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Grab A Bunk In The Dot-Com Dorm
airrage writes "According to this Washington Post article, the University of Maryland has created "dot com" like dorms complete will all the necessary executive perks: wood desks, leather chairs, wireless, whiteboards; all to encourage entrepreneurship. Apparently, it's working too. Twenty of the students have created their own start-up firms, and six are already generating revenue."
... have already started layoffs and are now filing for chapter 11.
Get Firefox!
... had the same type of ideas.
Hey, if I make money, I keep paying the rent- No money, no rent.
Tibbon
tibbon.com
I am waiting for Co-Ed Porn Dorms. There would be lighting rigs, a queen sized bed, and hot bi-sexual co-eds who will do anything for tuition money.
So how many of them are running porn sites?
There's never enough when you have too little
Only 6 out of 20 are generating revenue? Sounds like a pretty realistic dot-com environment to me.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
How many are profitable? I could generate revenue selling old paper cups to morons over the internet, but I bet I wouldn't make any money at it.
But this gives the \. readership something to strive for once they get out of high school, so I suppose it's topical.
-MondoMor
...if I recall correctly there was language in all the paperwork I signed when I went to school that said something to the effect of 'everything you do while you're attending college belongs to the college'.
Does anyone know of any possible consequenses to this type of arrangement, or if that sort of agreement is even enforcable?
"Twenty of the students have created their own start-up firms, and six are already generating revenue."
If six are generating revenue, then fourteen are a money-pit, no?
...Also, I didn't know Buggalo could fly.
On the other hand, maybe they're just playing the odds that if they throw 100 people together and provide the infrastructure and cell phones, one of them is bound to come up with enough of a marketable idea to make a bajillion dollars.
That's my purse! I don't know you! -- Bobby Hill
they got all the furniture off ebay for pennies on the dollar.
sulli
RTFJ.
Wow.. That's almost as many that were generating revenue before the burst..
Two of these students have been seen driving BMWs with stickers saying: "I burned 20 M$ in VC financing and all I got was this lousy gas-guzzler"...
Ten other students declared personal bankruptcy after failing the IPOs of their start-up, citing the lousy performance of the financial market...
And two former CS professors have seen panhandling outside the University with carboard signs saying: "will teach Java programming for food".
So what else is new? =)
(as if giving someone a leather chair was going to transform him/her overnight into a PHB with a clue... Sheesh...)
This story should be in the it's funny: laugh section.
The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
I wouldn't trust "wannabe guru" CS majors with anything. All university proves is that you were too pussy to join the real world when you should have.
1. Hire newly graduated CS students.
2. Discover Solaris has been replaced with Linux development kernel and GNOME.
3. Customers go elsewhere for professional services and products after meeting obnoxious, smelly and arrogant "techies".
4. ???
5. Profit.
What about the ownership of the individual business models or products?
At my university, all products and ideas developed on university owned equipment is property of the university. Is that to say that since the whiteboards and other "idea-inducing" workspaces and utilities are functionally provided by the university, and on university property, should they belong to the university?
Should they and will they are obviously two different questions...
When modding "Informative", please make sure it both has a source and IS actually informative.
"Venture capitalists, lawyers and serial entrepreneurs drop by weekly to impart wisdom and to mentor" If any of these "businesses" were worth a damn, the VCs would be imparting more than wisdom. But I do like the term "serial entrepreneurs", it describes these people very well.
Wood desks? Leather chairs? What the fuck for? I went to an Ivy League business school, and I currently run my own business, and I've *never* heard that in order to run a company, you have to have the best equipment. If anything, it's teaching these kids to fail. Anyone who spends this much just to *start* a business on unnecessary shit doesn't know how to cut corners on luxuries to make a new business succeed. It's impossible.
If they really want to teach these kids to run companies, they should set up an office that looks like their parent's basement, complete with folding chairs, ramen noodles for food, and a barely functioning PC. That's how real businesspeople do it. These are just some spoiled little shits who would never have the balls to start a business that isn't financed by venture capitalists (of yeah, and mommy and daddy).
This post was written in a relatively successful 4 week old store while sitting on a chair from the 1970's found in a broom closet, using an old P233, which also functions as the POS system, music player for the store, bookkeeping system, and graphic design station, in a store that was painted, lighted, and outfitted solely by the owner.
FAAAAACK. I CAN'T BELIEVE IT!!!! <bangs head on desk>
I miss:
Don't you miss that ones too?
Yours, Martin
"I have no more sympathy left for any of the dot-com ass holes. They are the reason the economy is on it's knees right now... and some people still manage to find pride in it."
Actually, I think it was all the people who believed in the '3.) ???? 4.) Profit!!' business model and invested in it that caused the economic slowdown.
It's a neat idea. Traditionally, college students who create viable businesses in their dorms have done so in spite of their surroundings. This project sounds like a way to give students an environment and a set of expectations that's conducive to starting up a business.
For that matter, most people outside of college can and should upgrade their surroundings in ways that would boost productivity. One post-college insight I've gotten is the huge difference in the working environments that successful people choose to set up for themselves. Good chairs and whiteboards should be seen as a necessity, not a luxury.
One potential pitfall of this venture, not mentioned in the article, is how U of M is going to avoid potential liabilities and lawsuits arising from student startups that go sour. The average failed startup has nothing left to sue, whereas a state university has deep pockets for disgruntled investors.
I'm generally "Interesting," "Insightful," and even "Funny" here. What the hell happens to me at parties?
...not to mention that kind of money, I would've startrf a real business. Not another bullshit dot-com that's built around *synergy*. I probably would've gotten a few used ovens to put in there, run down to the grocery store to get the basics started, and print out a shitload of flyers to put around campus announcing my new pizza business. THAT'S a *real* business. These kids are just playing make believe. I doubt that any of 'em have ever worked a day in their priviledged little lives.
I went to an Ivy League business school, and I currently run my own business
OK, so you went to an ivy league business school, own a free porn site, AND a pet store?
And now your pet store knowledge taught you all of this?
-1 Troll.
How may of the 6 that have posted profits have lied about their bookkeeping? :)
--
That's a hoax/scam/virus and your friend is a moron.
When modding "Informative", please make sure it both has a source and IS actually informative.
What are they doing, selling camcorder movies and Mp3s CDs?
sounds counterproductive to me. They are supposed to start a business and go to school. I had a business when I was in school. Guess which activity took up most of my time? It wasn't school.
I wonder if the students can start any kind of business. What if their company policies clash with the school's policies? This would include nuddie sites, adult toy sales and companies the dedicated themselves to spaming college students. Can the school draw the line somewhere?
NO! NO! Please don't mod me, I'm too young to die a troll. *click* Oh the pain, the pain...
Of course it would be an even number 'generating revenue'.
Probably they teach students about inflating revenue by 'round tripping' in their freshman year these days!
old idea, been working here in finland for atleast n+1 years... the worlds first mobile operator was born there...
http://www.innopoli.fi/english/background.htm
Am I a shareholder if they get financial aid from the US gov or MD?
How about they just fork over a nice chair? I could use something like that.
To be considered for the Hinman program, students must have a 3.0 grade-point average ...
Umm, it's been my experience that the folks with the real drive have shitty GPA's, because they want to spend all their time and energy on their other projects. Perhaps they should say, "To be considered for the Hinman program, students may not have more than a 3.0 grade-point average." =)
....better be making a nice amount of cash just to break even with the building they are housed in costing over 14 million.
This reminds me of the school that Richie Rich attended in the film of same-name. Wow, I can't believe I just admitted watching that.
Generally it is all classwork that belongs to the University, not _all_ IP. Anything that you did with their labs, their equipment, etc.
Not to mention most dorms aren't really associated with the school for other legal reasons. When I went to school, the dorms weren't even technically on state property, and run by some management company. This allowed for strict rules in the dorms that the university could pretend to not be able to do anything about, among other things. I wonder where this leaves these entrepreneuers.
You'd have to read the fine print on several different contracts, and not only the ones you signed, but the dorm with the university, etc.
This guy looks like he is the slacker of this group:
:-)
story here
So if you spend $500 (to be even) at Staples, you can become a successful entrepenuer? Silly me -- I thought business skills were involved.
Has anyone else noticed this sort of 'stratification' of the student housing on various campuses? Here at ISU they're building a lot of these 'student sweets' that cost more then regular dorms. I think its kind of sad, as one of the most interesting things about collage life is that for the most part its a true meritocracy, and you get to meet people from all different walks of life and social backgrounds (and, once you get out you're all mostly on the same playing field, depending on how well you did :P)
Now we add these stratifications, and... I donno it just seems wrong and in the least unnecessary.
---
Anyway, a more specific comment about this dorm. All I can say is 'belch' The business world will be soul sucking enough when I get out of collage. To me collage is supposed to be about learning and academia. Not about becoming the next money grubbing enronite. The whole 'money money money gimmy gimmy gimmy' culture is just so repulsive. I mean, I understand the desire for money, I do. I really do like money... (hell, just look at my sig : P). But this thing sounds like it's a breading ground for the kinds of people who put money above everything else, including the value to society. Lots of people would love to stifle innovation and humanity for profits (just look at the RIAA, Enron's roll in the California energy crisis, Microsoft, etc)
I guess I wish more people would try to think more of their impact on society rather then how much money they make. You can make a lot of money while making the world a better place (i.e. google, as a simple example) but the two things are not intrinsically bound.
I think this school should be more worried about teaching it's business students humanity rather then trying to shove them off into the dog-eat-dog world as soon as possible.
Lonely?
Find love on the internet
The one thing the article failed to address was the nature of the businesses. The Maryland side of DC tends to specialize in Genomics and biotechnology, while the Virginia suburbs do the more traditional e-commerce things (odd how geographic differences spring up in virtual/tech businesses, but that's a different post). Given the massive start up costs of most biotech ventures, the fact that 6 are generating revenue may not be at all bad. But to me, the most interesting thing about this (as a Maryland grad), is the idea that taking smart students, putting them in swank digs, is somehow going to generate a better mouse trap. Whether the end product is a genome sequencer, a great work of literature, or the next great super-virus, colleges and universities seem to love chucking money at rather small groups of students in the hope of producing something special. Does it work? I don't know that it doesn't, but I can think of other projects that I think might have a better chance of success. Lastly, I think the article's description of the dorm rooms was a bit misleading. It made them sound like the students are given all the creature comforts as well as the necessary technical and business tools. But it actually doesn't sound all that different from any of the newer dorm rooms at U of M College Park -- they are all actually pretty nice -- with a few extra mechanical and technical gadgets. Just a few thoughts.
When I rad "Dot-Com Dorm" first thing that popped into my mind was a dorm where they placed all the students destined to flunk out... my bad
I'm only paranoid because everyone is against me...
Because its never too early to learn the best ways of running a company into the ground with useless spending.
Monkeys have been known to put together a nice piece of work when given a typewriter. Doesn't change the fact that they're still monkeys.
+1 Insightful, -1 Troll. What can I say, I'm an Insightful Troll.
you own a free porn site, AND a pet store?
Actually, it's conceivable that both of those are part of the same business venture.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
Venture capitalists, lawyers and serial entrepreneurs drop by weekly to impart wisdom and to mentor.
... hey! Come back!
Woo hoo! The dotcom glory days are back!
Listen, I've got this great idea about selling pet food over the internet! It's gonna be the next big thing. All I need is $200m in start-up capital and
Universities don't own the ideas that students come up with on their own, outside of class, only things that you need to turn into the school. For example, a project you wrote for class could be sold by the school, but something you wrote in your dorm room in your spare time would be yours.
Lonely?
Find love on the internet
Once you change this aspect of the equation, the Ivy League business education suddenly makes all the sense in the world...
Obliteracy: Words with explosions
Only worked for a while. But who would have anticipated Microsoft writing less buggy software then their competitors?
Lonely?
Find love on the internet
"I'm gonna party like it is 1999" takes on a whole new meaning.
Interociter
-=What do I want? I'm an American. I want more.
oops, got a little too vanilla there for a second
"Old man yells at systemd"
Instead of pushing this money grabbing mentality, why don't they make the students master the fundamental educational tenants first before putting them in the "Grow-a-Dell" incubator.
Hey, Im lucky I even get a door to my damn room. Ugh. Such perks are a CrAzY idea for Wichita State!
The ultimate network admin tool needs HELP!
Obviously. Everyone knows that the three-stage version of that plan is more efficient.
There's a BIG difference between REVENUE and PROFIT. Toys.com had revenue. Pets.com had revenue. Amazon.com has had LOTS of revenue, but it took Amazon years to make a profit.
Northwestern University has a similar program in my town that has been running for years.
http://www.researchpark.com/
The 'business incubator' provides low rent and cheap internet access, as well as a community of other start ups.
Other privileges of living in South Campus Commons include monthy inspections by the RAs (yes, you do pay money to a private company to live under Resident Life rules -- even though we are technically "off campus" housing). It's not uncommon for the hot water to go out for days at a time, frequently with no notice.
And the kicker? The lease that I signed forbade running a business from my room. In other words, unless they modified the lease for these Hinman CEOs, they're all in violation.
We *definitely* do not live in spaces that would ever be confused with executive furnishings.
- Wood desks (to hold the extra-large pizzas)
- Leather chairs (for when the bed is taken)
- Wireless (for when your head is in the toilet)
- Whiteboards (for hanging women's underwear)
Yup, that would encourage me.TodayTM BillyJoelTM GoogleTMd for StitchTMes due to WindowsTM while RollerbladeTMing with an AppleTM and a PopsicleTM
Thank god. I thought that meant if I had children while at University, the college would own my offspring and could sell them into White Slavery. ...but at least it would save me on alimony. So it wouldn't be all bad.
I think the symbol of the dot-com is the Aeron chair. When these companies started to go belly up, and auction off all their assets, Aeron chair were the common factor.
Anyone else notice the body text is missing from people's comments, and several headlines?
Before modding this as "Redundant", consider my plight: I can't see the bodies of the other messages!
out of the 6 that are profitable, 5 of them are cooking up the books to make it look like they are making a profit, and 1 runs an adult website.
timothy: learn to write properly would ya.
"six are already generating revenue"
Yeah, but what about profit??...
They could run the business into the ground with expenses, sell a cup of lemonade on the corner, and consider themselves "generating revenue"...
"Truth is not decided by majority vote" consensus gentium -- Norman Geisler
I have a wooden desk AND a leather chair. Where's my startup? I want to get rich quick too!
Maybe I need a Dell with a LCD monitor...hmmm..
How is the bankruptcy agent going to save these champion scholars?
LIST OF ASSETS:
1) coffee mug
2) cold coffee in mug
3) pretty-boy haircut
4) roomate's dentist
5) earthquakes
hi, I like pancakes -.-- -.-- --..
I agree 100%. Whatever happened to pure research? It seems as though tertiary education these days is all about applying learning to make the quickest and biggest buck possible. Unless your scholarship/discovery has some sort of immediately-apparent commercial potential, most universities don't seem to be too interested in it (unless, of course, they have one of those "work for hire" type IP clauses where all your IP you develop there belongs to them).
Which is probably why most "innovations" these days don't seem to be anything radically new. They seem to be "better, faster, smaller, cheaper, smarter" versions of the same old stuff. Without research for the sake of research, we wouldn't have 99% of the "older" technology we take for granted.
Hmm, I seem to be repeating myself, to the tune of "Professionalism to excess is a bad thing." Whatever happened to having fun, anyway? Since when did our culture start glorifying the workaholic as the ultimate hero-figure anyway? I thought university was supposed to be for learning, playing, getting radicalized, pushing the boundaries, and other such similar things. University is short. Working life is long...oh, boy, is it long. I think people should enjoy it while they can. Anyway, starting my own business in a "business incubator dorm" doesn't sound like my idea of a good time -- or a good education.
I'm not a geek, I'm just a clever script.
Sounds more like the government
picking and choosing "winners".
BTW, where are the Americans in this?
I wonder if that title was intentional humor or a fruedian slip, as in:
"Sleeping room? No problem. There is plenty of bunk, I mean bunks in the dot-com department."
Table-ized A.I.
How in the world are old-money interests going to retain control over all of the new-economy ventures if new ventures have the ability to start up without old-money funds? This is a blow to our old-money controlled capitalist-worshipping way of life and must be stopped as soon as possible! Someone call Dubya and have him send in the BATF after these commie hippies!
Maybe the state's highest function is to grind out insoluble problems. (Zelazny, Hall of Mirrors)
Irrational exuberance related to earnings projections based on nonuniform purchasing patterns leading up to the Y2K hype machine caused the economic downturn.
To simplify:
Every idiot believed what they read instead of researching and determining for themselves the reason(s) the economy was on such an insane upward turn (history is a great indicator).
This is why in addition to my MIS degree I doubled in Finance. No point in having money if you don't know what the hell to do with it. I was expecting this since 1998 (and as a result was questioning the hell out of my forcasting until the summer of 2001!). You can still make money in the stock market, you just need to buy companies instead of stocks (see Warren Buffet methodology).
I am a Computer Science student at the University of Waterloo. I am just getting involved in the beginnings of a company (technology related if you must know, but not a dot com). People involved are from London, Waterloo, Toronto, and elsewhere. As far as places to meet, my residence is out of the question because it is too small, and does not offer the conveniences that these students are offered. If I had access to a board-room style table with whiteboards and conferencing equipment, and all for free, then I would have a much better setup to host meetings.
I see everyone here bashing this article, but it is actually quite an interesting program. Don't forget that aside from the material perks, you are also required to live in this dorm for 1/2 of your school career, so you will be around the same group of LIKE-MINDED ENTREPRENEURIAL people. This is a huge benefit, as half of the job of 'networking' is already done for you.
The reason Santa is so jolly is that he knows where all the bad girls live.
Here in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, the universisty I went to set up a similar program, named Instituto Genesis (Genesis Institute). You can check their web site in portuguese for more info.
The success rate is high, with graduate companies making good profit. A coincidence (or not) I work at one of those companies, and we are doing very well. The initial support given by the program was a very nice push.
I'm not a "real entrepreneur" at least by your definition, but it's worth mentioning that the cost of having comfortable and reliable office equipment is downright cheap. I'm not arguing for $900 leather chairs (especially since I'm vegan; ) but these days, the cost of equiping an office appropriately amounts to maybe a thousand bucks. I've got a great computer worth no more than $750, a super comfortable chair from Staples for $90, plus some other odds and ends. The bottom line is it helps my productivity and I don't feel like hell at the end of the day. Yeah, I suppose I could do my work on a folding chair and a 486 I scrounged from the Salvation Army, but why? My time and comfort is worth something, particularly when it can now be bought so cheaply.
If U of Md wants to spend a bit of money so these students have a great working environment, that's terrific. It's a super-cheap investment, which amounts to a tiny gamble. Now, let's see if it pays off.
I'm generally "Interesting," "Insightful," and even "Funny" here. What the hell happens to me at parties?
It appears that the idiots who dreamed up dumb dot-com ideas have retreated to the education field. I was wondering what happened to them all.
Do they get an expensive trenchcoat to throw over their heads when the Feds come to take them away because the SEC found they were involved in insider trading?
--Storm
And the rest of UMD gets: Slow Internet Access in Residence Halls:
We are aware that Internet access in the Residence Halls has been extremely slow for many of you this semester and apologize for the inconvenience. We are investigating various methods of improving the performance of your data connections.
And by "slow", they mean 2k/s downloads, and 1k/s uploads. Oh, if only I had my 28.8 back...
""you own a free porn site, AND a pet store?""
"Actually, it's conceivable that both of those are part of the same business venture."
There's that Vulcan sense of humor we're all so fond of here on slashdot.
-- "Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
If they really want to teach these kids to run companies, they should set up an office that looks like their parent's basement, complete with folding chairs, ramen noodles for food, and a barely functioning PC. That's how real businesspeople do it.
Actually, that's not how many businesspeople do it. If you want to hold interviews, interface with a customer, and do anything besides be a little code monkey, the nice surroundings and furniture will help. Would you trust the guy in raggedy clothes with a three-legged desk or the one in a sharp suit and an oak table? The former might be a better coder, but only the latter could sell code to an end customer.
Sure, many businesses do get started with little to work from, starting with only the capital in the founder's pockets. But a business is a hell of a lot more likely to be successful when the owner has a proper place to file things, have meetings, and talk to customers.
The point being that a successful entrepreneurial startup is greatly facilitated by using OPM - other peoples' money (the best kind). If you can get your potential customers to help fund you, then you stand a much better chance of having them actually buy your product/service when you're ready.
But, since not everyone pays tuition, you could argue that some of them might already be using OPM :)
FWIW (and there's a lot of education bashing on ./), the above information was relayed in a Wharton MBA class. So let the negative karma commence.
My school gave me a wooden desk. Plywood, sure, but still :P
Well, it was in my dorm room anyway, I guess they didn't really give it to me.
And yeah, these kids are pussies. I say let the company make enough money to afford the leather chairs and nice desks before it gets 'em : P
Also your porn site sucks.
Lonely?
Find love on the internet
Sure, but what if you try to use a hotplate?
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
> six are already generating revenue.
They're called "Porn n' Chicken."
Not a product in sight. If any of these people where to actually be bright enough to deal in actual "see, order, touch, own" products -- then would not the money better be spent on shipping, distribution, collections, customer service. I think that was the whole problem with the .com bust -- all sorts of tools (leather chairs, compuers, ping pong tables) and no tangible product. In the end the consumer spends money on the same things they have always spent money on. Technology can only offer different avenues for shopping for and ordering product. All the technology and VC in the world is not going to replace air with product.
(+1 Funny) only if I laugh out loud.
For the lovely co-eds of UMD, All rooms will be furnished with lovely reclining chairs, and padded carpeting
There are really two classes of achievers. One is the one whose driven to bear the fruits of their mind. The other is driven to do the best he can at whatever task they are put to. That second class will have high GPAs, the first will have GPAs that are lower then what they could have if they worked harder.
I would say that most innovation comes from the first class, but that a lot of success and wealth is generated by the second class (often times by exploiting the first class, but hey)
Lonely?
Find love on the internet
I think I can answer some of the questions you guys have about the program, I was interviewed by the reporter and a current participant of the program.
Question: Who owns the IP of the products and company?
Answer: The students and their supporting professor (if any) own the IP. The program has special arrangements with the university to leave the companies formed in Hinman as independent entities. If such an arrangement didn't exist, the program would not be here today. In fact, we even have servers that use the university's bandwidth. The School of Engineering and School of Business have been incredibly supportive of the program and we have the Deans' full backing. So if any companies become successful the only thing they expect is for us to donate back to the school. However, this is not true for non-Hinman students or if the technology used by the company was researched by a professor on the university's dime.
Q: Why the 3.0 GPA requirement?
A: While the application does say 3.0, the director has made many special exceptions for driven students. I myself had a 2.9 GPA when I enter the program (I'm a CompSci, so sue me). It's mearly there to scare off people that only want to join the program to take advantage of the extra nice housing.
Q: Where's all the money getting spent? Why buy all the nice furniture?
A: Because we often have very prominent CEOs and corporate execs giving speaches, it's important that we appear professional. For example, we've had the CEO of Webmethods, Polycomm, Microstrategy, and a host of many other local and national CEOs swing by for talks. We also use the conference rooms as shared conference space for client meetings. If you think about it, one very nice conference room split among 6 companies is pretty cost effective.
Q: Porn companies? ;)
A: No. Not yet
Q: What kind of technologies do you guys have? :)
Any more questions?
A: The first and 2nd floors of the apartments have full wireless access and all rooms have access to IP-phones donated by Avaya. We also have tele-conferencing units donated by Brian Hinman. On top of that, we have a 5 computer tech lab that's accessible to all Hinman students. The computers are brand spankin' new Dells all with flat planel monitors. The sys admins had to put screen guards on the damn things to keep the business majors from poking at the screen.
and six are already generating revenue.
"that's not encryption - it's a new perl script that I'm working on..." - from some Matrix parody
I just graduated with a Comp. Sci. Engineering degree, and I know for sure the best ideas and best knowledge that I obtained in the 4yrs was through talkin with 'the guys' in my dorm. In class, you learn specifics....In the dorm, you learn life application. (dealing with other people on a project, coordinating programming tasks, documentation planning).
I think it was a great idea for them to do that, as long as they make sure their not just sponsoring someones lush living for a year, and make sure that these 'e-businesses' are genuine, and full of ingenuity.
I know that if I had that type of environment, and had the time to do so, It would have been a GREAT experience...especially for new graduates to put on their resume.
Usually with new college graduates, all they have on their resume are classes, and any internships theyve done. If they have experience with a 'start-up' type business with responsibility....it would be a great asset to their education.
Firstly, Amazon is not presently in the black. They are in the red and by a large margin. They managed to pull themselves into the black for a tune for 5m or so one quarter. However, that sounds to me to be more like an accounting slight of hand than anything else (mind you, that is chump change when you look at the size of their reported revenues...it doesn't take much). Secondly, there is very little net equity left in the company because they've loaded themselves with debt in the process. Thirdly, just because a company is nominally profitable (and they're not) does not mean that they are a "real" business. It simply means that they _might_ have the ability to continue operating in the future. When many millions of dollars are invested into a company you expect a hell of a lot more than a trickle of profits. In short, I still would not invest in Amazon.com, especially not at its current 7b dollar market cap.
That said, I do believe there are "real" internet businesses, but Amazon is just not one of them.
I would have happily signed up for such a unique opportunity. :)
GJC
Gregory Casamento
## Chief Maintainer for GNUstep
"Twenty of the students have created their own start-up firms, and six are already generating revenue."
And two of them even carry fat chick porn!
Cheers,
Bowie J. Poag
i ran a computer repair shop in highschool, round certain times of the year, i got so busy, i didn't even bother with school. still doing computer work, just in the savannah area. Simontek
SimonTek
King-size bed, not queen, you dope! :)
...the fact that you'll force the business guys, engineers and tech dudes to hang out and live together, which may just breed a bit more understanding between the different groups: I mean imagine a business grad who appreciates the subtleties of letting the techs make the technical decisions and techs who understand that the business guys aren't completely clueless and do (usually) have reasons for the decisions they make.
Elgon
" dyke1: so whatche in for?
dyke2: i had steamy sex with one of my horny high-school bi-curious student bimbos, who subsequently ratted me out after i gave her a C on a shitty paper.
dyke1: ow. that's harsh.
dyke2: you?
dyke1: dildo fetish.
dyke2: *blink*. i guess i'm headed for deathrow.
dyke1: *nod*. you shoulda stayed in california
"
Extraordinary Vacations. Exceptional Prices
He comes from Vega the brightest star in the constellation Lyra.
-Linux is SO fast it does an infinite loop in 5 seconds.
On the other hand, creating good stuff is a low-margin business. In San Francisco, this is more like a fun hobby. I know a number of women who operate their own porno/erotica sites, but none of them are making big money. One, who knows all the major pro dommes in San Francisco, and does domination herself, tried a "fetish portal", but it's not making any money. (But she throws great parties.) Another is into "extreme bondage", and does make some money with her site. I know two photographers into glamour porno, one male and one female. The woman moved to L.A., the market wasn't there in SF. The guy had a good gallery opening last Friday, but nobody seemed to be buying.
And then there's the blonde with the all-girl biker gang. She makes some extra cash selling calendars, but despite national TV and press coverage of her gang, it hasn't been a huge moneymaker.
None of these people have been able to quit their day jobs.
According to the article, students can now learn the first-hand techniques on how to run a successful business, such as: creating snow-job Powerpoint presentations; stealing public grant money for private profit; and commercializing technology developed at public expense. Yes, they'll learn how to create artificial wants, get people dependent upon them, then yank the supply, jack up the prices, and call the police to enforce their newly created markets. They'll learn these strategies in specially created CEO dorms, fitted with leather seats and oak desks to reinforce the culture of an exclusionary class of manipulators and scammers. After being submersed in this PHB boot camp, they'll have developed all the essential traits necessary to succeed in the cut-throat world of business that they will help perpetuate: a narcissistic over-confidence in their own abilities to funnel money and power to the top of the grand pyramid scam--all the while knowing that they are intrinsically better than everyone else and basically the world owes them. Thus is created the modern day PHB. Capitalism Uber Alles.
Wasn't there a time in the dim past when colleges taught theory, fundamentals, and basic skills that could be applied in almost any field. College was about learning how to learn and use information, not about teaching specific careers and such. I hate to see all these resources being spent to accomodate a few students who want to start companies. I think economics and communication skills classes would be better investments in their futures.
Stop the Slashdot Effect! Don't read the articles!
They might try to sue the students for $5,000 because they are making a profit and want some of that too.
Hmmm, I have 5 mod pts, its time to metamod, and on top of that I have to meta-metamod? When do I get to read slashdot?
-_-_-
There are 0x40000000 types of people: those who understand 32-bit IEEE 754 floating point, and those who don't.
What?! You mean all this time I thought college was supposed to be about popping antacids like candy, futilely attempting to score with tons of chicks, and skipping sleep to catch up on schoolwork from that wild 3 hour lecture the night before, and it wasn't?! Man, I sure wasted the past 8 years!
Freedom: "I won't!"
At my university, they once had a guest speaker talk to the engineering students about the advantages of starting your own business. Two friends and I did just that, and it did quite well.
So well, in fact, that shortly thereafter we all dropped out.
Hacking Las Vegas A group of mathematicians from MIT jacked millions out of Vegas... Good article.
Small potatoes make the steak look bigger.
and i didn't need a whiteboard, a leather chair or a nice desk.
perhaps they should -qualify- the scale of startup we're talking about here. they could be cutting lawns - and would that have anything to do with their digs?
// "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
To bad you're not smart enough to know how to use a bank, dumbass.
But I guess we'll see if you're ability to spell, punctuate, and use correct grammar beats out my ability to use tools like "student loans" and "sepulchering software" (btw, there is nothing wrong with my grammar, and little with my punctuation. AFAIK)
I've also held down a part time job making $21/hr, as a which easily would have covered my education expenses. (as a VB programmer for the Student Loan company, ironically)
If you're an American (I'm assuming you are) the only reason not to get a university is general stupidity.
But congratulations on your grammar.
Lonely?
Find love on the internet
A new dot com era starting in school. Guys, let me suggest AT LEAST business 101. This will put you miles ahead of your forerunners.
Fundamentals... like the difference between "tenets" and "tenants?"
But 20 of 20 are generating a loss...
Hrm, one post gets -1, and a reply that says "I agree 100%" gets a 3.
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It dosn't really seem like much of a troll to me, either.
Certanly not worth a -1.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
For upperclassmen, and especially grad students, running a business could be a valuable experience.
An interesting project for a school would be to have a sort of business that gets passed along to students taken a particular course. Like Biz 146 is lower management Biz 246 is middle management and 346 is upper management.
It would probably lose a lot of money, but if the leaders or whatever we elected you might get some interesting and smart characters.
Well, I think it would be interesting, anyway.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
You can't GPL code you down own, wether you wrote it or not.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
if he made a few k, he should have got his own hosting.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
own a free porn site, AND a pet store
I think you mean free porn site AND a pet store.
After throwing the money down the pit for two years, do you have an empty hole, or a pit full of money?
:P
I certainly wouldn't mind a pit full of money
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
It's a damn good thing that an "Ivy League" business school taught you how to put a site together to teach people how to masturbate online. Commendable. And oh so different from the rest of the Linux losers that spend their days trashing others to put themselves above their otherwise dull and pointless existence.
I'm in the Hinman program, currently seated in my dorm - issue pressed wood desk and barely padded chair, in front of my ancient computer, working 2 jobs with 19 credits, and running a business. And it's not some sheisty online porn site.
Good to know that us "spoiled little shits" will grow up to be self-inflated huge shits like you when we enter the "relatively successful" business world. Thanks for the pearls of wisdom, swine.
Stop being so bitter about the lack of opportunity you had when you were young, and rejoice in the opportunities handed out to your younger counterparts. Perhaps your startup will be a little more than just "relatively" successful if you would be more openminded.
2x if we were girls.
For some reason this reminds me of the startup.com movie. The best part of that movie was when the guys were trying to secure an angel investor and before they had signed a deal, they were in a taxi cab talking about taking the company public. The economny has no room for people looking for get rich quick schemes - which seems to be what this program is encouraging.
I'm in the Hinman CEO's program myself. I'm not a dot-com business; not like your nasty porno site you have going. You think we're playing make-believe? I'm not the one trying to make a living with porn...and I'm not the one thinking that I have the right to bash a program I don't know about and kids that I can't hold a candle to in my past-my-prime age. Our students are engineers who are inventing medical instruments; trying to make the world a better place...News flash - creating a porno site makes you the scum of society; and the fact that you're so proud of that and present that as your life's work makes me understand why your bitterness drives you to attack faceless state college kids from your supposedly "ivy league" throne. We are working our fingers to the bone to EARN the priviledges. We're not handed any money; the "space" you so freely speak of without prior knowledge is an 8 by 8 room that we pay $600 for per month. And you have one point - I would actually probably be using Mom and Dad's money if I hadn't won a free ride here with a scholarship that I worked for with sweat and blood. We're not handed a silver spoon, we WORK. I'm in awe of my peers here in this program who work so hard and accomplish so much. You know nothing. Go ahead and stew in your ignorance and bitterness; when you wonder why you're not successful in the business world, realize that it takes a positive vision to really make it. Not the negativity that you so freely spew about a topic that you know nothing about.
but he seems to have understood both Newtonian and libniz's (sp?) notation perfectly as well.
(Or more then likely he meant he learned it all from lectures or something. Personally I think he just had an easy-ass class)
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
I have no more sympathy left for any of the dot-com a** holes. They are the reason the economy is on it's knees right now...
Actually, it's Worldcom's fault. B-)
The Internet was supposed to have a doubling time that amounted to growing at a factor of 10 per year. Turns out this was a myth. But it was a very believable myth. Even up to a week before the myth was exposed as false, well respected people (such as a certain Stanford professor) were promulgating it, in both media stories and learned papers.
Well, it turns out that, for about two years, the internet's traffic WAS growing at a factor of ten per year. This was just after it was opened to general exploitation, and was probably the result of pent-up demand.
But that was about 7 years to 5 years in the past. After that it slowed down to about a factor of two per year. (At least for the next three years, until the dot-com collapse. Last I looked the nubmers weren't all in for the following period, and maybe it was a bit lower.)
Now doubling every year is still phenomonal growth. (Beats Moore's Law by a bunch.) But it's still a shortfall from what was expected by a factor of five per year.
Well the network equipment manufacturers designed and built for the factor-of-ten. And the dot-com companies built business models based on the factor-of-ten. And then the demand failed to materialize. By the time of the dot-com collapse the shortfall was a factor of 625.
Now some of those dot-coms were crooks milking venture capitalists and 401(k) plans. And some of them had business models that amounted to "lose a little on each sale and make it back on the volume", or "if you build it they will buy". But don't you think that SOME of them might have been viable businesses IF their market was as big as they thought - 625 times what it really was - and doubling every hundred-ish days?
And by now the shortfall is about a factor of five THOUSAND from what people were building for. Any bets on why there's a telecom/internet equipment manufacturer collapse?
Now all this apparently happened because Worldcom's UUNET subsidiary was cooking their books. They kept saying that the net was growing at this mythological factor of ten - but what was ACTUALLY behind the stat (if anything at all) was an expansion of capacity, not traffic.
Much like saying "We built enough storm drains this year to handle ten times the water as we could handle last year. We'd better build ten times as many this year, or we'll be flooded when the rains come".
Unfortunately, nobody checked their numbers. (They were the biggest backbone - by their own numbers B-) - so they REALLY ought to know...) Other companies that weren't keeping up with the mythological growth rate blamed their sales operations rather than questioning the numbers.
Eventually the real numbers finally came to light as a result of the investigation of Worldcom's other accounting "innovations". B-)
So that's why I say that it's all Worldcom's fault.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
Puns are little "plays on words" that a certain breed of person loves to
spring on you and then look at you in a certain self-satisfied way to
indicate that he thinks that you must think that he is by far the cleverest
person on Earth now that Benjamin Franklin is dead, when in fact what you
are thinking is that if this person ever ends up in a lifeboat, the other
passengers will hurl him overboard by the end of the first day even if they
have plenty of food and water.
-- Dave Barry, "Why Humor is Funny"
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