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VNC Server for Toasters and Light-Switches
An anonymous reader submits: "How about using VNC to configure your toaster, microwave oven, or even your light-switches? Thanks to Adam Dunkels' micro-VNC server it is now possible to run a VNC server even on really small embedded 8-bit microcontrollers commonly found in such devices. The idea is that even low-cost devices that don't have a screen or graphics hardware could have a GUI, accessible over the network. To show that the server can run with very small amounts of memory, there is a demo server running on a Commodore 64. But the real question is: how would want to 'configure' their toasters using a GUI?"
Yeah, back in the day we used to say "Lets install Linux on a toaster!" and it was a joke.
But now someone actually took it seriously, and look whatcha dun!! You should be ashamed!
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
Scares me to think how fast it'll fall...
Now all i need is VNC for my microwave and oven, and i can control my whole kitchen from my computer.
How many GUIs does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
But why? The last thing I want is someone hacking my coffee maker.
Wouldn't it make more sense to draw the gui on the client machine, rather than putting beefier hardware in the toaster so it can send you bitmaps?
After all, your desktop machine will always have more computational ability than your toaster (the senient talking toaster from Red Dwarf notwithstanding).
A legparnasom tele van angolnaval.
So, when your toast is done, will there be a "pop-up" window telling you that? Sorry. Couldn't help it.
MadDad32
Quoth the page:
The pages you are currently watching are served by a web server running on a an Ethernet equipped 6510-based system with 64k RAM running at 1 MHz (a Commodore 64 with a TFE cartridge). The same system also exports two displays using VNC and the small uVNC server software.
Other servers have come down like they were Commodore 64's, but this one actually is one!
What will they think of next? Posting a link to a website running on a cellphone? Wait, that can probably take more hits than a C64.
Slashdot really needs its own cache of sites it links to. Maybe they should buy one of those google boxes in the ads.
This is Very cool indeed. Imagine a simple VNC controlled front end for your VCR so you can configure it to record your favorite show while you're away.... Or Turn on your A/C from work because it's going to be a HOT afternoon. (Sure could use that today).
And straight from the web page ...
This Server
The pages you are currently watching are served by a web server running on a an Ethernet equipped 6510-based system with 64k RAM running at 1 MHz (a Commodore 64 with a TFE cartridge). The same system also exports two displays using VNC and the small uVNC server software.
Please note that this is work in progress and far from something finished.
Its not going to get finished today!
-- Knowing too much can get you killed, but knowing who knows too much can make you rich.
OK, this is very cool and I can't count how many projects I would love to do with this...
That being said, is this smart?
Picture: 10 years from now, some company sells one of these things, and it takes off. Then somebody finds a nasty security hole that fscks the toaster up. Would you like it if suddenly you find your house burnt down by some script kiddie doing a port scan?
Everything connected to the net is not always a good idea.
Objects in the blog are closer then they ap
So could someone start a DoS attack on your kitchen?
- Was this page really generated by a Barrel of Attack Chickens for me?
Slashtoasted?
C64's weren't built to withstand a ./ing....
But they hold up better than I would have thought, nevermind it's down.. (remember that streaming audio one a while ago..?)
Tibbon
tibbon.com
So someone comes up with the term VNC and all of a sudden there's this great breakthrough. I've been working with tiny web servers on embedded boards for 3 years and this is nothing new at all. Been embedding DOS, a packet driver, and the WATTCP stack along with a little purpose-built web server in a cheap x86 board. So what's the news?
....I thought the title was VNC Server for Toasters and Light-Sandwiches.
But then I realised there's no such thing as a free lunch.
But the real question is: how would want to 'configure' their toasters using a GUI?"
Yes, how would I want it, indeed.
Seems like overkill, but I guess you might want to be able to logically connect your toaster to your bedroom lights so that toast would be ready some predetermined time after you wake up in the morning.
Sweet; we'll become lazier than ever.
Goddamit, JEFFK! YOU BURNT GOATSE ON MY TOAST!!
I'll get you for that!
(Can we use this to DOS riaa.org ?)
This just seems analogous to when you discover
a nifty new library or learn a new language or
way of doing something, and suddenly you want
to express everything in terms of this new way
of doing things - eventually it falls in to
perspective. Being able to configure one's
toaster via a GUI isn't likely to be significantly
more convenient than doing so with the switch.
But once the toaster is able to recognize the
user, the preferences could be automatically
set.
Toaster-cookies?
blah blah blah - i'd personally rather go back
to the days of black plague and clubbing each
other over the head for a chunk of meat, but
if we can't have that, at least we can have
X10.
It's bad enough having someone read your emails. Now someone's going to be able to turn down your air conditioning, and burn your toast. No Thanks!
http://pcblues.com - Digits and Wood
Correct me if I'm wrong, but VNC is a screen-sharing or remote-control system, ne? On a small device where memory, processing time, and complexity is at a premium, why would you waste effort rasterizing a screen image so that VNC can ship it over.
Wouldn't it be a lot easier to have a tiny HTTP server which sends out an HTML file and processes the results? This seems akin to someone scanning in a print-out of their email as an attachment instead of sending an email directly... =/
Hire a Linux system administrator, systems engineer,
.. there WAS a demo server running on a C64. Now there's just a smoking lump o' plastic surrounding a the burnt out husk of a 6502.
Then this (along with the ascii art driver for quake) is not for you. Way too cool.
you mean "there was a demo server running on a Commodore 64....
But the real question is: how would want to 'configure' their toasters using a GUI?"
The real question is who (not 'how') here would understand pig latin..
Rapid Nirvana
I would think something browser-based would be a lot easier and simpler instead of writing a GUI and then having to use VNC to access it.
...what would it be like to have your coffee machine crash? Not to mention your refrigerator...
We're Doomed
this is proof that we really dont need these 2Ghz machines. Maybe to run (Disneyland) type interfaces. But hey, the kids need something to interface with while they are learning to read and do math.
Thank goodness for Linux.
"This makes it possible to interact with a Windows desktop on a Unix workstation, with a Macintosh desktop on a Linux PC, and so on. VNC servers and viewers exist for all major personal and server operating systems."
I see good things in the near future... Wont it be the bomb to login to a M$ windows machine usng a VNC viewer to fix a die hard M$ fans problem. ; )
pretzel_logic
...there is a demo server running on a Commodore 64. Haha... not anymore but seriously (well not really) I would think that that commodore 64 was slashdotted by the article poster before it even got to slashdot.
can't sleep slashdot will eat me
It seems like its finished now!
I think that on the residential scale this is all a bit silly beyond the fun/cool hobby level.
However, there are lots of legitimate industrial/commercial uses for these applications. Take, for example, a restaurant kitchen. You want the cooking/prep time to be as fast as possible so that you can move people through & have more sittings. A waiter with a wireless touchpad could automatically send instructions back to the kitchen incuding special instructions for browning toast to the right level, rareness of steaks etc... Add a few bar code readers to the appliances and you could automate a lot of the routine process while still accounting for the need to customise preparations down to the unit level.
When you have nothing left to burn you must set yourself on fire
Call me crazy, but all the light switches in my appartment, my parents house, and damn near everyone I know doesn't have, nor do they need a 8 bit microcontroller. Anyone care to post a link to a ordinary light switch that has and utilizes this?
As for the idea, it's not that bad at all, with one small flaw that I can see. It's great if I can access my toaster from my desk at work, but if I have to leave a piece of buttered bread in there all day just so it's toasted but soggy when I walk in the door, I'll just start making it when I walk in.
This seems like more of a novelty than it is useful. But this kind of software combined with a wireless device could be great. For example: If you've had a late night at work, you could use this to have a cup of coffee ready for you when you get home and then oven heated at 400 degrees for dinner.
I don't know of any household appliances that are complicated enough to merit a full GUI for configuration, though. It would be great to use this for remote execution of everyday task.
- A real programmer uses $ cat > a.out
Sure, so one could turn on and off any light switch in the house, but think about trying to control a toaster on the network...
Will the network actually put toast INTO the toaster? Or will I still have to walk 20 feet to the kitchen just to put the toast in myself, only to walk back to my computer to tell the toaster to turn on?
Besides, we'll have to invent a new lightbulb joke about computer geeks forgetting how to change a lightbulb...they only know how to turn it on and off.
Broke my hand on a pineapple. Didn't even care.
A Commodore 64 isn't really a small system, and therefore isn't a great demo. Truly small embedded systems have on the order of a kilobyte of ROM and a hundred bytes of RAM available, not 64KB.
Examples you might be familiar with include things like the BASIC Stamp and other PICs. Your toaster's built-in logic is going to resemble these much more closely than in does a general-purpose 8-bit computer.
--
Twoflower
This is an odd article to see after a marathon battlenet session.
:)
Maybe someone could hack something using the GBA compactflash adaptor, the link cable and VNC?
Techsupport: Hi, how may I help you?
User: Hi, I got your ToasterVNC, and when i tried to install it on my toaster, all hell broke loose!
Techsupport: Can you describe what happened?
User: I opened the box, put the CD in my toaster's CD-ROM, pushed the lever, and a few minutes later the whole thing started smoking.
Techsupport: I think I know what the problem is. Take the whole thing back to the store, and tell them that you got an ID-ten-T error
User: Thanks!
run vncserver on my garage door opener, then run vncviewer on my garage door remote control!
YES, there is a McDonald's in Hanoi Square.
oops, that's the CLI. I don't know about the GUI version.
#!/bin/bash.sh
export $SHADE=/dark/brown
cat bread jam > $SHADE/toast
Height: 38U, Weight: 0 Newtons, Eyes: #0000FF, OS: Gray Matter 1.0 (Alpha)
A device that lets you program a VCR to let you record shows when you aren't there! What'll they think of next, a device to turn your lights on and off while you're away perhaps?? What a glorious technological revolution is ahead!
This Server
The pages you are currently watching are served by a web server running on a an Ethernet equipped 6510-based system with 64k RAM running at 1 MHz (a Commodore 64 with a TFE cartridge). The same system also exports two displays using VNC and the small uVNC server software.
When will the Slashdot editors learn that what they are doing to servers is totally rediculous? Will it take a lawsuit to stop the slashdot effect? Why shouldn't this poor machine be mirrored?
This is like the third time today. Blah.
-molo
Using your sig line to advertise for friends is lame.
So what's the benefit of running a VNC server as oposed to running a lightweight web/cgi server like all these cable modems do these days?
Stop flicking my lights off and on!
You're scaring Mabel!
Though it may seem like a harmless doowhackey, devised by modern contraptioneers to somehow make our lives more complicated, VNC is in fact an extremely dangerous tool, already on its way to being outlawed in the more progressive states. Your average Christian would in normal circumstances be apprehensive at the idea of "remotely controling" a desktop; after all, it raises many issues, not the least of these being the Cult of the Desktop (a whisker away from paganism and heresy). Unfortunately, the Information Age has dulled our danger sensors, and most have accepted VNC without alarms going off. Many upstanding citizens are even unaware of this insiduous tool. With VNC's spread to toasters and light switched, respected Texan analysts agree that it may soon be used to remotely control a human being. Think! Teenage hackers may soon be able to take over your dear old Aunt May and have her vote Democrat! At this point we must ask ourselves exactly who would benefit from remotely controlling our relatives with VNC. The answer is all too clear. VNC is being groomed to become the ultimate weapon in the domination of our fair land by Liberals. It would not surprise this author to find out that human VNC interfaces are already being set up in critical sites across the nation -- Arizona, Louisiana, Texas. It is time for the American people to awaken and smite the deceptive serpent that is VNC once and for all!
Linux will never make proper toast
without Pantone for calibration.
Great... so you have a small embedded device with very limited CPU horsepower. What better way to grind it to a halt than to require it to compress a bitmap of the entire screen, and squirt the result over a TCP connection?
If you're configuring an embedded device remotely, then it makes much more sense to either:
(a) use a plain old web page served over HTTP
or
(b) serve up a Java applet with a custom dialog that then sends HTTP requests back to the device.
Both of these solutions are far more lightweight in terms of memory and bandwidth requirements. VNC is just overkill.
I like my toast darker than my rommmate does. We could set up personal preferences for the toaster and have 3 or 4 'personal setting' buttons on the toaster. It's not worth putting a full gui on the toaster, but you could put some memory into the servo settings and have it controlled over the 'net.
The 'pop up window' when your toast is ready idea is, at worst, a good pun -- but which machine to pop-up the message to could be included in the 'personal prefs' button.
Then, of course, there's the original purpose of the 'MIT internet pop machine' -- which was to notify you of when the machine was out of pop, so you could save yourself a (fruitless) trip to the machine (which was a good distance away from the computer labs)..
If the toaster says it's in use, you can spend a couple more minutes surfing before you go down to make breakfast (or sneak in and steal the toast from your roommate when it's done).
Then again if your roommate is cute, and likes to make breakfast in sensuous undies, you might want to set the toaster to notify you when {s,}he hits the appropriate prefs button.
The possibilities are about as endless as the possibilities of attaching a video camera to a web server (I mean, who'd really want to do that?).
Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
Wasn't this what Oak ....uhhh I mean Java originally design for?
The pages you are currently watching are served by a web server running on a an Ethernet equipped 6510-based system with 64k RAM running at 1 MHz (a Commodore 64 with a TFE cartridge). The same system also exports two displays using VNC and the small uVNC server software.
</clip>
Once again, a Commodore 64 gets slashdotted... Have you no shame? When will this madness end?
How long before the industry takes this seriously? Sure, already there are many systems like this, but they tend to be expensive toys for rich people.
Considering universities spew out hundreds of thousands of "engineers" every year, these engineers'll have to do something.
I'm guessing that after 8 years of eating Ramen noodles to get that piece of paper, engineers will think they'll get to design space probes.
What a surprise when they'll be designing 8 bit microcontroller circuits that select between "bagel","light" and "dark" on a 25$ toaster.
The most popular 8-bit chips today are the 8051 (multi-source), AVR (atmel), PIC (microchip), and HC08/HC11 (motorola). Cost is usually the primary consideration, and projects with volumes of 20k/year and up, it makes a lot of sense to do some or all of the project in assembly language so you can get the code into a smaller chip that costs $1 less. Multiply that $1 by 20k (or whatever production volume is expected) per year over the life of the product.
At the beginning of many projects, there's usually a list of "got to have" features, and "would be nice to have" features (as long as they don't add cost or significantly delay the product release). A good designer (and there are many) will ask a lot of questions about the actual application and make changes to the feature set that still meet the customer's needs (often times an improvement) but allow the code to be smaller, run at a slower speed (increase battery life or reduce the cost of the power supply circuitry), and use less RAM.
It's a very different world from PC software. The 8051, PIC, AVR and HC08/11 are available in many different flavors with different mixes of built-in peripherals and different amounts of code and ram memory.... and an amazing amount of work goes into making VERY efficient code so it can fit in a less expensive chip. On top of that, most products that ship with those 8-bit chips ARE UNDER WARRANTY for years, and a bad bug in the firmware usually means replacing the product for everyone who's effected.
I just can't see a VNC server on that "got to have" feature list, and I can't see it not increasing the cost enough to get quickly axe'd from the "nice to have" list. Even using an additional 128 or 256 bytes (yes, bytes, not Mbytes, not kbytes, but individual bytes) will almost certainly push a "normal" 8-bit microcontroller project up to a chip that costs $1 to $2 more. That's a lot of money when you go into production and start shipping thousands every month!!
PJRC: Electronic Projects, 8051 Microcontroller Tools
See this link. Makes a lot more sense than hobbling the device's capabilities to save a few bucks.
If we run it on the coffee machine, will we have to run the JAVA version of the VNC viewer?
http://216.239.51.100/search?sourceid=navclient&q= cache:http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sics.se%2F~adam%2Fuvnc%2F
It's been slashdotted...
Let's see...
Automatic toasters, accessible over a network...
I wonder if I can buy stock in the local fire department. Does anyone else think that devices designed to burn materials (in this case bread) being left unattended, to be controlled remotely is inherently a bad idea?
"A terrorist is someone who has a bomb but doesn't have an air force." -William Blum
There's just no excuse for cooking your bread twice in completely separate processes. And don't even get me started on bagels; boil, bake, then toast? Wake up, people!
I once had two computers sitting next to each other, but was getting sick of hopping keyboards when going one from another. What I ended up doing was using VNC to link the two computers similar to how a KVM works. Instead of watching the update on the client computer, I'd watch the monitor on the host computer. It was neat, it was kinda like rerouting my keyboard and mouse on one computer to the other! Pity, though, I wish I could find a version of VNC where I can turn the image signal off. When using it like that, I don't need to waste the bandwidth/runtime. Anybody know of a flavor of VNC (or another App for Windows) that does that?
The cool thing is that because it's VNC, doesn't matter which OS I'm using. So my computer (or computer like device, heh.) could benefit from this type of interface as well. It'll be an interesting day when I can get my TV to work the same way.
How this is better than embedded web servers that have been around for years? They work, run in tiny amounts of ram/rom and are a proven solution for embedded control.
They stab it with their steely knives,
But they just can't kill the beast.
Earlier today, Sen. Ernest Hollings (D-Disney) announced legislation to allow copyright holders to use otherwise illegal hacking techniques to disrupt toasters, light switches, and other devices used by individuals believed to be pirating copyrighted works.
RIAA chair Hilary Rosen hailed the effort as a milestone in attempts at combatting Internet piracy. "The development of Internet-enabled toasters offers us vast new opportunities to hit the pirates where they live. 'Smoking out the bastards' will no longer be a figure of speech. It will be a reality.'"
my toast allready takes to long to pop up without a microprossessor involved.
im waiting for windows TE (Toaster edition)
80 comments and its still up, no way can this be a c64!
ok.. maybe a beowulf cluster of them.
their toasters would want to very badly
how their toast cook?
wires, red and glowing
An anonymous reader submits: "How about using an external control, made of plastic or metal, to configure your toaster, microwave oven, or even your light-switches? Thanks to Adam Dunkels' "dial", it is no longer necessary to run a VNC server on really small embedded 8-bit microcontrollers commonly found in such devices. The idea is that even low-cost devices that don't have a screen or graphics hardware could have a physical control, like a GUI only in 3-d space, accessible right on the device...But the real question is: who would want to 'configure' their toasters using a physical dial?"
-------------------
This is my SIG. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
What does it take, a minor miracle to get a good story posted on Slashdot? Yes, it's grousing, but dammit, it's a decent read. That's 11 out of 11. Sheesh.
2002-07-30 20:40:46 Jon, the Al-Qaida and the FBI (articles,internet) (rejected)
Jon Messner had a very good, not to mention devious idea: Hack a known Al-Qaida website, take it over and set up shop as an intelligence gathering operation. Then he involved the FBI and that's where things went wrong. A facinating look into governmental internet readiness and how easily your privacy can evaporate if you belong to the right group.
You need a FREE iPod Nano
This is for an 8051 8 bit processor. When you talk about cheap when manufacturing toasters and microwaves, $1 is a lot (multiply by hundreds of thousands or even millions of toasters and microwaves). In the automotive world, $.50 difference in parts is enough to justify a years worth of engineering. Many consumer products have similar volumes and price points.
science is a religion
now let's /. a toaster!
/. effect on!
This just opens up a whole new world of things to try the
this is a totally stupid idea, the more electronics in a household appliance the more complicated they become, and the more EXPENSIVE they are to buy, instead of spending 15 or 20 bucks for a two slice toaster you end up paying 75 to 100 dollars for a stinking toaster, or instead of 250 to 300 dollars for a referigerator you end up paying close to a thousand dollards for a damn referigerator...
i wish these people would quit trying to make every thing more expensive and more complicated than they need to be...
While the C64 does have 64k RAM, it does not have any extra ROM to store the code (which includes a web server as well), web pages and java applets on that site. My guess is that it probably would run on an AVR with 16k ROM and 1k RAM by taking away the web server stuff.
Oh wait . . . never mind.
Dallas Semi makes a Tini board which is an embedded microcontroller with ethernet that you can easily interface to a LUX thermostat.
d ex .html
http://www.ibutton.com/TINI/applications/lux/in
Guys,
Please stop slashdotting my C64. I am trying to watch some streaming video and play Counterstrike.
Sincerely,
Junis in Afghanistan
Do you even know anything about perl? -- AC Replying to Tom Christiansen post.
Toaster-specific applications notwithstanding, the reasons VNC would be useful on as opposed to are the same as the advantages VNC has over the protocol you're comparing it to (say HTTP/HTML; most of the comments seem to focus on that). Maybe somebody just wants to utilize VNC's particular merits, or has a program that uses VNC connections to get its job done, and just wants to integrate a toaster, or light switch, or entertainment center. What if I use VNC a lot, but not the web? Why use HTTP, for that matter, instead of X.10 or something else that was originally designed for home automation? Because it suits the purposes you're designing with.
The main objection I've been seeing in the comments is this, though: "Why not use something more lightweight?". Answer? The server runs on a C64.
Love justice; desire mercy.
That would be something. Make everything wireless and the world will be a better place.
does it really works on an 8bit controller?
;)
I highly doubt it, but to lazy to check it out
How about customer service?
Toast isn't browning right? Reflash the portion of EEPROM that governs the relationship between control setting and level of brownness. Now, you don't have to return it to the store for warranty replacement.
There are lots of little adjustments that now have to be done by a service person onsite that could easily be done by remote control if the appliance is Net-enabled in some manner.
Of course, if security isn't part of the Web setup, it isn't just service personnel who'll be inside your kitchen appliance.
Tech Public Policy stuff
Pinging tfe.c64.org [193.10.67.150] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 193.10.67.150: bytes=32 time=150ms TTL=46
Pinging tfe.c64.org [193.10.67.150] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 193.10.67.150: bytes=32 time=150ms TTL=46
Pinging tfe.c64.org [193.10.67.150] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 193.10.67.150: Oh, what sad times are these when passing nerds can slashdot at will old machines. There is a pestilence upon this land. Nothing is sacred.
Pinging tfe.c64.org [193.10.67.150] with 32 bytes of data:
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
This would let you have a house management program for everything. The toaster, blinds, fridge, tv, lights, everything.
the real question is: how would want to 'configure' their toasters using a GUI?"
But....the real question is: who would want to 'configure' their toasters using a GUI?
Everybody knows goatse.cx's IP by now. Fool!
Something like this perhaps?
-- "At Microsoft, quality is job 1.1" -- PC Magazine, Nov. 1994
I'd probably have to post something like the 50th Anniversery of the Barbie Doll to get posted here.
You need a FREE iPod Nano
With every new toaster I go through at lot of bread trying to find just the right "Darkness" setting. With this, I could just have a web-based slider with a picture of a piece of toast that gets darker or lighter as you move the slider. You could even have a drop-down with pictures of Bagels and Pop-Tarts (after all, they toast to different darknesses on the same setting). The possibilities are endless!
Since it would be to expensive to put a windows variant on a toaster they will probabally all run linux. Great now even the toaster is to complicated to be used by any common individual. Linux sucks, Im gonna eat my bread untoasted from now on!!!
Well F5 untill i see it! *wink*
I know where I can get a USB version today!
Hope your company's not IPO'ing soon!
It would be best to have an "appliance server" that is capable of handling the communications to the devices and generating interfaces from standard libraries created for appliance control. Then we could have an extremely lightweight communications protocol for the appliances, as they would only have to go so far as to detail their features to the server, and it would construct an interface for them.
This makes much more sense to me in the long run, as a central house server would be able to coordinate activities of numerous devices simultaneously with simple If/Then/Else statements. If you wanted coffee & toast in the morning, you could write something like this:
Beyond that, as appliances become more functional (refrigerators that know what's in them), a central system like this could also accept device notifications, telling you there is no milk or that the oven's timer went off.
That what was all this school was for... to teach us how to solve our own problems. -- janeowit
www.ipsil.com
As if I don't have enough to worry about at work, in twenty years or so everything is going to be on the freaking internet. I'm going to wake up at 4 am to repeated flushing noises because a 1337 h4>0r has r00ted my Microsoft Toilet (tm). And it's going to take hours to cook dinner because the oven runs Java.
'scuse me. I think someone just 0wned my cellphone.
Actually, I spent half of a summer working on a microcontrolled toaster.
It has an 8Mhz Microchip PIC and 1K of RAM. The design intent was that you set the knob to the color toast you wanted and it always came out that color, no matter how recently/how much the toaster had been used. The thing even compensated for variations in line voltage. I think it's actually patented too. It looks like a normal 4 slot toaster though, so you could have used one and never even know it.
BTW, I made a LOT of toast that summer.
Life is too short to proofread.
Maybe on a Beowulf ClusterFuck of C-64's.
I never thought the term "Video Toaster" would make sense to me until I heard about this.
No data, no cry
Almost all of you are missing the point. What you
thing of as VNC is a bizarre proof-of-concept
that rapidly overshadowed the original RFB
(Remote Frame Buffer) protocol. RFB was designed
for tiny things that needed a simple visual
remote interface. There's a coordinate system
and a set of events, and the compressed-bitmap
facility makes it ABLE to act as a whole PC-Anywhere
type of thing, but that is not what it's best at.
... the story of the King and the Toaster. Good to see that heads will roll.
Been wanting to setup a dedicated VNC station. Trying to get DirectFB and DirectVNC to work. Not much success, but after seeing the screenshots, this looks ideal for a central VNC console. And with VNC supported on almost everything, including some toasters would rock. (BTW, we call some network appliances toasters at work, aka, a simple server with no internal disks, throw away, replacable.)
I can see allot of potential for uses of vnc and directfb, and micro-vnc embedded appliances. (Software KVM, VideoCapture, Security, Service controls, Monitoring applications, etc..)
BTW, Gentoo has built in support for DirectFB. Now if DirectVNC just came preconfigured also...
Seems like MS is providing their own proof that windows can unbundle windows? We knew they were lying to the court about that one.
Linux on a toaster exists. But what's cooler is toaster for Linux.
The IPic won the 1999 Slashdot World Smallest web Server title. It is based on the world's smallest implementation of a TCP/IP stack(256 bytes) -- which is implemented on the PIC (a small 8-pin low-power microcontroller) .. using a mere 512 words of program ROM. At the time I thought this is great. At a dollar a chip, we will have this in all our toasters and light bulbs in a couple years but it has been three years and I have not heard of it since then. So, as noted in yesterday's Globe and Mail - After two decades of hype about 'smart homes' with computerized brains that control lights, stoves and stereos, The Clapper still rules the living room.
Today's vices may be tomorrow's virtues.
Either the 6035 or the upcoming 7135 - Integrated Palm and cellphone. Install PalmVNC and you're ready to go. :)
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Is anyone else as uninspired as I am with current technology? It used to be so cool. The Future Is Stupid
http://dunkels.com/adam/tfe/
They explain how they built an ethernet cart for the C64 (unenhanced) and how they not only got a webserver running, but it streams audio, LIVE! Of course, it's sampled at 1 bit 8khz, but still, it's LIVE STREAMING AUDIO!
Timothy, you are an arse.
The real question is now how, but who. :-)
It's funny though, I went toaster shopping the other day and found an interesting new (new to me...) trend: cancel buttons. No shit. Like lifting the lever to get the toast out early would be quaint.
I'm gonna write 'ESC' on my toaster's cancel button. Much cooler.
Build stuff. Stuff that walks, stuff that rolls, whatever.
Ok, so they can control my toaster. How about my bathroom... something that hooks to my toilet allowing a remote courtesy flush, and perhaps an emissions detector that turns on the fan?
They could actually build in (and I'm sure they are some) sensors that won't allow things to stay on unattended. But it would be nice to be able to set some rice to cook, and have it turn off the stove when the time is up, or tell you if it spills.
Or if your house starts burning down.
Also, remote manual override for microwaves so you could give people tumors would be cool. OK, maybe cool isn't the best word...
Please stop stalking me, bro.
I've done some embedded developing, and I have put an applet on a webpage of a TCP/IP enabled 8bit controller. It opens a connection back to the server and displays real-time data. This is much less overhead and the communication protocol separates the GUI from the application code somewhat. The way I see it, VNC is overhead. (It remains cool however).
"It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton LaVey
The rabbit semiconductor module that powers my etch-a-sketch is about equal in power to an original Mac. Getting a server on a C64 is impressive
Free cell phone tracking
In addition to the intended usage of VNC which is to control a host remotely, the ability to put VNC on a toaster or other kitchen appliance also has a secondary function. Since VNC by its very nature shows you what the host machine is displaying and also what the user is using the computer for, this hack will enable parents to covertly spy on what their kids are eating for after-school snacks.
Need a Linux consultant in New Orleans?
...are now just downloaded bash scripts!
.
BSD is for people who love UNIX. Linux is for those who hate Microsoft.
I think that the /. crowd has a tendency to be eth0 centric. CAN is better suited for the types of control applications described here. CAN, or Controller Area Network, is more popular in Europe than the US.
CAN supports more nodes, and at a greater distance than Ethernet. The latency typically associated with Ethernet is not present. CAN is used for sensors, and controls, where ethernet is more suited for transferring blocks of data.
Also the CAN protocol is built into the hardware on many 8 and 16bit microcontrollers. In fact you don't even need a microcontroller to manipulate a light switch or toaster.
MCP250XX CAN Input/Output (I/O) Expanders feature a CAN port to connect to a CAN network, and input/output functionality that can be manipulated over the BUS without a microcontroller in the system.
Microchip has more info.
Granted, ethernet is everywhere, and TCP/IP is used in everything, but you can put a CAN card in your PC and have a gateway to your home automation network. You CAN also attach a CAN adapter via RJ45, USB or RS232.
For more information about using CAN in automation see the website www.can-cia.com
Beans
In the long run, some things really don't warrant automation. Even though automating them may be a very cool and interesting exercise.
Personally, I'd rather have some of the more important sw I have work, or work better...
-tpg
This reminds me of that weather-forecasting toaster from a while back... Coverage of it on The Register, in case you have forgotten about it.
The first ever Ultimate Frisbee video game: here (now
...in which case it will be a pop-under.
Infuriate left and right
Maybe it would be more useful for the toaster to control the Commodore 64, rather than the other way around. You would need a 24 slice toaster; 16 slices to select the address in the 64K memory, and 8 slices to do the pokes, and display the peeks. Just like the good old days with toggle switches on the front panel.
fuck toast ... just configure all my clocks to sync via NTP
members are seeing something, your seeing an ad
Imagine a Beowolf Cluster of THESE!!!
So, what if they put it in a curling iron? If someone hacks your home network, will they turn the curling iron remotely so that your house burns down?
Who has stock in this idea? Tim Burton? :)
This is one big conspiracy to make breakfast time look like something out of Pee Wee's Big Adventure.
/^[A-Z0-9._%+-]+@[A-Z0-9.-]+\.[A-Z]{2,4}$/i
Seeing what can be accomplished on a 1 Mhz C64 with 64k of RAM got me interested in projects for my old 16-Mhz 80286 with 1 MB of RAM and 40 MB disk? All I can find on the 'net is ELKS.
Thanks!
Roey
The price never made it down to $1, but it's still around, used for building automation and such. The Echelon crowd keeps trying to promote for home automation (see Home Appliance Control Using J2ME? Technology with access from a Wireless PDA ) but nobody is buying.
Not to be picky, but that's a Commodore 128!
Control the cooking of your turkey while you're at work. (Well, you can't baste it, but...) Or jerky. Cook your chili. (Well, you'll scorch it, but still...don't have to be there!)
Or how about a furnace? Or water heater? Remote diagnostics and maybe even adjustment even for older hardware.
There's lots of appliances that could be better with internet connectivity. Toasters are probably not among them, however.
I agree completely. And if you still want a rich, non-HTML GUI on your computer while still running nothing more than an HTTP server on the device, you might want to check out XWT.
Acorn created a toaster expansion that would slot into your RiscPC. It was just an example of how powerful the 'slice' system was (impossible to run out of space in the machine), but it came with GUI to control it including a "browning control" widget. I can't find any pictures of it, though there is one of the RiscPC pizza oven and someone else uses it for his espresso machine.
Phillip.
Property for sale in Nice, France
The old 64 had tons of memory! You had to work really hard to fill it unless with junk and useless graphics. Now they are using it to illustrate that a program can fit into a toaster?
Well, they just to call one of the models "the bread-can" or something like that (in Swedish at least), so I guess it kinda follows suite...
It's silly to ask your small kitchen appliance
to send "screenshots" of a virtual screen when
cheaper lower-level protocols can be used. If
you want a pretty GUI, paint it on the client
end based on lower-level feedback from the
appliance.
For example, see HTCPCP/1.0
Hyper Text Coffee Pot Control Protocol
http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2324.html
-matt
The Remote Framebuffer Protocol that VNC uses to export the display is not limited to rasterized GUIs. A very constrained device could run a VNC server that uses the colored rectangle primitive of RFB to directly paint some very simple shapes.
For example, check out this very simple rfb server here. It displays a counter using LCD-style digits, using filled rectangles. There is no fancy graphical toolkit required, and no rasterization step.
Tsunami -- You can't bring a good wave down!
- X10 (I know... farging pop-unders!) addressable Thermostat thingies..
- The X10 Firecracker (wireless transmitter) on your PC..
- A web server running the Perl libraries for X10.
- A WAP-based web page for the cell phone...
So, fire up your cell phone... enter a temperature... and POOF! The A/C is on!Pretty cool.. My old boss has had that for about 3 years now.
T
---- It puts the lotion on its skin or else it gets the hose again. It does this whenever it's told.
1. Well first I would embed a VNC server to my girlfriend. Nothing like muting her when I am trying to read /.
VTC is an unacceptable means of remote support; that's why we use terminal services.
Maybe someone should write a module that allows you to enter your toast color in hex. Mine always ends up as #FFFFFF.