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Switching from Phone to Voice-Over-IP?
An anonymous reader asks: "I am fed up with the telcos. My last phone bill for one line was over $100 _without_ the $45 for ADSL, so i'm looking to cut as many costs as I can. I've compared my current Voice + Internet solution to one consisting of Voice-over-IP and Cable Internet and it looks like I would save over $50 a month by throwing away my land-line phone and switching to Cable/VoIP. I'm new to the whole changing-from-POTS-to-VoIP process though, so what are some of the 'gotchas' involved with switching? Can I keep my existing number? Will calls suck my bandwidth dry? And most importantly, do any of these VoIP providers work with or support Linux?"
Skype has better sound quality than a regular telephone, and it is free, for now.
Linux support-wise, Vonage supposedly supports Linux, though honestly I'd go with one of the hardware VoIP phones anyway, just for matters of simplicity (like when it comes to devices grabbing your hardware and fighting between mp3 playback and phonecalls, and just simple matters of Linux audio sometimes being a pain to deal with).
Personally I just use a cellphone for my primary phone line, but it sounds like you make way more calls than I do.
There are 10 kinds of people: ones who understand ternary, ones who don't, and ones who think this joke is about binary
and doesn't let him keep his phone number
but other than that, yes, it totally fits the bill!
There are 10 kinds of people: ones who understand ternary, ones who don't, and ones who think this joke is about binary
Most of the commercial providers will solve these issues for you. I'm currently using vonage at home for my second line. I still keep a traditional landline for E911 and other functionality. The whole "where is your service located" issue is quite interesting on this front when you call emergency services. Since I could take my Vonage hardware with me to a friends house if I were traveling, it makes it quite tricky. Plus you don't need to have a phone number that is within your local calling area.
I'm interested in hearing from vonage (and other) VoIP users that have called 911 and if there were any complications..
Legislation will close up those loop-holes soon.
The cost savings for a single user just are not going to be there. VoIP might be cheap for large companies that do $10K in long distance a month. But for Joe user it's not cost effective and the sound quality can suffer. It's cheaper to get a Cell phone with free nights/weekends and a good min/month plan.
Post: Sigged, for your pleasure.
Dude! A hundred dollars? I haven't tried VOIP but I switched to MCI's neighborhood and I only pay $60 with taxes. My wife has used 2000 minutes of long distance in a month and it cost the same (can't STFU imagine that). At least swap to a unlimited program even if you decide VOIP isn't for you.
Link: Skype
I've been using Skype to talk with a friend in France, from Oregon. The sound quality is excellent, much better than crackly old telephones. The link is computer to computer, and we both have high-speed internet connections.
Also, try OneSuite. 2.5 cents per minute to use a regular, scratchy traditional phone.
Both of these make me realize that the telephone companies are charging too much. When you talk, you are only transferring a few bits of digital information. Everyone's conversations are aggregated into a huge data stream that is very cheap to send by optical fiber.
It's too bad you can't get DSL service without paying for phone service from the phone company.
Why haven't these 2 services been separated? What if I want DSL for Internet access and Vonage for phone (for example). Why should I have to pay the phone company tax to get that?
Another thing. Skype operates with a totally firewalled computer. When it finds that its ports are closed, it uses the browser port, port 80. This raises interesting questions of security. Anything can be transmitted over port 80.
It also raises interesting questions of writing an open source version of Skype that would hook to regular phone lines.
I just got a flyer from Primus, a long distance and internet provider. They have something called 'Talking Broadband'. You order it, and they send you a little thing to plug into your network, and you connect the phone to that. Not only do they transfer your phone number over, but you can pick a new number, and you can pick the area code of any place that they service, no matter where you live. As well, you can attach up to two 'alternate' phone numbers with their own area codes. I live in Edmonton, and I'm thinking of signing up for the service and getting an alternate number with a Toronto area code. That way, phone calls that friends in Toronto make to that number are local calls. I get one-way unlimited long distance for $4 a month. I can't phone out on that line, but that's okay.
Check it out. Primus also does business in the States, though it doesn't look like they have this service in particular. You should mail and ask.
I used to be a Vonage customer. I will detail my reasons for leaving at the end of this post.
As far as Vonage and Linux goes, Vonage will supply you with an ATA (Analog Telephone Adapter) that plugs into your existing network. Run a patch cable from your router / switch to the ATA, and a telephone cable from the ATA to a handset and you're good to go.
There is no interaction between the ATA and your desktop systems. It doesn't matter if you're running Windows / Linux / MacOS / Amiga / Whatever.
As for why I left Vonage, I was unimpressed with the call quality. I had Road Runner Business Class (I think 1.5M down, 768k up, although I might be mistaken) coming into my residence, and I would occasionally get static and dropped calls. Also, about 1 out of 10 calls the other party would not be able to hear me at all and hang up in frustration (assuming it was a crank caller or the like).
Two other problems I ran into were getting my assigned number and a "cancellation fee." When I signed up over Vonage's site, I was told that Vonage would automatically cancel my existing land-line service. However, my area code (513 - Cincinnati) was not offered, so I went with 614 (Columbus).
I found out later (when Cincinnati Bell kept billing me) that since I didn't transfer a number Vonage didn't cancel my existing service. The wording on Vonage's site did not lead me to believe that this was the case. To Vonage's credit, after I complained about this they credited my account for what I had to pay Cincinnati Bell.
I was disappointed when I eventually cancelled my Vonage account (to move back to Columbus and just use my cell phone as my only number) that Vonage charged me $41.19 as a "cancellation fee." They refunded this upon me shipping their hardware back, but I was very put off by being hit with that. I told Vonage that they should reword that as a hardware deposit or something more palatable.
I'm not angry with Vonage for my experiences, but I'm not falling out of my chair to recommend them. I want to see VoIP continue to mature and eventually become ubiquitous. Whether it's ready now or not is up for discussion.
Hope this was helpful!
- Neil Wehneman
My legal education, in nifty podcast format
As a geek, it's a knee-jerk reaction to turn instantly to a new technology to solve the problem. But depending on why your phone bill is expensive, Voice over IP might be a difficult/costly solution to your problem.
If your main costs come from calling someone long distance (particularly for long stretches of time), may I suggest one of the many 1 cent (or your denomination of choice)/minute phone cards? I used them in the past with someone with whom I would have long (2+ hours) conversations, and once the initial connection fee of 30 odd cents was paid, I could pretty much talk as long as I wanted. My phone bill went down from $60-80/month to one phone card ($20) per month or less (2000 minutes is a lot of minutes).
There are also 3-4c/minute phone cards with *no connection fees* and just a weekly "mainenance" fee on the card of 35c or so.
Many of these cards are now also rechargeable through the Internet or over the phone.
My experience has been that the sound quality of these cards is pretty adequate for voice conversations. If you're using the phones to swap recordings of symphonies, then I wouldn't suggest it.
Finally, my understanding is that there are many phone plans offering *unlimited* minutes for a reasonable rate. This may do the trick for you as well.
My point is, there are a lot of solutions to your problem that don't involve tossing your phone.
Karma: Chevy Kavalierma.
The problem with Cable + VOIP is QoS. When your cable goes out, no phone. This includes power outages - and even if YOU have UPS or whatever, the likelihood is that your cable headend doesn't have anything but a few minutes of battery. POTS is generally provisioned to run indefinitely independent of power outages etc.
Other things to watch out for are 911 service, Caller ID.
Operating system is generally not an issue - VOIP means installation of a Cisco or some other such box that sits on your LAN.
Personally I chose AT&T One Rate USA instead. I didn't want to deal with the VOIP teething pains.
Yup, it sure sounded to me like he was interested in the latest in research on VoIP technologies.
/. for help.
Oh, wait a tic. He wasn't.
He wanted human-readable information about what the relative costs and reliability of VoIP was; whether he could receive incoming calls to his current number; and what some of the "gotchas" might be in switching to VoIP.
None of which were addressed by the matches to your search.
The only possible question that might have been answered is what VoIP providers support Linux. I have a feeling that since he already pointed to Vonage, he has done *some* preliminary research on Google. No doubt he wants assurances from those who have actually tried VoIP, not just companies trying to sell it, that they actually support Linux.
If the most helpful comment you have is to tell someone to use Google, then keep quiet. Unless the slashdot is something along the lines of "What is the definition of blah-blah?" or "Where is a good place to buy computers?", the person has probably googled it, found that the results weren't useful, and turned to
Karma: Chevy Kavalierma.
One of the reasons phone service is expensive is because of the 911 access. With POTS, you're able to call 911 easily and reliably, even in severe conditions (e.g. blackout). With VoIP, you don't get the ability to do that well. Any time your internet service goes out (admit it; it's more often than your POTS goes out), you'll lose the ability to call 911. What if there's a blackout? Will your DSL/cable modem and computer be hooked up to a good UPS? And what if you're under attack or something? Will you have the time to wait for your computer to boot up before calling 911?
Playing with the various VoIP solutions is a bit of a hobby of mine, so allow me to share some of what I have learned:
Vonage is a great company, they have area codes in a lot of places, and they also support number portability. The downside is you're stuck using their equipment (cisco ata-186). It's a nice box, doesn't require a computer, provides a plug for normal phones, and works quite well behind a Linux firewall. If that's what you're looking for, then by all means, go with Vonage. I currently have a personal line, and a business line w/ fax line through them.
Packet8 is another company where you're stuck with their equipment. I've heard of problems with their service, but I have yet to experiance anything. The price is right, and the quality is good enough, and they also support lots of area codes. I currently have a personal line through them, but I've only had it for about 4 months.
iConnectHere is another one that supports lots of area codes. The quality is ok, but I had lots of lag issues with them. The price is pretty good, but you have to supply your own equipment. The good news is it works well with most sip devices (I've used an ata-186 with it, as well as a few soft phones). You'll hav problems using softphones behind a firewall though, but the good news is, it integrates pretty well with Asterisk, the open source pbx software. I used their service for a few months, but I no longer have it, the lag issues were too much for me.
VoicePulse is my current favorite solution. Aside from SIP, they also support IAX (via their VoicePulse Connect! service). With IAX, it integrates extremely well with Asterisk even behind firewalls. They have a pretty good pricing plan, and you get all your incoming minutes for free. You can add as many phone numbers as you would like, but the only problem with their service is their limited area code availability, which will hopefully get better over time. They support multiple inbound and outbound calls simultaniously, and several codecs, so you can balance your requirments of bandwidth vs. voice quality. VoicePulse also has a service that's more like what Vonage offers, but I haven't tried that. As I'm sure you've guessed by now, I'm currently using the VoicePulse Connect! service as my PSTN gateway for my Asterisk PBX, and so far it's been working remarkably well.
I hope that helps!
Here they actually charge you for the dial tone on top of the normal phone service...
There are 10 kinds of people: ones who understand ternary, ones who don't, and ones who think this joke is about binary
There is already too much fiber. More than 50% is not being used.
Blah blah blah obligatory product plug, even though I'm just a consumer and get nothing out of it... sooooo,
I purchased a 900 mhz logitech headset for use with teamspeak cause I'm geeky like that. Later I purchased a monthly plan with Dialpad (yeah yeah, they need a linux client...) The custom viop app you install is tiny, and doesn't require a reboot so I've been able to use it pretty much everywhere with a cheapy mic/headphone combo. It won't work when I'm booted to linux on the lappy but oh well.
However, the voice quality of the actual calls on a decent qos was pretty good and as long as nobody was edonkeying for porn on my non QOS connection it was about as clear as a cell phone call. The delay (1/2 a second at times) can get to you tho.
VoicePulse
Although I also have a mobile, which removes the problem for accessing emergency numbers (sure, I need to keep it charged, but I don't need to crawl to the land line everytime I cut off one of my legs).
The main reason why? Well, my land line calls were so few and far between (about 2-3 bucks a month) my line rental ($AUS 20/month) far outweighed it.
The funny thing is, I hardly use VOIP at all. Email and chat usage went up (but that costs me nothing) while mobile remained steady.
I thought Asterisk required special hardware, but I guess not: "Asterisk needs no additional hardware for Voice over IP."
Anyone have any experience with Asterisk without special hardware? Can I connect to an Internet address directly?
Is the sound quality as good as Skype?
Why bother with the trouble of VoIP?
Verizon offers DSL + Unlimited Local/Long distance for $85/month.
While it't not cheap, it's also not that much more than a cable connection, and you get to keep your normal phone!
I'm in no way affiliated with verizon. I just find it amazing that people pay such high bills for no clear reason.
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
four of my friends have it and it works great. they now have 911 service in most areas. This is important to check on. Some services do not let you connect to 911 or 411.
If you get a business accounts, you even get a fax line as part of the service.
You can transfer your current pstn phone number.
Voice quality is at least a good as PSTN. See QOS notes below.
They used to send cisco-186 adapters for analog phone. I believe they not send you a motorola box that acts as a DSL/cable router and have a port specifically for your phone. this allows voip traffic to take priority over other data traffic.
The one real gotcha is that if your internet connection get flakey, the sound quality can suffer. If the connection goes away, so does your phone service.
If you do not go with vonage, get the linksys router that has QOS. This way you can point at a specific port for the phone so VOIP traffic get priority. this QOS is one of the bigger issues.
Other wise being on the phone while a big upload or download is happening and you'll think your on a bad cell connection.
One of the interesting things about VoIP from the start was the idea that, as a programmer, I could write a program that would connect to a telephone and "talk" to whoever or whatever was there. And now that the lower levels of the phone system is widely converted to VoIP (RTP actually), it seems like this should be possible.
I've been working on a medical project that would really like to use this capability. Things like alerting medical personnel via their cellphones, and sending them voice and/or SMS messages. We've been doing lots of Net research to discover what the code looks like.
So far, we haven't found it. Lots of enticing clues that, yes, it might be possible. But tracking down leads invariable leads to circles without actually discovering any code that does it.
Of course, the spam uses are also obvious, and as part of the project, we'd like to learn how to protect the medical people from that.
Anyone have any good clues?
Or is it all proprietary and not available to us?
Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
I had the same problem, I live in one state, my family and my wifes family all lived in another state. So my Veri$on bill was outrageous. Solutions, almost 2 years ago now, I switched to Vonage, using my local cable provider for broadband access. The end result is rock solid service that has only gone down in price and up in features, service and quality, not to say it was bad to begin with. I have no land line service and I enabled the 911 service that is part ov vonage, that is that it calls geographically closet location and you need to tell them your address. As for soft phones , vonage offers a soft phone with a seperate number and seperate services with 500 minutes for an additional 9.99 a month. My recomendation is this solution, good luck.
With POTS, you're able to call 911 easily and reliably, even in severe conditions (e.g. blackout).
Most people who have high-speed Internet access probably also have cell phones. And whether you want it or not, you even have E911 with your cell phone.
The 911 issue is a marketing gimmick by the phone companies.
I can see a problem here that flicking over the posts I can't see raised and that this:
Most internet services are provided by companies who are in some way linked to telcom companies or provide thier own telcom themselves.
Examples:
- adsl/dsl's?
- cable; Telewest broadband offer phonelines pretty much same rate as BT
Does anyone know of a way to get internet access on its own without buying from a cable company who would prefer to sell you a phoneline too? - in the UK...
A blog I run for the wealth
Anyone had any success googling for UK VoIP gateways and providers?
It doesn't seem to be too well known here and I'm not sure why since we pay the most. It could be a legal thing not yet delt with by Ofcom.
A blog I run for the wealth
And don't forget to count in the power consumption of any additional devices you need. My own (rather old) cable modem draws 30W, thats 250 kWh a year, or (depending on the cost of electricity) up to 80$.
Cheers
Edgar
I am a current Vonage customer. Here are the pros and cons as they apply to me:
Pros:
* Cheap - especially international calls, I cannot get a better rate except with a phone card.
* Features - lots of features that I normally would not take (because they usually cost extra) are free, such as call forwarding, caller id.
* Easy, detailed online account access.
* Its cool
* Voice quality actually improved over my previous service
Cons:
* 56K dialup does not work. This can be a gotcha in unexpected ways, for example my DirectTV Tivo cannot dialup to DirectTv, which means that I could not have multiple recievers, or use their sport channels.
* Reliability of Internet connection is not as good as phone lines.
* If the power goes down, then so does my phone (have not tried using UPS yet)
* 911 service is available according to Vonage, but how will I really know until I try?
* The hardware is a bit iffy. I have the motorola unit, which I originally setup as they suggested, directly to my cable modem, with the rest of my network behind it. This was extremely unreliable, and I get much better results by putting it behind a NAT router (I had to forward some ports).
* Broadband options are cut down - I cannot use DSL because I no longer have a land line, but I do not want to use cable (because I have satellite). So, I end up paying the cable company a "tax" of sorts because I am not interested in the cable, only the internet.
Most writers regard truth as their most valuable possession, and therefore are most economical in its use - Mark Twain
Sorry, but I've found faxing to be difficult to impossible on both Vonage and Voicepulse.
This is a major issue to me, and likely, to many.
Jonathan
I can offer some insight on VoIP. I use Vonage with two lines and one line for Verizon. I also have a home network using a cable modem.
To effectively use Vonage at all, you'll have to make a big investment in multiple-handset cordless phones or a small telephone system. I chose the telephone system from Lee Phones which re-sells the BBS Telecom IPS system.
The Vonage device will not properly work if you just run your entire house's loop to it. It may work for two extensions, but three is risking burning out the machine. The trendy thing today is multiple-handset cordless phones, so you plug the base-station into the device and you're all set. Since Vonage can have two lines on one device, try to get a multi-line multiple-handset system (they are EXPENSIVE) or a home telephone system.
Always keep the land line from Verizon or whomever it is for emergencies. I have seen Vonage go out-of-service even when my cable modem network is still running. A multiple-line multiple-handset cordless system or phone system makes this really easy.
There is nothing quite as annoyingas hearing the Vonage line ringing downstairs and not upstairs. This is where phone systems are key.
Kris
Kriston
My wife is on the phone right now, VoIP. I'm browsing, as is she.
We're using Vonage, with a cablemodem (TWC RoadRunner).
Our cost: RR:$45/month, Vonage:$27/month.
FWIW, Vonage gives us free voicemail, 500 minutes LD anywhere in the Continental US, caller ID/CallWaiting/Call forwarding/3 way calling, and $.05 per minute to the UK. In comparison, our local Telco gives us local only with NONE of the features listed above, for $32/month.
Check out Vonage here.
-- "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity." - R.A.H.
A couple things. One with the home telephone system, can you have access controls on a per phone basis? for example if you didn't want the teenage daughter to use her phone between the hours of 8:00 p.m to 7:00 a.m. Or you didn't want her to call or recieve certain numbers? Also I assume these systems are cheap enough, and easy enough for the prosumer market (as easy as regular phone equipment to install). otherwise I smell a business opportunity.
Just an FYI guys, if your phone is disconected you DO NOT have 911 service. I work for one of the big ones, and while people are pushing for this to happen, none of the major compaines do it.
F -8&oe =UTF-8&q=911+%22disconnected+phone%22
Just google it:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UT
If you are getting that kind of electrical cost, you can buy a new modem for just the power savings. My Toshiba cost me $50 and draws 6W.
Bring your wireless notebook along to a coffee shop which has wireless Internet, connect the VoIP equipment and your phone. Will it work? Will you be able to dial home without paying long-distance charges?
If this works, I'll get the VoIP equipment and a phone everywhere I go when I travel!
I use Earthlink cable internet and don't have to pay the cable tv tax. It is only availible in certain places though (areas serviced by TimeWarner, plus some test markets)
911 works by resolving your home address through the POTS network, so when you go off POTS you lose 911 service. This is definately something to think about. You can always program emergency numbers into your phone, but it won't help you if you're incapacitated and can't give directions. Even a 3 year old can dial 911, and help will arrive automatically.
I don't know anyone who still uses fax. There is something called email and you can even send text documents and pictures with it - you might want to check it out...
You can view my other notes on the topic through my posted messages. The biggest 'drawback' is the amount of time that it takes to switch. But otherwise I really have to recommend Vonage as being an excellent service provider. I didn't really shop around, but when my wife and I first got our phone service, we immediately switched to the Vonage service. At $37 (After taxes) for the phone, and asking Time Warner to keep my rate low, I save $20 a month in communications costs. I would be saving more if I called home to mom as much as she'd like.
I've compared my Vonage costs to going back to a land line, and I can't beat it. I'm just waiting for the next round of cuts to come throuh as the competition heats up.
Switch today, don't delay!
think before you write, it'll save me moderator points.
There is one really cool feature that caught me by surprise this last Christmas. It makes sense, if you have a vonage number, you can take the ATA anywhere in the world, plug it into a relatively speedy connection and then you are good to go! So, I took the ATA with me to Switzerland and I was able to call to the US as if I was there! Granted Switzerland already has really good long distance costs with swiss comm, but what was cool was that my friends at home could call me in Switzerland as if it was a local call! Very cool!
If your hardware is plugged into a UPS (including the VOIP adapter) I believe you can still make the 911 calls even in a power outage. The only problem being the possibility of your broadband connection going down due to the power outage. If this happens then yes, you'll need either a land line w/o a phone needing elctricity or a cell phone (depending of course how wide spread teh power outage is of course..) Still, depending where you live even a land line will not always work, for instance I live in Vermont and we have areas where trees fall due to winds or ice build up and take the lines out completely. Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on your view/values) there is not enough of a population to bury the wires. So anyway you go, IP, land line, cell, ther ewill always be a possibility of not being able to contact 911. I would think that having your VOIP hardware and your cable modem (most likely your phone also)on a UPS would give you decent 911 "uptime". If your REALLY worried I guess you could invest in a decent shortwave radio though :)