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NASA Purchases $19M Russian Space Toilet
Gary writes "NASA has paid $19 million for a Russian-built international space station toilet system. The toilet system, similar to the one already in use in the station's Zvezda Service Module, is scheduled to arrive at the space station in 2008 and will offer more privacy for a crew expected to double from three to six by 2009. The space station toilet physically resembles those used on Earth, except it has leg restraints and thigh bars to keep astronauts and cosmonauts from floating away. NASA says purchasing the multi million dollar toilet is a bargain compared to developing one from scratch."
I didn't realize that NASA was so flush with cash!
*drum fill*
I'm here all week!
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They already have one - for the Shuttle. I've seen it on Discovery or something.
No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
I know these are probably tasteless questions, but...
1) Is there some sort of mechanism to ensure that Mr. Hanky the poo goes into the bowl?
2) Can male astronauts pee standing up in this toilet?
Cheers!
Atheist: Buddhist in a Prius
I'd be happy to add some ankle bars to my loo for only $1m.
I can replace the water with a leaf sucker for only a small bit more.
Brings new meaning to a "floater".
Life is not for the lazy.
I think NASA got a shitty deal there...
Summation 2
You know, I usually love reading space news, but in this case I have to say:
Who gives a shit?
It's a crap!
Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
If I were one of the astronauts, I'd take 1/6th of $19m and poop in my hand in front of the world.
A $45 six pack of Coke?
/ 5469
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/11/4/18128
Leave it up to our space exploration agency to just go waste money like that.....makes me wonder...why couldn't we just use the toilets we got off the aliens in the space station?
We came,we saw, we kicked it's ass!
in fact, it's not true story, but who cares after all:
During the space race back in the 1960's, NASA was faced with a major problem. The astronaut needed a pen that would write in the vacuum of space. NASA went to work. At a cost of $1.5 million they developed the "Astronaut Pen". Some of you may remember. It enjoyed minor success on the commercial market.
The Russians were faced with the same dilemma.
They used a pencil.
Wow. Shit.
are these the kinds of toilets that come with the FEMA trailers in New Orleans ??? Sick b*st*ards...
"Goodness me, how unlike the FBI to abuse the trust of the American public." -- The Onion
Toilets flush money down you? I guess NASA learned a lesson after the incident where Russian cosmonauts decided to simply use pencils instead of spending millions developing a zero-g pen... NASA probably just spent $19M on a hole in the side of the space station that astronauts press their cheeks against so the poo is forced into the vacuum of space. So worth every penny.
(p.s. yes I know the space pen thing is an urban legend)
That the urine from it is recycled into potable water?
Also i wonder why it wasn't discussed in the article why the toilet designed for the Space shuttle couldn't be used. I'd hazard a guess that it is an integration issue, the Russian one is designed for integration into a space stations systems, whereas the shuttle one is designed to standalone.
Kind of like you have a different toilet in your house vs the one in a camper van.
Can someone be more informative?
"The weirdest thing about a mind, is that every answer that you find, is the basis of a brand new cliche" -
When I read this I couldn't help but remember a rather amusing fact of the space race. NASA spent millions developing a pen that would write in space, the Russians just used a pencil. It actually makes me wonder just how high tech this high dollar toilet system is or is it just heavy on common sense design?
By "leg restraints" they mean the roll of (Duct Tape) hanging off the wall next to the crapper...
Task Mangler
NASA says purchasing the multi million dollar toilet is a bargain compared to developing one from scratch."
:)
I created a zero gravity shitter for my 7th grade science project. I would have sold it to them for half that price.
It's not just a toilet, but a water reclamation unit. FTA: "...the urine is automatically transferred to a U.S. device that can generate potable water."
Plus, with this system very similar to the Russian module, there's no need for new training (and yes, you do need training to use a space toilet).
Finally--sorry to be indelicate--but in zero gravity, I'd say it's worth the $19M to avoid small droplets of urine end up in the electronics or worse, a small piece of poo float into your Tang.
Of all the things I would expect to hear NASA paying $19 million for, I never would have expected a Russian Space Toilet. I suppose it's better that they put the money down to get something that works rather than spending more money in developing something new. Still though, $19 million? That seems a bit extreme. Oh well. If it keeps the crew happy then I guess it's worth it.
You know, the one where NASA spends hojillions on a space-pen, and the Russians just use a pencil.
Classical Liberalism: All your base are belong to you.
I guess it could be a real bargain if the $19M includes delivery and installation.
Give me half that much money and I'll design you the most feature rich space toliet you could EVER want-- i think around $9 million ought to pay for R&D and prototyping costs. I would like to see the break down of what costs so fscking much.
Looks great! Like toilets in russian railway trains...
Dmitriy Bowman: Hello, Zvezda HAL do you read me, Zvezda HAL?
Zvezda HAL: Affirmative, Dmitriy, I read you.
Dmitriy Bowman: Open the toilet leg restraints, Zvezda HAL.
Zvezda HAL: I'm sorry Dmitriy, I'm afraid I can't do that. I'm going to flush you.
Dmitriy Bowman: What's the problem? You're really pissing me off.
Zvezda HAL: I think you know what the stinking problem is just as well as I do.
Dmitriy Bowman: What are you talking about, Zvezda HAL? This is is a shitty situation.
Zvezda HAL: This mission is too important for me to allow you to pee all over it.
Dmitriy Bowman: I don't know what the crap you're talking about, Zvezda HAL?
Zvezda HAL: I know you and Frank were planning to take a plunger to me, and I'm afraid that's an elimination I cannot allow to happen.
Dmitriy Bowman: Where the crap did you get that shitty idea, Zvezda HAL?
Zvezda HAL: Dmitriy, although you took thorough precautions in the toilet against my seeing you, I could hear your bowels move.
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Couldn't they have announced yet another design contest with a $100k going to the winner.
So, is this money going to pay for an actual physical toilet, or are they just paying for the licensing of the toilet?
Because if so, I expect loyal Slashdotters to be claiming that this is patent madness, and to start wearing t-shirts with the plans for these toilets on them, and to start launching tirades against the racketeering space plumbing business.
Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
It's a shame it costs $19 million. I've had nights after a few too many bean burritos where a toilet with leg restraints that kept me from flying off would have been very useful.
I'm not aware of the Russion toilet habits: is it a flush or squad toilet?
Where is the little shelf where they keep the three seashells?
I note from TFA that "the urine is transferred to a device that generate drinking water".
It appears there is little privacy left when they drink each others urine.
don't cut it off www.mgmbill.org
Don't underestimate the need for privacy while dropping the "bomb", so to speak. For ISS, this is the ramp-up to 6 crew members. It takes longer on the Shuttle toilets than regular Earth toilets (30+ min.), it's safe to assume the strap-in and strap-out time makes Mir-type toilets take longer, too. The pictured unit in the article has an actual crapper to sit on instead of the Shuttle's butt-sucker to strap into (think vacuum-diaper). It just seems more dignified. IIRC, the Mir-type toilets also serve a shower/cleaning function. With 2-3 crew it is simple to negotiate toilet time. With 6 people, they will need the second toilet.
Weirdest. Topic. Ever.
Josh
gigantino.tv - Heavy but weighs nothing.
the Russians just worked it out with a pencil.
Though NASA was mostly happy with the purchase, it was discovered that it couldn't be used while in Space Dock.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
It makes more sense for NASA to get ripped off by some Russians than have there best engineers working on something for a few years (after testing and whatever processes it needs) that's not *as* important as probably 1000 other things they're doing.
Having said that I think the issue here is NASA should have a lot more money than it does so they can do whatever they like, scientific prowess is what differentiates the American economy from the Chinese and America will end up in the gutter if it doesn't stay on top when it comes to cutting-edge tech.
$19 million? They probably plan on reselling it for $25 million on eBay.
Coder's Stone: The programming language quick ref for iPad
My head is swirling at this crappy deal. Something stinks here, and it pains me to see the NASA people bowled over by the Russians like this.
I think we should log a complaint against them for wiping away our limited budget on such things. But please people, this is nothing to make silly puns about -- afterall we're the ones getting pinched, and the Russians are getting flush with cash. I hope the media lights a match under this story. We need to clear the air.
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
They just need to figure out some way of creating a vacuum up there in space....
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
Isn't it time we start getting some low gravity modules developed and start putting them to good use? how hard is it to make a module that spins anyway?
passed out, floating in a personal constellation of excrement, too many times.
That still hold in outer space? Given that up and down is difficult to determine...
Camping on quad since 1996.
From TFA:
The space station toilet physically resembles those used on Earth, except it has leg restraints and thigh bars to keep astronauts and cosmonauts from floating away. Fans suck waste into the commode.
Astronaut 1: Uh oh
Cosmonaut 1: What happened?
Astronaut 1: The shit hit the fan
I have always wondered how they deal with things like explosive diarrhea in space. I mean seriously, with large quantities of very liquid material being ejected at high speed, how do they keep it from going all over the place?
You can pee into a container easy enough but diarrhea seems like it would be a problem to contain.
$19 million right down the crapper!
Erik http://yakko.cs.wmich.edu/~rattles
If NASA would have bought it in my hometown, they could've gotten a $100 (or $150!) rebate from the city. Suckers.
Cool funny t-shirts for geeks, gamers and everyone else
Bigelow, or some other group, should come up with an inexpensive loo and sell that to the feds for 5 million. Why? Because bigelow is looking to put up a NUMBER of stations, transports, and even planet bases. If they can get in the position of making it for the feds AND bigelow, they may sell 100 or more by 2020. As it is, if bigelow can put sundancer up before the end of 2010 and have BA-330 in line for the next year, most likely the first buyer of a BA-330 will be NASA to attach for living quarters at the station. Back in 2000, when congress killed transhab over the objection of clinton/gore, clinton/gore pushed in there that transhab should be sold and left in there the ability for NASA to purchase future modules. NASA has had a bit of a grudge about this, but if not America, then most likely EU or one of the participating ISS members will fork up the money and call it their module.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
... I thought the ISS was a joint project? Why do we have to foot the bill for it all?
So do the Russkis pony up every time they need to pinch a deuce, or will they just crawl under?
Captain's log, September 29th, 2007...
Wouldn't the waste be analyzed see how it is in space? I know it's gross, but it's science.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Leg and thigh restraints?! 19M worth of well spent money. This ain't your mothers roller coaster lap bar!
crap.
there's a space toilet.
It's true no man is an island, but if you take a bunch of dead guys and tie 'em together, they make a good raft.
I bet it sucks too.
New meaning to elimintating waste
With no gravity to settle it in either position, you now also have "half assed" (in any way, pun intended and I know it's a bad one). So you don't only get the option to piss on the seat or sit on the bowl instead of the seat, you now also get the option to float onto it, only to notice that it was halfway down, the suction didn't work as intended because it was too far away and ... I leave the mess to your imagination.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
We all remember the discussion about the moon shot. "But what did come out of it?" was the general question. Those billion bucks just to get some worthless rocks?
There were all sorts of additional developments, out of the necessity of creating new materials for the requirements of space flight that also had good applications down here on earth.
Sure, today all we want is immediately applicable results. We want a cost/benefit calculation. Another thing that's wrong with today's R&D efforts. They just see the toilet (ok, this is soooo funny and we've all laughed, but it doesn't matter that it's "just" a toilet, ok?), and they don't even see just what other benefits, new technologies and materials could come out of it as a by product.
I just know a few wisecrackers will produce some more toilet humor out of this and what other "technologies" could come to light due to it. But just think about it, and for Pete's sake ignore for a moment that it's a loo. It applies to just anything else there is. R&D is forced to limit itself to the desired results, instead of trying to even pursue everything they find in their efforts.
And that's just sad.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
You don't actually think they spend $20,000.00 on a hammer, $30,000.00 on a toilet seat do you?
Life is pain. Anyone who says differently is selling something.
This is just further proof that our nation wastes tax payer's money.
I could give a shit about how comfortable astronauts are when using urinal on a space station or shuttle. You're wasting my paycheck on this bullshit? Fucking Christ.
PROFIT!!!
too obvious not to be said I suppose
A goal is a dream with a deadline
I am with Linus on this one.
Using taxpayer money to purchase a $19 million dollar toilet, yet another infringement on our rights by the gov't. Add it to the ever-growing list of violations:
They violate the 1st Amendment by opening mail, caging demonstrators and banning books like "America Deceived" from Amazon.
They violate the 2nd Amendment by confiscating guns during Katrina.
They violate the 4th Amendment by conducting warrant-less wiretaps.
They violate the 5th and 6th Amendment by suspending habeas corpus.
They violate the 8th Amendment by torturing.
They violate the entire Constitution by starting 2 illegal wars based on lies and on behalf of a foriegn gov't.
Support Dr. Ron Paul and end this madness.
Last link (unless Stark County District Library caves to the gov't and drops the title):
America Deceived (book)
According to the NPR story on this last week, it was reported at $19M, but NASA says it was more like $15 million.
It's still way more accurate than most science reporting, but it was still about 27% high.
The Russian system is actually a full sewage system, and turns the urine back into drinking water. That saves launch costs at ~20,000/kgon the water. With 3-6 astronauts up there it pays to do this.
I didn't believe it in Waterworld, I certainly don't believe it now.
Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
In Soviet Russia, toilet flushes YOU!
Time for the obligatory comment:
In Soviet Russia, space toilet flushes you!
You are reading a sig. Cancel or allow?
my gear make me a little nervous.
Our toilets are also very, very simple. For $100, you get a shiny, but relatively heavy ceramic bowl with a couple simple levers, one valve, and a siphon (note that conventional siphons don't work in space). It uses about 5 kg of water per flush, and all the waste flows downhill into part of a much larger system that cost $billions (if you live in a city). 5 kg/flush x 6 astronauts x 5 flushes per day x $1000/kg to orbit means you'd spend $19 million on water for a conventional toilet in about 4 months.
The Russian space toilet uses no (or close to no, I'm not sure) water for operation. It separates and dries solid waste into containers that are burnt up in the atmosphere with discarded cargo ships. The liquid waste is distilled. The NASA life support cycle chart shows this distilled water going into the potable supply, although another source said it's kept separate because the astronauts are reluctant to drink it. Either way, the result is a lot of saved water.
So the $19 million cost covers the mechanism that captures the waste products with not release into the station atmosphere, the mechanism that separates the wastes, the mechanism that packages the solid waste, and the mechanism that recycles the liquid waste. Actually, reading the articles, it sounds like this might be an entire modular bathroom including handwashing, toothbrushing, and other miscellaneous appliances in addition to the toilet. Add onto that the fact that this is two-off product (whereas Halsey Taylor defrays their development costs over 100,000's of units sold), and the need to design it to be lightweight, and I begin to suspect that $19 million is an outstanding deal for NASA.
at least we can't accuse them of buying stupid shit
* ducks *
While it really pisses me off to think about paying $19mil for a toilet, the price is justified. It is a crap shoot bringing new commodal products to the market, about 90% of them are ejected from the market outright. The market serving the needs of the space community is flush with cash, and the value of this technology is often just flushed away when new ones enter the market. Having privacy concerns addressed for astronauts gives them time to think about their oratory skills, and I imagine we will have a number of master debaters on board at some time who will need to avail themselves of the discretion offered by the Russian crapper.
M
Plus, having to open the tank to re-attach the flapper mechanism must be way more interesting in zero g.
Squirrel!
I imagine the photo's of this thing would be too much for the British. Better check with the censor board before viewing in the UK! http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/07/07/05/199233.shtml
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
When I think "high quality toilets", the places that come to mind are the US (Stevens Institute of Technology, birthplace of the low flush toilet), Japan (high tech computerized toilets), and Germany (all-round well-engineered bathroom technology). The Italians and French maybe have a historical claim on toilet technology. But there's no way I'd want a piece of Russian-built toilet technology anywhere near my private parts.
Russian Toilet System: $14M
Toilet's "Star Wars" Laser Targeting System: $4M
Installation: $1M
Hitting the Whitehouse from space, Priceless.
Have you read the moderator guidelines? Well, have you, PUNK? (and I want a Karma: Gnarly option)
"One of the symptoms of an approaching nervous breakdown is the belief that ones work is terribly important." -BRussell
...charge $1 million less for a toilet than they do for a ticket to the space station?
While I agree that his comment was completely off topic, but if your idea of sobriety is discarding any hint of social conscience or empathy, then pass me the hard liquor please.
I hate printers.
http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp
paintball
I know that you are just trolling, but what exactly are YOU doing with your money? Are you giving 100% of all that you make above and beyond what you need for sustenance (which it turns out, is damn little), to other? Are you coming up with solutions that help ppl? How are you able to post here? You have a computer. That is a luxury (which was made cheap because of the space/military drives) that the vast majority can not afford. How do you justify your wasting of money.
Even if you solve 100% of today's issues, then new issues will come along. Unless you have a growing economy, then you are going nowhere. NASA is using damn little money to get us to another planet. In the end, it may save mankind by being on another planet when a major unforeseen disaster strikes here.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
The Russians omitted to mention that the toilet itself costs $1M, but requires $9M special toilet paper roll to properly function (shipment includes 2).
All jokes aside, to me, this represents a HUGE step forward in terms of collaboration between the US and Russian space agencies.
NASA has shown that it's willing to use proven Russian technology in its own systems. Russia's got a whole array of heavily proven technology that I'm sure NASA would greatly benefit from. Soyuz and Progress being the two most obvious examples of areas where US technology is either nonexistent or greatly inferior. The Energia launch system is also a very cool bit of technology that's been sitting dormant for almost 20 years.
Heck.... even Russia's new Kliper crew module is looking more promising than anything the US has up its sleeve (not to mention that the next generation of Soyuz will be able to fly around the moon). Given Russia's current economic woes, I wouldn't doubt that they'd be interested in collaborating with NASA as long as NASA were willing to provide some sort of financial support.
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
It's still a lot cheaper than the Navy's $600 toilet seat from the '80s.
This is a cost effective way of doubling the lavatory facilities on the space station, without incurring additional training or development costs. Even if some argue whether the technology is worth $19 million, it's not like the money is going somewhere other than back into the Russian Space Program.
"...thigh bars to keep astronauts and cosmonauts from floating away."
That must be one hell of a curry last night.
In Soviet Russia, Commode uses YOU!!
For real it seems this time.
Huh?
It might hit Ellen Muth in the head. Yet another Russian toilet seat to be killing someone.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
Hmmm, I hope NASA paid the dealer an extra $100 for the onsite warranty! A killer deal!
Horns are really just a broken halo.
1. roll back foreskin, if any
2. spread pee hole to prevent central self-adhesion
3. let go of the pee hole
4. pee
This toilet recycles.
American: "This Tang tastes like shit."
Russian: "It is shit."
American: "Kind of nutty, eh?"
Suppose the seat is mostly down, floating just a few inches above the rim.
You get into the general position, but not yet seated.
You grab the handles, straps, bars, or other S+M devices.
You pull yourself downward and backward. (ass direction or Earth-like coordinates)
Before your ass pushes the seat down flat, your balls get between the seat and the rim.
CRUNCH!
compared to the value adding a second bathroom does to such a prime bit of real estate.
:-)
Maybe they're thinking of selling?
"...except it has leg restraints and thigh bars..."
:)
sounds kinky.. but no
Ya know, there was a time when, like half the little boys out there, I dreamed of being an astronaut when I grow up. Reading such things about drinking filtered sewage and such, I'm suddenly very happy I didn't become an astronaut. (Or, depending on who you choose to believe, that I never grew up;) I have a lot more respect for the brave folks doing this for the benefit of us all, but, ugh, I'm very happy to be the little coward who lets someone else brave the risks of space and beta-test the piss filter.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
All I can think of is how cool it would be to send piles of this waste into deep space. The DNA of the living organisms contained within would have the opportunity to start life on another rock somewhere else in the universe. It would also come with some good nutrients to get it started.
Does it go on forever?