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Road to the Robocup 2004
RuiFerreira writes "Artificial Intelligence and Robotics researchers meet in Portugal from 27th June to 5th July in the 8th Robocup Football World Championships. RoboCup is an international research and education initiative. Its goal is to foster artificial intelligence and robotics research by providing a standard problem where a wide range of technologies can be examined and integrated. The RoboCup Federation proposed the ultimate goal of the RoboCup Initiative to be stated as follows: 'By 2050, a team of fully autonomous humanoid robot soccer players shall win a soccer game, complying with the official FIFA rules, against the winner of the most recent World Cup of Human Soccer.' Robocup has an exciting programme including RoboCup Symposium, the RoboCup Soccer (humanoid, middle-size, small-size, 4-legged, simulation), the RoboCup Rescue (real and simulated robots) and the RoboCup Junior (dance, soccer and rescue) competitions. The robotic competitions will take place at Pavilion 4 of Lisbon Industry Fair located at the Parque das Nações, the site of the 1998 World Exposition (EXPO'98)."
http://www.robocup2004.pt/imgs/demos/segway-with-b all.jpg. htm
http://www.fair.or.jp/robocup/2004/photo
Skynet....
The soccer team became self-aware at 6:21 pm. Slashdotters everywhere scared shitless. Knew the end was coming, but were more concerned about their kernels.
ruls
Robo Hooligans
It would be cool if it didn't suck.
In normal soccer you can push they other team around a bit, slidetackle etc. How many broken bones do you think there will be from the reining champions if they play against robots? Course, I would love to see a humiod robot slide tackle...
I, for one, welcome our new soccer robot masters...
Will they be allowed to use lasers? Is that against FIFA rules?
I think the human players will win by rolling around the ground clutching their knees to draw penalty shots. A robot will never be able to do that convincingly.
http://www.welton.it/davidw/
I wonder if the robots will run around taking off their shirts when they score a goal ...
those robotic rescue contests... I entered a local one with my friend not too long ago and our robots failed miserably after we fixed the 5 problems on each of ours that caused them to be disqualified. I guess the heated metal cheese grater wasnt such a great idea...
robots playing soccer? meh..call me if they include a riot function
Ever think of a game of 4-legs Vs. 2-legs? Got to be fun!
We'll know that they're really close to being like humans when they start asking ridiculous salaries, wear interesting hairdo's and date has-been pop stars :)
----- One learns to itch where one can scratch.
this is very cool.. first reply about my country.. hehe
GO CORNELL ROBOCUP!! ... Where is my jersey, Patrick?
Here is the server for the simulation league. I helped code a team for one of my college classes; it was pathetic :). The University of Amsterdam Trilean team has won three years straight. You should check it out; their team kicks some serious ass. If you're interested in the simulation league, be sure to check out the publications by the Trilearn team. The Master's thesis especially is a must read for anyone attempting to write a client. Tons of information on everything from self-localization to optimal-pass-determination.
By 2050, a team of fully autonomous humanoid robot soccer players shall win a soccer game..
Well I think if it comes down to penalties against England, they might not have to wait until 2050... has Beckham's shot come out of orbit yet?
I think that robots winning against a human team will happen much much later than 2050.
) will see the light way before a robotic team could compete with a c-league soccer team ...
It's more a gut feeling than a "sicentific based" prediction, but i think that perception and interaction with the real world is definitely the reign of animals, (and therefore humans).
It took evolution 1 billion years to create animals that run around and "act smart".
I think that the classical AI that models the world with language and rules, is a much simpler problem in comparison,
in other words, i think that a moderately intelligent computer that can understand humans and interact with them via language (see for example http://www.cyc.com/cyc/company/news/computerizing
We learn from history that we learn nothing from history - Tom Veneziano
I wouldn't say Greece bribed anyone, but the Swiss referee in the Portugal match was overtly biased on more than one occasion. Though I doubt this was bribery.
Although the Swiss are renowned for their impartiality this kind of makes me wonder if sour grapes didn't have something to do with it.
Although I am from England i'm not always patriotic and although we lost to France and later to Portugal, I think the better playing by the other team (France) meant they deserved it.
However, although I think they deserved to win. I also believe the disallowed goal, was the wrong decision, which would have meant the England win. I would have also doubted any further progression after that match.
Maybe referees shouldn't be from qualifying nations.
Of course none of this would happen I suppose if there were robot referees (or if they actually asked to see action replays, or listened to the linesmen).
What the english fail to see: http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2004/soccer/06/24/england.po rtugal/p1_campbell_getty.jpg
As far as I can recall, no contact can occur with the goalkeeper in his goal area.
Sorry
Let's just say the backbone of the Portuguese national team are FC Porto players: Nuno Valente, Ricardo Carvalho, Jorge Andrade (former player), Paulo Ferreira, Costinha, Maniche and Deco. Finish up the Champions' League winner team with players the likes of Cristiano Ronaldo and Figo, and only ignorance could claim Portugal needs referee work to win against any Euro'2004 team. We did stumble the first time, because a naive Scolari thought he could rely on former glory players like Couto. No longer. He's on the right track, and now we're poised to be European Champions.
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you
I was thinking, "Christ, *now* what has Ashcroft dreamt up?", but then I RTFA...
"Removing one's shirt after scoring is unnecessary and players should avoid such excessive displays of joy."
Boring fuckers.
Boffoonery - downloadable Comedy Benefit for Bletchley Park
Now that would be a RIOT.
Every true soccer fan knows the best part of a soccer game is the victory soccer riot. I personally think it would be funny to watch the robots riot.
The robots are only performing one task, albeit a pretty complex one.
The goalkeeper I think would be the first thing to be "got right". It's not hard to imagine a robot goalkeeper in 2050 being very good indeed at stopping shots.
Open play is a more complex problem but to have a team that beat a human team you wouldn't have to play like a human team nor necessarily be better than them at all aspects of the game. A goal keeper that is very good at saving and making pinpoint "route one" passes and some mobile and non-tiring strikers would get you a hell of a long way towards a win even if it wasn't a pretty one.
46 years is a long long time in technology in any case.
Boffoonery - downloadable Comedy Benefit for Bletchley Park
Two teams from my school down here in Australia are competing in the Junior soccer competition.
:) Well, I did chip in a $4 AUD donation in a raffle they were holding to raise air fares and the bastards stole all the soldering irons from my last electronics class to do last minute touch ups :( .Oh, they aren't using the gray color coding on the field to help navigate, so it's up to their radio control skills.
:)
The two teams in question are from Kardinia International College in Australia. Mr Ernie Follet is a stupid humorous house leader who is always wrong (NOT!) and Mr Dale Clohesy is a sport teacher at my school. (don't be suprised if anyone hears excess swearing or blowing of whistles, it's common).
I can't let out any design secrets, not that I know any
All the testing was done on a big green table set up to look like a soccer field
(AFAIK, I can't guarantee the accuracy of this information).
It will be interesting to see how well they perform, after all, I myself might be on the school/Australian team in a few years
How the most stupidifying sport in the whole world, can have any impact in robotics... The more fans it gets, less kids will be scientists.. They will be collecting cards and ball signatures from their robotic champions... - "Will you sign my football" - Bzzzzztt - printed with laser - yayyy!! this is better than mathematics and engineering, i want to be a roboballer.. I can imagine the portuguese robot football chmapionship... The country were engineering has been misunderstood for management, for more than 80 years... The robots will have a special box for corrupting the referees... Each time, a referee passes it just issues 20 euros... You know how enginners in Portugal start work in Portugal? The will all start putting their ties and look around for someone to do their work.... Pityless... You know why there are no foreign engineers in Portugal? The first month they sart working, they will hang themselves on their ties... Courtesy of the late-fascist engineering guild...
Bribing the referee is no longer against FIFA rules. :-)
Englanders just proved what they are: bad sports without any kind of fair play.
I wouldn't say Greece bribed anyone, but the Swiss referee in the Portugal match was overtly biased on more than one occasion. Though I doubt this was bribery
Biased not for the Portugal side, for sure. At the end of the game there were about 25 fouls for England and 14 for Portugal, but incredibly three yellow cards for both teams. Mr Cole for example, should have been double booked and kicked-off the game: it could only stop Ronald with faults.
Maybe referees shouldn't be from qualifying nations.
Usually the best referees do came from the qualifying nations.
It's funny how every englishman on the streets of Lisbon that night were all about fair play and congratulating us.
But then there are always those few that rather overlook what is obvious and claim that they were robbed. Hurray for the pitiful The Sun mentality.
I like this idea, of 'smart' robots knowing rules and regulations and stuff. Just don't know why they decided to let them play soccer. Why not drive around in a car. I think that would be a better way of expressing true robotic potential.
Hopefully, if we can actually accomplish this robotic feat, that we could have little robotic buddies that would follow us around and do our biddings. And we could have intellectual conversations with them, and not have them repeat the same line twice.
The trouble is with that figure, its based on the number of awarded fouls. Considering both teams seemed to be consistantly fouling or making bad tackles, your statistics could be evidence to the contrary. Fouls may be awarded when not warranted and also not awarded when they should be.
Ronaldo also himself, made many bad tackles and fouls which were not awarded, one kick to the back of the head which could have warranted a red card on its own. A kick to the back of the head against Campbell, he patted the guy on the head, then walked away laughing.
The ref also since admitted his mistake to Sven and FIFA have said he will not be shortlisted for the remaining matches.
Dont say bullsh_t, england fouls and corners allowed just show how offensive the portugal team was.
d =1 582/Match=1059188/Report=TS.html
. ht ml?p=0130_03_01_0365_0333s port1/hi/football/euro_2004 /3830451.stma /0,2458,502037 ,00.htmli o/2004/pp_ 1.0.421284148.shtmlt icle.asp?article=3801 1
http://www.euro2004.com/tournament/matches/Roun
Total shots 35 16
Possession 61% 39%
Corners won 13 9
Fouls committed 14 25
Offsides 5 2
Pinching the referee for a fault commited on the Goalkeeper area is covering out the sun with a net
You know, everyones know, fifa rules say so, that if the Goalkeeper is touched on his own small area, its fault against the team that made it. Even before the head shot from Campbell the referee had already whistled. So there wasnt a Goal Robbed since it wasnt Goal on the first place. Whatch the replay and you will notice that Ricardo was obstructed to jump with a hand on his face and shoulder from Terry.
I leave you all with the game statistics and international press, not english, nor portuguese since those could be biased. And that corroborate the previous post, almost twice as faults from the england side and the same number of yellow cards.
Cole made a pretty good job stoping Cristiano Ronaldo, that on my opinion showed some reluctance and didnt express his game the way he had showed before. But Cole should had been booked out with a yellow/red card atleast for 2 ocassions.
On the end was the indivuals game that arose, i take note of 3 for each side, Beckham for missing soundly all freekicks & penalti. James for taking out the ball from the net for atleast 2 ocassions from Figo & Rui Costa and Cole, as already noted before for stoping C.Ronaldo.
For portugal side, i take note of RuiCosta position on the middlefield, Postiga Head goal and the superb penalty with a low slow ball that just show that he has lot to give to the english permiership and the fantistic performance of RICARDO. Stoping a penalty with his own barehands, and scoring a goal deciding the fate of the match.
Just as side note, Ricardo before he went to the goalkeeper position he played as striker long time before he even joined the Sporting Lisbon, on his youth team on the lovelly city of Montijo (20km ahead of lisbon). So english fans dont take to hard the postiga penalty and the Ricardo shot. There was a reason for Portugal win.
Now you went home, as you chanted countless times before that you wouldnt until the final. Thank you for visiting us and for beeing respectfull and supporting your side without noticeable problems.
But now, dont be childish and acknowledge the defeat, we will do the same if we lose against holland.
Thank you england!
http://www.as.com/comunes/2004/eurocopa/partido
http://news.bbc.co.uk/
http://www.marca.com/edicion/notici
http://www.gazzetta.it/primi_piani/calc
http://sports.lefigaro.fr/ar
In my opinion I really believe Portugal deserved to win.
However, I don't think they did, because I believe that the goal was genuine. Maybe there would have been a goal spurred on by that by Portugal, but otherwise you would have lost. I don't feel any need to swear in my comments either or calling anyone a liar, these are differences of opinions and mistakes. I don't mind if you disagree with me, many Scots disagree, but then they also laugh at any failures on Englands part. I also hope Portugal wins, it would be great for the hosts to win the tournament.
Also in the references you cited, most of the links do not work and do not back up your claims, they are merely unbiased match results, stating what happened, no opinions either way, referees results. Like I said, the statistics only reflect awarded fouls. If they are not awarded or not awarded are dependent on the same referee. I saw a lot of this during the match.
This can be as much a sign of a biased ref as not. Certainly FIFA will not overturn a referee's decision, yet as the other poster mentioned Urs will not be shortlisted for the finals now unless the other referees show a conflict of interest. I am unsure whether it is likely the referee apologised for his mistake to the England Manager as the other poster mentions, since he publicly stated that he would do it again.
I don't think referees from qualifying nations are a bad idea, sure they might be more likely to be biased, but surely they'd have more experience.
Acknowledging the defeat is easy, like I said Portugal played better. I believe the England team was lucky you didn't score more in the 90 minutes. However, I just don't accept a lot of the referees decisions. Accepting a decision is easy when you believe it fair. Its nothing against Portugal and I do not call you childish for what you say.
The camera angle on this suggests contact, but looking closely from the lack of shadow I would say that the goalkeeper had no contact with the player.
What is clear (despite the angle) that there is no way the goalkeeper could have saved the goal from his position had no players been there. Contact with the goalkeeper is only a foul if a player obstructs the goalkeeper.
Otherwise any goalkeeper would just have to make contact with any player to null goals.
I think thats incorrect, there are plenty of times Englanders have not won or goals have been possibly wrong but they do not comment on it. In fact this is the first time i have heard one do.
Englanders just proved what they are: bad sports without any kind of fair play.
Wrong to stereotype an entire country because of something you read on a technical forum, but a further look into the story sees nothing other than a disagreement with the referee, which could hardly be counted as a 'bad sport without any kind of fair play'. I can only guess that you dislike the fact that if the referee was wrong as suggested, any victory would mean nothing. So I can undertand your vitriol.