an indie recording studio can do damned near the same thing, but you won't end up on MTV. By screwing over the record labels, the playing field between major and indie labels gets a much-needed levelling.

      In my opinion, I'd like to see music move away from the whole MTV teen-pop stardom thing and allow more talented artists to be heard on the airwaves. Also, I don't like how the RIAA has so much control over its industry and even worse, the government. Its just not right. For me, it's more a conflict of socio-political ideaologies with the RIAA than a matter of money. I don't have a problem slapping down 15 bucks for my favorite artist's new album. I do, however, have a problem with 14 of those bucks going to the label, and a paltry dollar for the artist.

      If the RIAA had any foresight, they'd move away from the MTV generation, and actually put out quality music. Is it really necessary to spend millions of dollars promoting an artist? Couldn't less money be put to equal or better use? The major labels have a really good excuse for why CDs cost 20 bucks apiece. The record company spends millions on its artist, hoping they will cash in on thier investment. Only a small percentage of artists actually make the label money, so they have to adjust accordingly. OK, that makes sense and all, but what about this: If the vast majority of your signed artists are actually talented, and have an actual fan following that persists (like Phish and much unlike this week's boy band), the odds dictate you will make money on your investments the majority of the time. Thus, the labels _could_ ajust prices accordingly (way lower). Of course, the labels could probably lower prices substantially and still stay well above the red.

      So, with all that said, I think the labels need to keep in mind that they are feeling the effect of thier customer's displeasure. We've found a much better way to filter through the crap and only support the artists we want to. Is that so bad? Do you like buying a CD only to find out that it only has one good song and the rest are pure crap? I don't. There wouldn't be so much file-sharing if there wasn't an itch to scratch. Its not anybody's fault that the RIAA is finding out that capitalism has a downside. Sure, you can make as much money as you are determined to make, but only if you can convince people to give it to you willingly. Maybe they need to try harder to convince people to willingly pay for their product. That shouldn't include pushing legislation, which has already happened. Its kind of sad that in this day and age, the dollar carries more weight than a ballot.

      --
      What could possibly hurt the security of the American people more than giving our own government the ability to hide its
    2. Re:Invalid moral argument by elflord · · Score: 2
      However, the RIAA is far from being a good neighbor itself.

      He didn't say that they were.

      The artist ends up with more money, and the record label gets fucked.

      Maybe, maybe not. Tours aren't always a winning proposition, and a lot of the revenue pays people other than the band (the venue itself, promoters, etc etc)

      In my opinion, I'd like to see music move away from the whole MTV teen-pop stardom thing and allow more talented artists to be heard on the airwaves.

      Well start your own radio station or something. There are plenty of non-profit radio stations that do a great job of giving air time to "talented artists". However, you won't get "talented" musicians on mainstream radio, because most people don't want to hear it.

      f the RIAA had any foresight, they'd move away from the MTV generation, and actually put out quality music.

      This idea that RIAA labels just produce cheesy pop-tunes is a popular slashdot myth. Actually, for the most part it's the napster scum who go for the cheesy pop tunes. I'm a jazz fan, and nearly all of the music I listen to (some of which is pretty far out) is on RIAA labels. The RIAA labels produce and promote all kinds of music, and the public buys what the public buys.

      Is it really necessary to spend millions of dollars promoting an artist? Couldn't less money be put to equal or better use?

      They choose the strategy they think will be the most profitable. On what basis do you consider this "bad use" ?

      The record company spends millions on its artist,

      Not on all artists, they don't. They only spend millions if they think it will help sell albums.

      If the vast majority of your signed artists are actually talented, and have an actual fan following that persists (like Phish and much unlike this week's boy band), the odds dictate you will make money on your investments the majority of the time.

      You're going to have a lower sales volume, so no, you won't necessarily make a lot of money. Look, if you think this is an easy way to make money, start your own business or something. It's kind of amusing how many armchair business experts there are on slashdot.

      We've found a much better way to filter through the crap and only support the artists we want to.

      Cut the rubbish about "supporting artists". You may care about "supporting artists", but the vast majority of napster users do not.

      Do you like buying a CD only to find out that it only has one good song and the rest are pure crap? I don't.

      Then don't buy CDs made by one hit wonders. I've never had this problem with my John Coltrane or Miles Davis CDs (-;

      Sure, you can make as much money as you are determined to make, but only if you can convince people to give it to you willingly.

      No one "gives away money willingly". Relying on the customers generosity is not a business model.

  81. I disagree here. by gdyas · · Score: 2

    I'm going to disagree here, not necessarily with your conclusion (that RIAA companies are dinosaurs) but with your rationale that it's because CDs are a thing of the past.

    Note that, in the story here, RIAA companies sold almost $14 BILLION in CDs. People are buying these things, and by the truckloads. Not only that, the net has not yet even begun to be able to handle mass-scale trading & purchase of uncompressed (or very low-compressed) audiophile-quality music. I use Morpheus & yet still buy many CDs because MP3, though a nice format, isn't perfect, either for audio quality or portability (yet). The CD, I would project, still has at least 20 years life ahead of itself as a popular format, and probably 50-100 years as an archival format - hell, look at records, considered by many audiophiles to be the way to go for recordings because of their analog nature.

    Where I agree with your conclusion that the music industry as a corporate entity is eventually doomed is in the fact that the net provides a group of musicians and a small management team to work independantly on creation & promotion of its music, allowing the market (us) to decide what we like. Huzzah for technology! We lose the middlemen, and their need to take their fat cut right out of the musician's livelihood. It'll happen when the musicians get smart enough about the technology and the marketing to do it themselves. If RIAA companies think they have problems now, they haven't seen anything until musicians realize they don't need them, their bloated costs, or their slave-like contracts.

    --

    The only tool you've got against psychosis is experience.

  82. beatles/image by mgkimsal2 · · Score: 2

    The first boy band, at least as we think of the term, was the Beatles. Of course, among their many differences from today's counterparts are the ideas that they wrote their own songs, could actually sing well, play their own instruments (when was the last time you saw N'Sync pick up a guitar?), and write thought-provoking, insightful, clever tunes. Of course, there was a sizeable subset of Beatles fans that didn't care about all that. They just screamed and pulled their hair when they saw their heroes on stage, and then years later discovered new dimensions to the music that most 12 or 13-year-olds don't pick up or notice.

    It isn't until the past 25 years or so that music has begun migrating toward outright commercialism, where the image is more important than the substance.


    Funny, I'd think that especially in the early days - (62-64) the Beatles' image WAS more important than the substance. "Can't buy me love" having 2 million preorders before the song was written rather points up that the songs weren't necessarily as important in the very early days, although they most obviously *were* of a very high quality. Probably wasn't until Rubber Soul that things started getting *really* cool with the music itself. :)

    The main difference the Beatles had over anyone since, imo, is that they attracted the 12 year old girls, yes, but they essentially *grew up* musically while their initial fan base grew up as well. That maturation process allowed their initial fans to come along for the ride, while gaining respect and new fans from a widening base as the years progressed. Who else is doing that? Probably more to the point, who CAN do that today within the confines of the popular music industry? I dare say not too many groups have the talent to mature/change/develop as rapidly as the Beatles did, but would anyone even be given a chance these days?

  83. Kudos for jamie! by bughunter · · Score: 2
    I read this story about the RIAA's survey yesterday, and wondered where the /. article was. I wasn't expecting such a cognizant editorial that cleanly and easily penetrated the cloud of FUD and BS that has accreted around this issue.

    In just a few paragraphs, jaime has identified all the flaws in the RIAA's report, called them on their fouls, and even laughed at their expense... without introducing any sort of strained metaphors or forced parables (unlike some columnists we know). We even got a precisely pertinent quote from one of the 20th century's most venerable and prescient SF authors. This brief little editorial is a gem. If forced to criticize it, I would only suggest a final paragraph after the quote, to drive home the point that the survey is manipulative BS and to end in your own voice. But even as is, it deserves exposure in a forum larger than Slashdot. The message needs to go out: Corporate entitlements to maximize profits at society's expense must end, and will end. And the RIAA's arrogance will help bring that about.

    I will enjoy reading more of your editorials in the future. And thanks, jaime, for reminding me of that passage from Life-Line -- I am often reminded of that short story by current events, but have never recalled that specific quote. I won't ever forget it, now.

    --
    I can see the fnords!
  84. It's called a cartel by MtViewGuy · · Score: 2

    I think you hit exactly at the gist of the problem the RIAA faces: they are trying to run the record industry as an economic cartel and finding out the very hard way that cartels are subject to the laws of microeconomics, namely their attempts to keep prices high will result in 1) customers less inclined to buy album-length audio CD's and 2) customers are more willing to bypass the RIAA cartel with file sharing sites like Napster, Morpheus, Kazaa, etc.

    Once the RIAA gets a clue and figures out that lower prices (like US$11 or under per album-length disc) will actually result in more revenue to the RIAA member companies, it will have two beneficial effects: 1) disc sales will quickly climb and 2) the incentive to pirate music drops to a negligent level.

  85. musical recommendations with P2P by TMB · · Score: 2
    No, none of them work like this. In fact, in every single P2P program, you must know the name of the artist you are searching for before you can search for them. Great for downloading Metallica. Terrible for downloading DistroThorque, the metal band down the street desperately trying to be heard.

    The programs may not have an overt method of recommending music... but Napster at least had a pretty good subtle one.

    Whenever I would log into Napster, the first thing I'd do was do a search for "Nitzer Ebb" (a good old EBM-industrial band I like). Despite the fact that I own every album and a good fraction of the singles they ever put out, and already had whatever few mp3s were floating around that I didn't already own. And then I'd browse the mp3s of each user who was sharing a Nitzer Ebb track, and download random things from them. Why? Because a track that another Nitzer Ebb fan likes is more likely to be a track I like than any random thing I hear on the radio. Learned about a lot of really cool bands that way.

    I switched to gnutella, but the new version of limewire removed the option to browse a user's shared files! So as far as I'm concerned, it's almost useless. Can anyone recommend a linux-based P2P client that allows you to do this? I miss finding out about new music.

    [TMB]

    1. Re:musical recommendations with P2P by epsalon · · Score: 2

      Use AudioGalaxy. They have recently added an option to see a user's shared files. However, I'm not sure you can search by user sharing a specific file, but you can look at fans of specific bands.

    2. Re:musical recommendations with P2P by TMB · · Score: 2
      Wrong. The easiest way is to do a "wildcard" search. Say you have a vague idea of a song's name. Just enter the bit you do remember and most P2P programs will search based on that.

      You've completely missed the point. How do you find out about music that you've never heard of before?

      [TMB]

  86. Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc by Sargent1 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I've seen this "analysis" before (that Napster boosted CD sales and that its shutdown caused the recent decline in profits), and I'm not sure I buy it. It smacks of the usual after this, therefore because of this thinking. It's like the hemline theory. Someone noticed that stock prices and the length of womens' hemlines seemed to track together. Look! The stock market is determined by how long skirts are!

    It's possible that Napster had a hand in both driving up revenues and then later driving them back down. But without more evidence other than "See! See! They happened at the same time!" I'm going to remain skeptical.

    1. Re:Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc by Sargent1 · · Score: 2

      Sure. I'll buy that the RIAA has even a harder time proving their theory, as the correlation between Napster and their sales is in the exact opposite direction. And I certainly could believe that Napster helped drive album sales to a certain extent. I'm just not sure that other factors, like the weak economy and overall loss in jobs trimming the amount of discretionary money people spend on CDs, aren't more to blame for the RIAA's current woes.

  87. Throttle ports not described by an RFC by yerricde · · Score: 2
    My school had to implement and upload/download limit on internet1 traffic whlie they go over the options on how to control this problem ... Becasue of our schools privacy policy and unrestrictive content, the school doesn't want to censor or block any incoming material or outgoing. They don't monitor content.

    Then just start throttling ports whose protocol isn't defined by an IETF RFC. This allows legit traffic on FTP, HTTP(S), Usenet, e-mail, ssh, etc., to continue unimpeded while maintaining a neutral stance on both content and services, and it gives your school a reputation of supporting open protocols. For instance, Rose-Hulman restricts the ports that OpenNap, Gnutella, FastTrack, and WinMX use to 2.4 Mbps (about 40% of total bandwidth), and it works well. The IT department also grants exceptions to users that can prove a legitimate educational need such as a comparison and contrast of p2p filesharing networks for a computer networking course.

    --
    Will I retire or break 10K?
  88. I'd like to read this survey. by NanoGator · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Don't you find it odd that 20% of these people filled out a survey saying "I downloaded free music from the net."? Most of these people know it's illegal. I have a hard time imagining they'd fill out that survey.

    In any case, I bet the survey's question was more like "Have you ever downloaded music?", "Did you pay for that download?". And then, I think the RIAA said "every time somebody downloads a song, they don't buy a CD."

    This sounds like baloney to me. The reason I'm not buying CD's today is that I'm boycotting the RIAA. I suppose they could blame that on Napster, i.e. suing Napster and not providing a solution to fill consumer's desires.

    --
    "Derp de derp."
  89. Gee maybe it's the RECESSION?!?!?! by zerofoo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    OK, unemployment is up, consumer confidence unexpectedly dove yesterday....what do these companies expect???? Infintely increasing market share and sales. RIAA let me give you a clue....the world economy is in a RECESSION! These dopes haven't even considered the macro-economic state of the world.

    I guess it's easier to blame napster and the terrorists and whoever else they can think of.

    -ted

  90. Support the independent labels by Laplace · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Just a sampling of music from indie labels that I have bought and liked:

    * Appleseed Cast, "Low Level Owl Vol I,II", Deep Elm Records
    This has to be one of the best recordings of last year. This band reminds me of Radiohead, yet with an earthy tone drawn from their subdued vocals and natural samples.

    * Morton Feldman/Ives Ensemble, "String Quartet II", Hat Art Records (limited pressing of 3000)
    The first complete recording of the 4-6 hour string quarted by the legendary composer. Takes a bit of will to listen to, but well worth every second.

    * Boxhead Ensemble, "Two Brothers", Truckstop Media
    A string ensemble. Not pop, but a great spin.

    * The Notwist, "Neon Golden", import (forget the label)
    A german band, singing in english, which fuses electronic and acoustic music very well. The inflections of the lead singer can be a bit confusing at times, but soon grows on you.

    * Unisex, "Stratosfear", Double Agent.
    Good pop/electronica music. Catchy with only one poorly executed track on the album.

    * Mirah, "You Think It's Like This But Really It Is Like This," K Records
    Low fi, post punk, female vocals that tug at your heart.

    I've been searching out obscure and hard to find music for the last several months now, and I feel good about supporting the indie music scene and I've enjoyed the music to boot.

    --
    The middle mind speaks!
  91. Here we go again... by prototype · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This drives me nuts. Everytime there's a flux in the economy, the RIAA uses it as a scapegoat to blame falling sales etc. etc. blah blah blah. Gimme a break.

    "the study found that ownership of CD burners has nearly tripled since 1999"

    Again with the analogy that more CD burners mean more piracy of songs. Again they fail to notice that the number of computers in the world is growing, operating systems and applications get larger, more people are backing up data to CD than before, etc. True, I think the number does contribute something but put it in perspective people.

    "Global piracy on the physical side costs the recording industry over $4 billion* a year"

    I still fail to see how anything except under-estimating production expenses or over-estimating demand will "cost" the recording industry money. So they're saying that $4 billion dollars worth of music *might* have been purchased instead of downloaded? Where do they get these numbers?

    "DVD Video Continues Steady Increase"

    Yeah, no shit. And DVD player sales continue to increase. Is piracy to blame because people can't rip DVDs very easily? So once DVD burners are the "in" thing, is the RIAA going to blame piracy on lower sales? No. DVDs will continue to flourish because more production companies are now seeing the need to create good quality and content DVDs. VHS sales are way down not due to piracy but to the fact that I'd rather spend my money on a DVD with commentary and extras than half that on just the movie. As more players get out there and more quality DVDs are released, the sales will increase. I don't need to be JoJo to figure that out. And yes, even when DVD burners outnumber CD burners, I predict that DVD sales will STILL increase each year (providing that studios don't stop making good content DVDs).

    "Cassette Popularity Sharply Declines"

    Oops. Guess we should blame piracy again here. Sales are down. Oh no! Sorry, just peeved at how they blame everything on piracy as usual, like how parents blame game companies on how they corrupt youth or something. When will the real players accept their own responsibilities. Silly, silly, silly.

    liB

  92. Downloading songs doesn't devalue CD's by NanoGator · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'd like to see some usage statistics on Morpheus. I'd be willing to bet that most people look for specific songs, not whole albums. If I'm right, then the RIAA's case weakens.

    They claim that 'Napster like downloading of music' is hurting their sales. I think what's really happening, in most cases, that people are downloading songs that they're interested in, particularly the older ones. I got to peak in a couple of people's MP3 lockers from way back when, and most of their songs were made at least 2 years ago, and date all the way back to the Beatles. I realize this isn't a very accurate slice of the world, but think about it, how many people do you think are saying "Hmm... I wonder what Pink Floyd is like?" and going and finding out? What are they supposed to do? Go to the store and try to find these albums? That's fine and dandy, but you don't know what you're buying there. Why pay $10-$15 for a CD when you only want one song?

    In any case, if somebody downloads a song, buying a CD still has value. Why? Because there are usually 10 or so more songs on it to listen to. What the person has actually downloaded is a teaser to go get the CD. In which case, it's even more valuable to the RIAA because if the user likes the song, they have more reason to go buy the album. If they don't buy the album, then it's likely that the content wasn't enticing enough. That's not the RIAA's fault.

    Part of me can't help but wonder if the RIAA is trying to protect themselves against sales lost due to customers really know what's on the CD. *Shrug*

    "But they can go download the rest of the album, if they like it!" -- this is what a RIAA rep would say in a Milhouse kind of voice. I think you can search for albums on the net. Who knows, maybe in the future Morpheus will get so good that all music is available. Until then, in the time it'd take me to get the album (i.e. searching for it, trying to find sources that are reliable, etc), I could have gone to the store and gotten it.

    If the day comes where entire albums are up for instant download on Morpheus, then the RIAA has lost their own battle. Today they could provide a means for people to legitimately buy individual songs in MP3 (or equiv) format. If they did that, then I could download any song I wanted from a fast server without having all the headaches of a p2p network. Every day they don't do that, more and more people wouldn't try it if it did materialize.

    In short, the RIAA's losses are their own fault. People want individual songs but can't get them legally without overpaying for them. File sharing is a result of a new market trend. A competent organization'd say "How can we make money here?" instead of fighting it like a bunch of spoiled babies.

    --
    "Derp de derp."
  93. Re:RIAA not listening, la la la la... by Gonarat · · Score: 2, Interesting

    And how many of you are going to go search for Anders Osborn right now, just because of this casual mention of his name? Yeah, I though so. You won't be disappointed.


    You hit the nail on the head. It is really sad when the RIAA/Clear Channel oligopoly is so bad that I can find more new music through Slashdot than on the radio. I have checked out several artists that have been mentioned in post over the last several months -- some I like, others are not my cup of tea, but at least the time spend checking 'em out was worth it. Bearshare is doing the same thing for me. I have been getting into Techno thanks to the bear. RIAA -- If you want my $$, then show me something worth spending them on!



    --
    Beware of Sleestak
  94. So the whole recording industry... by jeti · · Score: 2


    makes as much money as the US gov will spend on
    weapons every two weeks. And those guys are able
    to make things like the DMCA happen?

  95. I was interviewed... by UncleGizmo · · Score: 2, Interesting

    a few weeks back by a research company [forgot the name] asking about my music purchases. IIRC, some of the questions included how often I purchased CDs in stores, if I had ever downloaded music from the net [they listed Napster, Limewire, Morpheus & Kazaa as some of the choices], as well as if I'd bought music online [Amazon / mp3.com].

    I've worked for research co's so I felt compelled to help, since getting completed interviews from random people is tough. However, as the questions continued, the lightbulb went on and I thought "hmmm, I wonder why RIAA needs this info?" The only site I copped to downloading from was Napster, for that reason. Feed their egos and all.

    Here's the interesting part: They asked for my email for me to "complete the survey online", and they'd pay me $10. I gave them one of my junk mail addresses and never responded. They sent me 2 follow-ups, offering me up to $40 to participate. I wonder why they needed me to finish the survey online? Research co's generally want to do their interviews via one method, to get the data quickly and consistently.

    [insert conspiracy theory here]

    --
    Who put this thing together? Me, that's who.
  96. why do cds cost as much as DVDs? by mozkill · · Score: 3, Insightful

    why do cds cost as much as DVDs? why do DVDs cost the same but take many times more effort, money, and manpower into production?

    its easy. movie industry revenues are many, many times more than CDs. a typical CD is very lucky if 500,000 people listen to it, because that makes it a gold album. a gold album would earn the music industry mabye $500,000 x $12 . Thats 6 million. A super platinum album (with 3,000,000) in sales, might make 30 million for the record industry.

    a typical movie has already profited before it is released on DVD, and the revenues can be up to 2-10 times the amount of a good record album. (http://www.the-numbers.com/)

    Most importantly, the music industry spends a much larger percentage of profit on promotion and marketing... probably damn near 100% of profit... that means that they CANNOT lower prices, because if they do, they got to lay off all those marketing people, and if they do that, the other 4 big music companies will stomp all over them with marketing campaigns.

    its a catch-22 for the music industry as a whole.
    .

    --

    -- Betting on the survival of the media industry is a serious risk. I advise investing elsewhere.
  97. Re:Cant you give an example of intelligent ... by Deagol · · Score: 2

    Anything by Suzanne Vega. I have all but her first album, and the music and lyrics are quite good. 99.9F was my personal favorite.

  98. Re:Cant you give an example of intelligent ... by Deagol · · Score: 2
    (sorry to reply to my own post)

    The late Kirsty MacColl put out some fantastic music, too. Her style defies definition, and her lyrics are sharp. She sings in at least 3 languages, and expresses a wry wit in many of her stories. Her singing voice isn't the best, but that's a minor thing.

    Check her out -- you won't regret it.

    My favorite album is a tie between Electric Landlady and Tropical Brainstorm.

  99. HFS by wiredog · · Score: 2
    I swear that the music sounds the same as it did ten years ago

    I wish it sounded like it did 10 years ago. They used to have a reggae hour, lots of local bands, obscure European stuff. Sigh. Now they sound like DC101.

  100. Re: "about the music" by King_TJ · · Score: 2

    Ridiculous you say? Then explain why there were so many Blues singers who made next to nothing throughout their career? Why in the world would you choose to perform music for a living, knowing it takes years before you become popular at best, and most likely will never achieve popular status?

    I used to play guitar in a local band, and I did it because I truly loved doing it. Eventually though, I had to quit because the money we made playing out didn't pay the bills. Often-times, we lost money doing a show when all was said and done, because of equipment rental fees we paid out, people skimming off the top of ticket sales, etc. I knew that my skills in I.T. were much more valuable - so that's what I've done ever since.

    Granted, yes, the classical performers were often paid by the rich to compose a musical score. So what? Does this mean they were just in it for the money? Why didn't Beethoven quit when he started going deaf? Wouldn't that make logical sense if it was "just a job" for him? He already got paid for lots of his earlier work....

  101. Just a sidenote... by mindriot · · Score: 2

    ...it seems to me that the record industry is actually very lucky considering that, in spite of the gigantic p2p boom, their sales have only gone down that little.

    So who says this unproportionally small loss of profits is in any way even related to p2p?

    Maybe even, record sales increased in the past two years just because of Napster? I mean, where are the statistics that give us proof that p2p is actually really endangering the record business??

  102. Re:The price of CD's should go up by Sj0 · · Score: 2

    Artists get very, very little from the sales of their CDs. Perhaps you've heard about the many artists complaining about abuse by RIAA companies? The Courtney Love suit immediately comes to mind.

    --
    It's been a long time.
  103. The RIAA can not control digital distribution... by zerofoo · · Score: 2

    because of the last "A"; they are an american organization. How exactly do they plan to enforce US copyright law in nations that do not recognize US copyright law?

    The internet is a world wide medium, the RIAA can not put all the world governments (or ISPs for that matter) in their back pockets.

    The toothpaste is already out of the tube. The RIAA just hasn't "gotten it" yet.

    -ted

  104. Re: How can you speak for "people as a whole"? by jafac · · Score: 2

    Better still, their target market gets their money from parents, who, at feeling guilty for working long hours, give their kids more money in hopes that that will make up for not spending time with them.

    Then, in the parents of the materialistic culture's hearts, money is equated with love, so the harder they work, the more they love their family, the more money they can give to their kids to buy Brittney Spears CDs. Oh, I'll be giving money to my kids for CDs alright. Just not music CDs.

    --

    These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
  105. Movies vrs Music by MikeFM · · Score: 4, Insightful

    From my own buying habits I know I buy far more movies since the prices started dropping. Walmart has had VHS movies for $5-6 for some time and I've bought most of the ones they've made available. They now also have DVD's for $7-$10 which I've taken to buying instead of the VHS because I like DVD's better. I buy lots of movies because they are cheap and I buy almost no music because it's priced insanely. I actually buy the music videos on DVD for less than I could buy just the music on CD. How does that make sense?

    I'll still copy and even share the movies I buy but I buy far more. I have a bootleg copy of Harry Potter but I still plan on buying it on DVD when it's released. Because of the download size of LotR I decided to wait for the DVD rather than downloading it but I wouldn't have had I still had broadband. Not only does price matter but also release schedule. The studios need to understand that the DVD should be available as soon as the movie is in theatures. In many cases we'll still go to the theature.. for the experience.. despite the fact we own the movie already. Afterall many of us go watch good movies more than once at the theature anyway.

    One more thing music could learn from movies is that they need to release more than one version of a CD. A cheap version that is nothing but the CD for those who are satisfied with that and something more along the lines of a collectors edition later that might have extras such as a cool box (Rocky Horror Picture Show has an awesome DVD box), lyrics, information about the band, maybe a DVD of the music videos, etc. People will buy a product twice if the first time is a good deal and the second time offers stuff a 'true fan' will crave. Movie studios seem to understand this better than the music industry. The Phantom Menace Collectors Edition was also a nice release.. the inclusion of the film clip etc was very cool IMO and it probably cost them less than a nickle.

    If movies, music, and games would drop to $3/each I might buy 10+ a week (I buy 1-2 now) and would be much less likely to bother downloading them. They have to let me play them on whatever device I want though. If I can't play it in Linux and mess around with editing them etc then I'll go back to ripping and burning.

    --
    At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
  106. Used Mp3's for sale by loydcc · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Next thing they'll do is complain that used record stores bite into profits.

    If I buy an Mp3 do I have the right to sell it if I don't want it any more?

  107. Good sources by StarFace · · Score: 2

    Many online and paper audiophile magazines also give recommendations on good classical recordings. Though they tend to slant their reviews towards how well the CD is crafted sonically, typically they also base this on the quality of the performance as well. There are a lot of CDs out there that are recorded poorly, and checking out the recommends in these resources can help you dodge the worst.

    --
    V
  108. Your sig, the DMCA in plain English.. by jabber01 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Translating the DMCA from legallese and into plain English constitutes a form of reverse engineering, which is banned by the DMCA..

    --

    The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
    What you do today will cost you a day of your life

  109. Way to really **** the RIAA by dh003i · · Score: 3, Informative

    Here's my basic plan:

    1. Download the songs you want. Don't buy them. Try LimeWire, FastTrack (i.e., Morpheus, Grokster, KaZaa), WinMX, whatever. And don't whine about the "spyware" in LimeWire, you have the option not to install it; and if ur really concerned, go to the LimeWire directory and delete the **** u don't want. Btw, since LimeWire is open-sourced, u can modify it to your needs.

    2. If you can't find the songs you want, go out and buy the CD. Make sure to check on the return policy. Preferrably, you want one of the new copy-protected CD's which they have to accept returns on. So, open up the CD try to play it on your computer. If it works on your computer, rip the music. If it doesn't work on your computer, play it on a CD-player, connect the output jack to your computers input, and rip it. In either case, after ripping it, return the CD to the store and say it didn't work. That way, you get it for free.

    3. But what about the artists, oh the artists the artists? Well, when you buy a 15 dollar CD by Britney Spears, how much of that do you think goes to her? Maybe 5 dollars? Probably less. But lets be optimistic and say 5 dollars. So get the music for free via step 1 or step 2. If you get all 10 songs on her latest CD, that's 5 dollars that would have gone to her. So send her the money; hell, maybe even send her 10 dollars. You still spend less on the music than you would've, and she gets more. It eliminates the middle man. Then the RIAA can't whine about "how the musicians are getting screwed." No, now it would be only the companies that were getting screwed.

    1. Re:Way to really **** the RIAA by Chris+Johnson · · Score: 2
      *ROFL* She is damned lucky if she gets five _cents_. What on earth gives you the idea she'd get even one dollar from the sale of a 15$ CD? Even one DIME?

      It's really stunning, amazing to me, to see so many ordinary listeners making their decisions and choosing to act against the RIAA, while still believing things ("Britney probably gets a buck a CD- not more than five") that are orders of magnitude different than the way the business works. The RIAA propaganda DOES work, but it's still not saving them. And, I'd bet you anything you care to name that Britney gets less than a dime net profit per CD- in fact I think it is possible that she has not recouped and never will- she's a dumb kid and probably does not realize she is paying for the tour bus etc. out of her share.

      Go ahead and send Britney ten dollars if you like. You could send her a dime and a broken cigarette and still be giving her more than the record company does.

  110. Re:Questions.. by Chris+Johnson · · Score: 2
    This is pretty easy if you know the ropes:

    1: respectively, the artist and the promoters. Recording time is recoupable- it comes straight out of artist royalties. Stuff like a tour bus also comes out of royalties and is recoupable. It's _arranged_ by promotion- and the promotion also comes out of royalties. It's all recoupable. Read a contract.

    2: Not any more. The CD single is seriously deprecated. They _could_ be made, but they're not going to be. They hurt sales of the full album at the full price. This is something of a change, at one point CD singles and cassingles were big business...

    3: More than half of it- maybe as much as 75%. It varies. Won't be less than half, certainly.

    4: Breakage of the shellac the record is made of. "Free Goods", meaning promotional distribution. The fact that CDs never did have to drop in price as people kept buying the things anyway.

    5: Dunno, I don't know football as well as I know the music industry. It reminds me of my local supermarket (a one-supermarket town) and the price of Coke 2-liters. It's a one-supermarket town. They can do what they like. So, the price of Coke varies between 89 cents a 2-liter (on sale), $1.19 (normal) and $1.39 (what they'd like).

    I do have to expect this kind of foolishness. I also have to choose not to buy it at $1.39, because only then does it temporarily come down again- and with their 'cards' and quick feedback on how well the stuff is selling, it comes down within a couple weeks, and I stock up, and wait for the next experiment, maybe with Coke at $1.79. Whatever.

    Nobody ever said setting high prices has to _result_ in a profit. It can also result in a complete drying up of sales. That's business.

  111. Re:Money isn't the only bottom line here. by Chris+Johnson · · Score: 2
    "The recording artists? At first glance, they benifit somewhat, as record sales are the main source of their income, and they don't have to worry about. "

    What??

    That is generally not the case. It is considerably more likely if the artist/band has a pit-bull business team, including a very tough lawyer. Even so, such an artist has to be able to produce serious promotion and sell records WITHOUT a label to even get into a position where they can do so for a label and benefit anything from it. Metallica's a good example of this- they were able to set their terms for signing, because they were doing so well anyhow they could take it or leave it. Most artists are nowhere near as industrious and hardworking as this.

    I guess even your first glance is a bit crooked, if you figure that most artists live off their record sales. That has pretty much never been the case since recorded music began...

  112. This hit me like a brick, by SomeOtherGuy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Let me start off by saying that most of my life I have been a music junkie. My dealer was the owner of a small record store in my hometown. I would walk into the store and he (knowing my musical tastes) would peddle me some free samplers from the record industry with a few sample songs from the album --- or sometimes a pre release FULL album thrown in for a bone. I would be ever so greatful that I was getting this "special" service. In retrospect he could set his clock by the fact that I would be marching in his store in a few days to purchase a full length album or two from the group of sample tapes he had given me before. I would leave the store with my new purchased albums and a new batch of sample tapes. Repeat and wash for 10 years and a tape collection over 500.

    5 years later...The "big" record stores laugh at me when I ask for any samples. Radio does not play "my type of music"....I have know way of knowing what music to purchase....Let alone where to hear a sample before making the purchase....Needless to say, I go the next few years with only buying a handful of CD's (mostly from artists who had released music I liked "back in the day" or to replace my favorite crappy tapes with CD's.)

    Fast forward to Napster....Much like the sample tapes I used to get when I was a kid...I can download a few obscure album songs from a band I read about and actually have a fair and partial decision making process....AND guess what -- I started to frequent the music stores like crazy, and started filling up my CD collection with FRESH music from new bands, and old bands I had somehow missed the first time around.

    Post Napster: I have not been back to the record store because even if I had a gift certificate for a wheel barrow load of free CD's, I would not even know where to start....I tried gnutella for awhile, but it was not the same....Napster represented the WHOLE (by the numbers of people using it), everything else is just scattered pieces -- and if I was looking for top 40 or greatest hits records then maybe that would suffice -- but I am looking for obscure music from bands that may have never sold any more albums than I have fingers, never made the airwaves of radio, no MTV, yet still managed to get a record contract.

    Bottom line: the industry has failed. And until I can walk into a record store that has all of the trappings of my former "dealer" OR can easily SNARF music samples from an endless pit of obscure recordings such as Napster -- then the recording industry will never see another red cent from me thank you.

    --
    (+1 Funny) only if I laugh out loud.
  113. PMRC, Ogg, and How To Win By Playing by WillSeattle · · Score: 2

    We need a labelling organization like the PMRC, but one that slaps labels on saying "Can't Be Played On Home Computers, CD Players, And In Cars".

    We need people to rip Ogg files. We need people to host things at MP3.com and Try And Buy places.

    Above all, we need to break the back of the RIAA label Crony Capitalists who skim the money with their artificial monopoly. Either they give us rippable CDs or we don't buy them. Always buy with a credit card, and if it doesn't work, promptly return and insist on a full refund - not store credit. If they refuse, deny the charges.

    This is war. We can win. It just takes blood, toil and tears.

    -

    --
    --- Will in Seattle - What are you doing to fight the War?
  114. But be honest, what does the future hold? by doom · · Score: 2
    I'll cry no tears for the RIAA (that wasn't me you heard cackling with glee. Really). But really, be honest and take a look a couple of years down the road. Okay, right now, easy availability of mediocre-sounding MP3 files that are a hassle to deal with can help spur CD sales. Maybe that was happening, maybe it wasn't... (certainly I've bought CDs after first listening to MP3s downloaded from Emusic [1]).

    But what happens after we've all got government subsidized broad-band up the wazzoo? What happens after the next generation of rio/burner/whatever technology makes MP3s easier to deal with than CDs? And the encoding tech gets better so they really do have "CD-quality" sound? What do you say to the labels that suddenly aren't selling any CDs any more, and the artists that aren't getting any royalties? "Better get out there and sell some T-shirts guys! Oops, everyone's downloading pirated iron-ons off of the web now... Well, there's always busking."

    It's entirely understandable why some folks regarded Napster as a problem... I would not claim that these guys have really got a good solution, but you know, when you don't have a good one you try a bad one.

    [1] The author of this post does not speak for Emusic, which is still a pretty cool company even if they have been bought by some idiots at Universal-Vivendi. Unlimited download access to a large collection of independant music, where the artist gets paid royalties. Real MP3s, no idiotic copy protection.

  115. Re:Wrong by aphor · · Score: 2

    Really, I retract my claim. I'm sorry. I wasn't careful about my research, and I goofed.

    --
    --- Nothing clever here: move along now...
  116. "They" are not stupid by fm6 · · Score: 2
    The market does bear the greater cost though, doesn't it? "They" charge what they can get.

    Almost everything sells for what the market will bear. Of course it's more complicated than that, but that's a basic principle. Often very similar products vary greatly in costs. Go to the drug store and compare prices on Bayer Aspirin and the house brand. Do you think Bayer really spends more to make its product? Go to the shoe store and compare prices there. Does that stupid Swoosh really add $50 to the manufacturing cost of a shoe?