Slashdot Mirror
Election Day Discussion
With the polls now already open in most of the country, this is the official on-topic place for all Slashdot readers to discuss the election itself. And get out and vote if you can. Also, if you haven't noticed, the Slashdot poll shows once and for all where Slashdot readers fall on the election. I'm off to vote in a couple hours. Wonder if we'll have Diebolds in my district.
First Vote!
Like always, it's a choice between a doosh and a turd sandwhich.
For meaningful change, the only choice is Michael Badnarik!
"The evil of the world is made possible by nothing but the sanction you give it." -- Ayn Rand
A place to talk politics that will start off intelligently, and end in a bloodbath where only the extreme sides remain.
And no one will change their mind, regardless.
WHAT FUN!
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
Finally, something to distract me. I want some extreme polazation in this thread people!!!
Drudge is saying voting machines were found with hundreds of votes on them, _before_ polling started in philidepllhia. Anyone know if they use diabold machines there?
Official GOD FAQ.
..it is also obvious that Slashdot has an international readership. Would there be any way to re-run the poll restricting it to US bound IP address to see if the race isn't so runaway for Kerry from the slashdot side?
That being said, I'm all for Kerry to win. But I live in a pretty red state. Though while standing in line to feed my paper ballot marked with a pen into some thing I saw that the few people in front of me had all voted for Kerry/Edwards which I found interesting, considering how little either party has paid attention to North Carolina this year.
As a rock-in-roll Physicist once said, No matter where you go, there you are.
I forgot what it was like to turn on the TV or drive 2 blocks without being flooded with political ads. Yay! Finally back to real life. :)
Dr Superlove 300ml. I use my powers for awesome
Submitted this, but in case it gets rejected, Matt Drudge is reporting that about 2,000 votes were "planted" in Philadelphia-area voting machines before the polling places opened this morning. I guess it would be un-Drudgelike to mention which candidate the votes favored, but regardless, here's the abstract as of thirty seconds ago:
Before voting even began in Philadelphia -- poll watchers found nearly 2000 votes already planted on machines scattered throughout the city... One incident occurred at the SALVATION ARMY, 2601 N. 11th St., Philadelphia, Pa: Ward 37, division 8... pollwatchers uncovered 4 machines with planted votes; one with over 200 and one with nearly 500... A second location, 1901 W. Girard Ave., Berean Institute, Philadelphia, Pa, had 300+ votes already on 2 machines at start of day... INCIDENT: 292 votes on machine at start of day; WARD/DIVISION: 7/7: ADDRESS: 122 W. Erie Ave., Roberto Clemente School, Philadelphia, Pa.; INCIDENT: 456 votes on machine at start of day; WARD/DIVISION: 12/3; ADDRESS: 5657 Chew Ave., storefront, Philadelphia, Pa... A gun was purposely made visible to scare poll watchers at Ward 30, division 11, at 905 S. 20th St., Grand Court. Police were called and surrounded the location... Developing...
go out and vote for Bush and stuff...and stuff...
[insert redundant political rant here]
"I think, therefore I get paid."
It can't be said enough times: Americans! Please go vote! Voting is a right you get to keep by the very act of exercising it.
I hope it's all decided quickly, so the Canadian who sits next to me at work can stop bitching about the election all day every day. I swear she cares more deeply about this than I do.
And, to her, no, I still won't watch F.9/11, thank you very much. I don't need any extra propoganda in my life.
Put identity in the browser.
don't bitch about the president during the next 4 years
vodka, straight up, thank you!
Finally, an slashdot story that is non-American-centric!
The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
Voting was relatively easy/painless in PA. Supposedely lines were long this morning (at least at my polling place). VA people are telling me that their polls had lines in record numbers. My parents waited in line for two hours (1 outside the building, 1 inside).
I'm curious to hear from Ohio voters. Has anyone been challenged yet?
Sig it.
A valiant attempt by the Slashdot editors to slashdot Slashdot itself.
"goatse? What's that? Anyone have a link?" - AC
Remember to vote, or P. Diddy will kill you.
Let's keep a tally of sites with relevant information. Not sure if there's a bias in their reporting of news, but I've come to like Real Clear Politics as a way to keep track of the polls, etc.
Of course there's always non-US news sites like The Guardian and The Economist's articles regarding the election.
Breaking "news" also appears on Drudge Report. As far as blogs go, I don't really have any good ones. Any other ones you guys like?
Small potatoes make the steak look bigger.
They were touch screen devices that were named "WinVote". The first thing I saw was a blue screen. Man was I scared.
On a side note, I don't remember seeing voter turnout like this before, but the only elections I was involved with in this state were strictly senatorial or congressional. Those times I was in line for a good 10 minutes, this morning was a little over an hour. There was a great turnout and just about everyone in line seemed pretty excited. The folks at the polls who weren't election officials (people from the different parties) did a good job of helping people out without bugging the hell out of us (handing out copies of the ballots, walking the old people to the building and through the line - BUT not to the voting machines).
All in all it was a good experience, and I hope it works like this across the whole country.
I've been wanting to get this off my chest for a while now, and what better forum for this than slashdot.
We have an election system here in the US that attempts to count every vote. At some point they stop counting and announce the final results.
Anyway, we learned 4 years ago (and are learning this time too) that the vote is not accurate. It is error prone and sometimes subjective. But I haven't seen anyone attempt to quantify the level of error in the voting process? Why hasn't there been some academic or impartial attempt to measure the margin of error in our polling.
Why is this important? Because if you don't know the margin of error, then you don't know what the outcome is. Period. If Bush reports 51% to Kerry 49% and the margin of error is 5%, then we don't know who won the election. It's a statistical tie and anyone who announces a winner is at best foolish.
Someone said to me that, if you are living in an area where the vote is more or less decided (such as a very strong Bush locale, or a very strong Kerry locale), especially if you are voting the other way from the general populus, then don't waste your vote on either the Bush or Kerry side. Instead, vote for one of the smaller parties - if they receive 5% of the vote, then their funding is increased, and they may be able to work on something good in your area.
This doesn't follow in all counties, just in those that are very very strongly Bush or Kerry, and you are voting the other way. 'Cos if you vote the other way, you vote will more or less be lost.
Finally, no matter which way you are thinking of voting, go out and vote. If you don't know who to vote for, then vote for a 3rd party. But cast your vote!
T.
> And get out and vote if you can.
No, no, no, no. Get out and vote EVEN IF YOU CAN'T.
I don't care how hard it is, how inconvenient it is, what state you live in - think your state's tally is a foregone conclusion? So what - the totals still matter.
Seriously, folks - no matter which "side" you're on, this election MATTERS. GO VOTE!
Or don't complain for four years.
No gods, no demons, and no masters. Secular Humanism!
Looks like the early polls are favoring kerry 53/46/1 overall and 300/270ish electorally.
"Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
The polls are swamped in fairfax. The procedure is as follows:
1) Stand in line to get your id checked. If you are registered you get a blue index card.
2) Stand in a different line with your card and wait for a winvote machine to open up.
3) When it is your turn you present your card to the election worker that supervises the terminal that just opened up. She takes your blue card and unlocks the machine.
4) You vote.
Note that thing differentiating a random person that walked up to the machine and a registered, approved voter is posession of the blue card. Multiple people left after receiving their blue cards, saying they couldn't wait another hour and that they would return later. There is nothing stopping these people from reproducing the cards and returning multiple times. The voting places are an absolute packed madhouse, NO ONE would notice if someone just walked up to the second line with a blue card.
Did anyone else see any other glaring holes in their election procedures?
<high-level position here>
<name of stupid small company here>
If you have any problems at your polling place, call the Election Protection hotline at 866-OUR-VOTE (866-687-8683). This is not the time for complaisance.
In the rest of the democratic world, as far as I know, this is illegal. It seems to us that it goes against having a fair election. And yet in America it is normal practice. Why?
11.0010010000111111011010101000100010000101101000
to all the candidates who are running today. I sincerely hope that the "best" candidate wins.
One of my even greater hopes is that whoever loses will concede and allow the victor to take the publicly appointed position. Especially in the presidential race. I feel that this country should unite under the leadership of the president regardless of who they voted for, but whoever was elected. The electoral college, given power by the people, gets to decide who the president of the United States will be for the next four years, for good or ill. I hope and pray that whoever wins will have the courage and fortitude to lead us in the next few years. I also hope and pray the "loser" will have the courage to admit defeat and let the country move forward.
We may not particularly like the choices, but let's be the best people we can be and progress from there. Best of luck/karma!!!
I leaned in and looked at the book (breaking every rule in the book by looking at the book) and saw my name and pointed to it. The attendant looked at my name and stated, "but your drivers license says 2950 Ridge Rd, but in my book it says 2951 Ridge Rd" (an address which does not exist)
She spent 20 minutes on the phone with the board of elections trying to figure out what it is she was supposed to do.
Despite having a drivers license with 2950, a voter registration card with 2950, she was bound and determined not to let me vote because her book said 2951. I asked what paperwork I would need to fill out if I wanted to claim that I had moved. She explained that I could fill out the paperwork, but my vote would not be counted until the paperwork cleared. Figuring that would mean my vote would only be counted in a disputed recount situation (if even then) this wasn't acceptable to me either.
Finally another attendant called the Board of Elections (because I was starting to get very agitated) and discovered I could fill out the change of address forms with me, vote, and then turn the forms into the board of elections today.
I'm still not convinced my vote will get counted. I was given an "I Voted" sticker, and wondered if I did or not.
Introducing Microsoft Vacuum 1.0 The first Microsoft product that doesn't suck.
If Drudge is reporting it I would suspect Democratic fraud is alleged.
Meanwhile, the Republican party is engaged in massive, organized vote fraud. Does anyone care?
and I was disgusted to see that my candidate was not on the ballot. I truly believe he can "end global terrorism within 24 hours."
Click here for a free picture of an iPod!
My head just exploded.
You don't think Kerry is the better man, but you think he's better than the other man?
Are you sure you're not one of those undecided voter?
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
In Northern Virginia, they're using WINVote machines. I used one this morning in North Arlington - and waited TWO HOURS PLUS to vote.
The wait was not due to the machines, though; they only had one set of voter rolls, and one person flipping through them to verify voters. They had us divided up into A-K and L-Z lines. The L-Z line was maybe 30-45 minutes; the A-K line was the aforementioned 2+ hours. I worry about how many people turned away from the lines, just because they didn't man the polls appropriately...
All around the world, we're watching you today. We love America, we want you to lead and inspire and show us what democracy and freedom and technology can do. But right now we're feeling scared, confused, and angry about what your President has lead you to do over the past three years.
Please, give us back the America we admire and believe in. Don't turn yourselves into a religious state. Don't turn your back on the UN and the other peoples of the world - in the end we are people first, American or French or Iraqi or Chinese second. Give us back the America that went to the moon and carried out the Berlin airlift and brought us the IT revolution. Give us back the America of Kennedy's vision and MLK's dream.
And please, don't let the world's most successful democracy be reduced to a joke with a repeat of last election's Floridan antics.
Read Pynchon.
Yes I voted, but I honestly don't understand why I bothered. I live in a state that is as far from battleground as possible and voted for the 'other guy' When the electoral college takes over and casts their lot with the overwhelming majority here my vote will be thrown on the floor. Ignored.
I don't see how I am not being disenfranchised here. Yes I know slashdot leans toward the liberal side, but it can't be that hard to understand how I feel... Voting Republican in New York is the same as voting Democratic in Texas. You don't count. When it's all said and done, you simply don't count. I can't be the only person who feels this way. Why is my voice meaningless simply due to some silly boundary drawn on a map? Can anybody give me a good reason why we don't use the popular vote... aside from the fact that politicians will no longer be able to ignore those of us in states that aren't 'battleground' ones?
and SHAME on Colorado for turning down that bill that would split their EC votes based on the popular vote. Give yourself a voice people!
I can't be the only person who feels this way.
> and Drudge is known for his share of whoppers, but this is a very disturbing report indeed...
Disturbing, yes, but it has probably been happening all over the country for decades.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
No Diebold in Dupage County, IL, I'm glad to say. :) We have the "fill in the oval, let the Scantron machine scan it" setup. I guess when your county is 90% Republican you don't feel the need to rig the election with a bogus computer voting system. ;)
-------
"Every artist is a cannibal, every poet is a thief."
Hi all,
I cannot yet vote in this country but I would like to remind you of the importance of this, and encourage you to vote.
There are certain ideas and principles that are central to the political heritage of our country: freedom of speech and free assembly without fear of persecution, the right to be secure against arbitrary search and seizure, the right to a fair and speedy public trial, and above all, the idea that all people are created equal, and have these unalienable rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, regardless of race, origin or religion.
These principles have often distinguished the U.S. from other, less fortunate places places in the world. People have admired it because of that, and the country has been able to hold the moral high ground because of adherence to these ideas.
However, although these rights should be unalienable as values common to all human beings, they cannot be taken for granted unless people take an active role in participating in the political process and ensuring that these values are held up. I have lived under three quite different political systems in my life, and not all of them have allowed its citizens to have these liberties. Through my own experiences and memories of my friends, I have seen how they can be granted and taken away, and it always happens because of either the activity or inactivity of common people, people like you and me.
So please go out and vote, and encourage your friends to do the same. And whatever your political affiliation is, I hope you think about these rights when making your choice.
Thank you.
Targo
When men used to be men
A year ago, my wife and I moved from an apartment to our house.
A week later, we went and got our drivers licenses changed, and both registered.
I registered Green, she registered Republican.
A few months later, we both received our registration cards.
She voted this morning.
When I tried to vote, after waiting for two hours I was told that I wasn't on the rolls. 20 minutes later of me refusing to leave, especially since I had my voter registeration card, they told me that I was registered at my old address.
Which is garbage, because I _never_ registered to vote at my old address.
Evidently, this is pretty common. Now i'm expected to say "Gosh, i'm not going to wait another two hours to vote. I have to get to work."
Well fuck them, i'm voting after work today. I don't care if i'm there for 6 hours.
I'm still disenfranchised, as I cannot vote for my local representatives.
I voted this morning (in Ohio) using the electronic Diebold systems. I am well aware of the issues behind them because of their architecture, but I have to give them credit for their easy interface. If someone says they couldn't use it properly because it is too complex then they probably couldn't operate a shopping cart. If you have not seen them they are a white surface with lights that blink where you have not voted and a solid light where you have. Black boxes group the different candidates and issues. This is nothing like I was expecting. I assumed they had a more ATM like interface, which would have been more difficult to use I think. My only complaint was we only had five machines so I waited in line for two and a half hours (I got there at seven thirty).
Happy voting.
They should mark voters thumb nails with a marker pen once they've voted. That'll fix it.
I personally do not think that everyone should be voting. In fact I think a lot of people SHOULDN'T be voting!
Ignorance is rampant and I would rather have an intelligent informed nation choosing their leader based on facts, logic, and rationale rather than emotional responses, self-interest, and personality marketing/propoganda.
The Cato Institute published a report which is here: http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-525es.html [Cato.org] and it details its findings on the study of voter ignorance. Here is an excerpt:
"Overall, close to one-third of Americans can be categorized as 'know-nothings' almost completely ignorant of relevant political information," writes Ilya Somin, a law professor at George Mason University, in "When Ignorance Isn't Bliss: How Political Ignorance Threatens Democracy."
"Most of the time," Somin notes," only bare majorities know which party has control of the Senate, some 70 percent cannot name either of their state's senators and the vast majority cannot name any congressional candidate in their district at the height of a campaign."
Overall, voters tend to be "abysmally ignorant of even very basic political information... the sheer depth of most individual voters' ignorance is shocking to observers not familiar with the research."
A few examples from many in the report:
* The Patriot Act? What's that? Three-fourths of Americans say they know little or nothing about it. 58 percent say they've heard "nothing" or "not much" about it.
* Seventy percent don't know about the $500 billion new drug benefit added this year to Medicare, which Somin describes as "probably the most significant domestic legislation passed during the Bush administration."
* A majority cannot make even a rough estimate of how many Americans soldiers have been killed in Iraq.
* 61 percent believe that there has been a net loss of U.S. jobs in 2004.
* Over 60 per cent don't know that, during President Bush's term, there has been an explosion in domestic spending (about 25 percent above previous levels) that has enormously increased the national debt.
* Last year, 58 percent of Americans could not name a single federal Cabinet department.
And such voter ignorance is, alas, nothing new:
* In 1964, at the height of Cold War tensions, only 38 percent of the public knew that the Soviet Union was not a member of NATO.
* In 1994, after Republicans took control of Congress under the highly-publicized leadership of Rep. Newt Gingrich, 57 percent of Americans said they'd never heard of Gingrich, despite the avalanche of press coverage.
* In 1996, 67 percent couldn't name their congressman, and only 26 percent knew that senators serve six-year terms.
* In the 2002 elections, only 32 percent of voters knew that the Republican Party controlled the House.
In 1816, Thomas Jefferson wrote: "If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
Mass ignorance is easy to exploit and sway opinions based on nothing more than emotions.
And in conclusion I say that if you do not truly understand the issues, have a good concept of how the government and the world works, and grasp the ideals and principles of what this government was founded on and it's history - then stay the hell out of the voting booth!
Libertas in infinitum
I don't like Bush very much, he seems too willing to sell my freedom in the name of security (and being one of the "he who would surrender freedom for security deserves neither" crowd, it's a sticking point for me. I don't like Kerry, either; I think he's promised too much this election. I do want to see the things he's proposed come to fruition (better education/healthcare, decreasing the defecit), but I doubt whether it can really be done. But more than that, I distrust a single-party goverment. The House and Senate will go to the Republicans--the system so strongly favors incumbants that it's only likely to shift a few seats. Pair that with a Bush presidency, and you've got two thirds of government covered. On top of that, at least 2 or 3 Supreme Court justices are likely to retire, and with a willing legislature, Bush can act carte blanche in his appointment of the most extremely conservative judges he's able to find. That's the entire federal government dominated by the right. Put Kerry in instead, watch what happens: Congress and the President will have to fight for every inch on their agendas and when Supreme Court appointments come around, Kerry will have to look more toward the middle for his judges, belaying fears about him appointing from the far left. If it works, it works great. If it doesn't work, it's deadlock. But I'd rather have deadlock than giving my government over to the agenda of a single party, left or right.
They know the true costs of war. And they realize when it's really neccessary.
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
This is the best interactive electorial college map I found on the Internet. Clicking on the button 'Electorial votes' changes the proportions of the states to reflect the electorial college. Lot of stats and fun to play with too.
As of now, I believe after reading this that the states are going to be voting almost exactly as the did in 2000, and it will come down to Florida making the call, yet again!
How is it possible to see what people in front of you vote? Certainly here in Ireland, and I had assumed in most other democracies, one secretly marks one's ballot in a screened off area, and then places it folded up into a ballot box. I.E. it's a secret ballot.
-- *~()____) This message will self-destruct in 5 seconds...
Oh, in that case it's OK then.
the Philly machines are now the Danaher Controls ELECTronic 1242 voting machine. i don't think any distric in Philadelphia has had the vintage 1950's mechanical machines for over two years now. they rolled out these machines for the 2002 elections. it was a local big voting year because it was the Mayoral race.
as for the drudgereport story..... it has not made local news that i caught. not sure what the deal is with it.
I tried to write-in a vote for Nader in Illinois and was told by my precinct captain that my balot would not be "signed" and counted.
Apparantly, we actually do not have the right to vote for whomever we choose. It is actually up to the states to decide for whom we are allowed to vote.
It really sucks to be told for whom you are allowed to vote.
Down in southwestern VA, we get to use the old mechanical systems one more time. I love it. The tactile response of the levers and visuals of the little "x" next to the candidate/decision of your choice. But, really, it's the ratcheting and ka-chung! as you pull the lever to record your vote. It just _feels_ like you're inflicting justice with that pull.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
Sadly, when Bush wins, Moore simply has another four years of inflaming the angry left.
Stupid sexy Flanders.
Stop spreading disinformation. According to all major news sources (CNN just did a piece on the Philadelphia story), the votes on the machines in question are from previous elections and have no bearing on the votes for this election. They are just resident in memory.
The GOP are the ones who are trying to get these machines replaced -- not the Democrats.
has determined that George W. Bush has won, with 2% of the East Coast results tabulated (Bush - 56% // Kerry - 49%).
George W. Bush heartily thanks his allies
at Diebold for their assistance in bringing
these latest poll figures.
The government can now hold you indefinitely without trial. Rich people are richer, the deficit is skyrocketing, we've invaded Iraq and killed 100,000 Iraqis...
Or did you mean POSITIVE, meaningful change?
I'm voting Kerry. I like his lies better.
paintball
Not to mention conservative groups bulk-challenging votes in Ohio.
After SWVFT, Diebold, and this, how can anyone defend the mentality of the right in America? Oh, right, if Kerry wins the economy will tank and the terrorists will invade Wyoming, like they did under Clinton.
No
If you are a member of a democracy you should always make your opinion heard.
Tell your President, Prime minister, governor premier mayor, MP, MEP, MPP, senator congressman, alderman, councillor etc what you want.
Their job is to represent you, and work in the best interest of their consitiuents and the area as a whole.
To do this they MUST know your opinions.
If you were them and lots of people write/tell you what they want, don't you think that might influence your stance on issues?
If the politicians really thought they wouldn't get re-elected if they voted for the invasion of Iraq, they wouldn't have authorized it.
With recall legislation becoming more popular this is even more important.
Even Bush would get a little nervous if people started recalling their Republican Governors to replace them with Democrats.
FWIW I emailed my MP (Federal representative) about a do not call registry, his assistant emailed back the letter my MP had previously sent requesting such legislation.
Get your country back.
Yours truly,
Mr. X
...Badnairk is badass...
Badnarik has good credentials as a geek, and I'd probably hire him for a programming or systems administration job, but he has no political experience whatsoever. Hell, he wasn't even able to get himself elected to the TEXAS House of Representives. If he (and the Libertarian party in general) are serious about getting into the White House, they need to set their sights a little lower at first: GET PEOPLE INTO OFFICE. *ANY* OFFICE. Local level, state level, whatever. School boards, town/county council, state legislatures, judgeships, etc. This serves two purposes: it shows people that Libertarians actually *can* work with the system and it gives the office-holders actual EXPERIENCE to run for higher office.
Even more importantly, if and when they are actually able run a serious Gubenatorial or Presidential candidate, that person when elected will actually have a BASE OF SUPPORT in the legislative and judicial branches. You can't change the system from the top-down; you have to work from the bottom up.
IMHO the most effective place for the LP to start is getting some Libertarian Judges elected. Judgeships are usually not as highly disputed as Legislative or Executive offices, but they hold a LOT of power. A Libertarian-controlled judiciary would be in the position to check the worst execesses perpetrated by the Democrats and Republicans.
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
castVote("Kerry");
while (countingVotes()) {
crossFingers();
}
if (getWinner().equals("Bush")) {
bendOver();
moveTo("Canada");
}
"SWVFT"
Why do you think these guys are exclusively right-wing? You don't think that members of both parties from Vietnam hate John Kerry for painting them as baby-killing war criminals? Some of what SBVFT is true, a lot of it is lie or stretching the truth. But I think it stems from a hatred of John Kerry's characterization of them. I mean really, John Kerry's own "band of brothers" photo that he used early in his campaign is composed almost entirely of SBVFT members.
"Diebold"
What does this have to do with the right?
"and this"
You mean preventing people who might be double-voting from voting twice? The "get out the vote" rallies of ACORN and ACT have produced tens or hundreds of thousands of bad voter registrations.
Engineering and the Ultimate
This is when normally virulent assholes on either side can make themselves feel better by saying such crap as "it doesn't matter as long as you vote" and similar bromides. It's the equivalent of the Southern-US "bless your heart", where if you tack it onto the worst insult, it cancels out. "Bush? He's an asshole, bless his heart." "Kerry? He's an unabashed socialist, bless his heart."
I say to all of you rabid, two-party-endorsing, Statist votemongers: Fuck you. YOU'RE trying to perpetuate the myth that there's any kind of control over the system, to prolong the amount of time you can crow on your dungheap.
I say to everyone still with some shred of independent thought: Shrug. Don't vote. Don't pay a dime more in taxes, voluntary welfare contributions or government sleeze than you have to without threat to your person. Don't let them pretend that we all agree that today is a wonderfully warm fuckfest.
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
n
1.
a) Two or more slices of bread with a filling such as meat or cheese placed between them.
b) A partly split long or round roll containing a filling.
c) One slice of bread covered with a filling.
2. Something resembling a sandwich.
It's a real pathological thing we have going here. We vote for the "lesser of two evils," then act all surprised when we get . . . evil.
We really need something like instant runoff voting or one of the Condorcet methods. As it stands we get the second most objectionable candidate. We need a system where we can choose the least objectionable candidate.
In the mean time, how do you justify voting for someone who is terrible? Given the choice between two highly objectionable candidates, I'll vote for one who "can't win."
-Peter
John Fund of the Wall Street Journal has an excellent article today about how the election results are going to play out, hour by hour. He tells you what states are going to close their polls at what time, and discusses what are the key races and key factors in the election around the country. Great read.
I'm blogging live today, as usual
The faulty log with 3 missing hours (9:52pm to 1:31am) is here
India conducted a full-scale electronic election earlier this year successfully - few of the EVMs were connected or hacked
...polling place.
MyPollingPlace.com will tell you what voting equipment is being used at your polling place, as well as instructions on how to use it. It will also give you the location for where you vote based on your street address and zip code if you are unsure of where to go to vote.
Sig cancelled due to lack of interest
Ciao
(Before I get into it, I agree with what you say about the whole base of support. In this election, there are over 1,000 other LP candidates running for local, state, and national offices around the country.)
According to the Constitution, Badnarik meets all the qualifications necessary:
Not having held office before has nothing to do with being a good president. Perhaps the reason nothing changes is because we keep electing people who are already acclimated to "the system." While Badnarik might lack political experience, he far exceeds both baBush and Kerry in constitutional scholarship. (I think you would agree that Bush doesn't know crap about the Constitution, and Kerry isn't much better, having voted for the PATRIOT Act.)
"The evil of the world is made possible by nothing but the sanction you give it." -- Ayn Rand
Moderators: The Dupe is because I hit submit before I added my html tags. Sorry amigos.
.. 5.7 billion people in the world. ... and on and on.
One half trillion dollars will be spent in Iraq according to the Congressional Budget Office. Researchers at Johns Hopkins University estimate we have 100,000 dead Iraqis on our hands. 16.7% of our soldiers will bare this incredible burden in psych wards according to The New England Journal of Medicine, assuming theyre not dead. And today, 1,122 Americans will not vote because they couldnt escape the American torture chamber that is Iraq. Tomorrow a few more will die and several more will be added to the 7,532 people that were serious injured in Iraq, so do not forget this when you vote.
Kerry's not my favorite, but today he represents everything the republican party would offer traditionally and more!
(1) He's fiscally conservative
(2) He's socially liberal (no bigotry here!)
(3) He's environmentally friendly
(4) His foreign policy acknowledges the other
(5) He's actually aware of national security
Now, let the flame war begin!
That's very interesting considering the lists released by the Clinton administration don't even show Arafat as ever having stayed at the White House. For reference:
First term list of guests
Guests from 1999 through August 2000 (you'll have to click the link in the article to see the list)
Your source to back your claim?
We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
There should be a lot of traffic. This is perhaps the most important election of the current young digerati generation (hate that word, but it fits).
As an aside, I saw something fairly poignant today. I came into the World Trade Center site via the PATH, which I do everyday. There's always visitors (never understood the morbid fascination of looking at the hole; you get a very good view from the PATH train). What was different this morning was where they were standing.
There are photograph placards all along the fence, displaying the WTC at various stages of development, the tribute in light, etc. Typically people walk from placard to placard, take pictures, etc. One placard shows the destruction on 9-11-01 (dust clouds, the famous picture of the firemen at the cementary across the street, etc). For whatever reason, there were a ton of people just staring at that one placard. Noone demonstrating, saying anything, but just staring and thinking.
Are you sure you're not one of those undecided voter?
So, what's wrong with undecided voters?
It's so easy to make that blanket statement and fail to properly identify the classifications of undecided voters (UVs).
You were probably referring to the Apathetic UV who couldn't care less about anything but simply fufilling their civic duty and pulling some levers. Some wouldn't even care if they decided their vote based on a coin toss, only to have discovered later that someone slipped them a double headed coin.
Then there's the UVs which listen to all the rhetoric coming from the candidates, looking for consistencies in their campaign speeches, in order to make the the most informed decision as they can under the circumstances. "The lesser of two evils" is their motto. Most of these UVs reject candidate statements more often than a Slashdot moderator does with submitted stories. The remaining statements are mulled over day and night until they arrive at the voting booth on election day between 7PM and 8PM.
The thing with UVs is that they aren't really counted on pre election polls. This makes party hardliners, or "decided" voters, a little wary of the outcome.
Slashdot is slashdotted, so I can't tell if this was posted correctly before:
Facts you should know before you vote:
If you truly love your country, you will not just enjoy the advantages, you will be there for your country when there are problems.
100 Facts and 1 Opinion -- The Non-Arguable Case Against the Bush Administration
See The CIA trained Osama bin Laden and other Arabs in the techniques of terrorism.
Government data compares Democrat and Republican economics.
Most media exists to make money. Advertisers are understandably careful not to alienate anyone. It is not possible to develop an accurate opinion of government activities only by listening to the carefully crafted phrases from media employees who would lose their jobs if they seemed to indicate a preference for one policy over another. Books are the major media that are not ad-supported. Here are reviews of 3 movies and 35 books that discuss the corruption of the Bush administration: Unprecedented Corruption: A guide to conflict of interest in the U.S. government.
Bush's education improvements were at least partly fraud.
I recommend a new book, The Family: The Real Story of the Bush Dynasty. Don't expect any author to be perfect. However, this book is an excellent overview of the Bush family, and the best book by this author. Here is a quote which shows just one more fact about the chronic lying of George Herbert Walker Bush and his son George W. Bush: "The official family tree provided by the Bush archivists does not include the two mentally retarded daughters of John M. Walker, and lists only two of James Smith Bush's wives, not all four of them; one of Ray Walker's two wives is omitted, and George Herbert Walker III is listed with only two, instead of three, wives."
Before, Saddam was killing. Now, the U.S. government is killing and destabilizing, and you pay. Improvement?
15 of the nineteen 9/11 attackers were Saudis. Many don't like the U.S. Gov. influence on their country.
Did you see the network footage of George W. Bush holding hands with a Saudi man the Bush family knows as "Bandar Bush"? Since it was Saudis who attacked on 9/11, why did Bush invade Iraq? Was it a smokescreen to get attention away from the Saudis?
Bush borrows money to kill Iraqis. 140 billion borrowed. With interest, you pay 200 billion. When Saudis attack, invade Iraq?
Is Bush drinking NOW?
George W. Bush's brother was shown in a lawsuit deposition on 20/20 talking about his prostitutes and using government influence to make money. Family values? Neil Bush is different from other relatives of presidents like Billy Carter; he is heavily involved with government corruption and he does his corruption with the help of his family.
The U.S. government has fought 24 wars since World War II. The system of violence works by creating fear so rich people can profit.
Got this message from a tailgating friend in Florida about his wife:
I thought you all would be interested to know what just happened in the past 30 minutes (It is 9:20AM here).
My wife went to the polls. I voted at the same precinct early this morning with no problems. However, when she went to vote, she was not allowed because they said a) she had changed her address one month ago and b) she had voted absentee. Obviously, neither is true.
She is now standing in line at the County Election office who told her they had the absentee records on file for her to review once she shows proof of ID.
It will be fascinating to find out "who" filed a change of address and absentee ballot "in her name". It was obviously intentional (fraudulent) and obviously targeted at a registered Republican.
Get ready for a rocky ride folks.
---
Anyone hear about anything like this happening before?
the way I see it, I'm not voting for a governor of New York. Why should I be lumped in together with the others voting here? I'm not voting with issues like Upstate vs NYC development or Thruway upkeep on my mind. I'm voting with things like Stem Cell research, Iraqi Policy, and national economy in mind.
when you get to the votes that COUNT, mine is gone. My vote is thrown away in an unnecessary granularity switch.
So, the democrats have had dibs on color for a long time.
I think Eminem's new video, "Mosh" is one of the best constructed political anthem's I've heard for our time. Watch it here.
Some disclaimers: It's Eminem, and it's uh, kind of anti-Bush. Whatever you think about either, I still think it's worth watching.
http://www.talknerdy.org
If you intend to cast a paper ballot today, please be ready for an adventure. This morning in Santa Clara, Vickie and I signed in the way we always do and requested paper ballots. Hilarity ensued: attempting to vote on paper caused a flurry of activity: oh-no-you're-not, you-have-to-vote-with-the-machine, what's-your-major-malfunction-mister, and other clucking noises. (Cory Doctorow had something about this in BoingBoing on October 18th, which was dead on.)
There was no "votamatic" machine for paper ballots any longer; we had to enter a plain brown cardboard voting station that looked exactly like a refrigerator carton and mark our ballots with a pen. (Pen not supplied; bring your own.) I was first in line; after marking my ballot I approached the desk and asked the Nice Lady on the end if I should put it into the box. She nodded and smiled at me, so in it went.
Then I turned to look at Vickie and the rest of the line and noticed they all had big pink envelopes to put their ballots into when they were done. A tiny peanut-sized bulb flickered to life inside my brain. I went to the stack and checked, and sure enough: the big pink envelope said PROVISIONAL BALLOT on it. It had several choices to check: you had no ID, you had moved after the registration deadline, or were Otherwise Unclean. The Other Nice Lady--the one who had her act together--was making everybody who voted on paper seal it inside the provisional ballot envelope, even though there was no "I HAVE BEEN REGISTERED VOTER IN THIS PRECINCT SINCE 1987 AND I AM CHOOSING TO VOTE ON PAPER DAMMIT" box to check.
Further hilarity ensued: Vickie is a lawyer with a long history of political activism, so there was much back-and-forth between her and the Other Nice Lady, who then got on the phone with Headquarters and came back with the following ruling: we were all to mark our paper ballots, seal them in pink envelopes, and don't worry about filling out our names and addresses on the envelopes. Somehow--the nebulous theory goes--the election workers will be able to magically detect the paper ballots filled out by properly identified voters and pull them out to be counted tonight.
We left the station feeling VERY unsure that our votes would be counted.
If I was a busy election worker tonight, I'd just grab all those pink envelopes and heave them into the Provisional stack. And if I was the guy at the Provisional Counting Station, I'd have to seriously consider trashing all those envelopes without names and addresses filled in on the form on the outside. That's the point of a provisional ballot envelope, after all: to make it possible for them to verify your right to vote.
Wait a minute... something just occurred to me!
If some insidious government officials were to approve the installation an easily-corruptible voting system in order to co-opt the election according to their agenda, and if the mass media then convinced the masses that the election is really close and could go either way, then it wouldn't be quite so transparent when the election was rigged in favor of one candidate!
Holy crap!
Let's see...
The President lied about Iraq.
Massive invasion of Iraq, illegal.
No WMDs. None since 1991.
100000 Iraqies dead, women and children mostly.
Over 1000 US Troops dead and toll is rising.
US torturing civilians (for none existant WMDs?)
Usama Bin Laden still around... laughing.
And that's just the plain facts. It amazes we who live outside the USA Americans haven't impeached a president who's obviously insane.
I thought this webpage was amusing.
http://www.oldamericancentury.org/14pts. htm
Since the Bush family had placed it's Chosen One in the White House, with his pro-fundementalist anti-humanist bible belt supporters and greedy corporate rapists, America has fallen into the worst state of economic depression, fear, war mongering, racism, and down right fascism since the Civil War.
Once the Bush Junte had it's "Pearl Harbour" they immediately ignored any terrorist threat that might exist (gotta wonder why) in favour of a cartoon war against an "Axis of Evil".
America is lead by a Marvel comicbook character. And Americans wonder why the rest of the world has been refering to GWB as a "moron" (and I'm quoting statesmen before Sept 11/2001).
Instead of doing what would have been logical, having the CIA go get those terrorists (that's why the CIA exists after all), America attacked a nation it already controled! Iraq.
Why?
Well, if you ask certain Americans they tell you that Saddam was a threat to the USA. Well, he wasn't. Not even the White House thought he was a few months before 9/11. So why did America invade Iraq?
And now, they tell me it doesn't matter that the President of the USA lied to Congress to get war powers.
Yeaaaaaa... Americans are finding that it's now "legal" to be jailed without any representation, your home can be searched without a warrent, poverty groups have already been raided and any dissent is met with Gestapo like tactics - the Republican Convention in NY was a disgusting display of an arrogant disregard of peoples rights and freedoms.
The media is now owned by only three large Corporations who whole heartily support the Bush WH. Bush gives them everything they want after all and Corporations don't give a rats ass about laws, rights, or people. Never did. Worse, media has created an ongoing propoganda campaign in favour of the Bush Junte by simply ignoring stories the Bush White House would find embarrassing and, far more telling, would put GWB in jail. Recently, the Bush election camp has declared war on the New York Times in a smear reminisant of the attacks Micheal Moore faces for his documentary. A documentary that is obviously true to eveyone BUT Americans because the rest of the world heard about these things years before. Micheal Moore didn't tell the world anything different, he was telling AMERICANS.
You have to wonder about a nation that goes to war and doesn't care to even justify it. Sorta like Hitler attacking Poland because, as Hitler said, Poland was a threat to the Fatherland. Must have been the cream cakes?
Yet, on the US TV transmitions there is still nothing about what is truely going on. The rest of the world is not living in the bubble of American media (including me) where the facts about America ignoring the source of the Terrorists (Saudi Arabia), where the money for 9/11 came from (Saudi Arabia), and who is responsible (Saudi Arabia again) simply isn't discussed! WTF! And who in the USA has the closest connections to Saudi resident Usama Bin Laden?
The Bush Family.
Now, if that is so why isn't Usama in a jail getting his testies fried right now? Hm? The first thing a cop would do when faced with a murder is talk to everyone involved. The Bush WH packed the entire Bin Laden family in the USA onto a plane the day after 9/11 and sent them home, without interrogation.
Today, we hear the news about how the USA can't even count votes. Is America retarded? Well, one might think so if one wasn't
Random 500 and 503 errors notwithstanding, I don't know about that, in a sense. Regardless of who's elected today, the country will continue to muddle through. We always have before, and I don't sense a sea change in that respect - there is a fairly sizeable contingent of folks in this country who aren't quaking in their boots at the thought of either man inhabiting the White House, something that partisans on both sides tend to forget in their relentless drive to demonize the other fellow.
For whatever reason, there were a ton of people just staring at that one placard. Noone demonstrating, saying anything, but just staring and thinking.
Wow. Wish I was there.
Stay safe.
ABSURDITY, n.: A statement or belief manifestly inconsistent with one's own opinion.
Party representatives are allowed to touch the Ballots???
Here in Canada, the only people allowed to touch the Ballots are the Deputy Returning Officer (who is sworn to be non-partisan) and the Voter. The DRO isn't allowed to touch the voter list, that's the Poll Clerk's job.
The scrutineers and the candidate's representative (who oversees the scrutineers for their party) aren't allowed to touch anything. They also aren't allowed to talk about politics or have any signs or material which might identify their party etc. asside from their scrutineer badge (which has their name and party).
The election before last, I went up to the table to vote and the Poll Clerk, DRO, and scrutineer were telling me who to vote for. They turned absolutely white when right after putting my ballot in the box I walked over to the candidate's rep (for a different party) handed him my paperwork and got my scrutineer badge. They stopped telling people how to vote after that (I was assigned to their table).
Stop spreading disinformation. According to all major news sources (CNN just did a piece on the Philadelphia story), the votes on the machines in question are from previous elections and have no bearing on the votes for this election. They are just resident in memory.
Other sources are reporting the same now. Apparently the poll watchers mistook the machine's "odometers" for "tripometers". Kinda makes all these paranoid Republican types look quite silly.
Time is what keeps everything from happening all at once.
1. Partisan politics aside, how can such an inane comment get modded +5? Once you're able to actually decipher the grammar and spelling (hella?! Don't they make lights?), you realize that absolutely nothing was said.
2. Why is it that 90 percent of people who "support" Kerry cite their primary reason for their support as "I don't like Bush"? Whatever happened to a candidate running on their OWN record? What is it about KERRY that you DO support? Do you even know? Bush isn't above reproach here either, by any means. Thanks to Cheney, I'd be scared to vote for Kerry otherwise we could have terrorists overrunning our country. The whole thing just makes me sad and tired. If you're going to exercise your "right" to vote, please at least do so with some modicum of information beyond a vague yet undefined antipathy towards the current president. BTW Adian, this isn't all directed at you personally but more at the attitude in general so many people hold.
3. This, as I see it, is one of the fundamental flaws of Democracy, or at least Democracy as Americans define it. We have a bunch of people who know very little about the issues or the candidates making decisions about who will become the next president. As long as you're an American, 18+ and not a felon, you get to vote. That's great, but as I alluded above, if you're going to make the effort to vote, perhaps it's worth making the effort to place an INFORMED vote.
Disclaimer: As you may notice from my .sig, I'm a Canadian, yes. So I can't vote in this election. I've lived in the US now for 8+ years and I feel in many ways like this is "my" country. Which is why I feel so much frustration about what I see around me. Finally, for the record, between Bush & Kerry I'd vote for Bush every time. However, between all the options, I'm pretty sure if I could vote, I'd vote for neither. There has to be a better candidate on the ballot SOMEWHERE. However, since I can't vote anyway I haven't taken the time to look.
www.clarke.ca
(1) He's also fiscally liberal!
Something for everyone.
Vote change, vote Libertarian
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Any idea why?
I've seen some OP-ED stuff that talked about states deciding to go the winner-take-all route to increase their own "importance" or to get more "attention" from candidates. But I think history shows that election-year attention does not translate to legislative attention in any meaningful way. IMHO, proportional vote allocation more accurately represents the will of the people, which is what the Electoral College is supposed to do in the first place.
I am not your blowing wind, I am the lightning.
In Ohio at least, when you get to the table to get your ballot, they check off your name and next to it is your signature. You must sign and they check to see that it is your signiture. Once that is done, you can't vote again. So there is already a "challenge" inside the building. There is no need for people outside to be challenging people, especially not people who are strongly tied to a party. The real reason the Republicans want to do this is voter intimidation.
--Won't that be grand? Computers and the programs will start thinking and the people will stop. - Dr. Walter Gibbs
I get a card, go up to the machine and insert the card and "vote". I get to see my vote before "casting" it, after pressing "Cast Vote" I'm instructed to pull the card back out of the machine and so do so. Now I take that card to some guy and he inserts the card into a small handheld device.
At what point is my vote really cast - when I hit the "Cast Vote" button, or when the card is inserted into that handheld device? If the latter, they didn't show me what the device said. Was my vote really counted? I have no idea.
--- What?
On my registration form, I listed a mailing address that differed from that of my residence. I received my voter registration card in the mail, which gave me a polling place a few blocks from my listed residence. The card includes a note saying that since I'm a late registrant, I will not be receiving a sample ballot. No big deal. My mind is made up for the presidency, and I've done my homework regarding the local ballot measures. I'm also not a Florida resident, so I presumed I could figure out the ballot without seeing a sample. (Ok, cheap shot.)
Lo and behold, though, yesterday I receive a sample ballot after all. Complete with a polling place listed on the back. Only trouble is, it differs from the one on my voter registration card. It's not even in the same county. The local measures were the wrong ones, and there was a spot for Mayor of a town I don't even live in. Confusion arises.
So I go down to polling place #1. This is where I'm a resident, and as I understand it, that's the relevant issue at hand. I could theoretically have had them mail be a ballot overseas, if my legal residence was here in Northern California. I stood in line for quite a while, actually.. which was good to see. I finally get to the front of the line, and there's 3 poll workers doing their thing. I mention the ambiguity to them, and the 3 poll workers check their roll call sheets, or whatever the appropriate term is. Turns out I'm on only one of these 3, theoretically identical roll call sheets. Poll worker #3, who doesn't look like he's even old enough to vote, reasons, 'Well, you're on /my/ sheet, so you must be in the right place.' Unconvinced, I give them the ol' 'BBL' and drive down the road to polling place #2.
Again, I wait in a rather long line, and when I arrive at the front, it turns out I'm on all of the roll call sheets there, thus calling our pimply-faced friend's judgement into question.
So as I type, I'm trying to get through to the voter registrar's office, to see about clearing this up. Thus far, all I've received is the message, 'We're sorry, all of our representatives are helping other voters, please hold..' yada yada. Followed by 15 minutes of dead air. Followed by a dialtone. Hopefully, the registrar's office is just busy, and this isn't a ${Party} conspiracy to discount my vote. ;)
What concerns me most about this though, is that I just IMed a friend telling them what was going on, and she mentioned that several people at her job are going through the same thing....
Hopefully this will straighten itself out. Anyone have any other brilliant suggestions besides the registrar's office, and possibly that 866 number that keeps getting mentioned?
This is my sig. There are many like it, but this one is mine...
I believe that Drudge has been DEBUNKED once again on this one. ... nothing to see here folks...
Drudge Debunked once again!
here's the summary for ya if u can't follow the link:
The 'votes' that were 'casted' on the machines before polls opened were the ticker (like on an old car's mileage) to count the number of total votes that each machine had processed.
no big deal
------ no thanks... I've quit
An update:
After an hour in the county election office, my wife was allowed to vote. They confirmed to her that someone fraudulently switched her address and voted absentee for her. They obviously don't know who it is, but they do know the address of where they are located (where the absentee ballot was mailed). All they could promise her was that the county sherriff would be investigating immediately and that the duplicate absentee ballot would be invalid.
In addition, the Hindi news channel was carrying a very detailed analysis of the two candidates. Also, they had a pannel of people give their opinion about what the effects of either candidates foreign policies would be on India. I'd guess that most nation's media are carrying similar analysis and what-is-in-store for me analysis.
In fact, something like that turned up this morning in Des Moines, IA, where a husband and wife went to vote. They have voted in this same polling location for 34 years and have been registered to vote with the same address. The wife was told she was registered in Ankeny, a suburb town to the north, and could not vote at her normal location. Again, here, they are registered Republican.
Perhaps this will turn out to be an organized and targeted attack?
--- "1.21 Jigawatts!" -Doc
...would have had the poll listing the following options:
() Bush
() Kerry
() Other
() Would vote Bush if I could
() Would vote Kerry if I could
() Would vote Other if I could
That way everyone could have voiced their opinions properly. The results would have been much more interesting too...
The girlfriend finally voted after a two and a half hour wait.
While the recent appeals court decision does allow democratic and republican challangers, she didn't see any at our polling place.
So turnout around here is HUGE; perhaps even higher than the 70% expected.
I'm waiting to see if everyone votes early, thus reducing the crowding at the polls. Unless there is a crowd from the "vote often" set =p
A Human Right
Being ELIGIBLE for something does not automatically mean you are QUALIFIED to do it. I have a BS in Computer Engineering, therefore I'm ELIGIBLE for any job which requires that degree. However, there are a lot of jobs for which I'm ELIGIBLE that I'm not QUALIFIED to perform because my experience is in a different specialty.
If the candidate's degree of Constitutional scholarship is the only quality that matters when chosing a President, then I submit that Lawrence Lessig is an infinately more qualified choice for President than Badnarik.
There are probably over 100M US citizens who are eligible to hold the presidency, so by your argument ANY of them is qualified to do the job. I'm sure you could find a homeless illiterate paranoid schizophrenic with multiple felony convictions and substance abuse problems who still meets all the Constitutional eligiblity requirements for the Presidency. Would this person be qualified for the job? I think not.
Hell, *I* am over 35, have lived in the US all my life, and have never been charged with any crime more serious than driving 20mph over the speed limit. I'll wager a week's pay that my knowledge of the Constitution is at least as good as Badnarik's. Therefore, by your standards, I'm as qualified to be President as he is. Vote for Me!
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
Its interesting how people get things exactly backwards.
We didn't turn our backs on the UN, the UN turned their backs on US. The "coalition of the bribed and coereced" exactly describes the United Nations, not the nations allied with us in this war. Russia, China and France are up to their ears in kickbacks and graft from our old buddy Saddam. With "friends" like this, we'd damned well better be ready to "go it alone" if the situation calls for it.
And I LOVE that people forget how Ronald Reagan, the greatest champion of freedom in the last 50 years, was portrayed by the media during his tenure.
He was a reckless cowboy loner, willing to push the Soviet Union military (and the US) into bankruptcy, risking Total Nuclear Annihilation for some idiotic notion that he could defeat the Soviet Union without firing a shot.
He was villified by "our international friends" and hounded by the Democrats mercilessly. He was regarded as an empty headed, overly simplistic buffoon.
Those famous words "Tear Down This Wall" were almost universally decried as confrontational, dangerous and completely lacking any "nuance" in understanding our relationship with the Kremlin.
But, of course, since the Democrats, the media and the "international community" got it EXACTLY WRONG, you don't hear much about how things actually WERE back in the day. I remember. I was there. I see the parallels with today's situation. I wish that people who's knowledge of history ends with "George Washington chopped down a cherry tree" would just sit the f*ck down and shut up.
My experience wasn't quite as bad as yours but is related.
When I updated my address with the Califonia DMV, I checked the box to have them update my voter registration. That was about 3 months ago.
Last month, I called the county voter registration office and they said I wasn't registered.
So I drove down in person and submitted a change of address there.
I confirmed it last week over the phone and was on the updated list of registered voters for my polling place. They had the main list printed Oct 22 and another list with the folks who registered afterwards.
There are election monitoring web sites. I would reccommend you go to http://www.commoncause.org and click on the voter experience link.
They are collecting accounts of voting experiences (including irregularities).
If this is a pattern, they can do something about it.
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them." -- Albert Einstein
That list you quote is "from a list of guests" and is NOT a complete list.It is from the Washington Post and another Post article says "President Bush, insisting that Arafat take more decisive action to rein in Palestinian militants, has refused to invite him to the White House, where Arafat was a frequent guest during the Clinton administration."
From American Spectator:"Bill Clinton, for example, invited a terrorist to the White House who had conspired in the deaths of Americans, even letting him sleep and sate himself at taxpayer expense as an honored guest for weeks at a time. His name was Yasser Arafat, the Kato Kaelin of the Clinton years, bunking so frequently at the White House the press described him as a "constant guest." One of Arafat's terrorists, marveling at his White House residency, was able to brag to the press, "Arafat was a guest at the White House more often than Netanyahu was."
What a stunning example of the slashdot mod system that your partial list is 'insightful'...
Finally, we know what Mr. Bush didn't want to let us know about the Bin Laden tape:
n .tape/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binlade
It is interesting how much his arguments make sense. Did Bush ever say something THAT clear? Did he have such a clear strategy when he sent his troops to iraq? We will prevail... Yes, sure. Tell us hat we want to hear and we will not question it further.
The censored version of the tape made everybody wonder, why Bin Laden is supporting Bush. The uncensored version speaks a different language.
I hope Kerry wins, and I hope it will change something. I also hope Bush will pay for what he did to America and the world.
According to the Des Moines Register poll out late Saturday evening, 27 percent of Iowa adults have already voted. And among those Kerry leads 52 percent to 41 percent.
relevent links:
Salon War Room Report
Gallup Poll original data (I think this is the correct data set)
USA Today story
All news stories merely mention this in passing.....
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
That's great, our troops only killed 15,000 CIVILIANS. What is it called again when you kill civilians to futher a cause, like bombing buildings, Oh thats right its called TERRORISM.
Some of the things that you refrence even the Bush administration has said aren't true. OK city was a case of domestic terrorism, the 9/11 committee says Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. I'm not sure how you link the others with Iraq, but I highly doubt the actual facts back you up considering the other things you have asserted.
As someone else has already pointed out we are there now and Saddam was a real shit, but saying that we are there for untrue reasons helps no one.
Oh, I do agree with you that Reagan did a lot to put us in this situation. That is another thing that worries me about this administration, they seem to think Reagan was some kind of god. Reagan gave us American sponsered terrorists, Saddam gassing his people and Iran, and a huge recession in the late 80's with fiscal policies that Bush is trying to reinstate.
Sorry about the rant.
(Deep breath. I'm about to do something totally insane--try to present a rational, factual explanation of a political subject on SlashDot. Maybe its because I've been eating nothing but red M&Ms all day....)
IAMPAEO--BIHBO
I Am Not Presently An Election Official--But I Have Been One. And I can promise you, with all sincerity, that the margin of error is effectively zero. We count every single ballot, whether on the voting machines or in absentee ballots, regardless of how late we have to stay up to do it. The people in your county registrar's office total up all of the ballots from the polling places, and keep checking and re-checking until they have it right. The math is done in front of representatives from all political parties, as well as any candidate-appointed watchers that are present as well. When the election results are certified, the results are correct--with an error rate of zero.
Oh, c'mon. What about...
I have been an election official for more than fifteen years--and I have been involved in counting votes on Election night in heavily Democratic wards, and in heavily Republican wards. It does not matter--we get the vote total correct, and we turn it in to the county. Then the county re-checks our work--and they carefully preserve the voting machines until they're convinced we have done the work correctly. (One year, back in the 1980s, the county had questions about one of our voting machines and called the officials back in later in the week to make sure they understood what we'd done.)
Don't confuse the results announced on TV with the certified election
I have also done consulting work with the Elections Unit of a major TV network. They have an entirely different agenda: their goal is to "call" the election for one candidate or the other before any other media outlet. They are basing their "calls" on exit-polling data ("pardon me, ma'am, but could you tell me who you voted for?") in a handful of selected precincts across a state. They will report preliminary totals ("And we now see Governor Bloviate leading with 1,424,325 votes with 21% of precincts reporting...") without explaining the context (are those Bloviate's strong precincts? Who says the numbers are correct?) They're out to report fast, accuracy be damned. (Sorry, Charlie, but that's the way it really is.)
The real story, the real vote total, comes when the election is certified. And the "chaos" that we all saw in Florida was the actual process of certifying an election. There were flaws (the biggest: they hadn't defined any rules for how to count votes)--but they eventually arrived at a standard, and used that standard to count votes. They ended up with a total. That's the final number.
All that said....
The total vote count will be determined with a level of error of zero. What will not be determined--and what I fear will be rampant in this election, on both sides--is how many votes were fraudulent, due to duplicate registrations, absentee ballot fraud, etc.
Our own Corporation for National and Commmunity Service "provides opportunities for Americans of all ages and backgrounds to serve their communities and country through three programs: Senior Corps, AmeriCorps, and Learn and Serve America. Members and volunteers serve with national and community nonprofit organizations, faith-based groups, schools, and local agencies to help meet community needs in education, the environment, public safety, homeland security, and other critical areas."
And is not another name for the draft. Anyway, back to the page you linked to, if you read just a little further down you would have seen this:
out of my vote.
I am currently attending Texas Tech Universitiy which is located in Lubbock. It's about a 5 hour drive east of my hometown of Albuquerque, New Mexico. Some time in mid October I called in and requested an absentee ballot from the elections office in Santa Fe. I gave them my address info and they told me they would send the ballot right away. A week passed and nothing in the mail. I called my parents and they told me that other people had to wait a while for thiers too. I guess they had trouble keeping up with so many requests. So I decided to wait one more week. Still no ballot. I called them up saying basically "wtf, where's my ballot." The lady took said she would get some one to call me back on it. I gave her my phone number. Three days later it's too late to even mail in my ballot and they never called me. So all I can do now is sit around and hope Kerry gets elected. If not I'm gonna be pissed. My state has had a record of having problems with election counts. I wonder if it has anything to that New Mexico's public schools are the ranked at the most inadequate schools in the nation.
Abaddon: An Xbox 360 Indie game
"Documented cases of civilians killed by the US is up around 15,000. [iraqbodycount.net, etc]"
Exactly my point. This is nowhere near 100,000.
Sorry, but that's not entirely true. The numbers on IraqBodyCount.net are fully-backed media documented numbers about specific incidents with specific casualties. That means that, out of the thousands of civillians killed during the war in Iraq, we have hard and fast proof about that many, right now, with zero additional time spent gathering information.
The 100,000+ number is a reasonable guesss about the actual numbers of casualties, inclulding those who didn't specifically make the fscking international news.
Sheesh.
I don't know if a 6:1 ratio of casualties to media-reported specific casualties is correct, but it seems reasonable. It seems a whole lot more reasonable than a 1:1 ratio which is, I believe, what you're choosing to go with.
You're special forces then? That's great! I just love your olympics!
When I went to vote this morning we had the Diebold system. This is Montclair, CA.
They handed me a smart card, and I put card in and made my selections.
When came to the end I went to select the "cast ballot" button it returned a message "Are you sure you want to proceed, you haven't made all the selections you are entitled to."
OK?? So I went back and double checked everything. I definatly had voted on everything there was to vote on. Spent about 10 Minutes in all checking and rechecking.
I had to hit the "Cast Ballot" to finish and return my card.
So when I finished I complain to the manager there, and they said it's seems to happen every so often, we don't know what's the reason.
They really didn't know anything about these system, or what they could do about errors or problems.
So I walked away wondering if some of my votes were just dropped or something.
I mean as a programmer this system really made me feel incredably unconfortable as to it's reliablity, accuracy and security.
I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. - Pablo Picasso
Alabama, rightly so in many cases, gets a bad rap for being a backward state, but after reading all of the horrible stories about weird voting machines, [Democratic|Republican] "challenges", disorganized staff, etc. from around the country, I'd like to share my experience...
I drove by my polling place (a suburban neighborhood church) at 7:30 and the line was around the building, so I went on to work. I returned at around 12:30 and the line was more reasonable.
I waited in line for about twenty minutes before I got to the registration table. I showed them my driver's license and voter registration card. They looked up my registration on a form-fed printout of the registration lists and crossed my name out with a yellow highlighter and ruler and handed me a slip of paper. I walked to the next table, gave them the slip of paper and they wrote my ballot number on it, made me sign two side-by-side registers (one printed, one "signed") and gave me the corresponding numbered ballot and a Sharpie marker.
I took it to a privacy cubicle and completed it by connecting the very clear and well-aligned arrows beside the candidates and options of my choice with a big, fat, black line (no possibility of ambiguity unless you are a total idiot). I checked over the ballot, then walked over to the voting machine and fed it in. A beep and a green light told me immediately that all of my votes were registered unambiguously and the paper record of the vote went into a locked tray inside the machine. They gave me a "I voted" sticker and I was on my way.
My only gripe? There are two lines (clearly marked, BTW) for people whose last names start with A-L or M-Z. Everytime I've voted here, the A-L line has, at most, 5 people in in while the M-Z snakes out the door. Unless 'M' is the real clincher, it wouldn't be too hard to split the alphabet to more evenly distribute the lines. If 'M' *is* the culpret, they could even do A-Mi and Mo-Z, but that would probably confuse the moron element.
Why can backward Alabama (or at least our precinct in Huntsville -- can't speak for the rest of the state) get it right while the rest of country is awash in touch screens, mechanical dinosaurs, butterfly ballots, hanging chads, charcoal on tree bark, or whatever else they are forced to use? What is so damned disenfranchising about requiring proof of ID? How hard can it possibly be to cross-check voter registration lists?
-- stream of did I lock the front door consciousness
flossie
Write now. Defend liberty
Then obviously the Clinton administration lied (surprise, surprise) when the list of guests was presented OR the Washington Post, CBS News and all the other news organizations who had the same information failed to include Arafat on the list.
As far as inviting a terrorist to the White House, Bush I did the same thing by inviting Yitzhak Shamir so using that as an article leader really doesn't do anything other than show the bias of the American Spectator.
Further, nowhere in anything you presented does it say that Arafat was the #1 guest during the Clinton administration. The only thing that is mentioned is that Arafat was a frequent guest who stayed there more than Netanyahu. So what? If Netanyahu stayed there for a total of 2 weeks and Arafat was there for 3 weeks that would meet the qualification of staying there more than Netanyahu.
As far as the mod system, well, we all know it's a crap shot.
We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
I worked as a legal volunteer for Election Protection / Ohio Voter Protection Coalition this morning in Dayton, OH; and voted later in south Dayton.
We had many complaints of challegers intimidating voters, directly interacting with and interrogating voters, requesting voters to give their name to the challenger, among other things. Most of the problems voters had were locating the right place to vote, or they registered and weren't on the list, or hadn't registered at all.
The challengers were intimidating even if they didn't say anything, and I fail to see the purpose they serve. First, they sit behind the poll workers with a list of names (which more than likely contained the names they tried to challenge before the election, in which case they are in direct violation of a federal order enjoining them from doing that.) Then, they just glare at voters and make them feel uncomfortable. This is especially true in areas were the population is overwhelming black. They serve no purpose, because if they do challenge someone, the poll judge asks a few questions of the voter and the voter is allowed to vote almost every time. The only reason they are there is to intimidate and discourage people from voting. (If you believe in your candidate, you should want everyone to vote, shouldn't you?)
There were a few other minor things, but most centered around inappropriate actions of challengers. Hopefully a few will be tossed out before the end of the day.
My voting experience had a few bumps as well. I was immediately asked for ID, which I respectfully refused, and had to find my own name in the roster, because the poll worker couldn't hear me apparently. Once that was done, I had to get in a second line, where they took my ballot, wrote down the number, then wrote my name and address as they were on a second roll. (I'm not sure what the point was in that). As I was waiting in line, a lady asked if her son who has frequent epileptic seizures could be allowed to vote instead of waiting in line, so as to not disrupt everyone, and make it easier for him. The lady refused, so I made it a point to inform the poll worker and the voter that if there is any kind of disability, they can request to have the worker bring the ballot out to them in their car or whatever, and vote there. There is no reason why having a disability should prevent you from voting.
That said, I've heard some great news regarding early exit polls; the number of new voters I ran into was incredible; people genuinely seem to actually care about voting and making sure their vote is counted. It was somewhat reassuring to see so many people be so determined to vote.
The more people that vote, especially among groups that tend to avoid the polls, the better it is for the candidate I support. From what I've seen, things are looking very good.
What?
One could do worse than to watch the Frontline episode Choice 2004.
When, I believe, it was his roomates uncle, who was a highly placed government offical came to Yale to speak about service, duty and honor, Bush was partying it up, didn't attend the talk. When this uncle spoke private with Kerry and his close circle of friends, he impressed upon them just how important it was to serve. Kerry, and his friend ended up volunteering because they were moved to. They were PERSONALLY called to serve. Later would end up dying. And after Kerry's first tour, he signed up for a SECOND. Where he served with some distinction.
Bush and his crew were partying hard enough to make John Belushi blush. One of his friends pulled a stunt that got him kicked out of Yale, was forced to go to Vietnam and he died. That really put the fear of God into them. So they partied a lot, and after college Bush went into the air national guard with help from his father. A trick one of his own friends says he wished he could have duplicated.
= 9J =
I'm a first time voter and I asked how to do a write-in on the machines here. The first poll worker asked me if I was voting for Mickey Mouse, told me it messes everything up, and that I didn't want to do it. The next told me she didn't know and would have to get the book out and start reading. Fortunately there happened to be an election official from the county present, who showed me how to do it, and even comforted me by saying that there are a lot of write ins today. He also gave me his number so he could personally replace my voter registration card, which the poll workers had "lost."
Dear poll workers, sorry about "messing everything up," and fuck you.
I am confident that my write in vote will not be counted unless that election official is hanging over their heads.
Horray for the republic?
Spoon not. Fork, or fork not. There is no spoon.
Electoral system reform
The most pressing need, today, is a radical re-examination of voter registration procedures and voting procedures to eliminate vote fraud. I cannot stress this enough--the election today will be stolen; the only question is which side will steal more votes. I deeply regret that statement--but I mean every word of it. The electoral system today is simply a wide-open invitation to several different sorts of vote fraud, and you can be absolutely certain they're happening.
In short--the system is wide open for vote theft. It must be fixed; and there must be a careful scouring of this election to identify where votes have been stolen. And--without fail--those responsible for vote them (duplicate registration, vote theft, etc.) must go to jail. No probation, no community service--bona fide Big House jail time.
The Electoral College
The Electoral College is the most misunderstood feature of American polity. It should not be abolished--to the complete contrary, it should be strengthened; which is to say, it should be restored to how it was originally intended. The problem with the EC in most states is that each state is a "winner takes all" race: win the heavily-populated parts of California, and you can ignore the rest of the state. Win Houston and Dallas, and you can ignore the rest of Texas. Win New York City, and don't waste your time on upstate.
If EC votes were counted for each congressional district, with the winner of the EC votes in the state getting the bonus two "Senate" votes, it would have the immediate effect of taking major media buys out of the campaign. You couldn't run a last-minute attack ad campaign--you wouldn't have flash-in-the-pan candidates like Howard Dean or Jimmy Carter appearing out of the woodwork. You'd have to communicate--and convince--voters in every part of the country, rather than focus on a limited number of media markets in "swing" states. You'd have a lot less noise, and a lot more signal.
There is such a thing as the Law of Unintended Consequences. And one likely consequence of such a thing would be that fewer people would be likely to vote: because there would be less television noise, and because the campaigns would have to persuade, not sloganeer. Most consumers in America respond to ads--not to Op Ed page articles. Political campaigns would tend toward Op Ed types--hopefully that would mean more thoughtful voters.
Whoever wins tomorrow, you will return to your scheduled lives of greed, selfishness and exploitation.
That is who you are, and that is how you think. The danger to the world is not the Republicans, the Democrats or even the Project For The New American Century. It's the mindset of the common American.
I voted for kodos.
I know you must be joking, but that is a very stupid way to look at voting. It is like saying that since one person's taxes wouldnt make even a miniscule dent on the goverment's budget, that the government should stop collecting taxes.
-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Is that when he visited Australia, the Secret Service insisted on wearing weapons inside our Parliament... and for the first time in Australian history weapons were allowed in.
Read Pynchon.
I've been asking myself why I've been so preoccupied with reading about this election over the last two weeks or so. The reason why I couldn't initially understand it was because I'm not actually American.
Although I normally have a fairly high degree of interest in international politics, the more I think about it, the more I'm able to figure out why this election in particular holds so much importance for me. My country's current prime minister, John Howard, has tried to collaborate with the Bush administration as closely as possible over the last few years...Not only with Iraq, but also with a number of economic agreements, about which the unnoficial word is that they have generally benefitted the Americans far more than they have us.
It's not just about Iraq to me, though. I read somewhere that in the case of some countries, at least, whatever sociological/criminal trends America experiences, other countries tend to experience 5-10 years later. If that's true in this case, then I fear for Australia...and for the stability of the area in which I live.
What I mean by this is that as much as I've tried to read about the election lately, I've been reading other material as well. Material which really does not cast an appealing light on either Bush or Kerry. In Bush's case, there have been a *lot* of reports about how domestically in the US he is apparently trying to convert the country into a full-blown dictatorship, as well as an equal amount of dark speculation about the idea that this election could be portrayed publically as a stalemate even when it isn't, so that the results can then be manipulated in the courts.
The stuff I've been reading about Kerry though make me think that whoever would try and do that, won't need to in this case. The picture I've developed of Kerry tells me that he isn't really any opposition to Bush at all, in any sense, and that he most likely wouldn't do a thing differently if he got into power. I know most people here would probably wipe off the stuff about Kerry and Bush both having been members of Skull and Bones as just more deranged conspiracy theories...but to me, it honestly is scary.
Here's my overall conspiracy theory about this election though...laugh at it and call me a nutcase if you like, but I think it fits:-
Neither Kerry nor Bush either are or will end up being the genuine rulers of the country. There is a third entity (who, I don't know) who is able to choose the candidates in such a way that no matter who gets elected, the third (ruling) entity are able to continue persuing their interests unhindered. (I'm reminded of Palpatine's maneuvers in Attack of the Clones when I think about this, actually)
I think the reason why the 2000 election happened the way it did was because the Democratic candidate in that race was not one of the ruling entity's people, so they had to use whatever means necessary to make sure he didn't get into power.
But I think in this scenario there genuinely *is* a Palpatine wannabe around somewhere, or possibly a group of them. I think people in the US are going to need to find this individual/group, whoever they are, and get rid of them before they're going to be able to have genuinely free elections.
To me, only being able to choose between a couple of people who've been approved by the proverbial man behind the curtain is not the definition of a genuine democracy...it also isn't likely to guarantee a change in policy with a new administration...because even if the old puppet (Bush) gets voted out, the new one still has the same master at the strings.
Remember also...Just because I might be paranoid, doesn't necessarily mean I'm wrong. There was a lot of weird stuff about 9/11...things that just didn't fit together and add up if you looked closely at the official story...and I'm not alone in thinking that, either.
I'm possibly going to get replied to by Americans here who will say that I have no business caring about what happens with their election...to which I say th
http://www.electoral-vote3.com/
through
http://www.electoral-vote8.com/
Small, the Democrat running an uphill battle to unseat the popular Sen. Charles Grassley, R-Iowa, has stuffed all the remnants of his campaign into a used RV emblazoned with the motto, "Think Big -- Vote Small" and is selling the entire package on eBay.
CAMPAIGN IN A VAN!! ALL YOU NEED TO RUN FOR US SENATE!!
In 1996, I was an "election worker trainee" as part of a school program to get students interested in civics. My job was to be one of the people who helped out if people had trouble with the machine and reset the machine for the next voter after they were done.
My state had some very old mechanical voting booths with levers for each candidate or party lines and one big lever for closing and opening the curtain. When you were done voting you were supposed to pull the lever to open the curtain and your votes would be recorded. Anyway sometimes people would have problems and despite being told no fewer than THREE times not to pull the big lever until voting was complete they would use it to open the cutain and ask me a question, at which point the only thing I could say was that they had voted and i'm sorry but you can't vote again.
This is a problem with all current anonymous systems since you can't match the voter to the vote. The scary part about your post was that you pushed "cast ballot" while you were still uncertain about your vote BEFORE consulting the election worker, thereby ensuring that any mistakes will be uncorrectable. It seems to have worked out for you this time, but I can't stress enough that everyone must be sure of their ballot BEFORE casting. The election workers are there to help you.
Can you be Even More Awesome?!