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Is Samsung Blocking Updates To Froyo?
jfruhlinger writes "One of the complaints about Android is its fragmentation; many different versions of the OS are out there in the wild, and often users are held back from upgrading by their hardware or their carrier. But now a disturbing rumor has it that Samsung is strong-arming T-Mobile to prevent an over-the-air upgrade to Android 2.2 (Froyo) for Samsung Vibrant owners. The reason? Samsung wants people to shell out for the new Vibrant 4G — which, other than the fact that it ships running Froyo, is largely identical to the Vibrant."
Reader CWmike contributes an informative link if you'd like to know which Android vendors are actually delivering timely upgrades.
Hows all that "open platform" "not locked to a walled garden" "no need to jailbreak" Android working out for all the people that rant and rave against the iPhone?
So... It's officially the rumor to go along with what we were all thinking would happen anyway. It's nice that an "anonymous T-Mobile" employee can provide the evidence.
Don't get me wrong, I fully well think this is what will happen/is happening... But I'm going to need to see someone attach their name to this... That or see the Vibrant 4G be out on the market long enough to reasonably justify that something is indeed up beyond pure laziness.
I want an OTA update for my Samsung Vibrant. It's a Galaxy S on 2.1 Android, and it's a nice bit of hardware. I don't really need the upgrade but I do wonder why they're not putting anything out OTA. They are dragging their heels on the Kies update. Well, even if it were on Kies, I wouldn't use that piece of junk. Oh, wait, they don't make it for the Mac. It's silly to have such an advanced phone, which can't update itself over the air like pretty much every other smartphone in the past few years can do.
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The good thing about Android is that it's open and anyone can add features, customizations, etc. to it.
The bad thing about Android is that the manufacturers and the carriers usually end up raping it and making it a worse experience.
The ugly part is that Google doesn't seem to care all that much and is perfectly willing to put up with this kind of crap.
Not to say this rumor is true, but this is why forced vendor dependence is a bad thing. I'm not sure if Samsung is doing it (and they aren't yet, as I understand it) but if Samsung was doing what Motorola was and signing the kernel, then such fixes and updates would be impossible to install.
As it stands, you can root a Samsung device and load whatever ROM you want on it. But beware, this is the sort of behavior that they want such lock down for. Not for your security, but to deliberately limit the lifespan of your device and make you buy a new one.
Customers should demand that the phone's come with documentation stating A) What upgrade rights the customer has, B) The minimum span for which the vendor promises to support the phone by issuing upgrades to the standard Android build or a variant, and C) In the event that the company cannot fulfill (B), for example, because that particular model sold poorly, or the company goes out of business, that the phones will be completely unlocked (except for the black box components that let you violate FCC regs) and third party vendors or OSS hackers can issue their own upgrades, at the customer's own risk. Oh, and include a revert to original state option in case an upgrade goes south.
These rules could probably use some fine tuning, but I believe that this will make purchasing decisions simpler and budgets more predictable. It will also establish a sense of trust and even loyalty with the vendors that follow this model. As it stands, very few phone makers or telcos have earned any trust whatsoever. We just have to guess who will screw us hardest-- and when the contestants are Microsoft, Sony, AT&T, Verizon, Apple, Samsung, that's not a fun game.
Smart phones are expensive, and they're taking the place of PCs in many areas. PC vendors don't restrict your ability to install an alternative OS. We should expect the same from phone vendors. The status quo encourages forced waste-- which is always profitable for a few scumbags, but it's bad for all other life on the planet, consumers included.
in soviet russia, froyo updates you why not ?
but on the other hand, i might become a wealthy doctor, prehaps.
This rumor is interesting. I wonder if there's a similar situation with Motorola/T-Mobile's failure to keep their promise of updating the Cliq XT from 1.5.
sig: sauer
Eh, the latest i9000 (European Galaxy S) ROM has OTA updates, and it'll most likely be in the Captivate release.
If you want to update on your mac, I suggest using Heimdall , 512.pit file, and this ROM . It's most likely the 2.2 update that's been "blocked"
Quite well, as long as the Nexus S and/or the various Android Dev Phones are available.
Yes, just as the iPhone is a great open platform, for after all we have jailbreaking.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
this is why forced vendor dependence is a bad thing
But it can also be a good thing - witness an iPhone untouched by the broad clown-makeup brush of Verizon.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I was concerned about something like this. The Behold II stopped at 1.6, despite only being on the market for a mere 9 months. I bought the Vibrant with the expectation the 2.2 was coming within a few months. That's what I was told. Then it was October, then it was December.
According to Cnet Samsung has said that they're still doing testing to make sure it works well. This is absurd. Is it going to take another year for us to move onto Gingerbread?
I bought this phone thinking that I was going to get a great phone with all of the features advertised. The GPS is still garbage *when* it works. "Media Hub" does nothing, even after being activated it doesn't work. These problems should have been solved before the phone was released.
My tmobile vibrant runs just fine with froyo because I put it on there. It would be nice if it was an ota update but it works great all the same.
[RIAA] says its concern is artists. That's true, in just the sense that a cattle rancher is concerned about its cattle.
It's bad enough the two worst cellphone carriers are making the iphone (AT&T) and android (T-Mobile) look bad... but let's not blame the manufacturers. HTC, Samsung, Motorola, and others have done a great job of providing open upgradeable platforms... AND developing upgrades for them with hardware specific vendor modifications.
Blame AT&T and T-Mobile for sucking. Samsung is ok in my book.
E
The update to Froyo was supposed to save the Vibrant, which was having issue after issue, and a ton of half assed fixes (forcing it to 850mhz for example) has actually bricked at least a dozen of these things that I have seen.
It's been so bad that any calls to customer care are now leading to brand new replacement hardware as well as a $100 bill credits on the account.
The Vibrant is a piece, stands out in my mind as the worst phone I've sold in the last 5 years. Absolute rubbish.
My girlfriend got a Motorola Cliq last year from T-Mobile. To this day it still runs Android 1.5. She was promised updates that were never delivered
I really like it actually. GPS is spotty compared to iPhone, but other than that it is world's better (in my opinion). The OLED is gorgeous.
That said I will never purchase another Samsung device that needs updating. I was promised Froyo in September after purchasing in June. Still haven't gotten it. Sure I got my own Froyo update in December, but I expected an update and got shafted. I'd read bad reports about Samsung not updating in the past and thought "this time will be different... this is a flagship device." Nope.
I dislike the "this group messed up, so hate the whole company" attitude, so I would consider a TV or the like. But not a phone.
I am running FROYO on my Samsung SGH-T959D (Galaxy S Fascinate). I obtained the OS update directly from Samsung (via their Kies software) the day after I received the phone a few weeks ago. Perhaps it has something to do with T-Mobile (not my carrier).
Call me naive, but it seems to me that a lot of these problems can be resolved by Google allowing (and release a application to do it) for any device to be flashed reliably to a stock Android [stable] release. Past and present.
Manufacturers don't want to update there fancy phone and custom UI to the latest? That's fine. But the user is still allowed to manually update themselves and lose the original features they bought into. Guess what -- those fancy features that brought them to your phone may prove to be optional and there's a much better chance they won't choose your hardware platform moving forward. This may be a big enough kick up the butt that the manufacturers need.
Just want to say thanks for this info. I haven't been keeping up with Android developments.
The only things that draw me personally to Android is the thought that I have control over the software because, of the last 3 phones I've bought I've been forced into it because of outdated software. (p800 Symbian UIQ went outdated, K750i SonyEricson software outdated, c900 poor warranty service, n95 s60v3 not too outdated yet but I'm sure will be soon and nothing can do about it). I basically caved in 3 months ago and went for another phone that does what I want but suffers from the same problem because of the Nokia free predownload mapping it came with (E55 s60v5 non touch).
For me, the ideal situation is for Vendors to be free to act like jerks. But for consumers to be educated enough and disciplined enough for vendors to have no motive for doing so. Clearly users are idiots though because this stuff happens; you need a critical mass of educated people because anything happens and even then you need a break in the line from manufacturers. So instead the realistic solution I feel is to tax wasteful manufacturing.
The next time someone chats about phones with me I'll say `Yeah, been there 5x before and they all blocked software updates in the end`.
A blog I run for the wealth
I have a samsung android device.
When I plug it into the computer keeps telling me there's an update. Spends 30 minutes downloading, then fails the checksum. Always. Regardless of which computer I use.
Not sure how related it is...
The thing is, Samsung preventing the users from upgrading may cause us to abandon the phone, but in what bizarro world would we ever buy another device from Samsung? The thing about Android is that many different manufacturers sell handsets, and if I have to buy another device anyway, I might as well buy from a manufacturer that delivers TIMELY UPDATES.
So, I'm thinking this will play out as just another rumor caused by severe update anxiety.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
Samsung have done this since their first Android phone, the Galaxy i7500. Why do you continue buying Samsung phones when you know they will do this?
We're still working out which vendors are going to support their phones for the long run, like Apple does with their iPhone, and which ones are expecting you buy a new one every year, like Nokia. My expectation in 2011 is that if I spend £500 on a new phone, I expect to get software updates for as long as the hardware is viable, *especially* when the manufacturer isn't bearing the cost of building the software! If Samsung don't deny this rumour and confirm they'll be issuing minor Android updates, I don't see how they expect to compete against Apple, and every other Android vendor out there. The ridiculous, wasteful "fire and forget" model of smartphone development is long dead, and manufacturers that try it will fix it, or exit the market pretty quickly.
Even 8 years ago, I never understood why Nokia didn't try to sell their phones as long-term investments, and ship better software for their premium phones as they developed it, rather than trying to hawk us a new bit of plastic every 18 months.
Matthew @ Bytemark Hosting
I frequent XDA a lot and the warnings were clear. If you're not buying a Nexus device (Nexus One/Nexus S), you will most likely be left in the dark for an official upgrade path. The G1 and the original, slower Galaxy, for example, never received an official upgrade past 1.6. Personally, I don't think carriers/OEMs have a lot of demand from most of their consumer base to engineer upgrades. This news might gain much more attention since it's blatantly obvious that Samsung was gunning for obsoleting one of their flagship phones so quickly, but unless video calling really takes off (doesn't seem to have done so yet), it's not the biggest deal for many.
From a technical standpoint, it's completely irrelevant. Save for the upgraded modem and the front-facing camera, it's the original Vibrant. (They probably added more tricks in the hardware to make rooting harder, though.) Additionally, it's pretty trivial to add a front-facing camera to the current Vibrant and there is an unofficial carrier-engineered version of Froyo for it floating around on the Internet. For starters, it has Wifi Calling natively bundled into it. It's also somewhat faster. I flashed my Dad's Vibrant with it before I gave it to him as a Christmas gift and it works amazingly for him.
Just the mere existence of that ROM suggests that an update might be around the corner. The question, though, is how wide T-Mobile and Samsung is making that corner for people.
The real reason they are stonewalling on the 2.2 update for Vibrant is this: When they released the 2.2 update for the Vibrant in Canada, the update worked fine for a week or two, and then like clockwork bricked a huge percentage of the phones that updated. And when I say bricked, I'm not being liberal with that word, after a week or so running the Samsung 2.2 update, the SD card would become corrupt, and recovery mode would be unable to format it. My wife and I both have Vibrants, and it happened to them both one day apart. Samsung has been silent on the matter. Not surprising they'd avoid moving sending the 2.2 update out to US Vibrant owners, and also not surprising that they're refusing to explain why. Bell at least is fixing them, but lots of people on the XDA forum are saying their "repaired" phones are bricking again in short order.
ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
I think the best solution would be to deliver the base OS via the market. Sort of like what they did with gmail. Remember when it was part of the OS so it only got updated when you got a kernel etc. They split it out and now you can grab a new version as it happens from the market store. They should do the same for the kernel. ie. Google should put the vanilla OS (Froyo, Gingerbread etc) as a simple app store upgrade.
I guess that buggers up the customisations and overlays, like Sense, Moto Blur but who cares. I actually prefer vanilla anyway. The carriers would probably have to have clear disclaimer that if you upgrade the OS you will no longer get support, which is fair. They do that already, so whats the big deal.
Why can't do this? I'm currently burned by the Milestone. Its sitting at 2.1. They indicated that it would move to 2.2 but its not happening...
In the world as it exists now, commerce is about lying and tricking users into contracts that are effectively organized theft. How about the %6500 markup http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2010/news/1001/gallery.americas_biggest_ripoffs/ on the cost of text messages? Same kind of non-competitive market manipulation.
Of course the corrupt practices of telcos are minor compared to what the banks/credit card companies do. Even with the new regulations, credit card rates and practices are like allowing someone to pick you pocket on a daily basis.
It all goes back to lack of meaningful regulation. The "invisible hand" is a fictional device intended to dupe consumers into thinking that their choices make a difference. When all the big players conspire in a pseudo-cartel environment buyers are sheared like sheep, and cost is decoupled from price.
Some combination of real competition and government oversight is the only way to restore actual capitalism. Competition is preferable but that requires breaking up the big dominant players, and right now they own the political process through campaign contributions, so that is not going to happen. The best hope in the short run is decent regulation, if we can keep the corrupt government/business complex from shutting it down the way they did in the Bush administration.
Why is Snark Required?
I love my Galaxy S. I think I'd pay $99 or so for a hardware upgrade with dual core processor etc.
Even so if this story is true then... fucking pricks. I will never forget and it will affect my future purchasing and recommendation behavior.
Already had to use the One Click Lag Fix. Which really made me love the Vibrant more, but it should have been updated by Samsung anyway in the first place.
Working out perfectly for me. Updated mine by myself from 1.6 to 2.2 without any hassles. Beats the heck out of a locked iPhone, or windows phone. I can side load any android app I want to, plus, without a carrier locked rom, I have tethering, wi-fi hot spot and no bloatware.
It's interesting to see how many people here are jumping on the bandwagon and either claim that vendors act maliciously by delaying updates, or blame Android for this.
Fact is - you bought a phone which did everything you needed at the time, and it still does.
The phone didnt suddenly stop working or lose features.
No, people are just giddy that there is another "new big thing" and want to update to it.
Please note that 99.9% of the USERS of those devices dont care.
They are still happily browsing the web, sending emails, and checking flight status with their Android 1.x devices.
For geeks, nerds and people who compare version numbers of their phones at cocktail parties, there is a simple solution.
Buy a "Google Experience" device, like the Nexus-One or Nexus-S devices.
Those devices receive the update straight from Google, and come unlocked and "open" to update the OS.
Now you say - but - you can't afford to spend 500+ bucks on a phone, if you can get one for $99 from your carrier.
Well, in that case, if you buy a carrier subsidized device (actually, you didnt buy it, it's more a LEASE), then you shouldnt complain that it comes with strings attached, and your carrier remains free to make a business decision which phones to upgrade, and which not.
Unless the other 99.9% of users who dont care, start calling the help desk and start asking for upgrades, until then - you're out of luck.
Samsung preventing the users from upgrading may cause us to abandon the phone, but in what bizarro world would we ever buy another device from Samsung?
How about the world in which the only viable competitor to iPod touch, a pocket size Android device that isn't a phone and has the Market, is the Samsung Galaxy Player?
My Verizon Samsung Fascinate was finally updated today, but not to 2.2
They put out a 2.1 patch.
Next step is to find out what the state of the downloadable ROMs are these days. I put Cyanogen on my old G1 when I found out I could get Google Navigate that way.
I was told I'd be able to choose another search engine besides Bing with the update. If so, they didn't put it in search setup.
Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
A simpler explanation is just that T-Mobile just sucks dick for Android updates. I've had a MyTouch from them for ~9 months now, and since I bought it they've been blowing smoke up my ass about how they're going to upgrade it. First it was 2.0, then oh you don't want that, then 2.1, then 2.2, then finally the released 2.2 for the crappier version of my phone. I just recently got the text from them that they're going to update it in "the next two weeks". I'll believe it when I see it.
Never ascribe to malice when simple incompetence will do.
The Fascinate and Acclaim just got their 2.2 updates today. Hopefully the Captivate isn't far behind.
I should be used to the frustrating feeling of waiting for updates by now. As a former Nokia N95-3 user, I watched as my European neighbors got something like 20 firmware updates, including minor bug fixes, major memory handler improvements, new features, free maps, etc. And when my phone finally got an update it was buggy and in some cases worse than the prior release.
Then I was wow'ed by the N900 and the promise of lots of firmware updates for it. Several months after dealing with a faulty Bluetooth stack we got a minor release. Then we got a major release that fixed some other things, but messed up a few others. Then Nokia suddenly went in a different direction and screwed us all.
So I said "NO MORE!" and bought a Samsung Vibrant. Sure the GPS sucked, but there's a work-around. And they'll fix it in August. It finally got fixed in September, IIRC. Right after the announced Froyo would be out in the fall!
My point is, handset makers treat software maintenance like a teenager treats a book report. 1/2 assed effort at the last minute.
"Well, good luck finding a judge that doesn't run a bestiality site."
"which can't update itself over the air" - another "expert" making an grossly incorrect statement
That's the way with android. You'll only pay more for a brand phone. Android has made a whole new market possible. Before, we used to have generic crap from china for just about every need, including cellphones. The problem was the software, it sucked badly. Now, with Android, you can get those very same cheap devices with awesome software. I bought an awesome 7.5'' resistive pad with 256 RAM and a 750Mhz ARM processor for u$s 125. Camera is good enough, battery lasts 2 hours, it's made of plastic and aluminum. Came with Android 2.1, and it runs beautifully. Got a generic phone too. That's actually all I buy. I want NO vendor lock-in. Run free software, buy cheap generic hardware. You don't get trapped, and considering the cost, upgrading is a non issue: get a new one. I can buy a new pad every year for several years for the cost of a single, locked-in samsung tablet.
Quite well thank you, I've got my Motorola Milestone on Cyanogen Mod 6.1 and my HTC dream on stock 1.6. Thanks for asking
When an article starts out with the line:
It's typically trying to set the tone of the article to be negative. Especially using FUD.
But being the fair minded person I am I read on. Then I read this:
So, we have no actual proof.
But lets say I accept this dubious allegation as fact for a minute. How does this affect Android, the problem is with Samsung and T-Mobile. It doesn't affect Australian Galaxy S users, or French, English, Japanese, Korean or even non T-mo American users. Nor does it affect users of Darky's ROM.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
If we had binary drivers as mandatory requirement for android, then we wouldn't be having these problems.
Hey, I'm glad I didn't buy that Epic, and the froyo issue was the ONL thing that kept me from getting one. Tell that to your marketing people. I promise to tarnish Samsung's image as best I can, for not keeping a few month old phone current.
BTW, We don't want a bunch of value-added marketing-differentiated bull$shit, just a good Android phone, with a company that will stand behind it.
https://www.youtube.com/c/BrendaEM
The Samsung Intercept, at least the one distributed by Virgin Mobile, is going to the the Froyo update soon. So any insinuation that Samsung blocks all android updates is false.
http://twitter.com/virginmobileus/status/24854959556136961#
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
If you're waiting for hardware manufacturers to give you free upgrades, you're going to be sorely disappointed. That's not their business. They want to sell more hardware. Buy a new phone.
But since Android is free, my T-Mobile Galaxy S Vibrant has been running Froyo since a few days after I bought it. I upgraded to a nice version of Froyo called Nero and I switched from Samsung's sucky, slow filesystem to Linux EXT4. I also installed VOIP software that lets me dial out without using T-Mobile minutes.
Nobody is going to hell, or even to jail, over this.
I had to install some software from the Android market, click a few things, take responsibility for what I was doing, download the new version, and reboot.
Android is open to vendors. Its free as in freedom and cost, to vendors. It IS free and it IS open, but not to users. That is the point of the apache license! What is the issue here? Is it open? Yes to vendors! So can we stop arguing if it is open or not?
So any insinuation that Samsung blocks all android updates is false.
However, if we were to say this about Sony Ericsson's Xperia X10 Mini Pro, it would be entirely true. I have one of these devices, and actually like the nice, compact hardware, but SE really sucks as an android vendor. If I hadn't succeeded in rooting the device to enable tethering and get rid of my telco's crapware, I would have returned the device as defective, since I was told explicitly that my telco has no problem with tethering.
However, no-one seems to have succeeded in getting any Froyo ROM to run natively on it with camera etc operable yet, so it looks like I'll just have to be patient.
Advanced users, but not developers, won't go through the hassle of obtaining a dev phone. They'll instead use a phone where they can get the latest updates and are automatic.
Witness the Iphone with tethering blocked from the carrier level, thanks to AT&T wanting to charge a tethering fee.
Iphones are still screwed with by the carrier, they just don't get to put their badging on the front (which affects the operation of the phone how).
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
On the evil scale (lock down), it is clear that,
MPAA/MAFIA > Apple >> Microsoft > Google
Google platform is so far the most open OS for mobile computing. Google is also one of the least-evil companies, at least on the Fortune 500 level.
Network Neutrality!
This "entitlement" is because we realize that these phones are actually computers running largely general purpose software, and there are security vulnerabilities that need patched. This is like Gateway, Dell, or eMachines colluding with Comcast to block WindowsXP security update requests to update.microsoft.com so that you'll buy a new computer when your XP box gets owned.
to another phone so I don't have the same problem next time.
We still have no idea what Verizon plans for pricing are (read the FAQ about data plans), but I am 99% sure tethering on Verizon will be an extra fee, just as it is for any Android device on that platform.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
This is bullshit. There are exactly 5 versions of android "in the wild" far less than ios. 2.1 and 2.2 make up over 87% of android devices, with over 50% on 2.2, there is no single version of ios with that kind of install percentage. So if you want to look at software versions ios is more "fragmented". And there is very little software that cannot run on 2.1, so it's mostly about the os features in froyo, but really froyo is not so different from eclair.
Getting upgraded is always nice, but people should buy the phones for the features it has at the time of purchase and be happy with it and quit their bitching.
No amount of Jailbreaking will let you modify the OS.
Actually the truth is just the opposite.
Jailbreaking allows you to modify or replace anything in the OS you desire.
In fact modern Jailbreaking is all about installing "MobileSubstrate" which allows you to hook your own custom code into ANY method call in Objective C, which makes minor tinkering to various applications or OS features substantially easier than working with the full codebase.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
http://maemo.nokia.com/n900/
You can install iOS4
even on older phones
Since there's only been one iOS device pair (original iPhone/Touch) you cannot install the most recent OS to, I'm not sure what use I would get from a "custom distro".
Instead far more popular is a repository of system customizations and applications called Cydia. Why have a whole custom OS when you can just pick and chose what to modify? They leave Apple to enhance the OS, and build advanced features atop that.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Giant megacorporations do not care about the customer. That is the sole goal of why they wanted to become a giant megacorporation: So that they were beyond question. Not to make products the best and most reliable, stable, and fastest they could be for the consumer. FUCK THE CONSUMER. HE SHOULD HAVE BOUGHT THE UPGRADE!
This is exactly why we need open source not only software, but hardware, and have it reach economy of scale quickly and cheaply.
Not that Samsung, Sony, Microsoft, Apple, or even Google are interested in doing that. Though if Google really wanted to "Do no Evil"....... They could subsidize the nexus s a little more, and include cyanogenmod by default.
Furthermore, why the hell is it so hard to ROOT a device I PAID FOR?!?!? What the hell is wrong with these assholes? I say anyone who releases that kind of stupid restriction is not worthy of the consumer's money. We seriously need to boycott all these corporations entirely for a free, cheap, open source platform that connects peer 2 peer real time efficiently enough to supplant current cable companies. In dense urban areas where lots of wifi routers can talk, we should already be doing this.
I hold very few opinions. I hold information based on observation and fact. If you wish to disagree, please use facts.
If an Iphone user wants an open phone and doesn't want to jailbreak
If they want an open iPhone then they want to jailbreak. I don't see where one would desire something and then ignore the clear path to obtaining it. It makes no sense.
Jailbreaking is legal.
It does not void your warranty.
It's easily reversible should you decide it's not for you.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Is it just me or has quality control gone to hell on ALL consumer electronics and software in the last 2-3 years? From hard disks to phones, to....just about everything. It's as if every company's resposne to the GFC was to fire the entire quality control department and skip the test phase.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
Where are all the custom IOS ROM's then?
Can I load IOS onto a HD2?
Thought not.
The really sad truth is that you cannot make modifications to IOS no matter how much you hack. What's even sadder is that you cannot replace IOS on the Iphone 3GS or above because the 3GS requires code the be signed by Apple before it can run.
Sorry but you cant have it both ways, the most common thing I hear about IOS is that it supposedly "Just Works(TM)" but then you're trying to convince us that it's many times more hackable than any other mobile OS. The simple fact that there are no custom IOS ROMs means it is nowhere near the level of hack-ability that Android and WinMo 6 has.
I'm absolutely certain you'll say this is possible, as certain as I am it isn't but you cant rip out and replace the IOS kernel like you can with Android, jailbreaks just haven't gained that kind of access for some time. You've even said this yourself.
I suggest you look up what a "substrate" is. Yes they've used the term correctly, it's a base or foundation for applications, however it sits on top of the operating system and does not give you access to modify the OS's code. Essentially it sits on top of an OS in the way the substrate of a building sits on top of the ground, the substrate provides a stable surface to build on but does not allow the building to modify the ground.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
Android is far from truly Open and I hope that Meego will be able to deliver.
That being said, I own a HTC Desire. It was branded. Debranding is a no-brainer; rooting, too. HTC has delivered timely updates in the past and I expect them to continue this tradition. And if they don't, I will simply go to CyanogenMod.
As always when there's choice, people need to make informed decisions. Not buying from vendors that are still thinking you release software for a given model exactly once (yes, I am looking at you, SE) or from ones that are pulling funny stunts (Motorola) should be a given. That Samsung might be on that list now, as well.. Well, meh. But then, I would only buy stuff that is reasonably close to the dev phones or a flagship product to ensure that the community will be all over it.
I knew I should have waited for the HTC shift or got the evo but no........
I expected this exact behavior a few months ago when the upgrade that we Galaxy S users were PROMISED by the end of summer was not forthcoming. Samsung thinks that by simply providing new phones they can erase the memory of that outright lie to their customers. This is not the case for me at least as I will be changing back to the iPhone soon enough. The only question left is AT&T or pay early termination and jump ship to Verizon. Samsung lies = customer lost, goodbye.
Companies that sell devices want customers to upgrade their devices as often as possible to the latest models. This applies to EVERY company that manufacturers a product, not just phones. Since reliability is a selling point for many things, companies generally do not aim to make products that FAIL after a certain amount of time though, so they are constantly trying different things to encourage users to upgrade to the latest product they offer.
For Apple, they just release one new iPhone each year, and the zelots race out to buy it. For Samsung, they seem to be using the operating system as the way to push users to buy a new device, even if the old devices can handle the new OS version without a problem. It has NOTHING to do with Android, or Google, and is all about people thinking they need to get their updates from the phone manufacturer, rather than directly from the company that makes the OS.
There are two sides to this whole issue, and it is not as simple as some people make it out to be. A phone that COMES with a given OS version is simple to set up, but doing an in-place upgrade without doing a wipe is a LOT more difficult in many cases. For those who have done their own update, doing a backup of their data and possibly making an image of the device(in case the update goes wrong) is always a good idea, since you can break/brick your phone by doing an update not provided by the manufacturer. It is possible that Samsung has been fighting that issue, where doing the update to the latest OS is causing data corruption or problems with installed applications, and that would be a support nightmare.
On the Palm WebOS based devices, there was a permissions issue that caused some problems with the WebOS 1.4.5 update, and it caused a delay in the release of over the air updates. A clean install of the affected apps would have solved the problem, but since most users can't handle the idea of uninstalling apps and then putting them back, it caused the delay. This is the sort of problem that Samsung may be trying to avoid, since the support costs would be high.
just thought i'd leave this note
the likely reason the update has been pulled is the simple fact that up here in canada the 2.2 update bricked our phones and caused mass amounts of internal sd failures.
maybe samsung strong armed the company not to allow the update because as a company the didn't want millions in repairs or to be going through the same thing samsung and bell canada are right now.
o.. o did i just start a new conspiracy? i guess its that easy.
but seriously the bell canada sd card failure is true, and it is because of the update.
I assume we Nexus One users will eventually get 2.3. But it's kind of discouraging to know that, even though the Nexus One was used as an internal 2.3 testbed for most if not all Google employees, those of us that bought into the Google reference platform still don't have 2.3. But we have a nifty gingerbread statue on the Google campus. What's up with all the 'gingerbread coming soon' rhetoric and the actual vacuum? Is there some serious bug that's still preventing the Nexus One from getting the upgrade.
Posted from my Android phone. Oh, I can change this? There, that's better...
All models of iPhone with the exception of the original can be updated to iOS 4.x via the regular old Apple process. And given the hardware limitations of the original iPhone, I can't imagine the user experience would be even close to tolerable on that device.
So no, there are no "roll your own" distros of iOS. No one needs them.
... who've ported Linux to the iPhone. Not sure what flavor of Linux we're talking about here, but I've certainly seen Android proper running on an iPhone.
You keep hearing arguments to the effect that "Android is superior to iPhone because you don't have to jailbreak it". What goes unmentioned is that for practically every Android device (as mentioned, the Nexus line is an exception) you can't install from anywhere but the Android market without doing something similar. There are plenty of things you could legitimately bash the iOS universe for - high on the list is Apple's control-freakery about what they allow into the App Store, but I don't think jailbreaking is really one of them - in almost all cases, you have to diddle with your phone to use anything but the approved store, and it's not like jailbreaking is some tremendously difficult thing to do.
Does that mean I think it's ok that manufacturers try to keep us to their walled gardens? No, I think that kinda sucks. But it's not a situation that's unique to Apple.
I have Samsung Galaxy S, still stuck on 2.1 Eclair on O2 .. an OTA update was promised , and that shitty Kies software doesnt seem to play nice with linux or on a windows VM.
My next phone will not be a Samsung unless they change their ways.
N.
Electronic Music Made Using Linux http://soundcloud.com/polyp
At the same time, fanboys like you aren't helping anything either. Responding to any criticism of your chosen system with "That's not an actual problem, what the hell are you talking about" is just as bad, and it serves to push the idea that Android fanboys can't take criticism. Android is great, I love it, but to pretend that things like this aren't a problem is just insane.
An important thing to understand in this day and age is that dedicated mp3 players are fast becoming unimportant. Practically every smartphone made since 2005 already provides that function
Practically every smartphone made since 2005 is intended for use with a service plan costing ten times what I pay Virgin Mobile USA for service on my current dumbphone. Is there another device that 1. runs apps, 2. can buy apps from a store, and 3. is priced for end user purchase up front, not carrier subsidy? Or to put it another way: What alternative to Sony PSP and Nintendo DS do you recommend that doesn't have the anti-homebrew stance of Sony and Nintendo that's even harsher than Apple's?
If google would simply force anyone using Android to open source any drivers and or hardware-specific modifications made to the OS in order to support the hardware. If the Dev community had all of that to work with then it would be comparitvely easy to take each vanilla update from Google and create working version for each handset.
People are all bitching cause they bought a phone manufactured by a company who has the worst reputation in the business for not updating their phones after they're released.
That is like buying an Italian or British car and complaining about the electrics.
Why should current purchasers be concerned with hoops they would have to jump through if they would want to get what they want now in some speculative hypothetical future scenario?
Because while you're saving up for a new toy, you are a future purchaser, not a current purchaser. In fact, until you click the Pay button, you are a future purchaser, not a current purchaser. Under some web shopping cart designs, things can go out of stock or be discontinued while still in one's cart.
Sadly Linux is still GPL 2 and there is indeed a loophole in the GPL 2. Google for tivoization. The loophole is fixed in GPL 3.