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Preview of Sony vs. Microsoft at E3
kukyfrope writes "After Sony stole the show last year with their dazzling game trailers, will actual hands-on impressions of the PS3 stand up to all the hype, or will Microsoft's second wave of Xbox 360 games (HALO 3 anybody?) show Sony why 360 is not Xbox 1.5." From the article: "While the Xbox 360 is off to a great start, Sony is not stupid. The company knows that the PlayStation brand name is extremely powerful, and that a lot of hardcore and casual gamers are waiting on the PlayStation 3 before deciding on a next generation console. In addition, if you want a cheap Blu-Ray player, the PlayStation 3 will be the only way to go. Stand alone units are looking to run $1500 or more, but it's unlikely the PS3 will release at anything higher than $500."
> Given the choice between a $400 Xbox 360 and a $400 PS3 that doubles as a next
> generation DVD player, consumers will flock to the PlayStation 3 in droves.
Surely most of the people hanging on to see the PS3 have already made up their minds. They want a PS3 and will only get the Xbox if the PS3 really disappoints. Presumably Sony are going to make sure that it won't.
That has been one of the foremost questions on my mind, how do they rationalize charging $500 for a gaming platform/blue-ray player but $1500 for the stand-alone blue-ray player. I mean, if the job of a cheap console is to recoup the money on games, can't it be the job of a cheap DVD player to recoup money on DVD sales?
Wasn't it at E3 last year that Nintendo dropped the bombshell that is their controllers? I wonder if they something upt heir sleeves again to take some of the spotlight away from Sony and M$...
If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
Sony is not stupid
I beg to differ.
Second post!
Ha!
I am interested in what Sony will release about the PS3. I think a lot of PS fans are in for a big surprise. Sony is known for talking big and not delievering, Emotion engine anyone?
While I don't see it happening, it would be funny if they release more than one version, just like the Xbox 360. Are we going to see a crippled PS3 unit in terms of blu-ray, one that can only play games but not movies. To play movies, that will add on extra money.
With Sony's hype train show at E3, just trailers of games that they were toting as what "in game will look like". Is that what this years E3 is going to be like with Sony, just more smoke being blown up our ass? Or is Sony actually going to have something to show for.
I think it is rather interesting with the role reversals this time around. Last gen, Xbox was the late comer, but because of that was more powerful. You had the fanboys talking about powerful it was and how much better the graphics were. Sony fanboys saying more powerful doesn't mean better. Now, the PS3 is the late comer, most likely being the more powerful system. I can just see it now, the Sony fanboys saying the PS3 is more powerful and better graphics, the very same thing they hypocritically defended last generation. Oh, the fun of watching the fanboys, it always gives me a chuckle.
I wouldn't be so quick to say that E3 2006 will be a SONY Vs. MS battle only. More like a royal rumble. New information has come out to show that Zelda: Twilight Princess may be carrying a dual edged sword... litteraly.
I covered this today in the article: A Plan Emerges Nintendo may have the biggest ace up their sleeve of any console launch in history. Zelda may just be a final swan song for the Gamecube and a launch title of sorts for the Revolution... as well as a little of both! Fairly substantiated talk has surfaced showing the release date for Twilight Princess may also be pushed to November '06 and that it may feature the ability to control the action on the GC with the Revolution controller.
We know the Revolution controller can work with the GC from the demo's in New York with Metroid Prime 2 on a GC. Even if not on the GC, the fact that the Revolution can play GC titles means it could grow new abilities by playing it on the Revolution. Either way this is an artful marketing move, and may prove to be the show stealer in May.
http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
Nope. That was the Tokyo Game Show.
New information has come out to show that Zelda: Twilight Princess may be carrying a dual edged sword... litteraly.
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
For a lot of folks, myself included, HDCP will negate the Blu-Ray. If you get downgraded content for not having the correct cables and TV, what's the point? Sure, next time I buy an HDTV it'll have more than component input. But by the time that happens players will be cheap and people will be looking forward to the PS4.
The world is made by those who show up for the job.
"While the Xbox 360 is off to a great start..." This must be a definition of the phrase "great start" that I am not familiar with? Did they mean 'great' by the fact that they have production and delievery issues? 'Great' with buggy systems and boat anchor power supply? or 'great' with the fact that the released games look nearly the same as the old xbox games?
After Sony stole the show last year with their dazzling game trailers
Say what? I was at E3 last year. Sony was getting mocked for those same trailers, while Microsoft did have playable games.
Seriously, even those without a historical perspective on E3 should be able to read this line and say "WTF?". Game trailers can be dazzling, but they *never* steal the show.
"Mod, mod, mod...and another troll bites the dust."
But it's in all of our best interests that neither Sony nor Microsoft "WIN" this console war, at least not conclusively. It's better for us that any "win" be press-only, hotly disputed, and that in a few years we repeat this whole argument with the XBox3 and PS4. For that matter, it's best the Nintendo remain a player, too.
Having "a winner" in the conclusive sense, no matter who it is, is the worst option.
The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
"After Sony stole the show last year with their dazzling game trailers, will actual hands-on impressions of the PS3 stand up to all the hype"
That E3 show set Sony back. The trailors were nothing more than CGI movies of what Sony hoped their games would look like. The hardware no where near resembled what will really be in the PS3.
Also the PS3 will not launch any less than $500 without absolutely massive losses per unit. The 360 at this point will have markdowns to around $250.
The PS3 will win this generation only if they can convince the average family that the PS3 is worth 2x the price. The normal fanboys will buy it no matter what the price, but these sales will be limited.
For a lot of folks, myself included, HDCP will negate the Blu-Ray. If you get downgraded content for not having the correct cables and TV, what's the point? Sure, next time I buy an HDTV it'll have more than component input. But by the time that happens players will be cheap and people will be looking forward to the PS4.
This is a US problem only. HDTV has been out in Japan and Europe since the last century.
But, in a related question, is it likely that the PS3 release will coincide closely enough with the mandatory HDTV requirements in the US that it will be "blamed" for the sudden upsurge of HDTV sales?
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I'd be curious about other blu-ray manufacturers decide to block sony's importing of those PS3's.
After all - if company X charges $1500 for thir blu-ray machine, isn't Sony's $500 blu-ray box just being dumped?
Just a thought - trade law isn't my area of expertise.
I think the honor of 'stealing the show' at last years E3 went resoundingly to Will Wright and the rather stunning presentation of 'Spore'.
"This is a US problem only. HDTV has been out in Japan and Europe since the last century."
That's wrong, from wikipedia
"On January 19, 2005, the European Industry Association for Information Systems (EICTA) announced that HDCP is a required component of the European "HD ready" Label."
How pathetic are you that you follow me from topic to topic and waste all your mod points at once modding me down?
HDTV
not
HDCP
Sorry, but both the PS3 and xBox360 will work with existing HDTV sets in Europe and Japan.
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HALO 3 anybody?
With the news that Halo 2 is going to be the flagship game for vista I would be surprised to see Halo 3 before Vista is released. And the way things are looking, that will be significantly after the PS3 is released.
I can't imagine Microsoft wanting to remind PC gamers just how OLD Halo 2 is...it needs to appear to be 'sexy' and 'new' for the Vista release, not 2+ years old with a sequel already out...
I bought my last HDTV almost 4 years ago, it will be 4 in may. The year after mine, sets started coming out with DVI and also HDCP. Not all that had DVI had HDCP though. Another year after that, we say HDMI really hit a lot of TVs. HDMI has to have HDCP, it is part of the specs.
However, if you have a DVI input with HDCP, you can get a HDMI to DVI converter. You can also go from DVI to a HDMI input. HDMI carries audio, so when you do something like that, audio is lost.
There is yet one more evolution to HDMI, which is HDMI 1.2 that can actually support 1080p. Up until recently, HDMI chips being released couldn't even support 1080p. Most of the 1080p TVs out now, can't even accept 1080p and are not "true" 1080p sets, they just upscale. The ones that can, most of them can only via VGA. We will see more this year hit the market that can actually accept 1080p via HDMI. It should also be known, that most 1080p sets out now don't even have true display drivers, most have to use a method called wobbleton, which is a stop gap technology until we see full fledge true 1080p sets.
Bloody hell, acronym overload. And all I want is a television.
The issue isn't whether or not the PS3 and 360 will display correctly on the HDTVs since both will work just fine. The issue the OP is talking about is that your TV is required to have HDCP (High Definition Content Protection) since few/none of the original HDTVs that were sold in America support. This means that protected BluRay and HDDVD movies will not display the HD version of the movie and will instead fall back to the 480p version. Thankfully it looks like a conversion box that decodes the signal and outputs a non-encrypted signal will be available, but that doesn't mean people should need them.
And before you ask, the Revolution is not included here because it wasn't really a factor last year and we're hearing that even with the console hitting this year, it won't be Nintendo primary focus at E3.
Are you freaking kidding?
You're telling me that the Revolution, Nintendo's stop gap console with a radically new controller, 20 years of backwards compatability, and easier developer programming (or so I've heard), which is coming out sometime this year is not going to be a primary focus?
Can we revoke the gaming journalism liscense for these guys?
The Revolution wasn't a focus last year because Nintendo like to keep things under wraps until the last possible moment. The used E3 last year to show off Twilight Princess and the GBM.
Even Nintendo knows that you have to have a big showing before the release to get people fired up and interested (well, those that aren't already.) Nintendo's main focus will most likely be the Revolution. I'm sure we'll have some DS and GBA goodies, as well as TP, but the Revolution will be pretty much all anyone will be interested in, especially because they will have playable demos on E3.
I'm sure that Sony wil have a big showing, but everyone will want to at least give the Revolution a try, just to see what it will be like.
Here's hoping they have cover a good number of genres with their setups, even if the games are just demos. I think that, right now, getting people in on the idea of using the remote in different ways is really important.
As others have aid, the problem is that HDCP is a DRM format that will be part of all...
Actually forget it. You're right. Keep on insisting you know what the hell is going on while you miss out on the actual conversation.
How pathetic are you that you follow me from topic to topic and waste all your mod points at once modding me down?
The issue isn't whether or not the PS3 and 360 will display correctly on the HDTVs since both will work just fine. The issue the OP is talking about is that your TV is required to have HDCP (High Definition Content Protection) since few/none of the original HDTVs that were sold in America support.
And my point was this is perhaps a problem in the US, but not in Europe or Japan.
Thanks for agreeing with me.
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You're telling me that the Revolution, Nintendo's stop gap console with a radically new controller, 20 years of backwards compatability, and easier developer programming (or so I've heard), which is coming out sometime this year is not going to be a primary focus?
Of course not. The focus will be on the handheld Nintendo games, and plans to make them more wireless group compatible, with more cooperative local team games.
Basically, so that people can play Nintendogs in a virtual dog park while waiting for the bus.
Why push a product that isn't at launch instead of a growing market segment product that is taking off like wildfire?
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IF you want a new TV, you will need to know those terms.
HDMI and DVI are video input types.
HDCP is a copy protection scheme (HD Copy Protection)
1080p is one of the HD resolutions, it is 1920x1080 in progressive scan.
If you are looking for a good 26" - 36" HDTV, go with a Sony, can't go wrong with a Sony tubed CRT. If you want a larger TV, above 36" and don't want to spend much. Go with a Sony A10 rear projection LCD (last three numbers on the model number), the 42" should be around $1,500. If you can spend a little more, Mitsubishi and Toshiba DLPs are worth a look. If you have $4k to blow, you can get probably the best HDTV on the market right now, the Sony SXRD.
If you are looking for thinner models, the Sharp Aquos flat panel LCDs are going to give you a great TV for the money and a reasonable price. Otherwise, if you have cash to blow, the Sony Bravia are the best flat panel LCDs out there right now.
All these TVs will have HDMI and HDCP so you will be set for HD-DVD and Blu-ray, along with all the other HD content out there.
Then you should probably type out what the point you are attempting to make is. You never meantioned HDCP, and you said Xbox360 won't have HDTV problems where currently it can't play either BluRay nor HDDVD so of course it won't. Stating that HDCP is a requirement for the TVs to be called "HD-Ready" in Europe and Japan would help people reading your post understand the point your making.
Thankfully it looks like a conversion box that decodes the signal and outputs a non-encrypted signal will be available, but that doesn't mean people should need them.
There is a slight problem with that, at least with Blu-ray, not sure on HD-DVD as of yet. Blu-ray is suppose to have a dynamic database that can be updated. They can tell it what it can send the signal to what can't. Meaning, they will find these devices and block them.
I understand them wanting to protecto their property, but the HDCP method is just the wrong way about going about it. The devices blocking feature is also taking it one step further in a direction they wouldn't need to go if they hadn't done HDCP.
As of writting, there are a few devices out there that will remove HDCP. However, they are illegal in the US, most of them don't say that they do it to try to protect themselves and the cheapest one I have seen was around $300.
"This is considered plagiarism."
"On January 19, 2005, the European Industry Association for Information Systems (EICTA) announced that HDCP is a required component of the European "HD ready" Label."
A new requirement for a label is not the same thing as "I can plug my PS3 or xBox360 into my HDTV if I live in Europe or Japan and it works".
Works. Not uses a new overlay of protocols.
Again, mountains made from molehills.
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Works. But in 480p, which is the point here. HDCP (also required in Europe, apparently), or lack thereof, will prevent some TVs from displaying HD (720p, 1080i/p, whatever) signal. So it'll work just fine in the US too, but it might not be worth it if the player won't send the higher def signal to your TV (or does the TV block it?), which apparently will happen at least in the US and Europe.
Any word on Japan?
"This is considered plagiarism."
I was really confused as to what TP could be when I read your post. "...DS and GBA goodies, as well as TP"? Highly confuzzling! TP? He can't mean Toilet Paper? Maybe there's some handheld of which I have never heard, the Tiny Player perhaps?! It's even smaller than the GBM??? What is he talking about??!? And then I typed out TP, and I realized: TP! Twilight Princess! geez.. I should turn in my Fanboy card, or not feed my Nintendogs for a day, or purposefully lose a race when playing Mario Kart DS online. IDIOT!
If we'd just gone along with the HDTV signal patterns used by the rest of the world, none of this would have been a problem.
... and it isn't even better, it's worse.
But no, we had to go create our own version
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This is a content protection issue, not a signal pattern issue.
And I take it you're from the States too? Otherwise, you have to define who exactly "we" is.
"This is considered plagiarism."
Nah, I'm just going to go there, say "Does it work with my laptop?" then have it demo'd, and then say "Does it work with the PS3?" and have them show me.
If it doesn't work out of the box, I just won't buy it.
And I'll buy it on sale for about $300.
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$1500 blu-ray / HD-DVD players? Yes, but those are the equivalent of the $1000 DVD players that you can buy now.
Standard consumer level blu-ray / HD-DVD players will be much cheaper, and probably a much better player then the PS3.
from Sony $1000 (or whatever the model I saw was)? It is still a valid question how Sony can sell a game machine and DVD player for $500 and a stand alone player for $1000. The economics don't make sense to me.
Nintendo to demo Revolution in May at E3
Thanks!
Still, it sounds like that's a pre-release, so we shouldn't expect more than canned script game previews, no working models with working games. That sounds like Fall 06.
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Also the PS3 will not launch any less than $500 without absolutely massive losses per unit. The 360 at this point will have markdowns to around $250.
Perhaps, but with still no killer games out, that won't make me buy the xBox360. I'll wait till Fall 06 to decide which one looks good, and wait till post-Thanksgiving 06 to look for good reviews of actual games on each system.
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But has anyone even SEEN a Blu-ray movie on the shelves at a single store?
What's that? No??
A standalone player even? Not yet.
This is NOT the same situation that the PS2 was in when it was released in 2000. DVD's were out and had their first hot holiday in 1999...plenty of time for the PS2's DVD-playing capabilities to be relevant. Blu-ray is still, for all purposes, vaporware at the mass-consumer level. It is not going to be the reason people buy a PS3.
If you keep reading and wield a greater attention span than a retarded monkey, you will see the quote "the site remarks that SCE has been telling its partners to expect the PS3 to arrive at below the 40,000 yen mark when it debuts in Japan in spring of 2006". This is down from an earlier estimate of less than 50,000 yen. This is still hinting in that it's not an exact price... but it's an upper bound.
Sony is not entirely stupid. Recall the infamous story where they blew past the Saturn with the $299 US PlayStation release. The Saturn was losing money at $399, and everyone expected the PSX to be $499. Just like they did the PS2. Just like they do the PS3.
Things may change; we won't know until it's released. But the above official statements are the closest thing we have to fact at this point. Everything else is baseless speculation.
Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage
Well of course, when you show the whole power of the machine focussed on a single head & shoulders, it looks pretty nice. The individual faces in the Killzone demo may not have looked that good, but there was so much more going on (multiple fullbody characters, detailed outdoor environment, explosions etc), it's not really comparable. Regardless, neither of them were finished games running on final hardware, so it's still way too early to make claims about quality.
If the games look like what Sony claimed (see Project Offset...), what else matters?
Um, Project Offset is an in-development PC game that may at some time be ported to consoles. Neither Sony nor anyone else (other than you) are claiming it's relevant. What else matters? Price matters.
it's already been confirmed long ago that the PS3 will launch at the same price-point the PS2 and PS1 did
That link is hardly "confirmation" of a US$299 launch price - "hint" is the word used, of a claim that a different site had heard (somewhere) that "SCE had been telling its partners to expect" a certain price level. 12-18 months before launch. Kutaragi himself is on record as saying PS3 could be more expensive than the average console.
All we know is that, from the included hardware, the PS3 will be more expensive to build than any other console (probably ever). We can speculate that Sony might be concerned enough about Xbox 360 to try and undercut it on price, despite Microsoft's deeper pockets and despite Sony's reported extra costs in building a Live-quality online service as well - but that doesn't sound very realistic to me. I expect Sony to try and match the 360's price myself, but if they're as confident as Kutaragi (and you) sound, they may well price it higher.
Oh, and for the record? It's not just the games that matters. The 3DO's games were largely irrelevant because it launched at $700.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Actually, in recent interviews, Reggie has stated that they're putting together the demos, and are working out ways to ensure that the controllers don't get stolen.
Dang. There go my plans to Rule The World with my Nintendo Revolution controllers used to order my virtual armies of Jedi Wookies!
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