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A Different Kind of WGA 'Problem'
Ed Bott recently attempted to scout out the problems reported in so many horror stories floating around the net relating to Microsoft's WGA. He did experience problems, however, not the ones that you might expect. He intentionally installed a pirated copy of Windows XP to see how the process worked but was unable to get WGA to recognize his computer as pirated. From the article: "I'm reluctantly running a pirated version of Windows and can't get caught no matter how hard I try. But these same people want us to believe that the WGA software they've developed is nearly foolproof. They claim that all but "a fraction of a percent" of those 60 million people who've been denied access to Microsoft updates and downloads are guilty, guilty, guilty. Right."
Imagine what the ones who got caught must have done!
I'm reluctantly running a pirated version of Windows and can't get caught no matter how hard I try.
Here you go!
No, I just want to confirm the article. Really.
Its simple. Hes using the corporate VLK. Microsoft would _never_ damage its corporate customers by subjecting them to WGA. I thought it was well known that corporate versions of things (windows, symantec) are vastly superior and thusly are the most heavily pirated. Always go for a pirated corp copy over a real one. Those leet software pirates know how to do the job right, the first time.
I'll just use my special getting high powers one more time...
(to tell the truth, I am currently running zero illegal copies of microsoft products. work bought me a laptop that came with a license, and I put linux on my stinkpad, and used its windows 98 license in a virtual machine so I can play alpha centauri)
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Truly, a display of intellect unequalled in Slashdot history. Someone hasn't been caught, so the people that have been must be innocent. Were Johnny Cochran still alive, he'd have you on the frontline of high-profile criminal defense cases.
Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
When things like this come out; things like key checking for a game install and everything else that is designed to stop piracy I often wonder who wrote it?
Are the best and brightest out there the ones that get stuck with this task? I would think it'd be the interns and that developers everyone hates that get the fun task.
I've used products that had good licensing tools. Keys that you enabled online, and enabled a number of users etc. Everytime it seems like it comes out of some smaller software company with small bright teams. I'm guessing in these cases the senior level codes and maybe even the whole team got involved.
Anyone out there have expierence writing key checkers and other piracy related pieces of functionality?
because none of Microsoft's software products have any flaws...
Haiku for you!
It seems I can't get Canonical's apt program to recognize I'm running a pirated version of ubuntu. It should be obvious, since I even got it as an iso file on the internet for free...
DYWYPI?
I know a number of people who 'borrowed' a Windows Support Key from their employeers, and applied the key to their pirated version of Windows. None of them have had a problem with the Windows Validator tool.
How do ypu prove that you're not a pirate if MS says you are?
Is get him to host an ISO and share his cd key (or google one I guess) so none of us naughty pirates get attacked by WGA.
I mean, maybe he should distribute it for all the people that are being wrongfully accused of having a pirated version.
On a less stupid note, exactly how much of Microsoft's software has worked 100% of the time? Especially with all these false positives out there is it really to be so unexpected that a single person would be able to slip through the cracks?
To beter help troubleshoot the issue I ask that you please send me an .iso and key. I would like to attempt to help re-create the problem to further assist you troubleshoot.
Thanks,
It's far more of a problem for casual, non-technical pirates than the handful of legitimate customers who have been misidentified.
I personally know of at least half a dozen people who have subsequently either a) purchased a legitimate copy of Windows, b) downgraded back to their older, legitimate version or c) bought a Mac, because they lack the technical knowledge to keep up with the WGA arms race.
WGA is certainly going to reduce the level of Windows piracy. Unfortunately for Microsoft, it's going to do so because some people will move away from Windows altogether.
Simple fact is that WGA is utterly transparent and utterly irrelevant to most legitimate users, and even those it isn't, it isn't an issue for very long.
Join Tor today!
...except I am running Linux. No matter how hard I try, I can't get those dweebs at Linux Corp. to understand that I never paid for this copy. I keep calling them and asking for a invoice or bill or something. But I guess they don't have a record of my purchase. Go figure. Just lucky I suppose.
I judt got a nre Kinesis keybiartf so please excusr ant egregiou typos.
I have 2 OEM copies of windows that I bought from Fry's years ago.
Unfortunately -and predictably, in the course of 2 moves I have lost my activation key #s -I didn't glue them to my machines as recommended because I planned on moving the license to another, newer machine eventually.
Now I can't even finish the install without having to find some cracked key from some warez site. Then it won't let me install any security patches or Service Packs.
After the 30 days or whatever is up and I have to activate I then try the warezed key and am told that this key has been used too many times -Duh! a
and then I have to call MS support and get a new activation key from them. Fortunately they haven't given me too much grif, but its still a hassle.
Thanks to old flakey hard drives I have had to do this twice and now it has died a third time.
This time I said screw it and went to fry's and bought a new HP dual core media center PC for $750. so I guess MS won this round.....
But I will be trying this again since I have several more machines sitting around -I guess I'd better write down the key# the next time they give me one over the phone again. Does anyone know if the activation #s they give over the phone are 1-time codes or if they will work multiple times?
Has anyone had any luck just asking them for new activation codes?
-What's the speed of Dark?
Not too long after WGA came out I tried using System Restore to revert to a back up from about a week earlier to see if it would solve some issues I was having. After reverting to the backup, WGA was sure I had a pirated copy, but if I then reverted to the state it was in before using system restore, it didn't have problems at all. I haven't checked since then to see if maybe it was just because the backup was from before installing WGA, but it's sort of annoying that they would make one of their more useful features useless if the issue still happens.
I just love the name of the department issuing this story, given the content/context of it. LOL!
I'm going off to actually read the article from the link now.
So wait...You mean to tell me you just called up Microsoft one day and said "Yeah I'd like a pirated version of windows please" And they just handed it over? Yeah smells like BS to me.
The greatest revenge in life is massive success.
Or does it even need activation? having to call MS with your personal information to continue running xp after 60 or so days could be the end of his freedom.
Microsoft.Windows.XP.Professional.Corporate.SP2.In tegrated.July.2006.MULTI.IMAGE.REPACK-ETH0
That has all the latest updates... and has a WGA crack in it... no wonder he can't get it to recognize it's pirated.
In Soviet Russia, Linux compiles you!
Please, for the good of Humanity, vote Obama.
Obviously the P2P Pirate edition of XP uses the VLK and has modified the legitcontrol.dll, wgatray.exe, and wga*.dll files to not report a WGA violation.
Want to really test the WGA? Use your original copy of Windows XP and search the Internet for a known CD-Key and install with that key that millions of other people have used. Then watch as the retail or OEM version of Windows with unpatched WGA files reports you as a pirate.
Ninja Pirate Hackers and Crackers have modified the WGA files with something called MSIL that is like assembly language. For example if a valid key is found, you might have a comparision done and a JNE to 2000:1345 which calls the part of the code that turns on the "Your copy of Windows is not legit" function. Turn that JNE 2000:1345 into a NOP and the comparison does not match and the program does not jump into the Anti-Pirate code. Or change it to a JE 2000:1345 and if a valid key is found it jumps to the Anti-Pirate code and if an invalid key it does not. Or just take the code at 2000:1345 that turns on the Pirated bit and fill it with NOPs. I am just guessing here, I could be wrong, but I think the pirated version of Windows and those WGA-Fix patches do those sort of things.
Meanwhile my legit copy of Windows XP has to have the WGA spyware on it to get updates from Microsoft. Yeah Windows Update and Microsoft Update require that I install WGA in order to use them. If not, no updates from the web. WGA trashed my fast user switching after it got installed. I can see the WGA files eating my system memory, CPU cycles, and using up bandwidth to report back to Microsoft, yes folks it is spyware. I would guess the pirate version of the WGA Fixed files remove the spyware as well.
Not only that I heard that the pirate version of XP has special tweaks and bug fixes that the retail and OEM versions do not have. Yet your chances of malware infections are greater with the pirate version, because you never know who last modified it before you got a copy. So beware.
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
can I get a link to that Google page with the 5 valid keys, please?
there are 3 kinds of people:
* those who can count
* those who can't
How is that more people haven't pointed out that this post uses completely bullshit logic?
Let me be perfectly clear for all the kiddies out there: A high false-negative rate DOES NOT IMPLY a high false-positive rate! Understanding this only requires basic comprehension skills.
Right... so he intentionally installed a pirated copy. Good work. I think we should hold these genius responsible for breaking the law now. In other news I intentionally stole a car with armored tires and proved the cops couldn't catch me and the spike strip they laid out to stop me couldn't rip my tires... blah blah blah.
What does the author expect? Microsoft Windows also brought "acceptable to ship with known bugs", or at least redefined to current levels. While software has always had bugs in code and design, it is now acceptable to download anything, throw it in and expect it to work. Much like many I/T departments and management, as long as the PR/BS sounds right and the CIO owns the MSFT stock you are a Microsoft Pwnd. Microsoft isn't about quality well engineered software, it is about market manipulation, anti-competative dominance like bundling, PR and sales. They have no sizable competition because of the way it is sold. No competition means poorly functioning and insecure products.
Now imagine if you buy a PC, you had the legal right not to pay for the Microsoft part, and perhaps choose to send the $75 to Red Hat or Suse, or perhaps Ubunto, whould Microsoft have a 95% monopoly? My guess is not, as like cars, 95% of use don't drive the same cars nor buy gas from the same vendor.
At least you get to run a bootleg version as legit. It does not always work that way. When MS said my Word was illegal even though it was not, I simply unloaded it and loaded Open Office. I simply look at Microsoft as an overpriced monopoly.
There's a Linux version of Alpha Centauri available as a torrent. :(
I downloaded it in April (and I do not feel guilty of copyright infringement because I've bought the ms-windows version and Loki who made the port doesn't exist anymore...)
A quick Google "torrent alpha centauri Linux" sent me here.
Now, it's the full ISO, it could be useful to share only the binaries, as you have already artwork files...
Only issue I have with it is that fullscreen uses a modeline that doesn't fit completely in my screen
I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.
Is he might be using a legit corperate key. We have a VLK here (university) and you can just install XP on any system no problem, and it'll report as legit. They don't check vs number of license to make sure it's an exact count. So you could install it unlicensed on a personal laptop, and it'd report as legit no problems. Now however if they found tons of systems outside of the university cropping up, and saw the key on a serials board, they might invalidate it and issue us a new one.
However just installing a copy of corperate unlicensed won't do anything. It doesn't activate and there's not a hard limit check.
To really test WGA you need to do something like get a known pirate key or take a non-volume copy of XP and install it on more systems than you are allowed to.
... the frequency of false positives and false negatives don't have to be related at all. The fact that WGA might not reject lots of invalid licenses doesn't say anything about how often it rejects valid licenses. Without knowing the details about how WGA works, it's easy for me to imagine that Microsoft engineered the scheme to err on the side of identifying licenses as valid, e.g. to avoid pissing off large corporate customers, as another poster remarked.
For example, I have a method for figuring out in the morning if the Dow Jones Industrial Average will rise or fall by the end of the day. If I look out my window and see investors plummeting out of office buildings, it will go down. Otherwise, it will go up. My success rate for predicting up days is about 50/50, but my success rate for predicting down days is just about perfect!
I thought false positives were bad, but holy crap, letting a few pirates go with false negatives is so much worse! They may never get to experience the pleasures of those prompts or being prevented from downloading updates and utilities.
Why is this a problem for anyone but Microsoft (or those who have a perverse desire to be labeled as a pirate and then blog about it)? Do you suppose maybe he got a false negative because Microsoft is less willing to pull the trigger when in doubt?
When was the last time Microsoft told the truth, rather that just piled money into some crud ridden marketing smear campaign? Heck, when was the last time they even wrote something worth your time? As you can see, they can't even get this little flagship utility working! Can you really trust your company to these guys? Really?
If you are so sick of activating Windows XP, why not use a WPA crack (Windows product activation crack)
If you're running an illegal version of windows, but happen to actually have a license for a legit copy, how can you go about getting legit?
My friend has a pirated keygen'd version of xp pro, and also has a hologramed cd of xp pro complete with serial number and all... Is there an easy upgrade path available to him to go legit, without having to reinstall (too many games/apps/whatever he says.)
That is still a LOT of people...
I hate WGA, every other week a new "update" that bugs me about rebooting just because microsoft suddenly cares about piracy. It is obnoxious as hell.
The phrase "more better" is acceptable English. suck it grammar Nazis
It was just the 3-rd post.
-What's the speed of Dark?
The same as the speed of light.
Right. Remember, 3/2—or 119,990,000/2—is, after all, a fraction.
Just not a proper fraction.
Corporate Volume License Keys always pass the WGA test.
e.g. HP has all the computers in the Sydney office running with one Volume License Key, now if someone were to leave HP's employ and continue to use the key MS would have no way of knowing so has to let it pass the WGA.
It has to just shrug and go well thats HP let it pass or risk annoying the hell out of a lot of HP people if they refuse it.
it's Fuck Gates World
It's probably been suggested before, but what MS should do is what games used to do back in the '80s. When you turn on your computer, it asks you "on page 10 of the manual, what is the 7th word in line 13?"
Espeically since windows has become too complex for a purely software based solution to ever work reliably.
The bigger licensing issue is of course ACADEMIC
Mrs Smith trots off to the high street computer co and wants Windows XP, now does she buy the full version for $300 or the academic version for $98?
Come on M$ $300 for XP but only $98 if you put a red sticker on the outside of the box with Academic Version written on it?!
I would be interested to know how many of the boxes are sold at $300 in high st stores!
What I do is keep a text file containing all the CD keys for all the software that I own, and back it up along with the rest of my stuff. That way it doesn't matter if I lost the original CD case or sticker, as long as I've got the install CDs (original or downloaded) and at least a semi-recent backup.
False negatives don't imply false positives.
a fraction of a percent.... isn't 1/2 of 100% still a fraction of a percent? hell, 2/2 of 100% is also!
So the key that he's using hasn't hit Microsoft's ban list yet. There could be a number of simple reasons for this as others have pointed out.
:)
None of this has anything to do with legitimate license keys being rejected, which is a completely different problem with the same system. Just because a specific pirated copy of XP passes WGA does not mean that it's likely for legitimate copies of XP to be rejected by WGA.
The nice thing about both of these problems is that they can be fairly easily resolved with a single phone call
PS, I didn't RTFA, I'm simply responding to the last line of the quoted text. If there is some reason that this guy's experience has any direct relationship to legitimate copies of XP being flagged as pirated, please correct me.
PS2, I'm no fan of WGA. When I saw it come up in automatic updates on my XP box, I unchecked it. It continues to appear now and then, and often the system doesn't tell me that updates are ready until I'm shutting the machine down, at which point if I accidentally hit the big red shutdown button, WGA will be installed. No way to see which updates will be applied when that happens either.
MS has to get Vista out.
MS would hate to see a generation of young users trying other products.
Young ppl cannot be allowed to enter the workforce unexposed to Vista.
They might bring dangerous new ideas about other products with them.
WGA is for the share holders, IT journals, periodicals and trade magazines.
WGA is not going to slow the spread of Vista.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
this is basically truth! i don't understand how this is flamebait!
I have yet to install WGA, and I am downloading the latest security patches with no trouble at all. Now, I am not using auto-update (I never used auto update, or I WOULD have WGA by now.) For example, last night I downloaded and installed all 12 patches.
You don't need WGA to install updates. All you need is Windows Baseline Securty Analyzer - it will scan what updates you need and provide direct links to them. It's a little more tedious than Windows Update but it does the job. Another option would be to set up a WSUS server but that's a little more involved.
*My main PC is a Fedora Core box. My wife's main PC is a Mac. We share this Windows box, mainly for gaming.
:-D
It's okay, man. You don't have to prove yourself to us.
If Nalgene water bottles are outlawed, only outlaws will have Nalgene water bottles.
Well I can attest to many problems with WGA and or Win2k Sp4. One was one of the updates horked up the boot record so to shutdown I had to yank the darn thing from the wall. Basicly all tech support said to do was reinstall-not a huge BFD I don't use it for anything but games. The most amusing WGA issue I saw here was a new store (Davids Bridal and Mens apparel) that used a some sort of Windows Kioske-after it the store manager had the thing sent back as deffective. In its' place their installing a few XServes. a few leased G5's and only runing the nescosary software (CueCat esk software). However as a result of WGA giving them so many headaches it's no at least company policy that running windows is grounds for suspension (for managers ) and firing for floor staff. :)
... but I've been trying to find an inexpensive (read: not cheap) computer *without an OS* so I don't have to pay the M$ tax. Where can I find such a thing?
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
Dark can move superliminally, such as a shadow cast at an angle by an object at a great distance.
From the PR notices: http://www.microsoft.com/genuine/downloads/whyVali date.aspx
Confidence and Peace of Mind
Your software is authentic, properly licensed and supported by Microsoft or a trusted partner.
Ongoing Improvements
You will get access to updates, enhancements, and innovations that help you protect and do more with your PC.
Capabilities You Expect
Your system will deliver the features, options, and performance you need to maximize your productivity and enjoyment.
Greatest PR/Marketing campaign ever. Don't you feel the Love?
Enjoy,
It's just the normal noises in here.
Possibly because of your overzealous insulting.
Why is this flamebait? The license terms and conditions for an MS OEM license specifically states you cannot transfer the license!
When the grandparent violated the terms of his license and installed Windows on a machine that is not covered by his license agreement with Microsoft, that installation of Windows became effectively "pirated".
I'm not saying that Microsofts OEM licensing scheme is a legitimate or morally correct form of business, but from a (IANAL) legal perspective, the guy violated his license agreement and then was completely astounded when WGA told him that he had violated his license agreement... (jokes about Microsoft software actually working well enough to do what it should aside...)
I am government man, come from the government. The government has sent me. -- G.I.R.
Is that the version localized for:
Vunavutu?
Tuvalu?
Fiji?
Esperant Plus?
Dammit man, we wanna KNOW!
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
I still have an unpatched Windows 2k SP3 box which has been running behind a firewall for the last 2 1/2 years. Still relatively fast and shows no evidence of malware infestation.
I can see updates being necessary on Server 2003, which is often quite buggy and needs patches for stuff to work, but an XP or 2k box doesn't desperately need the updates if it's used in a reasonably sane manner.
-b.
"exactly how much of Microsoft's software has worked 100% of the time?"
Microsoft Bob, the purpose was to annoy my mouse-potato'd ass and it did, 110%!
Once you have a working machine - activated and all - go to C:\windows\system32 and copy the files wpa.dbl and wpa.bak to secure off-computer location(s) like a USB key or even a floppy. When you need to reinstall XP due to HDD death or whatever, reinstall as normal with the key you used on the previous install (if you don't know the key, download Magical Jelly Bean Keyfinder, run it, and write down the key). After you install, boot into Safe Mode (hold down F8 at boot and select from the menu). Copy the old wpa... files back into your C:\windows\system32 directory.
-b.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I had an MSDNAA key through my computer science department. I installed it one too many times due to some hard drive failures, and the authentication system on the install blocked me. I called the number it said to. Half an hour later, I told someone in India I had not installed it on multiple machines and I was given a new key and was officially free and clear to use Windows XP at will. Make the effort to make a phone call if it happens to you and you probably won't have to panic going "they want me to buy four copies oh no!!"
Actually, I bought a Dell recently. To my ineptitude and ignorance, I didn't realize that it was a special offer and couldn't choose XP Home, but only media center and Pro, of which Pro is like $100 more. So I end up doing a wipe and reinstall with a build 2600 version of Pro.
Installed. Drivers done. Now, I want to get some PowerToys, particularly the desktopmanager and something else. I go to MS, try the WGA download tester thing. Fine. It labels me as having a pirated version. Big deal. I go into a computer running a legal version of it, get the WGA code thing. ^C^V. Done. I can download whatever in hell I want from the MS site.
So the fact is, unlike mentioned in TFA, it's unnecessary to waste as much as 15 minutes googling for a new key and spending some time to patch it on. Just copy and paste the key from a legal or a patched-to-legal and you are done. I saved it for future use in case I need something else from M$'s site.
the speed of light in reverse.
Copyright is life plus 70.* Copyright infringement is also a crime in many developed countries, which can be prosecuted independently of the knowledge of any copyright owner. Developed countries' governments are most certainly not out of business.
* Term of exclusive rights, not term of imprisonment (yet)
Umm,
when I bought an OEM licensed version of Windows from Fry's I BECAME an OEM. both Microsoft and Frys allow this.
I built the system myself -as I have done with every system I have ever owned except for laptops and my new media center PC. If I pop the HD that enabled me to buy the OEM software into another sytem I have built the license transfers.
So morally (and legally) I regard myself as a HECK of a lot more legit than people using cracked or site versions of XP.
-What's the speed of dark?
Dear Pirates:
http://windizupdate.com/
Please send beer. Thank you.
sig?
wine ~/.wine/drive_c/windows/system32/WgaTray.exe
=w=
So how long until we see, in the wild, a virus/worm/whatever with a birthday payload that makes WGA think the compromised machine is pirate.
Or one that makes WGA think it's legit.
Either could cause all sorts of havoc.
I wonder if it's already happened?
(Wouldn't it be interesting if it had happened to the author of TFA? B-) )
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
that if M$ makes anything that doesn't suck, it would be a vaccuum cleaner.
Give me a break. The fact that WGA missed a pirated copy of Windows is absolutely not evidence that it doesn't work as it should.
The vast majority of WGA checks have to do with simply checking for known pirated keys. This particular key hadn't been picked up by Microsoft yet.
WGA missing this pirated copy is not the same as it falsely accusing a users of pirating a copy that is legit. The former will probably happen often, the later is extremely rare.
Activation is about controll for profit's sake, not stopping illeagle copies.
ALL schemes that require the goodwill of the vendor for you use the software
will eventually result in "sorry we no longer support that product, you'll need to
buy a newer version". I suppose it's possible for company to be just that paranoid
and stupid, but that doesn't guarantee they won't go bankrupt or get bought out or
get greedy later.
Mycroft
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
They just forgot a "!" in the checking code!
A 10MB mandatory patch should clear that one right up.
Seems that WGA errs on the side of the user, resulting in false negatives, which is good. This doesn't prove that there are tons of false positives, quite the contrary.
-- "I never gave these stories much credence." - HAL 9000
If you are so sick of activating Windows XP, why not use a WPA crack (Windows product activation crack)
That's risky. First of all, the hack itself could be a trojan or other malware. Even if it's not malicious and from a trusted source, it's still a hack that could very well break Windows. And even if you get it successfully installed, Microsoft could easily "accidently" break your system with some update. At the very least it's certain that they will likely break the hack, which means you have to hunt down another crack.
I find it easier just to not run IE, not run Outlook Express, and run a software and hardware firewalls, and just stay behind the curve when it comes to Windows updates so I don't have to deal with WGA.
So basically you lost something and now you're grumbling about having to go through hoops to get a replacement for free. It's your fault you lost something, not Microsoft's, or the key scheme itself. If you lose the remote to a television that doesn't have all the functionality on the face of the TV, you need to buy another remote. If you lose the key to your house, you need to pay a locksmith to make you a new key.
Maybe the hoops were a little annoying, and so you can blame Microsoft for making it so difficult, but I don't think that has anything to do with this key scheme. Some companies handle things like this better. Some companies worse.
Here is my WGA story.
A client's laptop started complaining. I checked its key, and it did not match the key on the sticker. So I attempted to change the key. No go with MS's vba script. No go with the activation wizard (which is another suggested way to change it) - it stated that the key was invalid. Further 'hacking' with the activation wizard (No, I don't know what I did, but there was a maximum of three buttons I could have clicked, and one of them was 'cancel!') got me a key I could use on the phone, and, after telling a bored Indian the story ("Have you installed this software on any other machine?" - I swear that quoting a snatch of Alice in Wonderland would have succeded!) he coughed up the activation code. WGA no more, but my it's a drag!
If I charged them full price, It may well have been more than a new licence. Even so, it probably would have taken just as long to get it to accept the freshly bought key.
Prediction for end of Universe #42: Fencepost error in Quantum_bogosort.cpp
...the original owner of the windows key which was pirated by Ed Bott, was killed when he was struck by a chair.
Sources tell us that a monkey boy was scene in the vicinty chanting "developers...developers"
Why is this flamebait?
Probably due to the excessive and inappropriate use of the term "moron". Also, saying "you can't do that" without saying why is pretty unhelpful. I think the modding is appropriate.Are there really 60 million people using hacked versions of Windows XP, or any other Windows OS's? Because if so, doesn't Windows see that threatening them with WGA-like threats,and, BTW, not denying that they may have a kill switch for the hacked Windows versions, will get these users over to Linux or Macs in no time, especially if they don't want to shell out the monies for the real stuff?
I service computers for a living. I've done so for more than 10 years. Over the past few years, I've observed a vast increase in unrecoverable hard drive failure rates, and an even larger increase of malware which negatively affects the system beyond reasonable repair. In these situations it is often much faster (and cheaper for the client) for me to re-install the customer's Windows. I'd guess that more than 80% of these re-installs involve an OEM release of Windows, where the product license key is on a sticker physically and permanently attached to the computer's case. One which is quite obviously either a legitimate license or an extremely well made (and unlikely) counterfit. Now, about half of all re-installs (which require product re-activation) fail the product activaiton (even before I can install the WGA spyware). This requires a phone call to Microsoft's product activation line. Here, if someone asks me a question or the other phone line rings or I hickup, Microsoft's non-human system will often make me start all over again repeating a boring string of numbers. After this, I get informed that the product key can not be validated (Which is the reason I called in the first place) and put on hold again until I finally get a human (if not English) voice. Then I'm asked to repeat the first part of the boring string of numbers before I'm questioned like a murder suspect about why I want to activate Windows. After all this, I am usually provided the clearance code to activate Windows. Total time for this process per client computer is approximately 20 minutes. Repeat 4 or 5 times each day, 5 days a week and Microsoft has managed to waste a very large quantity of my billable time. However, after jumping through these hoops, WGA did not bother these clients (yet).
- James
Hi all
Had a problem last week that I'd never seen before...
I had to reinstall XP Pro at home, so duly provided my license key during installation. Much to my displeasure, I was then required to go through the whole WGA problem to get some critical security updates.
It flagged my license as a dud, and put my code on screen for me to see and sort out.
Except that it didn't put in my code - the one I'd set when I installed Windows - but a completely different code...
Greg
(Inside a nuclear plant)
Aaaarrrggh! Run! The canary has mutated!
Didn't know yet that MS license keys contain political statements :-)
Maybe this key was intended for the French market.
I am using, at home, a pirated copy of windows XP Pro...lifted from a company that I no longer work for...Huge organisation with corporate versions...Works flawlessly...I am, however, planning of buying Vista unless the cost is too high (as is the case for XP), at which point I will wait until I can get another corp version.
Posting anon
Question: What is the computer, and what exactly is transferring?
Is it transferring if you move the hard drive to another box? What if the board dies and you replace all the hardware around the disk? What if only the motherboard dies and you replace it (same or different model)? What if the disk does and you restore an image to the new one?
What I called "my desktop computer" went gradually from a Duron 850 to a dual Athlon MP 2000+, with gradual replacement of motherboard, video card, sound card, addition of a disk, and SCSI card. Yet through the whole process I kept the same Linux install (Windows didn't survive the motherboard swap), and it was in my eyes the same computer, just a bit better. I never got to the point of having two desktops, just a box that was getting upgraded and a box of spare parts that was growing larger.
That red sticker wouldn't be in the shape of a large letter "A", would it?
You'd just hear all the hoots from your PDA and Laptop, whispering behind it's back, "How Cheap, for Shame!"
Sorry, I couldn't resist. Props to all the Hawthorne fans...
-- You are in a maze of little, twisty passages, all different... --
Most of the time copyright infringement is a civil matter. However, in some cases it's a criminal offense: see 17 USC 506 and foreign counterparts.
A MSDN-subscription is a subscription to the MSDN-online service hosted at MICROSOFT.COM . there are no "cracked" MSDN-subscriptions.
I recently bought a laptop from dell that came with Windows Home. I gave that disc to my sister and bought pro with my student discount and actually got both versions for less then dell charges for Pro.
I wiped the drive, set up a dual boot(ubuntu) and installed pro a few minutes after opening the box. When I booted up it asked me to activate, so I setup my internet connection and tried to activate online. It wouldn't let me, it kept saying my internet wasn't configured and presented a web link for help. I clicked the link and it worked just fine.
When I got to the site it said my copy was probably not genuine and I should take action to fix this by buying a legit copy. I bought my copy in a box off microsoft(through the college). I tried everyday for 29 days to get it to activate and everyday the same thing happend. Finally I did the phone activation which worked fine.
This made me wonder how many people would beleive there copy was not legit and buy a new one from MS. It also made me wonder why it would direct me to a website to resolve the issue AFTER telling me my internet connection was not valid.
I knew my copy was legit, but how many people have been duped into buying another copy this way? It assumed activation failed because it wasn't genuine, not because my internet connection failed. It just all seemed very odd...
How did you get my CD Key?
You... killed my son... you.... pirate bastard.
Or maybe I am. I couldn't care less.
.iso has over 100 keys in it. I picked one. Lately I've let WGA install and do its thing and never had a problem.
I downloaded a copy of XP Pro SP1 from somewhere (can't remember the site) nearly four years ago. The license.txt file that came with the
These days I have the same XP load running under VMWare on my Fedora box. If WGA ever shuts it down, I'll just delete the image and go on with life. I wish it was that easy for everyone....
I know for a fact that all the windows machines at my job are installed with the same keys for its software
Abreu? Bobby Abreu? Was that at your job before the trade or after? I always figured the Phils was a Windows shop.
A couple of years ago (when I was a bum and had no money) I had one of these VLK thingies installed. Fast forward to 2-3 years later, good job, new car, laptop (with geniune windows) and all that jazz, my old installation still exists on one of my computers. I can download updates but fail the wga authentication, from what I've seen it works like it should.
yea yea I should probably go buy a real windows xp but I already have a real one on my laptop and vista is around the corner so I'll just wait for that. The OPs logic is a bit weird tho. Just because your key hasn't been banned does not mean WGA does not work.
did you forget to take your meds?
I have initially not WGAed my home computer, my girlfriends computer, and my work computer just because the Big Brother concept pisses me off. All those machine have legit licenses and my work has a MSDN license for me ontop of those licenses. This has prompted me, a long time Visual Studio supporter (sadly even in the MFC days), to start dual booting my machines with linux and practicing C++ development with cross-platform IDEs. I fear the day when my OS is owned and leased to me from Microsoft as my content provider. We do not need another cable company.
That'd possibly make some peaple read and, as you know, reading is dangerous.
Especially reading software-manuals endangers valuable tech-support.
am i the only one that just unchecks the box that says 'Windows Genuine Advantage Tool' under Windows Update? just click that, tell it not to bother you about that update, and continue to recieve every update released without problems =]
What licence? They sold me the software via a reseller, with no requirement to read, agree, or sign anything from microsoft prior to the purchase.
Once the product is delivered, there are nice pretty stickers saying I have to agree to a licence before I use the product. But what licence? It's my box, my CD, and my copy of Windows. First Sale doctrine says that once they've sold me a copy of a copyrighted work, that copy is mine and they cannot use copyright law to apply any further terms to my use of said copy POST SALE. That sticker is now my sticker, my receipt says so, so they can stuff their OEM terms wherever they like.
You could argue that I need to agree to the licence in order to use windows update and activation, (i.e. an ongoing relationship), but I don't recall any notice to that effect when you activate. Nor should an artificial technical restriction to get round first sale doctrine stand up well in court.
Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
Actually cracking a dongle probably isn't any harder than cracking a regular serial key or cd check system. I have used, err not me, I don't pirate, my friend, yeah that's right a friend of mine has used a pirated copy of software in which there was a crack to suppress the dongle checking code in the program. If the code that checks the dongle is skipped, or given the correct response, then the program can work. Of course more complicated dongles might actually decrypt part of the program before it can be run, but even those can probaby be cracked in only software and no physical dongle copy need be made.
-- ssoorrrryy,, dduupplleexx sswwiittcchh oonn.. -Quote found on actual fortune cookie.
At least in the United States, (1) covers file trading through the 17 USC 101 definition of "financial gain":
Some people like to justify their pirating using inflated software costs.
XP Home OEM (good enough for home use for most people, really - that's if it didn't already come bundled on their PC) - 96$ CAD at ncix.com last I checked.
As for Photoshop, I've legally purchased CS2 for home use. Too expensive they all say... 150$ right from amazon.com (an upgrade version, from any version, like the v5 LE that came bundled with a cheap digicam, or version 2.5 on floppies for 99 cents off ebay or something...) I use it extensively, and I have no problems paying for it. Might have been cheaper than 150$ if I even bothered looking at other places. Alternately, my dad bought photoshop elements (for ~half of what I paid), which is almost as good, and more user friendly to boot. Oh, and I'd had similar apps (MS digital imaging suite - latest version) bundled for free with a keyboard/mouse combo (haven't bothered even opening it though, as I really wanted PS, but it would be good enough for most people too). And lots of people like Paint Shop Pro better, which is only ~100$ CAD (for latest version - "X") IIRC. Older/2nd versions (which are still suffucient for most people) or even upgrades are even cheaper. Yet people will whine the usual "I can't afford the 1000000000000000000000000$ photoshop costs!!!1!1!one!!!1" - total B.S.
Never used final cut pro though... No idea what it does or if there are any cheaper mostly equivalent apps or such.
Of course, not all software is cheap (I can't afford Win2003, even if I need it), but most of the time it's just a pretext people use to pirate stuff and feel good about it. I pirate what one can't afford (if there are no decent alternatives - not many cases), and buy what's decently priced to support the people who make it.
The OEM license rights you are speaking of are those of the OEM customer which limits that customer from taking their Gateway PC license and putting it on a homebuilt machine or giving the disc to a friend to install on their old Dell.
;-)
I don't want to get too philisophical, but what constitutes a machine from an OEM manaufacturer (my) standpoint?
I bought my OEM license with a HD and built a system with that HD. What happens when that drive dies? DO I not have the right to put a new hardrive in that system and reload windows?
Likewise, if that motherboard goes can I not put the hard drive into another system?
I believe that there is more right of transferability as an OEM than as an OEM customer from machine to machine -but not from customer to customer.
As far as I am concerned, when I have bought an OEM license as an OEM that license is good for one machine -old or new. Otherwise I would be buying a new license every time I decommissioned a machine -and I don't think I am going to get very good terms on a site license
-What's the speed of dark?
I've been using a bad copy of Windows xp for years now. Sure they dont allow you to go to windowsupdate and download patches, but automatic update still works fine. So the moral of the story is that it doesnt matter, the threatened punishment is completely hollow.
They claim that all but "a fraction of a percent" of those 60 million people who've been denied access to Microsoft updates and downloads are guilty, guilty, guilty.
A fraction of a percent (i.e. < 1%) of 60 million are legitimate? That would be anything under 600,000 people.
So, better that a thousand pirated copies run free than six hundred thousand legitimate copies be denied a security update?
Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
Gentoo users can soon share the Windows users' feeling of, well, whatever Windows Genuine Advantage provides. Just enter USE="-working" emerge genuineadvantage and watch in marvel as ninety percent of all ebuilds become hard-masked. Gentoo Genuine Advantage, coming soon to an overlay near you.
(Note: The Microntoo Corporation does not advise usage of the "cracked" USE flag. If you install the pre-cracked version of GGA the terrorists have already won.)
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
In order to download the MBSA, you need to be authenticated by WGA
Depends. If you are in a UCITA state you have the pleasure of having terms of a sale applied retroactively to items you bought. Of course, only two states passed the UCITA, Virginia and one other.
I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.