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Ballmer Threatens Linux Patent Lawsuits
gillbates writes "Today Microsoft warned several Asian countries that using Linux could subject them to lawsuits, claiming that Linux violates '228 patents'. Apparently, Steve Ballmer believes he can enforce U.S. law in Asia." Ballmer is presumably speaking about this story. So, companies which sell insurance against lawsuits and companies which make competing products both warn of the dangers of using Linux. Maybe someone should point out that Microsoft is battling dozens of patent-infringement lawsuits itself, and any user of Microsoft software (including governments) could also be sued?
There's the problem. Microsoft has someone to do that. "Someone" who is willing to send out threatening letters to MS product users on behalf of the OpenSource community will be hard to find (or hard to pay for)
Johns: Well, how does it look now? Riddick: Looks clear.
I knew we should have taken out the ability to double click!
And in related news from Middle Earth...
OSGILIATH (Reuters) - Mordor Corp. warned Middle Earth kingdoms on Thursday they could face the wrath of Orc armies for harbouring and aiding Gandalf and his fellowship of hobbits instead of rightfully bowing to the will of Sauron.
The growing popularity of Gandalf - a wise and benevolent wizard who freely aids all in need and is a friend of all free people of Middle Earth - is a thread to the global dominance of Sauron's Dominion Of Evil.
Gandalf's fellowship has illegally kept Sauron's valuables, Mordor's Mouth of Sauron said at the regime's Middle Earth Kingdom Leaders Forum in Osgiliath. He did not provide any details on what exactly the nature of Sauron's valuables which were stolen are, which the Fellowship disputes.
Ex-hobbit Gollum McBride, who claims that "nasty hobbitses stole his preciousss", is suing elves and hobbits alike, including the Shire.
Rohan's Riders of Defense at Gandalf's council last month readied 20,000 horsemen to face the assault of Mordor Corp instead of submitting freely to the evil reign of Sauron.
Other kingdoms in the region are also beginning to rally under one banner. Gondor, Arnor and Erebor this year agreed to jointly combat Sauron's forces at Gandalf's advice.
The kingdom of Gondor, in particular, sees its proximity to Mordor as a potential threat. Conspiracy buffs believe that subliminal messages sent to Denethor from Sauron via his Palantir might drive the steward insane and thus confuse and cripple Gondor's defenses, possibly during a battle in the Pelennor fields.
The Mouth of Sauron said that security fears some rulers had about surrending to Mordor were "overblown".
"We think Sauron will provide far more security than Gandalf ever could. Sauron is a better protector for you lot because he has this awesome Ring which he forged, he fixed and he stands behind. Gandalf doesn't have an awesome Ring," he said.
"Backups are for wimps. Real men upload their data to an FTP site and have everyone else mirror it." -- Linus Torvalds
Keep in mind that China is a Communist country and any concept of intellectual property is relatively novel.
===== Murphy's Law is recursive. =====
This should go over really well. At least MS is entrenched in most business environments here in the U.S. so they can get away with a lot of this stuff. But in Asia (especially in places where they are pushing the stripped-down edition of Windows) this is going to alienate them even more than just having high prices.
"Buy our expensive software... or try the alternative and we'll sue you."
Good way to make friends.
Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
There is an article in Groklaw about how Poland is voting against EU software patents, and that the majority has tipped against them. His comments only help to underscore why this is the correct decision, and can only help our cause. It looks like the US will be the only country to recognize software patents.
My rights don't need management.
You are not forgotten!
This subject making is presented in a way that implies that some sort of legal authority be brought to bear to make Ballmer shut up. I say that the best way to counter mis-information is with good information. I'd rather live in a society where people fight back against this sort of thing rather than whine, cry foul, and expect mommy to make him stop.
maybe MS prefers that the asian countries use pirated copies of Windows instead of pirated copies of Linux ;)
Consensus is good, but informed dictatorship is better
I'm getting bored of seeing these patent lawsuits. To think that insurance companies exist just to sell insurance against such lawsuits shows just how pathetic our patenting system is. *yawn*
What ever happened to winning by doing better than the competition, anyway? Are American corporations so pathetic that they have to stoop to this level to compete now?
While the long arm of United States patent law cannot be enforced in the Asian countries Balmer accuses, I am sure he is referring to the influence that will be exerted (directly and indirectly) to these countries by Microsoft and it's respective surrogates.
-Teiresias
(a) The EU is moving away from software patents (b) the majority of nations in Asia don't have them AFAIK (c) many governments are pushing OSS for open, stable file formats and to promote local entrepreneurs in development and support areas.
I suppose with the SCO FUD-fest against Linux imploding, that Ballmer feels the need to spread FUD direct from the source to combat the Penguin Horde advancing on the Gates of Redmond.
The US could complain to the WTO or somebody, but they are toothless. China is too big to start a trade war with.
Poland just recently decided against supporting software patents in the EU. Does that mean they will not respect other countries' patents on software or just that they will not go along with Europe issuing them?
...where the sun is rapidly setting on certain parts of his windows operation. The man might be a good businessman but he doesn't seem to realise that making veiled threats does not intimidate people as it does in the west , in asia its considered extremely rude and gets their backs up and hence they're MORE likely to be contrary and ignore you and your company even further.
> Apparently, Steve Ballmer believes he can enforce U.S. law in Asia.
No, I think he's counting on it that Asia cannot prosecute Microsoft under U.S.A. racketeering laws.
To quote Linus: They are smoking crack.
I think, therefore I am. I think?
You left out Tom Bombadil.
And the liberation of the Shire.
Bahhh...
I hope it will be included in the Special Extended Edition of this post...
I don't need a signature.
The original report said that the kernel potentially (since they are non-court validated) infringes an estimated 283 patents. And now Ballmer is sure that all of the issued patents are actually valid.
This sort of MBA doublespeak makes my blood boil!
Hilarious. That is like saying "I am the strongest man in the world because I have brown hair, I wear shoes, and I am standing here right now."
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
The BBC has an article about it as well. It has a nice tough at the end:
Microsoft, the world's largest software maker, has the most to lose should Linux use spread.
This nicely puts Balmers statement in the correct perspective for the readers that aren't 'into the bussiness'. I like that...
Advice to Ballmer: If you fight linux with patents, be prepared for Novell.
http://www.novell.com/company/policies/patent/
Does anybody know when Steve's birthday is? I'd like to get him a monocle, a fake scar, and a white cat.
I think he can pull that look off better than Bill can.
Either that, or a pinstripe suit - so he can do the "Nice OS you have hear. It'd be a shame if anything were to happen to it" thing better.
www.eFax.com are spammers
I think M$ is planning this as a last ditch. I think they are being very wary of how they approach Linux as a competitor in hopes that suits like SCO's will stifle Linux. Now that it's becoming obvious that SCO's suit isn't likely to succeed, they are hedging their bets with patents. I think this could ultimately backfire on them even if they hold these patents. Prior art is one aspect they aren't figuring on. Another is the fact that Linux is being adopted by a lot of companies and governments. To go into court in, say, 3-4 years and try to sue bsed on these patents might not sit well with a judge. Especially some of the more silly patents. They could come off as looking like they let the patents go unchallenged and simply enforced them in an effort to stifle competition. Whatever the case, having IBM, Novell, and more big companies backing Linux is only going to help.
I don't think the point is enforcing U.S. law in Asia so much as it's forcing an Asian company to comply with U.S. law if they want to do business in the U.S. or with a U.S. company.
People and companies outside the U.S. have legal action taken against them in U.S. courts all the time. While they can't necessarily do anything to that person/company in their own country, they can effect the status of that person/company with regards to dealings in and with the U.S. In layman's terms, that person/company is put on the shit list.
Evil is the money of root.
Okay fine! If you're not our customer, prepare to be sued for it!
While I generally take legal threats and action fairly seriously, my knee-jerk reaction is that Microsoft will be laughed out of the arena on this one. This would be a persuit that would turn the public against them. I can see the IBM propaganda commercials on TV now. They'd be depicting a hobbyist writing making something in their garage or basement followed quickly by a SWAT team with guns pointed at his head.
While it's true that business has taken a natural interest in Linux. It's free, it's reliable, it's flexible, it's customizable and it's everywhere and simply growing and growing. It can't be stopped. Anything that Microsoft does againt the users of Linux will certainly make them look even more evil in the public's eye than ever before.
Public opinion has turned against the RIAA and MPAA because they're now known for suing children and little old ladies. Clear Channel has bad enough vibe out there that they are operating under the names of the companies they bought out just to hide their identity since many people no longer want to go to Clear Channel events. Most people accept Microsoft as part of their computer like a keyboard, mouse or monitor. But when people and small businesses start getting sued and the public gets wind of it, not only will it serve as free advertisement for the new "Underdog" but it'll cause a lot of negative opinion against Microsoft. Apple will start collecting more fans as their next home PC will be a happy-faced G5 running something that's not Microsoft.
Go ahead Microsoft... make my day.
Their threats are empty. They are CONVICTED of being a monopoly and illegally USING that power to force themselves into dominance in other markets.
If MS attempts to use a patent to stifle Linux uptake, the courts can strip the patent from them even if it IS a valid patent.
Microsoft threatening like this is the best thing that has ever happened to those of us who oppose software patents. MS is huge and rich, but compared to the rest of the US and world economy, they are a flyspeck. Microsoft seems to be ACTIVELY trying to turn the whole world AGAINST them.
Funny how Ballmer is sounding like Darl McBride...
If you are a former customer, expect to be sued. You have our "presssccciiooouss" IP.
Suing your customers, or THREATENING to sue your customers is not a proven successful business tactic.
IBM has more patents than God, and their business interest is in protecting Linux. I am not too worried about MS or someone sucessfully getting Linux stopped via software patents, and the attempt will do more to teach our business community and our government that software patents are bad and should be abolished or limited in scope.
For one thing, companies should have to choose: Copyright or patent. They can have one or the other, not BOTH.
Corporatism != Free Market
That was Akamai's caching system that was running on Linux.
What is interesting is that because Microsoft's code is closed, they could be violating a lot of patents and no one outside the organization would know.
Linux's openness is the reason there is a target on Tux's back. Of course, Linus and Morton have said they will re-code if they have to to avoid patent issues, if and when they come up.
I wonder if Google could come up with a way to see if anyone is violating any patents. It would be an extremely useful tool, and a lot of corporations would buy such a tool.
This is just another public manifestation of the tactics used by MSFT. FUD FUD FUD....
But it is quite intesting to notice the effect this type of argument has on some IT people. The other day one of our clients (a manager of a US company) tried to explain me (and my team) how all open-source licenses are dangerous. It was kinda funny, because he couldnt event tell the difference between acronyms such as GNU, GPL, LGPL, CPL, MPL, etc. Basically, open-source is bad because lawyers told him so, although he was unable to cite any real example. I got really upset.
Yeah, Ballmer's arguments make a lot of sense from his own perspective. MSFT wishes to thank SCO...
--ASRG
What do you mean? This is business, plain and simple. Balls. The amount of /. mindshare that could be spent on writing better FOSS software, alone, is staggering.
In the US National Football League, this maneuver is known as a 'play action fake'.
Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
....is to make em all triple-clicks.
C'mon then, someone tell me that the patent says "two or more clicks in quick succession"....
Since when did China care about western laws and patents? Right now western corps are russing in there for business. There are a billion people in an up and coming economy. China doesn't care about M$ or US laws. They believe they are in the drivers seat.
China has the second most powerful military and the fastest growing economy. Plus they are not a democracy.... again, why would they care?
Evolution or ID?
and what about all the BSD code in Winders.... Yes it is sprinkled all through it. Look at the CL FTP client. Also what about SFU (Services For Unix) This is built on Open Source.
Guess Steve will have to sue himself!
"Today Microsoft warned several Asian countries that using Linux could subject them to lawsuits, claiming that Linux violates '228 patents'. Apparently, Steve Ballmer believes he can enforce U.S. law in Asia."
"In a related story, Ballmer is suing Sony for allegedly producing an inferior product, Dance Dance Revolution, which he claims cannot stand up to 'real dancing.' Ballmer has reportedly broken 10 of the devices made for the PS2 doing, as he calls it, 'muh jiggy wifit foot stompin' moves....'"
"In yet another unrelated story, neighbors of Steve Ballmer are suing him for scaring their children with, as they explain it, 'producing high-pitched, glass-shattering, woman squeals.' Ballmer denied the allegations claiming that such noises are natural when 'getting jiggy wifit....'"
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets that we're going to have a draft." --George W. Bush
"All great things are simple & expressed in a single word: freedom, justice, honor, duty, mercy, hope." --Churchill
I've already got a patent on teh axle, bitch!
Also, I've already applied for a patent for "a device, possibly over the internet, which reduces frictional forces acting upon an object by minimizing the surface area in contact with another mass, and by utilizing a rotational vector.
I plan to get ford first, then (thanks to that internet clause), I'm going after torvalds.
It's been a long time.
Paraphrasing from Mark Twain, "the threat of legal action is the last refuge of a scoundrel."
Steve Ballmer has an uphill battle to regain credibility among IT decision-makers if he has to abandon a tactic of directly comparing Microsoft's products to Linux and FOSS on the strict basis of features, price, bugs, security, standards adherence, kindly upgrade path lacking forced obsolescence, licensing terms, etc.
At least in the developed world where Microsoft has dominated the marketplace for years he can always bring up the Windows to Linux migration cost (neglecting to mention anything about the Windows to Windows migration costs) and backward compatibility to bolster his argument.
With this level of desperation, and with SCO's case foundering, MS may decide to fight more openly against Linux in the legal arena. But making such a move is risky from a PR perspective because it will cast MS in a bad light, opposing freely-available, zero-cost technology that helps anyone who cares to use it. While MS might be losing millions of dollars as companies choose FOSS in place of Microsoft products, it's not as if intellectual property violations (if they even exist) cause an equal - or even comparable - slide of millions of dollars into the pockets of greedy IP violators. Rather, most FOSS developers have minuscule wealth compared to Microsoft and stand to gain much less by contributing their work to the world at large. Pressing IP claims against software available to anyone and independently contributed by someone working from scratch in their garage at night is likely to smack of a David vs Goliath dispute, with Goliath wanting his tax from everyone else and David wanting to let the people keep their money.
Additionally, in the developing world they must regard claims of ownership of intellectual property as a curious and amusing Western contrivance for making money and preserving wealth, especially in light of the more preposterous patents that the USPTO has given over the last number of years.
"Provided by the management for your protection."
Fuck off.
Love,
Tux
p.s. - Fuck off.
One way to look at it is that lawsuits are an expensive way to make noise. Ballmer has to make noise or else folks will resume paying attention to their work and finding that MS is an obstacle. Or worse, that folks will start checking out other options like OpenOffice.org or OS X or one of the Linux distros. Or, even worse, they'll start to realise that MS stock is a worse investment than Enron:
Mainstream press is starting to figure out that MS-Windows dominance will last only another 2- 4 years and that only because of the enormous marketing and lobbying engine that MS is. To add weight to that, MS blocked its employees from exercising their "underwater" stock options during 2004. That was intended to increase retention, as employees need to remain with Microsoft to receive the payout. Retention would not be an issue unless the company looked to have no future.
Many execs, however haven't been able to empty their portfolios yet and want more delay.
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
"...In my opinion, Linux is thoroughly infested with patent violations. I have in my hand 228 cases of pieces of code which would appear to be either card-carrying patent violations, or certainly disloyal to the cause of intellectual property, but which nevertheless are still helping to shape the functioning of Linux..."
(if you don't get it...)
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
You know this is starting to sound more and more like an episode in US history. How many of you remember the story of the British East India Company and the early 1770's? It seems that the British government was trying to keep the British East India Company from failing financially and passed some laws to assist them "unfairly". The near-term result in the case of the British East India Company was a party in Boston Harbor (a.k.a. The Boston Tea Party). Maybe we should be reminding out governments about such things. It has been said that if you forget your history, you are doomed to repeat it. It seems to me that we are repeating it in that we are "unfairly" protecting large corporations with governmental laws.
I am not suggesting that we have "The Seattle Software Party". I don't think that polluting the Port of Seattle would accomplish anything in this case. I am simply suggesting that you should each give your law makers a history lesson to remind them of the consequences of government caving to big business and not protecting the people.
I have no sig, does anyone have one to spare?
Did anyone actually read the article? I would image that the person who submitted the story did and hope that Michael decided that it needed some more anti-microsoft tone too it and re-wrote it.
NO WHERE in the article does it state (in either yahoo or the register) that it will be Microsoft v.s. World. If you use half of your brain to remember that Microsoft indemified all of its customers from being sued (plenty of links in the comment area already) you would understand what Steve B is talking about.
Steve B runs Microsoft, Microsofts biggest competitor is Linux. Microsoft is telling Governments "Hey, we'll protect you if someone tries to sue you for patent violations. If you use linux, who will protect you from then ?"
Balmer is not saying "If you use linux I WILL sue you for violating patents". He is not saying "Use microsoft or you will be sued". He is saying that "I [steve b] will gurantee that you wont be sued if you use MS products, but if you use linux, you could be sued"
Even the register says "He did not specify that Microsoft would be the company doing the suing", which right after that it puts its own anti-MS propoganda.
so, MS fud? not a chance. Slashdot FUD? beyond all doubt.
I follow the SDK and GDN principles.. Spelling Dont Kount, Grammer Dont Neither
You gotta love it. "Microsoft.. warned Asian governments... they could face patent lawsuits..." Marmoset, meet the 900-pound gorilla. :) The idea of corporations having unlimited power and almost no accountability is somewhat foreign to the Chinese rulers. This kind of priviledge was historically reserved for the Communist Party, I doubt its leaders would welcome competition from Microsoft. :)
Future Wiki -- If you don't think about the future, you cannot have one.
In the dark past of Frenchkind, there is only war...
Apparently the poster has not been paying attention to either the article or modern history. When countries are in the WTO, they take place in the World Intellectual Property Organization also. Laws cross national boundries now.
Revolutions are never about freedom or justice. They're about who's going to be top dog. -- Kilgore Trout
I guess it's official, Linux is a real threat to Microsoft's OS dominance. Now that Balmer seems to be going out of his way to put Linux in the limelight, everyone who's been on the fence to this point should take a look and see what all of the fuss is about. Here's a link to the Knoppix to help if anyone wants to try before they buy! The Slackware based Slax is worth a look too.
Balmer's attacks certainly mean that the threat on the server is real, but it may also speak to what MS projects on the desktop. No, Linux isn't likely to take the desktop in the US, but MS is probably projecting lowered sales of Windows there too. Why? Because the PC market is reaching saturation with today's machines more than powerful enough to meet the needs of most, which means fewer new PCs will be sold. Most sales of Windows are in new PC bundles. PCs also face competition from other increasingly capable consumer electronics like cell phones, music players, and handheld game consoles. These competing devices are less expensive than a PC and much easier to use. All of this means eroding sales of Windows over the next few years. Microsoft may have been holding out hope that the growing PC market in Asian might rescue Windows, but the Chinese-Korean-Japanese joint Linux venture threatens to close that door. So Balmer is probably getting a little desperate. Personally, I think if Microsoft is to survive, it'll be Bill Gates who figures out what they need to do. I think that in the end Microsoft will have to learn to play nice with Linux just as Sun seems to be doing now.
To the making of books there is no end, so let's get started
Ballmar is a complete idiot, and it seems slashdot is good at missing out on news...
So why is this?
Well, last time I checked, most of Europe is in the WTO.
Now, as you can read on Groklaw also, Poland just decided on not supporting the EU software patent proposal, thereby removing the majority that was there, so it seems that patents are a logn way off in the EU for now.
MS can (and should imho) engorce copyright, but to claim that they can enforce their patents in any country that becomes a WTO member ? From what is happening in EUrope it seems they are more then a bit off there.
This is a typical case of what can properly be called FUD.
Thank god for SCO! Without SCO, the very idea of the Redmond software juggernaut wielding its mighty IP portfolio to crush some upstart software system, written by some "random hacker in China", would send corporate executives scrambling for the protection of O Holy Microsoft.
... and suing IBM, and suing and suing ... and not winning (yet) ... and not winning, and not winning ... Hmm, maybe this intellectual property crap isn't all it's made out to be, after all.
But guess what? For over a year now, these executives have been hearing about this little SCO company suing IBM, and
And what's this Linux thing the executives keep hearing about? Oh, it's nothing to worry about, says Microsoft. Ignore it, says Microsoft. Pay no attention, says Microsoft's Steve Ballmer to Munich, skiing across the Atlantic to bring this not very important message to Germany. Don't bother to even think about it, says Microsoft, pulling out all manner of independent reviews to prove its point.
And now, Microsoft roars, if you use Linux, we will SUE YOU!!!! (if you're in China). The Price-Waterhouse executive quakes in his boots as he gazes on the corporate global map--
Hey, waitaminnit, he says. We don't *have* anything in China.
He picks up the phone. "Miss Wynton? Have you renewed our corporate membership in MandrakeClub Gold yet?"
Thank you, SCO.
404555974007725459910684486621289147856453481154 in hex is "You sank my Battleship?"
[GPG key in journal]
Laws and Regulations provides links to English language translations of the Chinese law of copyright, trademarks, patents, etc. There is not much here that would look unfamiliar to the U.S. or any of it's major trading partners. No one is expecting any immeadiate changes on the street, but building a solid IP portfolio is beginning to look like a good business practice even in China. Microsoft Notebook: Piracy battle is key in China
OSRM hired PJ to do a free-lance project for OSRM, a project PJ wanted to do on her own anyway but didn't have the time to do it. The project was to update the Linux timeline. OSRM hired PJ to do this project on a new site, Grokline, not on Groklaw, and said she could spend as much time as she needed to work on Groklaw. This was good as before PJ had to do freelance paralegal work which prevented her from spending as much time on Groklaw as she wanted. Now she could spend a lot more time.
Everybody's happy except those people who believe the lie that PJ sells insurance. She doesn't. She has no controlling interest in OSRM. She was hired by them to do a specific job, a job in fact that will lessen the need for people to get insurance!
As for the 228 or 283 patent violations, that gets thrown around loosely in very inaccurate ways. Read the orignal OSRM press release (yes, it came from them, not from PJ who had nothing to do with it) and you'll see that OSRM is NOT saying that Linux violates patents, but that in today's litigation-happy climate, it's good to be aware that there are a bunch of patents out there that are vague enough to possible be used in nuisance lawsuits by someone hostile to Linux. It doesn't mean Linux really DOES violate those patents, but that unscrupulous companies might try to pretend otherwise. As SCO proved, you can be completely wrong and yet gum up the court system for a long time while you blab about your lies. That costs money. So OSRM, as other groups did, stepped up and said if you were in a vulnerable position (that is, prominent and a likely target from a money-hungry unscrupulous company), they would offer insurance in the case that you did get take to court.
Individual developers don't have to worry about it. They're not the cash-rich targets the SCOs of the world seek to shake down.
None of the above will shake the confidence of the anti-Groklaw shills that are spreading lies about PJ in an attempt to discredit her. They may not be in SCO's employ, they might even be sincere (sincerely wrong, of course), but the net effect is to help SCO's efforts. Way to go, trolls. I hope anyone else who reads this will take the time to research what I said to prove for themselves that what I said is a lot more accurate than what the anti-Groklaw folks are saying.
...you threaten to sue customers and potential customers for not buying your product.
This is REAL bad for Microsoft. First, it shows how much of a threat Linux is.
Second, those companies and governments he is threatening will think twice about enacting any software patent laws.
Third, no one likes to be threatened! It's just a simple fact that threatening someone is the worse thing you can do to make someone do what you want. Instantly that "someone" is antagonistic and will try at the first available moment to escape.
When Microsoft competed against Linux on price and quality it had a chance. Now we know it's over.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
Secondly, who owns them?
Why, oh why does anyone listen to this tripe? And how long will it take for Microsoft to learn that attempting to force customers into its arms at gunpoint isn't going to work?
As it shows a degree of panic on Microsoft's part. Ballmer starts out with the assumption that software patents are going to be conditional on entry to the WTO. This overlooks two main points:
1) The WTO is, by definition, the WORLD Trade organisation. Subserviance to a global Microsoft Patent arsenal would put Microsoft a step closer to killing off any competition from freely distributable FOSS that can be deployed in homes and businesses. As Linux is the only real competition that Redmond have had in the last 15-20 years to surrender to this would be tantamount to giving MS the global software market forever. Future free software development in countries other than the US would be more difficult, possibly impossible, leaving every country in the hands of the MS. Your country disagrees with America? Simple, Homeland security adds you to the export ban list and all of a sudden your DRM permission gets revoked. Far fetched? Manybe, but in the current climate I bet its gone through a few minds in high places.
2) There are not many countries that trust America at the moment. Europe's nervous about Iraq (why not it's a lot closer to Iraq than the US is), half of the Middle East is keeping its head down while the other half sit wondering whether their next and are probably tooling up just in case. The North Koreans? Wouldn't wanna be in their shoes right now. The Chinese won't want to submit to anyone as their economy's growing fast and they won't want to relinquish control. In short, global software patents suit one country and although Tony Blair will probably prostrate himself on the Whitehouse carpet while swearing to keep the UK government/Microsoft partnership going it's still part of Europe.
So; Given that the main effect of global software patents will be to kill of any other countries chances of competing with Microsoft, what reason have they got for signing up. If anything, this speech gives Europe and China a sign of the state of things to come adding extra impetus to turn to Mandrake, SuSE, Red Star Linux and forget about software patents for good.
As SCO come closer to death it's interesting to see Microsoft's anti-Linux activities seeming more desperate as they flail around looking for options however implausible they may be. The ultimate effect of this one though may be the isolation of Microsoft to American territory, their overseas markets cut off by their own hand.
Incidently, if terrorism is the art of threatening attack in order to influence governments or organisations the tone of Stevey Boys rant could easily be interpreted as such. I therefore suggest that Redmond be declared part of the axis of evil terrorist organisations. A UN force should be deployed in Ballmers office and sanctions be imposed on the evil dictator within. Alternatively, it could be subcontracted to the Israelis who can surround the aforementioned with Tanks, keeping Monkey Boy incarcerated until he's 75 and becomes entitled to utilise the French health service.
--
Hmmmmmm..... Deep fried and look like Squirrel.
I wonder if Google could come up with a way to see if anyone is violating any patents. It would be an extremely useful tool, and a lot of corporations would buy such a tool.
So many of the patents are vague, wide ranging, overlapping and untested in court (and quite likely invalid) that any substantial software development would quite likely appear to violate a number of them. As others have pointed out, given that it's virtually impossible to avoid a *potential* patent violation in these circumstances, it's actually much better *not* to attempt to check for these possible violations, since the penalties for wilful patent violation are apparently much higher than for unknowing violation.
Considered submitting this version of the story myself; what makes this one different is the commentary towards the end (edited here):-
What about all of those countries who're already members of the WTO? They should perhaps also get the message about how Microsoft sees IP law being used in the future. Which might well have a helpful collateral damage effect in Europe, if Europe's leaders are paying attention. Yesterday the Polish Government backed out of support for the EU patents directive, in a move which threatens to derail it... the sound of Microsoft threatening all-out IP war really ought to strengthen the opposition's hand, and make the European Parliament, which opposes software patents, more determined to fight. So well done, Steve, we look forward to the rebuttal.
"Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
Seattle Software Party...
You mean something like having some people go out in the streets and protest against governments protecting large corporations with "unfair" laws?
Evolution is just a scientific theory. Creationism is not.
They understand the Asian business culture even less than they do the US. When your dealing with Asian culture they will smile and say we are sorry, what can we do to make you happy. While in the background everyone is getting the whips, chains, and tasers.
All Ballmer did with this statement is acknowledge that they were going to start a business war. What he may fail to see is that the business war has already started. He just told them where they were going to throw a salvo. So now they can posture being defensless and talk and negotiate on this point, while making other plans.
I really think that his statements were meant for the ear of US businesses.
....It was in grade-school. He didn't bother to attend class; he just hung around the perimeter, terrorizing those smaller than him and robbing them of their lunch money.
:P
Normally, thugs like these end up in prison, usually for assault-with-intent. In this case, unfortunately, this particular thug managed to hook-up with a corporation with a personality just like his....
Regards;
I am not one who likes lawsuits or believe in suing, but as an open source software user and writer, I may have to encourage just that. It seems to me that Microsoft is mobilizing its lawyer corps and is using its patent portfolios in order to deter Linux users. Microsoft is also vulnerable in this same area. Microsoft has settled with several companies regarding software patents. There is also another area in which I can see that Microsoft is vulnerable. This area concerns the amount of viruses, spam, trojans, spyware, and other malware that is spread by Microsoft's lack of security.
Yes, I know that people that use Microsoft products are forced to agree to their E.U.L.A. and that E.U.L.A. does away with customers' options to sue Microsoft for damages caused by their product. I also know of many who do not use Microsoft's products and are still affected by Microsoft's products' lack of security. I am one of these people. I use Linux at work, home, and on my webhosting service and at each one of these places, I have to deal with spam. This spam is in many cases sent by unwitting Microsoft users whos computers have contracted spam spewing worms. While they are effective blocked from suing Microsoft, I am not. Neither are the thousands of ISP's around the country who have to pay for the costs of filtering, storing, blocking, and receiving spam. If Microsoft's insecurity is a contributing factor in the transmission of any kind of attack and that attack ends up costing people who have not agreed to any of Microsoft's E.U.L.A.'s, then Microsoft may be responsible for its share of the cost.
Here is the costs to employers. If you do not use Microsoft's products, just ask yourself this question, "How much time do I spend at work filtering and deleting virus and spam email?" Take that time and convert to hours. Multiply the hours by your pay rate. Have other non Microsoft-using employees at your job site do the same. Add these costs together. Now take the total amount and multiply by the estimated percentage of spam spread by spam-spewing software which was spread by Microsoft's software vulnerabilities. This is the amount Microsoft costs your employer.
Now look at your ISP. If your ISP does not use Microsoft's products, they have a case too. Figure out the total bandwith used by spam. Multiply this figure by the percentage of SPAM sent by Microsoft's insecurities. Do the same for denial of service attacks. Add these figures together. If your ISP pays for virus, spam, and D.O.S. filtering and blocking, you can multiply cost of these by the persentage of attacks caused by Microsoft's insecurities. Add the blocking and bandwidth costs together, and you get what Microsoft costs your ISP.
Yes, it also costs governments. Look at how much it costs the government to produce computer security programs. Multiply this cost by the percentage of problems caused by Microsoft's insecurities. You get the amount of money Microsoft costs governments for computer security programs.
How much does Microsoft's insecurities cost you? Your ISP has to make a profit. So do most employers. Higher costs gives governments excuses to raise taxes. All these costs are passed to you in one way or another. You also have to filter spam, viruses and such from your emails, how much time does that cost you? Does this sound like it can make for many lawsuits? I sounds like it to me. So, I would recommend that Microsoft be very careful about how it uses it legal clout.
The article only states that Microsoft dominance will last at least two to four years more, it does not imply it might wane after that point. Only that it is a lock until then.
However the article makes a terrible assumption, that Microsoft is way outspending "Open Source" with R&D dollars!! Six billion (for MS) to ten million (OSDL labs R&D budget).
If you think about it that is really absurd, you should really think about it in terms of raw manpower and not dollars spent. In software some guy in a garage working weekends is every bit a potential source of a great idea as some guy sitting on a million dollars worth of hardware. There is no supercollider or electron microscope of the software world without which it would be hard to make a contribution. Counting manpower, Microsoft is hopelessly outclassed by many orders of magnitude.
So, basically I would say just don't quote that article at all!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
My personal theory about why Gates stepped down as CEO, handing the job to Ballmer is that basically Gates is a decent guy who is just interested in technology and tinkering. His foundation (with Melinda) certainly is trying to do some good with all that money. Gates eventually grew tired of all the lying and deceiving that seems to be required (he certainly didn't lie very well in court and the DOJ). Whereas Ballmer clearly has no compunctions about lying and deceiving the public. He doesn't seem to have an ethical bone in his body. My sense was/is that Gates was sincere (however misguided or faulty his technology has been) about trying to do good things for the customer, whereas Ballmer clearly has no true interest in what is best for customer compared with his own self-interests. Gates never talked the way that Ballmer now talks...
As I recall, the ownership of these patents has never been revealed. For all we know, these patents could be owned by IBM. I know of one offhand - the RCU patent. IBM has publically stated that this patent is freely available for use within Linux (since they contributed it). Who knows how many other "friendly" patents are in there...
Ron Gage - Westland, MI
Well. I think they can pull it off. Theyll go all the way up to the supreme.
Since the supreme is own3d by your dearly chosen ass of the millenium (Bush) and, he in turn, holds ballmer as a great big chunk of what he calls his 'base', software patents will be accepted and confimed in final words by the supreme.
Congrats americans. Youve fucked up.... twice this millenium.
NO SIG
Just shift it to a US naval base in Cuba - no law applies there.
I believe it will be only a matter of time before the economic credibility of patents comes crumbling down like a castle of cards. This is the argument that will ultamately win the fight against patents.
Value of flimsy ideas comming out of the patent system $0.
Economic loss due to having substantial reduced competition, next to zero innovation and overheads in software development $mega bucks.
It just is not worth it!
Now if you consider the term "intellectual property" and the parallel to physical property, having software patents is equivalent to saying that air should be owned by a corporation (thus making you pay for air) or that I have to pay someone a license to look at the moon, or that some corporation owns a part of airspace so that you have to pay 1,000,000 corporations to travel from Australia to USA. We have private property rights essential for a functional society that believes in liberty but we have also have limits to property ownership also essential for a functional and society that believes in liberty.
If you consider the Kyoto protocol, this protocol intends to moneterise carbon emission levels not for the heck of it, but because limiting and moneterising carbon emissions has much greater economic gain than the loss and overheads involved with placing an artificial barrier to the carbon emission levels. Thus this same principle must apply to patents.
There has been a huge level of innovation in OSS software. The GPL which is tied into copyright is mainly responsible for this. It has nothing to do with patents. The way the patent system is now, with a weekend worth of brainstorming I can generate a million dollars of patents. Where is the value? Now you really need patents when you have to invest in a billion dollar labratory to invent new innovations in any field. But to give someone a monopoly for so many software generations for zero value, we are just selling out our future!
Consider the hinderence to innovation. Spend 10 million dollars per innovation or spend 0 dollars per innovation, which will you choose? If I was given the option I would choose the cheaper option. But any patent authority that is meant to encourage innovation must make every company that applies for a monopoly really EARN their monopoly, which is not happening, nor will it ever happen with software patents.
Yet another ironic recursive statement.
Remember folks, sg is about to move to a US-like copyright regime starting this Jan, after a successful round of FTA talks with the US. Essentially, we're about to get a DMCA-like law here, which includes criminalisation of piracy (currently, only selling pirated software is illegal; now even possession is punishable by jail), and yup, you guessed it, patenting of software.
Gov.sg organisations, which have been MS-friendly so far, are therefore running scared, and are fast moving over to OSS; to cite another example, the sg library system has also moved its systems over to Linux now. Smalltime .net-only ISV's like mine are already feeling the pinch; I know of at least two other ISV's like ours who are seriously considering migrating their code-bases to Mono or something like that.
Ballmer's comments should be taken in this context here; he's basically telling us that we can, possibly, run, but not hide, from the MS-patents keiretsu.
More than mere navel gazing.
Maybe not sued but they still have to pay (or alredy paid) for such lawsuits. Where does Microsoft get the money from? From customers. Thus, if Microsoft is sued, costs are charged to their customers (more or less directly).
And IANAL, users can't be responsible for patent or copyright infrigement in software products they did not developed. Only those who actualy put the "questionable" code into the product should be responsible.
Thus, if customer is charged money for "indemnification" from IP lawsuits related to software he is using then he is not doing good purchase. No metter from whom he is purchasing (Microsoft, Sun, Red Hat, Linus & co., ...) and for what price ($1, $100, $1'000, ...). IMHO.
The whole "indemnification issue" from (at least some) software vendors looks to me like in best case like "Hey, customer. You know, todays IP laws suks and we are not sure whether we have some stolen-or-something IP in our products so while we do not want to pay the bill for such fucked-up system, you'll pay but to make you more comfortable with that, let us agree that we will call it indemnification and it means we are protecting you from bad-guys.".
Or, in worst case "Hey, customer. We stole some IP from others and put it into our product. It's great because we make money from you thanks to work of others. And because they may sue us, you have to pay us for indemnification so we do not go out of business. And while today IP laws suks, we can make all this fishy arrangement look like we are doing you a favor.".
hany