Samsung Kills Headphone Jack After Mocking Apple (macrumors.com)

Last week, Samsung introduced its latest smartphone, the Galaxy A8s. Not only is it the first phone of theirs with a laser-drilled hole in the display for the front-facing camera sensor, but it is also their first phone to ditch the headphone jack. Slashdot reader TheFakeTimCook shares a report from Mac Rumors that takes a closer look at the move and the hypocrisy behind it: [The A8s] is also Samsung's first smartphone without a headphone jack, much to the amusement of iPhone users, as Samsung has mocked Apple for over two years over its decision to remove the headphone jack from the iPhone 7 in 2016, a trend that has continued through to the iPhone XS, iPhone XS Max, and iPhone XR. While on stage unveiling the new Galaxy Note 7 in 2016, for example, Samsung executive Justin Denison made sure to point out that the device came with a headphone jack. "Want to know what else it comes with?" he asked. "An audio jack. I'm just saying," he answered, smirking as the audience laughed. And earlier this year, Samsung mocked the iPhone X's lack of a headphone jack in one of its "Ingenius" ads promoting the Galaxy S9. Samsung isn't the first tech giant to mock Apple's decision to remove the headphone jack, only to follow suit. Google poked fun at the iPhone 7's lack of headphone jack while unveiling its original Pixel smartphone in 2016, and then the Pixel 2 launched without one just a year later.

Comments

Jack? Jack who?

[Anonymous Coward]

Who is this "Headphone Jack" and why has this multinational corporation murdered him?

And why do they mock an innocent piece of fruit?

And don't tell me to RTFA or even the FS.

Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Anonymous Coward]

Samsung is simply cutting costs on their budget line up by removing the headphone jack. Multiple accounts indicate the jack is still present on their upcoming flagship S10.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Anonymous Coward]

But when Apple does it, then we can say "Killed" right?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[alvinrod]

Could just be them testing the waters. If there isn't a decline in sales, expect this change to come to other models in the future.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Anonymous Coward]

They mocked Apple because they wanted people to buy their product instead of Apple's, and that was something different about them.

They also would like to sell the more expensive accessories, so they subsequently did the same thing Apple did.

And they are no longer mocking Apple, because they now have a similar product, and that is the only reason.

This makes absolute sense if you don't assume that the leaders of large corporations care about things like consistency and good-faith. They care about making money, and doing/saying whatever seems like the best way of doing that at the time. And nothing else.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[SuperKendall]

Except that they didn't kill the headphone jack from Mac computers they, so you cannot yet say Apple "killed" headphone jacks.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Anonymous Coward]

They just dropped all the other useful jacks (Ethernet, HDMI, USB type A) from most of their notebooks...

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[markdavis]

>"Samsung is simply cutting costs on their budget line up by removing the headphone jack."

Seriously? As if a headphone jack costs more than $0.50?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[MSG]

By removing the headphone jack on their lower-end models, they may intend to make the iPhone look cheap.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[J. T. MacLeod]

Designing phones that are thin and waterproof is difficult and expensive when you have ports to the outside.

The headphone jack is a prime candidate to cut. Not that I approve of the measure.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[arglebargle_xiv]

Y'know, if you could mix and match features from about ten different Samsung phones, you'd get one pretty decent phone that didn't suck. Take the J-series for example, a range of phones so badly crippled they can't even update their own firmware because there's no space on the system partition, but it does have a headphone jack. Then there's the A8 without the headphone jack. And there are others, all crippled in various ways so they won't compete with each other. Drop a few thousand on various Samsung phones and pretty soon you've got the feature set for a single actually useful phone.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Cinnamon Beige]

Designing phones that are thin and waterproof is difficult and expensive when you have ports to the outside.

The headphone jack is a prime candidate to cut. Not that I approve of the measure.

I'd argue that the 'thin' part is the real place to object--the goal should be to have it the right size and thickness to be easily and securely held. (If the expectation is that it'll be in a case, keep the case in mind...and possibly even design it so some of the ports could be contained within an inexpensive case that can be sacrificed to protect the phone.)

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[guacamole]

Seriously? As if a headphone jack costs more than $0.50?

You are probably correct, but when they sell cellphones by many many millions of units, these costs savings will add put to a nice seven figure pile of cash which the chief executives will pay to themselves as an end of year "bonus" while the suckers they're calling their customers be asked to swallow this new "feature" as if it was an improvement.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[guacamole]

So we now need to buy a 700 dollar smartphone to have a headphone jack? And the A8 still costs hundreds of dollars. For the last few years, my go-to cheap android phones were Huawei Honor and Moto G series. I never paid more than 200 bucks, and they always came with a headphone jack.

It's preposterous to defend Samsung by saying they did this to save the costs of making this "budget" device.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[guacamole]

Samsung is afraid of building an honest to god good 200-300 dollar smartphone that could compete with say the popular Moto G series because then the bubble of the 800-1000 dollar Galaxies and Notes will pop as people will realize that a cheap phone still can have a big screen, a quality build, and for most purposes it runs the same apps you need to use just fine.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Anonymous Coward]

Mmmmmm, steak.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[SeaFox]

Designing phones that are thin and waterproof is difficult and expensive when you have ports to the outside.

The headphone jack is a prime candidate to cut. Not that I approve of the measure.

Sony seemed to have no issues making phones for years that were IP68 rated but had headphone jacks (and didn't have a special plug or anything else on them to keep the water out).

Are these new phones we're getting now that headphone jacks have been removed a higher water-resistance rating? I haven't heard of any that are.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[hazardPPP]

I'm really at a loss as to why people pay $800-1000 for a smartphone in today's market.

My most expensive smartphone was my first one, an HTC Legend, I think I paid around $600 for that one. I used it for 5 years (it still works, although the power button is screwed up so turning on/off is annoying and you can't run any up-to-date software on it - the phone is now 8.5 years old).

My next phone, a huge upgrade in every way, was an Asus ZenPhone (ZE500) and that cost me around $280. It lasted me a good 3 years, the main reason I decided to replace it was the fact that I dropped it on the street and broke its screen (it's still usable btw). It did have a few other issues (was geting a bit slow, had some strange software bugs, and some mechanical issues with the power button and the SIM card slot), but had I not broken the screen I could've easily used it for another year.

A few months ago I got a Motorola Moto G for about $350. Again, a big upgrade in every way...works absolutely great. All this makes sense to me, as technology improves you should be able to get more bang for less buck. This is generally the case, I mean check out what you can get now in a Xiami phone for $200 (my girlfriend has one). Yet, the prices of the flagship models seem to be increasing (Apple breaks the price ceiling with each new generation top of the line iPhone) while adding rather dubious "features", such as the lack of a headphone jack, incompatibility with existing peripherals, phones so thin that they bend in your pocket and which you then need to embed in a two-times thicker case to ensure they don't break...I don't see why I should ever pay more than $500 for a smartphone again.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Gavagai80]

Bluetooth ear buds aren't exactly expensive. Got mine for $10 a few years ago. I've actually saved money compared to wired, because I always ended up damaging wired headphones by accidentally yanking the cord within the first year.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[hazardPPP]

Indeed. Phones are already too thin, so thin and fragile you have to put them in a case to stop them from breaking (or even just bending in your pocket or bag). Guess what, that makes them thicker...so what's the point again? Oh, marketing, so we can wow people with how thin our phone is compared to the competition. The fact that 90% of the phone's users will admire the thinness only while looking at the store display and for the first few hours/days they take their phone out of the box (before they permanently stick it in a case) seems lost on most people.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[jellomizer]

Why do you think any company or organization can be trusted?
When any any group gets larger their morals gets simpler as it will need to accommodate the diversity of all the people and their needs within it.
A company will want to make money. A religion will want more followers. A Lobby group will just want listeners.
Leaving us individuals having to fend for our self in terms of making sure we keep our moral standards in place.
There is nothing wrong likening a company, following a religion, or being part of a political party. But you will need to remember to keep your standards in place and these larger organizations will have an agenda that may be in conflict with its previous statements. Because their agenda is different then yours.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[ckatko]

>Designing phones that are thin and waterproof is difficult and expensive when you have ports to the outside.

Yeah, that's just some fanboy bullshit.

Waterproofing has been a "done" science since like, the 80's. There are entire laptops that are waterproof and you think a piece of crap little phone with an audio jack is somehow Achilles Heel? What about the goddamn USB port? What about the BUTTONS?

Conjecturing. Bullshit.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[hcs_$reboot]

I'm really at a loss as to why people pay $800-1000 for a smartphone in today's market.

If you want a high-end iPhone, that's the price to pay. Unlike Samsung in the Android world, the iPhone has no competitors. iPhones and Android based phones are still very different, mainly in terms of security, and ergonomics.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[sad_]

indeed, it's perhaps even a good strategy.
have phones with and without headphone jacks, people can decide for themselves if they want it or not.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm really at a loss as to why people pay $800-1000 for a smartphone in today's market.

For the same reason people spend 50K+ on a SUV when a small Hyundai Elantra for 9K would suffce?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[danbert8]

I would agree with you. I bought a OnePlus One years ago when it came out and it's more than sufficient with custom Android updates to do pretty much anything except AR and fingerprint reading. I did however just buy a new Pixel 3XL for $1000 but it was for the promotion with Google Fi where I should be getting that $1000 back in travel gift cards... I couldn't justify spending over $500 on a new OnePlus 6 (or T) considering the capability differences. I only pulled the trigger on the Pixel because of the deal which is awesome if it pays off and the exceptionally good camera on the phone. I also had service issues with the OnePlus One since it didn't support all of the GSM bands in the US and I was left struggling for a data connection a lot of times.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[markdavis]

>"I'd argue that the 'thin' part is the real place to object--the goal should be to have it the right size and thickness to be easily and securely held."

Couldn't agree more. And none of us CARE about being stupidly thin. We want to fill some of that thinness WITH MORE BATTERY CAPACITY! But somehow the phone manufacturers still haven't figured that out yet. And an extra 1 or 2mm of Lithium doesn't weigh much, either.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[iampiti]

Cutting costs? How must is cost to add the jack on a phone? I reckon less than a dolar per phone. I think it has more to do with either following trends or artificially crippling some models so people will buy more expensive ones

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[fluffernutter]

Oh sure, I have a cheap bluetooth headset too. But I can't listen to music with it at all. At around $45 I can listen to music with wired headphones, but I haven't found a bluetooth pair I can listen to music with yet. No bass response.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[samwichse]

That would be a bit of marketing genius if it were true.

But unfortunate for everyone who doesn't buy $800-1000 phones.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Cro Magnon]

Well, for one thing, my old iPhone 6 still gets security updates.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Ol Olsoc]

Oh sure, I have a cheap bluetooth headset too. But I can't listen to music with it at all. At around $45 I can listen to music with wired headphones, but I haven't found a bluetooth pair I can listen to music with yet. No bass response.

Your "cheap bluetooth headset" might be a clue.

I find the concept of audiophile level listening with a smartphone pretty amusing.

But there are applications that will tailor the sound for you. I use Boom3d and get all the bass I could want. With the real benefit that I'm not tethered to anything.

Wired headphones are going to go the way of replaceable batteries. A few people will miss them terribly, most of us won't.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Ol Olsoc]

>"Samsung is simply cutting costs on their budget line up by removing the headphone jack."

Seriously? As if a headphone jack costs more than $0.50?

Thickness and case intrusion are one problem with the headphone jack. You can pack in a significant amount of battery in the space taken up by the ingress - remember the ingress is going to define a line across the form that can't be taken up by battery.

Waterproofing the ingress area is going to take up space.

Then there is the problem of reliability. The mini headphone jack is a scaled down version of the quarter inch jack. Doesn't seem like much of a big deal until you factor in the spring strength, and there is a lot less pressure against the plug in the scaled down plug. I've replaced a lot of them over the years. Either through wear or the typical catching the cord on some object and pulling out the plug at an angle.

It is just a failure point, and while it could be made stronger, it would get bigger, and since the mini jack is supposed to be cheap, it would be putting lipstick on a pig.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[TheFakeTimCook]

Y'know, if you could mix and match features from about ten different Samsung phones, you'd get one pretty decent phone that didn't suck. Take the J-series for example, a range of phones so badly crippled they can't even update their own firmware because there's no space on the system partition, but it does have a headphone jack. Then there's the A8 without the headphone jack. And there are others, all crippled in various ways so they won't compete with each other. Drop a few thousand on various Samsung phones and pretty soon you've got the feature set for a single actually useful phone.

Or, you could just buy an iPhone. No headphone jack; but then, they sure aren't unique in that regard, now are they?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[TheFakeTimCook]

I'm really at a loss as to why people pay $800-1000 for a smartphone in today's market.

My most expensive smartphone was my first one, an HTC Legend, I think I paid around $600 for that one. I used it for 5 years (it still works, although the power button is screwed up so turning on/off is annoying and you can't run any up-to-date software on it - the phone is now 8.5 years old).

My next phone, a huge upgrade in every way, was an Asus ZenPhone (ZE500) and that cost me around $280. It lasted me a good 3 years, the main reason I decided to replace it was the fact that I dropped it on the street and broke its screen (it's still usable btw). It did have a few other issues (was geting a bit slow, had some strange software bugs, and some mechanical issues with the power button and the SIM card slot), but had I not broken the screen I could've easily used it for another year.

A few months ago I got a Motorola Moto G for about $350. Again, a big upgrade in every way...works absolutely great. All this makes sense to me, as technology improves you should be able to get more bang for less buck. This is generally the case, I mean check out what you can get now in a Xiami phone for $200 (my girlfriend has one). Yet, the prices of the flagship models seem to be increasing (Apple breaks the price ceiling with each new generation top of the line iPhone) while adding rather dubious "features", such as the lack of a headphone jack, incompatibility with existing peripherals, phones so thin that they bend in your pocket and which you then need to embed in a two-times thicker case to ensure they don't break...I don't see why I should ever pay more than $500 for a smartphone again.

Then you're in luck!

The iPhone XR is available from only $449!

https://www.apple.com/

Jus' sayin'...

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[TheFakeTimCook]

If you want a high-end iPhone, that's the price to pay. Unlike Samsung in the Android world, the iPhone has no competitors. iPhones and Android based phones are still very different, mainly in terms of security, and ergonomics.

Yeah, I'm also at a loss as to why anyone would want an iPhone of any variety, but I guess that's just me.

Maybe because my iPhone 6 Plus still gets full OS and Security Updates (and in fact, runs better than ever with iOS 12), plus still shows 93% battery capacity (and no "slowdowns" ever) on its original battery.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[TheFakeTimCook]

Indeed. Phones are already too thin, so thin and fragile you have to put them in a case to stop them from breaking (or even just bending in your pocket or bag). Guess what, that makes them thicker...so what's the point again? Oh, marketing, so we can wow people with how thin our phone is compared to the competition. The fact that 90% of the phone's users will admire the thinness only while looking at the store display and for the first few hours/days they take their phone out of the box (before they permanently stick it in a case) seems lost on most people.

Well, iPhones have actually been getting THICKER since the iPhone 6; so now what?

https://www.macrumors.com/2018...

And ANOTHER Slashtard Apple-meme bites the dust through FACTS...

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[TheFakeTimCook]

That would be a bit of marketing genius if it were true.

But unfortunate for everyone who doesn't buy $800-1000 phones.

Then just get an iPhone XR for as little as $449, or an XS for as little as $699.

And as a bonus, you'll actually get UPDATES (and a Secure OS) for 5 or more years:

https://www.apple.com/

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[swillden]

This makes absolute sense if you don't assume that the leaders of large corporations care about things like consistency and good-faith.

Right conclusion, wrong rationale.

The thing that, bizarrely, very few people seem to be able to figure out is that: Corporations are large collections of people. It's reasonable to expect an individual person to maintain a consistent viewpoint on a question (though they can also legitimately change their minds), but large corporations are made up of tens or hundreds of thousands of people, divided into lots of subsidiary organizations with goals that don't always perfectly align even at a single moment in time, much less over time. Yes, corporate leaders do attempt to prevent the worst cases of elements of their organizations working at cross purposes, but they often fail, especially over time. And that's true even when the leadership doesn't change, which it often does.

In cases like this, the "mocking" almost certainly comes from the marketing department who is focused on selling the current product. The product development department is likely not even consulted to see whether their future plans include products which can be mocked for the same reason. And note that I'm almost certainly dramatically oversimplifying to refer two only two organizations here.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[arth1]

And an extra 1 or 2mm of Lithium doesn't weigh much, either.

The Lithium in Li-Ion batteries is just a tiny part of the overall mass; the cobalt, oxygen, carbon and electrolyte is what makes up the most of it.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[samwichse]

Oh, Apple has put a headphone jack back on their phones now? Great news!

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[toonces33]

About a year ago, I got a Galaxy S7 (used and reconditioned). I think it only cost me 250$ or so.

The major challenge of going this route is that it seems like there are a lot of shady operators out there, so you have to choose carefully.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[fluffernutter]

I like to know I'm getting the best I can out of the device I'm using. If I want stereo sound I'll sit in the living room with my stereo. In either case, I don't want the wireless protocol to be an additional bottleneck and source of compression if I can help it.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[thegarbz]

And they are no longer mocking Apple, because they now have a similar product, and that is the only reason.

Which product? The poor selling A series of phones? Their flagship and best selling smartphone still has a headphone jack and the leaks from the S10 show a headphone jack too.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Ol Olsoc]

I like to know I'm getting the best I can out of the device I'm using. If I want stereo sound I'll sit in the living room with my stereo. In either case, I don't want the wireless protocol to be an additional bottleneck and source of compression if I can help it.

Take really good care of your smartphone then. As the top models fit your standards less and less, you may be forced to go to the cheapest phones out there in order to have your headphone jack.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[jimbo]

Indeed! My wife with an iPhone 5S just got the latest iOS 12 on it and it got faster - it practically got a new "lease on life" and she'll keep it for another year.

My Samsung GS6 stopped getting OS upgrades after three years.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[Dixie_Flatline]

I don't think it's the waterproofing, I think it's just that it takes up space. The hole itself isn't very big, of course, but the jack itself extends quite far into the phone. That means you have to design the screen hardware so that the jack isn't interfering. It also takes up a non-zero amount of battery space. If you pretend charging and audio could be done perfectly without any ports at all, that would probably be the best phone. A single, do-everything port is a good compromise to that. A headphone jack is just another compromise to make on top of that (though it might be one worth making—depends on what your design philosophy is).

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[nightfire-unique]

Heh. Funny, because I want to go the other way. I want to spend $2000 USD on my next phone, as long as it's a true, legitimate flagship. Removable/replaceable 7500mAh+ battery, factory unlocked bootloader with at least official acknowledgement of LineageOS, IP68, rugged, plastic body, dual sim, SD card, headphone/mic jack, hardware buttons, flat screen with "thick" bezel, hygrometer, thermometer, pressure sensor .. all the sensors..

Basically, a Note 3 (which I currently use) but with a bigger battery and modern camera, processor, and more RAM.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[nightfire-unique]

Designing phones that are thin and waterproof is difficult and expensive when you have ports to the outside.

Ugh. This is a lie you've been led to believe. The lie was told to justify removing the headphone jack to increase sales of wireless headphones / replacement USB-C adapters.

IP68 headphone jacks have existed for roughly 40 years. They're trivial to build, and integrating them is a 1st year engineering problem.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[markdavis]

>"The Lithium in Li-Ion batteries is just a tiny part of the overall mass; the cobalt, oxygen, carbon and electrolyte is what makes up the most of it."

True, but I still think most of us would be more than happy with a 2mm phone that weighs an extra 20 grams if it meant 33%+ more battery life (or whatever it would end up being).

In the past decade I have never thought to myself "oh, I wish this phone were thinner or lighter", it has always been "why can't the battery last longer".

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[arth1]

Agree. Well, I would like some of them smaller in area, so they fit in a shirt pocket without falling out, but thicker would be no problem, and I'd welcome the battery life!

The Xperia Z1 Compact works pretty well in that it's small and thick with a flat back so it can actually lie flat on a table unlike its successor.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[mapkinase]

It looks like you are looking for flagship series, for which you must pay much more than for J or A.

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[mapkinase]

You just convinced me to buy an iPhone next time. I am looking at my 2014 phone and last time I got any was almost two years ago.

Do you have to pay extra? Are your updates filtered through the provider, can the provider block them?

Do providers put a lot of their bloatware on iPhones?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[mapkinase]

>when a small Hyundai Elantra for 9K would suffce?

MSRP: From $17,100

Why don't you piss off and never show up again, AC?

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[hazardPPP]

Uhm, and the iPhone is the only smartphone lineup in existence?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[aquacrayfish]

Jump to Lineage OS (Samsung GS6 build), and don't look back. I got tired of being dependent on manufacturers and bloatware a long time ago. Been happy ever since.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[sound vision]

Why is a phone that works for multiple years with a functional battery so notable? Why so defensive?

Re:Killed is a bit of a strong word

[TheFakeTimCook]

Oh, Apple has put a headphone jack back on their phones now? Great news!

Mods, Parent is Offtopic, Redundant, and Trollish.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[J. T. MacLeod]

Ok, let's ignore that he was probably talking about a used model.

His comment makes perfect sense with the 17k figure. You have failed to even attempt to refute his point.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[J. T. MacLeod]

It's obviously possible. I posted that with an IP68 rated phone with a headphone jack right beside me. By Samsung, no less.

That doesn't change the fact that there are actual costs and design compromises involved in making it. Samsung's made a choice based on that. I'm not happy about it, but my displeasure doesn't mean these things aren't factors.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[J. T. MacLeod]

It's obviously possible. I posted that with an IP68 rated phone with a headphone jack right beside me. By Samsung, no less.

That doesn't change the fact that there are actual costs and design compromises involved in making it (especially in such a small package). Samsung's made a choice based on that. I'm not happy about it, but my displeasure doesn't mean these things aren't factors.

Re: Killed is a bit of a strong word

[J. T. MacLeod]

It's obviously possible. I posted that with an IP68 rated phone with a headphone jack right beside me. By Samsung, no less.

That doesn't change the fact that there are actual costs and design compromises involved in making it. Yes, buttons and USB ports present the same issues. But why would a manufacturer stop caring about one design difficulty/cost just because others exist? Samsung's made a choice based on that. I'm not happy about it, but my displeasure doesn't mean these things aren't factors.

Re:Yeah well then

[humptheElephant]

Do they glue the battery in too?

Re:Samesung

[Anonymous Coward]

I hear their mock apple pie is pretty good.

Re:Yeah well then

[Anonymous Coward]

starting with the s6

Re:Dont care about app UI

[Anonymous Coward]

How many users of phones without notches or holes drilled though the screen are going to have to suffer with unusable screen space on their phones due to app developers and content developers having to develop for the lowest common denominator. Were pretty much getting to the point you have to assume the edges of 5-10% of a phone's screen are unusable because you dont know what kind of notch, hole, curved corner or other bullshit might be in the screen.

So much for a bezel free phone, when now that 5-10% of the screen itself is now the bezel and has to be assumed to be unusable, lest some part of your content gets cut off.

Not really a big deal anymore

[Powercntrl]

A car stereo with Bluetooth costs $15. Walmart also sells Bluetooth adapters in the impulse bins at the check-out counters.

Yeah, the lack of a headphone jack probably annoys audiophiles, but if you're really that picky about your audio quality, you're probably using a standalone media player.

I've personally been using a phone without a headphone jack for several months now and haven't missed it. I never used it on my previous phone - I went Bluetooth "everything" quite awhile ago.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Jetstream]

What about those of us with less than perfect hearing, who use stereo headphones just to be able to understand what people are saying? Are we going to be required to pickup yet another gadget/gizmo to have to worry about charging & buying batteries for, in order to use bluetooth? Guess if I have to, I'll dump all bloatphones & go back to a flip phone if they all dump the jack.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[DontBeAMoran]

Wow, talk about a coincidence. I haven't had a TV in over two decades!

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[Harlequin80]

Really curious. Why won't my bluetooth headphones work on a plane? They did on my flights on Friday so I'm wondering what changed?

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Cmdln Daco]

Area man constantly mentioning he doesn't own a television.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[omnichad]

It probably has USB-C to 3.5mm audio adapter and you can keep using your existing headphones, knowing that the new phone is slightly more water resistant than the old one and that you don't need any more batteries.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[Cmdln Daco]

I am sitting in the seat behind you.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Actually, I do RTFA]

Audiophiles? A cheap pair of corded headphones is around $5 and I don't need to charge them or worry about power at all. I don't like having extra things that need charging.

I say this as someone who jumped hard onto bluetooth, but then realized the damn cord was more convenient.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[TuballoyThunder]

Wireless charging--works great. There are even battery packs that have wireless charging.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[arth1]

Yeah, the lack of a headphone jack probably annoys audiophiles, but if you're really that picky about your audio quality, you're probably using a standalone media player.

No need for that. USB-OTG to a DAC/headphone amp. And wired headphones retrofitted with a balanced plug.

Wireless is useful for when working out, and you don't want to risk snagging any wires. But it sounds like shit, unless your phone and receiver both support AptX-HD (ok) or LDAC (better). Especially AAC, which Apple uses, is max 250 kbps, which is less than most MP3s these days, and unless your file was AAC encoded to start with, full of recompression artifacts. Just don't bother for anything more complex than audio books or third millennium noise. There are AM radio broadcasts with better quality...

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[misnohmer]

Bluetooth things you have to keep charged. So if you use a headset once or twice a week you just want to leave in your jacket pocket because you use it only when you receive a call while outside, you're out of luck. Dongles add weight, break down and require replecement (my kids go through 1-2 Apple headphone adapters per year as they just stop working) or simply don't work well (I work with a person who's never been able to get his Pixel to work well with a small wire only non-chargeable headset to work, every time he tried, at some point during the call we'd have to wait for him to switch to speakerphone because the headset stopped working). That and bluetooth is not as reliable as plain old wired headset - interference, compatibility and reliability/software bugs issues plague them constantly. I have a Plantronics savi-7xx and it works great with Galaxy S9+ if I only enable bluetooth when I want to talk, but if I keep bluetooth enabled, few days of going in and out of range of the thing results in one way audio connection only, I can hear the caller but they cannot hear me - disabling and re-enabling bluetooth fixes it.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[markdavis]

>"It probably has USB-C to 3.5mm audio adapter and you can keep using your existing headphones"

Which you inevitably never have with you when you need it.
Which doesn't allow charging and using it for music at the same time.
Which uses more battery.
Which almost never comes with the device, meaning more $.
Which is more weight and complexity when using ultra-light/thin wired earphones.

Just give me a headphone jack! Which, typically also work with wired headsets and microphones (3 stripe).

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[friedmud]

Serious question: do you know about the "Live Listen" capability of Airpods?

Here's a good article on it: https://www.imore.com/how-make...

It essentially turns AirPods into hearing boosters.

Check it out and see if it fits your needs. Yeah, you'll have to charge them, but that's pretty painless and the case keeps them charged pretty well.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[Harlequin80]

Funny. Evil. But Funny.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[cheesybagel]

Same here. Not to mention the possible security implications of using Bluetooth.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[guacamole]

I care about audio quality and comfort but you don't need to have a dedicated audio player for that. Case in point the well known Koss Porta Pro and Sennheiser PX100ii ranges of headphones. They are both affordable and designed to work well connected to a mobile device.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Anonymous Coward]

That's precious. You're using a smart phone-home device and you're worried about the possible security implications of Bluetooth? LOL.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[SeaFox]

I've personally been using a phone without a headphone jack for several months now and haven't missed it. I never used it on my previous phone - I went Bluetooth "everything" quite awhile ago.

Why are the people in the "Bluetooth" camp always making this out as though we have to choose one or the other? There's no reason you can't continue to ignore the headphone jack for the Bluetooth you find more convenient. Removing the headphone jack has no impact on your use, so why can't they just leave it and give the consumer more choice.

The cost of the jack is a non-issue in a device costing as much as a major appliance. We don't need to remove the jack because it is "hampering the thinness of the phone's design" -- because they don't need to be thinner. People are already complaining about phones being too thin to be structurally resilient depending on the material. The waterproofing argument is bogus, too. Handset makers are not making the phones more water-resistant after removing the jack than they were before they removed it.

What is an actual legitimate reason that it is necessary the jack be removed?

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Falos]

A coworker lamented his dead headphones on his way to babysit a late meeting.

"I should have charged" "Oh do you want to borrow mine?" "I don't even have a jack"

It was an unusual sensation. It gave me pause the way that someone might have experienced when they first heard of a watch that needs no winding or batteries. "That's a thing? That's different than how I've always done it."

We have created entire new and exciting problems for the man of tomorrow. Except my phone does the same things as his. I'm pretty sure this is the opposite of progress.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Powercntrl]

Why are the people in the "Bluetooth" camp always making this out as though we have to choose one or the other?

That wasn't the implication. I was postulating as to why manufacturers don't see removing the headphone jack as a problem: its absence is not a deal-breaker for most users. Even though plenty of people still smoke, most cars don't come with ash trays these days, either. It's just part of modern design aesthetics to remove superfluous elements.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[hazardPPP]

A car stereo with Bluetooth costs $15. Walmart also sells Bluetooth adapters in the impulse bins at the check-out counters.

So? Lack of a headphone jack has nothing to do with annoying audiophiles...in fact it's more annoying to just us regular folk.

I have bluetooth headphones. The sound is great for my needs and they're pretty cool. But...

• - They're wireless (duh), so you need to charge them. Another piece of equipment you need a cable for and a charger and that you have to worry about plugging in at night. Annoying.

• - Bluetooth is far from a perfect technology...in the past it was horribly buggy, now it's got better but it's still not seamless. If you use just one pair of equipment (a single set of headphones with a single phone for example) it'll work OK most of the time but once you start swapping pairs around the problems multiply. Which headset do you pair to this device? Which is the default audio output? Did it automatically pair with another nearby device with which it was paired in the past and currently has its Bluetooth on? Etc. etc.

• - The communication is ultimately software-based, which means software updates can break things. For example, an update for my OS broke the ability of my computer to stream full stereo sound to my bluetooth headphones.

• - The whole pairing process is still so 1995, compare to the much more straightforward process of connecting to WiFi.

• - Declining battery life means your bluetooth headphones are going to need replacing sooner than your regular headphones most likely. Take earbuds. I can go the cheap route and pay $5-10, those will probably break within a year. But hey, they're dirt cheap who cares? Or if I choose to spend $30+ on earbuds those will probably last me 20 years. I also get to use them with a whole variety of equipment. Which pair of bluetooth headphones will last me 20 years? Which one of them will plug into my 10-15 year old sound system? Etc.

• - What happens all the time is that exactly when I need to use the headphones, the battery is empty.

• - More on the phone side: the main way I listen to music at home now is by plugging in my tablet or phone into my sound system and playing music off Spotify, Youtube, internet radio, MP3s, whatever. Hard without a 3.5 mm jack, and yeah, I like the ability of being able to charge the phone/tablet simultaneously.

• - You officially aren't allowed to use Bluetooth on an airplane.

So yeah, I have Bluetooth headphones, but more or less I always carry a pair of ordinary earbuds as backup. Don't remove my 3.5mm jack, thanks.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[froggyjojodaddy]

I use Anker wireless around-the-ear headphones when I'm working out. I started around 2 years ago and will never go back to wired headphones - there's nothing more annoying than cords getting caught on something, or you're on the treadmill and move just a little too far back and your phone gets tugged and ends up flying off

The battery lasts for at least 8 hours which is good for 4 days workout. Charging them is easy, just plug into any micro-USB cable. It's a trivial inconvenience.

I also don't understand the 'poor quality' sound comments - I had my annual physical a few months ago which includes a hearing test. Absolutely no issues with my hearing whatsoever. However, I cannot detect any decrease in sound quality of wireless vs. wired, and I've tried really hard. I mean, maybe if you're an audiophile and are listening to very specific notes or music, maybe you can tell the difference. But for the other 95% who listen to music when working out, on the train, or working around the house, I don't know if it's really a problem

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[froggyjojodaddy]

You CAN use Bluetooth on airplanes. I do it all the time. When I enable flight mode on my phone (S9+), it disables WiFi and Cellular radio but not Bluetooth.

Also, the FAA permits Bluetooth: https://www.faa.gov/news/press... Excerpt: "Devices must be used in airplane mode or with the cellular connection disabled. You may use the WiFi connection on your device if the plane has an installed WiFi system and the airline allows its use. You can also continue to use short-range Bluetooth accessories, like wireless keyboards."

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[hazardPPP]

Well, that's news to me, thanks. I stand corrected. I've been repeatedly told in the past by flight attendants that anything that has any kind of wireless transmission is a no-no.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[fluffernutter]

You must turn off all sending and receiving for wireless devices on an airplane. Therefore you have to turn off bluetooth.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[fluffernutter]

Because you have to turn off bluetooth on an airplane. No transmitting or receiving functions.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[fluffernutter]

At what cost? Presumably more than the free cable that comes with the phone.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[scamper_22]

Just to tag on.

I was using my bluetooth headset for a while at work.
I recently switched to a regular 3.5mm headset.

Battery life was a concern, but not the major one.
My main one was switching between devices at work.

I have to attend conference calls, so I want the headset paired with my phone. Then, I watch a training video and I want it paired with my laptop.

I know it's possible to switch what the headset is paired to. I've done it, but dammit if every time it's like I'm playing a game. Enabling and Disabling devices and pairings. Whatever I have to do, nothing is easier than just swapping the jack.

Wired headset is just easier. Do I care if it's USB-C or 3.5mm Audio? Only to the extent it works. I doubt my laptop will come with a USB-C port anytime soon, but it has that trusty 3.5mm jack.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[arth1]

I also don't understand the 'poor quality' sound comments - I had my annual physical a few months ago which includes a hearing test. Absolutely no issues with my hearing whatsoever.

Hearing tests don't measure your ability to discern harmonies or minor sounds lower in volume than the main sound.
You may have 20/20 vision in a test and still be unable to distinguish near colors, or see well at night.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Wulf2k]

Yes, that was the reference being made.

Congrats.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[Wulf2k]

But you are free to use the in-plane wifi on the same frequencies if you supply a credit card.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Wulf2k]

Wired pro controllers are a thing.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[TheFakeTimCook]

Well, I sure miss the audio jack. I would not buy an Apple phone for myself, but my work phone is an Apple and has been recently "upgraded" so that I no longer have an audio jack. I work remotely now so I use the phone a lot. Not having an audio jack means that when I'm on a conference call, I can't charge the phone and use the earbuds/mic at the same time. Bluetooth is not an option for the work phone (security reasons) and I wouldn't want a Bluetooth headset anyway. I don't need more things to charge. Also, the lightning connector headsets are stupidly expensive. Funny how Apple is now forcing users to use the much more expensive headset.

https://www.amazon.com/Bland-1...

Wow, that was hard. Took a whole 30 seconds on Amazon.

Oh, and $8 for this Y-cable is hardly "stupidly expensive". Just use them with the Lightning Headset that came with the phone.

Slashtards.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[TheFakeTimCook]

Audiophiles? A cheap pair of corded headphones is around $5 and I don't need to charge them or worry about power at all. I don't like having extra things that need charging.

I say this as someone who jumped hard onto bluetooth, but then realized the damn cord was more convenient.

You mention "audiophile" and $5 headphones like those two terms belong in the same sentence.

Cute.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[TheFakeTimCook]

If you use just one pair of equipment (a single set of headphones with a single phone for example) it'll work OK most of the time but once you start swapping pairs around the problems multiply. Which headset do you pair to this device? Which is the default audio output? Did it automatically pair with another nearby device with which it was paired in the past and currently has its Bluetooth on? Etc. etc.

I have great news for you! Apple has already figured ALL of this out with its Airpods.

See this post:

https://hardware.slashdot.org/...

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Cinnamon Beige]

It's also really nice if you want to hijack somebody's stereo or headphones. It doesn't take that much skill to hijack Bluetooth stuff...

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[iampiti]

I don't know if you were exaggerating but are there any headphones that last 20 years (or close)?
I've been using headphones (lately in-ear) for 20 years and not a single pair has lasted me more than 1,5 years and I'm not especially rough to them. I usually buy in the 20 - 30 € (most expensive pair was 40€) and the sound quality is enough for me but their durability has always been crap

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[thegarbz]

Especially AAC, which Apple uses, is max 250 kbps

As much as shitting on Apple is a favourite passtime of mine, I challenge you to do a blind ABX identification of a WAV file and a 250kbps AAC encoded file. I'll bet you a Marsbar you're unable to get through with any statistical significance.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[froggyjojodaddy]

Ah, makes sense. I guess I just don't know what I'm missing in that case if my otherwise-fine hearing is incapable of picking up subtle sounds. That leads to a weird feeling - what if I'm hearing something like Bohemian Rhapsody in a way that is very different to someone who can pick out all the different sounds that I cannot?

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Actually, I do RTFA]

Cord fraying is a real problem, including (and especially) adapters. Also, all headphones just got $1.50 more expensive (and needs to be ordered 2 days in advance). And wears the charging port. And blocks my ability to charge and play at the same time (which seems useful as at the same time.)

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Dixie_Flatline]

More to the point, if you're trying to get audiophile quality and listening experience out of your phone when you're out and about in the world, you're 100% doing it wrong. The ambient noise in the world is worse for your audio quality than the transition from cable to bluetooth. And let's not forget that a cable doesn't guarantee good quality, it simply removes that from being a factor in the quality. But the $20 bluetooth headphones I have are 1000x times better than a pair of wired Skullcandys at any price. Skullcandy makes garbage headphones with garbage drivers, but they have a wire.

I totally agree that if you're going to claim you're interested in quality you should be getting a DAC+amp to drive your headphones rather than just jamming them into your phone in any case.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[Dixie_Flatline]

Because it takes up space. That's it, end of story. Space inside a phone is at a premium for all sorts of reasons. More battery could be fit there. It's easier to design the layout of the internals. You don't have a long connector intruding on the screen internals. You already have a port that can output audio.

Apparently the reason why the headphone jack was removed on the iPad Pro was because they couldn't make the bezels as small if they had the headphone jack; it intruded into the space that the screen components needed, so Apple removed it. They felt the screen experience was more important, and so they made the tradeoff.

Look, lots of people disagree with Apple's decisions, and that's fine, but they don't make these decisions blindly or capriciously. They thought about the product they wanted to make, designed it, and released it, and we're not obligated to buy it if it doesn't fit our needs. This is also the case with the notch. It was deliberate, and they decided they didn't have a better solution for the moment.

I actually think the real thing that people hate is that other manufacturers ape Apple for no reason other than Apple did it first. Most of the phones on the market with a notch have it just to look more like the iPhone rather than for any technological reason. They hate that their headphone jack is disappearing because some lazy designer thought it was easier to just follow Apple's lead than make real decisions for themselves.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[J053]

Bluetooth and WiFi have been allowed on US flights since 2013:
https://www.faa.gov/news/press...

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[arth1]

That leads to a weird feeling - what if I'm hearing something like Bohemian Rhapsody in a way that is very different to someone who can pick out all the different sounds that I cannot?

We probably all hear music slightly different. I know that it has changed over the years for me - if I listen to music now that I listened to in my youth, I discover different things than I did then.

One pop music song from my early teens has a quite noticeable master tape stretch which I never heard when I was young, but now it's really grating to hear the slight dip in pitch for every revolution, getting less as the song progresses. That I didn't hear it when young wasn't because it wasn't there, but because pitch wasn't really what I listened for.

As for compression artifacts, what I hear the difference the most on are whisks and high hats. When bad, it sounds like someone is slapping a bag full of crushed glass. Another is the high pitched "walking treble" in Mike Oldfield's Tubular Bells, which psychoacoustic compression tends to filter away, thinking it unimportant compared to the main sounds. But it sounds really odd when it fades in and out, once you are familiar with the tune as it is uncompressed.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[Harlequin80]

FAA changed those rules in 2013.

And all the airlines I fly with in Australia allow bluetooth connections but require the cellular to be turned off. Depending on the plane there are restrictions around bluetooth during taxi, takeoff and landing. But not inflight. 747 for example are only while inflight, a320, a380, 787, 737 are on all the time.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[cheesybagel]

The less holes the better.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[hazardPPP]

Great then for people who use Apple products almost exclusively and don't mind spending $159 on AirPods...let me know when this becomes a standard feature on every new BT-enabled device, and works seamlessly across devices with different manufacturers. The way many other transmission standards do (like WiFi).

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[hazardPPP]

I don't know if you were exaggerating but are there any headphones that last 20 years (or close)?

I've a pair of Sony earbuds purchased a long time ago, most likely in the early / mid 90s. They still work fine. Also lots of cheap ones that have definitely lasted more than 1.5 years (although I had plenty of those which broke in some way after 6-12 months or even less)

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[froggyjojodaddy]

The one thing thing I really notice but never did before is the intake of breath a singer makes before singing a line. It's completely natural, of course, but I get very distracted by it, to the point of anticipating and focusing on that just to make sure I'm actually hearing it

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[omnichad]

Which you inevitably never have with you when you need it.

Leave it attached to your headphones.

Which doesn't allow charging and using it for music at the same time.

This does require a more expensive adapter, but also makes for a strange use case. Using it for music while charging doesn't really sound like a headphone use case. There are a lot of other inexpensive ways to cart off music to speakers from a fixed position. Chromecast Audio is one. And then the phone doesn't have to be next to the speakers.

Which uses more battery.

You're using an offboard DAC instead of an onboard DAC. I'm not 100% sure it has to use more electricity.

Which almost never comes with the device, meaning more $.

Is that really common? Every phone I've seen with no headphone jack does come with one. Even Apple includes one and they like to overcharge for the most basic of accessories.

Which is more weight and complexity when using ultra-light/thin wired earphones.

Phones are heavy. Either the thing goes in the phone or the thing goes outside the phone. The weight isn't terribly different.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[TheFakeTimCook]

Great then for people who use Apple products almost exclusively and don't mind spending $159 on AirPods...let me know when this becomes a standard feature on every new BT-enabled device, and works seamlessly across devices with different manufacturers. The way many other transmission standards do (like WiFi).

Hey the rest of every other BT earbud OEM is free to do the same thing. AFAIK, Apple's "Pairing" method isn't patented.

The other OEMs are evidently just too greedy, lazy, and stupid to do it.

Re:Not really a big deal anymore

[markdavis]

>"Leave it attached to your headphones."

True, but if you have more than one pair, gotta have more than one.

>"This does require a more expensive adapter, but also makes for a strange use case. "

Agreed. It is unusual.

>You're using an offboard DAC instead of an onboard DAC. I'm not 100% sure it has to use more electricity.'

I am not sure

>"Phones are heavy. Either the thing goes in the phone or the thing goes outside the phone. The weight isn't terribly different."

Also probably true. It is more of a problem with more than one jack to get disconnected inconveniently.

Re: Not really a big deal anymore

[Cmdln Daco]

Yes, evil. But think about evil dude with a jammer in his pocket on a crowded commuter train full of Iphone users with their ear podlets.

Re:Samesung

[DontBeAMoran]

Wouldn't it be better as "Samesong"?

This article is terribly misrepresentative

[psperl]

Apple has removed the headphone jack from ALL of its phones. Samsung removed it from one midrange phone, and still offers dozens of models with it. This is clickbait, pure and simple.

Re:This article is terribly misrepresentative

[fustakrakich]

Removing the headphone jack, that's patent infringement, right?

Re:This article is terribly misrepresentative

[Anonymous Coward]

Samsung just hasn't removed it from the rest of the phones YET.

Re:This article is terribly misrepresentative

[squiggleslash]

Please please please Apple sue over that! In fact, if they could sue over missing headphone jacks, notches, poor battery lives, and phones that are too thin, we may even forgive them for their many sins...

Re:This article is terribly misrepresentative

[thegarbz]

This is clickbait, pure and simple

No! TheFakeTimCook, Apple shill (or maybe just mental institution escapee) posting clickbait of no value? Say it aint so!

Surgeon General's Warning: Reading this post comes with levels of sarcasm high enough that it may cause cancer in the state of California.

Re:Fuck Samsung and Apple.

[nnull]

No root, no buy.

hifi snobs ?

[swell]

MY PHONE HAS ONE, a headphone jack. But for years I've preferred my Bluetooth headphones. I have a nice stereo for those times I want high quality sound, but why bother with the lower quality stuff in my phone?

My brother, a hifi snob, has electrostatic headphones for his musical journeys. But he doesn't listen on his phone either (which also has a headphone jack).

So where are the hifi snobs who get their music on a cell phone while they're out and about, and can't tolerate Bluetooth? Are they doing FLAC on their tiny phones? Ridiculous!

Re:hifi snobs ?

[Actually, I do RTFA]

It's not a weird quality thing. It's that corded headphones are dirt cheap, ubiquitous and never need charging.

Re:hifi snobs ?

[iggymanz]

all that is true but the wired sound quality really is better also.

Re:hifi snobs ?

[Doke]

Bluetooth has a history of security holes. Here's just one link https://www.cnet.com/news/blue...

Re:hifi snobs ?

[Solandri]

Bluetooth works OK for listening where timing is not a factor, but it introduces latency. My car seems to add about 300 ms of latency when receiving audio via Bluetooth. That makes it really annoying to play video on my phone with the sound piped to my car's speakers (so the kids or passengers can watch). If I use my tablet I can just plug the headphone jack into the car's aux port. But my newest phone eschewed the headphone jack. I didn't think it'd be a big deal because "I can just use Bluetooth." But I'm really missing the headphone jack.

Re:hifi snobs ?

[ljw1004]

I'm not an audiophile. My music is already in highly compressed mp3 format. But I prefer wired headphones because

* I like my Etymotics brand canalphones that stick far into my ear canal. They block out background noise really well, better than my wife's Bose noise-cancelling headphones. They passed the "sit next to a screaming baby on an airplane and not even realize that it's screaming because you can't hear it" test perfectly. I've not yet seen such "canally" canalphones in Bluetooth.

* The same headphones can either plug into my phone, or plug into the airplane's headphone jack so I can listen to music

Re:hifi snobs ?

[zilym]

FLAC is nice, but it can't fix problems with the original source material being poorly produced. The loudness wars have resulted in really poor recordings nowadays. The dynamic range has been compressed and normalized to make everything sound as a loud as possible, because hey, louder will help the music sell better, right? And once you've got everything uniformly loud, why bother making sure musical nuances and details are kept intact since nobody is going to be able to hear them anyway? It doesn't matter if you switch from lossy data compression to lossless FLAC -- you can't fix bad source material.

So, I've pretty much given up on my FLAC collection... I've moved on to collecting MIDI files instead. Back in the old days, MIDI files sounded pretty lame, but nowadays with the massive processing power, storage, and RAM we have available on modern computing devices, I can use HUGE multi-gigabyte instrument sample sets that sound fantastic. Sure, there's no vocals, but then again I don't have to listen to Nicki Minaj talking about truffle butter and other repulsive lyrics.

Re:hifi snobs ?

[PhrostyMcByte]

It's absolutely possible to have portable hi-fi. LG's line of high-end phones comes with a stellar audio stack that measures better than most desktop audiophile gear.

And you don't need FLAC. 256kbps MP3, 196kbps AAC, 160kbps OPUS are audibly transparent for basically any music.

Re:hifi snobs ?

[iggymanz]

my car will take audio via bluetooth.... but it sounds like shit compared to wired connection

Re:hifi snobs ?

[strikethree]

So where are the hifi snobs who get their music on a cell phone while they're out and about, and can't tolerate Bluetooth? Are they doing FLAC on their tiny phones? Ridiculous!

Nice strawman argument there. I want a headphone jack for several reasons, none of which you mentioned. Odd that.

I want a headphone jack because I don't like having to charge headphones.

I want a headphone jack because sometimes I am in a very dense EM environment and bluetooth just doesn't work.

I don't like remembering and performing the various dances that bluetooth devices require in order to connect to my phone.

A headphone jack just makes life simpler since the standard has been around for multiple decades.

It is great that bluetooth suffices for your needs. You are in luck, because bluetooth has been offered on phones for years, even with a headphone jack. You don't have to give up your beloved bluetooth in order for the rest of us to have a headphone jack. How cool is that?

Re:The road to Hell...

[Cmdln Daco]

What is a 'fandroid'? The rest of us just want hardware that is more open. I don't log into Google at all on my present phone any longer. I download apps I want from alternative sources, and have had little difficulty.

Google and Apple can pound sand in my world. Which, I know, is just my world, no more. But more and more of us are logging out these days.

I have no problem with killing the jack

[melted]

But if you're going to do it, there need to be some actual USB-C headphones available, besides the low quality earbuds that manufacturers include with their phones. I get that they'd like us to use Bluetooth, but it's yet another device that needs to be charged, and I hate that.

Re:Dont care about app UI

[omnichad]

Android has a new DisplayCutout API for this. It's usually in the notification area, so it only affects apps that block that.

Your post is pure spin

[SuperKendall]

Samsung has removed the jack from it's LATEST phone. You seriously do not think it likely the rest of the models will follow?

Do the mocking ads they produced apply to this phone or not? If they are making fun of no headphone jack, ANY phone that fits that description applies - including their own.

No matter how you look at it this is a self-own. And a great reason not to run mocking ads, for someday that could be yourself you are mocking.

Re:Your post is pure spin

[exomondo]

Who gives a shit? Apple went through a whole marketing song and dance about how great and necessary magsafe was and now admitted actually you don't need it, how the trashcan mac pro was the future of computing, 7" tablets, styluses, intel CPUs, etc ... the tech world is full of hypocritical pontifications and neither Apple nor Samsung are strangers to them.

Beware

[Anonymous Coward]

Some recent android devices without headphone jacks use the same antenna for both WiFi and Bluetooth, and this is a huge problem if you are streaming content over WiFi and want to listen to the audio via Bluetooth headphones. I nearly pulled the trigger on the purchase of a Huawei android tablet before I found a bunch of online reviews of people who claim the device fails at streaming standard definition content (Netflix, YouTube, etc) when using Bluetooth headphones. Don't pre-order devices and make sure to read those one star reviews.

Re:Beware

[Solandri]

Bluetooth uses the 2.4 GHz band. WiFi uses 2.4 GHz (802.11b, g, and n) or 5 GHz (n and ac). If you encounter this problem, all you have to do is connect to your router via the 5 GHz WiFi band.

I'm not even sure the problem is due to a shared antenna. The 2.4 GHz band is so crowded (a lot of wireless mice and keyboards use it too, and microwave ovens blast spread spectrum noise all over it when operating) that I see interference problems more often than I don't.

EXACTLY!!!!!

[SuperKendall]

Apple used to mock Intel CPUs before switching to them shortly after.

Yes I had those "Switch" ads in mind as well when I wrote my post. They were amusing at the time for sure, but they too were a self-own for Apple as Apple had to go down the Intel path as well... probably other aspects apply these days if you went back and watched them.

A little less direct a self-own, in that more time had passed before they applied - but still.

Re:EXACTLY!!!!!

[TheFakeTimCook]

Apple used to mock Intel CPUs before switching to them shortly after.

Yes I had those "Switch" ads in mind as well when I wrote my post. They were amusing at the time for sure, but they too were a self-own for Apple as Apple had to go down the Intel path as well... probably other aspects apply these days if you went back and watched them.

A little less direct a self-own, in that more time had passed before they applied - but still.

But Apple didn't just DECIDE to switch to Intel; they were FORCED to, because neither Motorola nor IBM were interested in creating a laptop-version of the G5 CPU, nor were they interested in breaking the 3 GHz barrier.

When will Android manufacturers stop copying Apple

[AbRASiON]

This is one idiot Apple feature, not worth copying.

Just picked up my new Huawei phone 3 weeks ago, after 7 years of Android loyalty.

Detest their insistence that only the weak phones get flat display. Even more glad now with this headphone change.

Fan since the S2. No more, they don't want me as a customer.

Bluetooth batteries dont last long.

[wolfheart111]

Always running out of battery, headphones jacks are good backup.

Re:Bluetooth batteries dont last long.

[swillden]

Always running out of battery, headphones jacks are good backup.

I use bluetooth headphones as a backup to my bluetooth headphones. Two pairs; one charging (often charging from my phone) while the other is in use. I have these; they're pretty cheap ($8), work fine in the shower, last eight hours on a charge and have a pretty decent microphone which I sometimes use for phone calls. I have two pairs that I bought about three years ago -- though they cost twice as much then as they do now -- and they're still going strong. In three years I'd have ruined at least a dozen pairs of wired headphones by catching the wires on things, so they've saved me money.

Re:Bluetooth batteries dont last long.

[thegarbz]

Depends on the headphones. Tiny earbuds I can understand, but in general I can happily take an intercontinental flight and get to my destination with 70% battery remaining while listening to music the entire time.

Now there are other reasons I hate bluetooth (skipping, poor sound quality, etc), but battery life isn't one of them.

Re:The road to Hell...

[Billly Gates]

Fortunately, "fandroids" have their choice of phones, and don't have to buy crippled junk from Samsung.

Take the Moto G4 Play and G5. Removable battery? CHECK! SD card slot? CHECK! Headphone jack? CHECK once more!

Dude have you seeen the specs on this thing?!> . 100 DPI? My non smart phone from 2009 had a better screen! It is IPS?! The CPU is 5 years old and 2 generations behind the budget grade snapdragons which powered my old Windows Phone. Tiny battery life and no mention of ram which makes me suspicious.

Can it even boot anything after 6 marshmallow or run apps? 3 gigs of ram is the minimum requirement for any phone these days.

It took COURAGE

[Spy Handler]

Samsung is just being brave. It takes courage to copy Apple even after getting your ass sued off for using rounded corners.

Thickness

[PhYrE2k2]

It is all about thickness. The headphone jack limited making the phone thinner. Samsung hopped on the Android fan bandwagon and made fun of Apple to boost their own sales. Now they want to make the phone thinner and need to do the same

Re:Thickness

[cheesybagel]

It is a bunch of balooney. If size was the issue they could have used a thinner headphone jack. There are such things.

This is just a throwback to the old days when mobile phone companies used to charge you $100 extra for a $1 headphone jack. Sony Ericsson loved doing that...

Re:Thickness

[Uberbah]

If size was the issue they could have used a thinner headphone jack. There are such things.

Which would require an adapter to connect to your 3.5mm headphones. So if you're going to make your users get an adapter anyway....might as well be USB-C. Tomato, toe-mah-toe.

Re:Thickness

[guacamole]

And how much thinner the Android phones should go? The Galaxy S8 is already about perfect size. It's only 8mm thin and it STILL HAS 3.5mm jack. Why would anyone need a thinner device?

Re: Thickness

[PhYrE2k2]

Ease of bending. Itâ(TM)s a feature thick phones lack.

Re:Thickness

[cheesybagel]

Yes, because it's impossible to manufacture headphones with a smaller jack...

Re:Thickness

[Uberbah]

Yes, because then you may as well get a pair of USB-C headphones. Once you've ditched the sacrosanct 3.5mm jack....you've ditched the 3.5mm jack.

Tomato, toe-mah-toe.

Re:The road to Hell...

[markdavis]

>"Dude have you seeen the specs on this thing?!> [google.com]. 100 DPI? My non smart phone from 2009 had a better screen!"

Ones he was quoting went off sale years ago. Let's look at the now 2-year-old Moto G5Plus which I bought a year ago from Costco for $189.

1080P screen on a 5.2" screen = 424ppi

> It is IPS?!

Yes

>The CPU is 5 years old and 2 generations behind the budget grade snapdragons which powered my old Windows Phone.

It is an 8 core Cortex A53 @ 2Ghz and seems very speedy to me. Much faster than the Nexus 5. And the Snapdragon 625 is only 2 years old.

>"Tiny battery life"

3000mAh is not tiny. Again, much longer battery life than the Nexus 5.

>"and no mention of ram which makes me suspicious."

5plus 2GB. 5plusS 3GB LPDDR4

>"Can it even boot anything after 6 marshmallow"

Android 8.1 Oreo

>"or run apps?"

Yep. And GPS, decent cameras, fingerprint sensor, headphone jack, and SD card.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Um...

[argStyopa]

...why does 'how the hole is made' ("laser drilled!") have anything to do with, well, anything?

1st and last

[AndyKron]

The way things are going with all the privacy bullshit these days my Samsung S6 will probably be my first, and last smart phone. I still have the old rotary hanging on the wall (with a DSL interface).

However you want to rationalize the hypocrisy

[Uberbah]

Apple has removed the headphone jack from ALL of its phones. Samsung removed it from one midrange phone, and still offers dozens of models with it. This is clickbait, pure and simple.

Was Samsung mocking Apple after they took the headphone jack off of their latest phone (7 at the time) whilst leaving it on all their other devices? Why yes they did! You are hand waiving, pure and simple.

Sorry, but MagSafe *was* the greatest

[SuperKendall]

Apple went through a whole marketing song and dance about how great and necessary magsafe was and now admitted actually you don't need it

Are you kidding? Magsafe WAS the greatest, and a laptop owner DOES need it. USB-C is sadly more all-around functional, but there's not getting around it absolutely is inferior to MagSafe for charging... the only reason why it's tolerable is that modern laptop batteries last longer so you can go for. quite a while without attaching the trippin' cord.

I've not talked to one newer MacBook owner that does not miss it.

It's so great in fact that people are making MagSafe USB-C cables.

Re:Sorry, but MagSafe *was* the greatest

[exomondo]

Are you kidding? Magsafe WAS the greatest, and a laptop owner DOES need it.

Apple obviously does not agree because they have gotten rid of it.

USB-C is sadly more all-around functional

You realize that even Apple's own laptops (prior to their current lineup) did indeed have more than one kind of port, the fact that they have USB-C never precluded Apple from having the magsafe charging port.

Re:Sorry, but MagSafe *was* the greatest

[fluffernutter]

Laptops with cheap flimsy power cords like Apple provides need it. I've never broken a Thinkpad cord.

Re:Sorry, but MagSafe *was* the greatest

[TheFakeTimCook]

I have a new iphone XS and a new macbook pro and can't plug one into the other, I actually have to buy a dongle to do that. That is fucking retarded unless you just want to extract some more profit from your userbase by doing asshole things like upselling dongles.

Or, you could just buy a CABLE, like SANE people do.

Here's one that is MFi-certified, Lightning to USB-A. a WHOLE $6:

https://www.amazon.com/AmazonB...

And here is a (non MFi) Lightning to USB-C cable for $8. Note that Apple's cable (not DONGLE!) is $20; but Apple just changed the MFi-program rules to allow 3rd Party USB-C -> Lightning cables; so cheap MFi-Certified ones are right around the corner.

https://www.amazon.com/METRANS...

That took about 2 minutes on Amazon's site.

So, it seems it is YOU that is the retarded one.

Re:Sorry, but MagSafe *was* the greatest

[TheFakeTimCook]

Laptops with cheap flimsy power cords like Apple provides need it. I've never broken a Thinkpad cord.

You've never broken an Apple one either; but I notice you don't mention THAT.

Headphone jack vs. waterproof

[steveha]

I like headphone jacks and every phone I have ever owned has had one. But there is a modern trend to getting rid of them, and also a modern trend to making phones waterproof. I don't think it's unrelated.

It is possible to make a waterproof phone with a headphone jack. But to my knowledge all such phones were top of the line, expensive phones.

All else being equal, I'd prefer a headphone jack. But I want my next phone to be waterproof, and my guess is that to get that I will need to accept the loss of the headphone jack.

P.S. My wife's phone has no headphone jack, but there's a little cable that plugs into the USB C port and then gives an analog headphone jack. Spare cables are something like $9. I would have no problem buying one of those cables for each of my telephone-capable headphones or ear buds.

Yes, this means I won't be able to charge the phone while listening to music on headphones. I'll survive somehow.

Re:Headphone jack vs. waterproof

[serviscope_minor]

P.S. My wife's phone has no headphone jack, but there's a little cable that plugs into the USB C port and then gives an analog headphone jack. Spare cables are something like $9. I would have no problem buying one of those cables for each of my telephone-capable headphones or ear buds.

Question is though how long is the port going to last? I can put my phone in my pocket with the headphones in and not worry about a small tweak wrecking the headphone port.

USB-micro was a heap of junk and auto-wrecked almost instantly by looking at it wrong. USB-C is a lot better but it's a way more complex port than a headphone one, and so likely much less robust as well.

Obsolete technology.

[jcr]

Apple's not shy about abandoning it. Floppies, ADB, SCSI, Firewire, PCMCIA, etc..

-jcr

Re:Obsolete technology.

[mccalli]

I agree but in this case I might well add on one more - Lightning. USB C is the ubiquitous choice now and whilst lightning does have a few advantages (I prefer the physical connector for instance) I think it's likely time to just go USB C full time.

I also think that solves a lot of the "no headphone jack" issues - you could then have your wireless ones, but also there would be USB C ones from many manufacturers and sold without adapters. Whether it solves the issue in a manner that Apple would actually like it to is a different matter of course.

Re:Obsolete technology.

[JustNiz]

That's because in those instances something better came along.
I don;t see 3.5mm jacks are obsolete tech. Bluetooth is a step backwards. More reliant on batteries, less secure, lower sound quality. Where's the upside?

Re:Obsolete technology.

[LynnwoodRooster]

Lightning is a terrible connector. The reason is the pins are in the phone - not the cable. The cable has all the fixed parts, while the pins (the bending contact springs) are in the phone. The parts of connectors that break/fail are the pins - either they get bent the wrong way, or dirt gets trapped underneath them and they no longer function. The pins belong on the cable, and the fixed parts belong on the phone. The phone is a LOT more difficult and expensive to fix/repair than a cable. The Lightning connector was designed backwards - but it definitely makes a "visual cue" about what connector you're using!

Re:Obsolete technology.

[fred6666]

Apple was the one who kept the obsolete Firewire the longest. It had no peripherals, except a few overpriced Lacie drives with no benefit over USB2.
Floppies were abandoned by Apple when they were still being used, so it was a bad move. They should have waited a few more years.

ADB wasn't used by anyone but Apple, so it was obselete from day 1.
SCSI was too expensive and had no benefit over IDE/SATA for the average desktop computer. Like Firewire, Apple was late on this switch by picking the wrong horse.

I can't remember when Apple abandoned PCMCIA/cardbus/expresscard thought so I won't comment this one. The only thing is that I remember it was useful when WiFi was not built-in to laptops.

In the end, Apple has definitely NOT been a leader in ports/connectivity. On the contrary, they still push obsolete technologies such as Lightning. It's a good thing we have choice other than Apple to drive innovation, and standards.

Re:Obsolete technology.

[LynnwoodRooster]

Yes, you can ship a lot of crappy product! Isn't that what the Apple Faithful always say about Android and Windows PCs? The facts are the same - it's a poorly designed connector, you don't put the moving/delicate parts on the expensive-to-fix side of the connection.

This would be Ok if there was a decent replacement

[iamacat]

Bluetooth headphones run out of battery and don't work in a family with X devices, Y earbuds and expectation of using headphones interchangably without complex/flaky pairing. USB-C headphones would work if they were inexpensive and had an an extra jack to charge the cellphone while playing audio. You have created a problem without solving one of a comparible importance.

Re:The road to Hell...

[war4peace]

Use it as a mobile PC.
I take my Note 9 and Samsung DEX phone cradle with me, with a TKL wireless keyboard and a wireless mouse and an HDMI cable. I am yet to encounter a decent hotel room without a HDMI-enabled TV.
The line between smartphones and laptops is now close to indistinguishable.

Surveillance

[mrwireless]

The reason I will never use a bluetooth headphone is that I don't want to be emanating a wireless signal as I move around town. Bluetooth and wireless tracking is everywhere now.

It's weird how Apple champions privacy, yet decided everyone should send out a wireless signal if they want to listen to music.

And yes, Apple's implementation rotates the bluetooth mac to different mac-addresses. Still, that doesn't make me feel comfortable. Perhaps Apple realised that after the GDPR went into effect they might become vulnerable to lawsuits for not applying Privacy By Design principles, so they rushed it through before then.

Samsung has never implemented that MAC address randomization feature. Bluetooth 4 and above actually supports this as a privacy feature, but last time I checked Samsung hasn't implemented it.

If the Samsung A8 doesn't support mac randomization someone in Europe should sue Samsung using the GDPR.

Re:The road to Hell...

[war4peace]

Wow, I must be living in the future.
I'm using full Office Suite (for Android) and Office365 Online, as well as Google office suite (Docs, Sheets). I'm using browser-based enterprise apps, attend audio/video meetings, play multimedia files, including high definition movies, all on Android. Amazing, isn't it?

Re:Dont care about app UI

[AmiMoJo]

Most phones with notches let you "disable" the cut out by shrinking the screen a little so that it's just the rectangular area under it. Works with every app, at least on Android (have not looked at iOS). So at the very worst you end up with a screen just like it would have been had they not bothered with a notch and simply reserved the top area for sensors.

Re:The road to Hell...

[markdavis]

You are correct. None of the non-Play models have removable batteries.

I changed my mind..

[Junta]

I thought "eh big deal, it will come with a dongle" when I got a phone without a headphone jack.

After actually having to live with it for a year, it has been far more annoying than I realized it would be.

I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[fred6666]

However, at some point I agree it might become obsolete. Just not in 2016. So there is nothing wrong mocking Apple for doing so.
Apple also killed the floppy drive too early. I remember my college had a computer lab full of iMacs, each with an expensive USB floppy drive adapter. Just because everybody followed (since floppy became obsolete) doesn't mean Apple was right to do it so early.

Re:I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[TheFakeTimCook]

However, at some point I agree it might become obsolete. Just not in 2016. So there is nothing wrong mocking Apple for doing so.
Apple also killed the floppy drive too early. I remember my college had a computer lab full of iMacs, each with an expensive USB floppy drive adapter. Just because everybody followed (since floppy became obsolete) doesn't mean Apple was right to do it so early.

But if Apple didn't push people into adopting new tech, who would?

Re:I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[fred6666]

It was a bad purchase decision to buy iMacs without floppy drives when they first came out. Floppy drives would have disappeared with or without Apple, mostly because of USB thumb drives. We don't need new tech to be pushed down our throat. We need it to be good enough so that we choose to use it instead of the old one.

Re:I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[TheFakeTimCook]

It was a bad purchase decision to buy iMacs without floppy drives when they first came out. Floppy drives would have disappeared with or without Apple, mostly because of USB thumb drives. We don't need new tech to be pushed down our throat. We need it to be good enough so that we choose to use it instead of the old one.

Strawman argument.

Why? Because there NEVER would have BEEN USB Thumb Drives in the first place, if not for Apple and the iMac.

Proof? USB Ports had been on EVERY Wintel motherboard for YEARS with virtually NOTHING to plug into them... UNTIL THE IMAC CAME ALONG.

Sorry. You stepped in it big time.

Now deflect with something offtopic like complaining about my use of Caps instead of ridiculous manual HTML tags for emphasis.

Re:I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[fred6666]

Strawman argument.

Why? Because there NEVER would have BEEN USB Thumb Drives in the first place, if not for Apple and the iMac.

HAHA good one.

Proof? USB Ports had been on EVERY Wintel motherboard for YEARS with virtually NOTHING to plug into them... UNTIL THE IMAC CAME ALONG.

That's hardly a proof. http://tylervigen.com/spurious...

Re:I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[TheFakeTimCook]

Strawman argument.

Why? Because there NEVER would have BEEN USB Thumb Drives in the first place, if not for Apple and the iMac.

HAHA good one.

Proof? USB Ports had been on EVERY Wintel motherboard for YEARS with virtually NOTHING to plug into them... UNTIL THE IMAC CAME ALONG.

That's hardly a proof. http://tylervigen.com/spurious...

I applaud your healthy skepticism; however, in this case, the vast majority of non-Apple-Hating tech experts would agree that Apple, through the iMac, pretty much singlehandedly put USB "on the map".

https://www.macworld.com/artic...

" Apple Inc.'s iMac was the first mainstream product with USB and the iMac's success popularized USB itself.[12] Following Apple's design decision to remove all legacy port from the iMac, many PC manufacturers began building legacy-free PCs, which led to the broader PC market using USB as a standard.[13][14][15]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Citations from above:

12. "Eight ways the iMac changed computing". Macworld. 15 August 2008. Archived from the original on 22 December 2011. Retrieved 5 September 2017.

13. "Compaq hopes to follow the iMac". Archived from the original on 22 October 2006.

14. "The PC Follows iMac's Lead". Business week. 1999. Archived from the original on 23 September 2015.

15. Popular Mechanics: Making Connections. Hearst Magazines. February 2001. p. 59. ISSN 0032-4558. Archived from the original on 15 February 2017.

So, no; in this particular case, the consensus is that the iMac made USB into a viable alternative to parallel and RS-232 Serial (as well as other buses, such as ADB) interfaces popular at the time.

And considering that USB Thumb Drives first appeared on the market in 2000, it is fairly certain that, if the iMac had not come along and, through its popularity, given USB the critical "push" it needed to get past the "chicken and egg" problem faced by every new technology, those USB Thumb Drives would certainly not happened in 2000, and likely not until much, much later.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Heck, I'm sure that you remember: While Apple was just a few months from launching the iMac, Microsoft couldn't so much as plug in a USB SCANNER without Blue-Screening W '98, even though Windows advertises USB Support as early as W '95 OSR2.1!

https://www.theregister.co.uk/...

And, BTW, note that Windows didn't even HAVE Storage Device USB Support until W '98 SE (May, 1999). AFAIK, Apple supported Storage-Class Devices from the first release of the iMac in August, 1998 (running (Classic) MacOS 8.1 !!!).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

...and let's not even talk about Linux's sad and late adoption of USB. It wasn't even added until the 2.2 Kernel in 1999, although that was experimental support. Mainstream USB support wasn't really available in Linux until the 2.4 Kernel was released in 2001:

https://kernel.readthedocs.io/...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

And even now, USB and Linux is sometimes an exercise in frustration (but I guess that applies to all things Linux, doesn't it?)

https://www.google.com/search?...

Re:I still think the 3.5mm is useful

[fred6666]

The price of flash memory would have reduced with or without Apple and this is what allowed USB thumb drives to exist.
Apple strongly pushed for external ZIP disk drives and it failed. Just because Apple pushes something doesn't make it a success. Removing the floppy from the first iMac was still a mistake, like it or not.

Do not confuse your fanboyism for any hate on my side.

Re:Yeah well then

[TheFakeTimCook]

Do they glue the battery in too?

I know you are trying to mock Apple; but iPhones haven't had a GLUED-in battery for several years now.

They use release-able adhesive strips, much like the 3M "Command" adhesive. They RELEASE when you grab the end of the strip and stretch it.

The best of both worlds: A non-hardware-fastener way to secure the battery, with the ability to easily change the battery if/when needed.

Re:Dont care about app UI

[jareth-0205]

How many users of phones without notches or holes drilled though the screen are going to have to suffer with unusable screen space on their phones due to app developers and content developers having to develop for the lowest common denominator. Were pretty much getting to the point you have to assume the edges of 5-10% of a phone's screen are unusable because you dont know what kind of notch, hole, curved corner or other bullshit might be in the screen.

So much for a bezel free phone, when now that 5-10% of the screen itself is now the bezel and has to be assumed to be unusable, lest some part of your content gets cut off.

Clearly you aren't a developer, and are talking out of your arse, or you'd know this sort of stuff is easy to deal with.

https://developer.android.com/...

Re:Samesung

[DontBeAMoran]

And Samsung is singing the same song as Apple, only one or two years later.

Re: Yeah well then

[sound vision]

So, when I go to the Brainiac Grove or Consumer Nirvana or whatever they call it this year, I expect they will show me where the easy toolless release for the battery cover is, and let me buy a couple extra battery packs to have on hand, right?

Wait a minute, silly me, I overlooked the bravery, the principles at play here... It's adhesive strips, not glue! What a game changer - Android manufacturers better watch out, once consumers hear about Apple's new adhesive strips, their marketshare will be on the downturn...

Re:When will Android manufacturers stop copying Ap

[iampiti]

Yeah, stupid thing to copy, the notch too. Why do they insist on copying the worst Apple ideas?

Headslap, you don't understand the problem solved.

[SuperKendall]

Laptops with cheap flimsy power cords

If power cords were actually flimsy then MagSafe would not be needed.

Magsafe is to solve a problem you apparently did not realize existed - to stop tripping over cords pulling laptops down onto the floor.

So in fact your "sturdy" power cords are WORSE for that problem.

Incorrect

[SuperKendall]

Apple obviously does not agree because they have gotten rid of it.

Wrong. They just find the value of an extra USB-C port MORE useful than MagSafe. Possibly they are correct.

But just because they moved to something else does not mean they didn't find the older standard useful. Please study logic.

You realize that even Apple's own laptops (prior to their current lineup) did indeed have more than one kind of port,

Sigh. Please learn to think. Again, value of extra USB-C port > MagSafe. Obviously.

Re:Incorrect

[exomondo]

Apple obviously does not agree because they have gotten rid of it.

Wrong. They just find the value of an extra USB-C port MORE useful than MagSafe. Possibly they are correct.

But just because they moved to something else does not mean they didn't find the older standard useful. Please study logic.

Don't be such a condescending dickhead with your "please study logic" nonsense, it just demonstrates your inability to make a coherent argument. Clearly if they thought it had value they would have added it, either by having 4 USB-C ports + magsafe or eliminating one USB-C port and replacing it with magsafe.

Re:Headslap, you don't understand the problem solv

[fluffernutter]

Well, I prefer to use a laptop on my lap in bed. I don't like it when you can't because the power cord keeps coming out in that position.

To paraphrase an Apple ad...

[SoundGuyNoise]

Wired headphones. They just work.

Re:To paraphrase an Apple ad...

[Tony Isaac]

Well, sort of. Wired headphones tend to develop crackling static when the wires get jostled. The wires often do break when used for a while. I'm no fan of Bluetooth headphones, but wired headphones do have their own issues.

So what? Nobody cares.

[mschuyler]

The A8 is the model for China. If they axe the jack on the upcoming S10, let's talk, but the lack of one on the A8 is not relevant in the US.

Re:Jack? Jack who?

[michelcolman]

Looks like they have a death wish if they mocked Erik Apple.

Re:Yeah well then

[michelcolman]

I wouldn't be worried as long as they still include a floppy drive.

Re:We've been seeing this for years

[Jetstream]

I think this comes under the heading of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". A headphone is such a universal accessory that I would argue there is NO GOOD EXCUSE for removing this jack unless they can provide something better. A proprietary dongle or bluetooth wireless is *not* something I would consider a better option. Maybe they're doing this so they can make phones that are even thinner, but I just don't see myself ever buying a phone that doesn't have a headphone jack.

Re:So, I mocked bluetooth headphones and...

[Jetstream]

Likewise, I don't see myself buying any phone without a headphone jack in the near future. Think the two of us will have the buying power to force the manufacturers to change their minds? :)

I also refuse to lug around a frigging "phablet" too. My phone is still an old Motorola Moto G. Don't know what I'm going to do when quit making decent phones at 5" & under.

Re: Yeah well then

[TheFakeTimCook]

So, when I go to the Brainiac Grove or Consumer Nirvana or whatever they call it this year, I expect they will show me where the easy toolless release for the battery cover is, and let me buy a couple extra battery packs to have on hand, right?

Wait a minute, silly me, I overlooked the bravery, the principles at play here... It's adhesive strips, not glue! What a game changer - Android manufacturers better watch out, once consumers hear about Apple's new adhesive strips, their marketshare will be on the downturn...

Nice snarkiness; but I wasn't trying to say that replacing globs of obnoxious, hard-to-release glue with a couple of pieces of essentially high-tech double-sided tape was groundbreaking or earth-shattering; but it was an huge advance in repairability over the glob-o'-glue method, and, IMHO, was a meme that needed to be put to rest.

Re:The road to Hell...

[Cmdln Daco]

Anybody who the situation is explained to, or who runs butt up against restrictions, will opt for open hardware. Not just zealots.

Re:The road to Hell...

[war4peace]

The Samsung DEX is small. The cable is a must even when using a laptop, IMO, because laptops have small screens. The phone is something I carry anyway so it doesn't count. That leaves the keyboard and mouse, and then again, I have to use a mouse, was never able to get used to the laptop embedded crap.

I really miss

[ennis99]

I really miss the days when we only had to use normal headphones ____________________________________________________ https://downloader.vip/torrent... https://downloader.vip/vpn/ https://tutuappx.com/