Windows Phone Market Share Sinks Below 1 Percent (theverge.com)

You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by hey! · 2016-05-23 07:16 · Score: 5, Funny

OK, now I want one.

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Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.

Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Opportunist · 2016-05-23 07:26 · Score: 4, Funny

Watch. And then decide if you really want one.

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We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by WarJolt · 2016-05-23 07:40 · Score: 1

I never thought the day would come where hipsters would buy Microsoft products.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by NotDrWho · 2016-05-23 07:47 · Score: 2, Interesting

Real cutting-edge hipsters are beginning to consider traditional Apple hipsters as poseurs. Retro Windows products and old mimeograph machines are so hot right now.

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SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Opportunist · 2016-05-23 07:54 · Score: 2

In other words, hold on to that Zune, it's gonna be worth something in a bit.

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We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by peragrin · 2016-05-23 07:58 · Score: 2

Give me a sec I am squirting out another brown zune as I type.
Interesting autocorrect changed zune to sine, and then to zone before allowing zune.

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i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 07:59 · Score: 1

No....no, it's not. Never.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by NotDrWho · 2016-05-23 07:59 · Score: 2, Funny

Let's just say that Clippy is hot shit right now in all the hidden coffee/hookah clubs in north Tacoma.

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SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by hey! · 2016-05-23 08:04 · Score: 2

Mimeograph? Pfft. Lamestream. Real hipsters use Gestetner machines. Cutting a stencil is so much more tactile, plus you can get high from the correcting fluid.

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Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by hey! · 2016-05-23 08:06 · Score: 1

Now if you could only get an old version of Ubuntu to run on it.

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Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by JustAnotherOldGuy · 2016-05-23 09:24 · Score: 1

Hipsters will fight each other to the death for the honor of carrying one.
"This? It's a Windows phone...you probably never heard of it."

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Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by JustAnotherOldGuy · 2016-05-23 09:25 · Score: 4, Informative

Watch.

What the fuck did I just watch??

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Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by chr1st1anSoldier · 2016-05-23 10:44 · Score: 4, Informative

As a current Windows Phone user, no you don't. I started on Windows Phone 7 and I'm still here in WP10, the experience has pretty much gone down hill. With the Exception of WP8.1, that was halfway decent. Everything else has just..... sucked. Microsoft hid the date applications were last updated in their app store because many of their apps have turned into abandon ware. Android and iOS are so far a head in features and functionality, I really do get envious when I pick up an iPhone or a mid to highend Android device.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by labnet · 2016-05-23 10:50 · Score: 1

Yeh.. we need /. counseling support group.
I'm going to have 'Unicorn Unicorns Happy Happy Happy Happy Happy Death' running though my head all day

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46137
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by rahvin112 · 2016-05-23 11:00 · Score: 1

Mimeograph's use ammonia. Very little will get you as wasted as a nice bit of ammonia being aired out as it dries.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by KiloByte · 2016-05-23 11:53 · Score: 1

I guess this will come handy then. (Spot a cat in the picture.)

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The creatures outside looked from Alt-Right to Antifa; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by duke_cheetah2003 · 2016-05-23 12:05 · Score: 1

Watch.
What the fuck did I just watch??
I think it's the 2016 version of getting Rick Rolled.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Ol+Olsoc · 2016-05-23 12:10 · Score: 1

Watch. And then decide if you really want one.
You Bastard! Unicorns from Hell will be the next Rickroll!
It was bizarre, like a slow motion train wreck first on Ecstasy, then on Meth.

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The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Ol+Olsoc · 2016-05-23 12:13 · Score: 1

Mimeograph's use ammonia. Very little will get you as wasted as a nice bit of ammonia being aired out as it dries.
They must use something else though. I remember in early grade school, when the mimeographs were handed out, every single kid would stick 'em in front of their nose and smell 'em. And it definitely wasnt ammonia. Probably Benzene or something awful.

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The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by justthinkit · 2016-05-23 12:56 · Score: 1

The ink originally had a lanolin base, and later became an oil in water emulsion. This emulsion commonly used Turkey-Red Oil (Sulfated Castor Oil) which gives it a distinctive and heavy scent.

- Wiki's 'mimeograph process' entry

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Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by rdelsambuco · 2016-05-23 13:18 · Score: 1

I think that's planned for 18.04 or maybe 20.04. I also think I saw that in 28.04 there will be snappy packages available for most Windows productivity software.

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Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Trongy · 2016-05-23 14:39 · Score: 2

Spirit duplicators used alcohol based solvents and smelled good, much better than mimeograph prints. Spirit duplicators typically used purple ink.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Ol+Olsoc · 2016-05-23 15:18 · Score: 1

Spirit duplicators used alcohol based solvents and smelled good, much better than mimeograph prints. Spirit duplicators typically used purple ink.
You are correct.. The mimeograph was one of those names that became so common that they lost the trademark. But spirit duplicators are not mimeographs. Thanks for the correction!

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The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by arglebargle_xiv · 2016-05-23 19:55 · Score: 1

Spirit duplicators used alcohol based solvents and smelled good, much better than mimeograph prints.
Ahh, memories of meths and aniline purple, mmmm...
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Opportunist · 2016-05-23 21:33 · Score: 1

Hush! Or you get a video of an ice cream shitting unicorn ... why do I say "or", it's on topic. Yay!
You asked for it!

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We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Gr8Apes · 2016-05-24 02:13 · Score: 1

If that had started with the chorus, maybe. You need to start about 1.5 minutes in or so, get closer to the chorus so people know they've been Rickrolled... err, unicorned....

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The cesspool just got a check and balance.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by WallyL · 2016-05-24 04:29 · Score: 1

How the **** can you write a comment that is both on topic and trolling at the same time?!
...
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Unicorns, that's how!
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by thegarbz · 2016-05-24 07:11 · Score: 1

Watch. And then decide if you really want one.
/internet
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by chr1st1anSoldier · 2016-05-24 16:46 · Score: 1

... like both Bing Maps vs HERE Maps from Nokia...
BRING BACK HERE MAPS!!! That was one of the best maps before MS bought Nokia and when they made it part of WP it was still really good. Now they are phasing HERE maps/drive out with the Microsoft Maps or Bing maps or whatever it is. Really, really bad. I tried using the MS Maps the other day and it was like when Apple dropped Google maps with their own in house maps, that crap took me everywhere but where I actually wanted to go. I actually had to find where I was going by using the good ol fashioned method it was so bad. 0/10 will print directions from Google Maps on the PC before using MS maps again.

As far as the apps story goes, in the US, it's true that it's clearly wanting. There is no Lyft, no Vonage, no 8x8, no Uber Partner, no RetailMeNot and a lot of apps are missing. But in other countries, where people are not hugely into apps, it's not a major deal. Here in India, I have on this phone all the major shopping sites (FlipCart, Snapdeal, Amazon), my local bank is fully supported, transactional apps like FreeCharge & Oxigen, Olacabs and enough more to make it worth the while.
Good for you because the only service we use at my work that I can use on my WP is Office365. I have inquired from all other services about when I can expect a WP app and I am told, "Never." Same with my bank and for virtually any other nonwork service I pay for and use except Netflix and Paypal. I don't watch netflix on the phone and there is only one store I occasionally visit that will let me pay with paypal from my phone. So my WP is pretty much worthless except for checking emails, which there is an awesome bug where I click on the email in the notification center it takes me to a random email in a random synced account. Good times when checking emails in the office with coworkers looking at your screen, I call it email russian roulette.
Re:You mean Windows phones are rare as unicorns? by Ulric · 2016-05-24 21:49 · Score: 1

Soon they will even be as rare as Blackberries.

no surprises here by goose-incarnated · 2016-05-23 07:17 · Score: 3, Interesting

Nokia would have done better without them.

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Re: no surprises here by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:38 · Score: 2, Insightful

EVERYONE, including Nokia, knew this.
Re:no surprises here by Dantoo · 2016-05-23 11:45 · Score: 1

They make a phone that runs an interface that looks like shit and it doesn't sell? How can it be so?
I wonder how much they spent on spin doctors trying to convince everybody that "Live Tiles" were so much better than widgets?
An interface that looks like its made for Sesame Street watchers.
Win8 was hated (and deservedly so). Make something that looks like Win8 and don't understand that it will also be hated? Just dumb.
Can't wait for Nokia to actually resurrect their phone business sans Windows. I will ditch this Samsung into the nearest toilet.
Re:no surprises here by TheRaven64 · 2016-05-23 23:40 · Score: 1

They make a phone that runs an interface that looks like shit
Odd observation. My partner has a Windows phone and the UI is the only thing about it that I actually like. It's clean and easy to use (I use Android on my phone and iOS on my tablet, so I have a solid basis for comparison here) and so far the only mobile UI that hasn't managed to piss me off. On the other hand, the fact that she needs to test her alarm before going to sleep because sometimes the phone needs a reboot to allow alarms to make a noise and that there's practically nothing in the App Store that you'd want are real problems for adoption.

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I am TheRaven on Soylent News

2+ million does not seem like dead... by SuperKendall · 2016-05-23 07:18 · Score: 4, Informative

I don't have a Windows phone, and don't know anyone that has one...

But even though percentage wise the share is small, 2+ million phones in a quarter sure seems a fairly long way from dead, especially given Microsoft's motivation to maintain at least a foothold in mobile.

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley

Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by fortfive · 2016-05-23 07:29 · Score: 1

Highly niche, maybe, but not dead.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by jitterman · 2016-05-23 07:45 · Score: 5, Interesting

I had a Nokia 920, then a 1520, both running Win Phone 8. For the state of things at the time, they were promising and, honestly, great. More stable than Android at the time (that's anecdotal, but my wife had an Android phone and it seemed to have more issues than my phone did), and was far more customizable than an unrooted iPhone (LiveTiles really is a great idea, IMO). Sadly, the combined hardware-software improvement that came in the move from Phone 7 to Phone 8 was a one-time event, apparently.

As I waited in anticipation for what I hoped would be some ground-breaking software innovations in 10 and fun/useful hardware features to give them life, I was at first in denial, then dismayed, next angry, and finally in acceptance (the ecosystem is diseased, after all) that MS entirely dropped the ball and screwed it all up. I'm no fanboy, but I really did hope for a strong third alternative. Once it was clear that my 1520 wasn't going to physically survive the last time I dropped it, I moved to a Nexus 6P, and I've been very pleased with the experience six months in.

So long, MS - it's your fault that you lost someone who was willing to be a loyal customer if you had shown some competence in the mobile area. I work in IT for a hospital, and can report there were four other people in the department who owned one a year ago, and don't today, so I'm willing to lay odds that you've lost not one, but five. I suspect that 2 million and change will continue to slip downward.

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For conscience is the wound, and there's naught to staunch it
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by NotDrWho · 2016-05-23 07:53 · Score: 3, Interesting

The few people I have known who have actually used a Windows phone actually really liked them. I seriously considered one on my last upgrade. The only thing that kept me with Android was the uncertain future of Windows phone support and MS's tendency in the past to abandon its products. I buy a phone for the longer-term (I usually only upgrade every 5+ years or so). So I didn't want to buy a phone and have MS bail on me a year or two in.

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SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:55 · Score: 1

Windows fanboy logic:
- Linux has 1% marketshare: OMG ITS DEAD LOL
- Windows Phone has 1% marketshare: WOO 2 MILLION PHONES!!!!11
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:01 · Score: 1

They make a lot more from the sale of Android phones than windows phones. They should just give up and start making apps for Androids. They're a fucking software company after all. A shitty one but a software company. Maybe they should stick with what they know.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by SuperKendall · 2016-05-23 08:02 · Score: 3, Informative

I don't even know if niche is quite the right word - if you figure people replacing a phone every two years, selling two million a quarter means a base of something like a 16 million user base! That's a lot of people with a wide range of uses (you would think).
Would we call any website with 16 million users a niche? Or even any other kind of computer hardware?
Just because there are a LOT more people using other devices does not have to mean that sixteen million people stop mattering in what they do.
Now that number may go down over time, but I would have thought the number was a tenth that already - at this point it sure seems like anyone inclined to move away from Windows Mobile would have already.

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:06 · Score: 1, Offtopic

My wife and I both had Samsung Note 3 phones. Hers was constantly fucked up. I was forever having to straighten it out. Eventually she bitched so much I swapped phones with her. Now her phone is fucked up all the time. Want to guess why? It's simple really, some people are not technologically adept. My wife is smart as shit at some things but give her a piece of electronics and it'll fuck up. This includes direcTV remotes and the CD player in the car and....everything.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by The-Ixian · 2016-05-23 08:07 · Score: 3, Insightful

I currently have a Nokia 920 running Windows Phone 10 insider.
It has been working like a champ for a long time. I think the Windows mobile UI is very elegant and not prone to clutter.
I have thought about going to Google or Apple but neither choice appeals to me very much. As long as the phone continues to work I will keep it. However, my next phone... I don't know... perhaps Ubuntu...

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:09 · Score: 1

I looked at some windows phones out of curiosity and I have to admit they seemed okay. I didn't care much for the layout but I'm sure some of that is the fact I've been using Android. That said though, I hate microsoft so I'd never buy one even if it was like "the shit." I like iPhones better than Android and wanted to buy one but no SD card and no battery access is a deal killer so I've always used Android in spite of having Mac computers.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 08:14 · Score: 1

"MS's tendency in the past to abandon its products"
Wait, so you're worried about MS abandoning a product (a company for all it's faults has one of the best long term support systems of any main stream tech company) so rather than going with them you went with Google (a company who's blood bath of abandoned projects is immense)? I question your reasoning. Now if it were less concern that Google would cancel one of it's flagships then MS canceling one of it's niche product, that would make sense. But as an owner of the Zune HD, a very good device btw, that MS still has built in software support for and only about a year ago started to shut down support for its networks despite it being canceled years ago, I assert MS is quite good at supporting things.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by DaHat · 2016-05-23 08:19 · Score: 1

especially given Microsoft's motivation to maintain at least a foothold in mobile.
What motivation?
For the last year or so it's been pretty clear that all they've been trying to do is keep the lights on in the phone side of things while biding their time.
The fact is that Windows 10 Mobile is a disaster. The devices which shipped with 8/8.1 and have been upgraded via the insider program are buggy as hell, and the few devices shipped with it built in have been even worse.
There seems to be a hope that a future 'Surface Phone' will save them, and if they completely shut down phone manufacturing/development, it would be a lot harder to re-spin up should they decide they've got something meaningful to sell.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by StormReaver · 2016-05-23 08:32 · Score: 5, Funny

Maybe this will be the year of Windows on mobile.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by DogDude · 2016-05-23 08:38 · Score: 3, Insightful

You bought a GOOGLE product because of MICROSOFT's history of abandoning projects?? Are you from an alternate, bizarro universe, by any chance? In this plane of existence, MS is known for supporting it's products for very long times, and Google is known for dumping projects with alarming frequency and rapidity.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Tom · 2016-05-23 08:39 · Score: 1

especially given Microsoft's motivation to maintain at least a foothold in mobile.
Which they've been doing for the past what, 20 years? Look what came from it!

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by LWATCDR · 2016-05-23 08:40 · Score: 4, Interesting

I had a windows phone for a while and it really was not bad.
I had a super cheap Lumia and it was still a good device. The OS was also really good.and was very responsive.
The problem that WindowsPhone had for me is the same problem that Linux on the desktop and OS/X has.
I could not get the applications I wanted to use on the platform.
People are not going to write apps until you have enough users. You will not have a lot of users until you have the apps.
The lack of Google apps for Windows phone was a real issue for me.
If you look at how it breaks down it is really interesting IMHO.
1. IOS has all the Apple, Google, and Microsoft apps.
2. Android has all the Google and Microsoft apps.
3. WindowsPhone has the Microsoft apps.
Frankly I think it is a real shame because Windows Phone is a good OS and the Lumia phones are good hardware. If Microsoft can help Intel get x86 mobile SOCs on the market or get developers to compile Windows Desktop Apps for ARM, or Microsoft can create a really good X86 to ARM JIT then the unified OS project might really pay off.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by DogDude · 2016-05-23 08:40 · Score: 2

You're upset over a Windows Phone version that hasn't been released yet...? I'm confused. Windows Phone 10 hasn't been pushed out to any Windows Phones at all, from what I understand. It's just comes with one model of a new Nokia phone.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by DarkOx · 2016-05-23 08:41 · Score: 4, Insightful

Right but where ecosystems are concerned its really all about the size of the pie slice.
If the ecosystem is highly fractured and you are a developer you will want to write the most cross platform-least-common-denominator thing you can so that you have a broad enough customer base to make it worth the time.
When the ecosystem gets a down to a few players you start doing a version for each. When one of the "big three" is only a percentage or so, well you have enough revenue for the next big two that your probably just ignore that part of the market. Its a death spiral situation, from there on out. Application developers stop supplying for the also ran people quite buying them, the market segment gets smaller still, more devs end support/supply....

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 09:09 · Score: 1

I have one. Got a prepaid nokia-something-or-other windows phone.
Why? It takes and SD card and I needed an mp3 player.
That plus a cheap bluetooth speaker and I had a portable music setup with 64 gigs of storage for less than 40 bucks. Not bad.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by MightyMartian · 2016-05-23 09:18 · Score: 2

It seems like a lot, but is it really? Considering the costs of developing these devices, and the amount of work Microsoft has put into developing yet another iteration of its seemingly endless family of mobile operating systems, it strikes me that shipping just a fraction of the number of phones your competitors can manage, to the point that it's likely Microsoft's "Android tax" probably generates more revenue, is not sustainable.
Blackberry is literally going down the tubes, and for of that time in its collapse in market share, it was selling somewhere in the same range Microsoft is (BB has now dropped down to something like 600,000 units per quarter, which is basically extinction level sales).
Since the trend for Windows phones is downward, even if they're making money right now, even the medium term outlook looks poor. Considering the amount of marketing that was done, if they couldn't even make a dent in the Android-iOS hegemony, then it raises the question as to why continue supporting the mobile platform at all. Surely at 2 million units per quarter the penetration is too low to make Microsoft's own software ecosystem viable, and really, that's the whole point of any mobile device nowadays.
Even MS seems to realize this, and is targeting more of its development at the major mobile platforms. I suspect within a year or two it will arrive at the same place Blackberry is, conceding that its hardware platform is finished, and likely move to push more of its software on to the dominant mobile platforms.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by MightyMartian · 2016-05-23 09:22 · Score: 1

Exactly. It's what killed Blackberry, and it will take down MS. I know Redmond is trying to push its cross-platform solutions, but I doubt anyone is going to care. Android and iOS so thoroughly dominate the market that the most MS might see from it is extra development tool sales. Why bother even compiling your app for Windows when the likelihood of a sale is so low that it probably won't justify the testing that needs to be done when porting.
I saw a similar phenomenon in the mid-90s as IBM desperately tried to keep OS/2 afloat as Windows 95 and the 32 bit Windows API gained ground. They developed a series of tools to ease porting of 32 bit Windows apps to OS/2, and despite the fact that there were still considerable similarities between the two APIs, few ever actually took advantage, and OS/2 ended its days on some embedded hardware.

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The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by MightyMartian · 2016-05-23 09:23 · Score: 1

The big question at this point, given that Microsoft has yet to make a mobile platform that sufficient numbers of people are interested in to justify its existence, is will anyone give a crap when Windows 10 mobile is released?

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The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by MightyMartian · 2016-05-23 09:24 · Score: 1

Are you even vaguely aware of the history of Microsoft's mobile platforms. It's been one abandoned platform after another.

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The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Grishnakh · 2016-05-23 09:27 · Score: 2

It depends on how much your company is spending going after that market, on development costs, on ongoing costs to maintain your products in that market and service those customers, etc.
If you have a niche product with 16M users, and you're some smallish company and this userbase is giving you a handsome profit, then great.
When you're a behemoth company like MS trying to compete in a huge market against entrenched players, and you're spending billions of dollars trying to stay in this market, then no, 16M users is not enough unless you've figured out a way of getting every user to somehow generate ~$1000 per year in profit for you. There's no way that MS is getting that kind of profit from WinPhone users.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Grishnakh · 2016-05-23 09:32 · Score: 1

Don't forget "PlaysForSure" which they abandoned when they came out with Zune.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by SuperKendall · 2016-05-23 09:58 · Score: 1

16M is absolutely enough for MS if they figure they will eventually expand, which they seem to still believe wholeheartedly. 16M is enough to provide for some decent funds to pay for further R&D to at least keep apace, though not enough to jump ahead of anyone...
MS is in it for the long haul. If it were a Kin kind of thing they would have been gone long ago.

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · 2016-05-23 10:12 · Score: 1

The difference is, because of Android and iOS, there is already a need to maintain cross-platform tools. And MS bought popular ones as opposed to developing a competitor inhouse.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by whoever57 · 2016-05-23 10:31 · Score: 1

It has been working like a champ for a long time.
Apart from all those apps that have been removed from the Windows app store. You probably don't use your phone for such things as on-line banking, do you? OK, you might, but not many banks actually support Windows phone today.
There are lots of reviews that show that apps for Windows phone either don't exist or don't work as well as their Android and IOS equivalents, so let me suggest that you haven't seriously researched the competition.

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Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by lgw · 2016-05-23 10:52 · Score: 1

They have - they bought Xamarin. You can build Android apps from Visual Studio now. Office is there now too (and free, I think). They are at least trying.

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Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by oakgrove · 2016-05-23 10:59 · Score: 1

But even though percentage wise the share is small, 2+ million phones in a quarter sure seems a fairly long way from dead
There are many reasons why you are wrong but I'll just pick on one. Where is the trend line going?

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The soylentnews experiment has been a dismal failure.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by cheesybagel · 2016-05-23 11:16 · Score: 1

Not anymore. This used to be true at one point. Even Joel has figured that out a couple of years back.
Want to run old MS-DOS games? You are better off using DOSBox than Windows. Heck even old Windows games often require loading Windows XP in a virtual machine so they can be playable. Same thing for several applications. Microsoft hasn't cared much for backwards compatibility ever since Vista came out.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by rahvin112 · 2016-05-23 11:31 · Score: 1

It wasn't that hard to predict. Microsoft is NOT agile. The phone market is, Android and iOS both have substantial changes every single year. Just look at the changes from early android version up to marshmellow and the number of years for those changes. I seriously doubt Microsoft could have done that even if they had prioritized phones (which they didn't).
Phones have always been an afterthought for Microsoft. They controlled the early smartphone market pre-android/iphone because there weren't any other real competitors. Once they experienced real competition they prioritized it for one generation then abandoned it, just like they'd done previously, that and the normal strategy of exploiting their existing monopoly. In the meantime Google and Apple didn't sit on their hand and as a result Microsoft's market-share isn't even a rounding error. They'll continue to try to rope up their desktop monopoly into the phone market to try to dominate but there's been a paradigm shift they still haven't acknowledged. That is people in their 20's and younger aren't locked to Microsoft like previous generations. They've grown up using iOS and Android and other systems and they are not afraid to use non-microsoft.
The new CEO seems to recognize that they've lost smartphones and are losing the desktop by positioning MS on the cloud and services front rather than focusing everything on the desktop. Honestly MS would do well to just abandon the smartphone and focus on offering services and software on the existing platforms. Android is going to dominate for a long time because underneath it's all FOSS licensed and the hardware manufacturers can focus on what they are good at and not worry about the OS.
At some point I suspect Google will combine Android and ChromeOS and basically takeover a significant chunk of the non-specialized computing market. You already see it in the schools and "light" computing venues where computers are primarily used to write memos and letters. It won't take much to flip most of the office work onto the equivalent of a chromebook. Probably all it will take is one big virus/ransomware outbreak and a bunch of the fortune 500 will shift all their "office" computers to web based zero administration platforms (chromebook). If MS was smart they'd be targeting this market heavily so they are on the front edge when it happens and can still sell Office365 subscriptions. Time will tell if Nadella is smart enough to pull this off.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by bobf0648 · 2016-05-23 13:01 · Score: 2

I have several Window phones, as well as Apple and Android, and I like the Window phones the best. BUT ..... if you need a whole bunch of aps....not so good.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by geoskd · 2016-05-23 13:11 · Score: 1

But even though percentage wise the share is small, 2+ million phones in a quarter sure seems a fairly long way from dead, especially given Microsoft's motivation to maintain at least a foothold in mobile.
It can cost upwards of a couple hundred million to design a cell phone that doesn't suck. Once you add in a reasonable amount of marketing, you double that. Divide that upfront cost among 2 million phones, and Microsoft is stuck with a profit margin that is hundreds of dollars less than their competitors. With the poor a showing, the manufacturer has two options. Take a loss on it and hope the next generation of phone fares better, or call it quits. The only way a 1% market share is viable is if your product is so good you can charge $200 more than the competition to make up for the lack of volume. This is what Apple started out doing. If you recall, everyone said apple was crazy and would never get $500+ for a cell phone when the competing phones cost only $200 for the highest of the high. Apple had the last laugh because their product was a *generation* better than the competing products. Windows phones not only aren't an evolutionary leap, they are a step backwards. Microsoft has *never* produced an innovative product of their own. The most successful they have ever been is to take somebody else's idea and get it to market first. Failing that they have barely succeeded at anything except the XBOX, in which they simply had enough cash to out-survive the competition. Any other company trying to break into the video game market would have given up or gone belly up with the business plan Microsoft used.

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I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by geoskd · 2016-05-23 13:18 · Score: 1

Would we call any website with 16 million users a niche? Or even any other kind of computer hardware?
A website doesn't cost $400M+ to create (even the dot-comers couldn't blow away that much money, and they tried). Most computer hardware doesn't cost that much to create either. The only close comparison would be CPUs and GPUs, and a huge amount of money is saved on that development by reusing huge pieces of the design. In spite of that, any processor that doesn't sell at least 10M units is considered a dismal failure.
A good way to estimate success vs failure is to divide the development cost by the number of units sold and add the per unit cost to manufacture. If this number is greater than 1/3 of the retail price of your product, you're gonna be in deep crap because that other two thirds pays for your overhead, including marketing, HR costs, building and grounds cost, and lastly your profit.

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I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by geoskd · 2016-05-23 13:29 · Score: 1

You bought a GOOGLE product
No, he bought a Samsung, or HTC, or Motorola phone. Google couldn't stop android even if they actively started trying to kill it. Most of Android is open source, and enough of it is open such that a cell phone manufacturer could use it without relying on Google for anything. Most manufacturers use some of Googles overlays onto Android because they provide many higher end features that it is easier for the manufacturers to buy than produce in house.
At the end of the day, if Google abandoned Android today, most of the Cell phone world wouldn't even skip a beat.

--
I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 14:33 · Score: 1

She'd rather watch the Kardashians than read /.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Barlo_Mung_42 · 2016-05-23 16:38 · Score: 1

Right there with you. I like the interface so much more than Android but the battery on my 1020 started not lasting very long. Picked up a 640 for now but it kind of sucks. At least now I understand how Mac people feel.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by sd4f · 2016-05-23 17:08 · Score: 1

I think the simple fact that it has released, and no one really cares, proves your point.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Dog-Cow · 2016-05-23 17:54 · Score: 1

That's not really fair. Outside of the mainframe world, no one expects infinite backwards compatibility. Especially as the hardware architecture changes, you have to expect the oldest support to be dropped. 16-bit, real mode x86 just doesn't play well in 64-bit land.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by AmiMoJo · 2016-05-23 19:56 · Score: 1

There are a few live tile launchers for Android, if that's what you are missing.

--
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by AmiMoJo · 2016-05-23 20:45 · Score: 1

Google dumps web products far too often, but continues to support quite old versions of Android with updates and security fixes via Play.

--
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Big+Hairy+Ian · 2016-05-23 23:50 · Score: 1

Yep they really screwed the pooch on this one given that you could get Decent MS Smart phones over 5 years before apple came up with the smartphone. But then so did Psion!

--
Build a Man a Fire, and He'll Be Warm for a Day. Set a Man on Fire, and He'll Be Warm for the Rest of His Life.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by Tough+Love · 2016-05-24 03:54 · Score: 1

...not dead.
Life support. Next step is, pull out the tubes.

--
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by thegarbz · 2016-05-24 07:16 · Score: 1

and Google is known for dumping projects with alarming frequency and rapidity.
Google is known for dumping alternate mini projects / companies they buy / anything that doesn't fit with their core business model.
Android is as much to Google as gmail and searching. It is their core treasure drove, the goose that shits out golden eggs (in terms of customer data), a cow that won't ever stop giving milk. If I had to ask who would drop what first, Microsoft drop Windows on mobile or Google dropping Android, the smart money, dumb money, and ever nickle that people toss on the sidewalk in New York would most definitely be on Google.
Now, the Nest on the other hand....
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by samwichse · 2016-05-25 00:50 · Score: 1

It PlaysForSure!!!
Re:2+ million does not seem like dead... by toddestan · 2016-05-25 14:41 · Score: 1

Microsoft seems to come up with new languages and frameworks constantly, but they support them a long time. You can still create an application using MFC like it's 1993 for Windows 10 and it'll work just fine.

Get rid of iPhones, too by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:19 · Score: 1

Everything will be better if we get rid of iPhones, too. They're obsolete and are awful technology. We'll be better off if everyone uses Android.

Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by blackomegax · 2016-05-23 07:29 · Score: 1, Insightful

Most android phones are outdated, can't be patched, are security nightmares, and overall suck. Short of buying a nexus (which nobody does)....not so much. Even my old iPhone 5 is still kicking ass and taking names on the buttfuckingly latest firmware.
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · 2016-05-23 07:42 · Score: 2

If all that's left is Android then I'm going back to a dumb flip-phone.
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by drinkypoo · 2016-05-23 07:50 · Score: 1

Most android phones are outdated, can't be patched, are security nightmares, and overall suck.
But this is Slashdot, where we're smart enough not to buy those phones, right? Right? *taptaptap* Is this thing on?

--
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:13 · Score: 4, Insightful

I had a flip phone for a long time. A simple tracphone that was indestructable. I still have it in a drawer but sadly I was seduced by a quadcore arm processor with a 1080p screen and 4g LTE data. I stuck a 64gb card in it and I have endless entertainment everywhere I go. I can sit for hours now in a hospital emergency waiting room and never be bored. Fuck, I hardly ever call anyone, it's a portable computer that makes calls occasionally.
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:14 · Score: 1

I hate microsoft but really, if all you want to do is talk, text, browse a little and do a little email it really don't make a shit what you use.
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by nukenerd · 2016-05-23 09:37 · Score: 1

I can sit for hours now in a hospital emergency waiting room and never be bored.
Hours in emergency waiting rooms?! Who TF are you, Evel Knievel ?
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 11:27 · Score: 1

I've got a wife who's got some serious health issues that sometimes leads to middle of the night visits to the ER.
Re:Get rid of iPhones, too by LesFerg · 2016-05-23 14:26 · Score: 1

I hate microsoft but really, if all you want to do is talk, text, browse a little and do a little email it really don't make a shit what you use.
erm... have you SEEN the horrid crap they provided for a mail app on windows phone?

--
If I had a DeLorean... I would probably only drive it from time to time.

Ass-rape by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:19 · Score: 1, Informative

I'd rather be ass-raped with a dildo covered in fish hooks than use Windows on my phone.

Re:Ass-rape by The+Grim+Reefer · 2016-05-23 07:33 · Score: 5, Funny

I'd rather be ass-raped with a dildo covered in fish hooks than use Windows on my phone.
I admire your resolve. But given a choice between the two, Windows phone sounds pretty good to me.
Re:Ass-rape by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:40 · Score: 1

I'd rather be ass-raped with a dildo covered in fish hooks than use Windows on my phone.
I admire your resolve. But given a choice between the two, Windows phone sounds pretty good to me.
the dildo won't send your credit card info to hackers
Re:Ass-rape by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · 2016-05-23 07:43 · Score: 1

Hell yeah, between those two options, even ass-raped with the Windows phone is the better choice.
Re:Ass-rape by drinkypoo · 2016-05-23 07:52 · Score: 4, Funny

I'd rather be ass-raped with a dildo covered in fish hooks than use Windows on my phone.
I admire your resolve. But given a choice between the two, Windows phone sounds pretty good to me.
the dildo won't send your credit card info to hackers
you can cancel your credit card. if you cancel your asshole you have to shit in a bag

--
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Re:Ass-rape by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:20 · Score: 1

I thought I hated microsoft. Apparently I just hold them in mild dislike.
Re:Ass-rape by The+Grim+Reefer · 2016-05-23 08:34 · Score: 1

the dildo won't send your credit card info to hackers
I can't say I've ever been ass raped by a "dildo covered in fish hooks", but something tells me that in such a situation "at least hackers aren't getting my credit card information" will be very high on the list of things that will be going through my head. Perhaps you're different from me.
Re:Ass-rape by The+Grim+Reefer · 2016-05-23 08:52 · Score: 1

Correction: will not be very high on the list...
Re:Ass-rape by ranton · 2016-05-23 09:09 · Score: 1

I'd rather be ass-raped with a dildo covered in fish hooks than use Windows on my phone.
I admire your resolve. But given a choice between the two, Windows phone sounds pretty good to me.
the dildo won't send your credit card info to hackers
I would give those hackers a signed power of attorney to prevent being ass raped by a dildo covered in fish hooks.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:Ass-rape by WaffleMonster · 2016-05-23 13:23 · Score: 1

I'd rather be ass-raped with a dildo covered in fish hooks than use Windows on my phone.
This happens anyway when you use windows phone. It is one of the most locked down oppressive spyware laden operating systems ever designed.

How is that millions of phones you're selling... by X86BSD · 2016-05-23 07:23 · Score: 1

working out for you ballmer? https://www.youtube.com/watch?... No talent, tasteless, useless corporation.

YO by blackomegax · 2016-05-23 07:26 · Score: 3, Funny

2016 is the year of Windows Mobile! Let's make this thing happen!

Re:YO by Austerity+Empowers · 2016-05-23 07:50 · Score: 4, Funny

No problem, I just threw it across the room. It was very mobile for a few seconds, then it crashed. Windows Mobile died as it lived.

3rd Party Developers by blueshift_1 · 2016-05-23 07:27 · Score: 1

The biggest problem is getting 3rd Party Developers to create excellent content for such a small part of the market. While they would be one of the only content providers on the platform, developing for iOS and Android just exposes to a much larger upside.

Re:3rd Party Developers by T.E.D. · 2016-05-23 07:51 · Score: 4, Insightful

No, that's the biggest symptom. But Android was new once too. It got past that because it was the most open platform available. Open is better for developers because the barriers to entry are lower. Open is better for buyers because all the competition keeps their prices lower.
The biggest problem with Windows Phone is that they are trying to fight an established competitor with no new genre-busting capabilities and a less Open product.
Re:3rd Party Developers by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:53 · Score: 1

MS failed when they tried to force developers to use beta OS on their development machines. Did they really believe, that corporate IT support would allow installing the Win 8 and/or 10 especially at their beta days? Or that developers would want to waste their time dealing with Metro UI and built in spyware? It did not help when they re-invented the API's for each OS release and tried to force people to re-implement the applications and libraries on C# just to develop for a 1% market share. Of course, the customers were also let down when MS obsoleted each phone generation when a newer device entered into market.
Re:3rd Party Developers by CaseCrash · 2016-05-23 13:46 · Score: 1

and a less Open product.
nobody gives a shit if their phone is "open". Can I facebook and play candy crush? yes? I'm good.

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No, that link you posted to a web comic we've all seen a hundred times is not "obligatory."
Re:3rd Party Developers by T.E.D. · 2016-05-24 02:19 · Score: 1

nobody gives a shit if their phone is "open".
Directly, you are quite right. However, they do give a huge steaming smelly shit if its cheap or not. Over the long haul, the open platform is going to be cheaper because it has more competition. They don't prefer the cheap platform because it is open, they prefer the open platform because it is cheaper.

Windows is now cool by tombak · 2016-05-23 07:27 · Score: 1

Back in the day having linux on your desktop made you cool and counterculture, now its having windows on your phone. You sell-out enjoy your functioning android/iphones, I'm ordering me a windows phone to stand up to The Man.
Long live the revolution!
H

Good by Opportunist · 2016-05-23 07:27 · Score: 1

Can we now drop the idea that your DESKTOP OS, you know, the one that you're famous for and that used to be your cash cow, has to run on a fucking phone? And turn it back into a DESKTOP OS?

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We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.

Re: Good by Opportunist · 2016-05-23 07:56 · Score: 1

Mostly because you didn't have to run it on a DESKTOP.

--
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Re: Good by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 08:50 · Score: 1

Windows CE was not Windows...
I understand it was a totally separate code base.
Remember the old UF joke:
The best of Microsoft Windows CE,+Windows Me,+Windows NT, and you get....
Windows CEMeNT.
http://images.uncyclomedia.co/uncyclopedia/en/8/8e/Windows-cement98.png

Windows is dying by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:31 · Score: 1

It is now official. Gartner has confirmed: Windows is dying

One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered Windows community when Slashdot confirmed that Windows market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all phones. Coming on the heels of a recent Gartner survey which plainly states that Windows has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. Windows is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent Which Does Your Phone Have? comprehensive survey.

You don't need to be the Amazing Kreskin to predict Windows' future. The hand writing is on the wall: Windowsfaces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for Windows because Windows is dying. Things are looking very bad for Windows. As many of us are already aware, Windows continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of chairs.

Windows Phone is the most endangered of them all, having outsourced 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time Windows Phone developers only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: Windows Phone is dying.

Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.

Gartner states that there were 2.4 million Windows Phones sold in the last quarter. How many users of Windows are there? Let's see. The number of Windows Phone versus Windows Tablet posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 2.4 million/5 = 480,000 Windows Tablet users. Windows RT posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of Windows Tablet posts. Therefore there are about 240,000 users of Windows RT. A recent article put Windows desktop at about 80 percent of the Windows market. Therefore there are (2,400,000+480,000+240,000)*4 = 12.48 million Windows desktop users. This is consistent with the number of Windows desktop Usenet posts.

Due to the troubles of Microsoft, abysmal sales and so on, Steve Ballmer was thrown off the board and was taken over by some Indian guy who sell another troubled cloud. Now the cloud is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.

All major surveys show that Windows has steadily declined in market share. Windows is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If Windows is to survive at all it will be among OS dilettante dabblers. Windows continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, Windows is dead.

Sounds familiar... by slapout · 2016-05-23 07:31 · Score: 1

Didn't someone predict that Windows phone would lead the market in a few years?

--
Coder's Stone: The programming language quick ref for iPad

Re:Sounds familiar... by Threni · 2016-05-23 07:40 · Score: 1

"Itâ(TM)s sort of a funny question. Would I trade 96% of the market for 4% of the market?... Thereâ(TM)s no chance that the iPhone is going to get any significant market share. No chance."
Re:Sounds familiar... by Tablizer · 2016-05-23 12:34 · Score: 1

Didn't someone predict that Windows phone would lead the market in a few years?
I haven't checked, but I betcha MS's good buddy Gartner did.

--
Table-ized A.I.

too bad really by art123 · 2016-05-23 07:34 · Score: 1, Insightful

In my work, I use iOS, Android, and Windows Mobile 10 (and before that Windows Phone 8.x). Windows felt like it made the best use of the hardware. Even a sub-$50 Windows phone ran smoother and had better battery life than a $400 Android. The Visual Studio development environment is light years ahead of Xcode, Eclipse, and Android Studio (imo of course).

But the first-mover advantage of iOS and Android was too much to overcome (yes I am ignoring Windows Mobile 6.x and earlier because that was an totally different era and was not any competition).

I guess Android won the handheld battle just like Windows won the desktop battle.
And iOS plays second fiddle to Android just like Mac OS does to Windows -- in market share at least, not necessarily profits.

Re:too bad really by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 07:43 · Score: 1

Not "necessarily" profits... Yeh, iOS makes 94% of all smartphone profits. Samsung makes 10% (and the 4% spillover is accounted for by the fact that everyone else makes a loss).
Re:too bad really by tgv · 2016-05-23 20:01 · Score: 1

Android Studio ... now there's a joke.

Turned Win7 into Win 8 for 1% by TheMadTopher · 2016-05-23 07:34 · Score: 5, Interesting

You turned your flagship OS into the worst interface so you'd have UI compatibility for that 1% of the phone market. Good job MS.

Hipsters will buy them.. by toonces33 · 2016-05-23 07:35 · Score: 1

Now all of the hipsters will want one. Or are they using Moto StarTAC? I have a hard time keeping up with what they want..

Re:Hipsters will buy them.. by Virtucon · 2016-05-23 07:53 · Score: 1

Oh StarTAC? Is it on that nifty PrimeCo network I've been hearing so much about too?

--
Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"

Re:How is that millions of phones you're selling.. by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · 2016-05-23 07:45 · Score: 1

I guess Steve Jobs was wrong about Microsoft "being McDonald's" after all.

People still go to McDonald's.

Re:Gartner is confused by jfdavis668 · 2016-05-23 07:45 · Score: 2

Very few people refer to it as Windows 10 Mobile. Even users of Windows 10 Mobile call it Windows Phone.

Harder still for people who can't even login by SuperKendall · 2016-05-23 07:46 · Score: 1

It's you that apparently have trouble with math; do you know what two times four is? Obviously not; the answer is eight, and in absolute terms if you are selling eight million of something per year you can probably keep doing that indefinitely if you wish.

--
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley

Re:Harder still for people who can't even login by amiga3D · 2016-05-23 08:02 · Score: 1

Not if you're not making money on them. Of course microsoft can afford to lose money just about forever so I guess in a way you are right.

Comment removed by account_deleted · 2016-05-23 07:47 · Score: 1

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:Put a fork in it by Dracos · 2016-05-23 07:49 · Score: 1

Windows phones long predated Win10's anti-features, and were never that popular.

MS has never figured out how to connect with consumers (except for the XBox business unit). They seem to think consumers buy like businesses do, using the same cold, cost-driven rationale, which just isn't true. Consumers make purchase decisions based partly on emotion and excitement, something that all MS product lines (again, excepting XBox) completely lack.

Part of this is that Microsoft's bread and butter is still business sales, and part of it is that they suck at marketing and actually competing, having enjoyed tremendous shares of every market they touch. Another factor is their continued colossal hubris which among other things makes them think consumers buy like businesses do.

What's the cause? by Dan+East · 2016-05-23 07:52 · Score: 1

According to the stats (direct link: http://www.gartner.com/newsroo...), Windows share fell by 1.8% across a single quarter. However, iOS's share fell by an even greater amount: 3.1%. Android's share increased by 5.3%. This could be because of a new market coming online, or China or India's growth in smartphone purchases (which would consist mostly of low-end Android phones).

The important statistic is the percentage in North America, which is responsible for the vast, vast percentage of app purchases. iOS share continues to grow in the USA, with Android and Windows staying fairly flat. iOS seemed to gobble up nearly every bit of Blackberry market as that platform diminished, which is how it grew while the others stayed flat. (source: http://www.statista.com/statis...)

--
Better known as 318230.

Blah Blah Windows Phone Blah Blah by Virtucon · 2016-05-23 07:52 · Score: 1

Blah Windows Phone Blah Dead Product Walking. Get an Android yeah it's Google but it's the biggest on the planet in terms of smartphone OS. Why? eventually the EU and the US will say "monopoly" and they'll make Android break away from Google. Win! Win!

--
Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"

Microsoft, do this: by emil · 2016-05-23 07:53 · Score: 5, Interesting

We know that the NT kernel developed by Dave Cutler has a POSIX emulation layer. This kernel runs the Windows app store, and it's perfectly capable of running Dalivk/ART in a variety of configurations - it does so already with Bluestacks and Google's emulators.

Take the NT kernel, and use it to replace Linux, leaving the Android userland as intact as possible.

To this "windroid," add the required javascript execution layers to allow the Windows app store to run on the same platform.

(Re)implement all of the extensions for Dalvik that are provided by Google services.

Reissue Windows phone as a unified Dalvik/Javascript mobile app platform, allowing Play apps to seamlessly move to the Windows store. Maintain enough control over the platform to provide security patches, and "windroid" could fix many update problems that Google seems incapable of addressing.

The NT kernel exists because it was able to mimic ms-dos. It could do so again with Linux.

Re:Microsoft, do this: by JustNiz · 2016-05-23 08:32 · Score: 1

Why would anyone want to replace a perfectly good free/opensource kernel with a Microsoft one? All you're doing is adding lock-in to Microsoft, along with the prerequisite closedness, weak security, built-in data mining and unecessary extra complication.
To me that is going in exactly the wrong direction, and furthermore I would never buy a monstrosity like that.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by emil · 2016-05-23 08:49 · Score: 2

The NT Kernel has far fewer security advisories than does Linux. It was more carefully planned, it is far more successful on the desktop, and the complete code has already leaked for those who really cannot resist seeing the source.
Microsoft's normal pattern is embrace-extend-extinguish. Android's BSD userland is uniquely vulnerable to this, and any action that Microsoft takes will likely improve general OS security, even if the data mining ramps up.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by JustNiz · 2016-05-23 09:09 · Score: 2

>> The NT Kernel has far fewer security advisories than does Linux.
Sure because Microsoft doesn't make them public very often, whereas all of Linux's dirty laundry is open for all to see.
>> It was more carefully planned,
Thats just ridiculous. Consider how much effort, (even just in broad brush terms of numbers of engineers, different companies and universities are working on it) hav gone into developing Unix, and are continuously happening on the Linux kernel, compared to NT kernel.
>> it is far more successful on the desktop. ... and hardly even on the radar for servers... I would also argue its only popular on the desktop as a result of monopolistic practices and marketing rather than actual merit.
>> the complete code has already leaked
illegally leaked at one point in time is not even close to the same as "current information" and "freely available"
>> any action that Microsoft takes will likely improve general OS security, even if the data mining ramps up.
History does not back up either of your points.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by JustAnotherOldGuy · 2016-05-23 09:34 · Score: 1

Why would anyone want to replace a perfectly good free/opensource kernel with a Microsoft one?

My guess is because of a head injury.

--
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
Re:Microsoft, do this: by emil · 2016-05-23 11:06 · Score: 1

>> It was more carefully planned
Thats just ridiculous. Consider how much effort, (even just in broad brush terms of numbers of engineers, different companies and universities are working on it) hav gone into developing Unix, and are continuously happening on the Linux kernel, compared to NT kernel.
Dave Cutler had previously headed the coding teams for RSX-11 (PDP), and VMS (VAX), before departing DEC with his last team and the PRISM source to build what became NT. Cutler had FAR more experience than any of the architects of free (non-AT&T) UNIX. He easily rivals Ritchie and Thompson in his stature as a father of operating systems.
For a better understanding of DEC, the genesis of NT, and the roles these various people played, I recommend that you read ShowStopper. The planning behind the NT kernel certainly dwarfed the care behind the accretion of Linux.
And yes, the NT kernel appears safer and more secure than Linux, especially as Linus does not focus on security. (I do realize that 119/38 is not 24/26 - but the second figure likely involves userspace, which is not apples-to-apples.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by Britz · 2016-05-23 11:19 · Score: 1

Making Android apps run on Windows Mobile was tossed around surely a couple times in Redmond and would have technically been feasible.
One reason they didn't do it (as I was told), was that they wanted to help the app developers that committed to their ecosystem. Allowing Android apps on Windows would have immediately crushed any native apps that Windows Mobile had and dry up the market for them instantly. They would have thrown their developers under the bus.
And for what? What can Microsoft gain by allowing the Google Play store on their phone, essentially earning money on Microsoft devices? Why should customers choose Windows to run Android apps instead of directly using Android for Android apps?
Re:Microsoft, do this: by epine · 2016-05-23 11:35 · Score: 1

The planning behind the NT kernel certainly dwarfed the care behind the accretion of Linux.
So too did the planning behind Nupedia dwarf the planning behind Wikipedia. One perseverated while the other iterated. Here's an entire EconTalk devoted to the common mental mistakes people make when talking about the best ways to plan and make decisions.
Phil Rosenzweig on Leadership, Decisions, and Behavioral Economics
I liked the following passage, in which I learned that even the best surgeons iterate.

Atul Gawande talks a lot about how a surgeon needs a coach because surgery, as important as it is, it's a discrete event that takes a certain amount of time but at the end of which you usually have a fairly clear feedback of how well you did. You can then take that feedback onboard and try again.
Linus is forthright that his strategy has always been to prefer taking feedback on board over out-front planning. In feedback-rich environments, this can often be an optimal strategy.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by ChunderDownunder · 2016-05-23 11:39 · Score: 1

They were building 'bridges' for both iOS and Android.
The Android one has been abandoned but evolved into the bash/ubuntu subsystem.
But the iOS bridge might still be in development.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by JanneM · 2016-05-23 11:40 · Score: 1

And the end result is another Android phone, except with small compatibility issues and without the actual app store. You'd be left with the worst of two words: Users would rather get a proper Android device with all the apps; and developers would rather develop for the billions of people using the Android ecosystem and would not bother rewriting and submitting their stuff to MS own app store variant.

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Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by drinkypoo · 2016-05-23 14:37 · Score: 1

And yes, the NT kernel appears safer and more secure than Linux,

and then you fail by going on to count publicly announced vulns again.

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"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Re:Microsoft, do this: by Maow · 2016-05-23 17:11 · Score: 1

We know that the NT kernel developed by Dave Cutler has a POSIX emulation layer.
Take the NT kernel, and use it to replace Linux, leaving the Android userland as intact as possible.
(Re)implement all of the extensions for Dalvik that are provided by Google services.
An interesting post, but as we've found with Oracle vs Google, APIs are copyrighted and (re-)implementing Android could cause a lot of legal pain.
I don't like it, but that's the world we live in right now. And Microsoft made submissions in favour of Oracle in the case referenced above, so any pain they get would be well deserved.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by sd4f · 2016-05-24 01:54 · Score: 1

I can't really understand your comment because, while MS didn't exactly throw the developers under a bus, the change from WP7 to WP8 meant that WP7 apps were abandoned, due to changes to WP8 making them different. Now with the UWP, they've basically done it again. The WP8/8.1 apps are being abandoned now because abysmal market share of W10M means there's no point developing a new app, and for the old app, there's no point supporting it when it's on a dead platform.
Re:Microsoft, do this: by thegarbz · 2016-05-24 07:32 · Score: 1

The NT Kernel has far fewer security advisories than does Linux
The thing about advisories is that someone needs to publish them.

It was more carefully planned
If a complete re-write several times over is "carefully planned" then ... yeah sure let's go with that.

it is far more successful on the desktop
Which has absolutely zero to do with the kernel itself.

Billion is bigger than million by raymorris · 2016-05-23 08:09 · Score: 3, Insightful

> if you are selling eight million of something per year you can probably keep doing that indefinitely if you wish.

Not when you're spending BILLIONS and selling MILLIONS. Just Nokia alone cost Microsoft $7.9 billion. They officially asmitted that 95% of that was wasted money when they took a $7.6 billion charge against their assets. The total cost of their mobile efforts is of course a lot higher. When you spend $30 million to make a few million back, you're in trouble.

$30 Billion, damn it by raymorris · 2016-05-23 08:11 · Score: 1

When you spend $30 BILLION make a few million back, you're in trouble.

I didn't know it was above 1 percent... by QuietLagoon · 2016-05-23 08:46 · Score: 1

I guess it was more successful than I had thought.

Betamax by DogDude · 2016-05-23 08:49 · Score: 1

It's another Betamax: The best product is lagging due to inertia, alone. I think that this is still happening because phones are still status symbols for so many people, and Windows Phone's "brand" isn't trendy right now.. Once people get used to having smartphones, my guess is that Windows Phone will become more popular. I certainly like mine, and when the Mrs needs a new phone, she's ditching her iPhone for a Windows Phone, too.

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I don't respond to AC's.

Microsoft can thank the Windows 10 marketing by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 08:53 · Score: 1

I was finally ready to embrace Microsoft, until they started with the new tactics to get people to take advantage of the free Windows 10 upgrade. The frequent pop ups on my toolbar convinced me Microsoft would soon expand ads directly on the desktop, so there is no way I will upgrade unless and until I have to. Now, far from moving to Windows 10 and buying a Windows phone, which had been my plan, I will be looking for long-term alternatives to Microsoft for my desktop. Good job, whoever conceived and supported the pop up ads scheme.

Shoot give me a cell phone on Desktop by Billly+Gates · 2016-05-23 09:00 · Score: 1

If only those of us who are afraid of change had to run cell phones on machines that were not cell phones would have me and the rest of slashdot just dying to run to get a Windows Phone! Boy, that is the ticket

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http://saveie6.com/

In the same way Blackberry is not dead. by edxwelch · 2016-05-23 09:05 · Score: 2

Windows phone now has the same market share as Blackberry.

Re:Me too! by hey! · 2016-05-23 09:09 · Score: 2

We're all unique rebels here.

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Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.

How rare again... by SuperKendall · 2016-05-23 09:11 · Score: 1

If there were 2+ million new unicorns trotting around the U.S. every quarter, we'd be issuing hunting licenses for them.

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley

Re:How rare again... by Gr8Apes · 2016-05-24 02:15 · Score: 1

Since they fart rainbows and poop gold, more likely you'd have the cleanest country ever.

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The cesspool just got a check and balance.
Re:How rare again... by silentcoder · 2016-05-24 03:00 · Score: 1

Like there's 2-million female virgins in America...

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Unicode killed the ASCII-art *

you can't put 10 pounds in a 5 pound bag by swschrad · 2016-05-23 09:12 · Score: 1

and Windows is too fat, too full of legacy code, and too slow to put in a pocket.

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if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?

Re:you can't put 10 pounds in a 5 pound bag by tgv · 2016-05-23 20:00 · Score: 1

Now that ain't true. I went from a Moto G to a Lumia 640, and I'm quite happy with it. I'm not a heavy user, and it fits my needs well.

No sense of urgency started with Ballmer by ITRambo · 2016-05-23 09:14 · Score: 1

Years ago, Steve Ballmer said that it was still "early in the mobile space" when it was already getting to be too late. Windows phone 7 withered and became 7.5, than 8, than 8.1,and now 10. Each iteration seemed to have more problems than the previous one, from what I remember reading. The strong push to Windows 10 on the desktop may have been a major influence on people leading them to choose any phone OS but Windows. Too many stupid decisions at Microsoft in the past 4 years to comprehend what they hell they were, and currently are still, thinking.

Re:Me too! by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 09:16 · Score: 2, Funny

I'm not.

Good company by wjcofkc · 2016-05-23 09:17 · Score: 1

It's nice to know that my Blackberry Classic has a friend in the business.

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Brought to you by Carl's Junior.

Well, damn by grimfate · 2016-05-23 09:17 · Score: 1

I don't want to have to change to iOS or Android :( I like my Windows Phone UI

Size of the pie not as important as it would seem by SuperKendall · 2016-05-23 09:22 · Score: 1

The revelation that there may be a stable base of some 16 million Windows Phone users makes it MORE likely I'd develop for Windows Phone, not less.

That; because everyone else has the same pie theory you do, whereas everyone is ignoring the "tiny" slice of Windows pie. But after a few hundred thousand of your developer friends have slashed that "large" slice into ribbons, how much of that can you realistically get? Meanwhile there are many fewer people building apps for Windows Mobile. You could charge 10x the price you would for an Android app and get enough people to pay for it to make things worthwhile...

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley

Re:Me too! by hey! · 2016-05-23 09:23 · Score: 1

Shh!

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Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.

Re:Put a fork in it by MightyMartian · 2016-05-23 09:28 · Score: 1

The general consensus seems to be that Microsoft has not actually broken even on the Xbox division, and is unlikely to anytime soon. There are still people out there who actually wonder why MS even went into the business of game consoles at all, the general theory being that they could use it as another route to prop up that other great long-term failure; the Microsoft online portal. That's probably even eaten more money than Xbox, and they've ended up with Bing.

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The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.

Factor out M$ employees... by globaljustin · 2016-05-23 09:34 · Score: 1

I'm wondering about users who are *not* employed by Microsoft and obliged to use it for some reason.

Factor those out, then factor out any work-only phones running Windows because they were part of an 'enterprise' purchase and cannot change without messing up the whole 'enterprise solution'....

I doubt you'd have even .01%

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Thank you Dave Raggett

Re:Yet another buger joint. by Grishnakh · 2016-05-23 09:39 · Score: 1

Yeah, that is a lousy analogy. You can eat a burger from anywhere, and it doesn't lock you in or out of anything. Buy a Windows Phone locks you out of most of the apps that people want to use, and has the added danger that it won't be supported for long if MS abandons it prematurely. With a smartphone, continued support is important, and for most people apps are too. Buying a smartphone that has no apps is like buying an PC OS that has no apps (remember BeOS?).

Windows Phone is not dead... by bev_tech_rob · 2016-05-23 09:46 · Score: 1

My Windows phone works just fine (HTC One M8). Just wish I could get Win10 for it now. It is a bit frustrating with the lack of apps, but as far as the phone itself I couldn't be happier.

Battery life is awesome. Can go two days without a recharge. Phone is very fast and responsive as well.

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You're messin' with my Zen Thing, man.....

Re:I Like me Phone by bev_tech_rob · 2016-05-23 09:51 · Score: 1

I got mine in the hope of using it for synchronizing a bunch of data between my phone and my Win10 PC. Now that I have the phone, the only thing I sync between the two devices is OneNote (both are logged into the same MS account).

At least that is handy. Type a grocery list into OneNote on the PC, moments later, ta-da! It appears on my phone!

Other than that....no other redeemable quality other than speed and battery life (mentioned below). App availability sux.

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You're messin' with my Zen Thing, man.....

I've just bought one by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 10:22 · Score: 1

I've just bought one. I was already pleased with W10 ecosystem, and I was just plain sick of being advertised at on my Nexus 6. Quick reality check on my behalf was that Google's vast majority of profit comes from advertising. Their recent I/O conference shows how they want to push more adverts into the echosystem. Edge browser on the fast ring builds has inbuilt support for extensions and adblock just worked. It'll be supported on the mobile system, so I'm happy now. I can call/text/use outlook/powerpoint/word and browse the web/listen to music..... for me I don't need any more than this.

Feel the love by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-23 10:55 · Score: 1

But I love my Windows Phone -- Cries....... I have a L920 and a L640 and run Win 10 and the harmony between desktop and phone is awesome !!!

Re:Feel the love by LesFerg · 2016-05-23 14:48 · Score: 1

My L640 is out of power by mid-morning. Have to charge it more than once a day to keep it running.
Tried to turn off whatever is sucking up the power but I can't stop it draining daily.
And I don't even use the thing... I get a business call on it maybe every 3 weeks, read the email maybe once a week.

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If I had a DeLorean... I would probably only drive it from time to time.

Re:Size of the pie not as important as it would se by LesFerg · 2016-05-23 14:11 · Score: 1

The revelation that there may be a stable base of some 16 million Windows Phone users makes it MORE likely I'd develop for Windows Phone, not less.

Yes but how many of them were private sales, to people who may be inclined to purchase some fun apps?

I'm guessing a significant number of them were purchased by businesses as an enterprise solution, which was perceived to mesh in well with their existing Windows solutions. In that situation they have probably locked down the phones so that users may only add apps approved by the organisation, or apps developed in-house for specific custom solutions. In fact my employers handed me a windows 8.1 phone, but it is not even allowed onto the corporate network and thus so far has not been a suitable platform to develop in-house solutions for.

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If I had a DeLorean... I would probably only drive it from time to time.

Re:Put a fork in it by LesFerg · 2016-05-23 14:33 · Score: 1

... and they've ended up with Bing.

Ouch. That was harsh. : )

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If I had a DeLorean... I would probably only drive it from time to time.

Re:Put a fork in it by drinkypoo · 2016-05-23 15:10 · Score: 1

There are still people out there who actually wonder why MS even went into the business of game consoles at all, the general theory being that they could use it as another route to prop up that other great long-term failure; the Microsoft online portal.

Well, speaking of propping up, game sales have long kept Windows' reputation propped up amongst users. Microsoft saw the writing on the wall for the PC and said hey, how can we get a piece of whatever is coming next? We have no idea what it will look like, but we'd sure like some of that money. So they decided to build a set-top box around their core competence. It sure wasn't realtime video, so a PVR was out of the question. A games console was the obvious answer.

The Xbox division is at least running in the black now, even if it hasn't made back its investment. I think building a game console was actually one of Microsoft's more savvy moves, as opposed to going into mobile phones at which they are clearly still failing miserably. They have only lost money making them. They never made that much on licensing Windows Mobile, either. But PC sales have stalled, so clearly Microsoft cannot go on being a PC OS and app company.

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"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"

Re:Size of the pie not as important as it would se by bingoUV · 2016-05-23 16:09 · Score: 1

"Stable" is the assumption here. If applications are 10 times as expensive as compared to other more popular platforms, why wouldn't users move to those platforms at the next chance?

So your plan kills itself pretty soon.

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Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.

Re:Gartner is confused by sd4f · 2016-05-23 17:33 · Score: 1

The name change is one of the dumbest things I've seen. Just seems like they can't make up their minds with anything.

I bought a cheap W10M phone recently, but ... by Ihlosi · 2016-05-23 18:10 · Score: 1

I bought a cheap W10M phone recently, but I don't think I'll use it.

While price and hardware are appealing, the operating system isn't, especially the fact that everything is tied to having a MS account and any synching runs over MS' cloud, even if I just want to get my address book to my local pc (connected to the phone by USB). I don't want my contacts in the cloud. It's no one's business what doctors I am in contact with, etc.

Microsoft by Mike+Frett · 2016-05-23 21:33 · Score: 1

With the demise of the desktop, with it Windows, and now this; Microsoft is pretty much finished. Their money would need to be made via making their Software (Office etc.) available on other OSes. They also have their Xbox but I think with Mobile Gaming, even that is going away.

So what Linux and Mac couldn't do, the Market did.

It's not just spyware-infected. by Ihlosi · 2016-05-23 22:57 · Score: 1

It's kind of odd that the general public don't buy these spyware-infected phones?

Well, you need yet-another-account to do anything, and give MS all your data so you can sync things between your phone and your PC.

My ancient Nokia E6 can transfer contacts over to my PC via USB or bluetooth. My brand new Lumia 550 can't, it needs to go over the cloud. Wth?

Re:Turned Win7 into Win 8 for 1% by Grishnakh · 2016-05-24 03:45 · Score: 1

It *was* a good job. Honestly, I think it's hilarious: people are bitching left and right about how awful the new Windows UI is, but they just won't stop using Windows. The spyware makes it even funnier. I can't wait to see what shenanigans MS comes up with next to screw over their customers, while they continue to whine but refuse to look for alternatives.

Abandoned..... by MercTech · 2016-05-24 06:13 · Score: 1

After they flat out abandoned owners of windows mobile phones a few years ago; why would anyone trust them to maintain their new OS?

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NRRPT/RCT

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Windows Phone Market Share Sinks Below 1 Percent (theverge.com)

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