Cellphone as Virtual Mouse, Keyboard

Wow by NIK282000 · 2004-05-27 08:10 · Score: 1, Interesting

now if only we could eliminate the phone and have th e object track your hands..

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Videos? by ryanwright · 2004-05-27 08:10 · Score: 5, Funny

Some very cool videos available

Heh. Not anymore, they aren't.

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-Ryan, with the unoriginal sig

Wow... by k4_pacific · 2004-05-27 08:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

Like the Camera phone itself, this is a solution to a problem I never knew existed.

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Unknown host pong.

Re:Wow... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 08:16 · Score: 1, Insightful

Not everything created is a solution for a problem. Sometimes it's just a clever hack that's interesting or entertaining.

Freaking engineers!
Re:Wow... by normal_guy · 2004-05-27 08:30 · Score: 4, Insightful

Why fly when you can drive and sail? Because it's faster and more efficient. Why carry around a cameraphone when you can easily carry a brick phone and your Nikon 35mm? Because it's smaller and more efficient.

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Linux: Free if your time is worthless.
Re:Wow... by rudeboy1 · 2004-05-27 08:32 · Score: 1, Funny

Now I can finally live my dream of never having to touch anything in public ever again. I can use my cell phone to book my flights, control my computer, and open doors! I won't ever have to come into contact with Evil Germs ever again!

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Re:Wow... by rainman_bc · 2004-05-27 09:20 · Score: 2, Interesting

Yeah, the problem existed. Not the convergence question, but still. Imagine - you get in an accident, and you don't have any paper; you can take a pic of the license plate. Or someone commits a crime and you're there to witness it. A picture sure does help. From a legal perspective, carrying around a camera can really save your hide. Of course IANAL, but I can imagine the possibilities. It would make the difference in a "my word against your word" kinda case. Same goes for video. Imagine if you were assaulted and managed to catch the assault on video. Kinda makes your case more concrete doesn't it? From a "my word against yours" angle, having a camera on you at all times likely does help a lot.

And besides, what if you were in calgary right now and want to remember all the b00bs being shown. What better way to relive the NHL playoffs than through the joy of pictures!

and on that note, what if you were to shag a supermodel? No one would believe you (being a slashdot nerd), so now you can snap a photo while shagging a goddess! You will be the envy of your friends!

=D

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Re:Wow... by Total_Wimp · 2004-05-27 09:53 · Score: 5, Interesting

Like the Camera phone itself, this is a solution to a problem I never knew existed.

This kind of statement about the lack of a use for a camera phone tends to tell me something about the person that says it.

1. They're not very creative. I use a camera-phone all the time for stuff I'd never use a camera for. For example, I take pictures of sales displays to compare the product on the internet when I get home and I take pictures of the sign that reminds me where I parked my car at the airport. Instant notes with no effort. I also have a cool game that lets me move around by moving my phone around. If you were more creative, you would have thought of a few more uses too.

2. They're not very spontaneous. I take pictures of my friends, family and important events far more often than I ever would if I had to carry around a full-size camera all the time. If you were interested in this kind of spontaneity then I'm sure you would see the use of a camera phone.

3. They're self-centered. People who don't want a camera phone personally, and seem to be dumbfounded by those that do, tend to be some of the most self-centered people I know. Lots of people have camera phones and lots of people like them. You may not desire or need one, but are you able to learn from and empathize with those that do? If you were interested in the thoughts and feelings of the people around you, you might have asked one of them why they bought a camera phone and realize that not everyone has the same needs and desires that you do.

Believe it or not, I'm not trying to slam you here. I'm just reporting my personal observations of people who've talked like you have about these devices. Camera phones are interesting because they're very popular, but there's a significant backlash. That backlash crowd, in my opinion, is really more alike than most people realize.

TW
Re:Wow... by milkman_matt · 2004-05-27 10:07 · Score: 2, Insightful

Why fly when you can drive and sail? Because it's faster and more efficient. Why carry around a cameraphone when you can easily carry a brick phone and your Nikon 35mm? Because it's smaller and more efficient.

Interesting point, but by the same token -- Why use your cellphone as a mouse? I can't think of any reason save powerpoint presentations or something, but for that you don't really need a mouse.. Flying is faster than cars and boats, the cameraphone.. well, I'd rather carry my little phone and my Nikon 35mm, because the results from a camera phone are ass at best. I have a camera phone, and I have a little pocket olympus digital camera. If I know I'm going to be taking pictures, I bring the digital, the resulotion and clarity blow my phone out of the water. For a quick "oh wow that's neat" picture, then yes, a camera phone is fine and sometimes very useful. However, usually if you're going to be taking pictures of stuff, you know it, so you bring your camera. Well, "I", not "You", but I can only speak for myself.

-matt
Re:Wow... by milkman_matt · 2004-05-27 10:15 · Score: 1

Or someone commits a crime and you're there to witness it. A picture sure does help.

It's funny that you should mention this. My boss was telling me about a month ago when his friend had his camera phone for a while, he saw some guy commiting something, I forget the details, anyhow, he whipped out his camera phone and snapped a couple shots good enough to make out his face, he showed the police when they arrived and it helped to catch the guy. Very useful (as I mentioned before) but hardly necessary or anything like that. It's just handy to have around for those times when you could use your camera but didn't bring it. Hardly a substitution for a real camera in any circumstance, though.

-matt
Re:Wow... by cjpez · 2004-05-27 10:25 · Score: 2, Insightful

(I know I probably shouldn't feed the trolls, but...)

... so your theory is that people who don't like camera phones
are uncreative, non-spontaneous, self-centered assholes? Whereas
your camera phone imparts creativity, spontaneity, and a greater
appreciation for your fellow man? Wonder of wonders! Maybe
this new phone will come with a feature that makes you less of
a jerk, too!

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Al Qaeda has ninjas!
Re:Wow... by Yobgod+Ababua · 2004-05-27 12:39 · Score: 2, Insightful

"Why use your cellphone as a mouse?"

As the OP notes, the primary use would be to create interactive displays and signs in places where there typically is no mouse, or it would be inadvisable to place a mouse (or other pointing device).

The idea is to enable people to use a device that many of them already carry with them to interact with these displays, rather than building some possibly expensive or damage prone method of interaction into the display itself.
Re:Wow... by Lobsang · 2004-05-27 16:39 · Score: 1

Like the Camera phone itself, this is a solution to a problem I never knew existed.

Sometimes, we got to admit, they Have their use...
Re:Wow... by sffubs · 2004-05-27 19:57 · Score: 1

To be honest, the quality of the pictures from my cameraphone is so far short of a real digicam that I tend to just carry my Canon with me, and forget that the phone can take pictures.

I know that the quality of cameraphones will improve dramatically, but when you consider that even the smallest consumer digicams tend to be about the size of a phone, I think it'll be a while before phones catch up with the bottom end of the camera market (quality-wise). And until then I personally wouldn't want to trust taking pictures of friends, family and personal events to one.

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Re:Wow... by greggman · 2004-05-27 21:24 · Score: 1

they already have caught up here in Japan. There are about 10 differnt 2megapixel camera phones out here. Some with auto-focus. The bottom of the digital camera market is currently 2megapixels. By Christmas here those phones will be the free phones you get for signing up for service and 3megapixel phones will be out.
Re:Wow... by DrPizza · 2004-05-27 21:27 · Score: 1

Except that my old non-camera phone is a much better phone, and I wouldn't carry around a camera anyway. Nor would most people (as amply evidenced by the fact that prior to the release of camera phones they didn't).
As such, the camera phone falls squarely into the "solution looking for a problem" category.
And even if one really did want a camera, a camera phone would be hopelessly inadequate anyway; crap compared even to a disposable 35mm camera, let alone a proper one.
Re:Wow... by cwis42 · 2004-05-27 23:48 · Score: 1

Like the Camera phone itself, this is a solution to a problem I never knew existed.

You must be new here.
Re:Wow... by Kiryat+Malachi · 2004-05-28 09:45 · Score: 1

I felt like camera phones were useless.

Then I got one for free. And once I had one, I changed my mind. For times when I don't have my good camera (Olympus C-50) with me, its nice to be able to just take that quick shot.

I think most of the people who are so heavily anti cameraphone, simply haven't used one and therefore haven't thought about the uses.

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Here's an idea: by magefile · 2004-05-27 08:11 · Score: 4, Interesting

If the spot codes can hold a few bytes of info - wave your cell over a tattoo or a shirt someone's wearing to get their name/cellphone number ... um, never mind, that'd be a bad thing.

Re:Here's an idea: by Richard_L_James · 2004-05-27 08:25 · Score: 1

Hey great idea, this would work well with your average spotty geek! Personally I've found asking people for their number is the easiest way but I guess this is slashdot - why do it the easy way when you can spend 6 months dev'ing up something really complex to do it for you ;-)

I don't understand... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 08:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

Why integrate a cell phone with all these add on features that aren't nearly as good as things devoted specifically to the task? Cameras on cell phones are horrible compared to a decent digital camera, cell phone games are also quite lame (though, in Japan, you can get some nice looking versions of Dragonquest 1 and FF1), and now this... Why not just fix certain problems with the PHONING (i.e. bad signals) - the main capability for which they were developed, rather than adding a whole number of (useless) features?

Re:I don't understand... by Khakionion · 2004-05-27 08:17 · Score: 5, Insightful

Why not just fix certain problems with the PHONING (i.e. bad signals) - the main capability for which they were developed, rather than adding a whole number of (useless) features?
Put yourself in Sprint's shoes. You could spend more on improving your network, thus upping your subscription costs, or you could have Samsung come out with a shitload of useless PCS Vision features. Both sell phones, but there's less risk for Sprint, since Samsung's doing the majority of the R&D.

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Re:I don't understand... by Mz6 · 2004-05-27 08:17 · Score: 2

Because the phone is the last thing people care about!
I have a couple friends who work as Spring salespeople and they say that the last thing that people ask about it the actual phone quality itself. They want to know about games, planners, cameras and all the other toys, but the actual phone part is last, if even touched upon at all.

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Hmmm.
Re:I don't understand... by Diaspar · 2004-05-27 08:22 · Score: 4, Interesting

Didn't Motorola CEO get kicked out because that's precisely what he was saying ("concentrate on quality that's obviously suffering right now, and not race for features")?

I think in the current market there is always race for features. More, more more and more. Until some complaint gets too loud and bites the company in the ass. Then fixing it becomes a future as well ("Our dialer is now better than ever").

I found it interesting how Microsoft acted back in the day. They bloated their software with features, many many features, to beat the feature list of the competitor. Well, so what that it crashed constantly, so what that it didn't do the job that well. (sarcasm). For some reason, it's still around...
Re:I don't understand... by Diaspar · 2004-05-27 08:30 · Score: 3, Insightful

I think the issue here is that the people *assume* that the phone just works. Quality of service is usually attributed to the provider.

Now that we got that out of the way, once people take reliability for granted they look at optional things, such as camera, organizer, phone book, etc.. nothing wrong with it, just how the mentality works.
Re:I don't understand... by realdpk · 2004-05-27 08:31 · Score: 1

I'm still waiting for them to come out with a Bag of Holding to carry all of the individual electronic devices that could replace the functionality of my Treo 600. One that could fit in my jeans pocket.
Re:I don't understand... by Kenja · 2004-05-27 08:35 · Score: 1

I call it "Japanese Schoolgirl Technology". The US market is not the main one for this stuff.

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"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Re:I don't understand... by ndykman · 2004-05-27 08:41 · Score: 2, Insightful

All these toys just allow the companies to churn phones and do nothing about, well, phone service. I agree. Two things I care about.

Reception. I understand that this is a combination of the network and the phone, but I'm not seeing many companies really making the effort to examine coverage, make investments in infrastructure upgrades. I think the phones may not have much more they can do on reception, save for a breakthrough in antenna design (the PLL for example).

The second is of course battery life. This is just a fundamental problem, but hey, not sticking a ton of crap in the phone can't hurt. I must admit, I do like some color screens, just because they are bright and easy to read to see who is calling, and whom I'm calling.

I am looking at switching providers, and I'm really looking at Nextel and Verizon, as they really seem to be about "getting phone calls". Any comments?
Re:I don't understand... by Biomemetic · 2004-05-27 08:49 · Score: 1

I have a colleague who uses this feature to control his Mac during PPT presentations, enabling him to wander all over the room during presentations, rather than being shackled to the keyboard. Sure, there are other ways of doing this, but it does look pretty slick.

seriously... by jbellis · 2004-05-27 08:14 · Score: 2, Insightful

pretty underwhelming that something described as a "virtual mouse and keyboard" turns out to be more like "virtual touchscreen, as long as you don't have more than a few options you want touchable."

How quickly is this all done? by Fiz+Ocelot · 2004-05-27 08:16 · Score: 3, Insightful

So how fast is it? From what it sounds like in the description: A bar code like "spot code" is on an object. Your phone reads it with the camera, communicates this to a nearby pc via bluetooth, which then somehow runs code on the phone.

Sorry but first off, I don't want a camera phone. Second, Will this all run within my 2 second attention span? Most likely just targeted ads anyways. Not to mention what this would do to the phone's battery life.

Re:How quickly is this all done? by stab · 2004-05-27 08:28 · Score: 4, Insightful

Sorry but first off, I don't want a camera phone

You're probably posting from the US. In Europe, it's almost impossible to buy a cellphone without a camera these days. You're correct in that I dont particularly want to take pictures with the crappy camera - so why not use it for something useful?

Will this all run within my 2 second attention span?

Pretty much ... the decoding happens in real-time (you see the camera viewfinder, and it highlights tags). Once the main slashdotting dies down, the videos hopefully explain it a bit better.

Not to mention what this would do to the phone's battery life.

Actually, it's not too bad ... I was demonstrating this stuff at a research demo day recently, and we ran a normal Nokia 3650 for a good 8 hours without seriously killing the batteries - that the camera and bluetooth active at the same time.
Re:How quickly is this all done? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 09:18 · Score: 1, Informative

> You're probably posting from the US. In Europe, it's almost impossible to buy a cellphone without a camera these days.

I live in the Netherlands and the majority of the cellphones in the shops here don't have a camera. Hell, it's even easy to buy phones without a color screen, let alone without a camera.

Mirror for some of the videos by stab · 2004-05-27 08:17 · Score: 5, Informative

Since the main site is predictably a bit bogged down, there is also a page at the University of Cambridge Systems Research Group detailing the research side of things. It also has some cool videos :-)

Re:Mirror for some of the videos by upside · 2004-05-27 08:50 · Score: 1

I guess the lab gets its name from you, judging by that photo - you look "high energy" there! Seems you've also managed to recruit the obligatory llama into your team. :D Nice work.

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I'm sorry if I haven't offended anyone

and the need for this is...? by chamblah · 2004-05-27 08:18 · Score: 1, Insightful

I honestly cannot see any real reason for this. As cool as it is for a proof of concept the idea is nice.

But this trend of incorporating everything into one device is annoying.

Re:and the need for this is...? by Rick.C · 2004-05-27 08:45 · Score: 5, Funny

But this trend of incorporating everything into one device is annoying.
That's the same line the Mormons use to justify polygamy.

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"Math in a song is good."-Linford

New Policy by bogie · 2004-05-27 08:19 · Score: 3, Interesting

If a site is unreachable within the first 10 posts the story gets yanked. Delete it like it never happened. Seriously, how the hell are we supposed to have a discussion about something we can't even read about?

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If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch

Re:New Policy by SwornPacifist · 2004-05-27 08:21 · Score: 5, Funny

how the hell are we supposed to have a discussion about something we can't even read about?

Since when has reading the article been a requirement to post authoritatively on Slashdot about it?
Re:New Policy by Chewie · 2004-05-27 08:22 · Score: 1, Funny

...how the hell are we supposed to have a discussion about something we can't even read about?

The same way we have discussions when no one's read TFA regardless of availability? :)

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Re:New Policy by Pizzop · 2004-05-27 08:24 · Score: 2, Funny

It's just a ploy by someone who secretly hates the people who did it. They have the site /.'ed and then laugh when the persons computer melts!

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How to Speak Leet
Re:New Policy by bogie · 2004-05-27 10:55 · Score: 1

I know I know, walked right into that one. But still it is rather annoying.

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If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch

ideas by medvezhatnik · 2004-05-27 08:19 · Score: 2, Insightful

what else can we turn cell phone in to ? i'd like to have web server and ssh installed on it too, wash the dishes, flashlight, what else ? :-)

Re:ideas by gandalphthegreen · 2004-05-27 08:27 · Score: 3, Informative

flashlight
You apparently haven't seen this.
Re:ideas by eboot · 2004-05-27 08:33 · Score: 1

went to the web site and i have a query... why does the torch need to be connected by bluetooth to a phone? Does it need the power of sony ericsson phone to know the difference between off and on?

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Two tears in a bucket. Motherfuck it.
Re:ideas by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 08:49 · Score: 1, Funny

what else can we turn cell phone in to ? I'd like to have web server and ssh installed on it too, wash the dishes, flashlight...

You can't install all this on a cell phone. Because, if you do, you can't call it a cell phone, you'd have to call it EMACS.
Re:ideas by dJCL · 2004-05-27 09:14 · Score: 1

I have the Sony-Ericsson CAR-100, it's basically a mini RC car that charges off the phone's power connector and uses bluetooth to control the steering and speed. I syspect that the S-E phones have a bluetooth serial option to allow control of properly setup devices... ie, I build a bluetooth car, and my older models can deal with it, same with the light, it probably lets the phone know what is going on with the light - maybe even turn it on and off.

Yes, these things are generally useless, but who really cares?

--
On Arrakis: early worm gets the bird. Magister mundi sum!
Re:ideas by Melchior_of_wg · 2004-05-27 09:19 · Score: 1

1 - No mentions of bluetooth. It has a BLUE light, maybe you missread.

2 - It has no internal power source, instead of uses the mobile's battery, hence the need for a physical connection.
Re:ideas by ryanwright · 2004-05-27 10:50 · Score: 1

Seriously, a flashlight built into a cellphone would be great. How many of us have used the backlighting from the LCD to locate stuff in the dark? I'm guilty. In fact I've done it several times. So why not just put a couple of high powered LEDs in the front of the thing with an on/off button? That would get me one step closer to the perfect "Swiss Army Cellphone."

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-Ryan, with the unoriginal sig
Re:ideas by skzbass · 2004-05-27 13:39 · Score: 1

Or the new Samsung E715 The flashlight is actuallty a arguable feature, ive been in thge dark trying to write something down, a Led would come in handy

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Google Cache by jm92956n · 2004-05-27 08:20 · Score: 3, Informative

Yes, that's the way I like to be clicked.

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Never really trusted them .... by taniwha · 2004-05-27 08:21 · Score: 1

Those guys over in High Energy Magic ... I've read all the stories about what goes wrong over there ....

Re:Never really trusted them .... by Pxtl · 2004-05-27 08:26 · Score: 1

I know. The very fact that there exists an organization with that name is hilarious. Hats off to them.

Gyroscopic mouse technology - patented by networkGhettoWhore · 2004-05-27 08:22 · Score: 5, Interesting

What wasn't reported though is that the company Gyration already has patent pending on gyroscopic mouse technology. Gyration had already released an open letter last week addressing this when the cell phone mouse was first announced.

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Re:Gyroscopic mouse technology - patented by poot_rootbeer · 2004-05-27 09:00 · Score: 1

Well, I can't know for sure because the article is Slashdotted, but I expect the cell phones don't actually contain any gyroscopes -- I know mine doesn't -- so "gyroscopic mouse technology" wouldn't really apply.

It would, I imagine, track the motion of the images captured by the camera to calculate relative motion -- sort of like the way an optical mouse works, but with less precision.

Pretty clever stuff -- this could either be the Killer App for Bluetooth, or the biggest nuisance ever, once anyone nearby will be able to change the channel on your TV using only their cellphone.
Re:Gyroscopic mouse technology - patented by FattMattP · 2004-05-27 09:54 · Score: 1

What wasn't reported though is that the company Gyration already has patent pending on gyroscopic mouse technology.
Cell phones don't contain gyroscopes. This uses the camera to detect movement.

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Re:Gyroscopic mouse technology - patented by Phroggy · 2004-05-29 05:09 · Score: 1

Anyone remember the Nintendo PowerGlove? It was ultrasonic rather than gyroscopic or optical...

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Re:Astroturf... by CoffeeJedi · 2004-05-27 08:22 · Score: 1

oh, ok... i guess it was just the "wow! gee-wiz! cool" tone of the post, it just seemed.... fake i guess

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Join us next time... by advance512 · 2004-05-27 08:24 · Score: 2, Funny

...when we show you how to take pictures of your family using an optical mouse!

Actually, this is pretty cool - nice idea. No need to carry around a mouse for your laptop (if you hate the touchpad), just use your cellphone! Simple and smart.

Re:Join us next time... by dJCL · 2004-05-27 09:18 · Score: 1

Not quite what they achieved, classic RTFA, but still an interesting possibility.

My Sony Ericsson T616 has a relativly crappy camera on it(good for those shots when you have no other device nearby). An option to connect as a Bluetooth mouse to my laptop and just put the phone on a flat surface with non-repeating textures would rock! I would not have to carry my wireless mouse with me, and therefore one less device to drag around.

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On Arrakis: early worm gets the bird. Magister mundi sum!

new use for this... by ferrocene · 2004-05-27 08:24 · Score: 4, Funny

Eliminate beer Goggles! Picture the scene: you're at a bar, gettin' close to closing time. The chick you've been talking to is lookin' pretty good, but all your friend's have abandoned you.

Whip out the phone, take a pic of the broad. Phone flashes green if she's good, Red if she's not.

That would have saved me uh...i mean...yeah...

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Most folk'll never lose a toe, and then again some folk'll...

Re:new use for this... by mrtroy · 2004-05-27 08:34 · Score: 1

Thats why camera phones were invented!

Whip out the phone, take a pic of the broad. Phone flashes green if she's good, Red if she's not.
Screw software...get a good and sober friend to judge and textmsg you back if shes ok or not.

Oh wait...software might be a good idea...their scale might accidentally be reversed ;)

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[I can picture a world without war, without hate. I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it]
Re:new use for this... by droid_rage · 2004-05-27 08:47 · Score: 4, Funny

Come to think of it... The only thing I've ever used my cameraphone for is to get a pic of the girl whose number I just got, to decide if I'm going to call her or not once I sober up.
Re:new use for this... by rayand · 2004-05-27 21:25 · Score: 1

Er... yes, and in fact these spots have already been used as tattoo's for dating applications.
http://corp.bango.net/corporate/med ia/releases/57_ bangospot.asp

Re:Astroturf... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 08:30 · Score: 1, Informative

Because this was invented at the University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory, in the Systems Research Group. Link

What I really miss in cell phones... by jorlando · 2004-05-27 08:30 · Score: 4, Funny

a multimeter...

lots of times I needed a damn multimeter and I looket to the cell phone and imagined it could have a pair of probes...

at least a AC/DC voltmeter up to 300V...

Re:What I really miss in cell phones... by markttu · 2004-05-27 08:52 · Score: 1

The Palm in my phone is great, add simple AC/DC voltmeter and 0-20mA DC ammeter and then if I could just unscrew the tip of the stylus and have a scredriver, and uhh.. I'd have a brick phone... and that would destroy the geeky cool factor...
Re:What I really miss in cell phones... by jorlando · 2004-05-27 12:06 · Score: 1

modded as funny?

I mean it...
Re:What I really miss in cell phones... by pyrrhonist · 2004-05-27 14:52 · Score: 1

lots of times I needed a damn multimeter and I looket to the cell phone and imagined it could have a pair of probes...
Digital Phonimeters? Hmmm, I can see it now...
If you make yours an Extech, you would have a built-in laser!
If you got a Triplett, you could get a free poster!
And there's probably already a phone on some Fluke multimeter. Hell, this one comes with an orgasm.

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Show me on the doll where his noodly appendage touched you.
Re:What I really miss in cell phones... by simonjester2424 · 2004-05-27 18:25 · Score: 1

I wonder how hard it would be, I have a fairly small multi-meter on my desk, but its still bigger than most of the new phines out there.

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Re:What I really miss in cell phones... by jorlando · 2004-05-28 01:28 · Score: 1

not hard... I have an old (more than 15 years) voltmeter and ohmmeter from hioki, sized like a credit card.

a large size from the footprint is due to the rotary dial (select VAC, VDC, ohms and continuity). Using the phone keys for selection you could have the same footprint of any cell phone, a bit bolder due the probes connectors.

it's feasible, the problem is: there is a market for this?

geeks of the world in need of a cell phone with multimer, unite :-)

Might be useful in a museum... by FirstTimeCaller · 2004-05-27 08:31 · Score: 2, Insightful

If anyone has been to Seattle's Experience Music Project (assuming the outside appearence didn't scare you away), this could be used as a replacement for the MEG devices that they provide. I could see using this to point at an exhibit and getting bluetooth audio streamed to your phone. Might be useful for museums that don't have Paul Allen's deep pockets.

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Wanted: witty unique signature. Must be willing to relocate.

damn it! by Haydn+Fenton · 2004-05-27 08:31 · Score: 2, Interesting

You wouldnt believe my face when i saw this story.. I've been mouseless for some time now (I'm sure a /.er can help me - details below), this was a god send.. then the site gets slashdotted - im not so happy
then i see some mirrors - im happy again
then i find it wont work with my phone - im pissed.

Anyway, I have two mice (1 USB and 1 PS2), yet neither work (the cursor will not move and clicking has no effect). Windows says the drivers are fine, it's not a virus.. i've been told it might be the motherboard, can anyone verify this?
The mouse was jumping a little a few days before breaking, then the day before it broke it was stopping and starting. The day it broke.. well, it broke. Right in the middle of making the GUI for a program.

WHY ARE MOUSEKEYS SO DAMN SLOW?!?

Re:damn it! by Haydn+Fenton · 2004-05-27 08:40 · Score: 1

do you have any idea of how long it takes me to tab through all the links (or use mousekeys) on pr0n sites before i can get to what i want?

Nobody can understand the pain im going through.
Re:damn it! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 08:45 · Score: 1, Funny

Did u try rebooting it?
Re:damn it! by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 08:51 · Score: 1, Funny

Try cat /dev/mouse and see what comes out.
Re:damn it! by bcmm · 2004-05-27 09:12 · Score: 1

Who needs a mouse? Or even a cursor?

--
# cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i llama
Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
Re:damn it! by dJCL · 2004-05-27 09:20 · Score: 1

New trick: Tab, Shift-Tab, Alt-Tab, Space, Enter and the Arrow keys... trust me, you get proficient at them and the mouse will seem slow by comparison for everyday tasks...

--
On Arrakis: early worm gets the bird. Magister mundi sum!

Wait a Sec by ZHaDoom · 2004-05-27 08:32 · Score: 2, Funny

Dont have a phone call while your using your new mouse. Sure let me see whats playing tonight. One second (scruffing sound) Sorry about the but my phone is also my mouse.

--
War isn't about who's right. It's about who's left.

Slashvertisement? by Quixote · 2004-05-27 08:32 · Score: 3, Informative

Submitter: Stab, a.k.a. Anil Madhavapeddy
Story is about HighEnergyMagic, for which WHOIS tells me:

Administrative Contact: Madhavapeddy, Anil anil@recoil.org 100 Carnbrae Avenue Belfast, Northern Ireland BT8 6NH UK +44 7771640674

Seriously, shouldn't the submitter put some sort of a disclaimer somewhere? Or failing which, at least pay Slashdot to run these "ads", dammit! :)

Re:Slashvertisement? by stab · 2004-05-27 08:52 · Score: 4, Interesting

Give me a break ... where do the disclaimers stop? I mean, the software's being given away for free for non-commercial use, and I think it's of interest to other techies. Notice I didn't submit anonymously.

And don't start spouting "open-source this, open-source that" to me ... I do my bit there as well. But noone cares about that stuff, so why bother talking about it instead of stuff I think is fun?
Re:Slashvertisement? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-05-27 09:18 · Score: 4, Insightful

I believe you could avoid any accusations of dishonesty by just writing your blurbs to say "Check this out! My company...etc. etc.". People do that often and it's not a problem if the tech is cool enough (and this tech is cool). People get annoyed when you write the blurb as though you're just a third party bystander who found this out there. Otherwise it smells like astroturfing. This tech is cool enough to stand on its own, why mess around with marketing stuff that will give geeks pause?
Re:Slashvertisement? by stab · 2004-05-27 09:26 · Score: 2, Interesting

Yeah, I think you're right ... live and learn eh? First time I've heard the term 'astroturfing', not going to forget it in a hurry :-)
Re:Slashvertisement? by Quixote · 2004-05-27 10:14 · Score: 1

Did I mention "open source" in my post? Or are you trying to flash your OSS creds to catch some slack?
Your post reeks of astroturfing (thanks AC, I forgot the right word). Nowhere did you mention your affiliation with the company or the research lab.
See the use of "they" in this sentence:
The tags used are really robust - they did a wastebasket torture test for a bit of fun as well :-)
It would indicate a separation between you, the postor, and the company, HEM, when in fact there is none.
Re:Slashvertisement? by stab · 2004-05-27 10:38 · Score: 1

I can only say that it's pretty obvious that wasn't my intention ... if it had occurred to me that this "astroturfing" was a problem, I could have submitted the story anonymously, or used a friend's account, or a hundred other ways to do it properly.

You might think it's clever to post my home address and phone number to /. by "cunning" use of the 'whois' command, but really - it isn't.

If I've offended, then I apologise.
Re:Slashvertisement? by Quixote · 2004-05-27 12:46 · Score: 1

You might think it's clever to post my home address and phone number to /. by "cunning" use of the 'whois' command, but really - it isn't.
Seriously, man, drop it. If it was a mistake, apologise (as you finally did in the last sentence), and move on. Bringing up OSS and your home address (how is anyone supposed to know it's your home address? It is public WHOIS knowledge, for Chrissake!) just prolongs the suffering. Seeing the fact that you've been around on the 'net for so long, I'm surprised you haven't heard of astroturfing; there was even a slashdot headline about it last Friday.
So, what is your relationship to this company HEM? Just curious.
Re:Slashvertisement? by The+Cydonian · 2004-05-27 23:11 · Score: 1

I think the real question is what is a Gult doing on /. (via Ireland) of all the places. :-)
(Always thought the only places you could find Tech Gults were Sunnyvale and Hyderabad...)

--
More than mere navel gazing.
Re:Slashvertisement? by ilargi · 2004-06-02 01:38 · Score: 1

Back in November, I deleveloped an application (MobileEye) which converts a camera phone into a barcode reader. This work was already presented in the MovilForum conference organised by Telefónica in SPAIN. Therefore, I dont think that this SpotCode system is anything new. I was the author of the TRIP system at the University of Cambridge, on which I believe the SpotCode is highly based on. I think it is really likely that they have used the algorithms that I described in my PhD dissertation. I would have appreciated some acknowledgement! Both the TRIP system and the MobileEye application are opened source available at: http://www.ipina-dorsman.org/trip

Re:Astroturf... by forrestt · 2004-05-27 08:33 · Score: 1

You forgot to mention the picture of him at the bottom of the page.

Reminds me of a few things... by Flat+Feet+Pete · 2004-05-27 08:34 · Score: 1

QR Codes:
This guy has got a phone that reads qr codes. More info here.

CueCat:
nuff said

My CD Player: (blatant self promotion)
Keep the camera still and move the cards.

Also I couldn't find any of the guestural/movement stuff you'd associate with a mouse. More like buttons you'd press with the camera.

I'm not sure if it's just because I'm interested, but there seems to be a lot of camera based code reading bits around recently.

Re:Reminds me of a few things... by maxdamage · 2004-05-27 10:41 · Score: 1

CueCat:
nuff said

When I saw this that was the first thing I thought!

Right idea, wrong tool by bo0ork · 2004-05-27 08:41 · Score: 2, Interesting

I haven't RTFA (./:ed), but these guys have potentially made a great piece of software for the physically impaired. Strap a webcam to the side of your head: Voila, no need to use hand to maneuver a mouse.

--
Does everything include nothing?

bad... by proudlyindian · 2004-05-27 08:43 · Score: 2, Funny

Now how will you (pretend to) listen to your gf/boss when ur actually surfing ;)

Striving to be common....

--

Striving to be common...

Doesn't work on P900 by clmensch · 2004-05-27 08:48 · Score: 2, Interesting

I installed the app on my P900 (28kb), but when I try to run it I just get a "Folder Not Found" error. And now when I try to uninstall it, I get a "There is insufficient memory available for the specified installation." This after a phone reboot. Ah, Symbian...

--
There is no gravity...the earth just sucks.

Did the submitter read the article? by tgd · 2004-05-27 08:50 · Score: 1

This is a camera phone barcode reader for a special "dot" format, not a mouse/keyboard.

For what its worth, that sort of thing exists, too. I had a program on my mac, which I can't recall its name, that let me move the mouse, click, and control things like iTunes via bluetooth from the phone. Didn't work well.

Either way, the submitter doesn't seem to have read the article. Which is really weird, given the other comment someone posted that the submitter is the person who WROTE the article.

Freecache of the videos... by acariquara · 2004-05-27 09:03 · Score: 1

plasma
spinner
throw
slider
passive-throw-subtitle
passive-crumpled-subtitle

--
Dear aunt, let's set so double the killer delete select all

something is better than nothing by Doc+Ruby · 2004-05-27 09:04 · Score: 1

Because the cameraphone is better than nothing, and it's very well integrated with the phone. It's about as good as a disposable (film phone, and much more convenient. The ease of use of a single device for all these functions translates to ubiquity and popularity - everyone does it, at the entry level. So the network effect of exponentially increasing value gets started right away.

There's nothing to stop a "specialist" or enthusiast from getting a better outboard camera, etc. Especially with Bluetooth, we're establishing a mobile platform with minimum quality on a broad minumum featureset, on which people can improve with components. It sounds like the right approach to me.

--

--
make install -not war

Blindingly obvious by t_allardyce · 2004-05-27 09:07 · Score: 2, Interesting

Ok maybe im pointing out the stupidly obvious but.. bluetooth (or even just normal phone/wap) is TWO WAY! why would you need a camera phone with ugly spots all over your poster/screen!? just press cursor keys on your phone and send that over blue-tooth (like a dvd menu interface)?

What would be totally totally neat would be a dumb-terminal standard using bluetooth so when you walked into say an airport and launched the 'dumb-terminal' app on your phone you would get a screen produced by the airport computer which would be able to tell you exactly where you were (triangulation or bluetooth 'cells') on a visual map. Then you could just tap in the 'customer code' on your ticket and the airport computer would be able to tell you the real time of your flight, delays, where you should go, how much time you had, where you could get discount booze etc etc. the same could work for libraries, train/bus stations, sports-games, malls, towns, tourist attractions, and of course cinemas (where the screen would say "turn your fucking phone off" just before the film started) the protocal could either be like wap/html or pushed by the server, whatever aslong as its a standard, its open, it supports funky graphics, sound and vide and you dont get charged for it.

--
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.

Re:Blindingly obvious by Nevo · 2004-05-27 10:34 · Score: 1

This seems seriously cool to me.

I check into a convention. The program has descriptions of each of the presentations with one of these barcodes. I use the barcode and my cellphone to get more info about the presentation, and decide I want to attend. Press a button on my cellphone and the convention organizers know I'm going to that session, and my cellphone calendar is updated with that session.

I'm in a museum and want to know more about the exhibit. Wave my phone over the barcode and get more info on the exhibit.

And that's just off the top of my head. Yes, I know there are other ways of accomplishing those two tasks. But imagine what could happen if all these disparate things could be integrated into my cellphone/PDA/whavever and I carry around the information I glean from my encounters with these barcodes.

I see a *lot* of potential here.

I must be tired. by freeze128 · 2004-05-27 09:15 · Score: 1

I thought you said:

As cool as it is for a proof of concept, the idea is mice.

They can't be doin too well by foniksonik · 2004-05-27 09:19 · Score: 3, Funny

They've already put their domain up for sale!

--
A fool throws a stone into a well and a thousand sages can not remove it.

Re:They can't be doin too well by t_allardyce · 2004-05-27 10:11 · Score: 1

Problem is if your going to develope something so radical you'd better make damn sure its a very very very good and marketable idea that fixes an existing problem or atleast makes people think theres a problem and that it fixes it. Otherwise you go the way of the cue-cat and your marketing team jump off the roof while high on that private stash of coke you bought off a shifty looking peruvian shepperd.

--
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.

SSH on Symbian OS by MoreDruid · 2004-05-27 09:35 · Score: 2, Informative

Here you will find putty for the symbian OS, so your SSH fix is already available. I have it on my nokia 3650. It's a pain to use because you have to type in the commands and with a cellphone keyboard this is absolutely not intuitive but it works.

Why you would want to put a webserver on your phone is beyond me though, the bandwidth technology is still a long way from usable for this kind of thing. Maybe in the future though, but still... what do you want to serve? A live stream from your phone that sitting in your pocket? Wow... a dark screen... that would be cool to watch.

Sure there would be some use for this (live webcast from a convention for instance) but it's more a brag thing than something useful as opposed to an SSH client.

--
The best weapon of a dictatorship is secrecy, but the best weapon of a democracy should be the weapon of openness.

Re:SSH on Symbian OS by electrichamster · 2004-05-27 10:51 · Score: 3, Interesting

You can get both a dyndns client and a webserver for the sony ericsson P800/P900, so there you go, all bases covered :)

I've been doing this for a year now by jgarland79 · 2004-05-27 09:39 · Score: 3, Informative

Sailing Clicker does just this. I'm using a 12" Powerbook with built in bluetooth and a Sony Ericson T68i. I can controll the mouse movements with the joystick on the phone.

--
Microsoft Windows runs on stress and frustration.

Re:I've been doing this for a year now by Sunnan · 2004-05-27 22:32 · Score: 1

Using the camera to track the movements isn't the same thing as using some dinky "joy"-stick.

Re:Cellphone as virtual mouse and keyboard by stab · 2004-05-27 10:10 · Score: 1

Err, no ... the camera does all of the image processing, so there is no GPRS or MMS stuff going on.

The idea is that you interact with local interfaces with low-latency (comms over Bluetooth, fast and free), and when/if you want to buy something, you can just go online and pay via your phone bill without having to whip out credit card numbers etc.

Nothing New by ftzdomino · 2004-05-27 10:15 · Score: 1

For controlling a computer via bluetooth, there is Bemused Which works pretty well for playing mp3s, and can do other things which I haven't tested. There have been a lot of other attempts to read data in with camera phones. http://semacode.org/ allows you to open up web links from physical items.

I'm working on an open source bar code recognition program which functions, but is still in its alpha stages.

Re:Cellphone as virtual mouse and keyboard by jrumney · 2004-05-27 10:20 · Score: 1

Err, no ... the camera does all of the image processing, so there is no GPRS or MMS stuff going on.

The idea is that you interact with local interfaces with low-latency (comms over Bluetooth, fast and free), and when/if you want to buy something, you can just go online and pay via your phone bill without having to whip out credit card numbers etc.

OK, I see the cellphone in there - instead of pulling out my credit card number, I pull out some phone number I guess. But I still don't see a mouse and keyboard, sounds like a barcode scanner to me (and no, I still can't get to the website to RTFA).

Did you read the article? by dangermouse · 2004-05-27 10:20 · Score: 1

I think you missed the point of the article. The on-phone software "locks onto" those circular "barcodes" with the phone's camera, and can detect phone movement relative to them. If you have a GUI interface with a spotcode on a slider, for instance, you can "grab" the spotcode with your phone and, by moving your phone around, drag the slider.

This is not cuecat, and it's not Salling Clicker-- Salling Clicker does none of the motion detection or image processing stuff.

You think that's odd. by /dev/trash · 2004-05-27 10:24 · Score: 1

Last night I was on and tried to post a comment but got: "DB is being worked on, so no commenting". Which is okay, but within 30 minutes three new stories were added.

That's not how they make money... by dgies · 2004-05-27 10:31 · Score: 4, Insightful

Carriers generally LOSE money on the phones. A phone with more whiz-bang features is a more expensive phone they have to subsidize. Carriers make money off of charges for using the network. The reason all the carriers are promoting picture phones is because they're hoping you decide to use your fancy new picture phone to send and recieve pictures over the cellular network, which they can charge extra for. That's the same reason they were heavily promoting downloadable ringtones and games last year. All carriers make money off of is your use of the network. The phones are just a nuisance from a carrier's point of view.

OMFG CONVERGENCE IS TEH SUX!!!!111 by dangermouse · 2004-05-27 10:37 · Score: 2, Interesting

Why integrate a cell phone with all these add on features that aren't nearly as good as things devoted specifically to the task?

Like what? What device, specifically, will perform the task these guys are describing? Are you going to build a completely new device with a camera, mouse buttons, and wireless connectivity for people to carry around so they can use these interactive installations?

Doesn't it make more sense just to install some software, which is practically free, on a device which already has all the necessary hardware?

Doesn't it make sense, if there are a lot of applications which require the same hardware, to just build one damn device and use it for all of them? If you really need a better implementation of one specific application than this convergence device can provide, carry a specialized device when you need it, as well. That still beats carrying a bag full of devices around all the time, when on any given day at least half of them are expensive and complete overkill.

Cellphone usage proposal by blingbing · 2004-05-27 10:43 · Score: 1

What about cellphone as a TV romate controller? so next time you can't find your reomoate control, you can always pull out your cellphone.

or car door opener? car engine starter? that's one less thing to carry around. the only problem is when the phone battery runs out, you are stuck and you can't call AAA.

A move to the dark side? by Foo2rama · 2004-05-27 10:49 · Score: 1

Is it me or do spot codes look vaguely like the Imperial emblem from star wars? **Insert funny star wars quote/joke here as I can't think of one**

--

---In a time of Chimpanzees I was a Monkey.

Re:Cellphone as virtual mouse and keyboard by Kiryat+Malachi · 2004-05-27 10:53 · Score: 1

The glyphs they use for recognition are orientated; by processing the image of the glyph, the phone can determine a relative motion and rotation and suchlike, which allows it to work as a mouse, sort of.

Is there a claim that it could act as a keyboard? I didn't see it...

Anyway. Imagine a glyph which represents the volume control for your computer. Aim the phone at the glyph, then hold down the 'activate' button, and twist. The phone measures how much rotation you apply, and changes the volume accordingly.

Neat in concept; not sure how useful in reality.

--

---
Mod me down, you fucking twits. Go ahead. I dare you.
(I read with sigs off.)

The mark of the beast by tepples · 2004-05-27 11:24 · Score: 1

If the spot codes can hold a few bytes of info - wave your cell over a tattoo

I can think of at least 666 things wrong with that scenario.

Other 2d barcodes could rapidly outpace this by jhsiao · 2004-05-27 11:47 · Score: 3, Interesting

It appears that Spotcode supports only 42 bits. Obviously, this is to accomodate the low processing power and camera quality of most camera phones on the market. At only 42 bits, the spotcode can't support any meaningful alphanumeric. But as a numeric value, there are enough unique patterns (over 4 trillion) to support almost 700 spotcodes for every human on the planet.

But with cameras and processing power on cell phones getting more sophisticated, other 2d barcode like QR Code or semacode will eventually outpace this technology with their considerably larger data capacity (up to as many as 4000 alphanumeric characters). In fact, semacode is already demonstrated on Series 60 implementations.

The submitter points to an application that uses spotcodes for remote control. In that implmentation, the spotcode translates to a number which the program then uses to send an instruction over Bluetooth.

However, those wishing to skip the tedium of entering URLs from the keypad using Spotcodes should note that BangoSpot (using the Spotcode technology) almost certainly uses a middleware server which performs a Spotcode number-to-URL lookup. So someone will know that you're using the Spotcodes. It's sort of like the CueCat but the implementation _requires_ them to know what you're looking up in order to provide a WAP URL.

It's an interesting approach, but I wonder how fast cellular carriers can adopt Spotcode-to-URL servers in their network before phone technology ends up leapfrogging and reading and entering sophisticated 2d barcode data directly into a phone browser.

Re:Other 2d barcodes could rapidly outpace this by williwilli · 2004-05-27 15:33 · Score: 1

Agreed, of the technologies I've seen so far this one is quite cool, but I think semacodes provide a superior implementation.

Semacodes are based on an open standard, they support more characters, they link directly to a URL and could easily support the features show in the story. As far as I know, semacodes are also free for any use, not just noncommercial use.
I've started a project to create a game framework using semacodes as location markers in an online, real-world RPG called SemaRPG. This framework could be customized and extended and used with standard technologies outside of the concern of cel carriers. As net-enabled camera phones become more pervasive I think these various URL-marker technologies like spotcode and semacode will continue to try and compete for market acceptance (Sony has it's own proprietary standard they would love to see adopted, etc.). It will be content that drives the adoption of these standards, so anyone interested in contributing to some open content is encouraged to check it out. SemaRPG could be a relatively simple project to put together that ends up being a lot of fun!
Re:Other 2d barcodes could rapidly outpace this by rayand · 2004-05-27 21:53 · Score: 1

The point is that the phone is always connected.

That means you can have (say 42 bits) "limited" capacity, and do the resolution to richer content (URL's etc) on the network. Also means that once printed, a spot can have a long life.

QRcodes and such like have to carry a heavy payload because they were designed in the days of "non connected" readers.

Horses for courses.

Chocolate + Peanut Butter = mmmm by d474 · 2004-05-27 14:23 · Score: 1

Cellphone + CueCat = wow.

Wish I would've thought of that.

--
Authority questions you. Return the favor.

New use for stickers. by d474 · 2004-05-27 14:31 · Score: 1

I can just see a new black market for stickers to put over the originals that link to the info. This could lead to gorilla combat advertising. You go to a Pepsi poster, and the Coke Rep puts a different sticker over the original to link you to some Coke website coupon or something stupidly capitalist like that.
You could wear a dorky T-shirt with some circular logo on it that chicks can snap a picture of and it links her to your account on some dating website or something stupidly desperate like that.
It'll never work.

--
Authority questions you. Return the favor.

Re:Next up... by gwoodrow · 2004-05-27 16:29 · Score: 1

Aw, my previous post wasn't at all off topic! Who's the person without a sense of humor?

But for those that have difficulty connecting humor to real-world events, I'll explain. What I was trying to get across is that I think the number of items being released that add in mostly useless extra features and hybrid functions is ridiculous.

A phone with remote control, mouse, keyboard, and pop-out canteen are just extra baggage. I have a nice samsung flip-phone with so many features it bothers me. I just want to keep it in my pocket unless I need to call someone. Why is any of this extra stuff necessary?

The mashing of many different kinds of media devices together is useless. Listening to music is something that can either be totally passive or integrate fully into one's day. Therefore - improved mp3 listening, options, and storage is always welcome.

Watching a video screen or playing a game is NOT a passive or easily-integrated activity. It requires mostly full attention to watch, listen, AND interact with something (unless it involves listening to your girlfriend gripe - that's easily ignored).

A cell phone that serves as a virtual keyboard/mouse is as usless as computer tower with lotion dispenser

So you see, the ON-TOPIC joke was that these devices are mostly a waste and will not be making any sort of drastic change in a user's life - save for a few more bucks siphoned from his or her wallet. Most people don't even know how to use all the buttons on their regular mouse - what in the world makes anyone think they're going to try to figure out how to use their phone as a mouse? Baby steps, people... baby steps.

Think about it this way: UNIX is as good as it is because it has several different smaller tools that are organized differently to serve different functions. But the smaller tools within the system remain the same - and they remain the best at what they do. Windows sucks because each program has to reinvent the tools they use every time - and each one does it so badly.

We need phones that can just be phones, mice/keyboards that can just do what they do, refrigerators that keep food cold, computers with hardware/software and not tissues, and digital music players that just play music. Why is the baggage necessary at all?
Personally, I'd RATHER have a jump to conclusions mat.

Correct URL by Lobsang · 2004-05-27 16:44 · Score: 1

Oops,

This is the right URL. Sorry about that... :)

Re:Cellphone as virtual mouse and keyboard by jrumney · 2004-05-27 22:22 · Score: 1

Is there a claim that it could act as a keyboard? I didn't see it...

The headline. But I guess that's made up by CmdrTaco, not the submitter. Slashdot's usual standards.

Better use, same idea by gosand · 2004-05-28 01:23 · Score: 1

Whip out the phone, take a pic of the broad. Phone flashes green if she's good, Red if she's not.

Or you could snap the pic and send it here.

If it comes back with Salma Hayek, take her home now. Abe Vagoda, run.

--

My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

CueCat debacle revisited? by macraig · 2004-05-28 07:51 · Score: 1

Hmmm... I still have my CueCat gathering dust in a corner, after that similar attempt to further commercialize hyperlinking failed. Might this not suffer the same fate? At least in this instance the device already has am existing primary purpose (as a phone), unlike the now-near-useless CueCat (it can be adapted as a barcode reader with some effort).

Re:robust robust robust Arrrrrggggg !!!! by maximilln · 2004-05-31 00:00 · Score: 1

I did approve the offtopic in M2 but I'd like to add to this.

I feel the same way about "touch base". Every time I hear someone use the term "touch base" I get the impression that they want to keep in contact because the association is doing far more to benefit them than it is to benefit me. I guess I've just been screwed over by too many managers who always want to "touch base". Funny how they never want to "touch base" about increasing my salary or promoting me. It's always just to ride my backside.

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+++ATHZ 99:5:80

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