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As a note, SuSE, despite their marketing claims, is not the first distribution to go to market with a commercial 2.6 kernel. This Beta is for a product that will offer the 2.6 kernel, however Gentoo is already selling Gentoo 2004.0, and Mandrake is selling copies of Mandrake 10 Community on DVD.

I don't know how SuSE defines "commercial" or "first", but if other distros are selling copies before SuSE even has released 9.1, then I'd have to say their marketing campaign needs to be revised ;)

Its not that software is not worth such an investment, its just that a product must stay in the price range of its competition for it to be worth it. Even down here in Texas where people will get in fights over brands of trucks, I'm sure the diehard Ford/Chevy/Dodge loyalists would stop buying their favorite brand of truck if it was $10000 more than a comparible model. With nothing to compare to $179 dollars for Redhat isn't that much. But when you consider joining the Mandrake Club costs $120 and SuSE costs $89.95 you see that Redhat's price IS too much.

You know I am pretty sure creating such a beast shouldn't be a problem. Watch.

Step 1: Get yourself a small form factor PC, like the ThinkGeek Cappucino or The Open Brick or build your own cool looking mini PC.

Step 2: Get yourself a USB DVD drive (brownie points for DVD burners)

Step 3: Get a USB TV Card that runs under Linux (Note: I did a quick google, but I'd bet money you could find one that worked much better. And that page was talking about spotty TV signals in 2002. I bet it's gotten better)

Step 4: Download a copy of MythTV

Bingo! You've now got a PVR which will either look nice in your stereo cabinet (like that ThinkGeek case), or which you can keep hidden, save for the external DVD drive (and since every DVD player has a DVD drive in it, you're not going to find anything with a much smaller footprint). And, it shouldn't be too hard to hide the OpenBrick. And all for under $1500.

Mandrakesoft have a version of 9.2 for Athlon 64 systems.

Fedora, Gentoo, and Debian also have A64 ports in development.

So dont wait for Windows, Join the 64-bit revoloution today, with Linux! Ported faster because the source is open!

This lets you directly jump to the conclusion without having to read the 3-pages:


Conclusion:

The coming months (weeks?) should be interesting in that Mandrake is set to release the AMD64 version any time now, as they are taking pre orders for it in the Mandrake store. Recall, it was one of the best (if not the best) in my first review, and I blame the drive problems on the Asus BIOS update. Gentoo is nearing (from what I read) a really stable working system, and I have read repeatedly that others have it working fully (as a workstation with X windows) on other motherboards, so I again blame the Asus for my troubles with Gentoo. Red Hat is another story, having dropped the desktop edition, the "workstation" edition is well beyond my financial reach. A corporation may consider purchasing a copy for evaluation, but I would be tempted to wait on Mandrake or Suse.

FYI: costs as of 12-16-2003 for AMD64 Linux distributions:

Mandrake pre order $100
Mandrake corporate server $750 (standard support) $1500 (unlimited support)
Red Hat AMD64 workstation $792
Red Hat Advanced Server $1992
Suse Professional 9.0 $120 (distribution on DVDs, no CDs)
Suse Enterprise Server $767 (2 cpu) $1450 (4 cpu)

Looking at the above cost matrix and my experience, it is almost tempting to purchase SuSe just to have the DVDs (no CDs, strange). The enterprise/server editions seem to all be priced about the same, with no definitive mention of CPU capability from RedHat or Mandrake on the server editions. (I assume at least 2 CPU capability built into the kernel)


Side note: the Mandrake pre-order in question is Mandrake 9.2 (pre-order is at http://www.mandrakestore.com)

I totally agree, and Mandrake is a great distro. I don't like SuSE's way of releasing their distro (ftp anyone?), and Redhat dropped the free version entirely, so for the desktop I usually recommend Mandrake for people just wanting to try Linux. I have great respect for their installer, which I find to be excellent!
IMHO this is great news, and as you say hopefully others will follow this model.

The latest version can be bought of Mandrake or downloaded from Linuxiso.org.
Feel like supporting ?

Are here on the preorder page. I haven't downloaded the beta yet, but in the past Mandrake included things like stock (vanilla) versions of Xine *without* css support. They may still, but I'm so in the habit of installing the PLF files before doing anything that I couldn't honestly tell you if 9.2 came with being able to read encrypted DVD's out of the box. FWIW not all DVD's are encrypted and having a non-css DVD player *is* useful, just not as useful.

Content

- 1 bootable CD
- 1 USB key, 128 Mb
- 1 booklet

think it'd be useful to know the price (obviously for the USB key) and size of the key. and perhapse a tentative release. sure, its RC1, but the final could be in a while

Why not just follow links to the Mandrake Store? The price is $59.90 and it includes a 128MB USB 2.0 key.

> mandrake just doesn't seem like a reasonable
> option to use for work/server environment on
> stable production servers.

"doesn't seem", but did you really try it in a production environment? I was very surprised to see how Mandrake is good for a server. The main issue with Mandrake is often all these fashionable multimedia/office apps that tend to eat a bit of memory and CPU. Just install your Mandrake with only tre console tools (and maybe webmin and console draketools) and you'll have an impressive server-oriented system, with all the softs you'll need with the networked URPMI (which now comes with parallelized capabilities: you can update 1000 server at once with a single command).

Additionally, MandrakeSoft this year released a "rock solid" server version of Mandrake, which has older features than the appealing Mandrake 9.1 and 9.2, but is really something reliable and affordable. It's the "Corporate Server 2.1" which starts at $749 with good support options, available for x86 & Opteron.

InfoWorld recently compared Mandrake, Red Hat, SuSE, and Turbolinux for a use inside a corporate environment. The result was that the 4 all products were excellent, but the Mandrake Prosuite 9.1 ranked first with the best overall note. Additionnally the ProSuite is by far the less expensive product (around $200). You'll find this 3-page article at InfoWorld. And the Mandrake 9.1 ProSuite is available for purchase directly from MandrakeSoft at MandrakeStore (Mandrake Club Members usually get rebates on most Mandrake products).

"You may want to consider purchasing a $60 upgrade ...
You may want to consider installing Linux"

$60 isn't such a bad estimate

XP Home: http://shop4.outpost.com/product/3063039
XP Pro: http://shop4.outpost.com/product/3063019

Apple doesn't do "upgrade editions". Every time they sell a copy of their OS, they sell it as a full retail purchase. It's a bit of a bummer, but considering that their full retail price is a little over half what XP Pro full retail costs, and less than twice what XP Home Upgrade Edition costs, (XP Home is so neutered! Who'd want it?) it's clear that OS X is a bargain.

And, mais bien sur, Mandrake Linux, a worthy competitor to either one, is available for free download or $54 for the Powerpack Edition 7 CD-ROM set or 1 DVD-ROM set. Red Hat, for those who are conscientiously objecting to anything French, can be had without support in the basic pack for $40. For those who don't like Mandrake but do like KDE, SuSE is at the exact price point.

There is also ample evidence, even without MacOS X's liberal use of the codebase, that BSD isn't dying, exaggerated reports to the contrary.

You can get you Mandrake box here (all official MandrakeSoft products).

It seems that they are doing much better since their latest Mandrake 9.1 was very warmly welcomed by users. In addition, their new business model based on Club subscription is certainly the best idea a Free Software company ever had to make money with Linux! On the users' side, the Club is a great tool to get and install - with one click - all the neat stuff that isn't available for free or difficult to find (such as RealPlayer, Flash player, many hardware drivers...).

I installed Mandrake 9.1 on many different machines and it's clear that it's their best distribution so far: I had extremely few glitches, and everything installed and auto-configured very quickly. In addition, their new desktop is very slick, in particular under KDE, with anti-aliasing everywhere, new icons (created by Everaldo, the designer of the new KDE icons) and so on...

I'm warmly recommending Mandrake 9.1 to all my friend and at work, because I found it very much more stable (less bugs) than Red Hat, especially on the desktop side (I found the X Window provided with Red Hat to be particularly unstable). When compared to Debian, it's really the same Free Software world and spirit, with 2 years of advance and a great desktop by default (yes CmdrTaco!!!). And I won't annoy you with supermount and other dynamic desktop options that made my life (and some friends') Microsoft-free for two years now...

By the way (1): it seems that Mandrake is also doing well at Download.com (look in the Linux section for you dudes who aren't under Linux). Much more than Red Hat and Suse actually.

By the way (2): the MandrakeStore has deeply improved since Mandrake 9.0 and I received my Mandrake pack pre-order in time.

Perhaps this "leak" is to take attention away from new releases of excellent servers: OpenBSD 3.3, RedHat 9 (even w/4 business hour response time), and Mandrake 9.1.

But I can guess at two reasons why it comes just now:

Perhaps this "leak" is to take attention away from new releases of excellent servers: OpenBSD 3.3, RedHat 9 (even w/4 business hour response time), and Mandrake 9.1.

Or perhaps it is to drum up sympathy in congress for new legislation which could be used to mandate DRM in the U.S. This would hamstring the U.S. IT sector and many public institutions by taking money out of already tight budgets and sending it to Redmond in the form of forced purchases of new hardware and software.

If you order 9.1 right now, you can also track the shipment on the MandrakeStore.com website. The other thing to note, if you have broadband and just want to download the distros, The MandrakeClub is nice to get all those closed source additions, like java and flash and realplayer.

I would encourage you all to buy the CD Set to support continuing development of this distrobution. Mandrake have been having problems recently, and every purchase counts :)

Seriously, I like Mandrake...a lot.

But, I don't feel right contributing cash as yet. Maybe I'll become a member this time if they are giving away some good goodies.

It's sad, really. I remember trying to support OS/2 a decade ago, buying it twice (2.1 and Warp). Well, nuff said.

that's all good and well, but Mandrake have gone on record saying that they don't make decent cash from the boxed versions, and would rather people downloaded and then joined their club. Still, the DVD will save all those swaps...

They actually make the most money if you buy a DVD from their store, especially if you buy the ProSuite with every new version (twice a year, iow).

Mini-ITX is strong.

specs and pics

If you look at this page, you'll see that for some of the features you need a non-free XFree 3.3.6 driver. Another fun detail on that page : description says : 300 to 400 EUR while it is sold for 590 EUR. But it definately is cool. Once they sell it for less than that 590 (which would buy you a nice PC WITH storage), and that non-free Xfree 3.3.6 driver thing is solved... it is a really nice box.

I like Mandrake but your comments regarding them not caring about the license is just plain wrong. 8.2 no longer includes Netscape. The next version will not include pine because of license issues. Mandrake has made a large attempt to remove all software that isn't free software from the GPL CDs. The only way to get anything else is to belong to the MandrakeClub or buy the PowerPack.

But remember, not only is it good to exercise choice - it's also good to encourage the proliferation of choice. (Huh?)

If you like Mandrake's work at providing a feature-rich Linux distro for the Mac, be sure to give 'em some money (ie, consider buying some CDs) so they'll see reason to keep up the excellent work!

Also you can now get the Mandrake 8.2 Powerpack CDs with full StarOffice 6.0 here for $65 (shipping included). StarOffice 6.0 is really *great* for import/export of MS files and font rendering. And it's a bit lighter than StarOffice 5.2.

Because Mandrake needs cash now!
...or they will have to lay of some of their people.
I placed a preorder for the 8.2 boxed set last night, while i was downloading the distro, just to support them.

Everyone that uses Mandrake should do this, or join the Mandrake Users Club. It's not very expensive and I get a nice boxed set, and some dead tree manuals.

I am pretty sure the Users Club membership could be really useful also, at least for linux newbies.

Altadena, CA - March 18th 2002 - MandrakeSoft is proud to introduce Mandrake Linux 8.2 as the most feature-rich, multi-purpose Linux operating system ever made available to the public. This new version of our flagship product combines the power and flexibility of a full-featured Linux server with the simplicity and elegance of well designed graphical user interfaces.

Mandrake Linux 8.2 is the best "all-in-one" solution for saving time and money with personal computers: installation couldn't be easier with our world-famous graphical installer, and no post-configuration hassles means that your Mandrake system is immediately ready for work. Depending on your requirements, Mandrake 8.2 can be installed either as a full-featured & powerful Linux server, or as a highly productive personal workstation.

New server features include the ability to use an encrypted filesystem for protecting sensitive data; "kernel-secure" adds important security features to the default Linux kernel; and an "Enterprise" kernel delivers SMP (Symmetric Multi Processing) and Hi-memory support (above 1024 MB) for high-end servers. Mandrake Linux 8.2 also introduces a quick and efficient way to set up printers and scanners; a new file sharing feature for easily sharing files and directories in a networked environment; and improved "hot-plug" support that lets users install new devices quickly and painlessly without having to reboot the system. A new remote desktop utility, RFBdrake, is extremely useful for controlling machines remotely within a LAN or securely through the Internet.

New desktop features include a completely redesigned Mandrake Control Center that serves as a central location for Mandrake-specific tools and utilities, as well as many new configuration wizards. Desktop users will appreciate the task-oriented menus in GNOME and KDE which greatly simplify locating applications by categorizing them into common "tasks".

MandrakeFirstTime is an easy-to-use wizard that helps setup a desktop environment (KDE, GNOME, etc.), choose a theme and configure email settings. DrakNet, the Internet connection and network utility, efficiently helps users configure all types of network connections, from common dial-up modems to DSL and cable connections.

The reworked version of MSEC, a utility for configuring the security level of a machine (Standard, High, Highest, Paranoid) is more powerful than ever. Also included are the latest stable versions of KDE and GNOME which both offer some great new features and applications such as anti-aliased fonts and Evolution (an Outlook-like email client and personal information manager). StarOffice 6.0 is included with the ProSuite and PowerPack Editions.

"With version 8.2, Mandrake Linux proves that it is the ultimate Linux experience. This new release is the result of our four year commitment to providing the best operating system ever. Mandrake Linux has long been the preferred Linux distribution for individuals, but Mandrake 8.2 marks a new step in our penetration of the corporate environment. The features and unparalleled ease of use make 8.2 an incredibly efficient and affordable alternative to UNIX and Windows 2000" said Jacques Le Marois, CEO of MandrakeSoft.

Core System Components

• Kernel 2.4.18
• Improved Firewire support
• Support for USB2, ECC memory, i830 DRM, ATA133, Geforce3
• XFree86 4.2 provides 3D acceleration for many video cards previously only supported in 3.3.6
• Glibc 2.2.4

Software and Applications

• Apache 1.3.23
• PHP 4.1.2
• MySQL 3.23.47
• PostgreSQL 7.2
• Sendmail 8.12.1
• Postfix 20010228
• Staroffice 6.0 is the latest version of the famous Office Suite that boasts integrated creativity and productivity tools, improved interoperability with Microsoft Office files, support for XML file formats, and improved international support.
• Evolution 1.02 is a full-featured personal information manager and advanced E-mail client. Evolution provides the best features in its class.
• KDE 2.2.2 (KDE 3.0 RC2 is also provided as an alternative desktop for users who enjoy the bleeding edge) and GNOME 1.4.1 -- Enjoy the latest versions of these popular desktop environments. KDE 2.2.2 includes a new print system which has been integrated with PrinterDrake; GNOME 1.4.1 includes Evolution to closely match the features and look of MS-Outlook.

Mandrake Linux 8.2 is currently available for x86 processors, and will soon also be available for the PPC platform.

To find out more about Mandrake Linux 8.2, please visit http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/82.php3

Pre-orders are now being accepted for the Mandrake Linux 8.2 ProSuite and PowerPack Editions at http://www.MandrakeStore.com

Or download your copy today at http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/ftp.php3

Mandrake Club members are entitled to download proprietary drivers and commercial software for 8.2: http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/club/

About MandrakeSoft

MandrakeSoft provides a trusted interface between users of information technology and open source developers. The company offers its enterprise, government and educational customers a set of GNU Linux and Open-Source software and related services, and user-friendly and highly competitive information technologies. In addition, MandrakeSoft offers technologists committed to open software and courseware a trusted channel to offer their services.

The company has technologists in over 20 countries, and is traded on Paris Euronext Marché Libre (Euroclear code: 4477.PA; Reuters code: MAKE.PA) and the US OTC market (stock symbol MDKFF). "Born on the Internet" in late 1998, MandrakeSoft established headquarters in the U.S.A., Montreal, England, Germany and France. Please visit the Web site, http://www.mandrakesoft.com for more information.

I was looking for pre-orders too. Found it
here. I sent in a message talking about pre-orders too. It looks like they might have gotten the picture.

There is no way more than 10%-20% of that will ever be seen by mandrake. It all goes to the great big distributers.

That's why Mandrake have started selling it themselves through the MandrakeStore.

Restore your system here, CDS fresh and cheap!

If you want to support Mandrakesoft, you'd better order your pack on MandrakeStore. Why? In traditionnal distribution channels, the final reseller (the shop) and the distributor (MacMillan?) take a big margin (traditionnally the two cumulated margins can be as high as 65% of the final price). On MandrakeStore, it seems that MandrakeSoft sells directly to the consumers, so it's very likely that they earn much money through MandrakeStore than from the traditional shelves. My 2 cents.

I've long said this. Subscriptions are the way to go. I'm up for the FreeBSD one ;-). BTW. Mandrake is offering subscriptions of sorts now also with FREQ stuff, you can get a FREQ Subscription.

The Mandrake Store puts an interesting spin on this as well. They now have a $5 "cheapo 2 CD burn set," and a $90 "fully featured, with manuals, 7 cd set." Note the lack of your standard Red Hat, SuSE, whathaveyou $30 boxed set. Basically, the only way Mandrake can make money now is off of the expensive boxed set, donations, or shirts/hats/mugs/whatever. I'm not quite sure where I'm goin with this, but it is interesting.

The only "intuitive" interface is the nipple. After that, it's all learned.

Two years ago, there were already some people working on a Mandrake for ibook/imac. There was a domain name called "imandrake.com". Actually, they didn't release anything until the Mandrake version was full-featured enough and easy to use to respect the Mandrake way! They didn't want to release anything that would have been too difficult to install or with the need to go through MacOS (with BootX) to launch the system. Now Yaboot seems stable enough for that purpose. Anyway I don't know if they ported Diskdrake yet! That would be a revolution in the Mac/Linux world. (BTW, if you need some Mandrake t-shirts they just have opened http://www.mandrakestore.com)