Here in the capital of Norway, Oslo, all new buildings [where available] are required to use the surplus heat from powerplants (District Heating). The building I live in was constructed just a year ago and since the pipes ran down this street it was obviously going to be connected. Now my apartment is always nice and cosy throughout the long and cold Scandinavian winters. And the best part is that I don't pay anything for the heat - my electricity bills hardly register!:)
Your point is well taken - and that's why Europe has chosen to use Russian technology: ESA has entered into a 340 million euro joint venture with the Russian Federal Space Agency over the use of the Soyuz launcher. Under the agreement, the Russian agency will manufacture Soyuz rocket parts for ESA, which will then be shipped to French Guiana for assembly. ESA benefits because it gains a medium payloads launcher, complementing its fleet while saving on development costs. In addition, the Soyuz rocket -- which has been the Russian's space launch workhorse for some 40 years -- is proven technology with a good safety record, which ESA might be happy to use for launching humans into space.
I don't know if you are European or not - I guess not since you haven't heard of these people. Although I admit one or two were not familiar to me most of them were. I have no professional interest in the EU - in fact I don't even live in the EU. I guess I just read more news than you?
We've had this kind of register for some time now here in Norway and the same rules apply i.e. telemarketers can't call you unless there is a previous relationship. It works great if you just remember to register everyone in your household of legal age. My existing "relationships" have not been abused and they're not likely to be. The law gives the consumer agency semi-effective means of punishing any offenders (fines/jail time). It's really only the very small, less serious companies that break the law - and they're not easily persuaded to stop.
The great thing about living in a small country is that you do NOT get bothered by foreign telemarketing companies because they can't break through the language barrier! Now the truth is that most Norwegians speak english quite well - more than enough to understand telemarketing calls - but thank God the telemarketers don't know that:) On the other hand most people would probably not accept deals offered in a foreign language anyway. Although recently there was this Florida-based American telemarketing company scamming people with offers of holidays to the Caribbean if you wouldn't mind handing over your Visa account number... Yes, several people fell for it.
Another great thing about the language barrier is that when a recent phishing scam appeared aimed at customers of a large norwegian bank - most people laughed it off since the e-mail was written in english... And there are no translation services on the net for the language that will work properly, hehe.
Realizing that you're a huge troll I still think you need a reply since most people will believe your "facts". No, Germans don't have to accept jobs at brothels. The case you're refering to was actually a matter of the right to post the jobs on the lists of the public employment agency.
You don't know squat about the European Union - it's not responsible for religious freedoms, that's actually a matter of national sovereignty. We also have the common European Human Rights Convention maintained by the Council of Europe organization - which is not associated with the EU.
In France it's illegal to use the 'hijab' covering one's hair [in school] not the tentlike 'burka'. And being a just nation of equal rights no other religion is given preference - so no religious symbol is allowed *in school* if it's deemed excessive and provocative. In fact religion is considered so private they're not allowed to collect statistics on the subject. On the other hand the government of France funds national Christian, Jewish and Muslim organizations.
The European Human Rights convention and it's additional protocols (optional) give European citizens [regardless of European Union membership] a far greater catalogue of civil rights than any U.S. American citizen will ever have. Your attack on France is quite ironic considering the French constitution is based upon the ideals of the American revolution. Don't forget that the British are also European Union members - do you consider them any less free?
No, I believe most European view the US a bastion of brainwashed religious fanatics fighting to create their own version of the Iranian Islamic Republic. It's fun to watch Americans criticize other nations for lack of freedoms - when in fact the only freedom you have left is the right to shout your support for your current regime. In more and more ways your nation is becoming more and more alike what your nation opposes. "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety". - I would say you're well on your way to loosing all of them. But then again nobody notices until it's too late.
The European Union constitution was not approved and as such the matter of including references to Christianity has not been settled. I guess you don't know as much as you thought you did?
It's not really news at all - I mean the European Space Agency has understood the value of Russian engineering done decades ago and simply decided that it was the better choice over spending vast sums of money on try-and-fail schemes. Even more interesting is: "In 2007 a Soyuz launcher will take off from Europe's Spaceport in French Guiana (South America). This will be an historic event as it will be the first time that a Soyuz launcher lifts off from a spaceport other than Baikonur or Plesetsk. It will also be a milestone in the strategic cooperation between Europe and Russia in the launcher's sector."
I believe the issue is control over something that is hugely important to commerce in every country today and in the future. Now, we've seen how bad the US legal system can be - and what views the US has on many issues (biotech, creationism, pornography etc) are often not acceptable to other countries. American legal action against what we consider to be free speech scares me - we actually believe in having freedoms not just paying lip service to them. So when the US controls something that could effectively restrict our sovereign rights as free nations we tend to take that seriously. The European Union is simply saying that's it's not fair that the US should have control over how European nations run *their* part of the Internet. Now, I would like to see it simply split apart and the EU putting up it's own root servers - that would be the easiest solution. It's not about taking it away from the US as much as giving us control over our part. And that's something most people would agree is fair, isn't it?
No, our system is quite nice really compared to the US. Being a lawyer I might be biased - but I believe we have a just and fair system for our citizens. Big companies don't enjoy any special rights here - other than having the money to hire the best lawyers. Public defenders are not that bad at all. And there is significant support from the government should you need legal help - it will only cost money if you want to hire something above the level of a qualified representative. It's free if you can't afford to pay for legal assistance [when defending yourself]. If you want to take an issue to court it's another matter - then again it's your choice and your risk.
Of course they didn't go after him using US law - it has no value in Norway. As a sovereign nation we do not accept any other source of laws other than our own. I'm asking myself what you could be thinking of - we're an independent European nation. I have law degree and I know my own country quite well.
The only other source of laws we have is the European Union which we subscribe to under a special free trade agreement.
I'm Norwegian and I've never heard that before - I think they're just mixing in Irish folklore out of ignorance. My impression based upon on our stories is that Trolls are always extremely large (as in mountain sized) - and they're not to be confused with the dwarfs called "nisser" (plural). Trolls are often featured in our fairytales where they are semi-evil monsters that will kidnap a princess - that the brave young man will liberate [and later marry gaining half the kingdom]. All of the Scandinavian countries are still monarchies.
A "Nisse" is similar to a leprechaun - though not the same. Nisser are an integral part of our Christmas traditions, Juletid (am. "yuletide") or simply "Jul". Remember this holiday is based upon our pagan belief system - and was only adopted/coopted by the Christian church. Don't confuse the nisse with Santa Claus - he's not a part of our ancient culture. One tradition involving the nisse is to put out a bowl of porridge (traditional) on Christmas Eve or else... you don't challenge the nisse(r)! They can be kind, bad or simply naughty. On the farm they could "problems". Today they're displayed everywhere come Christmas time - from garden gnomes to illustrations. I hope I managed to communicate the difference between the American and Scandinavian Christmas.
> First, Bosnia nad Herzegovina is not a Muslim nation but a multiconfessional nation Read my post again - it says "largely Muslim"... in other words not all.
> Second, Turks did not FORCE anyone to convert, You seem to both disagree and agree with me on that, don't you? It still holds true that Turkey attacked and colonized the Balkans. I sympathize with Austria and strongly disapprove of letting Turkey in the backdoor after we kicked them out the last time.
>MAJOR modern, young, vibrant, righteous... blah You do know that the Christian church is still the world's largest? I don't know what you mean by 'major' in this sense. Perhaps you meant larger than some minor church in Bosnia? It's of no importance regardless.
>Turks are nowadays (and for some time now) more European then some former Otoman Empire parts west Exactly what is European? In my opinion that's for us Europeans to decide - and Turkey's not part of that community no matter what it wants to believe. If the Turkish army let their guard down the true face of the Justice and Development party would be revealed. As much as the well educated population of western Turkey might want to belong to a secular nation - I believe the truth is that a majority of Turks would rather have a more religious state. Religion is important here because a modern European nation is not ruled by such laws. The people are not European in geograpical terms either - when did the Turkmen (as in all of them) people suddenly discover their Europeaness? They have more in common with people to the east of Turkey. Face it, it's just a project that Ataturk in his foolishness invented to develop the country. Good for Turkey, but we're not interested.
>in some fields they dwarf even some of the "old How can they dwarf anyone when the question is if they are European or not? You cannot eliminate another European country - it's not that kind of game. It's either a European nation or it's not. What you think of the matter is of course not important since you're not European, from our point of view Turkey is not a European nation in any sense. Turkey doesn't take part in any of our cultural traditions and heritage - Christianity is central to the European spirit. It's where our values are founded and our laws built upon. No, I'm sorry to say that Turkey cannot ever become European - even by emulating us they'll always be outsiders.
>the bridge is nonsense Right you are - they're not a bridge to the Muslim world. They're not even Arabs. So what does the US accomplish by forcing Turkey down Europe's throat? It gets to keep it's bases from which it can mount attacks on neighbouring countries. It has nothing to do with what Europe wants or needs - it's just America looking out for number #1.
>their potencial future economic and even technological/scientific contribution to Europe is not to be dismissed as insignificant. I'm not saying they are insignificant - I'm just saying that I don't see Turkey a part of my Union. Trade is the least of my worries - it's about creating social unity so that we can move on forwards. The European Union is destined to become a federal nation - and I don't see it ever bordering Iraq/Iran. The US will continue to push for Turkey, but in the end Turkey will be rejected not only by the people but also the governments of Europe.
No, of course, you don't see it. That's because Britain is just that little bit different from the rest of Europe. Are you really a part of Europe? You have a much more [non-European] multi-cultural society than most. Do you remember that total flop you sent to the Eurovision competition - Europe hated it, Britain loved it. For other reasons I believe that De Gaulle was right, the UK should never have become a member. You have far more in common with the US - culturally and politically. Perhaps you agree with me?
It's not Islam that's the problem - because I believe the largely Muslim Bosnia and Herzegovina should become a member. However that's a clear cut case of a European nation, clearly within the borders of what I consider Europe. Do you know why Bosnia is a Muslim nation? Turkey invaded that part of Europe - colonized and forced the population to convert. Of course that's not an argument against Turkey today - it's just an explanation why a Muslim nation is not incompatible with a European identity. Turkey has never had any European identity at all. I respect Islam and Muslims - however it's not a concern or part of the European Union project. That's what our Neighbourhood project is for.
You got it seriously wrong on that one - it's not the heads of state that dislike/hate Eastern Europe at all - it's the populace! People don't like the idea of cheap "Eastern" European labour undercutting their wages. The governments on the other hand love the idea of the economic turbulence they imagine is "development". Even worse the governments accept US/UK influence on the Turkish issue.
The Central and Eastern European countries that joined the EU have always been central to European culture - it's only the last 50 years behind the Iron Curtain that stopped them. Personally I welcome them back into the fold as valued Europeans - unlike the Turkish hordes once again attempting to invade and conquer Europe. When, oh when, will they get it into their heads that they're Asians Most Europeans would take Romania/Bulgaria [into the EU] over Turkey any time! The EU is not only a trading block - we're a cultural union as well. That's why we cannot accept the "bridge between the Muslim and Western world"-argument. We're not in the business of developing Asia/the Middle-East/North Africa under the EU umbrella. Turkey should look to it's neighbours for economic success, I'm sure they'll do well (seriously).
Obviously you don't know that Russia is now a democratic nation - far more so than the US! Why should I care what you spent here? We're not responsible for your spending after all. You really should look at the map again, why else would I suggest Russia? It's close to Europe in every aspect - in politics, culture and race. Why should we align ourselves with the extreme right wing nuts of the US Republican party? No, thank you. We're not inclined to believe in "intelligent design" and we don't fear sex. You my friend have a very "sick" country to deal with. What Europe needs is a strong partner (militarily) who agrees with us - Russia in other words.. (and not the US).
If you don't agree, don't move to Europe. And why should you care/meddle in our affairs anyway? I don't care that you "saved" France or any other European country. You didn't do it alone, the US didn't even enter the war till it was raging and the Germans had their hands full with Russians and Brits! We don't owe you anything!
That's not my point at all - the point is that whatever we buy will have to suit our needs/tastes or else. In that manner it will be decided here. The market always decides.
No, it might not be decided here (though Linus Torvalds sure made some impact with this thing called Linux). And sure the world might not revolve around Europe's 700+ million people - yet I believe that everyone out there will still be very interested in our purchasing power none the less. So go ahead market your product without European "support"... I like my SuSE installation(s).
For exactly those reasons I said I believe, the community of scientists that claim, there IS a link. It will always be a battle of experts on the matter - hard to claim absolute truths, of course. However I must say your man does not make a good impression. He doesn't come off as objective at all, why should I believe this "expert" over any other?
To me it seems the world is experiencing more disasters now then it used to (from what I've read) - it would be prudent to take it seriously and at least try to reduce the damage inflicted on our ecosystem. Even if global warming isn't on the top of your agenda - your children's health should be. It's been proven that children suffer greatly from exposure to pollution - everything from ADHD to allergies. And European laws are far ahead.
P.S. I'm a conservative and in no way green/socialist. A clean environment is a requirement for a productive society.
I had not seen it - in fact that's not the way media portrayed it here. I certainly understand your feelings, it was not the time and place. However his views on the matter are far from uncommon - I heard the same remarks from people I know. It shocked me to hear them say it - some said it with glee or jokingly: "That serves them right for their environmental policies".
I actually agree, I believe the world community of scientists have said that there is a link between the increase in natural disasters/weather conditions and pollution. So it would perhaps be a fitting reminder to a certain president that the Kyoto protocols and other initiatives are not just for fun. We need to change, all of us. We have seen the ill effects in Europe as well, don't know how much you've heard of them? People died here as well. Of course I regret the loss of life, however it's a potent reminder and perhaps the catalyst the US needs? In that sense I agree that you "deserve" it. You can not isolate yourselves from these global issues.
P.S. My feelings on US-EU relations remain and are independent of this discussion - Europe has remained under US influence too long. Similar to a long marriage - we've grown apart.
I remember every European nation (including the really poor ones!) offering people, doctors, search teams, money and food/blankets! What didn't we do!? The public donated money to the Red Cross - and we ALL felt sorry for those poor people!
My country gave money, search teams, equipment and offered oil assistance - the US administration told us to wait.
I once cared greatly for the US - now I realize I must have been wrong. I for one hope we/Europe cut all ties with the US. NATO should die and the EU should align itself with Russia.
I think you can safely call the French a paragon of free speech! After all where do you think those ideals came from? Some people forget quickly:
French Revolution Looking to the United States Declaration of Independence for a model, on August 26, 1789, the Assembly published the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen. Like the U.S. Declaration, it comprised a statement of principles rather than a constitution with legal effect.
Causes of the French Revolution include the following: # Bad economical situation, partly because of France's involvement and aid in the American Revolution. # Resentment of seigneurialism by peasants, wage-earners, and, to a lesser extent, the bourgeoisie # Resentment at noble privilege and dominance in public life by the ambitious professional classes. # Influence of the American Revolution.
So far all of my installations of both 9.3 and 10 have been painless. On the different machines I have installed it my Windows installations have continued working perfectly afterwards. I was a bit skeptical about letting SuSE partition and resize my NTFS volumes [to make room for SuSE] however it worked perfectly for me. Now I hardly ever use Windows, except for those few special business applications, and SuSE works like a charm.
The three largest contributors in august 2005 are: 1. Pakistan (9,881) 2. Bangladesh (8,812) 3. India (6,321).. 21. France (600)... 29. USA (334)
To spell it out for you - France contributes almost twice as many! What's really interesting is that the top three nations are all neighbours - and used to belong to the same British controlled territory (India) - and are Muslim nations or have large populations of Muslims (present day India). Oh, and they're not exactly as rich as the US...
I'm sure you could find other sources to improve on these figures however the whole point is still valid - the US is not a large contributor compared with the rest of the world. The world is not incapable of functioning just because it's poor/undeveloped. Of course the US pays for a lot of it, but that's another matter isn't it?
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Here in the capital of Norway, Oslo, all new buildings [where available] are required to use the surplus heat from powerplants (District Heating). The building I live in was constructed just a year ago and since the pipes ran down this street it was obviously going to be connected. Now my apartment is always nice and cosy throughout the long and cold Scandinavian winters. And the best part is that I don't pay anything for the heat - my electricity bills hardly register! :)
Your point is well taken - and that's why Europe has chosen to use Russian technology:
ESA has entered into a 340 million euro joint venture with the Russian Federal Space Agency over the use of the Soyuz launcher. Under the agreement, the Russian agency will manufacture Soyuz rocket parts for ESA, which will then be shipped to French Guiana for assembly. ESA benefits because it gains a medium payloads launcher, complementing its fleet while saving on development costs. In addition, the Soyuz rocket -- which has been the Russian's space launch workhorse for some 40 years -- is proven technology with a good safety record, which ESA might be happy to use for launching humans into space.
This cooperation is well on it's way - this week they used a Soyuz vehicle to launch the successfull ESA mission "Venus Express".
I don't know if you are European or not - I guess not since you haven't heard of these people. Although I admit one or two were not familiar to me most of them were. I have no professional interest in the EU - in fact I don't even live in the EU. I guess I just read more news than you?
We've had this kind of register for some time now here in Norway and the same rules apply i.e. telemarketers can't call you unless there is a previous relationship. It works great if you just remember to register everyone in your household of legal age. My existing "relationships" have not been abused and they're not likely to be. The law gives the consumer agency semi-effective means of punishing any offenders (fines/jail time). It's really only the very small, less serious companies that break the law - and they're not easily persuaded to stop.
:) On the other hand most people would probably not accept deals offered in a foreign language anyway. Although recently there was this Florida-based American telemarketing company scamming people with offers of holidays to the Caribbean if you wouldn't mind handing over your Visa account number... Yes, several people fell for it.
The great thing about living in a small country is that you do NOT get bothered by foreign telemarketing companies because they can't break through the language barrier! Now the truth is that most Norwegians speak english quite well - more than enough to understand telemarketing calls - but thank God the telemarketers don't know that
Another great thing about the language barrier is that when a recent phishing scam appeared aimed at customers of a large norwegian bank - most people laughed it off since the e-mail was written in english... And there are no translation services on the net for the language that will work properly, hehe.
I think you should reconsider that statement - after all I think the EU nations run their parts well enough - it's not all run from the US you know?
Realizing that you're a huge troll I still think you need a reply since most people will believe your "facts".
No, Germans don't have to accept jobs at brothels. The case you're refering to was actually a matter of the right to post the jobs on the lists of the public employment agency.
You don't know squat about the European Union - it's not responsible for religious freedoms, that's actually a matter of national sovereignty. We also have the common European Human Rights Convention maintained by the Council of Europe organization - which is not associated with the EU.
In France it's illegal to use the 'hijab' covering one's hair [in school] not the tentlike 'burka'. And being a just nation of equal rights no other religion is given preference - so no religious symbol is allowed *in school* if it's deemed excessive and provocative. In fact religion is considered so private they're not allowed to collect statistics on the subject. On the other hand the government of France funds national Christian, Jewish and Muslim organizations.
The European Human Rights convention and it's additional protocols (optional) give European citizens [regardless of European Union membership] a far greater catalogue of civil rights than any U.S. American citizen will ever have. Your attack on France is quite ironic considering the French constitution is based upon the ideals of the American revolution. Don't forget that the British are also European Union members - do you consider them any less free?
No, I believe most European view the US a bastion of brainwashed religious fanatics fighting to create their own version of the Iranian Islamic Republic. It's fun to watch Americans criticize other nations for lack of freedoms - when in fact the only freedom you have left is the right to shout your support for your current regime. In more and more ways your nation is becoming more and more alike what your nation opposes. "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety". - I would say you're well on your way to loosing all of them. But then again nobody notices until it's too late.
The European Union constitution was not approved and as such the matter of including references to Christianity has not been settled. I guess you don't know as much as you thought you did?
It's not really news at all - I mean the European Space Agency has understood the value of Russian engineering done decades ago and simply decided that it was the better choice over spending vast sums of money on try-and-fail schemes. Even more interesting is: "In 2007 a Soyuz launcher will take off from Europe's Spaceport in French Guiana (South America). This will be an historic event as it will be the first time that a Soyuz launcher lifts off from a spaceport other than Baikonur or Plesetsk. It will also be a milestone in the strategic cooperation between Europe and Russia in the launcher's sector."
I believe the issue is control over something that is hugely important to commerce in every country today and in the future. Now, we've seen how bad the US legal system can be - and what views the US has on many issues (biotech, creationism, pornography etc) are often not acceptable to other countries. American legal action against what we consider to be free speech scares me - we actually believe in having freedoms not just paying lip service to them. So when the US controls something that could effectively restrict our sovereign rights as free nations we tend to take that seriously. The European Union is simply saying that's it's not fair that the US should have control over how European nations run *their* part of the Internet. Now, I would like to see it simply split apart and the EU putting up it's own root servers - that would be the easiest solution. It's not about taking it away from the US as much as giving us control over our part. And that's something most people would agree is fair, isn't it?
Says a *descendant* of those very same Europeans that settled in America... Hope you don't mind the Native Americans taking their land back?
P.S. We really did fuck up the on North American continent I must say. Just look at that mess!
No, our system is quite nice really compared to the US. Being a lawyer I might be biased - but I believe we have a just and fair system for our citizens. Big companies don't enjoy any special rights here - other than having the money to hire the best lawyers. Public defenders are not that bad at all. And there is significant support from the government should you need legal help - it will only cost money if you want to hire something above the level of a qualified representative. It's free if you can't afford to pay for legal assistance [when defending yourself]. If you want to take an issue to court it's another matter - then again it's your choice and your risk.
Of course they didn't go after him using US law - it has no value in Norway. As a sovereign nation we do not accept any other source of laws other than our own. I'm asking myself what you could be thinking of - we're an independent European nation. I have law degree and I know my own country quite well.
The only other source of laws we have is the European Union which we subscribe to under a special free trade agreement.
The European Space Agency will participate in Russia`s new Kliper manned shuttle program.
I'm Norwegian and I've never heard that before - I think they're just mixing in Irish folklore out of ignorance.
My impression based upon on our stories is that Trolls are always extremely large (as in mountain sized) - and they're not to be confused with the dwarfs called "nisser" (plural). Trolls are often featured in our fairytales where they are semi-evil monsters that will kidnap a princess - that the brave young man will liberate [and later marry gaining half the kingdom]. All of the Scandinavian countries are still monarchies.
A "Nisse" is similar to a leprechaun - though not the same. Nisser are an integral part of our Christmas traditions, Juletid (am. "yuletide") or simply "Jul". Remember this holiday is based upon our pagan belief system - and was only adopted/coopted by the Christian church. Don't confuse the nisse with Santa Claus - he's not a part of our ancient culture. One tradition involving the nisse is to put out a bowl of porridge (traditional) on Christmas Eve or else... you don't challenge the nisse(r)! They can be kind, bad or simply naughty. On the farm they could "problems". Today they're displayed everywhere come Christmas time - from garden gnomes to illustrations. I hope I managed to communicate the difference between the American and Scandinavian Christmas.
> First, Bosnia nad Herzegovina is not a Muslim nation but a multiconfessional nation
Read my post again - it says "largely Muslim"... in other words not all.
> Second, Turks did not FORCE anyone to convert,
You seem to both disagree and agree with me on that, don't you? It still holds true that Turkey attacked and colonized the Balkans. I sympathize with Austria and strongly disapprove of letting Turkey in the backdoor after we kicked them out the last time.
>MAJOR modern, young, vibrant, righteous... blah
You do know that the Christian church is still the world's largest? I don't know what you mean by 'major' in this sense. Perhaps you meant larger than some minor church in Bosnia? It's of no importance regardless.
>Turks are nowadays (and for some time now) more European then some former Otoman Empire parts west
Exactly what is European? In my opinion that's for us Europeans to decide - and Turkey's not part of that community no matter what it wants to believe. If the Turkish army let their guard down the true face of the Justice and Development party would be revealed. As much as the well educated population of western Turkey might want to belong to a secular nation - I believe the truth is that a majority of Turks would rather have a more religious state. Religion is important here because a modern European nation is not ruled by such laws. The people are not European in geograpical terms either - when did the Turkmen (as in all of them) people suddenly discover their Europeaness? They have more in common with people to the east of Turkey. Face it, it's just a project that Ataturk in his foolishness invented to develop the country. Good for Turkey, but we're not interested.
>in some fields they dwarf even some of the "old
How can they dwarf anyone when the question is if they are European or not? You cannot eliminate another European country - it's not that kind of game. It's either a European nation or it's not.
What you think of the matter is of course not important since you're not European, from our point of view Turkey is not a European nation in any sense. Turkey doesn't take part in any of our cultural traditions and heritage - Christianity is central to the European spirit. It's where our values are founded and our laws built upon. No, I'm sorry to say that Turkey cannot ever become European - even by emulating us they'll always be outsiders.
>the bridge is nonsense
Right you are - they're not a bridge to the Muslim world. They're not even Arabs. So what does the US accomplish by forcing Turkey down Europe's throat? It gets to keep it's bases from which it can mount attacks on neighbouring countries. It has nothing to do with what Europe wants or needs - it's just America looking out for number #1.
>their potencial future economic and even technological/scientific contribution to Europe is not to be dismissed as insignificant.
I'm not saying they are insignificant - I'm just saying that I don't see Turkey a part of my Union. Trade is the least of my worries - it's about creating social unity so that we can move on forwards. The European Union is destined to become a federal nation - and I don't see it ever bordering Iraq/Iran. The US will continue to push for Turkey, but in the end Turkey will be rejected not only by the people but also the governments of Europe.
No, of course, you don't see it. That's because Britain is just that little bit different from the rest of Europe. Are you really a part of Europe? You have a much more [non-European] multi-cultural society than most. Do you remember that total flop you sent to the Eurovision competition - Europe hated it, Britain loved it. For other reasons I believe that De Gaulle was right, the UK should never have become a member. You have far more in common with the US - culturally and politically. Perhaps you agree with me?
It's not Islam that's the problem - because I believe the largely Muslim Bosnia and Herzegovina should become a member. However that's a clear cut case of a European nation, clearly within the borders of what I consider Europe. Do you know why Bosnia is a Muslim nation? Turkey invaded that part of Europe - colonized and forced the population to convert. Of course that's not an argument against Turkey today - it's just an explanation why a Muslim nation is not incompatible with a European identity. Turkey has never had any European identity at all. I respect Islam and Muslims - however it's not a concern or part of the European Union project. That's what our Neighbourhood project is for.
You got it seriously wrong on that one - it's not the heads of state that dislike/hate Eastern Europe at all - it's the populace! People don't like the idea of cheap "Eastern" European labour undercutting their wages. The governments on the other hand love the idea of the economic turbulence they imagine is "development". Even worse the governments accept US/UK influence on the Turkish issue.
The Central and Eastern European countries that joined the EU have always been central to European culture - it's only the last 50 years behind the Iron Curtain that stopped them. Personally I welcome them back into the fold as valued Europeans - unlike the Turkish hordes once again attempting to invade and conquer Europe. When, oh when, will they get it into their heads that they're Asians Most Europeans would take Romania/Bulgaria [into the EU] over Turkey any time! The EU is not only a trading block - we're a cultural union as well. That's why we cannot accept the "bridge between the Muslim and Western world"-argument. We're not in the business of developing Asia/the Middle-East/North Africa under the EU umbrella. Turkey should look to it's neighbours for economic success, I'm sure they'll do well (seriously).
Obviously you don't know that Russia is now a democratic nation - far more so than the US!
Why should I care what you spent here? We're not responsible for your spending after all.
You really should look at the map again, why else would I suggest Russia? It's close to Europe in every aspect - in politics, culture and race. Why should we align ourselves with the extreme right wing nuts of the US Republican party? No, thank you. We're not inclined to believe in "intelligent design" and we don't fear sex. You my friend have a very "sick" country to deal with. What Europe needs is a strong partner (militarily) who agrees with us - Russia in other words.. (and not the US).
If you don't agree, don't move to Europe. And why should you care/meddle in our affairs anyway? I don't care that you "saved" France or any other European country. You didn't do it alone, the US didn't even enter the war till it was raging and the Germans had their hands full with Russians and Brits! We don't owe you anything!
That's not my point at all - the point is that whatever we buy will have to suit our needs/tastes or else. In that manner it will be decided here. The market always decides.
No, it might not be decided here (though Linus Torvalds sure made some impact with this thing called Linux). And sure the world might not revolve around Europe's 700+ million people - yet I believe that everyone out there will still be very interested in our purchasing power none the less. So go ahead market your product without European "support"... I like my SuSE installation(s).
For exactly those reasons I said I believe, the community of scientists that claim, there IS a link. It will always be a battle of experts on the matter - hard to claim absolute truths, of course. However I must say your man does not make a good impression. He doesn't come off as objective at all, why should I believe this "expert" over any other?
To me it seems the world is experiencing more disasters now then it used to (from what I've read) - it would be prudent to take it seriously and at least try to reduce the damage inflicted on our ecosystem. Even if global warming isn't on the top of your agenda - your children's health should be. It's been proven that children suffer greatly from exposure to pollution - everything from ADHD to allergies. And European laws are far ahead.
P.S. I'm a conservative and in no way green/socialist. A clean environment is a requirement for a productive society.
I had not seen it - in fact that's not the way media portrayed it here. I certainly understand your feelings, it was not the time and place. However his views on the matter are far from uncommon - I heard the same remarks from people I know. It shocked me to hear them say it - some said it with glee or jokingly: "That serves them right for their environmental policies".
I actually agree, I believe the world community of scientists have said that there is a link between the increase in natural disasters/weather conditions and pollution. So it would perhaps be a fitting reminder to a certain president that the Kyoto protocols and other initiatives are not just for fun. We need to change, all of us. We have seen the ill effects in Europe as well, don't know how much you've heard of them? People died here as well. Of course I regret the loss of life, however it's a potent reminder and perhaps the catalyst the US needs? In that sense I agree that you "deserve" it. You can not isolate yourselves from these global issues.
P.S. My feelings on US-EU relations remain and are independent of this discussion - Europe has remained under US influence too long. Similar to a long marriage - we've grown apart.
I remember every European nation (including the really poor ones!) offering people, doctors, search teams, money and food/blankets! What didn't we do!? The public donated money to the Red Cross - and we ALL felt sorry for those poor people!
My country gave money, search teams, equipment and offered oil assistance - the US administration told us to wait.
I once cared greatly for the US - now I realize I must have been wrong. I for one hope we/Europe cut all ties with the US. NATO should die and the EU should align itself with Russia.
I think you can safely call the French a paragon of free speech! After all where do you think those ideals came from? Some people forget quickly:
French Revolution
Looking to the United States Declaration of Independence for a model, on August 26, 1789, the Assembly published the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen. Like the U.S. Declaration, it comprised a statement of principles rather than a constitution with legal effect.
Causes of the French Revolution include the following:
# Bad economical situation, partly because of France's involvement and aid in the American Revolution.
# Resentment of seigneurialism by peasants, wage-earners, and, to a lesser extent, the bourgeoisie
# Resentment at noble privilege and dominance in public life by the ambitious professional classes.
# Influence of the American Revolution.
So far all of my installations of both 9.3 and 10 have been painless. On the different machines I have installed it my Windows installations have continued working perfectly afterwards. I was a bit skeptical about letting SuSE partition and resize my NTFS volumes [to make room for SuSE] however it worked perfectly for me. Now I hardly ever use Windows, except for those few special business applications, and SuSE works like a charm.
Do you seriously believe that?
.. ...
The three largest contributors in august 2005 are:
1. Pakistan (9,881)
2. Bangladesh (8,812)
3. India (6,321)
21. France (600)
29. USA (334)
To spell it out for you - France contributes almost twice as many! What's really interesting is that the top three nations are all neighbours - and used to belong to the same British controlled territory (India) - and are Muslim nations or have large populations of Muslims (present day India). Oh, and they're not exactly as rich as the US...
I'm sure you could find other sources to improve on these figures however the whole point is still valid - the US is not a large contributor compared with the rest of the world. The world is not incapable of functioning just because it's poor/undeveloped. Of course the US pays for a lot of it, but that's another matter isn't it?