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Facing 16 Years In Prison For Videotaping Police
krou sends this snip from the Maine Civil Liberties Union: "The ACLU of Maryland is defending Anthony Graber, who faces as much as sixteen years in prison if found guilty of violating state wiretap laws because he recorded video of an officer drawing a gun during a traffic stop. ... Once [the Maryland State Police] learned of the video on YouTube, Graber's parents' house was raided, searched, and four of his computers were confiscated. Graber was arrested, booked, and jailed. Their actions are a calculated method of intimidation. Another person has since been similarly charged under the same statute. The wiretap law being used to charge Anthony Graber is intended to protect private communication between two parties. According to David Rocah, the ACLU attorney handling Mr. Graber's case, 'To charge Graber with violating the law, you would have to conclude that a police officer on a public road, wearing a badge and a uniform, performing his official duty, pulling someone over, somehow has a right to privacy when it comes to the conversation he has with the motorist.'" Here are a factsheet (PDF) on the case from the ACLU of Maryland, and the video at issue.
... you've nothing to be afraid of. So, I wonder what it is they're afraid of?
Its unfortunate that he will most likely win (atleast, we all hope) and will probably end up getting some money out of the state for his trouble. But the thing is, the people that made those decisions won't be punished, its the tax payers that will be punished because now the defecit due to the lawsuit has to be made up for.
I know your family's grievin'... FUCK 'em...
Cop Killer... 'cause tonight... we... get... even...
If Maryland only required one party involved in a conversation to be aware for a recording to be legal, this bullshit charge would never fly. Such is the case in Canada, and the majority of US states.
"Live as if you'll die tomorrow." Ridiculous. You could die later today.
It's growing more and more apparent every day. It's a shame that when we start doing something about it we'll be completely unarmed, defenseless, and powerless.
Camping on quad since 1996.
When is anyone anywhere going to learn about the Streissand Effect? This would only even be slightly more idiotic or ironic if in they video, they're pulling over Barbara Streissand herself. Now millions of people and probably CNN if it's a slow news day will pick up this story and know what a bunch of assholes these morons are and there will be resignations and law suits and blah blah blah just because of a few arrogant jackasses trying to use scare tactics. Well, at least the good news is they're all going to get what they deserve.
Btw, since they're probably not above suing over comments about this story also, SUBPEONA THIS! *flips off the screen*
Lol, just try and take me to court to make me prove you're all jackasses as stated (and make it a jury trial.)
Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
We're all one traffic stop away from total financial ruin and potentially jail. If it's not for something illegal today, it'll be for something illegal tomorrow, or simply something the police think might be possibly illegal.
Whether he's found guilty or not, his life is basically over.
If he's lucky, the ordeal will cost him thousands (maybe tens of thousands) when it's all said and done, and he wont get any of his stuff back. He'll have an impossible time getting a job, a loan, a security clearance, etc. with an arrest in his background. Many (most?) employers now ask if you've merely been arrested, regardless of whether you were charged or found guilty, so he'll be making minimum wage at best.
If he's unlucky, he'll have a bunch of jack-booted "law and order" Americans on his jury who side with the police by default and just want to see more people put in jail.
I can't speak for MD in particular (although I do live here) but beyond the pernicious "the public can't watch us do the public's work" aspect of this is those dashboard cameras we all love on America's Funniest Car Chases and whatever. I've certainly seen clips that include audio from the citizen as well as the police officer--are we to take it that these too are felonious wiretaps?
This next song is very sad. Please clap along. -- Robin Zander
You could kill someone and get less than that... (as long as the person you kill isn't a cop)
First step would be to learn about the laws involved. This is not a US wide law, this is state by state and the majority of states are not like this. If your state is affected, then set about trying to change it. You might discover that your state representatives don't even know. This shit was drafted up a long time ago in most cases. You make them aware they are a two party state and the consequences, maybe they work to fix it. If not, you continue the quest along other avenues.
However bitching about the USA being a "Police State" on a message board does no good.
And before you shoot back at me, I live in a one party state, so this particular issue is not one I concern myself with. My legislature has already made the correct choice, and we can record if we like.
I love how video+audio = "wiretapping", which is by definition, tapping into the wires of a phone or communications system to record the conversation. So have the politicians been jailed for taking video of their child at school and happened to video someone else? Have people been arrested for using a digital recorder at the local college lectures? What about the new crew?
We were all warned a long time ago that MS products sucked, remember the Magic 8 Ball said, "Outlook not so good"
Fuck yeah I am glad I don't live there. Would you like to import some of our (backward) European freedoms?
Re "private communication between two parties" :)
Funny how when a multinational Internet search and advertising corporation gets caught doing a wifi traffic stop, its a mistake.
No servers confiscated
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
I actually read an article about issues like this, and it seems different states have different wording in their wiretapping statutes. In some states, the audio part of the recording is what's illegal (many cellphones and pocket cameras record audio when they record video with no way to turn the microphone off). In other states, there's an exemption if it's obvious to all parties that what's happening is being recorded (local Channel 5 reporters with 50-pound cameras talking into a huge mic.) or if it's taking place in a public area (no privacy in public, remember?) but it seems judges are ignoring the public area exemption in cases like these.
If you have such a video, submit it to your local news station with a note requesting anonymity, or use a Youtube account created and accessed via TOR. If the police confiscate your camera/phone, you can sue and successfully get it back.
One thing I do wonder: how is it not a violation for cops to have dashboard-mounted cameras that record audio and video constantly, yet a brief cellphone video of a pulled-over cop is a violation.
Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
What Graber filmed was called a Terry Stop and the cop is able to search you without a warrant within your "wingspan" to check for weapons that may threaten him or other people. There are a lot of laws that cops often break on Terry Stops. My car was searched on my own property under the guise of a Terry Stop, which of course is wildly illegal, but I digress.
What Graber is "facing" is a maximum..he will never serve it unless he decides to roll the dice with a jury, blows trial and the judge sentences him to the maximum. Since the ACLU is involved, you can bet that will never happen.
But States and more often, the Feds will indict you for offenses that carry insane sentences in order to convince you to plead out, as the vast majority of people do. I did. I was facing five life sentences plus 105 years for an offense no one had ever been jailed a day on before. If I went to trial and lost on one single count, I would have done fifteen years, mandatory. (No parole in feds, BTW...you do 87.5%) I signed for five years, did 52 months.
Now, would you have fought? Really? Many people say they would, but it's a lot different when you are considering giving your life to 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty. When you realize that the whole system is set up to plead out 95+% of cases and do anything possible to convince you to not go in front of a jury, the average person has almost no chance in the system as it is set up. You didn't do it? That doesn't matter. It's what you can PROVE to a jury. And most of the time, the Government has much better lawyers and resources, so Graban is actually lucky...he won't serve a day, IMVHO.
CSI, Law and Order are worse than misinformation..they are propaganda, brainwashing us into thinking the system is fair and equal. It isn't. Graber is lucky that his case has publicity value. He may be "facing" sixteen years, but he'll never serve any.
But we aren't all lucky. We are indeed one Terry stop away from ruin. Be careful.
"The pie shall be cut in half and each man shall receive.....death. I'll eat the pie."
If the cop was doing wrong, wouldn't that make him a whistleblower?
I'm not a lawyer or anything, but it seems if he's exposing wrong doing, then couldn't he protected by those laws?
While we can get all indignant about how asinine this is and how the laws are stupid. What can we do if he does lose this case and goes to prison. What is our recourse? There isn't one. While I'd love to be able to look back and say this was some landmark case that caused some sort of sane reform, I just dont see that happening, and I just don't see Maryland replacing the politicians that are allowing this farce to continue.
Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
Definately, not you.
This is an excellent point. If they win this case a standard question on being stopped by the police should be "do you have a warrant for that wiretap?".
This is exactly why Basil Marceaux has been running for governor of Tennessee, so he can stop "slavery at traffic stops." Always wondered what he meant by that.
Support House Concurrent Resolution 298, "Expressing the sense of Congress that the videotaping or photographing of police engaged in potentially abusive activity in a public place should not be prosecuted in State or Federal courts." US citizens, click here to write your congressional representative.
Just imagine if LAPD pulled that on the person who filmed the Rodney King incident.
-Fiend-
If I wasn't guilty of what I was being accused of, yes. If I was guilty, I'd probably opt to take the quickest way out rather than fight.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Out of interest, were you guilty of any crime?
But regardless - the way plea bargaining works in the US is a travesty of justice. The whole system is weighted to encourage it as well. It requires much less work and no aditional staff costs (e.g. researches) for a DA to negotiate a plea bargain.
While I would defend 100% his right to post this video, there is one thing I wouldn't have done (well, two things really) if it were me:
1. Put the 120+MPH bit on YouTube. That's just asking to attract more unwanted police attention. I'd have just posted the last bit (where he admits to 69 and 80 mph, probably what he got the ticket for) and not put the bit where he overtakes the bus.
2. Do 120+ on a busy highway in the first place.
There's a time and place to go hooning, and it's called a very quiet road where no other traffic is, and where you're reasonably sure there are not cops lurking. And if you do get caught and get a ticket for 80 mph, for heaven's sake don't then admit to 120 in a YouTube video!
Oolite: Elite-like game. For Mac, Linux and Windows
Great, and on an even more cheery note we are about to add "Pedro Stops" to the list of harassment tools here in Arizona.
Any way to donate to this poor guy to help him defend himself?
I have an honest question for you: Why the fuck do you still live in that country?
Honestly, a place where cops are practically untouchable, the justice system amounts to "plea guilty and do a few years, or else...." and guilt is determined by your average group of mouthbreathers with an extremely mis-placed sense of justice on a power-trip. Why the hell would anyone want to live there?
People, what a bunch of bastards
Between a victim and an innocent victim. What the GP is saying is that yes, the wiretapping charge is BS and he's a victim in that way. However the guy was wildly and dangerously breaking traffic law. It isn't as though the police just found a guy at random and said "Let's pick on him!" The guy is a victim, but not at all innocent.
>But States and more often, the Feds will indict you for offenses that carry insane sentences in order to convince you to plead out, as the vast majority of people do. I did. I was facing five life sentences plus 105 years for an offense no one had ever been jailed a day on before. If I went to trial and lost on one single count, I would have done fifteen years, mandatory. (No parole in feds, BTW...you do 87.5%) I signed for five years, did 52 months.
Lol. Yeah I hear ya.
>Now, would you have fought? Really?
Best time is before your in custody.
The very second public officials -- be they law enforcement or not -- are legally protected from public scrutiny, our freedom is over.This officer, whoever he is, is *supposed* to be protecting the public, not operating as he or his department sees fit without the possibility of repercussions. This is BULLSHIT, plain and simple.
Just saying, it's the kind of crap our goverment pulls (well, the last one, mainly)
I want a list of atrocities done in your name - Recoil
(Trying again, sorry if this is a repost)
To Judge StupidWhoSignedTheWarrant and OfficerNe'erDoWell:
We have studied your case, and we have determined two scenarios:
1. You will throw a productive citizen in prison for the crime of catching you breaking procedure. This will cost the state his future income tax, property tax, registration fees, sales taxes, and various other regulatory fees, in addition to his productive life while we pay for his room in board to train him to be an actual criminal, assuming that he survives being in a prison he doesn't belong it.
2. You will have cost the state several million dollars we have to pay him in a settlement because your ego couldn't stand that you got caught breaking your own rules.
In either case, your actions will have cost the state millions of dollars, when we could have given you a two week "suspension" at the outset with an admonition of "there are camera everywhere now, you never know who is watching." Instead, you had to make an anatomical compensation, and we are paying the price for it. As a result, you will find that we are adjusting your taxes accordingly. I'm sure you're aware of the Department of Revenue's stellar relationship with the citzenry, and we hope you look forward with getting to know Agent BallSqueezer for the rest of your life.
-The Citizens of Maryland.
Now I know where the music industry gets its ideas from.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
I have one of many answers:
Once convicted of a felony, it is hard to get a visa much less an immigration status to any 2nd world country.
It's really not that easy to get OUT of this country either..
Takes cash for one. And someplace to go. Which may or may not have their own set of insane rules about moving to that country.
For the most part. America is still an 'ok' place. But it's about time to leave because it's getting worse.
And the pisser is the only people who could actually FIX how fucked up our country is..... Are the ones fucking it up.
If you ever have the misfortune to have to travel to Maryland, be sure to bring your passport so you can get back into the United States. As any former Maryland resident can tell you, the Maryland State Police have a long tradition of fascist behavior. During the corrupt tenure of former Maryland Emperor Schaefer, the State Gestapo were frequently reported for following persons who spoke out during the governor's speeches back to their homes and harassing them, even arresting them on trumped up charges of threatening Herr Schaefer. Whatever you do, don't talk back to one of the stormtroopers during a traffic stop. You'll get worked over with a nightstick, get arrested for assaulting the officer, and have your car stolen and sold at auction to pay for it all. If you simply can't avoid traveling in Maryland, then at least practice saying "yes sir, officer" in a mirror and make it sound *sincere*.
And what did they find in your car?
The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
First thing you learn in a lawsuit (not criminal in my case, but same idea applies), is that the truth doesn't matter. Once you are in a lawsuit you are now playing a game and you have to do whatever it takes to win the game, whether that means maintaining your innocence when you are guilty or admitting guilt when you are innocent.
I find it extremely hard to believe that you were charged with five life sentences for doing nothing. Not a whole lot of crimes carry a life sentence. What's more, to be charged with a federal crime, special circumstances have to apply.
Also there is the simple thing that I heard from a friend of mine who interns with the public defender's office "I've never met a guilty man in jail." What he means by that is that EVERYONE claims they didn't do anything wrong. It is rare almost to the point of non existence to find someone who says "Ya I did what they said, I should be here." They all think they are innocent and come up with justifications.
He, of course, sees the other side of that with people who are clearly guilty as hell that he helps represent.
Plus there's your disdain for jurors. This "people too stupid to get out of jury duty," thing is very tiring. I've twice been called for jury duty, neither time chosen to serve, but not because I tried to get out of it. I'd gladly serve on a jury, it is my duty. The people that did get to serve were actually roughly as educated as the public, which is to say several had university degrees. Hell look at the recent Terry Childs case where all the geeks cried about how "stupid" the jury was... Only to find out that a CCIE sat on the jury and had extremely good reasons for why they voted how they did.
So sorry, but I don't buy in to this "I didn't do anything wrong but somehow they managed to charge me with five life sentences!" thing. You have to go to something like committing a robbery using a gun minimum to qualify for a life sentence, and there has to be special circumstances that is a federal and not state matter.
Obviously that community needs someone to protect them from the police. Crack whores?
In Soviet Russia, police wiretap you!
I was facing five life sentences plus 105 years for an offense no one had ever been jailed a day on before.
You have made me extremely curious as to what this offense might be. Would you consider please telling us more?
Really? If you were completely innocent, but had been indicted on Federal charges that would most likely put you away for life if you blew trial, or you were offered a two year plea deal, you'd actually gamble your life on twelve people who hear a very colorized version of the truth?
The cold facts:
93.6% of Fed cases result in a guilty plea.
75.6% of Fed criminal defendants are convicted following trial.
97% of Fed criminal defendants are sentenced.
82.8% of Fed criminal defendants receive a prison term.
That's not guilty defendants: it's ALL defendants.
Many of the people I met in Fed prison had either done nothing, or something so minor as to certainly not merit hard time. (I was a bit of a jailhouse lawyer..not much else to do.) I saw guys serving 20 years for making a phone call. I am not kidding.
As I said, it doesn't matter at ALL whether you did it or not. It matters what you can prove. And trust me, it's YOU that needs to do the proving, innocent till proven guilty is BS.
So, maybe you didn't do it, but you almost certainly will lose at trial. Yes, you''l be "right" and will have the moral high ground,..and wear khakis the rest of your life.
"The pie shall be cut in half and each man shall receive.....death. I'll eat the pie."
I saw the video. The cop is in an unmarked car and plain clothes. He pulls up past the motorcycle while it's stopped at an exit, veers in front of it, stops, and gets out with a gun drawn, saying, "Get off the motorcycle. Get off the motorcycle! Get off the motorcycle. State police."
So what if this guy had been exercising the second amendment, and happened to be an overconfident quick-draw artist, and got "lucky" enough to shoot first?
Right up until he says "State police," it doesn't look like a traffic stop to me. It looks like a crime in progress. Even then, pretty much anyone can say "police". He could at least flash a badge. The video did cut off right there, but that was more than enough time for something bad to happen.
Why your contempt for juries? It's the last line of civil defense against unjust laws.
This is the gazillionth story I've heard of Maryland cops wantonly abusing their power.
The most blatant one I've heard happened to a coworker of mine from Bethesda in about '98. His car had been stolen and was reported to the police about a month prior to the incident. The police had actually recovered his vehicle and he had picked it up at the city impound lot earlier in the week.
On a Friday night, he was pulled over while riding with a friend. The cops ran to his car with guns drawn, pulled the doors open, dragged them out of the car, forced them to the ground, and kicked the crap out of them. All the while they were both of course shouting that this was their car and trying to show ID etc.
After they were both beaten into submission, the cops did eventually look at the car papers and ID, and then verified with their dispatcher that the car had been recovered that week, after which they simply drove away. I believe there were exchanges of something along the lines of "you have no proof of anything".
Now, my friend should have gotten a lawyer, but where he messed up was that he & his dad went to the police station to complain, which got them basically nowhere. Actually this was also about the time he left our mutual employer and we haven't really discussed it since, so I'm not sure how it turned out in the end.
Cops on duty shouldn't have any privacy. Everything they do should be recorded (except when cost would prohibit recording). As a tax payer, and therefore, the employer of all police officers, I want to make sure my employees are behaving.
I disagree with that to some extent.
Cop is on duty even when he goes to bathroom. Cop is on duty even when he sends an e-mail to his doctor (I'm assuming that the goverment offers them some form of healthcare, though I'm not familiar with how the system works in USA) about some problem of his. Cop is on duty when he asks that secretary from another department to go out with him. Cop is on duty when he tells a (perhaps slightly sexist or the like) joke to a co-worker... IE: They are workers and humans like all of us. I think we are only shooting ourselves in the foot if we try to rob them the amount of limited privacy that pretty much all other employees can expect. Even though I don't have anything that big to hide at my workplace, I would be calling my union if the boss tried to record every minute of my life there. If the union couldn't help (in my country, I'm pretty sure they could), I would find another place to work. If that wouldn't be an option, I would continue working there but be a lot more dissatisfied and angry about my job, life, etc... Which might not be what you want if my job might involve me pointing a gun at you!
What I am arguing for is their limited privacy even on duty because very few of us actually work nonstop from the time we go to work to the time we leave. We need some socializing with co-workers, breaks, a moment of browsing slashdot... Without fearing that all of that is recorded (Or worse: the records are made public and some "journalist" goes through all of them trying to find something that he can misinterpret to make it scandalous). Many people seem to think that public employees don't deserve that same time but I am fairly certain that if we took it away from their, there would be a lot of negative consequences.
I am not saying that this privacy extends to everything they do. Arrests, pulling people, over, etc. should always be recorded. If for no other reason, then because those are likely to be used as evidence in court. I'm not comofortable with "A cop's possibly honest, possibly accurare memory of the events" vs. "Another person's possibly honest, possibly accurate memory of events" being seen in court (and defaulting to "The cop is right")
That's why he videod it, so that you would not hear only the cop's side of the story.
And for that, he's facing 16 years and has had grand theft committed against him.
The speeding ticket and citation have already passed.
its aruldy been ruled videotaping a cop is not illagle. its just the police trying to get back at the guy for catching there buddy acting like a shitbag. been a few of these cases latly and every time the cops lose. as for the whole the guy will never find a job again i dought it. its only a traffic charge and a made up wiretapping charge that won hold up in court. its not its robbery assult or anything like that and employers ignore traffic charges unless you apply for a driving job. as for not getting his stuff back when he wins his court case they have to return everything if they dont he can sue them for it.
Gee! Four computers and living in the partents' house? That would teach'm some independence and cut down on his time spent online!
http://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
Really? Anything that involves interstate commerce can immediately be classified as federal. And it's easy to classify anything has having an effect on commerce.
I did not say "I didn't do anything." I said "I was facing five life sentences plus 105 years for an offense no one had ever been jailed a day on before. " And that is absolutely true. In fact, I filed my own 2255 collateral attack and the judge issued a sua sponte ruling (in violation of Greenlaw) using Gonzalez v Raich, a 9th Circuit medical marijuana case, which states that the Government can regulate noncommercial INTRAstate activity in which it has an interest. (See Wickard v Fillmore.) No "special circumstance.." the Feds just need to have an interest in you.
As for only "robbery with a gun" being an example of a life sentence requirement, that's bollocks. Feds operate on a very strict numerical system, (even though Booker says it's all advisory.) See this table? All you need to do is get up to Offense Level 37 with a few priors and you're gone forever. Or get a few 924(c) counts, the third of which puts you away for life, mandatory. There are white collar guys who are doing life because their dollar amounts are high. Bernie Madoff didn't use a gun, did he? How about Jeff Skilling? A guy who sells small amounts of drugs three times does 20 years, mandatory because of 18 USC 851.
You can do life for conspiracy. If I call you and ask "hey want a pound of blow?" and you simply say yes, you can be indicted on a pound of blow..at least 15 years. No blow needs to exist. Happens every day.
Just cause you have a pal who happens to work for a PD doesn't mean you understand just how unjust the system is. Actually, at the spot I served, I never saw a single inmate who claimed to be innocent.
I'm just suggesting people be very careful.
"The pie shall be cut in half and each man shall receive.....death. I'll eat the pie."
Plus there's your disdain for jurors. This "people too stupid to get out of jury duty," thing is very tiring. I've twice been called for jury duty, neither time chosen to serve, but not because I tried to get out of it. I'd gladly serve on a jury, it is my duty.
When people complain about stupid jurors, I ask how many times they have tried to get out of it. I think its my duty too. But unfortunately I was reject on both occasions since I have a Masters Degree. That meant i am not the 95% or whatever of the general public and was successfully challenged by the prosecutor.
The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
An unmarked police car pulls a guy over and the cop jumps out with a gun... at what point was the motor cyclist supposed to turn off the camera - after the fact he didn't know it was a police car? We don't know the history of the person being pulled over, for all we know he was a person of interest to the cops (his name popped up on the computer after the cop checked the registration of the bike then the cop proceeded with caution by pulling out a gun - maybe the motorcyclist had prior "dangerous" convictions?). Regardless, they might have had nothing on him and are using the "make an example out of him" method making his life hell. How many riots, uproars have happened when someone has video taped a cop? Authorities want to get the message across of don't do it or else this will happen to you... Anyway, if the filming part was so bad why didn't they confiscate the camera? How did the video end up on the internet?
Analytic & algebraic topology of locally Euclidean meterization of infinitely differentiable Riemmanian manifold
They found 5 bodies in the trunk :)
The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
Cops have hated being filmed ever since Rodney King.
Why is this criminal and not a civil suit?
Why People Hate Cops
Ken Rossignol was on the scene with a related case. His website looks like crap, he's horribly biased, and generally crazy, but I prefer his rag to that published by the Washington Post.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
I have an honest question for you: Why the fuck do you still live in that country?
Well, EU law makes it quite hard for an American to move to the EU or the UK. Due to their labor law demanding that jobs only be given to EU / UK citizens or spouses of citizens, it makes it extremely hard for someone to move to the EU, get a job in their field, and then become a citizen.
I've looked into it, not that the 60+% taxes really make it appealing.......but when you're unemployed, you look at all options.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
The people that did get to serve were actually roughly as educated as the public, which is to say several had university degrees.
Yes, but having an education doesn't mean you're intelligent. Congress if full of people with bachelor's degrees, masters degrees, J.D.'s, and M.D.'s - yet only a very small handful of them are intelligent.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
a place where cops are practically untouchable,
Seriously, please name a place where this isn't the case, I'm very interested ... The closer you look, the harder it is to find one.
"I love my job, but I hate talking to people like you" (Freddie Mercury)
Said it before and w'll say it again FUCK SOVIET USA!!
I love the "plus 105 years" bit, you couldn't make it up.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
You just hate freedom, and are therefore a terrorist. Be prepared to be extraordinarily renditioned.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Well I think everyone would have seen this coming, for years the Police all over have used CCTV and any kind of camera images still or video to look for people and even ask the publics help in finding individuals, they use it in bait cars and in surveillance and of course they love it and use it in the courts regularly. I find it hypocritical that they want to use the technology as long as it isn't being iused against them. How many case have been caught on tape by their own Police dash cams ( If you remeber the 4 police officers that were hatching how to frame an accident one of their officers caused against the driver of the car the officer hit ) as an example, and how many other instances were the Police were saying to the public in a press release put out by their OWN infomation office of how an incident went down and then a tape pops up showing different. In the eyes of the court an officers word carries a lot of weight over an individuals word. This smacks of intimadtion, There are a lot of instances were the Police and Prosecuters take a law and twist and turn it to use as an an advatgae and not within the bounds it was mean for... and I think this case is a prime example of that. If you have honest Police officers doing nothing wrong, well then the tape will show that, so why would they be concerned. I think even though this could be the case here I think the Police are doing what The Chinese goverment does to its people " We will tell you what the truth is, Not what you see or hear " . If something had happened during this traffic stop to the officer , do you think the Police would be going after this guy for taping it? I doubt it, my guess is they would be seeking the tape to help prove and prosecute the case against the individual. This comes across to me as they dont want anything out there that could be used against them. I think this is beyond a blatant abuse of the law.
That's the reason why I will never ever go to the US.
http://www.dumblaws.com/
I might do something accidently wrong and face prison. No, thank you.
Bullshit. Complete and utterly uninformed bullshit.
1. UK is part of the EU.
2. Nowhere is it a requirement to be a citizen, nor a spouse of a citizen. There are rules for minimum wages you must earn in order to have permission to stay in some countries, but thats it.
3. The 60%+ taxes are very very localized (specifically Denmark), and they only apply to the very highest paid citizens (you are taxed based on your income) - you should keep in mind that higher taxes equals higher wages.
But having a mindset like yours you should stay where you are.
I've looked into it, not that the 60+% taxes really make it appealing.......but when you're unemployed, you look at all options.
60% taxes, where? I would say, that the most taxing countries (France for instance), get at most 50%. But look at it in another way, yes, you pay 50% taxes, but that comes with UNIVERSAL health care, real rights to the ones that get unemployed, children support, practically FREE education all the way until the end of college (ok, in some countries you have to pay like €1000 per year when you are in the University, but in some other, they actually pay you to go to University, although it's just something like €300 per month).
And beside, what really kills me, is how you Americans just care about the money. Man, quality of life is much more than the money. It's support when you need it. It's knowing that you are protected in case something goes wrong and it's not entirely your fault, it's good climate (well, this only applies to Souther Europe), it's culture for free, it's really good food (once again ... only in southern Europe :D), it's living in a city where you don't have to drive every morning to work cause the public mass transport system is really effective or because the centre of the city is also occupied by it's citizens ... well, it's a very big bunch of many other things.
I might not be rich ... but then again, I have everything I need to be happy, so what's the problem?
I have an honest question for you: Why the fuck do you still live in that country?
You know, contrary to what US-Americans often seem to think, you can't just go anywhere in the world, say "Here I am!" and expect to be welcomed with open arms.
Emigration always and by necessity entails immigration. And immigration means moving INTO a country, and that country will have rules and regulations for doing so, and will reserve the right to reject people... and they WILL reject people.
It's not impossible, but it's not easy, either, and it's certainly not guaranteed. What's more, if you've already served a significant amount of jailtime (4+ years is a significant amount), quite a few countries might well reject you on those grounds alone.
It's not as easy as moving to a different city or even a different state, you know. You don't have a right to move to any other nation.
Wait. What? Why is this a troll. Someone help me out here.
The law AFAIK is quite clear: Unidentified man, in unidentified car leaps out pointing a gun at you? YES, you are within your rights to SHOOT HIM IN THE FACE.
IANAL, but am I wrong here???
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
Ah statistics.
Funny how you don't include figures of how many charges get dropped or downgraded before they get to trial.
Those statistics could represent a harsh oppressive society where the innocent are thrown into jail at the drop of a hat.
However it could also indicate that there's an incredibly high burden of proof required to get a trial, if this high burden isn't met, the trial doesn't happen.
As opposed to which other country? Seriously -- show me a country that isn't corrupt.
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
Not to mention that the USA is one of the only nations in the world where you *still* have to pay taxes if you move abroad. (As I do).
Leaving doesn't actually help you.
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
Well, i'm not sure if there is a place where cops are as accountable as they should be, but the crap you americans face surely doesnt fly here in holland. Everytime a police weapon is fired it is national news, and full inquiries are started, no Tasers, no patriot act..
Sure i still hate cops, but down here they are much more toned down than your american one
The way i see it, cops here in holland mostly are incompetent, but mostly benign, rather then malevolent
People, what a bunch of bastards
proof once again that slashdot needs a "Sad but true" mod.
(no, not that i'm a terrorist, but this perfectly illustrates the american stance towards anyone opposed to these "protections of freedom")
People, what a bunch of bastards
"Law obiding citizens have nothing to fear from surveilence" that is what they always say... SO law obiding policemen should have nothing to fear from being video taped... But apparently they want to keep their abuse of power and corruption to themselves... It is much better to be a policeman that way...
This is what I'd expect from a failing African police state. How long before the food riots start?
I've been following this case closely since it started since I live in MD.
The key issue here is MD's law on recording audio without all parties' consent. The state is arguing that all parties of the private conversation (i.e. the trooper) did not consent, hence the violation.
A key provision of the law is the idea of "reasonable expectation of privacy". This is what allows news crews to record street scenes audio/video without everyone's consent. In a public area, no one reasonably has an expectation privacy. The defense will argue this point and Graber will be found innocent.
Next step is to work on getting this law overturned. MD is one of a handful of states with the unanimous consent provision where most other states are so-called "one consent".
I'm unsure where one would go. There's no magical countries.
These countries are still better than most.
Because I personally think speeders should be locked up for life, I do not give a shit if this person goes to jail.
Fine, but if he goes to jail it should be for reckless driving, not for some trumped up charge that could set a nasty legal precedent that has serious ramifications for everyone.
Blank until
why would you want to live in a communist-bloc country?
FGD 135
It did miss that 90% of the cases were plea bargains (I think this stat is for all cases and not just federal ones so take with a pinch of salt).
But once you get into that, yu're not playing averages any more. Anyone who is guoilty and knows they'll be cnvicted of something will take the plea bargain. Anyone who knows there is no evidence will tell the prosecutor where to stick his case, and the case will be dropped. So the remaining 10% is disproportionately very innocent of very guilty.
Most of the time you don't actually have to "pay" US taxes. Just fill in a tax return. In a lot of countries, you only pay if your local tax bill is lower than it would be in the US.
Why your contempt for juries? It's the last line of civil defense against unjust laws
Because it turns out that they don't actually do that job. Judges regularly lie to juries that it isn't their job to stop unjust laws, and ill-educated juries swallow it whole.
FGD 135
This "people too stupid to get out of jury duty," thing is very tiring...
The people that did get to serve were actually roughly as educated as the public, which is to say several had university degrees.
Degrees don't make people smart. The country is full of total dumbshits with degrees.
Just ask Rush Limbaugh - the population with the most higher education tends to be the most liberal and that makes them total idiots, according to him.
You know, this is one of the few cases where the ACLU is genuinely right. However, you are full of shit. Very few of the protests that get tear gassed are actually peaceful.
Police don't like being video taped. It sucks to be held accountable for your actions.
Justice isn't the goal here. Justice is merely the strawman. The real goal is setting a precedent for the next power grab. You don't build the business of government by asking for more power and revenue. You act like total power was yours all along, and when they question it, you back down just a little bit, collecting and consolidating the difference.
Reminds of an old Jewish joke:
- Aaron, what are you doing with that globe?
- I've had enough. I am going away, looking for a suitable country.
Half an hour later comes back, globe is nowhere to be seen.
- Have you found one?
- No, I ordered a new globe.
On the other hand, the razor wire topped Free Speech Zones half a mile away from the actual site are really quite fetching.
But ... but ... but ... that's "socialism" (by the Fox News definition), along with anything else that the government does that might benefit the citizens who aren't part of the wealthiest 5% of Americans. Right now, we have a significant portion of the US Congress seriously arguing that the reason there are so many unemployed people during a recession is because getting $200 a week causes them to be shiftless layabouts. Oh, and also think that the 10% unemployment is wonderful, because it enables many corporations to hire high-quality workers at discount prices, and use the threat of unemployment to force their existing workers to work longer hours for less pay.
I am officially gone from
My largest concern is an out-of-uniform cop in an unmarked car (or not a cop car at all) drew his gun and only said "i'm a cop" - you draw a weapon without your uniform etc, and "i'm a cop" doesn't cut it. You have a badge for a reason. You have a uniform for a reason.
If you have a reason to NOT be in your uniform, you should not be acting in such a way. It wouldn't be so very hard to assume he was a road-rager coming to ventilate him. That's likely what I would have thought, and had I been armed, I would have been in serious trouble, because the dipshit wasn't wearing his uniform.
For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
@Vector- your sense of reading discretion is apparently on vacation. Or perhaps it's easier to feign outrage than think critically.
The OP claims he was the victim of a 'Terry Stop' and that on this basis they searched his car on his property, and as a result he was facing "...five life sentences plus 105 years for an offense no one had ever been jailed a day on before...".
Really? That's an extraordinary claim, and surprising that he wouldn't bother to reveal what such an amazing offense might be. Of course, to 'save himself from 12 stupid jurors' he pled, and served 52 months.
So ask yourself if there might not be the TEENSIEST bit of bias in the OP's description? What the HELL did the police find in that 'illegal' search? A body?
The OP posts, 'we're all just one Terry Stop away from ruin'. I'd reply that yes, much of our criminal system depends on impulsive or subjective enforcement by officers, sure. But they could Terry Stop me, search my car, my person, my home, my office, and STILL not find anything to charge me with...certainly not to give me 5 life sentences.
-Styopa
First, it's true - I looked into it just about 6 months ago, since I've always wanted to travel to the UK (I've been to most of the EU). Second, the 60+% was talking about ALL taxes, not just income tax. You forget the massive taxes on gas, VAT, and the tax on pretty much else imaginable that's all added on top of the typical 40-ish% income tax.
But hey, why let facts get in the way of bashing someone.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
We need the ACLU to take this all the way to the supreme court and get all the stupid laws related to video taping people in public found unconstitutional. When you or anyone is in a public place inside the USA, video taping of them needs to be allowed regardless of age, job, or location. Public is public. Judges need to be video taped, police, FBI, CIA, sheriffs, and people walking around in state or city parks. Public is public.
I'd go further and allow the video taping of any local, state or federal employee or contractor to get special allowances for video recording inside public buildings provided national security or crimes of a sensitive nature are not being actively discussed or presented. None of this leave an old rape photo on the wall to prevent videoing either. If the conversation isn't directly related to the "sensitive crime as defined" then there is no protection.
Going 1 step further, I'd like all police to have an always on audio microphone that cannot be tampered with. Tampering means they are fired. Police need to be held to a higher standard of conduct due to the public trust status.
Court rooms need to be video recorded too with the tapes delayed from public viewing for 30-180 days, but still made available to the public. Every court hearing covered by this. Secret court hearings need to be delayed no more than 20 years regardless of national security claims.
Sneaky and nasty actions have no place in government. If we, the people, are embarrassed by our government employees, we need to know that activities and apply corrective actions sooner than later.
Man, quality of life is much more than the money. It's support when you need it. It's knowing that you are protected in case something goes wrong and it's not entirely your fault, it's good climate (well, this only applies to Souther Europe), it's culture for free, it's really good food (once again ... only in southern Europe :D), it's living in a city where you don't have to drive every morning to work cause the public mass transport system is really effective or because the centre of the city is also occupied by it's citizens ... well, it's a very big bunch of many other things.
Wait, so quality of life is not about money but it's about support, protection (I assume you mean welfare and social security here, the economic system does not alter your ability to get support from friends) and "free" culture, which are in reality the same thing as money except someone else buys the products for you? You know that in the US, and in every other country in the world, money will also get you support, protection and culture?
Sounds like you are rich, it's just that 20-30% of your money doesn't appear on your budget since you're enjoying it through all these public services.
I have an honest question for you: Why the fuck do you still live in that country?
Moving to another country ain't like moving across the street. Nobody wants Americans. Remember, this is the nation that has always had to hire in the majority of its best scientists because of the inadequate education system. While a few of us are employable in other countries, few of us are so employable as to warrant international relocation.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Due to their labor law demanding that jobs only be given to EU / UK citizens or spouses of citizens
Sorry if this is off-topic, but can you tell me more about this "spouses of citizens" part? I'm a dual US/Austrian citizen, but my wife is only a US citizen. If i work in the EU, does that mean that my wife can also get a job? If so, where exactly does it say that?
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
I hope members of the fourth estate feel threatened by this and run to this guy's aid.
Sounds like you are rich, it's just that 20-30% of your money doesn't appear on your budget since you're enjoying it through all these public services.
No, that's the part most of the Americans constantly fail to understand. I'm not rich in here, and I wouldn't still be rich if I hadn't to pay those extra 20%-30% more to get these benefits. In fact I doubt that 30% over the wage I get (around €1000 per month) would actually allowed my to buy all that stuff. More, I'm completely certain that it would not allow the people that earn the minimum wage (which in here is around €500 and that's very little even with these benefits), would allow them to have this.
But his is the great part about it. The 20%-30% that a very rich people also has to pay, it's enough to give the benefits to that rich one, and there is plenty of money left to get those same benefits to a bunch the ones that earn much less than them.
A small example. The tax over fuel in here it's huge. It's really one of the highest in EU, but on the other side, public transportation works well and it's quite cheap (€18 per month to travel as many time as you want in the metro, or €25 to travel all you want in metro and BUS). And I'm happy, it's this way. The city works much better than if everyone takes their cars around, it's less polluted, and it's better for the environment.
It's not Socialism, it's Social Democracy and when done really correctly it works beautifully, like you have to admit it works in Northern Europe ... not so good in the South, but it's still ok in here. And well, although, Northern Europe is better in this social aspect and has all those nice blondes, but bah, it's too cold for me and the food kind of stinks ... and all that contributes to your quality of life :)
First, you say:
Then, you say:
That doesn't exactly do much for your credibility.
What part of "shall not be infringed" is so hard to understand?
Well I happen to live in Denmark, so no offense, but I know a bit more about life in EU than you. And last round of hirings we did we looked at some foreigners (Chinese, not US), green cards where no problem as long as they made 300.000 DKR (about $50.000) a year.
Also, traveling to EU is a lot different from wanting to live and work, so not sure how that applies. The taxes here are 40%, thats it, if you chose to spend your money on gasoline, then yes there are sales taxes and environment taxes, which is why it's frigging expensive to own a car here. If you decided to take public transport here in Denmark (we have 190% sales tax on cars), it's tax deductible, so are loans, unions, pensions etc.
I earn enough to pay some of my wage at the 60% level, but with all the deductions I get I still only pay 40% (38% is lowest in my region) - and I don't own a car, so as I said, your statements are complete and utterly bullshit. But hey, lets not have facts come in the way of a good bashing...
The way the story is reported you would think this guy
Only if your reading comprehension falls below the fifth grade level newspaper writers aspire to.
Because I personally think speeders should be locked up for life
Then lock them up for life for speeding. Don't make up bullshit that applies to everyone else just because you've got a hardon for punishing speeders.
The fact that you ignore the VAT that is added to the price of every goddamn thing you buy shows that you're either incompetent or just out trolling. Once you add that on top of the 40% or so income tax, it comes out to roughly 60% (if not higher if you have a good job). Why you insist on denying the extra taxes is beyond me.
Seeing as how you've never done any research into moving to the EU and getting a job, I'm doubtful that you'd know what the rules are - just like the majority of native born people in any country are pretty clueless as to the rule for immigration, because it's not something they'd ever have to worry about.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
The real problem here is that this isn't an individual officer being a jerk. That happens in every profession: humans aren't perfect. But the response was a coordinated offensive involving many individuals. This sounds like it might involve dozens of individuals collaborating together.
obtained an arrest warrant charging Graber
I don't know how arrest warrants work. Did a judge issue this?
the State Police also obtained a search warrant
That's equally scary: the video was already on youtube. What was the search warrant for?
the Harford County State’s Attorney obtained a grand jury indictment,
Now the state's attorney is involved.
This now involves several police officers, the states attorney, and at least one judge. We don't have all the facts yet, but if this is how the ACLU presents it, then IMHO each of those people should be charged with some serious crimes. What crime is it when a public official tries to shake-down someone? Is this any different from when the mob was doing the same thing?
And this is a perfect example of what the Tea Party movement is sick and tired of - a government that at all levels has forgotten that it exists solely at the pleasure of the citizens it rules. "Government is good - trust us" liberals have been telling us for years, ignoring the weight of all of human history that testifies loudly to the contrary. You twits forgot that liberty is the exception in the history of the world, and that oppression is the rule. And now you have the nerve to bitch about the size of the cage that you build around your own goddamned self? Fuck all you big-government apologist asshats.
If we're not allowed to video tape cops doing bad things, perhaps it's time for armed intervention to save innocent people from overzealous cops.
Sure, as long as your government is not spending more than it takes in while doing ALL of that, as long as all the costs are covered without getting into debt, as long as nobody is working to undermine the system (which you know they are doing all the time), you can continue this way.
But if your costs are not covered and you have to borrow and/or print the difference (which is happening to most of the state governments right now) then you are living on borrowed time and once the financial problems start, you will lose all of these entitlements whether you want to or not, then you'll be in the same boat as everyone else, without money and way of supporting yourself, as everyone else and you will find out what it's like not just to compete for money, but for food and all that you need to survive. AFAIC everybody who is making only enough money to carry them through the month and not investing something, not saving something (in gold at this point preferably) is kidding themselves. They are all living on borrowed time.
You can't handle the truth.
A good blog that covers this and similar issue is here: http://carlosmiller.com/
You may be surprised to see that this is not an isolated incident.
While the ACLU document does mention that this police officer unholstered his weapon before identifying himself as a police officer, this is not the crux of their complaint. If I am stepping out in front of an unknown individual (his face obscured) on a heavy motorcycle, I too am going to want some form of quick defense. I am no expert on the rules of escalation of force for MD state troopers, but at worst the unholstering of the weapon is a training issue that needs to be corrected with this individual.
The ACLU is, instead, focusing on the use of the recording laws in Maryland as a form of suppressing speech; in my opinion, a much more important issue.
Most posters here just want to run a jack-boot-thug, social-feedback-loop rant. They are completely missing the point of both the ACLU and the slashdot submission.
Bernie Madoff went to jail because it was his last option, he is hiding in jail, if he did not go, he wouldn't have been breathing by now, more importantly to him, neither would any of his close family.
You can't handle the truth.
You know more about life in Denmark, but you have demonstrated you know less about life in the UK. And even less about taxes.
Immigration rules in the UK are a lot tighter than simply an earnings threshold. There is a points-based assessment for highly skilled workers, investors, entrepeneurs and recent graduates from UK universities. Skilled workers can get in via sponsorship from their employer, mostly. Other workers are by and large SOL.
No-one is able to avoid all taxes other than income tax, no matter whether they live in the UK, Denmark or the US. The OP specifically mentioned VAT. VAT in the UK is charged on, among other things, many types of food and all adult clothing. You may not ever buy new underwear, but everyone else does.
... you're allowed to take photos of for instance the Swedish security service and their cars, that hot chick across the street, children, your nude neighbor, corporate buildings, ..
And imho you should be, because you can see them anyway.
Don't know how the law look upon video and storage of video. I think you may need to have permission to for instance use surveillance equipment in your store, which I find quite weird, I could eventually understand how you would have to inform the people going in about it (though you most likely rather want to do that to scare them off from doing anything stupid in the first place), but I can't see how you would have to as a private person so I don't understand why a store owner would have to.
> That's not guilty defendants: it's ALL defendants.
To play devil's advocate for a moment, how do YOU tell the difference?
They must do things different where that boy's from. One of the things that was drilled into my head in Journalism school was that you can take pictures of anything you can see from a public street. The Maryland law is unconstitutional, and citizens of Maryland have the right and responsibility to violate that unconstitutional law. But you know, that's not the thing that bothers me the most. The thing that bothers me the most is the 'Traffic Stop'. Here in Florida and in many other states, we have a right to carry concealed weapons with a permit. The man in the video did not identify himself as an officer. There was no reason to think he was anything other than some freak with a case of road rage. I could easily see someone drawing their weapon on that officer and killing him. Someone needs to review basic traffic stop techniques up there.
Maybe the motorist somehow has a right to privacy until there's an arrest? Sure, public road, etc, but if an officer is being a &#%* and pulling you over for no reason, drawing his gun, yelling obscenities and potentially humiliating you for no reason, should that humiliation be compounded by youtube? COPS (the TV show) often fuzzes the faces of people who aren't arrested.
You're very careful here to use numbers and categories and avoid mentioning what it is you actually did or what "Offense Level 37" means. Your only real-life examples are Madoff and Jeff Skilling, neither of which are exactly wrongly-accused victims of the system.
As idiotic and wrong the war on drugs is, anyone that does cocaine or "just agrees" to buy cocaine over the phone knows exactly what he's getting into and what are the consequences of getting caught. "White collar" criminals who rob people of millions of dollars in savings or steal from the public are not innocent either. Nobody's saying the system works perfectly but there's a way to go from there to pretending that just going about your daily business can land you life in a federal prison.
I have an honest question for you: Why the fuck do you still live in that country?
As a citizen of the USA, I would like to respond. I was born here, and raised here. This is my home.
I was raised in a time before 20M+ illegal Mexicans ran the show. I was raised in a time before my country drafted international laws in secrecy. I was raised in a time when the country still spent good money on education, and I learned a lot about the history of my country.
The reason I am here is simple: I am biding my time.
The rest of the world might not be aware, but the USA will soon face it's 2nd Civil War. I am still here because I am waiting for my opportunity to rebel against Police like those being discussed in this thread, against Corporations that own slaves in 3rd world countries and Senators in my own country, but mostly against the tyrants that have sunk their claws so deep into the American way of life that I, honest to God, believe that bullets now have more value than votes.
I own guns because I believe that one day I will have to use them on my government. Plain and simple. Every day that I read about incidents like the one discussed in this thread, I pray that more of my fellow citizens will being to think as I do. That way, the War will come sooner rather than later; which to me means that the healing can begin sooner.
"Be prepared, son. That's my motto. Be prepared." --Joe Hallenbeck
They is astonishingly similar to what happened in the last episode of Seinfeld.
If that were me I would have thought the guy was trying to jack my bike. Unmarked car + unmarked cop = high probability for things to go badly. Brandishing a firearm on top of that is just plain stupidity.
boycott slashdot February 10th - 17th check out: altSlashdot.org
Sure, as long as your government is not spending more than it takes in while doing ALL of that, as long as all the costs are covered without getting into debt, as long as nobody is working to undermine the system (which you know they are doing all the time), you can continue this way.
Well, yes, I agree with you in that part. But let's be serious here. We all know that the countries where this system works better and brings the more benefits and insurances to the population are in Northern Europe. And ALL those countries (except Iceland, but they are not a part of EU ... yet) have their finances in very good condition and survived the crisis practically unscattered. So, giving this support doesn't bankrupt anyone.
Now, the problem with Southern Europe, where people have less support than in Northern one, so if that was the problem (the government spending on population care) they should actually be beter, but they are not because of s simple thing. Corruption. Only and just that. If you check the Ginni index of the southern European country, it's much higher (so worst) than Northern countries, meaning the wealth in much worst divided, meaning that some are getting the money that should belong to all.
So, don't blame Social Democracy, simply blame corrupt governants/public administrators.
This has been said time and time again. Some Rep tried to do some grandstanding "resolution" but what we really need is a law protecting people's rights to video tape public officials. You can add whatever "under reasonable conditions, without directly impeding, only in a public place (street, public building etc.)" as long as the general act of video taping a cop under normal circumstances (such as in your own damn vehicle) is not a crime in itself.
What the motorcyclist did was stupid and he deserved to be booked with at least careless driving and at most reckless endangerment but the cop shouldn't have pulled a gun out without identifying himhelf as such. The correct thing would have een to flash his badge/say "I'm a police officer, dismount immediately" and THEN pull out his gun and THEN point it at him if he didn't comply.
In Florida the police officers and FHP don't usually chase speeding motorcyclists because it would endanger other drivers due to the speed and maneuverability of motos and just try and get their tag written down.
At least here in Minnesota it is generally not possible to "get out of" jury duty, unless you're 70+ years old. You can request a postponement twice, but after two postponements you are required to take part in the next phase of trials.
In the jury duty phase I participated in, there was no one that even attempted to "get out of" jury duty. I think we were all interested to see exactly what it entailed and participate in a jury trial.
Where on earth do you live that people "get out of" jury duty?
most of the low speed limits are about makeing cash and not safety just like the red light cameras.
If I was innocent, yes, I would. My principles mean that much to me. I could not look my son in the eyes years later and tell him I compromised my principles just because there was a chance I could lose.
Maybe that is stupid (actually looking at it pragmaticly it IS stupid. But it is still what I would do.
The fact that I am of Irish/German decent and thus was raised as one of the most stubborn people you will ever meet.
Whilst this stuff sounds unbelievable the economist agrees with him...
I don't understand why Marylanders reading this article don't walk into the Governor's mansion, stuff a printout in his face and then spit on him. The state is 180 degrees wrong here. They should be disciplining the officer and thanking the videographer.
He never said that the guy denied making the phonecall he just said that someone was doing 20 years for doing so.
The cop already had his gun drawn, so this fantasy could never have happened. The second the motorcyclist reached for his gun, the cop would have fired. What you describe is the surest way for the motorcyclist to have gotten himself killed.
It's still not worth it. That's ridiculous that someone would have to pay anywhere close to 50% taxes for those services. In the US I'm in the 25% Federal income tax bracket and my private health insurance plan and other benefits--including the employer subsidy would still only amount to about 30% of my my gross income. Adjusting for tax credits other deductions and my total tax burden ends up being probably closer to 18-20% anyway. I'll take quality of life + money any day.
Yes, the earnings threshold was an simplification, but in this context it makes sense, he is a (I might wrongly have assumed) skilled worker, therefore the earnings threshold is his problem - in practice you have to show you can take care of yourself, there are medical considerations, you have to be spotless on your criminal records etc. - but that applies to almost any country you want to work in, the hardest part of getting a green card is to show you can earn enough money.
In Denmark we pay 25% VAT on everything bought, so don't give me that BS, but you can't say you are paying 15% additional taxes, VAT is only applied when you spend your money, and you are by no means required to spend all your money on goods.
There should be a class of judgments for cases involving police, where if the judge determines that the officers involved are attempting intimidation like this, that they are severely reprimanded, perhaps even losing their jobs automatically. That would put a stop to these frivolous cases of intimidation.
Higher Logics: where programming meets science.
I have indeed done my research on this since I have had to consider hiring foreigners.
And as I wrote in reply to your sibling, you are by no means required to spend all your money, you can save it up, earn interest, invest them - at no point do you have to pay anything more.
And please, please, please don't tell someone they are incompetent when you can't even work out what 17.5% VAT is in terms of total taxes. By the way (for both you and sibling) in the UK you don't pay VAT on everything, unless you only buy goods.
Let me give you a nice example from Denmark where we in fact pay VAT "on every goddamn thing" at 25% - Lets say I earn 100.000 kr, I pay 40% taxes, that leaves me with 60.000 kr.
At 25% VAT, it means 20% of everything I buy is tax, so lets say I spend all 60.000, that means 15.000 of that is an additional tax, which is 15% of the original, that means I pay 55% taxes total.
I'm very much aware of how much I pay in taxes, and I do my share of gibbering about it every month when I get my paycheck, but then I remember, this pays for my medical bills, for the roads, my education, for safety on the streets (milage may vary here, I'll give you that) etc .
The Maryland State Police is a branch of their State Government. Like all police, they take an oath of office that requires them to uphold and serve the citizens and their State Constitution as well as the Federal Constitution. How can a "servant of the citizens of Maryland" have an expectation of privacy in the course of his normal duties. Especially when he, in the course of his duties, videotapes every traffic stop that he makes and also files a report on every stop and arrest and ticket that he makes? Any expectation of privacy is a joke.
Not only should this case be thrown out of court on its rear, the District or State Attorney that filed this case should, at a minimum, lose his job for bringing such a ridiculous case forward to the court. At a maximum that attorney himself should be arrested and charged for attempting to defraud the State of Maryland and under a charge of _______ (fill in your blank: racketeering, blackmail, intimidation, breaking his own oath of office to serve Maryland's Constitution) for attempting to intimidate, coerce, or falsely imprison a Citizen of the State.
" Shipley noted Graber told the trooper he was not being recorded." So the defence may have a problem.
Agreed. On a 4 lane road here (thats 4 on each side, mind you) the speed limit is 45. There are no lights, crossroads, or anything, but a 45 speed limit. When those lanes go down to 3 on each side, the speed limit drops to 35. I have been on 2 lane per side highways with speed limits of 55. Setting it to 35 is a deliberate moneymaking ploy.
"Going to war without the French is like going deer hunting without your accordion." ~General Norman Schwarzkopf
I'm told the government works for the citizens. So I hire the government every 2 or 4 years, and they contract out for police officers. As a stakeholder in this operation I have a right to have a voice in how the laws that are created for me are executed.
Personally, I hope lots of bad things happen to the assholes who thought it would be a good idea to arrest and harass this man.
Blar.
"I got ten years for raping kids. What about you?"
"Sixteen for putting a video on youtube."
Many many fine points about privacy and such, but the root of this case is AUDIO recording. Both parties not aware they're being recorded on audio? WIRETAPPING. The laws may be antiquated, but they're still on the books in many states. If that had been video, the cops might have been pissed, but they probably wouldn't have been able to do diddly about it. Maybe, MAYBE the charges can get thrown out on those grounds. Hope they do. But they're probably not abusing their power as much as we would like to think they are.
I had a sucky sig.
OK, I hate frivolous lawsuits, but I'd sue the department in this case, and not necessarily for monetary gains. I'd rather see the people who decided it'd be a good idea to make this an issue be forced to leave without their precious pension. It has to be made clear to the cops that they are not immune to consequences.
Ridiculous.
If you aren't suspicious of your government's actions, you aren't doing your job as a responsible citizen.
Try Japan, you can citizen arrest a cop if he run a red light or if he take a one way road outside of allowed times. Happened again few month ago.
Not just in the US. There's a *LOT* of very scary footage coming from the G20 summit that was held in Toronto, Canada. Some is what might be expected, people that pushed the police's buttons and got pushed back (I won't justify it either way, but not unexpected in those scenarios).
Others are just plain scary. People who had nothing to do with protests (even the peaceful ones) being randomly searched and/or arrested. A disabled man being knocked around by the police, and a whole trail of lies and violent/thuggish behavior.
I moved from Toronto a bit over a year ago... I'm *very* happy about this decision, because I worked in the district where much of this happened and who knows what might have happened to me on my way to/from the office. I makes me feel much more sympathy for my American brethran as well... as it seems that this is a country that one *used* to be able to have pride in, but corruption is slowly destroying it.
FTA
According to David Rocah, the ACLU attorney handling Mr. Graber's case, 'To charge Graber with violating the law, you would have to conclude that a police officer on a public road, wearing a badge and a uniform, performing his official duty, pulling someone over, somehow has a right to privacy when it comes to the conversation he has with the motorist.'" (emphasis mine)
If this David Rocah had even bothered to view the video in question, he'd know the officer was not wearing a uniform.
"And beside, what really kills me, is how you Americans just care about the money"
Actually, I think incidents like these may demonstrate what it's pretty necessary to care about money in the USA. Money is pretty much the only thing that may stand between you and being f***'ed....
Not enough money in this case (and no assistance in obtaining representation) often means no lawyer, or a crappy one being assigned to you who is no where near the level of the prosecution. Being able to afford a good lawyer is the thin line between being in jail or not. The money *IS* the support...
Think about how things have gone to shit with those that have bought politicians. Again... money.
Those that are in shit jobs, and are being abused. Sure, you might be able to go to court, but again ... money.
Maybe if there were less lawyers and lobbyists there would be less need for money. But as I see it, in many cases having an empty wallet is like being at a gunfight with a derringer (and the other guy has an Uzi).
You don't need to be rich to be happy, and there are things that money can't buy. However, without cash then in the current society you'd either better get lucky and hope you never piss off somebody more powerful (/rich) than you, or you get a good jury/judge.
I'm pretty much middle-class. I have friends who are well near dirt-poor. Yes, often enough they are happy, but they're also often unhappy and stuck in a rut they'll likely never escape, as they can't afford higher education (for themselves or a children) and often end up being worked into the ground just to survive (or finally saying f*** it and grubbing by on public welfare). It's often shocking to visit and see how bad it can be...
What would happen if police action is captured on a security camera that is in a fixed position? Would that also be a violation of the Maryland wiretapping law? I'm sure that it happens every time a cop has to arrest someone inside a store.
Actually, posting the video *with* the speeds made it - IMHO - less biased.
Sure, he looks like a jackass for speeding, but at least he didn't try and act as if he wasn't pulled over for no reason. In addition to cases like this, there's plenty of edited footage out there too that shows the cops knocking a guy down, but neglects the 30 seconds prior when he was pounding at them or attacking somebody else, etc...
I'm sure my contempt for the police shows in this post, but I really do believe that as a whole we need more control of the people we allow to walk among us with guns.
Good thing I have a license to carry.
As a board member of my neighborhood HOA, I arranged a few years ago for Howard County PD to talk with us about some problems we've had. One thing I asked them was if we could put up security cameras, either as official HOA owned cameras, or as individual residents. My car and my housemates' cars have been vandalized a number of times, we find drug paraphenalia once in a while, my side yard is used as a trash dump, etc. and we want to know who is responsible.
The HC Southern District officer in charge (Captain I think, maybe Commander, I forget which title) told us that as long as a camera is pointed at either our own property or at public property (ie NOT at the neighbor's private back yard or other private area), AND that we record video ONLY (NO audio), then we're good to go. He did suggest putting up signs at neighborhood entryways stating that video cameras are in use (even if there are not really any cameras anywhere), but I don't remember that being a requirement to having cameras in place, perhaps it was. So I'm a bit surprised that Maryland is one of the big bad 3 states with such restrictive recording situation. I'd like to offer any interesting footage to HCPD Drug Enforcement and things like that... I've just not had time to deal with installing my 8 camera DVR rig or I'd be recording my private yard/walkways, our cars in the parking areas, and certain points of interest on the street and common grounds areas nearby. But the HOA did get signs made up, and I do not plan to record audio, so maybe that makes it all good?
Don't police generaly have cameras in the patrol cars to record things as well, so we have all that Cops and Worst Car Chases footage to enjoy on late-night TV? Do they need our permission to turn them on? Subpeona the tape from the relevant patrol car and sue him under the exact same law... (Or do the police have an exclusion for that direction of things?) I attended the HCPD Citizens Police Academy a couple years ago, and they showed footage of some of their operations going down, so they definitely record stuff themselves.
Who's watching the Watchmen? Posted anonymous coward so I don't get pulled into unnecessary nonsense too.
when you are considering giving your life to 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty.
And you are the reason juries are like this. I serve on jury duty proudly. True, I don't have my Master's yet and I will likely never have a Ph.D. (my field doesn't offer it), but most people I know would not consider me stupid.
Yes, when all the intelligent people find excuses to get out of jury duty, that leaves only dumb people. When people look at it as a chore, as a pain, they try to get out of it. Did you ever do that before you were arrested? When you look at jury duty as one of the founding principles of this country, one of the hardest ones to sell out, then it is as much defending your own rights and freedoms as it is serving your fellow citizens.
And every time someone says something like "too stupid to get out of jury duty", they're making it that much more likely that it, like so many other institutions designed to protect the "average person" will fail. So fuck you. I'm sorry you got screwed by the Feds, and having read posts by you in previous /. articles I do thoroughly believe you got screwed, but fuck you for for insulting jurors and jury duty. You wanna know why they're able to set up the system to screw people like you? Inaction. Disinterest. And the disdain people have for anything that involves public service where they don't see an immediate benefit ("but I'm a smart doctor, I earn $100 an hour, why should I get paid $6 a day to serve on a jury where I might wind up acquitting a fellow doctor who's been involved in a bogus malpractice suit?). You of all people should be encouraging every /. reader to go to jury duty. Otherwise it's left up to 30 year olds who still troll 4chan. Encourage people to become involved in prisoner's rights (here's a good start: http://theprisonshow.org/).
Don't insult them for giving up their time and energy to help ensure more people don't get screwed like you did.
/rant
The top tax bracket is completely irrelevant.
What you should be looking at is the standard of living.
If the after-tax amount you have left is enough to get all the stuff and services that you need, the intermediate steps in the calculation do not matter.
"And beside, what really kills me, is how you Americans just care about the money. Man, quality of life is much more than the money. It's support when you need it. It's knowing that you are protected in case something goes wrong and it's not entirely your fault..." Thank you for this. As an American, I have this argument *constantly* with some...
-1, "1337" speak
The police in Spokane, WA will file a lawsuit against any citizen who either files a lawsuit against them, or files a complaint against them, for defamation of characters. (Google this, it's true.)
It's how police keep people from questioning what they do..
(Wonder if they'll sue ME for even posting this...)
-Myke
Same anonymous coward who just replied to the parent here:
FUCK YOU.
Read my previous reply. Thanks.
No, I will expand. There are plenty of people who serve on jury duty who are neither "mouthbreathers" (though I do get epic sinus infections from time to time) nor have "extremely mis-placed sense of justice on ... power-trip[s]." Some of us actually go into jury duty expecting some dude who got screwed by the police. Or screwed by the prosecutor. Or screwed by city hall (I know someone who is working to defend a guy who served a year for murder/being black and is suing the city for harassing him after he sued the city for putting him in jail for a year based on the evidence of a dog smell line-up [yes, that exists...wtf...] months after the crime actually happened). Or screwed by some "3-strikes" bullshit. Or screwed by one of the thousand levels of government that can screw you.
And every time you throw around things like "mouthbreathers" at people who are actively trying to help their fellow citizens, it discourages more people from showing up to do the same.
So fuck you.
When there's a possibility that a plea bargain will still leave you able to provide for your son's home, food and education, your outlook may change.
I doubt you'll relish looking your son in the eyes years later and telling him "sorry son, I gambled your future on my principles and lost".
good climate? well maybe in Norway. most of Europe doesn't get or stay cold enough for me. If it gets much above 26C, i'm starting to hate it, i'd rather it stay no warmer than say 20C. So Norway it is.
Otherwise I agree with you. but 40C is right out of the question.
All of the above was encrypted with a Quad ROT-13 method. Unauthorized decryption is in violation of the DMCA.
What about organizations like Cop Watch, who routinely MONITOR and RECORD the police...? Is what they do illegal?
-Myke
I believe you have fully grasped the allegory of his statement.
Oliver Wendell Holmes: "I like paying taxes. With them I buy civilization."
"We are here on Earth to fart around. Don't let anybody tell you any different!" -- Kurt Vonnegut
I currently live in New York (this is my first post in this thread). I think New York is one of the best states in the United States, as we have a very good state constitution. For example, we can take all the pictures and recordings of cops we want. We're as far from a police state as you can get in the U.S. after Bush screwed everything up.
So I'm not complaining, ok? BUT...
I wish I lived in the EU. I wish I spoke Dutch, and could live in Holland (you speak Dutch primarily, right?). I wish I could move to Europe and enjoy the civilization you've created there. Unlike most Americans, I concede that you Europeans have done great things with your form of government, and that you're currently running things a lot better than WE are. How I'd love to live that way...
Sadly, all I speak is English (and a bunch of programming languages). I'm stuck with the english language countries, most of which are worse than the worst states in the U.S. (the U.K. comes to mind in particular -- what a police state!). I suppose New Zealand might not be bad. I don't think Australia would be any different.
I guess I could do fairly well in Canada. Sigh...
If your spouting facts then please, show me the sources you got them from....?
The only restriction on employment based on nationality in the UK is in the Civil Service - where an American National can't get a job at all - regardless of marital status.
Otherwise you can get any damn job you want once you get the equivalent of a green card (work permit).
But please - show me the facts and the source you got them from - that way i can inform my employer of the place where the info needs updating...
To quote an interview with former Black Panther, Eldridge Cleaver:
Sure they were abusive and violent. They were murderers. And they still are. But policemen are like dogs on a leash. I'm not saying this to put them down, but you take the leash off a dog and it sics you, and that dog is going to bite if it is an obedient dog. The police function under political direction. They go after whoever they are sent after, and that's where the problem comes in.
I've seen the exact same thing. There are times when I have to drive up to Bergen County in New Jersey. You go through a whole bunch of small towns, along the same road. In one town, the speed limit will be 45. In the next, it's 35. In the next, it's 25. There was no discernible difference between the towns, either--no schools or anything else to provide a reasonable justification for the sudden drop in speed limit. It's just that cops in the 35 and 25 towns are huge assholes and keep the speed limits low to catch people who think it's still 45 or 35. I know not to speed through the town where it's 25, too, because the cops there patrol like crazy to keep their revenue stream.
Speed limits are supposedly about "safety" but it's pretty clear that safety falls by the wayside when there's money to be made.
Check out my world simulator thingy.
Where am I supposed to go? Its not like other countries are all that friendly to immigrants wanting jobs.
Interestingly, you can see the marked police car pull up right behind, during the incident. Is there any chance that this car had a dashboard camera (with video and audio)? If a person stopped in the middle of a public road has a reasonable expectation to privacy, then dashboard cams could NEVER be used. In this case, even if the marked car's dashboard cam was not recording at the time, the unmarked cop would have known of the possibility (consent?), and thus would not have had a "reasonable expectation of privacy." I know a hypothetical camera is not the same as a real one. But it would be very interesting to know if/how that would fit into this scenario.
He wasn't ripping along in a Hummer or anything, he was on a freakin' motorcycle. Sure, he'd crunch up the outside of a vehicle pretty well, but unless he ran smack into a stopped car and managed to catapult through the window, he was only endangering himself. One of the basic rules of riding, the cagers aren't gonna look for you because even if you DO hit them you aren't gonna hurt them.
Mind you, I don't endorse nor practice asshattery like that, but at the same time I realize that despite what some people shriek, it isn't particularly dangerous to anybody other than yourself.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. - Aldous Huxley
I don't blame anything except for people. People are the root of everything. No system can withstand the will of people, and the will of people is always the same: take as much as possible, give nothing back. This works out to detriment of any ideology in the long run, that is exactly why any social system, no matter how great in the beginning will get corrupted. Any system gets corrupted over time due to people, and specifically people in power, and that means people in government and that is why I am always against any government, I see it as inherently corrupt.
You can't handle the truth.
that cop is a complete moron. there is nothing to identify him as a police office: no uniform, unmarked car, no display of badge. yet the first thing he does is pull his gun, for a traffic violation. absolutely crazy.
You don't say that to the police. There must be two standards.
Think about it this way - you probably pay a certain amount for health care benefits. Typically HR calls this the employee share. Find out how much your employer pays per month (not your share, but in total). You should be pleasantly surprised that its almost 2 grand - mine is and I pay around 250 a month (my share).
I personally rather have the 2 grand and get taxed at 30-40 percent.
So no - healthcare payments aren't a tax per-se, but its why many "liberals" here in the US say that we pay more than any European country and get less favorable results.
WTF some guy walks out of an unmarked car - no uniform, no badge pointing a gun "saying get off the motorcycle" about 5 times before identifing himself as a police officer. It would not surprise me if this video instead showed an officer getting mowed over before having a chance to utter the word police. Without context provided by youtube it looks like something straight out of GTA.
You'd think at least common sense would dictate the existance of a protocol to protect both police and citizens so unfortunate actions are not taken in self defense. (especially when unmarked cars and ununiformed officers are in play)
I personally rather have the 2 grand and get taxed at 30-40 percent.
But I really don't understand why you need an intermediary in the middle profiting for something that should belong to all. Because it's not like you can have an acceptable quality of life without medical treatments, so you actually need to have medical insurance. It's not like having a anti-burglar insurance, that might come handy, but I wouldn't die because of not having it. The insurance companies are profiting from something very serious ... your health. So, why not simply remove them, and pay less for the same service ... or the same for a better one?
See, that's the part I don't get about you people. How can you defend this system, that only benefits the insurance companies and the corporation behind them. Not the state, and certainly not the people.
In Spokane, many more people are busted for conspiracy to possess a controlled substance than for actual possession of a controlled substance...
...Which probably explains why I have a lot of random people walking up to me asking me if I want to go score with them when I'm downtown there... I'm always like "no thanks..." =)
Maybe I should start saying "You dropped your badge..." =)
-Myke
This is not an isolated case. In Chicago, an artist/activist is facing felony charges for videoing his arrest for selling small sew-on patches for $1.00 without a peddler's license. They dropped the charges about the peddler license, but the felony case is in court. See http://www.c-drew.com/blog/ for his on-going saga. It is a case of dominated discourse when police and authorities can tape people, but people can't tape back.
So I presume any cop in the state using a dashboard camera is ALSO subject to prosecution under the same law?
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
It's funny how this is even possible in this country. Ironic that police want to have cameras record drivers go by traffic signals but don't want themselves filmed.
What effin' wire did this guy tap? None.
I'm a US citizen, born and still living in Illinois. I've visited almost all of the EU and would love to live there except for the taxes. You mention quality of life, a fair point, up until your country has crushing debt (Greece, Spain, and soon the UK and France) and has to cut social programs to balance their budget. I've been saving for over a decade from the proceeds of my own business. My lower tax rate combined with my savings means I have freedom. I can move anywhere in the world and live well (even France). Can you say the same? Or is your quality of life limited to where you live (and based on who is in power at the time)?
I also am American, though I also have UK citizenship and have lived there as well, so I'm here by choice.
I was raised in a time before 20M+ illegal Mexicans ran the show.
That's just ludicrous, the illegal immigrants have very little financial or political clout.
The rest of the world might not be aware, but the USA will soon face it's 2nd Civil War. Every day that I read about incidents like the one discussed in this thread, I pray that more of my fellow citizens will being to think as I do. That way, the War will come sooner rather than later; which to me means that the healing can begin sooner.
I actually live in MD, and rather than incidents like this making me fantasize about shooting people it makes me want to take steps to curb these types of abuses through the democratic process. Owning guns in the belief/hope that you will use them against the government is, in my opinion, even more misguided than those who buy home defense guns in the belief/hope that they'll get into a room by room shootout with home invaders bent on harming (for what reason is never specified) their family. It's not a rational assessment, and seems to stem from some sort of feelings of powerlessness. I'm not against guns, and I'm not terribly pro-government, but your rationale seems way off base. Try not to end up like James von Brunn, living in a paranoid fantasy world.
I have an honest question for you. Can you find me a country that will take me and help me get there with my family?
I got sucked into the American "justice" system when I was 14 for playing with fire in the middle of the road near my house. Ever since then the local cops have labelled me as trouble and been sure to search extra hard when I get pulled over.
I was kicked out of school shortly afterwards because several months earlier I had given a friend a copy of the anarchist cookbook on a floppy disk. The administration of course "found out" about this the day after the columbine shooting. Only after threatening to sue did they agree to pass me on to the next grade, but they wouldn't give me credit for all my high school level classes.
So I got dumped into 9th grade taking a bunch of classes I had already been through. Being young, angry, and too smart for my own good, this was of course unbearable. So I dropped out as soon as possible, but the laws being what they were I had to go through a year and a half of high school I didn't need. I skipped constantly only to show up on test days and get high 90%'s. Because I wasn't doing the boring repetitious homework of course my grades tanked. As soon as I hit 16 years old I dropped out, waited the mandatory 6 months and then took my GED, getting 99% on nearly every test. I've gone into community college a couple times but every time I get so bored and/or frustrated of taking classes full of people who dropped out of high school because it was too hard for them, and teachers who either don't expect much, don't care, or don't understand what they're supposed to be teaching. Between that and the need to work as much as I can so I don't starve I always end up dropping out
Thanks to the extra police scrutiny as well as a year long undercover investigation to bust our "drug ring" (read: teenagers smoking pot) I've got a handful of felony convictions. At 16 I decided to plead out instead of facing 20 years in prison for giving somebody I thought was a friend a dime bag after he claimed his step-dad would beat him if he didn't come home with some pot.
I spent a couple years hitching around with the hippies and anarchists trying to save the world from the insanity I had grown up in with slogans and protests, but eventually settled back down near my hometown and now have a fiancée and a 1 year old son. I did a lot of parkour during my roaming days and so now have a really screwed up spine (and no health insurance) so physical labor is out. Nobody corporate will hire me because of my criminal record so I work with my dad in real estate getting ~25% of his commissions (in exchange for keeping track of everything for him, half the reason I still work with him is because without me he would lose track of his own head). I barely make enough to keep a roof over my families head and the lights on. I have no higher degrees, no verifiable experience in anything other than getting my ass kicked by the cops, and no savings.
How the hell am I supposed to jump ship to another country?
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
You appear not to have watched the video, which was taken with a helmet-cam.
As opposed to Italy, where the mafia will kill you if you don't pay protection money.
Or Britian where the CCTVs are everywhere all the time.
Or France where it's impossible for twenty-somethings to get work.
Or how about we ignore biased overblown judgments of others' systems?
Really, if you have a bit of money and can afford a lawyer, the legal system isn't all that bad here. If you're poor, shit sucks for you, but it sucks pretty much everywhere. Although, yeah, it's probably better in Europe. No wonder why you guys have so many poor immigrants wandering in. But that's what you want right? You're questioning why we live here, and implying we should move there. Because it's a sign of a good government and country. And that's why we have immigrants coming up north. For all it's problems, we're still better then the alternatives.
...is to protect his life first. If the driver is aggressive and reckless you assume he will be aggressive and reckless once confronted.
How many times have people complained that, "I wish a cop was there to do something." An off-duty cop stepped in and did something and we need to cry about it.
Be upset about the "wire tapping" not the actions of the officer.
C'mon, everybody knows how to kill "gangland style:" Two to the body to put 'em down. THEN, approach and one in the head to be sure.
In the old days, you'd then drop the (gauzed) gun immediately, so if you were stopped even a few feet away, you could say twernt me. However, technology has removed that option.
Oh, to go back to those halcyon hitman days....
that was a completely unprofessional traffic stop! is that how maryland state police normally operate? was that guy actually on duty? no emergency lights or markings on the vehicle, could have been his personal vehicle. jumps out of the car immediately displays his weapon, no uniform, and does not immediately identify himself as a police officer. he could easily get himself shot doing that! especially by another off duty police officer. And as far as I know the privacy laws have nothing written special in them for employees of law enforcement, so the same rules apply equally. Noone should have an expectation of privacy when they are out in public. This is how the paparazzi are able to photograph and videotape celebritites just about anywhere they go. and how the news media is able to record/broadcast when some incident is happening in public. if anything a public local law enforcement agency should have a much lower expectation of privacy. seems the maryland state police is forgetting who their boss is, the public!
The cop was behaving completely unprofessionally by pulling his gun and not identifying himself. The video is quite embarrassing to him, so the police are trying to go after the rider, it's as simple as that.
We really need laws that ensure that recording public officials is legal while they are on the job, with or without their consent, with or without their knowledge. That shouldn't just apply to cops, it should also apply to government offices and anywhere else public servants work.
My lower tax rate combined with my savings means I have freedom. I can move anywhere in the world and live well (even France). Can you say the same? Or is your quality of life limited to where you live (and based on who is in power at the time)?
No, I don't, I'm quite limited to living in the European Union and if I want to move to a rich country outside EU, I know that all I've made here will be kind of lost. Then again to say the truth, the only 1st world countries outside EU where I see myself living are Australia or New Zealand (that have a quite good social system as well), cause I feel I have mostly of what I need in Europe, which let's face it it's extremely diverse.
This is not to say I couldn't go living to Australia, I could, and actually I have 2 friend couples that just went there about 1 year ago. But no, they don't live well (well, in the sense of wealthy), they just have a medium middle class life there.
But this takes me to the important point. By living here, I receive quite a lot from the state, but I also contribute. My taxes are used for good stuff. Stuff that benefits me and the other citizens. In my way of seeing things (and you see that's the way the other mostly do around here), that's the correct way to take your life ... contribute to society. That's why not all the immigrants are treated the same way around here. For instance, Ukrainians are really hard working, and they pay taxes and they have kids and raise them here ... so we like them. Some other immigrants, because of they culture, don't want to do that, so of course we don't feel very happy to have them around.
In the end, well, see it a bit as the Americans thinks about their army ... people that contribute to their country. We don't like armies that much ... but we certainly can appreciate people that contributes to the country in other ways, and in here it's not difficult, just work when there is work to do, and pay taxes when you got a work.
They always got something to hide. So since they hidden that this guy is an asshole, what more are they hiding?
"They" have hidden nothing; they guy admits he was speeding.
Because I personally think speeders should be locked up for life,
A speeding motorcycle is mostly a risk to itself and relatively harmless to other drivers.
ACLU and every other privacy nutgroup, learn that if you expect people to take you serious,
I doubt anybody gives a f*ck whether a moron like you takes them seriously.
The fact that the police are trying to get away with this doesn't mean that they will be able to. Court rulings in the US have so far generally been in favor of people charged with illegal taping. We should, however, make sure that laws make it even clearer that photography, video, and audio recordings in public places are completely legal, by anybody, for any purpose, and can generally be published as well.
Whatever the situation in the US is, it is far worse in Europe. The UK, for example, passed explicit laws against photographing police. Similar laws exist in some other European nations.
Which is exactly why one who is informed should not try to avoid being put on a jury.
The problem is that you either have to choose to be dependent on the social system of the country you live in or be dependent on yourself. It's not always easy to move to another country when the one your in is experiencing economic chaos (Greece, for example).
This is much more dangerous that most people realize because this is a trend in law enforcement. I am an artist in Chicago threatened with the very same offense. I was arrested while testing the misdemeanor peddlers license requirement in Chicago for selling art for $1 on State Street in the downtown area. Because I audio-recorded my own arrest in order to collect evidence of what happened during my arrest I was charged with a 1st class felony for violating the arresting officers privacy rights. As noted in this discussion, police officers on duty in public arresting people are not acting privately and the State does not accord them privacy rights while on duty. Yet, three States are testing new wiretapping laws, Maryland, Massachusetts and Illinois, with the idea being that if they are able to take our 1st Amendment right to watch our public officials (mainly police) away from us they can neutralize the threat of citizens using cell phone technology to gather information to protect themselves from a budding police state. We must establish our right to use our technology to protect ourselves. That is what is at stake. This is a fault line, one side is a police state and the other is democracy. you can read more about my case by googling "Chris Drew eavesdropping" or visit my website at http://www.c-drew.com/blog where I explain lots of interesting First Amendment issues. Sincerely, Chris Drew
Here's a useful phone app someone into phone apps should write. When you push one emergency button, the phone starts taking video and audio and uploading it in real time to a server, which then immediately sends the video someplace where it can't be deleted. (Sending it to YouTube, Wikileaks, the ACLU, and CopWatch might be overkill, but it would work.)
You're comparing marginal tax rates in the highest tax brackets. Progression into the highest tax bracket is much faster in Europe than in the US. In addition, European nations impose a lot of other requirements on you that result in additional annual expenses: television licensing fees, intellectual property fees, administrative fees, etc. Of course, salaries tend to be lower and prices higher in Europe as well. The limit for Danish immigration is about $80k these days, which is quite high for Denmark.
Of course, moving to Denmark isn't exactly a walk in the park for non-Danish people anyway: there's the language barrier and a big cultural barrier. There's a reason Denmark makes it comparatively easy to immigrate: supply and demand for Danish immigration.
Consider: three of those statistics: (the high ones) do not involve trial, innocence or guilt: they are of ALL Fed criminal defendants.
The most telling: 93.6& of all Federal CASES result in a guilty plea. So, if you are simply charged (you don't have to be indicted, you know...I saw many inmates who waived indictment) you have about a 94% chance of being found or pleading guilty.
Busted By The Feds the book many inmates use (stupidly) as a legal bible has even more frightening statistics.
I suspect your first assumption is probably the right one. How else to explain these statistics: that the US 1) has the highest incarceration rate in the world, 2) the highest documented prison and jail population in the world and: 3) 7.3 million people on probation, in jail or prison, or on parole?
"The pie shall be cut in half and each man shall receive.....death. I'll eat the pie."
Was that a phone call to intended as a go-ahead to kill someone? Drug smuggling? You see, you can make lots of phone calls for different purposes. It's probably not a phone call to place an order for pizza.
I've seen you post before and get modded positive. Yet, you never write what you were in jail for? And yes, everyone is innocent in jail except only few are more innocent than others.
In Canada you are not allowed to have a criminal conviction on your record and be a police officer.
Now, while that's great in theory, a recent study showed that 15% or police officers in Canada currently have a criminal conviction on record. Some of these being police chiefs. When the police get called on this, the government usually pardons the person, which removes the record of the criminal conviction.
And the police wonder why we the people don't trust them.
I constantly see police breaking the law. They especially show a disrespect for traffic laws. Speeding, running red lights when they aren't responding to a situation, illegal turns. Them following the law is more of a shock because it happens so rarely.
Microsoft, Apple, Google, Amazon what's the difference? All steal money from devs and control with walled gardens.
Well first of all, most of Europe got the hang of English, so language barrier is a not really that big of a deal. Secondly, when you get a job here, most companies are willing to spend money on teaching you the local language, a new employee is a big investment, we (the company) want to protect that investment and make sure you thrive. Also, I think your view on UK police is misjudged, from my experience they are nice and friendly - not sure what you base the police state on.
how willing are you to gamble your life when the prosecution can completely misconstrue what happened? I'm certain you're ignorant to what you're talking about. If you were the one getting convicted, you'd take a much different stance. Otherwise, you might end up like this man
Willingham's case gained renewed attention in 2009 when an investigative report in The New Yorker,[1] drawing upon arson investigation experts and advances in fire science, purported to demonstrate that, contrary to the claims of the prosecution, there was no evidence that the house fire was intentionally set, and that the State of Texas executed an innocent man.
do some research and you'll see for yourself that defending yourself is not only too expensive for the average person, but its also extremely difficult when the DA can falsify evidence and testimony. And believe me, if you do some research, you'll find numerous instances of this occurring throughout the nation
60% taxes, where? I would say, that the most taxing countries (France for instance), get at most 50%.
It depends what you consider as a tax: here in France, more than 50% of the money your employer puts in your salary goes to the government. Then you have to pay your taxes: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fichier:Coin_fiscal_OCDE.png. There is also a 33% tax on profit the companies make, and a 19.6% VAT on everything you buy. So, actually, much more than 50% of the money goes to the government at some point.
But I agree with you that quality of life is more important than money.
First thing you learn in a lawsuit (not criminal in my case, but same idea applies), is that the truth doesn't matter. Once you are in a lawsuit you are now playing a game and you have to do whatever it takes to win the game, whether that means maintaining your innocence when you are guilty or admitting guilt when you are innocent.
And this is American freedom is it? This is what you all mean when you're screaming "We're number one!" This is the right way of doing things - the way you're exporting to the rest of the world through strong-arm tactics and bullying?
No wonder parts of the world hate you, and most of the rest think you are fools.
When the plea bargain means going to jail anyway, I'd go to trial. If I lost, I'd appeal. Very loudly.
Ceci n'est pas un sig.
I'd be all for red-light cameras if it weren't for the fact that they always shorten the yellow-light timings when these are installed, causing more accidents at these intersections.
Sorry for answering two times. But actually the graph you gave me reflects what I said (in my 1st answer to you), see the line that says: coin fiscalo-social, en % de travail total. It gives 50%! Because like I was saying, you must remember that the employee doesn't pay himself one of those taxes. So actually half the green the employee is paying for you, the other half he is paying for himself ... but as you can see in the end, they are only taking half of the money from your work in total. So the 50% I said.
A similar situation happened in the area where I live, also in Maryland. The wiretap law in Maryland is very sketchy and skewed against the rights of the public. A guy had a pocket audio recorder, and had it intentionally recording in his shirt pocket. He had a conversation with the mayor of the city just outside the front door of city hall on the steps, and recorded it. He was charged with felony wiretapping but plead out on an Alford plea to the misdemeanor of something along the lines of distributing a recording without consent of the recorded, another ridiculous Maryland law.
The guy in this case is a bit of a wackjob but the argument is valid, with ridiculous two-party consent with EVERYTHING...
http://www.wboc.com/Global/story.asp?S=10162408
http://thepocomokepubliceye.blogspot.com/2010/01/local-blogger-wiretapping-trial.html
I'd give better references but the local newspaper archives articles and makes you pay to access them.
The one party system for recording applies to MOST states; there are just a few messed up corrupt states where everyone must be informed. Google around and find out if your state is a one party or all party recording state.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
A guy who sells small amounts of drugs three times does 20 years, mandatory
that's called natural selection.
you get caught selling. receive your punishment. now you decide gee that it would be a good idea to do that again. then you get caught *again*, receive your punishment. at this point you've probably even served some jail time.
now, knowing that a third offense carries a 20y mandatory, you decide to sell AGAIN ...
don't get me wrong, drug sentencing is way out of whack with the crime. but repeating and getting caught 3x in a row either says your are extremely stupid or trying to make a point.
Just like the POLL TAX on voting; government has undermined the right to gather by requiring permits. Police may not show up and cause trouble but you could be in trouble for unlawful assembly and whatever else they can make up.
You are required by a protest TAX to ask permission to exercise your rights and they CAN turn down your permit or move you to a free speech zone and charge too much "processing fees" - being totally unreasonable under the laws. We'll need a big fight to undo it just like there was for the poll tax on voting and the other laws that anybody with a brain could honestly see were just legal games to hack away at our rights. This is what judges are supposed to be doing; cutting out the BS that is just playing legal games to defeat laws and our rights not being so literal minded computers will soon be able to replace them.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
most of the low speed limits are about makeing cash and not safety just like the red light cameras.
Quoted for Truth! Highway Patrol should be pulling over people who don't use their turn signals or don't yeild the right of way but pulling over harmless speeders is much easier.
For Americans, quality of life is not as important as freedom. The freedom to do as the individual wants is more important than the good of the collective, which is what socialism is about. It is built upon the idea that the individual can do anything with enough blood and sweat, and thus not only is state assistance unnecessary, but the state shouldn't help.
At least, that's the ideal. It assumes an educated, enlightened populace who will weigh their every act that benefits the individual against how it will affect society, and will moderate any extremes and choose appropriately. What actaully happens is that people somehow interpret personal freedom to mean they can do anything they want without repercussions. Hence laws are enacted to stop such behavior, and government intrusion becomes necessary. The founding fathers understood this, and tried to enforce moderation of government intrusion through the constitution. Unfortunately, if the government is of the people and the majority of the people are uneducated and unenlightened, then it's only a matter of time before the whole elaborate system falls on its head.
One can say that the ideal of personal freedom itself is cognitively dissonant from reality, and that the compromises of socialism makes for an overall healthier society. But that's a separate discussion altogether.
"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
I think it's clear that riding a motorcycle at 127mph in traffic while doing wheelies is pretty fucking illegal. What the police department did about the recording is very wrong but that's a separate issue.
Those are indeed two distinct topics, but the latter topic is what this thread is about. I agree with you, at least in general, about traffic safety, but that's not what we're here to discuss.
That is a good course of action provided that:
1. You have enough funds to last through the trial and the appeal.
2. The appeal isn't thrown out.
Even then, appeals often not go as one hopes for.
Some info from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court_of_appeals
I'm curious though, what is the difference between a regular appeal and a very loud one?
Post "Audio monitoring and/or recording devices may be in use at all times." decals on the windows. By speaking the douchebag rookie cop with an overblown ego (no offense intended to respectable officers here - I've had run-ins with douchebags and have also been pulled over by very decent officers so I do NOT mean to offend everyone because there are a few douchebag rookie cops out there who should not be allowed to drive let alone wear a badge) consents to having his douchebaggery recorded for public record.
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
You do realize that rural highway speed limits are maxed out at 55mph-65mph (and often decreased on DOWNHILL sections) solely to raise revenue, right?
When you show me officers enforcing speed limits in school zones, residential side streets, and enforcing right of way in roundabouts/rotaries, and enforcing proper turns and lane changes (i.e., turn indicators/signals/blinkers) I might agree with you. But until actual safety regulations are enforced, I have to call bullshit on your entire post.
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
Quoted for truth. I worked for a company that had an injunction filed against it BEFORE any charges were filed or delivered to the executives of the company. The FTC filed the injunction and it said in it that the company could not use company money to pay its employees, pay its debtors, or even DEFEND ITSELF! What a crock of shit!
Like the burden of proof for THIS case to go to trial? Wake up. Judges grant cases all the time with little or no evidence or precedent for the charges to even apply.
yes, you pay 50% taxes, but that comes with UNIVERSAL health care, real rights to the ones that get unemployed, children support, practically FREE education all the way until the end of college
Free? It's not free. Your education and healthcare are paid for with tax dollars instead of private funding but it's not remotely free. Much of the education here in the US is paid for with tax dollars too even at the university level but Americans tend to prefer the option to choose what they pay for instead of having the government do it for us. Same with health care. You'll find that most Americans follow the principle that whenever possible those who use a service should be the ones paying for it. Sometimes that is not possible (military, infrastructure, primary/secondary education, etc) but it's not a bad concept and certainly no worse in principle than a system run by the government.
There are real unemployment rights in the US too but with an eye toward pushing people to get back to work instead of remaining unemployed. Unemployment rates in have historically been lower in the US than in much of Europe. There is no free lunch here. Greater unemployment benefits create incentives for people to remain unemployed. After all, why work if you can get by without working? Lesser employment benefits are harder on people in the short run but arguable better for everyone in the long run.
And beside, what really kills me, is how you Americans just care about the money.
You don't really know much about Americans do you? Much easier to lump us all together with ridiculous stereotypes than to actually try to understand. I'm sure you have lots of evidence to back up your assertion that Americans care about nothing but accumulating as much money and material wealth as possible. Couldn't possibly be true that we're just a teensy-tiny bit more complicated than that. [/sarcasm]
Man, quality of life is much more than the money.
True enough.
It's support when you need it. It's knowing that you are protected in case something goes wrong and it's not entirely your fault
Social Security, Medicare, Unemployment Benefits, Welfare, Insurance, Workers Compensation, WIC, Food Stamps, Homeless Shelters, Food Banks, Nonprofit Humanitarian Groups, and Emergency Response systems are just a few of the support systems we have here in the US. There is literally no part of the social safety net you can point to in Europe that does not have an equivalent here in the US. Not identical and not perfect but it is a system that works. The ones in Europe work fine too but have their flaws as well if you actually care the take an objective look. Different approaches with the same end goal. Americans prefer a different approach that suits our particular sensibilities. If you don't like it, that's your choice and we don't really care.
it's good climate (well, this only applies to Souther Europe)
Yeah, the weather is really shitty in Southern California, Florida, etc. Do you have ANY concept of the geography in the US? The most populous states not coincidentally have pretty good weather. I live in a more northerly area and the weather where I live is absolutely delightful most of the year.
it's culture for free
Are you seriously making the incredibly tired argument that Americans have no culture and not access to it? Do you seriously believe we have no art, no food, no music, no museums, no social outlets and no dance? Do you really think we charge for access to all of it?
it's really good food (once again ... only in southern Europe :D)
Then I feel bad for you because I've had truly excellent food throughout the US. I've traveled extensively and US cuisine is as good as anywhere I've been. There are some excellent culinary traditi
Wow you actually believed all that garbage? Have you *read* the Constitution before all the amendments? Scary scary stuff my man.... scary. We're not exporting it to the rest of the world, your leaders are selling it so they can take all your money.
MOD PARENT UP!
I don't live in the US, so not subject to the stupid dollar value attached to accessing the legal system as obvious in the US.
A very loud appeal involves the media. I'm innocent, there's a human interest story there. Either I've been framed, or caught in a technicality - both scenarios a decent journalist can run with.
Photographer Carlos Miller has been tracking these types of cases across the country for a couple of years. Check out his website for more information:
Photography is not a crime
But the OP is. You cannot fault his choice until you find your self in a similar situation
Whether you are innocent of guilty is for the court(s) to decide.
Hey, I'm sure this will not be published or modded out as Troll, but US citizens (not "Americans", that is a continent, not your country) are too used and unaware that they are being used as toys by their government institutions.
Here in /. people use to joke about Soviet Russia, but today's United States are the same or worse. They would make George Orwell very proud.
I'm just suggesting people be very careful.
Scary. I know I need to leave the U.S. sometime before "permanently leaving the U.S." is interpreted as "conspiracy to commit treason."
First of all, to be pedantic: VAT is in most EU member states different on different goods so whilst it's there on "every goddamn thing you buy", it's not that high on everything.
But in your obsession with taxes, you seem to forget a number of valuable things Europeans get for their tax euros - such as health care and subsidized public transportation, which benefits everyone. Less congestion and less pollution is a pretty nice thing to have (there are even areas in the EU where bus transportation is completely free). Furthermore, since tuition is free at European universities, graduates have much smaller student loans, if any (you might have to take one to cover living expenses whilst studying but you actually do get a certain monthly allowance depending on what degree you're studying for and proof that you do pass courses).
I suspect that you're fully aware that your statement regarding income tax percentages only applies to the highest income bracket but what you might not know, however, is that certain "household services" - such as cleaning and small repair jobs - are tax deductible in many EU member states.
Hoo boy is that naive. My whole point was that even if you did nothing, the prosecutor can get you indicted. Do you understand the Grand Jury system? You do not give testimony, only the prosecutor does. You really would tell a prosecutor to "stick it" if you thought he had no evidence? You'd roll the dice with a jury?
Many people face that choice every day, and do time rather than do a LOT of time.
"The pie shall be cut in half and each man shall receive.....death. I'll eat the pie."
Not if you renounce your US citizenship. By the way, that used to be free of charge, but I think it'll cost you >$400 nowadays...
Or how about "school zones" that are in operation at 7pm on a Sunday evening? I've got a ticket for that, that was in a work zone, too. "School zone, x mph when children present" - cops claim was that I couldn't have known that children weren't present, ergo should have assumed they were. Net result was that by his reckoning, at 11mph over the "school zone" limit, 6mph over the regular limit (fair enough), he was claiming that with that, and the workzone (hah), he would be within his rights to take me in for reckless driving...
It's not about being "right"... it's simply about being honest. Whether or not that matters to other people is quite irrelevant to how much it matters to me.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Truth can matter a great deal to one who believes they will ultimately be held as accountable for lying as if they had actually done the crime for which they are accused.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
What other people might believe about me is not nearly as important to me as what I know about myself. I'd prefer to not go to jail at all, but I'm not about to lie to a judge just to save myself from being prosecuted for something I never did in the first place. If I lied to a judge in a courtroom, I'd have to live with that knowledge that I saved myself however many years of prison by lying... essentially, cheating. That's not something I'm prepared to live with.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
I said "know", not "think". If you literally know that the prosecutor has literally zero evidence.
But what do you think happened in the plea bargaining stage to that 24.4% who are found not guilty? And they're not the only ones who are acquitted. If 90% of people take a plea bargain, then only 36% of the remainder are convicted. Based on your rates, 12% of those who refuse plea bargains go to trial and are acquitted and the remaining 52% don't get to trial. Stats are fun aren't they.
So, does this mean you should refuse to cop a plea even if you're guilty? Of course not. It's not a crapshoot. It's about how much evidence there is and skill of the lawyers. Still, whether you're guilty or not does tend to have an effect on the amount of evidence.
You don't think that many of us are asking ourselves the same question every fucking day. I am almost in tears writing these words. This was a great nation, and now it is a sewer. Fuck!
Social Credit would solve everything...
OK, so you don't understand immigration rules as they apply to the UK, you don't understand taxes and to add to your list of achievements, you don't understand what I've written either.
In the UK, the toughest part of getting in is *not* the earnings threshold. If you're a skilled worker, you need employer sponsorship and there *is no* earnings threshold. If you're a very skilled worker, you don't need employer sponsorship, but you do need to gain enough points based on qualifications, earnings (ooh are you happy?), UK experience, age, English skills and funds (happy again?). Additionally, you need to meet the entry clearance criteria that apply to your country of origin, which are often tough and separate in themselves. All of which is a long-winded way of saying that the OP was right and you were wrong, when you had your disagreement about whether it's tough to immigrate to work in the UK. It is tough.
I have no idea how you think your point on paying VAT on everything backs up your assertion that a 60% tax rate is only applicable in Denmark. That's just wrong. Particularly as you've assumed that there are only two taxes that apply: income and VAT. There are, of course, many more, and the cumulative effective is that many people pay more than 60% of earnings in taxes. This is not a left vs right thing: in the UK, a large number of benefits recipients have an effective marginal tax rate of above 100%, which discourages them from seeking better-paid employment and is a disgrace.
Jeez, you really insist on demonstrating your ignorance about the UK, don't you? The current administration is planning a "Great Repeal Bill" precisely because the previous administration was deemed by many to have curbed liberties unduly. As for friendly police, your experience is your experience, but there are many hundreds of examples of unfriendly police seeking to exercise authority beyond the rule of law, and they tend to succeed. Jean Charles de Menezes, Ian Tomlinson, kettling, attempts to ban public photography, stop and search, warrantless taps, etc etc.
Here's a suggestion: stick to talking about Denmark.
FFS.
"...you are by no means required to spend all your money, you can save it up, earn interest, invest them - at no point do you have to pay anything more."
In the UK, you pay tax on income. That includes interest and returns on investment. You also pay capital gains tax.
VAT covers goods *and services*.
I'd be astonished if the same weren't true in just about every EU state.
Why don't you quite while you're behind?
We're not saying that you'd lie. We're saying that the prosecution will lie and the lie that they tell will be better than the truth that you will tell and in the end, the prosecution will succeed in convicting an innocent person.
When did he get a chance to turn the camera off? The rider was filming himself in his own private vehicule when sudenly a man walks into the frame waving a treatening weapon. Is he suppoesd to think about turning the camera off at that moment, or when he is ordered off the bike by an unidentified gunman?
His "true" crime is probably putting the video up on Youtube without consent from the officer. But by going after this guy, maybe to intimidate him, maybe to get back at him, maybe to search his computers for other similar "cop films" the officer in the tape has brought national attention to his own failings, wich he could be reprimanded for.
The biker should sue for reparations.
On another note I wonder why there is no sound in the clip until the very end...
It's sad that once upon a time, you could tell your children that the police were a safe-haven - these days I tell my children to NEVER call the police, or interact with them as they are the true "mob" and rape, kill, and steal with the force of the so-called "justice" department behind them. That is why when I'm on a jury, I look at everything a police officer finds, or says as being a lie. If there was a gun - I figure it was a throw-a-way, same for small quantities of drugs, and other "evidence". Since I can have no past record of offenses of the accused, I automatically assume all charges are non-sense and treat them accordingly unless there are civilian witnesses to an event.
This type of behavior just goes to further prove to me that such a skeptical view is more than warranted. Once upon a time this country was about freedom, now it is literally transforming into a "police" state where they (the police) are worse than the Gestapo.
A ticket like that, you should go to court over. If you get a judge that isn't insane they'd throw it out.
Check out my world simulator thingy.
That would be unfortunate, of course, but just because the prosecution may lie, that does not legitimize my lying as well.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Major gangs routinely scour newspapers and networking sites to find pictures of police to add to watch lists.
A few years ago in Canada, a group of young cadets took a candid picture of some of their classmates at the Police Academy. The picture ended up on MySpace, and a couple years later one of the officers in the background of the picture was identified and killed while working undercover.
The Police don't know why or for whom these people are taking pictures or video of officers on duty. The officers have families and personal lives to protect, too.
The difference between a police cruiser using videotape to prove civilian wrongdoing (such as filming drunk drivers) and private citizens filming/photographing officers on duty is that the police tapes don't get put on the internet so that anybody can track the people down.
This case has nothing to do with 'vigilance.' Let's be honest for a minute: if the officer had actually done something wrong, the tape could have been submitted to the citizen’s action committee and the internal affairs office to investigate. Instead, the shutter-bug put in on YouTube, probably hoping for a cheap shot at getting some ratings.
16 years is a little much, but the guy was wrong.
Remind me, where is the wire? The point of the law was to prevent recording someone without their consent during a private communication where the other party would not be aware of the recording. These police officers are in public, where free speech is at its strongest, and where they can tell if someone is recording them. Furthermore, what harm did he do to the officers by recording them? It neither interferes with their job or hurts them. The only possible interference or harm is if the police are acting incorrectly, which will be seen on the tape. Meh.
Okay... what percentage of those that pled "not guilty" resulted in a person going to jail for a crime they did not actually do?
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
In a recent article titled "Boynton woman's suit fights to allow videotaping of police", police are alleged to have arrested but charges were not filed.