Slashdot Mirror


Iris Recognition To Take Off

An anonymous reader writes "Looks like iris recognition is about to explode. Turns out, a major patent held by iris recognition leader Iridian is expiring, and that's leading a stampede of start-ups and VCs into this space."

229 comments

  1. WARNING! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Do not stare into iris reader with remaing eye. Seriously, though, folks -- aren't things like this affected by a multitude of patents (as in "patent fence") so that the dominant company doesn't just get put out of business by copycats the day the main patent expires. Don't know how much cause there is for optimism here -- if indeed widespread use of invasive biometric IDs (think about having to provide this to buy liquor or smokes) is even a good thing.

    ~~~

  2. You've gotta admit... by PornMaster · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's not often that you read about a company's patent expiring being likely to benefit it financially. Quite interesting.

    1. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It just proves that patents stifle creativity.

    2. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You neglect to recognize the fact that the technology would never have been developed without the patent. But that just spoils your rant doesn't it.

    3. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      You're an idiot.

      The technology would have been developed without the patent. The technology would have been just fine without patents at all.

      Fucking moron.

    4. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Such insight...

      Companies will not invest in the necessary R&D without some guarantee of exclusivity for some period of time.

      But you knew that -- you're just bitter.

    5. Re:You've gotta admit... by Ismilar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "Companies will not invest in the necessary R&D without some guarantee of exclusivity for some period of time."

      Umm... did you even read article, or even the Slashdot blurb? The entire thing is /about/ companies being set to invest money in iris scanning technology and research due to the patent being removed. These companies would have done so long ago had there been no patent.

      The article even suggests that the reason that iris scanners aren't as common as fingerprint or other scanners could be because of the patents that the single company holds.

    6. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 0

      This is just one example -- it may have points that support or don't support patent law. In total, the laws support tech AND economic development. As much as you want to live in a Star Trek world, we don't. Not every industry pimps itself out cheap like the software world.

    7. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's pure speculation, not fact. Please learn the difference.

    8. Re:You've gotta admit... by sabernet · · Score: 1

      Okay, then let's hear you give an example of a patent being held such as this one where it -did- benefit the technology in question. Make sure to include sources as well as evidence showing that R&D on the creation would have been a mute point had such long legal monopolistic protection not been a factor.

      You like bashing people, fine. I'm sure it gives you quite an erection. Just prove your point better then he whom you claim is not. Otherwise you're just flaming.

    9. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You neglect to recognize the fact that the technology would never have been developed without the patent

      Do you have a reference for this "fact"?

    10. Re:You've gotta admit... by (negative+video) · · Score: 4, Insightful
      The entire thing is /about/ companies being set to invest money in iris scanning technology and research due to the patent being removed. These companies would have done so long ago had there been no patent.
      They're wrong. This is about the new opportunities for feeding at the Homeland Security trough, which by pure coincidence happens to be at about the time the patent expires.
    11. Re:You've gotta admit... by Xenoflargactian · · Score: 1

      Pick any major pharmaceutical that took >10 years to develop. I'm i'm Merck or GSK or Pfizer, why the hell would I spend tens of billions of dollars researching and getting FDA approval for a drug that my competitors can produce from the moment it's FDA approved?

    12. Re:You've gotta admit... by Xenoflargactian · · Score: 1
      Make sure to include sources as well as evidence showing that R&D on the creation would have been a mute point had such long legal monopolistic protection not been a factor.
      I'm not writing a thesis to win an internet argument that will be forgotten in two days.

      Why not pictures and interviews? Or a 90+ minute documentary? Or an under-oath sworn statement from a rich entrepreneur saying that he wouldn't have wasted oodles of money on something that was gonna be ripped off the moment he finished it?

    13. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 1

      The light bulb, elements of MRI, most major drugs, and do your own research.

    14. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Moving past the a.h. attack...

      These small companies -- why wouldn't they just patent the results of their efforts? Why exactly do patent laws favor size? I have a small number of patents that I paid for as an individual. They aren't going to make me millions, but submitting and getting a patent doesn't have any size barrier(s).

      So seriously, what was your point?

    15. Re:You've gotta admit... by NickFortune · · Score: 3, Informative
      This is about the new opportunities for feeding at the Homeland Security trough, which by pure coincidence happens to be at about the time the patent expires.

      That's one opinion. Business Week, that hotbed of anti-patent activism and communist propaganda, doesn't seem to agree.

      While Iridian still holds some two dozen active patents on everything from ways to digitize an iris scan to camera design, expiration of the Flom patent will finally allow a stream of competitors to enter the iris-recognition market.
      That's from TFA in case it wasn't obvious. The emphasis is mine.
      --
      Don't let THEM immanentize the Eschaton!
    16. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 1

      It just proves that patents stifle creativity.

      How is this a fact much less proof?

    17. Re:You've gotta admit... by sabernet · · Score: 1

      Actually, you didn't write in this thread other then to say you won't be writing much in it.

      And if you think showing sources is a thesis, you're as lazy as you are sarcastic.

      Why participate in a discussion of ideas if all you wanna say is "right on!", "MS is lame" or "I was here". Wouldn't your time best be spent doing something either more productive or, at the least, less derogatory?

    18. Re:You've gotta admit... by Xenoflargactian · · Score: 1
      Actually, you didn't write in this thread other then to say you won't be writing much in it.
      If you'd read, you see that I wrote:
      Pick any major pharmaceutical that took >10 years to develop. I'm i'm Merck or GSK or Pfizer, why the hell would I spend tens of billions of dollars researching and getting FDA approval for a drug that my competitors can produce from the moment it's FDA approved?
      but I guess I didn't write that. Thanks for letting me know that.
    19. Re:You've gotta admit... by Aphexian · · Score: 1
      These small companies -- why wouldn't they just patent the results of their efforts?

      I have a small number of patents that I paid for as an individual. They aren't going to make me millions

      I like a man who can answer his own question. Integrity lies within, after all.

    20. Re:You've gotta admit... by iminplaya · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You neglect to recognize the fact that the technology would never have been developed without the patent.

      That's a load of bull. If somebody needs an iris scanner, they will make one...with or without the damn patent. That's something that the IP drones won't ever admit....That something just might arise from necessity...not always exclusivity. It has been proven once again that IP law promotes speculation.

      --
      What?
    21. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'll admit that it's not "proof", but it lays a pretty good groundwork for the case and is consistent with what nearly everyone on this board has known for ages.

      There are cases where a patent is legit, but these days there's just far too many cases of "word it really vaguely, so we can cover anything even related". This essentially lets them patent an idea, which is a horrible abuse of the patent system.

    22. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Had there been no patent, the original research and development would never have been publicized and these other companies would not have had the information to develop their products.

    23. Re:You've gotta admit... by Col.+Klink+(retired) · · Score: 1

      On the other hand, look at DMSO. The patent has long since expired. Many people believe DMSO can cure arthritis, but it has never been approved for such a use. No company will spend the billions of dollars to get FDA approval on this drug because they won't own the patent.

      The same is true of just about any herbal remedy. Despite all the hype about medical marijiuana, even if the drug itself were declared legal the FDA wouldn't approve it for treating glaucoma or anything else unless someone spent billions proving it safe (only to be left holding the bill and no guarantee of a return on the investment).

      Thus the patent system distorts the ideal outcome. Natural and effective drugs are eschewed for artificial ones which, despite 10 years of tests, are still riddled with side effects. Even aspirin, once believed to be the only drug with no side effects, is now known to cause Reyes Syndrome.

      --

      -- Don't Tase me, bro!

    24. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 1

      That's the beauty of the patent system. If you are too vague, everyone will just invent around it. The less specific your patent is, the less likely it's enforceable.

    25. Re:You've gotta admit... by A+beautiful+mind · · Score: 1
      Check the history of the iris recognition!

      1936 ophthalmologist Frank Burch suggests iris-based identification

      We would have done it without patent or not.

      Anyway, just to correct some misleading posts:

      Pros for iris recognition:
      • FAR (false acceptance rate) is 10^-78 (earth population 10^10 at max)
      • For most of the work this guy, John Daugman is responsible. He identified 400(!!!) different and measurable(!!!) parameters on the iris and gave the statistical error model for them.
      • The iris' patterns form in young age and then it doesn't really change.
      Cons:
      • Quite expensive at the moment (partly due to patent problems).
      • The infection factor: it has to be kept really hygienic. There is the story of the american military base, where one guy had an eye infection and they used an iris scanner. The guy infected around half of the total personnel at that base, through the iris scanner.
      --
      It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
      Be yourself no matter what they say
    26. Re:You've gotta admit... by A+beautiful+mind · · Score: 1

      My sarcasm detector just exploded.

      --
      It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
      Be yourself no matter what they say
    27. Re:You've gotta admit... by TheLink · · Score: 1

      Uh. This is not retina scanning. There's no contact with the iris scanner at all. How can infection spread?

      Depending on how expensive the equipment used you can be from 6 inches away from the scanner to 2 or 3 feet.

      This is possible becayuse all the scanner needs to do is take pictures of the iris which is visible outside of your eye.

      I have tested such equipment. It does work, but for important stuff you still need people around to make sure it's being used the way its supposed to be used. E.g. not some guy with a fake iris strapped in front of a working/simulated pupil.

      Thing is, this is just comparing pictures of something. It's only secure as long as it is too expensive/hard to make a copy that can be secretly used.

      Print fake irises on contact lenses and you should be able to fool the cheaper scanners.

      If you want to simulate a moving iris and pupil, maybe all you need to do is have some reading glasses on and jiggle it a bit. I haven't tested this, but in order to prevent significant false negatives I think it'll be hard to stop these sort of things.

      --
    28. Re:You've gotta admit... by cheesybagel · · Score: 1

      Those opportunities have been around since 911, yet only now are they investing in it.

    29. Re:You've gotta admit... by cheesybagel · · Score: 1

      Can you manufacture any products using the patents you filed without infringing on someone else's patents?

    30. Re:You've gotta admit... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ahh, so the real reason you're shilling this comes out - you've got a few trophy patents on something rediculously trivial hanging on your wall, and you think it's "cool" that you hold a monopoly on something that probably won't be useful to anyone, and certainly won't be useful to the public as long as you've got the patent.

      Patents favor size because large companies can afford the fleet of patent lawyers that it takes to fight a patent case, and they favor size because a large company doing anything with technology has a large list of patents - small guy starts producing something new, large company somewhere has a patent that affects it.

      The ideal patent reform at this point is to shut down the patent system entirely.

      Barring that, cap the number of patents issued at say 50 per year - only something truly innovative should be eligible. Realistically, can there possibly be enough true invention that justifies the number of patents handed out today?

    31. Re:You've gotta admit... by Monkeyboy4 · · Score: 1

      The pharma industry is a poor example - the R&D process is predicated on the patent. The business model is predicated on the patent process. How's this for a counter argument? Medicines were developed once apin a time to CURE DISEASES, not to turn a profit. Noone is going to develop the next erection drug without a patent, but the next polio cure (say cancer or aids) would still be developed without patents. It's called caring for humanity, even altruism. You should take a look at it somtime. The economic model does not have all the right answers. It doesn't even have all the answers. Monkeyboy4

    32. Re:You've gotta admit... by ThreeE · · Score: 1

      Yes, but alas, there's no market for them...

    33. Re:You've gotta admit... by Charles+W+Griswold · · Score: 0, Redundant

      Pick any major pharmaceutical that took >10 years to develop. I'm i'm Merck or GSK or Pfizer, why the hell would I spend tens of billions of dollars researching and getting FDA approval for a drug that my competitors can produce from the moment it's FDA approved?

      Maybe because the government is paying for your drug research? Yes, boys and girls, the federal government pays for a lot of the drug research that the pharmaceutical companies do. When we ask why drugs cost so much, they whine and cry about the cost of drug research when in reality, we're the ones paying for it!

      Don't believe me? Here's just one example, straight from the horse's mouth.

      Some more examples:
      CHALLENGE GRANTS: JOINT VENTURES IN BIOMEDICINE AND BIOTECHNOLOGY
      CHALLENGE GRANTS: BIODEFENSE PRODUCT DEVELOPMENT"
      CHALLENGE GRANTS: BIODEFENSE AND SARS PRODUCT DEVELOPMENT
      Drug Companies and the NIH

      So don't go crying about how the drug companies need patent protection, or need to charge us so much, because I'm not listening. I know the truth.
      --
      "Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber" -- Plato
    34. Re:You've gotta admit... by (negative+video) · · Score: 1
      Those opportunities have been around since 911, yet only now are they investing in it.
      The opportunities have been around since at least the early '90s. However the political will to fling suitcases full of cash at anybody with security tech has really, er, exploded in the past few years.
    35. Re:You've gotta admit... by torokun · · Score: 1


      1. They are going to invest money because they can free-ride on the research of another company, now that its patent has expired. Whenever you can get someone else's work for free, there's a big opportunity for financial gain.

      2. How do you know these companies would have had any clue about iris recognition if this patent had never been made public? The patentee could have instead kept it as a trade secret -- would these companies have invested in iris recognition then??

      3. Iris scanners may be less common because of the patent, but that's by design. We allow them to set the price to whatever the market will bear, in order to receive extra compensation for inventing a technology first, and making it public.

    36. Re:You've gotta admit... by Xenoflargactian · · Score: 1
      I agree with you mostly, however I think the problem is with the FDA approval process. I think our government is way too restrictive on what they allow us to put into our bodies.

      If a drug is dangerous to other people (not just the person taking it), like crack cocaine, that's one thing. If a drug has potential to be beneficial to many people, and the only reason they can't use it is because no one has spent billions of dollars on medical trials, I believe those people should be allowed to put their own lives at risk by trying experimental medications.

      For example, a biotech firm has developed a gene therapy that uses the p53 (apoptosis) gene to kill cancerous cells. The treatment has been shown to be extremely effective and is on the fasttrack approval process, with the only known side effect being pain at the site of injection. The drug cannot be released until the trials are done. The one that bugs me is a trial in which the treatment was given to several terminal patients. Most of them showed significant improvement, yet the study isn't complete until a 75% (IIRC) of them die because they 'need' to know exactly how much the lifespans were extended. Why the hell are they postponing the release of this treatment over something stupid like that? This could be helping so many people, and yet it's being held back. The treatment is actually being delayed because it's so effective. BS

    37. Re:You've gotta admit... by iminplaya · · Score: 1

      Maybe, if you checked a little history, specifically the diesel engine and FM radio, among others. You might find some of your proof. IP is being treated just like physical property. It's all about hoarding as much as you can (IBM, Microsoft, etc.) and how much you can extort from the public (pharmaceuticals, software). If the cry for reform gets too loud, they back off a bit. This is not about innovation. It's simply about moving paper, specifically money, without any innovative device actually hitting the streets. It's a scam of the worst kind invented by thieves(pirates would be good word to use here, because that is what they are.)

      --
      What?
    38. Re:You've gotta admit... by sillybilly · · Score: 1

      It just proves that patents CAN stifle creativity, but the jury is not out 100%.

      True, there are lots of lawyer companies out there whose only business model is to own and manage patent portfolios and extort money for them. As their main business process they patent all kinds of broad and generic stuff on any technology that has some kind of hope, then they sit on it, in hopes it will turn an investment. For anyone else coming to the field who missed the 'first-post' by a millisecond because the lawyers were quicker, but who would really make the damn thing work, put in the sweat and elbow grease and release an actual product for general consumption, they are shut out.

      But then there are companies who invest lots of R&D money into developing a technology, and without patents they'd keep it a secret, possibly losing it to the world if they go bankrupt, and the files could get tossed into the garbage straight from the library shelves. At least this way there is openness, and public record, and in case their competitor simply bribes one of their employees to sell the secret, the initial company can still protect his 'open secret' if it's in a patent form.

      And then there are companies of the 2nd case who hire lawyer companies of the 1st case to manage their portfolio and maximize return.

      There is no good answer.

      In general though, about intellectual property:

      While there is such a thing as conservation of mass and conservation of energy, neither of which can be freely generated or destroyed, information is quite the opposite, it's generated and destroyed easily.

      Money is something tailored to deal with the conservation-type world, where you can stick an equivalent exchange measure - i.e. this piece of energy worth this much money, let's exchange.

      With information it's a lot harder to justify such things. How much is this piece of information worth? Well, you sell it to me for 1 cent, you still get to keep your original that you can keep selling, and you're better off than if you didn't sell to me at all. Marginal cost is 0, long term equilibrium price is 0. Note that this line of argument wouldn't work when you're trying to cut a deal on a car, the dealer can't sell it to you for 1 cent, then go around and sell the same thing it to someone else again.

      So while there is such a thing as constancy of money and concept of 'transaction' in sql databases and bank systems, with information the measuring unit or reward system should follow the nature of information, capable of being generated, or even destroyed, with no conservation laws applying. Such an old reward system, back in the days of Newton, Leibniz, Guass, was reputation, fame, and appreciation of colleauges. Such things are generated and destroyed easily. Academia teaches giving proper credit to originators of ideas, and plagiarism can be a reason for dismissal.

      Still, reputation and fame doesn't buy you food. It can get you a job that pays for food, but in general it'd be very hard to create a connection between the nonconstancy-world of information-money(whatever shape this takes, abstract, or printed, or ipod-stored-kudo-points) and the conservation-law-ruled material world of food. It would be too easy to abuse such connection, if based on a direct proportional equivalence, and overgenerate the credits and use up all limited food resources pretty fast. Saying that 3 information credits get you 1 food credit doesn't work, there is no such exchange rate. If you could come up with a 'fair' function that maps the infinite domain of information-money to the finite-domain of material-money, things would be easy. Are there such functions that would be fair? For one, you could monitor the current state of the finite-food domain, know how much food is available, and monitor the information-domain, know how many credits you currently have, and adjust the exchange rate on the fly. Still, who'd have the authority to issue information credits? Teachers, professors, juries? You can't just trust Pe

    39. Re:You've gotta admit... by sillybilly · · Score: 1

      By the way, these professors are already excercising a method of reward system for intellectual creations, and they can generate grades out of nothing - there is no such thing as conservation of grades, though there is such a thing as a 'curve.' This means creativity is not rewarded by a self regulated free market, but by a sort of an expert jury, and it's painstaking work, but hey, whatever doesn't stop someone from going to a public library and borrowing a book for free, I'm all for it. Also, the free market doesn't necessarily regulate itself into anything but producing massive piles of trash, waste and sophisticated exploitation schemes. Not to say that 'wise, intellectually guided 5-year plans' of the old communist block produce something better - you walked into a store, and all you had were size 5 and size 16 shoes, and none in between, because the factories met their 5-year plan the official statisticians gave them, and they were only allowed to produce more size 5's and 16's. Statisticians can't predict demand, but demand by itself is not sacred, because drugs have a lot of demand for instance, and so could miseducation have a lot of demand. We still put faith into professors ability to grade, and intellectual creations, unlike food, shelter and clothing, are not a basic necessity to survive. In fact you can have a ton of garbage quality information produced whichever way you go - self regulating or expert arbitrated. On the other hand, for food, shelter and clothing, demand is sacred. Now if only grades and education or creativity credits could be turned into food. Anyway, the way things are going now, how long til we ban public libraries? And if we don't and you can keep reading books for free, why can't you use Windows for free?

    40. Re:You've gotta admit... by sillybilly · · Score: 1

      Also, with intellectual creations the demand is not concrete. You don't know what you want, you just want something - as Frank Barone said, when his son Ray Barone was writing his obituary, Frank complaining about the stuff he heard in it, and asked what do you want then? To which Frank said, "I don't know, surprise me."

  3. Hopefully politicians will notice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    all the business and startups poping up once some company looses hold and some "idea", ie patent, and they will discover this revelation - more than one person can have the same idea *gasp*!! But I just don't have that much optimism.

  4. Patents and innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    A patent exipry causing a boom in company startups and innovation - say it ain't so. Are there any legislators out there paying attention to stories like this?

    1. Re:Patents and innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If patents lasted as long as copyright, we wouldn't be discussing this.

    2. Re:Patents and innovation by Have+Blue · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You don't know anything about the patent in question. How much did Iridian sink into developing it? How much have they made back from it? How much would they have made back if this flood of copycats came immediately after they announced their discovery?

    3. Re:Patents and innovation by minus_273 · · Score: 1

      of course you dont know if the tech would have been developed had there been no means of making a profit from it. Note that the patent is expiring now i.e. the system WORKS

      --
      The war with islam is a war on the beast
      The war on terror is a war for peace
    4. Re:Patents and innovation by Duncan3 · · Score: 1

      Historicly, this was always the case. Someone would patent something, then be stuck sitting on it until it expired because noone was willing to go near it, knowing that the licensing fees would eat all profits. Then soon after it expired, there was an explosion of interest in the product.

      Nothing ever really changes.

      Now days, with agressive cross-licensing, the delay is mostly removed, but now all the profits goto lawyers instead of the inventors - which have no control over the things they invented thanks to corps.

      Of course, it's still pointless, since Asia ignores patents, and that's where all the growth is.

      --
      - Adam L. Beberg - The Cosm Project - http://www.mithral.com/
    5. Re:Patents and innovation by MOBE2001 · · Score: 1

      You don't know anything about the patent in question. How much did Iridian sink into developing it? How much have they made back from it? How much would they have made back if this flood of copycats came immediately after they announced their discovery?

      IMO, companies should be reimbursed only for their costs by a properly instituted restitution system. Yes, we (the government) should all chip in to pay the cost out of our tax money. The important thing is that nobody should be refrained from using an idea. It is an artificial infringement on liberty and just plain stupid. More often than not, patents give the discoverer/holder an unfair advantage that gives them the power to gouge the public and make a killing. Witness Xerox, Microsoft, etc... Bill Gates does not deserve all this money for DOS and Windows.

      As soon as Xerox's patents expired and competitors joined in, we saw an amazing expansion of copier technology. Xerox found it hard to compete on a level playing field. I am not shedding any tears for them.

    6. Re:Patents and innovation by jdavidb · · Score: 1

      Sounds like a perfect example of how our idea of "securing for limited times ... the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries" is utterly failing to "promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts," which is the only justification for patent and copyright given in the Constitution.

    7. Re:Patents and innovation by Kanasta · · Score: 1

      Why is it that a patent - on a physical invention that does wonderful things - is let to expire w/o companies collapsing

      while legislators feel copyrights - on say Mickey Mouse - should last forever otherwise nobody would create anymore? Personally I got bored of Mickey Mouse after seeing it for the 5000th time.

    8. Re:Patents and innovation by Xenoflargactian · · Score: 1
      Bill Gates does not deserve all this money for DOS and Windows.
      Define 'deserve'
    9. Re:Patents and innovation by ThreeE · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You are not clear on cause and effect here. If Xerox didn't expect to get the patents they did, the tech would never have been developed, implemented, and/or marketed. And yes, marketed. Often, that's the most expensive and difficult part.

      "Tear shedders" like you are simply nuts wanting a free ride on other's hard work. You probably are a heavy user of P2P networks to illegally copy copyrighted work and live in some pirate haven in Asia. Someday you'll actually have to learn how to create value -- like Xerox and Microsoft did.

      To say Bill Gates doesn't deserve all the money he as gotten bespoils the name of a great entrepreneur. But hey, this is slashdot and reality doesn't count. I'm sure it's Bush's fault too.

    10. Re:Patents and innovation by Planesdragon · · Score: 1

      It is an artificial infringement on liberty and just plain stupid.

      No, it's a way to ensure that the first person to get a chance to profit from an invention is the inventor.

      Figure out a way to get "chance" into that automatic-restitution scheme of yours, and you'll have a workable replacement. But if a crappy invention and a great invention both get rewarded the same, well, then you've just re-invented communism.

    11. Re:Patents and innovation by MOBE2001 · · Score: 1

      Figure out a way to get "chance" into that automatic-restitution scheme of yours, and you'll have a workable replacement. But if a crappy invention and a great invention both get rewarded the same, well, then you've just re-invented communism.

      The restitution scheme should be adjusted to reflect the value of the invention to society. Value should be based on economic benefits, work done in developing the invention, use, etc... So, if you invent a shit simulator, you get nothing; but if you invent true AI, then society owes you a lot. The value should be computed (and retroactively applied, if necessary) by a formula that is refined as we gain more experience with the system so as to encourage creativity without stifling freedom.

      Any inventor/writer/musician should be free to file a claim with the restitution bureau. This is a workable system and it's not communism. It's all about fairness and free market. Current IP laws are evil, in my opinion.

    12. Re:Patents and innovation by Xenoflargactian · · Score: 1
      It's all about fairness and free market.
      It's about a free market where the government tells you how much money you can make off your own invention? Sounds like a pseudo-command economy to me.
    13. Re:Patents and innovation by drsquare · · Score: 1

      Where do these people come from? Do they exist in the real world? I've never met anyone who actually thinks like this. This HAS to be a troll, there's no way it can be real.

      Even your own logic betrays you. If an invention isn't of benefit to society, and so wouldn't generate any 'restitution', why do you care that other people aren't allowed to use it because it's patented?

      And why should tax-payers pay for this? Do you know how much corporations make? You're talking about maybe DOUBLING the tax burden just so cheapskates like you don't have to pay to licence patented technology.

      What happened to the days when people discussed real-life issues rather than masturbation like this?

    14. Re:Patents and innovation by MOBE2001 · · Score: 1

      What happened to the days when people discussed real-life issues rather than masturbation like this?

      IMO, you're probably a greedy SOB who hopes to make a killing by abusing an evil system that takes away the liberty of others. I hope some nasty-looking alien from Andromeda knocks on your door one day and demands payment for using the wheel which they had patented a billion years ago in their home world. Any display of public masturbation on your part won't be accepted as payment, sorry. ahahaha...

    15. Re:Patents and innovation by Planesdragon · · Score: 1

      The value should be computed (and retroactively applied, if necessary) by a formula that is refined as we gain more experience with the system so as to encourage creativity without stifling freedom.

      Interesting. It might work better if it was a larger economic model--i.e., applied to normal wages and not simply creative expression.

      But, really, the best thing if you want to aborgate the "make and hide" scheme of IP law is mandatory licensing -- a patent must be licensed by anyone who wishes it for a percentage of gross revenues not more than, oh, 25%. Do the same thing for copyright--"at a cost not more than the cost of original publication" and you've just matched the "I want to use that" and "I want to be paid for it" sides perfectly.

      Btw:

      Current IP laws are evil, in my opinion.

      Economics are evil. Money is evil. Laws are even evil. But they're all necessary and tame evils.

    16. Re:Patents and innovation by Planesdragon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Where do these people come from? Do they exist in the real world? I've never met anyone who actually thinks like this. This HAS to be a troll, there's no way it can be real.

      Don't say that. A side effect of a free and creative society is that a lot of very weird ideas show up. Some of them go away, and others are adopeted becasue they really do make more sense.

      And why should tax-payers pay for this? Do you know how much corporations make? You're talking about maybe DOUBLING the tax burden just so cheapskates like you don't have to pay to licence patented technology.

      I believe you can more articulately argue your objection by noting that the proposed system would place a burden of paying for an invention upon those that do not directly profit from it--thus, as I noted, going against capitalist principals.

    17. Re:Patents and innovation by melikamp · · Score: 1

      I agree with the parent. If restitution they want -- restitution they may get, but not at the cost of stiffling the research. I like that idea of awarding inventions in some kinda nationwide contest, and then setting the IP loose, thereby forcing manufacturers to compete on merit.

      As for the arts, I do not see any point in awarding artists at all -- iff we are talking specifically about awarding with IP protection, and doing so postfactum. I can argue this point by showing how artists can (indeed are) get paid in the absence of the copyrights.

    18. Re:Patents and innovation by QuickFox · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Any inventor/writer/musician should be free to file a claim with the restitution bureau.

      So in your opinion the power that now rests with consumers and shareholders should instead rest with bureaucrats, assigned by the State to decide the fate of inventors based on "value to society"?

      In Communist East Germany, if you wanted a car, the only choice was the ridiculously inefficient and simple Trabant, because decisionmakers felt that the people did not need better cars. Initiating things like our home computers and the Internet is quite impossible in such systems, because you can't convince a state bureaucrat of the value of such an invention by describing it. To be a good bureaucrat you need to be cautious and exact, not bold and imaginative. If a state bureaucrat takes bold leaps with the taxpayer's money, he's not doing his job right.

      I respect the bureaucrats, they do important work. But it's not their job to be visionaries. Your arrangement sounds quite horrible to me.

      -- Terrorism may have turned the United States into a nation of fear and aggression, but it won't succeed in Europe.

      --
      Terrorists can't threaten a country's freedom and democracy. Only lawmakers and voters can do that.
    19. Re:Patents and innovation by Zordak · · Score: 0
      Why is it failing? Because some companies had to wait a few years (a "limited time") before they could exploit somebody else's hard work? Remember that the word "patent" means "obvious or apparent." Without the patent, this technology would be a Trade Secret that would still be locked in a vault like a decades-old Walt Disney film. Nobody would have access to it. The purpose of patents is to encourage inventors to open up their inventions. What this really sounds like is somebody invented something, showed everybody what they invented, had time to do what he could with it, and now that his time is up, everybody else gets their shot. If anything, this is the poster boy case for keeping patent law.

      All the people posting anti-IP slashbot rants about how this "proves" the failure of patent law need to pool their money and buy a dictionary or something.

      --

      Today's Sesame Street was brought to you by the number e.
    20. Re:Patents and innovation by Sparr0 · · Score: 1

      Sure we would. You would see numerous booming industries, such as heavier than air flying machines!
      Linky

    21. Re:Patents and innovation by sonamchauhan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You are muddled on cause on effect. The US patent office has developed a false liberality which is unjust. The "tear shedder" is absolutely right when he says: "More often than not, patents give the discoverer/holder an unfair advantage that gives them the power to gouge the public and make a killing."

      Take the Eolas plug-in patent. Does your browser support plug-ins? Then for years, you may have used it illegally, according to the USPTO. (Thankfully that one patent is now invalidated)

      Regarding the Slashdot article we are discussing, here's the first Iridian patent from the eighties: Iris patent
      It covers AUTOMATION of an existing manual process - iris recognition - that opthalmologists and common people do day in and day out. (Note how it says _multiple_ pictures may be used of the iris driven to different dilations). Even you have probably done this - remember the Afghan girl on the cover of National Geographic, and her followup picture decades later, taken veiled, showing only her eyes? How can a patent on all possible way to automate this process be granted? See end of the patent statement which says:
      Although the present invention has been described in connection with a plurality of preferred embodiments thereof, many other variations and modifications will now become apparent to those skilled in the art. It is preferred, therefore, that the present invention be limited not by the specific disclosure herein, but only by the appended claims.

      Now see this more recent patent granted to Iridian Handheld iris imaging apparatus and method . It references their first patent, and now covers handheld scanners -- the type security patrolmen might use at a stadium or airport. Ironically, it was issued on 9/11.

      Now see the end of this patent:
      Although illustrated and described herein with reference to certain specific embodiments, it will be understood by those skilled in the art that the invention is not limited to the embodiments specifically disclosed herein. Those skilled in the art also will appreciate that many other variations of the specific embodiments described herein are intended to be within the scope of the invention as defined by the following claims.

      So industry is unfairly restrained a few decades more by this patent -- and this will hold back God knows how many real improvements to security. Happy now?

      > To say Bill Gates doesn't deserve all the money he as gotten bespoils
      > the name of a great entrepreneur.
      He probably deserved much of it, but to say he deserved "all the money" he got is foolish, given the company he led was convicted and forced to compensate others in multiple cases, and Gates was personally fined in the anti-trust lawsuit.

      > I'm sure it's Bush's fault too.
      No. I support Bush. Your opinion gives him a bad name.

    22. Re:Patents and innovation by ThreeE · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Thanks for briefly stating your opinion. Some questions/comments:

      1) Why is it ironic that the patent was issued on 9/11?

      2) Yes, Microsoft and Bill are convicted monopolists. Rather than dispute that (which I could) I will just say that he paid the fine.

      3) I support the US patent office and I give Bush a bad name? Huh?

      4) Automation of a manual process seems like a reasonable patent to me and the US patent office... Their patent also include preferred embodiments and boundaries. You included a pretty big ellipsis...

    23. Re:Patents and innovation by sonamchauhan · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You're welcome and your civitility is appreciate. My answers/added comments are:

      1) Because it is unfair. And because it deals with "handheld scanners -- the type security patrolmen might use at a stadium or airport."

      2) A monopolist (not evil in itself) convicted of unfair trade practises

      3) No, you support the USPTO granting unfair patents, and gave Bush a bad name by dragging his name into the conversation.

      4)
      4.1) Granting a patent on current and future embodiments of automating an existing manual process is ridiculous.

      4.2) Their first patent does not restrict itself and has absurdly limitless boundaries - it says their "invention be limited not by the specific disclosure herein, but only by the appended claims" - claims like claim 10 below, which are so broad as to cover all current and future embodiments:

      This is CLAIM 10:
      "10. The method of claim 1 in which comparing the obtained image with stored image information comprises deriving a set of descriptors of at least the iris portion of the obtained image and comparing the derived descriptors with stored reference descriptors derived from a previous image for identifying the person."
      This is CLAIM 1:
      "1. A method of identification of a person, comprising:
      storing image information of at least a portion of the iris and pupil of the person's eye;
      illuminating an eye, of an unidentified person having an iris and a pupil;
      obtaining at least one image of at least the same portion of the iris and pupil of the eye of the unidentified person; and
      comparing at least the iris portion of the obtained image with the stored image information to identify the unidentified person."


      4.3) I don't know which ellipsis you speak of

    24. Re:Patents and innovation by salesgeek · · Score: 1

      How much would they have made back if this flood of copycats came immediately after they announced their discovery?

      How about how much would they have made if they had reasonable license fees for their technology that allowed a boom of products to come out earlier on?

      I'm not opposed to patents. I'm opposed to how many companies use them: to hoard a technology under the illusion that they "own the market". Patent owners are often much better served when they license aggressively and leverage the patent to capture license fees on an expanding marketplace. A $200 Million patent-capped market will not make as much for the patent holder than getting royalties on $10 billion in sales.

      BTW - when the patent expires, how many times do we see the original mover totally wiped out by competition? Fax machines anyone?

      --
      -- $G
    25. Re:Patents and innovation by ultranova · · Score: 1

      But, really, the best thing if you want to aborgate the "make and hide" scheme of IP law is mandatory licensing -- a patent must be licensed by anyone who wishes it for a percentage of gross revenues not more than, oh, 25%. Do the same thing for copyright--"at a cost not more than the cost of original publication" and you've just matched the "I want to use that" and "I want to be paid for it" sides perfectly.

      Yes, you have. However, you are forgetting one important - perhaps the most important - side of copyright: "I don't want others to fuck around with my work".

      For example, suppose I create a character for online comic. The comic doesn't bring me any revenue, just fame (and ego gratification). Now, if you start publishing commercial crap using my character, both fame and ego boost are likely lost to me, and money cannot buy them back.

      Copyrights and patents may look superficially similar, but they are very different things, and should never be confused to be the same. Patents apply to technology, but copyrights apply to art (in the broad sense). The emotional attachments people have for their creations tend to be quite stronge, whereas technological innovations are typically viewed from the viewpoint of utility.

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

    26. Re:Patents and innovation by Planesdragon · · Score: 1

      However, you are forgetting one important - perhaps the most important - side of copyright: "I don't want others to fuck around with my work".

      Good point. But That's easily remedied by not requiring mandatory licensing for derivitve works--just copies or use of patents.

    27. Re:Patents and innovation by Deliveranc3 · · Score: 1

      If they hadn't patented it, it still would have taken them a while to produce a copy and the media furor over these clone companies would serve as advertising for the original.

      Let's say it takes 2 years to start a company and clone the product to a sellable level, that's a pretty reasonable amount but a HUGE advantage technically, in mind share, and should be more than enough time to inovate on the old design.

  5. patents rock by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turns out, a major patent held by iris recognition leader Iridian is expiring, and that's leading a stampede of start-ups and VCs into this space.

    Ah patents...Look how good they are for society!

  6. Iris Recognition by Jeet81 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I believe iris recognition takes some time to verfiy the identity of the person as the person has to stand close to a certain point and then the scanner would scan the eye. So this will take more time than pulling your card out and swipping it and walking through the doors. Therefore this tech will only be used in high security area and most of them I guess are already using it.

    1. Re:Iris Recognition by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't you know the british government are using it for their new ID cards, for 40 million of us.
      If they get their way, we'll be iris scanned all the time.
      This is bad news, we don't need it to be cheaper, they might really be able to introduce it.

    2. Re:Iris Recognition by Nosnam · · Score: 1

      Iris recognition and card scanning are quite different... Iris recognition proves beyond reasonable doubt, that you are who you claim you are. Card scanning, on the other hand, regardless of how quick and efficient it is, is still vulnerable to card theft. Usually in a high-security area, these cards are coupled with some form of biometric verification too (Fingerprints, signature, etc.) of which, iris scanning is the most secure.

    3. Re:Iris Recognition by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Iris recognition proves beyond reasonable doubt, that you are who you claim you are.

      Iris scanning proves beyond a reasonable doubt that your eye matches information in a row in a database. The information in that row may or may not match you.

    4. Re:Iris Recognition by thrashbluegrass · · Score: 1

      Don't be so sure of that. Where I work, a lot of consulting is done with MiniTruth...I mean, Homeland Security, and requiring iris scans at airports is being seriously discussed.

    5. Re:Iris Recognition by Bishop · · Score: 2, Informative

      Iris scanning is very fast, and can be done from a distance of several meters. It is typically setup such that people can walk up to an iris scanner controled door and be identified without missing a step. Iris scanners are used in some airports to identify and admit crew to the departure area. Aircrew love the scanners.

    6. Re:Iris Recognition by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Iris recognition is actually perty fast. I belive you are thinking of a retina scan. An iris scan is just a picture taken of the eye. This can be done from 2-3 feet away.

      This is being installed in the Orlando, FL airport now. (flyclear.com)

    7. Re:Iris Recognition by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting
      Iris recognition proves beyond reasonable doubt, that you are who you claim you are.
      Iris scanning proves beyond a reasonable doubt that your eye matches information in a row in a database. The information in that row may or may not match you.
      Good point, but you can go even further: iris scanning proves beyond a reasonable doubt that a stream of bits coming from what is hopefully the appropriate sensor matches information in a row in a database.

      Even if the bits did come from the proper sensor, it may be not be seeing what it thinks it is seeing. An interesting property of inverse optics is that it is unsolvable: while there is only one way any given scene can produce an image on a given camera, an infinite number of scenes could have produced any given camera image. Imagine long objects that happen to be viewed end-on, rows of objects that happen to be lined up directly behind one another, objects pigmented to obscure or simulate spurious edges, various disguises, perspective tricks, and the rest of the optical illusionist's bag of tricks. Our own eyes, and the cameras they lead us to design, must make the assumption that the world is (usually) not deliberately trying to fool us. Security devices need to be more careful.

    8. Re:Iris Recognition by jfengel · · Score: 1

      How is that possible? The details required to make an iris scan work are perhaps a millimeter across. Can a camera really take a millimeter-resolution picture of your eyeball from a few feet away, while you're moving?

      Are irises sufficiently stable, or will you spend a lot of your life updating your iris scan?

      I assume it would be tricky to custom-make a contact lens to fake out an iris scanner, but how hard is it? I've seen color-changing contact lenses and they're actually very crude; they wouldn't even begin to fool a scanner and those already require specialized technology. But if somebody were intent on doing it (and making it the primary biometric source of identification would be a major incentive), how hard would it be?

      (Thinking out loud: you could probably paint on a hard contact lens, but the details are very small. But something using an ink-jet printer as a base wouldn't be that hard to build if HP put its mind to it, assuming that the proper pigments could be created to print on that surface. You'd have to keep it oriented, but there are weighted contacts for that.)

    9. Re:Iris Recognition by SassyDave · · Score: 1

      I've used several different iris recognition devices, and the best devices took about 1 second. The worst devices required two snapshots and took about 6 seconds depending on how still the subject could be. Sometimes they failed to capture at all, and the user had to resort to prying his/her eyelids open with their fingers while the machine tried to find the iris.

      No matter what kind of hardware you use, the size of the database can still cause slowdowns, but this is where iris excells when compared to fingerprint. The "iris code" generated by the device can be as small as 512 bytes to get a positive ID. The problem is by nature linear, so it helps to have a badge scanner accompanying the iris scanner as well.

      Frankly, I'm quite excited about this development. For the last several years, iris biometric vendors had to pay big royalties to Iridian to license their algorithms. Now that *some* of their patents are expiring, that burden will be alleviated, and there will actually be a way to differentiate among vendors. For the past few years, no matter what vendor one chose, the software algorithms were all the same.

  7. Iridians iris readers suck by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Trust me I got one of these things, they suck. It only works like half the time, real secure huh! I hope these startups can bring some new ideas to the marketplace. What really angers be is Iridians lack of linux support. Hopefully these new companies will bring that to the arena

  8. Really? by Infinityis · · Score: 5, Funny

    I won't believe it until I see it with my own eyes...

    Of course, I'll need some of this new technology to make sure they really are my own eyes.

    1. Re:Really? by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      That means you'll only get to use it twice.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    2. Re:Really? by rbarreira · · Score: 1

      Nice, but if you allow me to be a pain in the ass, your post would have been even better without the second sentence :)

      --

      The AACS key is NOT 0xF606EEFD628B1CA427BEA93A9CA9773F
    3. Re:Really? by kfg · · Score: 1

      They're not really your own eyes. They're Tyrrell's niece's.

      KFG

  9. Wait A Minute... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 4, Funny

    I thought SGI was going bankrupt. Don't tell me they're come out of bankruptcy with a new version of IRIS. Some companies just never learn how to die properly.

    1. Re:Wait A Minute... by ravenspear · · Score: 1

      Some companies just never learn how to die properly.

      Refusing to die properly can sometimes be a good thing. Just look at Apple.

    2. Re:Wait A Minute... by TheRealMindChild · · Score: 1

      Or BSD!

      --

      "When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
  10. One question by ScrewMaster · · Score: 4, Funny

    Just who is this "Iris" person anyway, and why is she so hard to recognize?

    --
    The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    1. Re:One question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      She's one of the so-called Heinsenberg Pair, sister to Carmen Sandiego.

      When you know where they are, you don't know who they are; and when you know who they are, you have no clue where they might be!

    2. Re:One question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      She's our accountant, and I suffer from Prosopagnosia (face blindness), you insensitive clod.

  11. For those concerned about privacy... by Infinityis · · Score: 5, Funny

    This points to the obvious "next big thing":

    Tinfoil Contact Lenses(TM)

    1. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 1

      I have to say, I didn't see that one coming.

      --
      liqbase :: faster than paper
    2. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have to say, I didn't see that one coming. ...Not with tinfoil in your eyeball, you didn't.

      Seriously, folks, how hard would it be to make a contact lense with a picture of someone else's iris?

    3. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by Mahou · · Score: 1

      i don't know many people who own a designer contact lense making device or a way to scan your iris without you knowing in order to have something to copy onto the lense

      --
      if i'm not immortal, what's the point of living?
      ...te?
    4. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      i don't know many people who own a designer contact lense making device or a way to scan your iris without you knowing in order to have something to copy onto the lense

      Well, if you end up having to scan your iris all over the place (ATMs, bars, grocery stores, government agencies, etc) then it's perfectly possible for someone to scan your eyes under false pretenses.

      "Hello, sir or madam. My company is an up and coming computer manufacturer. In order to generate publicity, we are giving away a new computer each week. Just fill out this form, scan your iris here (to prevent multiple entries), and you are entered in the drawing." ::poof:: They have a scan of your iris.

      Not to mention getting you drugged/drunk, or piggy-backing onto another scanner, like an ATM. (There are scams now where people place a card scanner in front of the existing scanner, and a false keypad on top of the real one in order to ger card numbers and PINs.) If Iris scanning works from 'up to 24 inches away', then there is the posibility of someone usign a half-silvered mirror to 'split' the image of your eye so part goes to the real scanner, and part to their scanner.

      The point is, once everyone starts using iris scans, scammers will come up with ways to get your scan, if they want to. ("My name is Werner Brandes, my voice is my passport, verify me.")

    5. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by pHatidic · · Score: 1
      Iris Scans, like any technology, can be used for both good and evil. I know because I am starting a business using iris scans in a way that will actually increase privacy of users. Perhaps someday you will even see our technology on Slashdot, birthplace of the tinfoil hat.

      Remember, when video cameras were first invented only banks and the like could afford them, leading to them being widely distrusted by privacy advocates. But then they got cheap and now they are used for good as well as amoral purposes. As iris scans get cheaper you will see the same thing happen. They will be used to keep your data private, as well as to aggregate data about you. They will be used to let you create your own identity, in addition to be used by corporations to create an identity for you.

    6. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by grcumb · · Score: 1

      "Iris Scans, like any technology, can be used for both good and evil. I know because I am starting a business using iris scans in a way that will actually increase privacy of users."

      Good, then maybe you can answer a question for me: Will I lose access to work, my bank account and all my private papers when some kid who doesn't listen to his mother's advice puts my eye out with a snowball?

      I know I'm being a little glib, but it's a serious question....

      --
      Crumb's Corollary: Never bring a knife to a bun fight.
    7. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by ErikZ · · Score: 1


      For the fingerprint scanner here at work, they have us do two fingers. One on each hand.

      I'll assume that a good iris scanner will be done on both eyes. I'm not sure how laser eye surgery would effect this though.

      --
      Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
    8. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by pHatidic · · Score: 1

      Only if the company involved was seriously incompetent. If you are using my product (we don't have venture capital yet, so no company name), feel free to run with scissors.

    9. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ahh touche

    10. Re:For those concerned about privacy... by kwoff · · Score: 1

      Diet Coke through nose. Ow.

  12. Business Week has a better article by master_meio · · Score: 1, Informative

    Iris Scans' Leader Looks Secure
    Dominant player Iridian's patent on the technology is expiring. Rivals plan to jump in, but overtaking the pioneer is unlikely anytime soon

    In the mid-1980s, ophthalmologists Leonard Flom and Aran Safir realized that no two patients' irises were alike, and the idea of identifying people by their irises -- the colored part of the eye surrounding the pupil -- was born. In 1987, the pair were issued the so-called Flom patent, which has given the company they founded, Iridian Technologies, dominance in the iris-recognition market.
    Advertisement

    But Iridian's market leadership is about to be challenged. The Flom patent expired in the U.S. in February, and it will expire in Europe and much of Asia in 2006. This means a struggle over the rollout of new iris-recognition products, with smaller startups already beginning to challenge Iridian's lock on a business expected to grow more than sixfold by 2009.

    ACQUISITION TARGET? Competitiors, however, will have a hard time catching up to Iridian, which is flush with cash and likely to become more so. In April, the privately held company closed yet another $5 million round of funding. Now that iris scans are showing such promise, many venture-capital firms view Iridian as an attractive investment or acquisition prospect.

    Take Robert LaPenta, co-founder of defense contractor L-3 Communications Holdings (LLL), who formed a $250 million biometrics fund on June 7. He says the money will be used to cobble together a biometrics powerhouse. LaPenta plans to purchase several outfits in fingerprinting and facial and iris recognition to develop a single, superreliable system integrating several biometric methods.

    And Iridian is on the short list, says LaPenta. "We're looking at market leaders to acquire," LaPenta says. Iridian says only that it might seek more funding in the future.

    CROWDING FIELD. Since its founding in 1990, Mooretown (N.J.)-based Iridian has controlled about 99% of the market, licensing its software and knowhow to a few iris camera makers such as Panasonic (MC ) and LG Electronics. It has successfully sued for patent infringement every company that has tried to slip into the market without its blessing.

    While Iridian still holds some two dozen active patents on everything from ways to digitize an iris scan to camera design, expiration of the Flom patent will finally allow a stream of competitors to enter the iris-recognition market. Within a year, at least five well-established players will be in the market, believes Maxine Most, principal for Boulder (Colo.) biometrics consultancy Acuity Market Intelligence. Other analysts peg the number at a dozen companies.

    This influx should boost the iris-scanning market, which has long lagged behind that of fingerprinting (the leading biometric today) and facial identification. Iris recognition -- widely considered to be the most accurate method of quick biometric identification -- hasn't taken off due to governments and large corporations hesitating to rely on a single vendor, says Prianka Chopra, an analyst with Frost & Sullivan. A year ago, Iridian had to start offering no-cost licenses to developers for use in passport and visa verification so the International Civil Aviation Organization, which sets standards for international travel documents, wouldn't axe the possibility of the technology's future use over concern about having a single supplier.

    AIRPORT SECURITY. Now that the Flom patent is becoming history, the iris-recognition market is projected to skyrocket. It's set to rise from $81 million last year to $518 million by 2009, Chopra estimates. That would make it one of biometrics' fastest-growing areas.

    Iridian is still expected to be a big beneficiary in the next few years. But other iris-scanner startups will get a piece of the action, as various governments and agencies are expected to adopt the technology within a couple of years.

    Several U.S. government and international agencies are close t

    1. Re:Business Week has a better article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Parent is INFORMATIVE - Please mod UP!!!!

  13. Don't forget... by MarkByers · · Score: 4, Insightful

    1. You can change your password but you can't change your iris.

    2. If you are threatened with violence, you can tell the attacker your password, but would you want to give them your eye?

    --
    I'll probably be modded down for this...
    1. Re:Don't forget... by Paperweight · · Score: 0

      3. You can type in your password, but would you want to have to reach the iris scanner by bending over in front of the SysAdmin?

    2. Re:Don't forget... by PWatson · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Well, the same concerns could be raised for any sort of biometric security. Hopefully, technologies will become widespread that make stealing somebody's eyes , fingers, DNA, etc useless. For example, some fingerprint readers can tell if the finger is alive or not.

      Of course, in some situations, the very issue you mentioned is a boon to the system. For example, let's say that the CDC's Smallpox virus is protected by either a iris scanner or a password. If a scientist is faced with giving up a password or an eye, he'll probably be more likely to give up the password. Thus, if everything else is equal, the eye-based security is better.

      --
      Does your application handle + characters in e-mail addresses? (RFC2822)
    3. Re:Don't forget... by myowntrueself · · Score: 1

      but on the other hand, this will be a great opportunity for eye-ball phishing...

      --
      In the free world the media isn't government run; the government is media run.
    4. Re:Don't forget... by timeOday · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Exactly. Why go to all this trouble of reading irises and fingerprints? You could accomplish the same thing by tatooing users' passwords to their foreheads. Biometrics are just like normal passwords, but easier to steal and harder to change.

    5. Re:Don't forget... by gardyloo · · Score: 1

      3. You can type in your password, but would you want to have to reach the iris scanner by bending over in front of the SysAdmin?

      That would be the new BrownEye Scanner (TM) technology.

    6. Re:Don't forget... by brunes69 · · Score: 1

      For example, let's say that the CDC's Smallpox virus is protected by either a iris scanner or a password. If a scientist is faced with giving up a password or an eye, he'll probably be more likely to give up the password. Thus, if everything else is equal, the eye-based security is better.

      You are totally missing the point. If it was a highly secured substance like smallpox, then the thief would more likely just kill you and remove your eye. So now you have a loose smallpox virus *AND* a one-eyed technician.

      If it was something like your credit card number, then you would be better off with the password and just give it to the thief.

    7. Re:Don't forget... by Lehk228 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      problem: a $5000 DSLR with zoom lens could capture an iris from across the street.

      i would prefer that it cost more than $5000 to steal smallpox virus

      --
      Snowden and Manning are heroes.
    8. Re:Don't forget... by PWatson · · Score: 1
      You are totally missing the point. If it was a highly secured substance like smallpox, then the thief would more likely just kill you and remove your eye. So now you have a loose smallpox virus *AND* a one-eyed technician.
      Ahh, but I would hope that the CDC would spring for a iris scanner that's good enough to detect detached or otherwise "bad" eyeballs. Of course, you'd have to make it obvious that a "bad" eyeball wouldn't work; otherwise you'd still have a very unhappy technician on your hands. Additionally, it probably wouldn't do anything to stop the "Splinter Cell method" of just holding a gun to their head and forcing them to give a reading. Still, even with its faults, we can both probably agree that for highly important systems its more secure than a password.
      If it was something like your credit card number, then you would be better off with the password and just give it to the thief.
      Exactly. There's no point in having security that has such a large risk vs reward ratio.
      --
      Does your application handle + characters in e-mail addresses? (RFC2822)
    9. Re:Don't forget... by Paperweight · · Score: 0

      Well, most people aren't naked at work...and I was thinking of the women, of course.

    10. Re:Don't forget... by blindbat · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But someone who wanted your password and would be willing to gouge out an eye or cut off a finger would also be willing to do that or torture for your password. Would you want your finger or eye lost for a biometric scan or lose some other body part(s) as torture in giving up the password?

    11. Re:Don't forget... by nunchux · · Score: 1

      You could accomplish the same thing by tatooing users' passwords to their foreheads. They've been trying to do this for years, but there are only so many variations of "666."

    12. Re:Don't forget... by pHatidic · · Score: 1

      For banking, ecommerce, and airports you are absolutely correct, but there are a lot of situations where an iris scan is the easiest way to protect something that isn't worth the effort to steal.

      Remember: if the cost to steal something is greater than the cost of that which is being stolen, it is safe, and vice versa.

      Just because you can use a technology in dangerous way doesn't mean the technology itself can't also be used for good. Cf scissors and nail clippers in airports.

    13. Re:Don't forget... by pair-a-noyd · · Score: 1

      That was no problem for Simon Phoenix...

    14. Re:Don't forget... by forkazoo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      What I want is a fingerprint scanner, where you have to scan all your fingers, but the order you put your fingers on the pads would be a sort of 'pin code,' which you could change. Make all fingerprint scanners be sold with a protective hood, so nobody can see what order you use. If some criminal ever chops off your hand, just use the other one to phone in (or use voice dial), to change the pin before then can buy a TV.

      You have the security of revocability, but the convenience of never accidentally losing your "card" (except in extreme cases of accident.)

    15. Re:Don't forget... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Well, the same concerns could be raised for any sort of biometric security.

      That's right. Biometric security is, in fact, a dumb idea in general, and is only catching on because PHBs at various levels are wowed by its Mission Impossible-esqe style. Any security token that can't be changed in the event of compromise just plain sucks, as counterfeiting technology will always be able to catch up to scanning technology.

    16. Re:Don't forget... by SlimFastForYou · · Score: 1

      Aaaargh, people keep using the word "steal"!!

      It's infringing on "intellectual property", not stealing! You are not really depriving them of their property - all you need to do is take a sample and grow more. The loss in volume would be neglegable.

    17. Re:Don't forget... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      Exactly, which is why the new biometric company I'm forming, PeniScan, will solve all of these ... oh wait.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    18. Re:Don't forget... by ray-auch · · Score: 1

      For example, some fingerprint readers can tell if the finger is alive or not.


      Yes, but what they need to do, however, is determine that the finger is both alive and still attached to its original owner.

      Hand transplants have already been done.

    19. Re:Don't forget... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      With iris scanning, the iris has to be living at the time of a scan. This makes it pretty hard to steal.

  14. innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So much for patents encouraging innovation. BZZZZT!

  15. exploding iris by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny
    Looks like iris recognition is about to explode
    Please don't mention iris - or anything to do with eyes - in the same sentence as "explode". Some of us are squeamish.
    1. Re:exploding iris by QuickFox · · Score: 1

      Please don't mention iris - or anything to do with eyes - in the same sentence as "explode". Some of us are squeamish.

      Squeamish? But the writeup was extremely careful and considerate! They didn't even mention the feeler that checks if the eyeball is dead or alive by measuring blood pressure in the space between eyeball and cranium.

      -- Terrorism may have turned the United States into a nation of fear and aggression, but it won't succeed in Europe.

      --
      Terrorists can't threaten a country's freedom and democracy. Only lawmakers and voters can do that.
    2. Re:exploding iris by bluestar · · Score: 1

      The goggles! They do nothing!

      --
      "The cost of freedom is eternal vigilance." -Thomas Jefferson
  16. Better security by gcnaddict · · Score: 1

    In other words, now we can have iris recognition on our laptops? Wow, I can just imagine our laptop LCDs scanning our eyes when we look at the bios POST screen or the longhorn logon window... God thats going to be creepy

    --
    Viable Slashdot alternatives: https://pipedot.org/ and http://soylentnews.org/
  17. oblig. Simpsons quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Yarrr, two glass eyes"

  18. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 0, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  19. What stock should we buy, Timothy? by Hao+Wu · · Score: 1
    This "anonymous source" surely has no interest in market manipulation....

    --
    I suggest you read Slashdot
  20. IRS recognition? by ngunton · · Score: 1

    the Internal Revenue Service had developed some new way of finding me?

  21. Iris vs Retina by vossman77 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Are we talking Iris or Retina here?

    Because I've never heard of using the Iris and don't know anything about its uniqueness. Where the retina is easily scanned and heavily researched.

    Anybody know more? or is this a typo?

    1. Re:Iris vs Retina by kaiser423 · · Score: 4, Informative

      The iris is much more unique (I believe it has the highest amount of uniqueness in any biometric system), and I believe they've come up with some very compact and efficient schemes for its use. I remember when I looked back at various biometric technology about 3 years ago, iris scanning was the clear winner barring this patent nonsense.

    2. Re:Iris vs Retina by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      I'm sure they meant to type retina - the keys are right next to each other.

    3. Re:Iris vs Retina by Timodious · · Score: 1

      Indeed, iris recognition has been used in at least one high-profile case; see this National Geographic article.

    4. Re:Iris vs Retina by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unigue, uniquer, uniquest.
      Unique is an absolute quality - either something is unique or it is not. You can't have something that is more unique.

    5. Re:Iris vs Retina by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "more unique"?

      um... Engrish abounds.

      unique
      adj.

      1. Being the only one of its kind.
      2. Without an equal or equivalent; unparalleled.

    6. Re:Iris vs Retina by haut · · Score: 1

      The iris is much easier to "see" with a camera than the retina (have you ever seen a fundus camera?). How many of your friends' irises have you seen? Now how about retinas? The iris is plenty unique, however, to use for ID.

    7. Re:Iris vs Retina by elohim · · Score: 1

      er, scanning the retina is a hell of a lot harder than an iris. when was the last time you saw a person's retina?

  22. Excellent by Smiffa2001 · · Score: 1

    Good to see the Idirians are contributing peacefully to the Galaxy once again...

  23. Patents at work by jhylkema · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Regardless of what you may think of iris recognition, this is proof of how the patent system doesn't work. The technology for this has probably been around for 20 years, but it hasn't been able to be used because some shithead corporation owned a patent. This enabled them to browbeat competitors out of existence, and only now that the patent is nearing expiration can anything "innovative" happen.

  24. Not exactly by SuperKendall · · Score: 2, Funny

    I won't believe it until I see it with my own eyes...

    I'm afraid you won't be able to see it until you see it with at least one of my eyes. Access Denied.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  25. Use it daily and it works well... by master_xemu · · Score: 1

    We use it at the financial company I work at for access control. It is good solid stuff. The only downside is it is not as cool as the movies. Basically it is 2 high resolution black and white camera and a womans voice that says "Look in the mirror" "move back a little" or "move to the left" or "right" and then "access accepted". So no lasers or flashing light. But good solid access control.

  26. Defeated by contact lenses? by shawnmchorse · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Out of curiousity, does anyone know if iris recognition is defeated by contact lenses? I'm guessing that normal corrective lenses might be OK, but I have difficulty imagining iris recognition working through lenses that modify the color of eyes and other such. Will airport security be demanding that people remove their contact lenses prior to the security screening next?

    1. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by pHatidic · · Score: 2, Informative

      No, contact lenses don't defeat it. Cf John Daugman's homepage, the inventor of the iris scan recognition algorithm.

    2. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, contact lenses don't defeat it.

      The page you linked to links to a PDF (scroll down to Countermeasures against spoofing ("liveness detection"). ) that says "Some iris cameras can be spoofed".

      And then it goes on to show a guy holding a really BAD picture of an eye on front of his face. If THAT fool ssome scanners, we're in BIG trouble. Anyway...

      It talks about "Photonic and spectrographic countermeasures",ie: 'Is it a real face or a picture?'. This does not catch contact lenses.

      It talks about the 'red eye' effect to confirm the eye "has functional cavity optics." This does not catch contact lenses.

      It talks about "Behavioural countermeasures". ie: "Look up", "Look left". Again, not catching contacts.

      It talks about "4 Purkinje refections from corneal and lens surfaces". But the sensitivity has to be low enough that real contact lense wearers are verified, so... This does not catch contact lenses.

      Then they talk about a specific camera (like every iris scanner in the world will use this one model camera!) that has some impressive sounding statistics:

      * Correct detection of fake eyes in 98.4% of 700 attempts (LG)
      * False rejection of live eyes as fakes in 0.22% of 4,176 attempts (LG)

      This means that 16 fake eyes out of 1000 gets thru, and 2 people in 1000 are seen as fake.

      Would you drive a car that has those kind of failure rates?? Think about it- would you really drive a car that the brakes didn't work on 1.6% of the time?

      Finally, he gets to the 'Contact lense' problem. And what's the defense agains that? "The dot matrix that creates the printed iris introduces coherences that are abscent in a biological iris. The power spectrum pich up these coherences and reveals them as four points of spurious energy.."

      FOUR POINTS OF ENERGY.

      Never mind that printing technology improves daily. Never mind there are multiple ways of printing (inkjet, dye sublimation, etc). All that stands in the way of a contact lens showing as real are four little points of energy. ::sigh::

    3. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by pHatidic · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Correct, you can defeat it if you specially make contact lenses for the purpose. However your everyday over the counter prescriptions won't nullify your identity and turn you into a ghost agent living off the grid. Compared to other forms of biometrics, faking irises is medium difficulty and medium cost. Not great for banking and airport security, but very good for some other purposes.

    4. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by Achromus · · Score: 1

      Faking a static iris would be medium difficulty and medium cost. Faking a live iris which can dilate and constrict in response to a light in order to prove it is alive, and making the fake iris scannable at any of those different constrictions would be difficult indeed.

    5. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by pHatidic · · Score: 1

      Excellent point, I forgot completely about that aspect.

    6. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by netean · · Score: 1

      don't iris's change with age and illness. One of the big arguments for iris recognition included in proposed UK ID cards is that some illnesses (glaucoma, high/low blood pressure etc) alter the iris, and they alter anyway with age, thereby meaning UK residents will have to update their IRIS pattern every 5 years?

    7. Re:Defeated by contact lenses? by arose · · Score: 1

      "Difficult" is not enough for security.

      --
      Analogies don't equal equalities, they are merely somewhat analogous.
  27. Iris Recognition by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Kiss Me I'm Irish!

    Oh wait, nevermind, misread the headline.

  28. Before bashing patents... by mariox19 · · Score: 1

    Already there are a number of comments sarcastically noting how patents stifle innovation. The problem here was not the patent system but Iridian's short sightedness in developing and marketing the product. If government was one of their main buyers, and if governments were reluctant to rely on one supplier, then Iridian should have licensed their patent to a number of other companies.

    IBM licensed their PC design to a large number of companies, did they not? Because of patents they recouped the money they invested in PC development and allowed for competitors -- promoting innovation.

    Moreover, that Iridian's handling of their patent worked to "stifle" innovation just doesn't hold up in the long run. If iris recognition is an idea that will last, it's only been about twenty years that this patent has enforced a monopoly. Twenty years is hardly holding back society.

    Abuse of the patent system hurts us all; but patents issued properly are a boon to society, providing the hope of reward to the creator. Some creators may squander their patents, that can't be helped. Some people crash their automobiles, killing themselves and others, but the automobile is still regarded as a societal good in the balance.

    To get rid of the patent system is to throw the baby out with the bath water.

    --

    quiquid id est, timeo puellas et oscula dantes.

    1. Re:Before bashing patents... by jizmonkey · · Score: 1
      IBM licensed their PC design to a large number of companies, did they not? Because of patents they recouped the money they invested in PC development and allowed for competitors -- promoting innovation.

      That's news to me. Please give me a citation. As I recall, the PC design was available royalty-free, while IBM's attempt at controlling the architecture (the MicroChannel Architecture): 1) flopped in the marketplace, 2) did not have substantially better performance, 3) cost a hell of a lot of money, and 4) led to the downfall of IBM in the PC market as people shunned its PS/2 line.

      So unless I'm mistaken, your pro-patent argument is precisely wrong.

      To get rid of the patent system is to throw the baby out with the bath water.

      What baby? Aside from solving Arrow's information paradox, which is completely irrelevant to a company the size of IBM, the only time I've seen actual proof of the benefit of patents is in the pharmaceutical industry. Even there the gross price disparity between the US and the rest of the world shows that the system is not optimal.

      The Businessweek story here is a truly amazing example of how patents stifle creativity, even outside the software industry.

      --
      With great power comes great fan noise.
    2. Re:Before bashing patents... by mariox19 · · Score: 1

      IBM PC on Wikipedia.

      My mistake on the example. Thanks for pointing that out. I don't agree with the rest of your argument though.

      --

      quiquid id est, timeo puellas et oscula dantes.

    3. Re:Before bashing patents... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Learn your history mariox19!
      There was nothing new but the BIOS in the original IBM PC. Everything but the BIOS was off the shelf hardware. But get this : nobody licensed it! Compaq took the IBM PC und reverse engineered the BIOS. Just after this there grew a market of IBM compatible PCs.
      Ohh, have a look here : http://www.forbes.com/asap/2002/0624/044.html how IBM "licensed" their valuable IP to others.

  29. Iris no thanks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Criminals already cut fingers to open car doors, no thanks for our eyes.

    1. Re:Iris no thanks by fishbowl · · Score: 1


      "Criminals already cut fingers to open car doors, no thanks for our eyes."

      Cite? Police report detailing a single such incident?

      --
      -fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
    2. Re:Iris no thanks by PWatson · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Here you go: Malaysia car thieves steal finger
      With better scanners that can tell the difference between live and dead fingers, this might have been prevented. Of course, that would depend on the bad guys knowing that it wouldn't work...

      --
      Does your application handle + characters in e-mail addresses? (RFC2822)
  30. Public Enemy said it best... by bergeron76 · · Score: 1

    "Don't believe the Hype!"

    --
    Don't think that a small group of dedicated individuals can't change the world. It's the only thing that ever has.
  31. Flom is my opthamologist by Bob+Cat+-+NYMPHS · · Score: 1

    If you RTFA, or have my doc check your eyes (ooh, I'm way overdue), you'll know it's irises. Flom noticed that the iris is unchanged over years of exams.

    Note, that also puts the kibosh on the pseudoscience of iridology.

  32. RSA by Citizen+of+Earth · · Score: 1

    Sounds a lot like the RSA patent. The patent expired and suddenly ten minutes later, there was encryption everywhere. The useful arts and sciences are suddenly progress.

  33. Actually your iris does change with your health by crovira · · Score: 2, Interesting

    for example, an untreated diabetics' eyes show some filaments that will disappear when he starts geting treatment.

    And diabetes is only one disease which affects the patterns which can be detected in the iris. Many other diseases affect both the radial disposition and the radial pattern. The medical books are filled with disease effects on the eyes.

    While iris scanning for recognition is useless, it IS extremely useful as a diagnostic tool in medecine.

    For personal identification, you would want to scan the blood vessels in the retina. Those are relatively more stable under a wider range of biological conditions.

    But the eyes is a bag of watery tissue. Its subject to varying degrees deformation under a wide variety of physical and bioogical conditions.

    How would you like to be refused admision to your work place when all you did was eat some food containing some mono sodium glutemate for lunch? It that easy to screw your patterns.

    --
    MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
    1. Re:Actually your iris does change with your health by Copid · · Score: 1
      for example, an untreated diabetics' eyes show some filaments that will disappear when he starts geting treatment. And diabetes is only one disease which affects the patterns which can be detected in the iris. Many other diseases affect both the radial disposition and the radial pattern. The medical books are filled with disease effects on the eyes.

      The percentage of people who have diseases that acutally affect the patterns used for iris scanning are quite small. I'm in the business and I have yet to see anybody without at least one very usable eye.

      While iris scanning for recognition is useless, it IS extremely useful as a diagnostic tool in medecine.

      It's hardly useless. It's by far the fastest and most accurate biometric currently in use. Read some of the literature. It puts fingerprinting to shame, and face recognition is a non-starter.

      For personal identification, you would want to scan the blood vessels in the retina. Those are relatively more stable under a wider range of biological conditions.

      Retinal scanning is pretty accurate, but the scanning equipment is nowhere near as convenient to use.

      But the eyes is a bag of watery tissue. Its subject to varying degrees deformation under a wide variety of physical and bioogical conditions.

      The dominant iris algorithm has to make very few corrections for distortion. Viewed straight on, the iris is essentially a 2D annular region. It's a trivial matter to project it onto a coordinate system that normalizes it. Try saying that for fingerprints. Can you say, "plastic deformation?"

      How would you like to be refused admision to your work place when all you did was eat some food containing some mono sodium glutemate for lunch? It that easy to screw your patterns.

      That's just nonsense. MSG has absolutely no effect on iris scanning. In fact, nothing I've eaten during lunch has prevented me from using iris images of myself that I've scanned before lunch. You're just making stuff up at this point. I know that biometrics are "not cool" according to slashdot, but try attacking the actual weaknesses in a system rather than just making some up.

      --
      An interesting anagram of "BANACH TARSKI" is "BANACH TARSKI BANACH TARSKI"
    2. Re:Actually your iris does change with your health by elohim · · Score: 1

      you see retinal changes long, long before any iris changes. diabetic retinopathy is much more common than diabetic iridopathy, or rubeosis iridis.

    3. Re:Actually your iris does change with your health by corngrower · · Score: 1
      How would you like to be refused admision to your work place when all you did was eat some food containing some mono sodium glutemate for lunch?

      Sounds good to me. As long as I still get paid. It wasn't my fault that the security wouldn't let me in to work, so I'm sure the court would side on my behalf concerning any pay disputes.

  34. Correct me if I'm wrong... by xpeeblix · · Score: 2, Funny

    "Looks like iris recognition is about to explode."

    ..but isn't exploding iris recognition hardware a bad idea?

  35. Smart card patents expired, too by Urusai · · Score: 1

    ...but all my cards just have a magnetic strip on the back. I'm also waiting for my flying car and robotic manservant. Or womanservant. Whatever.

  36. Reminds me of a joke... by MacDork · · Score: 4, Funny
    This points to the obvious "next big thing":

    The "next big thing" eh? That reminds me of a joke =)

    An anatomy professor is quizzing his students one session when he calls on Suzy with question, "Suzy, what part of the body has the ability to expand to six times its normal size and under what conditions?" Suzy indignantly replies, "Professor! How dare you ask me such a thing, and in front of the entire class no less! I assure you my parents will be hearing about this incident, and you will no doubt have to answer to someone for it!" The professors tells her she may sit down and then asks Emily the same question. Emily replies "The iris. In the dark." The professor continues, "That is correct Emily, you may be seated. Suzy, your answer tells me three things. 1) You have not studied your lessons, 2) You have a dirty mind, and 3) You will be very disappointed one day."

    ;-)

    1. Re:Reminds me of a joke... by pHatidic · · Score: 1

      FYI that is from the movie Kinsey.

    2. Re:Reminds me of a joke... by Neoncow · · Score: 1

      It's also a really old joke.

    3. Re:Reminds me of a joke... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And it doesn't work anymore since nowadays before schools teach subjects like iris every girl has had sex. :)

    4. Re:Reminds me of a joke... by elohim · · Score: 1

      actually this is the pupil, and it's not really a body "part" per se, at least not any more than the space inside your mouth or any other hollow viscus. the iris, of course, is smaller in the dark.

  37. Rectal Imprinting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why develop a device that can sniff butts? Dogs seem to be pretty adept at this.

  38. It's not the patent's fault by davidwr · · Score: 1

    It's the patent-holder's fault.

    They made an educated but probably incorrect guess that by holding tight they could maximize profits.

    I think in retrospect their executives are thinking "What if we had licensed our technology cheaply and liberally 20 years ago?"

    Fortunately, iris recognition isn't something the world depends on. If this had been an HIV drug, you would've seen governments get involved and threaten to sieze the patent.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  39. Dont look at Bill of Rights with Remaining eyeball by billstewart · · Score: 1

    Sorry. Eyeball recognition is right out. Besides, there are lots of problems with using it in practice that aren't that easy - databases still are never 100% correct, and once the Feds have put somebody with a similar name to yours on the Don't Fly List without a trial, and the airlines have put your eyeball print on the computer with your name and refused to put you on a flight because your name is similar to the guy on the list, your terrorist status is just going to propagate to anything that uses your eyeball print.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  40. Re:Dont look at Bill of Rights with Remaining eyeb by pHatidic · · Score: 1

    Why would your no fly status propagate to anything else? That is like saying that if your no fly status is associated with your name, then anyone you tell your name to will automatically find out that you are on the no fly list. You criticize the government for convicting without trial, but then you turn around and convict the companies running the service without a trial. Granted I'm not a huge fan of iris scans being used in this way, but I think that you hold a double standard which is inherently unfair.

  41. Complete Fallacy by samael · · Score: 2, Informative

    Biometric recognition systems have generally been designed to only work if the part is still attached.

    Retina scans depend on blood vessels in the eye - which change radically if said eye is detached (or the owner is dead).

    Fingerprint scans are usually designed to check for electrical conductivity, which is different for an attached finger and a detached one.

    1. Re:Complete Fallacy by Xugumad · · Score: 1

      And yet, I don't fancy having to try convincing someone holding a knife, of this fact...

  42. cool, but unreliable by tri44id · · Score: 2, Interesting
    It's worth remembering that while any reputable website requires usernames to be unique and passwords to be half a dozen or more characters long, with a chance of guessing of less than 1 in several billion, biometrics are far less reliable.

    One of the more broadly applicable studies, performed for the UK Passport Office (reports downloadable from http://www.passport.gov.uk/publications.asp) with just over 10,000 participants, found that 1 in 10 British Citizens were unable to even successfully enroll their iris patterns into the system. And afterwards, the system couldn't confirm that 5% of the participants were still the same person.

    A facial recognition system was even less reliable, but nevertheless the goverment is going ahead with deployment in every passport.

    --
    Taxation without representation is tyranny! Statehood for DC, Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands & Pacific Territories!
  43. Oh well. by rice_burners_suck · · Score: 1

    Next thing you know, you'll have to stick your eye into all kinds of devices everywhere you go to authenticate your identity. And the next thing that will happen is that thieves, gangsters, thugs, and other malcontents will go around poking persons' eyes out to use them in these iris detection devices. It's going to be disgusting, and there will probably be a lot of people out there missing their eyes.

  44. "Gouging out eyeballs" not effective by IGnatius+T+Foobar · · Score: 1

    I work at a facility where iris scanners are in use as security to the data center. We've had all the usual discussions about gouging out someone's eyeball and using it as a "key" to enter the secure facility. Contrary to myth, this will not work.

    Once the eye has been separated from its owner, the blood and other fluids inside immediately begin to alter their state due to lack of oxygen, damaging the appearance of the iris enough to make it unrecognizable to the scanner within just a few minutes.

    If you're going to use someone else's iris, you're better off holding a gun to their head to let you in.

    --
    Tired of FB/Google censorship? Visit UNCENSORED!
    1. Re:"Gouging out eyeballs" not effective by slazar · · Score: 1

      okay, cut off their head then... that should last at least a little while.

    2. Re:"Gouging out eyeballs" not effective by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      Doesn't matter if gouging out an eyeball (or cutting off a head) works or not ... if the criminal believes that it will he's still going to remove them.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
  45. Funny... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...how technology, good or bad, seems to actually show up in the market place after the patent expires. Strange, that.

  46. Crazy claim... by timsch · · Score: 1

    From TFA "... the iris-recognition market is projected to skyrocket. It's set to rise from $81 million last year to $518 million by 2009, Chopra estimates." An intersting item, but the claim above rather weakens the whole article. I guess he could have said $518.437 million.

  47. Funny by arodland · · Score: 1

    I thought that "Iris" recognition reached its peak with the release of City of Angels.

  48. Argument against patents by pavera · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The whole article basically sums up why patents don't work as intended. And I'm not talking about software patents, all patents. This field could have been huge 10 years ago, generating billions of dollars and furthering innovation. The supposed purpose of patents is to foster innovation and invention, alas, patents just stymie innovation for 20 years until they expire.

    If as I've said before patents lasted 3 years, maybe 5 at the very most, they would probably be a good thing, in 3 years Iridian would have been able to establish itself as a market leader, and every newcomer to the field would most likely license their stuff anyway (under copyright, or some other license generated by the company). Instead it takes 20 years to get an iris scanner on my laptop, or built into a security system at my house? Those things should have been done in 92.

  49. Give it time... by Atario · · Score: 1

    ...and we'll all be living in that annoying-advertising scene from Minority Report.

    "[Scan] [Beep] Hey, Larry Melman! Refinance now!!"
    "[Scan] [Beep] Viagra is now over-the-counter, Mr. Melman!"
    "[Scan] [Beep] Larry, buddy! Long time no see! Did you ever get that diploma? Well, now you can!"

    --
    "A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
  50. why.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why does such a lame joke get moderated up to 5?

    1. Re:why.. by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      Alcohol.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
  51. Two words. by Caspian · · Score: 1

    Minority Report.

    --
    With spending like this, exactly what are "conservatives" conserving?
  52. New Thinkpad feature by martalli · · Score: 1

    I can see thinkpads giving up on the fingerprint check: Instead of the led light for my Thinkpad T23, the Thinkpad T63 will have an iris scanner. I wonder if it will provide a little light on the side...

  53. Mod down karma whore - this is the linked article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Mod down karma whore - this is the linked article.

  54. what if you have no iris? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    I have Urrets-Zavalia syndrome you insensitive clod!

  55. This will happen to M$ by Agarax · · Score: 1

    I see something similar to this happening to M$. I keep seeing wild and crazy patents submitted by them that will take 20 years to develop ... right in time to expire.

    --
    Remember folks, slashdot doesn't have a -1 "disagree" moderation!
  56. Iris Explosion by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Rockets from their sockets!

  57. eye surgery? by krunk4ever · · Score: 1

    if i lost my eye, i know it's a difficult surgery and only a handful of eyes would be compatible with my body, but by changing my eye, wouldn't that give me a new iris?

  58. Re:For those concerned about privacy... bend over by UnapprovedThought · · Score: 1

    Alex (if that's your real name) how much are you going to charge if a company like, say, Gator/Claria/MS, makes an offer you can't refuse for direct access to the iris scan data of each of your vict^H^H^H^Hcustomers? Even if you refuse to sell this, note that they could still get it through the lawsuit, bankruptcy, buyout trick, or even possibly eminent domain in some dark, not-so-distant future, since data can be considered property.

    Eventually, a person's iris scan data will be as ubiquitous and purchaseable as any other id number that you can't retract once you give it out for a transaction, if you ever make the mistake of giving it out. The only difference is it will be a bigger number, and one that anyone can grab off of you on the street.

    "Hey look!"

    You turn your head to look, and to your surprise a stranger takes a picture of your iris at point blank range and then runs off. You think "WTF?" and move along. The next day, all of your money is gone, you are accused of posting libelous stuff, etc.

  59. pirates by pintomp3 · · Score: 1

    with all this biometric security and identity theft, i expect to see a lot of ppl looking like pirates. maybe i should start selling eyepatches and hooks. arrrr!

  60. What's with the misinformation and blatherscythe.. by iNToIT · · Score: 1

    ... goin around about iris scanning/authentication? There's so much to respond to, this could almost be a rant, but lets try to stick to facts..

    First off, ISA (iris scanning authentication) is just a piece of the security puzzle. Like any other authentication tool, alone it is insufficient. Swipe cards without keying in a passcode, WPA without MAC filtering, ..etc

    Usually, there are multiple layers of security, and for the right environment, iris scanning has its benefits.

    Second, someone mentioned it is "slow".. having to stand and position for a camera, whereas a swipe card is faster. This is not true of well designed systems. Like any other, if it is designed properly, it works well, and swiftly.

    I use iris scanning authentication on a daily basis at home. For many years I've been logging into my systems with an inexpensive Panasonic Authenticam. You can see it on my desk between the monitors here: http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/1332/desk2ss.jp g

    Sure, it's bypassable with a high resolution photo of my face, which might break the camera, but as I mentioned, layers of security.

    The real reasons I use it are twofold, A) it saves keystrokes. Blame it on lazyness or carpal tunnel.. but I don't have to type in a username or password each time I sit down at my workstations. and B) Convenience. I can walk into the room, glance at the camera for a moment, and my systems wake up and run their happy little routines. One of which is a voice authentication application that so far hasn't been fooled by any form of recording we've tried.

    Just as a note, the iris scanning is not slow at all when performing authentication, and higher end systems are even faster.

    Now for the issue of positioning yourself to allow the iris image to be captured... for the newest of the high end systems, it's a non-issue. Technology exists to track and capture an image of the iris as a person is walking across a room. With multiple camera angles down a hallway, one or more layers of security may have already performed authentication. (facial recognition and other biometrics in addition to the iris scanning and perhaps magnetic/rf(id?) id cards sitting in a wallet.

    So with these methods, it becomes even less of an effort than swiping a keycard.

    Next, the issue of reliability.. since I did mention that the particular low-end iris scanner I use can be defeated by a carefully photographed high reolution image of my face and iris.

    High end ISA systems perform more than just an imaging of the eyes. They may also match points on the face, detect body temperature, natural movement and reaction of the eye/iris, detect the blood flowing through the veins in the eye, and many other actions to confirm that the iris being examined is not a fake, or photo.

    Now, I know I had some other points to make, but breakfast calls. So I'll leave you with this last one.. before bashing a useful technology with ignorant statements, learn about it. Then at least try bashing it with learned commentary.

    And no, I'm not in the iris scanning business at all. I just like how cool it is to look at my "webcam" for a second and then watch all my hardware come to life.

    --
    -iNToIT
  61. Airport in Canada have this by denisbergeron · · Score: 1

    working from a month ago !

    --
    Ceci n'est pas une Signature !
  62. Swipe cards by Hyperhaplo · · Score: 0

    Really?
    I swipe my card and the 'gate' opens for me (4 waist high gates to walk through at the front of the building. Uses lasers to 'close' the gate. Swiping your card disabled them for 3 seconds. Walk through without swiping and the alarm goes off.)

    The guards see my picture (and anyone going through) on their monitor to compare with my face.

    Total time going through the gate: 4 seconds.

    How long do you stand in front of the camera for?
    Would it work for a building for 5000 employees in it?

    --
    You have a sick, twisted mind. Please subscribe me to your newsletter.
  63. An excellent way to avoid being identified by technoextreme · · Score: 1

    Poke your eyes out.

    --
    Ooo man the floppy drive is broken. No wait. The computer is just upside down.
  64. Only a matter of time.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think it's clear that the busines potential of hijacking biometrics -- which are un-protectable and irreplaceable -- makes their compromise pretty inevitable.

    Proof positive of this is that you can already buy commercial advertising space in people's fingerprints on eBay.

  65. Obligatory Python riff by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Any twit can see those aren't irises, they're lupins.

  66. Re:For those concerned about privacy... bend over by pHatidic · · Score: 1

    We have a fancy trick where there is no way that you can get someone's iris if you know their account, and there is no way you can get their account if you know their iris. In addition to using open source software, I am considering making all the data we store open to the public as well just for kicks. Personally i don't believe in trust, and especially for a system like this the only way it can work is if it is so good that you don't need to trust the people running it to keep it secure.

  67. Argh! Enough with the paranoia, already! by Fantastic+Lad · · Score: 0, Flamebait
    The world was working just fine thirty years ago without all this high security crap.

    All it takes is a couple of wussy secret agencies bombing their own people and crying out a lie, "MOMMMMM! He hit me!" to get a free popsicle and your brother in trouble. --Do that and you get all the ignorant little sheeple lining up to have their eyeballs scanned.

    What a stupid, stupid, stupid scenario.

    Get the Mossad and American/British secret intelligence to blow up a few busses and trains in London, and suddenly a handful of paranoia companies, (like Carlyle Group, funded with Bush investement, and others like it), are making hundreds of millions of dollars selling their death and paranioa equipment.

    Consdier it. . .

    If YOU were a CEO and you knew that you could turn a 10 million dollar company into a 500 million dollar company overnight with a few homemade bombs, wouldn't you be tempted? Especially when the Mossad says they'll do it for you, because they hate the Arabs so damned much that they'll do anything to justify their endless agressions against them, (using U.S. and British cash, no less?)

    --Assuming, of course, you were a raving greed-driven asshole who had learned from such culture-programming television events like, "Survivor", which teaches that psychopathy is not just acceptible behavior to adopt, but desirable.

    Competition at all cost! Survival of the fittest! Jocks torture the Geeks! Old rich men get the young blond girls!

    Bah.


    -FL

  68. a dirty mind? Please! by roman_mir · · Score: 1

    it only tells me one thing - she is a virgin.

  69. But there is good news... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You can go here and find something to help you take back control! Hurry, I can see it's not yet too late for you!

  70. Re:Argh! Enough with the paranoia, already! by chawly · · Score: 1

    I considered it. Much prefer to think about "the cute Iris I knew".

    --
    How many beans make five, anyhow ? ... Charles Walmsley
  71. ...which most will know someday by mkcmkc · · Score: 1
    So probably only a few thousands of people will lose their eyes while this fact is tested and learned (i.e., by the criminal class)? Doesn't sound like a worthwhile tradeoff to me...

    Mike

    --
    "Not an actor, but he plays one on TV."
  72. Clueless. . . by Fantastic+Lad · · Score: 1
    You can go here and find something to help you take back control! Hurry, I can see it's not yet too late for you!

    Cute. All giggles aside, though, you are typical of the average guy in that you joke without offering any objective reason for why you think my comments aren't valid. --Please consider that a question asked.

    Interestingly, nobody who has made the lame tin-foil joke has ever responded with anything even remotely logical or reasonable when I ask them to back up their world view. It's pretty amazing, actually. --I should start saving for later cut & paste sessions some of the weak responses I've gotten. When you start to really examine the pale logic and baseless assumptions used by those who rubber stamp the old Tin Foil Hat joke, it becomes apparent fairly quickly exactly who the clueless ones are.


    -FL

  73. Re:For those concerned about privacy... bend over by UnapprovedThought · · Score: 2, Insightful

    First of all let me congratulate you for trying to put a bit more thought into what you are doing, than, say, any major electronic voting machine company did. But, I still think you will be doing your customers a disservice in the long run, whatever benefits they may derive in the short run.

    Rant: It doesn't do me any good to tell you to abandon what you're doing, because I know that the only thing that will happen is that a less ethically constrained individual will just take your place, whether at your company or at one of the IP-farms, and then it will be implemented even less competently. I realize this idea simply won't be prevented from happening while there is a mindless sheep herd of IP lawyers who all smell taller grass in another field guiding this ouija-board mental process along.

    We have a fancy trick where there is no way that you can get someone's iris if you know their account, and there is no way you can get their account if you know their iris

    1. Online ad/marketing/spyware companies also know a fancy trick called database merging. That is, one company says to you "we only want to buy the accounts and addresses for a mass mailing." Then, a separate company says to you "we only want the names and the iris scan data for our online purchases." You deal with both, happy that no one person has been given the farm. Then, of course they meet up with each other and agree to merge the data and share the results. They may be able to match the data based on some key you are not aware of.
    2. Even if you provide a secure service in the beginning and you are able to run it properly for a while, the next person who (purchases and/or) runs the company may not have your idealistic goals in mind at all, and in trying to squeeze more profit out of it will end up cutting out the clueful part of the tech staff, destroying the identities of the clientele, and basically running things as incompetently and abusively as most major companies do now, except with the added damage that they are figuratively holding some people by the eyeballs. (Reminds me of "A Clockwork Orange." It won't help in the long run because you're not taking the entirety of human nature into account.)

    Even if you have a thousand obscure tricks I still think that people's iris-scan data streams will be intercepted or spoofed and become public information in spite of your best efforts to prevent it.

    Once biometric data is public, a biometric measurement is no longer of value as a guarantor of identity because at that point anyone else could be sending it down the wire.

    Then, rather than learn their lesson, the IP-lawyer-drones will scurry off and repeat the same mistake on another part of the body, probably the inside of the colon at some point...

  74. This isn't the important patent by Paul+Crowley · · Score: 1

    The really important patent is

    "Biometric Personal Identification System Based on Iris Analysis." U.S. Patent No. 5,291,560 issued March 1, 1994 (J. Daugman).

    which describes the first algorithm that really works, and that doesn't expire for nearly six years.

    In a just world this would be the highest-scored reply to the article, but the moderation system rewards being early more than any other measure...

  75. re.: Iris Recognition To Take Off by damicha · · Score: 1

    great, that keeps stoners off campus computers...

  76. Re:For those concerned about privacy... bend over by pHatidic · · Score: 1

    I'm not going to go into details here, but in my particular business all of the things you mention are impossible because of our extremely minimalist design. Rather than aggregating data about you and storing it on a server, we provide a simple but powerful tool to empower users to create their identities. It is all based on 25+ year old tried and true industry standard technology, we are just combining it in new ways to produce different outcomes. What we are doing has been done for many years for businesses, but now we are bringing it to the average consumers for a very modest monthly fee.

    Email me if you are curious.

  77. Re:For those concerned about privacy... bend over by UnapprovedThought · · Score: 1
    all of the things you mention are impossible because of our extremely minimalist design

    Well, yes, it would have to be. The business as well...

    If your end user devices can be proven not to be storing any biometric data at all, and if one could determine from the source code that it isn't sending raw biometrics out, then it stands a better chance. (That brings it up a notch from snowball's chance to sugary-ice-cone chance...)

    I still wouldn't use it or feel better protected by it. Rather, I would think that despite all of your assurances that there would be a keylogger type of device in it.

    But don't see that as a request to post more details. If you thought I was curious about your specific product or service you were way off. It's like examining a pair of handcuffs to see which ones I'd like to wear.

  78. Re:For those concerned about privacy... bend over by pHatidic · · Score: 1

    But don't see that as a request to post more details. If you thought I was curious about your specific product or service you were way off. It's like examining a pair of handcuffs to see which ones I'd like to wear. Amusing. We actually use biometrics as a CAPTCHA to tell that each user as a human and they can have only one account. That way we have no reason to link a user's biomtric data to their account. It is impossible to tell a users biometrics based on their account, and it is impossible to tell a user's account based on their biometrics.