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China Buying US Directed Sound 'Weapon'
holy_calamity writes "The directed sound weapon made by US company ATC is being exported to the Chinese police, despite the public law banning sales of weapons to China. Turns out that such 'non-lethal' technologies are not covered by this law — an omission that may become more widely known if they are used to quell high-profile protests during the Olympics."
C'mon. Sound weapons? That's the least of it.
-1 not first post
What a great way to oppress folks and not leave bloody bodies around for cameras!
the Chinese have stolen Country and Western!
which is totally what she said
Corporations are not American.
The Long Range Acoustic Device(TM) (LRAD®) is a highly directional acoustic array that is designed for long-range communication and unmistakable warning. The LRAD device can issue a verbal warning and has the capability of following up with a deterrent tone to influence behavior or determine intent
Hopefully it'll only be used to blast the music I like, at a volume I can tolerate.
The Chinese can be trusted with technology and support individual freedoms in and outside their borders.
While stocks last.
How we know is more important than what we know.
This may be something to test on myth busters, but can't you die from your eardrums bleeding into your head?
Help fight spam
Rosanne Barr? Cool.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
This weapon is just a large boombox playing Kevin Federline's latest CD...
I don't really know much about this device, but let's, for the moment, assume it can't actually hurt anyone, just make them uncomfortable / stun them. Is it really a weapon then?
I don't know if it's such a bad thing to provide China with safe crowd control devices. If China wants some form of crowd control they will use whatever they have, including deadly force (such as back in Tienanmen Square).
Giving them something safe to use is probably a good idea and could save peoples' lives.
I think the counterargument would be something to the effect that the US shouldn't help a government such as China's to maintain control over its people. It's a difficult moral dilemma to be sure. However, China is not Burma and by and large the population is content with their government.
Once they finished slaughtering the objectors it sure got quiet over there for a while, didn't it?
and completely ignore the US occupation of Iraq
You're right, I wonder what became of that whole thing? I haven't seen that come up in the media lately... oh wait.
The twitter monologues. Click on my homepage and be amazed.
Unless the PRC plans on using this sometime in the immediate future, why wouldn't they simply develop this technology locally?
AFAIK, the principles behind the technology aren't all that complicated.
"The fight for freedom has only just begun." - Geert Wilders
Economic relations between the US and the ChiComs are arguably more important than supporting those opposed to the Chinese government.
We don't need more adversaries than we have already, and the cultural war with Islam is a greater concern than how the Middle Kingdom deals with its subjects. We have no duty to sacrifice for others, and our own prosperity should be our first consideration. I say sell Beijing whatever it wants, and quit caring about how Asians handle internal affairs.
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Did anyone else read the headline as China is buying Sound Weapons directed at the US? I felt bad for people living in California for a moment.
Reviewing just the first hour of video games.
That is what they were designed for here in the US.
Might blow up and kill this man...woooooooo
!!Are we sure Garth Brooks isn't a lethal weapon or in violation of the geneva conventions? I mean I heard about them playing Eminem loud at guantanamo to increase stress levels, but Garth Brooks...that would obscene. And from a strategic perspective, should we really give away our best interrogation techniques to the chinese?
Water boarding with achey breaky heart in the background? The horror.
From everything I have seen lately, the vast majority of Chinese are very happy with their government at the moment, so I question the likelihood of any mass protests during the Olympics. I disagree they are all silently cowering in fear; rather, my impression is they're very happy with all their newfound wealth and growing power.
If it's not a weapon, so that these laws do not apply... then I want one!
But really, this Chinese thing looks like a mess waiting to happen. More reason to hate / distrust the United States government... for both Americans and Chinese.
>>. I disagree they are all silently cowering in fear; rather, my impression is they're very happy with all their newfound wealth and growing power.
I suppose you're referring to the ones who weren't murdered by the government during the Tiannamen Square protests.
The bastards. How dare they wish to have a representative government?
it's illegal to have an outspoken opinion of the PRC.
the American President, good, bad or evil, at least they can speak out against him/her and the Office.
One HAIL of a weapon... All HAIL will be breaking loose... if misused...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DVvrcFi4M0
We were working secretly for the military
Our experiment in sound was nearly ready to begin
We only know in theory what we are doing
Music made for pleasure
Music made to thrill
It was music we were making here until
But they told us all they wanted was a sound
That could kill someone
From a distance
So we go ahead
And the meters are over in the red
It's a mistake in the making
From the painful cries of mothers to the terrifying scream
We recorded it and I put it into our machine
But they told us all they wanted was a sound
That could kill someone
It could feel like falling in love
It could feel so bad
But it could feel so good
It could sing you to sleep
But that dream is your enemy
We won't be there to be blamed
We won't be there to snitch
I just pray that someone there can hit the switch
But they told us all they wanted was a sound
That could kill someone
From a distance
And we go ahead
And the meters are over in the red
It's a mistake we have made
And the public are warned to stay off
And the public are warned to stay off
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
The images of pretty affluent Chinese living in modern-looking cities we've come to enjoy in the Western media are not exactly indicative of what actually goes on over there. It's a big country with a billion people.
In any case, it's illegal to express negative feelings about the glorious Communist Party or its leaders, so I'm not sure who you've been talking to over there. Just about every Chinese I've ever met here in the US love their country, but they've rarely had anything but negative things to say about their government, regardless of the era they happened to leave.
The twitter monologues. Click on my homepage and be amazed.
Pardon me, your brightness, but you might want to do just a tad bit of research regarding the distribution of that "wealth and power". You'll find (having lived and worked in China) as I did that it is almost entirely held by the communist elite. Unless you call working a mindless factory job for the equivalent of $10/mo. wealthy and or powerful. Oh, and don't forget that wealth-building beatings you'll be getting if your power isn't super enough on the lead-paint toy assembly line. God you're a jackass.
I'm glad that is your "impression." I've been there, and the majority of them are not happy, because as they grow in wealth they also grow in knowledge, and those in the growing middle class are not happy with their lack of basic freedoms many in the western world enjoy daily.
Is like protesting farts on the moon. It makes no sense. It is the Olympics, not 'China'. It just happens to be in China. Silly protesters need to back off and grow some pubes.
Damned anonymous button....
One HAIL of a weapon. All HAIL will be breaking loose -- if misused...
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
I'm tired of people like the GP defending China with "I think x and y" opinions that don't hold up to simple scrutiny or common sense.
likey it will be seen being used at the Olympics on free Tibet protesters.
the vast majority of Chinese are very happy with their government at the moment
On the other hand, it was recently reported that there were over 85,000 protests in China last year, some of them violent. That is a staggering number. I suspect these sound machines will see a lot of action.
Leave the gun, take the cannolis.
We've been selling them directed sound weapons ever since we've been exporting Britney Spears CDs...
Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
If you speak bad against the government in china you are either jailed or just dissapear.
If you speak bad against the government in the USA nothing like that happens.
I have only 1 feeling about this, and it's a fucked up one. The Chinese should be allowed to voice their opinions plain and simple. I bet the US military is just dieing to see the results of this too as the Chinese will be their test guinea pigs. Sick Bastards.
The "pain ray" the US has developed is pretty well suited for a totalitarian government as well. It leaves no marks, so you could also just round up anyone at a protest and subject them to microwave beams that activate the pain nerves in the skin just enough to be able to cause agonizing pain without leaving any marks . You have the double bonus of driving your victims insane from the pain without any ugly wounds to photograph and get people upset. However, China is not Burma and by and large the population is content with their government. China has a very effective ability to stifle dissent -- Tiananmen square is an excellent example. How are you going to know if anyone is unhappy if everyone is too scared to say anything? When you surf the internet in China they love to have little animated policemen popping up on your screen to remind you that you are being watched. People are scared enough there already of doing the wrong thing -- imagine what would happen if deaf people started showing up as not-so-subtle reminders of what happens to people who complain?
Imagine the scenario of one man in a truck with a sound weapon shutting down a whole protest without any ugly pictures to shock anyone into action, with no effective recourse by the protesters. This kind of thing is the way that your typical 'nightmare dystopian science fiction movie' would become reality. Once the people are unable to complain or protest, how nice would the government have to be?
So, to work around it, all protesters need to have sonic-activated bleed-makers. Insert in the ear, or as a collar around the neck, tuned specifically to government frequencies. When the government uses said offensive device, the "sound proof" will be earmarked or collared around the victims/protesters/dissidents.
ANY time some damned government (regardless of the country, EVEN if it's the u.s.a) dares to make zero-evidence weapons, a defiant nullification of anonymity should be created in the event the weapon's use is domestic vs true battlefield. Damned weaponeers and deviant policy makers...
Sounds to ME like THEY need a "ring around the collar"...
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
"Yes, I have a Disaster Recovery Plan. It's called my Resume"
Your incredulous attitude is troubling.
The sound weapon being sold may be non-lethal, but who is to say they won't RE the device and make lethal sound weapons. Sound can kill. If you stand next to a speaker when 160db of sound comes out of it, you'll be dead. NASA uses sound to test the tiles on the shuttle, anyone caught inside that tester would be killed instantly when the sound came on.
Christianity : Shit happens.
Islam : If shit happens it's the will of Allah.
Judaism : Why does shit always happen to us?
Agnosticism : I don't know whether shit's happening or not.
Tibetan Buddhism & Falun Gong : Shit's happening to our ears!
i cant get a job without peeing in a cup, cant go to canada without 28 forms of identification, cant get on a plane without a body cavity search, but if you are a company you can sell anything you want anywhere in the world.
,without any restrictions or checks on my person whatsoever.
i have decided to incorporate myself and ship myself anywhere i want to go. thanks to free trade, i will then have no problem entering any country on the planet,
or on top-tier foreign athletes who might beat the Chinese competitors.
There's bound to be news media from all over there. You really think Beijing has the intestinal fortitude to use them on anyone besides the Tibetans?
Why can't we go back to using jumpers to configure slot adapter cards? Why? I say!
Then by all means close that loophole up for national security.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Will they call them Weirding Modules?
Repton.
They say that only an experienced wizard can do the tengu shuffle.
The worst part of this is, the fact that this sales was allowed to go through is troubling. There is very little difference between the military and the police these days here in the USA. In other countries it is much worse, and in China the two are usually indistinguishable.
/. I DO have all the answers!) but the merging of military and police functions is bad for communities.
An easy example of this is how law enforcement and military tradeshows are now one in the same.
I don't have all the answers (wait, this is
Thank you Dave Raggett
It's not an omission from that law in any way shape or form. The item has a clear civil use and it was not designed for the military originally so how does one presume that it fits into this law much less it was somehow "overlooked" or "omitted"? This article is weak.
I'd normally be the first one here to complain about illegal or questionable exports of technology to China seriously... who cares?
Another quality product from your friends at Blue Sun(TM).
...a lethal sound...like Drew Carey's laugh. Those yellow bastards!
The software would probably not work. Being as it was writen by Westerners all the Chineese would look the same to the software.
Undetectable Steganography? Yep, there's an app fo
We can't handle sound waves of that magnitude!
you can believe what you want to believe, or you could do some research to find out the truth. The truth is most people on here don't have a clue, talking through the nose about China. Maybe when you grow older you will learn?
I wonder what the RIAA will say...
I would not be surprised if these gizmos were made in China in the first place.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
It'd feel like a weird earthquake.
You can't take the sky from me...
I thought the Lynch movie sucked but the thing about the weirding modules, if saying Paul's name was bad enough, what if you let one rip right into the mouthpiece? And what if it was a wet one, too? "My ass has a killing turd." If John Waters directed Dune.
Kwisatz Haderach
Sell the spice to CHOAM
This Mahdi took Shaddam's Throne
actually, the grandparent says some facts. believe or not, here is a huge and growing middle class in China, especially in large cities. In large cities like Beijing and Shanghai, the average income is about $300/month, if not higher (but with common goods much cheaper than here). And stores like starbucks is very popular there, who sells coffee at the same price as in US, if not higher. I am not saying that there is absolutely no people earn $10/month in factories, but the inflation in China and devalue of dollar here the same time, it will be very hard to find a wage at that level. China is not in Africa, after all.
I just filed a patent for "direct sound earplugs"! Should be rich by the end of the year.
They will wheel this thing out during the Olympic opening ceremonyin Beijing and do a massive rick role
Ha take that you western dogs, I get you back good.
someone tag this story "boweldisruptor"
Last bit of Chinese crowd control I saw used a tank - they want to switch to non-lethal sound weapons, I think this is a good thing.
It's not like we haven't violated every other weapons treaty thrown at us, or sold terrible weapons to terrible people in the past.
I hear accelerating tiny bits of metal towards people works perfectly well for killing them, and as China has both the capability to do so and few compunctions about doing it, I don't see them making Killer Scream Mk1000s.
Help poke pirates in the eyepatch, arr.
I'm not sure what relevance that number has. Make no mistake, I think China (the PRC, that is, not Taiwan) is a fascist dictatorship, but think about it: if there had been little to no protests, wouldn't you also use that as evidence that China's population is so scared that they daren't even protest or anything anymore?
This is outsourcing, simply. The weapons industry need to run large scale tests, and they don't want to have too many high-profile cases too close to home. By making this kind of 'loophole' in the law they get to test their controversial weapons without too much public outcry, and if things get too noisy, the government can say "By God, you are right! Fancy how we could have overlooked that ", and of course it takes a lot of time to change a law.
Producing incredibly powerful sounds isn't that hard or new, and I'd bet the Chinese already have louder things. E.g., a pneumatic siren can be made as loud as you want it to, e.g., by using higher pressure air.
So from a pragmatic point of view, I'm left wondering why would they want to buy it from the USA when they can make one themselves.
At a wild and uninformed guess, I'm more like guessing that some US company got one of those bogus blanket patents that we all love to hate. You know, something along the lines of "using a sonic device as a non-lethal weapon".
China on the whole still doesn't seem that fond of IP as a whole, but they also don't seem ready to break all international treaties over it. See for example their investing in designing their own protocols and codecs, when they don't want to pay royalties, as opposed to just calling the whole thing bogus. But I'm guessing that if something is blanket enough, there may not be a way to reinvent your own without infringing anyway.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
Every person who posted a reply to this "news", prior to me, didn't even read the fucking article links. You idiot sheep. The link is to another Slashdot "news" post about directed ultrasound research, and if you follow *that* link, this ATC company doesn't even have a product. Worse yet, the Ph.D. inventor behind this is developing it toward consumer products, not crowd control devices and certainly no type of "weapon", lethal or non-lethal. This is out of hand. Ridiculous. You people need a fucking brain check. This story about the weapon and the sales to China is a total fabri-fuck-ation. Read the fucking article and then go cleanse the gene pool by taking your own lives. Seriously. You would be doing world society at large a huger favor by doing so. Now go do it. Kill yourselves. Thank you.
And Slashdot, clean some fucking house or start losing users over stupidity like this. I don't come here for this kind of fabricated bullshit. If this kind of "news story" is the future of Slashdot then I'm no longer a "user".
Not a single person to this point read the fucking article links. There is no sound weapon and it's not being sold to China. This "news" story is a fabri-fuk-ation. This ATC company doesn't even have a fucking product. And when the Ph.D. behind the company does have a product, it's not going to be a weapon, but consumer gear. You people are idiots. Please do world society a favor and go kill yourselves to cleanse the gene pool. I mean it, go NOW! Quickly! Before you reproduce! Is this kind of totally fabricated "news" the future of Slashdot? Clean some fucking house please or start losing your intelligent users and be left with only brain dead sheep like all who posted above me here. Sad...totally fucking sad...
If you hit someone with a candlestick, the court will count that as a weapon.
Oh please! Would you people stop with the anti-Chinese campaign.
China is going through a national catastrophe and you dare posting such cheap attack on them.
This just shows that behind all the nice speechs Americans, and Westeners as a whole, are just as stupid, racist, nationalistic as people they loathe.
That of course includes political propaganda, which is exactly what this aarticle is.
Every weapon can be dangerous if misused.
We're so crazy!
Best Slashdot Co
This reminds me of "Project X", a fictional sound weapon in Atlas Shrugged, both in nature and in likely use.
"...and in China the two are usually indistinguishable."
No.
I just returned from my second trip to China and it is VERY easy to tell the difference. The uniforms are completely different and different colours. Also, there are at least two different types of police forces in China, just like in the USA.
There are the "local" police who wear the blue uniforms like in the little pop-up animations that are only shown in Internet Cafes. I never saw one of those pop-ups. (I wanted to see it, actually.) I've seen local police alone or in pairs, and I've seen male and female officers.
And there is what can be considered the "People's Liberation Army Police". Their uniforms are a light green, different from both the local police and the PLA uniforms. I saw these folks, always in pairs, at various national historical sites. I always saw them in pairs, and it was funny that the two guys (I never saw a female PLA Police officer while I was there) in the pair were always nearly the exact same height. Strange.
Also, the PLA Police are easier to spot because of the bright white holster/harness thing that they wear for their sidearms. It consists of a white belt with a white strap that on a right-handed officer would go over the left shoulder down to the right side to connect to the belt and onto the bright white holster holding what appeared to be a some form of 9mm semi-auto pistol.
The real "Army" uniforms are a different color. The different branches have different color uniforms, dark blue, light blue, and a dark green (sort of like the Marines in the US wear), but none of them have the light green color of the PLA Police.
I think we're more likely to *hear* it used at the Olympics...
Things need to be put in perspective. I criticize the U.S. all the time, but I find myself defending the U.S. against foreigners when I go abroad. My brother who is a bleeding heart liberal told me the same thing happens to him.
Also, China has much to criticize, but I think this is just taking everyone's focus off the problems in the U.S. (or whatever country you are from). We aren't the great country that we are taught in school (well, I think it is a great country but we have done many terrible things that we should admit to, move on and never repeat - such as the genocide of the Native-Americans, enslavement of a race of people and then discrimination against them, assassinations and coups perpetrated against democratically elected leaders, but ones who we didn't like, all the shit going on now that Slashdot talks about with our freedoms and privacy, and the list goes on).
Anyway, criticism is important. I just don't want everyone focusing only on China, as our government also needs criticism (so it will hopefully improve).
The link to the earlier slashdot article describing directional sound via ultrasound has nothing at all to do with this (LRAD) product.
LRAD is just a big loudspeaker (actually a bunch of regular tweeters). There's nothing "directional" about it, other than that fact that *all* speakers are directional at high frequencies.
This is 100% hype nonsense. Read the wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_range_acoustic_device
There is no "weapon" any more than any other speaker or bullhorn. Enough with the sloppy reporting, slashdot.
will be M4A1s with rubber bullets. They aren't lethal so the ban doesn't apply either ;)
Have you seen the movie Lord of War? Great movie.
85000?where?when?for what?
The USA has been exporting sound weapons (like the LRAD )for many years to 'friendly' countries like Georgia and Israel and so-on; more on sound weapons here: http://crab.wordpress.com/2007/12/10/a-short-history-of-audio-weapons/
Does it go up to 11?
This isn't a real signature, I just manually type this at the end of all my posts.
It's the Chinese government's own figures. They have been widely reported. Here are a couple of links and I am sure Google can provide many more. (That tresriogrande troll might want to check a few before shooting his mouth off next time.)
For instance: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/20/international/asia/20china.html
A paragraph from http://www.cpj.org/Briefings/2006/DA_spring_06/china/china_06.html
"Mass incidents" is the term the Chinese government uses to describe demonstrations, riots, and group petitioning. In January 2006, the Ministry of Public Security announced that there were 87,000 such incidents in 2005, a 6.6 percent increase over the previous year. Protests over corruption, taxes, and environmental degradation caused by China's breakneck economic development contributed to the rise. But some of the most highly charged disputes have occurred over government seizure of farmland for construction of the factories, power plants, shopping malls, roads, and apartment complexes that are fueling China's boom.Leave the gun, take the cannolis.
The vast majority of Chinese ARE happy with their government. It is NECESSARY: China is not like Russia, they do not control the populace with a secret service and giant army, they HAVE to keep the people happy.
If you would like an example of one way they do this, check out the article on slashdot a few days ago saying 60-70% of people actually favor censorship of the internet. This is a result of a government propaganda campaign against pornography. In China there is a TV station that broadcasts nothing but patriotic songs. I thought they were horrible (the music is very bad and repetitive), but when I mentioned it to a girl there, she told me she really liked that channel. The music is motivational I guess.
The main way the government keeps their people happy is by growing the economy. It is true a lot of people in the country are still very poor, but they are still better off than 10 or 20 years ago. Think about it....throughout most of the history of China, famine has been a periodic way of life. Compare that to now, when there is not likely to be a famine within the foreseeable future. This is a good thing.
Finally, I'm not sure about the Chinese you've talked to, but in general I've found if you talk to the young ones, you will find they absolutely love their government. If you talk to the ones that were college age around the time of the Tian-An-Men square massacre, you will find they are unhappy with the government, but their unhappiness is mostly that the government is not changing fast enough, they don't want to destroy the government. Finally, if you talk to some older people, you might find that they are unhappy because they miss the times of Mao Ze Dong.
Qxe4
For all the people complaining about this, what would you rather have them use bullets instead?
How many protests were there in the US last year? Then compare population/population density.
The fact that there were over 85,000 protests shows that a LOT of people are not afraid to protest in China. They feel that it is worth it to protest their causes. If interviewed, I bet you would find that a lot of the protestors aren't all that upset with the government, just with specific policies. Protests are being used as a way to let the government know that change is requested for those policies, not necessarily as an attack on the government itself.
That said, if any of these protests involve incitement to violence or rebellion, I am sure these machines will be used. I believe that the bullhorn will still be used to combat most of them however, and it will probably be very effective.
How many protests were there in the US last year? Then compare population/population density.
The US is about 1/4th the population of China. If there were 20,000+ "mass demonstrations" last year then the main stream media is doing a much better job of suppressing the news than even I give them credit for. I suspect if it was even a tenth of that Cheney would have declared martial law a long time ago.
I am not sure why this post has generated such contention. The Chinese released the figures. The Chinese bought the sound equipment. It isn't that much of stretch to think they are going to use it when they feel they need to do so. And like so many of these technologies (e.g. taser guns), the justifications for their use tend to expand rapidly.
Leave the gun, take the cannolis.
Translation: Test these devices in China where the people have less civil rights. Once they are found to be effective and within tolerable casualty levels deploy them throughout the United States and Europe.
the vast majority of Chinese are very happy with their government at the moment
On the other hand, it was recently reported that there were over 85,000 protests in China last year, some of them violent. That is a staggering number. I suspect these sound machines will see a lot of action.
Source for that number?Read the whole thread before you post.
This is the end result of the conservatives "privatize everything" agenda. They use government financing to start up their companies (and in many cases loot employees right from the goverment), and now... outside any accountability or control... the conservative agenda of wealth-based domination of the globe can finally be completed.
It's hardly surprising that a president who's grandfather financed Hitler would do more work in forwarding the fascist agenda than any person in history. It's likewise not surprising conservatives are forwarding a Nazi agenda: they are both using the same playbook.
How many dB does it take for YOU people to consider something a weapon, or merely painful? None of these LRAD devices can produce over 130 dB at over 50 feet, and the LRAD 100x, the one likely being purchased by the Chinese authorities, can only produce 132 dB at 1 meter, 39 inches away, which just about any decent PA horn in a stadium can produce, or a cheap personal or car alarm horn:
;-)
http://www.safetyenforcement.com/130dbalarm.html
http://www.escstores.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=92843
Is 140 dB a weapon?
From the official dB Drag 2008 rule book:
http://www.termpro.com/dbdrag/rules/2008/section1.asp
__________________________________________________
The contestant must be outside of the vehicle while the vehicle is being metered and all doors, windows, and other openings to the vehicle must remain closed during this time.
Exception - Competitors may remain inside of the vehicle during metering provided:
* They wear adequate hearing protection at all times. Removal of the hearing protection while inside of the vehicle will result in immediate disqualification.
* The competitor's maximum SPL never exceeds 140 dB. A measured SPL in excess of 140 dB will be recorded as 140 dB.
* The competitor must sign a dB Drag Racing entry form that includes a waiver stating that the competitor understands that "exposure to high sound pressure levels may result in temporary or permanent hearing loss".
__________________________________________________
The "adequate hearing protection" includes those little orange foamies you see if people's ears on construction sites. Sticking ones index fingers in your ears is almost as effective, but obviously you can't do any work that way.
Now, go buy an SPL meter that'll register over 130, and go find the kid with the loudest car in town. Ask him to play some bass tracks at the volume he normally does, and stick the meter inside the car. It'll be WELL over 130 dB as a single 12" sub with 250 watts does that EASILY due to cabin gain:
http://www.caraudiohelp.com/newsletter/cabin_gain.htm
So, in this Chinese LRAD context, if this "weapon" can be defeated by just sticking your fingers in your ears, would you consider my fist a weapon, if I planted it in your face? My fist would do a lot more damage and cause a lot more pain. And likely the pain would last far longer.
Likewise, if I sold my fists to China, would I be selling them weapons?
The whole point is, as my other post said very bluntly and with the opposite of tact, you all (exception HEbGb) are mindless sheep that can be led anywhere.
Thanks HEbGb. I've been trying to get it into their thick skulls. I flipped my top so bad when I first read this crap that I unloaded on them. And even after dragging their noses through the logic of just the mis-linking, they still didn't get it. After a day of calming down, I tried to actually give info showing them why they are wrong. Your link to the Wiki article (thank you), which I reposted again, may help bring these nubs around.
/. doesn't get their editorial house in order soon, they'll lose all their intelligent readers and contributors to a hoard of mindless non-thinking turds. I think there were 3 of us total saw the headline, hit the two articles, and instantly smelled dead fish. Everyone else immediately swallowed the "Oh my gosh! It'll hurt peoples ears! We must throw up our hands and scream China is evil and we're selling them weapons to use on demonstrators, so we're now evil too!!!"
/. knows the majority of their user base.
/. is now mind-less-sheep, what Michael Savage dubs "sheeple".
/. cause no one will every believe anything you type, cause you've been 'found out' to be a right wing nut!"
If
Ironic. That's exactly what the headline was designed to do. And it worked. So, obviously
I can't say it enough times. The bulk of the readership of
"OMG! Savage! He's a right wing nut! That makes you, hardwarefreak, a right wing nut! You may as well stop posting to
I swear to the all mighty the above paragraph describes 90% of the current users to a T...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Lrad.jpg
OMG! We're arming cruise ships with these LRAD weapons! OMG OMG! They're going to use them to hurt the ears of the passengers!
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=99472
"Outside the convention hall, New York City police plan to control protesters using a device that directs sound for up to 1,500 feet in a spotlight-like beam. Meanwhile, a display of former Republican presidents inside the hall will feature campaign speeches that are funneled to listeners through highly focused audio beams."
OMG! NYPD used LRADs on US Citizens! Lynch them!
OOOOh-Myyyyy-Godddddddd! The Republicans used LRADs on their own members! OMG! OMG! OMG! They are the ultimate evil! What vicious monsters! They used these weapons on their fellow Republicans! Everyone convert to Democrat! Everyone convert to Democrat! It's just a matter of time before your own party uses sound weapons on you again!
http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20051109/news_1b9cruise.html
"As two small motorboats approached the Spirit, pirates began firing rocket-propelled grenades and machine guns at the ship, operated by Miami-based Seabourn Cruise Line, a Carnival Corp. subsidiary. No passengers were injured, and just one crew member was wounded. Putnam said he did not know if the ship's crew issued a verbal challenge to the pirates before the LRAD blared more punishing, high-intensity sounds. The crew also fended off the attackers with water hoses as the cruise ship Seabourn Spirit changed course and moved away, using its wake to thwart the pirates' small boats."
OMG! They just wanted to sell you cigarettes, even though they shot rockets and machine guns at you! Those poor pirates! OMG! OMG! You didn't have to use that terrible LRAD weapon on them! You are evil for defending your passengers with the LRAD!
There is historical proof that sound kills. During WWI there were numerous cases of persons being killed near the proximity of explosions with no external injuries (ie no shrapnel or entry exit wounds). These persons had various internal injuries, but not from being hit by anything. It was later determined that the sound of the explosions caused internal organ ruptures. I'm not sure why 160dB is considered lethal, 200 dB is generally considered enough to cause: the lungs to rupture, and/or air embolisms which causes death. So if you can survive ruptured lungs and embolisms, then no sound isn't lethal to you and congratulations on making the medical books.
.05 atm .001 atm
By the way every 10 dB = a 10 fold increase in power and intensity.
atmospheric pressure is about 101,000Pa
Let Z = sound pressure of 160 dB
160dB = 20 log (Z Pa/0.00002) = 2000 Pa ~
not
and 194dB ~ 100,237 Pa ~ 1 atm
and 220 dB ~ 19 atm
and 250 dB ~ 620 atm which is more than six times the pressure at the bottom of the Marianas Trench. So if you can survive 600 atmospheres of pressure, then no sound can't kill you and you're also not human, or any form of life that originated on this planet. And that's no BS. It's simple logarithmic math. Or maybe not so simple.
So I guess someone needs to do a little better math.
But just because the sound isn't some high number of atmospheres, it doesn't necessarily follow that it can't kill you.
There is truth that the frequency counts. But not strictly in the way that is being put forward here. It is more about whether the sound is periodic or non-periodic (the sound weapon is non-periodic, as is a bomb blast). Of course not all ears are created equal, and my statements of course oversimplified things, sound is a complex topic. But all the medical and scientific experts agree that sound of sufficient power will kill you. Because it is already known to have killed in the past.So unless you can explain away the historical evidence then there really is no argument. I have no doubt these weapons could be modified to kill.