Zaurus Sync Software (Finally) Available for Linux

Tony Green writes "One of the biggest gripes of early Zaurus users (with much justification) was the fact that despite the fact that the Zaurus itself runs Linux, the only synchronisation software made available was for Windoze machines. Trolltech have now released a desktop synch program (albeit a beta at the moment) for Linux, so at last Linux users can start doing what the rest could already do. Information at The Zaurus Software Index or Trolltech One word of warning though, the MySQL installation on my Zaurus became unusable after using this; I haven't worked out exactly what it did yet, but I ended up having to completely re-initialise the Zaurus and then restore everything from my backups. So not recommended if you're running MySQL (unless you're feeling brave...)"

Comments

Hmm... still doesn't solve my problem...

[jsonmez]

Any word on when the AS/400 hotsync software comes out...

Funny, just downloaded this yesterday.

[sys49152]

Note, to use the docking crade you have to modify the kernel for USB-ethernet support. Something I don't feel like doing. However, I set it up to do a network synch (I have a Netgear MA701 wireless CF card in my Z.), and it works like a champ.

Also note that the various PIM applications use an XML file format, and while it is mostly guessable, the format is not published. And TrollTech recommends not modifying them directly, anyway.

Finally, remember that you can always FTP etc. into the Z. for file management and other tasks.

Now, how do you sync with Mozilla's address book, Outlook's -and- evolution's Calendar, and Outlook's todo list?

Re:Funny, just downloaded this yesterday.

[Whispers_in_the_dark]

Note, to use the docking crade you have to modify the kernel for USB-ethernet support.

Not so anymore from what I've heard! I modded my kernel long ago so I don't know if these work but there are now RedHat RPMs:

Get 'em here

Re:Funny, just downloaded this yesterday.

[krow]

Doesn't the latest ROM updates break this feature though?

Re:Funny, just downloaded this yesterday.

[muckdog]

not a total mozilla sync solution but here is a mozilla ldif to zaurus address book XML converstion script I wrote a few days ago...

http://www.jaysweb.net/zaurus/scripts/mozilla_ld if 2zarus.pl.txt

Re:Funny, just downloaded this yesterday.

[ahaile]

Worked fine for me with the 2.38 ROM, which is the latest. You have to change the last number of your host's usb0 net connection so that it ends in a .1. I.e., if you were a.b.c.d, you need to change it to a.b.c.1.

ogg

[daserver]

How much does 128mb flash card for this thing cost? I'm really considering buying one and using it as my mobile audio player. Remember it's about the only thing you can get that plays ogg!

Re:ogg

[Anonymous Coward]

I do have a Zaurus, and it's a nice handheld, but I do not use it as an mp3\ogg player because of battery life and size.

Re:ogg

[Anonymous Coward]

check pricewatch.com. You shouldn't have to pay more that $.50US a meg for CompactFlash.

Re:ogg

[Anonymous Coward]

Snicker, they're cheap enough. I have a 128mb CF and another 128mb SD for it - am planning on probably installing the gcc chain at some point for giggles. Seems that writes to the SD are obnoxiously slow but retrieval speed seems reasonable so far. (SD has some almost funnily stupid 'copy protection' crap that does little more than make it slow.) The CF flat out rocks.
It's a little bulkier than the snazzy little mp3-players out there, but if you want something that doesn't have someone elses 'digital rights management' hand down your shorts, it's an excellent way to go!

Besides, try playing any of Kendrick's toys on your stinking locked-up mp3 player! ;-)

Re:ogg

[Bill Kendrick]

Pick an electronic store, visit their website, look at their prices. (In other words, it's not like the Zaurus uses any "special" memory cards - just CF and SD (and MMC))

Re:ogg

[Anonymous Coward]

About $50. Already using it as described.

Use the Phone charger for Ericson while in the car.
Works like a charm.

Re:ogg

[oc255]

I've got a 128 meg SD card in mine. I put mp3s etc on it. I don't think the default player does ogg files. But thekompany.com has a non-free one.

Having an SD card is the only way to go. I've put everything from java sources (you can get jikes for the zaurus) to Atari 2600 roms to Doom wads (yes, you can get Doom for it).

Hours of fun when you're waiting in line.

Proper spellings

[Mr_Silver]

made available was for Windoze machines

You know, this is one of my big beefs. I know that Slashdot editors aren't exactly renown for their spelling abilities - but I think it would be rather nice if they could correct deliberate misspellings like this.

One of the things we all (I hope) advocate is the usage of something apart from Microsoft. That is Microsoft, not Micro$oft, Microsfot, Microcrap and any of the other 1001 illiterations that you find.

Maybe it's just me, but someone who deliberately misspells a company name comes across as a 14 year old and almost immediately wants me to completely dismiss the point they're making.

Harsh, maybe. But lets not alienate potential users by looking childish with our spellings.

Linux can and is a viable alternative - let us not give people the impression we're 14 year old script kiddies who think it's "cool" to munge corporate names.

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

What's worse is that this is a non-story anyway. Beta sync software that trashes the PDA itself ... Wooo! Where do I sign up?

Re:Proper spellings

[killmenow]

Blah, blah...illiterations...blah, blah...

What was that about spelling?

Re:Proper spellings

[stratjakt]

This is my pet peeve as well. Well, in particular:

It's gotten to the point that I can't discuss linux on its merits in my workplace, even when it truly is the right tool for the job.

People are starting to equate linux advocacy with 'M$ windoze is hella lame! I want free stuff'. This is the message that's leaking to the mainstream. This is what filters past the geeks and ends up in the users (and managers, marketers, etc) psyche.

This is now applying itself to the concept of Open Source in general.

I'm not pro anything, I'd love the freedom to use the most appropriate tools for the task on hand. I find myself limited to Microsoft solutions, not because of any sort of 'monopolistic demon powers', but because, frankly, the linux/gnu community has made jackasses of themselves.

*sigh* better get on topic.

hooray! another piece of software was released for linux!

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux can and is a viable alternative - let us not give people the impression we're 14 year old script kiddies who think it's "cool" to munge corporate names.

But Linux IS a bunch of 14 year old script kiddies who think it's "cool" to munge corporate names.

Re:Proper spellings

[DonkeyJimmy]

I think it would be rather nice if they[slashdot editors] could correct deliberate misspellings like this[windoze].

Weather or not you believe that we of slashdot shouldn't intentially misspell words doesn't mean that slash dot moderators have the right (leave alone obligation) to change the things we do on purpose (short of racist remarks, profanity, etc.).

If anything, you should be condeming the poster. I would be furious if a slashdot editor changed anything on my, or anyone elses, post like that.

let us not give people the impression we're 14 year old script kiddies. . .

I didn't think we were in the buisness of trying to look good for potential users. I think most people here just want to have an "intelligent" discussion about things they care about.

Re:Proper spellings

[FortKnox]

I, absolutely, agree entirely with the point you are making.

Linux won't become better by trashing Microsoft, it will become better if it gets support.
Misspelling Microsoft is like saying you are a 1337 H4A><0R. We aren't impressed by your attempt at humor and/or bashing. You want to make Linux the premier desktop? Lay off the bashing, and add to the community.
You know the MIS managers that don't like Linux? Its because they've either read something written by someone who is trashing MS, or have gone to a convention to meet a group of individuals that are trashing MS instead of pointing out the good points of Linux.

Two things need to happen in the Linux community:

1. Make Linux more user friendly and market it so that Aunt Mable will try it.
2. Get rid of the B1FFs of the Linux community, so we don't look like a buncha 16 year old H4><0Rs trying to be better than Microsoft instead of making a good OS. This point gets Linux into the industry, where it can make a huge difference. The Server market is the entrance, and it can break in even greater without elitists spouting "Screw Microshaft", "Windoze blows, man", and, the infamous, "RTFM".

Somewhere, somehow these people lost site of the true goal (to make a great OS) and came up with their own (to dethrown Windows). Ask the creator of Linux to determine what the true goal is if you don't believe me.

Re:Proper spellings

[spakka]

I think it would be rather nice if they could correct deliberate misspellings like this

Agreed, but...

One of the things we all (I hope) advocate is the usage of something apart from Microsoft

Isn't this assumption just as likely to alienate an unbiased reader?

Re:Proper spellings

[blaine]

I think Penny Arcade has a strip that sums up your feelings pretty well. If nothing else, it helps to point out the childishness of a lot of the namecalling surrounding Microsoft. Try showing it to the next person who tries to be cool by spelling Microsoft with a '$', or any other such stupidity. With any luck, they'll see how foolish they sound, and if they don't, you can just laugh at their stupidity. It's a win-win situation ;)

Re:Proper spellings

[lovebyte]

Fantastic! Your post contains 6 spelling mistakes! Not a record, mind you, but you could almost ask a job as a slashdot editor!

Re:Proper spellings

[Quixadhal]

I didn't think they were being childish, I just assumed that by using Micro$oft and Windoze, you protect yourself from the sea of lawyers who might come after you for trademark infringment. Afterall, when you corrected the fellow, you didn't specify it correctly as Microsoft(TM).

Let me ask you this... was there ANY doubt or confusion in your mind about the entity which was referenced by the slang "Windoze" term? If so, then you have a legitimate complaint, as the corruption introduces confusion. The purpose of language is to share ideas in a clear manner. If everyone understands what the slang refers to, then it is not really a problem for the intended audience is it?

Of course, the archaeologists who unearth the terrabytes of slashdot posts in years to come (the only useable record of this period of time, since it isn't DRM protected...yet), may be a bit bewildered (or perhaps they'll burn it as blaspheme since the Church of Microsoft(TM) would not look kindly upon it).

Re:Proper spellings

[DonkeyJimmy]

but you could almost ask a job as a slashdot editor

What would I ask said job?
--
In a battle of grammer and spelling, there are only losers.

Re:Proper spellings

[GiorgioG]

In all honestly slashdot's articles lately have been pretty flaky. Dup posts in the same 24 hour period to name but 1 issue that has plagued /., overly biased stories, etc. I think some of these guys need to go outside once in a while. It seems like they've got tunnel vision when it comes to Linux/OSS. This is NOT a flame. I like Linux and Windows 2K.

On that same note: Both have their own rightful place. Microsoft behaves like any other corporation would in their situation. They're trying to protect/expand their market. Unfortunately the end users wind up losing some functionality/choices in the process. The cliche "Money makes the world go round" has plenty of truth to it - even in the OSS community. RedHat offers consulting services. They are not doing it for the good of the community. Yes, it's great that Linux & other OSS started as just hobby projects. But at some scale/level, they are no longer manageable without some influx of cash (You have to pay your developers/infrastructure) Sorry for the rant, but I just don't understand why the /. community loves to hate companies that sell software (Oracle/Microsoft/etc). Microsoft is the 'King of the hill' and thus an obvious target, but lets not behave childishly. This isn't a troll. It's just my own (hopefully) balanced opinion.

Re:Proper spellings

[SirSlud]

> ... let us not give people the impression we're 14 year old script kiddies who think it's "cool" to munge corporate names.

_You_ are the one who conjurs up images of 14 yr old script kiddies. Most people dont even know what a script kiddie is, so you havn't much to fear. The usual reaction from my regular user friends when I use the namesakes for MS you so long to eschew actually gets a laugh from them. Hell, sometimes it even kind of coaxes a nod of understanding and relation from them; often users wonder if they're the only ones in the world who thinks Windows breaks for them.

And remember - much of the terminology you used as a kid displeased your elters, but became the norm for your generation. The language (and the methods of use thereof) evolves .. don't discredit a social movement or ideology simply because you have difficulty seperating the stereotypes from the lexicons.

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Lets remember to always use "Red Hat® Linux®" when we discuss that distro as well, because this could never happen in the Linux community. Hypocrites.

Re:Proper spellings

[kaisyain]

You fail to understand how trademarks work. You do not need to write Microsoft(TM). Take a look at how every single newpaper and magazine on the planet Earth spells it: Microsoft. It is part of fair use of the trademark.

Re:Proper spellings

[RobotRunAmok]

Maybe it's just me, but someone who deliberately misspells a company name comes across as a 14 year old and almost immediately wants me to completely dismiss the point they're making.

Well said.

Whether or not it is a SlashDot Editor's right/responsibility to correct the spellings when they are deliberately and childishly changed may be open to debate, but the fact that their continued use diminish the credibility of posters, forum, and movement is not.

Re:Proper spellings

[gujo-odori]

There's nothing wrong with bashing Microsoft. People hate Microsoft because Microsoft has worked hard to make them hate it. Remember how popular Microsoft once was? Remember when Bill Gates' "The Road Ahead" was a huge seller? People commonly viewed neither Gates nor his company as being capable of doing wrong in those days. I should know. I was one of them. Things change. People wise up. Now, since Microsoft has worked so hard to earn all of this ill will, we would not want to cheat them out of their so richly deserved reward and disappoint them, would we?

However, I do not view making Linux more "user friendly" as a good thing. What you and many other people really mean by that is "Let's make a Linux for people who don't know anything about computers and don't want to." Maybe you don't realize you mean that, but it's true. The trouble is that apart from the sheer difficulty of doing so, this would not be a Good Thing. Why not? Because doing that to Linux or any other *nix is going to take away so much of what makes it *nix. Stop and think. Linux and the rest of the *nix family is a server operating system, first and foremost. And it has not one but two decent GUIs that are already quite good enough (but still getting better nevertheless) that not only sysadmins like me but many other power users and near power users can use it as their full-time desktop OS. Beyond that, Linux, particularly when running KDE, is good enough for the corporate desktop Right Now. [1] [2]

But Linux for Aunt Mable? Uh-uh. I don't believe you can do that without breaking most of what Linux is today for most of the people who use it. For years, I was an advocate of user-friendly Linux. My mind was gradually changed by the kind of people I saw coming to Linux. Not people who wanted to learn, to give back, to teach those who came after them the way those who went before me taught me. Not people who wanted to improve the product for the sake of improving it. There were some of those, of course, but they were a minority.

What did we get? Whiners. Losers. Trolls. People who came into Linux and said "You owe me something." The whole attitude was/is one of demanding that since they've tried this "Linux thing" that the community - the LUG they found, the author of the package that bugs them this week, somebody, anybody - owes them help, bug fixes, feature requests, whatever. The idea and ideal that this is a self-help community founded on the ideal and idealism of Linux and Free Software is totally lost on them. I really believed in Linux for the masses. Now I've come to my senses. There are many places where Linux or a *BSD is the best tool available, and this includes corporate workstations. But there are places where it just doesn't belong, too. Aunt Mable's desk is one of them.

For people who want to get away from MS but want a vendor they can demand things from (or try to), who want all the user friendliness, etc., I strongly and highly recommend a Mac running OS X. Apple has done a truly marvelous job, and OS X is onlyk going to get better with time. For the typical end-user market, Apple is where it's at now. OS X has a terrific UI, is easy to use (something Apple has always shot for and largely achieved better than MS), and has the power of *nix underneath the hood.

Yes, I know OS X is proprietary, and I'm all for Free Software. But I also know that there are people who just aren't right for Free Software, and it isn't right for them either. The people I described above. There is no such thing as a free lunch, yet that's what they try to get out of Free Software. They are far better off buying a good but proprietary product from a good and innovative company like Apple.

And do you know what? The Free Software community is better off, too. We don't have to deal with it. Free and Open Source software can be present on an OS X system, but Apple is in between them and us. I like it that way. I've never owned a Mac before, but my next computer purchase will be an iBook. Maybe it'll dual-boot Linux and OS X, or maybe not. It might be OS X only. That's how good it is.

There is a lot of business-friendliness in Linux, and a lot of that in OS X, too. I truly believe that most businesses would be better off with a Linux, Apple, or mixed Linux/Apple network than with a Windows network. We should do a lot of this. However, beware of letting too much user friendliness into Linux. You'll be sorry.

You'll have to excuse me while I go off and write some anti-Micro$oft tracts about much Windoze blows chunks and draw Borg attachments on Dr. Evi^H^H^H uh, I mean, Bill Gates. Or is that Winblows? Or just 'doze? Whatever.

Now run along and buy your Aunt Mable a Mac. And maybe a Linux-based PDA to go with it. The embedded market is a place where Linux can really shine. This is, although user-friendly, not a Bad Thing because - as in the Apple case - you have a vendor standing between the community and the people who are using the software but don't want to be in the community. They are the vendor's problem.

[1] By "corporate desktop" I mean an environment where there is a professional administrator (or at least someone who plays one on TV) overseeing the IT operations. Windows networks should have one of these too, of course, and the reason many don't is a combination of tight budgets (or just plain cheapness) combined with technicall non-savvy managers buying into the Microsoft sizzle that tried to make people think you don't really need admins. Lack of admins is a big reason for Code Red, Klez, et al, spreading the way they did.

[2] No, I'm not out to pump up KDE at the expensve of Gnome. In fact, I personally prefer and use Gnome. However, KDE is better for the corporate desktop environment at this point. It's better for new users at this point.

Re:Proper spellings

[hilker]

I would be furious if a slashdot editor changed anything on my, or anyone elses, post like that.

What's the point of having editors if they aren't allowed to edit?

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Trashing Microsoft has nothing to do with Linux. It has to do with Microsoft. They are separate movements.

The #1 group of people who type "Windoze" are Windoze users.

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Its sad we have to censor ourselves in order for the rest of the world, who doesn't do the proper research before making decisions, obviously, so they will listen to what we have to say. If they did the research it wouldn't matter what we have to say because they would already know those options exist and their capabilities. If they don't like what we have to say then maybe they shouldn't use the people's products. Maybe open source should never be put in production and maybe they should be forced to pay large sums of money for the support contracts they want because they will never build the proper infrustructure to provide in-house support the way a competent corporation would. What I see is a lot of corporations jumping on the open-source buzzword in order to gain market share and caring about nothing else. They don't want to contribute, but instead they want to steal from our resources and hard work. We share for the love of it, they steal for money. That's why I could give a fuck how anyone spells M$.

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Having editors that edit is called censorship any way you slice it. But its good to know what you care about.

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

And remember - much of the terminology you used as a kid displeased your elters, but became the norm for your generation. The language (and the methods of use thereof) evolves .. don't discredit a social movement or ideology simply because you have difficulty seperating the stereotypes from the lexicons.

As someone with a BA in English, replaces his paper dictionary every 8-10 years, has a stack of slang dictionaries, "M$" and similar phrases still looks childish. In 20 years, it still will.

In the meantime, you're not helping any group except MS.

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL

How could they mod you as a troll?

Can they see the delicious irony in your post?

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

You find that strip funny? Okay... That boring old geek cliche is getting rather old in my opinion. Most of the geeks I know are potheads. Loser

Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

brilliant!
one - nil!

Re:Proper spellings

[The Turd Report]

Looks like your tin-fiol hat is slipping. :) Remember, shiny-side out!

Re:Proper spellings

[gujo-odori]

There's no such thing as an unbiased reader.

Re:Proper spellings

[ceejayoz]

Ah, yes, my favorite PA strip of all time...

The runner up would probably be the man-sized spider one... heehee.

Say What?

[HomerG]

I don't know what this is about, Qtopia Desktop for Linux has been out for quite some time now.

Re:Say What?

[gabbarsingh]

I agree. I have been using Qtopia Desktop on linux since I bought my Zaurus and that was in June '02. It says it's 1.6 beta.

Re:Say What?

[Anonymous Coward]

I have a SL-5000 (Developers Edition), and I have been using it for quite some time now.Since the end of last year, or first of this year. hmmm.

Re:Say What?

[Vrallis]

Agreed, I've been using this for months now. This is *definitely* nothing new.

The older version I'm using has some bugs still, so hopefully they worked those out (your first sync each time you start the software usually hangs on the calendar).

I'd be more interested in them fixing stuff like Hancomm spreadsheet taking forever to load (a 1MB spreadsheet takes about 10 minutes to load on my 5500!).

Re:Say What?

[vicviper]

Me too!

</AOL>

Re:Say What?

[XavierXeon]

who needs linux sync software anyway ? by that i mean software which does not integrate whith rest of your linux desktop, and just offers you a not too nice ftp frontend. (and yes i know linux on the desktop is so dead, blah blah, and i like my undead linux desktop a lot)

Re:Say What?

[Bill Kendrick]

Yeah, I was wondering. I thought maybe something NEW came out. I sync'd, once. I just never got into syncing. I don't use PIMs on my desktop, for some reason. I didn't when I used my Palm, and I don't now with my Zaurus. I guess it's good that it's getting some fanfare, or... err.. something.
*shrug*

Not news for 2 reasons

[tempest303]

This isn't news for 2 reasons:

1) This is just another beta release - not the final version - the 1.5 beta has been out for months. (Possibly even from when the Z was first released, though I can't recall exactly)

2) (well, ok, this is more a personal reason, but...) Wake me up when it talks to Evolution... ...which reminds me - I'd personally throw down like $40 just to see the Z synch with Evolution. It's not going to happen from Trolltech or the Kompany for political and technical reasons (they'd rather have it talk to Aethera, I'm sure), but an independent developer could probably make some nice extra $$$ writing a stable, usable, reliable Evo Z synch suite. Here's hoping some one does this... I'm going nuts!

(yes, I'm fully aware of the project at http://sf.net/projects/zesync - but it hasn't gone anywhere in months, sadly....)

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[numatrix]

1) Most definitely agree; this is not news.

2) Ask and ye shall receive. Haven't tried it myself, so I can't verify it, but it's not the zesync project. Also, zesync was updated August 28, what do you mean it hasn't been updated in months?

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[HomerG]

Have you tried using zesync yet?

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[Anonymous Coward]

I haven't sent zesync anywhere in months because of the grumblings I hear from both Trolltech and OPIE for filetype changes. Until they can standardize on one file in the future, I will not be coming out with new zesync releases, something I had made abundantly clear on zaurus-general.
I too would like to sync with evolution. But I got fed up with the back and forth. If anyone wants it the project is theirs; and you know how to find me.

--chayim

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[tempest303]

Ack, that sucks. I hope you didn't get the impression that I was trying to *slam* zesync per se, but rather just pointing out that it hasn't been updated in a long while. I didn't catch the comments on Zaurus-General either, because I quit that list months ago. (I couldn't stand all the flaming, idle chatter, and same old questions - it got ridiculous.)

*sigh*... what a let-down. ah, well.

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[tempest303]

yes - read this whole thread more carefully for why zesync doesn't currently fit the bill.

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[tempest303]

Well, that first bit isn't really a "synch" program, just a converter, and it only applies to the datebook. I'd really like something that handled todo, datebook, and addressbook.... something like zesync. Which brings me to my second point...

Yeah, zesync got an "update" on the 28th of August, but that was a small compatibility fix for people running Opie. Prior to that, the last release was in June. For software that only made it to two releases, it's pretty good, but it's not "there" yet, and unfortunately, with sync software, you have to make it nearly to the end before your app as any kind of widespread value. :-P

If you read the whole thread now, the author of zesync just commented on my parent post that apparently the file format of the PIM apps is in an undocumented (undocumentable?) state of flux, and thus any author would have to stay constantly abreast of changes to the file format. Yuck. I don't blame Chayim at all for not wanting to work in zesync any longer.

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[Enry]

theKompany.com won't take your money. They have their own sync software and Shawn Gordon has explicitly said they will not write the software to sync with Evolution. Even though a number of customers requested it.

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[numatrix]

Yeah, I realize it is undocumented; Sharp has explicitly said that not only is it undocumented, but it will likely change too. I'd dig up the irc logs if I wasn't so dang lazy.

Re:Not news for 2 reasons

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not that I don't want zesync to fly, heck I'd love it. But getting any form of help was also an issue. I must have put out a call for help at least 3 times, and received but one reply.
Then I attempted to release zync, a generic sync framework (also in python). This time I got a tonne of initial interest, but not one person who actually committed to my project in any way (even loosely).
In the end, between the potential (and admittance) for XML fluctuations, and the lack of help I gave up. But if you know anyone who wants to fix it I'm there.

--chayim

you know who else wanted Linux support?

[Anonymous Coward]

joe stalin.

that's right.

josef EFFING stalin.

consider the company you keep, you are with a pretty hideous crew

Re:you know who else wanted Linux support?

[Anonymous Coward]

Aye, but look at teh MS users:

Fidel Castro
The Una-Bomber
Osama Bin Laden

Nuff said...

Re:you know who else wanted Linux support?

[Anonymous Coward]

Stalin would love that little hammer and sickel icon that appears on the Zaurus for users to start programs. Oh wait, it's not a communist symbol, it's the QT logo. Never mind.

Beta only

[Mika_Lindman]

(albeit a beta at the moment)

That's still better than most linux software, just go to www.sourceforge.net and see how mony projects ever gets past alpha-stage.

Re:Beta only

[henley]

That's still better than most linux software, just go to www.sourceforge.net and see how mony projects ever gets past alpha-stage.

That's unfair, and comparing apples with oranges.

Think of a project on sourceforge as being a low-cost representation of an idea, rather than as a product. So the first thing you do is register your idea - or, if you're a fan of Homesteading the Noosphere, you "stake your claim". Then you see if there's interest, think a bit more about the problem and/or solution you're proposing, maybe try a few bits of code out.

Often times, what you deride as "alpha" level software is perfectly acceptable v1.0 shipping product from some large commercial suppliers (er, actually most commercial vendors). Their business model appears to be ship a minimally-functional product, if it works use the proceeds to fund v2.0

Remember also that that Alpha code may just do exactly what you want it to do - no final product required! Often times within the context of these sorts of connectivity programs, alpha-code is sufficient to prove the concept, wherein it becomes more profitable to roll the actual functionality into a larger project - e.g. Evolution's palm-sync equivalent, or a specific camera's photo-download software into gPhoto2 or similar.

In short, if I expect to have to pay for software, then I expect a Beta programme to a) provide an early look at the functionality b) provide an early look at the quality of the product before committing anything to it. If, on the otherhand, I'm crusin' sourceforge for solutions, then oftentimes a demonstration-quality Alpha release is more than enough to make a decision on whether to adopt, adapt, collaborate or ignore the project...

Re:Beta only

[momobaxter]

I think this should be modded up. I agree completely with his views. I like the concept of using it as a way of gaining an idea of rather your project is going to gain enough interest to continue development or not.

USB sync causes problems

[C.U.T.M.]

If you're going to sync with Linux I'd suggest doing it via wireless. I've used every possible USB kernel setup suggested and my Z still won't sync via USB. I can ping, ftp to transfer files, etc. via USB but the syncing software makes my Z hang. I'd go wireless if USB gives your Z issues.

Re:USB sync causes problems

[Locutus]

The sync software has never made my Z hang but I will tell you that the 1.6beta works much better than the 1.5 version. What's strange is that you have the ethernet-USB stuff working enough for ftp and that's what the sync software uses, ftp.

I'd look at the IP address settings in the qtopiadesktop( sync software ) and then delete the $HOME/.palmtopcenter directory and try again. You could have a corupted config file.

LoB

Zaurus

[mirko]

This is good news for sure, I personally own one that I got used to synchronizing to my Palm (infra-red), which I further synbchronize to my laptop.

Now, for all the geeks here, here's a nice Zaurus software repository...

And here is my favourite Zaurus App

Re:Zaurus

[Bill Kendrick]

Now, for all the geeks here, here's a nice Zaurus software repository

"For all the geeks?" Dude, the Zaurus Software Index is for EVERYONE who owns a Zaurus! :^P

Go Zaurus go!

[Anonymous Coward]

"Go Zaurus go!" to make a travesty of RMS on Gnome.

Another Good Embedded RDBMS...

[MattRog]

Is Sybase SQL Anywhere. It offers scalable, bidirectional synchronization of information between your handheld and your Sybase Adaptive Server Enterprise, Oracle, Microsoft SQL Server and IBM DB2 RDBMS's. I would even think it might poke your MySQL/PostgreSQL DB via ODBC or some other method.

A whitepaper is here: http://www.sybase.com/detail/1,6904,1016232,00.htm l

Moderators

[OrangeSpyderMan]

Most of them need to look up dictionary in a bookshop first;-)

Version with integrated cellphone?

[rseuhs]

If there will come out a GSM-variant, the Zaurus is certainly the PDA of choice for me, but otherwise I'll go for the Handspring Treo.

Does anybody have some information about Sharp's plans on Zaurus?

Re:Version with integrated cellphone?

[mirko]

Check this :-)

My Zaurus kicks...

[bhsx]

For those who haven't tried one out yet:

The Zaurus is a very nice PDA, no two ways about it. It has it's faults, as do every other PDA on the market; but it's highlights really outshine the drawbacks. Granted, the first OS it shipped with was a little buggy for me. I needed to wipe it clean and start over after only about a week; but one upgrade later (didn't take Sharp too long to realize they needed to get an update out) and it's solid as a rock. The keyboard is very useable, and playing Doom at work is a great distraction (i had Quake installed, but only got like 4-5fps). YMMV, but especially since they've dropped over $100US since I bought mine, I'd suggest them to even the non-uber-geek.

OT: Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe it's just me, but someone who deliberately misspells a company name comes across as a 14 year old and almost immediately wants me to completely dismiss the point they're making.

Well Perhaps it's me but whenever I come across a grammer/spelling-nazi deliberately running down somebody else I consider it Off-Topic or Troll and tend to dismiss the poster as a belittling bully.

If you cannot make a constructive addition to the story don't make any.

Posted anon because this OT.

Re:OT: Re:Proper spellings

[dinivin]

Hey hypocrite, how about following your own advice?

Re:OT: Re:Proper spellings

[Locutus]

Defending from a bully requires BECOMING a bully.

It's that the defenders tend to have control of when to apply pressure. Bullies don't.

This is still a dumb topic. IMHO.

Re:OT: Re:Proper spellings

[Anonymous Coward]

Escpecially grammer-nazis with poor grammer....

A PDA should mean less work not more

[Anonymous Coward]

Articles like this make me roar with laughter. I've had a Palm for years and never had as much trouble as you high-and-mighty Zarus guys. My Palm PDA, just like my real palm, just works. Having a PDA means less work not more.

"Hey lookie I got my PDA to sync! It only took a kernel rebuild and installing some 3rd-party Beta software!"

Schmucks

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Anonymous Coward]

Who needs a PDA for that matter? I just keep everything in my head. Much faster than a PDA and I have yet to drop it nor do I have to worry about losing data when wet.

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Anonymous Coward]

let me know when your palm syncs with your imap email, ldap contacts, etc

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, as a long-time user of Palm (my USR PalmPilot 5000 is still resting quietly in a drawer at home) and developer of PalmOS apps, I'm carrying a Zaurus and not looking back. Palm IS an excellent platform, no two ways about it. Palm is also struggling and after flogging a dead platform is going to know the exquisite pain of attempting to jump to an entirely new architecture and OS.

(Insert and delete several insults about Palm and some of the recent and funny blunders. There's going to be enough flaming here already.)

The Zaurus is what a *lot* of devices want to be when they grow up. iPAQ will someday have built-in expansion ports (WHAT? Extra hardware?) and *someone* else will finally catch on that a -gasp- removeable rechargeable battery is a good idea.

Heh. Careful when you're calling names, man.

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Don Calamari]

Well, I've gotten a lot less work done with my zaurus...

Damn you Froot!!

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Bill Kendrick]

Froot rules. I'd love to see perl-SDL ported to the Zaurus, though (we have Perl, we have SDL)... ...then we might be able to play Frozen Bubble!!!

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[lessthan0]

The Zaurus is not really in the same category of devices as Palms. I was a happy Palm user for 5 years and I still like Palms for basic PDA stuff. But the Z is an ultra small computer with all the power and complexity that goes with a real computer.

Yes, I use it for PDA stuff and it syncs nicely with my Qtopia desktop on SuSE 8.0. But I also use it for testing bash scripts, controlling servers with ssh, wireless web browing, programming routers, etc. It's much easier to lug into a wiring closet than a laptop.

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Anonymous Coward]

So go get an iPod and quit yer bitchin'. :)

Re:A PDA should mean less work not more

[Anonymous Coward]

My Palm PDA, just like my real palm, just works. Having a PDA means less work not more.

"Hey lookie I got my PDA to sync! It only took a kernel rebuild and installing some 3rd-party Beta software!"

You mean like enabling USB-serial support and installing pilot-link, like you would with a Palm? At least, that's what I had to do to setup my m130...

No go...

[Vrallis]

Well, appearently the new version is worse than the old one. This one starts a sync and hangs...that's it, dead. At least the old one only hung on the first sync, and could be kicked free.

Try again, Trolltech...

Re:No go...

[Vrallis]

Okay...if you are using the old version, remove ~/.palmtopcenter before running the new one...

Nonsense!

[Anonymous Coward]

I've been playing Ogg files on my ipaq for months with pocketdivx (http://home.adelphia.net/~mdukette/)

A quick question

[Squarewav]

I know I could probably look this up myself , but im lazy ;)
can the zaurus be mounted (i.e. can browse the files like a hd) under both windows and linux. one of the things I like most about my pocketpc is that I can easly browse , remove and add files from my windows desktop, I realy dont sync that oftin. in fact I can live without syncing at all, I would realy like to access my pda from linux in such a way( like thats ever going to happen) if it can I'll buy a zaurus next time

Re:A quick question

[HomerG]

Yes, you can mount smb and nfs shares with the Zaurus. You can ftp into it using Konqueror and then drag files from the KDE desktop to tha Zaurus and from the Zaurus to the desktop.

Re:A quick question

[Anonymous Coward]

Unlike PocketPC and its cousins and variants that run a specially-hacked operating system that matches *nothing* else, the Zaurus uses Linux. This means that once its network is active (either via ethernet over USB or PPP over USB or ...) it's a Linux machine on a network. Gives you an incredible level of flexibility in accessing the device, avenues that are closed off from more limited packages like PalmOS and PocketPC.
That said, my experience thus far with a Zaurus and a Linux machine (I don't even have a Windows machine in my home den at the moment) is excellent. The QTopia desktop works reasonably well - it handles basic functions and file transfers but too long a session tends to destabilize it. Yes, it presents you with an interface showing all the data files on the device, and it's a simple matter to move files to/from the device.

Finally?

[Capt. Beyond]

I've been syncing my zaurus on linux for months now.. about 9 to be exact.

This is new?

Cool!

[Wakko Warner]

Now the other two Zaurus users can sync to their desktops! The rest of us five will have to stop making fun of Bill and Andy now.

- A.P.

Proper grammar

[theLOUDroom]

Get a clue. I'm sick of this Linux users need to set a good example crap. Every person who uses Linux is not a spokesperson for the OS. People should choose their OS based on the OS, not because someone annoying uses/doesn't use it. If they don't, they're probably going to make a bad decision no matter what.
People can insult crappy software if they want. If someone is considering Linux, d'ya think it could be because they sick of MS' "You're going where we tell you today" attitude?

Linux can and is a viable alternative
If you're going to be a spelling nazi, check your grammar, buddy.

Re:Grammar Nazi - Not so fast...

[FlyerFanNC]

Americans are not the only English speakers who read Slashdot. True, using the plural for companies is not proper *American* English, but it is for just about every other national form of English, such as British English or Australian English. We Yanks are rather in the minority on this one.

Deceptive and Wrong

[FreeUser]

That's still better than most linux software, just go to www.sourceforge.net and see how mony projects ever gets past alpha-stage.

I'm sure there are any number of pro-Microsoft(tm) zealots and astroturfers who will take exception to this, but my (and, I think, most people's) experience suggests that most alpha-stage GNU, Linux, and BSD projects are far and away more stable and reliable than their Windows(tm) equivelents, if perhaps less polished on the install and user-interface side.

In other words, those pre-alpha and alpha projects are often already far and away better than many of their Microsoft(tm) counterparts (if such even exist, which is often NOT the case), and are certainly very useful to GNU/Linux users long before they reach beta or final release status, in contrast to many offerings from Redmond, which remain unstable and marginally useful long after people have begun paying good money for them.

Free software developers, being subject to public peer review, are generally much more conservative in how they label their projects than Microsoft(tm) and some other commercial enterprises are, as anyone who has used both can readilly attest. It is particularly deceptive of disingenous for pro-Microsoft(tm) zealots to be using that conservatism in nomenclature to imply an inferiority in the software being released that, emperically, simply doesn't exist in most cases.

And what about script kiddies?

[fireboy1919]

When I think about script kiddies, I first think about how successful the "Dude, you're getting a Dell" commercials have been.

Then I think about how my parents have always turned to me for computer guidance, and how they have recently started getting help from a 16 year old boy who my little sister knows (I'm 23, she's 16).

I'm starting to think that youthful computer users are respected by older computer illiterate users BECAUSE of their youth. So many people I know have begun their computer using experience with help from someone younger than themselves. Script kiddies are young...they might be respected for it despite their stupid phrases, D00D.

MOD PARENT TROLL!

[henben]

Nuff said.

Now, if only we can get

[jht]

All it needs now is MacOS X support and then I can throw away my old Palm - right now I sync Palm to all platforms that I use and then sync Windows to the Zaurus. With OS X support I could use the Zaurus on all my platforms instead.

I know a USB/Ethernet driver for MacOS X is do-able, since the folks at IAA have done it for the PocketMac software (sync sotware for PocketPC machines).

Fitting...

[Derkec]

It's a bit fitting that a guy who sumbits a story about a release from a company named "Trolltech" uses the term "Windoze" in his submission. Oh well, sounds like a nice piece of software, hope I'm not wasting everyone's time.

Re:Fitting...

[PrimeNumber]

FYI, as funny as the name "TrollTech" sounds, if you have ever used KDE then you have used QT which is one of the most widely used gui toolkits around.

PR Wins over Technical Excellence every time!

[SwedishChef]

There are good, solid reasons for making fun of M$ Windoze. This is a war to gain users and if users can be convinced that using MS products is, somehow, less cool than using open source products then we win, or at least gain.

Must I point out to you all the instances of products which were clearly superior but lost out because of public perceptions, advertising, or ridicule? Open source advocates may not have the resources to buy advertising like M$ does, but we do have the resources to ridicule them in subtle ways. The only downside is the risk of losing guys like you who, in all probability, are already on one side or the other.

This is not, despite what you'd like to think, a gentlemen's quarrel. Micro$oft will do anything *they* can to win. Let's not try to fight fair.

Besides, whining about it won't change it. Learn to live with it. :)

Re:PR Wins over Technical Excellence every time!

[Anonymous Coward]

There are good, solid reasons for making fun of M$ Windoze. This is a war to gain users and if users can be convinced that using MS products is, somehow, less cool than using open source products then we win, or at least gain.

So, acting like a dweb is supposed to be attractive? Please, don't "help" others this way.

Re:PR Wins over Technical Excellence every time!

[Anonymous Coward]

if users can be convinced that using MS products is, somehow, less cool than using open source products

Oh my, that's the funniest thing I've read all day. Using open source products may be a lot of things, but the one thing it's NOT is cool.

Re:PR Wins over Technical Excellence every time!

[GiorgioG]

...hahahaha...
Using Linux/OSS pretty much means you are an ubergeek. There's no way to make it be cool at the moment.

SuperNerd: Hey man check out this Linux thing it is Soooo COOL."
JoeUser: What's so cool about it?
SuperNerd: Well look it does all this stuff that Winbloze does and it's free from the Microsoft Evil Empire's control
JoeUser: Umm. Who cares?. *translation: You must have nothing better to do than waste your time hating some company*

Yes, this IS truly how Joe User would behave.

Re:PR Wins over Technical Excellence every time!

[daffmeister]

It's not about fighting fair, it's about making your opinions appear to be worth listening to. Childish misspellings make the whole argument seem childish.

Re:Grammar Nazi - Not so fast...

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually if I recall correctly (oddly enough this did come up in one of my college writing classes)it should still be the American way officially. The other is a bastardization that has occurred and become accepted speach. Similar to the American trait of making up contractions...ain't and y'all.

That doesn't make it right just because everyone is doing it.

Re:Grammar Nazi - Not so fast...

[taeric]

That doesn't make it right just because everyone is doing it.

Actually, isn't that exactly how language works? I'm not big on all language theory (or whatever it is called, though I do like word history), but I find it hard to believe that the rules in language are anything more the descriptive.

Agreed...so simple to look like an adult...

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a shame that a few well written commentaries use the childish name calling versions of Microsoft. I've read articles before that I've considered passing along to those who are interested in Linux -- only to have it ruined by word choice that undermine the paragraphs that are well done.

M$, Mickysoft, Micro$oft, and other variations make me cringe and remember the zelous Amiga and OS/2 fans of old. As a previous advocate of those old systems, I can say without a doubt that it didn't help then and doesn't help now.

Unlike those systems, Linux is suceeding very well so there's no reason to use words or phrases that say basically "I'm a looser and I'm angry about it". Linux -- and open source in general -- is a winning path. Why act like it's not?

Take a step back and listen to yourself

[NDPTAL85]

Read this back to yourself and think about how it sounds:

"For years, I was an advocate of user-friendly Linux. My mind was gradually changed by the kind of people I saw coming to Linux. Not people who wanted to learn, to give back, to teach those who came after them the way those who went before me taught me. Not people who wanted to improve the product for the sake of improving it. There were some of those, of course, but they were a minority."

Do you know how idiotically elitist this sounds? Does no one understand that you CAN overdo the "elite" thing? The "We're so l33t we don't want anyone else to join club yay!" Contrary to what you think you're not enhancing anything by being a jerk. You're just being a jerk.

Re:Take a step back and listen to yourself

[gujo-odori]

Yes, I'm an elitist, and proud of it. You, however, do not understand elitism, because you're mistaking it with exclusivism. Exclusivists want to keep people out. I, as an elitist, am happy to let people in so long as they, too, are willing to work to become elite. What I, and all the other elitists I know are saying is that if you want to be lazy, dumb, and stupid, that's fine. It's your right. It is not, however, your right to do it here. If you want to come in here, you have to be willing to work to educate yourself and then give back to others. The only people I want to exclude are people who are, and who voluntarily choose to remain, ignorant. Being open doesn't mean having no standards. You sound like you didn't even read my post. But then, this is /. so I'm not surprised.

The problem with the people I described in my prior post is that they don't want become elite. They don't even want to become competent. They don't want to give back. They don't want to become part of the culture. They expect the culture to change for them. They just want it to be done for them, and they want it to be done NOW. They don't even have the good grace to be polite to the people from whom they are demanding free help when they haven't even yet lifted a finger to find their own answers. That is not acceptable. It will never be acceptable.

I, and many other long-time Linux users I know, just plain do not want these people using Linux. They ruin it for the rest of us. A number of them were expelled from our LUG because their attitudes nearly destroyed it and permanently drove away some of our most valued members - people whose names are probably well-known to some of you, and who are sorely missed.

Linux is, and shall remain a community. People who do not want to be part of the community, and give back as they are given to, do not belong here. They aren't wanted, and they certainly aren't needed.

You say I'm a jerk, yet you're the one who jumped straight to name-calling rather than put forth any sort of counterargument to my statements. Perhaps because you really can't. I advise you to stop and ask yourself who it is that really comes off looking like a jerk here?

If you can't present reasonable and well-constructed counterarguments to my position, then you should really just stay under your bridge.

Re:Take a step back and listen to yourself

[NDPTAL85]

Do you and the long time Linux users that you know equal the Linux community at large? Do you speak for them all? Have you done extensive polling and research to see if your view is even in the majority in the Linux community?

Before I continue let me get this clear. You are not allowed to dismiss an argument or a statement simply because name-calling was used. If you can unilatterlly dictate who and who does not belong in the Linux community, then I can unilatterally dictate under what conditions you can dismiss responses to your statements.

Back to the subject. I don't see how you can say that Linux will "remain" a community. All movements evolve. The Open Source "movement" is rapidly approaching mainstream whether you like it or not. Thanks to the efforts of distro's of Mandrake and RH, folks who know jack squat about command lines are using Linux. And they have a right to expect improvements and upgrades without contributing something back. Whole corporations now rely on Linux without giving anything back. You don't DO Open Source and or Free Software in the expectation of anything in return. Thats why its "Free". Not even that madman RMS would agree with you here. Perhaps if you had the PROPER views on how developers of open source software should interact with those who simply use it.

I'll repeat if you do not understand. As a possible developer of Open Source/Free Software(I'm not sure if you are one or not) you are not allowed to be exclusive and or elitist in concerns with who else uses Linux or participates in the Linux community. Its simply not your call to make. You don't own the software. Everyone and no one does. You personally don't own it. Your LUG does not own it either.

I'd really love to know more details on what got those folks expelled from your LUG. Where they being violent? Or just demanding? Why did you not redirect their requests/demands to the proper dev mailing lists so they could talk to developers directly? What did you try to do before expelling them just so you could have your Lord of the Flies kingdom?

Re:Take a step back and listen to yourself

[gujo-odori]

Do we equal the community at large? We equal a good representative cross-section, and since my opinion is typical in my circles and since I also very commonly find people who share that opinion everywhere I go, the answer is that while I do not speak for them all, I speak for a great many. Quite possibly a majority.

WRT dismissing an argument b/c name-calling was used, I'm not dismissing it (only) because-calling was used, although since that was basically the whole content of the argument - "You're an elitist jerk!" - a case could be made for dismissal on those grounds. Mainly, however, I dismissed it because it was unsupported.

How can I say that Linux will remain a community? Because I believe it will. Despite the existence of distros like RH and MDK, Linux remains a community-driven thing, and there is no sign that this is going to stop. The community is a bit frayed at the edges, but the core is solid. If it did stop, that would spell the end of RH, MDK, and all the rest of the commercial distributors. If the greater community stopped producing and maintaining the Free Software that the distributors package up, they couldn't take on that role themselves. They do not have, and could not afford, the staff to do all of that. They'd go broke. Quickly.

Do users of MDK and RH have a right to expect upgrades without giving anything back? From their vendor, yes. At least if they actually bought the vendor's boxed set, made a donation, or bought a support contract. If they didn't, a case could be made that they don't have a right to expect anything from the vendor, either. They do not, however, have any claim on anyone whose software or documentation can be found in that distro.

As for whole corporations relying on Linux without giving anything back, there may be some. However, it is likely that they aren't taking anything, either. They have admins on staff who maintain their Linux systems for them. Gee, in fact, one of those companies pays me to do exactly that. I'm not a famous person, though, so we wont call that giving anything back. It supports me and my family, and allows me to time to do some things for free in the community. Under my direct influence, my company also paid the author of a GPLed product to write some extensions to it and release them under the GPL as part of the standard version. That was solely for our benefit, but many others have gained from that, and of course, the author did, too. Big companies like Sun and IBM and SGI have given back, too.

You were doing OK in this post, though, until you wrote:

"You don't DO Open Source and or Free Software in the expectation of anything in return. Thats why its "Free"."

Short response: Why not?

Longer response: The concept of giving back is what the entire community has been based on. If you've been around for a while, I'm sure you are quite aware of this. If you haven't, talk to some people who have. Don't take my word for it, b/c obviously you don't buy it coming from me. Ask somebody else.

The whole community has grown up on the strength of what happens when people benefit and then give back. To go back to your statement that you don['t see how I can say it will "remain" a community, in one scenario, you would be right to question that: if most people using Linux stop giving back, the community will collapse. Whether the distributors alone could sustain it in the face of that or not remains to be seen. I hope we won't have to find out.

I'm not allowed to be elitist? Ahem. Yes I am. Whether I can be elitist or not is (thank you very much for the perfect turn of phrase) simply not your call to make. It's true I don't own the software, but I don't have to help whiners, trolls, and lazy people learn it, either. Nor do I have to refrain from discouraging people who I think shouldn't be using it, for whatever reasons I think they shouldn't be using it. And let's be honest: if we both take off our sparring gloves for a minute, wouldn't you agree that there are people who (depending on how you view the problem) just shouldn't be using Linux because either they are not ready for Linux or Linux is not ready for them? There really are people who are better off with a Mac or even a Windows machine than they would be on Linux. And (sparring gloves back on) for some of those people, Linux is better off that way, too.

Oh, by the way, I do personally own anything that I create, even if it is under the GPL. Anything that's GPLed has a copyright holder. I can't prevent someone from using it, but I don't have to do anything for them, either. That's the free beer side of Free: you don't have to pay for it, and you're free to modify it as you see fit as long as you either release those modifications under the GPL or don't release them at all, but you have no *right* to support of any kind. Support for something that is free is at the sufferance of the author.

Details of what got people kicked out? Let's see:

- Repeated violations of written list policy, even after being warned;

- Not asking for help, but *demanding* it. And I don't mean even demanding it from a maintainer, but just demanding it from ordinary (if far more advanced) users like themselves. Saying, in effect, as I described before, "I'm trying out this Linux thing, therefore, you *owe* me help." A number of really great people left the LUG because they were fed up with that. Those events led to the Great Reformation. Things are much better now. They just didn't grok the concept that no one here owes you anything, but if you're civil and show initiative, many will really go the extra mile for you. I've stayed up most of the night helping people out many times. Not anyone who demanded that I do so, however. If you want to demand something from me, you have to be paying me, and even that has its limits;

- Posting questions where it was obvious that they had made no attempt at all to answer it themselves, not even a quick man page read or a Google search, then going ballistic on people (not me, if you're wondering) who politely but firmly told them to go and Read The Fine Manual, then come back and post if you still have any questions;

- Unloading on the list admins for doing their jobs;

That last may sound to you like we're some kind of awful elitists or something, but the real point of it is that we expect people to learn, and believe firmly that a major part of learning *nix is self-training. Not everyone will agree with this approach, but it's our approach and it has been successful for a great many people. Those who don't agree are quite welcome to find a forum that is more suited to their own philosophy and/or learning style. We, however, will not provide that forum.

As much as I've enjoyed this exchange, I'm going to refrain from posting further, partly because we've strayed way off the original Zaurus topic, and partly because I do have a project that I'm working on with a couple of other people and don't want to take more time away from it to do this.

Nice sparring with you,

G-O

Re:Take a step back and listen to yourself

[NDPTAL85]

Even if you don't respond I have to say this much.
I think the entire concept of Linux development as being "community based" is antiquated and no longer as accurate as it once was. People love to think that its a bunch of distributed lone hackers sitting in their own homes or basements slowly adding to and improving the source code. That may have been how it USED to be, but its not how it is anymore and will be less so in the future.

IBM employs a large number of core hackers. As does Red Hat. The remaining distros do so to a lesser extent but they do so. The one exception is Debian since its not a company, can't therefore pay anyone who works on it.

The point I'm making is that of all the Linux developers out there, those who make the contributions that matter the most, are in either direct or closely indirect employment for that exact purpose. The rest, the chaff, as you will simply don't matter. And if that chaff were to, lets say, get fed up with all the loser newbies then their departure from the community would have a negligiable effect on code production. It might even improve it since the experienced hackers wouldn't have to constantly review, examine and reject shoddy code. The Linux "movement" has been very much co-opted by corporate interests and is very much a corporate product. Just because its not the product of one corporation does not mean it isn't a corporate product in abstract. Their vested interests are too great to let it slowy evolve in its natural distributed hacker form or to be jepordized by the flighty whims of pedantic geeks. So they've basically taken its future into their own hands.

This is why I do not understand why you think that the community is being harmed by lasy demanding users. The "irritated hackers" aren't carrying the burden anymore and haven't been for sometime now in the first place so to me their complaints ring hollow. To me an anaology of this situation would be local police getting tired of having to do heavy infrantry. Well what are they tired of? Its not their responsibility! The military handles that, not the police! In order to get upset, the police/fringe hackers have placed themselves in an elevated position of worth. One they used to have but no longer do.

Zaurus In the Market

[Gallifrey]

Does anyone know how Sharp is doing selling the Zaurus? Are they selling many? (I.e. enough to keep on making it.)

Re:Zaurus In the Market

[iplayfast]

I've looked in Canada, and all the stores listed on their site which sell in Canada, DO NOT sell the Zaurus. It seems to be not available here. :(

Re:Zaurus In the Market

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't know about the SL-5500, but Sharp has a new Zaurus modle available in Japan, the SL-A300, so apparently they are being sold. The new model doesn't seem to have a built in thumbboard though. I don't think it has compact flash support either, though. Darn. Those are two of the main reasons why I got a Zaurus over the other competition, oh yeah, that and it runs Linux.

Using scripts gives you power.

[uigrad_2000]

I actually bought and used a IPAQ for awhile. The only time I'd boot my computer into Windows was so that I could sync with my PDA. For some reason, I couldn't mount it as a drive in linux. (Actually, I'm pretty sure that the reason was the immaturity of USB hard drive drivers in linux, but let's not go there!)

As nice as ActiveSync first appeared to be, I realized that it was slow because it did a million things I didn't want it to do, and yet it still wasn't as powerful as a ftp&telnet combination would be.

I'll start looking into buying a replacement PDA pretty soon (as soon as I get my finances back in order), and will definately be looking for something that has a linux backbone. And, no matter how "great" the syncing software is, I'll never install it. I'd much rather develop scripts that can transfer files from each directory as I choose, according to the rules I develop in the script.

Anything other than ftp/telnet/drive mounting is uncivilized.

Re:Using scripts gives you power.

[Anonymous Coward]

Manual drive mounting and unmounting is the most uncivilized thing in the universe. And the fact that you think the opposite screams volumes about what is wrong with Linux. It's users are all luddites.

uhmm, this is news to people?

[dr4ma]

I have had the Qtopia Desktop running for months now on my Slackware box for several months now, this is not new. Trolltech has had this available for a long time now.
Install the security app and that will allow you to setup a bit on ACL for what subnets can sync to the ipaq.

MOD GRANDPARENT FUNNY!

[starling]

I just hope the humour was intentional.

Evolution Syncing petition.

[slpyhd]

From a thread at http://zaurus.loveslinux.com ;

Hi all, asked the guys from Ximian, and they responded as follows: > Evolution uses conduits that in turn use gnome-pilot and > pilot-link. Ximian only develops the conduit layer. > > In order to devote resources to such development we would > need to know that there is demand in the user community. > Therefore, I would suggest filing a Feature Request at > bugzilla.ximian.com. > > Regards, So. Who will second that feature request if I am to file such a thing? I don't know how many of you guys are using Evolution, but I am, and I would like it to synch with the calendaring etc. If I get enough replies to this, I will consider filing the request.. Cheers, Stephan

Go sign up ! :) (I just ordered my Zaurus in the US,because it's so hard to get one in the Netherlands.)

US pricing example

[Anonymous Coward]

http://computers.cnet.com/hardware/resellers/0-270 9830-311-8407129-3.html?fl=0&tag=st.co.2709830-311 -8407129.sort.price

very ol' news...

[lems1]

this is very ol' news... who said this is new??? goodness SlashDot is becoming more and more like ... let me shutup

Call for Participants: Syncing Zaurus to Evolution

[ahaile]

I just got my Zaurus five days ago, and the inability to sync to Evolution has been bugging me, so I've decided to see if I can do anything about it with my humble coding skills. This doesn't seem to me like a hard problem, and if we can get a few people working on it (I'm volunteering my time) I think we could probably knock out something simple pretty soon. I've already spent about 8 hours coding. Here's what I'm currently thinking:

• There's no point in building a fully-featured, pluggable syncing framework (like pilot-sync and gnome-pilot, for example), because Trolltech has alread announced that the upcoming version of Qtopia (the software used on the Z) will have a new sync API, and so all we need now is a stop-gap until that software lands.
• On the Evolution side of the sync, the program should definitely talk to the Evolution libraries (wombat and camel) and not straight to the files. Going straight to the files -- like the existing partial sync utilities evolution-sync.pl and zesync -- risks corrupting some of Evolution's index files. Plus, the Evolution people have said they would be officially annoyed at anyone writing straight to those files, as they're not intended as a public API.
• For quick dev, I'm planning to use perl with a command-line UI. A GUI or a C version can come once the logic is fully working and when/if someone feels compelled enough to do it.
• There are two parts of Trolltech's software that they haven't released any specs on. One, as another poster already mentioned, is the DTD of the XML files used by Qtopia to store the PIM info. The other is the details of how the desktop lets the Zaurus know that a sync is going on. You can use ftp to transfer the files over, but you also need to tell the Qtopia apps to reload that info or they will keep chugging with the old data until restarted. Of course, this wouldn't be the first time a spec had to be reverse engineered.

To talk to the Evolution libraries from Perl we need a little PerlXS interface code. I'll probably finish the cal-client interface (addressbook and task list) tonight and start on the perl code tomorrow.

So, anyone want to help out? I'm sure there are plenty of people reading this list with a lot more talent than I. Anyone want to tackle the perlxs glue code for interfacing with camel, so that we could sync e-mail? How about to e-book for the task list? How about figuring out how Qtopia Desktop tells the Zaurus that it's syncing (I noticed there's a mysterious port 4992 open on the Z -- might be related). How about spending some time entering data and looking at the XML files produced and figuring out the DTD? Mail me -- too many people have asked for this feature, and its time to get something at least semi-functional together.

-- Adam

(Moderators: I know it's really lame to ask to be moded up, but I'd love to get some help on this. Thanks.)

Thanks for the link

[Anonymous Coward]

Hi I'm the author of the linked app (Powerchord) and I'm flattered that you liked it. I'm just pointing out that the released version is a work in progress and there are known problems with running on Opie and the Ipaq. If you would like to be told when there is a new release, drop me a mail and I'll put you on a list :) Thanks,

-Cam

camilo@mesias.co.uk

Sure

[Derkec]

Nothing against these guys whatsoever. Even seeing the post on slashdot, I probably wouldn't have associated them with anything like that if the post itself wasn't troll laden. So yes, I'm sure I've used their stuff and I mean no disrespect to them.

Doesn't Work

[PolyWog]

I downloaded this thing, and it's crap. In fact the older version (which is no longer there) works better than this one (if you can tackle dynamic libs). The zaurus in general has been the biggest waste of money for me... it doesn't work with Linux... period without patching the kernel, and even then you have to bi**ch slap this qtopia desktop which isn't "officially" supported under Linux. More BS... One would guess that linux would be the first OS supported...