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Linux-Based Phone Lasts 200 Hours on Standby
An anonymous reader writes "Motorola is showing off a Linux/Java phone with a claimed battery life of 200 hours on standby, or 200-250 minutes when talking. If those figures prove true, Linux sure is improving quickly on the power management front. That kind of battery life also suggests that the E895 might be the first single-chipset phone ever to run a complex OS, whether Symbian, Windows Mobile, or Linux. Other features are user-upgradable memory, 1.3MP camera, video capture, multimedia slideshows, and more. Hopefully a more U.S.-friendly version will follow, as happened when Mot's Linux-based quad-band A780 came out a year or so after it's tri-band forebear, the A768, shipped in China."
... wont' something non-Linux, something smaller and more efficient, give longer talk time?
The maximum capacity of the E895 is listed as 10MB. Is this an error, 10MB of 3gp file is like 20 mins of video. what about other standard expansions SD,MMC?
Oooh, that's nice, and I accept a plethora of comments to stream past about how we don't need this in a phone, and that a phone is a phone... But don't you just look at this and think "wow... we've come a long way". I know I do.
:)
A great phone by itself, with the addition of lotsa power, i'm liking it
Anonymous Coward
Those figures aren't impressive for a phone as all my phones in the past 3 years have lasted twice that long.
...this sounds like typical phone talk/standby times. And that's including the many Symbian phones out there, as well as the Treo's. Dunno what Hiptops do, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's in the same order.
-- Waht? Tehr's a preveiw buottn?
Nowhere in the article does it say that linux is the reason behind the batteries long standby time. You might want to read it again.
Rock is Dead! Long live Paper and Scissors!!
Again, TFA says:
Does anyone know why Motorola keeps doing this? Isn't there a viable market for linux-based mobile phone in Europe or the US for example?
as an example of a phone that can do up to 300 hours on stand-by
Nokia 5140i
Linux is not competing against a simple kernel that simply goes to sleep. It is competing against Win CE, Symbian, etc. that ARE real oses as well. They have their own share of issues that are apparently much slower and/or more overhead.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
When you try to use it, it texts you with the message "Can't find lib.so.8"
My Philips Xenium 9@9++ has a standby time of about a month. No useless toy features (camera, color display, ...).
Granted, I don't phone that much, but it's nice to have a device that doesn't need be be recharged every other day/week.
Does it really matter what OS your phone is running? It's a closed system; you can't get at the internals.
Am I part of the core demographic for Swedish Fish?
So, a phone runs Java or Linux as it's OS... unless I get access the system's internal files, and modify it how I want to, I'm not going to get too hot and bothered over this.
~The TwoTailedFox posts again....
drop your RPM based distro for Debian
http://www.thetelephoneexchange.co.uk/Teleweb_file s/selling.htm
"The E895 is expected to be initially introduced in the Asia-Pacific region"
AsiaPac simply has a bigger more dynamic mobile market than the USA.
Deleted
You must be new to Slashdot, hence "stuff that matters" like getting Linux to run on plastic lunch trays or pieces of lint matted down in my gym bag. It matters.
Yes! I listen to NYC Speedcore and do math at 3AM. I suggest you try it too.
Shell:
to send message:
$ message --body Hi, how are you doing? --recipient 0415898537
bash: message: command not found
I seems there are at least 4 totally isolated dev teams at Motorola.
They have
1. Multiband Phones running Linux (A780, this one, etc)
2. UMTS phones running Symbian UIQ (A1000, E1000, etc)
3. Clamshell-Phones running Windows Mobile (MPx220...)
4. and finally the ultra slim phones running Motorola's own OS (RAZR V3...)
Wow. Compare this to Nokia, they have about 3 basic setups with 50 different designs.
mount -t gsm /dev/gsm1 /tmp/.call -o number=1-555-3456 /tmp/.call/incoming /dev/speaker& ...
cp
http://malfeasance.50megs.com/
Imagine a Beowulf Cluster of these!
http://stoploudness.org/
I'm constantly frustrated by poor interface design and hate learning my way through new OSes. The phones I've used have such terrible interfaces that I can't imagine that they won't change quite a bit in the future. I've resisted buying a cell phone in part because I don't want to learn interfaces for devices that are going to vanish soon and be replaecd by something better.
/.: Where should I be looking for a good laptop/PDA/phone-type device that has a good and reliable interface and a QWERTY keyboard? What's your experience with these devices? What do you think is on the way?
Part of me wants a cell phone that simply has ten numbers, a call button, and a call log, and for the other stuff I'll use a laptop that has a GOOD interface for it. Oh, and a ringer and vibrate. But sadly, fewer features doesn't seem to less cost now.
Another part wants all mobile things integrated into one device, giving me a laptop/phone/PDA that I can carry everywhere. But it has to have a good interface. I refuse to learn this damn texting. Morse code I could do. But texting just seems awful.
I've got friends who have Treos and stuff, but I've never gotten to play with any of them. The idea of something that runs Linux seems nice, though.
So, my question for
xkcd.com - a webcomic of mathematics, love, and language.
will it be able to make phone calls?
...is this sort of power management a feature of typical Linux kernels? Who wrote it? Has LT reviewed it?
...are we really talking about an advanced low power processor which happens to run Linux?
...what is it about Linux that facilitates this low power consumption? Is it that the OS is free, so the development was cheap?
Nearly fifty percent of all graduates come from the bottom half of the class!
My Nokia has a claimed battery time of 250 hours. Of course, it does last that long. I think this claim about the linux phone is a load of whooshing hyperbolism!
Because no one is actually going to *call* a Linux geek :)
With how ultra-reliable Java runtime has been lately, I'd rather run an OS designed by seahorses.
Yes, *that* Bob Vila.
While power management can be performed by an OS, the majority of power savings can come from efficient hardware design. Being a chip designer, I know that the power consumption of my device is not highly dependent on the OS I am running, but on how many fast switching transistors I put in the device.
Linux has nothing to do with the power consumption. Good hardware design along with good software (regardless of OS) to switch the device off when not in use is the key to long battery design.
Enough with the glorification of Linux (and OSes in general). Lets give a little attention to the good hardware design. Software people have the easy job. They can simply recompile when something doesn't work. I get my ass beat when we spend 50k on a chip that doesn't work right.
How does this have anything to do with "Linux improving on the power management front"?
If anything they will be using a modified kernel with their own power management code. More realistically the reason for getting the battery times they are is simply the "Single chip".
Powering one chip takes less energy than multiple chips. But of course this is Slashdot...
nokia 9500 comes to my mind. but i think those communicators suck, they are big, ugly and buggy.
Way to go Linux !!
Chris ,
Php Programmers.
Now Motorola can make a little tux penguin cell phone holder because you know every linux geek would want one. I would!
Reality is a big nasty dragon. Fortunately I don't believe in dragons.
This is big because it's a full desktop OS. Think windows xp on a laptop. All other phone OSes were deliberately designed for small devices.
Why does that matter? Because it makes development and porting to it a lot easier than to PalmOS, PPC, WinCE, or Symbian.
Another cool phone that I will never be able to own because I, like thousands of other people, cannot have a camera phone at work. [/rant]
Seriously, isn't the market for GOOD non-camera phones big enough to support at least one?
!hoD
So does it run qtopia? Nowhere have I been able to find out what UI it has. Now, will I have to get a SDK from Trolltech?? Will it do on device debugging, will Motocoder tech-support have any idea of what I am talking about (I'm not getting my hopes up here..). Dunno, I am VERY sceptical these days. Been messing around with J2ME and having a look at Symbian I REALLY want a proper solution!! Linux and Qtopia COULD be that solution, but have you guys been over at the forums at qtopia.net?? Not one of the most busy ones around, on the other hand the j2me.org forums is spammed by stupid newbe questions a lá Q - "I want to to this, how do I do it?" A - You can't (exept on some obscure devices), see spec says yes but it's up to the implementation". The Symbian forum is better, but we are talking about 30-ish devices and half of them are Nokias..... Oh, and you can't (well you CAN, but it really sucks) develop in Linux and besides, they will try to suck the last penny/cent from you with their "Forum Nokia PRO" (4000 euro !!!!!!!!), and their j2me support is almost criminal insane, I am telling you, I almost thought they were sabotaging the java platform....
Ah well, I am on vacation but I soon have to decide on which platform my KILLER app will be released... and my (eh ours..) app will drive sales of that phone!! Seriously!
a claimed battery life of 200 hours on standby, or 200-250 minutes when talking. ... Linux sure is improving quickly on the power management front. That kind of battery life... is a meaningless statement unless you know how big the bloody batteries are. Why do I have this mental image of a device looking like a matchbox strapped to a brick?
My Karma: ran over your Dogma
StrawberryFrog
Run an entire PBX on your cellphone... now that'd be cool. Perhaps somewhat limited in functionality, but definitely cool.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
I should have done this. From TFA:
Measures 2 x 3.7 x 0.9 inches (51 x 93 x 23 mm)
Displaces 88.4 cc
Weighs 4.5 ounces (127 grams)
My Karma: ran over your Dogma
StrawberryFrog
Even assuming the documented maximum are from standing directly next to a mobile phone mast, I'm sure motorola's are skewed in the same way.
So.. big deal, welcome to the modern world! :)
First phone I looked up...Motorola V980, 215h standby. Battery life has nothing to do with the thing running Linux.
i have a nokia 6820, it rocks. it have an ssh app, an irc app, and i send like 50 million text messages a day. they're damn cheap now from tmobile.
Ogg? More flexible OS?
Don't think you will be able to get a BASH prompt on this phone. It's a closed phone; customization will be in Java; and yeah there may be a Java ogg player but thats little advantage over most other devices.
Linux is "interesting" here, but not "friendly".
Also, note that the phone is upgradable to 10MB -ooohh! Woww!!! 10MB!!; I wonder why they bother to release such a device, some of their early models had 96MB which is something but low for a multimedia device.
Sam
blog.sam.liddicott.com
The main reason behind the change is to modularise the phone so large chunks of code don't need to be modified for each different phone. This wont mean that any user software can be loaded because the bootloader won't allow anything except motorola firmware to run. The only way to get around this is to: 1. figure out what the encryption key is. 2. replace the bootloader by changing the bootloader rom with custom rom. btw the encryption key is kept on the chip that its run on so unless ya got an electron microscope handy you wont be able to extract it.
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Note: Linux has nothing to do with battery life on this phone. Modern phones last 200+ hours on standby anyway.
It could have been the best phone made to date. Has some really cool features, but a few annoying bugs. Motorola seems to have completely abandoned this phone; never released a firmware upgrade.
Even though the phone is a Linux phone, you can't install any linux apps on it. The only applications that you can download are java apps.
Jesus used to be my co-pilot, but we crashed in the mountains and I had to eat him.
Will it require you to read the manpages to answer a call?
pick up an old motorola v60 series phone. they are small, built like a tank, and the UI isn't completely terrible. battery life is good. plus people still look at the phone and want it... even those who have phones with fancy color screens with built-in camera, etc. it's stylish, but in a utilitarian way. not overdone like the RAZR.
forget your need for a PDA+phone+mp3+whatever. that's your inner gadget geek going to town with your wallet. a combined device will never be as good as seperate components. if you want the features of a laptop, get the laptop. you aren't getting the laptop UI in a pocket mobile device.
most people do not need PDAs. that is simply truth. look on ebay for people selling PDAs. 99% of them say they "had no use for it" or "thought they would use it more, but didn't." There are very few actual good uses for PDAs, and most of the time it is just the owner looking for an excuse to use the damned thing. Palmone still has no clue where they are going with their Lifedrive or whatever they have now. Get a laptop, get a *nice* mp3 player (iaudio makes some nice ones) and get a phone that functions like a phone. no nonsense.
And do keep in mind this quote from Fight Club:
"Things that you own wind up owning you"
now if my laptop would go into standby running linux...
Texting with this phone is fine because of the qwerty keyboard. However you still find yourself using text shorthand to cram as much as possible into a message. Y pay 4 2 msg whn 1 cn do.
You may think me a tired, old, cynic. I'd have to disagree about the tired bit.
Cellphones with better battery life than Motorola's existed even four years ago. For instance, the Sony Ericsson T65i was the market leader in 2002 having a standby time of 300 hours and a talk time of 11 hours. In practice, I found that phone never lasted more than 200 hours standby and 6.5 hours talk time even with a brand new battery in an area with good reception close to a basestation. In areas with poor signal strength, standby was ~80 hours and talk time was ~3 hours. I expect Motorola's battery life figures fall off similarly quickly with signal strength.
Scroogle
Spelling matters.
My cellphone from Motorola advertised 250 hours on standby. After the first full charge, it died within 10 hours, on standby. Now, after over 6 months use, it comes very close to lasting half as long as promised, when charged for 3 nights in a row.
Such inflated specs are about as misleading as hard disk MTBF ratings.
I imagine mobile phones interacting with each other via Bluetooth, automatically setting up a cluster as soon as there are ore than two of them in a given area... I don't know whatever for would it be useful, but it seems an interesting idea.
It is also reminiscent of Cranium Rats from Planescape, which is why I'm not certain I'd like to see that happen. Terminator may be the first that comes to mind when people think of machines ruling over people, but I find Stanislaw Lem's ideas much more disturbing... and the mobile phones, with their incessant miniaturization, are heading right there.
So please, moderators, don't go modding down memes just because you've seen them before. An apparent smart-ass can give you quite a lot to think about.
I, for one, would mod parent up Insightful, or at least Interesting.
Ignore this signature. By order.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but NEC and Panasonic make phones in the Japanese market (FOMA) that run Linux and get around double the standby time.
But can it run... Eh, nevermind.
Well I for one welcome our new long battery life overloards!
I cant wait until this gets into the mainline kernel! My laptop has a much bigger battery, so now it'll last 2,423,234,943 hours instead of four!
Wait, how does this matter?
I thought maintaining battery life was a coding/engineering issue? What's it being Linux got to do with it?
200 hours is exactly the figure promised by my bog-standard Sony Ericsson cameraphone. So what's the big deal here exactly?
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." -- Goethe
But can i apt-get install anything?
if not, then what is the big deal about a phone running linux?
I wonder if these linux phones will start trying to ssh with generic usernames to other linux phones because linux phone admins are too lazy to apply patches?
Just kidding, I know linux phone admins are diligent.
The GPL does offer the right to anyone using the software (on the phone) to read the code. The distribution and apps from Trolltech (and others) may not be licensed so. Either way there's got to be enough GNU tools used, so the non-average user can try and tweak it the way they like it (voiding warranty of course.)
If there are such possibilities than calling out "linux,linux,linux" might have some significance. Else, I'd rather not care about the OS/Platform/Chipset and just hope that the phone delivers the features it promises.
No Greater Friend, No Greater Enemy! (Lucius Cornelius Sulla)
In other news, the new Linux phone lasted the same as the best Windows phone when the both phones were powered off..
What a bunch of fucking bullshit!
>If those figures prove true, Linux sure is improving quickly on the power management front.
It means Motorola's drivers and other code have improved.
And so fucking what anyway? Am I supposed to ditch my current phone just because this piece of shit can standby 200 hours?
While reading the article I came across this quote:
"Such stellar battery life suggests the E895 might be based on a single-chipset architecture, "
If I read that correctly it sounds like they don't know if was built on the single chipset or not.
I appears that the "author" does not have access to anything more than publicity manual. I would think that they could claim that this thing cures cancer, stops wars and ends world hunger...and no one would really know.
That being said, I would love to see this thing reviewd by someone who has kicked one of these things around for a couple of months. Which brings on my second gripe --
"Availability
The E895 is expected to be initially introduced in the Asia-Pacific region in Q4 of 2005."
I guess it does not really matter, because it will never make it to our shores -- and if it does, it won't be until we have flying cars and they find some way to increase the price and reduce the features. This is about the 10th cool gadget I have seen this month that I will never get to purchase in person, or as the case with cellphones, even if I could purchase -- I would never get to use without moving to Tokyo.
(+1 Funny) only if I laugh out loud.
"Go to CNN [for a] spell-checked, fact-checked summary" -- CmdrTaco
The phone has 10MB built in, and has a transflash memory port to increase memory by 512MB. I'm not sure where you guys are getting this 10MB limit from.
now if only it didn't have the fatal flaw of that freaking hinge.
[At least] political activists will like the option to install strong encryption on their phone. I know I would buy one if its fast enough for stuff like that.
I read the article and I swear it said that it could be upgraded to 10MB of transflash memory but I am glad to be corrected.
Thanks
Sam
blog.sam.liddicott.com
Well, that's such a breakthrough.
So between this and the Linspire does Windows games news, we're pretty much beating into the ground that Linux is being used to emulate Windows rather than innovate and be different and cool for its own reasons.
Wake me when they shave the kernel to something reasonable and do something truly awesome with it.
If my grammar and spelling are off, I am [distracted/tired/careless] (take your pick)
This doesn't have anything to do with the power management schemes APM and ACPI that typically accumulate complaints when used with Linux. All this means is that Linux is an efficient general purpose kernel, which we already knew.
LRC, the best-read libertarian site on the web
The long battery life has less to do with Linux and more to do with its internal power management chip. This is an analog (yes, non-digital) chip produced by National Semiconductor. I know. My uncle designed it. :)
WTF is a "complex OS"?
When you look at the state of the world, how can you not become a radical, liberal anarchist?