Post-Quake, China Cuts Access to Entertainment Web Sites

thefickler writes "The Chinese Government has issued orders that all entertainment web sites and regular television programming be shut down completely for the next 3 days. Only web sites covering the recent tragic 7.8 magnitude earthquake and television stations broadcasting CCTV earthquake programming will be allowed to remain live." Can anyone with Web access in China confirm this report? From an AP story on the state of communications in the country right now, it appears at least that China is (despite ongoing monitoring) allowing freer than usual communications in the wake of the quake.

Comments

Think it's a showcase?

[Mal-2]

Do you think maybe the government feels they are doing such a great job there's no need to clamp down? From what I've seen, they are doing about as well as anyone could under the circumstances. Maybe they think that this will lead to good enough things being said (with a few bad ones for a "reality check") that they can pretend to be wide open and still come out of this looking good.

Re:Think it's a showcase?

[justicezyx]

I'm in Qingdao, Shandong Province now. I'm also watch Jackie Chan's Drunken Master clip on *youtube.com*. Actually, Chinese government issue a "3-day" mourning, like a public momorial activity that memorate the people die in this tragedy. It's vollentary, and all media is on their own way. Of course, there is mostly quake-related news, and this must be the mainstream now. As for web sites, I can access all sites that I accessed a few days ago, and everything is find. FYI, China's out-country net-access is limited by the service provides, i.e. China telecom, netcom, etc. Occasionally, you are unable to access some sites, it's because of the congestion in the bottleneck. Chinese government filter/block websits, and this is a open-secret. But, they do not act like a "censor-maina" or "fasicism"...

Re:Think it's a showcase?

[Max Littlemore]

Do you think maybe the government feels they are doing such a great job there's no need to clamp down?

Yeah, I think it's a way to show the world that they are a lot better at handling a humanitarian crisis than totalitarian governments like Burma's junta after the cyclone or the USAs rebublicans after the hurricane. They are doing well with this and are keen to show it - as many governments on Earth would be.

Re:Think it's a showcase?

[Guppy06]

"They are doing well with this and are keen to show it"

So, what are the building codes in the affected areas like? Comparable to earthquake-prone regions in North American and Europe? Are any of the Chinese "journalists" asking if things had to be this bad? Are they allowed to?

You mention the response by US governments to Hurricane Katrina. Don't forget that a great deal of the criticism was against the lack of preparation.

Re:Think it's a showcase?

[sydneyfong]

So, what are the building codes in the affected areas like? Comparable to earthquake-prone regions in North American and Europe? Don't have any data at hand, but probably not. Because China is poorer than North America and much of Europe.

Are any of the Chinese "journalists" asking if things had to be this bad? Are they allowed to? Yes. Specifically, there was much concern about why a significant number of schools and hospitals crumbled while government buildings seem to be relatively unharmed.

Does this answer your questions?

Whats the point?

[Redlazer]

What the hell is it supposed to do?

I would think that after a tragedy, it would better to OPEN the internet as much as possible.

I'm really starting to hate China.

-Red

Re:Whats the point?

[cyfer2000]

I hope you understand what "national mourning" means and at least understand what the title means.

Re:Whats the point?

[clragon]

What the hell is it supposed to do?

I would think that after a tragedy, it would better to OPEN the internet as much as possible.

I think this is part of the 3 days of mourning going on in China right now, to raise even more awareness of the quake.

Also, sites regarding the earthquake will stay up. So the websites created by people to track missing relatives, or to gather donations, will stay online. Was this absolutely necessary? probably not. But I don't think this move will hinder the rescue effort at all, but rather raise more awareness of it since earthquake related info is all the Chinese people will get in the next 3 days.

Re:Whats the point?

[Handover Phist]

Not to mention that the less people are able to sit and watch TV or surf the net, the more people are available to remove the rubble and rebuild homes and businesses. In at least that POV the decision actually makes sense!

Re:Whats the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

What the hell is it supposed to do?

I would think that after a tragedy, it would better to OPEN the internet as much as possible.

I'm really starting to hate China.

-Red

But China has been more open and receptive about this than they ever have. Look at their history.

If you want to see real government relief effort problems, look at Burma. China pales by comparison.

Re:Whats the point?

[ShieldW0lf]

I'm really starting to like China

Re:Whats the point?

[name*censored*]

It's possible that America isn't the only place with a Ted Stevens in high places, claiming that the information regarding relief effort and coordination "got tangled up with all these things going on the Internet commercially.". From there, it's a short logical (logic? hah!) bound to say that cutting off all unrelated content will speed the recovery effort up (although there might be a grain of truth to this thought, if you could prove that Chinese pirates are taxing the infrastructure to the limit, which I highly doubt).

Re:Whats the point?

[Gavagai80]

Because people thousands of miles away are really likely to come help if you take away their TV?

Re:Whats the point?

[Handover Phist]

No, but people in the vicinity who don't have the choice of sitting down in front of a computer and surfing will work through the struggle instead of burying themselves in whatever the computer has to offer.

OK, I'm done playing devils advocate now.

Re:Whats the point?

[RiotingPacifist]

that or a push to bind the comunity together for even greater levels of brainwashing

Re:Whats the point?

[ulyssesdreaming]

It is far more open than before. The three days is for mourning. I am an American living happily in Beijing and there are no access changes. Media and even blogging are actually encouraged at present. The simple fact is that unless you are here, you haven't a clue. China is not perfect by any means, but then again; what country is? It is my job th keep up with all news from all corners of the world. The only difference between the lies of a state run media, or a corrupt government in China is that everyone knows its a lie. Wake up sucker, you're a sheep.

Re:Whats the point?

[FelixGordon]

Nationalism of any kind is brainwashing if you look at it like that, which may well be the case, but it's not necessarily the act of totalitarian oppression some people are ready to make it out as.

Re:Whats the point?

[Tiro]

more open and receptive about this than they ever have

No, they have not!

All frontline coverage of the disaster should "uphold unity and encourage stability" while "giving precedence to positive propaganda", ordered Li Changchun, a member of the party's supreme politburo standing committee. Such edicts are a reminder that - in spite of a flourishing market economy, social liberalisation and a media revolution - the party still holds to the Maoist tenet that power depends on control of "two barrels": that of the gun and the pen.

I don't think we should declaring China's government response favorable based on the standard of Burma! If you think wall-to-wall coverage of disaster recovery is a concession to free speech, you're wrong. It appears more like they are trying to exploit this for nation building.

Re:Whats the point?

[colonel crayon]

The internet goes through a series of tubes, you know.

Re:Whats the point?

[lobatt]

Anonymous Coward

Re:Whats the point?

[jotok]

We could be optimistic and assume the Chinese gov't is realizing that you don't have to tightly control the media in order to look good. You can instead simply let them see you actually do something good.

Re:Whats the point?

[sydneyfong]

Well, let's presume your view of "they are trying to exploit this for nation building" is valid (which I don't agree).

Then, by US standards, China is doing just fine. The USA used 911 for nation building, fueled the fear of terrorists, and made Americans approve two invasions, one of which is viewed as a stupid war everywhere around the world.

You saw a bit more free speech in China after the quake. You saw less free speech in USA after 911.

So, what standards are you proposing to hold China to?

Re:Whats the point?

[kcelery]

The great-walls is for tourists, it could hardly stop the determined. The same is true the great firewall.

Re:Whats the point?

[LostInTaiwan]

Wow, another post justifying the actions of an authoritarian government base on mistakes of a democratic government. US government is not perfect and it's far from perfect. However, we have the freedom to criticize it through free press and we have the freedom to change it through free elections. I don't think you can say that about China. There's a lot of knee jerk reactions after 911 but the amount of criticism toward on the War on Terror post 911 is not possible in China. Free speech in China after the quake is still a long way from the "less free speach" in USA after 911.

Re:Whats the point?

[sydneyfong]

Would arguments like this please stop? It's getting old.

I'm not *justifying* the actions of the Chinese government (of declaring a national mourning). I'm saying that by YOUR standards, this is acceptable, and is simply the right thing to do. Unless you're proposing to hold China to a higher standard, and in which case I'm asking what standards.

The "War on Terror" is another thing entirely. Please don't mix up the issues. Until China decides to have a War on Earthquakes, or begins circulating conspiracies about some evil country causing the quake, this mourning is simply the equivalent of people mourning for the loss in 911.

Also (this is unrelated to my main point above) I don't see how "However, we have the freedom to criticize it through free press and we have the freedom to change it through free elections." helps. Yes, you have a more free press, free speech, and democratic government. But even with all that you elected a government who's waging a stupid war, people still believing that Saddam was involved in 911, and had WMDs. Sometimes I wonder whether I should say that you're justifying your wrongs with "free speech and democracy" -- yes we've done bad things, but we have free speech!! Hah!

I mean, if free speech and democracy doesn't lead to an accountable and sane government, why even bother? I sometimes wonder why Americans are so proud of their "freedoms"... they should be ashamed for electing a crap government despite having these freedoms. How many Iraqis have you killed because of your vote (or lack thereof)? And don't think you're entirely off the blame if you didn't vote for Bush -- did you use your freedom of speech to warn others about the problems of Bush? Did you use it to debunk the lies that the Bush administration has propagated (eg. WMDs)? Did you vote for the Senators who approved the war? (Did you even vote?)

PS: Pardon if you're not an American. "You" basically refers to all Americans who's using the same line of arguments as you.

Re:Whats the point?

[sydneyfong]

A government that allows free speech and free election does not lead to an responsible government. However, it gets you a lot further than a government without free speech and free election. The fact that US government allows for free speech is exactly the reason we can argue about the stupidity of the Bush administration and the absurdity of WMD claims. If critics of the Bush administration can be easily silenced like critics of the Chinese government you think youâ(TM)ll ever out about the lack of WMD evidence? This goes contrary to the action of the Chinese government. Can the Chinese citizens ever criticize its government for the brutality committed by the PRC government in Tibet? or the Tienanmen Square massacre? or the rampant government corruption? or the growing wealth disparity? I'll ask this: If criticism doesn't effect any changes, what's the point? You could criticize the Bush administration for all you want, and it's not changing their attitude. It only makes you feel better by venting out all your frustration, but it seems to have done nothing.

Do you hold the Chinese people to the same standard you hold the Americans to? If as you stated âoethey should be ashamed for electing a crap government despite having these freedomsâ should the Chinese people be ashamed for not even asking its government for the freedom to freely criticize it. Casting the right votes is a bit different from risking your liberty to say something... Besides, there are people who tries to push the limits. Maybe you haven't heard of them.

I see all these overseas Chinese rushing to the defense of an authoritarian regime that oppresses its own people and silences any opposing view and I wonder if they are are allowing their own ethnic pride to cloud their judgment of an oppressive regime. By defending the Chinese government you are just as guilty as those Americans you accused of electing âoea crap government.â I partially agree. When I saw all the Chinese gathering in foreign countries waving red flags and highly emotional... I'm like "wtf?!?!". Two weeks ago here in Hong Kong some people protested on the Tibet issue during the Olympic torch relay, and people started attacking the protesters, and if you ask me I'd say that's totally uncivilized. But sometimes the accusations towards the Chinese government is simply wrong (or misleading), and I don't see why I'm guilty of defending it.

Actually, I don't see myself as defending the Chinese government. I'm just hoping to clear up misconceptions of westerners towards China. The reason it looks like I'm defending it is because the critics are usually so bent on finding bogus flaws that any explanation on my part is bound to sound like an apologist.

Over the top

[tsa]

I think this is a bit over the top. Many people lost relatives or friends in the quake. Some entertainment can help them get over the grief. Now they're constanty reminded of the quake by the media. That can't be good for them.

Re:Over the top

[Beijing Monster]

I think this is a bit over the top. Many people lost relatives or friends in the quake. Some entertainment can help them get over the grief. Now they're constanty reminded of the quake by the media. That can't be good for them. I live in Beijing. Such sentiments as above sound so selfish and self-indulgent. Great shows of national mourning are not unusual, even in our own western countries (or at least they used to be). I am no apologist for China but, on this, please cut the Chinese a bit of slack. You have no idea how this tragedy has affected people in China and while three days of mourning might seem excessive it is not necessarily so here. Moreover, it helps focus the national mind on what has to be done next: no more hope for rescue, the need for rebuilding, fund raising, etc. BTW, I have so far not been affected in my access to the internet or TV, etc.

Re:Over the top

[digitalunity]

Just to put this into perspective, look at the raw unmitigated loss of life.

In the span of 1 minute, more people in China died than all the american lives lost in the "War on Terror" during the last 7 years.

Add it up and I dare anyone bashing China right now to respond saying this mourning isn't a natural and healthy response.

Re:Over the top

[RiotingPacifist]

I live in Beijing. Such sentiments as above sound so selfish and self-indulgent. Great shows of national mourning are not unusual, even in our own western countries (or at least they used to be). I am no apologist for China but, on this, please cut the Chinese a bit of slack. You have no idea how this tragedy has affected people in China and while three days of mourning might seem excessive it is not necessarily so here. Moreover, it helps focus the national mind on what has to be done next: no more hope for rescue, the need for rebuilding, fund raising, etc.

BTW, I have so far not been affected in my access to the internet or TV, etc. Mourning should be optional, it should not be used by any goverment to 'focus' a 'national mind', and distract it from other atrocities ( Read human rights, tibet, etc). The fact you even use the phrase 'national mind' just re-enfoces how well the patriot re-education act has worked.

p.s assuming your not brain-dead enough to think everything i write are western lies, stop to consider for a second how you can put a percentage correctness on philosophical writings? Mao would hate the Chinese government more than I do.

Re:Over the top

[Beijing Monster]

Agreed. That said, to put the GWOT example in perspective: the number of Chinese dead does not yet exceed the number of Iraqi dead since 2003 and America's war of aggression upon Iraq.

Re:Over the top

[fbjon]

Obviously, everything the Chinese government does that is not related to atrocities is to distract the people from said atrocities.

Re:Over the top

[lobatt]

As we living in different worlds, i understand that you can't understand us, so, no more debate. just one advice for you: mind your business

Re:Over the top

[Beijing Monster]

Rioting Pacifist: You know, you do have a point. Public mourning by a nation is nothing new and sometimes it does go a bit overboard - the overly self-indulgent mourning that followed 9/11 in America, in some senses, has not stopped and it indeed served to make so many brain dead, scared and irrational (cf. the PATRIOT Act and an illegal war). Just look at US history since that awful day and and a sustained public disinterest, it seems, at the damage inflicted over and over to the constitution and its protections. But you are correct, much rests on how well the Chinese government does - the mandate of heaven was always questioned first by a string of disasters and China these past six months or so has had a few biggies. In the realm of symbol and superstition the dots are being connected here by some. The Sichuan disaster is big and the government has done a lot that is well done and fast. At one level there is no doubt that a public mourning is self serving to the regime (and political instincts and survival are no different here than in the west). But do not by that token misread the general public's approval and recognition that a mourning may be appropriate. Three days is probably a reasonable balance here in China between not enough and too much. FYI, so far, and its only morning of the first day, I have not been inconvenienced by the mourning.

Re:Over the top

[Anonymous Coward]

1.2 billion people living 80 years give you over 41 *thousand* natural deaths every single *day*. The quake resulted in doubling of that rate for 1-2 days. Less than 1% increase in mortality over a year's time - smoking and pollution result in many more unnecessary deaths than that. Hence the real loss of life is almost insignificant compared to the infrastructure damage.

People are shocked at the number dead without knowing the number of dead and born each day. The numbers are staggering.

The numbers are for comparison.

Re:Over the top

[mpe]

Mourning should be optional, it should not be used by any goverment to 'focus' a 'national mind', and distract it from other atrocities ( Read human rights, tibet, etc). The fact you even use the phrase 'national mind' just re-enfoces how well the patriot re-education act has worked.

This sort of thing is hardly unique to China. There are all sorts of issues surrounding the US "Pledge of Allegiance", especially concerning the 1951 rewording. Then there was the way in which the death of "Princess" Diana was treated in the British media at the time, which included trashing TV and radio schedules for several hours for no good reason.

Re:Over the top

[Threni]

> In the span of 1 minute, more people in China died than all the american lives lost in the "War on Terror" during the last 7 years.

What about the number of victims of the American `war on terror`. Probably a little longer than a few minutes. More people die from obesity in the `land of the large` every four days from obesity than died in the 9/11 attacks, for instance. The number dead in China recently is a tiny, tiny percentage of the population. Perhaps refraining from sex for a few days would be a better way of addressing problems in China. Unless you want a land full of greedy men, fighting after the few remaining women.

Re:Over the top

[Fweeky]

So, er, is it OK if I say shutting down most media services isn't a natural and healthy response? WTF?

And yes, much of America's response to 9/11 wasn't exactly what I'd term "healthy" either. One nation being batshit insane does not disregard another.

Re:Over the top

[cyfer2000]

I hope you RTFA, or at least read the title. No news media has been shut down, entertainment program only. And websites are actually not touched at all.

Re:Over the top

[Sobrique]

Choosing not to out of respect is not the same as being unable to because the Government says so.

Re:Over the top

[RiotingPacifist]

Then there was the way in which the death of "Princess" Diana was treated in the British media at the time, which included trashing TV and radio schedules for several hours for no good reason. But that was optional, nobody forced the TV channels to be shit, nobody twisted the death of Princess Diana into a way to unite England and get them too ignore wrong doing by the government. Sure there was crappy sensationalism, but her death wasn't used as a way to control anybody. BTW I watched Sharpe that night due to the rescheduling, so it wasn't all bad.

And just because America may (I dont want to get into this argument again) indoctrinate thier population doesn't mean its ok for china to do it.

Re:Over the top

[querist]

Thank you.

I have visited China twice, and I have several Chinese friends. I do not believe I understand Chinese culture as well as you do, but even I can understand the need for these national days of mourning in the context of Chinese culture.

I have a friend in Shanghai who is still trying to contact a missing friend in Sichuan.

Thank you, Beijing Monster, for making this clear for others to understand.

Re:Over the top

[Beijing Monster]

Thank you. At about 2.30 pm yesterday everything stopped, cars and buses honked their horns and factories blew their sirens - 3 minutes. Thousands were at Tiananmen to mark the occasion. The three day mourning is something all Chinese want. There may have been days of mourning in the past for leaders but a mourning for people this is the first ever. And the population appreciates the opportunity. As to inconvenience, mainly the lack of movie and entertainment channels and the absence of live music in bars and resturants - at least as far as I can see.

The real reason

[Anonymous Coward]

No, it is a three days national mourning to honour victims in the earthquake. China is not only suspending entertainment websites, but also suspending everything from public entertainment to olympic torch relay and all Chinese flags will be flown at half-mast. There will also be a 3-minute silence everywhere in China at 2:28pm China time today.

Check out:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/olympics/05/18/bc.as.gen.china.earthquake.olympic.ap/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/1982617/China-earthquake-Rescue-teams-overwhelmed-by-disaster.html

Re:The real reason

[drivel]

I think they are suspending all entertainment facilities, such as karoke, clubs etc, but I have not heard about suspension of entertainment websites.

Re:The real reason

[jaaron]

Exactly. More details here:

• http://shanghaiist.com/2008/05/19/online_implicat.php. (Has translation of actual instructions to websites).
• http://www.cio.com/article/360213/China_Mourning_Suspends_Entertainment_Web_Sites

Again, to emphasize, these instructions went out to internal Chinese sites. Though I imagine they'll begin blocking access to other sites soon too.

China can't read slashdot

[fractalVisionz]

Can anyone with Web access in China confirm this report?
No they can't, since this is an entertainment website.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[Anonymous Coward]

reading slashdot here in shenzhen right now.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[saitoh]

Well, see, they haven't blocked all the crap on the internet yet.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[Catskul]

Can you normally?

Re:China can't read slashdot

[aaronlwe]

I read slashdot everyday in shanghai and I don't see any more block to the web than usual.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[lobatt]

your time spend on it is totally unworthy

Re:China can't read slashdot

[aaronlwe]

absolutely. I read slashdot mostly for linux/bsd related stories and I'll never take another look at such topics.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[Nocturrne]

I am also in Shenzhen... Everything seems open on the Web, but I miss my HBO...

Re:China can't read slashdot

[iNaya]

This story is absolute BS. I live in Shanghai, and no entertainment websites I know of are being blocked. For instance, I can access XKCD, Slashdot, Fox News... my usual sources of entertainment. The three days of mourning are Mon, Tue and Wed. Most people wouldn't go to clubs on these days anyway.

In other words this story is absolute BS, and although China does a lot of things I disagree with, they are not doing this, and even if they were I wouldn't see too much wrong with it.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[lobatt]

while, i read it for nerd jokes...

Re:China can't read slashdot

[_critic]

Reading Slashdot from Shanghai . . . no problems.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[makomk]

I doubt the Chinese government knows or cares about XKCD or Slashdot, and Fox News is (officially) a news site. The sites they'd be cutting access to would be Chinese-language ones...

Re:China can't read slashdot

[mathnerd314]

Reading it in Beijing. Always been able to. Wikipedia on the other hand doesn't seem to be working.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[dwater]

Me too. /. wasn't accessible for the first few months I was here - back in late 2003 - but has been ever since.

Wikipedia stopped working sometime last week, iirc, though it seemed like it was working for some of my friends at their work (no, they're not using VPN/etc). If I changed my IP address (it's dynamic/routable), then I could sometimes access it. Strange to be sure - almost sounds more like a networking issue in CNC.

Re:China can't read slashdot

[RobertinXinyang]

Wrong, I am reading this in Xinyang, Henan Provence, P.R. China right now. However, earlier today I tried to got to www.todou.com to watch the latest BattleStar Galactica and got this message, "Earthquake National Mourning, service suspended."

Re:China can't read slashdot

[fractalVisionz]

Can no one detect sarcasm anymore? I myself read it from Beijing and posted this.

Recent restrictions

[grainofsand]

I live and work in Shanghai. The leading (popular) domestic websites are all still accessible but are dominated by earthquake-related news and stories, including calls for donations.

TV stations are the same, and again, programming is dominated by earthquake news.

I noticed over the weekend that craigslist.org is no longer accessible from mainland.

Re:Recent restrictions

[beaverbrother]

The great firewall doesn't block slashdot?

Re:Recent restrictions

[grainofsand]

I recall /. being blocked in China for a few months back in 2005, but not since then.

Re:Recent restrictions

[mea_culpa]

It could be that Shanghai is a SEZ city. I've been there 3 times since 2005 and there wasn't any websites blocked that I could find. Could also be the hotel, and the western company I visited didn't have those restrictions.
I was also able to watch my Slingbox, and bring my Vonage adapter and make local calls back to the states.
YMMV

Re:Recent restrictions

[RiotingPacifist]

No need the firewall has done its job, now everything anti-Chinese is instantly written off as western lies. The government have managed to get the firewall into peoples heads, the actual firewall isn't needed any more.

This sounds like a bit of a push to get the nation even more indoctrinated. my friends lived in the UK his whole life and since the Tibet thing, he suddenly thinks all western media is bull.

Re:Recent restrictions

[fliptout]

I was in China in Fall 2004 and from Aug 2005 until August 2006, and it was not blocked during that time. At least not where I was, mostly in Beijing.

Filter news for young children..

[binaryspiral]

When 9/11 occured in the states, we had 24/7 coverage and news on just about every channel. Mr. Rogers came on PBS and said that these are aweful times, but please limit what small children are being exposed to - it could be very scary and detrimental.

Parents should act like a filter for the world - especially the hype and circus that is today's news reporting.

Other than that - what is the usefulness of an order like this? I would think having something for kids and adults alike to watch other than death and destruction would help.

Re:Filter news for young children..

[justinlee37]

Parents should act like a filter for the world

No, parents should empower children to filter the world themselves by giving them the critical thinking skills that they need to do so. Failing to give them this toolbox will turn them into incompetent, naive adults.

Re:Filter news for young children..

[MightyYar]

No, parents should empower children to filter the world themselves by giving them the critical thinking skills that they need to do so. This takes time. There is absolutely no reason for a young child to be exposed to horrible images or events if it can be helped. Hell, my daughter found it traumatic when we were at the petting zoo and the two alpacas got into a fight and one of them spit. You can't explain things to young children when they don't have the mental capacity - or even the vocabulary - to sort things out.

Re:Filter news for young children..

[Duncan Blackthorne]

*shrug* their paradigm is rather different than ours is, perhaps this is what's best for them. Who can really tell?

Re:Filter news for young children..

[binaryspiral]

Parents should act like a filter for the world

No, parents should empower children to filter the world themselves by giving them the critical thinking skills that they need to do so. Failing to give them this toolbox will turn them into incompetent, naive adults.

Fantastic theory - but you'd make a horrible parent.

Take your three year old to many R rated horror flicks lately? Well what would you consider the video footage of people swan diving from the 100th floor of the twin towers - played over and over again on Fox news?

Yes, let them figure it out for themselves. Maybe they can discuss it with the boogy monster in their closet or maybe Pokemon has the answer.

Re:Filter news for young children..

[justinlee37]

Yes, let them figure it out for themselves. Maybe they can discuss it with the boogy monster in their closet or maybe Pokemon has the answer.

You dumbass, I said that their PARENTS should discuss it with them, not that they should be left unmonitored in front of a television from birth and expected to understand everything without explanation. If you think that "giving them critical thinking skills" = "letting them figure it out for themselves" well geez ... I just can't help you!

Re:Filter news for young children..

[TheSync]

Mr. Rogers came on PBS and said that these are aweful times, but please limit what small children are being exposed to - it could be very scary and detrimental.

I should mention that on the morning of 9/11, PBS made an active decision to stay in children's programming, to be a safe harbor for children. Granted, PBS is a distributor and not a television network, and they had no control over what local public television stations actually put on the air, but it is my impression that most of public television decided to go along with the PBS decision.

Of course, it isn't like PBS was well set-up to do a 24x7 wall-to-wall news operation anyway. Maybe they could have pulled on every commentator they could find and tried to do something from the NewsHour set at WETA in Washington, but it probably would have been a real shoe-string operation. The commercial networks have pretty serious live-news-capable operations they can call on at a moment's notice.

Re:Filter news for young children..

[binaryspiral]

No, parents should empower children to filter the world themselves by giving them the critical thinking skills that they need to do so. Failing to give them this toolbox will turn them into incompetent, naive adults.

You dumbass, I said that their PARENTS should discuss it with them

No, you didn't... you said giving them critical thinking skills.

Children, even with thinking skills, shouldn't be subjected to the onslaught of terrible news coverage non-stop like I originally posted.

Critical thinking skills won't prevent nightmares, stress, or mental trauma in children. Only mental maturation and age appropriate discussions of traumatic events can prepare a child for this world... and even then maybe it won't be enough for this world full of people like you - dumbass.

Closure of Channel BT.

[scum-e-bag]

Translation: close all torrent sites.

All non essentials, ie p2p, will be shut down. All resources are to go into humanitarian relief.

Be prepared to wait a while for your latest episodes via Channel BT.

I'm really starting to hate China.

This is no reason to hate China... What did the rest of the US do when Cyclone Katrina hit? Oh, thats right, they sat on their bums and continued to watch Channel BT as they didn't want to know about their fellow citizens people drowning.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[SanityInAnarchy]

This is no reason to hate China... What did the rest of the US do when Cyclone Katrina hit? Whatever they wanted, which is the point.

didn't want to know about their fellow citizens people drowning. Some did, some didn't. Why is it alright for the government to force everyone to know about it?

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[nbert]

Translation: close all torrent sites.

That would be a fist timer - but maybe Comcast can provide some experience. The Chinese government is way more busy blocking public sources. It means that certain sites will be blocked by the great firewall (which can be circumvented by a simple proxy outside of China). From my ex-expat point of view that's nothing to worry about. If you really want to know you'll get the news regardless of censorship. In the TV domain it might be different, but I've seen many Chinese with dishes in Shanghai (providing CNN etc.) and I'm seriously in doubt that CCTV's coverage will be taken without a grain of salt. Even on the countryside I'm sure that most people see the difference between propaganda and actual news - they were trained on more than one occasion (great famine, Cuba missile crisis, breakdown of the SU and so on).

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[TubeSteak]

Some did, some didn't. Why is it alright for the government to force everyone to know about it? Because the Chinese Government can

Because it's a national disaster and the Chinese Government will eventually use it for propaganda purposes. Something along the lines of 'there was a tragedy, we rebuilt, see how awesome the Communist Government & Chinese people are'.

I expect some people will take exception to this, but you hear the exact same type of language surrounding the terrorist attacks of 9/11. The Chinese are already flying banners saying "fight the earthquake".

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[justicezyx]

Because this news is fake/untrue/wicked...or motivated on prejudice.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[guitarscape]

it is a pity that you don't understand when all people in a nation really belong to ONE nation they really want to be act together. The US will never be able to enjoy this kind union because US folks really don't care each other. The US law may force people to call black people "african americans", but it does not change the fact that mexicans, whites does not care about their african-originated peers that much. The united states may be united legally, or in name, but will never be "united" in reality, or in people's hearts.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[cavebison]

> Why is it alright for the government to force everyone to know about it?

So you don't have a Foundation Day, Queen's Birthday, Independence Day etc in your country?
Events that are plastered all other the national consciousness at various times each the year?
How many people in the US, or indeed the world, *don't* know about 911?

Or Coke for that matter? If you want to complain about being forced
to absorb a message en masse, go complain to Bill Gates or your local
advertising executives.

Why is this any different to the US or any other government
using a national disaster to send a political message?
Have you forgotten how 7k dead were just thrown onto the war furnace?

At least China is staying on topic!

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[HockeyPuck]

Some did, some didn't. Why is it alright for the government to force everyone to know about it? This is the common attitude in America. When Hurricane Katrina hit, many people in non-affected parts of the US said, "let me get back with my life." However, if you lived in Louisiana/Mississippi you would have begged the gov't to help you. You're lucky you live in a country that the gov't would and can actually help you in a timely manner. Go live in Burma, and when another cyclone hits, you go fend for yourself.

It's no different than the common "not in my back yard" attitude we have. I want cheap power, but go build that nuclear powerplant somewhere else. I want cheap gas, but jack up the price of other people. I don't want to pay taxes, but want pristine roads in my neighborhood and 500 cops on my street.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[spitek]

And many people, after Katrina went down and Volunteered to help. People all over the country donated. Business and people alike. I know lots of people that spent lots of time down there from all over the country.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[SanityInAnarchy]

Yes, I realize there's often a NIMBY attitude, and I am not advocating that any more than I advocate hate speech or child pornography -- that is, not at all.

However, I do advocate freedom, even when it results in other things that I don't like.

However, if you lived in Louisiana/Mississippi you would have begged the gov't to help you. True enough. But I doubt I would have begged them to shut down the Internet and force the rest of the population to help me, too.

You're lucky you live in a country that the gov't would and can actually help you in a timely manner. Are you saying that the Chinese government, which is capable of censorship on that vast a scale, is incapable of helping me?

The biggest human disasters around Katrina weren't apathy on the part of the rest of the population, they were sheer incompetence on the part of the officials appointed to deal with this kind of crisis.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[SanityInAnarchy]

So you don't have a Foundation Day, Queen's Birthday, Independence Day etc in your country?
Events that are plastered all other the national consciousness at various times each the year? We do.

What we don't do is actually cut access to everything else on July 4th, or on September 11th.

Or Coke for that matter? If you want to complain about being forced
to absorb a message en masse, go complain to Bill Gates or your local
advertising executives. Adblock, and rented DVDs.

You see, we do actually have a choice. There's a difference between intense advertising campaigns and actually shutting down access to most of the Internet to force me to pay attention.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[SanityInAnarchy]

The US will never be able to enjoy this kind union because US folks really don't care each other. And when we do care for each other, it is real, not because we were forced into it with propaganda at every turn. It's the difference between making love and being a rape victim. If you can't see that difference, you're the one to pity.

The US law may force people to call black people "african americans" Actually, it doesn't. See the difference?

If we call black people "African Americans", it's because we have made our own choice not to offend them. Often, there's actually nothing stopping us from calling them niggers -- but we choose not to.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[sydneyfong]

And when we do care for each other, it is real, not because we were forced into it with propaganda at every turn. It's the difference between making love and being a rape victim. If you can't see that difference, you're the one to pity. Just to tell you that most people who went along with the mourning really cared. If watching the Twin Towers burn to the ground on TV was shocking, actually feeling the shock thousands of miles away from the epicenter [1] is ground breaking (no pun intended, really...). And I already feel like a jerk for not giving much of a damn to the mourning. Not because of the propaganda, but because I see that some people actually care much more than I do.

And if you allow me, the sentimentalism of 911 was as "propaganda"-ish as the news about the quake in China, if not more. The fact that the media is controlled by the state doesn't mean that the Chinese people don't have the ability of empathy and sympathy.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[sydneyfong]

Hmm... about the words in bold.

How about reading the other comments on slashdot (that most sites are functioning), and the clarifications in TFA (that participating is voluntary).

Man, if you had to highlight something in bold at least you should verify it first lest you shoot yourself in the foot.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[sydneyfong]

Are you saying that the Chinese government, which is capable of censorship on that vast a scale, is incapable of helping me? If you're not Chinese and not in China, then "incapable" should be changed to "not obliged" ;-p

That aside, censorship isn't the same as rescue missions in dangerous terrain. Besides, as I've (and some others) mentioned here before, the Chinese government are not Gods, they might wish to be able to control everything, but in fact they can't.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[cavebison]

From what I've read in comments here from people actually living in China,
the whole blocking access thing is a bit of a china-bashing myth.

The reality seems to be limited access to different things in different places,
which isn't that different to normal Chinese net access.

So...

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[SanityInAnarchy]

The fact that the media is controlled by the state doesn't mean that the Chinese people don't have the ability of empathy and sympathy. Never said they lack that ability.

I do, however, find it disgusting when people use the empathy and sympathy of others for their own means. That includes the US.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[sydneyfong]

I do, however, find it disgusting when people use the empathy and sympathy of others for their own means. That includes the US. I don't really see this as the case in China. Declaring a national mourning is what the Chinese people want. You could dispute this with me, and we could go into philosophical discussions of how free will could be affected by state media, what it means by "wanting" something, etc. But at the end of the day, I think the government is simply following the wishes of the people in this instance.

It's just a bit insulting that you'd assume that if US used sympathy in 911 for their own means then the Chinese government would do that too. I'm not saying that they're definitely not doing it, but it's too early to tell. You're basically using a strawman argument.

Mind you, reinforcing national belonging is not an "ulterior motive". Using the disaster to fuel fear of terrorists and to launch two wars is.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[SanityInAnarchy]

Declaring a national mourning is what the Chinese people want. You could dispute this with me, and we could go into philosophical discussions of how free will could be affected by state media, what it means by "wanting" something, etc. All I dispute is that the national mourning should be mandatory.

I'm feeling a bit stupid now, as other comments have corrected the summary -- apparently things aren't actually being blocked on the global "firewall of china" level.

It's just a bit insulting that you'd assume that if US used sympathy in 911 for their own means then the Chinese government would do that too. No, I assume that the Chinese government would do that for other reasons -- like that they censor the Internet. Obviously, propaganda is a big deal over there.

Mind you, reinforcing national belonging is not an "ulterior motive". Using the disaster to fuel fear of terrorists and to launch two wars is. All you have to do is break it into a few steps.

First, they used 9/11 to "reinforce national belonging" and to "fuel fear of terrorists" -- which, by the way, the Chinese government doesn't have the opportunity to do here, as this was a natural disaster, not a manmade one.

Then, they used that "reinforced national belonging" to launch two wars -- fear of terrorists didn't hurt, but you'll notice there was also a lot of talk like "You're with us or you're against us", and people hanging flags, saying "Support the troops!" And so on.

You're currently at step 1 -- reinforce national belonging, and the faith in the current government. It may stop at that, but I suspect that someone, somewhere, is going to start twisting that for their own ends.

Re:Closure of Channel BT.

[sydneyfong]

All I dispute is that the national mourning should be mandatory. I'll concede this point. I saw the announcement from the department of internet control or something like that... basically the mourning is loosely administratively mandatory.

You're currently at step 1 -- reinforce national belonging, and the faith in the current government. It may stop at that, but I suspect that someone, somewhere, is going to start twisting that for their own ends. Criticisms shouldn't be that speculative. Otherwise why not just start the flames at step 0? After all, they might do something evil, we just don't know what.

Re:It's true

[grainofsand]

youtube.com is currently accessible in both Shanghai and Beijing. The previous blocking of uk.youtube.com has also been lifted in the last few days.

National Days of Mourning

[Kaeso]

I hear that they're suspending the torch relay for three days too: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/05/18/olympic-torch.html So since there are to be three national days of mourning, maybe cutting access to entertainment sites is also a part of this...

Access in China

[Auldclootie]

There are more problems than normal accessing sites after the quake (from Beijing), but this may be infra-structure damage similar to that experienced last year after the Taiwan quake. I'm having trouble getting Youtube and Hotmail, but the vast majority of my usual feeds are up and running - speeds are a little slower than usual.

Re:monitored is not free

[Vectronic]

So?

Not that I agree with TwITter having multiple accounts, but 'it' does make valid comments fairly often. It may simply for the purpose of modding up his trolled accounts, or maybe just genuine comments, doesnt matter "why" it just matters what was said.

Mod down his trolls, and mod up his interesting/insightful/funny comments as you see fit, as you would anyone else.

Treating it differently just creates scepticism, more problems for the modding system. If everyone was wondering if the person had other accounts, and therefore was hesitant to moderate properly, or down-mods for the sake of spite, the system fails.

Coming this fall...

[Sentry21]

It's QuakeTV! Live, unedited, uncensored footage from earthquakes all over the world! This is the quake lover's dream channel!

See earthquakes from exotic, foreign lands like Peru and Canada on our premiere programming, QuakeWatch! Or, tune in Thursday nights for a special episode of Classic Quakes, featuring a different home-grown American quake every week!

Tune in for the best documentaries about earthquakes, the latest quake news and reviews, and more! QuakeTV is the only channel a quake-watcher will ever need.

Call your cable company today to order QuakeTV, and see what's shakin' tonight!

Fascism idiocy

[unity100]

thats the way with fascism. they move on perceived necessities. not realities. cutting access to entertainment RIGHT at the time when their country totally needs it. only happens in fascist governments.

someone would have listened to a song from a website that someone s/he lost liked very much, and remember, and find some solace in good remembrance or similar.

but no. not happening with cold war derelict dinosaurs and a fascist party at the government.

Re:Fascism idiocy

[arthdo]

You got it wrong. It's the cutural differences hat shocked you. In Chinese culture, "mourning" is a serious process that few people would even think of seeking "entertainment". It is to show the deep respect for the dead and the families that are suffering. The government is simply suggesting to stop recreational activities during national days of mourning. Internet is certainly not being cracked down ...

Re:Fascism idiocy

[Moridineas]

First posts huh? A shill for the Chinese government? I didn't realize they were so desperate...

Anywhere, your attempted argument is nonsense, it's got nothing to do with "culture shock." You actually defeat your own argument--if "few people" would even think of seeking entertainment now, why does the Communist Party have to crack down? That doesn't make any sense, you need to consider motives when actions don't make sense based on your assumptions. Mourning is good and solidarity is good. Is enforced mourning meaningful?

The question is, what kind of free society can exist when the Government ORDERS (not "suggests" as you incorrectly type) mandatory shutdowns of websites. (If you have any evidence to the contrary, please post it!)

Imagine if you will if the US government had ordered all websites and TV channels off for 3 days after 9/11. Despite it's flaws, the US is a free society, and people would have been PISSED. Same for Europe, and many other countries.

The conclusion is, despite strides the people have made in China against the yoke of their government, they remain unfree. Let us hope for their sake this can one day be remedied.

Re:Fascism idiocy

[briskr]

No one is stopping us from listening to any songs!

Re:Fascism idiocy

[arthdo]

I'm in the states. I visit slashdot very often but never commented on anything. And I certainly have nothing to do with the goervnment. So dont draw a harsh conclusion by your own bias. I just wanted to help you understand whay maybe happening. From what I saw in Chinese websites, it was certainly not a "order". A order would mean legal actions toward any violations. I think somebody needs a better translator. I'm not sure how do you understand the word "Shutdown". I think the best thing now is to wait for others to comment from mainland China, and see what is really happening with the "shutdown", see if anyone or any website would get punished if they keep running any entertainment stuff. But certainly, most of Chinese are in deep sorrow right now, the mourning process is spontaneous...

Re:Fascism idiocy

[unity100]

what does 'entertainment' word mean in china if not songs.

Re:Fascism idiocy

[arthdo]

seriously, the government did simply "suggest" to stop any recreational activities activities during the three days of mourning. even they dont do so, most people would not have any mood to have fun these days because of all the concerns about the thousands of victims. "entertainment" certainly includes songs in my personal opinion. but how could the goverment stop people listening to songs? How effectively would three days of "shutdown" do to limit people's freedom? The whole purpose is to mourn, not to restrict communications...

Re:Fascism idiocy

[briskr]

We stops parties, football games etc., to express our condolence over the victims. That's the way we express our grief

Re:Fascism idiocy

[RiotingPacifist]

While i agree with you point after 9/11 the major broadcasters did sensor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_songs_deemed_inappropriate_by_Clear_Channel_following_the_September_11%2C_2001_attacks
(pretty much any anti wto song + any thing to do with planes + anything by RATM)

fortunately it wasn't government forced tho

Re:Fascism idiocy

[Moridineas]

You make a good point, though I do believe there's a huge difference between a broadcaster selectively choosing not to broadcast some songs (as well as many, many sites such as Penny Arcade doing something "different") from the government forcing it to happen.

Re:Fascism idiocy

[sydneyfong]

cutting access to entertainment RIGHT at the time when their country totally needs it. Wow the Earth's shaking! Let's party!! eh?

And what do you say to the people here claiming that net access is just fine, and they could, *gasp*, actually find that song for solace as you mentioned?

Do you actually honor *facts* instead of the fantasy world in your head?

No change

[Anonymous Coward]

posting from within china now. all TV channels available and net access remains. where did this piece of news come from?

"National Mourning Days" they say

[prof.nemo]

I am in Hong Kong, all I heard from the the official news from mainland is that there will be 3 days of "mourning for the victims of earthquake". All entertainment facilities (casino, clubs etc.) in mainland are supposedly to be closed for these 3 days, and all mainland citizens are supposed to dress "less colorfully" as well. Didn't realize that includes entertainment websites though. Of course over here in Hong Kong we find it a bit strange and obviously the local government won't follow suit. Most Hong Kong locals don't understand the logic too, but maybe it's kind of cultural difference thing again.

Re:"National Mourning Days" they say

[arthdo]

I dont think anyone ever imposed a dress code, although many people would like to wear more of black and white by themselves to show respect for the dead.

Re:"National Mourning Days" they say

[prof.nemo]

Ah sorry for the typo, it's gambling (lotteries), not casino, because Macau is operating as usual. Flags will also be flying half-staff for 3 days too btw, for the victims of the earthquake.

Re:"National Mourning Days" they say

[sydneyfong]

obviously the local government won't follow suit Linking to a Chinese (language) site isn't the accepted norm here, but I'm too lazy to find an English link.

http://hk.news.yahoo.com/080519/12/2u88q.html

Basically, the (Hong Kong) local government is following suit as far as they can. Of course in Hong Kong the government doesn't control everything, so participation from private entities/companies is on a voluntary basis, but they're asking people to do it. (if you can't read Chinese I'm sure you'll be able to find a colleague to do a bit of quick translation.)

Re:Only douchebags on Slashdot

[Handover Phist]

Hey sport, douchebagorama here. Someone mentioned 9/11 as that's how they relate to huge catastrophes. During that time I owned and ran an Internet Cafe. I implemented a 30 minute maximum on computer usage and cut prices in half because there was a lineup around the block of people who communicated through IM and e-mail to their relatives in the zone of destruction.

Communication is a GOOD THING! The Internet is a GOOD THING, and plenty of the folks here help run it, so shaddap. We play our roles and kick ass when it comes to facilitation of communication with those who, through Gods, Allah's or who/whatevers grace, still walk this ball of dirt we call home.

I Am In China

[Lorean]

Well, I can get this on China's youtube clone: http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/cd00f1006247o9p0.html But the front page is covered with earthquake stuff. At the moment, every CCTV channel (Except for CCTV 11 + the English CCTV channel) is broadcasting the same news program. Youtube was harmonized (blocked) starting two days ago.

Re:I Am In China

[briskr]

I'm in Beijing, China and it IS OK to visit youtube.com and CNN.com today. http://www.zooomr.com/photos/briskr/4883200/

Re:I Am In China

[Lorean]

Odd. I am in Qingdao, and am still getting the all-too-familiar connection reset.

Re:I Am In China

[iNaya]

I'm in Shanghai, and I can't get Youtube. But Youtube is so full of crap that I don't really give a damn.

Re:monitored is not free

[smilindog2000]

I'm going to do something dangerous, and quote my wife as a well informed person. According to her, right after the quake, the Chinese government banned all reporting in the effected areas. As usual, all the press backed off and went home. Except for two reporters from two papers. These two reporters rapidly reported on the actual situation, and the other newspapers and TV stations saw these competitors getting all the viewers and readers. Nationally, news organizations then defied the government order and reported on the situation openly.

So... the government is pissed, and is punishing the media organizations by sending them home for a while. I could be wrong, but that's more or less what I heard from my wife, and like in China, it's dangerous around here to disagree with the boss :-)

I'm in China

[sjb2016]

I'm in China, have been for a few years. I can confirm that there doesn't seem to be much shutting down of websites. I can still go to the websites I normally go to view the latest episodes of Lost (hosted inside China, they stream rather well). As far as television, last night (Sunday night Shanghai time) I was watching the only not completely state run English station. The content was complete shit, but not earthquake related. I don't watch Chinese language stuff as it is shit propaganda or shit period soap operas or a cheap knock of "The Price is Right". Can still access all the websites I normally do, except for wikipedia, which is always hit or miss. Will keep things updated as I can.

Re:I'm in China

[Nocturrne]

Can you post your link to the Lost episodes, inside China? I am in Shenzhen and downloading them from the US is making me old. :)

Re:I'm in China

[sjb2016]

Update:

The e-mail from my company states that the mourning will begin at 2:28 today. Indeed, I've gone to the sites I mentioned in my earlier post and in fact they have blocked the ability to search. You can only watch stuff on the front page. That, is fucking scary. From the e-mail I received from my company: all organizations and foreign embassies in China will lower the
flags; all entertaining activities will stop; sirens of automobiles, trains and ships will be on. As another poster mentioned, Youtube was already "harmonized".

When this idiocy stops, go to www.youku.com. Even if you can't read Chinese, you can easily see the search bar at the top. Just type "Lost" and work out which episode you need. It's usually up by Saturday morning our time.

China is opening

[religious freak]

China is opening, and I think it's apparent by the way they are covering the quake. No, they will not be a fully functioning democracy tomorrow, but this coverage of the quake is big news.

To the Chinese natural disasters were, in the past, covered up and silenced. They are embracing not only independent local coverage, but independent FOREIGN coverage as well (foreign access is truly amazing).

I think despite some obvious failings even today, China is truly moving forward into a more open society. Give credit where credit is due...

-------
-1 nonconforming opinion

Re:China is opening

[WizADSL]

They're not opening a damned thing, the only reason they are welcoming coverage of the quake is because they did not cause it, and no one can blame the Chinese government for it. Any action the government takes to help it people (including the foreign coverage) is going to help their (the government's) image. If this had been some kind of industrial accident it would be covered up (unless a foreign company was responsible).

re

[electronixtar]

WTF another Chinese government evil? How about I tell ya that all sites could be accessed normally? Stop all entertanment for the thousands dead, what's wrong with it?

Is just a test for Olympic web access control and

[Joe The Dragon]

Is just a test for Olympic web access control and to move off the Tibet issues

Live From Beijing: Its Monday Morning.

[fotoflo]

and everything seems normal. A search for ææ or gaming on baidu returns a thousand similar sites: http://www.baidu.com/s?wd=%D3%CE%CF%B7 , all of them working. Lesson to be learned: twitter isnt a great news source, and neither are twitter-derived news sites.

Re:Live From Beijing: Its Monday Morning.

[Kalriath]

Lesson to be learned: twitter isnt a great news source, and neither are twitter-derived news sites. Nor is Slashdot, truth be told. It's a masterful work of fiction though.

Its regional

[Demonicat]

Before I launch into opinion, let me first state the facts jack. China's Internet censorship (the great firewall part of golden shield) is regionally based. Similar to the US radio having locality based censorship. In February for example, the university I teach at(Inner Mongolia Uni of Tech/science), could not access wikipedia- but could access flickr. In Beijing, it was the opposite- its locality based and gladder for firefox kills it anyway. That said, I still have full internet. Yesterday the DNS kept crashing out, but internet is rolling along fine and dandy...or as close as we get here at 100kbs on a pppoe. All sites are behaving normally. Now opinion. While I am a firm believer and activist for Freedom of Information, in this case I believe shutting down a bit of commuications may be needed. Many people in China are a bit on edge currently, with the olympics, the protests, the whole t1b3t thing- and the earthquake moved them right to the edge. Rumours are circulating around the country here about radiation dangers, the government not acting, the goverment causing the earthquake like some kind of James Bond Villian...lots of BS. The end result of this is that people are too panicked and nervous to help out with reconstruction or aiding survivors- not good. The limiting of information until the area is secure and survivors helped is very important at this time.

Most Chinese TV down in Shanghai

[Mr Europe]

This morgning here in Shanghai I noticed that the hotel TV did send western channels such as CNN but almost all Chinese channels were down. Abt three channels showed quake clearings. Somewhat leaned towards showing heroic soldiers in clean suit saving people. And the president himself directing the work. But at least this time the TV has shown a lot of quake damages.
Death toll now 33000 verified. Will rise above 40000 since now 9500 verified to be beried under rubble. 220000 injured.

HBO and Cinemax went dark at my hotel

[Ixitar]

I am in Beijing and HBO and Cinemax channels at my hotel are not available today. CNN is available.

I have not found any websites blocked other than the usual ones.

Re:monitored is not free

[RiotingPacifist]

As much as i hate you for your sock puppet bullshit i have to give you credit i was wondering why they'd done this and your explanation is spot on even if you are a twat.

I do not have sock puppets

[twatt3r]

Help! Help! I have been a victim of unfair moderations!

As you can see from my previous posts, I am generally a trolling idiot who has nothing constructive to say.

But, but! Someone moderated me to +4 Insightful! If math serves me correctly, 3 someones!

I ask you to stop this unfair moderation and return me to my target of "-1 hopeless."

Arigatou gozaimashita!

(Besides, I don't have "sock puppets." That accusation is unfair to the world's other sufferers of dissociative identity disorder, who function just fine in society.)

I'm also in China

[topnob]

I'm also in China, Shanghai as well and my understanding is that all KTV(karaoke in a private room), bars and all shops relating to physical entertainment related will be shut. Not the internet, and what I saw about this entertainment ban, its for morning for 3 days, and they said nothing about the TV, but its been pretty much 24/7 quake coverage on every channel the last few nights.

Re:monitored is not free

[Christopher Neufeld]

I'm in China right now. I was here (Beijing) the day the earthquake hit. At 6:00, I was having dinner in a restaurant, and the television was tuned to the national news service. I speak Chinese, and I understand it well. It was all-earthquake, all the time. Reporters were everywhere in Sichuan (they hadn't arrived in the worst-hit areas yet, it having been less than four hours). The premier was on TV talking about sending help. There were pictures of people carrying bodies and bandaged victims on their backs, footage of destroyed buildings, everything you would expect to see in a major disaster, with no conspicuous absences. It was the exact antithesis of news suppression.

In the days following the quake, I've turned on the television a couple of times. There is a lot of earthquake coverage, but I've also seen costume dramas, soap operas, musical variety shows, fund raisers, home-shopping-network style shows, and billiards tournaments.

I proxy my internet through an SSH tunnel, so I haven't noticed any changes to website availability, but I just fired up an unproxied konqueror, and I can get to the BBC, CBC, arstechnica, and slashdot through the national firewall. If somebody wants to post URLs they think are unreachable, I can give quickly determine whether they are reachable.

It is just part of the Chinese Culture ...

[dadman]

that when people close to one dies, it is consider impolite for one to be engaged in anything that bring happiness to oneself, at least until after the grieving period is over.

So, even if the Government didn't raise the "order" of this 3 days shut down, you would expect to see much less activities over these channels anyway.

Having said that, being "ordered" to do something which should be done self-willingly and out of empathy is still a bad habit that the Chinese should learn to get rid of.

Am I the only one

[coldsalmon]

who thought this was about China's belated reaction to online FPS gaming?

Re:monitored is not free

[Anonymous Coward]

guys don't rush to judgements. Based on the chinese old habit, the son is supposed to live without entertainment for 3 years when the parent passes away.

I do not think anyone obey those rules any more. But tradition is tradition, it is kind of like that when chinese people mourn the dead in this case. I do not find it any strange if you understand the culture.

Order from State Council

[chinabuzz]

http://www.thestandard.com/news/2008/05/18/china-mourning-suspends-entertainment-web-sites

This is nothing about Censorship

[lobatt]

I'm a Chinese, we are not shutting down the website or TV channel, we are just not entertain for 3 days. If you are a foreigner in China and feel no pain and like to have some fun, you can get it, just we won't participate. This is our way of show our lament for the victims. Feeling sorrow, so we can relief the pain of the people in sichuan, and comfort the dead. As for your guys, just show some respect to this is enough, don't be so bitch!

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[Max_W]

lobatt, I do not support the anti-Chinese bacchanalia in the West. First with Olympics, an then with the Earth Quake.

I know history and I realize quite well why the Chinese people are careful with foreigners. After centuries of what happened.

Some evil forces in the West want to destabilize your country, split it into manageable chunks again, using for it any opportunity. Including pseudo-democratic rhetorics.

Keep up being wise and move forward step by step.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[Moridineas]

Some evil forces in the West want to destabilize your country, split it into manageable chunks again, using for it any opportunity. Including pseudo-democratic rhetorics. Lol... Do you honestly believe that bit of insanity?

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[Max_W]

Yes, I do believe that that there are evil forces on the World scale who use the pseudo-democratic rhetorics for their ends which have nothing to do neither with democracy nor freedom.

It is sad but it is so. The real goal in this case is the establishment of the new world order - the so called "Bloody Democracy", which has nothing to do with the real democracy. One has to be blind not to notice the first signs of this coming New Order.

So now people in such places like China, Iran, Burma, Iraq, etc. are to struggle for their freedoms not only with the local forces of dark and evil, but with the disguised evil forces outside. It is becoming more complicated now, as their have only themselves to trust upon.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[sydneyfong]

Lol, you don't?

What, didn't the USA "bring democracy into Iraq"? And now they're proposing to do it in Iran?

Lol? Did you read up on Chinese history where western powers tried to colonize China? If you don't know sht about China, you must have read up on the history of your own country? If you're an American you should know what happened to the Natives? If you're from Europe you should be aware of the great colonies of your country? What are those Europeans doing in Africa? What are US troops doing in Iraq? What are US troops doing all around the world?

I wonder what's so funny actually.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[lobatt]

å±ææ åæ-½äZä å±æäæ åå¼æ-½äZä If you can read and understand this, we 'll continue.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[lobatt]

talk about Iraq, it reminds me the famous joke:
"most American don't know where Iraq is, they just believed that they had brought Iraq democracy"
yes, i think you are free, and didn't brain-washed by your medias

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[Moridineas]

Lol, you don't? If you honestly believe that there is a "Western" conspiracy to break up China, I really think the onus is on you to provide ANY evidence or justification that the west would even want this!

What, didn't the USA "bring democracy into Iraq"? And now they're proposing to do it in Iran? Iran's already got democracy! Possibly more so than China!

As for the rest of your post, you get angry when people on slashdot bring up what the Chinese government was like last year (for instance back when ALL BBC was banned, as opposed to only banning Chinese language BBC), and then you bring up literally centuries old European history that Europe+American both are collectively ashamed of? I don't get it.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[Moridineas]

yes, i think you are free, and didn't brain-washed by your medias I'm glad you realize that with the diversity and freedom of media in America that one can't be brainweashed that same way one can be in a mono-reporting society. From Fox News to NPR to Daily Kos to Rush Limbaugh.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[Moridineas]

"å±ææ åæ-½ÃZà å±æÃæ åå¼æ-½ÃZÃ"

I don't think you can read that either, friend!

My grandfather was born in Shanghai in the teens. He could read it. I can't. Sorry if that makes me too unspecial to be able to hold a discussion with you.

Re:This is nothing about Censorship

[sydneyfong]

If you honestly believe that there is a "Western" conspiracy to break up China, I really think the onus is on you to provide ANY evidence or justification that the west would even want this! Firstly, I don't believe that statement literally. I'm just saying it's not "funny", and it's no secret, for example, that CIA has/had been doing some work in trying to destabilize Tibet etc. Also, talk about onus. Most people bashing China assumes the Chinese government is evil by default, and there's simply no way to prove otherwise to these people.

As for the rest of your post, you get angry when people on slashdot bring up what the Chinese government was like last year (for instance back when ALL BBC was banned, as opposed to only banning Chinese language BBC), and then you bring up literally centuries old European history that Europe+American both are collectively ashamed of? I don't get it. No, in fact I don't get angry (easily). Got a bit over the top here I guess, sorry. It's just infuriating to see how idiots trivialize the intentions of their governments etc. Literally there's no grand plan to split up China into chunks, etc, but there's enough truth in it that it's not funny. Tibet independence was/is supported by the CIA (at least that's what I've been told, prove me wrong), and Taiwan is backed by USA, Japan etc. I don't mean China should invade Taiwan, but why is USA backing Taiwan if not to create a counterbalance to PRC?

About history. The western sentiment against the Chinese government(s) decades ago still linger. The only times I've seen people bringing up these western histories is when people bash China for things that happened decades ago. Look, if you could ask people to forget about the history and look to the future (btw, some people are actually proud of that history. Go figure), why not give China a chance? Sure the ruling party in China is still called the "Chinese Communist Party" but the people inside have changed and ideology have changed.

And yes, I think censorship is stupid.

ESPN and HBO

[greenfield]

A friend of mine who lives in Shanghai mentioned that ESPN and HBO went off the air this morning. The only western channels that are available are CNN and a German channel that is over 90% news.

Re:ESPN and HBO

[iNaya]

I live in Shanghai so I'll have to check that out when I get home. I was watching HBO last night. BBC is certainly available because I was watching it this morning.

Hypocrisy

[cats2ndlife]

As much as I hate this sensationalist topic about China floating on Slashdot just like others Slashdot's front page everyday (literally). I have to start blaming this to either mass uninformed stupidity or the entire western media for so many years of biased and irresponsible reports on China. It seems that the more China is making progress in its modernization effort, the more biased reports on it surfaces for whatever reason.

The little village in Sichuan has lost 50K lives and had 200K injured and millions of lives affected and all you hypocrites know is how China is "shutting down" entertainment websites.

First of all, I've been reading all the news reports from Hong Kong and Taiwan and I don't see any reports on this "shutting down".

Second of all, the president of China has issued a 3 days national mourning period, which happens to encourage a temp suspension of normal entertainment activities.

To the Chinese, this is perfectly normal and merited because this is the traditional Confucian way of mourning. When disasters strike the US, the president and everyone else goes "business as usual", in China, people actually stop and mourn. It's called "culture" people. The world culture is not uniform. Not everybody grew up in the US.

Re:Hypocrisy

[dwpro]

The cultural difference is not as you say. We (speaking for Americans here), know that many Chinese have died, and we know what it is to mourn.

I think the cultural difference is where you speak of the president "issuing", where as in the US the president would be "declaring", and pretty much the only mandated thing would be flags flown at half mast at government buildings.

Re:Hypocrisy

[cats2ndlife]

Ok I rephrase as we seems to be in a words game now. The president didn't "issue", he declared. Yes it is true. Look it up. It's NOT mandatory but encouraged.

Re:Hypocrisy

[dwpro]

I saw that mentioned further down in an email. You are correct.

I am learning much about how things are handled in China and citizen's perspective thanks to the information posted here. It appeared at first that when the president issued the mourning period that entertainment businesses were legally required to shut down. Thank you (and others) for clearing that up.

Re:Hypocrisy

[drspliff]

*snip* The little village in Sichuan [province] has lost 50K lives and had 200K injured *snip*

Wow, and to think I lived in a "little" village of 100 people in rural Wales.

Re:Hypocrisy

[Moridineas]

The little village in Sichuan has lost 50K lives and had 200K injured and millions of lives affected and all you hypocrites know is how China is "shutting down" entertainment websites. Please try to be rational here. The US has already given money and flown flights to help China. Nobody is minimizing the horrificness of the loss of life. If you believe otherwise, prove it.

People ARE, and rightfully so, criticizing the Chinese Communist Government for cracking down on websites yet again. A number of slashdot posters have confirmed this.

Do you understand the word "hypocrite" -- how is anybody being hypocritical?

Freedom isn't cultural.

Re:Hypocrisy

[cats2ndlife]

The so-called "cracking down" is really website voluntarily joining in the call for a 3 day mourning period. There's no crack down order issued for this incident. The Chinese government does clamp down on dissenters from time to time, but fact for fact, it is not happening for this mourning period. Just like the whole western media(including Slashdot on various occasions) is assuming that China was cracking down on the Tibetans using excess force where in fact it was the Tibetans who were harming the innocents. If don't believe me, go read the blogs of westerners who were actually in Tibet when that happened. There IS no "crack down" happening here, therefore, criticizing "yet again" is not so "rightfully so". Get your facts straight before commenting. Nobody is arguing about freedom here. Human rights is universal. It doesn't warrant baseless accusations however. Presumption is a presumption, regardless of the subject has a precedent of doing similar things or not.

Re:Hypocrisy

[sydneyfong]

A number of slashdot posters have confirmed this. I must have missed them. Where?

Note that you'll have to show them to be involuntarily closed. I've seen a lot of sites voluntarily closed, or functioning with less features, or at least having its designs changed to mourn the victims of the quake.

Supporting this.

[Squeeze Truck]

I'm in Liaoning (northeast China) and I completely support this. The Sichuan quake was a massive tragedy, and it's good that something very big is being done to raise awareness and honor the dead. It's better that it's being centrally coordinated.

If you're in China, rather than spending your time goofing around online you should donate to relief, give blood, and get outside and be part of the community. This is not a free speech issue, not today.

There is nothing wrong or creepy about an entire country working in concert to do something good. I wish the US could pull together like this from time to time.

Re:Supporting this.

[lobatt]

Why the US guys always act like they are the governor of the world? Even when we lost our families or friends in the disaster, we still need a party to prove that we are free? Bull shit.

Re:Supporting this.

[Free the Cowards]

Getting the entire country to work in concert is what totalitarian governments do. It's practically the definition of one. The reason the US government can't do this is because it's a free country. And yes, the things that totalitarian governments get their entire countries to work on are frequently good things. The trouble is that they make no distinction between getting the entire country to band together for earthquake relief and getting the entire country to band together to kill/imprison/reeducate everyone with the wrong ancestry/religion/politics.

Re:Supporting this.

[freedom_india]

Oh.. the US did this during Pearl Harbour and 9-11.
Only that pearl harbor helped bring WW2 to end and made japan a peace-loving country.
9-11 ended in one country broken, one country on the verge of going back and US much poorer.
But then when the country is led by a single-digit-IQ oil-loving-Texan who still can't read books and thinks sacrficing Golf is the biggest sacrifice he can make...
Sorry. We are ashamed of him. And we didn't vote for him (if you know what voting & elections mean).

Re:Supporting this.

[freedom_india]

Getting the entire country to work in concert is what totalitarian governments do. Wrong. Look at what good did it do to Collective Farms in Stalin's period.
His was the most totalitarian government you could get and still he could not improve farming output. (forget about purges).
The more hard you squeeze the sand in your palm, the more sand escapes.
Its a genuine outpouring of grief. Recognize that for what it is rather than saying bull$hit about totalitarian, etc.

Re:Supporting this.

[Free the Cowards]

Nothing wrong about it. Stalin did a great job of getting the entire country to work in concert doing exactly what he wanted. The trouble was, of course, that his policies were disastrous. Central control doesn't work very well because the guys at the top don't know what's happening at the bottom. So having the guys at the top make all of the people at the bottom jump to the same tune often ends in sorrow. The Soviets did a fantastic job of eliminating useful people who were considered politically dangerous, of forcing everyone to embrace Lysenkoism, and other such insanities. The result was predictable.

There may very well be a genuine outpouring of grief but don't act like the government had nothing to do with it. The shutting down of TV stations and entertainment web sites is most definitely a government action. It's not as if they're shutting down voluntarily. The government made them shut down. China has a blatantly totalitarian government and this is just one aspect of it.

Re:Supporting this.

[Moridineas]

This is not a free speech issue, not today. And what about tomorrow? And the week after? And when something else bad happens and the Government shuts people down again. You're kidding yourself.

There is nothing wrong or creepy about an entire country working in concert to do something good. I wish the US could pull together like this from time to time. Thank God the US government CAN'T shut down our freedom of information.

I personally think enforced mourning cheapens the meaning of it, but that's really irrelevant.

Re:Supporting this.

[Moridineas]

Why the US guys always act like they are the governor of the world? Even when we lost our families or friends in the disaster, we still need a party to prove that we are free? Bull shit. Grow up, where did anybody say that you should be having a "party."

I'm really getting sick of all these newly registered Chinese Government shills. You criticize people for not doing solidarity-related things, and you sit on your butt and post to slashdot? How laughable.

Re:Supporting this.

[lobatt]

Why the US guys always act like they are the governor of the world? Even when we lost our families or friends in the disaster, we still need a party to prove that we are free? Bull shit. Grow up, where did anybody say that you should be having a "party." I'm really getting sick of all these newly registered Chinese Government shills. You criticize people for not doing solidarity-related things, and you sit on your butt and post to slashdot? How laughable. Newly registered Chinese Government shills? So you come with prejudice and arrogant tone. You think Chinese Government hire me to agrue with you? Think you are another Opinion Leaderï¼Y Be rational...and wake up, looser!

Re:Supporting this.

[Moridineas]

Newly registered Chinese Government shills? ARe you newly registered? It looks like it to me. If so, accurate.
Shill - n - "One who poses as a disinterested advocate of another but is actually of the latter's party; a mouthpiece, a stooge."

Like I said earlier, if the glove fits...

You have come here with a "prejudice" and an "arrogant tone" as well. Can we get past that and stop issuing platitudes (and ad hominems)

Re:Supporting this.

[Squeeze Truck]

Newly-registered? Me?

Re:monitored is not free

[Tiro]

Please try finding the article "Media edicts recall China's Maoist past" from the Financial Times' website (14 May 2008, ft.com)

Yes, no, and what the *&^

[ssquidd]

I am only visiting Shenzhen, China for the summer break. Here's some confirmation and corrections: The access to those "entertainment" website are not cut, rather, some these "entertainment" website has been shutdown, i.e., when you go there, you will show a page containing messages like asking for donation and other help, then redirect you to a news website or redcross.org.cn. I just opened a account in a local adult friend finder website last night, and it is now closed. Do you really think sex is entertainment? This is really a serious activity that continues human civilization! Well... yes, I do use condom, but still... Here on the street I live in, almost all restaurant and tea house and quite a few local pub are still opening. Many shop owners are burning papers in front of their shops --- a ritual for remembering the dead (actually it is originally a ritual to send money to the dead in the underworld).

Re:How gullible can you get?

[wolssiloa]

Please check your facts before stating something. YES tudou.com does work, but have you actually tried searching for content and not just blindly clicking one of the videos on the front page? Only earthquake-related videos are available. *rolls eyes* back at you. Did you check youtube? I call bullshit on your bullshit claim.

In China now...

[Nocturrne]

I am in Shenzhen now and can confirm all of the entertainment TV channels have been turned off, but all of my favorite web sites are still open - even the ones previously blocked, like wikipedia and bbc. So, WTF? Why turn off my HBO for 3 days, but leave CNN and CNBC on? Did they look up "mourning" in their pocket translator and get it confused with "boring?"

Earthquake-related coverage only

[martin_the_geek]

At the moment, there is only earthquake-related coverage on television. Other channels are just displaying a notice about suspended programming. Currently, there are flags-raising ceremonies going on plus the continuing rescue work. There has been extensive earthquake coverage in the Chinese media since about 20 minutes after the quake.

So far the Chinese have raised over $1B in donations, of which $500K has come from the US government.

I haven't noticed any restrictions on websites. Wikipedia is still visible.

Can anyone with Web access in China confirm this?

[Phoenix919]

-- "Can anyone with Web access in China confirm this report?" Just spoke with a brother who lived in Guangdong for 5 years, says he had myspace correspondence with frineds just today.

Re:monitored is not free

[Christopher Neufeld]

Please try finding the article "Media edicts recall China's Maoist past" from the Financial Times' website (14 May 2008, ft.com) Yes, I can read that article using my unproxied konqueror. I'm sitting in a coffee shop in Beijing, sending all packets through the national firewall. It's not being blocked at this time (00h36 EDT).

Re:Only douchebags in the Chinese government

[iNaya]

would worry about internet censorship in China at a time like this. The Chinese government certainly is

People are still crushed under rubble, entire towns are flattened,

And the pseudo-communist government is still thinking about how to censor the Internet.

I'd have to disagree with you that anyone's point of view is irrelevant. All points of view are relevant, whether or not we agree.

Disgusted

[ChameleonDave]

The sort of reactionary and racist anti-Chinese attitudes that are commonplace on Slashdot really sicken me.

A short period of mourning is declared, with very little enforcement, and all you want to do is seize the opportunity to make it look like censorship, in particular censorship of the disaster. It is the exact opposite. Frivolous entertainment is being scaled down a bit for a mere three days, and the TV networks are saturating the public with quake information. Never has the Chinese government been more open. With previous tragedies we saw secrecy and a desire to save face, but this regime is clearly much more modern. The contrast with the terrible Burmese regime is very clear.

I don't actually agree with the declaration of mourning, and I wish that this government could be replaced with one truly chosen by the people, but this doesn't mean that the non-stop stream of slurs and vilification is OK.

In particular, I find the concept of a period of mourning to be much less offensive than Bush's 16 Sept official day of prayer for hurricane Katrina. Separation of church and state, please!

Re:Disgusted

[Fluffeh]

all you want to do is seize the opportunity to make it look like censorship Actually, cutting off certain channels from the television, and redirecting certain sites to point to other ones is sort of censorship. If it's not, it is actually something more sinister - ala George Orwell. It is one or the other.

Having said that, I don't think I would be overly interested in find porn sites when my neighbors house was a ruined pile of crap, and I don't totally disagree with what they have done (some small part of me thinks it's not the worst thing they could have done) but don't be fooled into thinking it's not censorship or worse.

Re:Disgusted

[simonsleeper]

I'm in Shanghai and I can confirm that. The original report in the story is quite biased judging from what I see in China.

Re:Disgusted

[mpe]

It is usually Americans who use the "Yeah but we aren't as bad as [insert worse country here]" argument to justify censorship or the curtailing of freedoms.

Kind of hard to do this with things like proportion of the population in prison though...

It is also usually Americans shouting about how the whole world and his dog is anti-American.

Or "anti-smitic" if the US/Israel relationship is involved.

It seems China and the USA have more in common than just the same aim of a totalitarian police state masquerading as something soft and cuddly.

The truth is probably along the lines of government attracting the same kind of people the world over. About the only difference is that this "masquerade" appears to work best in North America and Europe.

Re:Disgusted

[Moridineas]

The sort of reactionary and racist anti-Chinese attitudes that are commonplace on Slashdot really sicken me. Right, because if you don't like somebody's opinion, it's racist.

A short period of mourning is declared, with very little enforcement, and all you want to do is seize the opportunity to make it look like censorship Censorship is censorship is censorship.

In particular, I find the concept of a period of mourning to be much less offensive than Bush's 16 Sept official day of prayer for hurricane Katrina. Separation of church and state, please! Nobody had to pray [and "pray" has nothing to do with separation of church and state]. No information was censored. No websites were shut down. No freedom of information was taken. You truly don't see the difference?

Re:Disgusted

[sydneyfong]

Censorship is censorship is censorship. Censorship is censorship.
Mourning is mourning.

The question is, which is it? This should be based on facts. You don't provide facts you don't provide evidence, you simply repeat your views based on nothing but a slashdot headline (and if you look carefully, it's misleading [if not outright false], as usual).

Re:Disgusted

[saiha]

Perhaps you could have kept your moral high ground if you left off that last paragraph.

Re:Disgusted

[microbee]

I am a Chinese and I just got back from China. I was in Beijing when the earthquake happened. I've been hanging around Slashdot for many years.

I have to say that although a lot of Slashdot submissions wrt China are not exactly friendly, I've seen a lot of very insightful and objevtive comments, unlike some of the mainstream media (e.g., CNN), and I personally learnt a lot too.

There are idiots everywhere, especially when it comes to a country most people never set foot on. But I am not disgusted. In fact I am often amazed how many people actually know what they are talking about.

Re:Disgusted

[Moridineas]

You know, 12 hours after the fact, and after many back and forths it looks like some sites in the affected region were only temporarily shutdown, while other across the country were just normal great wall sporadic blocking. I'm not in China and can't say anything first hand.

I WILL say that I find it rather hilarious that my own reaction (and the majority of slashdotters) to condemn the Chinese government was met with an equally vehement reaction from another group of (primarily Chinese) posters DEFENDING the Chinese Communist party actions.

EVen though nothing happened.

It seems that that is the most telling thing out of the whole incident!

Re:Disgusted

[sydneyfong]

It's hilarious once, but gets old when it happens once in a while, whenever "China" comes up....

And about the new registrants who seem to be predominantly Chinese .... I wonder how many flame wars they'll cause later... haha.

Re:monitored is not free

[_critic]

I can confirm the nearly identical media experience in Shanghai. I live in the French Concession (no TV at home, but have seen news, etc in restaurants). I also SSH through the great firewall when necessary, but seldom have the need.

I've seen no change in accessibility. I still can't get boingboing w/o SSH :P

Things are not what they appear!

[Goddson]

well,I'm a Chinese living in China mainland. I know western culture pretty well and I think it's just cultural thing.I dont think it's an "order" down from the gov,it's just recommendation stuff. 50,000 people lost!! 50,000 people maybe more!!This country need more attention and help!! In fact,not all entertainment website suspended,not so worse as your imagination,check out this: http://yule.aigou.com/detail_13623.html BTW: 50000 people lost their lives,more people suffered 7 miserable days,3 days calmness and sympathy won't make you a loser!!!Just be humane, people!!

Re:Things are not what they appear!

[jaaron]

It was an order. Read this.

Three days national mourning

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, Theres 3 days national mourning. All entertainment venues will be closed (I'm not sure about the internet). From 14:28 today there will be 3 minutes silence. It's out of respect for the now 32,000+ dead and nothing else. This is the email I got about it (I'm working in Beijing)

Dear colleagues,

In memory of the casualties in earthquake of Sichuan Province, the State Council has announced an official three-day national mourning. Flags are to be kept at half-mast and all public amusements will be suspended from today to Wednesday for respect of victims of the May 12 earthquake.

All people in China are suggested to take actions jointly to show the condolence to victims in the tragedy.

In specific:

If you are at your desk, or in meeting, please stand in silence for three minutes starting from 14:28 today

If you are walking, please stand still in silence for three minutes starting from 14:28 today

If you are driving, please pull over your car at the same time and horn for three minutes from 14:28 today

Meanwhile, we would highly appreciate your continuous efforts in contributing to the MAC Relief Donation. And every penny we receive will go to those who are still suffering from the great pains of losing their families.

Regards,

Human Resource Department

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

The quake happened at around 2:30pm China time.

Brief reports of the quake came within an hour. More detailed reports of the quake came rolling in within 2-3 hours, detailing death tolls etc. Wen Jiabao flew to Sichuan on short notice and made an (national) announcement on the plane.

If your story is true everybody involved reacted real quick.

If anybody was trying to cover up the story it could only be the local (municipal?) government. If that's the case I'm not really surprised. It's no news that many local governments in China are crap, and it's not surprising that they couldn't suppress news of a huge national disaster like this.

Re:monitored is not free

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you still alive now? :)

Dear all China/Communist haters

[sydneyfong]

Dear all China/Communist haters,

Next time, please try to report on the EVIL CRIMES of CHINESE COMMUNISTS with a bit more subtlety. These days, with the free Internet, and more Chinese citizens on the Internet who've seen the real deal, blatant lies about the Chinese government will not work, and will get you discredited.

Please, for the sake of humanity and those who rightly believe in the CULT OF ANTI-COMMUNISM, run stories about CHINESE COMMUNISTS KILLING BABIES in their basements or something. Something that nobody can be sure about. At least you won't get a heck load of comments from readers outright contradicting your claims.

Best regards,
Concerned Reader

Re:Dear all China/Communist haters

[Moridineas]

Next time, please try to report on the EVIL CRIMES of CHINESE COMMUNISTS with a bit more subtlety. These days, with the free Internet, and more Chinese citizens on the Internet who've seen the real deal, blatant lies about the Chinese government will not work, and will get you discredited. Which lies?

Look, people on slashdot absolutely understand that many Chinese citizens are very nationalistic. People on slashdot also tend to be very anti-Government, and especially anti-freedom of information. If the glove fits...

Re:Dear all China/Communist haters

[sydneyfong]

From a comment from TFA:

I also received confirmation from one of the CN human rights reps that the internet and television shut down is VOLUNTARY and OPTIONAL as part of the the three day mourning period, some that was lost in translation earlier. :) If you have somebody to translate: this is the original notice from the Chinese government. The relevant part basically says "all public entertainment activities shall be ceased". I'm not familiar with how much direct control over websites the Chinese government has, and whether "public" means "public as in government/state owned" or "public as in publicly accessible", but it seems that they won't pull you into jail if a website owner doesn't comply. Besides, most Chinese sites are more than willing to participate.

Compare with Slashdot title: "China Cuts Access to Entertainment Web Sites". And then people start bitching about how China is getting more oppressive etc and crackdown on entertainment sites... wtf.

Not lies? Willful ignorance?

And I admit I was a bit too sarcastic. I usually don't buy into the "lies" thing, but sometimes you just can't help but have that conclusion. Did you read about that Nepal "Chinese police" somewhere in the discussion? There are numerous other such examples, which sound perfectly "right" to westerners because most aren't familiar with issues in China, but are simply outright ridiculous when viewed by anybody with a clue about China. This one is simply a bit over the top. I mean, we all know that slashdot doesn't have any journalistic standards, but slashdot frontpage "news" linking to a site that comments on some rumors on Twitter?

Sometimes I feel that the western attitude towards China related reporting is like this: anything that paints China in a bad light "sounds" right, so it goes through without much scrutiny. Anything that paints China is a positive light "sounds" wrong, and people just have to twist it to sound like there's some ulterior motive. If you look and read carefully with an unbiased eye, you might see it yourself (just put your tinfoil hat on, the Chinese "nationalists" exaggerates things too).

I'm all for freedom of information and I personally think the great firewall of China is stupid (especially the wiki ban), but one should base criticisms on fact and not false rumors from people who have an anti-China agenda.

Re:Dear all China/Communist haters

[Moridineas]

Sometimes I feel that the western attitude towards China related reporting is like this: anything that paints China in a bad light "sounds" right, so it goes through without much scrutiny. Anything that paints China is a positive light "sounds" wrong, and people just have to twist it to sound like there's some ulterior motive. If you look and read carefully with an unbiased eye, you might see it yourself (just put your tinfoil hat on, the Chinese "nationalists" exaggerates things too). Americans especially are very sensitive about this. All of our products are made in China, with jobs lost. This causes resentment amongst some parts of the society. Then with the number of highprofile spying cases, widely believed and reported cases of economic espionage, and even events such as the EP3 crash, there's a lot for people to think about. (and the ASAT test)

I do maintain that nobody on slashdot at least is claiming that China is worth off than it was 20 years ago. The Chinese government (largely relying on the abundance of very cheap labor) has done a remarkable job of turning around 50 years of meh. That doesn't mean that the Chinese Communist Party should get a free pass for human rights violations, censorship, and state sponsored nationalistic jingoism.

Many of the posts seen on slashdot today seem downright creepy to your average Westerner! People saying things like the Government has a duty to control rumors to protect the people. Very creepy.

Re:Dear all China/Communist haters

[sydneyfong]

Many of the posts seen on slashdot today seem downright creepy to your average Westerner! People saying things like the Government has a duty to control rumors to protect the people. Very creepy. Creepiness noted and understood. I'm surprised at the number of new registrants surging in... :-/

As for the "duty to control rumors"... I, for one, welcome our Rumor Controlling Overlords... Well, seriously, in an ideal world, I really would. I mean, digging into every rumor to find out whether it's true is a time consuming process, and *IF* we had a responsible government who actually controls false rumors (instead of censoring real ones they don't want to hear about), then I'm all for it. The problem is just the big "IF"....

Lets be mature regarding China

[damburger]

There is a whole list of problems we might have with China, but can we just shut up about them for five seconds to discuss this specific situation?

As far as any government can, they've done everything right with regard to the earthquake. The Premier (who is IIRC a geologist which I guess would be useful) went straight to the scene with thousands of troops to organise relief work.

Foreign aid was requested almost immediately, and the government allowed them to get on with their jobs and not use their presence or not as a grisly bargaining chip (unlike some other regimes we could mention). This openness has even extended to the US military of all people.

Shutting down entertainment services for the duration of a major disaster is not a totalitarian move, seeing as it isn't affecting news media. And it isn't like they are alone in doing so. How many sitcoms could you find on US and British TV on 9/11?

Exaggeration

[Alex_Ionescu]

I'm in Shanghai this month and just heard the air raid siren for 3 minutes while in Old Shanghai... it was quite touching to see everyone stop whatever they were doing.

As for Internet access... I think this is sensationalist BS. I'm on slashdot.org, people.com, youtube.com, cnn.com and wikipedia.org right now without any problems. Nobody's cutting access, they're just asking for a period of mourning and respect for the dead.

How is this different from our reaction to Pearl Harbor and/or September 11?

Re:Exaggeration

[jaaron]

You're going to international sites. Those aren't the ones being shutdown. Only Chinese sites have these instructions. See sina.com or games.com.cn or others.

Re:monitored is not free

[BananaPeel]

I note with interest, over the past 6 months, the noticiable uninformed anti chinese bias of the articles on Slashdot.

You didn't need to dig very far to find out that China is in 3 days of mourning.

You guys appear intellegent but incapable of independent thought when it comes to China.

It seems that you really just don't get the cultural differences and you don't understand the inter-realtionship between responsibile reporting and control.

You flap about over freedom of the press, and yet appear to have no understanding of what that is or what it means.

China is made up of 56 different ethnics groups, 800 million of which are on less than $2 a day. You want to throw into that the irresponsible, almost unaccountable, sensationalist press we have in the West?

Yeah that would really work. Reporting without responsibility great invention.

A truely free press is a dangerous thing. It allows everyone to peddle whatever truth the desire and to encourage others to believe it.

Do you believe that any Western country allows a truely free press in that sense.

Push a negative story a little, someone starts a rumor, and you have a blood bath on your hands.

In the UK many kinds of story are not covered here by agreement between the press and Government. There is a code of practice for journalist and editors covering what should be reported.

The reason you have this is to try to instil some degree of responsibility into the press. Even with this totally ficticious and inflamatory stories are still run.

But in the west we don't have anything like the same kind of ethnic tensions that they have other countries.

And come on tell me you are not sick of reading the papers or watching the news in the West. Why because you know it's bias and not the whole story.

The very reason you come online and use a site like Slashdot is that you want to be able to shout back at those stories.

Only problem is that on the internet there is no code of ehtical practice. So everyone says what they want and we end up with some really nasty hate being shifted around the world fueling people prejudices.

The idea of a totally free press is a noble idea which totally does not take into account human nature.

Re: Can anyone with Web access in China confirm th

[jaaron]

That's because it's not international sites that have these instructions from the China government. It's internal Chinese websites. Check this out.

It's fine by me

[Eosha]

I live in China (near Shanghai). As of this morning, the usual blocked sites were still blocked (Wiki, etc.) but /., YouTube, webcomics, etc. are still up and running.

Re:Only douchebags on Slashdot

[sydneyfong]

Huh? I pardon you that you probably don't read Chinese, but a LOT of news and information about the quake came from Chinese forums, and lots of people communicated with their families through the internet or SMS or other means of communication.

And, the story isn't accurate. They declared a 3 day mourning, they didn't cut off the Internet.

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

I note with interest, over the past 6 months, the noticiable uninformed anti chinese bias of the articles on Slashdot. I note with disinterest, that the situation has been going on for as long as I remember being on slashdot. It's just that perhaps in the past 6 months, the irrational China-haters have gotten less real issues to bash China, and the bias and absurdity is finally surfacing.

You didn't need to dig very far to find out that China is in 3 days of mourning. Blame that on the editors. They think that a comment on some twitter messages are "news", despite that there's no report from more authoritative news sources, which TFA responsibly notes.

You guys appear intellegent but incapable of independent thought when it comes to China. People here think they're smart yet I simply see that they're brainwashed with western propaganda. Yes, brainwashed. They can't accept the fact that the situation in China is improving, and they resort to pseudo-journalism (if even that) to reinforce their beliefs, so that they don't have to acknowledge that they've been BS-ing all along.

Re:Current Situation

[Douglas Goodall]

This seem o%*&^

Re:monitored is not free

[Potor]

... and at least six other major language families

Re:That's exactly what I did

[Douglas Goodall]

I got REALLY tired of paying too much for not enough channels. I put some of the money into a faster Internet connection (16mb). Now I get a huge amount of podcasts, including all the news I can watch. I guess that means I am over exposed to the news. But that can happen no matter what media you watch.

Re:monitored is not free

[Christopher Neufeld]

4chan.org Reachable.

worldofwarcraft.com Reachable.

http://asdasd.fjordsdfoj.com.ch Unknown host, but also doesn't DNS resolve on my home machine in Canada, so it appears this doesn't really exist.

http://www.bankofamerica.com Reachable.

Re:monitored is not free

[schwieter]

I live in Chengdu (about 100 km from the epicenter of the initial quake), the nearest big city to the affected area, and have noticed no change in what's accessible, be they Chinese or foreign hosted sites. Information was slow to spread after the earthquake, with, according to a friend, CCTV first reporting the earthquake about 4 hours afterwards. Here, the internet (but not intranet) was down until at least 2 hours afterwards, and the radio stations were almost exclusively running one track on repeat since everyone had fled from the studios. The cell network went down too, of course, though oddly enough international calls seemed to be able to make their way in.

Re:monitored is not free

[schwieter]

For more about my relatively uneventful earthquake experience in this city which saw almost no damage in or around the CBD, you can check out the blog I keep for my family members, though it's unaccessible from China:

Herd of the misinformed

[jovius]

In an amazing Slashdot twist the subjective observations of one Marc van der Chijs, CEO of Spill Group Asia and Cofounder of Todou.com, become the official voice of the Chinese government. Hilarity ensues as hundreds chime in to express their views about the views of van der Chifs about the current events.

Let's see now. "Ge Jianxiong, a professor with Fudan University in Shanghai, made an appeal to China's top legislature to mark May 19 a national mourning day in his article published in Southern Metropolis Daily on May 16." according to Xinhua (China announces three-day mourning for quake victims, torch relay suspension). The article says that the appeal came from the public, and the government drew up a few guidelines and made it official.

About the ceremonies themselves, Xinhua reports. "National flags will fly at half mast, public entertainments will be cancelled and the Olympic torch relay suspended during the three-day mourning period."

Nowhere does it say anything about entertainment websites, but public entertainments. Besides, the actions seem to be voluntary and based on solidarity. It's quite hard to imagine that the PLA would enforce mourning at gunpoint. The whole case seems to be an example of internet hysteria.

Whatever the propaganda, the quake pages of chinaview are an interesting read.

Re:monitored is not free

[Hal_Porter]

Punishment can come later. By closing off entertainment, they have less to watch. In the aftermath, they can take advantage of community spirit to purge dissenters of all stripes.

Hey I agree with twitter. That's never happened before. I...feeel...a..bi~

ERROR! ERROR! EMEGERGENCY SYSTEM REBOOT!

Sorry, what were we talking about again?

50 channels, but a choice of only ONE

[Chief Wongoller]

It's 7.06 pm in China now (where I am) and I have just switched on my tv to check. I get around 50 channels on cable here, but today they are ALL showing the same programming - except the solitary English language channel which has a diffent show, but on the same theme. It won't make much difference to me as I can still download my P2P files, and although Chinese download sites may be suspended, the DVD stores (at least those near my home) are still open for business selling pirated DVDs for the equivalent of 85cents US. The 3 minutes silence was interesting and well observed, but curiously the end of that three minutes was marked by the sounding of air raid sirens and much honking of car horns.

Re:50 channels, but a choice of only ONE

[glorious tao]

"the 3 minutes silence was interesting and well observed, but curiously the end of that three minutes was marked by the sounding of air raid sirens and much honking of car horns." what a shame on you. please respect the dead people just a little. At 2:48 we were having class, the teacher from Canada reminded us to mourn for 3 minutes. During that silence, we thought about the dead people and true mening of life, very moving experience. So don't act so selfish, if you do care about chinese people, please do some real thing to help us. please, thanks a lot.

Major entertainment sites only provide quake news

[ypwong]

It's true that entertainment websites have stopped providing entertainment. Two largest video sharing websites, 6.cn and tudou.com, now only broadcast videos that are related to the earthquake, you can no longer view videos that are unrelated to the tragedy (could you imagine youtube only serves only one kind of videos but no others?). If you dare to try using the search box to look for other videos, you will either be brought back to the front page or to a page asking you to lend a helping hand, like donation.

Meanwhile, many portal sites have toned down the color of their layout to gray, very depressing indeed. Examples include baidu.com, www.sina.com.cn, the two video sharing websites mentioned above, g.cn (Google in China), www.tom.com. Many sections of the news portals have also been shut down and completely replaced with tragic news.

We should all mourn the death of the lives lost in the earthquake but the act of this information blockade is too much. The websites should be able to decide by themselves what to do instead of following a government order.

Re:monitored is not free

[1u3hr]

it was the exact antithesis of news suppression.

Yes. This is not about NEWS suppression. As TFA says, it's about entertainment. Since today was the first of three official days of mourning in China, (including here in Hong Kong), one week after the quake hit, many light-hearted events were cancelled or postponed. There was a three minute silence this afternoon at 2:28 pm, the time of the quake. Disneyland HK has cancelled its fireworks, the Olympic Torch run has stopped. Flags are at half mast.

There is no cover up gong on that I've noticed. There is a scandal about shoddily constructed schools that collapsed, being vigorously pursued.

If there is any spin going on, I suspect they're trying to change the story from "China suppresses Tibet" to "Brave China united to recover from earthquake".

Re:monitored is not free

[something_wicked_thi]

I couldn't resist answering your idiotic post that just asked lots of pointless, stupid questions (without a question mark no less!), that seemed to lead the reader into random circles of thought like a labyrinth with no exit.

I note with interest, over the past 6 months, the noticiable uninformed anti chinese bias of the articles on Slashdot.

Um, do you even read Slashdot? Point to one topic here that isn't covered in a biased manner.

You didn't need to dig very far to find out that China is in 3 days of mourning.

So if the government declares a day of mourning, I'm not allowed to laugh at a funny television show? That sounds completely unhealthy. I don't care what your culture is.

You guys appear intellegent but incapable of independent thought when it comes to China.

It seems that you really just don't get the cultural differences and you don't understand the inter-realtionship between responsibile reporting and control.

Ooh, this one's easy. Responsible reporting and control have nothing to do with each other. If it's controlled, it's propaganda, not reporting. Deal with it.

You flap about over freedom of the press, and yet appear to have no understanding of what that is or what it means.

Another easy one. It means the press can report whatever they like without fear of being prosecuted for it.

China is made up of 56 different ethnics groups, 800 million of which are on less than $2 a day. You want to throw into that the irresponsible, almost unaccountable, sensationalist press we have in the West?

So what? The US started off with lots of poor farmers, too. I frankly don't see how this can have anything to do with freedom of the press. Do people get docked pay every time a reporter criticizes the government?

Yeah that would really work. Reporting without responsibility great invention.

And reporting with censorship is better, how? I can think of a number of ways it's worse.

A truely free press is a dangerous thing. It allows everyone to peddle whatever truth the desire and to encourage others to believe it.

Oh, so you criticize the people on Slashdot for not thinking for themselves, then say that you need to limit the spread of opinion because people might actually believe it? Either you want people to think critically or you don't. Make up your mind.

Do you believe that any Western country allows a truely free press in that sense.

Well, no. But again, I don't see your point. Just because the west does it doesn't mean China should. If we don't have a perfect free press, then maybe China could beat us at it. As-is, though, the Western system seems quite superior.

Push a negative story a little, someone starts a rumor, and you have a blood bath on your hands.

A blood bath? Really? Where? The only blood bath I can think of is Iraq, and that wasn't the media, though you can maybe blame the media for not being critical enough. You certainly can't blame them for warmongering (well, except Fox, but that's not news).

In the UK many kinds of story are not covered here by agreement between the press and Government. There is a code of practice for journalist and editors covering what should be reported.

Well, whatever works for you. It might even make sense assuming it's a gentlemanly agreement to be civil rather than a "I'll scratch your back" thing.

The reason you have this is to try to instil some degree of responsibility into the press. Even with this totally ficticious and inflamatory stories are still run.

So it doesn't work? Go figure. Of course, you spoke of an agreement not to cover stories, not about making sure they were true, so it's an even bigger surprise that it fails to accomplish a goal it doesn't seem to have in the first

Didn't the US pause events post-9/11

[HockeyPuck]

I seem to recall that in the aftermath of 9/11, many events were postponed. From concerts, to WWE wrestling to Major League Baseball. Hell I believe even Saturday Night Live took a short hiatus. Why aren't you still complaining that the airlines were shutdown on 9/11 (and 9/12) so you couldn't go on your vacation to DisneyWorld. I guess that makes the US gov't an oppressive regime b/c you couldn't go on Mr Toad's Wild Ride? Do Americans complain about the "1 minute of silence" during baseball games on 9/11? Doubt it.

I'm not sure what the whole "OMG Chinese people can't go to entertainment websites for THREE WHOLE DAYS" is that big of a negative deal. Maybe the gov't is using this to focus the attention on the earthquake and give people the time to reflect that the loss on this is actually quite great, and *GASP* try to give some help.

Instead of posting about how China is the awful place and has an oppressive regime, why don't some of you actually MOVE to China and do something about it. I'm sure that your help would be greatly appreciated.

Re:Didn't the US pause events post-9/11

[Moridineas]

I seem to recall that in the aftermath of 9/11, many events were postponed. From concerts, to WWE wrestling to Major League Baseball. Hell I believe even Saturday Night Live took a short hiatus. and websites like Penny Arcade too. Nobody ORDERED them to do it.

Why aren't you still complaining that the airlines were shutdown on 9/11 (and 9/12) so you couldn't go on your vacation to DisneyWorld. I guess that makes the US gov't an oppressive regime b/c you couldn't go on Mr Toad's Wild Ride? People DID get pissed off at the lack of flights, though it wasn't because of your ludicrous suggestions. We're not still complaining about the flights being cancelled because we had freedom of information the whole time. No websites were shut down. We could access wikipedia the whole time.

And people ARE still complaining about the Patriot act, etc.

Do Americans complain about the "1 minute of silence" during baseball games on 9/11? Doubt it. You're trying to make an analogy between a minute of silence and a government crackdown on websites and freedom of information. Do you realize how ludicrous that sounds?

Re:Didn't the US pause events post-9/11

[sydneyfong]

You're trying to make an analogy between a minute of silence and a government crackdown on websites and freedom of information. Do you realize how ludicrous that sounds? Yes, sounds ludicrous to me.

As I understood it, nobody is cracking down websites to enforce the "order". They are doing it voluntarily. (Did you read the comments in TFA?)

Look how false information could mislead and spread. Stop it please, I'm tired of debunking them.

Re:monitored is not free

[cyfer2000]

Are you joking or something? John Vause of CNN has been there since the earthquake. BBC has been there too. AP and Reuters claimed they had been there also. So at least two of them are lying if your wife was right.

Re:monitored is not free

[slack_prad]

He knew his audience comprised of people who thought Asian == Chinese. How would this audience know what Mandarin is.

NO

[gzipped_tar]

They are not shut down. E.g. mp3.baidu.com, the music search (which is hated by MPAA) part of Baidu is still up, with logo changed to black-and-white instead of the usual color one.

tudou.com, a Chinese imitation of Youtube, has all quake-related videos on the front page, but is still operating and hosting various entertainment videos.

and there are many more.

And by the way, my connection to opendns.com's name servers are getting worse (with 50% lost packets) these days. Related or not?

Re:monitored is not free

[Kelbear]

How would this audience know what Mandarin is. Iron Man's arch-nemesis. ...Why?

Find a Chinese-speaking friend, dudes.

[NuclearBovineBoy]

I think BananaPeel was the first to notice that the entertainment sites are actually up, but they have a subdued black-and-white background due to the declared three days of national mourning. Maybe you should find a Chinese-reading friend to check on such things before you post hate-mongering rumors. The Chinese news agencies have been quite open and forthright about the tremendous destruction and loss of life due to the quake. CCTV and Xinhua are full of news and there was even cell phone camera footage on CCTV.

Re:monitored is not free

[mollymoo]

In the UK many kinds of story are not covered here by agreement between the press and Government.

What kinds of story? I can think of details of court cases (eg. details of pending cases which may prejudice a jury) and details of actions in war (eg. location of troops, presence of high-ranking royals or politicians). In both cases the stories do get reported on after the need for censorship is over. So, other than the could-harm-justice kind and the could-risk-lives kind, what kinds of story are suppressed in the UK?

Having a free press may not be ideal, but then nor is having a democracy. The problem is who makes the decisions. If we could find a suitable benevolent dictator to run the country it would be a lot fairer and more efficient. If we could find a suitable benevolent censor to control the press it would be a lot fairer and more accurate. Unfortunately such people don't seem to be very common, power corrupts and nobody would be able to agree on which dictator/censor would be the most benevolent. So we have democracy and a free press, which is the least-bad way we've come up with.

Re:monitored is not free

[joggle]

If it wasn't for a free press the US could quite likely still be a colony/protectorate of the UK or at least would have been a colony for much longer. The press was instrumental for spreading discontent in the American colonies. That seemed to work out for the US and eventually for the UK as well.

The negatives are true too. Take the Spanish-American War of 1898. The trigger for the war was a doubtful report of a US war ship being sunk by the Spanish (which was more likely sunk due to an accidental internal explosion from munitions). A less free press would not have been much better though since the government was itching for a fight with the Spanish due to a desire for more territory so a false report by the government would have had the same results.

The press in the US is in a way much less free than it was in the 19th century. Back then there were many more newspapers and almost no accountability so much of the information in the press was heavily biased and often based on rumor and libel was an afterthought here. Even major city newspapers that were considered serious then would be considered tabloids by today's standards.

Considering the US government has withstood such a free press for over 200 hundred years I don't think it's as dangerous as you seem to think it is.

Re:monitored is not free

[Moridineas]

I note with interest, over the past 6 months, the noticiable uninformed anti chinese bias of the articles on Slashdot. As the old joke goes, maybe the reality of the situation has a an anti-Chinese government slant.

It seems that you really just don't get the cultural differences and you don't understand the inter-realtionship between responsibile reporting and control.

You flap about over freedom of the press, and yet appear to have no understanding of what that is or what it means. Sir, with all due respect, it's you who has no understanding of what freedom is. It's not cultural, it's not racial, and it's not what you think it is.

China is made up of 56 different ethnics groups, 800 million of which are on less than $2 a day. You want to throw into that the irresponsible, almost unaccountable, sensationalist press we have in the West? What's the worse thing that happens? People learn to think for themselves? I can see how that would be scary for the Chinese Communist Party and its supporters and shills--those people who derive power, wealth, and prestige from being at the top. This is the reason communism and far left states always become corrupt.

A truely free press is a dangerous thing. It allows everyone to peddle whatever truth the desire and to encourage others to believe it. See previous paragraph, a free press is only dangerous to those people for whom the truth and freedom is dangerous. Those invested in a corrupt system.

Push a negative story a little, someone starts a rumor, and you have a blood bath on your hands. That would seem to be an argument FOR freedom of information. It's only countries like China, much of the Middle East, etc, where there are restrictions on information that mass rumor hysteria is a problem.

In the UK many kinds of story are not covered here by agreement between the press and Government. There is a code of practice for journalist and editors covering what should be reported. Do you truly fail to see the difference between an individual making a personal decision to cover or not cover an issue, vice a government ORDERING sites shutdown, etc? You're not even close to the issue here.

But in the west we don't have anything like the same kind of ethnic tensions that they have other countries. Yes, China's it's 90%+ Han population must really be quaking in its boots. Are you really attempting to justify crackdowns on the fact that ~5% of the population might get angry? Your arguments don't even begin to make sense!

The very reason you come online and use a site like Slashdot is that you want to be able to shout back at those stories. I also like arguing with Chinese government shills.

Only problem is that on the internet there is no code of ehtical practice. So everyone says what they want and we end up with some really nasty hate being shifted around the world fueling people prejudices. And in China there is no racism? No hate? Because you seem to for one thing be laying a lot of the blame on China's ethnic minorities..

The idea of a totally free press is a noble idea which totally does not take into account human nature. BS.

Re:monitored is not free

[Moridineas]

the irrational China-haters have gotten less real issues to bash China, and the bias and absurdity is finally surfacing Can you give me some examples of this? I'm very curious as to what exactly you consider irrational, China-hating, and bashing?

They can't accept the fact that the situation in China is improving Who has ever said anything like that? Please, if you're going to make ludicrous arguments, back it up. That's one of the bonuses of having freedom of information!

Re:monitored is not free

[Goldberg's Pants]

Yeah. I mean everyone knows it's a type of orange...

Sorry, couldn't resist. Any action movie fan worth their salt knows what Mandarin is.

There's an easy way to check the TV broadcasting in the western world anyway. Use some of the P2P video software like Sopcast etc... All of them carry all the CCTV stations live, as well as other Chinese stations.

Not just in China

[coresnake]

Anyone else using QQ may have also gotten the message that from the 23rd everyone has to login to QQ in 'invisible' (i.e. appear offline) mode, and for those who appear online theres the following set of penalties: if you chalk up more than one hour online time they suspend your account for 3 days if you chalk up 1-24 hrs they suspend you for 30 days if you chalk up over 24 hrs they BLOCK YOUR ACCOUNT I'm pretty sure this also applies to people using QQ abroad. It's totally fucking ridiculous, people have enough pressure to go through without this forced mourning, everyone has different ways of coping and should be free to heal in their own time instead of having this demagoguing bullshit forced down their throats. Bring back MSN Messenger, all is forgiven! Oh and I also don't believe that the government would be doing this unless they had something to gain from it, so you can keep all that 'but what about the victims' crap, too. Who knows they're probably just covering up massive failure in their Internet infrastructure or something (although their Internet was full of FAIL to begin with).

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

Can you give me some examples of this? I'm very curious as to what exactly you consider irrational, China-hating, and bashing? Basically, look around. There is some rational bashing, and then some totally ridiculous ones. Most of them basically goes like this: "I know the Chinese government is evil. So anything they do must be evil, and any positive things they do MUST have some ulterior motive. Therefore the Chinese government is evil." Example? You don't need to look far. Interpreting a national mourning (well justified, just look at the death toll) as an act of censorship or oppression.

Who has ever said anything like that? Please, if you're going to make ludicrous arguments, back it up. That's one of the bonuses of having freedom of information! Could I turn your argument on itself? ;-p

Basically, a lot of people (whether on slashdot or not) bash China (and government) based on unconfirmed ludicrous arguments. A lot of "what if they did this?", "they're bad guys, so they must have done something evil" kind of thinking/reasoning. Why do they have to resort to this instead of basing their criticisms on actual facts? "They can't accept the fact that the situation in China is improving" is my conclusion.

Sorry that I can't point you to people saying explicitly "Oh no China can't be improving". Most people aren't stupid enough to say this. But then, may I refer you to the famous (in Chinese circles) comment by Jack Cafferty: "I think they're (the Chinese) basically the same bunch of goons and thugs they've been for the last 50 years".

If you know what China is like 50 years ago, and the fact that it has unarguably improved a lot (though still a long way to go), you'll see how my statement could be valid.

Btw, my statement is not too ludicrous to Chinese or those who actually have a clue about China, but I admit I should have given a bit more evidence here ;-p

Re:monitored is not free

[strabes]

Wow, I've never seen an authoritarian pro-censorship post get dominated so badly by an advocate of freedom in my life.

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

China is made up of 56 different ethnics groups, 800 million of which are on less than $2 a day. You want to throw into that the irresponsible, almost unaccountable, sensationalist press we have in the West? What's the worse thing that happens? People learn to think for themselves? People believing Saddam had WMDs.
People believing Saddam caused the 911
People believing they are doing Iraqis a service by "bringing freedom" to them.
People believing Obama is a Muslim.
People voting against Obama simply because he's black.
People believing the slashdot headline here.

Tell me, when have people learned to think for themselves?

Don't get me wrong I'm not for censorship. I'm just for responsible journalism, because like it or not, there are some people who'd just believe in anything they're told.

Re:monitored is not free

[BananaPeel]

I couldn't resist answering your idiotic post that just asked lots of pointless, stupid questions (without a question mark no less!), that seemed to lead the reader into random circles of thought like a labyrinth with no exit.

A lot of questions because its a complicated subject with many things to take into account.

I note with interest, over the past 6 months, the noticiable uninformed anti chinese bias of the articles on Slashdot.

Um, do you even read Slashdot? Point to one topic here that isn't covered in a biased manner.

Fair enough lets have bias both ways some stories bias one way some bias the other. If bias is constantly one way then something appears to be wrong.

You didn't need to dig very far to find out that China is in 3 days of mourning.

So if the government declares a day of mourning, I'm not allowed to laugh at a funny television show? That sounds completely unhealthy. I don't care what your culture is.

Maybe they are trying to encourage people to take an interest in their fellow human beaing around them. The general sentiment in many of these articles is that people doggedly believe that the government don't care about its people. My experiance of actually going there and seeing what they are trying to do is that they do care. They may not go about thing in the way that we would like, but they do it in their own way which works for them.

You guys appear intellegent but incapable of independent thought when it comes to China.

It seems that you really just don't get the cultural differences and you don't understand the inter-realtionship between responsibile reporting and control.

Ooh, this one's easy. Responsible reporting and control have nothing to do with each other. If it's controlled, it's propaganda, not reporting. Deal with it.

Responsible reporting and control have everthing to do with each other.

Take the UK headline "immigrants responsible for most crime in UK" responsible reporting probably not. Look at the situation in South africa where at the moment there is major civil discontent and violence targeted towards immigrants. Would you run the same headline there.

You would argue no one would do it the press would be responsible. You might say publish anything like this and I will proescute you for incitement. In saying that you have just controlled the press.

That is the connection between responsible reporting and control

The difference between their press and ours is that their controls are blunt, unsophiticated and indiscriminantly wielded. Ours are more subtil but there never the less, more of that later.

Control is not just about propoganda, it's also about trying limit damage and also civil unrest

The interesting thing is that you believe that this is not true in the west.

With respect to Propoganda. Do you believe the american press is free of government propoganda?

You flap about over freedom of the press, and yet appear to have no understanding of what that is or what it means.

Another easy one. It means the press can report whatever they like without fear of being prosecuted for it.

But we know that they can't say whatever they like without being prosecuted even in the west. They have to stick to certain rules.

China is made up of 56 different ethnics groups, 800 million of which are on less than $2 a day. You want to throw into that the irresponsible, almost unaccountable, sensationalist press we have in the West?

So what? The US started off with lots of poor farmers, too. I frankly don't see how this can have anything to do with freedom of the press. Do people get docked pay every time a reporter criticizes the government?

Poverty and lack of education combined with ethinic tensions have a lot to do with civic unrest. 800 million people stuggling to live. All you need is someone

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

Having a free press may not be ideal, but then nor is having a democracy. The problem is who makes the decisions. If we could find a suitable benevolent dictator to run the country it would be a lot fairer and more efficient. If we could find a suitable benevolent censor to control the press it would be a lot fairer and more accurate. Unfortunately such people don't seem to be very common, power corrupts and nobody would be able to agree on which dictator/censor would be the most benevolent. So we have democracy and a free press, which is the least-bad way we've come up with. Hear. If I could quote you on that. Basically in China they seem to have found a way to get acceptably benevolent dictators to the top (in the last 20 years at least). Nobody's perfect, and not everybody agrees with the leadership, but there are considerable difficulties if China were to be a democratic country (when a significant portion of the country is illiterate, do you really trust them to make the correct voting decisions?). So in the Chinese context, it is arguable that it's the least bad way they've come up with.

Sigh. People from the UK actually understands these stuff, instead of the Americans who sell democracy as a silver bullet. :-/

Confirmed

[ryry]

I live in Shanghai. All TV stations on my cable outlet have been replaced by broadcasts from either CCTV 1 (the main station) or CCTV 9 (for us English speakers). Everything on both stations is 24/7 earthquake coverage.

As far as I can tell the Internet is normal.

At 2:28 PM yesterday the entire country observed three minutes of silence for the victims.

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

Tell me that this guy is made of straw, or imaginary.

No one here is going to cease lodging criticisms against oppression just because a government is less oppressive one day than the day previously No, but at least acknowledge the fact.

Only to you it's about China To me, it's about getting the facts right, so that China could progress into a more open, free, and democratic country. To me, it's about criticizing China about the things that's worth criticizing, and not making up false accusations.

I'm here writing "large posts flaming" people because I'm fed up with people having NO FSCKING CLUE ABOUT CHINA trying to pour their own "great ideas" into the discussion, drowning any useful comments. I'm fed up with people totally missing the point when criticizing China, thus ignoring the real issues that hinders China from becoming an open and free country.

Yes, to me it's about China, it's about a free and democratic China. It's not going to happen today, nor tomorrow, but things are getting better, so until the progress stops, we can see that day. If course, if you're saying that's too slow, I'd invite you to change it today with your God-like powers of switching the country with the largest population into a democracy overnight, despite socio-economic problems like poverty and illiteracy. (Why's that a problem? imagine you could buy a vote from them for a dollar...)

Mod me down, I have karma to burn.

Confirmed again

[ryry]

http://shanghaiist.com/2008/05/19/online_implicat.php

Re:monitored is not free

[lobatt]

yes, he shares a room with me in jail. -__-

Re:monitored is not free

[Moridineas]

Don't get me wrong I'm not for censorship. I'm just for responsible journalism, because like it or not, there are some people who'd just believe in anything they're told. Yes, you're absolutely right--and this is why freedom of information is absolutely vital. Else crazy rumors and mass hysteria can run rampant. (see for instance the huge body of stories reporting growing conspiracy theories out of the quake zone in china--frogs disappearing, ponds draining, authorities knowing before hand, etc)

Re:monitored is not free

[Moridineas]

Basically, look around. There is some rational bashing, and then some totally ridiculous ones. That's what I want to know--in your opinion, what is the the "ridiculous" bashing?

I know you think that the majority of people on slashdot are unfairly "hating on" China, but I really would like to see what exactly you consider unfair?

Re:monitored is not free

[something_wicked_thi]

Dear god, man, learn to use the quote tag.

I'm not even going to try to fix that up. Instead, I'll just make a few points below.

First, we do have bias in all ways. You just need to read news from multiple sources to get it. You can't expect one source to be biased in multiple ways. Most sources who want something like that just try for unbiased.

You also seem to think that it's ok for the government to censor what its citizens can see because some people died. I don't care what their intentions are. That this is allowed means it can be abused.

Anyway, now on to the more important issue. Let me spell this out, because it seems you don't get it:

Responsibility is not control.

Let me say it even more clearly:

Responsibility cannot exist with control.

If I don't let you push a button, are you responsible for not pushing it? No. I am. If the press cannot report on certain things, it cannot be responsible. It is just subservient.

So if you want to argue further, please learn the terminology and start making sense.

Anyway, the rest of your post seems to be pretty meaningless. You don't address my points, so I won't address yours. You say I don't understand without providing proof when I give you logical arguments. Good day. Go find someone else's time to waste.

Re:monitored is not free

[sydneyfong]

I'll outline a few common themes.

- Communists are evil. China is ruled by communists. The Chinese government is evil. [despite these days they are anything but the "communists" you know]
- Chinese are brainwashed. If they support their government that's because they're brainwashed. So the opinions of the Chinese people don't matter. (The best one so far: Chinese don't really care about the victims of the quake, they're just brainwashed)
- China is not democratic, so they are bad. (despite that implementing democracy in China would be extremely difficult right now, it's not like places like Afghanistan, Iraq have very functional democracies huh?)
- China occupies Tibet, so it must be wanting to take over the world!
- Chinese government censors. OMFG WE SHOULD CALL THEM NAMES!! BASTARDS!! BABY KILLERS!! FSCK THEM ALL!!
- You Chinese should overthrow the communist government because we don't like them.

Re:monitored is not free

[BananaPeel]

First, we do have bias in all ways. You just need to read news from multiple sources to get it. You can't expect one source to be biased in multiple ways. Most sources who want something like that just try for unbiased. My post began about bias. I don't see why I should just accept continued bias in my media, just because thats the way its always been? Bias when it contiunally denegrates one race of people is just wrong.

A simple way to avoid bias is to try and put things into context, try and see things through another cultures eyes which is what the rest of my post was about.

You also seem to think that it's ok for the government to censor what its citizens can see because some people died.
I don't care what their intentions are. That this is allowed means it can be abused. Context: 40,000 people dead 3 days of mourning declared. The question is, in this instance, is it right to stop people watching entertainment going to clubs and bars watching game shows and generally participating in frivalous activitites and to make them take stock of what has happened?

Yes the process can be abused, But I find it interesting that you feel that this instance is an abuse of something that ultimately all goverment do do some degree.

Maybe when 9/11 happened they only got "we interupt this show to bring you a news flash" before returning viewers to their oblivion of watching "The Price is Right" 5 mins later and maybe some people were upset by the interuption to their entertainment viewing.

The Specific instances of "abuse" here is just a subset of omnipitant control. You quite rightly are rialing against the latter but you have chosen for your example a specific instance which, in one shape or form, is endemic of the more general kind of control that most civilisation exert over media.

Anyway, now on to the more important issue. Let me spell this out, because it seems you don't get it:

Responsibility is not control. Correct "responsibility is not control" Do you have a responsible press or one controlled by laws

You have laws for what you can and can't say and when you can say it. Laws are brought into effect by the government (Lible, Incitement, National Security, etc). The Government control the limits of what is said.... THEY DO NOT rely on responsibility because to differing degress (depending on the government) they believe people will abuse it. The Chinese case is just a particularly heavy handed version where they control the limits and the "word" of what is said.

The way that Governments intereact with media varies across a spectrum. In the west a significant investment is made in Spin and PR to direct the "word" of the press, in china they just slap the button.

Are we really in so much more control in the west, Main stream media is controlled by just a few individuals, editors have varing degrees of control, but are selected by the media's owners?

We were certainly sold a cock and bull story over Iraq which was carried to us by the mainstream media. Even the coverage of that war appears to be dominated by "embedded reporters". Control in that instance is exercised to "preserve moral".

Let me say it even more clearly:

Responsibility cannot exist with control. Are you suggesting that the "free press" can ignore the law. The "free press" has to stick to the rules it is given by Government.

If I don't let you push a button, are you responsible for not pushing it? No. I am. If the press cannot report on certain things, it cannot be responsible. It is just subservient. So the press in the West is subserviant to those who set the laws and those that own the media, believe me this is not trivial.

So if you want to argue further, please learn the terminology and start making sense. You want to warp up a very complicated subject in a few sentences, without taking into account all the side issues.

If this was so easy to deal with then please tell me why we don't have a "completely free" press in the West where everyone can just say exactly what they want without fear of procecution.