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The Death of BCC

An anonymous reader writes "An interesting op-ed at NeoSmart discusses the demise of BCC in emails at the hands of Facebook and the like. It discusses how certain technologies that are slowly being supplanted by 'cooler' yet less effective alternatives have actually been spoiled for all, since they rely on a basic community-wide awareness regarding these technologies for them to work."

366 comments

  1. Nope by eison · · Score: 3, Interesting

    BCC was killed by spam filters, not facebook.

    --
    is competition good, or is duplication of effort bad?
    1. Re:Nope by Seumas · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Saying BCC is dead because people use facebook is like saying SSH or FTP is dead, because my mom doesn't use either.

    2. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

      yo momma so fat, that when she walked in front of the computer my FTP connection timed out!

    3. Re:Nope by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Not to mention nobody outside of corporate knew what the hell a BCC was anyway. I've shown users how to BCC themselves when sending pictures so they have a copy in their email and every single time I get "Is that what that was for? I didn't know what that thing was."

      It is one of those techs like knowing how to set up your own DNS or change your IP that few outside IT and corporate EVER use or even has a clue is there. I have a feeling if it dies completely out of non corporate environments there will be so few that care it won't even raise a stink. I like BCC simply to send copies to a backup address but it isn't like I just couldn't add the address in the to: field.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    4. Re:Nope by Vegemeister · · Score: 0

      Yo momma so fat, she got her own autonomous system!

    5. Re:Nope by MysteriousPreacher · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it's most useful anyway in a corporate setting, and then I'm in the habit of telling people to expect it. The only reason I'd use it outside of work is to send a bulk mail in which I put everyone on BCC. That though is incredibly rare.

      --
      -- Using the preview button since 2005
    6. Re:Nope by perlchild · · Score: 2

      It ain't been killed till we have a new version of smtp without it, imho.

    7. Re:Nope by ls671 · · Score: 2

      I guess you are right because when I started reading, I actually thought TFA was about the BBC. It could have made more sense I guess...

      --
      Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
    8. Re:Nope by eugene+ts+wong · · Score: 1

      Are you talking about sending a copy to a different email address of yours? I ask, because if you're talking about keeping a copy in the same account, then it seems simpler to just save a sent copy, which also keeps the attachments. Some services keep the attachments, and some don't.

    9. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      FTP and telnet is dead. Long live SCP and SSH.

    10. Re:Nope by grumbel · · Score: 1

      I'd say it was "killed", if one wants to call it that, simply by not being very useful in the first place. The article itself gives the answer already: "Send a message to X, copy and paste it, and send it to Y.", that serves the same as BCC, allows you to add additional information and is far easier to understand for both the sender and receiver, thus people use that instead of BCC. Also I don't think the original design purpose for BCC was to allow easy sending of nasty messages while letting a third party know about it in the first place, so if that abuse of that feature dies out, so be it.

      The only valid reason I see for using BCC is the case of mail announcements, where you don't want to go the trouble of setting up a mailing list, but still want to get mail to a few hundred people without giving the recipients away to everybody. Thus you use BCC instead of CC. No confusion on the recipient side and everything works as intended.

    11. Re:Nope by mr_mischief · · Score: 5, Informative

      SMTP doesn't know "BCC". SMTP knows "RCPT TO". The MUA knows "BCC" and "RCPT TO" both because it speaks SMTP and also knows the mail content format for TO, FROM, CC, and REPLY TO headers. BCC is an extra version of CC that adds more RCPT TO requests to the SMTP session but doesn't add a header like CC does.

      Unfortunately, since so many implementors included the completely non-standard capability of multiple recipients in the "TO" field, CC itself is terribly underused itself.

      So now you know... and knowing is half the battle.

    12. Re:Nope by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1, Funny

      Yo momma so fat,

      I told you before, She's got a metabolic disorder!

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    13. Re:Nope by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Yes, I have multiple email accounts and one is set up simply to be a backup storage facility for things such as files and emails I may require access to out in the field, or want to make sure I don't lose like pictures or important correspondence.

      You see that way my main email address is nice and neat, with only outstanding shipments of parts and currently open conversations in my inbox, whereas my bulk backup is currently at 500+ emails with everything from certain must have files I often find a need for out in the field (such as a reg file that fixes the dreaded "Windows has the sound driver but says "no device" under sound bug) and backups for any important emails sent from any of my addresses so if someone claims I never sent them something I can check by name and find a backup with the date/time stamp to back me up.

      So in my case BCC makes it easier to manage multiple accounts while simultaneously giving me an easy backup of anything important just in case my main email provider were to have a "senior moment" like what happened to Hotmail users a few weeks back or Gmail users two years ago. That is why I tell people never trust a single email provider, because bugs happen and backups can get borked. Just because it is owned by Google (or MSFT or Yahoo) doesn't magically make their service perfect. Better to be safe than sorry and with webmail backups if I suddenly have to fix something when I wasn't expecting to work a simple login to my backup has the files that I use most ready to go.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    14. Re:Nope by westlake · · Score: 1

      Saying BCC is dead because people use facebook is like saying SSH or FTP is dead, because my mom doesn't use either.

      Close enough.

      When was the last time you saw anyone but the alpha geek use a stand alone FTP client?

    15. Re:Nope by Toam · · Score: 2

      Having multiple addresses in the "To" field is useful, though.

      Often I might need to send an email that is explicitly intended for more than one person, while other people might need a copy of it simply so that they are "in the loop" for some reason or other. In that case, I would put the people who I was addressing in the "To" field and the others in the "CC" field.

    16. Re:Nope by kenj0418 · · Score: 2

      Yo momma so old, that she thinks "additional bandwidth" means Glenn Miller hired a fat guy on trombone.

    17. Re:Nope by Lifyre · · Score: 1

      Good it wasn't just me. I thought I had missed something momentous and it turns out I just missed an idiot talking about something he doesn't understand.

      --
      I'll meet you at the intersection of "Should be" and "Reality"
    18. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yo momma so FAT, her blocks exceed the inode allocation for the filesystem.

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    19. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 0

      Yo mamma so fat, she needs extra bandwidth to transmit her picture

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    20. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 0

      Yo mamma so fat, the scales need *two* cpus

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    21. Re:Nope by breakfastpirate · · Score: 1

      I do a fair amount of web design, and I barely mess with FTP nowadays. I use my hosting provider's HTML upload tool to throw a zip file on the server and then extract it. I haven't installed a standalone FTP program in probably over 2 years. Just haven't required it. Occasionally if I need to mess with something more complicated I'll fire up Dreamweaver (which uses it's built-in FTP) but that rarely is required.

    22. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      m.u.s.t...s.t.o.p....aarrrrrggggghhhhhhh

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    23. Re:Nope by ls671 · · Score: 1

      I am sure using "BCC:" instead of "BCC" would have caused my brain to work correctly. My brain isn't used to see BCC. It just looks strange to me without the ":"

      --
      Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
    24. Re:Nope by GNUALMAFUERTE · · Score: 2

      She actually has different ASNs, one for each timezone she spans.

      --
      WTF am I doing replying to an AC at 5 A.M on a Friday night?
    25. Re:Nope by GNUALMAFUERTE · · Score: 2

      You know what I hate? People that don't use reply to all, and force me to forward emails I receive. Idiots.

      --
      WTF am I doing replying to an AC at 5 A.M on a Friday night?
    26. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it's most useful anyway in a corporate setting, and then I'm in the habit of telling people to expect it. The only reason I'd use it outside of work is to send a bulk mail in which I put everyone on BCC. That though is incredibly rare.

      I do the same but I do it because I respect *other* peoples privacy. Usually it's a joke or something funny that I want to send around. They chose to give me their email address not everyone else I know so that's when I bcc it. There are many other things that I use bcc for.

      But I note that only people who have no business speaking about the direction of technology try to create a meme about it to hide their inadequate grasp of it. Maybe gmail doesn't support bcc but that's a choice of the email *client* not the email protocol. Perhaps this ill informed blogger should consult with RFC 2076 - Common Internet Message Headers or RFC 2822 section 3.6.3. Destination address fields before announcing that a particular piece of functionality is in demise, as long as people choose to write free software there will be an email client to support bcc. I just checked the RFC and it tells me support is still there and I can't see the people who spent all that time writing that functionality into sendmail, postfix, etc etc taking that support away anytime soon.

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    27. Re:Nope by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

      I've shown users how to BCC themselves when sending pictures so they have a copy in their email and every single time I get "Is that what that was for? I didn't know what that thing was."

      I've considered giving up the damned paycheck because the idiots cannot learn technology.

      --
      I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
    28. Re:Nope by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

      (such as a reg file that fixes the dreaded "Windows has the sound driver but says "no device" under sound bug)

      Do you have a fix for the "opening quotes never closed" bug? Because there's a recent relevant xkcd, although it was about parens, which my emoticon could be considered to close. :)

      --
      I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
    29. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Where did you get the idea that GMail does not support the BCC: header? It's right there, a link that says "Add BCC". Click it and you get a text box to type in addresses just like To:.

    30. Re:Nope by mcmonkey · · Score: 1

      Not to mention nobody outside of corporate knew what the hell a BCC was anyway. I've shown users how to BCC themselves when sending pictures so they have a copy in their email and every single time I get "Is that what that was for? I didn't know what that thing was."

      Don't these people have a 'sent' folder?

    31. Re:Nope by shawb · · Score: 2

      The only thing bigger than yo mamma be her Swarzchild Radius?

      --
      I'll never make that mistake again, reading the experts' opinions. - Feynman
    32. Re:Nope by xaosflux · · Score: 1

      gmail supports BCC: in both client/server mode and web mode. In Web Mode the link to add BCC recipients is just as prominent as the link for CC recipients. They even have a pretty 'English' write up of it's use: http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=57143

    33. Re:Nope by Billlagr · · Score: 0

      She's just big-boned

    34. Re:Nope by ElderKorean · · Score: 1

      I am sure using "BCC:" instead of "BCC" would have caused my brain to work correctly. My brain isn't used to see BCC. It just looks strange to me without the ":"

      I can't remember seeing it written in all uppercase before.
      Even gmail and Fastmail.fm both use 'Bcc:'
      My first thought was Brisbane City Council, then Birch Carol Coyle Cinemas, then realised it must be Blind carbon copy.

    35. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      gmail supports BCC:

      My apologies, it's been a long time since I attempted to use it and it was an assumption that it still didn't support it.

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    36. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1
      Even bigger than your super massive black hole...

      .....bwahahahahaha!!

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    37. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. Typical sensationalist crap looking for page views.

    38. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I half agree with you. I had no idea what bcc was for for a long time (or cc for that matter since to me it made sense just to put everyone you wanted to send the message to in the "to" line) and it was my computer illiterate grandma who ended up first telling me what it was used for. So I think maybe its the one piece of knowlege uniquely shared by both IT professionals and the elderly.

    39. Re:Nope by oneiros27 · · Score: 1

      Sure, spam filters (particularly for mailing lists) helped kill it, but it also doesn't help when you have so many clueless people who don't know it exists who then hit 'reply all' to the message, and thus reveal to everyone that they were added in on the message when they perhaps shouldn't've been.

      Hell, I can't even get people to stop using the mailing list for our department rather than for our building when they report 'someone left their car lights on' or 'I found a set of keys' ... there's more than one department in our building, and there's some of us who aren't in the same building with 90% of the department ... and those are blatantly obvious in the headers.

      --
      Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
    40. Re:Nope by StormUP · · Score: 1

      It's been years since I have worked on either an MTA or an MUA, but as I recall RFC 821 doesn't say much about memo headers at all. It merely specifies multiple recipients results in multiple RCPT commands being issued. I don't think there is any restriction on number of recipients in the to field of the header or anything that states recipients beyond the first should be placed in the CC field of the header. To SMTP that is all just data and it really doesn't give a crap. The more recent RFC 2821 does have some things to say and does specifically mention even BCC, so I'm not sure where you're getting the idea multiple recipients in to was ever non-standard as far as SMTP is concerned. As wikipedia would say: Citation needed.

    41. Re:Nope by Meski · · Score: 1

      Geeks use standalone GUI ftp clients, whereas alpha geeks use the command line one.

    42. Re:Nope by isopropanol · · Score: 1

      Yo momma so FAT she got two tables instead of inodes!

    43. Re:Nope by bedouin · · Score: 1

      Public FTPs are still common. It makes no sense to grab a Linux distro over sftp, not when the encryption layer wastes bandwidth and CPU power.

    44. Re:Nope by bedouin · · Score: 1

      I do this same thing less clumsily with sftp. Make a public_html directory, tell Apache to enable directory lists, and then drop whatever you need there. You could go the WebDAV route too. Though I do not like it personally,Windows, OS X, and most Linux dists can deal with WebDAV out of the box.

      The real benefit of that is not having to deal with file sharing services to get files to your friends. Want something to be publicly accessible? Just drop it into the public_html on a local Samba/NFS/AFP share with virtually no wait time (assuming the server is in the same building).

    45. Re:Nope by the+grace+of+R'hllor · · Score: 1, Funny

      She got big-boned alright.

    46. Re:Nope by bedouin · · Score: 1

      Still not nearly as bad as no subject at all, or more strangely -- someone writing the entire E-Mail in the subject line.

    47. Re:Nope by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

      Since the Schwarzschild radius is, by necessity, smaller than it's object with the possible exception of infinitesimally small objects, please explain the joke.

      --
      Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
    48. Re:Nope by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

      Elderly people remember what a carbon copy is, and how it is used in mail. I remember using it with a typewriter before switching to printers and later email.

      --
      Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
    49. Re:Nope by andrea.sartori · · Score: 1

      Last Thursday.

      --
      Mostly harmless.
    50. Re:Nope by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      Why post that on slashdot ? It is dead since digg appeared.

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    51. Re:Nope by TheMidget · · Score: 1
      Your mom doesn't cause your server to broadcast your ssh password to the world. It's still safe for you to use ssh, even if your mom doesn't

      However, the "facebook mindset" causes Bcc'ed people not to notice that they are bcc'ed, and so they may goof up where they shouldn't. Which makes Bcc a dangerous feature to use if you don't know for 150% percent sure whether the Bcc'ed guy is still a true geek, or has fallen into the "facebook mindset".

    52. Re:Nope by Max_W · · Score: 1

      I can well use FTP functions from a PHP script, but not so with SSH FTP functions. I am still struggling to get SSH FTP work in my PHP scripts.

    53. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      tell her what SFTP really is.

      she'll shit bricks.

    54. Re:Nope by quenda · · Score: 1

      My first thought was Brisbane City Council, then Birch Carol Coyle Cinemas, then realised it must be Blind carbon copy.

      Less colloquially, it means Basal Cell Carcinoma. I thought they have a cure for a cancer!

    55. Re:Nope by isorox · · Score: 2

      Saying BCC is dead because people use facebook is like saying SSH or FTP is dead, because my mom doesn't use either.

      Close enough.

      When was the last time you saw anyone but the alpha geek use a stand alone FTP client?

      Our journalists are continually using ftp, when it works (often doesn't work from hotels). On the otherhand, anyone with a clue uses sftp.

    56. Re:Nope by isorox · · Score: 1

      You know what I hate? People that don't use reply to all, and force me to forward emails I receive. Idiots.

      How about people that reply-all to mis-sent wide-reaching emails with "Why have I got this"

    57. Re:Nope by Max_W · · Score: 1

      I see the benefit in the fact that one can use SSL-https to upload a ZIP file. But how do you unzip it? Do you use a PHP class to unzip an archive?

      Do you upload the ZIP archive in a specific folder and unzip it? Or do you delete several folders on the web-server and upload several corresponding folders together and unzip them?

    58. Re:Nope by Compuser · · Score: 2

      To quote wikipedia: "An object smaller than its Schwarzschild radius is called a black hole. "
      He is calling "yo mama" a black hole.

    59. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yo mamma is a black hole.

    60. Re:Nope by MichaelSmith · · Score: 1

      You know what I hate? People that don't use reply to all, and force me to forward emails I receive. Idiots.

      How about people that reply-all to mis-sent wide-reaching emails with "Why have I got this"

      I work for a multinational with in excess of 60000 employees and one time somebody very high up broadcasted a message like "good news everybody!" or some such by sending an email with every address in the To: field. It surely can't have been all 60000 employees, but it was a lot. I am holding on to that message. The next best way for me to send STFU I am out of here is to create a bug report and assign it to everybody.

    61. Re:Nope by MBlueD · · Score: 2

      From the wikipeida article: "If one accumulates matter at normal density (1 g/cm3, for example, the density of water) up to about 150,000,000 times the mass of the Sun, such an accumulation will fall inside its own Schwarzschild radius and thus it would be a supermassive black hole of 150,000,000 solar masses." Quite fat, that momma.

      --
      We don't stop playing because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing.
    62. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1
      Yo momma so FAT, her journal ended up in lost+found!

      ...get it - her *journal* ended up in lost+found!

      Sigh - sadly slashdot is the only place where these jokes work.

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    63. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      it would be a supermassive black hole of 150,000,000 solar masses."

      Quite fat, that momma.

      I'd say, supermassive FAT momma.

      This HAS to stop I have useful things to do!

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    64. Re:Nope by breakfastpirate · · Score: 1

      Most websites I set up now are implemented with some form of CMS, so typically my process is to upload the zip file for the CMS installer, extract it using my host's upload tool (there is a button to extract zips you upload), and then install the CMS. It's pretty idiot proof, haha. Once that's in place basically anything else I'd need to do (update/change themes, upload files, add content) can be done via the CMS itself, so I rarely have to touch FTP. I typically use Wordpress for my simple 5-10 page sites and Joomla for anything that requires something more dynamic or complicated.

    65. Re:Nope by Lost+Race · · Score: 1

      821 covers SMTP (HELO, RCPT, DATA, etc); 822 covers message headers (To, From, Cc, etc). 822 does not restrict the "To" header to a single recipient. No idea where GP may have gotten that idea.

    66. Re:Nope by ThirdPrize · · Score: 1

      Yo momma so fat, her IP address is 256.256.256.256 !

      --
      I have excellent Karma and I am not afraid to Troll it.
    67. Re:Nope by Voyager529 · · Score: 1

      I use one quite frequently to get files from my storage server at home. Nothing I'm transferring is THAT sensitive that I need the encryption layer, plus it's easy as hell to implement with Filezilla Server.

      Actually, I had an interesting case a few weeks ago where a client of mine was FINALLY ditching their Windows 98 machine in lieu of a much newer machine - Core i7, 8GB of RAM, 2TBytes of storage, the works. Anyway, their Win98 machine has been beyond repair for months, and BSODs at basically anything, including using a garden variety Samba share. It was pretty convenient to use the Filezilla client/server combo to migrate their data off the machine.

    68. Re:Nope by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 1

      Yes, I have multiple email accounts and one is set up simply to be a backup storage facility for things such as files and emails I may require access to out in the field, or want to make sure I don't lose like pictures or important correspondence.

      You see that way my main email address is nice and neat, with only outstanding shipments of parts and currently open conversations in my inbox, whereas my bulk backup is currently at 500+ emails with everything from certain must have files I often find a need for out in the field (such as a reg file that fixes the dreaded "Windows has the sound driver but says "no device" under sound bug) and backups for any important emails sent from any of my addresses so if someone claims I never sent them something I can check by name and find a backup with the date/time stamp to back me up.

      So in my case BCC makes it easier to manage multiple accounts while simultaneously giving me an easy backup of anything important just in case my main email provider were to have a "senior moment" like what happened to Hotmail users a few weeks back or Gmail users two years ago

      This may be a whoosh... but why don't you just:

      1) Upload them to your private website
      2) Carry them on a usb drive?? I have like 3 hanging on my keychain, two more in the car.
      3) Use Google Docs
      4) Use any online backup service
      5) Carry them on your phone's storage
      6) Put them on a CD

      Convenience as a factor?
      A mailbox filled with attachments sounds more like a nightmare scenario.
      Unless you use gmail, then it's all moot since all sentmail is saved and
      you'd have access to Google Docs.

      Any file I'd need to get access to, naked (no electronics on me) are on
      either priv bucket or Google Docs. Drivers, charts, data. Images that I
      can burn to disc in the field.

      Plus I have an instance on EC2 that I can fire up with just about anything
      else I'd need.

      The likelihood of another (significant) loss of data by Gmail is just about
      as likely as they going bankrupt, [which would do it]. But it's also orders
      of magnitudes less likely to happen than any other schema you have.
      And orders of magnitude easier to manage.

      Embrace the cloud.

      -AI

      --
      For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
    69. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      thehollywoodgossip.com/images/gallery/irina-shayk-sports-illustrated-cover.jpg

      For certain values of "work".

    70. Re:Nope by JonStewartMill · · Score: 1

      And I thought my alma mater, Broward Community College, was closing its doors.

    71. Re:Nope by simplypeachy · · Score: 1

      I bet he top posts. Filthy savages. Admit it made you grin inside...all of those articles written by "an idiot talking about something he doesn't understand" are good for entertainment.

    72. Re:Nope by tolan-b · · Score: 1

      SFTP or FTPS I presume?

    73. Re:Nope by dgatwood · · Score: 1

      BCC was killed by spam filters, not facebook.

      Close. Email was killed by spam and lack of mandatory end-to-end encryption and authentication. BCC was killed because a secure system (where secure is defined as spam-free) and anonymity are antithetical.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    74. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In this case I would say parsing is half the battle.

      Seriously, try proof reading.

    75. Re:Nope by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      In order 1.-I have NO desire to make a "gee aren't I interesting love me" website, and free hosting sucks and I sure as hell ain't paying for a website for as little as I'd use it. 2.-I HATE Google Docs, as I find it a clunky badly done ripoff of MS Office. 3.-Must not have kids, or you would know they have a habit of carrying off your flash drives no matter how many you have. 4.-Again the free services suck and it would be stupid to pay for a service that in the end wouldn't give me enough advantage to pay for itself in the long run. 5.- My phone is actually a phone and is used for such, therefor no battery sucking smartphone crap. 6.-Tend to get scratched and/or left at a customer's somewhere.

      So in the end why reinvent the wheel? What I have works as simply as a BCC, makes it trivial to backup email, pics,etc from anywhere without needing to leave squat on a customer's PC (just download portable Opera which is less than 5Mb and toss afterward) and it all "just works" without either costing a dime or taking any real effort on my part since I already have the email addresses anyway. Your arguments remind me on some I've had with those trying to get me to switch my shop to FOSS, when I have no problems with Windows why bother? in the end you are just giving me more work to arrive at the same place I was before with no real advantages. Every file I would need for any fix that could be done in the field is less than 25Mb anyway, which means there really isn't a point in paying for a hosting site like EC2. if it requires larger files frankly most of the home connections around here blow ass and it would literally be faster for me to simply drive to the shop and sneakernet than it would be to wait on their crappy connection, again killing many of your selling points. in the end your "solutions" are just more work with no real advantages and increased cost, well unless you call being able to say you're "in the cloud" to be a big advantage or something.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    76. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Geeks use SCP or SSH from the command line. Alpha geeks use TRAMP mode in Emacs. The term for people who use GUI FTP clients is "wannabes".

    77. Re:Nope by hrimhari · · Score: 1

      Thank you! I also thought I was alone in this.

      My broken brain version of the summary:

      "An interesting op-ed at NeoSmart discusses in emails the demise of BBC at the hands of Facebook and the like. It discusses how certain technologies (like public funded broadcasting) that are slowly being supplanted by 'cooler' yet less effective alternatives have actually been spoiled for all, since they rely on a basic community-wide awareness regarding these technologies for them to work."

      And what an awful article... So because some people are "lazy" to check if they're in the To: or CC: fields, we can't use BCC: to share secrets? If you plan for human error, you'll certainly choose any kind of Forward rather than BCC: for gossiping. The best use case for BCC: is for sending the same message to a lot of people without letting them have access to each other's addresses (read SPAM).

      --
      http://dilbert.com/2010-12-13
    78. Re:Nope by SCHecklerX · · Score: 1

      'alpha geeks' don't use ftp, they use scp. My girlfriend, an artsy mac type, uses ftp to upload videos because the site admin there apparantly isn't too bright either.

    79. Re:Nope by SleazyRidr · · Score: 1

      And then the people who reply-all to that email telling them not to reply all to wide reaching emails.

    80. Re:Nope by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      Yo momma so fat, her IP address is faaa:aaaa:aaaa:aaaa:aaaa:aaaa:aaaa:aaat

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    81. Re:Nope by daffmeister · · Score: 1

      The point is that BCC only works when the recipients understand what it means (as it says in TFA), and are savvy enough to check for it in sensitive situations. In today's world that's not many people.

    82. Re:Nope by Smallpond · · Score: 1

      I'm sure using "Blind carbon copy (the BCC: field in email)" would have made things clearer to the author of TFA and all his tetchy sorry "techie" friends.

      Right - because nothing is so immediately recognizable as rolling carbon paper and flimsy into your typewriter carriage.

    83. Re:Nope by Smallpond · · Score: 1

      Public FTPs are still common. It makes no sense to grab a Linux distro over sftp, not when the encryption layer wastes bandwidth and CPU power.

      Its wasting the server bandwidth. Why not use torrent? Its sort of the ultimate Bcc.

    84. Re:Nope by skiddie · · Score: 1

      I'm fairly sure that the lady who sits at the desk behind me at work uses an FTP client to upload orders to one of our suppliers. God knows why it happens that way.

    85. Re:Nope by Smallpond · · Score: 1

      You neglected to explain the "blind" part, but you illustrated the CC: field admirably.

      Then I would have had to explain secretaries, dictation marks, interoffice envelopes with red strings and other such antiquities. Think I'll just go soak in my clawfoot tub and make some calls on the rotary dial phone.

    86. Re:Nope by Meski · · Score: 1

      Yes. But the way you put that made me think of a geek's "Dr Livingston" moment.

    87. Re:Nope by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 1

      I met many, many people like you in the early 90's
      shaking their canes at me, tellin me to get off their
      lawn, as I was trying to sell them on this new thing
      called the internet. And that they should buy their
      domains NOW before the land-rush when they won't
      be available anymore. "Stake out your presence on
      the internet, it's not going away... it's where all the
      commerce will eventually take place."

      Oh, btw... I can tell alot about you from #1. I didn't
      tell you to make a website you ludd. In fact, since I
      said PRIVATE WEBSITE, that should have been an
      indicator as to the NATURE of the site. I said store it
      on a website. MUCH difference there.

      And if you can't cough up $50 PER YEAR for hosting
      with a provider like 1and1 you need to get a better job.
      (No, I understand the difference between can't and won't)
      But won't(s) only excuse is lazy, scared, etc. Can't may
      have mitigating factors.

      Being in the cloud is a HUGE advantage and just
      like 1993, there are going to be those that get it and
      those that will have great stories to tell their kids and
      friends (if they will listen) about how they missed out
      on the next big thing.

      If there is a single nerd, geek, whathaveyou on /. that
      doesn't have some type of cloud account... turn in your
      badge...

      ... and you better look out your front window, I think
      someone is on your lawn.
      [for the ludds that use expense as an excuse...
      it's FREE for a t1.micro instance, that you can run in
      perpetuity for the entire year on EC2... did I say FREE?]

      -AI


      FWIW, EC2 is like having a FREE 2.66 GHz Xeon PC,
      with a (unfortunately paltry) half gig memory but 7 Gigs
      of drive storage... that you could hold in the palm of your
      hand. [For those of us that have smartphones.] Yeah, I
      know you can do that with your home PC, but you don't
      have to expose your home computer this way and that's
      not really the point anyway. The point is, it's a free box.
      A +1 to your collection. And you can access it just like
      any other computer you sit in front of (or access via
      some wireless device)

      I ran a half million prime sieve on it... and I got every
      cycle promised. Loaded a rainbow in 'memory' and did
      some hash blasting. You can do heavy cracking of
      encryption from a cell phone.

      EC2's been around for a long time. No excuses geeks.

      EC2 is really simple. Get an Amazon account.
      [ https://aws-portal.amazon.com/gp/aws/developer/registration/index.html ]
      Then get the AWS account. Log in. Click on Launch
      Instance. Click on the Community AMI's tab, select the
      OS image of your choice. They have Linux AND Windows.

                                  SELECT A t1.micro INSTANCE!
      If you select another one, it won't be free but it won't cost
      an arm and a leg either. It's nice, you can scale up to a
      [pay] BIG iron box with multi CPUs, tons of RAM to test
      on, after you've made your distro and did dev on a free tier.

      Set up the params, security and storage, and grab a snack
      or coffee (Takes like 2-3min).

      Then log in... here's the LAMP I just assembled as a
      test bed for a WordPress blog. Yeah, it's not exposed yet.
      http://ec2-50-17-49-155.compute-1.amazonaws.com/
      just has a hi world on it.

      They have LAMP instances, but I put mine together
      myself so I could test some install scripts.

      --
      For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
    88. Re:Nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      BCC should die. If there's something you can't say without know all who will read it, then maybe it shouldn't be said.

    89. Re:Nope by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Alright bright boy, riddle me this: How EXACTLY is all your magical Xeon powered cloud crap going to give me ANY advantage when it is literally faster to drive 20 miles to the shop and back than it is to use the average DSL connection in these parts to download over 50Mb in files,hmmm? And running a "private website" requires either an extra $200 for a "business connection" or a nice termination notice, your choice. BTW here the ONLY difference between the "business connection" and standard cable is $200 and a static IP. Whoopee, I'm sure gonna jump on that!

      You see you and all the "cloud baby cloud" types have a serious flaw in your big plans and that is for huge chunks of the country home connections blow for anything other than checking email or low res youtube videos.

      So how EXACTLY is you magical Xeon cloud going to give me ANY advantage at all with an average 150kbps DSL connection being the norm here, hmmm? Am I supposed to tell all my customers "LOL call me when you spend $500 a month on a T connection LOL!"?

      Sadly you are EXACTLY like some of the FOSS zealots I've dealt with here that have given me marvelous "suggestions" like tell my customers when some device doesn't work in Linux "Go buy something else LOL!" and all so they can have a worse experience than they have now, but hey, they're running FOSS so that makes it better by default, right?

      Tell you what, when we all have FIOS around here, which is scheduled for the fifth Tuesday in the month of never, right after the third go fuck yourself of spring, THEN I'll be happy to go "cloud baby cloud". But as of right now for large sections of the country all your fancy magical Xeon powered bullshit is is buzzword bingo that works about as well as WebTV did in the 90s, that is not at all. Thanks but no thanks junior, I prefer solutions that...oh what's the word? Oh yeah actually work regardless of connection speed which sure as hell don't apply to your cloud.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    90. Re:Nope by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 1

      So how EXACTLY is you magical Xeon cloud going to give me ANY advantage at all with an average 150kbps DSL connection being the norm here, hmmm? Am I supposed to tell all my customers "LOL call me when you spend $500 a month on a T connection LOL!"?

      Valid points, but now you confuse me. How does your
      email help your situation? Aren't you limited by the same
      slow speeds? I must have missed something entirely.

      -AI

      --
      For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
    91. Re:Nope by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      "Send a message to X, copy and paste it, and send it to Y.", that serves the same as BCC, allows you to add additional information and is far easier to understand for both the sender and receiver, thus people use that instead of BCC.

      Yeah, try doing that with a really large group of recipients on a regular basis. BCC still has a valuable place for some of us who need to send out "broadcast" emails without having every yahoo knowing the whole list of recipients (and don't want to be limited to 140 characters).

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    92. Re:Nope by grumbel · · Score: 1

      Yeah, try doing that with a really large group of recipients on a regular basis. BCC still has a valuable place for some of us who need to send out "broadcast" emails without having every yahoo knowing the whole list of recipients (and don't want to be limited to 140 characters).

      Yes, thats why I mentioned it right in the next paragraph. However even that use isn't necessarily a good reason for BCC, as that could be implemented on the client side. Nothing stops a mail client from providing a feature that sends the same mail to multiple recipients without help from the mail server and BCC, it would waste a bit more of a users bandwidth, but maybe that wouldn't even be a bad idea, as it would make the cost of mass mail a bit more obvious to the user.

    93. Re:Nope by mr_mischief · · Score: 1

      Actually, 822, 2822, and 5322 all three specifically allow for it. There were standards for the Internet Messaging Protocol and such before SMTP and RFCs 821 and 822. There were also other non-ARPAnet email systems before 1982.

      You are completely correct that To: accepts a list by the current standards for Internet email. The merits of that decision are debatable, but the problem isn't really the number of people allowed in the To: field as people using the To: field for both primary and secondary recipients or naming dozens of primary recipients rather than using BCC or a mailing list package. That's the real shame.

    94. Re:Nope by eugene+ts+wong · · Score: 1

      That is a very clever use of BCC. Thanks for explaining. I would never have thought of it, if it weren't for your examples and explanation. Now, in hindsight, it seems so obvious, but until then, nope.

      I'll try to start doing that more, especially since I also need to keep backups of older discussions.

      For the backup email address, I might choose a really obscure account name, so that it will be harder for spammers to find my address. I'll try to protect it with a Spamgourmet alias as well.

    95. Re:Nope by sznupi · · Score: 1

      NOT using BCC seems more related to spam - particularly in the form of chain letters. Collecting hundreds of valid addresses per sweep seems to be their only "valid" purpose.

      --
      One that hath name thou can not otter
  2. BCC still existed? by hedwards · · Score: 2

    Seriously, given all the people using email that don't know when to use BCC rather than CC or vice versa, I'm surprised it hasn't already been yanked.

    1. Re:BCC still existed? by KingSkippus · · Score: 5, Funny

      The crux of his point isn't that people don't know how to use BCC, although that's part of the problem. His point is that even for those who do know how to use BCC, recipients don't know what BCC means.

      Here's a typical example of things I've had happen. Someone sends me a misguided nastygram at work over something that I have no control over. I reply to them basically saying, "I can't do anything about this, you need to contact x." Also, because I know they've been dog-cussing me over it to their boss, who is good buddies with my boss, I BCC his boss so that I can 1) let him know that the stuff he's hearing is unjustified, while simultaneously 2) trying not to agitate someone who's already bothered by looking like I'm needlessly escalating something to his boss.

      Unfortunately, his boss is also a dipweed, and next thing I know, he's done a "Reply All" and said something like, "Hey, make sure you call x today, because we need this up and working for close of business."

      Now, not only does the person know I sent the e-mail to his boss, but he knows that I did it surreptitiously, and he's even more pissed off than if I'd just CCed his boss on it so that he would know.

      Having said that, I do wish that people would learn how to use BCC. Here's another typical scenario we have happen now and then:

      Someone sends out some dumb little, "Hey everyone, we're having a party in the marketing group tomorrow, so bring in some food!" Unfortunately, they make two mistakes: 1) They accidentally send it to the entire company, including offices in Europe, Asia, Africa, etc., and 2) they address it in the To: or Cc: field instead of Bcc:. Next thing I know, I'm being inundated with, "PLEASE TAKE ME OFF YOUR DISTRIBUTION LIST!!!11!11!!" e-mails. And then after that come the inevitable deluge of, "PLEASE STOP REPLYING TO ALL!!!11!11!!" e-mails. The first one isn't so bad, but then there's this global e-mail flame war that breaks out between the people saying they want to stop getting e-mails and the people who are fussing about the people who want to stop getting e-mails. Sometimes it even descends down to a third, people fussing about people fussing about people who don't want to get e-mails, level.

      I never cease to be amazed by how dumb people can be.

    2. Re:BCC still existed? by Idimmu+Xul · · Score: 0

      BCC doesnt show other recipients, so if your boss scenario actually happened, either you don't know how to use BCC yourself, or he added everyone in by hand.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_carbon_copy

      --
      The problem with slashdot is that most of its users were bullied and stuffed into lockers as kids!
    3. Re:BCC still existed? by SuricouRaven · · Score: 3, Informative

      Actual scenario, that I've been on the recieving end of: A company decides to send a mass-mailing to a group of customers. The employee CCs them all... and thus inadvertantly gives out half the company mailing list to everyone on it.

    4. Re:BCC still existed? by Firehed · · Score: 1

      Depends on the email provider, at least at some level (might be the client, the sending server, or a number of other things - I don't know the SMTP protocol). I've done the same thing by mistake, not realizing I had been BCC'd. My experiences were on Google Apps and I've had similar issues with standard gmail. Thankfully nothing embarrassing, but enough to receive an "Oh, didn't realize this was forwarded to you too. Um, thanks?" kind of response.

      Handily, there's some new Labs feature for gmail that will display some sort of warning if you received the message over BCC, although it would probably be better if it just disabled reply-all.

      --
      How are sites slashdotted when nobody reads TFAs?
    5. Re:BCC still existed? by hey+hey+hey · · Score: 2, Interesting

      BCC doesnt show other recipients

      Not all mail systems handle BCC this way. The X.400 system (at least used to) take the odd approach of hiding the BCC recipients from the main recipients, but all the BCC recipients could see each other. Other mailers may do equally odd things (or have non-standard settings).

    6. Re:BCC still existed? by ladadadada · · Score: 4, Informative

      Have another read of his comment. He sent an email To: one person and Bcc: to that person's boss. The boss receives an email that does not have his email address anywhere in it. When the boss hits reply-all, the email will go to two people: the person who sent the email and the person to whom it was addressed. It was the boss who was in the Bcc field and hence when the boss hits reply, he doesn't send an email to himself.

      There is no adding "everyone in by hand" because there are only two people who receive the boss's email and neither of them were in the Bcc field.

      --
      Sig matters not. Judge me by my sig, do you?
    7. Re:BCC still existed? by relyimah · · Score: 1

      BCC doesnt show other recipients, so if your boss scenario actually happened, either you don't know how to use BCC yourself, or he added everyone in by hand.

      He was the only one BCC'd by the example above, meaning that he can still see all the other recipients that weren't. Thus, a reply-all from him shows everyone else that he was BCC'd....

    8. Re:BCC still existed? by hawguy · · Score: 4, Funny

      BCC doesnt show other recipients, so if your boss scenario actually happened, either you don't know how to use BCC yourself, or he added everyone in by hand.

      I think it's you that doesn't understand how BCC works, the parent poster's scenario is quite possible (and has happened to me)

      I send:

      From: Johnny Five
      To: Stupid Coworker
      Bcc: Big Boss

      Dude, Stop sending me porn, I don't want to see it.

      My Stupid Coworker doesn't know I Bcc'ed the boss since he doesn't see the Bcc list, however, if the Boss does a reply-all, then stupid Coworker gets this email from him:

      From: Big Boss
      To: Stupid Coworker, Johnny Five

      >Johnny Five wrote:
      >
      >Dude, Stop sending me porn, I don't want to see it.

      Don't send porn to Johnny, send it to me instead.

      Now Stupid Coworker knows that it was me that reported him for sending me porn.

    9. Re:BCC still existed? by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Not really, look at it THIS way: A sends bitchy email to B, B sends his reply with a BCC to boss C, Boss C hits reply all and A gets a copy of an email he only sent to B from his boss.

      So if A sent his bitchy email to B only and suddenly his boss is sending him a copy of the bitchy email it really doesn't take Kojack to solve the case. Moral of the story is you should treat BCC as a "everybody might get a copy of this" email and not something private, as you can never overestimate the ability of a PHB to fuck shit up.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    10. Re:BCC still existed? by noidentity · · Score: 1

      Now Stupid Coworker knows that it was me that reported him for sending me porn.

      ...because your boss is a dork. He should have send a message to Johnny Five (or everyone), "reminder: don't send porn to co-workers".

    11. Re:BCC still existed? by MysteriousPreacher · · Score: 1

      The RFC doesn't specify things either way, but personally all the email systems I recall using would allow the BCC'ed person to see the To and CC recipients. Assuming people know how BCCing works, this is the best implementation.

      --
      -- Using the preview button since 2005
    12. Re:BCC still existed? by hawguy · · Score: 2

      Now Stupid Coworker knows that it was me that reported him for sending me porn.

      ...because your boss is a dork. He should have send a message to Johnny Five (or everyone), "reminder: don't send porn to co-workers".

      Uhh...yeah, that was kind of the point the parent poster was trying to make when he said:

      Unfortunately, his boss is also a dipweed, and next thing I know, he's done a "Reply All" and said something like, "Hey, make sure you call x today, because we need this up and working for close of business."

      People that don't recognize that they've been Bcc'ed and handle it appropriately appear to be dorks (or dipweeds).

    13. Re:BCC still existed? by sjames · · Score: 1

      The BCC'ed recipient sees the to, from, and cc fields. Why wouldn't that play out exactly like the OP said?

    14. Re:BCC still existed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, there's a reason that Best Practice guide for Microsoft Outlook recommends forwarding the email from your sent items rather than BCCing them in. That way, when said boss clicks reply, you get the email.

      As for the second one, that really should be a firing offense; but we can only dream. A better idea is for the IT dept to mark those D/Ls as requring moderation so someone, hopefully vagely clueful, has to approve them.

    15. Re:BCC still existed? by mmj638 · · Score: 2

      No. If you receive an email, you see all the "To" and "Cc" recipients regardless of whether you were Bcc'd. You just don't see the Bcc recipients (ie, yourself).

      So if you "reply all" it still goes back to everyone in the "To" and "Cc" recipient list.

    16. Re:BCC still existed? by silverdr · · Score: 1

      The pure fact that this is modded 5:funny shows how dumb people can be... ;-)

      --
      Now, mod me down freely. My karma can't get any worse...
    17. Re:BCC still existed? by silverdr · · Score: 1

      As is this modded as "Informative" :-( No - it works as described by "KingSkippus" and it happens all too often. The reason I stopped using BCC was exactly a situation like the one described above.

      --
      Now, mod me down freely. My karma can't get any worse...
    18. Re:BCC still existed? by mmj638 · · Score: 1

      No, it doesn't depend on the email provider.

      A recipient's email server will see the "To" and "Cc" recipient lists on any email it receives. It is never actually given the "Bcc" recipient list by the sending server so no matter how the mail server works it won't see the Bcc recipient list. The only way your mail server could even know if someone was Bcc'd is if the other Bcc recipient(s) use the same mail server, because it would also receive the emails going to the other people. And properly functioning mail servers don't let person A know what mail is in person B's mailbox (if they did, the server admin is not doing his/her job).

    19. Re:BCC still existed? by tabdelgawad · · Score: 1

      As someone who has worked in a corporate environment for a number of years, I would say bringing someone's boss into a spat is childish enough. Bringing someone's boss in via bcc is downright shitty.

      --
      Imposing Libertarian views on everyone online since 1992.
    20. Re:BCC still existed? by tsadi · · Score: 1

      Wrong. How did this get modded Informative?

      The BCC'd recipient sees all the non-BBC'd recipients, whether the other recipients are in the CC or To field.

    21. Re:BCC still existed? by 787style · · Score: 1

      He only BCC'd the other persons boss. The To: and From: and CC: fields would be populated in the email to the other person boss, and he can click reply all and email every who wasn't BCC'd. Outlook by default would also show the original email, and the subordinate could look at the To/CC fields, and see his boss wasn't listed, and was BCC'd. Managers make this mistake, directors and above have generally made this mistake at a manager level and learned their lesson.

    22. Re:BCC still existed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Re your final sentence:

              Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.
                      Albert Einstein
                      US (German-born) physicist (1879 - 1955)

    23. Re:BCC still existed? by RollingThunder · · Score: 1

      People that don't recognize that they've been Bcc'ed and handle it appropriately appear to be dorks (or dipweeds).

      To be fair, the most prevalent clients in business (Outlook at the desktop, and Blackberries on the go) don't warn you that you appear to have been BCC'd. Probably due to it being really hard to tell if you were truly BCC'd or just received the email via some bizarre nesting of distribution lists, but it's still fairly common for people to not notice they weren't explicitly listed.

    24. Re:BCC still existed? by KingSkippus · · Score: 1

      As someone who has worked in a corporate environment for a number of years, I would say bringing someone's boss into a spat is childish enough. Bringing someone's boss in via bcc is downright shitty.

      You should meet some of the people I work with. I don't disagree, but unfortunately, it's a necessary evil sometimes.

    25. Re:BCC still existed? by kenj0418 · · Score: 1

      I don't use BCC because other people are stupid. (I summarized it for you)

      I agree completely. The only use I have for BCC is to copy myself in on something. (BCC my personal account from my work account on occasion).

    26. Re:BCC still existed? by Belial6 · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately, depending on the corporate culture, there is often no choice but to bring a boss into a spat. Of course, if you must, then CCing the boss is the best course anyway. The boss knows it's only an FYI, and the other employee knows that everything from that point on is out in the open.

    27. Re:BCC still existed? by ls671 · · Score: 1

      In the old days, using BCC in emails you sent was considered a "stab in the back" strategy. It was considered fine to use it for mass email sending but not for specific emails you send to a specific group of people. Using CC was the prescribed strategy to adopt.

      --
      Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
    28. Re:BCC still existed? by ls671 · · Score: 1

      You mean the sendmail daemon implementation ?

      Then, I would agree. It is weird what some mailers do with headers when it would be so simple to stick to the basic implementation.

      A Notes user asked me why he wasn't in the recipient list and he was pretty sure there was a problem somewhere. He understands what BCC: means. The problem was that mail sent internally get handled exclusively by Notes and Notes shows him explicitly that he as been BBCed when he receives internal emails.

      Then, one day, he gets BCCed by somebody external. The external sender mailer daemon behaves like sendmail so Notes doesn't see the BCC header when it receives the message. Notes then sends the message to the user in complete standard fashion, the same way sendmail would do but now the user is all freaked out because he doesn't see himself in the BCC header of the message.

      I would assume Notes behavior is configurable to mimic sendmail although but that is how it behaved in that company setup.

      --
      Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
    29. Re:BCC still existed? by ATMAvatar · · Score: 1

      All too often in the corporate environment do little arguments turn into bullet items on your next review. Except it is a bullet item 6+ months later without any context to justify your actions. Now you are just the guy who doesn't work well with others.

      It may feel like you are being a dick by copying in a manager in a reply email to a co-worker, but sometimes it is necessary.

      --
      "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    30. Re:BCC still existed? by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

      You will cease, one day.

      --
      I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
    31. Re:BCC still existed? by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

      The problem with slashdot is that most of its users were bullied and stuffed into lockers as kids!

      OT on sig: the defining characteristic is also the problem? Well, I suppose you're correct: we are discussing science, with a view to change policy, so that we can prevent future generations of scientists from being bullied and stuffed in lockers as kids at the hands of non-scientists.

      --
      I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
    32. Re:BCC still existed? by MacGyver2210 · · Score: 1

      I think the best solution is just to not use Reply All unless you know who all is on the list, and actually have a valid reason to send it to them.

      It's not the stupid use of BCC that's the issue, it's the stupid use of Reply All.

      --
      If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits
    33. Re:BCC still existed? by arth1 · · Score: 1

      Given the technical skills of the average Outlook user, I think it would be smart to disable "Reply All" unless your address is in either the To: or Cc: fields.

      And if there is a Reply-To, throw up a requester saying that there is a preferred reply-to address, and would you please consider using that (default yes)?

    34. Re:BCC still existed? by Rubinstien · · Score: 1

      It isn't difficult to learn, or to teach, at least to the younger generation. Even my 7-year-old knows the difference between, 'To:', 'CC:', and 'BCC:'. She even complained to her second-grade teacher about putting everyone in the 'To:' field, because now everyone has her address, which she was told to keep private. He's learned his lesson. My 15-year-old's soccer coach is another story, though. The concept seems too difficult for him. He's at least learned to distribute those nasty .docx files with a PDF as well, though.

      I taught my wife and daughters: Use the 'To:' field for the primary people you are corresponding with, and might expect a response from. Use 'CC:' for those that might also need the information but probably don't need to act on it in any way. Use 'BCC:' for large distributions or any email where not all of the parties will know each other and you don't have permission to share their contact information with other people (a good example is sharing a joke with a bunch of people in your address book). My oldest daughter also uses it to keep me informed when her online conversations wander into the territory of "stuff Dad had better know about."

    35. Re:BCC still existed? by MysteriousPreacher · · Score: 1

      I think it's 2445, but I could be wrong.

      --
      -- Using the preview button since 2005
    36. Re:BCC still existed? by migla · · Score: 1

      You're right, Kojack would solve this in a heartbeat. Columbo would also, although he might first pretend for a while he didn't understand this emailing thing.

      Seeing Kojack and Columbo working together would be super cool.

      --
      Some of my favourite people are from th US; Vonnegut, Chomsky, Bill Hicks.
    37. Re:BCC still existed? by TheMidget · · Score: 1

      BCC recipients are not shown to anybody. However, BCC recipients will see the other (non BCC) recipients. So yes, the above scenarios could happen (... unless the boss' e-mail client is smart enough to put up a warning when replying to a Bcc'ed mail...)

    38. Re:BCC still existed? by thsths · · Score: 1

      > His point is that even for those who do know how to use BCC, recipients don't know what BCC means.

      That is exactly the problem, and the solution is to forward a copy of the email in question. This solution is better by every measure except upload data to the SMTP server. And since this is not a pressing issue any more, the forwarding is becoming the norm.

      I don't see anything wrong with that.

    39. Re:BCC still existed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      he's done a "Reply All"

      You BCC'd him, a reply all would only come back to you.

    40. Re:BCC still existed? by cyn1c77 · · Score: 1

      BCC doesnt show other recipients, so if your boss scenario actually happened, either you don't know how to use BCC yourself, or he added everyone in by hand.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_carbon_copy

      You did not read the GP's post carefully enough. Only the boss was BCCed. All others were in the TO and CC fields. So while the boss can't see other BCCed recipients, he can both see and reply-to-all to those on the TO and CC fields. (This is confirmed in your link.)

      Ironically, your post illustrates why BCC is a problem nowadays. People don't spend enough time reading online text before hitting the reply button. (Don't take offense, we all do it. There are just too many emails and not enough time in the day.)

    41. Re:BCC still existed? by ivucica · · Score: 2

      Gmail's "Mute" ftw.

    42. Re:BCC still existed? by jimicus · · Score: 1

      In the old days, using BCC in emails you sent was considered a "stab in the back" strategy. It was considered fine to use it for mass email sending but not for specific emails you send to a specific group of people. Using CC was the prescribed strategy to adopt.

      Quite correct, hence why I've seen at least one employer ban it outright.

      Didn't stop people CC'ing in the chain of command as a means of stabbing someone in the back, just meant that the stab-ee knew about it straight away.

    43. Re:BCC still existed? by Mr_Silver · · Score: 1

      Have another read of his comment. He sent an email To: one person and Bcc: to that person's boss. The boss receives an email that does not have his email address anywhere in it. When the boss hits reply-all, the email will go to two people: the person who sent the email and the person to whom it was addressed. It was the boss who was in the Bcc field and hence when the boss hits reply, he doesn't send an email to himself.

      I was stung by this six months into my first job and shortly afterwards realised that no-one in the office environment uses BCC in this way for the very reason you describe. Plus it doesn't help that Microsoft Outlook out of the box hides the BCC field - which means that the vast majority of users have no idea it even exists.

      The better solution is to send the email directly the person as you would normally and then dig that out of the Sent Items and forward that onto your boss with a simple "FYI". If he tries to do a Reply-All then it'll only go back to you.

      --
      Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
    44. Re:BCC still existed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I can one-up this:

      Employee of our company sends mass mail to customers, using To: or CC: (I can't remember which now). Email gets stuck in the misconfigured mail server of another company, which proceeds to resend the email to all original recipients once every minute. On contacting the company with the broken server, it turns out that they have gone into administration, but it looks like there may have been some dodgy asset-stripping type deals going on, so the moment we ask to talk to the old company name we get hung up on pretty quickly. Meanwhile everybody else on that list is getting really pissed that they are receiving thousands of copies of this email.

      That was a fun couple of days.

    45. Re:BCC still existed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I never cease to be amazed by how dumb people can be.

      A good deal of this is because nerds have done a crap job of making computers easy to use/understand and explaining just what things like "BCC" mean. Some of it is because people are fearful that the computer will take their job and some of it is, despite some people being gaga over the latest 8-core laptops and self-healing kernel threads, most people just want to watch television (youtube) and "interact" with friends they think they have (facebook). Beyond that computers are little more than that damn alarm clock that keeps going off at 04:45.

      PS - I work with computers daily, pretty much like them and own several. But I'm not stupid enough to think that they're of vital and necessary importance to a good and fully engaged life.

    46. Re:BCC still existed? by Geminii · · Score: 1

      So why hasn't the IT team for that company installed something which prevents emails-to-all unless authorised by the CIO? I've seen it done at a number of larger employers; it's by no means impossible. Even better is having all larger (multi-hundred and over) email groups locked down so that if someone not on a preauthorised list tries to send to them, they get a popup saying it will have to be authorised by $bigboss-for-that-team, and this this OK?

      Bigboss then gets a message in their email requesting authorisation of the original email, along with the proposed recipient list and the approximate cost (in dollars, time, and resources) to send it. They can choose to deny it, authorise it for immediate sending, or authorise for overnight sending. Their response is then logged as well...

    47. Re:BCC still existed? by Slur · · Score: 1

      Now that you know how BCC: works, you will know to send the email TO: yourself and BCC: everyone else, including the main recipient. OR, skip BCC and send a separate message to your boss, if needed. Main rule: always consider the potential consequences of your actions before committing to them.

      --
      -- thinkyhead software and media
    48. Re:BCC still existed? by tilandal · · Score: 1

      BCC is simply a tool to keep the privacy of e-mail addresses. There is no inherent expectation of confidential knowledge. If you want something to be confidential you should explicitly say so which means forwarding the e-mail with an explanation. It seems to me like the author of that article is just complaining because people do not use e-mail the way he wants them too.

    49. Re:BCC still existed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The real answer is the "forward"

      Yes, get the information to people who need to know, but do so quietly. And then the other email addresses are not "live," obviating the errors of the technically inept.

    50. Re:BCC still existed? by SCHecklerX · · Score: 1

      I flamed a headhunter for doing that once. Thanks for the client list!

    51. Re:BCC still existed? by ssbljk · · Score: 1

      "I think that all good, right thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that all good, right thinking people in this country are fed up with being told that all good, right thinking people in this country are fed up with being sick and tired. I'm certainly not, and I'm sick and tired of being told that I am."

      --
      /ss
    52. Re:BCC still existed? by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      Except the example he was speaking of was the BCC target hitting reply to all...

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
  3. So true by QuantumG · · Score: 2

    Every single time I use BCC these days I think "this is gunna bite me in the ass".

    That said, try to find an email program that gives any "help" or description of the functionality. Email software is arcane and unlearnable by the isolated individual. They really are a relic of a long forgotten time when people were introduced to computers with "training" provided by competent professionals, in a community where someone was available to provide gentle reminders of appropriate etiquette.

    Yes, email is now our lightsaber.

    --
    How we know is more important than what we know.
    1. Re:So true by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      When was the last time you used BCC? I'm not sure I used it at all in the last five years. Is it even useful for anything practical?

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    2. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "a community where someone was available to provide gentle reminders of appropriate etiquette"

      Yes, indeed. Long ago, far away....and pure fantasy!!

    3. Re:So true by Saint+Stephen · · Score: 1

      If something's sent to the group and you want the group to know you're sending a reply about a topic they might not care get the followups on. Like you may be interested in X but don't want to see all the back and forth that comes after.

      I've always put who I BCC'd to in the body. It's common courtesy.

    4. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It works for CYA when someone claims that you never sent an email to them and you always BCC your boss.

    5. Re:So true by Kidbro · · Score: 5, Informative

      It's useful when you're informing a large group of people that may not know eachother already about an event. For instance when sending out an invitation to a party.

      It's just plain rude to share people's email address without their permission.

    6. Re:So true by e4g4 · · Score: 1

      We use BCC all the time at my work, any time someone sends an email that remotely effects the entire (small, startup company) everyone@ gets BCC'ed.

      --
      The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. - Albert Einstein
    7. Re:So true by geoskd · · Score: 2

      When was the last time you used BCC? I'm not sure I used it at all in the last five years. Is it even useful for anything practical?

      I use it all the time at work, when I want person X to know that I am on top of a situation dealing with person Y, and person Y is being a douche. I usually only have to do this once with any given douche before they do what I tell them to without the stupid games.

      -=Geoskd

      --
      I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
    8. Re:So true by Lobachevsky · · Score: 0

      If you have multiple girlfriends and you want to share with all of them "Happy Valentine's Day", and don't want to be bothered compose individual emails, then Bcc is great.

    9. Re:So true by mug+funky · · Score: 0

      then you want CC.

    10. Re:So true by phantomfive · · Score: 1, Funny

      I usually only have to do this once with any given douche before they do what I tell them to without the stupid games

      This may be part of your problem, instead of telling people to do stuff, ask them to do it. It could be you are acting like a douche without realizing it.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    11. Re:So true by mug+funky · · Score: 2, Insightful

      cue the tech-savvy one asking why is she BCC'd on her valentine...

      i think an email-merge would serve this purpose better.

      but really... why would you want multiple girlfriends? it's hard enough finding one girl that's not insane let alone several

      (oh, no i didn't!)

    12. Re:So true by Saint+Stephen · · Score: 2

      No, I want BCC. That way people on the BCC don't get the replies; people on the CC do (they stay on the thread).

      BCC = 1 reply no followups. CC = all followups.

    13. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Consider that every time you send an email to someone, your address is forever enshrined in their email client, via the From: field of your email.

      Now, consider sending a mass mail to a list of friends with all the addresses in the CC: field. All those people and all their email clients know all those addresses. Maybe this isn't bad, per se; you'd like all your friends to be friends, even the ones who don't know each other. However, you don't necessarily know the minds of all those people -- maybe some of your friends don't want some of your other friends to have their email addresses.

      The worst case scenario is that one of those peoples' machines gets infected by a trojan/virus/malware that goes through their email client and adds every email address it finds to spammer's mailing list. By using CC: instead of BCC: you put your friends in the line of fire, without their consent, and there is no way to take it back.

    14. Re:So true by noidentity · · Score: 2

      On the flip-side, you have to assume that anyone you email is clueless and will share your address, and will get some kind of virus that adds it to spam lists, so you share a forwarding alias that you can kill if it gets misused.

    15. Re:So true by jaymz666 · · Score: 1

      Any time I send an email to a group of people who don't know each other or other's email addresses. Like, people who signed up for a beta test or something

    16. Re:So true by macshit · · Score: 2

      I quite often BCC myself at another address, e.g., if it's a mail I'm sending from work, but I want a copy in my non-work mail account too.

      Less often, but still occasionally, I'll BCC somebody so they also have a record, and I don't necessarily want the recipient to know -- you know, the actual intended use of BCC header...

      BCC is certainly useful, if not something you typically use on every email. Sure the masses are ignorant of it, but they're ignorant of vast numbers of useful features.... that's certainly no reason to get rid of it (unless perhaps you're making a dumbed-down lightweight client and every byte counts...)!

      --
      We live, as we dream -- alone....
    17. Re:So true by g253 · · Score: 1

      For keeping someone informed? I see a lot of people sending an e-mail and then forwarding it to someone just saying "fyi".... Why not just bcc that someone?

    18. Re:So true by Arancaytar · · Score: 1

      When sending an email to a group of recipients whose email addresses you do not want to disclose to each other. Even when the fact you have copied them is not secret, their actual address should be kept in confidence in many situations.

    19. Re:So true by Arancaytar · · Score: 1

      "To: undisclosed-recipients"

      That's not suspicious at all. :P

    20. Re:So true by GIL_Dude · · Score: 1

      We use it at work a lot when sending notes to large groups of people. If you were to use To: or CC: to these groups, you always get the couple of blockheads who "reply all" to say, "take me off of your distribution list". They are too stupid or too busy to realize that it makes no sense to do a "reply all", but that's what they do. Then you get the storm of people who equally stupidly use "reply all" to tell people to stop using "reply all". Many years ago we had some folks mistakenly send to a DL that contained most of the 50,000 people in the company. The resulting storm of "reply alls" actually caused mail service slow downs and an outage or two. (There are now permissions applied to those large DLs). In IT when we have to send a note to a DL containing (for example) 100 people, we use BCC just to avoid the crazy people using "reply all". We find it a best practice to put at the bottom of the note a message like, "this note was sent BCC to the following groups:" (and list out the DLs). On the other hand I've found no use at all for BCC at home (although others on this thread clearly have some use cases for it).

    21. Re:So true by Gonoff · · Score: 1

      I occasionally help a couple of voluntary groups and try to get them to use it when they are sending notices out to members.

      The problem is, every time I show someone how to do it, someone else takes over the secretary job and I have to start over. Otherwise at meetings someone complains that everyone else now has their email address.

      --
      I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
    22. Re:So true by geezer+nerd · · Score: 3, Informative

      Amen. I am not in the corporate world, being retired. But I am frequently the recipient of jokes and cute pictures and such which include long lists of email addresses of who knows who. And nested deeply through the 3 or 4 times the stuff was forwarded.
      I feel very strongly that one should not willy-nilly expose email addresses in that way, so I carefully delete all that from any email that I forward on.
      Frequently I will forward one of these to my friends and family, many of whom do not know each other. I then use BCC all the time so those friends are not seeing the emails of those they do not know.
      And, very few of my correspondents do the same.

    23. Re:So true by HornWumpus · · Score: 0

      Wait a second.

      Are you claiming you found a girl that is not insane?

      Proximity axiom: Pussy makes you crazy. Think how crazy the little bit you get makes you. They are attached.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    24. Re:So true by bmorency · · Score: 1

      I wish people would use BCC when sending an email to a bunch of people they don't know. It also helps to not advertise everyone's email address. A co-worker got an email , I think it was just a joke or something from someone that she knows and it had a lot of people in the to field. Not too long after she received that email she got another mesage from someone else that must have been in the list saying thanks for everyone's email address. So now a spammer got a hold of all these people's active email addresses.

      It's also a pain when people forward these type of messages and leave everyone elses addresses that received this message prior.

    25. Re:So true by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      i married the one who's crazy was compatible with mine.

    26. Re:So true by Belial6 · · Score: 1

      Seriously, I am surprised at the number of Slashdot users that don't get that. They should be complaining that it isn't used more instead of claiming that it is never used. When most people are rude, you don't remove the mechanism needed to be polite.

    27. Re:So true by Belial6 · · Score: 1

      With that kind of attitude, your never going get that 3 (4, 5,6) way.

    28. Re:So true by smellotron · · Score: 1

      We use BCC all the time at my work, any time someone sends an email that remotely effects the entire (small, startup company) everyone@ gets BCC'ed.

      Wow, you create small startup companies when you check your email? That's godlike!

    29. Re:So true by mrclisdue · · Score: 1

      What are these Valentine's Day and girlfriends you speak of?

    30. Re:So true by Kjella · · Score: 1

      Oh please, we're talking about work here not taking requests or asking for favors. People are paid to do as you say. While it might not be the military with "Sir, yes, sir!" you are often giving instructions to people - you tell them what to do. You should do so politely, but it's not asking. Not if you want to stay employed anyway.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    31. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So in a nutshell, expect the unexpected.

    32. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hilariously you are the person i dislike the most. STOP SENDING ME JUNK MAIL. At least the others don't know better. You do.

    33. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      hahah, I just did this.

    34. Re:So true by kramulous · · Score: 1

      Sending out a job opening to people. Everybody is a BCC. Y

      --
      .
    35. Re:So true by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      I don't know what company you work at, but when I work at a place, I do it because I want to work at that place. I have other options. Treat me like a slave or a commodity, and I will leave. You'll see how much I 'have' to do what you want.

      Besides, there's always room for courtesy.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    36. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      she wouldn't know she was bcc'd. some guys don't want to be females with a penis, they just want sex. multiple girls allows for variety.

    37. Re:So true by reilwin · · Score: 1

      Treat me like a slave or a commodity, and I will leave.

      There's lots of room for interpreting in the meaning of "telling a person what to do", but why object to "being told what to do"? There was no mention of slave-like behaviour, just a statement of fact. Seriously, does your boss actually ask you if you want to work? No, he tells you to because he's paid to do so, and you're paid to listen and work.

      Mountains out of molehills...

    38. Re:So true by allo · · Score: 0

      CC = follow ups possible
      BCC = no follow ups possible, even when useful

    39. Re:So true by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Sanity is defined by the norm for a society. If most women are irrational then irrational behaviour is sane.

      Few people believe in little green men, especially considering there is no reliable evidence for them, therefore someone who does is nuts. A lot of people believe in God, despite there being no reliable evidence for him, therefore someone who does is normal.

      I don't think women are insane though. Maybe I don't understand them all the time but their decision making processes are no worse than the majority of men's.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    40. Re:So true by TheThiefMaster · · Score: 1

      Fun.

    41. Re:So true by Saint+Stephen · · Score: 1

      Well, that was part of Netiquette where I used it. You'd better not BCC someone if you really meant to CC them. There truly were instances where BCC is warranted. Mostly where the follow ups are of too deep a nature for the BCC'd to care about, and you don't trust everyone else you are continuing the discussion with to know the difference between who cares and who does not.

      Most cases are CC, but there are a few where you want BCC. Or at least will take advantage of it when its there.

    42. Re:So true by jodio · · Score: 1

      I use it keep from filling up my boss's inbox. When troubleshooting problems, there is often a lengthy back and forth email session involving several people. I will Bcc: my boss occasionally, so that he gets updated, but doesn't have to deal with every reply to all.

    43. Re:So true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well yeah, it's gonna bite you in the ass because BCC is fundamentally deceptive. It operates on the principle "I don't want X to know I did this". Well X is usually going to find out, BCC or not. But BCC sure as hell makes it easier for X to find out. If one is going to deceive, one should cover one's tracks a bit more carefully than that.

      TFA cited sharing secrets he shouldn't be sharing as an example of a use of BCC he can no longer rely on. Apparently the idea that maybe he shouldn't be sharing those secrets didn't occur.

      It amazes me that people think email is suitable for sensitive discussions of that type in the first place.

      It also amazes me that the author of TFA ever got told a secret. I'm sure it didn't happen twice.

  4. Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by kcbnac · · Score: 1

    Perhaps email clients could be modified to highlight, or give a textual warning at the top of the preview/document pane/window (much like our browsers today warn us about a site wanting to install an addon, and whatnot) saying that "YOU WERE BCC'D ON THIS EMAIL."

    Default this feature to 'on.'

    Ideally built-into the client; an easy-to-install addon/plugin would work as well but guarantee most don't have it.

    1. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bigger problem is that most of the latest 'major' email clients do hide sender email address and only shows the actual sender name (what ever the sender decided to use as a name) ... and to be able to see the actual email address, requires several clicks and only then you'll know that you were BCC'd ... *sigh*

    2. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by Lobachevsky · · Score: 1

      All distribution lists are BCCs, so everyone receiving a distribution list email would say that.

    3. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Gmail is doing this now!
      See http://googleappsupdates.blogspot.com/2011/02/new-gmail-features-due-out-to-all.html

    4. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by Gonoff · · Score: 1

      If someone can't do BCC, there is a good possibility that they can't do distribution lists and are adding a whole boatload of addresses manually!

      --
      I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
    5. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by kramulous · · Score: 1

      God, I hate that 'functionality'

      People sometimes have multiply email addresses; Work and Private. Sometimes I need to know which one was used and the client I'm (forced) using does not allow me to see the whole email header and thus which email address - just the user's name.

      The other thing I hate (shakes angry fist at exchange) is that you don't get to see what the link is before you click it. I am in the habit (like a lot of others I imagine) of hovering the mouse over the link to see the domain. Exchange/Outlook have a redirect that you cannot see. My bank may have sent me an email but I'll never know.

      --
      .
    6. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      That is not correct. Users will see in the "to" field the name of the distribution list, which can in outlook / exchange be expanded to show all recipients.

    7. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      I think email clients should be set to not be able to reply to all by default if the recipient isn't in the "To" list. This would fix most headaches caused by BCC.

    8. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by jimicus · · Score: 1

      That is not correct. Users will see in the "to" field the name of the distribution list, which can in outlook / exchange be expanded to show all recipients.

      Two issues with that:

      1. Not necessarily. You can set permissions up on distribution lists to prevent this, and AIUI cross-forest permissions lists can't be expanded in this way.

      2. The World is not necessarily running 100% Microsoft software. And even if it was, you certainly can't get the list of people in a distribution list working in a totally unrelated organisation.

    9. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by multipartmixed · · Score: 1

      No only this, but most email forwarders do not alter the To:/Cc: fields. This means that all mail that is sent this way would like it was originally a Bcc.

      --

      Do daemons dream of electric sleep()?
    10. Re:Possible fix for "I didn't know I was BCC'd" by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      His words were

      All distribution lists are BCCs

      Which is not correct. You may not be running MS software, but for those who are running Exchange it is most certainly false.

  5. BCC by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    is alive and well over here. TFA is an inane rant.

  6. Not Sure... by Nukedoom · · Score: 1

    "f you're fighting with a friend and want to let your BFF know what's going on as you send your frenemy a nasty messsage — what's the best way to pull that off?" ...Better yet...why would you want to send hate mail to as many people as possible? BCC is an interesting feature, but this isn't exactly the best demonstration of its usefulness.

  7. cooler yet less effective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    > certain technologies that are slowly being supplanted by 'cooler' yet less effective alternatives

    You mean the way the Slashdot web 2.whatever comment system is inferior to any 90's USENET client?

    1. Re:cooler yet less effective by webmistressrachel · · Score: 1

      Yep, and the same way my 1980s hifi seperates sound better than any MP3 source, and my 1990s 21" Trinitrons have better resolution than most LCDs and a higher contrast ratio than ANY flat tech.

      Why are we getting dumber, poorer, and unhealthier?

      --
      This tagline was transcoded to result in at least one smirk. If you experience failure to smirk, please consult your Gen
    2. Re:cooler yet less effective by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      huh?

      i can't tell if you're serious or not. i can only guess that you're not because each one of your points is demonstrably wrong.

    3. Re:cooler yet less effective by webmistressrachel · · Score: 1

      lol. trollbiter.

      But lets see if you're serious... Wharfedale speakers, Sony mid-range CD player, Rotel amp. ANYTHING with MP3 as the source. Use a musician's ears or an oscilloscope and microphones, and TRY to prove me wrong.

      Re: Trinitrons, 1600x1200 @ 85Hz and contrast ration >700:1. Kiss my trolling, female butt.

      --
      This tagline was transcoded to result in at least one smirk. If you experience failure to smirk, please consult your Gen
    4. Re:cooler yet less effective by webmistressrachel · · Score: 1

      "contrast ration" - and spelling Nazis, there's a troll for you, too, albeit an accidental one. x

      --
      This tagline was transcoded to result in at least one smirk. If you experience failure to smirk, please consult your Gen
    5. Re:cooler yet less effective by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      mp3 = transparent

      musician's ears = irrelevant, as proven by the last 10-15 years of terrible mastering on CDs.

      CRT's = blurry, distorty, colour-drifty, and have problems with colour if they're not north-south aligned. LCD has beaten them on contrast for years, and on resolution for longer.

      a hifi setup is a matter of taste. i have one that sounds pretty (1970's amp, 130W speakers), and one that sounds accurate (bi-amped nearfield pro-monitors).

    6. Re:cooler yet less effective by jimicus · · Score: 1

      You tried hunting down a 1600x1200 LCD lately? Since the manufacturers moved over to using 16:9 aspect ratio panels almost exclusively, it's quite difficult to find anything other than 1920x1080 unless you're prepared to shell out a lot of cash. There are still a handful around but they're getting rarer by the month almost.

      Well and good if you want the horizontal resolution, not so good if you want the vertical resolution.

    7. Re:cooler yet less effective by webmistressrachel · · Score: 1

      Where the hell do you get the idea that mp3 is transparent? It is, by it's very definition, LOSSY compression, losing information (and therefore quality) is part of the spec!

      --
      This tagline was transcoded to result in at least one smirk. If you experience failure to smirk, please consult your Gen
    8. Re:cooler yet less effective by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      transparent != lossless

      perceptual transparency means that a listener in a double-blind test cannot tell the difference between source and the mp3.

      LAME at it's current default settings will produce mp3 files that are transparent in 99.9% of cases (there's a few known "problem samples" out there that will sound a little tiny bit different. most of these are extreme cases of transients).

      i backup to flac (i like the ability to format-shift, or re-burn a CD if a housemate loses the original), but most of my listening is in mp3.

      i'm sorry. you can't out-geek me in any of my areas of expertise.

    9. Re:cooler yet less effective by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      i happily used several 2560x1536 monitors. even 2 years ago, they were not that pricey, considering (AUD$1300 i think)

      i would have got one myself, but the colour profile that came with it was inadequate. the more expensive (1 year older) version was a bit nicer.

      ever see a CRT that goes to 2560x1536?

      didn't think so.

    10. Re:cooler yet less effective by webmistressrachel · · Score: 1

      Where are your links to double-blind tests? And why aren't you dogfooding your "transparent" mp3s instead of "wasting" disc space on FLAC? And yes, I can, I've been fixing, building and listening to proper hi-fi since I was six. Are you just trolling me?

      --
      This tagline was transcoded to result in at least one smirk. If you experience failure to smirk, please consult your Gen
    11. Re:cooler yet less effective by mug+funky · · Score: 1

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codec_listening_test

      plenty there to look at.

      i don't know what dogfooding means in this context. i take it as a substitute for some kind of actual argument.

      mp3 v flac? the flacs sit on a backup drive gathering dust. every now and then i dig it up to burn a disc or use a track for a showreel or some such thing, or to re-burn a disc i can't find anymore.

      my workmates would not appreciate me bringing in 50 gigs of flacs rather than 10 gigs of mp3s to play in the noisy office environment. likewise i can fit more mp3s on my iriver than i can flacs (which i'm not sure actually play on it). considering i can't hear the difference, it's a fair compromise.

      i don't get anxiety over things i can't hear.

      into hifi since you were six? nice one. not sure how old i was. i gave up hifi for modestly priced pro gear yonks ago though. occasionally i'll troll the local bang and oluffsen store, but i haven't bought anything "audiophile" for ages since i heard proper stuff rather than rich-kid toys.

      "Are you just trolling me?"

      trolling is making psychoacoustic decisions based on an oscilloscope. i'm replying to a troll because i'm bored and feel like stroking my e-penis a bit.

  8. Kill CC instead by Wowsers · · Score: 0

    I detest people who think my email address is so meaningless that they use it in CC field instead of BCC, and soon enough thanks to their ignorance and arrogance, I get spam email from the compromised Windows boxes.

    Anyone that uses CC instead of BCC should be shot at dawn.

    It is CC that should be killed off.

    --
    Take Nobody's Word For It.
    1. Re:Kill CC instead by SilverHatHacker · · Score: 1

      I was considering writing my own email client, just for kicks, and one thing I toyed with was removing the CC field. If the message has to go to multiple people, why not just put them all in the "To:" field? The only difference is that CCing is like saying "Oh, by the way, thought you might like to know I sent this out," but is that really worth it?

      --
      Funny may not give karma, but +5 Informative never made anyone snort coffee out their nose.
    2. Re:Kill CC instead by godrik · · Score: 1

      actually, I find CC pretty useful.
      The To field tells who the mail is addressed to and CC gives interested parties. I often Send mails to distant collaborators while CCing my boss that manage the whole thing.

    3. Re:Kill CC instead by Malc · · Score: 1

      CC is a very useful field. It shows things like the recipient isn't required to respond, or they've been included as an FYI. It drives me nuts when people misuse the To: header. It's often just a sign of laziness, although in fairness it occasionally can be because they need some help finding the right person. We work across three time zones eight hours apart (London, Shanghai and San Francisco), so I need copies of conversations that I can find later via X1 rather than waiting for the small window I'm online at the same time with somebody who will be able to answer my questions, but putting my in the To field of those threads would be wrong.

      BCC is also very useful, but I tend to avoid it if I certainly don't want the recipient to accidentally reply to the whole thread and reveal that they were included (then I tend to forward my message instead). I use BCC by far the most frequently if I'm pruning recipients from long email threads. I mention what I've done in the first line of the email, and then anybody who should be on the thread will know what I've done and re-add themselves if they really want to.

    4. Re:Kill CC instead by TheMidget · · Score: 1

      It is CC that should be killed off.

      CC is useful in situation where you actually want reply-all to work. Such as, a group of friends discussing what to do on the weekend.

    5. Re:Kill CC instead by TheMidget · · Score: 1

      why not just put them all in the "To:" field?

      A, B and C organize an event together. A asks B to do some action item, and wants C to know (so that C doesn't need to worry that it might have been forgotten). A would put B into To: and C into Cc:

  9. An App for That? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Couldn't someone just write the Facebook BCC App and make money off it?

  10. I must be old by wumpus188 · · Score: 0

    if you're fighting with a friend and want to let your BFF know what's going on as you send your frenemy a nasty messsage

    Wtf does that even mean? Who is frenemy and what's "messsage"?

    1. Re:I must be old by BJ_Covert_Action · · Score: 1

      It means the author is one of those "normies" that manages to function in the meatspace and actually has a social circle outside of their mother and their cat. ;)

    2. Re:I must be old by jshackney · · Score: 1

      Frenemy, that's Portmanteau. You know, the guy from Fantasy Island.

      --sorry, couldn't help it.

  11. It's dead? by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 4, Informative

    Strange, I see it used all the time - in the workplace, that is. For one thing, it's a very convenient way to "loop out" someone from a long-going email thread (when it's no longer relevant to them).

    1. Re:It's dead? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In that case, don't you just leave them off the reply entirely?

    2. Re:It's dead? by Sharp-kun · · Score: 1

      I use BCC quite frequently at work, mostly when I reply to a client regarding something important that my ops manager would quite likely want to know about, but wouldn't want the client to know he was aware of (since some are the kind that would then want to deal with him directly on it which he doesn't have the time for). BCC lets me respond and makes me the main contract, but quietly lets my manager know whats going on (and gives him a copy of the email if he needs it). Ofc, he knows he gets bcc'd into these so there's not much issue.

    3. Re:It's dead? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Not the orig poster, but it's so they know they are being looped out.

      For example, if you're looping out a list that shouldn't have been looped in in the first place (perhaps they should be contacting another list instead, which you are now cc-ing), then moving them to the Bcc and saying "list -> Bcc" or "Bcc list" in the body lets the other people on that list know you're looping them out.

      That way, the Bcc-ed people know they don't have to follow up and do the same thing ("You want information-disbursement@, not information-retrieval@...").

      This only works in a professional environment with people who know how email works (not the "please unsubscribe me" masses).

    4. Re:It's dead? by B+Nesson · · Score: 1

      This is actually why I hate BCC. I honestly have no idea how many different mailing lists and groups I'm a member of at work, since lists can be nested. I have a long list of rules set up for many of these lists, since I frequently don't care what's being said on them, and just archive for later reference.

      But every once in a while, someone will ask a question to the wrong list, and someone else will reply-all with that list on the BCC, and it breaks all my rules. So a message shows up in my inbox, and I have no idea why I'm getting it. My only option is to try to script out a tree traversal to search the addresses on the To: line to try to find my address, or traverse my membership tree until I find an address on the To: line.

  12. Gonna miss that site by Tablizer · · Score: 4, Informative
    1. Re:Gonna miss that site by mehemiah · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I read it that way also!

    2. Re:Gonna miss that site by JonySuede · · Score: 2

      I was sad for the brits too.

      --
      Jehovah be praised, Oracle was not selected
    3. Re:Gonna miss that site by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Actually it's this site: http://bcc.org/ Who knew that Slashdotters were so religious?

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    4. Re:Gonna miss that site by Martian_Kyo · · Score: 1

      Score: 5 Dyelxsic
      /. is in desperate need of the dyslexic mod.

  13. my other me by epine · · Score: 2

    The only time I ever used BCC was to send a copy to my other me on some other account, whose existence I didn't wish to publicize.

    I don't know why FB doesn't implement "burning carbon copy". Never been on the service, maybe that's also too much to ask people to understand. Perhaps the major downside is getting sued for implementing this by the visually impaired.

    The upside of Facebook is that we can now explain dark matter to your average dim bulb: it's like a person without a FB account. It shows up on an abstract census, but there's no public record of its birth date, mother's maiden name, or SIN number, and it doesn't even interact with likinos, so for most practical purposes, it's not really there.

    1. Re:my other me by Gonoff · · Score: 3, Informative

      I don't know why FB doesn't implement "burning carbon copy".

      Blind Carbon Copy Actually - unless this is another example of how the USA has diverged from English. In that case, sorry.

      --
      I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
    2. Re:my other me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No no no, it is different kind of BCC: it uses javascript based animation to slowly make your message fade, from the top, so that you'll hardly be able to grasp to whom it was addressing (other than yourself, of course). Not only that, the moment you finish reading (or didn't manage to read it, who cares, a message on fb is usually not important), the message will no longer be readable!

    3. Re:my other me by MacGyver2210 · · Score: 1

      It's blind in the US also. OP is just dumb, or trying to be witty.

      PS: I BCC'd him on this.

      --
      If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits
    4. Re:my other me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The only time I ever used BCC was to send a copy to my other me on some other account, whose existence I didn't wish to publicize.

      I don't know why FB doesn't implement "burning carbon copy". Never been on the service, maybe that's also too much to ask people to understand. Perhaps the major downside is getting sued for implementing this by the visually impaired.

      The upside of Facebook is that we can now explain dark matter to your average dim bulb: it's like a person without a FB account. It shows up on an abstract census, but there's no public record of its birth date, mother's maiden name, or SIN number, and it doesn't even interact with likinos, so for most practical purposes, it's not really there.

      I thought the acronym BCC stood for "blind carbon copy"

      I use BCC all the time to keep our Service-Now records in the loop, that way when we get reply all's come through it doesn't clog up the internal work notes with email trails. . .

      On the other hand I wish more people in my organisation would reply all. . .

    5. Re:my other me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's "blind carbon copy" in the USA too. Either he was trying to be funny or doesn't know what bcc stands for.

  14. BCC handy for non sinister uses by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I send weekly emails to nearly a hundred admirers of my photography and just find that using bcc protects everyone's email addressses. Yes I know other technologies might seem better (blogs, rss etc) but this seems to work the best for us (eg many of the recipients wouldn't get around to learning even rss and setting up some notifier).

  15. Huh? by Overzeetop · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Bcc: is usually used for juicy emails. It's used a lot for CYA, and to keep certain people in the loop on touchy subjects. Whenever I get interesting emails I always check the to/cc fields to see who the players are, and who is involved. And if I'm not on there, you can bet I'm going to keep my trap shut until I need to say something.

    Bcc: is alive and well; it appears that the author of TFA got burned by bcc'ing a clueless sot. You've got be careful on both ends...

    --
    Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
    1. Re:Huh? by John+Hasler · · Score: 1

      Bcc: is alive and well; it appears that the author of TFA got burned by being a clueless sot.

      FTFY.

      --
      Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
    2. Re:Huh? by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      I always check the to/cc fields to see who the players are

      Hrm, there must be a Thunderbird extension to more actively alert the reader that he was bcc:'ed. Stepping carefully across a minefield is great; having a bomb-sniffing robot go out in front of you is better.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    3. Re:Huh? by Overzeetop · · Score: 1

      That's actually a good idea. They already have that "forgot the attachment" falcepalm popup. No reason not to make one for any email on which you'r bcc'd but you hit replay all.

      I haven't looked, but it would be nice if Google incorporated this into their mail system as well.

      --
      Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
    4. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Apparently they are about to roll this out to Google Apps users. Maybe they will push it to GMail in due course.

    5. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Using BCC to send copies of juicy emails is the worst possible use for BCC. You're asking for trouble when someone BCC'd replies to the thread, or otherwise shows knowledge of something they shouldn't. Why not just send a *copy* of the email to the person you wanted to BCC?

      The way I see it, BCC has two legit uses: removing people from a thread that's no longer relevant to them (in which case it's good to mention in the email that your're doing so), and for announcement emails where reply-all never makes sense. Anything else is just asking for confusion or trouble.

    6. Re:Huh? by archen · · Score: 1

      And if I'm not on there, you can bet I'm going to keep my trap shut until I need to say something.

      This is why bcc is dangerous and I discourage people from using it. Because it requires intelligence.

    7. Re:Huh? by houghi · · Score: 1

      Same here.
      My guess it is 'dead' because it is not included as a default option in most email clients. Even CC is not always used properly. One that is even 'deader' is bounce. When applied properly, funny things can happen.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
  16. Re:Good Riddance by Seumas · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yeah. Political bullshit.

    Or . . . you know, an extremely useful way to keep someone apprised of communications without actually including them in communications. Say, when you are perhaps communicating information to a client and want an engineer to be up to speed on what is being communicated to said client, but you don't want to unnecessarily directly involve said engineer to the point that the client would just start spamming the engineer directly or that the engineer would start getting copied on every single piece of future communication in the thread.

  17. BCC is dead, long live BCC! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Blind Carbon Copy is used all the time, don't let the lies fool you.

    BCC is dead, long live BCC!

    1. Re:BCC is dead, long live BCC! by Lobachevsky · · Score: 1

      People get BCCs all the time. Everytime you get an email where your address doesn't show up in the To: or Cc: field, guess what? That's right, Bcc! That means all the distribution lists you belong to use bcc.

    2. Re:BCC is dead, long live BCC! by Kaz+Kylheku · · Score: 1

      People get BCCs all the time. Everytime you get an email where your address doesn't show up in the To: or Cc: field, guess what? That's right, Bcc! That means all the distribution lists you belong to use bcc.

      When you get a Bcc e-mail, you generally do not know you are getting one, because your name does appear on the To: line, and ONLY your name. Only the e-mail contents can give you a clue that it's a Bcc. If you get a message from Bob where Bob is quoting and replying to Alice, and you are not Alice, and Alice does not even appear in the Cc or To, you're probably getting a Bcc.

      Mailing lists do not use Bcc. Bcc is specifically for the situation where by sending to multiple people, you do NOT wish to create the potential for a list discussion. Mailing list servers iterate over all of the members of a list and repeat the e-mail individually to each person.

    3. Re:BCC is dead, long live BCC! by allo · · Score: 0

      your mailclient must be crap. when i get a bcc, then the name of the recipient is in to and my name is nowhere in the email.

  18. Too Bad... by BJ_Covert_Action · · Score: 2

    You mean, I won't be able to send out generic, "I love you Babe, you're so special to me!" emails to my multitude of girlfriends without them finding out about one another anymore? Oh the horror!

    *insert Slashdot virginity jokes here*

  19. Re:Good Riddance by LurkerXXX · · Score: 2

    As the other poster pointed out, there are LOTS of us using it in non-political bullshit ways every day. It can be very handy. Just because YOU don't use it or have a need for it, doesn't mean others don't. I don't use facebook, but I understand other folks find it useful.

  20. This article shows what's really wrong with tech by Nick+Fel · · Score: 1

    People like him. The guy seriously believes that people are the problem, not the poorly designed email clients and protocol (then totally confuses himself and bizarrely hurls the blame at Facebook). If BCC was the best solution to the problem (that is, the problem of, er, betraying your friends), then it would work. As he demonstrates, it doesn't. Regardless, he pig-headedly believes it is because it works just fine at his end, and hey, nothing that's been around since the command line can be a bad thing.

  21. Carl's an idiot by Rudolf · · Score: 1

    Carl is just mad that someone found out he couldn't keep a secret. If someone tells you a secret, you need to keep it to yourself, and not worry about how you can share the secret and not get caught.

    1. Re:Carl's an idiot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What if a friend tells you in confidence that something terrible is about to happen to him. You feel really bad for him and worry about his mental wellbeing. Some other friends of yours who are also friends with him ask you how he's doing as they haven't heard from him in a while. Do you confide in your other friends about the thing your first friend told you? Or do you just say "he's fine" because it's unlikely they give a shit anyway?

      Sometimes when someone drops a bomb on you RE something in their life it's nice to be able to talk to other friends about it.

      tl;dr mature people know when to keep a secret and when not to.

    2. Re:Carl's an idiot by discord5 · · Score: 1

      If someone tells you a secret, you need to keep it to yourself, and not worry about how you can share the secret and not get caught.

      That's why I use forward, it totally doesn't have this problem.

      Fw: Secret

      Fwd: Fw: Secret

      Fwd: Re: Fwd: Fw: Secret

      Doorg: Fwd: Re: Fwd: Fw: Secret

    3. Re:Carl's an idiot by hedwards · · Score: 1

      Or at least be smart enough to not blab about it on a medium that records what you're saying.

    4. Re:Carl's an idiot by Geminii · · Score: 1

      Take that, Julian!

  22. force bcc for mailing lists by wkk2 · · Score: 1

    Mail programs should insist on BCC if there are more than say 8 addresses. I'm tired of getting mail with a TO: list a mile long. One of the people will have an infested computer and everybody will be put on a spam mailing list.

  23. Re:Good Riddance by darkstar949 · · Score: 3, Informative

    I've seen BCC used to send bulk company-wide emails out to all of the employees so if anyone tired to reply to it, only the original sender would be the email as opposed to the entire company.

  24. Yeah, they really suck these days by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Their reporting has gone bonkers to the point that when those bastards say it's raining you bloody well have to look outside and check. Their world news is so bad we might as well send the license fees to Finsbury Park. The Daily Fail is starting to look respectable in comparison.

    Oh, were you talking about something else? I am sorry, I must have spoken in error. Yes, the Borland C compiler was quite the product in its day...

  25. Reply All storms by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 3, Interesting
    1. Re:Reply All storms by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      msexchangeteam.com

      ... m sex change?

    2. Re:Reply All storms by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Me too!

    3. Re:Reply All storms by bedouin · · Score: 1

      Was hoping it was a link to someone who E-Mailed their friend admitting that they're actually of the opposite sex, and accidentally BCCed it to their unknowing significant other at the same time. The post not only reveals how incompetent Microsoft is internally, but how oblivious they were to registering such a horrible domain name. Both represent the company's tendency to hire people in bulk who have no real purpose, and the idea that throwing money at any problem will solve it.

    4. Re:Reply All storms by vegiVamp · · Score: 1

      Back in the second half of the nineties, my employer was on Banyan Vines groupware. Three-pronged email adresses (individual@group@company), which happily supported *@*@*. Yes, wildcards in an email address. Took them until probably '97 or '98 to figure out that it would be a good idea to disable that for the common luser, too. Many a kittens-for-sale mail was bounced around, including plenty of reply-alls, and apparently everyone in charge just took this in stride without ever questioning how that could happen.

      --
      What a depressingly stupid machine.
    5. Re:Reply All storms by Eskarel · · Score: 1

      To the best of my knowledge that's actually a perfectly legal form of e-mail address and how it's handled is completely up to the final mail server. A good idea however, probably not.

    6. Re:Reply All storms by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      [msexchangeteam.com]
      Am I the only one who reads this url as m-sex-change-team.com? I of course think the m stand for male, making me think this is a website about male sex changes...

  26. Re:Good Riddance by Zocalo · · Score: 2

    OK, here's a counter example that I use BCC for all of the time:

    I frequently email a list of people some data such as links to a photo gallery from a recent trip, friends & family events, that kind of thing. The recipient list will typically vary slightly every time and, since it is most likely a one shot deal, there's not much point setting up a mailing list. Out of common courtesy, since not everyone on the list is going to know everyone else, I use BCC so that just in case one or more of them has been pwned, the entire list of email addresses won't get harvested and everyone will get spammed even more than usual.

    --
    UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
  27. What by justinlee37 · · Score: 0

    What is this I don't even

  28. did anyone else read... by Cyko_01 · · Score: 0

    ...BBC? I couldn't watch pron with only skinny white dudes in it. Bcc I can live without

  29. Killed by Facebook? by Kaz+Kylheku · · Score: 2

    Great! I can add one more reason why I don't use Facebook: I'm helping to keep Bcc alive.

    If you want to reach me with a group e-mail that looks like it is only going to me, you will just have to blow the dust off that Bcc header.

    Bcc is useful when you're sending an e-mail to many people without intending to start a virtual mailing list discussion where people can "reply all".

    It is essential in situations where you need to ask a bunch of people some personal question where an accidental "reply all" leads to embarassment.

  30. Re:Good Riddance by jomama717 · · Score: 1

    Someone else pointed that out as well, that is a nice counter example.

    --
    while [ 1 ]; do echo -n -e "\xe2\x95\xb$((($RANDOM&1)+1))"; done
  31. BCC? Borland??? by GuruBuckaroo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It took reading the summary twice for me to realize this story wasn't about the Borland C Compiler. I couldn't figure out what the hell Facebook had to do with the best cross-platform C compiler and library ever written.

    I was actually just talking to my Domino admin the other day about BCC:. Every chance he gets, he reminds our users about it. Almost nobody knows what it is, can't imagine a use case, and thus fail to even try - until we give them a couple of good solid examples.

    --
    Poor means hoping the toothache goes away.
    1. Re:BCC? Borland??? by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I was going to remark that BCC was killed off way back in the early 1990s by Borland Builder and Microsoft Visual Studio. Apparently it's not totally dead though; it seems that they still offer downloads old versions of Turbo C++ for free.

    2. Re:BCC? Borland??? by MacGyver2210 · · Score: 1

      Did you forget a sarcasm tag? Because while I know what the Borland CC is, I sure wish I didn't. Most horrible compiling experience I've ever had.

      --
      If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits
  32. Re:Good Riddance by jomama717 · · Score: 1

    I dunno...that's certainly not a malicious use of BCC, but what do you do when the client responds with a clarification or correction? You have to remember to forward that response to the BCC'd engineer. CC would be much more useful. You can put a disclaimer that all communications should go through you, or instruct the engineer to reply with the same if contacted directly. The kind of bullshit I've seen it used for more than once is people BCC'ing their own or the recipient's manager, instantly creating an awkward situation for all involved.

    --
    while [ 1 ]; do echo -n -e "\xe2\x95\xb$((($RANDOM&1)+1))"; done
  33. Huh? What? by bmo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    BCC was dead ages ago because nobody hardly ever learned to use it. It was dead before Facebook. It was dead before the large influx of spam. It was dead about the time Gopher came out.

    Ever get a "chain forwarded" email with hundreds of email addresses of people you don't know?

    That's because nobody uses BCC. Nobody ever learns how to trim FW: lines either. FFS, nobody ever learns to reply in-line with quotes. Replies are all top posted, mostly because of that crawling horror called Lotus Notes and that other crawling horror Exchange. Nobody ever learns how to trim replies either - a one line top posted reply to 10 screens of text or multiple forwards? Sure!

    The death of BCC is not because of Facebook. The death of useful email features is because most people are unwilling to learn, rude, or stupid.

    --
    BMO

  34. Branch on Carry Clear dead, indeed. by Kaz+Kylheku · · Score: 1

    Global CPU condition codes for program logic are largely dead because they are hard to parallelize.

    In modern instruction set architectures, CPU flags are for things like interrupt masks and privilege modes, not for "the most recent arithmetic instruction produced a carry". :)

  35. I use it to CMA by tkprit · · Score: 1

    [cover my ass], often, esp. w/ committees when we're not supposed to discuss something, but someone inevitably tries to drag my ass into an email conversation. To be polite, I respond with a bland 'we should discuss this at the next meeting' and cut the original post except the header, and BCC to at least one other member to prove I didn't start any conversation, and don't intend to be part of one.

  36. I'd say the bigger problem with tech by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

    is the rise of the "consumer centric" tech model. One of the things I miss about the old Gates era MSFT is how you had the business line in WinNT and the consumer line in Win9x. With the line split like that those that didn't want the bling bling BS and just wanted a corporate centric desktop had it, while the consumers got the bling bling hand holding.

    Now and with the rise of Apple it has considerably gotten worse, is everything made for the home user FIRST and business second. If TFA is correct and BCC is dying it is just another proof of consumer centric (as consumers don't know WTF BCC is) as opposed to business centric design. in the old days business users were first and foremost in the design then afterward you might make a consumer friendly version. Now everything is flipping 3D bling bling transparent windows which is about as useful to businesses as tits on a boar hog.

    So if anyone is to blame it is the sudden switch to consumer centric design. You just don't get anything mass market designed for business anymore, it is all being designed for Joe and Sally home user and business is an afterthought. Some may prefer it that way but I miss the days of low resource grey apps that just got the hell out of my way and let me work. Should I tell everyone to get off my lawn or do others miss it as well?

    --
    ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    1. Re:I'd say the bigger problem with tech by TheMidget · · Score: 1

      Should I tell everyone to get off my lawn or do others miss it as well?

      I'm missing it as well.

      But I've got to disappoint you: nowadays business users are just as clueless with e-mail and everything computer. True geeks are a dying species, both in the home arena and in the business arena.

  37. Man... by xx01dk · · Score: 0

    i LIKE the BBC! It's got Top Gear!

    --
    There is simply too much glass..
  38. It's great to cover my ass at a previous work by Obble · · Score: 0

    When I needed a coworker to her job I would email BCC to the boss just to let him in on whats going on and to at as prove later on if required.

    It covered my butt a couple of times because since I am the "tech" at my work, I could easily fake an email, so by sending at the same time my butt is covered if a dispute occurs and the coworker never received my deleted email. (I hate people playing politics at work)

    And on the plus side, the boss would think I am hard working and motivated while the other is troublesome.

  39. How has Facebook killed Bcc? by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 2

    I don't know that I've ever used blind carbon copy on a personal email, so whether or not I use Facebook's messaging instead is not relevant. I DO use Bcc in work emails, and I have a hard time believing Facebook messaging is going to supplant email for the workforce.

    I'm guessing the submitter has not yet entered the workforce? That seems like a blindingly obvious miss on his part.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
  40. Alive and well by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    BCC (and BBC) are alive and well. This article misses the mark.

  41. I, for one, am convinced by dsinc · · Score: 1

    "BCC is dead"... because NeoSmart says so?! W(ho)TF is NeoSmart?

    On their page, About gives a very meaningful result:

    "Oh no! You're looking for something which just isn't here! [..]"

    Oh, OK then. Trustworthy source.

  42. Not just bcc but ccc too. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sadly this is why ccc was also dead on arrival: http://www.ietfng.org/draft-jhuacm-cosmetic-carbon-copy-01.txt

  43. But I *like* the BBC by Sooner+Boomer · · Score: 1

    They have such interesting programs on TV and radio. Even the news on their website is good.

    --
    Chaos maximizes locally around me.
  44. double huh? by ushere · · Score: 1

    yeah, and the net's dead too.... not everybody thinks everything should be broadcast - unless they have a facebook account.....

  45. Re:Good Riddance by Belial6 · · Score: 1

    Maybe if you were not playing BS politics, you would never find a BCC'ed email to be awkward. You also are totally naive about customers.

    If you give a customer an email address, you better expect them to use it. Telling them not to send emails to the person that definitely knows the answer because it should first go through someone that might know the answer is going to be taken by some as you telling them that their time is unimportant. It doesn't matter if you are right or wrong. Making your customers feel insulting when it is totally unnecessary is not good business.

  46. oy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    god... it took 20 comments before I realized this wasn't the BBC...

  47. Re:Good Riddance by smellotron · · Score: 1

    Its only use as far as I can tell (I welcome counter examples) is to enable political bullshit.

    Counterexample: A large organization has an IT staff that is shared across several autonomous (and potentially competing) business units. Some member of the IT staff must now send a message to all business units about a particular piece of technology that is considered "sensitive" (i.e. it's exposing too much to even know who uses it).

    Solution: email the IT group itself and other "shared" resources. BCC all business units, with a comment in the email to that effect. Privacy between business units is maintained. "Reply All" keeps the discussion isolated to IT plus a single business unit, where it belongs.

    Yes, you could use some sort of mail-merge to send the same email out to each group independently. So BCC and Mail-Merge have some overlap in the functionality they provide. That's OK.

  48. Killed by facebook? Not really... by damn_registrars · · Score: 1

    In order for something to kill BCC, that something would have to be as useful for serious correspondence as whatever email client I am using at the time. Facebook is several orders of magnitude less useful than real email - especially for me since I don't even have a login on facebook - so no, it will not change how I use BCC.

    That said I don't use it very often. The times when I have a use for BCC are so rare I can't even think of the last time I used it. But I use it less because I don't need it; not because I have something that I would use instead of it.

    --
    Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
  49. Re:Good Riddance by smellotron · · Score: 1

    I dunno...that's certainly not a malicious use of BCC, but what do you do when the client responds with a clarification or correction? You have to remember to forward that response to the BCC'd engineer. CC would be much more useful.

    As a project manager or customer-relations manager given this scenario, your priority should be preservation of your engineers' privacy. It's better to guarantee that with BCC—with the added cost of remembering to forward replies appropriately—because that's your job. A disclaimer or policy can always be ignored.

  50. Re:Good Riddance by jomama717 · · Score: 1

    That's a good point but look, the bottom line is you can achieve the same thing without BCC or CC and just deliver requirements to your devs outside of the conversation with clients - you might have it the other way, a dev needs to know some inane API detail and grabs an client email address from the mail and ends up annoying the CTO of your client. If I copy people on an email to clients it's usually a support team member that I fully expect to be able to handle all aspects of direct communication.

    --
    while [ 1 ]; do echo -n -e "\xe2\x95\xb$((($RANDOM&1)+1))"; done
  51. BCC is quite handy - prevents reply storms by seifried · · Score: 2

    I used it recently to send a couple hundred emails with myself as the recipient and BCC'ed to all the people that needed to receive it (not worth doing a list since we only had to email them once). No BCC means any replies create a reply storm, no thanks.

  52. Re:Good Riddance by jomama717 · · Score: 1
    What I should have told the parent was BCC'ing or CC'ing developers on client communications were equally bad ideas.

    If you give a customer an email address, you better expect them to use it.

    On the flip side, if you surreptitiously give a developer a customer email address, you better hope they don't use it.

    Maybe if you were not playing BS politics, you would never find a BCC'ed email to be awkward.

    Someday after you learn to admit that you do not know everything and some company lets you have direct reports you'll find out that people are wildly unpredictable and do all kinds of stupid things to put you in bad situations without you having breathed one political breath in your life.

    --
    while [ 1 ]; do echo -n -e "\xe2\x95\xb$((($RANDOM&1)+1))"; done
  53. Re:Good Riddance by smellotron · · Score: 1

    That's a good point but look, the bottom line is you can achieve the same thing without BCC or CC and just deliver requirements to your devs outside of the conversation with clients

    I think we're dereiling ourselves... the bottom line in this thread is that BCC is not dead, because are still many legitimate uses for it.

  54. "interesting" by cinnamon+colbert · · Score: 1

    if it is really interesting, you don't need the word "interesting" - your writing should demonstrate that in any event, why would you have a /. article on a non interesting thing ?

  55. Re:Good Riddance by jomama717 · · Score: 1

    Agreed on both points :)

    --
    while [ 1 ]; do echo -n -e "\xe2\x95\xb$((($RANDOM&1)+1))"; done
  56. Used it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When I was TAing a class in Grad school, I used BBC for mass mailings to my students. No reason to give all of them the others addresses.

    That said, I was initially wondering what Facebook could be doing to bring down the British Broadcast Company.

  57. Yeah, what about NNTP? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nobody cares about BCC very much, that's why its dead. Personally, I miss NNTP. I blame Slashdot for the death of NNTP.

  58. Re:BCC is NOT dead. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You think BCC is dead? It isn't. Here's what I ran into.

    I put a filter on emails on my mail server mandating that the "To:" field exist and be filled in with an email address. Certainly fixes those spam emails to "undisclosed recipients". This seems reasonable and straightforward right?

    Nope. Next thing I know I've got people complaining that their emails aren't going through, because they're sending emails with a long list of recipients BCCed only, and the email isn't actually "To" anybody at all. I tried to explain that all they need to do is send the email "To:" themselves, but nooooo, that's just too complicated. :-(

    Used correctly, and used with people who UNDERSTAND IT, BCC is a feature. Used incorrectly or sent to people who DON'T, and it's a hindrance.

  59. both still around by rubycodez · · Score: 1

    I use bcc at work for replies to clients that certain internal people need to see.


    NNTP is still around and there are quality newsgroups such as for computer language development (many with two-way gateway to subscribed mailing list)

  60. Facebook? by Torodung · · Score: 1

    Hey, I'm not worried about BCC: being "killed" by Facebook. I'm worried about e-mail getting killed by Facebook.

    It's like having to be a member of AOL just to e-mail someone.

    While the article mentions Facebook, it has nothing to do with Facebook. The BCC: problem he mentions is a "problem" with mail clients, not the competition. This BCC: trouble could be neatly solved if all mail that arrived in your box not actually addressed or CC'ed to you was highlighted, or the client simply inserted a yellow bar above the display text saying "This mail was sent to a different address, listed mail recipients do not know you have this information, and will not see your mail address." It's not a bad idea for the next Thunderbird, in fact.

    --
    Toro

    1. Re:Facebook? by mcclungsr · · Score: 1

      That's not a bad feature for a mail client at all.

      I intentionally reply in email to people who send me facebook messages. Facebook is so primitive compared to even old email clients.

  61. Re:Huh? What? by MacGyver2210 · · Score: 1

    Complaining about top-posted replies vs inline replies is just stupid. Top-posting the reply is standard practice now. Every client I use does it, from generic school mail to GMail.

    --
    If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits
  62. This is backwards. by zippthorne · · Score: 1

    The problem is that BCC should have been the default, and CC should've been the special one. Because if everyone sends to everyone all the time and the reply-all list grows with every forward, it doesn't take many hops before everyone's valid emails get sent to a spambot. Not to mention the plenty of situations where you might want to send something to a bunch of people, but you don't necessarily want everyone to know who everyone else is. And the bigger the list, the bigger the chance that some dumbass is going to f' it up and forward the whole thing to the wrong person.

    How big a chance? It's already High when N = 1. I suspected it approaches certainty before leaving the single digits.

    The default should've been the behavior of BCC, unless some kind of deliberate, "let everyone see everyone else" flag is enabled, for those few times where the information you want to send everyone IS the address of everyone else.

    --
    Can you be Even More Awesome?!
  63. BBC is Dead? by rossdee · · Score: 1

    Especially since there was another frontpage story that said "Science Channel buys Firefly" and the BBC (america) is the main channel that shows SF* these days since the renaming and demise of the ScIFi channel

    BBCA has ST:TNG and X-Files in addition to their own SF shows like DR Who, Torchwood, Primevil, and Being Human...

    Anyway back to the intended subject, I don't use FaceBook, and I do use Thunderbird, and It still hac BCC

  64. Most people use email, not just Facebook by FoolishOwl · · Score: 2

    The point of the blog post seems to be that since Facebook doesn't offer BCC, people aren't using BCC anymore. It makes the rather bizarre assumption that Facebook has supplanted email. That's simply not true, as a glance at anyone's email inbox will reveal. In fact, it's a laughable presumption.

    1. Re:Most people use email, not just Facebook by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Facebook doesn't feature a telephone either. Telephones are dead.

  65. Fuck facebook. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you send me a facebook message when you could send me email instead... seriously, fuck you.

    1. Re:Fuck facebook. by bedouin · · Score: 1

      I quit checking my Facebook E-Mail for months. When I finally looked at it people were getting mad at me and defriending me because I never replied to them. If they sent me an ordinary E-Mail that wouldn't have happened . . .

  66. Re:Huh? What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'll have to disagree with some of your points.

    Inline replies and trimmed reply histories often work fine on mailing lists with few distinct threads, but in e.g. a workplace environment when I'm on dozens threads any given day, anything that obscures the thread history just makes my life difficult. I want to be able to see the full thread history when I receive an email.

    Trimming replies will cause new people added to a thread to lose context. Also, it's far easier to scroll down in an email than to find the previous email in your inbox (if you still have it!). It's not like the memory waste from long emails is a burden on modern computers.

    Inline replies just make a big mess of who wrote what and when. It's appropriate when several distinct points are under discussion, but I still like to see the unedited, uninterrupted text of the previous email included.

    IMO the "death" of bcc is well-deserved. It causes confusion (why did I receive this email?), if not trouble (replying to a thread you weren't supposed to be on), and subverts mail filters (e.g. I want to file emails from certain lists into a separate mailbox; if it's bcc'd then that doesn't work). It's ok for announcements where reply-all makes no sense, and it's great for removing people from a thread that's no longer relevant to them, but otherwise there's no upside to BCC versus just sending a separate copy of the email to your intended BCC recipients.

  67. Re:Huh? What? by gullevek · · Score: 1

    It is still horrible to have top replies without a trimmed body. Especially with all the wonderful 50 line long law footer BS in each and every mail.

    --
    "Freiheit ist immer auch die Freiheit des Andersdenkenden" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1871 - 1919
  68. Bcc still works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Bcc is still extremely useful for keeping the contents of my address book out of the hands of others, spammers included. This doesn't require any of the recipients to understand that.

  69. Re:Huh? What? by cbope · · Score: 1

    BCC was dead ages ago because nobody hardly ever learned to use it. It was dead before Facebook. It was dead before the large influx of spam. It was dead about the time Gopher came out.

    Ever get a "chain forwarded" email with hundreds of email addresses of people you don't know?

    That's because nobody uses BCC. Nobody ever learns how to trim FW: lines either. FFS, nobody ever learns to reply in-line with quotes. Replies are all top posted, mostly because of that crawling horror called Lotus Notes and that other crawling horror Exchange. Nobody ever learns how to trim replies either - a one line top posted reply to 10 screens of text or multiple forwards? Sure!

    The death of BCC is not because of Facebook. The death of useful email features is because most people are unwilling to learn, rude, or stupid.

    --
    BMO

    Huh? What? I use BCC and trim all the time. Just because "everyone" is not doing it doesn't mean some people aren't doing it and using email effectively.

  70. Re:Huh? What? by Pastis · · Score: 1

    My father is not what one would consider a technology friendly person, but he understood what BCC is for and is using it right. It took a few months and a few mistakes. And now he teaches others to do it. So I think most people don't use it, because they don't even know it exists or don't understand the problem caused by it.

    One nice thing I've noticed: the group of those who don't use BCC, almost 100% interesects with the one of those who send me hoaxes (in a top posting, hotmail/yahoo style forwarding with the headers of past messages containing previous senders/recipients). It's very practical because I can answer to everybody and point them to http://hoaxbusters.org/ or like (using BCC this time).

  71. brain farts by Torvac · · Score: 1

    an artice based on brain farts instead of fact, stats , numbers or basically anything. if you think something is dead just because you or your idiot friends dont use it, or dont know how to used it it DOES NOT mean its dead. real people just use it as they have been the last 20 years.

  72. AIM killed IRC by elucido · · Score: 1

    For the very same reason.

    1. Re:AIM killed IRC by sznupi · · Score: 1

      Time outs (and all sorts of other technical problems) didn't really harm the adoption of "archetypal" IM networks (because not only AIM) - their mode of communication was just better suited to what "average" people wanted, hence growing in times when those people connected to the net.

      --
      One that hath name thou can not otter
  73. Re:Huh? What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes granddad, when you were young the abacus ran on only 1GB of RAM and if you wanted to install a program you had to put a coaster in the drink holder.. you already told us this one

  74. Re:Huh? What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's even worse. I Do not top post, but most non tech people try to explain me every time that I should top posting, because it's better and because that's what "everybody is doing".

    Disgusting.

  75. Way to go! by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

    I love how the author of TFA tries to make the point of BCC being dead by demonstrating a case wherein the "victim" of BCC is a guy who abuses trust and gets caught. Using BCC to inform friends of how you betray another friend may not be the best use of BCC.

    --
    Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
  76. Re:Huh? What? by bmo · · Score: 1

    >Especially with all the wonderful 50 line long law footer BS in each and every mail.

    Those always make me laugh. They have absolutely no legal power whatsoever. At best they are contracts of adhesion. What they really are is intimidation. If I accidentally mail something to the wrong person, it's not their fault, it's mine, and they can do whatever they want with it. The "if you received this in error blah blah blah" lines tacked on are just wasted electrons.

    Someone having a bad day would be more tempted to post an errant email to 4chan /b/ that has the threatening footer than one without. Politeness breeds politeness. Asshole legal behavior begets assholes.

    --
    BMO

  77. Re:Huh? What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Everytime someone sends me a chain mail with a CC, I make it a point to reply all and admonish them to use BCC and tell the one who cc'ed it to me to not be an idiot and stop sending me crap.

    I may be a jerk when it comes to idiots on emails, but it works well.

    I hardly get someone chain mailing me another time.

  78. Facebook? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are Federal agencies that configure their MTA's to forward the BCC: header along just like CC: If someone from the Forest Services BCCs someone on an email to you, you'll see it in the headers you receive. I don't know if it's because their admin is an idiot, or if he was directed to do so.

  79. BC is dead by Mr.+Moose · · Score: 1

    BC has been dead for thousands of years. We have been using AD for 2010 years now. Try to catch up, people!

  80. This must be a joke. by Jicehix · · Score: 1

    I use it everyday, and most of my co-workers do. And of course it's mostly useful at work, where you don't use Facebook to communicate. Hopefully. This sometimes leads to funny situations where the BCC'd recipient answers some mail he wasn't "supposed" to read, by the way.

    --
    Jicehix
  81. That depends on how long that email is. by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

    n/t

    --
    Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
  82. my experience by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I was a hotshot English coach in Milan, and helping this big marketing director write perfect emails. (outlook). So I was sitting there doing them with her. She kind of had a routine where she would send an e-mail, then immediately go into her sent e-mail and forward it to other people she wanted to see it. "Why didn't you just CC them?" She said, she didn't want the people getting the e-mails to know about the other recipients. "Why not use BCC?" She said, because it would appear sneaky.

    I kind of had a facepalm moment. But then I thought about it, and you know what: she's absolutely right, it does appear sneaky. I have never once used BCC since then (ever, for any reason). Now I go into my sent email and click "forward".

  83. Re:Huh? What? by TheMidget · · Score: 1

    It's very practical because I can answer to everybody and point them to http://hoaxbusters.org/ or like (using BCC this time).

    ... or you could even set up a procmail script that does it automatically for you.

  84. Lame Article, Dumb Conclusion by coerciblegerm · · Score: 1

    Facebook isn't e-mail. I use BCC, and so do many other people; it still works just fine. Just be happy these tards can actually send an e-mail and don't need to call you for help with that.

    1. Re:Lame Article, Dumb Conclusion by coerciblegerm · · Score: 1

      Also, copying and pasting into a new message is nothing new. There were plenty of people who didn't know how to use BCC properly before Facebook, and there will be plenty who don't long after it falls into obscuriy.

  85. BCC required by siwelwerd · · Score: 1
    As faculty, if including more than one student in an email, we are required to input students' email addresses in the BCC line to protect their privacy. We get a nice reminder whenever we write an email from the online course content system:

    Important Privacy Notice: If you copy email addresses for use in another email program, you must use those addresses in the 'bcc:' field when sending email to ensure that student email addresses remain private in accordance with FERPA policy.

    1. Re:BCC required by PPH · · Score: 1

      This is a much better justification for the use of BCC than the example given in TFA.

      The whole sharing secrets with a third party via BCC falls on its face when quite a few people aren't smart enough to realize that they aren't supposed to share communications with the subject. Even when forwarded as an enclosure to a message requesting discretion on the part of the BCC'd party.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    2. Re:BCC required by atomic-penguin · · Score: 1

      FERPA does not automatically protect a student's "Directory Information" such as e-mail addresses, and phone numbers. FERPA only applies to the privacy of a student's academic records. There have been several FERPA cases tested in court with regard to what is, or isn't, a protected student record.

      You can, as a student, request that your own "directory" information not be published by the school. I would say its probably easier to be safe than sorry, in this particular case. It would not be feasible for faculty to cross-reference every students directory "privacy flag" when sending a mass e-mail to many CC recipients.

      There is a better way to send mass-recipient newsletter type announcements and retain privacy for recipients' e-mail addresses. For example, using a Mailing List Manager (Sympa, Mailman, Majordomo) intended for that purpose. If its just a one-time message, then BCC would beat having to set up and manage a mailing list.

      --
      /^([Ss]ame [Bb]at (time, |channel.)){2}$/
  86. Re:Huh? What? by Splab · · Score: 1

    Inline replies are fucking annoying, especially when the mail grows with multiple people answering inside the text.

    Putting it on top gives a very clear history of whats been going on and it makes it a heck of a lot easier to read through if you need to catch up on something (e.g. someone else has been making a mess and it has been escalated).

  87. Re:Huh? What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've been top-posting replies since the 80's. It simply makes more sense to me. It would be an interesting Slashdot poll to see the breakdown of preferences for top vs. bottom replies in emails.

  88. s/chain //g #(no body) by jonaskoelker · · Score: 1

    (See topic.)

  89. I think it's safe to say... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    he only said anything about Facebook to get more views.

  90. Re:Huh? What? by Geminii · · Score: 1

    or?

    AND.

  91. Re:Huh? What? Really? by ukemike · · Score: 1

    BCC was dead ages ago because nobody hardly ever learned to use it. It was dead before Facebook. It was dead before the large influx of spam. It was dead about the time Gopher came out.

    That's funny because the most popular email client around, Outlook (cringe), still supports BCC. Gmail still has bcc. Yahoo still has bcc. For a dead technology it sure is implemented in tons of current software.

    --
    -- QED
  92. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  93. What about 'Forward'? by edmicman · · Score: 1

    Forget BCC...you can't forward a message in FB, either. If my friend sends me a link as a private message and I want to send that to another friend - I have to create a new message and copy-paste the link to them. FB messaging works fine as sort of a text message replacement. But I don't see it supplanting real email communication any time soon.

  94. Facebook wants it dead ... by PPH · · Score: 1

    .... as do other social networking sites. Because they want the complete distribution list for all communications to support their link analysis/marketing initiatives.

    --
    Have gnu, will travel.
  95. Easily... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...the dumbest I've read on /.

    Congrats!

  96. Pot / Kettle / Black by SCHecklerX · · Score: 1

    Kind of like that whole blog / forum thing that took over the more elegant usenet...

  97. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  98. I hate it when people do that on online forums too by skiddie · · Score: 1

    n/t

  99. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  100. Re:Huh? What? by syousef · · Score: 1

    Speak for yourself. I literally use BCC every day and sometimes many times a day. I guess I am neither a subset of nobody or everybody, at least according to your email.

    --
    These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer