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A Home Lab/Shop For Kids?
sharp-bang writes "When I was growing up, my Dad let my brother and I have the run of his wood shop, and kept up a steady stream of Lego kits, Estes model rockets, chemistry sets, Heathkit projects, and other fun science stuff from the Edmund Scientific catalog, and the rest was history. I'd like to give my kids that kind of experience. If your kids were interested in science, computers, robots, and building stuff, how would you build and outfit a lab/shop for them (and you) to play in?"
diesel fuel, fertilizer, and a copy of 'the turner diaries'?
the united states is a nation of laws; badly written and randomly enforced -- frank zappa
Kit it out with stuff that you're passionate about. Only then can they get your passions...
http://scientificsonline.com/
Sorry I had to post as AC. The "Hardware" section apparently doesn't accept my login*.
There's also http://scitoys.com/
My favorite: http://amasci.com/
.
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*(It's slashdot's problem, not mine. I can log into other sections)
Depending on the ages in question, these are great toys:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capsela
They have little plastic spheres containing motors, reduction gears, worm gears, etc. You can build stuff from their designs, but it's even more fun just to build things of your own imagining.
You can't do that any more it is too dangerous!!!!
Undetectable Steganography? Yep, there's an app fo
Are you interested in adopting a 38 year old?
...Rob
The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
Legos absolutely for sure. The simplicity of the blocks and parts allows (forces?) you to think big picture. All of the others are great too, and you usually get into the details more. Legos.
Buy em anything. Anything except from that catalogue. The prices are rather horrid.
Me, I say give em a can of coke and some pop rocks.
Now that is entertainment for hours.
Follow it up with a bowl of rice crispies.
Each time they ask why these things do what they do... lie... lie a lot and change it each time.
"You should always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't come to yours." -- Yogi Berra
Not to put too fine a point on it, but there was a time where the majority of workers were involved in actually using these tools, and so it was normal to have an old set of them around the house. Nowadays, with globalization pushing most manual labor out of first world countries, high school kids who take metal shop are more likely to be familiar with manufacturing than their parents.
We live in the kind of world that Isaac Asimov and Philip K. Dick used to write about, where kids think meat comes "from the supermarket" cause they've never been on a farm and think cars are made by robots with no human hands involved.
Many young inventors are shocked to discover that you can't just design a part using CAD-CAM and email the design off to a factory in China to be mass produced.. that often even the most sophisticated computer controlled milling machine produces parts that you have to get out a file to finish.
How we know is more important than what we know.
Get them into remote control aircraft when they're old enough. It's not a cheap hobby, a few hundred dollars to get into it, but you get to learn about:
- Combustion engines
- Mixing fuel (some chemistry)
- Radio gear
- Flight dynamics
- Assembling and building, where care is needed to avoid major mistakes that would render the model unflyable
- Woodwork and metal work (and you'll aquire the tools for these if you don't already have them)
- The importance of measurement in the real world
- Importance of safety and developing good practice and procedure to make things safe
If you go with the above, make sure you join a club and practice on a simulator as it does take quite some time for most people to get the hang of controlling a plane and nothing will cause a child to lose interest quicker than a toy that takes a month to build and breaks (crashes) in under a minute. It's definitely harder than r/c cars which don't fall out of the sky if you slow down too much, aren't affected by the wind etc. (In fact petrol engine cars - not the $10 toys - are a simpler alternative with less of a learning curve BUT there isn't as much reward either).
Also when they're old enough, you could get them to build a dobsonian telescope. It's not particularly difficult, and you can choose to do it from components. Again you learn about woodwork and metal work, but also add optics and astronomy to the mix.
The point is that while the above are in a sense toys, in another they are not. You have to be rigid and disciplined because you are creating a real working piece of equipment where tolerances are important. Kids unfortunately grow up in a schooling environment today where they are taught whatever they do will be just fine. Great for the child's confidence, but the trouble is that's not how the real world works.
These hobbies aren't something they can't be left to do unsupervised - you'll actually have to learn yourself and help teach them. You might even end up doing classes together (telescope making), or taking tution together (learning to fly r/c). It does require that the child can follow direction, has some patience and doesn't just lose interest in a week. They also have to be interested in the end product or they won't want to do it.
The other thing that should be obvious to people here if you like the idea of building things together is to teach them to build a computer from scratch. That's actually a practical skill they can use whether or not they wind up in IT.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
I'd build it well away from the house, and constructed from reinforced concrete, and don't forget a good fire suppression system (the one you build for the kids won't need to be so robust).
Whatever you do, safety should be a prime concern I'm sure. You probably don't want some heathkit burning down your house cause it was wired incorrectly. Use GFI plugs - LOTS of em, make sure the electrical is all properly grounded, have fire extinguishers handy, first aid kit, a phone to call 911 from, and maybe a halon for when they misbehave...
Somewhere on this globe, every ten seconds, there is a woman giving birth to a child. She must be found and stopped. -- Sam Levenson
"They" had shop class when I was a kid. We built
electric motors, crystal radios, and all sorts of
things. We learned safety rules, and how to use
machines that cut and shaped wood and metal. We
learned how to read drawings, and follow instructions. When you know the basics, you do
whatever you want to do with any "kit" thrown
at you.
What can your kids do with raw materials?
Can they fabricate something from sheet, rod,
tube?
Can YOU?
Sounds like your Daddy had more money than time
to spend with you.
What are the basics of thinking for yourself?
What are the basics of problem solving?
Ask yourself: Should *I* have had children?
No, really!
...a computer running Linux to experiment on.
-Nemo me impune lacessit-
Young boys(and, okay, maybe some young girls) like to burn stuff.
It all starts with the magnifying glass and the ants, then it moves on to dousing G.I. Joes in lawnmower gasoline. Later, when they get older, firecrackers come into the mix.
Lord help you if you hand-load your own ammo: gunpowder(a mix of fast-and-slow burning ^_^ ) and primers, with some match-heads all poured into a metal can creates a louder and much more exciting(read: dangerous) projectile than an Estes rocket. Speaking of Estes rockets, screw the rocket and put just the engine on the pole.
Oh crap, I'm guilty of terrorism for posting that. Who's that knocking at my door?
I would: let them have the run of his wood shop, and kept up a steady stream of Lego kits, Estes model rockets, chemistry sets, Heathkit projects, and other fun science stuff from the Edmund Scientific catalog
I would reserve a place in the basement (assuming it's dry) or attic and build a configuration of work benches along the wall. If the walls are unfinished, I'd put up drywall to make it more homey, and make sure it's well lit and maybe buy one of those magnifying glasses with the light. Place power outlets on the back edge or nearby so you could have a computer lab section, a model building section, and an art section. Whichever you're into. If you have a computer lab, I might consider not hooking it up to the net so your kid won't be surfing YouTube or IMing friends on chat all day. You could also get into model train building or more artistic stuff. Buy some metal shelving to store the project kits and supplies.
Try to add some design elements to the area by painting with colors or maybe a mural. You could paint the mural with your kids for more fun. You can add wall hangings, tapestries, medieval collectables, gel lamps, electronic knick knacks, and mood lighting to make it cool. Buy a nice radio and speakers so you can have music playing, but keep the TV and Wii/Xbox out of that room.
I would also consider putting in a sofa and nice cushy chairs so you can have a reading section. Place that near a window to let the light in.
Camping on quad since 1996.
As the coach of a FIRST FTC (FIRST Tech Challenge - for high school kids) team I can say that FIRST is a FANTASTIC way to help your kids "Geek Out". As for building out a lab, that's the beauty of FTC. You don't need the big equipment (or money) that you do for FRC. Just some hand tools, maybe a drill and some room to design, build program and test. A large room, 15x15 is more than enough. For the 2008-2009 season FIRST is going to a new kit. Total expected cost should be about $1k.
For younger kids FIRST Lego robotics is the way to go.
Either way it's great to see the kids get involved, geek out in a social way and have lots of fun.
I highly recommend it.
r
Building a LAB for the kids to learn in is a nice idea but "what does the child really like"?
If you build a LAB based on what you" like, or what you think the child should like" a situation could arise were the child feels they are being forced and they rebel. So ask them "what do you enjoy doing" and use that as a guide so both you and the child feel as though you are getting something out of the experience. Good example, I liked electric motors, so my parents bought me a lego electric train set and lots of other things with motors in kits.
interesting new book about home science labs"
american science and surplus near Chicago- I would highly recommend a visit to the real store, if you are nearby.
Creationists are a lot like zombies. Slow, but powerful and numerous. And they all want to eat our brains.
breadboards, chucks of wires, gears, any old bits of junk and spend time *together* deciding what improbable circuit on the internet you will build
If anything this will teach them that just 'cause its in "print" in aint 100%...
At best it might just get them modifying other peoples circuits changing bits of code etc...
Make sure they know how to use the basic tools... (basics include soldering iron, dremel, exactoknife, glue, drill) Make sure they know how to improvise with what tools they have (witness me stripping wire with teeth or exacto-knife)
/. ... Though the two guys like me that come to mind also have the same first name x_x
The type I think you're thinking of is me. And It seems to be rare outside of
As for furnishings? Maybe that's something the kid will know themselves. I'm 20, and it's really only in the past few years that I've started salvaging stuff from broken stuff (saving that stuff from being thrown out, of course) and building cool stuff...
So *give your kid the broken stuff in the basement for his birthday*... cd player/radio boombox, VCR, electric blender, broken plastic containers for raw material...
Gever Tulley: 5 dangerous things you should let your kids do
Stop asking the unwashed masses
Thank you kdawson for all those links. I didn't even know most of those companies were even in business today. And seriously - I loved every single one of those when I was a kid.
I've bookmarked them all for my son for when he's ready. Can't wait to launch rockets, or look at stuff under microscopes, or look at the moon with a telescope with him.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Check out the NXT Step blog. Definitely the best tinkering toy ever created, all kinds of crazy stuff you can do. Full disclosure, my mom is one of the contributors there. She went from reading the blog to help her husband help their son, as she had time on her hands, to designing robots and even writing her own book. (It is very surreal to see your mother with no engineering education or experience get published by O'Reilly for a book on building robots...awesome, but surreal, I'd be proud of her if I had anything to do with it!)
Robots and mechanical engineering aren't really my thing, but my best friend's kid is going to to be getting a lot of Lego this Christmas.
You should probably mention that the initial investment can reach the 1000 bucks easily. Unless you want some equipment that gives you more troubles than fun.
:)
Don't get me wrong, I like RC planes and it's a great hobby, my dad's the prez of the local club and we spend a good deal of my (and his) spare time there together. It's basically the only thing we have in common (him being a die hard conservative non-technical bureaucrat, me being a liberal computer geek... there ain't much we agree on but model planes), but be aware that it can be very quickly very expensive and time consuming. Not to mention that I wouldn't recommend it as a hobby for children under 12. It can be quite some time until you can handle a plane that is really "fun" to fly, the trainer planes certainly ain't much fun.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
This is a fundamental flaw in today's science fields. I see it time and time again. People become so caught up in the "high" tech. Never bothering to learn the roots of it.. don't get them a lab. Don't get them a kit. Get them a damn book. Then get some resistors, IC's, diodes, ETC. Let them learn eletronics that way. Chemistry?? Same approach. Let them learn how to do everything, I gaurentee that the kid who knows the roots of everything will forever be better then the guy can write the Java code for a robot.
So basically, -1 troll/offtopic is really slashdots way of saying "I hate that you thought of something before me."
Legos, model rockets, heathkits, and chemistry sets were all big influences (and my son and I STILL launch model rockets).
A good low-cost way to develop mechanical skills and encourage curiosity about how things work is a basic set of hand tools and a pile of discarded appliances/electronics. Let the kids tear them apart, and maybe even find out what failed. If you are lucky enough to get hold of older electronics (before VLSI/ASICs took over), you can even scrounge enough useful parts to build your own circuits.
I trashpicked TV's for years as a kid, and eventually taught myself enough about electronics to fix and resell most of them, earning enough money to buy my first real set of electronic test gear (mostly Heathkits),and land a summer job as a bench tech at a local TV repair shop while most of my peers were flipping burgers or delivering pizzas.
Remember "News for Nerds, Stuff that Matters"? Help make it a reality again! http://soylentnews.org
Fischertechnik kicks butt on all other kinds of building sets. Engineering professors use it at universities to built robot prototypes. Until you actually get your hands on some Fischertechnik kits and start building things, you won't appreciate the difference... but it is a huge difference.
Instills real world skills such as meaningless grinding for material possessions which depreciate immediately after acquiring them while jockeying for position through brown nosing. Also carries a limited guarantee to dull any creative urges or excess socialization!
Computers are central to our future, the next generation should view programming skills as like the ability to use a screwdriver or drill. Sites like MySpace are already establishing basic (mis)understanding of HTML and JavaScript across non-programmer types.
I have always thought that Lego was the best toy for children. The Lego Mindstorms kit includes USB and Bluetooth capabilities, amongst a hell of a lot of other cool stuff.
I think it would be a great thing for a young kid to have. That and a fabricator.
"There is nothing nice about Steve Jobs and nothing evil about Bill Gates." - Chuck Peddle
I have a bunch of my old 150 in 1 and 300 in 1 kits (have to get my kids a bit more interested)
I also have a bunch of prototype boards, OScopes etc
That and a Full sized lathe and Mill. We will be doing a "rebuild my 8" Dobsonian scope into a truss tube dob" this summer (probably)
-- 73 de KG2V For the Children - RKBA! "You are what you do when it counts" - the Masso
I doubt you can even buy the same science kits anymore.
My brother and I had hours of fun doing all sorts of "science", but it usually ended it burning or blowing up something.We probably took years off our lives hacking out great clouds of purple smoke from god knows what... but it usually involved sulpher and potasium chloride, and magnesium (gotta let the retinas get some fun too - no use ruining just your lungs.)
We did eventually develop an appreciation for goggles, ventilation and gloves.
Back then, the cops would just say "don't launch rockets in your yard anymore" and that was it.
I also remember carrying .22 rifles thru suburban San Diego, on the way to a gravel pit for plinking. Only once were we stopped by a sheriff, who admonished us to make sure those weapons were unloaded and to go home.
This was all just a couple of years before Brenda Spencer of "I Don't Like Mondays" fame. Talk about ruining it for the rest of us.
I think we even had some Jarts.
If we did that now, we'd be surrounded by SWAT and branded terrorists. Same stuff, different perceptions.
Oh yeah, Get off my lawn!
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
They were both dead by the time I was three in 1949, but between them they left a few boxes of electronics parts, a Hallicrafters shortwave receiver and a nice pair of WW2 headphones. My dad was a radio operator in the Air Corps who opened a radio repair shop after the war, but passed away from cancer almost before getting it started. My grandfather was a tinkerer in his spare time with a variety of interests.
By the time I was ten, I was listening to the shortwave radio and learning about ham radio by reading about it. The librarian noticed that I was checking out books about radio and introduced me to her brother, who was a ham. I passed my first FCC test the next year and have now been a ham 50 years. Because of this early influence, I also pursued an electrical engineering career that has been very good to me.
My point is that it only takes a nudge to see where interests lie. I was very lucky that my family went with the flow and encouraged me. The times are different now, but the principle applies.
"Do the Right Thing. It will gratify some people and astound the rest." - Mark Twain
Get a subscription to Make magazine. Also, check out some of their kits. http://www.makershed.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=20
Calvin: "Why does the sun rise in the east and set in the west?"
Calvin's dad: "Solar wind."
Calvin's mom: "Dear!"
Vex kits are expensive, but will teach your kids about everything. A cheaper option is just going to radio shack and buying a bit of everything (breadboard, LED, resistor kit, some wire). I'm at IGVC (Intelligent Ground Vehicle Competition) and well that's what everyones robot mostly is anyway.
Seconding lego mindstorms, and get your kids into lego league-it's a great, fun experience for younger kids and a nice intro to robotics. I'd especially push that if you've got girls-get them into it early and get them comfortable around boys and a machine shop or they'll end up stuck with the pr and painting (maybe software if they're good) jobs even if they get into robotics.
Also, have them build their own box to run computer code-lego and microsoft are options to explore, pyro if you're dead set on FOSS. Once they've built it, they'll have a lot of fun testing it, plus they learn a lot of coding fundamentals.
open source modern art: laser taggi
Yep, sounds a lot like my childhood!
:P
Need not dive in to the expensive airplanes right away... I built a rubber-band powered, balsa wood and tissue paper Spitfire (~$20 + ~$40 of basic wood tools, baseboards, and paints) and then a 2 channel R/C glider (~$60 + ~$100 for the radio) as practice for the 4 channel gas powered trainer (~$100 kit, ~$100 engine, and shared the same radio as the glider). It was very educational, gave me a lot of time to work on my woodworking skills, and was quite motivational and therapeutic (I'd often start working on them in the mornings before school, so the glue could set during the day, and it was quite relaxing to spend time sanding and filing late into the evening).
Actually spent much more time working on the cheap rubber band airplane, since it used more old-fashioned but cheaper construction methods.
I eventually made it through an aerospace program at an ivy league school. My grades were quite threatened by my side hobby of playing with computers. The irony is that my entire professional career has revolved around doing reasonably fun stuff with Linux & Windows on pretty nice computer hardware, and I pretty much only get to play with aviation things for fun on the side. As a minor consolation, at least I'm doing computer stuff for an aerospace company.
I too grew up with a workshop that had a bit of everything...from wood working to electrical, plumbing and metal working. The most important aspect of how the workshop dynamic influenced the person I've become is how it related to my daily life. Whatever I was doing in the workshop had a direct impact my life outside the workshop (and quite often vice versa). Kits are great, so are silly projects that have little utility other than the fun of dreaming it up and playing in the shop.... its all about the process and what you can learn that you then take elsewhere. -mahalo
I agree that it can get very expensive very quickly.
I don't agree that a trainer certainly isn't much fun to fly. I had a Worldstar 40 ARF. Large plane, very stable. Been in the hobby for a couple of years and only just recently crashed it for the first time - unfortunately a total loss of the airframe. (Crashed doing inverted spins, almost recovered but stalled coming out and fell right back into a spin). I was definitely pushing the limits with that plane, but basic IMAC was certainly doable, and it was a lot of fun to fly. I've been busy building planes since (I got given the Worldstar second hand by my wife's family who've been into it for years. I had to learn to build after learning to fly).
I loved that Worldstar, even though in some ways I'd outgrown it. I'm in the middle of building another one anyway. The one I had was modified with better control rods so working out how to do that properly has slowed me down a bit since I refuse to put in balsa rods. I've completed 3 other ARF aircraft in the meantime.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
Too bad there's not a sort of MMO that lets people do this kind of stuff. It could be pretty fun.
Other things to note are that:
- Because it's expensive, the time and money are both spread out over time
- As another poster noted, no need to start with R/C. Rubber band power and gliders are a gentler, cheaper entry into the hobby.
Still some parents will spend that $1000 on toys without giving it a thought.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
Thats exactly what we are trying to do for the local community at http://www.thegeekgroup.org/ Give kids and anyone else the access to tools parts and space to tinker, build and test whatever they want. All for free, sponsored by donations and generous businesses, and our in house computer repair shop, http://www.appliedintel.net/
You might want to try them out on the Arduino (http://www.arduino.cc/), an open source hardware platform, it comes with things like light sensors, LEDs and potentiometers.
It's quick and easy to get started, the components are cheap and loads of fun to tinker with.
I recommend vexrobotics. It's a mix of programming, control systems, building, designing, radio control, etc in a package that's easy to learn but yet very slick. With vexrobotics, you can do just about anything.
http://RepRap.org
Mindstorms or if your kid's a bit older, try arduino and a soldering iron. There's lots of examples and lot's neat-o things they can do with either.
Get this book. It comes with a pre-filled order form for a complete chemistry lab kit and it has dozen of experiments. So it's basically a chemistry kit manual.
http://www.amazon.com/Illustrated-Guide-Home-Chemistry-Experiments/
And remember, a good experiment is an experiment that leaves a crater. A great experiment is an experiment that leaves a crater from which you can walk away.
Fantasy: http://ferrisfantasy.blogspot.com/
HOW IS THAT ?
Read radical news here
... on how old they are and what they are interested in.
Something like this?
Have gnu, will travel.
Your basics are as follows:
- Wood shop
- Metal Shop
- Chem Lab
- Computer / Electronics / Sound Lab
- Paint room
- Engine shop
- Materials Testing Lab
First the wood Shop. I would start by getting basic stationary tools: Table Saw, Compound Miter saw, Band Saw, Drill Press, Router table, Router, Lathe, Air Compressor / Air tools.
Next, I would make sure you have the basic hand held power tools: Cordless Drill, reciprocating saw, Circular saw, Grinder, Sander(s), Rotary tool
And don't forget the hand tools: Hammers, Wrenches, Screw drivers, Sockets and hand saws. Other tools are a bonus, but this collection (along with the appropriate bits) will let you do just about anything with wood.
Metal Shop is a little harder. While much of this is very pricey to buy, they can be built fairly reasonably. Make sure you have good ventilation here. Stick welder, MIG/TIG welder, Hand Held Grinder, Metal Lathe, CNC machine, CNC plasma table, Pipe Benders and Threading kits are a good start.
Chem Lab isn't my area, but I am sure others will fill this one in for you.
Computer / Electronics / Sound Lab. If you are on this site, you should have this one covered, but make sure you have a production server that is off limits for playing, as well as one or more test servers for mucking about with. Some of the more commonly overlooked items include the Oscilloscope, Signal Generator, and a big work surface for your collections of robotics toys (Lego, etc)
Paint room. Fairly easy, but have good ventilation in here. Air sprayers, paint brushes, various paints, etc.
Engine shop. Again, not my area, but a powerful resource for kids to have.
Materials Testing Lab. Electronic Load Sensor, Stress Tester, Wind tunnel, various sensors (wind, temp, humidity, etc)
Hope this helps.
Here's a page from the author's "Journal" (he doesn't all it a "blog")
He's also working on a "Home Forensics Lab" book.
I highly recommend a VEX kit. http://www.vexrobotics.com/ The starter kit doesn't require machining, just bending metal and cutting it with some good scissors. With it they can also learn to program. With the different wheels you can teach them about friction etc. I love the kit and it taught me how to program. If you don't want to program get the EasyC add on and you will be able to use pictures to program your robot and with the provided instructions it will be VERY easy. AND if you want you can even enter VEX competitions and stuff all for under a few hundred dollars and come away with even MORE VEX goodies as they hand out kits and stuff as prizes. You can do anything with VEX with very little knowledge and in the end you will think in a different manner and it teaches you a new way of solving problems. Have your kids try to move a soda can one day, and then purchase some bigger motors and have your kids try to mechanize your lawn mower for even more fun. (I'm doing this right now.) Also if you have any problems the Innovation First Inc. (IFI) staff is great. I have had problems and IFI helped me out. Their forums are top notch and their service is very hard to beat! Try it out, your kids will LOVE it. -Junx
One day the world of robotics will have the answer.
Estes model rockets are hard to find now, especially with all that anti-terrorism regulation.
Chemistry sets are equally hard to find, with all the regulation and EPA control.
HAM radio, well, that's an option, but the license does have some age restrictions.
Same with anything involving solder, etc.
Why not setup a simple computer and have them learn some java?
It's free, and java is a perfect learning lanaguage. They don't have to learn any of the complex C stuff, and can still code neat little applets.
Or better yet, the LEGO kits include a microcontroller, programmable in a simple point and click language.
In addition to erector sets and Heathkit labs and other such that I enjoyed as a kid, one of the things I loved to do was to take apart the store-bought toys, see how they work, and then reassemble them. My dad exploited this by bringing home surplus electronics, printers, fax & copy machines and all kinds of gizmo's rescued from the dumpster at work that I could disassemble.
Turns out that sort of industrial waste is a gold mine of miscellaneous sensors, servo's, motors, gear sets, mirrors, lenses, lasers, actuators, relays, electronic components, shafts, beams, frames - a lot of the stuff that is still useful to me as a well-organized collection of robotics resources. And they were all fun to take apart!
That if your kids have an "unhealthy" interest in science, computers, robots, and building stuff, you should turn them in to the authorities for reeducation. Knowledge is a dangerous thing, and its acquisition should be discouraged without proper supervision by a DHS officer and a priest.
What?
Gotta put in a plug for Make magazine, which is a fun read, and full of good projects that anyone can do.
I teach an undergrad course in computer organization (basically beginner architecture), and I've gotten lots of ideas from Lady Ada and Evil Mad Scientist. We use AVR microcontrollers, and the cheap-o USB programmers from Lady Ada, to do a bunch of fun and easy projects.
My kids are 8 and 5, and are playing around a lot with LEDs and magnets. I probably won't let them solder until they're teen-agers (lead in solder sucks, but solder without lead also sucks), but they are getting to breadboard some stuff.
And of course, mentos and coke is always a good idea.
The owner of the TinkerSchool site - http://www.tinkeringschool.com/blog/ spoke at the last Maker Faire http://www.makerfaire.com/ this year in San Mateo(something you should look into attending with your kids, theres also another one in October in Texas)
Anyway, he did a talk on "Make Your Own School" which was about his tinkering school he runs for kids, as well as "the Five Dangerous Things You Should Have Your Kids Do" Both were very informative and common sense. Write him and see if he has any publications you can read.
On his site he had a link to his five dangerous things talk at ted: http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/202
"Enjoy what you're doing! If it becomes drudgery, you're doing it wrong!" - Jim Butterfield
and once you are bored of just taking thinks apart, perhaps you try to reassemble said thing, and perhaps even fix it!
Of course, I got into some trouble when I was young doing exactly this, and as a previous poster stated, a great deal of what then was considered harmless childhood experimentation would get you (or your "irresponsible" folks) thrown in jail today.
Hey, if you do decide to have kids, teach them a whole lot about rocketry and self-sufficient life support systems so they can help get you to a place where the "adults" aren't so concerned about security and safety of said kids. Since childhood, my Never-Never Land's vector is 90 degrees to the tangent of the circumference of the earth, straight up.
sig sig sig siggy sig
What he or she reads is just as important. For younger kids - The Book of Knowledge (if you can find it) has many "how to" articles. For older kids -a subscription to the Scientific American - Yes, it's high level - but a 9th grader can read at least some of it, and the ideas - the Amateur Scientist section of the 70's and 80's - led me to my present (scientific) career.
Heh, I was going to post this exact thing. Balsa wood, glue, tissue paper, and Bernouilli's Theorem will go a long way and probably won't land you on a government list. As for reminiscing about activities that *will* get you on a list, I used my "learn about electronics" kit to make hydrogen and then set it on fire. I also used to power it with a voltage convertor I salvaged from an alarm clock in lieu of batteries ...
We all want to guide our kids and provide as many tools as necessary but to be honest..
If your kids are not interested in any of this stuff, they will get nothing out of it and you will get frustrated.
I played with Legos, those small electronic kits with the spring terminals, went to HAMFESTs, build stuff with the 555 timer chip, built cabins in the woods, and used to tear apart my bike and put it back together because I wanted too, not because my parents wanted me too.
My parents owned an electronics business and my dad was a jack of all trades and I spent a lot of time with him so maybe I naturally found interest in that stuff as well. Along that theory, my son likes to work on cars and computers as well so maybe kids typically enjoy doing what their parents do but I'm sure there are just as many that actively refuse to do what they parents are interested in as well. If they like hangin' with you, they will probably like doing stuff that you like to do and maybe even when they get to the teenage years.
There was one guy selling the same science kits that were available in the 1960's, but he was raided by the AFT's SAWT team. It seems that pure elements are a problem to the federal government.
The torrents are full of interesting and currently illegal bits of chemistry.
If you can not walk out the back door and shoot a squirrel, you can not grow up free. Living on 40 acres in the country will not hurt, as you need to get away from evil neighbors and home owners associations.
Andy
get on the mailing list for http://www.sciplus.com/
It's a science surplus store, lotsa fun stuff for kids and big kids. I found it while riding a bike in Milwaukee when I was bored because my boyfriend wouldn't stop playing World of Elfquest or whatever it was. Decent anime shop next door.
Seriously, what could be a more practical lab than the kitchen?
They have two XOs between the three of them, and I have a pile of Thinkpads of various types, with Knoppix and other distros, that they can use. They also can talk to the Mindstorms through my wife's OS X box.
#!
My wife does DNA research, and I'm a programmer. (Why else would I be posting on slash-dot!!)
To teach programming to a pre-teen, or young teenager try:
http://www.alice.org
For biology, they have kits now where you can extract DNA from a potato. I forgot the web-site but you can Google:
ScienceWiz - DNA Wizard.
I'm thinking that by the time my kids are adults all the jobs will be in bio-tech anyway, to I'd get them into studying biology and DNA.
Wasn't there a slashdot story on this roughly about 8 months ago. Buy the tyke a dupe-detection kit.
Table-ized A.I.
Damnit, thanks for reminding me of my father's failure as a dad!
Since he started moving around so much for his work we've never finished the model airplane we started ~6 years ago. I've got the equipment and materials we bought in my closet... I just don't have a workshop to build in or the expertise my father has with wood and metal things.
follow your own genuine interests... use your kids as an excuse to buy the latest mindstorm kit, model helicopter, hydrogen fuel cel remote control car etc...
There is so much concern for "safety" these days, you can't get much in kit form that is really interesting for a kid--certainly not the exciting sets we remember. The Chemistry sets only have kitchen products in them and don't make interesting smells, the Electronics kits don't do much of anything useful, and the Biology kits can't be wet or moving.
On the other hand, there are some really nice gadgets which you might consider, like the microscope you can hook to your TV, a planetarium, excellent telescopes, and the like.
There are also some very nice robotics items and even online stores that specialize in them.
I commend you on your desire to share your delight with the next generation.
LSD-25, a ruger 10-22 with a 30 round banana clip, model rocket ni-chrome wire, a 12 volt battery, and the day after a run to chinatown on Chinese New Years with a fistful of twenties in a slowly cruising car, looking for people wanting to sell gunpowder based ordinance, bandaids, lots of baindaids and bandages, bicycle inner tubes, a sharp knife, trees with forks in the trunks about head high overlooking a concentration of worthy adversaries, and did I mention LSD-25?, an electronic pick lock, duct tape, lots of duct tape, and metallic camping matches, the kind that light dozens of times soaking wet, a vise, a hammer, a wrench set, and a solid core door on two old sawhorses.
I'd like to see a series of videos on youtube that shows how to build electrical technology from scratch up to the level of what Tesla had. (Or up to the level of radio.) Suppose you were living in a primitive hunter/gatherer society. How would you develop basic technology? How do you make metal tools and weapons? How do you farm? How do you make soap? How do you make houses and buildings? What useful mechanical devices should you make, and how do you make them? How do you make rope? Candles? Where in the wild do you find your materials? I don't know, but I would love to see these things explained systematically.
In Europe there are some great bench-top and hand-held tools available from Proxxon. In North America Sherline tools are a little more expensive. Alternatives include: MicroMark and Mini-Mate tools (the Mini-Mate is especially designed for hobbyists and older kids. We've got one.
Depending on age this might be a bit advanced. At a young age ( under 10 years old ) kids need to have shorter timelines for completion/reward than a stick-built RC flyer. My earliest tinkers were paper airplanes. Find a good book on paper airplane construction -- cheap and easy, and lets kids learn about the basics of control surfaces, center of lift/center of gravity, etc. Then move on to toy-level rubber powered planes which are cheap, but require some knowledge of trim, etc., and often need to be repaired. Oddball things like mousetrap cars are fun and can be built in an afternoon. Back in the mid 80s Lego made some fantastic kits under the series name "Expert Builder". They had gears and mocked-up piston engines and such. Can't seem to find them today, I'm not sure there's an analogous complexity-level kit today ( Lego seems either pure toy or highly complex these days, less middle-ground ). The only mistake my dad made was giving me stuff that was over my head (wacky german kit-thing called Logix-Cosmos). Sometimes it made it seem more like work. Ultimately, if your kids see you engrossed in something, it will drive their curiosity. So in some ways pick a project that they would be able to handle, start doing it in their view, and if they join, be very happy.
If you can find an em (electo-mechanical) pinball machine (1930-1978) that would be an interesting project (try to find one that ran on 24 volts AC instead of +50 volts for saftey issues).
Fun with relays and switches and if it was broken and you getting it running, a new toy to boot.
I was given the following real tools when I was three (the alternative being a stupid plastic toy hammer that most kids get):
* Pointy nose pliers (small enough for kids hands)
* Very light-weight metal hammer (functional, but light)
* Phillips and flat screwdrivers
As I got older I was then given a regular stream of broken appliances (toasters, irons, etc) that I was told I was allowed to pull apart so long as I didn't use the hammer to break them (to encourage discovery of the function of the object, and to prevent just smashing it as a small child might be tempted to do).
I highly recommend teaching your kid safety first. Cooking chemistry is fun, and teaches you the basic principles of chemistry. 1. Being safe around hot stuff. 2. The importance of measuring (volume, weight, time) accurately.
Other than that, give your kid some space to take stuff apart and don't micro-manage his life. And give them something that will keep them active and exercising outside also. And give them lots of books and a subscription to Popular Science.
Cool! Amazing Toys.
I have a 16-month-old, and if (God forbid) he turns out to be a geek, I'll have to deal with the same issue.
I grew up in a small town, and my father's shed had all the tools and space I needed. I remember ordering a 50 lb bag of potassium nitrate over the phone from a farm supply outfit, and when they asked "What do you need this for?", I joked with them "You don't want to know." I was grinding model rocket fuel in my bedroom.
The big difference today is the Internet. Nobody was around to teach me the fundamentals back then, and nobody shared my interests. I'd like to think that with an Internet connection, I would have spent less time fumbling around alone in the dark. My son may not get all the space or tools or explosives, but he'll definitely get answers to his questions.
Start with some rather basic & less expensive stuff. (Simple microscope and blank slides, maybe a circuit board kit or two, Lego Technics kit or two, etc.) If the kids prove trustworthy and can actually take care of what they have without breaking it, then start getting them some cooler toys/equipment. Might not hurt to actually ask them and find things that might be more geared towards their interests.
Not much point in getting kids decent stuff if they don't have the responsibility not to ruin things or not hurt themselves or others. Also not much point in having too sophisticated items in a home lab if it's too much above their level. Likewise you don't want something too simple, because kids quickly loose interest in "baby" stuff. You have to have some good judgement there.
Sure puts a nice warmth on those music files (flac) off the computer....
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Lego Mindstorms are basically the ultimate kid-science-lab-toy. They even grow with the kid...simple programs & cars to build...and later, sky's the limit on what you can do!
http://scitoys.com/
This web site is full of cool stuff you can build. Available in dead-trees versions if you prefer. Seriously, check this out; this site makes me want to start building things.
Example: build a home-made radio. He starts with a trivial radio with only two parts, then adds another part to improve it, then improves it again... eventually he has you rolling your own capacitors! Each step illustrates something cool. By the end you are building a crystal radio like the ones soldiers used to build during World War I.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I'd recommend Ground Fault Interruptors as I enjoyed experimenting with 110v AC and .... HOT DOGS!
...0-30 in 15', muy dangeroso.
We used to stick nails in the ends and plug-em-in; also did this with capacitors(POP), resistors(smoke).
No GFI's in those days and we were lucky to have survived it all.
Just have good basic tool set.
I got old Ship's Radios(tubes) through a parental friend(captain) and cleaned them up and listened to shortwave from Ecuador and many other places...opened the world to me...now I love to travel.
Get 'em stuff to tear apart for gears, wheels, belts.
Rockets...one of our 3' Estes rockets launched just as the county sherrif's helicopter passed over our rural home and we missed him by about 75 feet; I still don't know why he let it slide; completely unintentional by the way. Today we'd be in Guantanamo!
Lots of motors and wheels are good. We had washing machine motor with very long extension cord on gocart with wild pulleys and one plugged it in
Rolled my neighbors little brother down the hill in a clothes dryer drum; they lived on Xmas tree farm so he bumped over young trees all the way down and was only stopped from deadly plunge into Redwoods by a barbed wire fence. Skip the human experiments kids!
I'd have the shop UN-attached to the house for fire safety reasons.
Fire extinguishers!
You can purchase (and sometimes download) paper models of various different planes. Just print, cut, and glue. A very inexpensive way to get introduced to building. If a child shows enough interest then they will likely be able to handle building one out of balsa. Only after all of this should you get the radio gear and a motor.
Remember that it is the building that is important to a child. ARFs are just expensive toys and should be avoided.
Most of the paper models appear to be from eastern Europe - not so popular in the western countries. Oh well, the following link is one example distributer of such models (just found it on Google - I can not vouch for them.)
http://www.e-papermodels.com/
Willy
Step 1: Foster curiosity from age 1 month. Really work at it. Remember a dog on a lead can't be pushed and if you pull it it will get resentful. Some people find they need to develop patience and put up with small disapointments in order to get this right.
Step 2: Reward study because if you don't you'll end up with a child with the attention span of a gnat.
Step 3: Expose to lots of different stimulii. This is a 'horse to water' situation. With any luck they'll be drinking at the well of science, splashing in the brook of adventurous exercise and swimming in the stream of dealing with life.
You start with a concrete floor, impact-proof walls and a "No Housekeeping Allowed" sign. My buddy couldn't get something like this to work until he had flat-out banned his wife from the garage.
In order to do that, he had to pretty much cede control of every room in the house. That included the rec room, where suddenly the bar had to be spotless, lest a (female) guest lay fault-finding eyes upon water rings and make sniffy comments.
He and his sons own the garage, and it is nerd heaven.
I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
It's a bit of shameless self-promotion, but what about an Open Source 3D fabricator? Google for RepRap. They get to put it together themselves (non-profit kits from rrrf.org), learn about electronics and programming, and then get to make cool stuff with it for pennies.
:v)
What's more, they can use it to print the parts for later models, and to give sets of parts to their friends who can then join in the fun by building their own RepRaps.
Vik
I just don't have a workshop to build in or the expertise my father has with wood and metal things.
Best thing you could do is join a club and get some help that way. Other than that you just have to suck it up and try your best. For a work bench, I use a fold out table in the garage. Far from ideal but good enough. I have to pack it away when we want to put my wife's car away *lol*. Fortunately for me she has a crap car, so parking it outside isn't traumatic. (She gets the next decent one, but she doesn't feel like car shopping till after she gives birth). I have to say I have a very understanding wife, but even she complains about how much time I spend with the planes, and really after being out of the house 60 hrs a week for work, I don't get that much time with them (and still spend time with her).
I've put together my 3rd ARF now, and am quite confident now, though I don't enjoy the building side of the hobby. I prefer flying the damn things.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
Well I haven't seen a 4 year old build a heli but I have seen one fly one in jaw dropping style that puts adults to shame:
http://www.justinchi.com/
Download one of the videos.
http://www.justinchi.com/page3.html
Okay so he's one of those child prodigy types complete with the asian stereo type of being pushed by his parents. I've seen him flying on the sim at 3 years old and being told it was a lousy flight when he crashed. I wouldn't do that to my child. Still it proves he's capable (even though I'd question the safety - I'd have him on a buddy lead even if the buddy never took over, but I guess that wouldn't sell the way a kid doing it on his own does). At 12 or 14 if you can have them using a power tool supervised, I'd argue you could have them on a buddy lead flying a plane or heli.
I'm about to become a father in just under 2 months. I plan on having the kid on the sim by age 2 or 3 if I can get him interested. (I won't be putting him down if he crashes).
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
"My wife's actually pretty cool"
They usually all are when we're dating them, but here's the order of things:
1) You have kid(s). The wife is a lot less cool at that point. And the point of bitterness will be that she insists nothing will change once you have kids. It always does, and tremendously. There will start bitterness and resentment towards each other that will last decades.
2) She goes through menopause. She will get completely crazy, and if you argue with her, she'll get pissed off, and if you don't argue with her she'll get pissed off.
3) Then she's less interested in sex (basic biology), which will piss you off tremendously, since you won't be less interested in sex (basic biology). An irony here is that she gets pissed off if you want sex, and gets more pissed off if you ask her if she minds if you get a little something on the side to take the pressure off her.
4) There is a lesson every married man can tell you (married more than 20 years), that every single guy rejects because "...no my wife is really cool...". Which makes the married guy laugh because he was standing in your shoes, the same exact shoes, 25 years ago.
Mouser and Digikey for electronics parts
They can probably find their own projects from blogs, instructables, etc.
Here in Switzerland, kids in high school synthesize as part of the standard chemistry lab. In high school, even when not specialising in science.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
Model railroading combines electricity, electronics (digital control), mechanical engineering, computers (for research and design), art (scenery and kits), scheduling (to operate in a prototypical manner), history, and just plain play. http://www.modelrailroader.com/
I remember as a kid spending hundreds of hours with Edmunds stuff that my dad bought us.
A three stage water rocket, that was so cool; each stage would use up it's water/fuel, separate, and the next one would blast off. I think the final stage even deployed a parachute for effect. Nowadays, I think they might have a boring one-stage water rocket (I can make one of those out of a coke bottle, big deal.)
But the coolest kit was an optics kid with hundreds of parts; lenses, tubes, housings, photosensitive paper, and so on. It had plans for telescopes, microscopes, periscopes, and the final project was a full functioning SLR camera with zoom lens that worked! Truly amazing. I'd love to find a kit like that again for my kids (okay, okay, and me), but they don't seem to offer much like this any more. Sigh.
Even anticipating and reading their catalogue brought many hours of enjoyment each year.
Love many, trust a few, do harm to none.
My 12-year old loves working with the Scratch software from MIT and the Scratchboard input device.
He's able to build "games" quickly and interact with them using the switches on the Scratchboard.
His peers also like it.
He hasn't quite gotten to the level where he can use a Wiring.org.co board, but I use them a lot, and it looks like it will be good for kids also.
If you're going to make a workbench designed for kids, a neat design feature would be to make it possible to grow with the kids. Maybe some nesting tubes for legs would allow it to change in height over time.
Apart from that, look at the surface of the bench. Whether you want to use wood, laminated particle board, or lego base plates, making the surface extendable can help small arms reach the back, then expand horizontally as they need more bench space.
10 Bits= $.25
100 Bits= $.50
110 Bits= $.75
1000 Bits= 1 byte
Don't let them have a computer. Getting mine is when my interest in all of that other cool stuff faded.
Since moving to Chicago in the mid-nineties, I discovered American Science and Surplus In their store, I've literally seen a box of electronic parts labelled, "we're not really sure - if you figure them out, let us know".
Lots of good stuff... assuming that Fatherland Insecurity doesn't come down on you.
mark
You can't do what you did as a kid. Everything you did is now outlawed, either directly or indirectly. Come on, 3 ppl died, so we banned all of the chemistry sets. Two ppl tried to make bombs, so we banned the chemistry sets. Yah, da, yah, da....
I understand your quest :) I have a 6 year old boy and a 4 year old girl and these are things which I have in fact already been working on since... before they were born. When I found out my wife was pregnant, I started building this type of educational environment. Unfortunately, here in Oslo Norway, it's hard for an American to track all those good things down, especially the Estes model rockets (which I did manage after a long time).
Throughout my house, you're likely to encounter the biggest classic erector sets (at least that's what it said on the box).
We have at last count over 25,000 lego bricks because we don't reuse, be just buy more to build new things.
We have Capsula, a large selection of small tools, bits of wood, glues, etc... for constructing small things.
We also, so far as I know have the only functional model rocket "lab" in town. Since rocket engines cost me about $20 each here in Norway, I've taken to shipping them via surface mail (REALLY SLOW) through hazmat shipping lines which actually costs me a bundle, but cuts the cost to about $5 an engine. We buy 4-5 rockets each time we're in America and spread out the task of building them.
We also have robotic components which I tend to either track down through online catalogs or design in solid works and have a local school produce (they make me buy one per student in the class, but only charge for materials).
I also keep a work bench with soldering equipment and a selection of about 2500 different electronic components, including breadboards and such.
For a chemistry set, I've been lucky, my father-in-law was a chemist (old style pharmucist) for nearly 50 years. He donated a tremendous collection of glassware, microscopes and even some controlled chemicals (his license is still valid). For a bunsen burner, I rigged one up, but it appears to function well enough.
I have just begun planning the biology and botony "lab" but since this is not my area of expertise, we're dependant on kits from educational suppliers. If it weren't for wikipedia and a subscription to britanica (it's has a fabulous children's version) I'd be lost in these areas since I don't like leaving questions unanswered for the children.
At the local technical museum, there's a huge selection of science kits, so I tend to purchase one or two each time I'm there. Too bad it's going a little too mainstream now and is carrying $5 crap items which are more likely to sell and less higher end educational components.
I hope the description of my lab helps you to plan yours since I believe that thus-far mine has been extremely sucessful in spurring scientific interest in my children.
Oh.. P.S. don't forget computers, and don't be cheap. I found that providing each child with a relatively high end computer makes them more interested in using them and asking questions about them. Building a computer with a 4-year old was a blast since I let him do most of the work.
What about when the parent doesn't know that much about hands on stuff. I'm a software engineer and I don't really know that much about building machines/circuits/etc, however it would be something interesting to learn. What avenue would be best for a parent and their child to both learn hands on activities simultaneously? My father was a maintenance planner, and as such knew a lot about making things, but I never got around to making stuff with him.
I grew up on a farm and had a 120 acre lab, if you include the neighbors land (yes back in the day when there were no "no tresspassing" signs, we had 1400 acres to experiment, play and generally F things up without much harm to anyone or anything.
Some of the things I learned were:
RESPECT
caution
patience
black power goes BANG
methane come from manure
dry grass burns (quickly)
grasshoppers make EXCELLENT trout bait
If you are walking behind someone hunting, they think you are the one making all the noise.
Neighbors are neighbors and want to generally help if you let them.
There is nothing to gain by sitting on the sidelines, jump in and get to it. You can read as many books as you'd like, but until you get your hands dirty, you learn nothing!
I'll bet you've been married what.... like 3 years?
No seriously, couples that seem happy when you meet them, have these resentments underneath. They choose not too surface them because who really wants to tear things up when you're 55. Go to a marriage counselor or psychologist and find out what really happens in long-term relationships.
First thing I would do is Build a Workbench with them. Check out instructables.com and makezine.com there are plenty of plans. Here is the link to a make podcast on a bench http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2006/07/make_podcast_weekend_projects.html I would then setup an old PC with a dual boot linux/XP setup, just to cover all your bases. If you are into Electronics and a little programming I would suggest getting an Arduino. http://www.arduino.cc/ To expand your electronic aspect of the lab I would get packs of resistors and Caps. Get a cheap soldering iron and DMM. That's all I got for now hope that helps.
"If you like Battlestar Galactica, you're probably a huge nerd." -Stephen Colbert
I grew up with rockets. Building them gave me experience in science and construction methods.
Back then Estes ruled but today Estes although widely available is not the best place to buy rockets. Semroc and Fliskits rule today. They shy away from plastic and still use balsa wood and classic materials.
Or an even more interesting twist in Estes-style rockets is printing them from your computer. Cardstock rockets fly great and are perfectly safe.
You can dowload dozens at the Rocketry Blog site
When the kids are young a spare room is all they need. They won't likely be playing with anything dangerous until they are about 10. Lego kits, Erector Sets, and even model rockets (no engine), RC cars and such don't require special equipment. The worst you have to worry about is model glue.
At around 10 (use your own judgment about what your child is capable of) is about the time you should teach your child about workshop safety and introduce him or her to your workshop and tools. This is when you need to devote some serious workspace to your child.
disclaimer: I am not an educator, I am not responsible if anything bad happens.
One of our competitors trademarked the term "hypothesis". From now on, we will call them "boneheaded ideas".
If you look at the Lego website, I seem to recall that you could buy lots of specific pieces/colors. Not sure how cost effective or if you can get anything like "1000 assorted".
As with anything you'd like your kids to do:
- Lead by example: If they watch you repairing/building/fiddling with things, they will want to do it as well.
- Enable: place to make a mess!!! Tools. Raw materials. Things to take to bits and to combine
Let them find what they'd like to fiddle with.
Don't jump on them with instructions and help, Even if you mean well. Wait for the moment when they are ready to invite you, then share the project.
Not confused enough? http://translate.google.com/translate?u=www.slashdot.jp&hl=en&ie=UTF8&sl=ja&tl=en
The X...01's electronic kits where fun. We got the 101 electronic kits and had great fun building the electronic dog whistle (fun to torment that nasty dog next door!). We then asked to the other series the 501 and 1001 (I seem to recall). We spend hours and days building all sorts of electronic devices. Best way ever to spend the winter doldrums locked indoors. Helped out lots when I took circuit board design classes (which where trivially easy as I had a very firm grasp on the basics and understood the terminology). I have recently looked for those very same kits and have yet to find them.
My Sig indicates the end of the comment I posted.
I'm a ham radio op, and my kids are interested in that. They're only 8 and 5. I let them on the air every once in a while and my daughter is on and off again with Morse code. One rainy Saturday afternoon I got a couple of FM radio kits and sat with them and we put the whole thing together. Yes they cost 16 bucks each and I had to help my 5 year old put it together but they love those things now. They sound horrible but they would rather use them then the $50.00 AM/FM/CD players they have. I would have to say that the main thing is spending time with them doing all kinds of things. I'm better at the electronics and handy man type of things. My wife teaches them art and crafts. Both my wife and I are in to music so thats something we can teach them together. Really it just comes down to teaching them a little bit of everything and letting them decide what they want to do. Then you just need to be able to afford it!
Sure Dad's workbench had tools, but more importantly, there was scrap wood of all varieties and sizes, fasteners, ropes...
My first go-kart grew out of lawn mower wheels and stuff around, no adults involved.
Mom had cupboards filled with craft supplies. Want to make a birthday card for them or gift? There was sparkle, glue, wax for melting into candles. Need a parachute? Fabric scraps...
Another great thing my parents did was NOT give us "age appropriate" gifts but some gives we'd grow in to over the year. That "kit" that baffled us when we unrapped it might become a favorite ten months later.
Want a 10-speed bike? I couldn't have it until I disassembled and reassembled it.
(Thankfully I didn't have to do that with my first car, but my brother did.)
Lastly, there's also things like BBC radio show: http://www.thenakedscientists.com/ which offers kitchen experiments each week you can do in ten minutes to foster curiosity and a nugget of knowledge.
Subscribing to a magazine like that can do wonders.
hth! -Randy
PS: I loved reading, to not get caught reading after bedtime, I ran a train transformer's wire over to a thumbtack stuck in my bedroom door's jamb, back to a car's parking light bulb, so when my door was opened to check on me (from seeing the light spillage under the door), the light went off automatically and all I had to do was hide the book and pretend to be asleep.
I basically grew up building and breaking things in my dads garage. It had a little bit of everything: woodworking, metalworking, automotive etc.
What I really learned was respect and patience for tools, jigs, and problem solving. Most of all, build something together. Kits are great (especially remote control cars/airplanes), but I still remember my first pocketknife. I was 6, and I loved carving toy solders and ninjas from scrap wood.
My brother and I made our own transformers from scrap wood and cheap hinges. We were young to be working with knives and a bandsaw, but my father supervised us on the bandsaw, and made sure we respected the pocketknives. Yeah, I occasionally slipped and cut myself, but never worse than a scraped knee on a playground. He also taught me how to sharpen it so it never got dull (and dangerous). That stuck with me. The idea that a tool needs to be cared for, not just used and tossed away.
A small scroll saw is a great first power tool for a kid to use. It's hard to hurt yourself too bad on those, and you can build almost any small project with it.
I was always a big fan of New Yankee Workshop.
Pure Iodine is pretty much impossible to get nowadays, thanks to the War on Drugs (it is used in one popular method of making methamphetamine). The water purification kits have moved over to iodine compounds or other ingredients.
Remember "News for Nerds, Stuff that Matters"? Help make it a reality again! http://soylentnews.org
At least that's what Caltech's director of admissions told me when I asked why there weren't as many kids who followed in C.L. Stong's footprints in the frosh class.
So get them the $150 Altera FPGA starter kit
Still software, but at least they'll learn about hardware.
Make is okay, but it's much more oriented towards 'artistic' than 'rocket science'.
Check out the Society for Amateur Scientists
off topic, but thank you to the OP (sharp-bang) for the link to the Edmund Scientific catalog. i've never heard of it but it looks like a great resource for cool science stuff for my kids! thanks!
aikodude
The stuff is great;
2" schedule 40 is sturdy enough for kids to build their own play structure.
1-1/2 makes good whacking sticks.
3" with a valve and an air compressor you can make an air cannon that does away with the hairspray but can still fire a tennis ball out of sight!
It's easy to cut to size and most connectors necessary are easy to buy at the local big-box store.
Watch out for the adhesives though, that warning about use in a "well ventilated" area is a real WARNING.
I would start with Benches:
1. Woodworking/Plastics
2. Metalworking
3. Assembly
Two desks, one for the computer, printer, etc.. and another desk for drawings and writing.
Shelving... lots of shelving, and overhead storage of materials.
Tools for each area w/ there own toolbox/bin.
1. Hammers (each type for there purpose)
2. Screwdrivers (philips(sp?), flat-head, torx)
3. Hex keys & T-Handles
4. Rachet and Socket sets
5. Wrenches
Powered hand tools:
Circular Saw
Electric Drill
Router
Machine equipment:
Drill Press
Lathe (best if you had a woodworking and metalworking lathe)
Vertical Mill
Measuring Tools:
1 Tape Measures
2 Calipers (Vernier, Dial)
3 Micrometers (OD & ID)
4 Height Gage
5 Bore Gages
and I would get at least two carts for project(s).
TKBui
I only know that when toddler stage comes around my kids aren't getting a plastic oven with little pots and pans; there's a fisher-price lathe in my kid's future.
One day, we will have robot dogs. Until then, my wife and I can maintain separate hobbies.
...but try Cub Scouts.
Last month my 6 year old son and I went to "Space Camp" (not the real one) where he wore a little blue jumpsuit, "launched" 2 liter bottles with a bike pump, built & launched a model rocket, learned about constellations, etc.
Guess what? He asked if we can build rockets at home, and the water/bicycle pump powered plastic bottle launcher.
His next rank has a requirement involving "tools for fixing and building."
Start out with the simple PCV, Hairspray, BBQ ignition. Engineer smaller, bigger, longer, shorter versions. Try new fuels like propane or lighter fluid, and learn about air/fuel ratios.
Or go the compressed air route. PVC seals well, but you can move to metal pipes and soldier them together. Use mechanical valves opened by hand, or electronic actuators (lawn sprinkler valves work good).
Try different materials as the projectile. Potatoes, apples, eggs (usually hard boiled, but raw are fun if you do it right), or melt down plastic pop bottles in a toaster over and mold your own slugs (use it outside, because you'll eventually need to learn what temp is too hot and burns the plastic at.)
The best potato gun launch I've see was conducted by my old HS chemistry teacher. We wrapped a chunk of sodium in aluminum foil, loaded it into hollowed out potato, and launched it into the swamp behind the high school. Sodium + Pond = cool. It was his last year teaching there, so with retirement 2 weeks away he let us get away with a lot of cool stuff.
Snap Circuits from Elenco (www.elenco.com). Found one of their lower end kits at Hobby Lobby and my son played with it so much we plan on getting him their big expensive kit for christmas this year.
My 8 year old son now has an excellent grip on circuits, how they work and loves "inventing stuff" with it.
In a nutshell, its a kit with a bunch of modules and a plastic grid that the modules snap on to and you join them together using connecters that snap on. Its friggin awesome. They learn about circuits safely with no soldiering.
Not gas, get them a Zagi.
- Combustion engines
- Mixing fuel (some chemistry)
+ Radio gear
+ Flight dynamics
+ Assembling and building, where care is needed to avoid major mistakes that would render the model unflyable
+ Woodwork and metal work (and you'll aquire the tools for these if you don't already have them)
+ The importance of measurement in the real world
+ Importance of safety and developing good practice and procedure to make things safe
And finally the big one:
+ Nearly indestructible. A friend of mine saw one of those fly into the ground at top speed and then BOUNCE 6 feet back into the air. No significant damage.
Gas engines are a mess and will discourage you from flying. All you need is a decent slope with a glider and you can stay up longer than any messy gas job. The electrics are good too and can be used in flat fields, but the regular gliders are simpler, sturdier and more performant. I did have an electric though and it was a lot of fun. Especially when the wind dies and your plane is way out in the boonies.
Foam planes are the closest thing we had to simulators back then.
They ARE out to get you simply because They are in it for themselves and they don't care about you.
Just an odd thought, if you manage to get your kid into the tinkering, maybe you could introduce them to some live steam enthusiasts. Those guys have the killer workshops. All the train guys I've met seem to love sharing the skills.
The cost of that cleanup, of course, will be borne by taxpayers, not industry.
I was looking for replacement batteries for my little brothers powerwheels car and ran across www.modifiedpowerwheels.com. They have some cool projects like upgrading the gears and batteries to make it run faster. The projects look simple enough, but its something that your kid can learn to do and introduce him into doing hands on stuff.
While the common belief goes:
"A long time a ago son, the poprocks ambushed the coke tribe at the Valley of the Overflowing Beaker, since then..."
In reality, both sides fearing an ambush from the other actually retreated unknowingly into each other, thus for the first time both sides effectively ambushed each other!
Thus began the Poprocks vs Coke animosity that lingers to this day.
Apologies to Terry Pratchett!
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
Remember Beaker Valley!
Say bad words about my book, in cold oatmeal, or I shall sue!
The most important part is for the kids to get physically involved, no matter what you do. Start with folding paper airplanes -- show + have the kids do it themselves. Then take a piece of thin balsa wood 4" x 8" and cut a square out of one end. Trim the cut-out piece a bit, shape the other end into a point, put a rubber band across and wind the loose piece up in it to make a paddle-wheel boat for the sink or bathtub. Then let the kids make a flag or sail out of a toothpick and some paper. Then work up to the kits from Edmund's.
I have to admit while they have their place, I hate electrics. Being able to refuel and fly 6 times in a row is much better. Yes it's messier, but I don't have potentially exploding LiPos to charge, and yes they're more fragile but that's because you're often going further, faster, higher. I'd like more resilience in my models but I did mange to go 2 years with just 1 crash. I'm hoping to do well if not quite as well for the rest of my flying hobby days.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
A drill press (my favourite shop tool), band saw, soldering iron + assorted accessories, dremel, spools of wire, resistors, caps, etc., two by fours of various lengths and qualities, Bunsen burner (this is key), striker, beakers of various sizes and shapes (Erlenmeyer for the win), sink, vice, hand tools (if in doubt, get the bigger hammer), a bunch of nails to hang things from, Shop-Vac, and a lot of band-aids.
Need not dive in to the expensive airplanes right away...
A good starter option is petrol powered Control line flying. Fast, fun, cheap, crashes usually aren't terminal and the child can design and fly the entire aircraft on their own. I was given a model petrol engine and propeller and did everything else myself. Good fun.
---
A neurotic is the man who builds a castle in the air. A psychotic is the man who lives in it. A psychiatrist is the man who collects the rent. - Jerome Lawrence
http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/electronic/923a/
or one of these
http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/electronic/77aa/
Going 2 years with 1 crash is hecka impressive but... there is a whole class of those Zagi type planes they call combat slopers. The goal is to knock the other guy out of the sky
They ARE out to get you simply because They are in it for themselves and they don't care about you.
Ooops- not lithium, Nickel metal hydride.
They ARE out to get you simply because They are in it for themselves and they don't care about you.
... is a far better lab than any crap you can set up on a workbench. Give the kids a magnifying glass and some good hiking shoes.
+++OK ATH
With 3 battery packs and two chargers even when on flat ground I don't run out of batteries. If I have a slope with good wind the glider will stay up for hours (limited by my rather inept piloting skills).
:)
Not interested in gliders I'm afraid. Just as well. No where nearby suitable to fly them. As it is I'm spending 45 mins to get to my field, which is getting rather tedious.
We started off with NiCads, then went to Lithium metal hydride I think (don't remember hearing of them exploding).
I think I'll probably end up going electric for my first 3D/hovering type rig. Simply for the reliability for an engine that doesn't lean when you point it up, with instant response. However I'm very nervous about the exploding battery thing. Anything that could cause the house to burn down if I'm having an off day isn't something I take lightly. I think I'd have to fast charge so they could be supervised, but that in itself presents problems. I'll have to look into Lithium Hydride.
Going 2 years with 1 crash is hecka impressive but... there is a whole class of those Zagi type planes they call combat slopers. The goal is to knock the other guy out of the sky
To be honest 2 years took some skill but mostly luck and having good instruction. Bear in mind I didn't fly every weekend for 2 years. I got married during that time so that's 2 months without flying right there.
Combat flying is interesting as is combat with streamers but it does increase the risk to your aircraft. Our club is getting a bit anal. We have an open day once a month (not just planes. Cars, boats, steam engines, it's not a dedicated flying club). They won't even let me fly with streamers on open day. Worried they'll get tangled in the control surfaces. I haven't flown too much with streamers but I haven't had a problem yet.
Biggest issue is a constrained hilly flying field with fences everywhere and no fly zone on 3 sides of the flight line. Not to mention wildlife. Cows, snakes and foxes mostly. Wildlife doesn't matter though. What I really want to join a club with a real runway.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
for all the informative and insightful commments!
I'm still digesting it all. RSN I will summarize the advice and links from this discussion on a journal.
Best regards,
for all the informative and insightful comments!
I'm still digesting it all. RSN I will summarize the advice and links from this discussion on a journal.
Best regards,
#!