WoW: Wrath of the Lich King Release Date Announced

Mini-Geek and many others tipped news that Blizzard has announced the release date for Wrath of the Lich King , World of Warcraft's second expansion. It will be in stores on November 13th in the US and Europe. They've also released details about the contents of the Collector's Edition. Wrath will be preceded by a large content patch, which will expand the talent trees and include many of the gameplay changes set for the expansion (including the consolidation of spell damage and healing into 'spellpower,' achievements, and a new profession). The patch was installed on the public test realm yesterday, and the current patch notes are available.

Comments

StarCraft

[stun]

I couldn't care less about WoW. Where is my StarCraft II?

Re:StarCraft

[illeism]

Yep, and we all have mod points today somehow... but seriously... I'm starting to wonder if the only people getting mod points and zealots and trolls...

Re:StarCraft

[lgw]

Hmmm, I got modpoints today, I play WoW, *and* I'm a zealot and a troll - yup, it's an evil conspiracy!

Re:StarCraft

[SL Baur]

Hmmm, I got modpoints today, I play WoW, *and* I'm a zealot and a troll

Hmm, three out of four ...

Now, where do I have to go to get my copies at 12:01, the day of release?

Re:StarCraft

[Rebelgecko]

Yep, and we all have mod points today somehow... but seriously... I'm starting to wonder if the only people getting mod points and zealots and trolls...

Don't forget the zerglings!

Re:StarCraft

[JosKarith]

I've met Zealots but what are trolls - are they a new Zerg troop type?
On that front, when are we going to get World of Starcraft...?

Re:StarCraft

[Bullet-Dodger]

A Wow Expansion pack makes the slashdot frontpage? Someone (indirectly) complaining gets modded flamebait? Are there really that many WoW players here on slashdot???

A Blizzard game is popular? Shocking!

Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the way..

[SilentChris]

* "It'll be more of the same."
* "You can never win an MMORPG. It's a never-ending treadmill."
* "Thank God I got off that crack a year ago."
* "It won't be as good as Eve/Warhammer/etc."
* "Blizzard isn't going to get another one of my dollars after that DMCA bullshit."
* "I'm waiting for Diablo 3/StarCraft 2."
* "I hate PC games. Console games rule."

I think I've covered the major ones. On that note, I have my copy on preorder.

KHAAAAAANNNNN!!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh... Lich KING...heh...uh... sorry...

Re:KHAAAAAANNNNN!!!

[duckInferno]

Roll a druid. Use the following macro.

/cast Wrath
/y KHAAAAAN

Re:KHAAAAAANNNNN!!!

[Macgrrl]

/cast spellbyname "Wrath"
/y KHANNNN!!!

Fixed that for you

Moonkin - the most fun you can have with your pants on.

Re:KHAAAAAANNNNN!!!

[duckInferno]

What's the diff? (other than the focus on N's)

That soon?

[MarkovianChained]

I'm a part of the beta right now, as well as a few friends and guildmates. Sure, there are bugs now given that it's beta, and I don't expect it to be bug-free at release, but... given how many fundamental things are broken right now (continents crashing regularly, critical talents for some class builds not working, etc), I wonder how they plan to have this out in less than two months.

Then again, I'm a sucker, so I'll be buying it anyway.

Re:That soon?

[Necroman]

I've been playing WotLK on and off for 4 months now (alpha/beta) and seen it come a long ways in that time. When they first made it "public" only a few classes had new talents and abilities, some of which did not even work. Much of the landscape was unfinished (Dalaran barely even existed in the early patches).

They need to clean up some talents/abilities, finish some content, but there really isn't a whole lot to finish. At this point it will be a lot of tweaking of all the changes they made. They know they can't get it right the first time so they will try to make it as balanced as possible with 3.0.2. Within a week or 2, 3.0.3 will be out to fix the critical issues. They are close, and I think it will be ready to go.

Re:That soon?

[gardyloo]

continents crashing regularly

That's what drives orogeny, you insensitive clod!

Re:That soon?

[Dancindan84]

They move pretty quick. Also, you need to remember that the CD will likely just have patch 3.0 on it, and they'll push out any updates past that at release. Then factor in the time it takes to get to 80 (I know someone will do it in 2 days or something ridiculous, but I mean the average) and they still have time to tune things. Plus the endgame raids get tuned almost continually, so it's not like they need to be in completely stable state at release either.

Re:That soon?

[Androclese]

So basically...

You are in the Private Beta right now and once it launches in two months, I'll be part of the 10 million player Open Beta?

OK! Sign me up!

Re:That soon?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, the current beta has scores of bugs; it appears Blizzard is rushed by its new management, and we'll see if they can meet this ambitious release goal.

Their work is definitely cut out for them. Some group content does not appear to be itemized at all yet; many items that are implemented have placeholder names and graphics. Many talents and some new spells have placeholder names/graphics and untweaked properties. The servers have several recurring issues: mana regen will sometimes cease until you relog, characters cannot mount in cities like Orgrimmar and Undercity, and the server must be restarted frequently during the hours that I play. Blizzard has stated that the new class talents are still in an experimental phase, and that class balancing (e.g. TPS/reduction for tanks, HPS/regen for healers, dps for the rest) cannot even BEGIN until talents are reasonably solid.

Once player characters become more consistent, Blizzard will have to re-tweak their tested solo and group content to make sure it still presents an adequate challenge for players.

Re:That soon?

[MBGMorden]

It really depends on which set of "work" is left to do. Personally, I have no issue with them doing content/balance/encounter tuning after launch. That's to be expected, and I've just never been one of those guys to jump on the official forums with "OMGIMGUNNAQUIT" responses every time they "nerf" one of my classes.

Stability though, as in the client/servers not crashing on me (at least not at a significant rate - anything more than once per 2 weeks is excessive), is paramount. By the time I'm buying the product I expect it to be relatively complete and ready for usage by the general populace.

That said I'm buying it either way, but I'll be irked if it isn't stable. I just hope they've put in some major upgrades to the servers last time they were buying hardware. When TBC was released the servers choked down so bad that HFP was unplayable for the first few days. I ended up starting a Draenei Shaman alt to pass the time (and Exodar was less laggy), but somehow I think that the Death Knight starting area will be almost as crowded as Northrend this time around.

Re:That soon?

[Fozzyuw]

They need to clean up some talents/abilities, finish some content, but there really isn't a whole lot to finish. At this point it will be a lot of tweaking of all the changes they made.

Right, talents, spells, etc. are all things that are not actually part of the expansion, which consists of new content (new zones, factions, items, mobs, and a class). Everything else will be addressed via the Test Server and the patch that will precede the expansion, kind of like The Burning Crusade. Now that the new patch is on the test realm, I'm sure the talents and things will come along nicely.

Should the talent changes and things like "spellpower" have issues, they'll know and push back the release date until some point after the patch goes out. Speaking of which, we can probably expect the 3.0 patch to go live around the end of Oct. early Nov. all things being equal.

Either way, the only thing that will be on the CD's in the box will be the content files. The mechanics will all be mostly implemented through the patch. Pretty common practice now-a-days.

Re:That soon?

[BigGar']

Yeah, but given what you know of the game you could skip the deathknight starting area and work your way over to the eastern plaguelands for a couple of days or hfp, should be a lot quieter.

Re:That soon?

[AppyPappy]

I tried to be a beta-tester but I got disqualified because I once had a date. I tried to tell them it was my cousin but they said because I'm from West Virginia, it counts.

Too bad cause I needed the money.

Re:That soon?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm a part of the beta right now, as well as a few friends and guildmates. Sure, there are bugs now given that it's beta, and I don't expect it to be bug-free at release, but... given how many fundamental things are broken right now (continents crashing regularly, critical talents for some class builds not working, etc), I wonder how they plan to have this out in less than two months.

A lot of those issues are directly tied to the fact that it is a beta. The beta servers are not production-grade hardware, and they're cramming an awful lot of people into them. Previous betas (WoW, BC) had similar issues with continents constantly crashing. I'm not too worried about seeing that after release... The live servers will be able to handle the player load better, but I'm sure it'll be laggy (to say the least) for at least a few days.

Talents are constantly in flux in WoW. They seem to change from one patch to the next. I'm sure they'll be working in some manner at release...but I doubt if they'll stay the same for long.

Re:That soon?

[WillAffleckUW]

A better bet would be to do the WSG and BG instances at the start before other players develop competing strategies, since most of the twinks will be playing deathknights.

Use the class the way it was supposed to be before it's all twinked out.

Re:That soon?

[MBGMorden]

I'm not positive, but from what I've heard you have to do quite a bit of stuff before you're allowed to leave the Deathknight starting area. I've not played it, but most people I've talked to said that you'd generally make it from level 55 to level 58 before you could get out.

I may be mistaken there though.

Re:That soon?

[bigstrat2003]

You aren't. You have to do the intro quests to get out into good old EPL, much less the wider world. Until you finish the final quest in the chain, for example, all the NPCs in your capital cities are unfriendly to you, and jeer at you, throw things at you, etc.

Fortunately, given how they implemented the starting area, it shouldn't be that bad. Crowded, but manageable.

Re:That soon?

[BigGar']

Interesting, I haven't been paying attention real close though. I'll have to look into it, since I'll be rolling one myself, not that it matters much I suppose.

Re:That soon?

[moniker127]

Wait wait wait wait... who ever said that the game would actually come out at the release date? That wouldnt make any sense...

First they put out a release date. Then, they push it back in increments of two months, untill people literally want to burn down blizzard's HQ. THEN they release it. The expansion is actually going to come out some time in late 2009.

Re:That soon?

[vitaflo]

I was in both the Alpha and Beta of Burning Crusade. Even up to a couple weeks from release I thought they still had work to do, but they pulled it off pretty well. I see no reason why WotLK will be different. I would certainly expect there to be a patch after you install the retail game for obvious reasons.

Re:That soon?

[MeanderingMind]

Blizzard isn't under new management (all literature on the subject shows Blizzard is maintaining similar or greater autonomy in relation to their parent company), and they certainly aren't being rushed (the Beta for WotLK hit a lot sooner than the BC beta, proportional to the closer release date).

Re:That soon?

[bughunter]

"Subduction leads to Orogeny" -- did the Earth just move for you, too?

Re:That soon?

[Udderdude]

It's going to be delayed until December, count on it.

Re:That soon?

[Daswolfen]

You must have never beta tested with Blizzard before. That is SOP. The place holder names and graphics will be put in the beta a patch or two before the final RC. They are more concerned with making it work right than look pretty. That said, there are a lot of new graphics already in place.

The reason the servers are up and down right no is because they have been load testing the server software for several days now, until it can handle the full population load of a live server.

Re:That soon?

[Incoherent07]

Well, that, and they just sent out a huge wave of beta invites last week, and all of those people are currently bringing the death knight area/Borean Tundra/Howling Fjord to their knees.

Re:That soon?

[eabarcelona]

There are plenty of beta games, not onli WoW, you can also have even online poker games where they give you money to star playing.. o.O

If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Petersko]

Burning Crusade was a great add-on, and I expect that this new one will be just as good. Sure, some people will complain that they have to buy content AND pay a monthly fee, but I only have to buy it once. If they skimped on the content I'd be upset too, but they don't. I'll get far more playing time out of this add-on than I have gotten out of any other recent game purchase.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[theonlyalterego]

well...
19.99 + 29.99 + 29.99 = 79.97
so that gets you WoW, WoW:BC, WoW:WOTLK

November 23, 2004 - November 23, 2008
@14.99 per mon = 719.52 for 4 years

$799.49 grand total.

Yeah, I mean that's a totally reasonable price for 1 game and 2 expansions.... or not.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[ahodgson]

For 4 years of entertainment, it sure is. I've spent more than that on activities on one vacation before. $15/month for tens of hours of entertainment is dirt cheap, and $40 on an expansion every couple of years is nothing.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[mfh]

I'll get far more playing time out of this add-on than I have gotten out of any other recent game purchase.

Meanwhile I've been checking out gog.com and I got Fallout 1 & 2 to mess around with until WotLK.

I'm pretty excited about the new content. I have an undead warlock with 4pc t6, plus 550 resil in my pvp gear. The game recently has become rather dull as you can imagine.

Warlocks in the expansion look like they will be amazing. I'll prolly lvl a Death Knight after my main gets to endgame, but likely not before.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Yosho]

As the other poster commented, $800 is a great deal for 4 years of entertainment. You can go on cruises or trips to resorts that will cost you more than that after only a week or two, and the only things you'll have to show for it when you come back are a sunburn and a t-shirt.

Or, to compare that price to other video games: let's say that your average single player action game provides a max of 20 hours of entertainment, and your average single player RPG provides a max of 40. If you play a mix of the genres 10 hours a week (perfectly reasonable for a casual gamer, and way under the norm for a "hardcore" gamer), you'll go through an average of 1 game every 3 weeks. With a typical game costing $50, you'll spend over $1700 on games in two years. WoW is way cheaper than playing single player games.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Il128]

well... 19.99 + 29.99 + 29.99 = 79.97 so that gets you WoW, WoW:BC, WoW:WOTLK November 23, 2004 - November 23, 2008 @14.99 per mon = 719.52 for 4 years $799.49 grand total. Yeah, I mean that's a totally reasonable price for 1 game and 2 expansions.... or not.

The truth! It burns! Your comment will of course be followed up by the following comments: "It's cheaper than *.*" Blizzard. Stealing the human soul four years running and mankind is still blissfully unaware! MUHAHAHAHA! /slurping sound of creature eating human eyes

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Consider the average cost of most games: $50
Consider the number of games purchased by an average gamer: .5 per month

$50 X 36 = $1800

Even if you cut that in half: $900

Most gamers spend at least that in 4 years. WOW is saving me money.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Talderas]

At even 10 hours a week, that's a phenomenal deal.

52 * 10 = 520 hrs/year
14.99 * 12 = $179.88/year
$179.88 / 520 = $0.34 / hr

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[theonlyalterego]

I'll spare the "have you played Game X" comments. But WoW is really not a good deal, month rate games never are. That's not what it's about the point being if you enjoy playing the game almost any cost is justifiable.

I was just trying to shead light on just HOW much WoW costs. If you're the rare gamer who plays nothing BUT wow, yes you're probably saving money. But I doubt this encompasses the vast majority of people who play. I for one also own an 360 and play a number of games on it in addition to my $15 soul-snatching-blizzard-fee. I do it because I love the game, and I (apparently like you) will justify it as a necessary cost.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Except that you would have a NEW game every 3-4 weeks. Not the same game. Not to mention you can buy games used for 20-30 dollars.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Talderas]

All entertainment is based on the assumption that you enjoy the product being sold to the point where you're going to pay for it. Comparing the cost per hour of various forms of entertainment is a completely valid comparison.

For example, let's say you go to a 2 hour movie for $8. The cost is $4/hr. Likely the enjoyment from one hour of a movie is going to be more than one hour of playing WoW. However at $0.34/hr WoW is hardly a good comparison. Is approximately 24 hours of WoW just as enjoyable as a 2 hour movie? If the 24 hours of WoW are likely to be more enjoyable than a 2 hour movie, then WoW is the better deal since you're getting more satisfaction for the money you're spending.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Ansonmont]

Not if you bought Neverwinter Nights, admitedly, the graphics are way outdated, but the best modules created by the community are better than most, if not all, the storylines you find in most RPGs. You can buy the Neverwinter Nights Gold edition for $20 and really never have to pay anything else again. Also, you can play multi-player (I never have, but apparently you can), but the best thing is being able to play off-line or at your own leisure. No one is waiting for someone else to go on the raid with them....

Anyway, sorry to appear like I am dissing WoW, I am not, but $800 on almost anything is a lot.

My .02

-A

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

The poster was saying "entertainment", not "memories". Even if they were thinking memories, what does it matter if it came from a real event or a virtual event? If the memory brings that person happiness, so what? Just because you don't like the game doesn't mean you have to be so rude about it.

Now back to comparing my last family camping trip with a quest in Zangarmarsh...

Jim

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't worry, kiddo. Someday your mom will buy you a new PC, then you'll be able to admit that you like MMO's too.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[bigstrat2003]

but $800 on almost anything is a lot.

Over 3.5, almost 4, years? I think not. A decent salary around here is $35,000. So, when we do the math, $800/($35,000 * 3.5) = .0065 (rounded).

I really don't think that a half a percent of your income is "a lot" to spend on anything.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[joelwyland]

in addition to my $15 soul-snatching-blizzard-fee. I do it because I love the game, and I (apparently like you) will justify it as a necessary cost.

This is such bullshit and it's been said so many times in these comments. Soul snatching? Really? That $15 per month (something you can easily spend in food each DAY) is really stealing your soul? You love playing game, by your own admission... yet it's stealing your soul? Give me a fucking break.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[X0563511]

If you liked single player, MP is better. They've got games up for all styles of play, from "lets go kill shit" Diablo-style to "everyone got their character sheets filled out" DnD style.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[X0563511]

Please explain your math. How is 15/30 more than (20 < x < 60)/24 under any circumstances?

----
30 = days/month
24 = just some number between 3 and 4 weeks
20 = your stated minimum
60 = my observed maximum

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[MeanderingMind]

You have a good point, but it's muddled in your stereotyping and misinformation. You're also missing the point.

The good point is that a cruise has worth as it potentially offers you opportunities WoW does not.

Your problem is that you overlook that the same is true of WoW. What the cruise and WoW offer are separate and address different needs. The comparison used in the GP highlights that.

WoW is very economical entertainment, and very convenient. It fills the same niche as movies, books and television. For four years worth of entertainment $800 is extremely cheap. It looks a lot bigger because we're summing up the total costs over years.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[MeanderingMind]

You may have been trying to shed light, but you only showed your own colored view of the situation.

Firstly, "never" is a very bad word to use unless you are absolutely sure of the impossibility of something. This is especially true as the second sentence of your second paragraph refutes your use of the word in the first paragraph. That said, we can conclude that there are times where month rate games are a good deal and it's only a matter of arguing how often and under what circumstances they are.

Secondly, "saving money" and "good deal" are relative to the individual gamer's habits. Gamers who consistently buy $60 games every month could easily save money, while gamers who dredge through bargain bins and ebay for deals could possibly lose money. There's more nuance than the "nothing BUT wow" crowd.

In conclusion there's no issue in pointing out the the cost of WoW is, in most cases, non-trivial. There is issue, however, in making a mountain out of a molehill.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

dude, you must have time...

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[duckInferno]

I'd rather sit in the basement playing games. But then that's my opinion of a good time. YMMV

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[duckInferno]

Four years of entertainment for $800. $200 a year. What point are you trying to make?

Compare this to any other regular form of entertainment and you'll find it comes out favourably.

- A night out on the town every two weeks? Let's be conservative and say $20 per outing (good luck with that). $520 a year. $2080 in four years.

- "Regular" games? Again, being conservative, a casual gamer that plays 10 hours a week and the average $30 game lasts 50 hours (good luck with that). $300 a year. $1200 in four years.

- A weekly trip to the cinema. My local price is $14 -- I'll cut that down to $9 for the sake of argument (and guessing US pricing). $468 a year. $1872 in four years.

- Let's get really cheap... a weekly tramp through the bush. $3 for some lunch and $3 to drive there and back. $312 a year. $1248 in four years.

The best of those solutions accounts for 10 hours a week of entertainment (the casual gamer who has extremely good luck with titles and duration)... and yet WoW is still significantly cheaper. If you want to rack that 10 hours up to 30 or 40, which is fairly hardcore, the casual gamer solution costs 700-1000 more per year than WoW. The money argument is a flawed argument and only helps draw attention to the extreme entertainment thriftiness of MMO gaming. Adopt a different argument and I'll slam it too, if not quite as hard.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Yosho]

A week on a cruise hanging out in an exotic remote location, and interacting with people, local culture, trying new foods, etc is well worth $800 more so than sitting in the basement playing a computer game for 4 years.

You appear to misunderstand. I'm not saying that playing WoW is better than going on a cruise. I'm saying that it's several orders of magnitude cheaper and still fun. That may be difficult to understand if you have so much money that you can afford to constantly go on cruises for four years.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[ghostunit]

http://www.kunstler.com/mags_virtual.html

"One of the extremely painful lessons of our time, I'm convinced, will be that the virtual is not an adequate substitute for the real."

I agree (from my very own painful experience) with that general idea.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[CFBMoo1]

It really is a great way to kill lots of time and spend very little money doing it. You may be as productive as a bump on a log, but your still saving money by not going out much.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

"One of the extremely painful lessons of our time, I'm convinced, will be that the virtual is not an adequate substitute for the real."

So do you think that things like playing board games, watching movies, and reading books are also not an adequate substite for the "real"?

I agree (from my very own painful experience) with that general idea.

I'm going to guess that means you got addicted to an MMORPG and suffered some ill consequence, and that's a shame, but that no more means video games are worthless than the fact that some people are alcoholics means that alcohol should be illegal.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Daswolfen]

A week on a cruise hanging out in an exotic remote location, and interacting with people, local culture, trying new foods, etc

Getting diarrhea from the water of those 'exotic' locations. Getting a deadly virus or bacteria from the cruise ship, because 1000 people cooped up for a week in a tin can is oh so sanitary. Getting swindled by those people you are interacting with from the local culture. And don't for get the projectile vomiting from that new food that you have never had before.

Yeah.. good times.. good times...

Or, I can sit here on my recliner, playing WoW on my 60" big screen, eating the food I know I like, and not having to worry about losing more than 15 bucks a month to spend 6-10 hours a week having fun with my friends online.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[narcberry]

and the only things you'll have to show for it when you come back are a sunburn and a t-shirt.

With an MMO, you get to pay to work a second full time job. Your duties will include:
-Mashing the same button combinations approximately 20,000 times.
-Spend weeks grinding faction.
-Play with idiot 15 year olds convinced that you want to talk about anime with them.
-Maximize your profits in a virtual economy of near infinite inflation.
-Save up for version 10 of a spell you've had since day one.
-Call up all your friends and proclaim, "It's time to slay the dragon!"

When your tasks are nearly finished, we will void them by introducing epicester tasks/rewards much epicer than the previous epicest tasks and rewards previously assigned. Be motivated though, these are truly epic, as our non-gameplay teaser video demonstrates.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Yosho]

With an MMO, you get to pay to work a second full time job. Your duties will include:
(senseless trolling)

You're quite adept at reposting old, inflammatory arguments, but -- why does any of that matter? If you have fun playing the game, then it's not a waste of time. If you don't have fun... then go do something else (which will probably, in the long run, be more expensive than WoW, as multiple people here have illustrated). Please, list your hobbies so that I can mock them childishly and tell you how I don't think they're any fun at all, and, therefore, you shouldn't, either.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Dhalka226]

If you've really been playing for 4 years, it most certainly is extremely reasonable. You can look at it in many ways, but here are some examples (I'll round the total up to $800):

$800 / 4 years = $200/year
$800 / 48 months = $16.67/month
$800 / 208 weeks = $3.86/week
$800 / 1456 days = $0.55/day
Or break it down hourly: $0.02/hr.

Now, clearly, some of those aren't realistic; nobody's playing 24 hours a day 7 days a week for 4 years, but they're each interesting points of reference. For example, if you rent one movie from Blockbuster per week you'd pay more than the weekly price of WOW over the course of four years. A three hour movie would be considered fairly long; most WOW players would play at least that long in a given week and probably considerably longer. Don't even bother comparing going to the movies, because you know what kind of dough you shell out for THAT--before you even pick up any popcorn or a drink. Cable TV over that period at $30/mo would cost you $1440 (and let's face it, $30/mo is cheap for most households with cable).

WOW costs a lot over the long term, there's no doubt. But it's also a lot of entertainment for its price. If people aren't getting their money's worth, they wouldn't be buying all the expansions and subscribing monthly from day one. If they are, why complain about what they spend their entertainment dollars on? Nobody's forcing you to believe it's a good deal, but others clearly do.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[QuickSilver_999]

Actually, I would say just look at it this way:

Cable TV (TimeWarner Digital, no premium channels, no PPV, 1 DVR box) $60.90/mo.

That's 60.90*12*4=$2923.20 for 4 years. And I actually probably really WATCH that TV much less than I actually log in and play Warcraft. I have the TV on all the time, but I'm usually ignoring it or using it for background noise while I do something else. When I play warcraft, that's ALL I'm doing. So $800 for 4 years of actually using a game and being entertained as opposed to $3000 for 4 years of half ignoring something. Not a bad deal after all.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Your comment will of course be followed up by the following comments: "It's cheaper than *.*"

And you don't even attempt to offer any counter to that logical response, which shows that you know it's completely valid. Looks like the truth burns you.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[theghost]

Is any given 24 hours of WoW (randomly pick 24 hours from any number of days) as entertaining as any given 2-hour movie (randomly chose one from all the movies i've seen)? Probably not. Are the best 24 hours i've ever spent in WoW as good as the best 2 hour movie i've ever seen? Maybe.

The movie was just me and the screen. There was certainly a sense of awe and it made me think and produced some real emotional responses.

The good times in WoW were me and my friends talking and laughing, beating tough challenges and having a riot.

The more i think about it, the more i think it's apples and oranges. Given that, i think value per hour is a better metric than enjoyment per doller. Is any given hour in WoW worth $0.34 to me? Yes, easily.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Il128]

The truth is a few hundred thousand Americans are going to wake up someday and be very, very sad about how they've spent years of their lives. Call it flame bait all you want kids. The truth is the truth, games like World of Warcraft are soul sucking black holes of regret.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Quote- "You can go on cruises or trips to resorts that will cost you more than that after only a week or two, and the only things you'll have to show for it when you come back are a sunburn and a t-shirt."

ROFLMAO........

Like you've got something to show for 4 years of playing WoW. The 30 pound wifebeater beergut doesn't exactly scream "great memories" like a trip to Cozumel does........

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

. <-- the point

. <-- your head

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

sunburn and a t-shirt..Oh, and those little things called "real-life" memories.

You fukkin losers trying to relate a game to real-life entertainment are pathetic. Get help.

Yes, I'm sure you're climbing Mt. Everest as you troll slashdot. That's some amazing WiFi!

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[narcberry]

Yeah I got sidetracked. My real point was an mmo leaves you with less than a suntan and a tshirt to show for it.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

"The truth" does not mean "Il128's ineptly stated, poorly informed, utterly worthless opinion".

And you've again screamed aloud your acknowledgement the "cheaper than X" argument is 100% valid by ignoring it. You're literally shaking with rage that you can't rebut it right now. Yes, you are doing exactly that, and when you pathetically attempt to deny this fact, you will be lying again. Incompetently.

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[craenor]

I have always valued entertainment at $4/hr, based on the cost of movies @ 2 hours. So, when I picked up Ultima Online for $50.00, and hated it. I insisted on playing it until I had 10 hours worth of actual entertainment.

I think that took me about a year of hardcore play. ;)

Re:If you play WoW, it's worth it.

[Anonymous Coward]

You can go on cruises or trips to resorts that will cost you more than that after only a week or two, and the only things you'll have to show for it when you come back are a sunburn and a t-shirt.

I travel all AROUND the world in Norrath... I've seen bikini clad blood elves, and sat on the sandy shores of STV... and I never lose my luggage.

What more can I ask for?

btw, I am an Anonymous Coward because my comment is offensive to no one.

WoW

[Verdatum]

For I moment I interpreted the headline as meaning they just created a http://wow.slashdot.org/ category. plz dont.

It looks so tantalizing

[Anonymous Coward]

That crack pipe looks so tantalizing from the bridge of my UFO in the Galactic Core of Spore...

patch notes?

[Anonymous Coward]

anyone mind posting patch notes for us sorry sobs behind a corporate filter?

Re:patch notes?

[Jonah Hex]

Test Patch Notes Disclaimer: The test realm patch notes only apply to features that exist on the public test realms. We provide these patch notes to players who wish to know what features and changes exist in the test environment in order to more effectively test these features.

To learn more about the Public Test Realm, visit our Test Realm Page.

World of Warcraft PTR Patch 2.4.3

The latest patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/

The latest test realm patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/test-realm-patchnotes.html

General

* Dispel effects will no longer attempt to remove effects that have 100% dispel resistance.
* Parry Rating, Defense Rating, and Block Rating: Low-level players will now convert these ratings into their corresponding defensive stats at the same rate as level 34 players.
* Haris Pilton has launched a new line of bags and jewelry. Check her out in the World's End Tavern!
* Mounts at 30?! Yes, it's true: Apprentice Riding and mounts are now available at level 30. Training costs 35 gold.
* Blood Elf flightmasters outside of Silvermoon City and Tranquillien have traded in their bats for glorious fire-breathing dragonhawks.
* Alcohol cooldowns have been rolled into Drinks: All 10-second cooldowns have been removed and replaced with the 1-second Drink cooldown.
* Numerous flying non-combat pets have had their flight height modified to no longer skim along the ground: captured firefly, dragonhawk hatchlings, moths, owls, parrots, phoenix hatchling, spirit of summer, sprite darter, and tiny sporebat.
* Nether Ray Fry (a non-combat pet) is now available from the Skyguard Quartermaster. This requires an Exalted reputation with Sha'tari Skyguard.
* Equipping an item will now cancel any spell cast currently in progress.
* Placing an item in your bank will now cancel any spell cast currently in progress if the spell was cast by that item.
* You can no longer move backwards to stop racing rams.
* When a stun wears off, the creature that was stunned will prefer the last target with the highest threat, versus the current target.

Druids

* Barkskin: The cost of this spell is now reduced by Tree of Life Form.

Hunters

* Growl: Pets will no longer generate additional threat from this ability based on attack power buffs cast on them. Attack power buffs on their master will still indirectly increase the threat generated by the pet's Growl.
* Pet Aggro: Pets will no longer generate threat immediately from being summoned.
* Scare Beast: This spell will now be limited correctly to one target.

Mages

* Frost Armor, Ice Armor, Mage Armor, and Molten Armor are no longer Magic effects and cannot be dispelled.

Paladins

* Greater Blessing of Light Rank 1: This spell will no longer overwrite Greater Blessing of Light Rank 2.
* Summon Warhorse is now available at level 30.

Priests

* Mind Vision: This effect will now be cancelled immediately on targets who use an Invisibility Potion or Gnomish Cloaking Device.
* Spiritual Healing: Ranks 2-5 of this talent will no longer prevent refreshing Prayer of Mending.

Rogues

* Cheat Death: This talent has be

Re:patch notes?

[Nathanbp]

Those are the patch notes for the last patch (2.4.3), not the current one on the test realm (3.0.2). Sorry, as GP I'm behind a filter, so I can't post the real ones.

Re:patch notes?

[Anonymous Coward]

Those are not the 3.0.2 Patch notes... that patch is already live.

Re:patch notes?

[Fbelch]

PTR 3.0.2 Patch Notes
The latest test realm patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/test-realm-patchnotes.html The latest patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/
General

- All players will have their talent points reimbursed and will have access to new talents throughout their trees; this includes the 51-point talents. Several new spells and abilities have been added for all classes. Players will need to visit their class trainer to learn new spells.
- The Kirin Tor have made their move and so has Dalaran.Please watch your step around the crater that has been left behind!
- The Barber Shop has been implemented and you can now visit one of the Barber Shops in the major cities to change your appearance. Be sure to get your Shave and a Haircut!
- The all new Achievement System has been implemented and the Achievement panel can be accessed via the interface. While many achievements are not retroactive, we have done our best to credit as many as possible. Gamemasters will not be able to grant achievements for past accomplishements.
- Stormwind Harbor is now open for business.
- New towers have been added outside Of Orgrimmar and in Tirisfal Glades. Crews are currently at work to establish a new Zeppelin route to Northrend for your travel pleasure. Please no /spit off of the towers.
- A new entrance is now viewable in the Caverns of Time.
- Hit Rating, Critical Strike Rating, and Haste Rating now modify both melee attacks and spells.
- Spell casting and spell channeling pushback has been changed to the following:
- When casting a spell:
+ The first and second hit will add .5 secs each to the cast time.
+ All hits after the second will have no effect.
- When channeling a spell:
+ The first and second hit reduces current duration by 25% of total duration each.
+ All hits after the second will have no effect.
- Spellpower:
+ All items and effects which grant bonuses to spell damage and spell healing are being consolidated into a single stat, Spellpower. This stat will appear with the same values found on items which grant âoeincreased spell damage and healingâ such as on typical Mage and Warlock itemization.
# For classes which do not heal, they should see no change in the character sheet other than new tooltip wording.
+ Healing characters will see their bonus healing numbers on the character sheet decrease, however, all healing spells have been modified to receive more benefit from spellpower than they received fr

Re:patch notes?

[Jonah Hex]

Thanks, I followed a link to the official site from Massively's coverage of 3.0.2 and didn't notice they were linking to the older patch notes. Someone with mod points mod my post down and one of the posts with the correct notes up!
 
Jonah HEX

Re:patch notes?

[rev_g33k_101]

Way to screw the Warrior Blizzard.

I will highlight my "favs".

"Death Wish (Fury) no longer makes you immune to Fear effects."

Awww come on!?!? WTF!

"Hamstring now only has one rank and no longer causes damage" and "Pummel now only has one rank and no longer causes damage"

No damage?

"Improved Mortal Strike (Arms) now increases damage by 2/4/6/8/10%, no longer reduces cooldown"

Why the loss of a cooldown reduction?

"Overpower now only has one rank and no longer causes any bonus damage (i.e. weapon damage only)"

Again with a reduction in the damage a Warrior can do!

"Sword Specialization (Arms) can no longer trigger more than once per 6 seconds." (you missed some at the end of the list)

Again with a reduction in the damage a Warrior can do!

Generally the Arms Spec Warrior gets screwed.... looks like I am respecing

Re:patch notes?

[Anonymous Coward]

Slashdot speak:

Classes change. You will need to adapt or focus on gearing up and adding stats (resilience especially) to keep your edge.

WoW speak:

QQ, nub. Locks won't be your free HKs anymore. No more charge/intercept/mortal strike/execute/gg.

Re:patch notes?

[rev_g33k_101]

but I don't want to be a tank. I like my 2handed sword spec arms warrior, and that setup relies a lot on the use of mortal strike + high crit rating. not to mention rend + hamstring.

to make it so that a 2handed Warrior (who has a slower swing time then anybody else in the game) has to waste 2 or more swings (one for hamstring and at least 1 for pummel) and get no damage, fine! but I want frost nova to not do damage, I want entangling roots to not not damage.... and so on and so on...

Its bad enough that warriors still do not have an "escape" skill, now you are going to nerf the warriors few abilities that counteract other classes escape.

Re:patch notes?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm no warrior guru, but I'm pretty sure that instant attacks don't affect your swing timer, so hamstring and pummel (both currently and in WoLK) waste no swings at all.

In addition, I suspect that the pummel and hamstring do no damage changes are because they are now off the global cooldown, which is really a plus (they do next to no damage anyways).

Oh, and mages and druids could care less if frost nova/entangling roots did no damage. Would be better for both of them. Frost nova would no longer break cc, and entangling roots would no longer cause itself to break early.

Re:patch notes?

[rev_g33k_101]

Good point Sir.

That was a thought I didn't have.

You win this round......

Re:patch notes?

[WillAffleckUW]

actually, after careful reading of the 3.0.2 patch notes, a number of people came to the conclusion that it was more of a weakening of the rogue class, and that what most warriors lose they gain equal replacements - at least in terms of being able to p0wn rogues who try to one-shot them.

Re:patch notes?

[duckInferno]

Hi,

All of your quoted nerfs have associated godly buffs that make said changes a drop in the bucket. For example, a cooldown-less, chance-to-activate-on-bleeds overpower. Have you seen the arms talents at all? It sounds like you've been spending too much time listening to the trolls/whiners on the warrior forums.

Re:patch notes?

[theurge14]

Thank goodness. Warriors are the most OPed class in PvP.

Re:patch notes?

[Anonymous Coward]

OMG NERF!!!!
OMG OP!!!!!!

OMG... oh wait... I've stopped playing 2 years ago...

Re:patch notes?

[Il128]

Old patch notes get +5 Informative ratings? Fuck /. let's just start calling is WoWDot

Re:patch notes?

[Macgrrl]

Entangling roots not do damage - sure. Given it's the only CC in the game that has a chance to break itself (it breaks on damage), I"d accept that trade.

How about you make it so that people can't attack from Entangling Roots while you're about it.

Re:patch notes?

[Anonymous Coward]

STFU mage.

The boxes are freezing

[Anonymous Coward]

How to get the DVD to install it?

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[nicolas.kassis]

Option 6 please. Oh and to make this quicker please just use the boilerplate examples provided.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[the_fat_kid]

you insensitive clod, now what are we supposed to talk about?

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Poltras]

* "It won't be as good as Eve/Warhammer/etc."

Uh, I've been playing etc online for like a week. That game was crap. Eve/WAR maybe, but etc, never.

Collector's Edition...

[Anonymous Coward]

I wonder if they will forget to include the promised ingame pets again (at least they were "accidentally" not included in the version sold in Denmark).

In any case, it will be fun to watch the queue outside EBGames on my way to work when it's released, it was pretty insane last time.

Re:Collector's Edition...

[Jonah Hex]

I just want to know where I can pre-order the Collector's Edition (X2 one for me and one for the wife), it doesn't seem to be up yet anywhere.

Jonah HEX

Re:Collector's Edition...

[Anonymous Coward]

gamestop.com seems to have it at the moment. (limit 2 per household, so I guess that works for you.)

Re:Collector's Edition...

[Jonah Hex]

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?sku=647480

Link to Collector's Edition PreOrder thanks to the AC above for finding it on GameStop.
 
Jonah HEX

upgrades!

[theonlyalterego]

Since the majority of the MMO flames were fired above...

I'm excited, and will be dishing out the extra cash for the rediculous little pet. Why you ask? Because because because... he's shiny.

WOTLK should bring some much needed change to the gear. Not being a beta tester, I'm looking forward to seeing how the new stat distributions will play, as well as how the new talent points help/hinder/change game play.

70 prot pally - shandris tank wtf!

Re:upgrades!

[tweek]

70 prot pally - shandris tank wtf!

WTF? You too? Do I even wanna ask what your toon name is?

Distributed waste

[Tenek]

I can't help but wonder why they waste all their time making so many boxed copies for retail. Blizzard has made excellent use of P2P distribution for major patches, and all of us WotLK beta types got to download many gigs of patches.

OK, there are undoubtedly people who want to live the experience of dressing up as their favorite elf maiden and waiting in line for hours to get the box at midnight, but seriously. All you really need to buy is a key to upgrade your account. Then they can let people download the client a week before the official launch date and flip a switch at launch time to enable the new content. No waiting, no order shortages, and they can use the money they saved from not having to make 50 million discs to buy gold or something.

Re:Distributed waste

[Anonymous Coward]

Just for the huge amount of free advertisement by resellers and retail presense to attract new customers, I suppose.

Re:Distributed waste

[mapsjanhere]

well, there are those of us on Comcast that had huge issues with some of the patches when throttling was active. Nothing blows more than finding out that patch was 300 MB, you background loaded 290, and those last 10 MB take 2 h to get from blizzard's server at 32 k since P2P is disabled.
EQ went to an "empty box" expansion system (all that's in there is the code). It means horrible downloads if you have to reinstall.

Re:Distributed waste

[GameMaster]

I don't understand it either. For whatever reason, they have always been horrible about online distribution. When I went to buy my copy (Original game and Burning Legion expansion by the time I got around to joining) I first went online to find out if I could save a little money by downloading without a box. Not only was the available download the same exact price as the retail box but they didn't even have one of the two packages available for download (I think it was the expansion). Why should I pay full price for a game you didn't have to print manuals/boxes for or pay a retailer for shelf space?

Usually, I'm not a fan of buying games by download. I want a physical copy of the game so I can still play it long after the company has gone under or stopped selling the title. The only game I've ever gotten online was Half-Life 2 because I got it for free with one of my video cards and they made it as difficult as possible to request a physical copy. In my opinion, the one place where online distribution makes sense without a company trying to take undue control of how I play the game I paid for (ala. Spore) is in the case of MMOs. If the company goes out of business or stops supporting the game, the servers wont be available for use even if I do have a physical CD/DVD. It also means that I should pay less for it with the company keeping their margins the same (as long as they don't get greedy).

Re:Distributed waste

[Talderas]

This is the basic reason why owning hard disks of the game is valuable. I downloaded the client for WoW and BC on my laptop. It took me 3 nights to download them, when I could have had the game installed and patched in 1 if I had the disks.

Re:Distributed waste

[Bieeanda]

First off, not all of us are on unlimited, high-speed broadband. Second, in my experience the official P2P client is abysmal. There are vast numbers of users who never seed at all, making even small patches take an inordinately long time to download.

The price of pressing and packaging discs is negligible, especially with the economy of scale that they're operating on. They're guaranteed sales to retail chains by the hundreds of thousands; a massive, lump sale like that looks a lot better on the spreadsheets than a steady trickle of downloads, and moves the strain of demand off their servers and network.

Re:Distributed waste

[Foodie]

Because some folks don't have a fast/big connection? How about those playing from other countries with higher latency? What if you wanted to reinstall from a crash? I know I'll be getting the update via downloads. I hate collecting boxes.

Re:Distributed waste

[Anonymous Coward]

One thing they have done well is their 'streaming client' you can get with a trial account (and what I'm still using). Basically, you download the initial game code and your starting area, then you can start playing, and the game will download new areas as you move into them. Works quite well.

Re:Distributed waste

[Puffy Director Pants]

Because the retailers would have a cow about being cut out of the loop. Yeah, Blizzard could easily get by with online distribution of the expansion (though I do think many of the concerns already expressed are valid, they're not universal.), but all the retailers involved would collectively scream their rage out of not getting their slice of the pie.

Re:Distributed waste

[Anonymous Coward]

The game doesn't need to be installed, you can just copy the directory to a new PC to play. Burn your game directory to disc and you won't have to waste time installing/patching, plus all your settings/ui/keybindings will be saved.

Re:Distributed waste

[dctoastman]

You aren't paying for the box/physical media, you are paying for the effort it took to create the game in the first place. You are telling Blizzard that their years of hard work and dedication are worth $X to you.

Now, they probably see more of that money if you purchase through digital distribution rather than traditional channels. So if you truly love their products and support the company, buy it online so they have more money to dedicate to future development.

Re:Distributed waste

[bigstrat2003]

There are vast numbers of users who never seed at all...

On the Blizzard Downloader, you can't seed. It quits as soon as the patch is downloaded to run the patch.

Re:Distributed waste

[thejynxed]

The WoW updater uses a not-so-well modified Official BT client using the standard default BT ports like 6881 the last time I checked. Quite a few ISPs have totally squelched outgoing traffic on that port. Not to mention that the client itself isn't tweaked to the connection it's running on, etc. which can also kill the connection of end users.

It's also pretty safe to say that most players on there probably don't know how to configure their firewall or router either.

I think now you get the idea on why you get crappy rates on that thing.

It's why I just download any game patches from places like FileFront.

Re:Distributed waste

[WuphonsReach]

One nice thing about the (current) WoW client is that you don't *have* to install it when moving from one system to another. Just copy everything in the C:\Program Files\World of Warcraft\ folder to the new machine and you'll be off and running.

Or just make sure that you keep a backup copy (or two) of that folder in case you ever want to reinstall.

Re:Distributed waste

[duckInferno]

Neg - it stays up in the background (and patches tend to take a while to install). It also explicitly requires the user to close the downloader, unless this was removed. I've never had a problem with patch download speeds in NZ.

Re:Distributed waste

[bigstrat2003]

My Blizzard Downloader has always closed on me as soon as the patch is done, don't know why. Then again, I also quit using it and use Azureus with the torrent file, so I don't really care, either.

Re:Distributed waste

[Daswolfen]

Because I can't put the P2P download with the cd key in my figure case, behind all my WoW action figures, Figureprints of all my 70s and the knockoff Frostmourne and Warglaives replicas on either side of the case.

Yes.. I am a fan boy.

Re:Distributed waste

[Anonymous Coward]

Quite a few probably don't seed because it has the nasty habit of capping your connection, making browsing turtle-slow while seeding for example.

Simple solution would be to allow to cap bandwidth on it, as is it's simply a matter of "Why should I seed when it actually lowers my speed and makes my internet go pop?"

Re:Distributed waste

[MarcoG42]

I downloaded the "free trial" installs for WoW and BC and burned them to DVD. Also, I have a full install on my portable hard drive that I can play on any Windows PC. For some reason running it from my portable drive using wine/linux is glitchy in that it loads, but graphics don't render at all. I haven't taken the time to figure it out, since I generally just use it to play WoW at work when it's quiet and we use XP.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[TheNecromancer]

* "You can never win an MMORPG. It's a never-ending treadmill."

Yeah, but my doctor says I need the exercise.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[iamsolidsnk]

Where is the "It was fun but now I've moved on." option? Both praising it as a milestone in MMO gaming but at the same time suggesting there is more out there. If this is your way of evangelizing a WoW content patch then you forgot your [sarcasm] tags.

First Quest!

[CorporateSuit]

"Zug Zug and Welcome to Northrend! To help with the landing efforts, we're going to need you to kill 12 iceboars, 8 frost basilisks, and 10 snow buzzards!"

Re:First Quest!

[Anonymous Coward]

While you are there could you collect 8 boxes of raw materials we left behind when the snow buzzards attacked? Thanks.

Re:First Quest!

[Geek-tan]

Also, GET ME THAT BOOK!

Re:First Quest!

[sky289hawk1]

Actually the first quest in Borean Tundrea involves you meeting the general in the barrack, and killing 6 crypt fiends. That being said, the Death Knight starting zone is a well crafted masterpiece with a dynamic changing world that helps tells a gruesome and tragic tale of your death knighthood. It was one of the best 6 hours of WoW in a long time.

Re:First Quest!

[Dewin]

But it's right there!

Re:First Quest!

[WillAffleckUW]

Just remember, in this expansion, herbalists will finally become the real profit-making center of professions, since the DKs need them to provide ingredients (other than the souls).

Re:First Quest!

[electrosoccertux]

Yawn, sounds like more of the same. I enjoyed wow, but what eventually killed it for me

-People leaving pick-up-groups because their guild's raid (that they knew was coming) starting an hour after we start an instance. Leaving with nothing but "guild > pug imo". Needs a rating system of some sort, or a stats list of "uncompleted instances" vs. completed instances. Maybe if the whole group decided they wanted to quit, everybody could vote to "end instance" and not have their "uncompleted instance" count increment. But, if only one guy wants to leave, then everybody else could vote that they wanted to continue the instance, and then the guy that left for his guild, his "uncompleted instance" stat would increment.

-Blizzard's apathy towards class balance and fairness in 1v1. When another class, that you have significantly better gear than,can kill you over and over, yet you can't get to him, and he spends an hour doing this and you have to stop what you are doing, log off, and hope he goes away...then it's a big deal. Maybe I should go for warhammer.

-Idiots in general in the game. Don't know anybody in real life that likes this game, too, so I'm just stuck playing with whatever the best guild I can get into is.

Re:First Quest!

[BRSloth]

6 hours? "l2grind, noob"

Re:First Quest!

[Daswolfen]

unfortunatly, most of that was lag ;)

but the OP is right, it is FANTASTICALLY well done. the fact that the game changes with you and unlike those lazy carpenters in Lakeshire, you can see the changes happening. Plus the fact you actually feel like a participant in the story rather than the observer. I especially like the reaction you get when you come to Stormwind and have to make your way to the king while being pelted by rotten fruit and eggs, and being threatened with hanging.

So far, Blizzard have out done themselves with this expansion, despite all the QQing about servers being down and beatings with the nerf hammer.

Re:First Quest!

[Daswolfen]

umm dont roll on PVP servers if you don't want to get ganked.

Thats your own fault.

Re:First Quest!

[Anonymous Coward]

You got it wrong.

"Nice, you killed the foes. NOW go collect 8 boxes amongst the respawned foes."

Re:First Quest!

[Anonymous Coward]

Go back to the wow forums buddy.

Game news

[JoltCola]

I think it's amazing how polarized the game news is we see on /.

Warcraft - patch notes!
Warcraft - omg a trailer!
Warcraft - recruit your friends!
Warcraft - more patch notes!
Warcraft - rumors on new content!
Warcraft - WOTLK in alpha!

Though.... I guess that's what should be expected from such a massive and captivated audience. Crapflood on the news pipes.

Re:Game news

[MeanderingMind]

I think it's probably an emergent property of the nature of the game.

WoW has three advantages that make it uniquely poised to flood slashdot with news. 1) It's monstrously huge. 2) It's online. 3) It's social.

For the first point, it's fairly obvious that having a large player base inherently means you have a lot of people interested in news about the game.

Second, we can assume that everyone who plays the game has a basic modicum of internet skills. All WoW players are potential readers, while the same can not be said of everyone who plays Mario Galaxy.

Third, the social nature of the game further pushes the demographic toward sites such as Slashdot. The people who play WoW don't just want to read about it, they want to talk about it even if it's with people who don't play WoW.

The only other game bearing those three attributes is Spore. Incidentally, the only other game with as much Slashdot coverage is also Spore.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

WoW is like a treadmill that makes you fatter.

Because

[Anonymous Coward]

Box on shelf = marketing.

Some people like to have a box. It gives a sense of palpability to what they bought. In fact, too much online purchasing of video games will devalue the game in the eyes of the consumers, as it will drive home the point that all they are really buying is access to someone else's server...and all they really own is...well...nothing, really.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Vexor]

I'm pretty sure he didn't have "lifting hot pockets to your mouth" in mind when he said that.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Petersko]

"On that note, I'm a total fucking loser."

Fixed that for you.

That "fixed that for you" thing is getting really, really old. I know the best you can do is ape other people's wit, but at least let the old guard die.

"LOL, loser."

Anybody who uses LOL in a forum that doesn't limit responses to the length of a cellular text message is most certainly a loser.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[ParanoiaBOTS]

Just think of how pathetically sad it would be if there was a insanely long uncut movie of your retarded ass sitting there for day after day after day after day wasting your useless life away in front of the absolute bottom of the barrel/mass market/Brittany Spears of MMORPGs, WoW.

LOL, loser.

Versus say...trolling slashdot all day?

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Il128]

"On that note, I'm a total fucking loser."

Fixed that for you.

Just think of how pathetically sad it would be if there was a insanely long uncut movie of your retarded ass sitting there for day after day after day after day wasting your useless life away in front of the absolute bottom of the barrel/mass market/Brittany Spears of MMORPGs, WoW.

LOL, loser.

Even with the hate, that was a damn good comment.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[pdusen]

As opposed to flaming random gamers anonymously on Slashdot. Yes, I can see how your life has so much more meaning.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[virid]

/cheer SilentChris

Wait... is that man made of straw?

[Petersko]

"19.99 + 29.99 + 29.99 = 79.97 so that gets you WoW, WoW:BC, WoW:WOTLK November 23, 2004 - November 23, 2008 @14.99 per mon = 719.52 for 4 years $799.49 grand total. Yeah, I mean that's a totally reasonable price for 1 game and 2 expansions.... or not."

Or you could look at it this way. The add-on will cost you about what... 3.9% of what you've paid so far?

I said that if you play WoW the add-on is a good deal, and it is. You're arguing that WoW itself isn't a good deal. You might believe that, but that's not what I said.

For further reference: Straw Man

Re:Wait... is that man made of straw?

[Splab]

Also calculating the total paid and thinking its expensive is just ridiculous, I mean, will he stop eating because he spent a lot of money on food?

I don't play WoW, but I play other MMORPGs, and the way I see it is I get 20-30 hours of play per month, sometime more when I got the time for $15. Its hard to find anything entertaining that costs around 0.5c per hour.

Re:Wait... is that man made of straw?

[Arthur Grumbine]

Its hard to find anything entertaining that costs around 0.5c per hour.

I didn't realize you could buy anything for 1/2 a copper, and definitely not anything in the Real World, pennies being primarily zinc.

Re:Wait... is that man made of straw?

[onefriedrice]

Also calculating the total paid and thinking its expensive is just ridiculous, I mean, will he stop eating because he spent a lot of money on food?

You're not really comparing WoW with food, are you? Really? I hope I won't have to explain how unrelated that comment is, since food is a necessity and WoW/[insert any MMORPG] is merely what you choose to do with your time...

Re:Wait... is that man made of straw?

[Jor]

It's an Addiction. It doesn't need to be an essential one like food, oxygen or sex (the last being open to debate), but it is one nonetheless.

Re:Wait... is that man made of straw?

[Splab]

I didn't realize people could be so moronic, but hey, we all live and learn.

Re:Wait... is that man made of straw?

[CountBrass]

If you were a properly qualified pedant you would know that C is the symbol for carbon. The symbol for copper is Cu.

Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[Dutchmaan]

Then embrace sheer joy in the starting zone with interesting game play, a good storyline and the pleasant experience of phasing.

Then set foot into Outland, feel your heart sink as you realize that you and thousands of others exactly like you have to do the grind to 70 in same content you've been playing for the last year, while all your friends tell you how great Northrend is.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[Anonymous Coward]

It isn't that disenheartening. A casual play should be able to power through outland in about a week with a death knight. Maybe a little longer now that they have been toned down a bit. Also there is nothing saying you have to immediately roll a death knight an play it exclusively, you can switch back and forth to other character to see the new zones.

BTW the art for the new zones is generally very nice.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[BobMcD]

A casual play should be able to power through outland in about a week with a death knight.

Being a DK isn't going to shorten the 4-5 hours of play per level that much - not for anything even close to being called 'casual play'.

Face it: A DK has a minimum of 40 hours of gameplay ahead of them once they leave the starting zone, before getting to Northrend. This will be highly competitive play without much instancing or much hope of help from any non-Death Knights.

On a PvP server? God help you.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[Fozzyuw]

Well, at least you'll have a lot of other DK to level up with. =P Now if only you could find a healer for your group... hehe

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[Anonymous Coward]

Then embrace sheer joy in the starting zone with interesting game play, a good storyline and the pleasant experience of phasing.

Then set foot into Outland, feel your heart sink as you realize that you and thousands of others exactly like you have to do the grind to 70 in same content you've been playing for the last year, while all your friends tell you how great Northrend is.

The Death Knight starter area was amazing. Tons of fun. I really enjoyed the way the storyline progressed... You get to participate in the destruction of a town, actually seeing it over-run with the scourge. There's a real sense of time passing, of having an influence on the world around you.

Outland does feel like a step backwards. The world is static and unchanging, and they're all quests that I've run through dozens of times already. But the Death Knight seems vaguely overpowered at that stage of the game, and I've been breezing through the BC content. It really isn't that much of a chore. And I've got a couple other characters out in Northrend right now... So I'm basically juggling characters as rested XP allows. It really isn't that bad.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[bigstrat2003]

Except the XP per level from 60 to 70 got halved, if not thirded. It's not 4-5 hours per level any more.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[wembley fraggle]

Pfft. How many times have I ground (grinded?) a character from 0-70? Four times. A fifth won't be all that hard, and they're halving the XP requirements to get from 60-70, more or less. Outlands will blow by in about 20 hours of /played, and you'll be in northrend not too much after your friends.

I'm not saying you couldn't get to Northrend sooner if you took your already-epiced-out level 70 toon, sure you could. But getting 55-70 isn't all that hard, and in the long run, so what if it takes you an extra week or two to get to 80? We've got YEARS to enjoy the new character.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[BobMcD]

Except the XP per level from 60 to 70 got halved, if not thirded. It's not 4-5 hours per level any more.

When?

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[bigstrat2003]

As of 3.0. It's currently the case in the beta, and will hit live realms whenever 3.0 hits.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[BobMcD]

As of 3.0. It's currently the case in the beta, and will hit live realms whenever 3.0 hits.

Oh, that. Perhaps, and hopefully, but betas have a policy of being quicker to level in, as a general rule...

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[bigstrat2003]

No, they said that they're happy with the XP curve from 60 to 70, and it will go live like it currently is in beta. The curve from 70 to 80 is basically finished as well, for that matter.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[Snaller]

They are going to make it easier to get from 60 to 70.

Re:Go ahead... roll a deathknight.

[tweek]

Shit. There are 5-man DK groups running with 1 frost tank and 4 bloods. The healing alone from the bloods is enough to get through the non-70 instances.

QUICK!

[fragbait]

Every gnome in the game get ready to get your pink mohawk! ...buncha sheep. At least I'm not bitter.

-fragbait

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

You forgot one: "Khaaaaaaaan!!!!"

Oh, wait a second; The Wrath of what?

Re:patch notes? -- PTR 3.0.2 Patch Notes

[Fbelch]

These are the Proper 3.0.2 patch notes...

PTR 3.0.2 Patch Notes
The latest test realm patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/test-realm-patchnotes.html The latest patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/
General

- All players will have their talent points reimbursed and will have access to new talents throughout their trees; this includes the 51-point talents. Several new spells and abilities have been added for all classes. Players will need to visit their class trainer to learn new spells.
- The Kirin Tor have made their move and so has Dalaran.Please watch your step around the crater that has been left behind!
- The Barber Shop has been implemented and you can now visit one of the Barber Shops in the major cities to change your appearance. Be sure to get your Shave and a Haircut!
- The all new Achievement System has been implemented and the Achievement panel can be accessed via the interface. While many achievements are not retroactive, we have done our best to credit as many as possible. Gamemasters will not be able to grant achievements for past accomplishements.
- Stormwind Harbor is now open for business.
- New towers have been added outside Of Orgrimmar and in Tirisfal Glades. Crews are currently at work to establish a new Zeppelin route to Northrend for your travel pleasure. Please no /spit off of the towers.
- A new entrance is now viewable in the Caverns of Time.
- Hit Rating, Critical Strike Rating, and Haste Rating now modify both melee attacks and spells.
- Spell casting and spell channeling pushback has been changed to the following:
- When casting a spell:
+ The first and second hit will add .5 secs each to the cast time.
+ All hits after the second will have no effect.
- When channeling a spell:
+ The first and second hit reduces current duration by 25% of total duration each.
+ All hits after the second will have no effect.
- Spellpower:
+ All items and effects which grant bonuses to spell damage and spell healing are being consolidated into a single stat, Spellpower. This stat will appear with the same values found on items which grant âoeincreased spell damage and healingâ such as on typical Mage and Warlock itemization.
# For classes which do not heal, they should see no change in the character sheet other than new tooltip wording.
+ Healing characters will see their bonus healing numbers on the character sheet decrease, however, all healing spells have been modified to receive mo

It's interesting.

[gnarlyhotep]

How many of these announcements are being made before, not at, blizzcon, and how they all line up to be made within days of Warhammer Online's release. While it's normal to try and steal the spotlight from a competitor, this does seem awfully reactionary by Blizzard's normal standards of pr.

Re:It's interesting.

[bonch]

Consider that:

- Blizzard released the WotLK right after Mythic released their new trailer.
- Blizzard announced the WotLK release date the week of Warhammer's release.
- Blizzard copied the achievements system from the Tome of Knowledge and attempted a world PvP zone with Lake Wintergrasp (I say "attempted" because it's fun for maybe 10 minutes...).
- Blizzard is re-running its Shatner and Mister-T commercials.

They do indeed seem surprisingly reactionary. Having played Warhammer's early release this weekend, I think I can understand why--it's a surprisingly good game with the potential of drawing in a lot of players, including casual players, which was what WoW was originally lauded for before it turned into a grindfest. Also, fuck the Arena.

The women!

[Snaller]

Thank of all the women who are going to sit lonely and abandoned whiles their guy goes dragon hunting!

Re:The women!

[Anonymous Coward]

Wherever there is a WoW widow, I'll be there...

Re:The women!

[Anonymous Coward]

Heh, want to take my woman then? She's not a Wow widow, but still complains about my 20-hour a week playtime after I cut back from 40+ hours...

Re:The women!

[Zwicky]

I think there's a mistake in your lyrics there.

Itll keep the northrend clearer.

[Cyno01]

This is good for everybody, for those who want to roll a DK right away, they can hang out in plague lands and the outland for a couple of weeks while everybody else hits the northrend, less competition for quests and resources.

If they wanted to lighten the load on their servers even more (although theyve probably learned a thing or two since the BC launch), theyd release Starcraft II on the same day.

That would be a tough decision...

Re:Itll keep the northrend clearer.

[tnk1]

This is good for everybody, for those who want to roll a DK right away, they can hang out in plague lands and the outland for a couple of weeks while everybody else hits the northrend, less competition for quests and resources.

You wish. The Chinese leveling service will be taking care of my 4 characters I need to get from 70-80 on my 2 other accounts while I play with my new DK on the third one.

Northrend isn't going to be less crowded, its just going to be a lot less social. When most of the conversations are going to be: "You make me food/waterrr?" and "Ni hao?", you aren't going to have much witty banter. And that's assuming that there aren't whole guilds who have turned on Glider.

Luckily, there's always the Barrens.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't see an option 6. Please choose an option from * to *.

Personally, my favorite is *. It really defines me as a gamer.

OpenGL Issues

[mule007]

I hope they manage to fix the issues currently affecting users running the game in OpenGL mode (most wine users.)

My wife and I are currently trying to beta test WotLK on our systems at home with wine, but many areas, upon entering, completely white out the screen. Running the game in Direct3D mode will fix the issue, but at a severe performance penalty. The parts of the game that do have working graphics seem to be quite buggy as well. I don't really think two months will be enough time to straigten out all the bugs, so it will be interesting to see how things proceed from here.

Another month down the drain

[jaguth]

Thank you Blizzard for keeping me addicted for yet another month... assholes ;)

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[mopower70]

Our friends at ManaPotions.com would beg to differ.

All your answers here

[Snaller]

All you need to know:

http://www.lixumos.com/countdown/index.php

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

This is one of those things you'd have to run Windows to understand, right?

Why isn't it cheaper?

[Puffy Director Pants]

Because the retailers would then scream about Blizzard selling things for less.

Re:Why isn't it cheaper?

[Cadallin]

I don't buy it. Blizzard are big enough that they could tell retailers, "My way or the highway." WoW fans are gonna buy this drivel whether they can get it at retail or not. Retailers honestly don't have any leverage whatsoever, they can either take whatever scraps Blizzard gives them, or go stock games that aren't going sell. What are they going to threaten, "Don't sell WoW expansions for cheap on-line, or we won't stock StarcraftII/DiabloIII/Blizzard Battlechests! *Lip Quivering*"

Bullshit. Blizzard's just using that as an excuse so they can bilk customers for an extra $10-$15 or so when they buy on-line.

Re:Why isn't it cheaper?

[holmedog]

You apparently have never read the complaints by the big Media companies about how shelf space at Walmart has caused them to drastically decrease prices. Blizzard has nothing on any of the large distributors, and if they want shelf space, they have to compete with toothpaste and diapers the same as everyone else.

Re:Play?

[Il128]

Does anyone still play this game? I would have thought most players would have grown up and left school by now. Life gets in the way. Or perhaps WOW has destroyed many lives!

Personally I think games like WOW make it easier for the rest of us to get jobs.

If you were looking for a job at McDonald's, maybe? I kind of doubt that is even a viable option. There is no "I play a little." with these games. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HicElm2PIGQ

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[elrous0]

You forgot "Anyone else taking off a day at work for this one?" and "My name is X on X server, anyone else want to raid on November 13th?"

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

Uh, I've been playing etc online for like a week. That game was crap.

You've been playing with crap for a week?

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[kv9]

Anybody who uses LOL in a forum that doesn't limit responses to the length of a cellular text message is most certainly a loser.

LOL

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[billcopc]

Anybody who uses LOL in a forum that doesn't limit responses to the length of a cellular text message is most certainly a loser.

I have carpal tunnel, you insensitive clod!

What is a women? -Ali G

[Anonymous Coward]

Ali : Boyaka-sha. Check dis. Today we is talking about the women. I is with none other than Sue Leetch. She be none other than director of the centre for gender research and we is going to talking about ladies.
Now, one in two people in the country is "a women", so we has got to know about this. Women. They is important aren't they?
Sue : They indeed are, very important, as important as men.
Ali : Which is better? Man or Woman?
Sue : Well equality is not about who is better.
Ali : But which one is better? But one must be just a little bit better.
Sue : In what way?
Ali : Like, in the way that somefin is worse and somfin is better.
Ali : Do you think there will ever be a female Prime Minister?
Sue : There has been one.
Ali : Who?
Sue : Mrs. Thatcher.
Ali : Yeah but she wasn't a real Prime Minister. Do you think they'll ever let another one slip through?
Ali : Do you think that a women should be able to 'av any job?
Sue : I think so yeah.
Ali : Yeah, but would you feel safe thought if you new a women was flying your plane.
Sue : Would you feel safe then? Do you feel safe being driven by a women?
Ali : Nope. Would you not be scared though that she might start nattering or what ever or start finking about fings and then forget to
fly the plane, and get angry with somebody?
Ali : A lot of boys me know are trying to get their girlfriend to try a bit of feminism, do you think that if right?
Sue : Yeah I do actually I think it's a good thing.
Ali : Do you think all girls should try feminism at least once? Do you think it's right that they should try it when they is drunk at a party or what ever with one of their mates?
Sue : What is trying feminism?
Ali : You know try a bit of feminism and when they is sober wake up in the morning and get back with their boyfriend?
Sue : What do you mean?
Ali : When they kiss a women.
Ali : Me uncle Jamal say that he is tri-sexual. That he will try anything that is sexual. What does that mean?
Sue : There are a lot of people who would like to have sexual relationships with men and women.
Ali : So you think that he is saying that he is having it with blokes?
Sue : Yes.
Ali : Ayyy?
Sue : It would suggest that or that he is interested in it, but maybe not done it. It depends what done it means.
Ali : So you fink my uncle Jamal is a botty boy?
Sue : I don't think he is a botty boy but...
Ali : So you think that he just like it in both pipes?
Sue : Not necessarily.
Ali : So you think that it is a joke? Coz he is a joker. Coz if you call him that to his face he'd probably kill ya.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Shellbear]

You forgot one: "Will I NEVER have my husband to myself?!? Damn you, Blizzard, and your brilliant, endless marketing schemes that keep your revenue in the $Hundreds-of-Millions/month!!!"

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Nathrael]

Sir, please turn in your nerd card. Real nerds don't get girlfriends (except said girls are nerds too, but we all know that female geeks are sadly about as rare as that unknown space object Hubble just found).

Re:The women! must not forget them

[WillAffleckUW]

Actually, most of my friends who play WoW are women, not men.

Think of all the poor hubbies who will be saying "But sweetness, can't I roll a death knight oo?"

To which their wives will say "Step away from my pink-haired Gnome Death Knight or you're sleeping on the couch tonight!"

Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[CronicBurn]

For over a year now we have been grinding reputation, grinding gold, and grinding gear. Tier 4, Tier 5, Tier 6, Sunwell, Endless wipes on Kalecgos... And now, back to square one.

Now with "improved" talents, more level grinding, more rep grinding, special attention to things like _hair cuts_.

Completely ignore things that are really important to some people. A self sustaining economy, a trade system that is GOOD or even marginally good... Those who have played Eve KNOW a good trade skill system, and economy...

Professions that actually make money for the player instead of being an endless pit for us to wastefully throw gold at to the the 2-3 really good items that get replaced in a couple months when we clear Naxx...

I digress... I will buy the expansion, and I will play, and grind, etc. I will not be happy about it. I just cannot leave because there is nothing better yet. When there is, I and may others will just go elsewhere. Why? Because Blizzard is tuning the game to people who only play an hour a day.

Remember when "Epic" meant something? When they didn't just drop from the last boss in a 5 man?

Re:Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[skrolle2]

I will buy the expansion, and I will play, and grind, etc. I will not be happy about it.

If you pay for something you don't enjoy, that's pretty close to the definition of stupidity.

Re:Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[Anonymous Coward]

if I were able to see further, it was because I stood on the sholders of Giants -Newton

Sholdn't that be shoulders?

Re:Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[bigstrat2003]

Professions that actually make money for the player...

Alchemy. Inscription. Enchanting. Jewelcrafting. Gathering professions. All of these can make you money.

Remember when "Epic" meant something? When they didn't just drop from the last boss in a 5 man?

I raid. I enjoy it. I have raided since original WoW. That said:

If you get your enjoyment from other people not having nice gear, bye. There's the door. We won't miss you.

Re:Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[tnk1]

Unless you really have friends in the game, or it continues to be fun, just quit.

I used to be guild leader of a guild in almost exactly the same spot (we had killed Kalecgos), and I realized sometime after the Sunwell patch came out that I was just waiting for an opportunity to quit.

WoW is one of the best games of its kind ever, but you can't play it forever unless you have the right people there with you and you really enjoy it. Otherwise, you will spend too much time for too little return.

I'm going to try and get a beta key, so I can at least get a look at the new art and the DKs and then I'm going to call it quits permanently. WoW may be better than most of the competition out there, but only until you have played it out.

There are other games out there, perhaps not as good, or of a different sort, but honestly, they don't have to be Game of the Year to be entertaining, they just need to be different.

Don't stay just because you think there is nothing else. There's always an option.

Re:Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[Jorgandar]

Remember when "skill" meant something? Not "time spent grinding stuff"?

Oh, never mind. That was never the case in WOW.

Re:Sigh... there's just nothing better yet...

[ArsonSmith]

It's like saying I'd go to Vegas, but I don't want to grind on the slot machines, or BJ tables, or Poker/craps/whatever for a weekend. Pumping money into a slot machine and watching the pretty lights is fun for about a $quarter, but then I'm done. Ohh I could win this car, or this $65k jackpot, or...or...or.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[archen]

Heh, just a day? Been hearing about people taking off an entire week to play when the expansion hits. I probably play World of Warcraft too much, and I can't say I've got my life priorities strait but I sure as hell wouldn't blow a weeks vacation to play WoW. I sure hope the servers don't totally crash for like 3 days when the expansion hits or some of these people are going to be pretty pissed.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

hmm the major reason I started playing WoW again was because I was single.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[UNHOLYwoo]

liek my bff jill? Sorry, had to...

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm guessing he has a thing for high school jocks...

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Daimanta]

Welcome to Slashdot, you must be old here.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[n dot l]

Not if you play so much that you forget to eat.

You never buy this softwware, it is leased.

[Anonymous Coward]

And when you don't pay the extortion and ransom demands you no longer have an application that is of any use what so ever...not matter when you pre-ordered or how much you paid up front and have foolishly paid for months.

Buy? BWHAHAHAHAHAHA!! Whadda maroon!

This would be the part in a looney toons cartoon where you turn into a picture of a sucker and/or a jackass.

Don't fool yourself or buy the lies for one moment either, great MMORPGs exist that are free to play and don't hold things you paid for hostage. Enjoy your leases!

Re:You never buy this softwware, it is leased.

[seek31337]

Now I am going to commit suicide. Thanks for enlightening me. I am sure you don't waste $15/mo on anything frivilous. You /rent/ going to a movie. You /rent/ gas. You know, you just /rent/ food. You /rent/ the room in your moms house. Moron. BWAHAHAHAHAHAhaHAhaaaaahaaaaaHAHA!

Less time

[Glass Lizard]

My response to the upcoming expansion has been to greatly reduce my time spent playing. It just seems like the current game has lost some of it's charm now that a chunk of new content is on the way. I'm sure that when the expansion hits I'll spend a huge amount of time playing it, but until then I'll focus my spare time on other entertainment options.

Re:Less time

[MeanderingMind]

It's not so much lost charm as it is a snowball effect.

For one reason or another a few people stop playing in the face of the oncoming expansion. This puts a strain on grouping/raiding for the players who remain, some of whom will then stop playing. Rinse and repeat.

This started three or so months ago, leaving us where we are now (there's only one guild still raiding 25 mans on my server/faction).

Sounds like a porno...

[Tetsujin]

I mean, really... "Wrath of the licking"? ...Yeah, I'd like to see that one.

Re:Sounds like a porno...

[spire3661]

Its pronounced as 'litch', I have mod points and I wasted the opportunity to mod in this thread to tell you that.

WoW treadmill

[OglinTatas]

I rigged up a "desk" such that I can use my computer while I pedal my stationary bike. (the bike doesn't fit anywhere near my regular desk.) Works pretty well. 300 kcal/day easy just playing WoW. It would even be a decent CV workout if I actually cranked it, instead of the leisurely rate I do.

I'm sure you can do something similar with a treadmill, but first you have to take the boxes off of it and get it out of the basement. Probably wouldn't work with a rowing machine, weight bench or bowflex (but taking the boxes off of those and the drying clothes off the bowflex would be a good start though.)

Re:WoW treadmill

[Hoi Polloi]

There are little mini peddle devices you can get for under your desk without any rigging. I think they are marketed mainly for physical rehab but that should match the needs of most hardcore WoW players.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[DeadBugs]

Wait for the Misc. expansion.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Etrias]

* "It'll be more of the same."
* "You can never win an MMORPG. It's a never-ending treadmill."
* "Thank God I got off that crack a year ago."
* "It won't be as good as Eve/Warhammer/etc."
* "Blizzard isn't going to get another one of my dollars after that DMCA bullshit."
* "I'm waiting for Diablo 3/StarCraft 2."
* "I hate PC games. Console games rule."
* "I have my copy on preorder."

I think I've covered the major ones.

Fixed that for you.

Emphesis

[Skuldo]

The emphasis tags show up in the RSS feed titles, FYI.

$800 for just one game?

[Anonymous Coward]

No, $800 for one game is not a great deal at all. There is not enough effort put into it on the development side to justify such an extravagant price tag. Furthermore, if you can be entertained sufficiently by playing just that one game for hours and hours then it is quite likely that you can be perfectly entertained with less expensive options, like Neverwinter Nights or Diablo II or a ball of yarn.

Re:$800 for just one game?

[ukyoCE]

Obviously it's personal choice if you think it's worth it overall or not.

But saying WOW is $800 for 'one game' is a bit misleading. WOW has continually changed since release, with dramatic expansions and a ton of new content.

Even if you never bought the expansions, you can still play the original game and use all the revised talent trees, new abilities, etc.

Also consider it has a co-op leveling game, a small-multiplayer tournament game, a large-multiplayer round-based game with several maps to choose from, large-group end-game raid content, etc.

Again, not to say this means it's perfect for everyone. The RPG aspect devalues a lot of the multiplayer games, for instance. But comparing WOW to a traditional game is a bit disingenious.

I would argue that WOW is certainly 'worth' some arbitrary amount more than regular games, and it also has tremendously higher development and maintenance costs due to the ongoing development and Blizzard's hosting of the servers. So it's not like they're spending the same amount on development and just raping customers' wallets.

Re:$800 for just one game?

[JAlexoi]

Look at it this way:
- Single game HL2(each episode) MAX ~20 hours of entertainment at 19.99 current price is ~$1 per hour.
- Movie 1.75 hours of entertainment at roughly $10 is $5.71 per hour.
- TV free intitially(but due to comm's you buy a tonn of crap you dont need), say, $1000 later on for 24hrs of entertainemnt is ~$41 per hour.
- World of Warcraft average it out at 5 hours per week and we get yearly average of 18* hours of entertainment per month at $15(and added the upgrades) is $0.90 per hour.
With hard core players it's lower than $0.30 per hour with minimal of $0.03 if played for 16 hours per day, each day

Look at the reality, it's just plain cheaper entertainment. It's quite dynamic, you interact with people, in fact you are forced to interact with people and the game itself is interactive.

* - number of hours is very large, and this is a very modest amount of time.

Re:First Quest! or Stats vs Guild Rep

[WillAffleckUW]

Actually, in my RP guild, Squirrelly Wrath, one of the preconditions for guild leveling will become use of the /hug and /love actions with squirrels, as well as killing off of heretic squirrels, so I can see how bailing from an instance is less important than a guild raid.

But on a PvP server, this might be critical - do we get credit for drops due to server disconnects, as I've frequently had that happen ...

Re:It's interesting. but is it new?

[WillAffleckUW]

Consider that:

- Blizzard released the WotLK right after Mythic released their new trailer.
- Blizzard announced the WotLK release date the week of Warhammer's release.
- Blizzard copied the achievements system from the Tome of Knowledge and attempted a world PvP zone with Lake Wintergrasp (I say "attempted" because it's fun for maybe 10 minutes...).
- Blizzard is re-running its Shatner and Mister-T commercials.

They do indeed seem surprisingly reactionary. Having played Warhammer's early release this weekend, I think I can understand why--it's a surprisingly good game with the potential of drawing in a lot of players, including casual players, which was what WoW was originally lauded for before it turned into a grindfest. Also, fuck the Arena.

Hmmm.

Achievements predate online RPGs - they were part of FTF RPGs much earlier, in fact some AD&D systems had them in the 80s.

Haircuts are really there because, let's face it, we all want to be a Nightelf Mohawk riding on a Frostsaber. Well, except for when we're a pink-pigtailed Gnome Mage riding on her psychedelic flying carpet ...

Re:Sigh... is it better or is it memorex?

[WillAffleckUW]

Actually, now you can be an herbalist and bring in the big bucks since the DC class requires your ingredients for their abilities.

And, to be quite frank, there's a lot more of us who can only spare an hour every day or two than there are people who depend on their mom to tend to their basic needs ...

Re:Play?

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no "I play a little." with these games.

This is a lie. You are a liar.

Scalping by Major Store?

[Databass]

In a seemingly sleazy move, GameStop has added a $15 "Handling Fee" to the WotLK Collector's Edition. Not a SHIPPING and Handling fee mind you, shipping is extra. This is just straight grafting in the style of:

"Oh HO, it seems some of you WANT this product do you? And we're the only one with the Collector's Edition right now! Weeellp, the box is all the way over there on the shelf and I'm kinda tired... maybe an extra $15 could motivate me to lean over there and get it for you. If you don't, I'm sure someone else will pay extra for the LIMITED SUPPLY of these! You've made the right choice."

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=72700

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Jorgandar]

You forgot one

"I have my copy on preorder." :p

mmoRPG????

[Anonymous Coward]

funny things named h4xslash0r and m4st3rk1ll4 are no RPG
now get the off my lawn!

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[VanGarrett]

To be fair, most of the female nerds out there aren't very attractive and/or masquerade as men on the internet.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[vux984]

Anybody who uses LOL in a forum that doesn't limit responses to the length of a cellular text message is most certainly a loser.

lol, like wtf, and a few other related acronyms predate cellphone SMS, and go back to the inception of email, irc, muds, and newsgroups (usenet).

I don't have much patience for people who write:

wat r u doing? wil u plvl me?

but "lol" or "wtf" or "rtfm" or "lmao" etc don't get to me at all.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Macthorpe]

I also happen to think that an insanely long uncut movie of you writing Slashdot trolls would be pretty pathetically sad.

I don't think you can judge someone's life by "Would it make a good movie?". There's precious few existences that would live up to that benchmark.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[ArsonSmith]

Well, November does have me close to the use or lose time for my vacation so a week may not be as bad as it would seem.

Re:The women! must not forget them

[Snaller]

You are just hoping all the hot women you are hitting on in Stormwind really are women ;)

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[alisson]

I work at target, so no pre-order for me. I'll just buy it before we open :D

OH WAIT! I meant to say "It won't be as good as Champions... if it actually gets made"

wtf?

[dougnaka]

I thought MMORPG's failed due to Darwinian evolution of their players and (lack of) offspring? Oh, maybe I'm a few years early. Sounds awesome, I pre-ordered like 50 copies and will play them all at once until I win and stuff. Plus I'll get the super platinum monthly and farm out some, but not most!, of the play to India. The MMORPG is dead, Long live the MMORPG! PS, GFYS

Bored with WoW

[freedom_surfer]

Wow has become incredibly stale. I just let my account expire this month because there was nothing fun to do. The instanced PvP is just a grind in a different form and pretty weak at that. Granted all these are my opinions. Myself, I am giving Warhammer a run. I know they also released this before it was ready, but at least its new. And in all my years of MMO, Camelot had the most fun PvP scenarios with its siege warfare. I was in the Warhammer open beta and I can say they have kept with Camelots good traits. (although I wish there were 3 sides...supposedly it comes down to story line...boo..but I digress...hehe) Anyway, I hope WoW's expansions lives up to its acclaim, because if it doesn't, when the rest of you decide to check out Warhammer, my toon will be fighting in the upper tier realm vs. realm... =P

I should end this by stating I had tons of fun in WoW when it first came out. Blizzard had managed to fix so many things that were wrong with fantasy MMO's, eliminating much of the stuff that was just a time waster. Sadly, I think they are falling into this trap now just to keep subscribers. Once gameplay starts to suffer for the bottom line, thats when I start to get bored, and fast. Again, IMHO.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[narcberry]

You forgot:

And with one quick stroke, Blizzard, again, swipes the legs out from your stool of achievement. Your only hope to regain your previous uber is to purchase the expansion, keep paying your monthly fees, and ultimately try to not think that all your future effort will be trashed as easily soon.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Jor]

Hide all pizza delivery flyers. Problem Solved.

Re:The women! must not forget them

[JosKarith]

Not a WOW player myself, but of my friends who do play WOW I'd say about 2/5th are women. Gamer girlies are not as rare as you think - my other half's managed to rack up about 150 hours in Oblivion and it's only that low cos' I want time on the 360 too...

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[prenk20]

Excuse me for being pedantically obvious but isn't StarCraft 2 developed by Blizzard? You claim you are going to buy it yet you iterated before that you shall not give Blizzard another of your dollars.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

How did you get to preorder it????? I wanna please :)

Re:The women! must not forget them

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, most of my friends who play WoW are women, not men.

Good to see that the Blizzard marketing department has both a good understanding of its key demographic, and where they are to be found. Just watch the number of subscribers skyrocket!

what do u prefer?

[Anonymous Coward]

Nowadays people only pay WoW or online casino games like poker... Videogames or online games, wich is better?

No drama, sorry to burst your bubble

[Shivetya]

First point, everyone knew it was coming THIS year.

Second point, the announcement date is exactly two months from release date.

Third point, if Blizzard wanted to pee on Mythic's party they would do something in game which makes pvp/raiders not want to miss out on.

Fourth point, with 10 million subs do think Blizzard cares what Mythic does? Considering the amount of content/features chopped from WH I am amazed it actually played decently.

Fifth point, WH has a serious balance problem, enough so people are having fits. 3:1 is not healthy for PvP.

Re:No drama, sorry to burst your bubble

[gnarlyhotep]

Fourth point, with 10 million subs do think Blizzard cares what Mythic does?

Why do people keep saying this? What planet do you live on where company executives and shareholders do not care about their revenues?

Complacency is not a laudable attribute for a company. If they do in fact think "we have 10 million subscribers, what do we care?" then they are setting themselves up for failure. They have other projects in the works that require funding, infrastructure costs, payroll costs, and shareholder expectations to uphold (regardless of them being publicly traded or not). If their revenues go down, they have to answer questions and run the risk of not having the funding to uphold their budget. Do you really think Blizzard doesn't care about that?

Just for the sake of argument, let's assume that 1 million people leave wow for warhammer and cancel their accounts (numbers completely made up). $10/month for each customer, that's $10 million/month gone, $120 million/year. Do you really think they're not going to notice or care about that? I can tell you anyone who's invested with an expectation of return upon that investment is going to care and ask a lot of uncomfortable questions. Wall street has destroyed companies for failing to meet projected earnings by $120 million over a year. I don't see how blizzard is magically immune to that because they make WoW and have 10 million subscribers currently.

Or to make a bad analogy: imagine telling your spouse you got docked 10% of your paycheck for the next year.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Bill_the_Engineer]

I think he objected to the small number of letters:

Maybe you should've typed:

ROFLMAO

Re:The women! must not forget them

[Anonymous Coward]

On which server are they playing?

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

You forgot:

"Shamans got nerfed AGAIN (see Earthen Power)"
"Druids are still OP to the point of being broke."
"Warriors are still OP to the point of being broke."
"Rogues are still OP to the point of being broke."

HTH

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[TheLinuxSRC]

Ummm.... No.

Re:The women! must not forget them

[instar]

My husband and I recently bought a second 360 so we didn't have to fight over who got to play Oblivion =) He plays on the projector screen and I play on the TV, in the same room.

Really, gaming together isn't much different than watching TV together. Gaming is interactive and often involves problem/puzzle solving, and for me at least is much more fun than watching the same 5 plots get repeated week after week on TV.

For what it's worth, we both also play WoW, along with two other couples. So I believe there are more women out there than a lot of people would like to think.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Hoi Polloi]

I prefer to play "e.g." myself (for example).

"Etc" just goes on, and on...

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Hoi Polloi]

Anyone who uses the tired comment "you insensitive clod" is just like in Soviet Russia...

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

In Soviet Russia, insensitive clod tires of you!

Re:

[CronicBurn]

I guess our views on the game are quite different. I actually enjoyed working for my epics pre-bc. We worked hard for them, and when you walked around in epics, people understood that you busted your ass to get them.

My main problem with the game, is that it's catering to people who want end-game items just handed to them.

If you are one of those lazy people, thanks, you ruined the game. If you only have 1 hour to spend in the game a day, you should be in blues, and happy about it.

I still play the game because I still enjoy end game content, and I expect I'll simply roll over and deal with the shortcomings at this point, because I still have friends in the game who play. I have had many more friends however, who have left the game, because of these same issues.

Thanks for the obligatory comment about living with parents, I would only have expected that on the WoW Forums, not on Slashdot. I would imagine that people who actually post here would be well out of their parents house, most with actual carriers, and kids. I guess not.

Now to figure out how to spell check my signature...

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Anonymous Coward]

Interesting... there's got to be a way to combine the two. WoW is probably much easier to play while on a treadmill than twitch gaming.

Re:The women! must not forget them

[WillAffleckUW]

Most probably aren't. I'm referring to actual friends, who I met first FTF, and of my friends, most of those who play WoW are actually women.

Actually, they're way more hard-core than I am.

But, yeah, most of the pixels running around may not be women - strangely, they tend to choose male characters.

Re:The women! must not forget them

[WillAffleckUW]

Various servers - one is on Sen'jin, but they seem to be all spread out on servers.

Re:Here, I'll get the basic comments out of the wa

[Macgrrl]

Strongly considering taking the 14th off work, 1. it's a Friday, 2. it isn't released until the 14th in Aust - probably a midnight launch again where my order is held.

Confirming my CE copy today (fingers crossed). EB Australia won't take pre-orders for the Ce until it's officially announced but will convert the first X# of pre-orders to CEs. My preorders are now 1 year and 1 week old. :)

Neverwinter Nights (OT)

[ZzzzSleep]

I bought Neverwinter Nights recently. Do you have any suggestions about where to look for good mods? Thanks!

Want countdown?

[Snaller]

No its not, redundant, its very important for us to know how much time is left.

http://www.lixumos.com/countdown/index.php

Re:The women! must not forget them

[Snaller]

"But, yeah, most of the pixels running around may not be women - strangely, they tend to choose male characters."

Why strange? Perhaps they do if for the same reason the men does it: Pleasing curves ;)

Re:The women! must not forget them

[WillAffleckUW]

Well, I must admit my male blood elf hunter looks all spiffy in his leathers and furs ...