Slashdot Mirror
GrokDoc Goes Live; All GNU/Linux Newbies Welcome
An anonymous reader writes "Writing at LinuxWorld, Groklaw's PJ asks "What Do Newbies Need to Make the Switch to GNU/Linux? and invites the world - literally - to help with answering the question, by participating in the wiki she and some colleagues have just launched. GrokDoc aims to turn the usual process on its head: "Instead of experts telling newbies how to do things, we will let newbies show and tell us what they need." Might be a fantastic way to help push Linux still further toward that fabled tipping-point."
but you know the newbies STILL won't RTFM
"Some things have to be believed to be seen." - Ralph Hodgson
This is the Montessori method of teaching Linux. Brilliant. Maybe I can get some questions I've had answered, finally.
the major advances in civilization are processes which all but wreck the societies in which they occur - A.N. White
Isn't this just like a regular forum like
r g
www.linuxquestions.org
or
www.mandrakeusers.o
or
whatever fedora people use?
Its just a fancy forum! Move along, nothing to see here people.
On the other hand, rather than pushing linux past a "tipping point," listening to newbies might lead to many of the aspects of the Microsoft/Mac models that many hard core PC users hate.
Not that I think this is a bad thing, but it's worth considering that if, for instance, standardarized application appearance/performance becomes more important, much of the speed and robustness of Linux may fall by the wayside.
Being able to detect and have control panels for common peripherals like sound cards and printers. Some distributions do this better than others, but a newbie shouldn't have to deal with the nuances of OSS vs. ALSA vs. JACK or CUPS vs. LPR just to listen to music and print a document.
... that the entire /. community is a bunch of newbies?
Hmmm.
NEVER tell me to modify the xyz file in the abc directory!
No offense as I'm sure the intentions are good, but aren't there already several dozen similar sites and services like this? Why not contribute the man power and resources to an existing project instead of duplicating the work?
Blind leading the blind? I don't see many schools asking students to lead class and I think there is a reason...
1. An installation process as straightforward and simple as Windows
2. The device compatibility offered by Windows
3. The level of cooperation shared by Windows applications
4. The games available on Windows
5. The simplicity of changing system configurations offered by Windows
I wonder where the heck I can find an OS that does all that and more? Hmmm...
(This is not a bash on Linux. I use Linux and love Linux for doing SERIOUS WORK. Most of the world does not do SERIOUS WORK at home. Windows meets virtually every requirement a home user could have. To meet these requirements, Linux would have to effectively become Windows. I, personally, would never use that distro.)
Even uber-newbs like the differences they can see between Linux and other OS alternatives. What we need is something they can understand, while still maintaining the environment of speed and customization that we have all grown to love. Discovering new things should be up to the user, but for those who need their hands held, they have somewhere to go instead of resorting back to the monopoly.
Read the only personal Runyon page out there.
as newbie after newbie complain that linux needs a "clipy". or worse, a talking, pop-up tux.
Assuming this is implemented well, I could see this being a very useful tool for new linux users. It seems like the hardest time I have convincing people to at least give Linux a try is when they want to know where to go when they need help. It is often a little difficult to describe to them how they need to search Google, picking through endless messageboard postings and offtopic comments, and find what they need, especially when they aren't even sure what they were looking for in the first place. A centralized resource that is helpful and friendly could be very useful for those who are intimidated by learning a new OS.
This kind of testing is exactly what needs to be done. Recently I took several seminars on useability engineering and useability testing, and I was amazed at how much better you can make a product after testing it. I suggest that if you do plan to add your input to the project that you incoiurage the user to think out loud and write down all the things they say. It's really enlightening to hear a user say something like, "I'm looking for a button to do XYZ." when you know that the feature he wants is in a menu right in front of him.
My only concern is that, quite frankly, I find that the first and most difficult hurdle for new users is installing linux. Many people have no clue what's inside of their machine, and more times than not you need to specify some odd bit of hardware during the setup process.
Heh, I should try this on my mother.
100% Crunchier
Stop calling them newbies. It's to much of a deragatory name and tends to push people away. How about calling them beginners or something like that?
I don't consider myself a newbie by any stretch of the imagination, but the majority of the time I still can't make sense out of linux documentation.
I tried every night for two straight weeks (reading the docs, getting some great help from the standard linux forums, reading every samba tutorial I could find etc) to get Samba working on my home network before finally giving up on it (and hence linux altogether).
You can't really complain about newbies not reading the manual when the manual either just plain doesn't contain the information you need, or has wrong or out-of-date information in it.
The same way they don't need DOS. And they definitely don't need "GNU/Linux". Give us a break, any newbie who wants to go around pronouncing that awful name all day is a nerdy geek and no newbie.
Anyway, Linux is the underlying OS and no use to any newbie. Newbies want to use a user-friendly desktop system. The discussion can't be centered on Linux itself. There should be discussions specific to each distro or window-manager.
Newbies don't give a shit about the OS. They want to install a desktop and run things and go back and easily find and use the files they created last week. Oh and, no childish games about names, evil monopolies, litigious bastards and whatnot. In other words, no "grokxxx"!
What manual? You mean man pages (already getting into an abbreviation now, just the name) written in programmer/sysadmin speak, which is composed of equal parts arcane jargon and acronyms, and assumes a background in Unix administration and total familiarity with running Bash? That manual? You are correct, they will look at it and go "this is absolutely NFG for my purposes right now".
Patience.
To determine who should switch, it is important to note where Linux is best/strongest and where it is most weak.
We still can't run games out of the box. We've got to compile kernels and tweak and adjust because I have YET to see a Linux distro install itself optimized for any given graphics card allowing for 3D acceleration that's worth a damn... OUT OF THE BOX... (please don't tell me anything that works after tweaking... it's the before-skilled-tweaking that I'm talking about.)
So gamers? You're stuck with the trojan/virus/worm-target, MS Windows for now.
If you're browsing the web and doing email and quite possibly even things like the office apps, graphic and web design, you're about ready with some exceptions. Just install whatever Linux distro appeals most to you and go with it... they're almost all free to acquire to take your time, learn a little and install them all, evaluate and decide. It's all good.
If you're running server-oriented services such as SQL, HTTPd, SMB, NFS, FTP, SMTP, etc... Why haven't you changed already!? What are you stupid?!
I know RMS has a point that many GNU utilities are in Linux. But as a brand name, it's crap. "Linux" is hard enough to remember or understand in comparison to names like "Macintosh" or "Windows" - please, please don't make it worse by adding something vaguely unpronounceable and obscure-sounding at the beginning and then arguing about it endlessly.
Just call it Linux. Not Lindows, not GNU/Linux, not the endless new and old distribution names (and what the heck is "Gentoo" anyway?!), just Linux.
Then people might understand what the heck you're talking about. Which would be a step in the right direction.
sulli
RTFJ.
well, for starters you need to buy the SCO Intellectual Property License for Linux which can be nowwww bought online at a special discount price of $49.00 only for desktop users. So hurry..while SCO^H^H the offer lasts...
Abandon a piece of Unix tradition. Namely the importance of commandline. Why?
The most promising Linux newbies are those who aren't computer newbies but who are yet to be turned into Linux users/advocates. I'm talking about the people who have wide knowledge of how computer and windows work. Those that do patch, run firewalls, set up networks for their buddies and so on. Unfortunately they also like how Windows works. By GUI.
Now, they're a good target because:
- They decide the computing trends
- They know enough to get Linux up and running
- They also can be courted with things that Linux does better then Windows
But they're also a difficult target because:
- They aren't really interested in learning new stuff. Knowing stuff is a means to an end, not an end in itself.
- UNIX way is way too hard for them and without commandline Linux isn't as complete as windows is.
But as the computing trendsetters they truly are a group that must be courted in order to get Linux a wide acceptance.
Please! Love or hate microsoft, you can thank Bill Gates and company for making computers accessible to everyone. Without the sea change that was microsoft, most tech guys here would not have jobs - why you ask?
Because there would be a lot less computers used by a lot less people.
If Linux is going to really revolutionize the industry, then useability needs to be at the forefront of its design. As a network administrator, I want to get calls from my users when stuff legitimately doesn't work. I don't want to get calls from users asking me to help them browse their filesystem, or figure out how to center and bold a title in OpenOffice.
-ted
ever see the Simpsons where Homer designs a car? that's how Linux would end up if we let the newbies do it all.
Too bad more beginners don't know about it:
Linux Learner's Guide (PDF)
-JemNo more command line.
What's That! Blasphemy!! BaSH him to Death!!!
Seriously, I challenge someone out there to make a distro where a user need never resort to the command line interface or a terminal of any kind.
I guess something like....Windows really...
If you ask Aunt Tillie to type
rpm -ivvf lovelyrpm-withnoguitoinstall-2.3-5.rpm
she will, legitimatly I think, return to windows. She's a busy person with no time to appreciate the finer points of red hat package management.(Or why up2date keeps crashing)
P.S.
This does not say that you must get rid of the command line altogether mind. Even XP still has the command prompt, hidden away somewhere.
May the Maths Be with you!
Another great place for linux newbie help, http://www.linuxquestions.org/ complete with forums and Wiki!
Even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day.
That's 50% of the reason I won't use Linux on my desktop. If I install it, I get one of two scenarios. 1- The screen res is at 640x480 and looks like crap 2- The screen res is at 1600x1200 and I can't read a single piece of text. When I try to change the resolution I either get the screen scrolling around on the monitor or I get a small square in the middle of the monitor. I've used Suse, Mandrake, Knoppix and Red Hat with varying degrees of success but my main complaint is that I don't have a drop down box that will let me adjust screen res, like I can in Windows. At least it's not as functional as the one in Windows. The other thing is Samba configuration. I may be crazy but file sharing on a Windows network should've been the EASIEST thing to configure in Linux. It's the only way that Linux will ever compete in the desktop market. I've been a computer tech for years and have used everything from the TI99/4a, a 286 running a proprietary OS called "8n1" over DOS, to my latest Windows XP machine. I dictate what my family uses as their OS (because I work on their computers for free) and if I can't configure it like they want it, how are they ever going to be able to do it? After working all day long, I don't have time to weed through hundreds of man pages, only to find out there are 10 apps that do what I need it to do, but none of them will do it without editing several files and recompiling. Also there needs to be a big red button in the center of the Linux screen that says - "I really screwed up bad, please set everything back to install defaults"
60 percent of the time, my comments are right everytime.
we will let newbies show and tell us what they need.
This is an excellent idea.
A lot of people in IT have a lot of experience with Microsoft, whose approach since they gained market dominance has been to more or less shove new products to their audience after some token sampling of the marketplace.
But FOSS is currently making a similar supply-side mistake, too: people that want to use Linux to do something in particular for their business have to "just accept" a distro and what's out there. Before you say "but they can write their own app", think - How many small business owners are capable of "writing their own app", modifying an Apache module, etc?
Sure, there's tons of free and open source software out there that people can use to build systems for their businesses, but many of those small business owners have little time or little expertise about how those pieces could be put together to help them. They need help with insight. Call it marketing, for lack of a better term.
Instead of just offering a supply, either as MS offers OurOneSizeFitsAll - take it or leave it; Linux offers an OceanOfFreePartsAnyExpertCanUse, drive a focus more onto customer demand that will help provide more people with Linux solutions that can really help them. And, if it helps them, it will help even more people as they can more easily see how it can be done.
"Provided by the management for your protection."
but it's not contained within the distro when you install it, you might not even be able to get online at all to find it, and if you did, you would have to know it exists in the first place. A lot of the problems with linux and newbies or intermediate level is that it's not WITH the installation. If you are lucky enough to have a friend or LUG handy to get you started, it's probably a lot better, but sometimes that isn't possible, and a lot of people only have one computer, so if they install linux and then get stuck, they are en-screwed pretty quick if they can't go find any decent help for one reason or another.
I agree though, task oriented and written in normal english with zero acronyms is a better idea. To ME that would make the difference between say just downloading or buying a cheap copy or paying a reasonable fee for a distro direct from the distro seller. I've gotten slightly past the total newbie experience, but initially it was a struggle, coming from an almost total no-command line background. And I'm about done registering with a buncha forums just to ask a question or take part in the conversations, I really don't want to use my email addy much anymore. I used to, but back then I got tons of spam, now that I don't register to new places or get on news lists I don't get much spam. I know that's a side issue but it's effective in keeping the box clean too.
Back to the subject, tell you what would be *nice* is if there was a program that would mirror what you are doing in the GUI right in the console in real time, just keep following along with what is going on just as if you were totally running from the console. Say you go to open a program, the console automagically types out what the command would be, and so on as you are using the program, say sorting through the file manager, and etc. Kind of like when the GUI will give you the keyboard shortcuts when you pop open a menu item, but *better*.
Anti-virus software and monthly security updates and bug patches.
The typical Windows user has become so adjusted to the idea of constant crashes, security holes, and bug fixes that they'll think Linux is somehow lacking if it doesn't provide them - constantly. After all, viruses are a normal part of computer operation, right?
And should you try to convince them otherwise, they won't believe you. I've actually heard pro-Windows CS students say, "Well, it's impossible for a computer system not to crash from time to time..."
Sometimes I think that Windows is Bill Gates' revenge against all those kids who used to make fun of him on the playground. He charges Joe "corporate-fool" Sixpack exorbitant amounts of money for the software equivalent of a Pinto - sweet revenge indeed!
The society for a thought-free internet welcomes you.
>> Users need to be educated, there is no alternative.
Nuts. This is just another way to blame users for software that isn't good enough.
Better to write software that doesn't require an education than whine about users.
-- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
We may experience some slight turbulence and then...explode. -Capt. Mal Reynolds
Recently, when my hard drive borked, I had to resort to using Knoppix to check my email, et cetera while waiting for the spare time to get things working again.
With a Knoppix CD, I could:
Now this was incredibly usable to me since I am familiar with Linux in the first place. There are only a few places where things fall apart.
I think that the Harmony Remote concept would be useful for Linux Configuration. For those too lazy to Google for it, the concept is this:
90% of everything is crap. Also, crap is relative.
First step is letting neophytes know what is out there. There are loads of different distributions, applications and desktops, and it's difficult for new users to figure out what they want.
What would be helpful is a site like Freshmeat, but set up for new users, ideally like a software store. You could look for apps under various headings, and install them by clicking a link. Maybe a Mozilla plugin that autodetects what OS you're running on and grabs the appropriate rpm/deb/ebuild/whatever. Ximian has something like this, as does Lindows, I think. But it needs to be even easier to use than their systems.
While we're wishing, how about a consistant interface for help? Base it on XML (Docbook?) and make it possible to import info and man pages, and make it auto-update from the net with bugfixes, changes, and news. I really like the old Microsoft help format, about Win98 vintage, not HTML help yet but it could display HTML and had a nice contents page and tree-style index. Hmm, time to start coding...
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
Do we let undergraduates tell the professors what they need to know? Do we let middle schoolers decide on their curriculum? No?
The point being is this: newbies do not know what they need, anymore than the examples above, or the person buying a Dell running WinXP which comes with only 128Mb of RAM.
I'm tired of people trying to make linux something that it is fundamentally not. Linux is not designed to be an OS for the masses; it is designed to work. Breaking that paradigm will inevitably break the core of what Linux is.
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
Because they still don't _get it_!
/usr/local/bin? Or maybe /usr/bin? or /usr/local/apps? (I've seen it in all 3 and more), not to mention NONE OF THESE PATHS MAKE SENSE TO YOUR AVERAGE USER!!! Even if you explain it to them.
GrokDoc is asking about the _applications_, and that's not the problem. Mozilla on Linux is the same as Mozilla on Windows. OpenOffice is the same on both platforms.
It's the system, stupid!
If I install an application on Windows (or Mac or OS/2), where does it show up? Usually on a nice folder on the desktop or on some sort of "system menu". In Linux? Usually the answer is "I don't know!". (Problem is, some will play nice, some don't). Even if I knew to get to the command line, where is it? It's usually not fixed my $PATH variable, so it doesn't point to it yet. So how do I find it?
In any other OS, it's obvious. Look in "Programs" or "Program Files". Bloody obvious. Linux? Err...is that
And last of all, don't tell the user to RTFM. Most of these FM's are derived from man pages, which are F*** all useless to your average user.
Here's a big problem with Linux. Linux users want people to switch to Linux, but they're not willing to help. It's always, "Did you 'man' it?" or "RTFM!!!".
People are used to turning the computer on and using it. I dual boot with XP Home and Fedora 2, I do not consider myself a Linux guru, but I know how to get around.
For the most part, Windows is easy. Linux is not if you grew up using Windows that last umpteen years.
Some of you will hate me for this, but the billions of distros doesn't help. With Windows, there's only one. Having a computer background, I can say I enjoy having a choice in my flavor of Linux and desktop. But the everyday user will look at this as a hinderance. They don't want to choose the wrong one. Not everyone is a Unix admin or a developer.
You can't find the same program in the same place on different distros. Or if it is, it's not given the same name. In Suse, XMMS is 'XMMS', in Fedora Core 2 it's 'audio player' or something like that. Not a big deal to the normal Linux user, but a huge deal to the everyday computer user that grew up on Windows. When they install Winamp, they're gonna find it under Winamp, not Audio player or anything else.
Not to mention the amount of upgrades different distro companies produce. People don't want to feel like they have to upgrade every six months to a year.
You can flame me all you want. The truth is, I love Linux and enjoy the upgrades, etc. But the normal computer user is discouraged by all of this.
Until Linux works with all hardware(it won't work with my Lexmark all-in-one) and is unified in it's overall look, normal users won't adopt it.
Eric Windham
my first distro was just someone I knew made a copy and gave it to me. that was enough to get me installed, but not online with, but luckily I have multiple computers so I was able to go find out what I was missing and doing wrong. Second distro was a boxed redhat 7.2, that came with two good paperbacks that had *some* useful info, but if what they said didn't work when you tried it, then back to googling here and there and yonder. Since then I just buy shipped-cloned because I am on dialup, well, don't own a burner either, running FC2 now, but that's only because I can go look up whatever I am stumped with, but I also have a lot of patience and the backup computer that I know very well, my trusty old mac classic, can get me to the web to find info. If all I had was the one computer, no way would I still be running linux, and driving an hour round trip to go to the library is not an option. I guess you just really have to WANT to run linux is what I am saying, to make it worth your while. I never went through windows insecurity, so that wasn't a factor in getting me to switch, I switched because steve jobs priced me outta macs to be frank, not because I didn't like them or couldn't figure things out, on the contrary, I always found classic to be fairly easy to use with zero instructions beyond click here, it does it. I never understood using windows *on purpose* as in going out and actually paying for it, and I never even saw anything unixy before I tried linux.
/., although someone's mom might not like it....
Yes, printed out instructions that could be included with a clone copy for another buck or two would be a pretty nice addition. I find any of the built in information I have seen to not be of much use unfortunately, for one, it's hard to keep track of what you are doing when all of it is brand new, better to have a dead trees manual by your side while you try to make sense of what is on the screen in front of you, at least it keeps the clutter down and you can scribble some notes in your manual as you tweak stuff.
I still like my idea of a command/GUI real time mirror though. Or even take it further, to build up the mind/muscle-memory deal, you start the mirror program, it forces YOU to follow the example that is indicated and to type the command, almost like a typing tutor but to learn linux, while you are actually doing what you want to be doing, not what they want you to do.
Hmm a name for the GUI/console mirror tool... heh heh heh , perfect for
Command Line Interactive Training
Watch them try and record the results. If you have a video, and they are willing, record it for your own use so as to analyze carefully what happens.
That's how usability testing is done. Although, to do it right, the user should be alone; no hints. And you need video and audio of the screen and the user.
It is worthwhile to make a highlights reel from such videos for developers to watch.
I take back what I said, I hadn't noticed at first by Grokdoc and LQ.w have different aims and, anyway, both websites have the same webmaster.
Treehugger? Treehugger... Treehugger!
I don't know about you, but if I have problems installing something, I don't always RTFM either. For example: I tried many many times to get wine to work, and every time failed. It crashes, or can't find some config file, or just doesn't do anything at all. Why didn't I RTFM? Because it is BIG and I just don't want to waste all that time to figure out just what options I need to type into the darn config file. Instead, I just boot into Windows to play games. Much simpler, not wasted time, no strange crashes, and everything is supported, including my nVidia card. Another example: printing. My machine can not print right now because the printer is networked from a Windows machine and magicfilter crashes for some reason when used in the smbprint script. Could I debug it? Probably, but why waste time? If I need to print a letter, I can just boot into Windows and use Word to type it and print it. Much simpler than spending hours messing with unfamiliar code in gdb (don't you just _hate_ gdb? It's another example, by the way. It is simpler to just put some printfs into the code and recompile than to figure out why it suddenly loses all my symbols ["can't find class string as reported by C++ RTTI"]). So, as you can see, unless the failing program does something vital to me, it is much simpler to just boot into Windows for a while, do it, and then reboot again and go on living.
I'm a computer tech and consultant that generally putters with programming. I wasn't too shocked to see, as I moved to Mac OS X, how badly the man help and documentation files were written.
My career involves many publishing venues, including a very popular book publisher and a city newspaper. While most developers are very adept at their work, self-expression or documentation is not their strong suit in general. The text is jargon-rich and circular, presuming that the reader already has a knowledge base equal to that of the writer.
This one point alone is why Linux and almost all other UNIX blends and clones never get the attention they seek. It's not that the OS is rotten (far from it), but because users have NO FRICKIN' CLUE what to do with it, including installing the OS (which programmers should really assume will be atop or supplementing Windows), and the help information is incomprehensible, if it exists at all.
Further, the diversity of X Window-based interfaces (window managers and desktop managers like KDE) are too diverse, leaving users very confused where anything is. Mac OS X is essentially the only UNIX clone/blend that a grandma can use. Sure, grandma CAN use Linux, but who's going to teach her how in a way that is understandable? She certainly won't try to READ how.
My humble opinion is that programmers should stop trying to steal the likenesses of Microsoft Windows and Mac OS X and attempt to kidnap the companies' marketing and human interface staff!
Vos teneo officium eram periculosus ut vos recipero is.
But anyway, back to the topic at hand. I think we both agree that at the moment, usability for most people is equated to having a Windows look and feel. The real challenge to the Linux community will be to get to a point where Linux's usability can be judged independently of whether or not it looks or works like Windows. This is something Apple has been quite successful at.
Don't confuse the issue!
This webpage isn't intended for computer newbies - people new to computers altogther. This is for people who want to make the Windows (or MacOS)-to-Linux transition, and need help doing it. There's still an awful lot DOS/Windows people need to learn to progress to Linux, and I think it's knowledge worth having.
All I'll say is: more power to them!
"Please! Love or hate microsoft, you can thank Bill Gates and company for making computers accessible to everyone. Without the sea change that was microsoft, most tech guys here would not have jobs - why you ask? Because there would be a lot less computers used by a lot less people."
Nice re-write of history to match your fantasy. Bill Gates and company didn't make computers accessible to everyone. Bill Gates and company opportunistically snatched a dirty clone of Gary Kildall's operating system after selling IBM something Bill Gates and company didn't have.
There was no "sea change that was microsoft" except for the change from collaborative computing to antagonistic computing, from a model following the scientific method of progress to a model of greed. Bill Gates and company have been holding computing back for twenty years. Evidence in the real world? Linux.
By the time Linux was 7 years old, it was already the number one threat to MS. (I'm sure you can search Google for those terms. Hint: Ballmer is the one who proclaimed the threat). MS had how many years by 1998? Yet the "upstart", using collaboration instead of secrecy, with enlightened self-interest to motivate instead of greed, and using a license that protects the USER instead of enslaving the user as a revenue generation unit, overtook Microsoft. They've been falling behind the penguin ever since.
I note while reading the comments that much of the whining against Linux and much of the promotion of MS comes right out of the CDs, handbooks and publications MS put out beginning in 1998 about how to deal with Linux. It's time to read Bill's memos at opensource.org/halloween and give up on the FUD. It doesn't work.
Business is waking up to the fact that it needs Linux. They are stampeding away from the ever-tightening cage that MS is attempting to lock around them. Microsoft's desperate rush to patent, while the USPTO is still rubber-stamping everything, will not be sufficient to stop the stampede.
Individuals have discovered that there are distributors of Linux who work very hard to make things easy. People are fed up with the continuous, expensive, damaging, time-consuming reminders of the low quality of MS products, which reminders come in the form of service packs that break existing "applications", viruses that eat data, exploits that allow MS "extensions" to standard HTML to hijack and control their computers. People are fed up with MS telling them they must not do this or that, with the threat of U.S. Marshals and the BSA kicking down doors. People are fed up with the increasing invasion of their privacy in return for the privilege of paying ever higher subscription fees for software that provides more functions for exploiters than those who pay the rental.
Linux works. Linux is easy enough for kindergartners to use, now. Linux has already revolutionized the industry. Linux sets individuals, businesses, governments and schools free from the illegally obtained, maintained and extended monopoly's choke-holds and its unwanted and unwarranted intrusions. Linux lets you own your computer, instead of being 0wn3d.
people don't use an "X/Linux" system, they use a "X/GLibc" system. Linux can be swapped out in favour of the FreeBSD kernel if you like. Your user space apps call GNU Libc, not Linux.
In 1983, X and TeX existed, RMS decided we needed a free OS. So he started writing one. He personnally wrote GCC, Emacs, and GDB. He recruited volunteers, he founded FSF (who hired 15 programmers), he wrote the GNU GPL, he asked people to help again and again and he gave them the tools to write free software. He gave talks, he spoke to the media, he answered slashdots questions, he has worked and worked, and produced more than anyone else has for this OS.
Linus Torvalds found the tools made by RMS and wrote some free software (it was proprietary initially but Linus GPL'd it in 1992). Linus (accidently) finished the GNU project, the pure GNU OS didn't have to be finished because a variant using Linux as it's kernel was ready.
You can call it "GNU/Linux" out of respect for the GNU programmers that wrote the largest chunk of the OS, or you can call it "GNU/Linux" because that's the only name that keeps the topic of freedom in the conversation. (IBM and MS have neither of these goals, so they call it "Linux", please don't just copy the Megacorps.)
Expert in software patents or patent law? Contribute to the ESP wiki!
..Are for true Linux users to stop telling us to RTFM.
I have a Linux zealot living at my fraternity house with me (we're mostly a geek fraternity,) and he will go on and on about how great *nix is. Since I went to a public school with the bare minimum in extra-curricular, I've grown up with Windows my entire life. I'm 19, and the most experience I've gotten with any kind of *nix is the command prompt on a solaris box and some basic SSH (which I'm not sure even counts.)
We have a router at the house running OpenBSD (that this Linux zealot designed,) and the current section (I go to Kettering U, if anyone knows what that means) has messed it up a bit. I was trying to fix it on my own, and I was thinking that I could e-mail this guy (who lives an hour away or so right now) to help me on it. He gives me the SSH info, and then keeps saying, you guessed it:
RTFM!
Which would be great. Except, being a linux n00b, I don't have a damn clue what M to F R! If I knew the commands I needed, but didn't know how to use them, RTFM would be expected. But I don't even know the commands to start out with (yes, I know about man man, but that doesn't help me a lot with editing the file that controls the router, or even where to find it.)
I guess the basic answer would be: Support from those without egos the size of Texas, and little to no conceit. That would be nice...
Reminds me of a Bash quote that states that, to get a real answer, you have to troll Linux forums/newsgroups. I haven't tried that, but I expect I may have to.
I am a software engineer who's been using Solaris for about 8 years now and just recently switched to linux as a result of a job change. Much of the switch was painless enough, but there are a few differences between the two that needed sorting out, as well as using new software and doing sysadmin things that I previously had smart people paid to do for me.
My local linux guru happens to be a good friend of mine, and even when I come to him with seemingly intelligent questions, I get borderline hostile responses, suggesting to me I am an idiot/asshole/whatever for daring to waste his time with a question that I could've found the answer to myself.
Unfortunately, for someone of my intelligence and experience, "finding the answer for myself" usually means hours spent poring through manuals and FAQs and HOWTOs for the weird little behavioral quirk I'm looking to get answered. I dare not look into newsgroups and ask, for fear of even harsher treatment.
Most of the time, the people complaining about how idiotic newbies are, are often the same people wondering why linux hasn't taken over the world, established peace and harmony and cured cancer. Quite simply, it's not because people aren't curious about a free operating system and tons of free apps to do what people normally pay to do -- it doesn't take a sociologist or economist to realize that people will gladly do the same things they pay for, for free, given the chance. The problem is, they need to ask questions, and the best people to ask generally have enormous egos and a massive elitist streak.
RTFM/RTFFAQ is not without it's merits, but unfortunately many linux geeks use it as a simple, smarmy response to questions one can't reasonably be expected to know or discover for oneself. RTFM is meant to stop people from wasting time with common questions, but instead it's being used to stop otherwise interested people from pursuing linux further because those already steeped in it treat them like idiots. People like free software, but they don't like being insulted to get it.
One of the reasons Microsoft ascended to where it is now is not because they make high quality, stable, efficient, easy to use software. It's because they treat their customers like gold, help them with their problems happily, and treat even the most idiotic questions with empathy. Linux users looking to evangelize the movement should do likewise. Remember, you were there once too, not knowing how the hell to install patches or configure a Samba server or get your network running. Just because you have the knowledge doesn't make you a better person, unless you REALLY embrace the open source movement and make your knowledge as open source as the software.
B
"I'm payin' taxes, but what am I buyin'?" -- James Brown