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DVD Jon to work for Michael Robertson
GuNgA-DiN writes "Jon Lech Johansen, the 21-year-old Norwegian media hacker nicknamed DVD Jon, is moving to San Diego to work for maverick tech entrepreneur Michael Robertson in what can only be described as the most portentous team-up since Butch met Sundance. "I have no idea what I'll be doing, but I know it will be reverse engineering, and I'm sure it will be interesting," Johansen told Wired News during a Friday stopover in San Francisco. Robertson's website reveals that they are working on a new project and all he said was: "Oboe is the code name for a significant new project we have underway that will launch before the end of the year. It's as momentous as anything I've ever done in my technical career, but I won't say more since I despise vaporware. I know this project will be even better with Jon on board.""
Hulk'in Halloween Display/Webcam is up
He should stay out of the US. We don't need him becoming another Dmitry Sklyarov.
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
Lets just hope that the MPAA doesn't try to charge him HERE.
Moving to the US...
Officer: Welcome to America, sir
Jon: It's a trap!
[Brief pause] Officer: You are under arrest for crimes against the DMCA.
now he won't be able to reverse engineer anynthing that circumvents the copy protection on Blu-Ray.
If you don't know what AltaVista is (was), get off my lawn.
"All I know is it will involve reverse engineering"
Despite the fact that reverse engineering is legal for plenty of abstract instances, there's only a few cases where it's legal (in the US) to reverse engineer to compete/modify/upgrade (with) a product.
I'm guessing this 'Oboe' thing is doomed to fail, regardless of how 'legit' it is, it's going to be blockaded by legal barrierers and appeals and whatnot.
That's assuming they're using the reverse engineering to enter a market and compete with another services, if it's something completely new and doesn't compete with other services (at least directly), I'll change my tune.
I'll subscribe to Slashdot when I see a month without a dupe, a typo, or an article the "editors" didn't read.
What's the difference between an oboe and an onion? Nobody cries when you chop up an oboe.
-mkb
and fell silent..
Who is going to break the DRM on pretty much anything and everything now?
Why can somebody that smart be so stupid? (as to move to The Land of The DMCA)
Doesn't that just give the big boys someone to sue that has more money?
My Tech Posts on Twitter
Being able to play DVDs on Linux seems pretty productive and useful to me.
The Farewell Tour II
How do you get "reverse engineering" and "momentous" into one paragraph?
Seeing bad movies only encourages them. Watch responsibly
The WIRED story is here. It is more indepth then the WSJ article.
He's just going to get arrested isn't he? He's clearly comitted crimes under the DMCA; more so than Dmitry Skylarov, and look what happened to him. I think this is a really bad idea.
But there is already something called an Oboe.
A doublereed, soprano range instrument with a conical bore (slightly expanding diameter from reed to bell). It has a nasal, but mellow and poignant, tone.
Honestly though I don't see how Lindows + DVD + reverse engineering = profit?!
~jennifer.k~
Diabolical!
well maybe not productive ;). but you should have the right to see things you've bought w/o needing another "licence". grandparent, i hope you're being paid by the **AA, if not, why are you shilling for them?
This is my Sig, this is my Gun. One is for Slashdot and one is for Fun.
I, for one, miss TripMaster Monkey's insights. What have you done with him?
See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
Dmitry was the first person I thought of too - seriously Jon, stay out! I'm not kidding. You'll wind up in jail. Doesn't matter if what you did was legal in your own country or not. The Media Mafia does NOT care. They'll have you locked up. These guys own Senators and they make the rules.
No offer they've made could possibly be worth the risk. Don't do it.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
He might not be reverse engineering an American-made or otherwise legally protected in America product.
It might be a hydrogen-powered, transparent aluminum encased, Linux box- with full support for word, excel, powerpoint, etc.
oooh baby!
Cogito Ergo Sum
Reminds me of the hype surrounding the Segway.
Click here or here.
Being able to play DVDs on Linux seems pretty productive and useful to me.
Yeah, I've been waiting for that feature for years. I long for the day when I will finally be able to play a DVD under Linux.
Who knows, maybe one day someone might even crack their encryption scheme?
If he's going to be doing "reverse engineering", why on earth would he come to the place on planet Earth where he is most likely to wind up in jail for doing so?
Why not hook him up with a VPN and have him work out of his current home? You know, some place far far away where he can't wind up in jail for DCMA violations?
You don't need your physical body to be in the US to work for a US company, you know. Keep your body somewhere where it can't get thrown in jail.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Ah yes, a code word.
Prosecuting counsel: "Moreover he is, Your Honor, a player of the pink oboe."
(Judge faints, courtroom erupts in uproar)
Las qué passoun
tournoun pas maï
You're moving from Norway to San Diego? I hope you packed your sunglasses and sunscreen. Enjoy!
I wonder how he got a visa with his criminal record?
Why don't we just set up the "Free Jon Lech Johansen" fund now? Will save time later.
For the love of God, please learn to spell "ridiculous"!!!
Senator Roark will get revenge on you through Nancy! You cut his bloodline!
Is that it will blow.
C17H21NO4
"In Norway, you have the same laws (as in the United States) now," he says, "so it makes no difference if I'm doing my work here or there."
A post a day keeps productivity at bay.
Absolutely true story: my novel in progress (don't tease) is about a young man going to San Diego to work for a wealthy maverick technology guru on a project involving reverse engineering. Is this a good omen or some kind of cosmic goof on me?
It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries
IANL, of course, but reverse engineering is perfectly legal under most circumstances. The DMCA creates one exception... it's illegal to perform reverse engineering in order to circumvent a security mechanism, i.e., copy protection.
--Larry
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence
Thierry doesn't read Slashdot!
Ginger.
...a foreign programmer is moving to America to work on technology projects for a rich dot-com investor. This has never happened before, has it?
$nice = $webHosting + $domainNames + $sslCerts
I won't say more since I despise vaporware.
Sounds like he has high expectations for this project.
The Wired article makes a few things much more clear then the original article. It would stop this constant posting of "oh no Jon, don't move to the land of the DMCA" because it tells how Norway has adopted the EU's version of the DMCA. The original article only mentions this in passing at the end.
Also it tells more about Robertson and his previous battles with the content industry.
If Johansen goes on now to help make legitimate programs that will help change the face of content distribution and digital media, then I think this is better then waging guerrila warfare on content producers. I think DVD Jon made a good choice for himself, and probably for the good of digital entertainment.
"how can they call it a MINE if everything here is THEIRS?!?!" -Straight Jacket
Linspire already has support for dvd playback so I kinda doubt he'll be working on DVD stuff... My bet is that he will be hacking on the Skype protocols to get Gizmo to be compatible with it. That way Gizmo will work on Skype, but not vice-versa.
http://www.gizmoproject.com/
What's with /. and the fuckin hero worship
Jon is a kid hacker, wasn't even the author of DeCSS for crying out loud.
RMS needs a shower and job.
Kevin Mitnick *IS* a criminal.
Linus is not our lord saviour.
etc. etc...
Tom
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
(SCNR)
Although Michael Robertson is known for things like Lindows, it seems that he's currently more excited about SIPphone and his Gizmo Project. I would guess that he's more interested in connecting that tool to the world to make a Skype killer. It's already got IP Phone, Jabber chat, and links to Google maps. Perhaps they're ready to reverse engineer some chat protocols for integration into a Jabber server? If only my crystal ball were working...
The weird part is that I can feel productive even when I'm doomed.
Then, more seriously, he added, "I'm not scared about being arrested now that I'm here. Michael has good lawyers."
Brave move, I expect this will be tested. It is also good he is backed well by someone who can afford the legal harassment from the entertainment industry. Sure hope he wins too as DRM is turning out to be a conspiracy. My attitude is if I don't buy them, don't get the content and don't copy it their case is mute. That is why I don't buy DVDs. And besides, my VCR records what I want to see which by last count is legal for personal use.
That's the only way it can be described? Damn, I'm glad I know that, so I won't even try now.
"In Norway, you have the same laws (as in the United States) now," he says, "so it makes no difference if I'm doing my work here or there."
This may be true but, I'd be surprised if it really were. I thought only the US had the DMCA. But, assuming it is true, it does not mean that the US have the same courts, judges, juries or mindsets as Norway. Indeed Jon's freedom in Norway was at risk. The fact that he was successful in twice defending himself in Norway does not guarantee that he will also be successful in the US. It doesn't even mean that he would be able to afford to defend himself in the US.
I'd hate to be in a US jail for months, waiting for a trial where a public defender will represent me against the wishes of massive moneyed corporations. There is no way that I would set foot in the US if I were DVD Jon. Surely he can telecommute for a software gig!
...the ability to synchronize music across pc, ipod, and other devices regardless of format?
Jon Lech Johansen, the 21-year-old Norwegian media hacker nicknamed DVD Jon, is moving to San Diego
So he'll be within prosecutable/persecutable range of the DCMA, then.
San Diego is right on the Mexican border, silly. Why bother with visas?
Well, the techie in me believes that you always give a project a secret code name that represents some attribute of the nature of the project... (or is that the evil genius in me)?
I looked around for data on the Oboe (ok, I went right to Google then to the Wiki) and found this intriging entry:
"Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech."--Benjamin Franklin
From Robertsons email...
Last Saturday, the Wall Street Journal ran a front page story about Jon relocating to the United States. After that, he got plenty of job offers from some of the biggest names in the technology business. I talked to him over lunch today and asked if he wanted to work at those other companies. "Not really," he replied in a typical minimalist Scandinavian-style reply, forcing me to ask why not. "I want to work on open systems, which is why I came to you."
Sounds good to me.
Apparently Annalee Newitz (the author of the article) is a really busy, important person. So busy and important that she can't get the code name of the project correct. Either that or she just leaked Mr. Robertsons secret weapon: codename Obeo.
Why do we keep wasting our time paying attention to Robertson's antics? He's not much of an innovator and he's a terrible businessman. He consistently makes the wrong decisions, both in business and in the legal gambits he inevitably gets himself entangled in.
mp3.com was his one true pioneering moment. The my.mp3.com site allowed you to put a CD in your drive and have mp3 versions of the music you owned instantly unlocked in their library. There was security to ensure that only one person was logged into any account, and that you had a physical copy of the disc you were unlocking. And of course, the RIAA sued them for it. And instead of sticking to his guns, Robertson settled, inviting even more lawsuits and eventually bankrupting the company and forcing him to sell it to Universal, who gutted and subsequently abandoned it.
LindowsOS had to be renamed Linspire -- again because Robertson wouldn't stand his ground after poking "the man" in the eye.
This is a man who consistently rocks the boat to garner attention, then steps down when anyone calls him on it. This is yet another move designed to make public waves without actually accomplishing anything. He's not one who makes sound business and legal decisions. I just hope he doesn't drag DVD-Jon down with him.
The media industry will contend that Jon violated a US law even though he wasn't in the country when he violated it. They WILL go after him. He WILL face trial. Never mind that the industry isn't the government and isn't supposed to bring criminal charges (which can put you in jail). It wasn't the US State Department driving the charges in Norway, it was the media industry.
There are many laws, that the US contends, apply outside its borders. The big word for this is 'extraterritoriality' and it annoys other countries. Never mind, the US does as it pleases.
Stay home Jon!
The **AA will martyr him.
and then the men with the hands of blue will ebola anyone who came in contact with DVD Jon...
It's as momentous as anything I've ever done in my technical career, but I won't say more since I despise vaporware.
While I make it a point not to fawn over capitalists, he'll be my hero if he holds to that mindset.
Why do you think they said, "the most portentous team-up since Butch met Sundance?"
I cried real tears when Li Mu Bai died.
Its an OS to run any windows app or anything that works on windows. Justin Frankel talked about doing this long long ago. mp3.com wonder nutt is back to his copying other ideas again.
They are reverse engineering iTunes. I'd be willing to bet on it.
"Here Lies Philip J. Fry, named for his uncle, to carry on his spirit"
[ ] Winter in Norway
[X] Winter in San Diego
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
Read the article, he's not going to the U.S., guys. He's going to California.
For his paycheck, they told him he'd have to have his memory wiped at the end of each job.
In other news, DVD Jon is cuffed as he enters LAX.
He was only an Oboe, but one more is gone
Leaving nobody to sing his sad song
Leaving nobody to carry him home
He was only an Oboe, but one more
One more
One more
One more is gone
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
Michael Robertson: What happen ?
DVD Jon: Somebody set up us the bomb.
Michael Robertson: What you say !!
Officer: You have no chance to survive make your time.
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Having worked for Michael Robertson before, I wonder how long Jon will last when MR continually calls him up at 3 in the morning bitching at 500 decibels about why something he didn't build isn't working and what he's going to do about it.
Also, I wonder if this new project was also announced to the company in a meeting that began with, "Well there is this gray area in the law we can go through...".
IANAL, so could he be arrested or not?
There will be waiting comitte waiting for him and soon he will be working for Michael Robertson but from San Diego jail.
.. please move onto the 22nd. I think Apple will have annual upgrades for the iPod for the next 100 years, so why not skip past them?
...don't leave home without it.
The Roman Rule: The one who says it cannot be done shall not interrupt the one who is doing it.
But I can't read it, and he looks like they fed Burgers to him in US jail too.
Slashdot: stuff for news, nerds that matter, matter for news, stuff that nerd
I'd be surprised if the lax security managed to do anything right
Why is that when DVD-Jon intends to move to the US, slashdot wants him to stay out because he might get arrested, but when virtually any other foreigner intends to work in the US, slashdot wants them to stay out because there are enough tech-job-stealing foreigners in the US already?
You're forgetting extradition. There are few places that the US cannot extradite people from. Naturally it would have to be grave enough matter or have the proper political momentum for it to happen, but these things aren't impossible when it comes to doing things that large businesses don't like.
This reminds me of a joke...
"I was thinking about getting a dog but then I didn't because my apartment is too small"
"then I thought to myself, I am living in a place I wouldn't let a dog live in!".
Isn't it funny. We are telling some guy not to enter our country lest he be arrested and yet we are perfectly willing to live here ourselves.
evil is as evil does
He will reverse engineer "Duke Nukem Forever"!
Of course they didn't go after him using US law - it has no value in Norway. As a sovereign nation we do not accept any other source of laws other than our own. I'm asking myself what you could be thinking of - we're an independent European nation. I have law degree and I know my own country quite well.
The only other source of laws we have is the European Union which we subscribe to under a special free trade agreement.
No, our system is quite nice really compared to the US. Being a lawyer I might be biased - but I believe we have a just and fair system for our citizens. Big companies don't enjoy any special rights here - other than having the money to hire the best lawyers. Public defenders are not that bad at all. And there is significant support from the government should you need legal help - it will only cost money if you want to hire something above the level of a qualified representative. It's free if you can't afford to pay for legal assistance [when defending yourself]. If you want to take an issue to court it's another matter - then again it's your choice and your risk.
Since he originally asked Steve Jobs for FairPlay and was told "No", I believe Micheal is going to have Jon reverse engineer FairPlay. Real has gotten away with it for a year and an a half now. Just my thought, but I'm sure that's what he wants.
Not sure where you heard that - the charges against Skylarov were dropped in exchange for testimony that was used in a case against his company.
DVD Jon will be arrested on sight.
He'll be taking a lot of insults and verbal abuse and be insulted with comments like "IF I GAVE YOU A MILLION DOLLARS COULD YOU MAKE THIS WORK?!?!!?" if my experience working directly for Michael Robertson back at MP3.com is any guide. Yes, I'm still bitter.
the O-b-o-e is the Duck in the narrated version of Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf.
I'll be your candy shop of infinite deliciousity if you'll be my discotheque of endless rump-shaking.
Did you even read the grandparent, moron?
look a bit like a
young Bill Gates?