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AT&T to Target iPhone to Enterprise
narramissic writes "AT&T is reportedly preparing to market the iPhone to business users and is scurrying to ensure that its backend enterprise billing and support systems will accommodate the device when it ships. Analysts are baffled by the move. In addition to running an OS X-based operating system, which enterprises may be reluctant to adopt, the iPhone is also expected to have a number of shortcomings for business users, including not having a removable battery and not having buttons, which would make it difficult to dial while driving says Gartner's Ken Dulaney. Avi Greengart, principal analyst for mobile devices at Current Analysis, also thinks the iPhone won't be a good option for enterprise customers because enterprises won't be able to write applications for the phone."
I think that the Enterprise has better communicators than the iPhone already.
'Loose' is when your pants are three sizes too big. 'Lose' is when you misuse 'loose'.
I dont think businesses will care what it runs
I think businesses will be concerned with how it integrates with the things they need/do. Will it be able to open Office files? Will it be able to synchronize with Outlook? Does it make phone calls? Will it be able to synchronize contacts and such?
None of those should be beyond the capabilities of the phone... it is all just a matter of what actually is implemented (or implementable with minor work) when the phone is released.
StarTrekPhase2 - The Five Year Mission Continues!
which would make it difficult to dial while driving
That would be a "feature" not a "bug".
Please punch the first suit you hear complaining about that.
#!
Hum. I thought that you were not supposed to use a cell phone while driving because it distracts you from the more important task at hand which is guiding upwards of several tons of steel safely down the road without killing any one.
Undetectable Steganography? Yep, there's an app fo
...which would make it difficult to dial while driving...
GOOD! Hang the fucking phone up and drive people.
Thanks,
Disgruntled Motorcyclist.
Isn't it a little early to write this thing off as a business tool? Does anyone actually have one in their possession? Most of the executives with Crackberries use them for email, so I fail to see where the requirements for entry are real high. If the thing is deemed to be more of a status symbol than a Blackberry, executives will want it and it will be used as a business tool. AT&T might just be trying to keep it from being perceived as a toy, or "for kids". All it has to do is be a good email platform.
:)
That said, I'm skeptical that it will make a good email platform without a real keyboard
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
For serious business and enterprise users the Iphone completely fails to compete with other offerings like the blackberry. If AT&T wants to do well they should do what apple does and try to appeal to the "hip and trendy" teen and young adult crowd like the old dancing B&W Ipod commercials did. The rest of the market that wants to follow the hip & trendy crowd will do so.
Well, back to rejecting software patent applications.
That is the smell & noise of the CEOs at Research In Motion, Palm, and Pocket PC, collectively soiling their pants after hearing this news.
I can throw as many stones as I wish; my house is made of transparent aluminum.
"..and not having buttons, which would make it difficult to dial while driving"
How is this a bad thing? Perhaps people will think twice before trying to make that call.
Hm, you'd think those pricey analysts would factor the high cost of the device into their cogent analyses.
Then again, the likes of Gartner don't want their corporate customers to be thinking too much about value for cost.
I may sound trollish, but honestly, this sounds like to me like AT&T is now stuck with this sad excuse for a phone and is now begging people to use it.
A phone with no buttons, horrible battery life, and... AT&T expects people to use this for business?
Looks like AT&T has a hot iPotato and has no one to toss it to.
"No freeman shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson
Implementing a horrible idea that is doomed to failure because they still think they're the only game in town? Cingular really is the new AT&T.
How does a 7-person democracy cut a pie? Into 4 pieces.
Here's an idea...Write a web app!
It's so ingenious, I'm going to patent it. :D
I imagine you'll be able to store files locally and if you can access them thru Safari on the phone, than just do that. If not, write some security and put it on an extranet.
I'm going to preface this by saying I'm not an Apple fanboy by any means and I'm definitely not buying an iPhone.
How did the RAZR succeed? By being a high priced toy to the wealthy at first. How did Blackberry succeed? By being a high priced email toy for business elites. The iPhone really combines both - a sleek design with email, web, and calendar built in. The downside is that it isn't compatible with Outlook.
But, for the low low price of $500, only the elitist of the elite will be able to afford it. And Apple will open it up for development if a large enough enterprise requests it. They want the marketshare and if a Wall Street Bank or Music Studio requests it, they'll do it to add to the cool factor of having those rich famous people carry it around - just like the RAZR and the Blackberry.
I recently purchased a pocketpc based phone device. I really toiled with waiting until the iPhone comes out and getting that, but I heard some pretty sadening news - that Apple/AT&T will only allow signed programs to be installed on the phone. Unless they make that a pretty simple process, which I can't imagine they will - this will severely limit access to developers and software other than Apple sanctioned devices.
This is the main downfall of the iPhone. I have no doubt it will be popular with home users as well as business users who use their devices solely for email/calling. It will be a status symbol. But unless they open their source and allow developers to really get into the nitty gritty, I don't see it becoming the "one device to rule them all".
1. Take grain of salt.
2. Read Gartner analysis.
3. Consume Ripple as required.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
The Newton failed because of the way it's free-form hand-writing recognization was presented to the public. You'll note the Palm and Handspring did well even though their hand-writing recognization was more constrained. Anyway I think the iPhone has a chance, even if it's price is high compared to the competition.
All the iPhone will need to do is:
Connect to a POP / IMAP Email system (it does).
Read PDF files. The image zoom functionality will work fine for reading PDFs.
Then on the backend, the iPhone uses will get a special email account where all Office attachments are automatically converted to a PDF file before being sent to the phone.
Fairly trivial thing to do.
III.IIVIVIXIIVIVIIIVVIIIIXVIIIXIIIIIIIIVIIIIVVIII
The iPhone is geared up to be Apple's biggest flop since the Newton.
So was the iMac. I mean, come on, it didn't even have a floppy drive! That made it useless, and one of Apple's biggest flops.
... except Newtons were marketed long before PDAs were common; how do you get someone to buy something when they don't know how they'll use it? Cellphones are a bit of a different animal.
Considering how many cars have an ipod interface as an option, it isn't conceivable that voice recognition can be used to operate the phone when it is in the ipod dock of a car. Or to use the ipod interface of the car to operate the phone. (The Lexus touch screen is incredibly good to operate a motorola razr, by the way.)
Help! I'm a slashdot refugee.
One of the many reasons that Newton failed is the fact that it started out as a way to reinvent how we interact with computers, and then Apple decided to panic when they realised that the project could interfere with Mac sales, so they turned it into a Mac peripheral.
For iPhone, OTOH, Jobs took "Computer" out of the name of the company, so I don't think they are too worried about giving iPhone the room it needs to succeed...
Interesting that's third on the list of requirements for a mobile phone.
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If businesses let employees pick their phones (and this is a choice) then they'll go for this nice phone. Who wouldn't.
this is a device intended for geeks and hipsters. you listening, ATT wireless? geeks and hipsters.
they don't wear wing tips and hold offsites at the golf course and discuss their stock options.
ATT is making the fatal assumption of assuming if they have an expensive geegaw, sell it where expense is no object... upper manglement of large corporations for "business use."
have fun, folks.
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
If you want to make a prediction, make it right:
No wireless. Less space than Nomad. Lame.
Obama 2012: our incompetent asshole is slightly less of an incompetent asshole than the other incompetent asshole !
Seems to me the fact that it's not a desktop isn't an obstacle. It just has to communicate with *some* of your desktop-ish apps. Tell you what - give me a phone, ANY phone that capture my address book, group calendar, support a VPN tunnel to my corporate net, run a browser and send receive email, SMS, IM and of course be a phone and allow me to use them while I'm on a call w/o having to write down things on little scraps of paper then I'll take a serious look at it.
And in the last 11 years I have replaced a battery exactly one time instead of replacing or upgrading the phone.
When the year end summaries total up around Christmas 2007, the story will be told.
Consumer enthusiasm for a great advanced phone solution is obvious in the surveys of potential buyers. Lots of the enthusiasm is based on crummy hardware which everyone has had, like unreadable screens, batteries that fly out when dropped and keys that don't work.
Either you will be shown to be prescient, or you will want to forget you ever said that.
Of course AT&T is going to market to the enterprise side.
Apple is going to market to the teenagers and 'trend setters' and in the meantime, AT&T will market to the enterprise side. They don't NEED to market to anywhere else but the enterprise side! Apple's got the rest covered
2. No removable battery or buttons.
3. Inability to write own applications.
4. ???
5. Profit!
"Analysts are baffled by the move. In addition to running an OS X-based operating system, which enterprises may be reluctant to adopt, the iPhone is also expected to have a number of shortcomings for business users, including not having a removable battery and not having buttons, which would make it difficult to dial while driving says Gartner's Ken Dulaney."
Since when did the enterprises start dictating OSes that are used in Mobile phones? I am baffled by the Gartner analyst Ken Dulaney's move!
The implication being that the Blackberry has done so well because of all of the corporate PCs and servers running the Blackberry OS?
"difficult to dial while driving"
You shouldn't be dialing while driving!
These analysts seem to underestimate the "gotta have it" factor among executives. My mother is an executive secretary, and she has to deal with her 2 execs wanting new phones as soon as someone in their ranks gets the New Whiz-Bang Phone Of The Week(TM). One guy even walks in the office, drops his phone on the floor, kicks it a few times, etc, all while saying "Wow I wish I had one of those new Blackberries that [person] just got".
Its all just a big e-penis competition between them. Somebody will get one just because its "cool" and "hip", not because it might be a good phone.
Plus, its company money, what do they care if it costs $500?
There are only 10 kinds of people in this world... those who understand binary and those who don't
If you look at the history of those two phone lines, you'll see why iphone doesn't have much of a chance. Blackberries were targeted to the enterprise from day 1. Sidekicks were focused on consumers. Despite high profile users such as Paris Hilton and others, Enterprises didn't ask for the ability to put apps on the sidekick. However, many non enterprise users have adopted the blackberry.
Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
It doesn't integrate with Exchange Server, it has a music and movie player, and it can operate as a hard drive. This isn't an "Enterprise" product, this is a consumer product. This should be marketed as a replacement for your phone and your iPod, not as something middle-management uses to interfere with the folks who do the real work.
I'm in the hole of the broadband donut.
1) it's not even a 3.5g phone-- it's a 1st generation phone
2) there's little room for third party apps unless you want to play Apple's usary for the privilege
3) the phone has inherent security problems because of #1 (think old GSM phones and how easily they're cracked)
4) you can't get high speed anything on the phone, not even GPRS speed, let alone UMTS/Edge, or even something reasonably kewl
5) No Outlook. No SmackBerry. And I'm only betting here, but no Vista support (iTunes-- hello???)
6) Poorly designed UI-- no key depression feedback as there are no keys; and no 'say command' apps in this generation
7) Can't get at the battery??!!??? Who are these guys fooling???
8) Can't change the SIM!!!!!! Imagine, every EU roamer will throw the iPhone under a train!
9) Ok, it won't get a virus..... for a while.
Let's take your business user case arguments and apply them against the above, not to mention the price, the captive (I won't even get into popularity here) carrier, and the fact that there are a lot of bright minds far, far ahead of Apple in this market. Now tell me that business users are going to swallow this up. At least the RAZR can proxy via Bluetooth-- an EV.DO connection.
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
"...because enterprises won't be able to write applications for the phone."
It's too bad that companies can't write apps that run on websites.
It's too bad that the iPhone won't be able to browse websites with a fully-functional web browser.
Oh. Wait.
Well, wouldn't Apple's VoiceOver tech let people dial their phone by just talking to it, rather than having to physically type in numbers? that with a hands free set would eliminate a bunch of phone distractions.
Then if women would just put their make-up on at home, the world would be a better place.
I don't know that there are to many companies that write apps for phones directly. The iPhone is not Qualcommm Brew but look at the number of Brew developers in comparison. I don't see many enterprises in this list. It is just a great deal of BS to say this. http://brew.qualcomm.com/brew/en/developer/directo ry.html
1. Companies write apps that run on websites.
2. The iPhone can browse websites with a fully-functional web browser.
3. This is the absolutely most airtime-intensive way to write applications.
4. PROFIT!
(for AT&T anyway)
also require signing.
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Some companies learn lessons the hard way - by failing. Apple's had a number of large failures, but has managed to learn from those failures and make better things with higher margins.
Most companies in the tech industry can't handle more than one or two failures; they tend to go bankrupt. Those companies that survive product failures tend to try and forget about them instead of learn from them. For example, Microsoft could have learned a lot from Micrsoft Bob, if they so desired. Instead, they buried old Bob in the back and abandoned all attempts to do any radical user interface changes for Windows.
Apple, on the other hand, has a large number of failures to draw from, all of which are extensively documented. Apple also has a large number of successes, most of which probably haven't been documented enough. Why has the iPod really succeeded? Why and how has Mac OS X (and the Mac) been an unstoppable locomotive of progress?
The Enterprise market is smaller than you think, and requires substantial investments with questionable returns. Allowing developers onto your platform incurrs substantial support and infrastructure costs. Enterprise demands also tend to warp your perspective, as large accounts exert greater leverage on the development process than thousands of individuals. They also don't pay retail, and tend to demand substantial up-front and back-end discounts.
Apple has bypassed this in a simple manner, with a simple question: why have your enterprise apps on the phone when you have a live browser connection? If you can get to salesforce.com, google apps, and your custom web-enabled apps, who cares whether you can install a binary or not? In fact, not having to install anything is much better - no management issues. It's the freaking web, already. Everything that's important has been webified. Anything that isn't yet will be in 5 years. Everything that isn't nobody cares about.
The only "enterprise" feature of the iPhone would be the ability to hard-wire it to your corporate network instead of using the public network. That's it. If the iPhone can do that, then the internal IT guys can do the rest.
"Hi, I'm from IT and I brought you this I-Phone. Now, if you'd just hand over your Blackberry ..."
[Insert pithy quote here]
I don't know that there are to many companies that write apps for phones directly.
When you include third party applications? Plenty...
When we did the rollout for iPaqs at our division we had half a dozen applications that ended up getting distributed with them because there were enough people using each to make it worth while.
I've played with many of them as I am a developer of software for them.
As a Mac user (recently switched, from linux) I'm actually interested in the iPhone.
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It appears many enterprise / business customers demand that cell phone Not have a camera to be in compliance with their IT/company policy.
Does this mean there will be a camera free iPhone?
Perhaps OT, but curious. A lot of people are complaining that the iPhone sucks because it doesnt have a SDK or free development environment. Since when has any phone? Granted you can download the Java SDK for mobile phones, but can you actually load it to your phone? I'm under the impression the only way to get software on your phone from any provider is to pay them for a "service" to use software X for Y amount of time. I can't just write my own Reversi game and load it on my verizon phone. I hope I'm wrong, if so let me know how.
At our division, we have maybe 4 or 5 people you could class as "executives", and 150 others, of whom about 50 get company-supplied cellphones.
The market for "executive" phones is a fraction of the business market.
From the summary: Analysts are baffled by the move.
From a 2001 article on the just-introduced iPod: A big yawner, you say? Perhaps. After all, there are plenty of MP3 players out there. (Compaq Computer (CPQ), for example, offers one for $149.99 on its Web site.) But while Apple's latest debut might not score high on the significance meter -- particularly according to Wall Street analysts hoping for a splashier announcement -- it does offer a glimpse into the tactics computer makers are beginning to employ as demand for their core products wanes. When it comes to Apple, if the analysts can't make heads or tails out of a new product, it's almost certain the product will sell. Usually when you've caught the analysts off-guard, you've moved to an area of consumer savvy marketing that has a life all it's own.
A friend in the EDA industry who has been marketing these tools for twenty years notes that analysts are consistently wrong about the marketability of new products in established markets - he says: "those who can't sell, analyze."
As if Windows Mobile doesn't have its own set of "shortcomings," like being a buggy pain in the ass. As an owner of several WM devices over the years, I have a real love/hate relationship with the things. "Oh sorry I didn't get your call, looks like the phone app crashed and I need to reboot... yeah, I should really remember to do that a couple times a day."
If Apple sees an opportunity to get the iPhone adopted by business, I'm sure they'll compromise on their no custom applications policy too, if that's what it takes.
Go Apple, competition is good.
Perhaps OT, but curious. A lot of people are complaining that the iPhone sucks because it doesnt have a SDK or free development environment. Since when has any phone?
Any smartphone does, whether it's running Symbian, Palm OS, or Pocket PC phone edition.
Apple has bypassed this in a simple manner, with a simple question: why have your enterprise apps on the phone when you have a live browser connection?
Airtime.
The reliance on web apps is the key. Of course, these web apps won't work if they are IE only and require Active-X. When the CEO finally realizes that his intranet is suffering from MS lock-in, will things actually change?
"there's little room for third party apps unless you want to play Apple's usary for the privilege"
Right, that's why the Blackberry failed as well. People were unwilling to pay Blackberry's fee for allowing apps to be put on there...
They're baffled? Really?
So you're saying the CEO isn't gonna want one of these things? Please.
Also, you don't write applications that run *on* the iPhone... you write web applications that run in the *browser* that runs on the iPhone.
I can't believe Gartner is this clueless... I think someone at Apple forgot to pay them to gush.
Give me the choice of an iPhone and a plain black-and-white nokia bar-of-soap... I'll take the Nokia.
Look at the iPhone's battery life on apple.com.
Apply an adjustment for pre-release optimism.
Apply a reality adjustment - the only way to get listed standby times is to run your tests next to a tower.
You're gonna want two extra chargers, for the car and the office, because that's pitiful battery life even BEFORE you apply those adjustments.
Which won't matter a whit for most businesses out there. "Shiny" will matter.
Full featured web browser.
Your logic is truly dizzying. First, saying that "its new, and thus will have inherent security problems" is a logical fallacy. There will no doubt be bugs, but I haven't seen any evidence that they won't be easily fixable software bugs instead of 'inherent security problems.' Second, while there are certainly companies out there that care about security, very few are likely to think in terms of 'its new, thus security will be a problem.' They will ask if the feature list for security matches up with their requirements and probably leave it at that. Those that care about the stability of the platform will wait, but that has nothing to do with security.
The only question that matters in this regard is: "will it be fast enough." "Something reasonably 'kewl'" does not fit into it.
Considering when it comes out, I am willing to bet on Vista support. iTunes has fairly well understood problems with running on Vista, none of which I can think of will apply to the iPhone. They also have several more months to work on it, and most environments don't seem to be switching to vista anyways.
A lack of Outlook support is more of a problem, but also not guaranteed to be the case. It may also not be that big of a deal: some companies it will matter and in some it will not, and it does promise to sync with the computer.
You are kidding, right?
I would love to see stats on how many people, percentage wise, actually ever change the batter on their phone. How many among business users would also be an interesting stat.
Which matters for most US-based businesses why?
How many viruses are in the wild for OS X?
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
From Apple's site:
iPhone features a rich HTML email client and Safari -- the most advanced web browser ever on a portable device -- which automatically syncs bookmarks from your PC or Mac. Safari also includes built-in Google and Yahoo! search. iPhone is fully multi-tasking, so you can read a web page while downloading your email in the background over Wi-Fi or EDGE.
(1)First Gen phone?
(2)little room for third party apps? Please provide a link with the specs that indicate that... Being an OSX platform, with most of the needed support in the built-in libraries, apps should be very small anyway.
(3) inherent security problems based off #1 - which is clearly wrong - thus making this point of yours as ludicrous as the rest.
(4)No EDGE support? Cant get high speed anything? Apple clearly states EDGE support, and 802.11b&g.
(5)No Outlook? What about web based? That will work on this phone.
(5)No Vista support? Says who? You? I doubt they will drop the ball on that one - even though Vista market penetration is minimal so far, they'll make sure it works with Vista just because soon Vista market penetration (through pre-installs) will be significant.
(6)Poorly designed UI in your opinion - I personally think it is equal to the others available out there, especially since it has a multi-touch screen - which other phones dont yet have.
(7)Cant get at the battery... if the battery is as easy and cheap to change as on the iPods that you "cant get at the battery", this too is a moot point.
(8)Cant change the SIM... not confirmed... as like many other phones, I think this will be dependant on the network the phone is being sold for. Just like when I bought my Treo - I had to look for one that even had a SIM slot so it would work with T-Mobile.
(9)OK, it wont get a virus... for a while.... and that is bad why? And with Apple's track record of support, when that does happen (based off your statement), that will be an issue why? Apple will have a patch, and probably (in my opinion) far quicker than MS usually does.
And Bluetooth 2.0 which a number of current phones are just starting to support (or dont yet fully support).
.
So, all in all, every point of yours is wrong, and whoever modded you didnt bother to check any of them. Oh well, they way of /.
Next time, learn something about what you post instead of posting FUD with no idea of what you are talking about. Just a thought/suggestion.
StarTrekPhase2 - The Five Year Mission Continues!
About your number 4, according to Cingular's site about the iPhone (http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/specia ls/iPhone.jsp?_requestid=71252), it is:
EDGE, GPRS, GSM Quad-band, and WiFi capable
So.. the speed thing seems to be a lost argument point.
As you've already pointed out, supporting MS Office files is probably not a big deal. None of the "enterprise" users I know take advantage of this feature on their phones. The people who really do want to use Word/Excel/whatever on their phones are going to stick with a Windows Mobile device anyway.
What is a big deal is an Exchange email client. Exchange is really dominant in corporations. I work at a very large Internet company. Many years ago all of the email accounts were on POP. There was a demand for Exchange from the business types, which resulted in employees either getting a POP account or an Exchange account. Sometime later POP was phased out in favor of IMAP, and eventually the IT people decided they wanted to move everyone over to IMAP. IMAP scales much better than Exchange, and our company uses Unix/Linux servers for nearly everything other than Exchange anyway. Consequently, everyone was pushed over to IMAP. There was a huge backlash from the business/marketing types, and now _everyone_ is being pushed back to Exchange. A large number of the employees are on Linux/BSD systems, and the response has been to tell these users that they have to use OWA (Outlook Web Access) to read their email.
In theory, OWA will enable iPhone users to connect to their Exchange accounts with Safari. However, this is a huge inconvenience. Most of the time you are using your phone you are not online. The ability to read and compose emails while commuting or otherwise away from the office makes the Blackberry really appealing.
#include ".signature"
Sorry, but this post is mostly wrong.
It's not a '1G' phone, it's a 2.5G phone, which means that it does in fact have GPRS and EDGE, just not HSDPA. And though it doesn't have Outlook, it does have push IMAP, which is what companies need, not specifically outlook or Blackberry email.
And we don't know jack shit about the battery, SIM, possible third-party apps, or voice recognition yet. So don't pretend you know.
Take off every sig. For great justice.
No replaceable battery. Less speed than a 3g phone. Lame.
How'd that prediction turn out? I'm not saying that you're wrong on any of those points, but it's gonna sell cause it's a shiny status symbol.
Argggghhhhh. I use a PowerBook G4, but I don't even have the fanboi blindness you've displayed.
1) it's not even a 3.5g phone-- it's a 1st generation phone
Which won't matter a whit for most businesses out there. "Shiny" will matter.
>>Uh, no. Shiny no longer gets it. Functionality gets it. Why are there so many ugly Treo 650s out there? Because it's cute? We're talking businesses here. Cute lasts about 30 seconds.
2) there's little room for third party apps unless you want to play Apple's usary for the privilege
Full featured web browser.
>>And it renders as fast as Safari does? Egads. Sure, I'm going to browse with no keys and my thumbs. While driving.
3) the phone has inherent security problems because of #1 (think old GSM phones and how easily they're cracked)
Your logic is truly dizzying. First, saying that "its new, and thus will have inherent security problems" is a logical fallacy. There will no doubt be bugs, but I haven't seen any evidence that they won't be easily fixable software bugs instead of 'inherent security problems.' Second, while there are certainly companies out there that care about security, very few are likely to think in terms of 'its new, thus security will be a problem.' They will ask if the feature list for security matches up with their requirements and probably leave it at that. Those that care about the stability of the platform will wait, but that has nothing to do with security.
>>No, you don't get it. It's pretty easy to snarf a 1G GSM phone. Take your 'logical fallacy' argument and buy a sub to 2600.
4) you can't get high speed anything on the phone, not even GPRS speed, let alone UMTS/Edge, or even something reasonably kewl
The only question that matters in this regard is: "will it be fast enough." "Something reasonably 'kewl'" does not fit into it.
>> Oh yeah, fast enough. A network substrate that can support a blistering 20K/sec. MMmmm. HD on that would be well, a frame per fortnight.
5) No Outlook. No SmackBerry. And I'm only betting here, but no Vista support (iTunes-- hello???)
Considering when it comes out, I am willing to bet on Vista support. iTunes has fairly well understood problems with running on Vista, none of which I can think of will apply to the iPhone. They also have several more months to work on it, and most environments don't seem to be switching to vista anyways.
>>Sure. Vista support will come out before iTunes Vista support. Lots of time to work on it. No other projects have been put off for it, either (don't look at that Leopard in the corner). You get sucked in so dearly by PR.
A lack of Outlook support is more of a problem, but also not guaranteed to be the case. It may also not be that big of a deal: some companies it will matter and in some it will not, and it does promise to sync with the computer.
>>Sync and replace are two different concepts. Outlook is a moving target, if you haven't noticed. Or maybe it'll be an AT&T 'option'. Mmmmm Options.
6) Poorly designed UI-- no key depression feedback as there are no keys; and no 'say command' apps in this generation
You are kidding, right?
>> Yes, Jakob Neilsen would have a fit. No keys? Ok, eat that donut and dial, buddy.
7) Can't get at the battery??!!??? Who are these guys fooling???
I would love to see stats on how many people, percentage wise, actually ever change the batter on their phone. How many among business users would also be an interesting stat.
>> Use as your first clue the shelf space dedicated at the Big Box retailers for battery widgets. Then pull out your imaginary stats.
8) Can't change the SIM!!!!!! Imagine, every EU roamer will throw the iPhone under a train!
Which matters for most US-based businesses why?
>> Yeah, the US market is going to make it for good ole Apple. Don't need that foreign sales crap at all. Nope. You're tied to a specific carrier, just like you're almost tied to iTunes. Open, that. Not.
9)
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
You must be quite a reseller... you appear to be pitching "crash-proof solutions" using Microsoft technology.
:)
Do you also work at children's parties in costume?
Lies about crimes
I was wrong about Edge. See http://gracefulflavor.net/2007/01/19/iphones-edge- devoured-by-evdo/ For an interesting data sample of what that means.
And do use WiFi, where you can get it, and with all the great authentication schemes available.
In terms of Outlook direct access, it's unlikely to work unless Microsoft does something. In terms of OWA access, if all is correct from stem to stern (meaning that the x.509 certs work in the new browser), then you could get OWA. Please bring your binoculars.
Vista support? See any Apple announcements copping to it? No, not yet. I wonder why.
No, the models seen so far don't have a way to change the SIM, just like you can't get to the battery.
So none of my points are wrong, save the Edge discussion. Now let's see, EDGE has three channels of upper-end transmission capabilities, where three channels are available. Want me to do the math, or can you see what 56K * 3 is? That's awful. WiFi is ok-- subject to the standing inherent problems of WiFi. So calm down and look at this thing rationally: a business person takes a look at the list and has a RAZR or an LG or a SmackBerry or a 650, looking at the iPhone. Pick one. And be rational about it. AT&T and Apple are going to get creamed in the first generation after the fanboi buy-cycle.
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
It reminds me of the RAZR when it was first released. It was expensive, buggy, usable only as a cellphone, yet sold well enough that 2 years later it has become the phone of choice for much of the general market. Maybe the iPhone is the new RAZR?
Now look up Edge and GPRS and then go to http://gracefulflavor.net/2007/01/19/iphones-edge- devoured-by-evdo/ and do the #s.
WiFi is actually cool. Now tell me, do you use a WiFi VoIP phone? Ok, say you do. When was the last time you felt comfortable going into anyplace and logging on to a WiFi hotspot away from your home/office.
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
Shiny lasts 30 seconds until it doesn't do something that I think it should, compared to those in the damned airport lounge surrrounding me. Then it's dustbin fodder. It's that easy.
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
> 1) it's not even a 3.5g phone-- it's a 1st generation phone
It's actually a 2G GSM phone, 1G is a term used for analog mobile networks.
> 2) there's little room for third party apps unless you want to play Apple's usary for the privilege
did you mean usury? lending money at unreasonably high interest rates? wft?
> 3) the phone has inherent security problems because of #1 (think old GSM phones and how easily they're cracked)
did you mean old analog phones? sounds like you have those confused with GSM
> 4) you can't get high speed anything on the phone, not even GPRS speed, let alone UMTS/Edge, or even something reasonably kewl
it has EDGE and WiFi - did you read the specs? http://www.apple.com/iphone/technology/specs.html
> 5) No Outlook. No SmackBerry.
It has a mail client and supports push email, did you watch the webcast? Each iPhone will come with free yahoo push email
8) Can't change the SIM!!!!!! Imagine, every EU roamer will throw the iPhone under a train!
the SIM card slot was shown in a slide in the keynote... watch the webcast
Your post is designed to spread FUD. Lets face it, if it wasn't for the iPhone, America wouldn't even have a mobile phone that stands up to European/Japanese designs. Even though it was designed by a Brit...
Not trying to troll here, but how could they not get at least 3G(UMTS) into this phone? The PDA phone I have was released 9 months ago and they managed to get HSDPA into it. I would bet that the battery life in this phone isn't that great. That would explain why they stuck with only EDGE.
Dunno about the US but I'm almost certain that here in Europe the iPhone will be a big hit among the suits, especially early on when they're a curiousity and too expensive for most consumers. Never mind the features, it'll be a little status symbol and a bit of style you can buy. It's not like corporations have carefully weighed the pros and cons of all available cars and decided that only Mercedes, BMW and Audi have the features that suits need most, yet that's what 99% of them drive. As long as Apple can't bring down the price of the iPhone enough to make it a mass product like the iPod, it needs to target this market which will pay a premium for a prestige product. They would need a bigger range of iPhones then, and make sure the more expensive ones are visually distinguishable, to cater to the whole corporate hierarchy.
> 1) it's not even a 3.5g phone-- it's a 1st generation phone
- devoured-by-evdo/
It's actually a 2G GSM phone, 1G is a term used for analog mobile networks.
>>I sit corrected. Slow in any event.
> 2) there's little room for third party apps unless you want to play Apple's usary for the privilege
did you mean usury? lending money at unreasonably high interest rates? wft?
>>yes, usury. Fealty.
> 3) the phone has inherent security problems because of #1 (think old GSM phones and how easily they're cracked)
did you mean old analog phones? sounds like you have those confused with GSM
>>No, GSM phones aren't exactly secure. Think not?
> 4) you can't get high speed anything on the phone, not even GPRS speed, let alone UMTS/Edge, or even something reasonably kewl
it has EDGE and WiFi - did you read the specs? http://www.apple.com/iphone/technology/specs.html
>>Again, I sit corrected. See http://gracefulflavor.net/2007/01/19/iphones-edge
> 5) No Outlook. No SmackBerry.
It has a mail client and supports push email, did you watch the webcast? Each iPhone will come with free yahoo push email
Mmmm.. Yahoo mail. Yummy.
8) Can't change the SIM!!!!!! Imagine, every EU roamer will throw the iPhone under a train!
the SIM card slot was shown in a slide in the keynote... watch the webcast
>>No, I haven't seen "the webcast"
Your post is designed to spread FUD. Lets face it, if it wasn't for the iPhone, America wouldn't even have a mobile phone that stands up to European/Japanese designs. Even though it was designed by a Brit...
>>No, it's not designed to spread FUD. It's intended exactly to show why this unit will be ignored by business people. And while I don't particularly care for Dvorak, I agree with him that this phone will be torn to shreads in the marketplace.
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
Like Blackberry and Good. We use Good at work. That would be sweet. Don't get me wrong, I love my Nokia E61, but an iPhone would be the cat's whiskers.
Just one comment:
""will it be fast enough.""
Picture something for me.
Picture the clouds opening up, and a booming voice from heaven:
"NO"
EDGE PDAs are disastrously bad. Anyone paying $500 for an EDGE pda with intent to use its internet functionality should get their head examined.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
I've said it before and I'll say it again: ActiveSync is an essential ingredient for the success of any smartphone device in the Enterprise market (and will eventually be the death knell for RIM). Even Palm has realized this with the addition of ActiveSync support in the Treo 650 and later. ActiveSync support is even more crucial now since Outlook Mobile Access (OMA) is not included in Exchange 2007. Nay-say MS all you want, but Enterprise customers live or die by groupware connectivity, and Exchange is the king of the hill right now.
*** Quantum Mechanics: The Dreams of Which Stuff is Made ***
For
enterprise
applicati-
ons, the
display
must be
able to
display
web pages
in a
usable
manner.
The iphone
needs high
resolution
of 800x480
minimum
like that
demoed by
Hitachi
and
Samsung.
Talking about EDGE in terms of bandwidth understates how bad it is.
The low bandwidth is a very small part of the problem with GPRS/EDGE. The bigger problem is latency; with the connection loaded (i.e. approaching 10 KBps) you tend to see 2000+ ms roundtrip ping times. While driving (as a passenger), I would see 15000+ ms round trip pings.
Can you imagine how painful it is to do anything online with a 15 second ping time?
Even with the connection virtually idle, and with ideal single strength, you'll see ping times in the 800-1200 ms range. This compares very poorly to EVDO Rev 0's 100-200 ms, and far worse to EVDO Rev A's 60-180 ms pings. Sprint has EVDO Rev A in many markets(40% or so) *now*, and plans a nationwide rollout by the end of 2007.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
"Lets face it, if it wasn't for the iPhone, America wouldn't even have a mobile phone that stands up to European/Japanese designs."
*shrug*
Motorola has made tremendous strides in mobile phone design lately. I (heart) my Moto Q.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
...worked in corporate IT.
I've had many occasions where a VIP has called me into his office, handed me some shiny new gewgaw/digital status symbol he bought without consulting anyone, and said, "Get this to work [with our infrastructure]."
Yeah, YOU tell him it's nonstandard and thus unsupported!
And anyway, nobody knows what Apple is cooking up, and won't know until it is actually released. For all you know they've secretly licensed the Blackberry software and the iPhone apps will be able to talk back and forth with a BES.
Hmmm?
Go use an EDGE phone, and then come back and say the speed thing is a lost argument. EDGE sucks big time. No one should be forced to use the internet over EDGE. Dial-up is vastly superior.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
the iPhone is also expected to have a number of shortcomings for business users, including ... not having buttons, which would make it difficult to dial while driving
Um, good? Anyone who's screwing around with dialing while driving is as much of a road hazard as people who apply makeup, dress themselves, fiddle with the radio too much, and constantly adjust climate controls while driving. IE not paying attention to the road!
If you need to dial, pull the frick over! Or use voice dial...
Magic doesn't work in my presence. My power of disbelief is too strong.
1, Apple has already said there will be 3d party development for iPhone, but it has to be vetted for compatibility with the cell network. You want X type of software? Get their SDK. Anyone still ignoring this old news is spreading FUD.
2, iPhone is probably going to handle Voicemail and advanced call handling better than people realize. I'm guessing here, if you've got the earpiece in, the phone set to "driving" and a call on your "A" list comes in, it beeps you. Anyone else goes straight to voicemail. I didn't see the whole demo from MacWorld, but the writeup indicated some advanced mediation features.
And Apple, you still suck for killing the Newton. Old School!
Josh
gigantino.tv - Heavy but weighs nothing.
At least in the US they'll have a hard time if they don't sync with Exchange. Windows Mobile is popular and growing rapidly in the states because of that. And you can buy a decent device (Motorola Q) for $149. Much easier sell to a business than $599 or whatever Apple ends up charging.
See, thats exactly why I don't know why they chose Cingular/The New ATT (bleh) over Sprint. I worked for Sprint for 6 months awhile back, and one of the things I was most impressed with was their internet bandwidth. Using their Windows Smart Phones with EVDO was quite nice. Verizon has slick marketing that talks about their new TV feature, and their GPS feature, but Sprint has had these things for far longer, and on a better network... their marketing and advertising just sucks so no one knows. And Cinglar? They might "have more bars" but data? No thanks. I don't need data so I use T-Mobile.
At any rate, I think Apple shot themselves in the foot by going with such a slow network. It's like buying a BMW M5 for the looks and putting a 160 HP Camery engine in it.
Business does not and will never care if the iPhone works with systems or not.
Okay, show of hands:
Who has worked on some completely lame technology because some VP thought it was the Next Big Thing and decided to force the company to use it?
Ta Da! iPhone to the ruscue. A VP's wet-dream. A solution looking for a problem. Make it work with something (anything) and justify the CEO carrying one around and you are the Golden Boy. Fail, and some poor IT slob goes down.
Here will be an old abusing of God's patience and the king's English.
Once the iPhone is released in June, there will be a big discrepancy in the number of people who currently say they will buy the $500 iPhone from those who actually do. There will also be a big discrepancy in purchasing numers between different demographic age groups. Young people will care less about the actual functionalities of the product and more about the hype and "coolness" of it. Older business users are the exact opposite. Because of this, I think it would be a waste of AT&T's resources to market towards business users (for the first generation iPhone anyways). There have been quite a few polls from different research firms showing a wide range of interest in the iPhone. Change Wave Research: "9% of the population that is somewhat to very interested in getting the iPhone" http://www.intomobile.com/2007/03/23/most-people-d o-not-want-an-apple-iphone.html
Lets Talk: "52% of the surveyed users answering that they will NOT buy an iPhone"
http://www.intomobile.com/2007/03/18/current-music -phone-users-dont-want-an-iphone.html
PiperJaffray: "85 percent of high school students said they were already familiar with the multi-function Apple gadget, and of those students, 25 percent said they'd be willing to buy one at the previously announced $500 entry point."
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/07/04/09/high _school_teens_say_theyll_plunk_down_500_for_iphone .html
This is a market that already has plenty of design and integration where phones are made to appeal to people with different needs. You want a smartphone, it's there. You want a pretty phone, it's there. You want a music phone, it's there. You want a real simple, do almost nothing phone, it's there.
iPod came along in a nascent market. Phones aren't. It's at saturation.
Oh, and touch screens suck. I had a phone with one, and it was horrible. Unless Apple have come up with something revolutionary to deal with the lack of feedback and fingermarks, the iPhone's touch screen will suck too.
The "non-replaceable" battery of the iPod hasn't hurt its sales, I don't think that it'll hurt the iPhone much. Especially for companies, who generally have IT guys on staff who can replace batteries if they seriously die. Can't change the SIM!!!!!! Imagine, every EU roamer will throw the iPhone under a train! Go rewatch Job's iPhone keynote. In one diagram, it shows a little slot for the SIM card easily accessible at the top of the phone. I'm sure it galled The Steve to put a hole in his beautiful iPhone, but he apparently accepted its necessity.
i thought, therefore i was...
That's the best thing about this Treo. I can get a good 1.5 cps while driving. In fact im doing that right n
I'm not at all convinced that widgets can be installed on the iPhone without Apple's blessing. Web apps, yeah (I think its safe to assume the browser will run javascript), but have you seen anything indicating you can arbitrarily install a 3rd party widget?
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
It's gonna be easier than any other phone you ever had.
Don' worry, be happy man!
It's no problem picking a iPod playlist on the road right now, is it?
This one's gonna be MUCH easier, quicker -
BIG KEYPAD, BIG EASY-TO-HIT KEYS. EASY!
And that's BEFORE they add in the cool voice dialing features.
I'm ready right now!
Apparently AT&T missed this article. Who wants to tell them?
Isn't enough that I ruined a pony, making a gift for you?
This is not going to be iPod mark 2.
So, playing analyst are we? The iPod launched as a Mac toy - it used Firewire and could only be updated via a Mac application. But Apple kept at it until they got it right (read: USB and Windows support). The iPod was DISADVANTAGED compared with competing players at the time. The iPhone is an iPod-phone with Safari. Lots of people will want that - more than you seem to believe.
What enterprise user is going to want one if it doesn't even support 3G internet speeds, let alone HSDPA?
Lets not forget about Google Maps. This is a great feature for any business man on the road or the one wanting to find that restaurant they heard about on the flight to the convention.
i agree
Jobs just after the unveiling, said personally in an interview that the iPhone would be able to run third party apps - but they would be tightly controlled by Apple, there would not be an open SDK. If AT&T and Apple in combination are willing to solicit the construction of some enterprise apps, they could be bought by users and loaded as well.
However much of the need for third-party applications will be removed via the obvious step of the users ability to include Dashboard-like widgets created with Dashcode, something not announced but pretty obvious. If you can load your own custom web snippets, how many actual applications do you really need? Most people buy applications for devices to replace built-in programs that stink, but Apple has been pretty good at delivering good applications with systems that many people actually like using.
The iPhone is going to sneak up on the enterprise just the same way the Blackberry did, by a lot of corporate users owning them and demanding more enterprise support.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Probably because Cingular made them a better offer.
Up to that point, you're right. The problem is, buying decisions are made by managers. So the rest should actually read :
- Is the same name of system that they're running on the desktop ? (Windows)
- Is there an icon that looks like the one they double-click to stat their work processor ? (Word)
And optionally :
- Does it has some "Intel-Inside" type of sticker ? (That makes the intertube much faster !!!)
That explains while the iPhone will fail :
There's no "windows written on it". There's no "Microsoft PocketWord" pre-loaded on it.
Manager will prefer to buy WinPhones. It may be utter crap, but that's crap they are used to.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
I use my personal phone only occasionally for business and even I have all the important numbers saved--which means I have to look at the screen anyway because you can't "touch scroll". The really important ones have voice dial commands assigned to them so I don't have to dial at all.
The need to "touch dial" is way over-rated. I don't know anyone who keeps all their important phone numbers in their head and dials them manually while they're driving. Everyone just goes to contacts or recent calls, and the iPhone is designed to make that process as easy as possible. That was one of the big points of Jobs' presentation--the way people use phones has changed. Finding saved numbers is now the norm; actually dialing digits is the outlier.
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
I see that it will run widgets, but not that you will be able to install 3rd party widgets. And I see people debating whether it will be able to ( http://discussion.treocentral.com/showthread.php?t =134376 ) but no solid answer.
People, People! Predictions of the failure of the iPhone are comically off-base and premature. Writing it off as an enterprise-worthy smart phone is also absurdly based on nothing more than the conventional wisdom and cliches of people who couldn't think outside the box if their life depended on it. Let's review:
(1) Between Dashboard widgets, Cocoa running on a more or less full version of OS X, and a desktop-class browser capable of displaying everything that Safari can display on Macs today, with Javascript support, that's three fairly robust ways to implement any kind of application on an iPhone. Apple (i.e. Steve Jobs) would have to be colossally stupid to build off of a foundation like that and then MARKET the device as "running OS X" and mentioning Cocoa as one benefit of same, and then declare that there would be no ability to add third-party applications, ever. That would be monumentally stupid, and a giant waste of all the stuff that comes with any system running an OS as mature and capable as OS X is. There would be almost no benefit to using OS X, and certainly nothing to gain from referring to OS X as a bullet point in your marketing, unless that technology was being leveraged across the board. To stop at an email app, a browser, and google maps, is just not even in the realm of believable. This phone was designed expressly to further the mobile phone paradigm in every possible way, and the ability to produce desktop-calibre sophisticated software for almost any imaginable type of task was surely a key design goal. So, yes there will be third-party software on iPhones. Duh!
(2) Can we all get a grip already? It is an unreleased first generation product, the very first product of its kind designed by Apple. Obviously, it will not do everything anybody ever imagined using a mobile phone / PDA for, or thought of doing while on an acid trip, or saw someone else doing on some mythical superphone commonly found in Asia but nowhere to be seen in the pathetic US mobile phone market. Did somebody hear about the iPhone, watch the webcast where Steve Jobs thoroughly demo'd it, and then read up on it on Apple's web site, and walk away from that with the idea that the only thing iPhones can't do is your kid's trig homework, cleaning your gutters or baking a wedding cake from scratch? Get real! Yeah, Apple announced the iPhone. It is a phone, with a very advanced GUI, a browser, email client, google maps, SMS "iChat-like" texting, and Apple couldn't come up with a single idea for even one additional use for this phone. They fully expect this to be the full feature set of all iPhones for all time, and have never for a single second entertained the idea that they, or someone else, might have a task that they would like to be able to use their iPhone to perform, much as they can already do on a variety of other products from Palm and RIM and so forth. Those Apple people, see, they aren't very forward thinking or creative, not a bright bunch at all, really, and the features publicly announced for the very first iPhone model were all they could come up with. Whatever.
After the very first iPhone model, you can expect Apple to release ADDITIONAL models, at a variety of price-points and with varying features. They could have a camera-free model for people who have no-camera restrictions at their workplace, or to offer a lower priced model. They could have a model that ditches the iPod features and is just a phone/PDA. They could have different form factors, cuz, like, some people like flip phones and some people like slider phones and so on. Just imagine the possibilities!!
Oh yeah, I forgot. Apple is SO stupid they will never think of any of this. Too bad they have such brain dead people working for them. If only.......
(3) the iPhone may or may not initially or eventually support direct communication with Exchange over MAPI. And what if it does not? Oh no! If only you could somehow use a third party program instead, something that DID speak to Excha
If people want a touchscreen phone but businesses want it secure and with the ability to add applications, might it be time for a Neo1973? Oh I think so! Why would I spend $500+ and a locked-in contract for a semifunctional phone? OpenMoko and the Neo1973 should have these headline. http://www.openmoko.com/press/index.html
"which would make it difficult to dial while driving says Gartner's Ken Dulaney"
One word: Asshole.
--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
The iPhone is also expected to have a number of shortcomings for business users, including . . . not having buttons, which would make it difficult to dial while driving
Sounds like an advantage to me. A phone that keeps you from doing something stupid!
Your reasons are simply not well-enough thought out. Sorry, I'm sticking with my WiNCE$#@)@$+++
Hey! I take offense to that. Us hipsters wear vintage wingtips with our torn jeans, self-altered button up shirts and skinny ties.
I think security will be the biggest corporate worry. iphone coolness will make them a target for theft which will make corporations concerned about security.
Engineering is the art of compromise.
Target iPhone and fire!
I've had cell phones forever. I'v had laptops since the white iBook. I'v had numerous digital devices, some with removable batteries, some without (like the iPods, since 2001) The only time that I've needed a spare battery was with the digital cameras. Why ? Simply because I can't plug it in like ALL the other devices. Since day one people have been commenting about the iPhone's lack of a removable battery... quick survey: who the hell has ever had a spare battery for their cell phone ? (besides mountain climbers and various non-urban adventurers?) This is simply a dumb argument that does not reflect the real world. Besides, replacing most cell phone batteries is never simple (for good reason). A spare for my laptop ? Could be useful... but the extra weight sucks. I use public transit. When I drive, I use an adaptor that costs a quarter of the price. Duh.
Those are their "elevator pitch" downsides to the iPhone for corporate users? That's it? These are painfully weak points.
... you can take an iPhone out of the box and be on the corporate Intranet before your coffee cools. No other handheld has a real Web browser.
> not having buttons, which would make it difficult to dial while driving says Gartner's Ken Dulaney.
Dialing while driving is illegal in many states. If you need to do it, you should have a hands-free. Doesn't matter what phone you have. And not having buttons has not hurt the Web. Most people will get the iPhone's Web-like UI much more than most phone's attempts to ape the pocket calculator.
> removable battery
The reason this analyst concern will not play out is that iPhone actually has a removable battery, however the removable one is optional. You buy it from a third-party and plug it onto the iPod dock and your iPhone will run for 36 hours. This is the same as iPod today. There are many different accessory batteries from many different manufacturers. Some mimic a full iPod dock, they are very easy to deal with if you are that kind of user, for example if you go camping.
So what is called the lack of a removable battery in iPod/iPhone is actually seen by users (whether consciously or not) as an extra large-capacity internal battery that removes the requirement that they manage batteries unless they are the equivalent of an "off-road" power user. Compare to other phones that ship you a mini-battery to reduce size and price and the battery you really want is extra and hardly anybody buys it. It is a scam for most users.
When you compare AC adapters on phones, the iPhone will just plug in to anywhere that has an iPod dock. If you give a corporate user an iPhone they may not even ask you for an AC adapter. They may have an iPod dock in three or four rooms in their home and also in their car. Putting juice into iPhone will not be a challenge for any user.
> Avi Greengart, principal analyst for mobile devices at Current Analysis, also thinks the iPhone won't be a good option for enterprise
> customers because enterprises won't be able to write applications for the phone
The iPhone can run Web applications, out-of-the-box. It has a full desktop-class Web browser. It has Wi-Fi "n"
Similarly, alone among all phones and handhelds, the iPhone has a desktop-class API and development environment with a huge community of knowledgeable developers who at this point simply lack iPhone specific information due to the newness of the device. However the iPhone is not the first time Cocoa has been ported, and one Cocoa developer can do outrageous stuff because it is high-level. Apps made for iPhone will have the gloss and animations and similar for free. Apple will be happy to sell corporations a bunch of Macs so they can develop their iPhone apps and deploy with iTunes. The features that are seen as "locked down" will appeal to corporations. They will be able to install a custom VPN through iTunes and know it can't be monkeyed with easily outside the office.
Also the iPhone is running Unix, just a 500 MB installation of OS X on its 4-8 GB disk, just like AppleTV. Not the hardest thing in the world to hack. Linux runs on iPods.
You don't suppose AT&T had a chat with Apple about v.2 or v.3? Come on
No removable battery? Let me put it a different way; No replaceable battery? I'm sorry but not only is there no excuse to not be able to replace your battery as your phone ages (and the battery dies out) but its just obvious that not being able to replace your battery is such a great way to force users to upgrade as new versions (new iphones) to upgrade. This phone is only catered to the hipster fad of throw it away when their is something better.
Not only do I hope that this fails utterly if its push into an enterprise market, but I hope it makes companies like Apple realize that bullshit tactic's like this will not work with people on people who buy devices for work/business/enterprise.
TruePunk | Games
You'll note I never said it would be a raving success, only that your points tend to be in error if not outright logical fallacies.
Because, of course, the iPod was the most feature-rich digital audio player on the market. It had wireless, more space than the nomad, and many more features, right? The zune is a big hit right now because of all of those extra features? "Shiny" sells--particularly when its coupled with good integration and a good interface, both of which tend to be Apple strong points.
I sincerely hope you do not use one of the most dangerous legal weapons while surfing the web at the same time. That said, I have no evidence one way or the other to know how fast it will render. Neither do you.
First, GSM is by definition 2G ne? Second, you are still committing a logical fallacy. Try again.
For the purpose of email and a little web surfing, most of which can be done over 801.11b/g? You keep asserting it will be "too slow," but really, the questions are "for what purpose" and "will they have access to a faster network?
Most airports and hotels these days have high speed connections, and hotspots are cropping up everywhere.
None of the moving projects around mean anything to me in terms of Vista support. You are basing this entire set of assumptions on exactly zero evidence and lots of meaningless supposition, unless you are hiding something you haven't shared yet. Even if it doesn't support it immediately, but picks it up within a couple of months, so what? Vista is not exactly flying off the shelves.
...and what does the price of tea in China have to do with anything? There are separate questions here: 1) Will it sync with Outlook? 2) Does it matter if it syncs with Outlook? 3) Will it provide a separate equivalent service such that outlook is not required for Calendar/Contact/etc management, which may or may not sync with Outlook? The answer is 1) We do not know yet. 2) To some yes, to some no. I've worked at both kinds of companies. 3) Most certainly. Proclaiming the death of a product you haven't seen for features it may or may not have and which may or may not matter to a sufficiently significant part of the population seems a little premature.
Actually that tells me nothing re this product. There are two major reasons for having interchangeable batteries: 1) To extend battery life. For this there are plenty of attachments for the iPod which extend battery life, if such is needed for this device I'm sure there will be at least a few. 2) When a battery dies. In which case any reasonably competent tech should be able to change it, or you will undoubtedly be able to pay a small fee to apple to
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
Honestly, in case it wasn't apparent on casual reading, I was being just slightly sarcastic in my previous post. I'm not in any position to say what will end up happening, either with the overall success of iPhones, in general or in any specific market segment (such as enterprise), or in how Apple will or will not address the needs of certain markets by, for example, allowing for the extension of iPhones with third-party applications. I'm merely a 15 year IT professional, Macintosh system engineer, longtime Apple enthusiast who has been around long enough that I think I have intuition about these things that might be just slightly better than the average bear.
I'm not claiming the iPhone will be an unqualified smash success, including or especially in the enterprise market. My sarcastic smart ass post was mainly aimed at those people who take a pessimistic view, but apparently just KNOW that they are absolutely correct in their views and predictions, and state their thoughts unequivocally. I'd like to know where they get their information, because while they may have legitimate points to make and have valid opinions about things, I don't know where they get off acting like they just know everything there is to know, they have factored in every variable, envisioned every future scenario, and can state their OPINIONS with absolutely no trace of humility or acknowledgement of the fact that they, like myself, are going on limited information and the widespread inability of the majority of human beings to know future events ahead of time. I'm much less annoyed by opposing views than I am by people who argue from the position that they are utterly and infallibly correct. I would be the first to qualify a statement as being just an opinion, based on limited information, subject to factors I may not be aware of and thus fail to take into consideration, etc. Everything out of my mouth should be taken with a grain of salt, as is generally the case for almost everybody. It just bugs me when other people either don't realize, or just fail to acknowledge, the limits of their own knowledge and experience and the fact that their views are just as subject to unknown factors, missing or incorrectly understood details, etc.
A plea for some humility, in other words.....
One example (the iPod) is not proof.
Several questions for anyone who is using it now. First - which is best? Coverage wise in honolulu ? Any tips on buying a plan? Im thinking about a family plan 2 phones and 2 numbers for 39.99 . Tmobile has 400 min but At &t has 450 mins. Not sure about all the other details. Try out period? You know you can back out if you dont like it. If you break a phone can I just buy another phone anywhere and use it? Voice mail costs etc.For more related discussion please visit me at:web design company Foreign long distance rates. Land line ---- I was thinking of cacenling it but now Im not sure if that is feasible. Whats the lowest rate for a land line ? All I want it for is a back up just in case the wireless reception is bad or whatever. Is Verizon the only choice in honolulu? And whats the lowest cost for a basic land line?
In the enterprise? Ugh. It's not exactly live, blackberry style messaging, is it? Let alone that enterprise mail tends to have to be server based so that you can access it from more than one machine. iPhone in the enterprise is just a dumb idea.
Yes, exactly. If you're on Exchange 2003 SP2, which if you're an MS shop you will be at some point, then WM for live messaging is very tempting, particularly given how cheap WM phones are these days. If you're not, and you want a quick, cheap and above all safe and politically non-sensitive way of doing it in a big enterprise, then you slot in a BES and you're good to go. BES support comes from the vendor, the handsets come from the local phone company, and there's no awkward change request cycle to go through. /. posters seem to be ignoring is the difficulty of changing large enterprises' infrastructure - you don't just convert to a new mail server when it serves tens of thousands of users and they can't afford the downtime...
What the majority of
Some people at Apple think it allows very high speed of development.
I know it has a learning curve, if I had patience to get over that curve I might be able to talk to the question from personal experience.
Because Apple decided to not only not allow people to write their own apps
for it, they also don't include Java on the phone (wow, they sure plugged that hole
there, huh). This will piss off a lot of Apple fanboys, but I saw screw Apple
for this decision.
I was a little skeptical at first about the iPhone just because cell phones are already a massive industry with a lot more money flying around, and a very fast upgrade cycle. Though in the sluggish, low price U.S. market that may not be the case I had trouble seeing it competing with the hundreds of models in Japan say (though someone told me iPhone would be out through Softbank).
But these analysts sound really dumb, I'm sorry. They are saying things Apple must know and AT&T and others must have told them. Personally I think I might rather have a Willcom phone running CE with a keyboard etc but I'll wait until the iPhone comes out.
And about this thing about the iPhone being closed. This doesn't make any sense at all. All the other phones out there run applications. If it really is closed then maybe it could die but my guess is just that Apple wants to carefully control what goes in it (that's how the big phone providers like NTT DoCoMo etc. get rich) and supply all the valuable components themselves as widgets with the result being that it will be easier for developers to develop for it once you just buy into it, like writing a small HTML web page instead of programming a complex Java app and tuning it for different models. If Apple's smart they won't even charge much for it. A lot of phones on sale now can open (and some can edit) MS Office files but that may not be what enterprises really want.
An easy way to do purchases and view remote databases would be needed for impulse buys on iTunes anyway, and those components would be useful too. What I'd like to see is a system that makes it really cheap and easy to develop for the iPhone and server apps to it. My guess is Apple will provide those things. It is so open ended there is nothing for the analysts to grab onto yet. For example, if it automatically switched all phone calls onto a WLAN and synched to it wirelessly, that alone might be worth it.
It remains to be seen whether Apple will really try to go it alone, or try to create an ecosystem of vendors and create a lucrative, inclusive content production/distribution system. It might even boost Mac sales but I think they are just keeping most of the functionality under wraps on purpose. There are already copycat systems appearing.
The listed specs show talk time as 5 hours, and audio playblack as 16 hours. There are no estimates of standby time available anywhere. Everyone keeps misreading this as 16 hours of standby time, but that's wrong. 5 hours of talk time is actually pretty standard for a cell phone. Based on the talk time estimate, I'd say standby is probably on the order of a week.
Here's a better idea...The iPhone Shuffle...only one button, no display, and it just dials randomly...
When my company (a large financial institution) was looking into smart phones, there were two requirements that were particularly hard for vendors to provide:
.Net Compact Framework is a pain. You're better off making a Web-based application with a tiny interface.
1) Encryption. Gotta have the e-mail, phonebook, and any files encrypted wherever they're stored. Doesn't do us any good to have an SD slot that someone can pop in any old card and move their messages to that is unencrypted.
2) Remote Wipe. Gotta be able to enforce a security policy that wipes a lost machine on demand.
So far, I haven't heard if iPhone supports either of these. We couldn't find ANY cell phone vendors that supported all of this out of the box, so we had to go to third party solutions. From everything I'm reading, that isn't an option with iPhone.
This is why I think that the iPhone will fail in the Enterprise. Period. Gotta open to third party solutions. I think the option of companies creating their own applications is unrealistic. Unless your entire organization is going to standardize on one handset and one vendor you're looking at a support nightmare. Even J2ME or
by Mike Buddha -- Someday the mountain might get him, but the law never will.
The Newton didn't fail, it was killed when Jobs came back to the company. That the Newton was Scully's baby might have something to do with that....
Frankly, I'm looking forward to all the Apple Fanboys getting their ass handed to them over the iPhone.
How much space is left on your Nomad, Taco? A 4 gig nano will set you back $200, a lot of decent phones $200-$300. $200 + $300 = $500. The visual voicemail alone will sell a lot of iPhones. These things are going to sell like hot cakes, so I hope you like the taste of crow.