Hong Kong Using Children to Hunt for Piracy

westcoaster004 writes to tell us that according to The New York Times the Hong Kong government will be using some 200,000 youths to scour the internet for piracy. Members of the Boy Scouts, Girl Guides, and nine other youth organizations will be drawn from with the first 1,600 being "sworn in" this Wednesday. From the article: "Tam Yiu-keung, the Hong Kong Excise and Customs Department's senior superintendent of customs for intellectual property investigations, said the program should not raise any concerns about privacy or the role of children in law enforcement. The youths will be visiting Internet discussion sites that are open to all, so the government program is no different than asking young people to tell the police if they see a crime while walking down the street, he said."

Comments

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[Lord Grey]

From the article summary:

The youths will be visiting Internet discussion sites that are open to all, so the government program is no different than asking young people to tell the police if they see a crime while walking down the street ....

From the article:

Starting this summer the Hong Kong government plans to have 200,000 youths search Internet discussion sites for illegal copies of copyrighted songs and movies, and report them to the authorities.

Asking someone to report a crime they've happened to see is very different from asking them to actively search for a crime and report it. I would be pretty concerned if the government asked my son to explore dark alleys at 3am, just to figure out if drug deals are going on in that part of town. Asking children to do something like that is a form of indoctrination, making the implication that "ratting" to the government is grand thing to do. If the government needs help like this, they should offer up a bounty on the illegal material let some idle adults collect the prize.

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[PitaBred]

Adults shouldn't have the amount of collective free time that children do. This is a way to capitalize (in a communist way) on an untapped pool of labor that the human rights people won't get upset about.

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[Anonymous Coward]

I would be pretty concerned if the government asked my son to explore dark alleys at 3am, just to figure out if drug deals are going on in that part of town.

Hardly the same thing. I think it has a double purpose in educating kids in the illegal nature of piracy. If people actively reported piracy and the government would take action the problem would be a fraction of what it is today.

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[Reality Master 101]

I would be pretty concerned if the government asked my son to explore dark alleys at 3am, just to figure out if drug deals are going on in that part of town.

I think there's a wee bit of safety difference between exploring dark alleys at 3am and surfing the net.

Asking children to do something like that is a form of indoctrination, making the implication that "ratting" to the government is grand thing to do.

So you're saying that you'll teach your children to ignore any crimes they see and just bury their head in the sand? If they see a little old lady being beaten, they should just stay out of it and not "rat" to the government on the criminal? I'm sure your children will turn out to be fine citizens.

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[cgenman]

Darn it... Now my evil plan actually will be foiled by a 5-year-old.

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[post-tech-guy]

Either communist or facist, either way it is a recipe for disaster. Remember the Hitler Youth, they were instructed to do similar actions with rating out people who didn't agree with the Third Reich

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[neurovish]

Indoctrinating children and teaching them to "rat" on their fellow citizens to the government!? Why would Chna want to do such a thing!? Next thing you know they'll be controlling what people see and making up their own news to gloss over/contradict any real news that makes them look bad!

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[SP33doh]

hardly the same thing? what if one of the kids stumbles upon hard-core pornography while searching for pirated things?

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[voice_of_all_reason]

You're confusing "illegal" with "wrong."

Substitute in a bunch of things for piracy in the above statement based on laws of different countries, like "homosexuality" or "democracy."

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[Sage Gaspar]

So you're saying that you'll teach your children to ignore any crimes they see and just bury their head in the sand? If they see a little old lady being beaten, they should just stay out of it and not "rat" to the government on the criminal? I'm sure your children will turn out to be fine citizens.

So you're saying you'll teach your children to report every crime they see? Old lady jaywalker is SOOOOO busted.

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[S.P.B.Wylie]

There is a difference between reporting a crime when you see it and hunting for it. You are making kids agents of the government to protect us. We are supposed to protect children, not the other way around. The big problem is that when you have children looking for crimes, they land in the environment of that crime, and from what I have heard about the sites that have piracy, that is not a safe place for children. So, in that manner, it is a lot like sending children down alleys to look for drug exchanges.

Will you have children looking for online molesters soon? They are the most qualified to do so, even if it does put them in a dangerous situation.
Think about it.

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[grim4593]

Many warez sites have porn advertisements, so good point.

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[mlarios]

Wow, only two comments before mentioning Hitler. Is that a record or something?

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[Catbeller]

It was pertinent to the topic, unlike your comment. It's not our fault the resurgence of fascism is becoming obvious.

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[MidnightBrewer]

Luckily, there is absolutely no comparison between someone asking your son to surf on the internet from the safety of his home and asking him to risk physical harm at the small hours of the morning. I think it'd be a better idea to stick with an "accidental is not the same as on purpose" analogy, which is more appropriate to your argument. For example, I'd be concerned if the government indoctrinated my son to go looking for trouble in a dark alleyway at 3am, rather than encouraging him to get home at a reasonable hour.

That being said, yeah, the excuse given by the Chinese government is pretty transparent.

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[mlarios]

Regardless of whether or not this marks a "resurgence of fascism", I was merely commenting on the poster's flawed reasoning. The mere fact that the Nazi's supported a particular idea does not make it inherently bad. This fallacy is so common it has a name, Reductio ad Hitlerum.

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[Ruff_ilb]

And, of course, don't forget the Spies from Orwell's 1984. The Party in the book encouraged children to spy on their parents, even while they were sleeping.

Of course, China isn't trying to destroy the relationship between parents and their children, but they're certaintly being systematically used for espionage.

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[Columcille]

This isn't even remotely fascist activity. There's quite a difference between Hitler using children to weed out dissent and Hong Kong using children to find criminals engaged in a crime recognized as a crime all around the world.

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[Columcille]

Reporting illegal activity is one aspect of being a good citizen. Being willing to support law enforcement is another aspect. And this is hardly like walking down a dark alley at 3am. Risks to the child are nil.

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[Foobar of Borg]

Well, I like coffee. Wait a minute, Hitler liked coffee! Oh no, I'm a Nazi and I didn't even realize it! Aaaahhh!!!

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[Anonymous Coward]

Just like everybody in, say, the United States is instructed to rat out murderers and rapists if they're confided to. Example: Anonymous counseling organizations and suicide hotlines are required by law to turn over people planning murder. What's the difference? Oh yeah, that piracy isn't wrong, just illegal, just like opposing Hitler.

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[from_downunder]

I agree there is a resurgence of fascism, and I feel that this is a Bad Thing(tm)

However, I think you'll find that many will either pretend that certain views are not fascist, or even claim them to be a Right Thing(tm)

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[Buran]

criminals engaged in a crime recognized as a crime all around the world.

Are you sure about that, given that this is Slashdot?

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[sumdumass]

It isn't as much that your a nazi, it is that you might be prone to doing bad things now.

The whole hilter did it and it was bad thing comes form hitler doing many bad things. It is an attempt to associate behavior with those bad things. People tend to dismiss someone who warns of a scenario hitler has done but then wonder what happened when we are facing the same if not simular things.

Hitler (and i think stallin before him) had the children spying on the adults. But after a child turned an adault in, these childs say so was enough evidence to convict them of a crime. Imagine little johny down the street turning you in because you hit his dog three years ago or told his mom were he was hiding the time he ran away from home. Now imagine a group of snot nosed punks asking you to visit some website to drive up advertising revenue and you don't. Then you get a summons for having pirated materials availible ot the public.

--spellcheckers are for people who care

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[Wolfier]

How do you discriminate against some crimes but not others?

And by the way, old lady jaywalker SHOULD be busted, for good reasons (although law enforcement will not likely lay a charge).  What would you choose, a warning from a police officer, or getting run into by a car?

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[Wolfier]

Hong Kong != China.

If you perform a search and know your facts, Hong Kong is running a system that is WAY more democratic than China, and many so-called "democratic" countries.  In fact, it has more freedom now than when it was under British rule.

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[Wolfier]

You're making me laugh - are you telling me you cannot tell the moral difference between

1. "Rating out people who didn't agree with the 3rd Reich", and
2. "Reporting piracy"?

I'd liken it as "please report if you see people selling counterfeit goods".

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[Wolfier]

I'd mod you up if I had the points.

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[paedobear]

Most of those "freedoms" were set up by Chris Patton, at the end of British rule, chiefly to piss off the communists. It's not like the mainlanders WANTED "one country, two systems", it was something they had to take up to avoid killing off the goose that laid the golden eggs.

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[Zemran]

Asking children to do something like that is a form of indoctrination,

Asking children to this is cheap labour, any other country would be ashamed to admit drafting so much child labour but China seems proud of the idea. These children should be encouraged to focus on their school work rather than scouring the internet for music and probably looking at lots porn while they are at it because that is what funds the warez sites.

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[post-tech-guy]

Yes I can. I was merely pointing out that the methodolgies used by the Hong Kong government have precidence in using children to futher their own agendas, whether the infractions of those being 'ratted out' are doing the right thing or not. The use of children, in a way which makes them mere pawns should not be a path that they should walk down

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[Sage Gaspar]

How do you discriminate against some crimes but not others?

The same way I discriminate between anything else, common sense and my personal system of ethics. I obey laws when they're not too unreasonable. I agree with most of the regularly enforced laws in the U.S., hence me and a lot of other people in the same boat live here under a government that will enforce these laws and prevent other people from committing acts like rape, murder, theft, et al. Plus give us a fair shake if we're accused of any of that nasty stuff.

We also have a police force to investigate these crimes. If we were to start telling little Johnny to keep on the lookout for nasty copyright infringers, we've just given him the go ahead for a witch hunt and breached another hole in the healthy distrust he should have for his government.

Hell, the legal system already assigns different penalties to different crimes, ranking them by their severity. It's not really an astonishing idea.

As for old lady jaywalker, there's some old ladies that shouldn't be crossing some streets. The laws exist so the police officers can stop them. The appropriate action for a strapping young lad that sees an elderly lady having trouble crossing the street, however, is to assist her, not to call the feds on her.

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[Anonymous Coward]

So you are advocating a nanny state?

(note: I'm aware that jaywalking endangers others. However, you used her own personal safety as a reason for busting rather than that)

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[ultranova]

Either communist or facist, either way it is a recipe for disaster. Remember the Hitler Youth, they were instructed to do similar actions with rating out people who didn't agree with the Third Reich

Yeah, and let's not forget the East Germany snitch network.

It's funny how copyright enforcement seems to create more and more such parallels, isn't it ? Kinda makes me wonder if we don't regard the Copyright Lobby in 50 years the same way we regard Nazi Party now.

Yeah, copyright Nazi. Nazi copyright. Copyright mass murder Hitler Stalin terrorism evil RIAA MPAA DMCA DRM. Eat it up, googlebot :).

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[ultranova]

I think there's a wee bit of safety difference between exploring dark alleys at 3am and surfing the net.

Physical safety, yes. However, there's a very real chance of getting used to being a spy, and that have the potential to lead to doing very nasty things indeed. Besides, once you'll get known as a snitch, who would want anything to do with you ?

So you're saying that you'll teach your children to ignore any crimes they see and just bury their head in the sand? If they see a little old lady being beaten, they should just stay out of it and not "rat" to the government on the criminal? I'm sure your children will turn out to be fine citizens.

Copyright infringement is illegal. Beating up little old ladies (or anyone else for that matter) is wrong. Don't confuse the two. Wrongs should be righted, if it's possible to do so without more harm, while merely illegal things should usually be ignored, since it's far too easy to realize one day that you've committed a wrong - busted someone for doing something that shouldn't be a crime, like, say, criticizing the state (this is China we're talking about, remember ?) - if you start hunting for "criminals".

So I'll teach my children to call the cops if it's neccessary, if, for example, someone is getting beaten up or some place has people carrying stuff out through a broken window; but not when they witness something that is illegal but not wrong, such as copyright infringement.

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[Anonymous Coward]

"rat to the government"?
I hope they do.
Im sick or web pirate scumbags and hope they get wahts coming to them. You wouldnt be so shocked if you ran a company affected by piracy. But as long as its someone else who loses money who cares right?

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[ajs318]

Hold the hell on here. You're missing an important point.

The events that the Hitler Youth were reporting upon were crimes, by Hitler's definition.

Nowadays we wouldn't tend to regard them as such; but, according to NSDAP standards, crimes they were. What every "law-abiding citizen" should remember is this: you are just one government-imposed ban away from becoming a criminal.

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[ajs318]

Software companies lose about as much to "pirates" as the bra industry loses to Charlie Dimmock.

If it wasn't so easy to pirate software, do you really imagine everybody would suddenly start buying the stuff, or even turn over to using non-pirateable software {Free and Open Source}? Almost nobody would have computers; we'd all go back to using pencils and paper, the way we used to do for years without problems. Even the Free Software movement benefits, however indirectly, from piracy: the presence of pirated software has led to cheaper hardware, which has allowed ordinary people to get onto the scene. Free Software would exist around universities, and other isolated pockets where people can afford to live up to their highest ideals. Rich electronics hobbyists would build their own computers, write their own operating systems, and have their kids chuck the lot in a skip when they died. Ordinary office workers would be making do with log tables and mechanical typewriters -- and dealing out packs of playing cards when they wanted to play patience.

Even go beyond computer software; look at music and movies. Before there was a recording industry, the only way for a musician to make money was to go out and perform live. The invention of the phonograph created a situation where anyone in a position to invest in the equipment necessary to begin making recordings, could make a lot of money {often at the expense of the performers}. Remember, all this was post-IR1; so anyone with half a brain cell should have been able to foresee that sooner or later, recording equipment would be within the price range of ordinary people and the record companies would lose their supremacy. The only surprise is that it took this long, but the recording industry managed to divert attention around the mid-C20 by creating a format war and so effectively restarting the game. Had the 45rpm record format flopped I think we would have seen, if not home recorders for 78rpm discs by the 1960s, then an independent record label in every city.

The movie industry is already on the way down, they just can't see it yet. Hollywood films are getting more and more irrelevant as independent films are taking on a life of their own. It's not enough to spend millions of dollars on overpaid, plastic-surgeried-to-fuck actresses and special effects: no amount of money can make up for a plot so dire that the holes are the only thing that keep it together. The CGI thing is losing momentum, too; I confidently predict that either DreamWorks or Pixar will have a box-office flop within the next five years. The studios are haemorrhaging money slowly enough not to notice. Meanwhile, faster turnaround times in news publishing are allowing more people to find out about alternative movies. The kind of films that five years ago wouldn't have made it outside of a university arts centre cinema are now turning up in the big multiplexes.

If it wasn't possible to pirate music and films, people would listen to less recorded music and watch fewer films. Some of them might even pick up an instrument, or put on a costume, and climb on a stage and perform. I'll tell you something for free. Out of all those people who pirate albums, way fewer would have bought them at the prices you're charging, than the number of people who buy them because they heard a pirate copy at a friend's house. Do the maths: sell 1000 real albums, have 10000 bootlegs made, sell another 50 real ones to people who heard a bootleg and liked it enough to buy it. Or sell 1003 real albums, have 9997 would-have-been bootleggers not giving a fuck, and have 50 would-have-been buyers never hear it.

If you don't like the fact that what you make gets pirated, then just stop fucking making it.

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[level_headed_midwest]

This is *China.* They have been indoctrinating people and telling them ratting to The Party on their neighbors is grand since 1949. This is nothing new.

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[plague3106]

Asking someone to report a crime they've happened to see is very different from asking them to actively search for a crime and report it. I would be pretty concerned if the government asked my son to explore dark alleys at 3am, just to figure out if drug deals are going on in that part of town.

Um, sorry but that's a pretty crappy analogy. There's a huge difference between being in a dark alley at 3AM and visiting a warez type site. Quit trying to pull people's emotions into this, and more importantly, stop with the crappy irrelevent analogies.

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[plague3106]

For this to work though, China will need to indoctrinate the children to a certain political / social mindset. After all, would kids do it if they didn't really feel they were fighting something bad?

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[plague3106]

Thank you for explaining that so nicely. It is the children as pawns part of the equation which is distrubing.

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[v1]

Where have I seen this before? Oh yes, now I remember.

It was called "The Hitler Youth"

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[1u3hr]

to find criminals engaged in a crime recognized as a crime all around the world.

Wow; talk about circular reasoning.

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[1u3hr]

If you perform a search and know your facts, Hong Kong is running a system that is WAY more democratic than China, and many so-called "democratic" countries. In fact, it has more freedom now than when it was under British rule.

I live in Hong Kong, and no, we are not freer than under British rule. Since 1997 democracy has been wound back, the Legislative Council is much less representative due to the restricted voting of functional constituencies whihc elect half the members. Free speech has declined, self-censorship of the media is observed daily. We're still miles ahead of the mainland, but many freedoms (except the freedom to make money) are quite limited.

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[1u3hr]

Luckily, there is absolutely no comparison between someone asking your son to surf on the internet from the safety of his home and asking him to risk physical harm at the small hours of the morning.

Not physical harm (though one never knows, an unwary person can be tracked down by his IP, let alone other clues, and Hong Kong is a small place). But it's intersting to consider how this could develop. What if some over-zealous kids decided to encourage others to upload movies/MP3s etc and then ratted them out? Seems like entrapment. Or what about kids who are accused who claim that THEY were investigating the site and were going to report it but had to upload to gain credibility?

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[1u3hr]

This is *China.* They have been indoctrinating people and telling them ratting to The Party on their neighbors is grand since 1949. This is nothing new

This is *Hong Kong* which has been capitalist since 1841, and the Communist Party is still forbidden (by Beijing) from operating there overtly. This is evidently new to you.

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[Anonymous Coward]

So I'll teach my children to call the cops if it's neccessary, if, for example, someone is getting beaten up or some place has people carrying stuff out through a broken window; but not when they witness something that is illegal but not wrong, such as copyright infringement.

I think you're oversimplifying. For example, I'm a student, and I buy all my textbooks, but I know a lot of people who just copy them. Textbooks are an essential part of education, and if everyone copied them instead of buying them, they would cease to be published, which would be harmful to all students, as well as to those who devote their time to writing textbooks, hence it is arguably wrong. Even now, I know I pay a higher price because of the copying (but I still wouldn't report anyone for copying, even if I knew of anyone to report them to).

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[Apoklypse]

and let's not forget Bush's Youth ...

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[Braino420]

So you're saying that you'll teach your children to ignore any crimes they see and just bury their head in the sand? If they see a little old lady being beaten, they should just stay out of it and not "rat" to the government on the criminal? I'm sure your children will turn out to be fine citizens.

Just as there is a difference between exploring a dark alley at 3am and surfing the net, there is a difference between an old lady being beaten and 'copyright piracy'.

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[tomlouie]

> Example: Anonymous counseling organizations and suicide hotlines are required by law to turn over people planning murder

Can you cite some sources to back up such a sweeping statement? In some states, volunteer staffers at anonymous suicide hotlines are not required by law to report to the people callers who are contemplating suicide.

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[level_headed_midwest]

Hong Kong had only been capitalist since 1841 because Britain owned them up until 1999. And there is a HUGE difference between "overtly" and "at all." And anyway, who's going to tell Beijing to play by its rules? Nobody in China will, that's for sure!

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[1u3hr]

Hong Kong had only been capitalist since 1841 because Britain owned them up until 1999.

1997. And in your first post you seemed to imagine HK was communist in 1949.

And there is a HUGE difference between "overtly" and "at all."

If you look at the composition of the current HK government, all are civil servants who were trained, and served, under the British colonial government. Everyone however has an eye on how things will play in Beijing, but Beijing's control is thus far subtle.

And anyway, who's going to tell Beijing to play by its rules? Nobody in China will, that's for sure!

China is a member of the UN, the WTO, and is holding the Olympics in 2008. They can't just tear up international treaties, several of which make conditions on the status of Hong Kong and civil rights here. A few weeks ago on July 1 we had the annual Democracy March in support of full democracy and an elected Chief Executive, and on June 4th there was the annual commemoration of the Tiananmen Massacre. Neither of these events could be held in any mainland China city, and both highly irritate Communist Party faithful, who however cannot prevent them.

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[Columcille]

Hence my reference to this kind of activity being recognized as a crime around the world. This isn't a limited group enforcing the standards of a limited group, it's activity against something that is worldwide recognized as unlawful.

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[Columcille]

I miss the circular part. You do realize that circular reasoning is defending point A with point B and defending point B with point A? That statement says that A. Hong Kong is finding criminals B. the criminals are engaged in a crime that C. is recognized as a crime around the world. I haven't actually offered firm defense of any of those points so it can hardly be called circular. But point A is demonstrated from our article and we wouldn't be having this conversation if point A didn't exist. Points B and C are pretty well known and demonstrate another reason we are having this discussion - some people don't like the fact that these activities are illegal. Nonetheless they are illegal activities (which means if you commit the activity you are engaged in crime). Please let me know how all this somehow magically becomes a circular argument.

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[grumpyman]

>The big problem is that when you have children looking for crimes, they land in the >environment of that crime, and from what I have heard about the sites that have piracy, that is not a >safe place for children. So, in that manner, it is a lot like sending children down alleys to look >for drug exchanges. "from what I have heard about the sites"? What site and from who? What stuff did you just smoke dude? People who post BT seeds or whatever download links on the web in HK is not much different than the people/youths here in North America - they just share the stuff they have and not making a buck out of that stuff. I'm not agreeing to this 'project' thingie at all but comparing this to "sending children down alleys to look for drug exchanges" or "find pedophile" is just ridiculous. Moderators: 5 Insightful gotta have some credibility in it. You know what, from what I heard from a friend of a friend who worked in CIA, Cowboyneal is one of the top fugitive in the US.

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[1u3hr]

I miss the circular part.

Granted, not quite a circle. But rather redundant and getting very close to the "it's wrong because it's illegal; it's illegal because it's wrong" argument one often hears about things like drugs.

some people don't like the fact that these activities are illegal.

Some people don't agree that this illegality you assert is a "fact", certainly not "all around the world", let alone think it's wrong.

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[Columcille]

Whether or not you think it wrong doesn't change its legality. There are plenty of good reasons for such activity to be illegal, but I haven't made any claims to any of those reasons in any of my posts, so your statement is somewhat silly. When you hear me say that something is illegal because it is wrong and wrong because it is illegal then you can accuse me of circular reasoning. Until then you're just grandstanding with empty words.

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[1u3hr]

Whether or not you think it wrong doesn't change its legality

| I DIDN'T SAY THAT. I said it's not illegal EVERYWHERE as you stated.

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[S.P.B.Wylie]

That is somewhat faulty logic. More people believing something doesn't make it right. At one time almost everyone agreed that the earth was at the center of the universe, and it was considered blasphamy to say otherwise. An idea must be back be logic and facts, not support, to be right.

Its not that hard

[GmAz]

Why do they think its so difficult. Go to google.com and search for Warez.

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[timeOday]

I don't think the main point is to find the Warez, but rather to "educate" the children by enlisting them in the battle.

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[Cutterex]

Heh. Using google to search for something in China, that's a good one.

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[cdrudge]

"Here you go kids, this is how you can find/download the latest app/song/video."

It's kind of like education kids about drugs by showing them where to buy all the ingredients to make meth...

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[TheOtherChimeraTwin]

Or they could just click here

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[pla]

Why do they think its so difficult. Go to google.com and search for Warez.

Why did this get modded "funny"? I'd almost call it obvious, but not really all that funny, just a fact. "Insightful", if anything.

Seriously, finding pirated material takes so little effort even a child could do it - As Hong Kong apparently intends to demonstrate. Just search Google for "[warez/appz/gamez/serialz/keygen]" AND "[name of product]" and then filter through the literally thousands of hits until you find something promising (usually the first hit that doesn't try to send you to popup-hell or auto-download a suspiciously small executable).

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[mingot]

Hrm. How about if they just told kids what the byproducts of meth production looked like and asked them to keep their eyes open whilst biking around the neighboorhood and to call the police if the happened to see them? Would something like that be considered facist and/or some slippery slope that gets kids down the path of turning in anyone for anything the state deems illegal?

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[RMB2]

Why not just use Google to search for illegal software... I think I remember reading about this somewhere.... oh, no wait, somebody already developed that

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[mad_minstrel]

Oh sure, the children will be educated - I imagine that with a bit of time they will become quite a bit more knowledgeable about how to be a pirate and not be detected.

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[fafalone]

It's kind of like education kids about drugs by showing them where to buy all the ingredients to make meth...

That would be Walmart. No joke, they've got it all.

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[Zontar_Thing_From_Ve]

I don't think the main point is to find the Warez, but rather to "educate" the children by enlisting them in the battle.

I think this is quite right. Interestingly enough, I'm sure the local law enforcement is turning a blind eye to the illegal Versace and Gucci knockoffs in the local night market. I have forgotten the name of the street since it's been 9 years since I was in Hong Kong, but there's a famous night market on some street that is notorious for selling counterfeit goods. I bought what I'm sure was an unlicensed Bart Simpson tie there. I assume that pirate VCDs and DVDs are there as well, but I was last there before either of those formats really took off. I know that copying movies is a really big deal over there and the local film industry blames all of its woes on that, just like the MPAA does in America. The real problem with the Hong Kong film industry is that they have too many films and the quality has gone down a bit recently. It's not unheard of for big name actors over there to appear in 5 or more films a year. If you have enough time as an actor to do 5 or more films a year, I can guarantee you that all of those films are not going to be great ones.

Re:Its not that hard

[1u3hr]

I think this is quite right. Interestingly enough, I'm sure the local law enforcement is turning a blind eye to the illegal Versace and Gucci knockoffs in the local night market.

No, they don't. They're still around but get busted regularly. I believe you can also buy fake Rolexes in New York.

Re:Its not that hard

[1u3hr]

Woops, pressed submit too early. Continuing:

The real problem with the Hong Kong film industry is that they have too many films and the quality has gone down a bit recently. It's not unheard of for big name actors over there to appear in 5 or more films a year. If you have enough time as an actor to do 5 or more films a year

No, that was 10 years ago. The bottom fell out of the movie market (partly because of what you say, an overheated market, financed often by Triads). Now far fewer movies are produced.

they had better be prepared

[Anonymous Coward]

to see porn and all its flavors, casiono/poker scams, spyware, popups, circle jerks, top20 gateways and all the other scum that floats on the bottom of the warez scene

Re:they had better be prepared

[celardore]

I used to get "popups" all the time when I used to search for warez and see porn.

Re:they had better be prepared

[ackthpt]

to see porn and all its flavors, casiono/poker scams, spyware, popups, circle jerks, top20 gateways and all the other scum that floats on the bottom of the warez scene

All they'd need to do is post a few messages here and there on blogs or newsgroups with their email addresses and the filth will come to them. Just find the stuff hosted in China and Bob will be their great uncle!

Re:they had better be prepared

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry, but you can't float at the bottom. It's self-contradicting. Do they float at the top of the warez scene, or do they sink to the bottom. It can't be both.

Re:they had better be prepared

[InsaneLampshade]

Do i dare ask what "circle jerks" are?

Re:they had better be prepared

[kevlarman]

trust me. you don't wanna know

Re:they had better be prepared

[Fluffy_Kitten]

don't you mean on top?

Re:they had better be prepared

[filterchild]

When Merriam just doesn't cut it: Urban Dictionary.

Re:they had better be prepared

[kabocox]

to see porn and all its flavors, casiono/poker scams, spyware, popups, circle jerks, top20 gateways and all the other scum that floats on the bottom of the warez scene

I thought that was the funniest part of this article. How long could this program last when most of the kids go home and tell mom and dad what they've been seeing on the internet today? Gosh, with the way that we overreact, I'd see people demanding jail sentences for those that purposly exposed childern to various adult only material.

Bad idea

[frosty_tsm]

The first problem with this that comes to mind is that there are a lot of piracy websites that have images unappropriate for kids.

Yes, yes, I know that any kid can go online and find whatever they want to look at. I'm getting at that maybe this isn't a task for children (in the government-run sense).

Re:Bad idea

[pilgrim23]

In a first coup for the Hong Kong police, the kids found 1000 copies of pirated Microsoft Offce and dutifully reported the discovery. The culprits in question turn out to be....the Hong Kong Police...

Re:Bad idea

[TEMMiNK]

Not really something to add, but I thought the type 'Microsoft Offce' was funny in this context, you know, or not...

Save the pirates!

[StikyPad]

In my day, we used Pirates to hunt for children.

Yarrr!

Re:Save the pirates!

[Anonymous Coward]

I think that was likely the fastest +5 in slashdot history.
10 posts into the discussion and you've been modded up the wazoo.
My ninja mask is off to you, good sir.

Re:Save the pirates!

[P3NIS_CLEAVER]

You didn't happen to live in Soviet Russia, did you?

Re:Save the pirates!

[_Sprocket_]

Arrr matey! That be a thought crime, fer sure!

like 1940's vice squads

[smellsofbikes]

Sending oodles of kids out looking for music-sharing sites is kind of like sending angry, unattractive, middle-aged cops to "stop" prostitution. I imagine these kids sticking USB thumbdrives in their cop computers and bookmarking wildly for the evening's Internet Cafe feeding frenzy.

Re:like 1940's vice squads

[Anonymous Coward]

prostitutes are not picky to the looks of their paying customers...

Might make more sense for sluts who are doing it for free...

Re:like 1940's vice squads

[smellsofbikes]

Traditionally, cops didn't pay. Or, they DID pay, by not arresting the person, which was the value-added-service for which they expected considerations.

Oboy!

[ackthpt]

Anti-Piracy Merit Badges!

To earn one you must:

• Identify a pirated song
• Identify a pirated video or film
• Turn in a friend or family member
• Be able to recite from memory the RIAA & MPAA oaths of Allegiance to Lucre

Breaking news: Chairman Moa is doing 3,500 RPM in his grave.

Re:Oboy!

[RobertLTux]

Breaking news: Chairman Moa is doing 3,500 RPM in his grave.

and in other news Chairman Mao is doing 75,00RPM in his urn.

Re:Oboy!

[bruno.fatia]

Be able to recite from memory the RIAA & MPAA oaths of Allegiance to Lucre

maybe IF they buy a license/pay royaties to the composer.

Re:Oboy!

[ackthpt]

Be able to recite from memory the RIAA & MPAA oaths of Allegiance to Lucre

maybe IF they buy a license/pay royaties to the composer.

Well, duh! They have to buy the sheet music, don't they?

Re:Oboy!

[Anonymous Coward]

At least they will earn there porn badge in the process !

Rob.

Re:Oboy!

[ultranova]

Breaking news: Chairman Moa is doing 3,500 RPM in his grave.

and in other news Chairman Mao is doing 75,00RPM in his urn.

Just attach wires and magnets and you have the energy crisis solved ;). Urns make nice portable generators, too...

And here I thought that various administrations were just incompetent, stupid and treacherous, but now I realize that they're just doing their part in developing alternative energy sources for the world after peak oil !

Re:Oboy!

[Anonymous Coward]

Breaking news: Chairman Moa is doing 3,500 RPM in his grave

Huh?? Why is an extinct New Zealand bird a chairman? Why does this bird care about piracy and boy scouts? And why 3,500 RPM, when everyone knows the accepted units for extinct, offended animal species is unit-arcs-per-second?

Or does this Chairman Moa refer to some specific, unholy mixture of Bird and Communist, like Maozilla refers to a specific, unholy mixture of Communist and giant, radioactive Reptile?

Please clarify, since the two ideas outlined here are two totally different things.

The Junior Woodchucks are coming!

[Animats]

Fear the Junior Woodchucks.

I have to do it....

[onehalf]

Not to be outdone, Soviet Russia is now using Pirates to hunt Children.

I can see it now...

[RyoShin]

Hong Kong: Aha! You people are pirating software and video games!
Pirates: Aha! You are using child labor!
Joe Everyday: Oh no, who should I hate more?
RIAA/MPAA: The pirates, they're the worst kind of criminal!
American Government: Think of the children!
Joe Everyday: [glares] Not helping!

And then Canada just kind of laughs and goes back to whatever its doing.

Re:I can see it now...

[westcoaster004]

It's simply the economics of the issue. Child labour is far cheaper than pigeon labour in China.

Re:I can see it now...

[TheVelvetFlamebait]

RIAA/MPAA (quietly in American Government's ear): You were ment to say "Think of the economy!" Say it, or you won't work in politics again!

Really.

[ackthpt]

Why do they think its so difficult. Go to google.com and search for Warez.

Anyone who spends ten minutes actually looking should be able to find enough to choke a hard drive. Go look in USENET groups, Google for it, get into chatrooms and ask 'Where can I get a copy of X' or even just look on eBay. Piracy and Knock-offs are rampant on there, despite their lame attempts to curtail it.

Re:Really.

[Anonymous Coward]

Anyone who spends ten minutes actually looking should be able to find enough to choke a hard drive. Go look in USENET groups, Google for it, get into chatrooms and ask 'Where can I get a copy of X' or even just look on eBay. Piracy and Knock-offs are rampant on there, despite their lame attempts to curtail it.

Shhhh!

Wow, what a bad idea

[grasshoppa]

First of all; Warez sites have porn. Not just a boob here and there either. Real live penetration. Often times, you have the weirdest fetish shit to deal with too.

So let's dump that on 200k kids. Lovely.

Second, kids are idiots. Truly, they are. I remember when I was a kid, I was an idiot. So now we are turning out 200k kids in to an enviroment ripe for molestation. And porn, lest we forget.

This is a bad bad idea, no mater how you slice it.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Anonymous Coward]

"Often times, you have the weirdest fetish shit to deal with too." You'd be suprised how literally right you are.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Anonymous Coward]

>First of all; Warez sites have porn. Not just a boob here and there either. Real live penetration. Often times, you have the weirdest fetish shit to deal with too.

You know, sex is not as big a deal in other countries as in the puritanical US.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Anonymous Coward]

And you know this because???

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[grasshoppa]

You know, sex is not as big a deal in other countries as in the puritanical US.

Be that as it may, I'm still for blocking children from seeing donkey shows. And worse.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[houghi]

Indeed, instead of watching porn, it would be better let them watch people kill each other on daily television.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Columcille]

If you would RTFA you'd notice that the idea isn't to have children out there surfing for warez sites, they will keep their eyes open while visiting discussion boards.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Gibsnag]

Yes, but there quite a large difference between bared breasts & 'regular' sex and hardcore/fetish/beastiality/etc... porn.

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't they have moderators in China? At pretty much every messageboard I've been to, when someone openly talks about piracy/links to pirate sites/etc. they get banned and/or their post gets deleted. Unless the point of the messageboard was to discuss piracy links, which naturally would fall under the category of "children out there surfing for warez sites."

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[Columcille]

The links are getting deleted? It sounds like the Hong Kong boy scouts are doing their job. :)

Re:Wow, what a bad idea

[evilviper]

Indeed, instead of watching porn, it would be better let them watch people kill each other on daily television.

The violence on television is as fake and unbelivable as the sex on television.

If TV actually showed brain matter flying about, intestines hanging from the bodies of corpses, etc., you might have a point... Not much of one, mind you, but still.

As is, you're saying that hearing a car backfire, and seeing someone lying on the ground covered in ketchup, is worse than hard-core porn.

Nothing can go wrong!

[Gurp]

Ok, so we're going to:

1) Force children, who no doubt understand teh intarwebs better than those in charge of this, to swear that they will search out piracy
2) Encourage said children and young adults to spend time searching for movies and warez
3) Wait for the reports to roll in.

Whoever thought this up is brilliant. This plan has no flaws. Why didn't my government think of this?

Re:Nothing can go wrong!

[east coast]

Why didn't my government think of this?

You own a government?

Re:Nothing can go wrong!

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, I am a rich republican. We hold semi-annual stockholder's meetings. You are not invited.

Re:Nothing can go wrong!

[rts008]

You forgot:

4) ?????
5) Profit!

P.S. I see where you're going with this and agree with you, but could not resist.

It's the vodka talking in me, honest.

Re:Nothing can go wrong!

[jZnat]

I don't know about him, but I own a government and three internets, so nyah.

Re:Nothing can go wrong!

[Anonymous Coward]

"1) Force children, who no doubt understand teh intarwebs better than those in charge of this, to swear that they will search out piracy
2) Encourage said children and young adults to spend time searching for movies and warez
3) Wait for the reports to roll in."

4) Profit!

FUD, sensations and the rest...

[Anonymous Coward]

You can tell it's the "summerhole".

all your pr0n......

[Roskolnikov]

I wonder if they're going to report on pr0n-sites.......

The lesson....

[aiken_d]

So 1% of the kids will be all into it and be good citizens... and 99% of the kids will laugh at and mock that 1%.

Great way to make piracy seem even more cool, and to make reporting piracy something that only losers do.

-b

Re:The lesson....

[some1somewhere]

And I can tell you, this is the reality of how these kids are viewing it.

Only the "uncool" and "morons" are actually signing up. In fact, even those that do sign up, are just all reporting the same websites to gain "credits", they are not actively doing anything.

All the while, they are doing the searching on their pirated WinXP computers...

this reminds me of...

[56ker]

The massive attempts (and manpower) China require to keep their Great Firewall of China up to date. Who knows if these "Youth Ambassadors" won't just have their task expanded to include reporting on objectionable material? After all currently Hong Kong isn't covered by the GFC.

Boy/Girl scouts report.....

[Roskolnikov]

a surge in enrollments, it would seem that the warez-hunters have found a sanctioned way to collect britney speers albums.

Re:Boy/Girl scouts report.....

[nolsen]

Well of course. They'll have to download and review the stuff, just to be sure.

Re:Boy/Girl scouts report.....

[epp_b]

a surge in enrollments, it would seem that the warez-hunters have found a sanctioned way to collect britney speers albums.

So Hong Kong hasn't outlawed torture yet?

child labor laws?

[MoFoQ]

Isn't this against international child labor laws?
What next, use real kids to push child p0rn rings?

slippery slope!

Re:child labor laws?

[Anonymous Coward]

For those unclear on where this leads, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Kampuchea.

Re:child labor laws?

[Lehk228]

i was thinking along the lines of Hitler Youth

Re:child labor laws?

[Columcille]

Quite a few people have thrown out child labor comments but I'm struggling to see how this remotely applies. Children are not being employed or forced to work daily hours, this is a program within youth organizations that I assume are somewhat similar to Boy Scouts/Girl Scouts in the U.S. The groups here frequently take part in civic projects, including local law enforcement projects. This is not child labor, this is giving youth another way to take part in activities that demonstrate good citizenship.

Re:child labor laws?

[MoFoQ]

because...they are forced by propaganda into an untruth/grey-area

relevent Red Dwarf Quote

[rucs_hack]

'Betray your family and frinds, fabulous prizes to be won.'

It's horrific that a few years ago that was a joke, now it's true. My god...

Re:relevent Red Dwarf Quote

[Anonymous Coward]

It has always been true. That's what makes it so funny.

Sounds familiar.

[Jason9x19]

"With those children, he thought, that wretched woman must lead a life of terror. Another year, two years, and they would be watching her night and day for symptoms of unorthodoxy. Nearly all children nowadays were horrible. What was worst of all was that by means of such organizations as the Spies they were systematically turned into ungovernable little savages, and yet this produced in them no tendency whatever to rebel against the discipline of the Party. On the contrary, they adored the Party and everything connected with it. The songs, the processions, the banners, the hiking, the drilling with dummy rifles, the yelling of slogans, the worship of Big Brother -- it was all a sort of glorious game to them. All their ferocity was turned outwards, against the enemies of the State, against foreigners, traitors, saboteurs, thought-criminals. It was almost normal for people over thirty to be frightened of their own children. And with good reason, for hardly a week passed in which The Times did not carry a paragraph describing how some eavesdropping little sneak -- 'child hero' was the phrase generally used -- had overheard some compromising remark and denounced its parents to the Thought Police."

Re:Sounds familiar.

[HolyCrapSCOsux]

And you will now go to jail!. You reproduced part of a copyrighted work without giving credit to the authors! You will BUUUUUUURN!

Re:Sounds familiar.

[whitehatlurker]

'Who denounced you?' said Winston.

'It was my little daughter,' said Jason9x19 with a sort of doleful pride. 'She listened at the keyhole. Heard what I was saying, and nipped off to the patrols the very next day. Pretty smart for a nipper of seven, eh? I don't bear her any grudge for it. In fact I'm proud of her. It shows I brought her up in the right spirit, anyway.'

G Orwell

Re:Sounds familiar.

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh the humanity, the second generation inheritors of Orwell's estate! For the love of god, please think of the second generation inheritors of Orwell's estate!!!

Re:Sounds familiar.

[DNS-and-BIND]

Uh, hate to be the one to break this to you - but George Orwell was what we would today call a neocon wingnut. Seriously.

Re:Sounds familiar.

[ajs318]

No, the reproduction was entirely legal under the "fair dealing" provision of the Copyrights, Designs and Patents Act 1988. Meanwhile, by laying a false accusation, you are laying yourself open to a charge of wasting police time. The Met are famous for not liking having their time wasted.

Re:Sounds familiar.

[Ihlosi]

but George Orwell was what we would today call a neocon wingnut.

Yeah, and that was exactly why he joined a Marxist party and fought on the side of the Republicans (left-wing guys in this context) in the Spanish Civil War.

Re:Sounds familiar.

[Guuge]

No, not at all. Perhaps you're unfamiliar with what a neocon is understood to be. Or pehaps you've never read Animal Farm and Nineteen Eighty-Four, which criticize many political elements present in modern neoconservatism.

Re:Sounds familiar.

[Braino420]

This situation is very much like 1984... There, I said it. Oh please let some karma pour over into my cup!

Re:Sounds familiar.

[DNS-and-BIND]

Animal Farm and 1984 were reactions to Stalinism. George Orwell became a rightwing nutbag after becoming disillusioned by Communism.

That's nothing

[SuperKendall]

Here in America, we have millions of youths scouring the internet for piracy!

However, we do outsource the collecton results in Sweden so I guess we can't take all the credit.

Self invoked Godwin's....

[rts008]

"Asking children to do something like that is a form of indoctrination, making the implication that "ratting" to the government is grand thing to do."

Not a new idea (Hitler Youth, anyone?), but it seems our capacity for learning from history seems tied only to short-term memory.

I think the "...asked my son to explore dark alleys at 3am, just to figure out if drug deals are going on ..." was a little overdone, but I do agree with you in principle.

Face it, it is hard for the would be dictators/over-control types to acheive their agenda unless.....they "THINK OF THE CHILDREN", to use an old /. meme.

Re:Self invoked Godwin's....

[orthogonal]

A bunch of little Pavlik Morozovs:

Pavlik Morozov, supposedly killed by "kulak" relatives for denouncing his father to Stalin's secret police (OGPU-NKVD), was adopted as a patron saint by the "Young Pioneers," the Soviet equivalent to the "Boy Scouts." His life exemplified the duty of all good Soviet citizens to become informers, even at the expense of family ties.

Re:Self invoked Godwin's....

[Anonymous Coward]

Whenever I hear someone use the phrase "THINK OF THE CHILDREN" I tend to think, this sounds more like "USE THE CHILDREN" to get what I want.

I also tend to get this picture in my mind of Roman Centurians strapping their babies to their shields before entering the battle, believing that the enemy would never strike at a child and would just give up instead.

Leave it to a politician to bring a child to an adult fight.

This is going to be just daaaaandy....

[Anonymous Coward]

That's about 200,000 youths going to get innundated with spyware and porno pop-ups. This must be "Operation Sheep-Across-the-Minefield".

Scouts?

[ozbird]

"Dob, dob, dob" indeed.

this merit badge has a problem

[circletimessquare]

the merit batch comes with an E.U.L.A. that makes it measure as a 3' circle

hard to stich that on your average girl scout/ boy scout uniform

additionally, due to D.M.C.A. rules, each boyscout/ girlscout must get preapproval from 5 separate companies and 6 layers of lawyers before they are able to legally wear the merit badge

and finally, anyone viewing the merit badge on the person of a boyscout/ girlscout must gain preapproval from the same companies/ lawyers or they are in violation of fair use of the merit badge

i mean come on folks, content creators have rights here! think of the starving merit badge stichers!

Re:this merit badge has a problem

[The-Bus]

You forgot that the "badge" is stitched through your back into your kidneys and spine, so removing it kills you.

Hmmm....

[Cherita Chen]

If they catch all of the pirates, Hong Kong could very well land themselves in some very hot water with the U.N. as this in no doubt aids in the proliferation of global warming

Not as bad as we think perhaps

[hurfy]

After all the 700 pilot kids found 800 postings.....

I wonder what the other 693 kids in pilot program where doing during this time? Or maybe it slows them up when they decide to d/l them all,hehe. It is either that or the pilot program only lasted 20 minutes before they implemented it full-scale ;P

Program is available for export...i dare you to try that here...hehe they would probably download 1600 for every 800 found ;p

ok, back to how sleezey this is.....

Boy Scouts?

[k4_pacific]

Redmond WA (Hydraulic Press) - The Business Software Alliance announced today a settlement agreement in their long running trademark dispute with the Boy Scouts of America. According to the terms of the agreement, the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) must use its swelling ranks to help the Business Software Alliance (BSA) sniff out piracy on the internet. Another controversial term of the settlement is the mandate that requirements for the Computing merit badge must be completed using only legitimately purchased Microsoft branded software.

The dispute started in 1998, when the Business Software Alliance noticed that the Boy Scouts of America, a quasi-military organization headquartered in Irving, Texas, had the same three letter initials as them. They promptly sued for damages and infringement. While many legal scholars believed that the Scouts would prevail as they have existed for nearly a century, the Business Software Alliance won the case by throwing wave after wave of lawyers at them until the Scouts relented.

"I cannot continue to sit back and allow the Boy Scouts to continue to sap and impurify all of our precious intellectual property," said a Business Software Alliance representative, "God willing, we will prevail, through the purity and essence of our trademarks and copyrights."

Bob Talbee, a scoutmaster in Grand Rapids, Michigan, stated that he would cancel the weekend campout to comply with the order, "Sorry kids, we've got to spend the weekend on the internet looking for something or someone called warez," he announced at a recent Scout meeting. Talbee, a bricklayer by trade, was not sure what a warez is, but thought it sounded thoroughly unwholesome and worthwhile for the scouts to work towards eliminating.

Re:Boy Scouts?

[shodai]

"I cannot continue to sit back and allow the Boy Scouts to continue to sap and impurify all of our precious intellectual property," said a Business Software Alliance representative, "God willing, we will prevail, through the purity and essence of our trademarks and copyrights."

Anyone else think that sounds a bit too much like a religious zealot?

It's just a business, not a cult... I think.

Kid's firewall

[Marcos Eliziario]

Actually child slave labor is, by definition, so cheap, that I believe that soon the chinese government will replace the siscoo (a famous chinese networking brand) firewalls with specially trained kids that will analyse each packet. Of course this is going to make online gaming somewhat painful.

The lack of Peter Pan jokes is disheartening.

[BigBuckHunter]

Cmon Slashdot! On with the Peter Pan jokes!

Mod parent down

[Anonymous Coward]

Asshole. So they attack your free shit, fucking thief. You equate that with genocide? Man, things have gone way too far around here.

Re:Mod parent down

[Anonymous Coward]

You equate a fanatical youth group in Nazi Germany with genocide? That's your problem.

Merits

[subl33t]

"Mommy! Mommy! I got my Narc badge!"

The Asian equivalent of the RIAA has just recruited gold farmers.

Re:Merits

[Wes Janson]

Substitute "busts" for "gold" and "rich American kids" with "oppressive government" as the customer, and you've got it.

Children fighting pirates?

[zerblat]

So, basically, what we have here is children fighting pirates on an island? Where have I heard that before?

Re:Children fighting pirates?

[Anonymous Coward]

isnt hongkong a peninsula?

Re:Children fighting pirates?

[OldManAndTheC]

RIAA/MPAA: Do you believe in intellectual property? If you do, clap your hands! C'mon, people ... if you don't clap, the idea of perpetual ownership of an abstract intangibility will die!

Reminds me of

[Anonymous Coward]

Living in a post-communistic country, i remember from my schoolyears how we were 'trained' to look for and report saboteurs, spies and evil western agents. Given the state paranoia, the agents were portrayed as almost mythical creatures, with ninja-like capabilities, evil to the bone. The result was that everyone i know wanted to be western agent, so cool, merciless, almost invulnerable, able to get anywhere ...

So .. way to go China! :)

Don't forget

[Anonymous Coward]

So we're sending all these kids out to look for warez.

What, exactly, are we teaching them by doing this?

Are we teaching them warez is bad and the police need to be told about it? (The intended effect.)

Or are we just teaching them how to find warez? (The unintended effect.)

I mean seriously, do we not think that at least some of these children will, during their government-sponsored hunt through the internet underworld, at some point stop and have it occur to them, "oh wow! if I just come back to this website later today after I go home, I can download any game I want!".

Re:Can anyone say ...

[Rebelgecko]

Yes.

Victorian England

[owlnation]

Instead of sending children up chimneys they're sending them down the internet pipes. Such cruelty.

Re:Victorian England

[qyiet]

Instead of sending children up chimneys they're sending them down the internet pipes. Such cruelty

No no, not pipes, tubes. You have to understand the internet is made of tubes.

-Qyiet

can't see chinese upsetting muslims as much as

[Anonymous Coward]

americans. period. someone set up US the bomb.

-m10

ah, history

[Aeron65432]

And, start the Hitler Youth analogies now.

Re:Can anyone say ...

[Anonymous Coward]

Considering that Hong Kong is now under Chinese rule, I'd think Mao Zedong (Mao Tse-tung) and his "Red Guard" via the Cultural Revolution would be more apropos.

search != stumble upon

[jdbartlett]

Considering the adult (as well as illegal) content openly displayed on such sites, this isn't an unreasonable metaphor.

since this is Hong Kong

[Simonetta]

Since this is Hong Kong, one must wonder if they are looking for pirated materials in order to wipe out their competition, or are they looking for something new to pirate that hasn't as yet received wide exposure.

    The idea that the children of Hong Kong are being sent on a crusade to supplement the RIAA is absurd, and should not be taken on face value.

    Perhaps the Hong Kong politicians who have received gifts from the pirates along with honorariums (to cover expenses, of course) from the RIAA need to show everyone involved on both sides that they are making 'a sincere effort' to address the 'problem'.

Re:since this is Hong Kong

[LardBrattish]

Congratulations, first insightful post & I'm out of mod points.
If they were serious about stopping piracy they'd just send the Police to three or four locations I've visited several times ;) let's just say Mong Kok and clean up an awful lot of piracy for relatively little outlay...

Re:since this is Hong Kong

[some1somewhere]

Indeed! As with most things in Hong Kong, the government would rather not care at all, but since they are having pressure put on them, are giving a "real" push. Meanwhile, the HK police are found to be running pirated WinXP copies on their computers...

Hong Kong?

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe they oughta start cleaning up piracy on their streets before they mess with internet piracy. Unless things have changed in the past few years and you can't buy pirated whatever-you-want on the streets of Hong Kong, I think their priorities are a bit misplaced. My two dollar Advance Wars NintOndo gba cart is still running strong.

Another Exciting Adventure brought to you by ....

[unity100]

... RIAA. Enjoy !

Do not be fooled!

[posterlogo]

The article makes it sound like this is another communist China authoritarian/totalitarian scheme to use the people for state aims. Do not be fooled! This program is the brainchild of MPAA/RIAA. Why not do it domestically?

FTA: "The program may work better here than it would elsewhere, local officials suggest. Hong Kong teenagers are surprisingly obedient, possibly because of a Confucian tradition and very strong social pressures to study hard and serve the community."

That's right! Their kids are more brainwashed! Go MPAA/RIAA.

Re:Do not be fooled!

[Unlikely_Hero]

I've said for ages that all this confuscian crap (yes crap) is the basic root of authoritarianism in asian cultures. And I'm always branded some sort of bigot.
LOOK AT THE MAN'S WRITING. IT'S TRUE

Re:Do not be fooled!

[stilz2]

Just because a belief system or philosophy has been misued doesn't make it "crap" does it? Confucianism places emphasis on loyalty and obedience for subjects to their superiors, yes, but at the same time it requires the superiors to be kind and wise toward the subjects. The result of the abuse of the Confucian teachings are probably what you refer to as authoritarianism, but that is definitely not the intention of its founder. I think it's similar to how the Bible teaches "love thy neighbors" and we end up with so many holy wars.

Re:Do not be fooled!

[Unlikely_Hero]

Granted, I can accept that and agree with you in theory. I was referring to how it has ever actually been practiced that we know of. I would also refer to christianity this way, communism, utopian things in general that discount human nature. So I still stand by what I said, it is crap. Maybe not in its ideal theoretical form, but in any actual application I've been able to see in human history, yes. It Is Crap

Re:Do not be fooled!

[Unlikely_Hero]

I wish there was an edit button here, but I just thought of this and am adding another post.
Consider this.
I make a new philosophy. It involves having herbivores as the servants of carnivores. The herbivores are supposed to serve and obey the carnivores, and in return, the carnivores are not supposed to tear the herbivores into ribbons and feast on their entrails. Now, this of course would not work, because it defies the basic nature of the carnivores. If I suggested this philosophy to a serious person, and then got angry when they said they had heard more sensible things from someone on acid, then I would be an irrational nutjob.
So yes, I am still quite happy to refer to an unrealistic and broken philosophy, as "Crap"

Been done

[JazzLad]

Reminds me of the late '30s - '40s in Germany.

Remember good little kids, it's your duty to report if your mommy or daddy have anything bootlegged.

-
Please do not mod funny, that would be insulting.

If it's a good idea, lets expand it!

[Alsee]

WTF!

Ok, fine. How about we take this brilliant fucking idea and expand it. Lets recruit pre-teen children to scour the internet for terrorists.

And of course to complete the holy trinity of no-law-can-be-too-drastic you're-with-us-or-you're-against-us causes, we also need to recuit pre-teen children to scour the internet for kiddyporn.

-

This just in...

[patio11]

China is a police state.

Re:This just in...

[Anonymous Coward]

Hong Kong is a Special Administrative Region of the People's Republic of China with a high degree of autonomy until at least 2047.

From Wikipedia article:

Under the "One Country, Two Systems" policy, it retains its own legal system, currency, customs policy, cultural delegation, international sport teams, and immigration laws.

A new merit badge

[winkydink]

The Rat Fink

In America it is becoming...

[expro]

In America it is becoming Rumsfeld Youth, complete with the natural lead-in to the military.

Breaking news!!

[S.P.B.Wylie]

This just in: Hitler has risen from the grave and is suing China for violation of his intellectual property rights.

The numbers don't add up!

[DJ_Perl]

200,000 youths?!?!! Depending on which source you believe, there are only about 1 million youths ( ages 9-25 ) in all of Hong Kong. Even the sources disagree on the exact demographics of Hong Kong. Total population estimates ballpark around 6.9million.

That would mean that 1 in every 5 youths would have to become part of this program. Sounds....unlikely.

Sources:

1. Wikipedia (Demographics of Hong Kong) - 6.9 million in 2003
2. Wikipedia (Hong Kong) - 6.86 million in 2005
3. CIA World Factbook - 6.94 million in July 2006

wow

[uberCHIEFTAIN!]

wow. this is just like the spies in orwell's 1984.

The Internet

[RMB2]

The Internet is not something that you just dump some kids on

Re:The Internet

[ScrewMaster]

No problem ... they can just borrow the Great Firewall of China to protect the kids ... of course, it means they probably won't find anything.

Re:The Internet

[Columcille]

Haven't you heard? Kids are already on it.

Re:The Internet

[Anonymous Coward]

The internet is not something you just dump some kids on.

Of course not, it's a series of tubes.

Re:The Internet

[RMB2]

You da' man, but I got no mods for you, and also you're A.C. anyway... but you're still the man. Them others didn't seem to pick up what I was laying down

Re:The Internet

[The_Mr_Flibble]

Dammit, and I was hoping that it would raise my kid.

The real reason

[megaditto]

1) Hong Kong (of China) is producing about 0% of quality games/movies/software
2) Hong Kong is losing about 0% due to piracy each year?

For some reason, however, HK wants 200,000 kiddies to start looking around the places that will introduce them to the underbelly of computing

Now let me ask you, what would China want with some 200,000 script-kiddies?

Considering that the US of A already has a computerized powergrid, huge internet backbone/banking systems/telephone/cellular networks/freaking traffic lights and building ACs? Half of Navy's networked computers still running Win 98?
Not even takling about our trends to move towards Aegis-style computerized battlefield management, computer-heavy ABM shields, reliance on sattelites for CCC?

Re:The real reason

[Jeremi]

Now let me ask you, what would China want with some 200,000 script-kiddies? Considering that the US of A already has a computerized powergrid, huge internet backbone/banking systems/telephone/cellular networks/freaking traffic lights and building ACs?

Sorry, but that's really dumb, even for a conspiracy theory. If you were the Chinese government and wanted to hack in to American information infrastructure, you wouldn't hire 200,000 children, you'd hire 200 really bright graduate students, and have them write automated attack programs. Not hundreds of thousands of amateur volunteers who are (a) not going to be very effective, and (b) are going to be impossible to keep quiet about their activities.

There's also the minor detail of China having the USA as their largest customer -- attacking the USA is hardly in their economic interest.

Re:The real reason

[megaditto]

Hmm, I guess I botched that attempt at humour. Sorry.

As to your '200 really bright graduate students', where do you think thouse elite 'hackers' come from? Do you think we can pick any random snotnose and train her to grow up to be a scientist?

I submit to you that those 'elite hackers' start off as motivated script-kiddies. Helped by various Talented and Gifted programs. And a bit of motivation early on (e.g. Could you help me fix this radio set, Richard?)

As they say, no dumb theories, just dumb audience, yes?

Oh, and a big lol at your third paragraph.

Re:The real reason

[ErikTheRed]

1) Hong Kong (of China) is producing about 0% of quality games/movies/software
2) Hong Kong is losing about 0% due to piracy each year?

Ahem... Hong Kong has made some damned good movies (including some of my all-time favorites). And I'm sure they get pirated.

Re:The real reason

[1u3hr]

1) Hong Kong (of China) is producing about 0% of quality games/movies/software 2) Hong Kong is losing about 0% due to piracy each year?

Hong Kong is one of the major movie producing cities in the world; coming after Hollywood and Bombay. Its pop music (Cantopop) is also popular in Asia (and American Chinatowns). There are frequent ads fronted by these movie stars (perhaps you've heard of Jackie Chan?) and singers on the theme of piracy is theft, you'll go to jail, etc. Undoubtedly the local industry has suffered due to piracy (though many other factors come into it). But the main reason the Hong Kong govt is getting gung ho about copyright piracy enforcement is because of pressure from the US, who berate all their trading partners about this at the behest of the RIAAA et al.

For some reason, however, HK wants 200,000 kiddies to start looking around the places that will introduce them to the underbelly of computing Now let me ask you, what would China want with some 200,000 script-kiddies?

No one will learn even the minimal amount of knowledge required to be a "script kiddie" from writing down IP numbers from Bittorrent sites.

Considering that the US of A already has a computerized powergrid, huge internet backbone/banking systems/telephone/cellular networks/freaking traffic lights and building ACs? Half of Navy's networked computers still running Win 98?

Duh. Another Hong Kong fun fact: Hong Kong citizens can't join the PLA. In any case, if that was what they needed China has a hundred million people on the Internet already.

Re:The real reason

[1u3hr]

I submit to you that those 'elite hackers' start off as motivated script-kiddies.

You obviously know nothing about Hong Kong. China does not trust Hong Kong people politically, (having beeen tainted by British colonialism and western concepts of democracy) and they not allowed to join the PLA. For various reasons the Beijing govt keeps a hands-off policy with regard to HK governance (except for ruling out real elections, etc), and I can assure you this idea is entirely home-grown and in line with other of it's nany-state ideas.

Re:The real reason

[dextromulous]

c) children cannot legally visit adult sites.

Re:The real reason

[megaditto]

This "nany-state" seems to give America all these idiotic laws that hinder business, what with the minimum wage and nondiscrimination laws, Socia Security/Medicare, child literacy, workplace safety regulations, environmental protection standards, antitrust environment, the military.

If I want to hire a 9 y.o. kid to mine coal for me, who is the government to tell me that I should pay for her to go to school instead with my hard-earned tax dollars.
If she wanted to not starve, get vaccinations, and learn to read so badly, why did she chose to be born off the trailortrash parents?

I second your oppinion that we abandon all these Government programs as the right step towards qualifying America for a Darwin Award.

Re:The real reason

[grumpyman]

>> There's also the minor detail of China having the USA as their largest customer -- attacking the USA is hardly in their economic interest. Dude, but this is what I don't understand about the audience here in /. They despise conservatives/bush/etc yet in opinions on China, the comments are more conservative/paranoid/knee-jerk than fox news. Majority of them choose not to believe in your statement, and they rather believe the Chinese government is still the same old evil communist that'd like to take over the world by force. Or is it the deep down fear that the Chinese will catch up and take over as the biggest economic power in the world in near future?

Re:The real reason

[Anonymous Coward]

Dude, but this is what I don't understand about the audience here in /. They despise conservatives/bush/etc yet in opinions on China, the comments are more conservative/paranoid/knee-jerk than fox news.

I gather that one of the major objections of the /. audience to Bush relates to the relatively authoritarian nature of his government (since the 11 September 2001 terrorist attacks). To the extent that the government of China is a great deal more authoritarian than Bush, it is only natural that such anti-Bush sentiment would be accompanied by an anti-China (or anti-PRC-government) sentiment.

I'm often at odds with the majority views on /., being a supporter of social-democratic economics (and hence far too statist for most /.ers), and an opponent of mass immigration, but I can't stand Bush either. I also find the government of China appalling (corrupt, authoritarian, anti-egalitarian, militaristic, anti-democratic, et al.), but this is perfectly compatible with opposition to Bush. Indeed, from my Nordic perspective, both the current American and Chinese governments are quite objectionable, though the American one is far less so in most respects.

Re:The real reason

[grumpyman]

I'm often at odds with the majority views on /., being a supporter of social-democratic economics (and hence far too statist for most /.ers), and an opponent of mass immigration, but I can't stand Bush either. I also find the government of China appalling (corrupt, authoritarian, anti-egalitarian, militaristic, anti-democratic, et al.), but this is perfectly compatible with opposition to Bush. Indeed, from my Nordic perspective, both the current American and Chinese governments are quite objectionable, though the American one is far less so in most respects.

I wouldn't disagree about corruption and anti-democratic aspects in China, but to me the States is definitely much more militaristic than China. On top of a huge budget boost to the military in spite of huge deficit, they actually use force to get their way and what they want.

The secret to ending piracy is...

[Jackie_Chan_Fan]

A simple formula.

1 parts - Living Wage that provides a quality life, and covers all medical needs.
2 parts - Lower Prices for software
3 parts - Lower Prices for music
4 parts - Lower Prices for movies

Put them all together in a bowl, mix them up gently.

Re:The secret to ending piracy is...

[Anonymous Coward]

5 parts - ???
6 parts - Profit!^H^H^H^H^H^H^HBig losses!

Re:The secret to ending piracy is...

[cdrguru]

The problem is that "lower prices" just doesn't work, even though it is a nice idea.

Today, in the marketplace of the Internet you have a real choice: pay or not. Period. You want a copy of Adobe Photoshop - you can pay any amount from $0 to $1000. You get to choose. The fact that some people will pay $1000 but most choose something less is a fact of life. Where the rubber meets the road is when everyone (or at least nearly everyone) chooses $0.

This is where music in China has gone. Everyone chooses $0.

This is where it should go in the US as well. Because that will finally push the issue to the point where it will be a clear choice for everyone. Either support sale of creativity or not. Right now it is a mix and criminals are able to make plenty of money by paying $0 and selling for >$0 to people that think they should pay something, just not as much as "legitimate" channels. So, if we can eliminate the criminals we will be left with the $1000 and the $0 choices. Obviously, everyone will choose $0, right?

At that point I hope you like learning the inner workings of GIMP, because Adobe will be gone. Good riddance, right? They charge too much.

These are the choices we face, and I think the answer is obvious. $0 for everything. State support for artists. State support for education, medical treatment, food, housing, everything. That ends the gouging, right?

Re:The secret to ending piracy is...

[Zaphod2016]

Which State? Which officials? And who will be running this State tommorrow?

Your faith in Government is incredible. I, on the other hand, avoid interaction with Uncle Sam whenever I possibly can.

Some more information about HK piracy

[uv_light]

Here are some information. You will see more shop selling pirated everything in shopping mall (and on the street) in HK than you can find Starbucks in US (I am sure those who visited HK know what I am talking about)

Nobody seem to try to crack down on those, well, I guess because those are control by ganster or dirty cops, who knows... But those should really be the kind get crack down first..

Its scary...

[Ichigo Kurosaki]

It's scary how similar this is to 1984...

Re:Its scary...

[IHC Navistar]

Would this be the 1984 equivalent of "The Spies" and the "Junior Anti-Sex League"? You are right... It is strikingly 1984-ish. But then again, youths are most likely to purchase things that are most often counterfeited-----Movies/DVDs, computer games, video games, music, shoes, computer parts, and cigarettes.

-----

Sig Sauer

One step closer to...

[geekdom04]

1984.

Obligatory.

[Pzychotix]

In Communist Russia....

Warez finds you!

In soviet russia

[fireman sam]

Pirates search for children

free-thinking adults fear the brain-washed youth

[gruthen]

"In 1984, brainwashing and instilling loyalty to the political parties begins at a very young age, similar to the situation during the Holocaust. In Orwell's novel, children were encouraged to be spies, and even to turn in their own parents."

from http://www.angelfire.com/blog/1984essay/index.htm

Re:Search != Stumble Upon [OT]

[Kijori]

Sorry for the off topic post, but there's a term for laws against things that aren't, in themselves, wrong, like illegal immigration. Can anyone tell me what it is?

maybe they've been reading

[hachete]

http://www.e-sheep.com/spiders/

which is a damn fine webcomic as well

Re:Search != Stumble Upon [OT]

[ajs318]

injustice

Re: Why stop?

[Anonymous Coward]

And why stop there? With a deft click, they might be able to make more as .. "actors" of such material than the police pays them to find copies of Sinatra.

Absolutely.

[jotaeleemeese]

It is what the government in East Germany used to say. I think it is a similar motto in Fidel Castro's Cuba ot in North Korea.

Very good citizens there, I tell ya.

Re:Absolutely.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, but that doesn't make it less true. The problem with places like North Korea and Cuba (and formerly East Germany) is not the willingness of citizens to report illegal activities, but rather the criminalisation of a great many activities that most rational people would not consider to be wrong. In other words, if their laws were sound, and geared towards promoting the welfare of the people, rather than towards preserving one-party states, and the power of the elites within the ruling party, these 'good citizens' would indeed be improving the welfare of their respective populations, rather than making things worse (by helping to preserve systems which harm the public).

I knew it!

[TheVelvetFlamebait]

This is just another OMG TEH KIDDIES!!!!!111 story isn't it?

Hong Kong kids can do law enforcement in sleazy sites if they want to. They don't need your moral objections.

Jesus.

Re:Why are they wasting their time?

[ajs318]

It's not just muslims ..... christians and jews are every bit as bad. All monotheists are fucking evil cunts who need to be stopped -- by whatever the hell means it takes -- from believing that there is one god. All the evidence points to there being either fewer than one or more than one god, but certainly not exactly one.

No gods => everyone is responsible for their own actions.
Many gods => even gods you don't worship can still punish you if you transgress against them.
One god => any fucking thing is justified because it's in the name of the Law-Giver, you filthy infidel scumbag.

Why not brown uniforms?

[flatcat]

Heck give them brown uniforms with cool symbols on them instead of those blue ones.
I wonder if they get extra credit turning in their parents?
I can just see this happening, piss your kid off and they plant pirated goods in the house and turn you in. In the US they train the brats to threaten their parents with calling DYFS if you smack them in the bum.

Kind of like the Twilight Zone "It's a good life" or Star Trek "Charlie X".
Fear the children.

perfect!

[gargletheape]

Long have I wondered how to combine the awesome coolness of combating free software/porn with the law-abiding edginess of working for the Man.

Oh so long have I wondered!!

Another Sci Fi manifestation

[smchris]

Not that this raises disconcerting images of Neal Stephenson's Diamond Age or anything.

HATE SPEECH - MOD PARENT DOWN

[Anonymous Coward]

The reason being is pretty evident when you read the parent's post.

Both of them for that matter.

Re:HATE SPEECH - MOD PARENT DOWN

[ajs318]

Are you seriously saying you think it's a good idea that

• Jews should be allowed to bomb innocent civilians for the crime of not being jewish
• Muslims should be allowed to blow themselves up on buses because some of the passengers are not muslims
• Catholics should be allowed to spread AIDS in Africa because condoms are evil
• Protestants should be allowed to go on "orange order" marches with the sole intent to piss off catholics

?

Simple fact, all these religions have "nasty" sides which are neither separable from the "nice" sides, nor reconcilable with one another (at most, one monotheistic world view can be true). I think the short-term consequences of outlawing monotheism are a small price to pay for the long-term benefits to society.

I also believe that all means to the same end are equally valid; and if a monotheist can't be persuaded gently to give up their dangerous beliefs, then I think less benign methods are called for. If it later turns out that one of the religions we banned was right all along, well, we can deal with it then.

Re:HATE SPEECH - MOD PARENT DOWN

[Anonymous Coward]

So, are you seriously saying that:

A soverign nation, Israel, should not be allowed to defend itself against attacks from other nations and non-state actors?

Every Muslim ascribe to the exact same philosophy as suicide bombers and other radicals? (Here's a hint...it's called radical because it goes way outside the majority's belief structure and actions)

Every Catholic should encourage safe sex, when any sex outside of marriage is against their belief structure?

Every Protestant should say "Hey! You're right Catholics, we'll fall back in line with the Pope now" when they interpret The Bible differently and don't recognize the Pope as their religious leader?

I don't know where you come from, or what your own religious background is (I'm guessing decidedly not monotheistic), but just because you think your unilateral interpretation of the universe is correct doesn't mean you can impose it on the rest of us, which, as it may still surprise you yet, some are completely peaceful with their faith and it's relation to other faiths?

You're not enlightened there buddy. You're disillusioned and jaded.

And if you're not willing to realize that the aggressive and violent parts of a religious are completely seperate from the peaceful and loving ones, then why don't we talk all about atheists who have done wrong for whatever reason, and credited to their atheism? I'm sure there's gotta be a few, but hey, why don't we lump them all together and ban that too?

Re:HATE SPEECH - MOD PARENT DOWN

[Anonymous Coward]

Isreal is only soverign in some state's eyes, not all. Palestine does not recognize it as as state, as do many Arab states. Personally, I think their opinions are compleatly dismissed, unjustly. Britian never had legal ownership of the land, thus, they could not legally pass it over to the Jewish people. Yet, that is how Isreal was formed. All the Palestinieans have been saying is, "If the Natzis commited such a crime against the Jewish, then give them German land, why are you taking ours?"

Also, its not that religions have a strong view that I object to, its when they impose it on others. If you are against homosexuality, fine, don't engage in gay sex. But what gives you the right to stop other people? What happened to tolerance? You need to let other people believe what they want, and not push you're beliefs on them. Especially via legislation.

Crime?

[mordejai]

so the government program is no different than asking young people to tell the police if they see a crime

Except, there is no crime here.
A better analogy would be the children telling about their friends/family thoughtcrimes... I think I read that somewhere...

Life Imitating Art, Again Orwell Proves Prophetic

[cyberbian]

Nearly all children nowadays were horrible. What was worst of all was that by means of such organizations as the Spies they were systematically turned into ungovernable little savages, and yet, this produced in them no tendency whatever to rebel against the discipline of the Party. On the contrary, they adored the Party and everything connected with it. The songs, the processions, the banners, the hiking, the drilling with dummy rifles, the yelling of slogans, the worship of Big Brother, it was all a sort of glorious game to them. All their ferocity was turned outwards, against enemies of the State, against foreigners, traitors, saboteurs, thought-criminals. It was almost normal for people over thirty to be frightened of their own children. And with good reason, for hardly a week passed in which The Times did not carry a paragraph describing how some eavesdropping little sneakchild hero was the phrase generally used, had overheard some compromising remark and denounced its parents to the Thought Police.

Clearly this is a step down the double plus ungood path.

Reading between the lines.

[Aqua_boy17]

I think I've figured out what's really going on here. This is all part of the Chinese government's campaign to eradicate global warming and embarass western leaders by taking all of the credit. Here's how it works:

1. Children locate pirates
2. Chinese government detains pirates
3. Pirates begin reproducing during long, boring confinement
4. More Pirates = Less Global Warming

Brilliant!

Re:Reading between the lines.

[DarkDragonVKQ]

Nah it's.. 1) Children locate pirates 2) Chinese government detains pirates 3) Chinese government forces pirates to work for them 4) Chinese government further excel their technology 5) Chinese government transforms pirates into the super hackers from command and conquer generals 6) Chinese government steals money from everyone 7) WWIII is fought between China, US, and terrorist organizations called the GLA 8) I use Nuke General 9) CAPITAL

Re:Search != Stumble Upon [OT]

[Anonymous Coward]

there's a term for laws against things that aren't, in themselves, wrong, like illegal immigration.

Why do you say illegal immigration is not wrong? Illegal immigrants make use of all sorts of infrastructure and state services created and paid for by the national population. I'm not sure about the USA, but here in Europe, they get a lot of subsidies too, and are disproportionately involved in other crimes, especially violent ones (which are unfair to the national population, and expensive to handle).

I can see the argument for saying copyright infringement is not always wrong (even though I support the idea of copyright, I think the copyright period is much too long), but illegal immigration is an entirely different thing. One of the most obvious ways to see this is that, if we stopped enforcing immigration laws (even poorly, as is unfortunately often the case now) in Europe, infrastructure and state services would be overwhelmed and collapse: our continent would quickly degenerate to Third World levels, perhaps with the rich sealing themselves off in private fortresses (as in South Africa, or much of China).

All in all, illegal immigration effectively amounts to large-scale theft of the resources of the national population, which is as clearly wrong as, for example, breaking into someone's home and stealing things from them.

Uhmm, not the same thing

[Anonymous Coward]

there is a difference between sex and pooping in the shape of a sundae machine on your partner's face, while you piss on your dog and are wearing 18inch stilettos, while your partner is getting rammed by a power tool converted into a sex toy, on stage while all the other people in the fetish sex club are watching, all the while, the 18 web cams around the stage are streaming it to members all over the world via the internet.

I'm hoping you now understand the difference between sex and 'some weird fetish shit'.

Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Back in the '80s, FAST offered rewards to kids for every "friend" they reported. The ad ran as a comic strip in several mags.

I can't be the only one to think...

[LordPhantom]

....Dr. Tran!!!!

Re:Why are they wasting their time?

[Anonymous Coward]

I could just as easily change this to:

Many gods => any fucking thing is justified because it's in the name of the Law-Givers, you filthy infidel scumbag.

and

No gods => any fucking thing is justified because it's in the name of Survival of the Fittest®, you filthy infidel scumbag.

What was your point, again?

Society of joiners

[slowbad]

Of course Microsoft had their "Spynet Community" in Microsoft Antispyware Beta. And in a few days when that dies, it has been reincarnated in Windows Defender.

In Vista it says "Join the online community that helps identify and stop spyware" ... followed by advanced membership or "Join with a Basic membership"

I must not be a joiner type of guy.