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Surfing the Web Haptically
Chakat sent us a story about Haptic feedback, a buzzword ready technology where the mouse provides tactile feedback in addition to letting you click on your porn. Seriously I would love a bit of feedback when my mouse moves over a button or a link: Sorta like how modern window managers can snap borders to edges of other windows or the screen when moving or resizing... I think that a similar tactile thing for buttons would ease mouse navigation. Or else I can just continue binding ridiculous things like Ctrl-Alt-Shift-Meta-F8 to every little action.
this will finally open up the possiblity of tactile response to the general internet; yet another direction of evolution for web browsing. maybe companis will offer tactile samples of things like clothes?
-teknopurge
techienews network help us beta !!
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Can I get haptic feedback on those pictures of blue naked people at Burning Man? I'm not sure that's a good idea after all.
Those X-10 bastards would have a field day with this.
... is to make sure all my windows are placed in exact positions on the screen. I even make sure that windows that auto-dock to corners of the screen are positioned in such a way that they're close enough but not really docking at all. (e.g. making sure XMMS/Winamp is exactly 10 pixels from the screen borders) Call me obsessive-compulsive. ;-)
Having 'tactile responsiveness' to this sort of thing I do would be a God-send for me, but I don't know how else it can be useful. Perhaps a way to determine how deep I am into a surfing session just by listening to the sound of a click-thru?
Pet peeve: Profane people propagating perfunctory pedantry.
In all seriousness, what's the big deal? Porn's is big business, and it's good money. Just because we could make money off of it doesn't mean we become nasty porn mongers. I mean, look how much money people like Marriot, run by the friggin mormons, makes off of pay per view porn. Doesn't make them a porn company.
I really think we need to develop this market. Maybe then my options could be worth something...
Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known. -- Carl Sagan
Seriously I would love a bit of feedback when my mouse moves over a button or a link: Sorta like how modern window managers can snap borders to edges of other windows or the screen when moving or resizing...
But imagine the virtual "gravity well" sucking your mouse into the ad banners.
Brings a whole new meaning to "real time black hole".
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
This would probably be great for reading braille webpages. Otherwise, it sounds annoying.
"Would it kill you to put down the toilet seat?" -- Maya Angelou
For the 2nd time today.. this HAS been going on for a while. You can make your Windows desktop and website touchy feely using the logitech i-feel mouse. I have one and it actually works okay.
Just improve it a bit and you got it...
"Yes.. no matter what the culture, folk dancing is stupid." -MST3K
END RANT MODE
"If you think education is expensive, try ignorance" - Derek Bok
OK, looking at porn is one thing, but being able to feel up a woman without ever meeting her? How many women will stand for that(even pr0n stars)? If there are so many why aren't they walking up to me on the street and offering? Is it that much different if shes there or not when I do it? Can you honestly say "I've never felt up a woman" after using this technology for pr0n? Things are getting a little too weird.
Think of the impact this will have on the blow-up-dolls-for-geeks market. Now you can program your night time friend to do what you like it to do. I wonder if think geek will have these soon?
So far today there have been articles on tactile mouse feedback, replicators, and browser spyware that records mouse movements. Of course, we already know that the porn industry will be the first to utilize these things to full effect, but can you imagine what it would be like to use all three? Imagine images the react to your mouse movement and give you tactile feedback, all while replicating on your desk!
I like to play children's songs in minor keys.
"We're all sons of bitches now." --J. Robert Oppenheimer
I would love a bit of feedback when my mouse moves over a button or a link
I view my mouse movements as a plane taking off and landing at my destination. I don't want to feel bumps for each tree I fly over, I want a smooth ride, and maybe one bump when I land, but how can a haptic device know where I want to land? Better to forget about the whole idea.
--Got Lists? | Top 95 Star Wars Line
"On Wednesday, Microsoft Chairman Bill Gates showed off a handheld computer that understands which way is up and where it's being touched."
His wife was, reportedly, fuming on the sidelines of the press conferance. Apparently, she was mumbling something about the invention resulting in her role being usurped in the couple's sex life.
"Old man yells at systemd"
You can make your Windows desktop and website touchy feely using the logitech i-feel mouse. I have one and it actually works okay.
Got one myself, but there's a drawback: no matter what settings I put it on, it makes my wrists hurt within minutes. I've got the onset symptoms of carpal tunnel syndrome, and it's really getting better, but I had to turn off the iFeel feedback. Weird.
What's your damage, Heather?
I stumbled apon what I now know is a simulation of Haptic feedback several times in the past. To enable this simulation, simply eat corn/potato chips in the general vicinity of your mousepad.
Of course, the bumps don't really correspond to whats on the screen, but every once in a while, damned if it doesn't seem that way!
m00.
Mmmm, feely mouse.
I've tried the whole "Immersion" Tech with those Logitech Mice. It kind of feels like a gummed up mouse (rollerball style, not Laser), almost like some forgot to clean the rollers. It get's annoying real fast.
I hope this is more than that, otherwise count me out.
Sean D.
"Hmm. I am to metaphor cheese as metaphor cheese is to transitive verb crackers!"
UNC has been using haptic interfaces, in conjunction with VR technology, to allow [bio]chemists the ability to 'assemble' new compounds at the atomic level. The researchers have grappling arms attached to their hands. The atomic repulsion/attraction is felt by the user, and can be used to figure out how the atoms / molecules should join together.
I think...I think it's in my basement. Let me go upstairs and check. -M.C. Escher (1898-1972)
So this is touch; we've had sound for a good while, and of course sight. Throw in aromatherapy and you've got the whole experience. I seem to recall that about 6 years ago the hot topic was the "3D Virtual Reality" interface, but nothing really came of that. Fundamentally, I don't think these technologies make the computer more productive as a work device - on the contrary, they tend to get in the way. Is there anybody out there that does productive computing that actually uses systems sounds beyond the basic "bell"?
Personally, I prefer fluid motion - I don't want an interface to get in the way. This doesn't mean that I don't think this technology could have an application in the computer as an entertainment device, but I'll believe it when I see it. For my 3D-sense-enabled experiences, I prefer going for a walk.
It would be great to feel the mouse actully give back when you cross over something or near it. Sometimes I have trouble finding where the dang pointer is when I'm working on people's computers. Mostly when their screen is all white with the default pointer in windows. But just think about it when playing games too. Imagine taking a rocket in quake and actually having your hand pushed back a little. Or if you run into a wall and it won't let you push it anymore. Of course it could work for any game out there.
%blow
%blow: No such job
^how did the sex change go?
Modifier failed
Every time it goes over a link it emits a nice electric shock so that you will notice the link. Tactile feedback.
Jeremy
I wouldn't mind a mouse where there is a tactile surface where the buttons are today. There would have to be several configuration options.
- tactile graphics, turn on/off
- Tactile text turn on/off
- tactile intensity adjustment, similar to sharpness - brightness - contrast in monitors
- Scale adjustments for buttons, etc.
I wouldn't mind having tactile for buttons, table edges, lines, etc.although I wonder what the best way for to enable your right/secondary click options would be.
- - -
Radio Free Nation
an alternate news site using Slash Code
"If You have a Story, We have a Soap Box"
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
Wasn't there a similar idea out a few years ago where you could hook up a "Smell-o-matic" chemical emitting device to your box, thereby allowing web sites to embellish your web experience with smells? I hope this is half as successful as that idea was.
Truthfully, though, this could have lots of application in accessibility for the blind. Braille web pages could be just around the corner. BML?
in ArsTechnica. It's actually quite funny.
"We"?
I don't see why anybody should have anything to say about the way how someone satisfies him/herself without hurting someone else in the process.
Or else I can just continue binding ridiculous things like Ctrl-Alt-Shift-Meta-F8 to every little action.
Yikes, a quintiple-bucky...
In David Brin's "Sundiver" they administered a test, where they studied a person's eyeball movements as they were shown a picture. The objects of focus, lingering time, and relative timing of noticing those objects in the first second or two were construed to have deep psychological meaning. The test results were used to determine who was a rightful member of society, and who bore 'watching'.
Obviously haptics is less sophisticated than eyeball tracking, but perhaps not really. Eyeball tracking is straightforward once you have the sensor. Inferring the same type of information from mouse movements seems in some ways more sophisticated to me.
So put on your Gibsonian hats for a moment, and imagine an Echelon/Carnivore-type backdoor *required* in haptic feedback systems. Then have data-mining of that information looking for criminal or terrorist tendancies. Unlikely? Yep. But compared to Strategic Missile Defense?
The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
15 years ago, when the Atari 2600 ruled the roost and Ms. Pacman came out for it (what a great game given the console's limitations), my mother (who was very good at it) claimed that the game would sometimes physically drag her down tunnels to her demise. She *swore* she could feel the joystick tugging in the wrong direction, despite her best efforts to go elsewhere. Having opened the joysticks several times, I tried my best to convince her that this was *not* possible, but she refused to believe me. So my mother would really rather not have anything to do with any *more* haptic input, thank you very much.
Keep a bunch of crap on your mousepad. You know, boogers, chewed gum, spitballs made of VA Linux stock certificates. Everything you roll your mouse over will give you tactile feedback.
AC's cheerfully ignored
"People don't buy online because they want to feel the fabric or squeeze the Charmin." A simulated feel or squeeze is not going help. To me, this looks like a technology that has little pratical application.
Granted, there are niche applications as described in the medical fields or for the blind, but mainstream applications such as haptic enabled mice do not offer much value to the average person.
It should be noted that Taco's example of windows that can snap to a position or size demonstrate exactly how interfaces can be improved without using haptic technology. Tacos examples utilize visual feedback, are available today, and are very effective. Why invent a technology to solve a problem when an effective solution already exists?
Life is like a web application. Sometime you need cookies just to get by.
Okay, that first sentence is classic. Congrats, Taco; for once I'm complimenting instead of bashing you. LOL...
--
I like to watch.
this is something i'd been contemplating for a while, then i saw the logitech iFeel mouse. i wanted to try one in an everyday/productivity environment, but all i could find was their cheezy store display that made the mouse 'buzz' when you scrolled over a dot.
my goal is to find an other-than-visual feedback mechanism for everyday UI controls; i.e. being able to locate/confirm buttons, menu items, without relying soley on visual input to do so.
the goal is simple: to get faster. i already use the Finder sounds on my MacOS machine, the audible feedback allows me to already be retraining my visual focus on the next task position even before i click to complete the current one - i know to click when i hear the blip. it allows you to lead with your eyes; you spend less time pondering the next task.
audio, however, is not the most convenient feedback mechanism. in noisy office environments you either have to wear headphones and be in a cocoon, or turn your speakers up, and the constant bleeps will probably annoy your cubicle neighbors enough that they plot some sort of revenge.
so, does anyone own one of the logitechs? pity it's such a simple/flat mouse, i don't think the company has really explored this as a productivity enhancing tool, so it would seem that this one is the litmus test to see if the market embraces it or dismisses it as a novelty.
www.pixelectric.com
First haptic puh. r u ready 2 g0?
Puh! +im3 2 g0!
BleepBleepBleep, "you just beat me cause I had the stupid vibrator on. I can't play with that crap, turn it off"
"I don't know where to do it, Haha too bad. You just suck anyway, quit making excuses"
"No you suck. I get first controller..."
the mouse-watching tech and we'll really be on to something!
sulli
RTFJ.
It's just that -- in general -- there's so many better things you could be doing with your life than watching and/or developing porn. Not that it's not Big Business, and sure, some guy may come along and do it; but do you really want to be That Guy?
that's all.
~jeff
> I once was "Ungrounded Lightning Rod" but /. slashed off my " Rod".
Dear GOD! Was it the new version of Slashdot that did this to you? All that happened to me was it quit spam-proofing my address.
Forget worrying about web sites tracking my mouse movements or sending gravity-well pop-up ads -- I'm surfing with a codpiece!
Insert simplistic political, ideological, or personal proselytization here.
that's some dumb shit. i saw that on some girls computer, man that is so girly, dumb fucks.
Certianly there will be some use for some people, but overall they will be a small percentage.
General browsing(what most people do) will only be handicapped as webwienies..er webmasters, find ways to use this for everything on the site they master..er maintain.
short of wiring the actual tactile sense into your brain, this will never be tactile enough to judge textile products with.
and of course gamers will claim that there is an 'unfair' advantge to this as some people download driver that lets them 'feel' when there on target. Which will allow people who MIGHT have that ability to be banned from certain server(like having a driver which gives you the ability to see through walls, even though your not using it).
basically its another really cool technology with very limited real world use.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
A full body suit that you would strap on before you loaded up something like 'knockout kings.' Every time you get punched you feel a hit wherever you got punched. Just imagine how fun it would be to tweak your own games then...
"Here (insert person-who's-been-pissing-you-off's name here), try playing Mech Warrior with this suit on..."
~ now you know
That being said, it is really sad to think that there have been few really innovative and memorable improvements to the human-computer interface since the original Macintosh in 1984. (Yes I know Messr. Jobs got it from Xerox - cool your jets flamers. The Mac was the first widely available GUI system. Facts are facts.)
Not only is it time to start thinking more seriously about using the 4 other senses besides sight to enhance the human-computer interface (no pr0n jokes, please - I'm serious) but it is also high time to realize that not everyone has the use of their eyes. This type of interface improvement can do wonders for the visually impaired computer users among us. I'd like to see more improvements of this type.
Laws affecting technology will always be bad until enough techies become lawyers.
"On Wednesday, Microsoft Chairman Bill Gates showed off a handheld computer that understands which way is up and where it's being touched."
Why do I get the feeling this is the only reason why this new technology was reported?
"Oh, wow, Bill Gates said it, so it must be true..."
*fumes*
is what you'll most likely do should you come accross the only piece of equipment in existence today that actually uses this technology: the force feedback mouse. If you haven't tried it: it vibrates if you place the mousepointer on something that can be clicked. If you run into the edge of a window, it, well, also vibrates.
hardly the most exciting "user experience".
somehow, I don't see them get from "vibrate" to "within 10 years, shoppers will be able to "feel" a piece of silk or other fabric simply by rubbing their finger over a computer screen" (article). if we're supposed to be able to mimic "the feel of silk" in ten years, right now we should've been able to "feel the shape of a woman's tits", i should think. and i'm pretty sure the porn industry would've picked up on this if it were possible.
i wouldn't expect this technology to come into existence within the next ten years if i were you. nor twenty or thirty.
News and bla for computer musicians: http://lomechanik.net/
How about instead of Haptic feedback, someone invents slapstick feedback!
When you click on an banner ad, you get a pie in the face!
I have a logitech IFeel mouse, and the tactile feedback gets old real fast. I turned it off after only a few days. I occasionally turn it on for games, but that's about it. Nothing like having your mouse vibrate when you're playing Tribes 2 and you run over a mine.
** The opinions expressed here are my own, and do not reflect those of my employers - past, present, or future**
I can see this type of thing being included in the next release of Net Nanny/Cyberpatrol/etc.
NetNanny... Make your children run from pr0n (or their mouse anyway)!
Bow before my sig, for it is good.
Not only is it time to start thinking more seriously about using the 4 other senses...
My computer already makes use of the sense of smell...
"My processor's melting, my processor's melting!!"
I am the hub of Jack's digital lifestyle.
Well taco, the Logitech iFeel mouse has been out for several months and is already able to do that. I have one. It is usb-only (which is a pain to set up sometimes even with the latest kernel) and there are no drivers for linux that allow it to use the vibration, though. With the windows drivers, it vibrates whenever you move it over a link in IE, but it is not that helpful, because it doesn't keep vibrating. You feel the same then whether you move it past the link or not. Not very helpful. And it only works in Internet Explorer, not Netscape or Opera (which is by far the best-engineered browser of them all). All in all the mouse is neat but the tactile feedback is not useful. So, in my opinion, this "feedback" techonology is not the next big thing, and will be almost unheard of in a few years except in specialized tasks.
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
its not like this technology hasn't been around. playstation has being shaking for a while now.
Along the same lines, computers and monitors should include small explosive charges that could be detonated in the same circumstances.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
hubbabubba
I yam a proud and happy
Fried ice cream is a reality. - George Clinton
to touch my mouse while surfing pr0n?
Evil is the money of root.
(Humor, not flamebait. Please mod accordingly.)
The CS department at UNC Chapel Hill has a neat research project where they use haptic feedback in conjunction with a "nanomanipulator". Basically you can feel atoms. It's pretty slick. They have a number of other haptic research projects too in regards to VR and such.
pretty much 99.9% of all the functionality can be done with the keyboard.
Linux GUI is inconsistent in key bindings and seriously lacking keyboard interface.
I like windows in this regard. The copycat linux folks could do a better job emulating if they spend some time to use windows.
Linux gui is also ugly. Just look at the solid color top bar of an app and compare it to windows design...it has a fading color effect.
before you go and say yeah windows is "pretty"...I'm saying windows gui is a well thought out, pleasing to the eyes, and it make your computing experience a lot better...less boring.
Even the simple iFeel is a *little* more than just "shaking or not" -- it does have "varying degrees of vibration" and the frequency of shaking can be chosen too as indicated (http://moore.cx/dan/out/ifeel/). Irregular patterns of vibration can be handled by just timing individual pulses in software. The Immersion software simulates textures by triggering pulses of various intensities that correspond to the mouse position/movement. It isn't spectacular, but is a much better effect than I anticipated. There are pointing devices that do actually restrict movement, in particular I've seen at least one that is a mouse, but they're much more expensive. The nice thing about the iFeel is that it gives another non-intrusive way to indicate something to the user at very low cost. The bad thing is that no one really uses it well right now.
This seems to rate right up there with speech recognition as one of those technologies whose advent has been only 5 years away for the past 15 years.
Speech recognition is here. It works. It works very well. And it doesn't take a ton of resources.
But no one wants it! Except for a few specialty uses, people simply do not want to talk to their computer. It's embarassing.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
Again, making the virtual world more like the real world. Anyone remember the Simpsons' episode where Marge could get the kids to do yard work, but as soon as they saw the yard work simulator they wanted to do that?
She sat at the window watching the evening invade the avenue.
but maybe I'm just not a true geek. I can't seem to get excited about this. But then again, I actually look at my screen, and different color fonts with underline seem to work quite well as to alert me to links.
Shift happens. Fire it up.
Besides, how can it be offtopic? The message thread specifically mentions using haptic feeback devices to surf pr0n.
Then again, the novelty will probably wear off after 10 minutes and I'll be back to console lynx style...
If I were playing a game, this would be much different. It would be cool to have the mouse give a kick when I shoot. Can you think of other uses?
Yeah, I can tell from the goatse stench that an editor's been through here marking everyinthing down.
What the hell's wrong with a normal AC (score: 0)?!!!! No one's gonna see it at 0 unless they go looking for it since the default threashold is 1. It's not going in the archive, since it's below 1. I really don's see why some editor felt threatened enough by my sad attempt (grantedly OT) at humor that they felt the need to stomp on it.
Abuse like this is why the moderation system doesn't even have a chance to work right. I guess I'm just a "No-Good Shit" AC.
...but I just had to say:
My wife, Juanita, likes to browse the web Hispanicly
Oh wait, that's haptically, not hepatically...
It's only software!
I want a radio tuner wheel that "clicks" into stations relative to how strong they are.
-Frank
it works on self-deforming flat screen technology. Touch-screens with the ability to make "buttons" could be as revolutionary to the UI as the mouse was. Just don't ask me how it would work.
Let's see, I can use the iSmell to recreate scents. I can get the 180 degree immersive monitor to immerse my sense of sight. My sense of hearing can be fooled by the AuSIM reCREate. The previously mentioned iFeel MouseMan covers my sense of touch. That just leaves my sense of taste, which is obviously lacking if I would use all of these products rather than go outside and take a walk. <sigh> I suppose I will just have to lick my iSmell.
Serious question: is there a window manager that will let me do X mouse operations using user definable keyboard commands? E.g. I'd really like to replace the "middle-click" with, say, the F12 key.