Apple Console Rumour Resurfaces

1up has commentary on speculation from an industry analyst, which GamesIndustry.biz has published. Prudential analyst Jesse Tortora gesticulates wildly in the direction of renewed interest by Apple in the games market. From the GI.biz article: "We think the videogame market represents a distinct possibility for Apple, especially considering that it recently announced the availability of videogames for its iPod through its iTunes store ... The game console device could be morphed out of some combination of the MacMini and iTV, while the handheld player could be developed as an enhancement for a future version of the widescreen iPod."

Comments

apple + videogames = ?

[krotkruton]

Yeah, because when I think of video games, I think of a Mac.

But seriously, this will either follow the usual theme of Mac gamers (being that they don't exist) or it will give Apple a chance to bust out of that stereotype.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[JoeCommodore]

I know, Pippin!

I actually saw one once!

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[lpcustom]

I think they just noticed how much the PS3s were going for on Ebay before they were release and thought "you mean we can get away with selling one for that". If they did release a game console:
a.) it'd only play the games it wants to play, when it wants to play them
b.) the retail price will match the PS3 pre-release ebay price. c.) no one will be lined up to get one

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Mike Blakemore]

I agree, Apple isn't on the list when you think of gaming.

As the article mentions, Apple makes it's money from hardware
(unlike everyone else who IS actually in the gaming market).
There would have to be some major changes there.

"We think the videogame market represents a distinct possibility for Apple, especially considering that it recently announced the availability of videogames for its iPod through its iTunes store," - Yeah, cell phone quality video games bring forth a new age of gamming only made possible by Apple.

And, consider the fact that most Mac users are old people, any console they release will tank.

They are using Intel chips now, so it is kind of feasible... Ok, maybe not.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Anonymous Coward]

And, consider the fact that http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/11/30/ 1827251, any console they release will tank.

Hey, that's not true! I know plenty of young hippie douchebags who swear by Macs!

The "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" commercials will back me up on this.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[joshetc]

I think it could have huge potential for apple. Especially if they can get some deals with major producers to create games for whatever their system is. Especially if they make it easy to port games from their gaming systems to OSX. Somewhat like what Microsoft is trying to do with DirectX and Xbox360. Something like that could bring more games to the mac and possibly open even more developers eyes to the mac gaming market....

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[silentounce]

"As the article mentions, Apple makes it's money from hardware (unlike everyone else who IS actually in the gaming market)."

Last I checked, Sony and Microsoft were making hardware, too. The profits do come from the games. The game developers receive those profits and the hardware developers get a large cut. How many games do you see out there that are developed solely by the hardware manufacturer?

Apple has a brand, a very popular one right now. If they can tie their gaming platform to the iPod it will definitely get their foot in the door. If Apple enters gaming it most likely won't be to compete head on with the 360 or PS3, at least to start. As Nintendo has shown with the Wii, you don't need to have cutting edge graphics or processing speed, you need an innovative idea. And although a lot of us do not like to admit it. Apple has been an incredible innovator in the past few years and their products are highly desired in the areas that they focus on. I guarantee that Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo have already considered Apple in their gaming business strategies.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Ucklak]

Apple isn't on the list when you think of gaming.
Pippin comes to mind and how that was a failure.

2 things are different now and maybe that is what the impetus is.

Apple's customer base knows how to use the internet.
There are thousands of free computer games available that can be played on computers today and people know pretty much how to do it today.

Their `iTV` or whatever will likely turn heads when it is released. I know I am interested. I do not own an iPod. I do like their interfaces.

If their iTV thing does what I think it does, it will become a gateway for their content to be delivered to the living room and that means games.

I bet that most people would like to play Bejewed or some other flash/java game outside of their computer.
That being said, most people have a computer so the TV isn't really all that important anymore as it used to be.

If the iTV will be a platform for specialized content (games) then maybe it will be worth looking into for casual gamers.
I doubt it will be the graphic caliber of the uber expensive Xbox and PS systems but it may have some content worth looking into.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[poopdeville]

As Nintendo has shown with the Wii, you don't need to have cutting edge graphics or processing speed, you need an innovative idea.

This is certainly true, and your observation almost touches upon an interesting parallel.

In some respects, Nintendo is the Apple of the console world. They produce quality hardware in an attractive package. They rely on interesting, well integrated features to sell their hardware. The Wii even looks like a MacMini on its side.

I wouldn't suggest that Apple couldn't do as good a job as Nintendo. But is there really room for both in the market? Especially when on considers Nintendo's (and presumably Apple's) target audience? If Apple made a compelling feature, Nintendo would be forced to retaliate with another. Ideas are a scarce resource, and I doubt Nintendo or Apple has a large enough cache of them to avoid lame gimmicks. Kids might be fond of gimmicks, but grown ups usually aren't.

In the end, this would erode both brands.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[7Prime]

Actually, Mac gamers are a huge part of the game industry... they're called "Console Gamers".

No, but seriously, we already have an Apple in the game industry: it's called Nintendo. They share almost identical business, interface, and design philosophies. If Apple were to have made the perfect handheld back in 2004, it would have been a DS. If Nintendo had made a digital media player back in 2000, it would have been an iPod. Sometimes I even start to forget which company is which, anymore, they've been so obviously cross influencing eachother for quite some time now.

The best thing that we could hope for would be a merger of sorts, in the area between gaming and portable entertainment: a cross-developed iPod/DS would be both very nice and make a lot of sense. But I just can't see Apple entering the gaming market and having anything different to offer from Nintendo, they're infostructure and design philosophies are just too similar.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[macdaddy]

You might want to brush up on your Pippin knowledge. The Pippin was a very interesting product. I wrote a research paper on it back in the day.

The Pippin was both ahead of its time and a late entry into the console market. Consoles were not a multi-purpose multimedia station back in the mid-nineties like they are (or can be) today. The Pippin was too much too soon and not enough of a console too late. By the time the Pippin-based products were on the market the market was already dominated the Big 3. They did what they were designed to do better too. The market wasn't willing to wait for the Pippin to mature given multiple mature alternatives. The Pippin should have remained an Apple R&D project and never should have been sent to market. Like so many of Apple's great ideas they were timed poorly. Had Apple brought back the Pippin 3-4 years ago as a multi-functional entertainment system (TV, DV, DVR, home audio, Web, some gaming perhaps) they would have had a stellar product on their hands.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

No, Sony is the Apple of the console business, no matter what the Nintendo + Apple = LOVE crwd says.

Which console manufacturer makes a console that not only can play AAC, can rip CD's into it? Sony.

Which console manufacture makes consoles and portables that can play iPod video content? Sony

Which console manufacture makes a portable device that can play AAC? Sony

Which console manufacture makes a console that is a true "home computer" and can do what the Mac Mini does but is a better game machine. Sony.

Which console manufacturer makes x86 desktops and laptops with style (Vaio)? Sony.

Which console manufacturer sucks at marketing which is why they haven't trounced everyone else with their technologically superior products? Sony.

Do the Sony commercials mention the fact that the PSP has a built in web browser, supports RSS and can download podcasts and vodcasts directly to itself with no PC intervention needed? No.

Do the Sony commercials mention that the fricking PS3 can run Firefox, Thunderbird, OpenOffice, can edit your photos, etc via Linux, so that it's not just $600 gametoy for lil Timmy, it's a computer too? No.

Frakkin SCEfoo marketing morons.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

There already is an iPod/DS, it's the Sony PSP. Why do you think the PSP plays AAC and video content encoded for the iPod. Surely Sony's been influcenced by Apple too, including the Vaio line.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Westacular]

From the perspective of the portable games market, the PSP is vastly more similar to the Zune than it is to the iPod.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Do the Sony commercials mention that the fricking PS3 can run Firefox, Thunderbird, OpenOffice, can edit your photos, etc via Linux, so that it's not just $600 gametoy for lil Timmy, it's a computer too? No."

they also don't mention it doesn't have a processor suitable for general computing processing loads, or that it has insufficient memory to edit most digital photos nowadays (even my cheap digital is 5 megapixel). they also don't mention it comes without a monitor or keyboard or mouse. basically the concept that the PS3 is a home computer is laughable, it doesn't have the general processing power of the cheapest low end laptop and yet is more expensive. FFS it is a gaming console, and given the hardware it has no chance of ever being much more than that.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[truespin]

"Which console manufacturer makes a console that not only can play AAC, can rip CD's into it? Sony."
You do know AAC is not an Apple proprietry format? The iTunes Store uses AAC protected with their FairPlay DRM (creating a .m4p file). Sony does not (nor does anyone else) make hardware or software that will play iTunes Store files because Apple don't license out FairPlay.

"Which console manufacture makes consoles and portables that can play iPod video content? Sony"
You do know h264 is not an Apple proprietry format? The iTunes Store movies/videos are saved as h264 files and are once again protected with Fairplay and won't play on any other hardware than your iPods and on authorised machines running iTunes.

"Which console manufacture makes a portable device that can play AAC? Sony"
See my first point.

"Which console manufacturer sucks at marketing which is why they haven't trounced everyone else with their technologically superior products? Sony."
So now you're implying Apple sucks at marketing!?
Or are you trying to say Sony has failed to trounce MS/Nintendo because of marketing and not the MASSIVE price tag of the PS3 and MASSIVE shortages of hardware? Let us not forget the PSX was inferior to the N64 but Sony certainly won that round. the PS2 was technologically inferior to the xbox and gamecube but again Sony definitely won that round too. Sony didn't win those rounds by technologically superior hardware.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

I have a PS2 Linux kit, and it's fully capable of running standard "home" applications at 294 MHz and 32MB RAM. The CPU isn't the bottleneck at all except for things like converting flv into MPEG4 with PSPVC, stuff like that.

  The PS3 is 10x faster and has 8x the RAM and you're saying it won't be able to do that? You do know that GIMP is capable of editing images larger than available RAM. I bet if had a 5 megipixel image I could load and edit it on the PS2. I've done 3.2 MP myself on it.

My local Wal-Mart has desktops on the shelf with slower CPU's and the same RAM.

Trust me, for home desktop uses the PS3 will run just fine.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

Oh sure AAC and h.264 aren't Apple specific formats, just strongly associated with Apple. For example all the vodcasts out there are described as being for the iPod Video even though the PSP plays them too.

And yes, Apple sucks at marketing or they'd have better than what is it now 10% market share? Overpiced products, the whole "we want the Mac to be seen as a serious machine so we won't encourage gaming on it" philosophy they used to have. The whole abandonment of the "home computer" market so they could sell overpriced Mac's to art departments in corporations.

IMHO pricing is the most important part of marketing.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[somersault]

I agree, Apple isn't on the list when you think of gaming.

Just as Microsoft and Sony weren't really on the list when you think of gaming until they brought out their own consoles, and Apple weren't the first thing you thought of when you thought mp3 players a decade ago..

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[RemovableBait]

I think the iPod is pretty big proof that Apple does not suck at marketing.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Manmademan]

To be fair, prior to the debut of the playstation Sony was a console game developer under the Sony Imagesoft Brand, Developed the VERY good sound chip used in the SNES, and collaborated with Nintendo on the never released SNES CD drive that eventually led to the playstation. Anyone who kept their ear to the ground re: the console industry could have seen a Sony console coming sooner or later. Microsoft is less obvious, though with the way consoles have been gradually inching towards PC territory it was inevitable sooner or later. Microsoft had also been experimenting with set top boxes for quite some time prior to the debut of the Xbox as well for the same reasons. (Remember ultimate TV?)

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

Apple is supposed to be computer company, not a portable audio company.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[truespin]

iPod + iTunes not fantastic marketing efforts? Both are clear first place in their market and the adverts have won numerous awards. I love the iTunes 7 Web site too.

"For example all the vodcasts out there are described as being for the iPod Video even though the PSP plays them too."
The press calls *all* MP3 players iPods too - it's a quick and easy way to write 'generic portable mp3 player'

"Overpiced products, the whole "we want the Mac to be seen as a serious machine so we won't encourage gaming on it" philosophy they used to have. The whole abandonment of the "home computer" market so they could sell overpriced Mac's to art departments in corporations."
Apple is an incredibly successful and profitable company, *even* on 4% (or similar) market-share.
Now that the 'Apple tax' is *much* less than it used to be (in fact Apple are now very competitive pricing-wise in the price ranges that they work in) Apple's computer sales have gone up - the MacBook and the MacBook Pro are doing especially well. ::hugs Core 2 Duo MacBook Pro::

Apple has changed a lot since Steve came back - their philosophy has changed a lot too. The Mac mini, iMac and MacBook aimed squarely at the consumer/home market. AirPort Express allows streaming of iTunes around your house very easily. The forthcoming iTV DVR/set-top box will do similar for video. FrontRow etc...

Combine the price reduction with the fact that you can run OS X, XP, *NIX easily off their entire product line, iTV, apps like iLife and FrontRow built-in I think we'll start seeing Macs *everywhere*...

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[silentounce]

Who dictates that law?
 
I suppose Sega is supposed to be a gaming hardware company then, too. And Sony is a Betamax manufacturer. And what the hell does IBM think they are doing? They are a punch card manufacturing company for God's sake!

A company that is just a ______ company is sure to die eventually, especially if they are not on the top of their market. Every company needs to find its segment of the market. Every company needs to adapt to survive. Apple may have been a "computer" company, but now they are evolving into something else. Would you rather they stagnate and die? I welcome any additions to the gaming world. Even if they don't fair well, the competition they provide will spur innovation in their competitors.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[somersault]

I don't remember ultimate TV, I was always a Mac/Amiga boy until 1998 or so when we got our first PC (well we had a 486 that I used to play Quake on but I don't think that counts :p ). Microsoft did make games before the X-Box, but I always thought of Sony as makers of walkmans until then(I was only 14/15 in 1998!)

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Manmademan]

You didn't really miss anything in regards to ultimate TV. It was a set top box that combined the features of a TIVO (though the interface was not as good) with a Web TV. It was released around the time when common thinking was that set top boxes like web tv would eventually overtake the pc as the dominant platform for web browsing, etc. nothing stellar...it sold terribly and microsoft dropped it once it became obvious this wasn't going to happen.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[drinkypoo]

Do the Sony commercials mention the fact that the PSP has a built in web browser, supports RSS and can download podcasts and vodcasts directly to itself with no PC intervention needed? No. Do the Sony commercials mention that the fricking PS3 can run Firefox, Thunderbird, OpenOffice, can edit your photos, etc via Linux, so that it's not just $600 gametoy for lil Timmy, it's a computer too? No.

There are two reasons for this. The first reason, which applies to both of your complaints here, is that everyone who cares already knows. They already did their marketing. It's called making press releases. The nerd press has done the rest.

The second reason, which applies mostly to the second one, is that the machine is not a credible general-purpose computer, primarily because it has too little memory. You could use it to surf the web or read your email but I shudder to think of what it would be like trying to do photo manipulation or similar. The PSP actually is similar; who wants to surf on a game console? But again, anyone who would want to knows that it can be done already.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Sizzlean]

Ummm Microsoft was on the list the minute Windows the defacto standard for playing PC games. I don't see too many being made to run on the competitors' OSes

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[somersault]

It's just a side effect that Windows is the 'standard' gaming platform on PCs as you say. Microsoft started off in the OS business, then later Office 'productivity', then games. There are more and more games being made that run on other OSes, and there used to be plenty of games made for Mac, Atari and Amiga. We're talking about a different market here anyway: console gaming. There is a distinction, though obviously a lot of people will have both a console and a PC.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[avronius]

I remember my first Lisa - now there was a gaming machine! I remember dragging files to the trash... Good times. Good times.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[freeweed]

Which console manufacturer sucks at marketing which is why they haven't trounced everyone else with their technologically superior products? Sony.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

*breath*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

Sony sucks at marketing and hasn't trounced everyone in the console world? You seriously missed the past 12 years of console gaming?

Sony, and let's be crystal clear about this, is the Microsoft of the console world. 70%+ of the console market, massive marketing campaigns, nearly everything runs on it, huge media blitz for new product release, proprietary formats everywhere...

Your post was a joke, right? Right?

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[JL-b8]

Who the hell wants to edit photos on a gaming counsel? First off, trying to constitute a PS3 as a cheap solution to a computer is ridiculous. Despite being able to use a keyboard/mouse on a PS3, you're going to use a regular TV to edit photos? Even with an HD tv you're going to have to shell out $2000+ and at that point I think it's moot. (Speculation)Plus you have to be somewhat tech savvy to even run linux/install it on the PS3 which most consumers aren't and could possibly brick the damn thing. Linux on the PS3 is a geek's wet dream but serves a purpose like tits on a bull. Sony just beat us to the question as to whether you could put linux on it. And Frankly, I'd rather have my gaming counsel and my work machine separate. I don't like mixing my ice cream with my mashed potatoes.

ChronoCloud... Sony or Square Fanboi? I'm putting my money on Sony.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[johnpaul191]

and Microsoft has always been associated with fun. in theory Apple could just buy up a bunch of game developers like Microsoft has done.

in all honesty it seems a bit out there. if these new Apple devices can play games, i would guess it's a secondary thing (if even that). if Apple is talking to game makers, or hiring a few in-house, i would think it is more likely to be for the iPod (or maybe iPhone, if it is real). Macs have always had some goofy little time killing games on them, like snake on older cell phones. becoming a full blown console maker is a bit hard to keep under wraps... even for Apple.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[johnpaul191]

b.) the retail price will match the PS3 pre-release ebay price so Apple would use a business model that did not lose $300 per unit sold?
talk about thinking different!

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

Who the hell wants to edit photos on a gaming counsel? First off, trying to constitute a PS3 as a cheap solution to a computer is ridiculous. Despite being able to use a keyboard/mouse on a PS3, you're going to use a regular TV to edit photos?

I've done it,works fine. People used to do all sorts of things on 320x200 and 640x400 displays.

Even with an HD tv you're going to have to shell out $2000+ and at that point I think it's moot.

You can buy 1080p HDMI sets for less than a 1000 here. But the PS2 does other resolutions so you could use an older or less capable (cheaper set) and still get better than standard NTSC.

(Speculation)Plus you have to be somewhat tech savvy to even run linux/install it on the PS3 which most consumers aren't and could possibly brick the damn thing.

Anybody who can follow simple instructions can install Linux on a PS3, or PS2 for that matter. It's like following a recipe. And there's no possiblity of bricking it, Linux is a totally separate thing from the GameOS, in both the PS2 and PS3 it's akin to dual booting Linux and Windows.

Running Linux is not that hard at all, plenty of books on the subject out there and since the PS3 can use standard PPC Linux binaries it's even easier, less need to compile everything like one does for the PS2 (though that isn't that difficult either) Anybody could learn to use the PS3 as a desktop machine.

Square first, Sony second, but SCEfoo can't market it's way out of a paper bag.

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Nossie]

Crono... your digging a very big hole for yourself lol

get out while you still can :P

http://theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=32171

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[Daedone]

Actually,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Betacam
Sony IS STILL a betamax manufacturer(scroll down to the bottom where is says HDCAM SR to get to my point, but its all relevant since everything about 15 years old or newer is probably still in use at some smaller stations).

You didn't think the TV station downtown uses a $20 walmart VCR did you?

Re:apple + videogames = ?

[CronoCloud]

Oh that, the PS2 works the same way. You don't use the "local memory" the way PC's do it. It's not a real issue except for anti-sony folks looking for some kind of ammo. You write to local memory, you don't read from it.
Nothing new.

Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[__aaclcg7560]

Buy Nintendo, slap an Apple logo on the Wii, call it Applicious and get sued by the Beatles (again)!

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[El Gigante de Justic]

Considering how much the Wii and it's packaging look like an Apple product, it seems like they are already working together.

In any case, it would make more sense for Apple to get into some sort of collaboration with Nintendo (iTMS Channel on your Wii maybe?) then to enter an already full gaming market. If Apple already had a games development studio, it might make more sense, but as it is, they're better off interfacing with the existing consoles instead.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[geekmansworld]

This would basically be a brilliant move if it could be pulled off. iTMS as a Wii channel? Oh yeah...

But try to get that idea past Japanese regulators, they don't take very kindly to the idea of "Gaijin" buying up their prominent corporations. Too bad, though. They seem made for eachother.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[HappySqurriel]

Actually, I think it would be a Bad idea for Apple to produce a games system (regardless of whether they bought a company or not) but it could be a good idea for them to partner with a company.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Dr. Spork]

Apple wouldn't actually have to buy Nintendo. They could just partner up. Nintendo has nothing to lose and lots to gain. Just to get a bit of Apple's good vibes halo would really help them. Unfortunately, Apple have been too busy mending fences with Sony and this would more than undo all that.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree that it would be a wise move. With such a deal, Nintendo could perhaps get access to Apple's iTunes and then the Wii becomes a very solid media distribution system, make it even interface with iPods with an adapter or something.

Lots to gain, almost nothing to lose from Nintendo's view.
Where as Apple would have lots to gain, almost nothing to lose; and have to do very little work on their end, as the existing system is already there.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[7Prime]

Now, from a business perspective, there probably is very little insentive to collaborate, so I'm not keeping my fingers crossed. And the world works just fine with these two companies separated, and in existance, anyway. It's just that sometimes the resemblence is uncanny.

However, the suggestion of an iTMS Wii channel is an awesome prospect... I do hope that they at LEAST have the foresight to do that.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[smic]

its got usb2...no need for an adapter

porting an itunes player/channel should be easy

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[NekoXP]

I don't think Apple has enough money to buy Nintendo anyway.

For the unsuccess of the N64, Gamecube, Virtual Boy and whatever other dumb mistakes they have made, Nintendo continue to make very very healthy profits each year (on par with what Apple make - they may have the iPod but Nintendo have the GBSP, DS, Zelda, Pokemon, Mario and every spin-off, and now the Wii) and I think it would be very, very difficult for Apple to stump up the cash for the real WORTH of the Nintendo brand, let alone the company, engineers (how much is Shigeru Miyamato worth alone?), entire product range and assets.

I really think an Apple iTMS channel on Wii would be a good idea though. It doesn't seem too difficult to organise; and if every Wii has 512MB of flash, you would need some place to offload those tunes and the photos you'd edit (did everyone see that photo edit app they demoed on the Wii site before launch? I can't find it anymore, help?!) and that would quite obviously be an iPod wouldn't it? It would look great in the cradle next to the Wii.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[ProppaT]

The only one of those products that wasn't successful was the Virtual Boy because it lost money. The N64 and Gamecube both made substantial money for Nintendo. The only way the N64 was a mistake was through poor marketing and not getting the developers the tools they needed in time, thus loosing developer support and marketshare. The CD vs. Cart issue is debatable, though it did loose them Square. The Gamecube was a success from every angle. It made money and maintained/gained market share. Despite what people say, it did/still does have a strong fan base and a fantastic library of games, even outside of 1st/2nd party games and multi-console games.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[NekoXP]

Nintendo have taken profit drops (although never losses) from the N64 and Gamecube.

Where the Playstation and XBox have had long, fruitful lives right up until they were killed off by their next generation siblings (PS2 games still being released TODAY!) the Gamecube has pretty much not had a good game in 2 years, game store simply do not pay attention to it because of that, and it has been blamed for a poor quarter due to "low sales".

However you're right they never had a truly disasterous mainstream product apart from the VB. They lost a lot of faith from developers with the N64 but seem to have won them back with the Gamecube and providing the Wii with practically the same hardware (just faster and nicer!) and the innovative controller seems to have won some hearts and minds as well as pocketbooks. It would have been better for them if they didn't have to woo developers back (Xbox360 and PS3 development seems to be a dead cert requirement for all game studios except for Infogrames/Atari who have sworn off PS3 until the EU launch at least).

But yeah the point stands. Nintendo make a shitload of cash from everything they do. If it's not from their home consoles, it's from their portables. They have substantial funds in the bank and can do what they like. And if something starts to fail.. hey, you could always bring out Pokemon or a Mario or Zelda for it. Isn't that what was wrong with the VB? Red Alarm and Galactic Pinball and a bunch of Gameboy WarioLand ports didn't cut it :D

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Manmademan]

The only one of those products that wasn't successful was the Virtual Boy because it lost money. The N64 and Gamecube both made substantial money for Nintendo. The only way the N64 was a mistake was through poor marketing and not getting the developers the tools they needed in time, thus loosing developer support and marketshare.The CD vs. Cart issue is debatable, though it did loose them Square. The Gamecube was a success from every angle. It made money and maintained/gained market share.

Neither the N64 or Gamecube were successful platforms for nintendo. Both Platforms lost substantial market share and sold substantially less hardware and software than their predecessors. The SNES Sold 50 million, the N64 Sold 32 Million, and The GC struggled to hit 20 million sold while the total size of the market actually GREW. Losing over 50% of your base over two generations isn't exactly the mark of success.

Third party publishers abandoned both platforms in droves and the end of both console lifespans saw droughts of months between releases. The N64 in particular is notorious for having virtually NO high profile third party support- Nearly all of the high profile titles released for it were produced by Nintendo themselves, and some Genres (RPG's in particular) were completely absent.

The VAST majority of Nintendo's profitability came from the success of the Gameboy and Gameboy advance line during this time as they were outsold by a wide margin on Software and Hardware by their competitors in the console area.

The CD vs. Cart issue isn't really debatable, otherwise we'd all still be using carts. There's a reason everyone made the switch to optical media, you know.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[steveo777]

iTMSChannel? You read my mind. Hell, I'd pay another $25-50 bucks to be able to listen to whatever I want on my Wii when I'm gaming (like the 360). If I could just plug in my iPod... I know there are USB ports on the back. Any idea what they're for yet?

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Akaihiryuu]

The best part...since the Wii is backward compatible, Gamecube games are not going to disappear for a long time. Remember how store just recently (like within the past year) stopped stocking PS1 games? The GC games will probably be like that this generation. Anyone with a Wii can just pop in a Gamecube game and play it, so stores will continue to stock them, and new games (probably more budget oriented games, like the PS1 games produced during the PS2's life) will keep showing up, and they'll probably be cheap too.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Nevyn]

Where the Playstation and XBox have had long, fruitful lives right up until they were killed off by their next generation siblings (PS2 games still being released TODAY!) the Gamecube has pretty much not had a good game in 2 years, game store simply do not pay attention to it because of that

It lost third part exclusives, which is a big hit. But I bought Lego Star Wars 2 for it very recently, and Fire Emblem and Mario Party 7 (both first party) were released late 2005 (and Zelda TP is comming out any day now, if you don't have a Wii). I can't think of many must have games I got recently for the PS2 either, God of War (PS2); Ratchet Reloaded (PS2); Need for Speed (GC) and Lego Star Wars 2 (GC) are what I played before I got a Wii.

I think because a lot of people had something else as well as a GC, many stores found it more cost efficient to severly limit the GC stock (as people would just buy the Xbox/PS2 versions instead). For instance it took a couple of stores before I found one that had Lego Star Wars 2 for the GC.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Anonymous Coward]

Apple wouldn't actually have to buy Nintendo. They could just partner up. Nintendo has nothing to lose and lots to gain. Just to get a bit of Apple's good vibes halo would really help them. Unfortunately, Apple have been too busy mending fences with Sony and this would more than undo all that.

Try removing "Apple's good vibes" from the above post, and see what happens.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Anonymous Coward]

A partnership between Apple and Nintendo would be a fanboi's dream. There would be so much image I think my eyes would bleed.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Anonymous Coward]

There's a reason everyone made the switch to optical media, you know.
Yeah, like watching stupid 'Now Loading' messages all the time.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[El Gigante de Justic]

They haven't said much about what the USB ports are for, but it would be nice if I could just plug my digital camera in instead of having to upload to my computer, move the files from there to an SD card and then put the SD card in the Wii. Plug and Play keyboard support would be nice too.

The only confirmed item I've heard of for the USB ports is the wired network adapter that is coming out in January for those that don't have WiFi at home, or the Nintendo Wireless port on their PC.

As for listening to whatever you want while gaming, the only game I know of that supports that is ExciteTruck, and you have to bring the songs on via SD card - I'm not sure yet if it plays straight from the SD card or if you have to copy them to the flash. I've noticed that games don't give an option to save to SD card directly, unless that only because my card isn't an offical Wii compatible card from switch and carry.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Eq 7-2521]

I think you mean Appliicious, or maybe just Applii.

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[ronanbear]

iTV

[/speculation]

Re:Apple Need To Do Something ORIGNAL!

[Anonymous Coward]

apple consoles! give me a break! the brand is eroding faster than shit... call it iConsole ahah what a crap company

once that stock value begins to go down oh my! a company that survives on rumours is headed for destruction

It'll work great!

[the_humeister]

Just like their last one. BTW, isn't the console market getting a little crowded already?

Re:It'll work great!

[Anonymous Coward]

there's only 3 right now. 4, if you count the xavix.

The market has survived having more than 4 consoles in the past - look at the early 90's:
SNES, Genesis, Turbografx, Neo Geo. All of these were sucessful consoles with great games, though the latter two were somewhat niche.

the mid 90's got a bit crazy, however: besides the big 3 (playstation, saturn, and n64) there was the 3d0, jaguar, cd-i, pippin, and amiga cd32. and that's just in america. We currently aren't anywhere near that.

Re:It'll work great!

[twosmokes]

I don't think you can call Turbografx and Neo Geo successful. They may have had good games, but a good sign of a console's failure is when the manufacturer quits making consoles.

Re:It'll work great!

[Anonymous Coward]

It's interesting that Apple's stab at the console market was a platform that they licensed out to OEMs while Microsoft went with a top-to-bottom solution (providing the hardware, the killer app, the online service, and maybe some other things).

Anyway, not that I think Apple would or could break into the gaming industry, but they're basically a different company now than they were when the Pippin came out, so I don't know if its failure means anything.

And I wonder if people would think the OS market was "crowded" if Windows, Linux, and OS X had the same marketshare as Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo have in the console market?

Re:It'll work great!

[despisethesun]

Of course you can call the NeoGeo successful. It made SNK loads of money and had new games made for it for well over a decade. Unfortunately, SNK couldn't follow up its success and with the death of the old-school arcade, there wasn't a whole lot of new money to be made from the system.

The Turbografx 16 was also hugely successful, just not in the American or European markets. In Japan, where it was known as the PC Engine, it was more popular than the Sega Mega Drive (aka Genesis) and was a legitimate competitor to both the NES and the SNES. Again, though, NEC and Hudson couldn't follow up on their success and exited the market. By your logic, the Genesis was a huge failure because Sega no longer makes consoles.

Re:It'll work great!

[Mattintosh]

By your logic, the Genesis was a huge failure because Sega no longer makes consoles.

No, by his logic, the Dreamcast was a failure, whereas the Saturn was a success. That's the "absurd" point you were aiming for.

Re: It'll work great!

[eRondeau]

...because when I think of Apple, I think of videogames! (-;

Re:It'll work great!

[hal2814]

"but a good sign of a console's failure is when the manufacturer quits making consoles."

It'd be nice to know what you're talking about before posting. By your logic, the PC-FX was a failure as that was the last console made by NEC (and it was). The TurboGrafx wasn't even the second to last system NEC made. That dubious honor goes to the SuperGrafx (also a failure). And the Neo Geo wasn't even close to being the last console SNK made. Here's a list. Note that they are all followups to the Neo Geo (and all largely failures).

Re:It'll work great!

[twistedsymphony]

Just like their last one. BTW, isn't the console market getting a little crowded already?

Well even last generation had 4 consoles: Dreamcast, PS2, Xbox, and Gamecube...

The Generation before that we had the 3DO, Jaguar, Saturn, Playstation, and N64...

Before that we had SNES, Genesis, TurboGrafx-16, CDi, Neo-Geo...

If anything the market is the least crowded it has ever been save the video game crash of 1983.

Re:It'll work great!

[LordVader717]

No exactly. By his logic, a sign of a consoles failure is when the maker of the console quits, making the DC a failure. The reverse isn't necessarily true though. The Saturn was horrible even though they did make the DC.

Re: It'll work great!

[Raenex]

Nobody thought of Apple and music players together before the iPod.

Wrong end of the stick

[TheWoozle]

The only way I see Apple getting into the console business is *after* they've taken the living room by storm with their other media offerings (iTV, etc.). Exactly the opposite of the way Microsoft and Sony are doing it.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[maeka]

The only way I see Apple getting into the console business is *after* they've taken the living room by storm with their other media offerings (iTV, etc.). Exactly the opposite of the way Microsoft and Sony are doing it.

Fair view, unless you consider console games an essential foot in the living room door.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[NineNine]

Exactly the opposite of the way Microsoft and Sony are doing it.

What do you mean, exactly? My PS2 is the center of my entertainment now (games, movies, and music). The PS3 will do the same thing for me. What else is there?

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

On the other hand, they could put "casual" games on the iTV from the start. By "casual", I mean exactly the sort of games they're putting on the iPod right now: Tetris, Bejeweled, Pac-Man, etc. It would be a minor selling-point but be a sort of foot-in-the-door.

Really, Apple is in a good position to do this gradually. The first thing would be establish the iTV with these casual games. Meanwhile, they should be trying to get game developers to port more of their games to OSX, with simultaneous launches with the other platforms. Then they could release a decent bluetooth gaming controller (or maybe license the technology from Nintendo for the Wii-mote?) Finally, they could release a specialized iTV to run connect to this controller and play these games.

It wouldn't be so far different from what Microsoft has done. What's the Xbox, really? A computer running a modified version of Windows. It plays games which are not very different from Windows games (from what I've been lead to believe). There's no reason why Apple couldn't do the same thing-- release a specialized Mac that runs a specialized version of OSX, aimed at gaming. The difference might be that you could also take those games to your regular Macintosh and play them there, too (I wish Microsoft had done that, and made it so Xbox games could run on your PC).

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

I think he was saying, in the opposite direction. With the PS3 and XBox, Sony and Microsoft are leveraging what is essentially a game console to establish a foothold in general entertainment (movies and music). The poster was suggesting that Apple, on the other hand, could leverage what is supposed to be a general entertainment system (the iTV, which will play music and movies), in order to gain a foothold in the game-console market.

I'm not sure it would work, but I'm pretty sure that's what he means by "opposite".

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[HeavenlyBankAcct]

The only way I see Apple getting into the console business is *after* they've taken the living room by storm with their other media offerings (iTV, etc.). Exactly the opposite of the way Microsoft and Sony are doing it. Yes, because Sony is a relatively young upstart that sprung into prominence with the release of the Playstation. Never mind that whole Walkman thing, or VCRs, or televisions, or home stereos, or any of the other products that have been infiltrating American living rooms since the 1960's.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Anonymous Coward]

port more of their games to OSX before that apple needs to have better gaming hard ware a $2000 mac pro with a geforce 7300 and slow sever ram it not cuting it also not haveing a mid-rage head less desk top is no help as well.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[dlockamy]

Actually I fully expect iTV to have games and very likely it will play the games you already have on your iPod.

With the Mac,iPod, (iPhone?) and iTV combo + universal binaries could create an increable platform if Apple chose to.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Kayamon]

Despite what you may have read in the popular press, the Xbox isn't just a modified PC running Windows.

It runs it's own kernel, which is based loosly from the NT kernel. There's no GUI code at all present. There's no GDI/USER stuff. Also, you get almost direct access to the GPU, which is the essential path needed for any decently-performing console.

If Apple were to try this themselves, they'd need to throw out most of OS X and drop back to just running the Darwin kernel. They'd need to pick a GPU and stick with it for a few years, and give the developers complete access to it's internals.

It'd be a Mac in spirit, but not in practice.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

Despite what you may have read in the popular press, the Xbox isn't just a modified PC running Windows.

You're right, it's not a modified PC running Windows. It's a PC running a modified version of Windows.

If Apple were to try this themselves, they'd need to throw out most of OS X and drop back to just running the Darwin kernel. They'd need to pick a GPU and stick with it for a few years, and give the developers complete access to it's internals.

Oh, gosh, there's no way Apple could do that.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[drsmithy]

The poster was suggesting that Apple, on the other hand, could leverage what is supposed to be a general entertainment system (the iTV, which will play music and movies), in order to gain a foothold in the game-console market.

The iTV isn't a "general entertainment system", it's a glorified input switcher.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[pboulang]

The iTV isn't a "general entertainment system", it's a glorified input switcher.

The same could be said about IE or Firefox.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Kuciwalker]

A tri-core PPC CPU, custom video card, and optional hard drive qualifies as a "PC"?

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Blakey Rat]

If they're going to be trying to woo game developers, they're going to have to do something (and fast) to compete or be compatible with Microsoft's XNA development tools very very quickly. Using XNA/DirectX, developers can simultaneously develop a game for Windows Vista, XP and Xbox 360 with all the industry standard plug-ins (like Havok physics) and support for all the major rendering engines (like Unreal 3.0). That's hard to beat. Windows Vista might be disappointing, but I think everyone can agree that Microsoft Game Studios is kicking ass right now.

Considering Apple's best effort in this area in the past was "Game Sprockets" (the best parts of which were developed by Bungie anyway), and was quickly abandoned, I'm not holding my breath. Hell, does OS X even support joysticks? (Classic never really did worth crap, except mapping them like keyboards.)

And frankly, I'm sure this rumor is all a bunch of hot air. When a company is developing a game console, people know... simply the amount of game studios/tool developers/hardware designers/etc involved will make leaks impossible to avoid. (I mean, everyone knew pretty much everything about the Xbox a full year before its launch.)

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Yvan256]

Never mind the digital/internet revolution, where Apple knows how it works (Easy CD ripping, easy synching, iTunes, iTunes Store, iPod) and Sony is still stuck trying to force its consumers to eat up locked down/proprietary formats (miniDisc, Memory Sticks, Atrac3, Blu-Ray).

Apple has always been about computers and software, Sony has always been about separate devices, until recently. The fact that Sony has internal conflicts (Sony Hardware vs Sony Pictures+Sony Music) doesn't help them a bit.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Wizard Drongo]

Note. The poster stated 'XBox'. Not "XBox360" (which, by the way is a great example of a stupid sodding name...why the 360? It's not the third version, and it's got nothing to do with 3d gaming, as the first xbox did that too). The original xbox was a (if i remember correctly) 400MHz celery onion. And, for the record, the XBox360 is pretty damned near a pc, since it uses powerpc chips (which apple used in their pc's). And I guarantee you that somewhere in Apple, someone's got OS X running on one, just for a laugh.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[DrXym]

Except why would iTV take the living room by storm? The device is pointless unless you already own another Mac / PC which happens to be turned on, running the streaming software. Not many people would be inclined to go through all that.

Besides, if you want to watch movie downloads on your TV, then both the 360 and the PS3 will do it from a single box. The 360's service has already started and Sony's can't be far behind. And both the 360 and PS3 cost less than buying an iTV and even a Mac Mini.

Apple's position in the living room is looking incredibly tenuous. It's hard to see how they could possibly compete there. Their best bet would be to buddy up with either Sony, Nintendo or Microsoft because they'll be picking up scraps otherwise. Of the lot I'd say their "vision" is most closely aligned to Nintendo, but the Wii is such a godawful underpowered system that doesn't even offer HD that Sony might offer a better technical fit.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Xugumad]

Yeah - joining the console market for this generation would be incredible financial suicide. All three of the major consoles have launched (except the PS3 in about half the world, but never mind), everyone who was waiting for a specific console is now trying to get hold of one. Unless Apple is about to launch a games console imminently, it'd be coming out so far into this generation people would barely notice.

There's a decent chance one of the major console manufacturers will give up making hardware after this generation, and if that happened it would provide an ideal opportunity for Apple to join the market...

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Yvan256]

And frankly, I'm sure this rumor is all a bunch of hot air. When a company is developing a game console, people know... simply the amount of game studios/tool developers/hardware designers/etc involved will make leaks impossible to avoid. (I mean, everyone knew pretty much everything about the Xbox a full year before its launch.)

Oh, you mean like everyone knew about the 5th generation iPod which can play games? Even long-time Mac games developers didn't knew about it. Apple are usually able to keep their new stuff secret until it's on the market. I find it weird that they announced the iTV months in advance.

And now, put compatibility with these new iPod games on the iTV and you got a basic "games on TV and on a portable system that also happens to be the most popular digital music player in the world" market. The distribution chain is already there via the iTunes Store. All they need to do after that is release a free, simple-to-use devkit so people can make their own games, and with Apple's approval they could be sold in the iTunes Store (easy way to sell your games = one good reason not to release your games as freeware).

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Blakey Rat]

The difference between iPod games and Xbox/PS3/Wii games is tremendous. The iPod can play games like a cell phone can play games-- the controls are all off, the games themselves are simplistic, and the graphics and sound are at MAYBE Super Nintendo levels. Making the leap from that to competing with even Nintendo (the least powerful console of this generation) is enormous.

I don't think iPod games indicate anything... you might as well say that since Bejeweled runs on Motorola phones that Motorola is going to make a video game console. Not likely.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[mikey_man380]

the whole reason why Microsoft et al. don't want you to play console games on your pc is so that you BUY a console.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[RexRhino]

The trouble is, if you have an Xbox 360 you can download and play Bejeweled, Pac-Man, etc., right now. For the Mac console to compete on casual games (which Microsoft is already building a big library of...), they would have to make the console a "casual" price. If they would be charging $600 for a new console to play Bejeweled, people will probably just choose another console.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

Glorified input switcher? I don't know what you mean. Rumor is that it will have a hard drive to store movies, music, and TV shows, along with a menu system to sort through and play them. Plus, you'll supposedly be able to buy stuff from iTMS directly from the iTV. No word on whether there will be any PVR capabilities. It should be a handy little device.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

Sure, why not? If not, which component makes it not a PC? If I have three cores, it's not a PC? What if I have 4? Or 8? Do PCs need to be based on Intel chips? Do PCs need to have particular video cards? Must PC operating systems run from hard drives rather than some other media?

A couple years ago, you could have bought a quad PPC based Apple machine with a custom video card, and now you can buy a dual-core Intel-based Macintosh running more generic hardware. Rumor is, Apple's working on laptops that use solid-state storage for the operating system. Do these changes make the machines more or less fitting of the category "personal computer"?

Other than a lock that Microsoft built into the hardware, there's nothing really prohibiting the XBox 360 from having Linux installed on it, and using it as a desktop machine. So, yes, indeed, the current line up of game consoles are optimized both in hardware and software for gaming. However, there isn't any fundamental difference between these systems and the PC under your desk.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

Not necessarily. Typically, especially during the years where people are rushing out to buy these consoles, the console itself is a loss-leader. They want you to buy the games and the accessories, and the console makes money on those items, as well as licensing to other companies who make those items. This might not be true closer to the end of the product's life, but supposedly they never make much of a margin. As the console gets old, they have to keep cutting prices.

At least, this has been the conventional wisdom. Rumor is that Microsoft has started breaking even on the 360 already, which is a quick turn around. However, they're also likely to cut prices soon. Apparently Nintendo has been making money off of the Wii from the start. So it's just not clear that Microsoft's economic incentive is really towards selling Xbox consoles. It's a common belief that the reason they entered the market at all was in order to protect their Windows monopoly. One of the reasons people stick with Windows is that other platforms don't have games, and there were rumors that Sony had aims for making the Playstation into a media-center. By ignoring the console market, they were opening themselves up to a threat to Windows' dominance. Therefore, they threw a lot of money into an attempt to take over the console market to remove the threat.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[nine-times]

But that's just it-- whatever they charge for the iTV, the price won't be justified by playing Bejeweled. People will pay the price (if they'll pay it at all) because they want a good way of accessing their iTMS content on their televisions. However, if the iTV has casual games and you can buy movies through the 360, their markets begin to intersect.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Alzheimers]

Because it's competing with the Playstation 3, so Microsoft didn't want the impression that the "Xbox 2" was an inferior product.

Obviously, a 360 is 120 times as good as a 3, right?

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[drsmithy]

Glorified input switcher? I don't know what you mean. Rumor is that it will have a hard drive to store movies, music, and TV shows, along with a menu system to sort through and play them. Plus, you'll supposedly be able to buy stuff from iTMS directly from the iTV.

Well, that's changed considerably from the last time I heard about it. If it's actually doing that, it's a bit more useful.

Re:Wrong end of the stick

[Yvan256]

Cellphones are too varied and the market too spread out amongst different brands/models for a cellphone maker to try to enter this market. It just won't happen, even cellphones from the same brand can't play the same games (if they even can). Too many differences in LCD size, processor, memory, controls, etc.

And just like Nintendo isn't trying to compete with the high-end graphics of the PS3 and Xbox 360, maybe Apple just wants to steal Nintendo's low-end marketshare: simple GameBoy Advance games. After all, they now have sales numbers for such games from the iTunes Store, with an extremely limited choice of games too.

And they've also already got a portable system available with the 5th generation iPod. Add the fact that they're coming up with a set-top box for your television with their "iTV", and they already got the whole system in place: distribution, home gaming, portable gaming (same games as the home gaming too).

Sure, games have to be kept simple because of the limited number of controls, but it does have the clickwheel advantage (just like the DS and Wii have their own advantages) and it's more of a "it can also play games" factor, not a "it's a low-end gaming system" factor.

Now, if only they came out with a (free) devkit so people could make their own games, and even allow people to sell their games on the iTunes store, it'd be even nicer.

Gesticulates?

[emmp]

Prudential analyst Jesse Tortora gesticulates wildly in the direction of... Gesticulates??

Give me a break :)

Re:Gesticulates?

[Anonymous Coward]

I had hated several big vinyl houses in front of my house for about 20 years because the vegetables in these houses have the same feeling of melancholic...A week ago when I walked beside these vinyl houses, I talked to the vegetables in these vinyl houses. By using my third attention, I said to these vegetables 'Please, excuse human beings who will eat you soon. Don't get perverse as long as you live on the earth.'...When such a message could reach the vegetables in the vinyl house by me, beautiful transparent flash suddenly lightened in the vinyl house by me and the vegetables turned to be lively. Then I could feel relieved and joyful.

Re:Gesticulates?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sounds like someone had a good 4:20

Re:Gesticulates?

[Anonymous Coward]

damn fo sho

Re:Gesticulates?

[realityfighter]

"To gesticulate wildly" is an idiom indicating urgent and frantic communication, and usually implies that the thing communicated is not as important as the speaker implies, or just plain doesn't exist.

gma 950

[Anonymous Coward]

the mini can run flash games just fine

Here's an entertaining concept for you...

[david.given]

A stripped-down, customised OSX variant for the Wii.

Hey, they're both white. It's an ideal match. You heard it here first...

Re:Here's an entertaining concept for you...

[the_humeister]

The Wii has the lowest specifications of this console generation and it's already documented that the OS X kernel is slower than others such as Linux, which would be a better fit. Although a custom game-specific OS kernel would probably be even better.

Great news but will it run

[Anonymous Coward]

openVMS?

stupid analysts

[Anonymous Coward]

what kind of idiot extrapolates that apple will start making game consoles from the fact apple added a games section to itms?

iTV not released yet

[mkiwi]

Seeing as the "iTV" has not even been released and gone through a few revisions, I can't possibly see this happening in even a year. It could happen, though, as many games are written with OpenGL (as opposed to DirectX)- and it could be totally cool, since if you have a broadband connection and a wireless card, you can play games in your 7.1 THX certified 45" LCD home theater setup wirelessly over the Internet (Read: CmdrTaco's ultimate WoW fantasy).

Only problem is getting people in that particular age group and price point. But, one man told me, "Parents buy things. That's what they're for." [Insert inflamitory jokes about Paris Hilton here]

$0.02

Re:iTV not released yet

[Anonymous Coward]

We've had ITV for years in the UK. Trust me, you don't want it.

Re:iTV not released yet

[Anonymous Coward]

Insert inflamitory jokes about Paris Hilton here

Where do you stay while in France?

Inside....

OK so that is so bad that even as AC I am not going to put it in there.

Re:iTV not released yet

[b.burl]

Yea, what they did to formula one...ack! BBC rox.

Why not partner up with Nintendo?

[Dr. Spork]

Here's a concept that should be considered: Apple are clearly wanting to build a living-room device that displays content from the network and internet on the television. The hardware they will use will be better than the mere "just enough" to get the job done. So why not invest a couple of extra bucks and partner up with Nintendo so their living room device plays Gamecube and Revolution games? Surely future Apple hardware could hack it. Neither side has anything to lose: Apple's living room device becomes more versatile while the market for Nintendo games grows substantially. Plus, don't underestimate the the value of Steve Jobs and countless Apple ads saying the word "Nintendo" on multiple occasions. Nintendo need the added mindshare.

Re:Why not partner up with Nintendo?

[99BottlesOfBeerInMyF]

After the cell processor was more or less confirmed to win the battle for the console, but before Apple announced the switch to Intel this move seemed like a no-brainer. A virtual Nintendo console built into every mac would have been a real win. Now, however, the development for both the Wii and the Mac virtual console might be too hard. If Apple, Nintendo, and Sony were willing to shake hands in order to deliver a combined kick to Microsoft's groin they could to it as follows: build a single development platform on top of OpenGL and similar technologies that allow a game developer to target the Wii, Mac, Linux, Windows, and PS3 with minimal effort. Promote it like hell and hand it out to every college student everywhere. All the players are already behind OpenGL in one way or another. This would have a similar, but more widespread effect and threaten some of MS's lock-in with respect to their crown jewels (Windows). But then I've always been one of those "a strong offense..." types.

Re:Why not partner up with Nintendo?

[7Prime]

What's a "Revolution"? Wasn't that the predicessor to the Wii?

What a silly name. Glad they changed it.

Re:Why not partner up with Nintendo?

[thermal_7]

So why not invest a couple of extra bucks and partner up with Nintendo so their living room device plays Gamecube and Revolution games?

For the same reason that Nintendo don't release Nintendo franchise games to non-Nintendo consoles. Exclusivity drives people to buy Nintendo consoles, which they actually make money off as well as the games. In addition they also lose brand recognition as the Nintendo console is no longer seen as a magical wonderful box but as something easily emulated. And lastly, what happens if Apple take all the Nintendo consoles sales? They are suddenly essentially relegated to a software vendor despite all their investments in producing and marketing a console.

Re:Why not partner up with Nintendo?

[Evangelion]

I have a better idea.

Just port iTunes over to the Wii.

People will want to buy music on the Wii, and people will want to watch movies and TV shows, so let them buy them from iTMS. The Wii has USB , so you could even sync your iPod with it.

Or if Apple just wants to tie the product to their CPU sales, have them port the iTV "streaming" software to the Wii, and still require a Mac on the LAN to stream from.

While it wouldn't directly make Apple money from iTV-like hardware sales, it would be a strategic interception to the MS/Sony movie/music purchasing systems, keeping iTMS in the picture.

Re:Why not partner up with Nintendo?

[poot_rootbeer]

Plus, don't underestimate the the value of Steve Jobs and countless Apple ads saying the word "Nintendo" on multiple occasions. Nintendo need the added mindshare.

One, I don't think Nintendo really needs that much additional mindshare. Even non-gamers are talking about the Wii, and they've sold something like a million of them worldwide in the past month.

Two, I don't think Apple has that much additional mindshare to offer to Nintendo. True, the iPod may give them approximately 2/3 of the portable MP3 player market, but an Apple home game console would not be part of that market. And in markets other than the iPod's, Apple's share is marginal: 5% of PCs, optimistically.

Nintendo tried to partner with Atari to bring the NES to America in the 1980s, but that fell through. They tried to partner with Sony to bring their games to CD in the 1990s, but that fell through too. Then they partnered with Philips instead, and the CDi was a massive failure.

I think we need to recognize that when Nintendo chooses to go it alone, it probably has very good reasons for doing so.

Apple and Gaming

[DECS]

Microsoft uses DirectX to tie game development to Windows and the Xbox. That presents a significant weakness for an Apple assault into serious PC gaming, on the level of Microsoft trying to displace the iPod with the Zune. Microsoft can spend billions for years and may still end up no better luck than five years of Janus/PlaysForSure.

Apple's best bet may be to target competition with the Wii - leave Sony and Microsoft to fight over $500-700 game consoles (they are both the same price with HD optical media playback), and join Nintendo in trying to sell $200-300 simpler games to a wider audience.

The Wii targets physical gameplay and retro sales of earlier games. Apple already has the gameplan down for selling music, TV, and movies, in addition to free podcasting, and recently, online game sales for the iPod. The iTV is an iPod cousin that uses an HDMI TV instead of a 2.5" screen, plays the same content, works from the same iTunes media libarary. It also is tied into iPhoto and home movies with iMovie.

Future consoles aren't going to be 2006, they're going to be a lot broader. Apple has a lot of elements in place to deliver, and its own retail stores to hawk them.

Why Apple Will Change TV

Re:Apple and Gaming

[Anonymous Coward]

Now that's what I call Big Pimpin'

Do you get cash moeny for all that linking?

About time!

[The-Bus]

We needed a Dreamcast for this generation and the original Microsoft Xbox team has been pretty nervous about "being the next Dreamcast" ever since the 360 debuted its weird circular logo and brought Peter Moore on to lead the whole thing.

Eh?

[djupedal]

"...especially considering that it recently announced the availability of videogames for its iPod through its iTunes store"

I know I get all tingley when I think about playing 'Pong' & '2-D Centipede in My Pants' on my iPod...ohhhhhhhh....ahhhhhh! Start of a revolution, that! Look out PS3! U 'pwned!!

What about emulated games on an iPod?

[wooden pickle]

What would make me giddy like a schoolgirl is if Nintendo and Apple somehow got together and made it so I could play emulated NES/SuperNES games on my iPod, assuming it's even technically feasible given screen size, processing power, etc. Given those two, I imagine it would be possible to make a controller that plugs into the connector on an iPod. Would be awesome!

Re:What about emulated games on an iPod?

[Anonymous Coward]

Get a PSP

Re:What about emulated games on an iPod?

[Spikeles]

Instead of whining about it, go get http://ipodlinux.org/ and port an already established emulator across.

Re:What about emulated games on an iPod?

[dancingmad]

That could only improve the sales rate of Nintendo's cash cow portable game machines.

Oh wait, no.

don't forget

[commodoresloat]

the joystick will only have one button.

Re:don't forget

[CastrTroy]

That might be a welcome change from the 10+ buttons, plus joysticks, plus DPad that some of the current consoles have.

Re:don't forget

[angrymilkman]

Hey that would at least make it accessible to the majority of the gamers suffering from physical disabilities who have a hard time now playing around with 16+ buttons. (why 16 buttons on a playstation 3 controller we only have 10 fingers?)

Re:don't forget

[carlivar]

So they can just use Atari 2600 joysticks!

Re:don't forget

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sure you typed that on a 10-key keyboard...

Re:don't forget

[Lehk228]

and it will take over 20 minutes to copy a 17 meg file

Re:don't forget

[master_p]

...and for a 2nd fire button, you have to hold the Apple key on the console down then press the fire button on the joystick.

Re:don't forget

[ben there...]

the joystick will only have one button.

And Apple fans will herald it as the best innovation since Apple invented the mp3 player...Er, wait.

Re:don't forget

[peterpi]

Apple & Nintendo are probably the only two companies with the competence to make it work.

Re:don't forget

[aplusjimages]

I'm still waiting for the keyboard that has one key. It would be a welcome change from the 104 keys, plus mouse current computers use.

Re:don't forget

[jandrese]

Especially if that button is labeled "Do what I want".

Re:don't forget

[Zenmonkeycat]

Like this?

It did the trick for me until I got an IBM computer back in the early '90s. Until then, my C64 and 1-button joystick worked perfectly.

I don't see this working..here's why

[way2trivial]

how many games do you play that can be made to work with just one button on the controller?

Re:I don't see this working..here's why

[blugu64]

Didn't the Atari only have one button?

Re:I don't see this working..here's why

[UtucXul]

Didn't the Atari 2600 joystick have only 1 button? And Steve Jobs did work for Atari. So as long as Asteroids and Pacman are good enough for you, it should be fine.

Re:I don't see this working..here's why

[Anonymous Coward]

For a more modern example, chck out Kirby's Air Ride for the gamecube.

Re:I don't see this working..here's why

[Anonymous Coward]

Didn't the Atari 2600 joystick have only 1 button?

Yes, because back then a hand had only had one thumb, dammit!
Damn kids and their new-fangled multi-thumb hands!

Obligatory

[93 Escort Wagon]

That makes perfect sense, wink wink.

Steve Jobs is an idiot

[Mike Buddha]

Steve Jobs has never embraced gamers as a legitimate target audience, regardless of the evidence that gaming is the number three reason people buy home computers, right behind the web and email. Even now, getting Apple to add decent video cards and support is like pulling teeth. Their implementation of OpenGL performs abysmally.

Apple may join the gaming fray, but they'll fall flat on their face with that egotistical moron running the show. He's gone out of his way to impede game creation on MacOS for fear that people won't take his baby seriously. Apparently, he believes you can do anything with your "bicycle of the mind" except have fun.

It's always the games

[Esc7]

There's a big problem that is brought up in the article: Console makers sell hardware at a loss. Yes, yes I know about the Wii and how it makes a "profit" but I doubt that is Nintendo's primary source of profit. It has been and always been the games. With Apple notorious for selling overvalued hardware in shiny plastic, this business model is something foreign to them. And then ponder this next point. So what GAMES is this iConsole going to have? If it just has ports of everything else no one in their right mind is going to buy it. It needs a killer app. Good luck Apple finding a developer to create a "must have game" on a new, possibly disastrous platform, for something you know absolutely nothing about. I detest companies trying to do everything for everyone. Do something and do it well dammit.

Re:It's always the games

[Mike Buddha]

I concur. There's no way in hell Apple will survive in the console market. Gamers are not willing to pay the premiums that Apple users gladly shell out. Not when there are comparable products from proven producers out there. They'll re-Pippin.

controllers will be like their mice

[kungfujesus]

ONLY ONE BUTTON!!!!!!!!!!!

Re:controllers will be like their mice

[99BottlesOfBeerInMyF]

Your comment does not really deserve a reply being a joke and redundant at the same time, but if you've seen Apple's recent mice I'd say they are of the same mentality as the Wiimote. That is to say, they are designed to be easy and accessible to everyone and to encourage developers to do the right thing. At the same time, they can easily enable power users to have the myriad buttons they need and want. In fact, Apple's "mighty mouse" is the only mouse I've ever seen where a shared computer can have one hardware mouse with one button for kids and novices and multiple buttons for expert users. I've seen firsthand what happens when novice users try to operate one of those four button designs favored by power users and I've cursed at trying to use the same mouse (as I'm accustomed to three or more). I find it sad that people still drag this old horse out of the closet, even if they're trying to be funny.

Re:controllers will be like their mice

[Anonymous Coward]

I've seen firsthand what happens when novice users try to operate one of those four button designs favored by power users

Umm.. "power users" use the fucking keyboard, asshat.

A "Me Too" product from Apple?

[tji]

I think they're smarter than that. They wouldn't go after an entrenched market, where they have no particular skillset advantage, especially one that you need to throw tons of money at to get a foothold. Gaming has been done, by many more qualified competitors.

I wouldn't be surprised if they offered a few simple games, for the casual gamer, on a device like the iTV. Similar to what they do for the iPod. But, I wouldn't call that going after the gaming market, any more than I would call the iPod a GameBoy/PSP competitor.

Re:A "Me Too" product from Apple?

[mgblst]

This is the whole point. They start of selling a few games for the iTV, just to say they have something to download. If people really enjoy these games and they take off, then they should be to capitalise on this, and start really pumping out the games. If they keep them cheap and simple, then there is a market that isn't really being tapped at the moment.

Re:A "Me Too" product from Apple?

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh, they wouldn't go after an entrenched market? What about their partnership with Motorola to sell iTunes-enabled cell phones? Are you saying no other cell phone out there can play music? And their rumored iPhone would just be another entry into the very crowded cell phone market.

They also entered the MP3 player market when it was full of competition. The fact that they ended up dominating it doesn't mean they don't do "me too" products.

Let's do the math

[Infonaut]

Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo are battling it out for console supremacy, devoting massive resources to winning this war.

Hey, what a great time for Apple to jump in! Low barriers to entry. No entrenched competitors, and a vast unserved market with pent-up demand. It's *perfect*!!!

Re:Let's do the math

[mrfett]

exactly my thoughts. this is the stupidest ploy to draw hits i've seen in a while. get the fanboys whipped into a bigger frenzy by the possibility of yet another mega-corporation entering the gaming market. how dumb do you have to be to buy into this delusion?

apple is hiring game developers to make sure their new iPods with bigger screens have a couple of decent launch titles. they might invest in making a few more downloadable games for the new models, with perhaps one or two built on entirely new IP. that's the extent of Apple's involvement in gaming. you'd have to be a moron to think Apple could compete in the console market. they can barely get decent OpenGL performance out of their current hardware (compare running WoW native and then under XP in bootcamp on a MacBook. it's pathetic). gamers would just laugh at any Apple-branded gaming device. this is coming from a diehard Mac user, btw. you can't change reality. for the record, though, Macs and 360s go great together (as long as you have access to a PC to run QTFairUse on, and share your music and photos with Connect360) :-P

alternate inputs

[Anonymous Freak]

It would also have the best voice recognition and handwriting recognition out there; but it wouldn't be advertised, because Apple wants to forget the past, even while retaining the technology...

oh great

[mgabrys_sf]

They could call it the Pippen 2.

I think games on the iPod and - eventually - the next generation iPod video - would be more than decent. Anthing more is a massive money drain for audience share. Nintendo has driven the 3rd man out argument by virtue of it's own titles. A fourth? I don't see it. But then the market HAS grown to proportions not seen - well - ever.

One button jokes

[Sneakernets]

Can we stop with the one-button jokes already? The Atari VCS had one button on it's joystick and look at what was possible with it!

Makes more sence for them to buy out Nintendo

[BlueCoder]

Just think about it. Nintendo tends to shoot for the family and low end market. They strive more for inovation of design. Their sales are not all that spectacular. It seems they are a worthwhile company for someone like apple to buy out. Further more it would open up the desktop gaming market to them as they could port all the nintendo games past, present, and future to OSX.

Re:Makes more sence for them to buy out Nintendo

[MemoryDragon]

Actually lately Nintendos sales are spectacular, look at the DS 20 mio consoles sold and no end, and the Wii seems to become a success as well.

Re:Makes more sence for them to buy out Nintendo

[BlueCoder]

Yes but it's Xmas time. Will it sell as well three years from now? I doubt it. Nintendo will maintain it's third place position I believe, maintaining the low end of the market. I give the odds that 50 percent of those that buy the Wii will at a later point buy a 360 or an PS3 once prices drop and a better game selections exist.

The money is in the games.

But let me reitterate. If Apple did buy nintendo they would attract a lot of interest. Especially on it's next game colsole and SDK which would make OSX the development environment for it. So making a game for the Wii 2 would open you up to all those Mac fans that wants to play games on their Mac. That market is practically non existant. So coming out with a hot game that is exclusive to the Wii 2 and Macs would go a long way to promoting apple's bottom line.

Re:Makes more sence for them to buy out Nintendo

[RyeGye24]

If Apple bought out Nintendo (which I dont think they have the money to do) it wouldn't help apple it would only hurt nintendo. All these people talking about an apple nintendo team are stupid as all it would do is drive away nintendo's fan base. I know this as i am a nintendo fan who waited 16 hours in line for the wii writing this post on my trusty PC. Listen, just because they're both white and shiny doesn't mean that they're the same.

Apple should buy nintendo

[Billly Gates]

Marketshare is needed if they want to not waste billions like Microsoft and Sony did.

Nintendo already uses powerpc chips and making another wii with macosx and frontrow would be great. They could use nintendo api's to backport alot of wii titles to teh mac if any developers want to target that market as well. Too bad Apple switched to x86.

Re:Apple should buy nintendo

[nanarchy]

games development is incredibly expensive, Apple don't have the gamers mindshare or developers for it. Why would nintendo even consider Apple, they bring nothing to the table, there hardware is to expensive, they have no gaming experience, there OS is completely incompatible with the nintendo stock of games. I don't like either company, but this would just be self destruction for nintendo if they did this for no good reason, why partner with a loser when your winning?

Re:Apple should buy nintendo

[Billly Gates]

I was thinking more of Apple buying nintendo more as a means of adding a gaming function to their front row DVR which is basically their sub $499 mac. Microsoft eventually plans to merge their Windows Media Center OS DVR functions to the next Xbox where its going to be the center of every home. Kind of like a home server for games, music since it will sync to a Zune, TV recording, and hd-dvd watching.

Apple needs to compete and it doesn't have mindshare nor game oriented developers so buying Nintendo would make sense. Frontrow 3.0 mixed with gaming functions would be sweet. Also Apple owns the majority of mp3 player market at the moment and they could use their Ipod and Itunes to make their appliance a stereo as well. Zune unfortunately is not real popular at the moment but it can sync to the xbox.

Re:Apple should buy nintendo

[p0tat03]

Apple is still a computing company first. Moving to x86 is probably the single most important thing they've done in YEARS. The possibility of running Windows on a Mac is what has converted many of my colleagues to Mac over the last year. The Switch is occurring much faster than it has ever before, and much of that is thanks to the Intel move.

n-Tunes

[Pi_r_ed]

Nintendo's "Shop Channel" has so-far only shown games, and had us all waiting for the Opera browser. Why not team up with Apple, and include an iTunes application for the thing? It can't play CDs anyway...

Re:n-Tunes

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, that's why itunes wouldn't make sense - can't play CDs. Meaning it can't rip CDs so you can put them on your ipod.

I think it doesn't have the right laser in there, but you'd have to ask someone who's taken one apart. The lack of a hard drive also makes it a bit useless for shuffle/nano owners who can't store their music elsewhere, though it has a USB port so they could add one through that. Or use a network drive, but that's a bit slow/unreliable/expensive.

Possibly a later model will play CDs (and DVDs) and perhaps even have a hard drive.

Anyway, why would Apple bother? They use the ipod to sell macs. If you can buy a much cheaper Wii then they lose that advantage.
If they really wanted to decouple the ipod from the mac/pc they could just stick wifi in it and let people buy direct on it from ITMS. Release a dock with a CD drive for ripping and they're done.

Re:n-Tunes

[CronoCloud]

Wouldn't it make more sense for Apple to work with Sony, apart from the usual fervor of the cults of Apple and Nintendo for a team up.

The PS3 already has a hard drive, and can rip CD's (into AAC, MP3 or ATRAC), can play video encoded for iPod, and runs Linux ( I wonder if OSX would run via Mac on Linux distributed with Yellow Dog 5.0 for it)

You're missing something...

[7Prime]

Noone would buy a Mac if it simply had Windows installed on it. People buy Macs because they love OSX, and its integration with the hardware. OSX is to Apple what Zelda and Mario are to Nintendo. People wouldn't buy a Nintendo, anymore, if Nintendo stopped selling great games, and stop trying to create an inspired atmosphere for developers to do the same. People wouldn't buy Macs if Apple stopped making OSX and stopped pushing developers to be more consistant, interface friendly, and created a framework for them to create better software.

It's all about infostructure, and both Nintendo and Apple have very similar philosophies when it comes to their developer frameworks.

The only real difference is how they ACTUALLY get their money. In the gaming industry, hardware is sold at a loss or at only a small profit (even Nintendo wouldn't stay in the game if they ONLY had their hardware profits to live off of). In the computer world, hardware is sold at a huge profit, and software is used to promote the hardware (iTMS and the iPod being a good example).

Simply because Apple, itself, doesn't "do games", per-say, has very little relivance. They don't do games because the Macintosh lost the gaming war LONG AGO, and it would be futile for them to put a lot of money into trying to win back that market. Also, Apple's plug-n-play, and hard-nosed infostructure is much better suited for the console market than the Computer Gaming market, which are very different.

So, you're right, Apple doesn't have a snowballs chance in hell in the Computer Gaming market. They have about as much chance as Nintendo does in the PC gaming market. Both have an attitude very well suited to the console gaming market.

Re:You're missing something...

[Txiasaeia]

"Noone would buy a Mac if it simply had Windows installed on it. People buy Macs because they love OSX, and its integration with the hardware..."

Off-topic, I know, but I bought an iMac about a month ago solely for its form factor. I needed a small, silent, reasonably fast machine for everyday use and couldn't find anything with as small a footprint as an iMac. I really despise OSX and use it only as a media player, but XP flies on it. So yeah, there are some people out there who buy Macs for the hardware alone.

Re:You're missing something...

[Anonymous Coward]

I normally don't do this, but I want to help you out because you sound intelligent, but you are writing stuff in a way that makes you look like a moron. First, "Noone" is not a word...if you pronounced it, it would sound like noon. You need to separate the words to get "no one". Could be a typo, but I am guessing not when you use a work like "infostructure" twice. Try "infrastructure". It's just hard to take you seriously when you write like that.

Re:Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft...

[r_benchley]

When Sony introduced the Playstation, everyone thought that it would get stomped by Nintendo and Sega. Even though Microsoft has huge cash reserves, there were some who thought that Microsoft would get whipped by Nintendo and Sony. It wasn't the market leader, it sold a respectable number of consoles and proved that it was a player. Apple could compete with Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft, but they would have to make very good decisions. Otherwise it would be a repeat of the poor, dead Pippin.

In other news

[Anonymous Coward]

Another bit player in the hardware market is think that they "might want to be competitive" because they have one good product that is at the top of the list in its' class.

Nothing to see here, move along.

ac

Re:In other news

[p0tat03]

Apple... bit player?

A little too much ganja, mon?

Yes, we all know Apple only has one good product at the top of its class. Nevermind the MacBooks that're selling like hotcakes... or the fact that it has multiple iPod products, each of which is at the top of their respective classes...

Easy answer...

[Aphrika]

Buy an iMac... shove Boot Camp on it... Games Machine!!

Seriously though, maybe they should concentrate on having people write games for their computers then. I mean granted, you have Civ IV and Doom, but 99% of Mac games arrive late and it's just embarrassing. I mean they have Myst as the splash graphic for Strategy Games on their store for Pete's sake! My local Game store here in the UK has just removed its Mac shelf (yup, one shelf) to make room for... more console magazines.

If Apple are really serious about making a console, it isn't going to happen anytime soon. Put plain and simple; Apple don't understand gaming. And if they did, it'd probably hurt their 'creative professional' image. Leave the consoles to people who do it best and plough your money, brains and time into making the Mac better.

Re:Easy answer...

[Anonymous Coward]

This is what I was thinking. I like games and that's what drove me away from Apple. There history of gaming is one of the worst, apart from devices like my toaster that don't play games at all. Combine that with the selling price of Apple products, which tends towards the high end and I envision a $900 console that only plays antique java games and a few crummy ports of Windows games (5 - 10 years after release on Windows).
 
Boot Camp - the one thing that started bringing back to the idea of having an Apple computer again to me.

Calm down everyone!

[jlebrech]

It's just a rebranded Wii.

How about a real 3D graphics console?

[master_p]

...and I do not mean 3D as in 2D graphics with 3D drawings but real 3D graphics, as in floating in mid air images with 360 degrees visibility. The technology is already available.

And if such a console was coupled with an innovative control method analogous to the Wiimote, it could be a success.

I do not see Apple succeeding in the console market in any other way.

And we'll call it...

[konigstein]

the apple iBox360.

This is not going to happen. However...

[soft_guy]

I think that Apple probably is trying to come up with some strategy to address the problem of not enough games for the Mac. I don't think they will make a separate video game console. I think they will do some things to try to make the mac more attractive to game developers and maybe they will create some games of their own for the Mac.

Re:This is not going to happen. However...

[Jerry Rivers]

This makes a lot more sense than trying to create another console. Simply doing more to facilitate game developers for the Mac would be enough. They don't need to create a new platform.

A similar thought

[Mr. Samuel]

This touches on a remark I was going to make regarding the grandparent.

OS-X should be a major draw for Apple customers. In my opinion, it's a top-shelf OS that makes Windows XP seem crude.

With that said, I'd love to see some stats on how many people buy an Apple product (computers especially) because of the "pretty" factor; I'm certain there are people drawn to Apple computers on looks alone, unaware they are different from a "normal" (read: Windows) computer.

They should stick to what they do best.

[HiVizDiver]

Making inane trinkets for hipster doofuses.

Oh, wait...

Re:Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft...

[Manmademan]

When Sony introduced the Playstation, everyone thought that it would get stomped by Nintendo and Sega. Even though Microsoft has huge cash reserves, there were some who thought that Microsoft would get whipped by Nintendo and Sony. It wasn't the market leader, it sold a respectable number of consoles and proved that it was a player.

Are you mad? Microsoft DID get whipped by Sony. They sold less than 1/5 as many hardware units while losing 4 Billion dollars in the process. Nintendo at least was somewhat profitable with the Gamecube. Any other company NOT in a position to bleed cash like mad would have been in no position at all to offer a follow up console in those circumstances.

Mood lighting

[steveo777]

Mood Lighting! Get the blue one to compliment the LED on your PS2

How about...

[TomRC]

How about a $199 add on to a Mac that makes it XBox360 compatible, using the existing DVD, hard drive, display, sound - i.e using the Mac as an audio and storage peripheral, and steal its monitor to play games? And that can also work with any PC whose manufacturer takes the trouble to tweak the software?

Nope not a good idea

[Azih]

Apple as they are currently have no hope of succeeding in the console marketplace. The thing to understand and what's being ignored is that any console machine NEEDS a steady supply of games software to have any hope of succeeding (at least half a dozen games a month). This steady supply has to represent as many genres as possible, be of mostly solid quality with regular standouts and at least one killer app per year (during the holiday season). No game hardware company can provide this quantity and quality of software on its own (only N64 era Nintendo came close), and as such it is the third party game developers that are the true kingmakers in the industry. It is the EAs, the Ubisofts, the Capcoms, the Konamis, the Epics, the Bungies, the Rares, and Square-Enixes of the world that determine how well console hardware sells in comparision to its competitors, not the hardware company itself. Apple would have to learn not only how to play nice with these guys but beg for their support and Apple has never struck me as a company that plays well with partners. I hesitate to think how they would handle being so dependant on outside software developers. The games are always the most important thing and I don't know where Apple would get that supply.

Re:Nope not a good idea

[Anonymous Coward]

Also note that when apple announced there were going to be games on the ipod, many developers emailed apple asking if they could write games for it. Apple replied no, and stop pestering us.

Anyway, Apple dumped the company who designed the ipod software and hardware a few months ago, so the next version may not be backwards compatible.

not that far off....

[cttforsale]

make a cheaper MAC mini included with video out options and a media centre interface and a controller.

Agreed. Gamers would shun Apple in droves

[Infonaut]

gamers would just laugh at any Apple-branded gaming device. this is coming from a diehard Mac user, btw.

Spot on.

I love working with Macs, but you have to be delusional to think Apple is going to woo hardcore gamers. Jobs knows this. Tilting at windmills won't work for Apple, and he knows it. I'm frankly surprised that this rumor is getting so much play, when it so obviously makes no sense. Think of the effort required to get game companies to develop titles on a new platform. That in itself is a massive barrier to entry for Apple.

Re:Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft...

[Lone_Foxx]

An Apple-cider console, huh? Name any good games for the Mac besides MDK or anything from Bungie.

iPod for the controller?

[Anonymous Coward]

What are the launch games? Pong and Arkanoid?

Seriously, how much control do you have with a click-wheel and a center button?

Not with that video chip

[argent]

Not with the GMA950.

And if they were going to do a mini that was both fast enough and cheap enough to compete in the console market, why the hell would they have bothered making the crippled horror that is the current mini?

A game console, or a console that plays games?

[macwhiz]

The thought in my mind is... is Apple thinking of making a "game console," or is the rumor based on an idea that Apple might be making a living-room console that also plays games?

If the iTV had even rudimentary game playing ability, it would be one more feature that could entice buyers. If it were relatively easy for Apple to implement, it would make a lot of sense. At the announced price level, the iTV is close to being an impulse buy for people with disposable income. Perhaps a game feature could be the one thing that makes some people say "why not?"

I don't think I'm the only person who has ever seen something in the store, found it intriguing but not quite worth buying, and then noticed some "extra feature" that made me reconsider. "Oh... it does that too? Well... that might be worth it, then."

It doesn't have to be as good as the Wii or the PS3. It just has to play games that people find fun at the right time.

I own a Nintendo DS. I don't play with it nearly as often as I play Solitare on my Blackberry. The DS is a much better game machine than the Blackberry. However, I usually have my Blackberry with me when I'm stuck in a waiting room, and the DS isn't something I carry around all the time. It doesn't matter that the Blackberry is a poor gaming machine; it's entertaining enough at the right time.

There are a lot of people who would not buy a "game console" who would play the occasional game if it were available on the iTV they bought to watch movies or listen to their iTunes library. Even if the graphics were on par with the Atari 2600. (How many Atari Flashback2 consoles has Target sold, I wonder?)