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A Background of a 'Background Checker'

pamri writes "The Times of India profiles Jay Patel, of Abika, a firm that specializes in background checks, personality profiles, satellite or aerial Photos of any location besides other services in the US. It is now venturing into other countries including Canada and India. Abika is already facing protests from Canadian Privacy groups for breaching the Canadian Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act"

204 of 277 comments (clear)

  1. Personality profile? by REBloomfield · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Hell, Google will do a damn good job of that. Hundreds of USENET posts and forum posts and website things, you can find most of my life out there on big ol' web.....

    1. Re:Personality profile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      So.. How're your tropical fish doing..? :)

    2. Re:Personality profile? by garcia · · Score: 4, Interesting

      And that's exactly what companies do when they interview you. I have personally had three interviews and found that typically *after* you have the interview a Google referrer shows up in your logs from the interviewing company.

      I know one guy on IRC that interviewed with a company and they spent a good amount of time passing around the link to his gallery (mostly pertaining to the pictures of the large gauges in his ears).

      One interviewer checked my site before I came in (and I knew it) and he said that they didn't hire pot smokers. He assumed I was a pot smoker because I was a Grateful Dead fan.

      Just remember that you may or may not be hired due to interpretations of your "web presence" regardless of whether or not it's actually how you live your life.

    3. Re:Personality profile? by Umbral+Blot · · Score: 1

      I wonder if Google will in actuallity replace these kinds of services. It must (may) be possible to automate this kind of searching, and if you did you would turn up information about the personality and opinions of your subject, rather than just their official history. This may well turn out to be more relevant to those who use this service. (did you mean your post to be funny? It looks as if you are insightfully funny)

    4. Re:Personality profile? by Lonesome+Squash · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Hell, Google will do a damn good job of that. Hundreds of USENET posts and forum posts and website things, you can find most of my life out there on big ol' web.....

      Actual conversation:
      "Dad, did you write something about masturbation on the web a long time ago?"

      "What? No! Waitaminute, yes. Not on the web, on a newsgroup. But it was just a metaphor! It was about intellectual masturbation."

      "My friends think you're so cool!"

      Who knew when we were writing that stuff 15 years ago that it would be around FOREVER?

      P.S. How did I know what she was talking about so fast? A former student of mine tracked me down one day. The first thing he said was, "Hey, I read that thing of yours about masturbation." I had no recollection of it so I went and looked it up.

      --
      Behold the riant ape! Beware, his crooked thumbs!
    5. Re:Personality profile? by REBloomfield · · Score: 1

      see! exactly... it's what i get for being lazy and not using a different ID...

      they're fine, incidentally.... :)

    6. Re:Personality profile? by g0at · · Score: 3, Funny

      One interviewer checked my site before I came in (and I knew it) and he said that they didn't hire pot smokers. He assumed I was a pot smoker because I was a Grateful Dead fan.

      Did you respond that it was fine since you never work for people who beat their wives anyway?

      -ben

    7. Re:Personality profile? by REBloomfield · · Score: 1

      I work in a school, and after i'd been here two years, the Principal found a page on site that detailed my copious piercings. She had me take it down.

    8. Re:Personality profile? by blowdart · · Score: 1
      Seriously, who the hell have you been interviewing for??

      I've searched for people when I've seen their CV. For the type of technical positions (either web based, streaming media or .net stuff) I'd expect to either find their web site or a usenet post somewhere. If I don't I get a little suspicious.

      That's not to say I will reject people based on what google throws up, that's too dangerous, especially when you get a CV from John Smith, but if I saw a CV and the resulting search from someone called Sandford Wallace I'd think twice about hiring them.

    9. Re:Personality profile? by Lonesome+Squash · · Score: 1
      Link Please?

      Sorry, I should have included it. Try any of these, and search for "mastur".

      I don't know how I ended up on pages of these quotations by Einstein, Fuller, T.H. Huxley, etc. But there I am. That part of the file goes Konrad Lorenz . . . Thomas Paine . . . Isaac Asimov . . . Richard Lederer . . . ME! . . .Clarence Darrow... I know I'll never get into such company again.
      Sadly, my daughter's friends don't think I'm cool for hanging out with the Big Boys, but for publicly using the word, "masturbation."

      --
      Behold the riant ape! Beware, his crooked thumbs!
    10. Re:Personality profile? by abysmilliard · · Score: 5, Interesting
      This is one incident where being named Jones makes me happy.

      I can never find myself on Google, even with my full name. Sometimes not even with the city I'm in.

      All those years bemoaning the mundanity of my name, and it turns out it may someday become my greatest defense against the All-Seeing Eye of Google

    11. Re:Personality profile? by northcat · · Score: 1

      you can find most of my life out there on big ol' web.....

      Isn't that a pickup line?

    12. Re:Personality profile? by REBloomfield · · Score: 2, Funny

      dunno... are you hitting on me?

    13. Re:Personality profile? by WormholeFiend · · Score: 1

      Was the Principal specifically searching for you, or for piercings?

    14. Re:Personality profile? by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 1

      I'm kind of curious where exactly it is any of their business, legally. Unless you are getting into the level of libel or slander against the school or anyone in it, then I can understand.

    15. Re:Personality profile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Oh great. There's a guy with my name who's a gay porn star. No wonder I can't get a job.

    16. Re:Personality profile? by REBloomfield · · Score: 1

      i think it's more of a having to present a professional image to my students, and if they discover that i like to stick large bits of metal through certain large parts of my body in my spare time, that they might like, lose some respect for me or something. I was happy to take it down, it wasn't a big deal.

    17. Re:Personality profile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Want a job? That's an easy one. Apply for a job as a gay porn star. There's already a huge amount of stuff on the web you can use as your resume. ;)

    18. Re:Personality profile? by Inda · · Score: 4, Funny

      RE: R. E. Bloomfield Personality Profile

      Hi! Remember me? Remember when we robbed the local 24hr garage? I still think about the blood pouring from that blind old aged pensioner in the wheelchair. I thought her head was going to pop when you stamped on it for the third time!

      Did you ever get away with the drug smuggling operation you were running? I told the police that you were the lowest on the ladder - I think they bought it. I didn't read any newspaper stories so I'm guessing you're OK..?

      Who would have thought that, after all these years, I'd find you through Google.

      How's the job hunting going?

      --
      This post contains benzene, nitrosamines, formaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide.
    19. Re:Personality profile? by THESuperShawn · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "One interviewer checked my site before I came in (and I knew it) and he said that they didn't hire pot smokers. He assumed I was a pot smoker because I was a Grateful Dead fan"

      Sounds like a case of slander and/or deflamation of character to me. There are very strict rules about what can be said/asked in an interview (or on the job, or when firing, etc), and they are enforced pretty seriously. I know of one person who actually got in a little bit of trouble for giving a negative reference for an old employee.

      Always remember, you are interviewing the company at the same time they are interviewing you. If this was a person of authority, and I would assume they would be if they were interviewing you, would you really want to work for someone who made such accusations without backing it up?

      Just thin, whenever he found the toilet seat still up, the coffee pot empty, the TP roll finished off, spoiled food in the fridge, etc, he would be looking to blame someone.

      Even though it sucked he labeled you like that, it doesn't sound like a company you would want to work for anyway...

      --
      Repant. Thy end is sheer.
    20. Re:Personality profile? by REBloomfield · · Score: 3, Funny

      dammit.... busted......

    21. Re:Personality profile? by iainl · · Score: 1

      Aaah, I see the problem. I think the previous posters had assumed you were a student, not a teacher.

      --
      "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    22. Re:Personality profile? by stevey · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I come top when you search google for my name.

      My website has images of my tattoos, graphic mentions of my body piercings, and a lot of free software.

      I'm happy if people rule me out on the ground of piercings/tattoos whatever. At the end of the day the kind of environment where those things are unaceptable (no matter how discriminatory they are) I'm not going to want to work.

      I think that my achievements stand on their own technical merits.

      Hopefully somebody who's looking for a Debian Administrator would get in touch despite my piercings/tattoos/etc. If not no loss.

      We've just saved me and them some time on each side.

    23. Re:Personality profile? by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      A search of GoogleGroups will get a lot more than my life since ARS and NANAE have been the hardest hit by sporgery (spam-forgery) attacks over the years.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    24. Re:Personality profile? by Jucius+Maximus · · Score: 1
      "Just remember that you may or may not be hired due to interpretations of your "web presence" regardless of whether or not it's actually how you live your life."

      Crap, I'd better remove that link from my sig!

    25. Re:Personality profile? by Saxton · · Score: 1

      Seriously, who the hell have you been interviewing for??

      I would assume he applied somewhere where they actually take some effort in their hiring decisions. What he described is not uncommon.

      -Aaron

      --
      My name is Aaron Landry, and I approve this message.
    26. Re:Personality profile? by gcaseye6677 · · Score: 1

      Remember Bernard Shifman from Chicago? Google for that name, if you want to see an example of someone to NEVER hire at any cost. This is the type of stuff employers want to find out ahead of time, and will rarely become apparent in an interview. Bad employees are a huge liability, so someone's reputation and conduct in previous jobs is a valuable indicator as to how they will eventually perform in a new job.

    27. Re:Personality profile? by DutchSter · · Score: 1

      [i] This is one incident where being named Jones makes me happy.

      I can never find myself on Google, even with my full name. Sometimes not even with the city I'm in.[/i]

      Must be nice - I don't exactly have a common name, but anyone who searches for it will find that there is a college instructor in my age bracket from Europe who actively promotes "hacktivism" and defacing corporate websites. You can imagine the fun that I had when I went to an interview and they kept asking me questions about ethics and "bending the rules for a cause." After I looked completely dumbfounded, the interviewer explained that they had done a Google on me and found all sorts of stuff attached to my name. Funny the job was for an IT security position. They hired me anyway, after the interviewer pulled up the instructor's site and looked him up at his Univ and called him right from the interview room. Once my alter ego answered and announced himself with our mutual name the interviewer was like "Sorry, wrong number."

      Cleared that bit of confusion right up, but made for a very anxious few minutes! Incidentally, I can't find anything about *myself* on Google, just this other guy. I'm just thankful that they even let me come in the door for a sit-down and didn't just "assume." Now that I'm in management myself, I've vowed to never assume - whenever I interview a candidate, I always let them come in and speak their piece, especially when something circumstancial points negative.

    28. Re:Personality profile? by Archangel_Azazel · · Score: 1

      --and if they discover that i like to stick large bits of metal through certain large parts of my body in my spare time, that they might like, lose some respect for me or something--

      If anything, I think I would have had MORE respect for any of my teachers in school if I knew that they were more like the younger generation and not like my grandparents beating me over the head with the cudgel of knowledge.....but that's just me I suppose.

      A.A.

      --
      Your mind is like a parachute. It works best when it's been opened.
    29. Re:Personality profile? by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Well if that bothers you, you'll be glad to know Google groups is useless now. :)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    30. Re:Personality profile? by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Sounds like you went on a fishing expedition! :)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    31. Re:Personality profile? by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Well, all I can say is, I hope you have an industrial strength webserver on that box.

      Inviting a slashdotting can be risky.

      If your box actually stays up through this, and I was someone looking for a sys admin, I'd likely hire you. Your site as of now, seems to be performing quite well. Thanks goodness you are running Linux, but I'd recommend upgrading Apache, 1.3.26 is a bit out of date.

      Anyway, if you can survive a slashdotting, you're better than many corporate sites.

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    32. Re:Personality profile? by SlartibartfastJunior · · Score: 2, Interesting

      My sister got a major internship this past summer. After a few days, her new boss mentioned something about "What's this about how you can balance a stack of twelve books on your head and gargle entire scenes from "The Phantom of the Opera?""

      Of course these had never been mentioned, but her boss had googled her name and found her college dorm website with a picture of her balancing a textbook, pizza box, bottle of laundry detergent, a bottle of soda, and a board game on her head all at the same time, along with the program from a dorm open mic night (where she did, indeed, gargle a scene from "The Phantom of the Opera." Luckily, her boss thought this was cool, instead of scary - but it could have gone the other way.

    33. Re:Personality profile? by fucksl4shd0t · · Score: 1

      MASTURBATION MASTURBATION MASTURBATION

      "Daddy, why did you call yourself 'fuck slashdot'"?

      "Becasue intellectual masturbation is dumb. To that I say, fuck slashdot!"

      :)

      --
      Like what I said? You might like my music
    34. Re:Personality profile? by stevey · · Score: 1

      I'd like to get hired based upon my skills, and that's what an interview is for.

      I'm merely suggesting that if somebody were to interview me and come look at my site seeing my piercings/tattoos shouldn't be something I'm worried about.

      If my skills are sufficient, as presented in the interview, then if they are sufficiently unhappy with my piercings/tattoos that they wish to ignore my teamworking/programming/admin experience then it is their loss.

      Not mine. At the end of the day if I'm desperate for cash I can work for a company doing a job where those things aren't relevent, where the people either don't know or don't care what's on under my clothes.

    35. Re:Personality profile? by stevey · · Score: 1

      My box is fine, thanks! I think it would probably cope with a real front-page link, as not much is dynamic most of the content is static or could be switched to a static version quickly if not.

      I've setup a few webservers like Machinima's which have survived a /. attack before.

  2. My Fortress of Solitude by 10101001011 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Of Ice, Snow and the Eskimo (Inuit) is finally succumbing to being invaded by Americans (for flu vaccine, for our natural resources, and now for our privacy). Oh great, we get to become the 52nd State!

    (Iraq is 51st ;) )

    1. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by PornMaster · · Score: 1

      When I lived in London, callers to a radio show were so used to hearing people deride Blair's lapdoggishness by calling the UK the 51st state that they thought there were actually 51 states.

    2. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      you mean 53rd.

      Afghanistan 51
      Iraq 52
      Canada 53

      and you haven't counted several other countries, notably in central and south America.

    3. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by 10101001011 · · Score: 1

      And what about the American's favourite Asian Vacation spot: Vietnam. Wonderful people, great food and a secret evil lurking in the shadows that must be burned out to preserve the two aforementioned good things using Agent Orange.

      Let's face it:

      Canada - 51
      Afghanistan - 52
      Iraq - 53
      Vietnam - 54
      ALL OF SOUTH AMERICA - 55..64

    4. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by I+confirm+I'm+not+a · · Score: 1

      OK, Canada at 51 I can accept, but Afghanistan at 52? Shurely shome mishtake! Where's the UK? Or does Mr Blair's toadying count for nothing, even in the US?

      --
      This is where the serious fun begins.
    5. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by mog007 · · Score: 1

      What about Austrailia? I'd call the land down under number 51 before anybody else.

    6. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by kfg · · Score: 1

      Oh great, we get to become the 52nd State!

      I don't know how to break this to you, but here in upstate NY we've been calling you "The Maple Leaf State" for decades already.

      Wouldn't know what to do without you either, it's handy having the only state with legal Cuban cigars so close by and we're really happy sucking on your hydroelectric tit too.

      It's not like you need your own power anyway, you guys are used to being cold and sitting in the dark, right?

      KFG

    7. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Citizen+of+Earth · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Oh great, we get to become the 52nd State!

      Imagine another blue state with the population of California. I doubt that the present administration would want that.

    8. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Rev+Wally · · Score: 1

      Oh come on now...there's even a song called "51st State" that came out in 1986 http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=10:53 rp28ot054a...so the idea of the UK being the 51st state is atleast that old.

      --
      LOAD "SIG",8,1
    9. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by 10101001011 · · Score: 1

      Canada was created in 1864 (Well, 1867, but the basics were established in 1864) and ever since we have been providing the US with mroe and more resources they couldn't pry out of their own reserves, or used up and needed a quick fix.

      I like to think of Canada as the American natural resources equivilant of a crack dealer...

    10. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Pxtl · · Score: 1

      That's because upstate NY does look a lot like Canada. However, you may or may not have noticed, upstate NY does not look like USA. So really, shouldn't you be "The Stars and Stripes province"?

    11. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Pxtl · · Score: 1

      Actually, I'd be horribly insulted if we were only 1 state, besides the fact that it would be patently unfair. Keep in mind that small states in the USA get a disproportionally large amount of power thanks to the Senate. Canada would be the 51st through 64th states, going 1-to-1 provinces/territories to states.

    12. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by kfg · · Score: 1

      That's because upstate NY does look a lot like Canada.

      I went out for a walk a couple of hours ago. It was pretty nice, for December. I just looked out my window and sometime in the interval my world has turned into an arctic wasteland, so you've got a point. :)

      However, you may or may not have noticed, upstate NY does not look like USA.

      And to the extent that that is true I bless it every day. Hell, in various isolated little nooks and crannies of the Adirondacks we've even got entire villages where people will still pretend they don't understand you if you don't at least try to speak French to them.

      I tend to prefer Vermont though, which looks almost, but not entirely, unlike the USA. It's a little bit of alternate universe, and since I can't stop this one and get off it's the best I can do. Bummer that they caved and joined the Union, innit?

      And I can get there a bit faster than I can get to Cananda, being a bit south of the lake.

      . . .shouldn't you be "The Stars and Stripes province"?

      Well, you guys have already conquered the Northway (Ironic, considering that it was built as a conduit for the American invasion of Canada. One favor though, could you, maybe, stop driving 90 in the slow lane, or at least put down your paper and steer with your hands? Thank you), and I admit the scenario does have certain attractions, but I wouldn't bet that that's the way things are going to go.

      KFG

    13. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Geordon · · Score: 1

      Don't you mean 53rd state? (Or do I mean 54th?)

      I mean, first there's Puerto Rico, then Iraq, (do we count Afganistan in there?), and only THEN do we count Canada! After all, the USA hasn't "liberated" Canada yet...

      --
      It is by caffiene alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of java that thoughts acquire speed, hands acquire
    14. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Jherek+Carnelian · · Score: 1

      Imagine another blue state with the population of California. I doubt that the present administration would want that.

      Never underestimate the power of gerrymandering.

    15. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by back_pages · · Score: 1
      Imagine another blue state with the population of California. I doubt that the present administration would want that.

      Canada is one of the largest suppliers of American oil. Imagine the current administration annexing Canada and claiming all that oil as domestic - reducing our dependence on foreign oil.

      The whole issue of whether or not Canada wants to be liberated notwithstanding, I don't think it's inconceivable, although it would take (or be) a world-changing event.

    16. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Who changed Democrats to blue and Republicans to red?

      I remember when it was the other way around (I know it was in 1980 - Carter v. Reagan).

      It made more sense. Especially with the other meaning of "Red", and what party most "blue blooded" people would be in. Also it fits nicely with this theory. :)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    17. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by Citizen+of+Earth · · Score: 1

      Canada is one of the largest suppliers of American oil. Imagine the current administration annexing Canada and claiming all that oil as domestic - reducing our dependence on foreign oil.

      That's the wonderful thing about trade--especially free trade. There is no need for war. If you want Canada's oil, you can just buy it for no higher price than you would pay to pump it yourself.

    18. Re:My Fortress of Solitude by dman123 · · Score: 1

      According to an informed source (Ken Jennings), the major networks alternated the color scheme every 4 years during election coverage. The recent red vs. blue in such close races has made the public strongly identify with the appropriate colors long after the election was over. Therefore, the colors are now stuck as they are.

      --

      --
      dman123 forever!
      Filtering out the -1s and 0s since 1999.
  3. Recourse by Savant-Ben · · Score: 4, Insightful

    People may be shouting about it, but what international laws prevent this? Espionage? Isn't that for state bodies though.

    1. Re:Recourse by 10101001011 · · Score: 2, Informative

      It isn't necessarily INTERNATIONAL laws that prevent this, rather it is national laws that keep tabs on it. In Canada in any case we have the Privacy Act which basically means people cannot keep your personal information without your consent. Granted, I am doubtful there is a clause that says:

      All font point sizes must exceed size -1...

    2. Re:Recourse by vidnet · · Score: 1

      Makes you wonder who owns the satellite they're spying with.

  4. Outsourcing Privacy. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    "It is now venturing into other countries including Canada and India. Abika is already facing protests from Canadian Privacy groups for breaching the Canadian Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act"

    So in other words. Privacy (getting around) is being outsourced.

    Welcome to the Brave New World. Hope everyone brought an antacid?

    1. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by superpulpsicle · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Who cares. Our credit card companies have more information about us than you can imagine.

    2. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by 10101001011 · · Score: 2, Funny

      I have no:
      Driver's License
      Credit Card
      Valid Bank Account

      The ONLY two sources that have any sizable information on me are the government due to birth records and social insurance number (which I might add cannot be easily linked to my current address).

      Face it, I have no need to worry about my privacy; my life on the other hand, could use some serious pyschiatric evaluation.

    3. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by FCAdcock · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but if you ever need to drive to the airport and get on a plane, you're screwed...

      --
      --Forest C. Adcock--
    4. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by 91degrees · · Score: 1

      How do you avoid having a valid bank account? Most employers would be very reluctant to pay by cash, and paying monthly bills by cash isn't something that most companies encourage.

    5. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by 10101001011 · · Score: 1

      Well:
      -P.O. Boxes for all mail -Cheque Payments are made out to a different name than the account -Many employers I know would be glad to pay cash merely to avoid the taxes and headache they'd have to deal with.

    6. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by 10101001011 · · Score: 1

      Actually, I'm 25... As for how I get away without direct deposit, I live in the land that time forgot - oh shoot! I gave away my location...

    7. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by dotwaffle · · Score: 2, Informative

      Oh how I love our Data Protection Act in the UK ;) It is illegal for any personal information to be shared between companies (and even divisions of government) without a good reason, that has been ok'd by the subject first - that's right, the Police are not allowed to get your Health records unless it's either a criminal investigation or they have your permission - they can't look "just in case", and neither can anyone else...

    8. Re:Outsourcing Privacy. by fucksl4shd0t · · Score: 1

      I don't have a valid bank account. Instead, whenever I receive a check, I read on the check which bank it's drawn on, drive down to that bank and cash it. Slightly inconvenient, certainly. But until my old bank and I agree on how much money I owe them, this is what I'm stuck with. ;(

      --
      Like what I said? You might like my music
  5. This was bound to happen by Large+Bogon+Collider · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Since they are not a Canadian enitiy, they are not bound by Canadian laws. As such, they are not accountable to any but likely much less strict Indian laws. So how does one deal with this? Either 1) Make whomever uses the service (in Canada) be liable, 2) enact international laws via UN or such, or 3) stick head in ground and hope problems go away. This is another problem that comes with being a global community.

    1. Re:This was bound to happen by 10101001011 · · Score: 5, Informative

      I am not sure I understand what you are saying; the Canadian Privacy Act forces ALL corporate entities to destroy any personal data, regardless of where your main office is. If they intend to merely profile Canadians for their business venture, then they would be liable to any laws that are imposed on people conducting business in Canada that are from outside the country.

    2. Re:This was bound to happen by zrobotics · · Score: 1

      even so, if they're operating in Canada, they still have to follow Canadian laws. the worst the Canadians can do is kick them out of the county, however IMHO, i think this won't fly, cause there's enough resistance against something like this in Canada

    3. Re:This was bound to happen by Umbral+Blot · · Score: 3, Interesting

      yes, but how would canada enforce this law if they never set foot in Canada. extridition? I don't think that would sit well with other governments.

    4. Re:This was bound to happen by Large+Bogon+Collider · · Score: 1

      I am not that familiar with Canadian laws. However, one thing is still very true in these days. Data, once created, is very difficult to completely eradicate despite the use of legal means to deal with it. A case in point is CSS/DeCSS. I believe that the only way data will ever go away is if it is completely undesireable. Maybe one alternate to combatting this sort of data mining is to seed it with ludicrously false info so as to make the database worthless.

    5. Re:This was bound to happen by normandr · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This person does not have privileged access to information about me. He is just collecting what is out there. This is just a snow storm in a teapot. You can sue if you are being defamed.

    6. Re:This was bound to happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      Are you a a lawyer? I'm not. But I am a Canadian law student. So I probably know more about the law, particularly Canadian law, than 99% of the posters on this board. Which isn't saying much, I admit.

      That said, with respect, you're very wrong.

      As a matter of law, you can always bring a claim against a foreign defendant in your own jurisdiction. The threshold issue will be whether your jurisdiction is the appropriate venue to pursue the claim.

      Incidentally, I don't think the problem is so much PIPEDA as defamation. If someone publishes inaccurate and defamatory information about me, I can sue their pants off, whether I'm in Canada or the US. But I'd probably want to do it in Canada, since US libel laws are pretty defendant-friendly.

      If you succeed, however, you'd have to enforce the judgment in the defendant's jurisdiction, which could be problematic.

      Incidentally, although the Times of India is profiling this fellow, the company is based in Wyoming (or so claims their WHOIS record). One would go after the corporate person, I would think, so at the very least, people can sue the corp under Wyoming/US law.

      If, for any reason, you think I'm full of it, then note that Americans regularly sue Canadians in American courts. Right now there's a great case about a junkyard owner in Virginia suing CIBC (one of Canada's largest banks) in negligence for mistakenly sending faxes containing the bank's customers' information to his business.

      However, IANAL. None of the foregoing is legal advice.

    7. Re:This was bound to happen by eison · · Score: 1

      Oooooooooooooh ooooh I know I know, 3!
      Do I win?

      --
      is competition good, or is duplication of effort bad?
    8. Re:This was bound to happen by Rich0 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The issue isn't principle - it is practicality.

      Suppose somebody from Sealand travels to Canada and kills somebody. Then they fly back to Sealand before the crime is discovered.

      Clearly the broke Canadian law. However, the fact is that the Canadians can't do anything about it except invade Sealand, impose sanctions of some sort on the entire country, or hope the guy flys back to Canada so that they can arrest him at Immigration.

      The company in question gets lots of money from Canadians, but probably never steps foot in Canada, or has assets of any kind there. If they aren't violating Indian laws then the Indian govermnent will probably not extradite them. That is, unless the rest of the civilized world imposes sanctions until they adopt privacy laws. Probably won't happen - too much money to be made there...

      Many people break foreign laws all the time - perhaps by not praying daily to the local dictator, or whatever. As long as you never set foot in those countries, there isn't much they can do about it. This is usually a good thing, but sometimes a bad thing. Then again, the average Indian probably could care less about Canadian privacy laws - they're just happy for the extra jobs...

    9. Re:This was bound to happen by budgenator · · Score: 1

      IANAL but in a quick scan of the Canadian law, my lay American eyes didn't see where the law is limited to Canadians, apply to organizations that sell personal information across provincial borders. This seems to be one of those strange laws where if something is illegal for you to do or not depends on what someone else really does with it or where. My take is if an American company sells the info about a Canadian to an American, the Canadian law isn't broken; but if the Any Company sells the info across a Provincial border, then it is. I'm not sure what the Canadians would do to a foriegn corp but individuals from that corp. might end up on a watch-list that could make travel rather exciting.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    10. Re:This was bound to happen by Rich0 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I think the principle is that unless there is a good reason not to allow it, everybody should be able to petition their courts when they are treated unjustly. After all, their local courts are the ones which they would tend to trust to judge their case fairly (since they comply with local views of right and wrong and civil rights).

      When a sensitive issue of diplomacy is involved, the local state department or equivalent may file briefs with the court to address these issues as well. Once a judgement is made, the foreign government can choose whether or not to obey it, and the local executive branch can decide whether or not to seek to force the foreign goverment to obey it.

      For countries with similar principles of justice and civil rights this probably works out fine most of the time. It tends to work out less well when one country is a democracy and the other is a dictatorship, or something like that. Unless the democracy wants to go to war or impose heavy sanctions (which only work so well, and may lead to war), things are pretty much in the hands of the dictator.

      Note that one of the big areas of controversy surounding the International Criminal Court is the concept that individual countries would give up their power to veto a judgement of this court. In the USA, for instance, supreme court justices are appointed by a US-elected president and confirmed by a US-elected senate. An ICC justice would have a much more murky selection process, and the US would certainly have fairly little influence over their selection. To a US sentator asked to ratify the necessary treaties, the question is "why appoint somebody we have no control over to have power over US citizens, when the international court gives us no benefit we don't already have?" (The ICC doesn't benefit the US much, since if Osama Bin Laden were found the US wouldn't be calling for a warrant by the ICC, they would simply transport him to America to stand justice there. It isn't like anybody is going to refuse to extradite him.)

    11. Re:This was bound to happen by radtea · · Score: 1


      Or:

      4) Behave like the United States, and impose our laws by force on the citizens of foreign countries.

      --Tom

      --
      Blasphemy is a human right. Blasphemophobia kills.
    12. Re:This was bound to happen by tonyr60 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "Clearly the broke Canadian law. However, the fact is that the Canadians can't do anything about it except invade Sealand, impose sanctions of some sort on the entire country, or hope the guy flys back to Canada so that they can arrest him at Immigration."

      You forgot extradition. So Canada does not have an extradition treaty with Sealand, then just wait until the alledged criminal travels to a country with an extradition treaty with Canada.

      Extradition does work fairly well for capital crimes, as long as solid evidence is involved. Privacy cases, which may involve civil law, may be another matter though.

    13. Re:This was bound to happen by myov · · Score: 1

      I could be wrong on this, but my impression was that you are bound by the laws of the country/region you are doing business in. If you are doing business in Canada, you are subject to Canadian laws.

      A few months ago an American company attempted to offer medical services out of the back of a van. Even though it was legal where the company was based, their operations violated the federal Canada Health Act. Canada Customs prevented them from entering.

      As another example, if the widgets my company produces are illegal in your country, I can't sell them to you. Look at the G4's when they first came out. The computers couldn't be exported to certain countries (under US laws), but if machines were made outside of the US (.: not under US laws), could Apple export them? Maybe if they didn't get caught, although I'm sure Cupertino would now be a crater.

      I've seen many contests which are void in certain provinces (Quebec is a good example), or are not available to Canada. Why? Often the company doesn't want the hassle of complying with the various laws. If an Ontario company offers a contest in Quebec, they are bound by the Quebec laws, or the Quebec government will take action against the Ontario company (and yes, they've done it)

      On a recent flight on Air Canada, smoking was not allowed. As a Canadian company, they had to follow Transport Canada's rules, even outside of the country.

      1) Make whomever uses the service (in Canada) be liable
      They probably already are, especially if the American company is representing/acting on behalf of a Canadian company.

      But, IANAL. What do I know?

      --
      I use Macs to up my productivity, so up yours Microsoft!
    14. Re:This was bound to happen by Jardine · · Score: 1

      Clearly the broke Canadian law. However, the fact is that the Canadians can't do anything about it except invade Sealand, impose sanctions of some sort on the entire country, or hope the guy flys back to Canada so that they can arrest him at Immigration.

      Even Canada could win a war against Sealand. It probably wouldn't come to that in a murder case. As another poster said, the person would probably eventually end up in a country with an extradition treaty with Canada. In the case of Sealand, it would probably be England.

    15. Re:This was bound to happen by Jardine · · Score: 1

      Extradition does work fairly well for capital crimes, as long as solid evidence is involved.

      Just a slight clarification, Canada no longer has any capital crimes. You will not receive the death penalty for any offense committed in Canada.

      I have heard that the Canadian government will often refuse to extradite someone accused of a capital crime in the US unless it is promised that the prosecution will not seek the death penalty.

    16. Re:This was bound to happen by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      The thing I don't understand is why the US caves in with these cases, or why they are so outraged.

      The US should just refuse to drop the death penalty and put the suspect on the arrest-on-sight list at the border.

      Think about it - the US saves all the costs of a trial, and yet there is no threat of a US citizen ever being hurt by the suspect again. If the Canadians are smart they'll file charges against the guy to get him off the streets (would you want him walking around loose?). Thus the US has neatly transferred the cost of imprisonment to the foreign country.

      Same goes for all those terrorists that the EU was threatening not to extradite to the US out of fear that they will be executed. The US should just let them stay there - it isn't like they're going to be allowed to walk around on the streets or anything. If they were just going to get jailed either way let the Europeans pick up the tab. I'm sure the US would be willing to take them back once the EU gets tired of being the new Autstralia of the world - but only with no strings attached...

  6. Video by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I actually remember that the CBC did a piece on this topic. Here's the video.

  7. he just doesn't get it by tuxette · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Patel though sees it differently. The root cause of insecurity and intolerance in this world, he argues, is that we know so little about each other. If everyone knew everything about everyone else, or at least had access to such information, there would be less problems. Besides, why try and hide things, when it is becoming harder and harder to do so?

    Perhaps the reason why we know so little about each other is that people feel the need to sneak around and dig up dirt on others and then use that information against them? If you truly wanted to know more about someone, then open your mouth and ask that someone.

    --
    People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
    1. Re:he just doesn't get it by The+Cydonian · · Score: 3, Interesting
      If you truly wanted to know more about someone, then open your mouth and ask that someone.
      Heheh. I speak as an Indian of course, but I believe this is more a cultural thing than anything else; somehow, as the Brit-born Indian author Ruskin Bond puts it, being nosey is a sign of friendship among Indians. You can immediately notice it if you, say, enter an intra-city bus in India; you get scanned from head to toe by everyone around. Most international travellers get spooked by that, but really, curiousity is, apparently, a sign of friendship.

      Of course, intra-bus cultural nuances get complicated once you extrapolate them to the Internet and get professional about all this snooping.

  8. how much longer by wcitechnologies · · Score: 5, Insightful
    How much longer will it be until we have a worldwide "people" database? How long until it has 6.x billion entries?

    I hate to be the one running around with a tin foil hat here, but I don't like this idea one bit. Although some see huge privacy implications in this, my personal reasons are more religious.

    How long until each entry has an X, Y, and Z associated with it?

    --
    Electrons are free; it is moving them that becomes expensive.
    1. Re:how much longer by tuxette · · Score: 1
      How much longer will it be until we have a worldwide "people" database?

      Isn't that what Orkut has tried to attempt?

      --
      People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
    2. Re:how much longer by wcitechnologies · · Score: 1

      Actually, iirc it was his lack of genetic enhancement that kept him from going to space.

      --
      Electrons are free; it is moving them that becomes expensive.
    3. Re:how much longer by Cyno · · Score: 1

      I would love to have access to such a database. It would be very informative to know everyone's religious and political affiliations. This data could then be used to manipulate people, or possibly convert them.

      I'm all for collecting more data as long as everyone gets access to it.

      But privacy would be nice...
      Peace would be nice...
      Freedom would be nice...
      There are many things that would be nice if people didn't have to go and fuck 'em up.

    4. Re:how much longer by TiggertheMad · · Score: 1

      How much longer will it be until we have a worldwide "people" database? How long until it has 6.x billion entries?

      OOH! I want to sign up for that now. With luck, I can get a low ID number, and nobody will ever be able to flip me shit again about being a n00b!

      --

      HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
    5. Re:how much longer by LaCosaNostradamus · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I can see it now ...

      Name.Full: Lon Horiuchi
      Occupation: government sniper
      Address.Home: 293 Shady Lane, Colorado Springs CO USA 80828-3392
      Phone.Home: 719-349-2932


      So much for THAT idea. Any comprehensive database of persons will be purged of all the elements that protect the ruling class, including their own information. That makes a worldwide "database of persons" automatically useless except as a weapon against the lower classes.

      Remember, like guns, databases can be used AGAINST the ruling class. That determines how regulated, applicable and widespread they are.

      --
      [You have a stable society when some nut guns down a schoolyard and the law doesn't change.]
  9. not bound by laws? eh? by 192939495969798999 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Other comments have said basically that anyone whose company's not based in country X doesn't have to abide by the laws of country X when acting within the borders of country X. Granted, aerial photos is a bit of a grey area, but within the concept that in order to take a picture of Canada to that resolution, you'd pretty much be intentionally invading Canadian airspace, at least in principle, then it's pretty much like jaywalking in Germany but saying that since you're American, you don't have to abide by German laws.

    --
    stuff |
  10. This guy hates privacy by Ironsides · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If everyone knew everything about everyone else, or at least had access to such information, there would be less problems.

    Name one that would be solved this way.

    Besides, why try and hide things, when it is becoming harder and harder to do so?

    Because I don't wan't everyone knowing a lot about me. I like people not knowing stuff about me. Particularly things like my income (why should anyone care buy me and the IRS), ex-wives, speeding tickets, where I live when I don't know them, who I talk to and a whole host of other things. If I choose to tell someone or post something on the internet that is fine by me. But I don't want them finding out info any other way.

    At least when I submit to a government background check I have to give them permision first.

    --
    Fly me to the moon Let me sing among those stars Let me see what spring is like On jupiter and mars
    1. Re:This guy hates privacy by CrazyJim1 · · Score: 1

      "If everyone knew everything about everyone else, or at least had access to such information, there would be less problems. Name one that would be solved this way." In tribal communities, there is humanity and anthropologists love it.

      In small towns, people know each other's reputation.

      In cities, people rely on money for the most part.

      The more you know you're being observed by others, the more you want to make a show of it and be a good person. So problems are solved. Yet, I don't think giving a select group of individuals spying rights solves anything. The ultimate truth is that everything you do is being watched by God. Whether you cheat or you help the poor.

    2. Re:This guy hates privacy by dema · · Score: 2, Funny

      Name one that would be solved this way.

      Females.

    3. Re:This guy hates privacy by R.Caley · · Score: 1
      [If everyone knew everything about everyone else, or at least had access to such information, there would be less problems. ]

      Name one that would be solved this way.

      People would no longer get eyestrain from watching too much TV since they would have to spend all evening, every evening, reading reports on everyone else.:-)

      I like people not knowing stuff about me.[...] ex-wives, speeding tickets[...]

      Speeding tickets are a matter between you and the people who own the road you were speeding on, and for a public road in a republic that is basicly everyone.

      Similarly, if you choose to register your sex life with the state (marriage and divorce) you are choosing to make it a matter of public record, perhaps because you want social approval or perhaps just for tax reasons, so have no reason to gripe if people know about it.

      --
      _O_
      .|<
      The named which can be named is not the true named
    4. Re:This guy hates privacy by GoofyBoy · · Score: 1

      >The more you know you're being observed by others, the more you want to make a show of it and be a good person.

      No, you learn to hide certain behavour better. Don't change.

      --
      The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
    5. Re:This guy hates privacy by homer_ca · · Score: 1

      What's scary is that this guy honestly believes that total transparency makes for a better, more civil, society. Well I say let him put up or shut up. Try buying a full profile on Jay Patel, founder of Akiba. You think they'll sell it to you? The classic question here is who watches the watchers? If the watchers submit to the same public scrutiny as the database subjects, it's somewhat less of a problem than if the watchers reserved privacy for themselves.

  11. Different Juristictions by Jumbo+Jimbo · · Score: 2, Interesting
    A lot of the discussion, yet again, centres around which country's laws apply.

    Lawson believes Canadian privacy law should apply to Abika since it is selling Canadians' information about themselves, but there are hurdles because the firm is based in the United States.

    In the UK we have strong data protection laws as well. However, many companies that take our data make us waive the right by saying that we are aware that the data may be moved outside the UK (Bank call centres in India?) and our rights do not apply.

    I guess that these may not have been tested yet and may be like click-through EULA that may not always stand up, but our privacy is being gradualy eroded away to whichever country has the weakest privacy laws.

    1. Re:Different Juristictions by altgrr · · Score: 1

      In the UK we have strong data protection laws as well. However, many companies that take our data make us waive the right by saying that we are aware that the data may be moved outside the UK (Bank call centres in India?) and our rights do not apply.

      I think India's far from one of the worst offenders. Companies don't have to say anything about what they're doing with their data, as long as the data protection laws give you at least as much protection as the UK laws do.

      For that reason, it is illegal for data about you (a UK citizen) to be processed in the US without your permission.

      If you don't want your details handled by a country with lax data protection laws, just use another company!

      --


      Like car accidents, most hardware problems are due to driver error.
  12. Expectation of Privacy, Revisited the 1000th Time by Onimaru · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Okay, so let me get this straight. A company is searching through and compiling publicly available information, and then making some TheSpark-style random conjectures based on these data?

    Where is the expectation of privacy here? Do I have a (reasonable) expectation that data about me on the internet are private? Even my grandmother can tell you that that's ridiculous. This is the cyberspace equivalent of looking through my garbage, not breaking into my house. I hope this action falls on its face, because people providing information aggregation of all kinds are a very valuable, growing part of the coolness the internet has to offer and I want to encourage them in any way possible, even if it does mean that someone might know I bought a USB Christmas tree off ThinkGeek.

    Two qualifications, though:

    1. I hope this site also logs visits to...this site. It would be neat to know if my prospective employer is vetting prospective employees without telling them. That would speak to their trustworthiness, I would think.
    2. I also hope that the fact that their "psychological profiles" are basically for-fun-only personality tests is stated plainly. This is one place where legal weasel-words would make me very happy. This goes under the generic heading of "You can be as stupid as you want, but please don't make other people stupid, too."
    --
    adam b.
  13. will it be run on mysql? by mgkimsal2 · · Score: 3, Funny

    select * from people where id=666;

    1. Re:will it be run on mysql? by Mr+Guy · · Score: 1

      Leave Kissinger out of this, he hasn't caused trouble for a while now!

    2. Re:will it be run on mysql? by sconeu · · Score: 1
      select * from people where id=666;
      RETURN VALUE:
      NAME = "JOHN ASHCROFT"
      OCCUPATION="ATTY GENERAL (RET)"
      ACCOMPLISHMENTS="DISMANTLING CONSTITUTION, LOSING TO DEAD GUY"
      END RETURN VALUE
      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    3. Re:will it be run on mysql? by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      The results of that query are too long to post here, but I'll provide a subset of them

      ID=666
      FIRST NAME=Darl
      STATE=Utah

      Anyone know the significance of the above?

      -Mr. Database ;)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
  14. you don't get it by tuxette · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The problem is putting this bit and that bit of information about you in a profile and making an assumption about your personality and behavior based on this profile. Keep in mind that these bits of information are more often than not collected non-contextually. And more often than not, using this information against you.

    For example, borrowing a good example used here earlier, if you are a big Grateful Dead fan who goes to all their concerts and runs a website dedicated to them, you are a pot smoker.

    --
    People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
    1. Re:you don't get it by bloodredsun · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But would you want to work for a company that was this stupid. Or a manager that relies on crude psychological evaluation from an unreliable and non-contextual source to excuse the fact that he can't find his arse with both hands and a map.

    2. Re:you don't get it by tuxette · · Score: 1
      But would you want to work for a company that was this stupid.

      Probably not ;-)

      --
      People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
  15. Wow by Jakhel · · Score: 4, Insightful


    Comprehensive Background Checks, typically return Subject's Name, Aliases, AKA's Age Month & year of birth Date and Location where SSN issued. Others associated with SSN 22 year address/phone history B&W Satellite Photo of current location Nationwide Bankruptcy Search - Nationwide Judgments, Liens Search Nationwide Real Property Search Property Assessments Others listed at subjects address Possible Associates Relatives summary, names & phone numbers Voter Registrations Records Current Neighbors, Names, addresses, phones Court cases involving subject FAA registrations Drug Enforcement Agency Search FAA Airmen, FAA Aircraft Social Security Death Index Professional Licenses Internet Domain Ownership Corporate affiliations UCC filings (Business Loans) Aircraft Ownership Vessels Ownership Motor Vehicles, Motorcycles, Boats Ownership (FL, ME, MN, MS, MP, NE, NC, OH, TX, WI) Drivers License Info (FL, ID, MN, MO, OH, TX, WI) Concealed Weapons Permit (AR, FL, IN, LA, ME, ND, VA) Hunting & Fishing Permits (AK, AL, AR, CT, DE, FL, GA, IL, MA, MS, MO, MT, ND, NV, NJ, NC, OH, OK, UT, VA, WI)


    It looks like IT hasn't been the only victim of offshoring. Who would have thought that BIG BROTHER would be outsourced to India too..and you can have all that information AND a psychological profile based on past actions for $140. It's like a credit report of your ENTIRE LIFE. I'm almost tempted to get one just to see why I get hired/turned down for the jobs I apply to.

  16. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  17. During a television interview... by DougDew · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...that was aired recently, the founder of Abika claimed that privacy is stupid and that he doesn't believe in it. In short, he declared his hostility to the very notion of privacy.

    Perhaps it would be possible to publish some of his family's private information on the web to test his conviction that privacy is stupid. Perhaps this could be done in the same way that folks published some facts from Poindexter's private life as a response to the Total Information Awareness initiative.

    Also, Abika's business model depends upon privacy. In other words, in the upper right hand side of http://www.abika.com, there is a "private, confidential, guaranteed" logo, which makes sense as Abika's services would be far less attractive to customers without such a guarantee. If Jay Patel really believes that privacy is stupid, then I challenge him to publish on his website the results of all background checks. More importantly, I challenge Jay Patel to inform the targets of background checks when checks are being performed and also of the identity of the requesters of the checks. After all, the major credit reporting agencies such as TRW are now being forced to report such information to the targets of credit checks, so why should Abika be permitted to operate any differently?

    1. Re:During a television interview... by DougDew · · Score: 1

      My feelings are the same as yours actually. I would really rather find a way to convince Jay Patel of his "moronity" that doesn't require punishing his family. However, given the extreme stupidity of Jay Patel's stance, I doubt that he would be convinced to change his stance by anything other than an extreme example of the implications of his stance.

    2. Re:During a television interview... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Hmm, let's see... according to a CNN transcript, he lives "on the outskirts" of Cheyenne, Wyoming and works in the basement of his home.

      There aren't too many Patels listed in the phonebook in all of Wyoming, much less in Cheyenne.

      Mailing addy is Cheyenne, customer support is farmed out to Colorado.

      Go to town...

      According to Network Solutions:
      Registrant: Make this info private
      AccuSearch Inc., (28417407O)
      6812 Lupine
      Laramie County, WY 82009
      US
      Phone: 720-207-0362
      Fax: 720-207-0388

      Domain Name: ABIKA.COM

      Administrative Contact , Technical Contact :
      Webmaster, Abika
      (28417408I)
      abikamail2@yahoo.com
      6812 Lupine
      Laramie County, WY 82009
      US
      Phone: 720-207-0362
      Fax: 720-207-0388

      Record expires on 28-Sep-2010
      Record created on 28-Sep-1999
      Database last updated on 08-Jul-2004

      Domain servers in listed order: Manage DNS

      NS1.LNHI.NET 209.41.184.100
      NS2.LNHI.NET 209.41.170.99

  18. Some of their other services include.. by Jakhel · · Score: 4, Informative

    Basic Background Search (Public Records) (USA) $9.98

    General Background Check (USA) $49.98

    Comprehensive Background Check (USA) $69.98

    Background Check including Psychological Profile (Includes Behavior History and more) (USA) $139.98

    Background Search with Nationwide Criminal Record Search $99.98

    Background Search with Statewide Criminal Record Search $79.98

    Find / Locate this Person (Public records search only) $29.98

    Verify Employment (each) $24.98

    Verify Income $39.95

    Property Search $24.98

    Civil Court Records Search (each Court) $29.98

    State Criminal Records Search (First Name, Last Name, DOB required) $39.98

    County Criminal Records Search (each County) $29.98

    Copies of Court Documents for criminal and civil court records $39.98

    Police Reports, Accident Reports Search by County, City or License Plate Number $69.98

    Search History of Employment (Public Records) (Searches Public Records and Work Databases) $49.98

    Current Employment Search $149.98

    Search / Verify Education & College Degrees $59.98

    Find email or IM from physical address $49.95

    Find Cell Phone Number, Address & Name from SSN $169.98

    Search Date of Birth of this person $14.98

    Search Possible Girlfriends/Boyfriends/Spouses/Roommates $99.95

    Search Social Security Number $139.98

    Search Utility Records (Trace person by searching Electric or Gas utility accounts) $79.98

    Find Relatives (Through Public Records) $49.98

    Search Family Tree Returns info on Ancestors $139.98

    Physical Address from P.O.Box & Name $89.98

    USA Nationwide Criminal Records Search (First Name, Last Name, DOB required) $59.98

    Unconventional Behavior Search $89.98

    Background Check for Canada (Please click on above link for info on this search) $119.98

    Sex Offender Search (each state) $17.98

    International Background Check (Each Country, Please click on above link for info on this search) $139.98

    Medical Records $89.98

    Statewide Marriage Records Search (CA, CO, KY, TX, ME, NV, FL) $24.98

    Statewide Divorce Records Search $179.98

    Statewide Marriage Records Search (Any other state except CA, CO, KY, TX, ME, NV, FL) $179.96

    Find Person by their First Name & Age $39.98

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    Sexual Orientation Search (Name, Address, DOB required) $49.98

    Cheating Search (Relationships) (Name, Address, DOB required) $89.98

    Verify Name, DOB from Picture (Checks if Name & DOB belongs to the person in the picture) $89.98

    28 Hour Rush Delivery $39.95

    1. Re:Some of their other services include.. by Quixote · · Score: 1
      Whoa....
      Search Possible Girlfriends/Boyfriends/Spouses/Roommates $99.95

      Does "possible" here mean "possible in the future"?? Sign me up!

      On the other hand, for most of the /. crowd, the answer to this question would be the null set... ;-)

    2. Re:Some of their other services include.. by dsnowak · · Score: 1

      Take a second look at that list. Most of that information is public record, freely available to anyone who goes to the trouble of requesting it. All of this is due to the Freedom of Information Act. Chances are, this company has people who are specialists in FOIA processes and do nothing but fill out the appropriate forms all day. The state exceptions you see listed are due to the different privacy & public access laws in many states. Remember, open access to Government records is a two-way street: sure, you get to see what they are doing, but other people can get information on you.

  19. Some local governments violate privacy. by Shivetya · · Score: 1

    My local county and many others around here make tax assessment records of private property available via the web.

    In my case I could, without any requirements, look up the value of a piece of property and the value of improvements (ie the house), and the registered owner by address, lot/plot, or name. You can even wildcard these searches.

    In two counties I checked you can search the past and present court dockets to see if someone has been in the system lately.

    Of course non-government sources include any store with debit/cc or check acceptance. How many people actually tell their CCs via the CC companies terms not to share?

    Privacy is an illusion anymore. Yes I would like to protect what little I have left but there is also credit to be given to the idea that if there is no privacy what would there be to fear that isn't already a problem today?

    --
    * Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
  20. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  21. United States of Canada by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    Yea its been beaten to death but United States of Canada seems more likely than Canada becomming part of the USA :)

  22. and another thing... by tuxette · · Score: 4, Insightful
    He noted her name tag, came home, and using his knowledge of databases and search techniques, riffled through the Internet looking up information on her. He went back a few days later and surprised Angela with details about her life. He also told her how he had found out. Three weeks later, in a story that could make a script for a date-movie, they were married.

    What was it he dug up on her that made her marry a sneaky bastard like him in three short weeks? And how desperately did he need his Green Card? Or is that "none of our business?"

    --
    People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
    1. Re:and another thing... by 91degrees · · Score: 1

      Not sure, but if you have anything that people might use to blackmail you, keep it off the internet.

    2. Re:and another thing... by tuxette · · Score: 1

      I'll be sure to keep that in mind ;-)

      --
      People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
    3. Re:and another thing... by Minwee · · Score: 1

      Well, there goes my alt.com account...

  23. Globalization and communications by YetAnotherName · · Score: 2, Insightful

    More and more the technology for communications are breaking down barriers both physical and national. And it's precisely a "national game" that I see service providers like this playing more and more effectively. Previously it was just a megacorp that could set up operations in a foreign country, but with services become virtualized and products becoming not much more than information, even small fries can use their national benefits to provide what can't be gotten locally.

    What'll come next? Probably nations realizing that they're losing control that they thought they once had, and finally coming together. To globalize and equalize citizenship? Goodness, no ... to control all this potential with WIPO-like legislation and freedom-sapping rules.

    1. Re:Globalization and communications by o1d5ch001 · · Score: 1

      This brings us to tinfoil hat conclusion #12. The internet was designed by the Department of Defence as a population control trojan that is working better than ever expected... and this day was going so well.

      --
      Q. What is Calvin's monster snowman called? A. The Torment Of Existence Weighed Against The Horror of Non Being
  24. thanks for the cultural clarification! by tuxette · · Score: 1

    I don't care if someone scans me up and down when I travel. I do care when some stranger digs up all kinds of information about me and then confronts me with it. Especially when that information is used to paint a very incorrect picture of me.

    --
    People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
    1. Re:thanks for the cultural clarification! by Sick+Boy · · Score: 1

      You SAY you don't mind when someone scans you up and down, but why then did you take out that restraining order? Peeping through your window is just my way of being friendly.

      --
      Does narcissism count as a hobby? --Shawn Latimer
    2. Re:thanks for the cultural clarification! by matria · · Score: 1

      Actually, in rural Japan, it is.

  25. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  26. Re:not bound by laws? eh? by theMerovingian · · Score: 1

    Two forms of commercial-grade aerial photos... taken from satellite, and taken from airplane.

    It's relatively cheap and easy to get satellite photos of around 1 meter resolution for almost anywhere in the world. You can get them from a company like Space Imaging. Two caveats:

    1) the US government will often purchase the rights to "black out" an entire region of coverage. It would be next to impossible to get current air photos of Iraq or Afghanistan, for example

    2) It can be tricky to get satellite photos from a specific time. The satellite orbits the earth and takes pictures in long, narrow bands. So, you have to pretty much take what you can get when the satellite is overhead, and hope there isn't much cloudcover that day. So, it's difficult to get time-sensitive data from a satellite provider.

    As far as air plane photos, they would likely subcontract out the operation to a company already in the US or Canada. This way, you can fly underneath the clouds, your resolution is generally higher, and you can pick the date/time of your imagery. The downside is the cost - you have to pay some joker with his own plane and some expensive camera gear to take the raw image. Then, if you want to actually use the imagery in a mapping or GIS environment, you have to bend the image into a map projection with the proper coordinates defined.

    The only other option I can think of would be to acquire the data from previously existing historical sources such as the USGS digital orthophotos, LandSat, etc. These have varying degrees of quality, and vary in availability from state to state.

    --
    "If you think you have things under control, you're not going fast enough." --Mario Andretti
  27. Permanent record by Jakhel · · Score: 4, Funny

    Forget google, what about all those times in elementary, middle, and high school when teachers told us that "this will go on your permanent record"? I guess they really WEREN'T bullshitting us after all. :(

    1. Re:Permanent record by REBloomfield · · Score: 1

      i work in a school. 'Permanent' means gets shredded after 7 years.

    2. Re:Permanent record by jacksonj04 · · Score: 2, Funny

      I am a student in a school. 'Permanent' means 'Until the network goes down again', or about 32 minutes ;-)

      --
      How many people can read hex if only you and dead people can read hex?
    3. Re:Permanent record by REBloomfield · · Score: 1

      lol, yeah.... (and i'm the SysOp...) but that's why we use paper!

    4. Re:Permanent record by jacksonj04 · · Score: 1

      We're stuck in the middle. Our head wants usto be a modern, upcoming technological school. So we are encouraged to work digitally, registers are electronic etc which is all fine when it works. But most teachers wouldn't know what to do with a .pdf if it came up and slapped them, so there goes my way of providing universally compatible homework. So I submit as a .doc, only to find that the school's version of Office is 2000 whilst I'm on 2003. Oh well...

      --
      How many people can read hex if only you and dead people can read hex?
    5. Re:Permanent record by Black+Marlin · · Score: 1
      In North Carolina, "permanent" is exactly what it says. There's a short list of items that are supposed to be permanent (NCGS 115C-402), but many districts keep more than that.


      http://www.ah.dcr.state.nc.us/records/local/school schedulefinal.pdf

  28. Data Rape by ObsessiveMathsFreak · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is just data rape, pure and simple. This company is gathering vasts amounts of your personal, public and private dealings over several years and then peddling that information to souless private companies.

    This is wrong pure and simple.

    I don't question someone's right to have access to "specific" data about me. i.e my GP needs to know my blood type, the taxman needs to know my income, the pizza delivery boys needs to know my address. But the wholesale collection and amalgamation of every possible facet of my life by people who have no business knowing anything about me, disgusts me to my very core. No doubt Mr Patel wets himself over the prospect of getting access to embedded RFID telemetry as well.

    Stalking is a crime. When stalkers are caught with pictures, diaries and details of people's whereabouts and dealings, this is usually used against them in a court case. why shouldn't the same apply to Mt Patel and his kind?

    This behaviour is inexcusable. Noone needs to know this much about anyone else and those that do should be prosecuted. Persons and Companies should have the minimum amount of data possible on any one person. Data is on a need to know basis, and they don't need to know.

    Of course, these dirty data raping fiends will argue on grounds of civil liberty(which they threaten), free speech(which they help to chill) and of course they play the happy smiley, "Our motives are purely innocent, you have nothing to fear" PR card, that will fool so many people.(That whole three week marraige story is probobly just a PR stunt) .They'll also bitch about how we have no right to privacy(while keeping their own records out of the public eye).

    Well guess what. I have a right to dignity. And if some private company starts selling off every minutes detail about me, every action I have ever done, every rumour, everything I've said or been remotely involved in, be it happy, sad, embarrassing, glad, hopeful, disparing or just plain private, to every slobbering data hungry slimeball that comes looking for it, I consider that a pretty big dent in my personal dignity pal! See you in court!

    --
    May the Maths Be with you!
    1. Re:Data Rape by ChrisPee · · Score: 1
      Well guess what. I have a right to dignity.
      Correction: You had a right to dignity, until you tried to characterize a few photos and a Google search as a "rape".
    2. Re:Data Rape by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Stalking is a crime. When stalkers are caught with pictures, diaries and details of people's whereabouts and dealings, this is usually used against them in a court case. why shouldn't the same apply to Mt Patel and his kind?

      Because stalkers aren't corporations trying to make a profit. Isn't the right of a corporation to make a profit somewhere in the Constitution or something? :)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    3. Re:Data Rape by MikeBabcock · · Score: 1

      You mean you don't lie to websites?

      I lie about my name, birthdate and mother's maiden name. If they want the real information, they can subpoena it from me.

      Time to start an online purchasing agent service to let people hide behind for a minor fee.

      --
      - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
  29. This is only the warm up act by HangingChad · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Consolidating all this information off shore facilities is going to be a real boon to the Chinese and Indian governments. All that juicy data on those fat and stupid Americans. And it won't cost them a penny. They'll simply help themselves to copies. No one in the companies would dare complain or refuse.

    This guy is doing it here, but as the off shore trend increases the information is going to become more available to potentially hostile foreign governments.

    Manage it now or pay the price later. We're already paying the price with companies like this one cropping up. This is nothing less than domestic spying.

    --
    That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
    1. Re:This is only the warm up act by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      And even if the information isn't offshored, well, how much of your computer was made in China? Drives, motherboard, network cards, etc... (Do they make foil hats too?)

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    2. Re:This is only the warm up act by orkysoft · · Score: 1

      Yes, but those are permeable to the specific frequencies of the Chinese Orbital Mind Control Lasers. The Made in Taiwan tinfoil hats, though, are especially good at blocking those frequencies.

      --

      I suffer from attention surplus disorder.
  30. Paranoia by Saeed+al-Sahaf · · Score: 1
    I have personally had three interviews and found that typically *after* you have the interview a Google referrer shows up in your logs from the interviewing company.

    How do you draw the connection? You have a web site? And Google sends you someone, so you assume some connection between that and recent job interview? And, how many job interviews have you had recently?

    --
    "Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
  31. This isn't that bad by Thunderstruck · · Score: 1

    At least from the perspective of someone living in a Untied State, none of the information available on the akiba website is all that private. My name is in the phone book, and in the yellow pages next to my firm. My house is much like others on my block so the value is easy to guess. Any crime I commit gets published in the local newspaper.

    I gues the short of it is, everyone in town already knows all of this stuff about me. The akiba site does not appear to search small financial transactions in my bank, or library records, or magazine subscriptions, or letters I send to the Libertarian party's division of metal headware.

    Also, it may be worth noting that clever lawyers now tend to include ambiguous values in deeds at the courthouse to foil searches such as this, like "sold for $10 and other valuable consideration."

    --
    Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
    1. Re:This isn't that bad by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      I gues the short of it is, everyone in town already knows all of this stuff about me.

      Everyone in town knows how much income you have, your political party affiliation, and whether or not you have a concealed weapons permit??? Where exactly do you live?

      I think you are drastically underestimating the potential abuses of this database. Do you really want the crackhead on the corner to know everything about you? Now think about this in ten years when everyone has access to the internet all the time, and the potential criminal abuses.

    2. Re:This isn't that bad by Thunderstruck · · Score: 1

      North Dakota.

      My party is pretty easy to guess from the signs in the yard and the loud arguments at the coffee shop. The newspaper published it along with the other public notices when I got my pistol permit. I guess my income is not widely known though... Perhaps thats an issue.

      --
      Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
    3. Re:This isn't that bad by silverbax · · Score: 1

      What about:

      - What types of purchases you make
      - What types of books you read ( or don't read )
      - What types of web sites you visit
      - Which routes you take to your relatives house
      - Which routes you take to work
      - What time you wake up and go to bed
      - What reasons you ever visited a doctor

      And the beat goes on...

    4. Re:This isn't that bad by Thunderstruck · · Score: 1

      If you'll read my first post in this thread, I lay out the kinds of information this website provides. Apart from house purchases none of the information you list is available on the abika site.

      --
      Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
    5. Re:This isn't that bad by silverbax · · Score: 1

      I am familiar with this and other companies. Almost all of the information I listed can be gleaned from your bank statement.

    6. Re:This isn't that bad by Thunderstruck · · Score: 1

      - What types of purchases you make
      - What types of books you read ( or don't read )
      - What types of web sites you visit
      - Which routes you take to your relatives house
      - Which routes you take to work
      - What time you wake up and go to bed
      - What reasons you ever visited a doctor

      I am familiar with this and other companies. Almost all of the information I listed can be gleaned from your bank statement.


      If your bank lists the route you take to work, your alarm clock settings, medical information, browser cache, or library records... I suggest getting a new bank. Mine lists... mym account number, deposits, withdrawals, and dates. It includes my address & phone number. Thats it.

      I don't however recall seeing an option for personal banking records on the abika site. Can you provide a url?

      --
      Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
    7. Re:This isn't that bad by silverbax · · Score: 1

      Do you ever buy gas one your way to or from work?

      Boom. I know which was you go to work.

  32. Re:not bound by laws? eh? - satellites by bored_lurker · · Score: 2, Informative

    to take a picture of Canada to that resolution, you'd pretty much be intentionally invading Canadian airspace

    Sorry, not right. Since we are talking about satellites here "airspace" does not apply. This from a US Navy law page:

    The upper limit of airspace subject to national jurisdiction has not been authoritatively defined by international law. International practice has established that airspace terminates at some point below the point at which artificial satellites can be placed in orbit without free-falling to earth. Outer space begins at that undefined point. All nations enjoy a freedom of equal access to outer space and none may appropriate it to its national airspace or exclusive use.

    --
    --- Tolerance is the axiomatic "virtue" of those without convictions ---
  33. Re:not bound by laws? eh? by drewzhrodague · · Score: 1

    Highly true, and good point.

    I work on a popular WiFi/GIS site, and it is difficult to get free data of any time related relevance. TIGER is not very accurate.

    How soon is it that there are free repositories of updated spatial data, and when does that cross the privacy line? How do we make sure others don't cross that line?

    From our end, we've made sure not to associate APs listed in our maps from being associated wtih street adresses, and we hide MAC addresses from being displayed. We're making an effort to protect people's privacy while also having a useful application.

    --
    Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
  34. Privacy by talaphid · · Score: 1

    If he's so against privacy, he won't mind telling me his credit card numbers...

    1. Re:Privacy by DougDew · · Score: 1

      Let's go even further:

      1. Jay Patel subjects himself to all of the types of background checks that Abika currently offers.

      2. Then, Jay publishes all of the results of all of the above checks on http://www.abika.com.

      However, doing that would still provide Jay an advantage that most background check targets wouldn't have: the opportunity to verify the accuracy of all reported information. So, to make things even more fair, it should be possible to go to http://www.abika.com and perform any background check on Jay Patel at any time and receive the results of the check without Jay getting an opportunity to review the results.

      However, even that wouldn't address all of the problems with Abika. Are the results of Abika's background checks re-publishable without Abika's permission or the target's permission? In other words, could I copy and paste the results from an Abika background check into a blog for others to read? If the answer is "no", then clearly Abika isn't believing its own philosophy that public information is good. If the answer is "yes" then what will happen if I alter the background check results when pasting them into the blog, especially if I cite the source of the results as http://www.abika.com?

      Speaking of sources, does Abika permit its customers to know the sources of Abika's information? I doubt it, as that would greatly reduce Abika's value proposition. So, that means that Abika is trying to establish itself as a trusted source of factual information. And that is the *scariest* aspect of all!

  35. Identity theft made easy... by Zro+Point+Two · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I havn't seen anyone mention this yet, but this was the first thing I thought of.

    Pay a couple bucks to this company, get complete background on someone, and then take over their life....you now know everything about them and their past, you don't even have to create things. This means that anything you say about your past can be verified as true.

    The other thing that really got me going was this comment...
    "Patel questions the need for restrictions on personal information, saying lack of data about people is what breeds fear and ignorance. "Most people don't care about privacy. It's the media that makes it a big hype.""

    I'm sure that there are LOTS of people that care about privacy...why do you think we have curtains on our windows?

    --
    Zro . two

    "I come from Canada...they say I'm slow....eh?"
  36. Re:Hosted by Yahoo? by REBloomfield · · Score: 1

    hey, it's not their bandwidth their paying for is it? ;)

  37. free market? by fantomas · · Score: 1

    presumably if it's a free market then we just sit back and let commercial organisations do it? Or do we ask our national governments to pass national and international legislation limiting data collection and data privacy? Or are there other ways to control who keeps data on us (apart from becoming some hardcore-retreat-to-the woods-with-ma-guns survivalist?)

  38. that data is available because we sent it there! by wotevah · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I believe they can do this in India because we are sending all our information there for processing in the first place. Once it's there, it doesn't take too much to bribe someone to get those records.

    There should be laws that prevent any company from sending US citizen's private information overseas (with a very broad definition of "private", to prevent abuse). This not only will stop this leak, it will also keep some jobs here (medical transcriptions, marketing and all "data mining" business as it relates to person's activity or credit).

  39. Re:not bound by laws? eh? - satellites by OverlordQ · · Score: 1

    Ooops it appears our rocket accidently collided with your satellit . . .

    --
    Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
  40. Hmmm wtf p2p!? by OverlordQ · · Score: 1

    Abika the . . . P2P Search Engine!?

    --
    Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
  41. This wouldnt happen if you had a decent DPA... by t_allardyce · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Countries that dont have a Data Protection Act like *cough* the USA need to get one, and countries that do need to add a clause to stop any stupid loop-holes. Oh and also kick people like Blunkett out who want to shit all over the DPA for no reason.

    --
    This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
    1. Re:This wouldnt happen if you had a decent DPA... by back_pages · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Countries that dont have a Data Protection Act like *cough* the USA need to get one, and countries that do need to add a clause to stop any stupid loop-holes. Oh and also kick people like Blunkett out who want to shit all over the DPA for no reason.

      WTF are you talking about? It sounds pretty clear to me that there is money in this - industrial/commercial money. It's a service business that could relocate to any location where the laws permit it - taking its tax dollars along for the trip. A democracy should reflect the will of its people.

      Like it or not, the American people spoke loud and clear last election day and told our government that we don't mind be face-fucked as long as somebody else is getting rich. The USA doesn't have a "Data Protection Act" because the people clearly don't want it - just as they don't want their soldiers at home, they don't like the Constitution anymore, and they really don't like fags.

      So seriously, wtf are you talking about? You must be talking about some OTHER country that needs a Data Protection Act - a country that has -citizens-, not -consumers- as voters; A country that lives up to a higher standard of libery and justice. Wake up - these are the Red States of America. You don't want to be a terrorist, do you? Why do you need to protect that data, hm? What library books have you been reading?




      Wish I could say this was tongue in cheek, unfortunately it's far more cynical/realistic than comedic.

    2. Re:This wouldnt happen if you had a decent DPA... by back_pages · · Score: 1

      Ok so the parent post to this is probably going to be moderated as a Troll. The point still holds. Look at the current political climate in the US: This is NOT the country that's going to stand up and protect its citizens with a Data Protection Act.

  42. Patel sounds like a Class-A citizen. by lysium · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The article mentions that Jay Patel saw his wife-to-be at the mall, went home and researched her on the Internet, and then returned to the mall to recite her personal life back to her. They married three weeks later.

    The guy sounds like a real creep, and now he offers services like "Sexual Orientation Check." Truly disgusting.

    --
    Together, we will drive the rats from the tundra.
    1. Re:Patel sounds like a Class-A citizen. by Suzuran · · Score: 1

      Yeah, because we all need our God-given right to discriminate based on sexual orientation. It's their own fault for being fags! If they weren't faggots, God wouldn't hate them, and we wouldn't hate them. Why does everyone blame the white people for discrimination when it's plain to see the fault lies with the fags? It's just like how women complain that their husbands abuse them when it's sure as shooting she didn't bring the beer when she was told. Everyone wants to assume the problem lies with white people. Next I bet you'll start saying it was wrong for us to invade Iraq and Afghanistan and kill all those godless heathen ragheads.

      PS: GOD HATES FA, err, sarcasm alert! ^^;;~

  43. oh that? by wild_berry · · Score: 1

    with a bill of rights and a Konstitution written at the aKademy?

  44. A case could be made by Crag · · Score: 1

    There is a school of thought which says that privacy is only necessary to keep people equal. With ubiquitous monitoring, privacy would not even be something people would want. The usual privacy concern is that our secrets will be used against us. If someone knew I had a gold-plated toilet they would steal it or mock me.

    With ubiquitous monitoring the theft of the toilet would be recorded and the information on the event would be available to everyone. Since I would also know the embarressing things about people who mocked me, I probably wouldn't mind getting teased about my fancy toilet.

    The problem with lack of privacy isn't that our secrets aren't secret, but that it's one directional. Who watches the watchers? Privacy is like money. If some people have more than others it creates an imbalance which is open to exploitation (stolen gold toilets). If noone has privacy then exploitation is not possible because the playing field is level again.

    I don't favor invasive monitoring, but I do support fully public two-way monitoring. I want anyone to be able to see me walk from home to the bus, and from the bus to work, and I want to have the ability to find out who watched me, and to call up video of them watching me. The technology is not here yet, but when it is, we will have to deal with it.

  45. Simple solution... by Firedog · · Score: 1

    Run the full background check on every Congressman, Governor, and influential businessman around... send each one a copy of the report. We'd get a Data Protection Act real quick.

    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

  46. Re:that data is available because we sent it there by Cyph · · Score: 1

    I don't know if I've misread, but to me it appears that they are NOT doing this from India. Abika is based in Wyoming, and the only reason as to why this was profiled in Times of India was because "Patel says he is writing this week to Jagdish Tytler, the Minister for Overseas Indians, offering his services in such a way that it can be done free for the neediest."

  47. Re:Expectation of Privacy, Revisited the 1000th Ti by budgenator · · Score: 1
    A company is searching through and compiling publicly available information
    The Canadian law actualy says
    1. The following information and classes of information are specified for the purposes of paragraphs 7(1)(d), (2)(c.1) and (3)(h.1) of the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act:

    (a) personal information consisting of the name, address and telephone number of a subscriber that appears in a telephone directory that is available to the public, where the subscriber can refuse to have the personal information appear in the directory;

    (b) personal information including the name, title, address and telephone number of an individual that appears in a professional or business directory, listing or notice, that is available to the public, where the collection, use and disclosure of the personal information relate directly to the purpose for which the information appears in the directory, listing or notice;

    (c) personal information that appears in a registry collected under a statutory authority and to which a right of public access is authorized by law, where the collection, use and disclosure of the personal information relate directly to the purpose for which the information appears in the registry;

    (d) personal information that appears in a record or document of a judicial or quasi-judicial body, that is available to the public, where the collection, use and disclosure of the personal information relate directly to the purpose for which the information appears in the record or document; and

    (e) personal information that appears in a publication, including a magazine, book or newspaper, in printed or electronic form, that is available to the public, where the individual has provided the information.

    So I'd say that pretty well covers web-crawling.
    --
    Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
  48. The Ghost of Usenet Postings Past by AndroidCat · · Score: 1
    --
    One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
  49. Plan ahead! by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

    If people are going to trust clueless searches of the Internet and archive material, start planting the stuff now that you'll want people to find later!

    --
    One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
  50. Abika Pizza Delivery by AndroidCat · · Score: 1
    --
    One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
  51. Let's not forget what happened by Jeremy+Singer · · Score: 1

    To all those guys who tried to find out personal information about Cthulu. I hear it wasn't pretty.

  52. Already there by tacokill · · Score: 1

    If you are a participant in the free-market economy, then this is already happening to you. It's called CREDIT. And every lending body in the world has a way to do a query, specific to you, and find out whether you are credit-worthy enough for them to lend money to. That most certainly counts as the X, Y, and Z you refer to.

    [Note, by CREDIT, I am not speaking of just credit cards. I mean *all* credit.]

  53. AFAIK by TheLibero · · Score: 1
    Nobody (e.g. Abika) will be checking your background unless they have your written approval in order not to get liable for privacy invasions lawsuits. But the thing we suffer from here in the UK, if you're looking for a job and they require your approval to do the security checks, you're just stuck. You either approve it, or you stay home unemployed!

    --
    "Evil thrives when good men do nothing"
  54. I did by Fencepost · · Score: 1
    Who knew when we were writing that stuff 15 years ago that it would be around FOREVER?

    I did. There's not much out there under my name that I'd find truly embarassing (and really nothing under another name either - guess I'm just vanilla). Anyone digging around for info on me would have to have a pretty good idea of what they were doing though, if only because of assorted and sundry ISP changes over the years.

    --
    fencepost
    just a little off
  55. Being scanned can be used to your advantage by augnober · · Score: 1

    You don't want to work for a company that would choose to employ this search, correct? You don't want to be in a relationship with someone who would pay someone to conduct this search on you, correct?

    Some prospective employees will benefit from these scans. Though they may never know it, a scan may be what saved them from working for the wrong employer. Of course you're not likely to apply to SCO (unless you're intending to bring them down from the inside), but for those other cases, there's now another means of selection which can take place in blissful ignorance rather than calculation. At the least, it's a little way to take some personal control of the situation. Help spare your conscience in a relatively easy way -- Destroy your reputation ;)

    In seriousness.. If you have the maturity to make your decisions one case at a time, doing this may take some important opportunities out of your hands. I mainly wanted to draw attention to the fact that though you may never know who contracted an intrusive scan on you, you do have the opportunity to craft a special message for them alone.

  56. 52nd state? by WebCowboy · · Score: 1

    Imagine another blue state with the population of California. I doubt that the present administration would want that.

    There are a couple of flaws in your theory:

    1. Canada is fairly diverse--geographically, demographically and politically. Were Canada to become the 52nd state I'm willing to bet that it wouldn't be a blue state--it would be a swing state. In the last federal election Conservatives got almost as many votes as Liberals. Canada isn't Liberal--ONTARIO is liberal and the rest of the country is a mixed bag of other parites. In fact, if you didn't count Ontario then Canada would have a Conservative government. Even Ontario isn't solidly liberal the way it used to be (granted, our idea of "conservative" is probably along the lines of a McCain or Swartzenegger Republican)

    2. You are assuming that if Canada were incorporated into the USA that it would bo one state. I doubt that having one state that is bigger in area than the rest of the American states combined would work very well at all. The argument that Canada has a sparse population is a weak argument for it being a single "52nd state" as well--The Canadian city I live in is 50% more populous than the entire state of North Dakota for example, and that works just fine as a state.

    Considering these facts, Bush may be cool to the idea of Canada as a state in the union, he might not object to the incorporation of Alberta or western Canada as a whole into the US since it is relatively compatible politically and is home to the second largest known reserve of oil on the entire planet (Saudi Arabia is the largest). If our southern neighbours continue to get their personal liberties become eroded as they have been lately then such a prospect is looking less and less appealing.

    1. Re:52nd state? by Jardine · · Score: 1

      1. Canada is fairly diverse--geographically, demographically and politically. Were Canada to become the 52nd state I'm willing to bet that it wouldn't be a blue state--it would be a swing state. In the last federal election Conservatives got almost as many votes as Liberals. Canada isn't Liberal--ONTARIO is liberal and the rest of the country is a mixed bag of other parites. In fact, if you didn't count Ontario then Canada would have a Conservative government. Even Ontario isn't solidly liberal the way it used to be (granted, our idea of "conservative" is probably along the lines of a McCain or Swartzenegger Republican)

      If Canada was incorporated as a single state, it would not be a swing state in presidential elections. You can't just ignore the vote of the people of Ontario. It has about 1/3 of the population of the country. The last polls I heard had about 66% of Canadians against Bush. Sure if someone like McCain or Schwarzenegger was running, Canada might become a swing state but so would quite a few other traditionally blue states.

    2. Re:52nd state? by LPetrazickis · · Score: 1

      Canada is fairly diverse--geographically, demographically and politically. Were Canada to become the 52nd state I'm willing to bet that it wouldn't be a blue state--it would be a swing state. In the last federal election Conservatives got almost as many votes as Liberals. Canada isn't Liberal--ONTARIO is liberal and the rest of the country is a mixed bag of other parites.

      You are ignoring the existence of the NDP and the Bloc Quebecois. Most of people who voted for them wouldn't be caught dead voting Republican (of course, this is somewhat compensated by the fact that the Liberals are conservative these days and wouldn't be out of place in the Republican fold).

      --
      Is this a sigs-optional kind of place? 'Cause I am totally down with that if you know what I mean.
  57. A Good Reminder by Saige · · Score: 2, Interesting

    In many ways, the article and various /. comments made here are a great reminder of exactly how much personal data some of us even WILLINGLY put out there on the web. It's not that way for everyone, but I'm sure plenty of /. users, for example, have done enough stuff on the net that someone could put together a pretty good profile of the person from a Google search and some simple digging into what's found there, without having to go into anything fancy.

    Heck, I'm just thinking about what I've done, and wonder how much someone could pull up about me from everything I've made available. It's a little strange to think about.

    --
    "You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do."
  58. And the competition begins... by the-build-chicken · · Score: 1

    ...which /.er can get the most background information on Jay Patel and/or all of his employees.

    Let the games begin

  59. Don't worry about that. by Timmy+D+Programmer · · Score: 1

    I'd worry more about the microchip we implanted in you 3 years ago!

    Mwahahaha!

    --


    (If at first you don't succeed, do it different next time!)
  60. The inside scoop on "Jay Patel" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    (Posting as AC for privacy reasons.)

    1) Jay Patel is an alias for Sanjay Amin. (More on this in a bit)
    2) Sanjay Amin started out a company called Entropy Systems, which offered a perpetual motion machine to paying customers. This was after he defaulted from school loans at the University of Minnesota. (He left the university and the state due to some disagreements with the university about his engine)
    3) Using the millions of dollars he bilked out of various people and organizations primarily in the Youngstown area, Entropy Systems disappeared and became www.abika.com, a site that offered free eBooks. See the Wired article for details about the transition.
    4) After deciding that free eBooks weren't very profitable, Abika.com went through various transformations until it made it to its current state of being a background investigation website.
    5) To avoid connections with his questionable past, Mr. Amin now goes by the name Jay Patel.
    6) Abika.com sells a combination of reports from an astrology CD-ROM that Mr. Amin has, plus actual reports from private investigators that he re-sells (without a license).

    So how about that, Sanjay? How do you like your privacy now?

    1. Re:The inside scoop on "Jay Patel" by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

      If I had mod points, I devote them all to this post. Thank you for pointing out how much of a fucking con this guy is! Such vile scum, I wouldn't be suprised if he's into spyware and spamming too as part of his personal revenue stream.

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    2. Re:The inside scoop on "Jay Patel" by necrognome · · Score: 1

      Here's a picture of Sanjay Amin, lord of entropy.

      --


      Let's get drunk and delete production data!
    3. Re:The inside scoop on "Jay Patel" by MikeBabcock · · Score: 1
      This guy?

      How are you? Havent talked to you for quiet a while now. We have opened our brand new website selling engines and refrigerators running on the Amin Cycle. the url is: http://www.entropysystems.com.

      Also look at the following magazines for more information on our engines.
      September 1999 issue of : Physics Today
      September 1999 issue of : Mechanical Engineering Magazine.
      September 20, 1999 issue of : Applied Journal of Physics Letters
      September 24, 1999 issue of: Science

      Keep in touch Bob. Hope to talk to you soon.

      Sincerely,
      Sanjay Amin

      Entropy Systems Inc.,
      8150 Market Street
      Youngstown, OH 44512, USA.
      --
      - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
  61. Is that his business model? by concept14 · · Score: 1
    It's like a credit report of your ENTIRE LIFE. I'm almost tempted to get one just to see why I get hired/turned down for the jobs I apply to.

    I bet that's his business model -- make millions from people checking up to see what he has on them.

    --
    Quis metamoderunt ipses metamoderatores?
  62. Don't like it? Complain. by voodoo1man · · Score: 1

    On Abika's webpage there's a little link down at the left-bottom that lets you file a complaint against anyone, for any reason. Let everyone know how you feel about Jay Patel (not that it really matters, if you look on Google there's about 500 different Jay Patels out there).

    --

    In the great CONS chain of life, you can either be the CAR or be in the CDR.

  63. It's treason... by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

    ...pure in simple. You know, last I remembered was that an act of Treason warrants the death penalty.

    I don't know about the rest of the slashdot gang, but I want a public hangin...Texan style

    --
    Life is not for the lazy.
  64. More accurate response by RedLaggedTeut · · Score: 1
    One interviewer checked my site before I came in (and I knew it) and he said that they didn't hire pot smokers. He assumed I was a pot smoker because I was a Grateful Dead fan.

    More accurate response:

    I don't work for people who do not stop beating their wives.

    --
    I'm still trying to figure out what people mean by 'social skills' here.
  65. Then you got lucky by Moraelin · · Score: 1

    This guy actually gave you a chance, and was willing to check that info right in front of you. Most don't.

    HR and management these days is mostly about:

    1. Avoiding responsibility, especially the kind that can spell "lawsuit",

    2. Avoiding work,

    You see "valuable" management advice all over, which basically boils down to "nah, just throw away half the applications, based on whatever excuse comes to your mind." It's less work.

    Didn't like his email address? Drop the application. Didn't like the colour of his socks? "Thank you, interview is over." A couple of posts about guns with his name on them? (E.g., on a gaming board, talking about a game.) Gee, he must be one of those NRA crackpots, let's drop the application real quick. A couple of posts about using drugs in Fallout 2? (A computer game again.) Good grief, he must be a junkie IRL too, let's pretend we never even received that application. Someone from East Elbonia with a similar name posting some pro-communist crap? Surely it must be him, drop the application. A post defending the people's right to get married to whoever they goddamn please, even same sex? Gaah, he must be one of those sinners damned by the Lord, surely we don't want him in our company. Etc.

    Most people don't even intend to do the work of actually sort through the mountain of google info, and put it all in context. They're just looking for an excuse to avoid work. They're just looking for that phrase, even if out of context, which cuts their work short.

    You'd think noone would be that retarded and still get promoted to management, but think again. There are companies who hire based on Tarot or numerology. Even big ones. You can get your application dropped just because adding up the numeric values of the letters in your name, added up to a number they don't like. Literally.

    And again, it's also all about avoiding responsibility. Confronting you about the data they found, is just begging for a lawsuit or press attention. What if they asked you about it and then didn't hire you anyway, for whole other reasons. Depending on what they asked about, it can be a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

    --
    A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
  66. Deadheads? by SomethingOrOther · · Score: 1

    > he said that they didn't hire pot smokers Well... Thats pretty much our entire physics department fucked then.

    --
    Anyone quoted by a reporter knows how little they understand
    Don't believe what you read is the truth.
  67. International Law by lorcha · · Score: 1

    What is this "international law" that you speak of? And more specifically, who enforces it? Who should I call if I see someone violating this "international law"? Where might I go to read this "international law"?

    --
    "Avoid employing unlucky people - throw half of the pile of CVs in the bin without reading them." -- David Brent
    1. Re:International Law by Savant-Ben · · Score: 1

      You could try the Hague?
      Ever hear of "The International Law of the Sea"
      War Crimes Tribunals?

  68. Not good enough by lorcha · · Score: 1
    If you truly wanted to know more about someone, then open your mouth and ask that someone.
    As a rental property owner, I can confidently state that that is not good enough. I perform a thorough background check on every potential renter because, and I'm sure you'll be shocked by this, people with something to hide will frequently lie to you.

    This is critical to my business because if I allow a convicted axe-murderer to live in one of my buildings and he hacks another resident to bits, I'm looking at a nasty lawsuit. Such is life in America, I guess.

    --
    "Avoid employing unlucky people - throw half of the pile of CVs in the bin without reading them." -- David Brent
  69. chickens coming home to roost by necrognome · · Score: 1

    Isn't Wyoming full of independent-minded gun owners who value their privacy?

    --


    Let's get drunk and delete production data!
  70. The background of a con artist. by voodoo1man · · Score: 1
    Well, thanks to an anonymous poster (see my other post in this thread) it turns out "Jay Patel's" real name is Sanjay Amin. And guess what a little google search turned up:

    http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,37963,00.ht ml

    Turns out that before Sanjay Amin founded abika.com ("an online e-book retailer" according to Wired), he was busy defrauding investors with a perpetual energy source scam! Looks like Sanjay is all done with Entropy Systems (the name of company hawking said scam, founded by him in Youngstown, Ohio in 1994), but he himself is far from done defrauding the general public.

    --

    In the great CONS chain of life, you can either be the CAR or be in the CDR.

  71. Aha, a serious problem by twitter · · Score: 1
    You are joking, but you bring up the fundamental problems of accuracy and slander. The background checker defends himself:

    If everyone knew everything about everyone else, or at least had access to such information, there would be less problems. Besides, why try and hide things, when it is becoming harder and harder to do so?

    What he says is true, but that's not how the world and his company are working. The problem is that large government agencies and companies can get things wrong and that goes on to hurt without you having any idea much less a chance to defend yourself. A truly open system would be good, you should be able to tell who said what about you. What we have now is not very good at all, hence the $150 that can be charged.

    --

    Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.