Slashdot Mirror
Self-Destructing DVD's Coming Soon
BrianH writes "Looks like a close cousin of everybody's favorite self-destructing video format is making a comeback. Four years after Circuit City and its Hollywood backers pulled the plug on the self-expiring DVD concept, FlexPlay Technologies has introduced the EZ-D...a 48-hour self-expiring DVD disk. The difference? This time around you don't need a special player, and "time extensions" are no longer an option. It looks like Buena Vista has already signed on to the format, so Disney, Mirimax, and all of their other companies should be using this soon. As if that wasn't bad enough, it looks like this works for music and software disks too!" Here's an older story on these technologies.
Also great for those messages that just need to self destruct. Kind of reminds me of Inspector Gadget. I'll get you next time gadget! NEXT TIME!
I'm assuming the disc reacts with gasses in the air, so all you have to do to get unlimited viewing time is keep the dvd in a vacuum, nothing major.
Is this really a problem for people who have access to DeCSS and a DVD burner?
It doesn't take 48 hours to rip a DVD. ;)
Now I don't have to return the DVDs after I rent them to rip and encode. Thanks MPAA!
... and then I'm sure they'll cry victim when everybody starts copying the damn things and starts giving them all out to their friends because you can't get a permanent copy of the work.
I'll tell ya, the first thing I would do with such a thing is to back it up. Or better yet, I would just return it after it expires and tell them that it never worked right in the first place. It's not like they could prove otherwise.
Inspired by HP and its printer cartriges and now Flexplay, Ford has decided to make its cars cease to function after 60,000 miles or 10 years, whichever comes first. A press release says that "this will ultimately help consumers, as older cars just aren't as safe - for the driver or others on the road." When the time runs out, strong chemicals will be released to distroy most of the cars internal components. Disabling this protection will result in prosecution under the DMCA
The solution is scavenger robots, that search for used-up dvds =)
"Hey give that back! I was using that as a coaster! GNggghhhh!!"
If you can't manage to get the vobs off of there and create yourself a longer lasting copy in 48 hours you probably don't deserve anymore stolen movies IMO. At the very least you lose your honorary "Pirate" title.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Shouldn't all copies of The Hot Chick be destroyed after 48 hours?
I just wasted your mod points! HA!
Somebody tell me again how this reduces the impulse to bootleg? They might as well just sell the nicely-printed cover art, and let people get the bits from their friends, or wherever. (Maybe they can get AOL to send them out.)
Like any technology it will have a a certain % failure, what will the rental place do if you come back before 48 hours with a dead disk?
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
I know what else just expired: My willingness to plunk down my hard earned money supporting the music and movie industries.
Freedom Is Universal
Linux-Universe
Obviously, nobody is going to pay full price for a DVD that self destructs. This is meant as a rental replacement. However, something like this could put rental places out of business.
Why? Rental places typically buy a certian number of new copies and rent them out repeatedly, after a few rentals the disc is paid for and it is pure profit on the disc after that, especially when you factor in the real money maker, late fees. When the movie is no longer a hot rental, they'll then just sell off their excess copies as pre-owned DVDs.
With the self destructing DVD, rental places will continuously have to replace their stock. They will not be able to charge late fees, nor will they be able to sell excess copies they've already made money off of. Ultimately, the rental place will no longer even be necessary since you'll likely be able to buy the destructable disc at any retail outlet or direct from the company for $2 a pop.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
Capitalism at its best means that we consumers have the ability to reject this stupid idea and cause it to fail....
Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
Gotta love it.
"The first thing I will do is make an illegal copy, then I will return it and ask for my money back by lying and saying that it never worked."
I'm no angel, but what ever happened to ethics? Are we now so numb to piracy that stealing and lying are considered the "first thing" one would do?
Am I the only one who thinks there is something just a little cracked in the general conscience?
-sk
This is just a cheap excuse to avoid digital distribution. Downloading the movies would be cooler, and more enviro.
It seems the polution comments are not getting modded up. Why? How many billions of these things are going to be produced? Where does plastic come from for the most part (hint - we just had a war over this stuff)? And recycling? Just how easy is it separate the thin metal film from the plastic? Besides that, if these things are reactive to air - the article mentions that they begin to expire as soon as their opened - that would suggest some sort of strong plastic/foil packaging.
Scrap the crap - just put it up for download.
What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
So, I oblige. *Inserts DVD into DVD-R*
I don't call it ripping...I call it saving lives, one movie at a time.
No really. If it's a software thing, shouldn't be too hard. If it's physical, like reacting to a catalyst, there is most likely some way to treat the discs so that they will remain usable longer...
If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.
Duh...I want DVD...two dollah at checkout register...works once...what a bargain!
More disposable crap to fill up the landfills with. I'm sure glad our kids are going to have to solve the problem of a throwaway society.
I guess it'd be too much to ask them to make the discs out of something degradeable or to include a mailer for recycling - but instead, they place the burden on the consumer to recycle the discs by asking us to mail the discs in off our own volition. Something I'm sure we all have time to do.
In other words, these discs will NEVER get recycled.
Seriously, as the alpha-geek crowd, we should do our part to dissuade everyone we know from even thinking of buying these.
I would do a refund thing: charge 8 bucks for the disc, and give 5 bucks for the emptied disc. This would more than encourage recycling, yet keeping the low cost.
This is my digital signature. 10011011001
How long is it going to take for companies like this to realize it? turn-around traffic is way too important to rental stores for disposable media to work. IIRC, Blockbuster claimed that a full 1/3 of their rental business comes from turn-arounds.
For those unfamiliar with the term, it refers to a customer returning one video and renting another, usually on impulse, in the same visit to the store. Obviously, if there's no returns, there's fewer opportunities to visit the store. Thus, fewer rentals, impulse or planned. Needless to say, that's a Bad Thing when rentals are your business. And how much of an impact is a constant flow of disposal DVDs going to have on inventory management?
It was a loser with Circuit City DIVX. Earlier generations of self-destructing media were losers. No matter how much they improve the materials, it won't stop being a loser until they can make up for the lost traffic at Blockbuster and Hollywood.
This sig intentionally left blank.
Well...it works for the MPAA and RIAA. I guess the "consumers" are catching up. ;-)
Speaking as someone more than 30 miles from the nearest "good" rental shop, I really hope this catches on.
Nope, I'm baffled by how acceptable theft has become. I know the big media companies are bad and want to restrict our rights, but that does not justify consuming their product and not paying for it.
The attitude of "if I can get away with it then I should do it" seems to be everywhere.
[Set Cain on fire and steal his lute.]
This comes out just after I finished installing a dvd player to watch in my hyperbaric chamber.
Glad I don't own a rental store, this could be the end of the business.
Hey.. if they want to blow another $100 million to try it again, go ahead. I personally would have figured it out the first time, but that's just me.
-Restil
Play with my webcams and lights here
Depending on what gas in the air causes the reaction, it's probably the oxygen or nitrogen.
If the reactant is oxygen or nitrogen just place the dvd player in an open box with a piece of dry ice or another source of CO2. The CO2 is heaver than air so if you don't disturb it, the CO2 will stay in the box. If it's not O2 or N, bolt the box to the ceiling and fill it with helium.
Submerge the disc in an oxygen-poor environment. Someone already noted nitrogen. Possibly water (I guess it depends on the chemical reaction), oxygen gas is O-O, water is H-O-H, depending on the chemical they use it may not react with the oxygen in the water. Watch DVD, submerge in tupperware DVD holder until next viewing cycle :)
h arpie.
:)
CD/DVD layer cleaners. Those Dr. Fixit things that clean scratched CD's. The chemical has to be exposed to oxygen, why can't you just scratch off the opaqueness? Kind of a reverse write-over-the-copy-protection-on-the-CD-with-a-s
Least cost-effective: Open the DVD in a vacuum and put it in it's player, in a vacuum.
Seriously though, unless these are recycleable, I hope they fail miserably. What a huge waste of resources. More crap to throw away. What irresponsibility. What happened to ethics? Corporate responsibility? I guess you save some gas not having to return them tho. It better be cheaper than renting, cuz I live a quarter mile from a blockbuster. I don't mind renting and returning every once in a while.
More chemistry to think about: Is it the oxygen that bonds to the disc that makes the disc opaque? Or does it bind and pull whatever off the disc causing it to be unreadable, kind of like an oxygen wash? Would another chemical binding cause the disc to not be opaque and never fail? I'm no chemist, I only have a rudimentary understanding of the underlying forces. Your thoughts?
-- Having a Creationist Museum is like having an Atheist place of worship
Would be samples of games for various systems. If they can get / keep the price down low enough (say under $5), this might work. See a new game for you PS2/XBox/GameCube/PC, but aren't sure you'll enjoy it enough to warrant dropping $40+? By the trial disk. You now have 48hrs to try the game. Probably wouldn't work as well / at all for the PC, as all I need to do is copy the disk, and then find a no-CD crack for it, and I never need to buy it, but might work for the consoles. However, for movies? No way. I thought DivX (the Circuit City one) blew chunks, and am glad it died a (fairly) quick death. Unless you either sell me these disks for under $2, OR give me a VERY large discount AT THE REGISTER when I buy a non-expiring copy of the same movie, I would not buy ANYTHING in this format. As I said, NO mail-in rebate crap, as I would not want to wait 3-4 months for a rebate. Jason A.
Do you see the FNORDS? I refuse to post anonymously, as I am fireproof!
And this is definitely a COMPELLING solution. The way I see it, every product should self destruct after 48 hours. Bought a computer? Well, a $2,000 computer should be the first thing to self destruct after 48 hours. The warranty card would read, "This warranty expires 47 hours and 59 minutes and 59 seconds and 999 milliseconds after you make up your mind to buy a computer, and not even this particular one!"
Bought a new car? They should attach explosives all over the car... don't worry, 48 hours after leaving the dealership, a buzzing sound will alert you and your passengers that you must exit the vehicle, and then the car will drive itself under automated control to a safe part of the desert before exploding. And yes, you still have to pay off the financing for the new vehicle. In fact, dealers will be extra innovative in this respect: You'll simply subscribe to receive a new car every 48 hours and your bank account will simply be debited for the $25,000 or whatever the MSRP is for each occasion. If you don't have that amount of money at the bank, the dealer will provide an alley for you to prostitute yourself in order to earn the money. In fact, it will become federal LAW that you MUST prostitute yourself in order to pay for self-destructing products, as it is the God given right of multinational corporations to enjoy eternal perpetually increasing profits, and it will simultaneously be illegal to prostutute yourself, thus putting you in a situation that you will go to jail no matter what you do, and you will have to subscribe to a new "eMafia" protection service to avoid such arrest. It will obviously be illegal to bypass any devices that make the car blow up after 48 hours, and if you do so, you'll get more time in jail than a murderer or a rapist. In fact, to make the justice system more balanced in light of today's enormous piracy problems, murder charges and rape charges will be reduced to misdemeanors, because those crimes aren't all that bad, but if you God-forbid copy an album so you can perform the horrendous crime against humanity, a thousand times worse than any genocide this world has ever seen, the criminal act of listening to an album that you paid 20 bucks for... you should be beaten nearly to death but simultaneously kept alive, and tortured, and made to suffer the worst of all sufferings of the world combined and then some, because you are the dirtiest, slimiest, shittiest, more horrible criminal this world has ever seen, and shame on you.
Oh yeah... Houses will be made to self destruct in 60 hours, to compensate for the fact that you need to move your belongings in before they self destruct.
Christ. Trust a geek to come up with a plan for bolting a helium-filled DVD-playing box to the ceiling to avoid the ELEVEN DOLLARS a brand-new DVD costs. Or are we doing this because we can? Slashdot makes me laugh sometimes.
"If he thinks he can hide and run from the United States and our allies, he's sorely mistaken." Bush on bin Laden
>This is designed to be similar to a video shop transaction.
Okay, lets assume this isn't a hamfisted attempt to push DRM down the throat of Joe Sixpack. While all these useless DVD discs pile up in the local landfill, someone out there is getting a pizza delivered.
I wonder what's best for the long-run? A peapod-like video store or 48-hour DVDs? You still have to drive out to the store to buy the DVD in the first place.
Also, video stores makes a lot, if not most of, their money off late fees. I wouldn't expect these things to be that much cheaper than the offerings at your local video store.
Also, where exactly is the market for this? People too lazy to goto the video store AND who also don't have pay-per-view AND don't want to subscribe to NetFlix? Yeah right, I'm sure these 800 people are going to love DRM-DVD.
It should be interesting to see how these effect the storage market and the film industry. Imagine a game that requires a CD that expires in 48 hours.
..
Hmm.. When I first read that, I misinterpreted your mention of the "film industry" to mean they'd use this as a plot point.
NEXT SUMMER.. IT'S JAMES BOND.. IN A RACE AGAINST TIME!
[M] James Bond, we need you to get this DVD to a scientist held prisoner in a North Korean jail!
[James Bond] Sounds too easy. What's the catch?
[M] You only have 48 hours-- before the DVD's copy-protection makes it disintegrate!
And of course james bond slams the dvd into the north korean prisoner's imac with 5 seconds left before the disk oxidizes or whatever, after which we get to see a tense moment while COPYING FILE appears on screen and a progress bar tries to outrun the dying DVD while the seconds tick down... will it be copied in time?
Find out, in
007: JAMES SCREWS SOME CHICKS AND THINGS BLOW UP
[[ This film is not yet rated ]]
Irritable, left-wing and possibly humorous bumper stickers and t-shirts
Can't speak for the 799 others, but I'd like this. If I could pick up a 48-hour DVD for a few bucks, that'd be a good deal to me. I don't have pay-per-view, I hate making two trips to Blockbuster for a single movie, and Netflix is a bad deal unless you rent at least four or five movies a month. There just aren't that many movies I'd like to see. Plus, since you don't need to have a rental system in place, they could stick these things anywhere: 7-11, grocery stores, Wal-Mart...all places I usually go anyway. I'd love to be able to pick up an occasional movie "rental" when I stop for gas or groceries, without having to worry about returning it by such-and-such a date. It's like DivX without the expensive equipment, the invasive privacy issues, or the hassle. Pretty cool stuff, actually.
And what's with all the yelling about DRM? I hate overly-restrictive DRM as much as anyone, but how is an essentially normal DVD that just stops playing after 48 hours any worse than a normal DVD that you have to give back to Blockbuster tomorrow? DivX, with all its nonstandard technology, "activation" crap, etc. was ugly. But this EZ-D thing you can play in any DVD player, there's no one tracking what you're doing with it...what's the big deal? It's not like these are going to replace real DVDs in the market. This technology is made to target renters, not buyers...
DennyK
This could be a great rental-fee saver for my friends and I.
If I unseal the movie and watch it in 3 hours, it still has 45 hours of life left. I can then pass it on to someone else to watch because, unlike regular rentals, I don't have to trust them to return it.
I have a feeling video stores are not going to like this. Or do they get the majority of their money from people without friends?
- mib
Damn! If only there existed some sort of device that would copy a DVD in less than 48 hours, a so-called 'DVD-copier'. May thee rot in the depths of technological hell, Flexplay Corporation and your cursed, foolproof technology.
I think there is a world market for maybe five personal web logs.
It worked with DivX. The reason that failed
was that MOST people avoided it. If you ever
see a product you want that is only available
in this new EZ-D format, contact the company
and tell them that you are not only not buying
it, but that you will not buy any of their
other products either, until they stop using
that system. When enough of us do that, they
will have a simple choice; stop using the
system and have out money, or continue to use
that system and NOT have our money. I believe
that like DivX, they will choose our money...
This sounds great! Just imagine, no more late pornos! Don't you just hate it when you've got your S.O. at the rental place and they ask for a late fee on "Lesbo Love Fest #69"
Seriously, does anyone think that some little startup has so completely exhausted the realm of human knowledge in proving there are no countermeasures? I doubt it.
There's nothing like 5 billion people looking for a Something-for-Nothing win to subvert a concept like this.
Everyone seems to be interested in the chemistry behind this, but the article posted here does not go in-depth about this, which has lead to many misunderstandments.
We will never know what happens exactly, as this will obviously be a trade secret. I will buy a DVD like this as soon as they are available, even though I don't have a player for it. Just to see the effects of changing the environment in which the DVD is kept, and see if it slows down or speeds up the process.
Let's summarize:
There are two technologies, SpectraDisc and Flexplay.
Both Flexplay and SpectraDisc add a chemical time bomb to DVDs that begins ticking once the package is open and the discs are exposed to air.
SpectraDisc applies an outer chemical layer to the disc that begins evaporating and changing in color as the expiration time nears.
Flexplay integrates its chemicals into the inner layers of the disc.
SpectraDisc DVDs turn blue. Flexplay discs also turn darker, becoming so opaque that the laser inside a DVD player no longer can read the disc. Eventually, the laser beam is not reflected anymore, because the disc has become too dark.
Spectra Science won't say exactly how its technology works, just that the chemical reaction is similar to how litmus paper works. Once the disc is put in the player and is hit by the DVD laser, it starts a process that eventually turns the disc blue, and blocks the DVD player's ability to read the disc.
SpectraDisc's self-destructing DVDs can be reused if a new coat of the play-limiting chemicals is reapplied. Apply those chemicals, and your DVD works again.
Flexplay's discs can only be broken down and recycled as plastic waste. Without opening the Flexplay package, the DVD will become unreadable after a year. Which means the reaction also occurs in the wrapping, although a lot slower.
None of these technologies disable the possibility to be copied. A DVD can be ripped in about half an hour, and no technology is built in to stop you from doing that. But you can also copy a rented VHS. In fact, this is renting, it's just that "giving it back" is replaced by "making it unreadable", which has the same result: you once had a working copy, and a bit later, you don't.
Take a look at the following US Patents: 6537635 and 6511728. My best guess is that their first gen disc uses the Silver/Aluminum redox effect. This is dead easy to block, and, moreover, is reversible. This stuff could be a lot of fun to play with. (p.s., the full text of the patents is available on the US PTO database- use any search engine to get the URL)
A lot of people are speculating that exposure to air is what will cause these disks to cease working. My hypothesis would be an exposure to light.
.02
After being exposed to light, the disk then takes approximately 48 hours for the chemical agent to cure. It's probably some derivative of silver nitrate (used in photographs) and will opaque the disk, and the laser will then be unable to read it.
Just my
Yup, as others have posted, here is a list of things that this would be useful for.
Seems like a good idea to me. Just make sure they don't degrade until you open the package and it's OK with me.
This won't kill the regular DVD's that are for sale.
Not so great for video games as you generally want more time then 48 hours. But I don't rent games to play to win. I rent to try it out before I buy it. If it sucks, I don't buy a copy. If I find I really like the game I buy it. There's a whole lot of crappola PS2 titles out there so I've been burned before and I don't have time to read all the reviews and keep up on the latest one hit wonder game title. I also don't have 48 hours to play the game non-stop, I have a job and girlfriend so that's out.