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GTK+ TTY Port
An anonymous reader writes: "FootNotes is reporting about what might be the coolest thing since textmode Quake: a curses-based GTK-2.0 port called Cursed GTK. This not only makes it possible to give Gnome the look and feel of Contiki, but also brings many real opportunities, such as remote logins where X forwarding is not possible, or remote logins over very slow modem lines. Screenshots here, here, here and here! Patches for bugs are welcomed by the authors."
Well, it did happen. And now the world can see what kind of childish and immature mentality they are dealing with when it comes to the open sores script kiddies of the world. It surely seems to backup SCO's claims: After all, these kids probably do think stealing code is "ok", just like stealing music is "ok".
first post utdallas represent faggots
gathers GAY NIGGERS from all over America and abroad for one common goal - being GAY NIGGERS.
Are you GAY ?
Are you a NIGGER ?
Are you a GAY NIGGER ?
If you answered "Yes" to any of the above questions, then GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) might be exactly what you've been looking for!
Join GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) today, and enjoy all the benefits of being a full-time GNAA member.
GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) is the fastest-growing GAY NIGGER community with THOUSANDS of members all over United States of America. You, too, can be a part of GNAA if you join today!
Why not? It's quick and easy - only 3 simple steps!
First, you have to obtain a copy of GAY NIGGERS FROM OUTER SPACE THE MOVIE and watch it.
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Talk to one of the ops or any of the other members in the channel to sign up today!
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If you have mod points and would like to support GNAA, please moderate this post up.
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G_____________________________________naann_______ ________G
N_____________________________nnnaa__nanaaa_______ ________A
A____________________aanana__nannaa_nna_an________ ________Y
A_____________annna_nnnnnan_aan_aa__na__aa________ ________*
G____________nnaana_nnn__nn_aa__nn__na_anaann_MERI CA______N
N___________ana__nn_an___an_aa_anaaannnanaa_______ ________I
A___________aa__ana_nn___nn_nnnnaa___ana__________ ________G
A__________nna__an__na___nn__nnn___SSOCIATION_of__ ________G
G__________ana_naa__an___nnn______________________ ________E
N__________ananan___nn___aan_IGGER________________ ________R
A__________nnna____naa____________________________ ________S
A________nnaa_____anan____________________________ ________*
G________anaannana________________________________ ________A
N________ananaannn_AY_____________________________ ________S
A________ana____nn_________IRC-EFNET-#GNAA________ ________S
A_______nn_____na_________________________________ ________O
*_______aaaan_____________________________________ ________C
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x box rox0rs
oohyeahbitches
Can I put my schlong in your titty port?
FUKKA YOU you are the sons of a mother fucker all of you. I will kill all of your babies and you will fucking burn shitfaces.
How I'm supposed to run gimp with this thing?
Wasn't a similar thing with Qt an April fools joke a few months back?
Wow, they moderate down a GNAA post but leave this garbage?
Typical moderator stupidity.
dear reader the gnome armageddon has started,
first of all i want to clarify that this text was meant to be a source of information otherwise i wouldn't have spent so much time into writing it. belive me it took me a couple of days writing this text in a foreign language. even if you don't care at all for gnome, you may find some interesting information within this text that you like to read. please try to understand my points even if it's hard sometimes, otherwise you wake up one day and feel the need to switch to a different operating system.
on the following lines i'm trying to give you a little insight of the gnome community. the things that are going on in the back, the information that could be worth talking and thinking about.
many of us like the gnome desktop and some of us were following it since the beginning. gnome is a promising project because it's mostly written in C, easy to use, configurable and therefore fits perfectly into the philosophy of u*nix. only to name some of its advantages.
unfortunately these advantages changed with the recently new released version of gnome. the core development team somehow got the idea of targeting gnome to a complete different direction of users. the so called corporate desktop user. in other words they're targeting people that aren't familiar or experienced with desktop environments. usually business oriented people who are willing to pay money for getting gnome on their computers.
having this new target in mind, the core development team mostly under contract by companies like redhat, ximian and sun decided to simplify the desktop as much as even possible by removing all its flexibility in favor of an easy clean simple interface to not confuse their new possible customers. so far the idea of a clean easy to use desktop is honourable.
some of the new ideas, features and implementations such as gconf, an evil windows registry like system, new ordering of buttons and dialogs, the removal of 90%-95% of all visible preferences from the control center and applications, the new direction that gnome leads and the attitude of the core development team made a lot of users really unhappy. these are only a couple of examples and the list can easily be expanded but for now this is enough. now let me try to get deeper into these aspects.
you may imagine that users got really frustrated because their beloved gnome desktop matured into something they didn't want. during the time, the frustration of a not less amount of people increased. more, more and more emails arrived on the gnome mailinglists where users tried to explain their concerns, frustrations and the leading target of GNOME.
but the core development team of gnome don't give a damn about what their users are thinking or wanting and most of the time they come up with their standard purl. the reply they give is mostly the same. users should either go and 'file a bug' at bugzilla or the user mails are being turned so far that at the end they sound like being trolls or the user feedback is simply not wanted. whatever happens the answers aren't really satisfying for the user. even constructive feedback isn't appreciated.
if you gonna think about this for a minute then things gonna harden that they are directing into the commercial area. the core development team actually don't care fo
You have all the menus and mouse support built into the GUI already, and you can get a thin client to do remote logins for cheap.
Why, except for a pathetic fetish for obsolete technology, would you want to use a text-based interface to your X-Server?
You are all weirdos.
You forgot to mention how great this will be for slow computers with low ram. I can't wait to try this out on my P1!
The Television Wiki
Wow.
Here I was thinking that it was utterly impossible to make the GTK file dialogue worse than it already was.
Zemljanka, I bow before you in humility!
WOOO WOOO
I realize this is all about geekiness factor, but how do they handle these :
:-)
- Widget alignments when whatever widgets you align don't fall exactly on their equivalent ascii places?
- GDK pixmaps : do they use AAlib to render them?
Alright, I'm off to recompile X-Chat. If it actually turns out good in ascii, nobody will be able to give me crap on IRC because I don't use 1337 BitchX
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
I won't have to bring up X to edit photos in the Gimp!
Karma: Marginal (mostly due to the border around the website)
The screenshots look awful like the good old Turbo Pascal (circa 1990 or so) text-mode GUI library. Which was a fine library, at least IMHO. However, does the word, ahem, "creative" mean anything anymore?
gnaa reccomends anuses cheeses
Using the combined toolkit allows most users to seemlessly integrate the two often opposed processes -- including SMP and multithreading support native to the frame buffer and GART API.
Wow, being able to do remote-desktop over slow connections sounds cool, I'm having a lot of trouble using vnc over modem to fix mom's pc every time :P
The IT section color scheme sucks.
Wow, they moderate down a GNAA post but leave this garbage?
Typical moderator stupidity.
Instead of fixing stuff like the file dialog, split pane in nautilus, fixing file roller, proper gamma correction when scanning, you write crap like this!
Get it through your heads already, the commandline was designed for FREAKING TELETYPES back in the 1970's, not the 2003 Computer.
When Long horn comes out in 05, you geeks will get the shafting up the ass linux deserves, and GTK will still have that crappy dialog.
Remote logins in the absense of an X server have been possible forever. This novelty hack did not bring many real opportunities as the submitter claimed it did.
-- Fighting mediocrity one bad post at a time.
Even better, I wrote aavga2 to run Quake2 on aalib!
Now that Gtk+ is moving to TTY as well, maybe I can get rid of X entirely? *grin*
Hardware, software, and blinking lights!
Back in the minicomputer days, WordPerfect corporation created a reasonable port of WP onto the VAX/VMS environment. It supported a number of terminals, many of which were text-only.
Mind you, this was in the days of DOS WordPerfect dominance, WPWin was relatively new.
But the coolest thing was graphics mode for non-graphics terminals. They abused the font download capabilities of the VT220-series terminals that were the standard for the day to create 'mosaics'. Decent pictures of bitmaps could be created. I could recognize B&W bitmaps pretty well. Lousy for pr0n, but good enough that a letter-writing system we set up had recognizable signatures.
Design for Use, not Construction!
Joe can suck my dick.
For a character base port of javax/swing...
a rva1.png
see charva: http://www.pitman.co.za/projects/charva/
screenshot: http://www.pitman.co.za/projects/charva/images/ch
this was not written by the core gtk/gnome hackers who are indeed working on everything you mention (unlink your uselss whiney ass which has dont nothing for noone) you uselessly worn out blood encrusted old tampon
I just submitted this story, and it was rejected. I would think that any Bill bashing was wanted here.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/957595.asp?0si=-
Borland had something like this in their DOS-based IDEs (Borland C++, Turbo Pascal, etc) back in the 80s.
Very cool for the time, supported dragging, resizing, iconifying windows, even pseudo 3-D buttons and "shadows" underneath windows.
-- Samir Gupta, Ph. D. Head, New Technology Research Group, Nintendo Co. Ltd., Kyoto, Japan.
It has the same miserable file selector dialog as the X11 version! Won't those monkeys ever realize what a barrier to adoption that thing is? It was behind the times they moment they wrote it.
This was actually an April Fools some time ago, but with QT.
Dont you people have something better to do, like make the Linux X-Windows desktop UI something less than hidesouly ugly and un-usable? Also, why do I get signal 11 in the kernel all the time? How about fixing that?? Please??
In this screenshot... http://zemljanka.sourceforge.net/cursed/screenshot s/najdi_rozdily.png
I couldn't tell which was the real X/GTK based file selector dialog and which was the GTK/curses based file selector dialog.
<carson>Golfswingafterjoke</carson>
1992 called, and they want their GUI back!
you just repeated the comment you read on footnotes, wanker. nice karmawhoring.
Well, for the hack value I suppose.
However, the utility of non-command oriented text interfaces is pretty well established. There is, of course, the venerable curses; pretty sophisticated non command text interfaces were the norm on MS-DOS in the pre-windows days. These often featured mouse input, which combined with text display is enough for a wide variety of applications. Don't know if this GTK supports mouse inputs. From the screenshots I'd guess not which somewhat limits its utility.
As an example of a non-command oriented text interface in common use today, look no farther than your BIOS setup program.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
This looks like VNC that's been merged with screen. screen was a great text-based virtual login back in the day, and is still useful when latency is too high for VNC. However, it's still a pain to use. :)
With GTK++ TTY mode, you could have a virtual text-based desktop capable of controlling (via mouse) any thing you'd want without opening many virtual screens.
but this is fucking sick. Stop it. Go fight world hunger or something.
Care about electronic freedom? Consider donating to the EFF!
The gtk filedialog has tab completion. Hasn't seen that in Longdick yet.
Am I the only one who think it looks like Xtree gold on DOS?
Rus
Cheap UK and US VPS
Now I can have a text mode file dialog that loses my default file name too.
Alex, I'll take keybindings not used by Emacs for $400....
this will make system maintenance across ssh so much easier for chumps who don't know how to use CLI commands.
:)
hell, even I'd use it
The reason girls and Windows users don't understand UNIX is because all the documentation is in Man files.
it doesn't look nearly as good as xtg in DOS. Not as fast, either.
I am currently working on porting GTK to the Apple II. It even runs gnome (at 512x384 black and white). Once I've finished the port, I will release it, but for now, enjoy some screen shots.
Screen shot 1
Screenshot 2
Screenshot 3.
It's interesting that once the flashy grapics is stripped away, today's user interface looks (and functions?) basically the same as yesterdays. Perhaps much of what we call 'advances in user interface' is just eye candy, or am I being deceived by appearances?
this is very handy, alhough I wonder how well it scales beyond 25x80...
this could also be very useful as a standalone X-less toolkit (a la Qt Embedded). RedHat (and some other distros) could really use a cleaner console widget toolkit... The one they use now (for system tools, etc) works like crap.
OTOH, I wonder what kind of resources it uses.
hmmm might have to try this out.
--- sig moved for great justice.
That link to contiki had some really cool screenshots, but they were for C64 only. Does anyone know if there's something like this for windows?
NOOOOOO!!! I thought we were rid of the generic ascii text!!!
I'll admit, maybe in specialized circumstances, but man there has to be a better way than this in 95% of the cases.
This isn't going to be of much use unless app developers of common gtk apps actually test it - it may work fine for the Gtk demo app but (speaking from experience as a developer at a mid-size company that ships a GTK UI) real GTK apps often abuse GTK to get around window manager incompatibilities, resize and widget placement restrictions, etc., and developers, OSS or otherwise, aren't going to verify that their crazy hacks actually work on the TTY port. This is exactly why the Windows GTK port sucks in real life even though in theory it should work just like GTK on X.
What the crafriggiap are you talking about? You just spouted a bunch of nonsense! Nonsense troll! SMP has nothing to do with frame buffer has nothing to do with GART API (what the crap??) has nothing to do with GTK+ has nothing to do with ncurses!
Move along folks. This one's just plain pathetic.
A solution to the problem with music today
>Important note: Patches are welcome! Bugreports without patches send directly to /dev/null :)
What's the deal with that? If you find a bug, and you can't write code, they don't even want to know the bug exists?
I used WP5.1+ for VMS for several years. Being on a campus of only vt100 terms made us do all kinds of interesting things to get The Job done.
yadda
...when gtk 2.4 comes out with a new file selecter? how sad it will be when you can't repeat the same old tired bullshit over and over and over and over and over and over and over an.......
I am currently working on porting GTK to the Commordore 64. It even runs gnom. Once I've finished the port, I will release it, but for now, enjoy some screen shots.
Running on a dual head display.
Running in high resoultion mode with extra memory modules.
Loopback support..
choking it down everyday like you do.
1) Start ...
2)
3) Profit !
Sorry.
I recall a Usenix presentation on something similar (either for vanilla X or or one of the early toolkits), mapping a window system's graphics calls to text. This was back in the day when lots of businesses were still being run off dumb terminals.
I love it.
I actualy like the GTK+ file selector. it's very powerfull, and I like that it makes traversing the direcotry tree easy. Apple liked it enough to steal it and pretty it up in Aqua, so I don't know why people gripe about it.
That which is done from love exists beyond good and evil
TUI is very useful to write system utilites which needn't graphics at all.
It was called TurboVision. A user-maintained fork still exists and has been ported to various platforms and compilers including gcc and Linux.
Its key difference from the text-based GTK+ is that it was a text-based library only. There was no graphical implementation of the same API.
On a serious note, is it GPM sensitive?
Less is more !
So are the godawful color schemes intentional or not?
It is official; Linux Magazine has now confirmed: GTK+ is dying
One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered GTK+ community when IDC confirmed that GTK+ market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all desktops. Coming on the heels of a recent Linux Journal survey which plainly states that GTK+ has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. GTK+ is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent comprehensive programming test.
You don't need to be a Kreskin to predict GTK+'s future. The hand writing is on the wall: GTK+ faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for GTK+ because GTK+ is dying. Things are looking very bad for GTK+. As many of us are already aware, GTK+ continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.
GNOME is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time GNOME developers Havoc Pennington and Owen Taylor only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: GNOME is dying.
Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.
XFCE leader Olivier Fourdan states that there are 7000 users of XFCE. How many users of ROX are there? Let's see. The number of XFCE versus ROX posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 ROX users. Nautilus posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of XFCE posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of Nautilus. A recent article put GNOME at about 80 percent of the GTK+ market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 GTK+ users. This is consistent with the number of GNOME Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Sun, abysmal sales and so on, Eazel went out of business and was taken over by Ximian who sell another troubled Toolkit. Now Ximian is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major surveys show that GTK+ has steadily declined in market share. GTK+ is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If GTK+ is to survive at all it will be among Toolkit dilettante dabblers. GTK+ continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, GTK+ is dead.
Fact: GTK+ is dying
It's in XP. Probably 2k as well.
It is official; Linux Magazine has now confirmed: GTK+ is dying
One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered GTK+ community when IDC confirmed that GTK+ market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all desktops. Coming on the heels of a recent Linux Journal survey which plainly states that GTK+ has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. GTK+ is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent comprehensive programming test.
You don't need to be a Kreskin to predict GTK+'s future. The hand writing is on the wall: GTK+ faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for GTK+ because GTK+ is dying. Things are looking very bad for GTK+. As many of us are already aware, GTK+ continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.
GNOME is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time GNOME developers Havoc Pennington and Owen Taylor only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: GNOME is dying.
Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.
XFCE leader Olivier Fourdan states that there are 7000 users of XFCE. How many users of ROX are there? Let's see. The number of XFCE versus ROX posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 ROX users. Nautilus posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of XFCE posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of Nautilus. A recent article put GNOME at about 80 percent of the GTK+ market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 GTK+ users. This is consistent with the number of GNOME Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Sun, abysmal sales and so on, Eazel went out of business and was taken over by Ximian who sell another troubled Toolkit. Now Ximian is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major surveys show that GTK+ has steadily declined in market share. GTK+ is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If GTK+ is to survive at all it will be among Toolkit dilettante dabblers. GTK+ continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, GTK+ is dead.
Fact: GTK+ is dying
Here is the thing---
The CLI is generally designed around scripting and system administration for professionals. The GUI tends to focus around general productivity and interactivity.
This still had limited power for many things, but it still has many uses and may help make administrating a Linux system easier for the beginner.
LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
Forget GIMP, I want GNOME for TTY!
The only real stumbling block is, how do you draw a "gnome foot" with only text?
Now would the wxWindows GTK port link with this? If so then I could bring all my wxWindows apps to terminal access... that would actually be quite usefull, all those little utils I wrote from any system I control...
Just a sec, I have a text terminal that I was working on a few days back... I suddenly have an urge to redouble my efforts on that. Heh.
And for those who are complaining about how this is a total waste of time, and this person could have been more productive elsewise: You didn't pay them to do this, and your money would not pay them if they were, eg..., fixing the file dialog as many complained about.
This is one of the nice things about coding open source: If you want to, you can try to code it. It can be totally useless, but that is not a reason to stop trying. Usefullness is not a deciding factor for everyone out there.
Anyway...
On Arrakis: early worm gets the bird. Magister mundi sum!
It is official; Linux Magazine has now confirmed: GTK+ is dying
One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered GTK+ community when IDC confirmed that GTK+ market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all desktops. Coming on the heels of a recent Linux Journal survey which plainly states that GTK+ has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. GTK+ is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent comprehensive programming test.
You don't need to be a Kreskin to predict GTK+'s future. The hand writing is on the wall: GTK+ faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for GTK+ because GTK+ is dying. Things are looking very bad for GTK+. As many of us are already aware, GTK+ continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.
GNOME is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time GNOME developers Havoc Pennington and Owen Taylor only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: GNOME is dying.
Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.
XFCE leader Olivier Fourdan states that there are 7000 users of XFCE. How many users of ROX are there? Let's see. The number of XFCE versus ROX posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 ROX users. Nautilus posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of XFCE posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of Nautilus. A recent article put GNOME at about 80 percent of the GTK+ market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 GTK+ users. This is consistent with the number of GNOME Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Sun, abysmal sales and so on, Eazel went out of business and was taken over by Ximian who sell another troubled Toolkit. Now Ximian is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major surveys show that GTK+ has steadily declined in market share. GTK+ is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If GTK+ is to survive at all it will be among Toolkit dilettante dabblers. GTK+ continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, GTK+ is dead.
Fact: GTK+ is dying
Is that former Triumph guitarist Rik Emmet on the desktop wallpaper?
It is official; Linux Magazine has now confirmed: GTK+ is dying
One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered GTK+ community when IDC confirmed that GTK+ market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all desktops. Coming on the heels of a recent Linux Journal survey which plainly states that GTK+ has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. GTK+ is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent comprehensive programming test.
You don't need to be a Kreskin to predict GTK+'s future. The hand writing is on the wall: GTK+ faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for GTK+ because GTK+ is dying. Things are looking very bad for GTK+. As many of us are already aware, GTK+ continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.
GNOME is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time GNOME developers Havoc Pennington and Owen Taylor only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: GNOME is dying.
Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.
XFCE leader Olivier Fourdan states that there are 7000 users of XFCE. How many users of ROX are there? Let's see. The number of XFCE versus ROX posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 ROX users. Nautilus posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of XFCE posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of Nautilus. A recent article put GNOME at about 80 percent of the GTK+ market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 GTK+ users. This is consistent with the number of GNOME Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Sun, abysmal sales and so on, Eazel went out of business and was taken over by Ximian who sell another troubled Toolkit. Now Ximian is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major surveys show that GTK+ has steadily declined in market share. GTK+ is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If GTK+ is to survive at all it will be among Toolkit dilettante dabblers. GTK+ continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, GTK+ is dead.
Fact: GTK+ is dying
Does it support themes? :)
but also brings many real opportunities, such as remote logins where X forwarding is not possible, or remote logins over very slow modem lines.
"They say travel broadens the mind, so I went over the falls in a barrel." -Thomas Dolby
It is official; Linux Magazine has now confirmed: GTK+ is dying
One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered GTK+ community when IDC confirmed that GTK+ market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all desktops. Coming on the heels of a recent Linux Journal survey which plainly states that GTK+ has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. GTK+ is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent comprehensive programming test.
You don't need to be a Kreskin to predict GTK+'s future. The hand writing is on the wall: GTK+ faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for GTK+ because GTK+ is dying. Things are looking very bad for GTK+. As many of us are already aware, GTK+ continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.
GNOME is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time GNOME developers Havoc Pennington and Owen Taylor only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: GNOME is dying.
Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.
XFCE leader Olivier Fourdan states that there are 7000 users of XFCE. How many users of ROX are there? Let's see. The number of XFCE versus ROX posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 ROX users. Nautilus posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of XFCE posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of Nautilus. A recent article put GNOME at about 80 percent of the GTK+ market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 GTK+ users. This is consistent with the number of GNOME Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Sun, abysmal sales and so on, Eazel went out of business and was taken over by Ximian who sell another troubled Toolkit. Now Ximian is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major surveys show that GTK+ has steadily declined in market share. GTK+ is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If GTK+ is to survive at all it will be among Toolkit dilettante dabblers. GTK+ continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, GTK+ is dead.
Fact: GTK+ is dying
hahah, so, Sun + Novell standardizing on gnome/gtk means its dieing? hahaha, riiiiight
I wonder if it works with wxWindows and
in particular with wxPythonGTK which I'm into
these days. If so it would be pretty cool to
have the same application work on MS Windows, regular GTK and TTY GTK.
Man I miss the ASCII days :) I used to hack at Maximus, Gecho, and Frontdoor to get my system to look really cool over a modem before the internet came along and changed things. Though it was interesting to see some of my friends try to exist in the same manner through TCPIP instead of a dialup session to someones computer. I rather just moved on to HTML and did cool things there though I never got as serious about it as I was with BBS software when I was a kid.
_ /
OOO( )
O ---,
(
\ L/)
---
or maybe something a little simpler, like:
G
A lot of people are making jokes and comments about the GTK+ open/save file dialog. However funny, they also bring back a very big question I have had.
Has there been any efforts of replacing it ? Is there code/patches/whatever I can get ahold of to do just that ?
Because, seriously, the dialog drives me fucking nuts. Someone mentioned losing the default file name in another post, etc. This isn't whining, or flamebait, it truly gets in the way of me doing work on my machines.
Any info is appreciated, but if you're gonna reply with praises about it or demands of knowing every little problem people have with it, then try to realize that there is a reason why so many people have issues with it.
N.
The obvious way to do a GNOME foot with only text is to try to draw a G with an umlaut sign over it (U+0047 U+0308), but because character-cell terminals generally don't support many composed characters, the GNOME port will probably use alternate text like [GNOME].
Will I retire or break 10K?
Hey... I've never really heard of this aalib stuff before, and I followed a bunch of links to a site for MPlayer, and it was playing DVD's in ascii...
Is there any players for win32 that will play using the aalib codec?? I would love to see this in action, but don't have linux installed on my laptop!
Help??
Does this thing nest? Can I run a gnome terminal window inside it, and then run gtk+ in that terminal?
I find this exciting for quite a specific reason: cut and paste within the comand line. I like to run framebuffer rather than X because my machine is quite old (k6 with 256MB) and I still don't think X has evolved to be command-key friendly enough yet (although the recent releases of gnome are very close). When I use my computer, it tends to be an exercise in managing multiple command lines rather than running any windowy applications beyond firebird.
... I tried to learn it once but remember it being very awkward. I've also tried to pick up emacs for the shell but fiound that to be klunky and the terminal definitions primitive. Vim has a terminal program for it and suffers the same problems.
Anyway - the problem I have with the framebuffer is a lack of decent cut and paste support. It's sort of available in screen
But with GKT+ under framebuffer, I should be able to run gnome-terminal in a vt, and with that have access to a clipboard! I hope it's easy to navigate around for selecting text and the like.
Believe with me, my saplings.
Talkin' 'bout dang 'ole why Hank ... why?
Here I was thinking that it was utterly impossible to make the GTK file dialogue worse than it already was.
I have to ask what you think is wrong with it. It's got a nice little tree, tab completion, multiple M$ style shift key first to last list and CTRL key for individual inclusion, tab completion and three obvious, text labled buttons for rational tasks, rename delete and directory creation. It's fast and does what it should, what more can you ask for? I kicks M$ ass, and works on devices small and large.
My curse on you is that you be forced to WinCE on a keyboardless device until you beg for a CLI and know the true value of what you now despise. Eat your own dog-food, astroturfer!
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Considering the fact that the interface is all text, TTS would be nice for blind people. On X start up, depending on what XDM is used, you would get something like, "My box, login, name, password, Using every normal program, email client (Balsa), web browser (Galleon) would all be much easier, especially with tool tips enabled. Compare that to Microsoft's Accesability options! Rock on GNOME!
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Don't dig up that Apple II from the dump though - it is still 32bit Linux...
Oh well, what the hell...
I agree that text-mode can be very handy in some circumstances, but I think that more research should be devoted to improve X. I was a mlview-dxpc supporter and now I use NX, that has superseded the old project (http://www.nomachine.com). I can run GNOME from home, connected to my computer at office through an old 28.8 pcmcia modem. Here are some statistics:
s ion.php).
The client for Windows includes an X server based on the Cygwin port of XFree86. It is slower than many commercial X servers for Win32 I tried in the past, but it's free and quite "standard".
1019 B/s average, 1966 B/s 5s, 1050 B/s 30s, 2954 B/s maximum.
NX Compression Summary
link: MODEM with protocol compression enabled.
images: 22097472 bytes (21580 KB) packed to 2431560 (2375 KB).
Images compression ratio is 9.088:1.
overall: 25101152 bytes (24513 KB) in, 448863 bytes (438 KB) out.
Overall NX server compression ratio is 55.922:1.
NX is a free client+commercial server. Server is very cheap, compared to Citrix and uses X-Window as underlying protocol. Server compresses the X traffic down to the client to an extent that you never thought it was possible. The compression and X stuff are GPL while some parts are closed source. I don't care much, as the alternative would be MS+Citrix. There is a document explaining how compression is working (http://www.nomachine.com/doc_NX-XProtocolCompres
GTK+ 2.4 will have a new file dialog. They didn't show any shots of it, but the new API is already documented. It will be ready for GNOME 2.6 (or they hope, at least).
How did you get this through the "lameness filter". Don't get me wrong--I don't think your ASCII Gnome foot is lame, I think it's cool. I'm just curious--most ASCII art things get rejected by the filter.
Furry cows moo and decompress.
Yeah, but can I get font antialiasing with that? :)
It has no method to quickly navigate directories. Depending on what I'm editing (print-quality photos, web graphics, the family album, etc) I'd like to quickly switch between directories. Now, what happens: I load Gimp, open the file dialog, navigate to my images directory (slow, even with command-completion), then load the image. After editing, I want to save the resulting image to another folder, so I then go back to the file dialoge, and do the same damn thing again.
First, use multiple instances of your programs and real file browsers to drag and drop. This is the easiest step of all. Run multiple coppies of GIMP, each from a shell in the directory you want to work. This way, the dialog box will be defaulted to where you want to be. Next, use the drag and drop capabilities of GMC, Nautulis or KDE's file browser. If you try to use bookmarks, you will quickly be overwhelmed by too many of them. Depending on what window manager you are using, one or more of these should work. SSH X11 forwarding currenly works to move clipboard contents accross different computers on a network, I'll bet it can or will soon be able to drag and drop files the same way. How's that for spanning directories fast? Use multiple file viewers, of course, for place keeping as well as multiple versions spawns of GIMP.
Next, try more appropriate programs for viewing and batch manipulation. Eye of Gnome and Gqview are excellent programs for viewing and moving multiple files. For batch manipulation, use Image Magic's convert utility. It's a front end to lower level utilities that resample, rotate, convert file types and more. "man convert" is informative and contains examples of usefull stuff. Use igal to make quicky web pages. Between that and a simple shell script to feed multiple directories, your days of waiting for dialogs are over. You won't get around the time your computer takes to manipulate the images, but you will save loads of clicky clicky GIMP time.
Right rotates are a typical example. I use gqview to select and move all picutes that need to be rotated right and left to seperate directories. The CTRL key selections also work in gqview's thumbnail screen. Selecting them is as easy as looking hoding the ctrl key and a mouse button. Moving them is as eay as right clicking the mouse, selecting "move" from the pulldown menu and creating the new directory withing the directory you are in. You did remember to start gqview from a shell in the directory with pictures to manipulate? That way the right directory will always be the default. Next I run the following script to rotate all those pictures:
count=1
while [ -n "$*" ]
do
convert -rotate 90 $1 $1
shift
count=`expr $count + 1`
done
I named it "rr" issuing ~/home/me/bin/rr dir_1 dir_2 dir_3 does the directories. Other common convert commands can be substituted for each and every batch job you may have.
A similar script can be used to call igal for many directories and thus generate thumbnails, an index and an html page for eveery photo in every directory listed.
Happy editing and don't try the above in windoze!
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
I thought the tubroPascal (and turboC++, which my school still uses, and i like) had a very good GUI... Since the code was GPLed (turbovision) why hasn't someone made a linux gui that uses it?!
has been less than stellar. It runs like a dog (CPU-wise) as it lacks acceleration, and it seems slow even over 10/100mbit ethernet.
It's nice, I guess. But what Exceed and Reflection and Starnet let you do which I can't figure out in cygwin is nice is use Win32 window decorations by running it rootless, which really helps since that's how I tend to run most of my session on unix boxes too (remote X windows, not XDMCP). I don't want it taking over my screen, or relying on any local cygwin binaries to provide the windowing environment (even slower).
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
As an ordinary user longing for Linux to be a complete alternative--competitor--to Windows, I shake my head at such efforts and wonder why such time and effort could not be better devoted to filling more popular user needs.
WHAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING ABOUT TEXTMODE QUAKE^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^HCURSED GTK
"people are starving to death in this world... and somebody had time for this....."
"This is the greatest *sniff* I'm too broken up...I can't believe how wonderful this is. I can't stop the tears streaming down my face. Oh the humanity!!"
"This is seriously, extremely perverse. I'm impressed."
"This is quite possibly the most inherently wrong thing in the world today."
"I can now die. This totally, totally, totally rules."
"I would need serious tylenol 3's after playing this for more than 2 seconds. My eyes are still hurting from looking at it!"
"Rarely do I see something on the web that makes me scream OUT LOUD, but I saw this page and yelled, "Oh Jesus God, NO!" like I had just seen Rosemary's Baby. I don't know what the contest was, but YOU WIN!"
"gimp-console" is console based app thats not gtk dependent useful for running script-fu and other scripts, this should make "gimp" start faster since it would not be needed to start all the plugins as they would handled by gimp-console. you can a see a mention about it here also see ftcameron's flamingtext and cooltext have been using "gimp --console" from a very long time.
I got a patch. here it is:
rm -rf gtk-curses
Just to clarify, do everything on the command line using the GPLed stuff, running a remote GUI session over a modem. It's only the GUI interface to this functionality which is non-free.
perl -e 'fork||print for split//,"hahahaha"'
it has antialiased fonts!
This is like the dog walking on its hind legs.
It's not that it's done well,
It's that it's done at all.
Except far less entertaining...
"Information wants to be paid"
Shouldn't this be on dead^H^H^H^Hfreshmeat?
/. it should be where it belongs.
This has very little importance to be on
How much better is it than LBX?
the webshite says:
Requirements/dependencies:
To install RPM/DEB packages: ncurses + gpm
I'd imagine that's because it uses gpm for mouse input
Cheers & God bless
Sam "SammyTheSnake" Penny
The comment about this enabling remote login is incorrect. What this enables is executing GTK-based apps over a remote login that has already been established (e.g. via ssh, rlogin or telnet). Of course, ssh already allows X-protocol forwarding, but that might be too heavyweight for your remote connection, depending on what kind of bandwidth you have available...
Think of the infamous Vigor. It was not an April Fool's joke thought but a cartoon from Userfriendly.org
Singularity: a belief in the "God" idea with the "demiurge" relation inverted.
some one put a curse on GTK :-)
in my life God comes first.... but Linux is pretty high after that
Francis Smit
I can easily say that there is not comparison between the two. I know it's difficult to believe. A lot of people to whom I spoke about the project were hesitant, especially because of the commercial stuff. That happened until they tried themselves. At least for myself, NX did put a different light on what X can do.
Didn't see this one mentioned.
Assuming that the runtime requirements can be made small enough, this would be an ideal way to rewrite the long-suffering FreeBSD systinsall! (and others)
Good. I'll have to give it a try some time. I've never tried LBX either, usually opting for remote text logins.
Patches for bugs are welcomed by the authors
yeah? sure i'm great at making buggy software, i'm sure i could come up with something...
Nope I had not, so I just did. I tried the version in Debian stable but did not see the rotate button, nor did I see it in any dialog or the homepage. You would think it would be a trivial call, but it's just not there. It could be that the designers don't want to make the thing too big or too dependent on other libraries. I prefer gqview because you can drop the thumbnail views if you want. This makes it very fast.
Rotation, of course, was just one example of batch work. I expect most of the useful and common manipulations will make it to a right click menu in gqview and other viewer programs.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
What the crafriggiap are you talking about? You just spouted a bunch of nonsense!
Sounds like nonsense to me too, but you know there's going to be someone who reads it and swears by it.
CLI and text-mode interfaces are independent concepts.
There have been a number of graphical CLI interfaces in the past. That is, you type commands, get results back, and occasionally use the mouse to select something. It's a graphical user interface, it's just completely different from the "menus and mouse" stuff you are thinking off. People use CLIs, either of the text mode or of the graphical variety, because they are by far the most effective way of interacting with computers for anything complex: database searches, distributed systems administration, symbolic math, numerical math, software testing, simulations, etc.
People use ASCII or text-mode interfaces for bandwidth reasons or because they have lots of text-only hardware installed. Text terminals may be "obsolete", but they are cheap, very reliable, and very widely deployed. Many text mode interfaces are mouse based and, except for the somewhat clunky looking appearance, work just like interfaces on bitmapped displays.
I was a mlview-dxpc supporter and now I use NX, that has superseded the old project (http://www.nomachine.com).
DXPC is a simple, open source proxy that works just about everywhere, and works pretty well. NX may be a pretty nice commercial product, but in what way does it "supersede" NX?