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I Personally use a Logitech Marble Mouse Trackball and when the gods are happy and the chi is with me I am pretty unstopable at TFC. The thing is, it's a matter of preference. Maybe the super responsive razor boomslang will make you over shoot and is just too hard for you. Maybe you will do better with something with a slower rate. Maybe a trackball is the way for you. The best bet is to go out and find some people who you know who maybe have them and try for yourself. I Had a top of the line MS Optical mouse (Not the one you speak of, bit older, but the shit of it's time) and when I moved to the little $20 trackball it just felt more natural for me. Some of my friends though are clumsy as hell with a trackball though but great with a mouse. Then there is also that strange one who plays it all with 2 joysticks pretty successfully, but that's just him. Go and try yourself, it's a matter of you, not the reviews.

I actually happen to be partial to my Logitech dual optical mouse. Sure it's big, bulky and klunky, but so are my hands, and it happens to fit them great. I did wish they made two sizes of it so I could recommend it to just anyone, and not just people with big hands. I tracks great, I don't think I ever want to go back to a ball mouse again for gaming.

And as for this poor professor, it sounds like he was just telling the truth. If it he was supposed to be this big star witness to defend microsoft, then microsoft should have done a bit better to prepare him for questions like this. But then again, "What do you mean there are other operating systems? Why don't you just run windows?" Some people are just like that. Lemme guess, this guy was an MIS professor? I sure hope for MIT's sake he wasn't computer science and didn't know about other operating systems. :)

• my monitor hung up on my wall
• my mouse in my hand
• my keyboard in my lap
• my Internet connection in the kitchen
• my DivX movies on my television
• my MP3 receiver in my entertainment center
• all controlled by my PC in the bedroom

...of course, in a house where we can't even keep the cordless phone on its recharger for more than five minutes and stash the remote control in a new location every day, this will probably be less of a boon than some people think.

• my monitor hung up on my wall
• my mouse in my hand
• my keyboard in my lap
• my Internet connection in the kitchen
• my DivX movies on my television
• my MP3 receiver in my entertainment center
• all controlled by my PC in the bedroom

...of course, in a house where we can't even keep the cordless phone on its recharger for more than five minutes and stash the remote control in a new location every day, this will probably be less of a boon than some people think.

Personally, I don't see the point of novelty mice either. Give me an ergonomically designed mouse with a scroll wheel and at least one thumb button.

The Wheel Mouse Optical is a pretty basic optical wheel mouse. Real 3D Artists/Photoshop Gurus/Gamers would want a Logitech Dual Optical, which does two snaps to ensure much better accuracy (on a bad surface, the mouse cursor can suddenly jump around as the mouse wrongly recalculates where it is.

Plus, no more paying Microsoft, which is always a bonus in my book, however good their hardware might be.

--Dan

Really cool stuff!

Ciryon

Quit with the juvenile broken-record "3-button-mouse" bit already! Any of the following that are USB-compatible will work:

• http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/mouse/products.a sp
• http://www.logitech.com/cf/products/mice.cfm

I started with severe shooting pains in my right hand due to too many hours of work, programming for school, and mostly because of playing Diablo II.

I started using my right hand for mousing and developed the shooting pains within a couple of months (which is odd, since it took almost 8 years of computing to develop the pain in my right hand).

I tried several mice, but the trackball worked best. Not all trackballs are created equal, however. Some of them require you to push the buttons with the standard pointer and middle finger. These did nothing for the pain.

Finally, I found an excellent trackball that is both ambidextrous AND allows the left and right mouse button to be pushed with the pinky and thumb instead of the standard fingers. It's also Optical so I don't need to clean the damn thing every week. It's the Logitech Marble mouse , and it rocks.

I found the most difficult part to get used to is not having the scrool button. It took longer to get used to that than switching from my right to left hand. Now I can use a trackball or standard mouse in either hand with equal ease.

Unfortunately, it is not feasible to bring a trackball to work because I am always sitting at a different terminal, so I had to adopt a method where I use my right hand to guide the mouse and push the buttons with my right hand (while using the muscles in my wrist and not my fingers) to do the mouse. It's only a little counterproductive, and it's better than not being able to work...

It doesn't sound all that unreasonable to make something you're talking about.

Brain: I want to scroll down.

Hand: Alrighty, Brain!

Brain: I don't see any scrolling. I think I'm going to cry.

These buttonless mice look pretty spiffy, but I can't imagine using one to play Quake! I'm SO rough with my mouse. It's so comfy!

Yup, Black & White is what made me buy a Logitech iFeel mouse, and I've got to say it's pretty good (Logitech licenced Immersion technology for this).

While the Windows desktop feedback gets boring very quickly, and their "Businessware" software (feedback for Word & Excel) is just plain annoying, in games it does actually work really well. The Half-Life/Team Fortress/Counterstrike plugin is pretty good, and Black & White definitely benefits plus you get a few extra mission-quests.

Just have to mention one of the Immersion-enabled quests in B&W (my favorite one), it's on first level:- You find a hippie standing outside his hut next to a ring of magic mushrooms and a boiling cauldron (ready to get his brew on), and to help him you have to pick which one is "buzziest" by holding your cursor over the them and feeling how strong the vibes are through the mouse! A great and funny use of feedback technology if ever there was one :)

A list of supported games can be found here and game download mods (including Serious Sam 1 & 2, No-one Lives Forever, and Unreal Tournament, but no Max Payne unfortunately) are here

Stef

Check out logitech. They have a great unit that does exactly what you want. It plugs into both line in and out of your PC for use with music/netmeeting, etc. Additionally, when you answer the phone, it automatically cuts over to the phone and cuts out the PC. I bought them for my entire help desk staff, they love them. You can check them out at Hello Direct where we purchased. Or directly at Logitech

Guess that was more of that useless 16-bit code they threw out. I noticed this when I updated the drivers for my new mouse sunday.

While we're at it, I'm going to post the specs on a more down-to-earth machine that I'll be building shortly. My ultimate goal is to create the ultimate workstation / gaming box that won't sound like a small aircraft when you turn it on.

$189 Seagate Barracuda IV SoftSonic 80 Gig
The 'Cuda IV is probably the quietest and one of the fastest Ultra-100 Drives in existence. A pair of 40-gig platters with Softsonic fluid-bearing motors keep the noise down below 30dB

$757 2x1.2Ghz AthlonMP
2x256 ECC DDR RAM
Tyan Tiger MP
2xThermalTake VolcanoII Cooler
The Tiger is the baby-brother of the Thunder. You get the same performance as the Thunder, without the extras, such as on-board SCSI, & integrated ethernet. You can look up specs at tyan.com.All of these components may be purchased, pretested, from Monarch Computers as an "AMD Pretested Combo;" Monarch produces very high quality boxes (my last three, actually).

$070 SD-M1502 Toshiba 16X DVD Drive
This drive's a fairly good performer, (try a google search for the model number and "review"), but what I am interested in is the noise and vibration factors. Toshiba's introduced a type of balance mechanism designed to handle unbalanced / cheap discs.

$335 Asus GeForce3 Pure 64Meg AGP
At this point, the choice of video card is purely up to the builder; I chose this one simply because it was one of the better performing, and the higher quality cards (google will tell all about this card...)

$85 SB Audigy X-Gamer!
Hey, why not? At $85, it's not a bad deal at all for a new whiz-bang sound card.
??? Speakers?
Up to you.

$014 floppy
Duh. Pick one.

$170? Lian-Li PC-60 Case
Reasons for this part: 1. It's cool. Literally.
2. It's light-weight.
3. Lian-Li cases are extremely high quality, which explains the high price.

$089 Enermax Whisper 431W EG465P-VE(FC) Power Supply
The Whisper is an ultra-quiet PS with variable speed fans. If you look at the Product Page, you can see the various nice specs on this PS.

$214 24X10X40 Plextor CD-RW
Based on various net reviews (again, google), this is the current burner of choice. That'll probably change by the time I finish typing this setence, but that's the nature of the technology.

$80 Wireless Keyboard / Optical Wireless Mouse from Logitech
As a long-time logitech fan, the Logitech Cordless Freedom Optical takes all of the good stuff from their keyboards, mice, and wireless devices and wraps it into one package. Note that RF mice are not very good for games. I've owned one of these for about a month, and can say that I have no problems with either device until I try to play DoD or Q3A, in which case my trusty Mouseman Optical comes in handy.

$1918 Subtotal sans Shipping (If the numbers don't add up, I'm gonna look really, really stupid. Oh well.) (updated price 10-13-01)

Most of my price info came from either Pricewatch or MySimon, fyi.

I'll avoid the theoretical for a moment and just speak to this:

My web designer friends are damaged for life because of mice, and yet we persist... Where do we go from here ?

Just thought I'd mention that when I started showing symptoms of RSI I went out and bought a couple of trackballs and a couple of Wacom Stylus tablets.

For design work, the Wacom products spoil me rotten, and though it hurts me to say so I've had nothing but luck with the Microsoft thumb-controlled track pads.
Though if you have political problems with them try the Kensington (which are excellent) or Logitech versions. I might try the new Logitech units myself actually.

It really changed the way i work, any desktop I loose to the tablets is mitigated by not halving to mouse around. So anyway, no more pain for me.

You can now buy a wireless keyboard with optical mouse combo (and on the bright side it's black!) but for some unknown reason it's not the ergonomic keyboard, it's similar to the 'Internet' keyboard :(

Cordless Desktop Optical (you might need to tell the site which country you're in first, then hit that URL again)

Regards,
Denny

I need a new ergonomic keyboard, a split keyboard. I am considering Logitech's Cordless Freedom Pro. Any experience with this? Any chance of Logitech coming out with a new ergonomic keyboard soon? Suggestions for competitor keyboards? Trying to stay below $100. Thanks

Let's see, I can use the iSmell to recreate scents. I can get the 180 degree immersive monitor to immerse my sense of sight. My sense of hearing can be fooled by the AuSIM reCREate. The previously mentioned iFeel MouseMan covers my sense of touch. That just leaves my sense of taste, which is obviously lacking if I would use all of these products rather than go outside and take a walk. &ltsigh&gt I suppose I will just have to lick my iSmell.

this is something i'd been contemplating for a while, then i saw the logitech iFeel mouse. i wanted to try one in an everyday/productivity environment, but all i could find was their cheezy store display that made the mouse 'buzz' when you scrolled over a dot.

my goal is to find an other-than-visual feedback mechanism for everyday UI controls; i.e. being able to locate/confirm buttons, menu items, without relying soley on visual input to do so.

the goal is simple: to get faster. i already use the Finder sounds on my MacOS machine, the audible feedback allows me to already be retraining my visual focus on the next task position even before i click to complete the current one - i know to click when i hear the blip. it allows you to lead with your eyes; you spend less time pondering the next task.

audio, however, is not the most convenient feedback mechanism. in noisy office environments you either have to wear headphones and be in a cocoon, or turn your speakers up, and the constant bleeps will probably annoy your cubicle neighbors enough that they plot some sort of revenge.

so, does anyone own one of the logitechs? pity it's such a simple/flat mouse, i don't think the company has really explored this as a productivity enhancing tool, so it would seem that this one is the litmus test to see if the market embraces it or dismisses it as a novelty.

this is something i'd been contemplating for a while, then i saw the logitech iFeel mouse. i wanted to try one in an everyday/productivity environment, but all i could find was their cheezy store display that made the mouse 'buzz' when you scrolled over a dot.

my goal is to find an other-than-visual feedback mechanism for everyday UI controls; i.e. being able to locate/confirm buttons, menu items, without relying soley on visual input to do so.

the goal is simple: to get faster. i already use the Finder sounds on my MacOS machine, the audible feedback allows me to already be retraining my visual focus on the next task position even before i click to complete the current one - i know to click when i hear the blip. it allows you to lead with your eyes; you spend less time pondering the next task.

audio, however, is not the most convenient feedback mechanism. in noisy office environments you either have to wear headphones and be in a cocoon, or turn your speakers up, and the constant bleeps will probably annoy your cubicle neighbors enough that they plot some sort of revenge.

so, does anyone own one of the logitechs? pity it's such a simple/flat mouse, i don't think the company has really explored this as a productivity enhancing tool, so it would seem that this one is the litmus test to see if the market embraces it or dismisses it as a novelty.

For the 2nd time today.. this HAS been going on for a while. You can make your Windows desktop and website touchy feely using the logitech i-feel mouse. I have one and it actually works okay.

Just improve it a bit and you got it...

See? Now I'm buff from using my mouse... And my bicepts are ripped from lifting my bawls. Later on, I'm going to play some Q3 and work on my quads.

The Logitech Cyberman 2 (http://www.logitech.com/cf/support/cyber2.cfm is ok. I've got one and used it a few times. But for me it doesn't work any better than the plain old Quake style mouse-look movement. 4 keys to move and a mouse (or trackball in my case) to look up and down and rotate. Works better than any expensive controller.

Here is the list of frequencies for each model of keyboard. This is direct from Logitech's web site:

http://www.logitech.com/cf/support/1029.cfm

It's nice when they make it easy for you.

I recently purchased a Logiteceh Cordless Freedom Navigator - this is their iTouch Keyboard and a Wireless mouse with a dual-receiver. However, the combined receiver has two plugs - in the older models, these were PS/2 plugs. The newer model has two USB plugs, with those funky USB->PS/2 adaptors.

It really puzzles me why you'd put two USB plugs on the device. After all, the iTouch keyboard is already a "composite device" - the keyboard, the iTouch keys and the multimedia buttons. Would it really have been so hard to make the USB controller provide the composite keyboard/keys/button set up and mouse information through one USB plug?

With the corded options, you're better off - the mouse plugs into one of the two low-power USB ports on the keyboard, and keyboard plugs into the computer's USB port.

I ended up having to buy a 4-port hub so that I could have my keyboard/mouse plugged in at the same time as my Keyspan USB adaptor. The iMac only has 2 USB ports (same for most ATX motherboards).

If you're willing to work for a company that contracts with the federal government, you should have little trouble finding work in Europe. Particularly if the contract is for the Department of Defense, you may fall under the Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA). If so, the first $75K of your income is exempt from US taxes and it is possible not to be taxed by the host nation either.

Specific companies I know of include Logitech, Mitre, and SAIC.

I have the Logitech iFeel MouseMan and this product allows you to "feel" a web page as well. While the iFeel technology is limited to a variable speed "rumble" type force feedback, I have found it to be immensely useful to find links and buttons on pages. For instance, while I am reading the summary of a Slashdot article, I can position the cursor on the link to the comments by "feeling" the link (links and buttons have certain feels to them) and then clicking it as I finish the summary. Not that this would help the blind mich, but I, for one, like the certain feel that my desktop and applications have taken on.
The key is overcoming the "gimmick factor." If they can make it genuinely enhance your interface, it will be successful. Thinkgeek has some info on the iFeel Mouseman's sister, just the cheaper version.

about one year ago. i set two limitations to the design of my "lan party computer"

1. it must use standard components (to make it easier to find parts to buy)
2. it must be cheap (at least cheaper than a comparable laptop)

this is a list of components that i used to build the system.
i updated parts of the list to reflect what components i would buy if i was going to build it today.

case mini tower $60
monitor 14" lcd $600
motherboard micro atx $100
processor P3 800Mhz 100FSB $160
ram 256MBpc100SDRAM $100
video Geforce2GTS64MB $195
keyboard mini-keyboard $40
mouse cordless optical $70
hard drive 40GB ide $100
cd-rom drive Plextor16/10/40A $250
floppy 1.44MB Generic $10
sound card SB Live Value $40
network card netgear FA310TX $20
cat5 cable 14 feet $20
headphones koss td61 $20
carry strap GearGrip Pro $35

other stuff:
cable bag a small, strong bag to attach to the side of the case to hold all the cables
power cable with 3 outlets that have 3 prongs each to accommodate the power cables for your system and monitor

i attached the lcd monitor to one side of the case and the cable bag to the other side. i put all the cables attached to the computer inside the bag to get them out of the way. then, when i went to a lan party i would only have to take one power cable, one network cable, the mini-keyboard, cordless mouse, and headphones out of the cable bag. everything was already connected at the back of the computer so there was no onsite setup involved.

i also screwed a piece of plexiglass onto the lcd monitor to protect the screen. (yes it was stupid to drill holes into a monitor that i just spent $900 on at that time, but it worked)

i had a lot of fun with that computer. i even dropped it down a flight of stairs once and the case was bent and all the pci cards popped out of their sockets. i put it back together and it worked fine.
the only downside to building this system was that it weighed about 30lbs. although if you spent more money on a lunchbox case with integrated lcd it would still weigh a lot.

unfortunately i never took any pictures of it for posterity and i ended up dismantling it for parts about 6 months ago, but i'm sure you get the idea.

-stan

Connectix did, however, bring us the era of cheap PC cameras, which they then sold off to Logitech. The QuickCam, which I have one sitting on my desk, the original B&W, was awesome for it's time.

The Logitech optical mice have been great to me. None of the roller problems, and there was just an Ask Slashdot the other day on replacing the red LED with a super-neat-o blue one!
I have the smaller variety (more of a "normal mouse" shape than the larger "tank" style) and have had no problems. Works great in X too.

The Logitech optical mice have been great to me. None of the roller problems, and there was just an Ask Slashdot the other day on replacing the red LED with a super-neat-o blue one!
I have the smaller variety (more of a "normal mouse" shape than the larger "tank" style) and have had no problems. Works great in X too.

The Logitech optical mice have been great to me. None of the roller problems, and there was just an Ask Slashdot the other day on replacing the red LED with a super-neat-o blue one!
I have the smaller variety (more of a "normal mouse" shape than the larger "tank" style) and have had no problems. Works great in X too.

For keyboards with USB, the Evil Empire offers

• Internet Keyboard Pro
• Natural Keyboard Pro
• Natural Keyboard Elite

Logitech offers:

• iTouch Keyboard

For systems with USB, IBM offers:

• Netvista small business range

Compaq offers:

• Presario range

I've used many of the trackballs mentioned on this page, including the Kensington, other Logitechs, etc. The Logitech Marble FX and its successor, the cordless TrackMan FX, are in a class of their own, and leave the others in their dust in terms of feel, control and precision. If you've ever found a thumb-driven trackball to be hard to control precisely, the FX is the answer - you can use any or all of your first three fingers, and your thumb too if you like.

As an added bonus, if you appreciate good design, this trackball is unusual-looking enough to have been used in the Sci-Fi channel TV series "Farscape" as a navigational control on the spaceship "Moya". Of course they tricked it out with a bit of paint and stuff first.

One drawback to be aware of: I don't know if there's a left-handed version, but if not, left-handers are out of luck since it's shape makes use with the left hand nearly impossible.

Looking at Logitech's site just now, I see that the Marble FX isn't listed anymore, but the cordless TrackMan FX is.

I happen to love my Logitech Trackman Marble+. It's mostly a personal preference thing. I have a few friends who use this trackball too. Once we got used to thumb-controlled trackballs, there was no turning back. It allows for the non-thumb fingers to have minimal movement. This mouse improved my FPS (frags per second) by about 50-75.

It just takes some getting used to; the entire palm stays on the mouse when you use it. When using any other trackball, this is not the case. Unlike mice, your arm doesn't move either; just your thumb.

I only wish it came with 3to4+wheel buttons instead of 2+wheel.

--------

I thought that I would mention that there are three button mice out there for macs like this nifty little Logitech mouse that's a real cost-effective way of getting 2 more buttons. You MacOS X followers will be interested to know that the scrolly button also works in cocoa applications!

And have it turn off because it's out of batteries? You might as well buy a cheap webcam, get some free motion detecting software, and have that do the job for you. This one comes with software that supports motion detecting, among others.

Just when I thought my 4-button Logitech mouse was
the one with the most buttons, now I gotta go get another one!


Yes, I know it's not really a mouse, but damn that's a lot of buttons!

They are, in fact, supposed to be shaped more like the Logitech Trackman Marble (when viewed from the appropriate angle :-)

I've used the Logitech cordless keyboard + mouse combo set and they've been very good. Very power-efficient too.

The mouse is one of those slightly tilted deals with a thumb-clicked left mouse button, so if you don't like ergo-stuff, don't get one :-).

cf. http://www.logitech.com/cf/products/productovervie w.cfm/64 - a newer model

WingMan® Force Feedback Mouse

I'm not saying that I wouldn't want force feedback when I move over something, because I do. My question relies more on, will Logitech create Linux drivers for it when it comes out? I still have yet to see full use out of my four button Logitech mouse (I don't have the skill to do what I want with it, nor the time to learn the skill), and from what I have been able to decern from their site they have no plans on porting the software they created for Win9x to Linux, or NT for that matter.

I am about to contact Logitech and request full Linux support.
Their website for contacting Logitech is here.

kinda like my office. i really have to be thankful that my employers worked with me on the lighting in my office. i've left a company or two in large part because of the conditions of work (flourescent lights, bad chairs, bad monitors, etc)
my current setup is pretty rigged:

Lumichrome 1XX CRI 98/6500K (go for teh UV, you can pick up the missing IR with full-spectrum incandescents)
Aeron Ergonomic Chair from Herman-Miller
Effektiv funrishings
SGI Flatpanel monitor Split keyboardfrom Microsoft
Logitech Mouse
3 windows that face north

i'm not bringing all this up to show off my setup here, but moreover so that people can see what a reasonable healty office stocks.

we also use 4200k (i think) flourescents for general hallways/etc.

much of this equipment is a little pricey - i had to split some of it with my employers. but unless you're employers outright don't care about your health then they shoudl at least be amenable to you bringing in your own equipment. you'll pay extra for the quality, but when you're in you're office you'll know where that money went.

Logitech's had an optical trackball (the Trackman Marble) for years now, a wonderful little number that I don't think has ever gotten the recognition it deserves. I'm admittedly behind the times in that I don't use one with a wheelie-dealie on it, but this is the only pointing device I'll use with my computers anymore.

Not only that, but everyone I've introduced to the Trackman Marble has adopted it as their exclusive pointing device of choice. They're easy to use, you never have to worry about a surface to use it on, and they're amazingly easy to clean.

The next pointing device I buy will probably have to be linked directly to my brain in order for it to merit me getting rid of my Trackman Marble.

Logitech's had an optical trackball (the Trackman Marble) for years now, a wonderful little number that I don't think has ever gotten the recognition it deserves. I'm admittedly behind the times in that I don't use one with a wheelie-dealie on it, but this is the only pointing device I'll use with my computers anymore.

Not only that, but everyone I've introduced to the Trackman Marble has adopted it as their exclusive pointing device of choice. They're easy to use, you never have to worry about a surface to use it on, and they're amazingly easy to clean.

The next pointing device I buy will probably have to be linked directly to my brain in order for it to merit me getting rid of my Trackman Marble.

Apple and Microsoft aren't the only ones. Logitech is shipping their padless optical mouse. It looks to be a nice mix of design: Two buttons and a scroll wheel, but not as bulky as the IntelliMouse.

Kevin Fox

and it looks like this one doesn't have the annoying blue light.

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