Slashdot Mirror
First Look At The New Palms
Jason Prini writes: "Take a look at ZDNET for pics of the new Palm pilots." They talk about the wireless models, as well as the new entry level models to compete more with Visor (which feature 25% smaller screens, but only a $150 price). I find it amusing that they offer changable color face plates (ala those Nokia phones).
Palm's have a much longer battery life than WINCE computers. My Palm Pilot runs for a month on normal alkalines, and my friends with a new Palm III, and Visor say they get about the same runtime.
Refrag
I have a website. It's about Macs.
And a 25% smaller screen? That's just not going to be very useful to people.
It's for kids.
The current 73 dpi display was designed for 40 year old aging eyeballs. The youth market will have no problems with a smaller 90+ dpi display as long as the contrast is reasonable.
For some kids, a display too small for their parents to easily read over their shoulder could even be a selling point.
Point the first: The US healthcare debacle is a discussion for another day, but I will concede that in that case free enterprise has not found a viable long term solution. (You're right, you caught me in an overgeneralization.)
Point the second: Peer pressure does NOT constitute force. Nobody MAKES you do anything. They may make you think it's cool to have a polka-dot speckledy phone, but the purchaser still bears full and final responsibility for the purchase. "But my friend made me!" didn't work when I was in elementary school, and it certainly doesn't apply in consumer electronics.
Point the third: Do you see the parallel? Just because it's available doesn't mean you HAVE to buy it. If you buy a Palm M100, and don't buy a fashion faceplate, nobody is going to come to your door in the middle of the night.
Point the fourth: Despite the fact that my point was couched in barbed words (as much for humorous effect as anything else), you have not yet successfully explained how Palm selling little hunks of plastic forces you to buy little hunks of plastic. I wouldn't concede MY personal sovereignty to ANYBODY, least of all some faceless corporation that happens to make cool PDA's (I love my Palm III). Take responsibility for your own choices, and I guarantee that it will make you a happier person. (This is not meant to imply that you or anybody you know is unhappy, merely that in this individual's experience, which correlates well with logical thinking about the way the world works, personal responsibility leads to personal satisfaction. YMMV, no purchase necessary, no warrantee express or implied...)
Re-reading my posts, I realize they were a bit pointier than I had originally intended. For that, I apologize. I am seriously interested, however, in understanding this notion being put forth that options are a bad thing, and should not be sold.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Before raking this thing over the coals, keep in mind that pretty much any /. reader does not fall into the target market for this product. The m100 is aimed towards the non-techie youth market, the same people who have custom faceplates on their Nokia and the most fashionable school backpack available.
And a 25% smaller screen? That's just not going to be very useful to people
A 25% smaller screen isn't really a problem, as long as the resolution is the same.
The problem with these is, the graffiti-area will also be 25% smaller, which will make it harder to use. (I sometimes have trouble writing on my IIIe)
I have to agree with this.
.2mm acetate. Giant fucking load of bullshit - makes me not want to ever do business with you again. If this is a part subject to wear, then let the user replace it cheaply.
I bought a Palm III last year, on ebay. Things Palm has to do to get me to buy another one:
Lower price - compare the functionality to a CE device. Mind you, I'm never going to buy one of those peices of crap, nor do I want or need that kind of functionality in a Palm, but there's no justification for the price.
Smaller form-factor; baby, if you can put the features of the III (upgradability, accessories, backwards compatability) into the V's form-factor, you'll have a winner. Forget color! Only ONE reason I can think of for color, and that's maps, and for that, you really need gobs more memory. Really. Even the V is really too big for most people to conveniently carry around, but DON'T shrink the screen. ultimately, a credit-card form-factor would be best, like those wallet calculators - only make the screen the size of the whole thing.
User-replacable writing pad; I wasn't clued into the fact that I needed to put a piece of scotch tape over the writing area of my Palm III. End result: scratched-up screen, Palm asking to take my device for 3 weeks and bill me $100 to replace a peice of
Functionality? The desktop software sucks. You need a sketch-pad software so people can sketch quick diagrams or maps. That's a gimme, not a value-add. 160x160 is insufficient. 320x320? getting there. 640x640? We have the technology, we can rebuild him, the price-point is already there. I also think that there should be MUCH more pager integration going on, with a wider variety of vendors. I'm a gadget guy, I love gadgets, but at some point, clipping more things to my belt than Batman becomes tiresome - I'm sick of carrying a pager AND a palm-pilot, and there are so many cool things that could be done with integrating a text-pager, fuck the internet, that's lame. Just let me download stock quotes, weather, and news every hour like my text pager, automatically, from a satellite. Why is that so hard?
Drop functionality;
Dude, the email feature is weak. Unless you can provide a viable competitive email client on the PC side to Outlook, the current offering sucks. There isn't enough memory to store my emails consistently without jamming my synchs, and composing email on the Palm is pretty pointless if I can't send, and paying for a Palm VII with monthly service fee just isn't worth being able to email. I save email for my desktop. If you could include a decent email client with your desktop software, integrate it with the schdule stuff, like Outlook does, make it 100% outlook compatible so I can use it, and still function with the others in my office who use Outlook, and synch all that to my Palm, that had enough memory, and enough resolution to actually display enough text on screen, that would be cool. But until you do that, it's useless, why bother?
In short, I'm unexited by Palm, but it's still by far, the best solution to the personal info management problem there is.
if it ain't broke, then fix it 'till it is!
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
Well, actually, a higher screen resolution would be required too.
Right now, the Palms are really locked-in to 160x160 resolution. Someday, they are going to have to crack out of the 160x160 box.
If I were Palm/Handspring, I would be prototyping new units with 360x360 resolution, and a backwards-compatibility mode for older apps that treats each 2x2 square as a single pixel, thus providing 160x160. And I want one of those!
Long-term, someday we will be carrying palmtops that have 1200dpi resolution, and really excellent contrast... in other words, we will have palmtops whose displays are about as readable as paper is. When that day comes, I want a box the size of a paperback book, waterproof, with enough storage to contain a whole bunch of books.
Any guesses how long I must wait?
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
don't count on it. Motorola seems to be having problems with clock speed ramping lately.
(probably fucking Bill Walker's fault again)
if it ain't broke, then fix it 'till it is!
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
160x160, same as any other Palm device. Most Palm devices are 2-bit greyscale (== 4 shades of grey), and the IIIc has 256 colors.
The Palm V showed how readable and usable a Palm device can be with a physically smaller screen. Compared to previous Palm devices, the V's screen has much better contrast and is much easier to read; the slightly smaller pixels tend to make it look a little bit sharper, which doesn't hurt.
Therefore I predict that the new Palm devices are using a screen the same size as the Palm V. Most likely, the same exact screen as the V; that way they can order them in larger quantities and maybe get the price down a little.
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I suggest you try ScreenWrite. This is a Palm extension that lets you write Graffiti in the whole screen display area, instead of in the little Graffiti box at the bottom. Shareware, $5 to register it.
http://www.inkverse.com/screenwrite.html>
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I asked a bidder that question once and she replied there were no units to be had on shelves or ecommerce sites anywhere - everyone was backordered - and she wanted it for a gift that week.
Acctually this has been done already:
The Anoto pen.. (www.anoto.com)
>>"Somebody makes a thing that's got a pad of paper, that you write on with a real pen, and the information gets downloaded to your palm -- the palm docks on the other side, the whole thing is like a little leatherbound notebook. I can't remember who makes it."
They shouldn't. I suspect that the older Gameboy games are written like Apple ][ and Commodore 64 games were: they depend on the clock speed of the system, and if you speed up the system, the games run too fast and are unplayable.
Possibly the action games on the Palm are written like that, but I doubt it; we already have a substantial speed difference between the basic Palm models and the Handspring Visors.
Actually, the 2600 used a 6502-related microcontroller, the 6510 I believe. Contemplate, for a moment, a chip even less capable than the 6502! (The 6502 can address 64KB, and I believe the 6510 can only address 4KB.)
The Palm devices all run on a Motorola 68000-family microcontroller, the Dragonball. When Motorola releases new, faster versions of that chip, you will see new, faster Palm devices.
But keep in mind: one of the best things about the Palm devices is that they don't suck the batteries dry too quickly. Moore's Law stands mute on low-power devices. Expect even low-power devices to get quicker and better, but don't expect them to improve as fast as desktop CPU chips.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I just had to buy my wife a Palm, as she liked mine so much. Ebay is ridiculous, but I managed to find a refurbished III one for $99.95 at redgorilla.com
George
Hate to be pedantic (
henry [ w i r e t r a p . n e t ]
Simple. "Power" users, who read SlashDot, want a Palm that does a lot, and generally know what they are talking about, don't want a IIIe, they want a IIIxe, a Vx, the new VIIx, a TRGpro, etc. PalmStation readers are not their target audience. The IIIe was/is most popular with people who just want "one of those 'Palm' things" to track their friends' phone numbers, and maybe their shopping list. They want a fancy organizer, not a Palmtop computer or communications device.
Palm realizes that. So they are taking their low-end products and saying "these people want sizzle, so let's give them sizzle." It sells Palms on the "funky colors are cool" crowd, including many, many teens. At only $150, it's cheap enough for them to afford as a fancy, high-end organizer. Then, 12 months from now when about half of those people realize that they do need more than 2 MB of RAM, or a larger screen, or what not, lo and behold there are the higher-end Palms like the IIIxe and IIIc ready and waiting for them to upgrade, but they loose nothing because their existing addressbook is perfectly compatable, any add-on programs they have will work, and the learning curve is virtually zero. Just a few hundred dollars for that upgraded device, junior.
As a wise man once said, "Get them while they're young." The M100 is an "on-ramp" product ("Gateway Palm?"). And I think it has a decent chance of succeeding as precisely that; a way to get people into the PalmOS market, so they can be sold future devices next year. The M100 is of absolutely no value to me, I'm perfectly happy with my TRGpro. But in terms of getting high school aged kids (or high-flying execs who would like to think they are high school aged kids) into the PalmOS world, which means creating more long term customers, Palm does know what they are doing.
--GrouchoMarx
--GrouchoMarx
Card-carrying member of the EFF, FSF, and ACLU. Are you?
I think I just saw my IIIx get more valuable on the used market. I don't like the new design at all. I agree that the screen is about as small as it should get to maintain useability. Whether they shrunk the size and/or the resolution -- bad move.
I don't mind a move into a new market demographic, but please oh please continue to make and sell the present models.
I may have to go out and try to find a IIIxe or a Vx soon or start shopping for one on ebay.
Also, I haven't seen anyone address the wireless issue for those of us that don't live in a big city. The VII is right off my list. There is no wireless network here (Flagstaff, AZ) so the price difference is just not worth it. Maybe with a bluetooth adapter to talk to my cell...
And Palm, where are the slots? Expandability is going to be essential.
I see this as an iterim solution on the way to slots and bluetooth wireless. I'll pass thanks.
War is Peace. Freedom is Slavery. Ignorance is Strength. - George Orwell or George Bush?
I've heard it said before that US companies don't understand the European mobile market - particularly SMS services, and this helps confirm that theory. Mobile phone usage in the UK has now hit 50%, and this is behind other European countries like Italy.
If Palm don't do something soon, they're going to lose out to other manufacturers, and that's a pity, because I firmly believe theirs is the best PDA product out there. But for GSM PDAs, the new Ericsson R380's looking pretty good...
I mean ok, 8 megs of RAM instead of 2 is nice (just like how Gameboy games got bigger size-wise with the advent of cartridges that hold more memory), but is the processor any beefier? Is there some correlation between hand-held devices and a power increase that is more sluggish than Moore's law would predict? I had it in my head that it should actually grow faster on new kinds of devices, but copmpact devices (Palms, mp3 players, videogame systems) seem to not get beefy as fast as they should. Am I crazy?
sig:
sig:
See the "..for smart people" banners Wired runs here? Look elsewhere guys.
I dunno... is it me or we all thought the logical expansion path for Palm was color? at least i thought so.. i've own a palm for a long time now and the only problem i see with it is the absense of color, it does everything else i need it to. their IIIc version wasn't that great a success, but i thought they would keep on trying...
.1 release, not a major upgrade...
so now the question, why are these new models better? IMHO if they were software they would be a
There are two kinds of people in the world: Those with good memory.
You're welcome.
--Shoeboy
WWJD? JWRTFM!!!
About half of the folks I work with who use a palm keep it in a 6x9 zipper organizer -- daytimer, franklin, etc. What I would like is LARGER pilot, say 4x6 inches or so, designed right into such an organizer. Then I could read /. during meetings without having to hit the scroll key every 17 words. I can't image the screen any smaller than it already is!
And just to anticipate the objection, I've tried and tried to get my life down to just using the palm, but nothing beats a quick "note to self" written the old fashioned way.
----- Indecision is the key to flexibility.
Alright, cool new case. Big whoop, I can already get a Palm IIIe with the larger screen for the same price. And that doesn't even include going to the Visor (which the cheap one bothers me because it has no sync cable). Keep the IIIe and if you have to compete with Visor, give it some funky color cases. Oh yeah, while your at it, allow the IIIe to upgrade its OS. Hell, you already made a clear cased one.I love my Palm, but this just seems to be the wrong direction. Its the same price for less Palm.
"My head hurts, My feet stink, and I dont love Jesus." -Jimmy Buffett
I was trying to be nice.. ;)
--
Sam
On one hand, it is very nice not to have to buy and trash AAA's. But OTOH, they do drain - or report needing to be changed anyway - much faster than Alkalines. I average about a week and rotate among 4 NiMH's I have. I like not throwing away the alkalines, and I save money too not having to buy them each month. I paid about $20 for 4 AAA's and a charger.
I also have a digital camera (Oly D340l) where I use NiMH as well and as you pointed out, the performance of NiMH vis-a-vis Alkaline is 3-5 times better with the NiMH's.
With that experience, I expected to see decent NiMH performance with the Palm, but guess that is not to be. If anyone can explain why NiMH outperform Alk. in a DigiCam, but the situation is reveresed in a Palm, I'd appreciate it.
know where i can get one of those?
Actually, I'd like to get a whole bunch of them. With wireless communication so I can set 'em up as a Beowolf cluster. :-)
Spontaneous Palm-size distributed computing. The mind boggles at the possibilities.
I think I'll make that my new .sig
"200 Quatloos on the newcomer!" "300 Quatloos against!"
A question, I have been DYING to get a Palm Vx since it was realesed, but the price is downright ridiculous. The new palm is not interesting at all - sooo ugly and SMALLER screen. shessh. So, is the price of the Palm Vx going to drop when the new palms are released?
>No, they'll be sold separately.
...would suit you just fine. You know those Ford Explorers have several colors besides the ever popular Forest Green. How about one of each? Look at this fine boat. Just run your eyes along it's sleek lines and smooth fiberglass. Isn't that metallic gelcoat pretty...just sign here, thank you. Come back any time.
And if they were, the price listed would not equal the sum of the parts? BZZZT - poor thinking.
> This'll be another example of a business taking
> advantage of gullible consumers...
Which is exactly what gullible folks are for. They are there for the rest of us to use to our own advantage. I mean really, why else do they exist? Why does anyone have the ability or motivation to observe, learn, make rational decisions, and thus become less gullible if not in order to improve their own position relative to those that remain more gullible?
> and you obviously won't be on the side of the
> business (you clearly have no understanding of
> that).
BZZZT - poor thinking again. On the contrary, I am a stock holder and I will most certainly enjoy the profits reaped from the fertile fields of the gullible and spineless fashion followers. I sincerely hope that you buy at least one of each color face plate, even if you choose not to buy the new M100. Do it just so that you can one up your office roomie and tell him that you have the complete collection! It doesn't matter if you don't like the color. The selection is there. You don't have to pick just one. If such decisions are too much for you, just get it over with and buy them all. You'll feel better afterwards.
>Grow a brain.
Don't grow a brain.
Don't open your eyes.
Don't develop a spine.
You are a fine profit source just as you are.
Hey!, I've got some M$ stock. Would you like to buy another copy of w2k? Perhaps a 3com NIC? How about another processor? You know both AMD and intel have new models over 1GHz. How about a new ***DESIGNER*** PowerPC..."Ooooh a cube. Isn't it cute!"
Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
- W. Wriston, former Citibank CEO
!"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;?@ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTU VWXYZ[\]^_`abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz {|}~f...SOEZ''""---(TM)soezY£¥¦©®±¼½¾ÀÁÂÃÄÅÆÇÈÉÊËÌ ÍÎÏÐÑÒÓÔ ÕÖ×ØÙÚÛÜÝßàáâãäåæçèéêëìíîïðñòóôõö÷øùúûüýÿdddddd
---------------
Hey, now that's pretty interesting. Here's what's funny, though: you'd think something this informative would have been done much earlier, but I guess somebody had to be the first to do it. The mainstream press seems to have underrated this important story, however.
Yay noise!
Style wise they where going in the right direction with the PalmV (which I bought). All the new models (excluding the Vx) have been cheap plastic steps backwards. Making my "same or better" garantee almost worthless. (When "better" to them is "worse" to me).
Technolgy wise, they are beeing too conservative. Now, I like the simplicity of the Palm, and I don't think they should take the WinCE road, but there are tech improvements that could be made, and not just hardware ones (which could affect price or battery life), but programming ones.
How about adding "hyperlinks" to the OS so that I can insert a link to an address book record into my diary, or to-do list, and vice versa. Now *that* would be cool.
Thad
Thad
i just want a 200MHz CPU, 24 bit LCD, 64MB RAM, 128MB flash, linux and X windows and sound/accelerated video/scsi connections/pcmcia slots on a device the same form factor as the palm. and it should last a month on 2 AA batteries. anyone know where i can get one of those ?
Skins are cool for software applications. In the real world they're just a pain in the arse - you've got to put them somewhere when you take them off. I know I'd just be losing the case, or my girlfriend would move them to somewhere with all my other missing junk after I've left it laying around the living room for a couple of days.
I love my Palm III, and am glad to see the prices of PDA's falling. The only think i would add to mine is some sort of electric-shock-thingy so I could zap all the people who come up to me while I'm reading something I've downloaded onto it and say "Ooo, can I play Hardball?" or something.
========
Stephen C. VanDahm
Sure, I've been using rechargables for a long time - they are definitely worth it. I have a total of four rechargable ones (+ some normal ones for backup, which I've never needed to use). The batteries might not last as long as normal ones, but with Palm III it's a non-issue. The lifetime varies from a week (CPU-intensive/backlight) to about a month.
So, it is beneficial to use rechargables in a Palm, although not as much as with high-draw devices.
Perhaps I was unclear. I don't want a Palm PDA the size of a paperback book; I want a gadget for reading books, that is the size of a paperback book.
My Handspring Visor IX or whatever can have the paper-like display, too, but it doesn't have to be big or waterproof. I want a dedicated bookreader that is as good as a book in every way, and waterproof besides.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
And besides, those faceplate for the Nokia phones are just a gimick to make you spend more money on over-priced mobile phone accessories. Too bad the idea is spreading.
Sounds a lot like the Cross Pad.
"Sweet creeping zombie Jesus!"
Cute leather cover that turns the unit on
So get the hard case. It offers even more protection than the flip cover on the Palm III
Maybe you need to hold it like it was designed to be held then! And wipe your hands before using it.
Palm III: Upgradable
If you want to play about with a soldering iron. Funnily enough that's not why I got a PDA.
Well, I don't know about you, but I will take a Dilbert Palm over a Calvin Klein Palm any day! (Palms are mainly about function, not form.)
Fine. I think you'll find most people will take the device that is well designed on the software side, and on the design size. The Palm III/Visor and the Palm V run the same software. Which makes the only difference the look, and the Palm V wins out every time.
At least with digital cameras (which have high current draw), you get a very significant benefit by using NiMH batteries. For example, my Nikon Coolpix gets over 100 shots per charge, as opposed to about 6[!] for a standard run-of-the-mill alkalines.
Anyone know if you get a similar benefit in low draw devices like the Palm? I've been looking at PDAs, but after having my old Velo I (WinCE) tune Channel One while I was on the way to an interview, I've been reluctant to make the investment.
-
bukra fil mish mish
-
Monitor the Web, or Track your site!
Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachtani?
www.fogbound.net
My other first post is car post.
It's nice to see Palm computing cater to all of the lusers out there who would buy a wince box. But honestly, I'm waiting for some real major changes to make me upgrade my pilot personal. (yeah, it's got the pro card in it)
It pretty much does what I want it to, be a convienent way to track dates, phone numbers and passwords....Ya know the obvious things a PDA is supposed to do. Besides looking at some of these new styles, it makes me want to hold onto my personal longer.
"If you insist on using Windoze you're on your own."
I'm not surprised at this one bit. The Palm Pilot has become the new tech toy on the block, and it would naturally follow the path of business-oriented tech evolution - to be stylish.
Business people are snatching Palm Pilots up like crazy, and many want to add their own dash of individuality. It's a given that some want to be chic while being productive. (i.e.: The Nokia Faceplate.)
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon?
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon? :P)
(If you can't figure out how to E-Mail me, Don't.
Whew, dodged the bullet one more time. I dread the release of each new generation of PDA, because I know that one of these days they're going to begin offering voice recognition for input. Then, in addition to the construction guys and their offices shouting back and forth via Nextel phones, the yuppies chatting up their brokers, the teenagers with their pagers, and the dweebs who set their watches to beep every ten minutes, we can look forward to everyone bellowing into their fruit-colored brain-crutch. Where's a High-Energy Electro Magnetic Pulse when you need one?
Use The Bridge to connect your Palm V(x) to third-party accessories designed for the Palm III series.
For more information, click here.
A pig?
Compared to what?
Maybe an HP Wince device might be piggish, but a palm or visor? Yeesh. Come on now.
We're talking something smaller than a deck of cards. Any version. Pig is a Newton. Now relegated to swiping cards at tradeshows.
But any palm works fine. All this is a matter of taste.
> I hacked your firewall. YOU SUCK!
Dude! Don't do that. I cracked his machine and the prick came and trashed MY computer. Vindictive little fucker.
Ryan
For that matter, the Palm IIIe has a full sized screen and starts at $150 ($130 if you look hard enough.
Finkployd
I've got a Palm III where the glass screen cover is cracked. The LCD's fine, but the digister won't work because the glass is gone.
How'd this happen? Fall of maybe 3Com onto lino, out of a pocket. I can't believe 3Com never thought that sort of thing would happen when they designed it...
What it really makes me wonder, though, is why use glass? Surely perspex would be lighter, just as rigid yet less fragile? And scratching isn't an issue as there's a separate screen protector on top of the glass anyway... Or, for that matter, why design the glass and LCD to be totally inseparable. Makes it a non-economic repair and absolutely guarantees I'm leaving PalmOS.
It's getting replaced with a Psion 5. Bigger screen, easier data entry - I just got sick of having to do too much in Graffiti. And, from what I can see, no glass in that screen.
Greg
(Inside a nuclear plant)
Aaaarrrggh! Run! The canary has mutated!
Actually I installed the hack in my III to make it reverse the text when the backlight comes on (Palm V like), I've found that to be easier to read.
:)
Oh well, to each his own. That is why there are hacks
Finkployd
The III is a pig?
A pig?
Compared to what?
Compared to my V. I had the Palm Pro originally, looked at the III but the case was still too thick and bulky, and it was still plastic and creaked if I pressed on it. The V is thinner, smaller and "solid"
I agree that when compared to a Newton or most of the CE devices, the Palms are about as un-pigly as they come. But I was comparing amongst versions of the Palm.
The palm screen is a perfect square, go ahead, measure it :)
Don't count the silkscreen area, just the display.
Finkployd
The [Newton's] handwriting sucked for most things. Great for notes, useless for anything else
Verus what? Graphiti? Where you have to write things out one letter at a time in a tiny little box? After using a Newton, this aspect of the Palm experience immediately turned me off to them. I've been trying to become interested ever since. I don't think most people really realize that with a Newton, you could write anywhere on the screen and have the thing recognize it.
I honestly don't know what you mean about the handwriting recognition. I thought the MessagePad 120 did an exceptional job of recognizing my handwriting. What I will grant you is that the Newton was too big and too expensive. If Palm had just taken the Newton and shrunk it and reduced the price, I would have been onboard right away. But I feel the Palm had a significantly less efficient UI than the Newton, large due to the constraints of Graphiti.
- Scott
------
Scott Stevenson
Scott Stevenson
Tree House Ideas
...IMNSHO, would be a "sports" model. I always carry a folded up ziploc bag in my Palm pouch just in case I get caught in a rain shower. Would it be that difficult to add a rubber seal around everything? Okay, the hard buttons might lose a wee bit of functionality and hence be not as good for Hardball or whatever, but let's remmeber that the Palm isn't meant to be a gaming platform. Just as long as they don't add the bright yellow color that seems to be automatically associated with "sports," I'll be happy.
-J
Karma: T-rexcellent.
C'mon - colors? Ok that's cool for the mass market aka Nokia phones. But what about just building a tougher hardened case? Shockproof, waterproof? Generally something that you don't have to baby as much? True the screen will always be the weak point but there must be some way to make a mass market device for young people that's designed to be used the way young people would treat it - aka abusively. Heck I have a Nokia 636 analog cell phone you can pound nails in with. I was hoping that this was what Sony would bring to the party - a consumer oriented tough unit you could treat like a Discman.
Guess I just have unrealistic expectations.
Did anyone else think about radical RSI surgery when they saw this headline? (Either that or someone wanting to show off their clean-shaven palms...)
Somebody makes a thing that's got a pad of paper, that you write on with a real pen, and the information gets downloaded to your palm -- the palm docks on the other side, the whole thing is like a little leatherbound notebook. I can't remember who makes it.
There is a /. PQA someone made. Check palm.net. I use it and it works very well. On the VII, you can either go per K, or a flat rate plan for like $40/month.
By making it all curvy, like an iMac, and colorful (like an iMac), and giving the user the ability to change the color to match their mood (like a Nokia cell-phone), 3Com is letting the rest of the competition know that they have simply run out of technological ideas, and are ready to be replaced as the leader in the PDA market.
So it is your belief, then, that 100% of Palm's core engineering department was deployed to put colored cases on the devices? And you do not think that Palm is continuing to develop technological advances in parallel with the redesigned casings? I hope you're not one of those people that feel that every single device, OS and application in the world should have the visual appeal of a lead pipe. Heaven forbid we think of humans as visual beings. Careful not to make the industrial design too bold or creative, it might steal cycles from the processor.
BTW: What's up with the car industry? Why all the color choices? Isn't VW just telling their competition that they've run out of technological ideas? Why can't all cars just be beige and shaped like a 80's Volvo?
- Scott
------
Scott Stevenson
Scott Stevenson
Tree House Ideas
Pretty see-through colors don't increase useability
None of the pictures of ZDNet depict see-through cases.
- Scott
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Scott Stevenson
Scott Stevenson
Tree House Ideas
I think Palm is making a mistake in playing Handspring's game with the "iMac" principle of computer design, which seems to be "cheerfully colored case == better!" Frankly, I think I might be embarrassed to whip one of these M100s out on the subway or wherever
Exactly! What would people would say if you had a PDA that was in a color other than black? Just think about what a metallic blue or gold case suggests about you to the casual onlooker. I won't even mention anything about the silver case. Yikes.
Black casings forever, I say!
I think Palm is making a mistake in playing Handspring's game with the "iMac" principle of computer design, which seems to be "cheerfully colored case == better!"
Again, agreed. I definitely subscribe more to the "Model-T" principle of computer design.
- Scott
------
Scott Stevenson
Scott Stevenson
Tree House Ideas
Must disagree on one point....
With the Lithium battery, who in the hell wants to leave it in the cradle for an hour or so to recharge when you could simply go out to the store and buy some AAAs and keep on trucking.
Not me . . . . thats why you won't see GameBoys or anything like that with a rechargeable, in-dock-only battery.
Gateway is using the Transmeta 400MHz TM3120 chip to build "Web pads". The chip uses only 1 watt of power during normal operation, The chip can be upgraded by computer makers or consumers using software. No chip replacement needed.
A pad the size of a sheet of paper is nice. As long as I can fold it in two and stuff it in to my pocket.
b.b.
From CONSCIOUSNESS EXPLAINED, by Daniel Dennett, p. 177
"The juvenile sea squirt wanders through the sea searching for a suitable rock or hunk of coral to cling to and make its home for life. For this task, it has a rudimentary nervous system. When it finds its spot and takes root, it doesn't need its brain anymore so it eats it! (It's rather like getting tenure.)"
Which is strikingly similar to 3Com's approach to the new Palm. By making it all curvy, like an iMac, and colorful (like an iMac), and giving the user the ability to change the color to match their mood (like a Nokia cell-phone), 3Com is letting the rest of the competition know that they have simply run out of technological ideas, and are ready to be replaced as the leader in the PDA market.
Time to ask Handspring for a Palm Vx-like form-factor. Now, I know, they come in fruity flavors too, but they've done some new technological innovation to already show more promise than the Palms. The Springboard is a great idea; though the non-upgradable ROM has got to go.
Frankly, I was convinced that some version of the WinCE PDA'a would have been the first to go candy-colored. I guess M$ is going to have to try real hard to top 3Com now... Maybe a talking paper-clip for the Jornada? Nah, paper-clips are too bulky for a device with such limited storage and processing resources.. How about a talking staple??
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
Not to mention that a Palm III (and all it's bastard cousins like IIIv IIIc etc) are not very durable. The design is quite bulky and quite lame. The original Palms often had their screens cracked in half. Palm didn't do a whole lot better with the Palm III. I wished they would stick with the metal V design. If they released a Palm V Color, I'd buy it in a second. But they don't listen to consumers...I already wrote them like 3 times and they didn't even bother to reply.
//m
Try placing a Palm III and a Palm V on the floor and stomp on them. Let's see which one wins. I'm thinking the Palm V.
//m
I had the dubious pleasure of owning a MP120 5 or 6 years ago. It wasn't the 2100, which was supposed to have repaired some of these problems, but it wasn't the first model, either. My palm does a lot more for me that's useful than any of the messagepads ever could, and while they were a nifty piece of technology at the time, I can understand why Jobs gave them the axe. For example(s):
All of those relegated newton to the niche market, and that's not what apple wanted. Had they have done more research a la palm, we might have something here.
What palm should do is work on getting the processor speed up without hurting battery life too much. This would enable a lot of applications that aren't possible right now, like handwriting (although graffiti does well for what it was intended to do). Color isn't important. If the screen went from 160x160 to 320x320 - whoooeee, baby. Or, paper white on black. I remember those notebooks back in the day.
This wasn't meant to flame anyone, but just put things in perspective. IM(ns)HO I think the vaio and the palm are a superior combination.
..don't panic
The screen will be smaller then most Palms because it's going for a small size like the V and Vx. I went from a III to a Vx and didn't mind the smaller screen, because the entire PDA shrank to a nice new pocket fitting size. The resolution will stay at the same 160x160 though.
Hello.
I also saw this news item on PalmStation. The general view there seems to be that the unit is 'ugly'. You can find the comments about it here.
I don't see why anyone finds this thing ugly, or big, or unfunctional. I agree that it's not the prettiest of designs, and I think the shape is a little too round. I really wish they had done more with a Palm Five-ish case design.
The first comment on that page is interesting: the guy predicts this thing to flop. If this flops, Palm could get into troubles.
looks like it was designed by an engineer
Well, I don't know about you, but I will take a Dilbert Palm over a Calvin Klein Palm any day! (Palms are mainly about function, not form.)
I do agree that the Palm V is smaller (thinner). And that is one of its benifits.
I contrast the devices like this:
Palm III: Upgradable
Palm V: Sealed, upgradable if you void warranty
Winner: Palm III
Palm III: Hard Plastic Cover, offers excellent protection
Palm V: Cute leather cover that turns the unit on when in your pocked due to bad design!
Winner: Palm III
Palm III: Long Life on 2 AAA batteries
Palm V: Rechargable
Winner: Palm V (Unless on long trip away from base)
Palm III: Flash upgradable
Palm V: Nope
Winner: Palm III
Palm III: Ugly, but does not slide out of my hand
Palm V: Digs into the edge of my hand and has a habit of sliding out of my hand and plummeting to the floor.
Winner: Palm III
Palm III: Has large number of PDA accessories avalible
Palm V has large number of PDA accessories avalible (pretty much) only from palm.
Palm III: Original Hot Sync contacts, compatible with nice toys like digital compasses and GPS'es
Palm V: Hot Sync contacts not compatible (won't even sync on an old Palm/Palm III cradle!!!!!)
Winner: Palm III
And the winner of this bout by completley biased judges is:
THE PALM III SERIES AND FORM FACTOR!!!
Try to hack my 31337 firewall!
Swappable faces! Now I can throw on my easy-clean face for when I'm looking at www.wap-pron.com!
Gfunk
Send lawyers, guns, and money!
Yahoo also has a story about the M100. You can find it here ...
I know it's all personal opinion but how can you prefer the Visor over the Palm V. The Visor looks like it was designed by an engineer and resembles a brick. The Palm has elegent curves, is smaller, lighter, and more attractive. I liked my Palm III but I'll keep my Palm V, and leave the Visor to those for whom cost is the main concern. And that outward taper. It fits comfortably along the heel of your hand making for a snug fit.
One of my friends, who works at a prestigious private school where the staff was given Palm Vs, noted that one of the Palm's great advantages over the Visor was that it looked more professional--by comparison, the Visor looked like some kind of hand-held computer game.
Well, even the Visor has it all over those things. Ugh!
And a 25% smaller screen? That's just not going to be very useful to people.
--
Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
If I get one and use it to view dirty pictures, will hair grow on my Palm ?
Not keeping up on Palms at all, I suppose this is as good a time to ask as any. What are the chances of there being 802.11 Palms in the forseeable future? A wireless modem is nice, but I'd much rather be able to use a Palm anywhere on my home network.
the display is still the same size in pixels! The Palm V(x) has a smaller display in *inches* (or centimeters if you prefer), yet the pixel dimensions are exactly the same as previous palms. Think about it... why would they alter the amount of pixels on the screen? About every app would have to be rewritten to fit on the damn thing. No company's *that* stupid, not even Microsoft, or even LinuxOne (ok, maybe they're that stupid).
The smaller screen's actually a *benefit*, as the pixel size will decrease and make it easier to read. Fonts will seem less jaggy, etc. Plus, it'll be sooo much easier to fit in my pocket (right!)
From the looks of it, they've actually made this particular new version of Palm worse than the previous ones. Technology has a trend of making things better, but making them cheaper at the same time. This new Palm only follows the second rule. The screen is 25% smaller (and this article markets it as if it's a feature), and the thing runs on Alkalines - it's back to the Palm III!
Personally, I'd rather have a Palm Palm V when they reduce the price (or discontinue and find them clearanced) down to $150. That way I can have my pretty nice-looking screen (after you install the hack to make the backlight look normal instead of reversed as by default), built-in lithium ion batteries (incredibly preferable over alkaline or do-it-yourself NiMH), and a convenient dock. The changable plastic pieces don't do anything for me, I kinda like the silver Palm V myself (why don't they just offer different colors but not make them changable? Everyone loses those things anyway).
Anyway, I hope the generation after this one provides an improvement over what we already have.
"The universe seems neither benign nor hostile, merely indifferent." --Carl Sagan
jeesh... does anyone actually like the new cases? looks like marketing approved some bad-designer's "1950's vision of the future" because they were told it was good. ugly and non-ergonomic.
as for screen real-estate... they should concentrate on putting more buttons onto the screen, this way:
a) the buttons can be redefined according to the context (what app, etc you're in)
b) the buttons can be removed altogether if the app you're in doesn't need them, freeing up more screen space
a good place for some proper buttons would be on the side of the Palm, where your index finger and thumb lay when you hold it in the palm of your hand - these could be used as Ok/Cancel, Yes/No, Forward/Back buttons depending on the application.
It seems instead of actually improving the interface, they just want to put it in different coloured boxes.
I see they also haven't included Springboard module support, the expandability that made the Visor so great. If more companies use it, it would be a fantastic standard to upgrade PDAs by. But no, profits come before usefulness.
sad.
I just finished designing some web page screens for the diminutive Palm screens that exist currently. How can they possibly see a benefit in making them smaller? I was so looking forward to a slim (Palm V), color (Palm IIIc), rechargable(Pick one), wireless(Palm VII or OmniSky) palm. Why can't they take all of the great things they have now and combine them. And leave the dopey, bulbous color pads out. Nate
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
Yes, I know it's a hack, and sure, maybe Palm should've included such functionality. But hey, there is a solution. You get a much larger space in which to enter text, if that's the main issue. If you also would like a larger screen, well, not much you can do about that.
If small writing area is a problem for you, there's a $5 shareware program called "ScreenWrite" that allows you to use the whole screen as the writing surface. You'll find it at any of the sites offering downloadable software for the Palm OS.
"Villains, I say to you now: Knock off all that evil!" -- The Tick
I just picked up my first PDA, a Handspring visor deluxe, and it's fitting my needs very nicely, that is it is a toy. I will definitely have a use for a wireless networked webpad, when they come out, but these PDA's are strictly toys for the moment. I think a couple of things Handspring has going for them are the expansion module, and the PalmOS.
Unlike wince, the Palm OS is very open to being developed, and is (as far as I can tell) native to *nix, hence the GNU tools being ported to windows.
I am a web designer not a programming, but I am trying to get the hang of programming this thing to allow better access to my website customers, and it seems pretty intuitive (so far).
"If voting could really change things, it would be illegal. " - Revolution Books, NY
And here is the thing that really chaps my hide: Memory is down under $1/meg these days and the best we can get in a Palm is 8MB? Talk about price gouging!
My boy, what you need is a Compaq iPaq 3650. Got a 200+ StrongArm, 12-bit big color LCD, 32MB, 32MB flash, stereo sound, PCMCIA/CF, same form factor as the palm and well, not a month on 2AA but a good day of use on a charge. Runs Linux (see Handhelds.org) and the PocketPC OS (WinCE 3) is finally fast and good. Bliss if you can get one.
I had a palm. i became addicted. it replaced my actual neuronal memory. it was wonderful. i took it everywhere. i took it into clubs to get numbers, had it in my pocket, danced all night with it, no problems.
then one day i'm sitting at my desk. i lean over to pick up my bag. the palm falls off the desk, where i had it plugged in to synch up. crack. broken screen. but that's ok, the guy at office depot convinced me to buy a protection plan. i asked him what it covered. he said everything. he said it included droppping it in water, whatever. so i call them. nope, it doesn't cover any of that. so i look in the coverage of the unit, nope not under warranty.
look up palm.com and find a plan called 'one year screen replacement plan'. but now i'm wary. look at the fine print. nope, it doesn't cover having the palm fall off your desk. so i call palm and ask what it would cost to replace the screen. $100!!!!! wtf? it only costs $150 to buy a new one, including the case, the chip, the os, the pretty packaging, etc. but the screen costs $100 to replace.
so i refuse to pay that. now my brain no longer remembers how to remember. and i have no palm to do that with. maybe i'll get one of these cute new ones. or maybe with these coming out they'll drop the price of the IIIe to say....$95? Then i could go into business buying new palms and giving them to people, pretending i'm replacing the screen in their unit for $100. i cannot believe that it's impossible to buy protection saying that if it gets broken by dropping it that the screen will be replaced. you know 99% of the people buying these protection plans are buying them for that reason. it's not like i'm going to strt using the screen as a hammer because i have coverage on it. i still wouldn't wan the inconvenience on being without my palm, i'm not going to intentionally break it. but everyone i know with one has broken it at some point......
A friend of mine recently picked up a color Palm. I played around with it this past weekend and basically found the color to be more of a "wow, look at me" factor. I was really disappointed in the display, each pixel has a black outline which made the image appear as if viewed thru a screen. Also the screen resolution of the Palm seriously limits what you can do (the palm is 160x160, the MP2100 is 320x480).
I guess I'll stick with the Newton, haven't seen anything better come along yet.
I wish I could do that with RedHat. You should try Debian, then. You feed it a few (up to 5) disks and an ethernet port, and off you go. That includes PCMCIA support, as well.
Read my stuff.
The pricing for Palm VII service isn't great, especially compared to Omnisky service. But it's competitive with American web-enabled phones, so there's not much to complain about there.
I think the month of solid use I get out of a pair of AAA alkalines on a VII is just fine; granted, it's not as good as the 6-8 weeks I got on a Palm Pro or III. And it's much more convenient than having to worry about buying weird batteries or having to carry around a cradle when you travel just so you can charge the thing.
It really did need more RAM, though; thank goodness they've bumped it to 8MB. As far as I'm concerned, that should be the norm for anything they sell for $200 or more at this point.
I love the palm. I've had a III for ages and really appreciate what it does well (and am fairly irked by the few things it doesn't do well).
But this connectivity model is for the birds. The recurring costs are high, the PQA infrastructure is not an open standard (as far as I can tell) and it's too easy to go over the limit. The model of the VII just doesn't work for me (I like the design and size of the V better anyway).
What we need is something the size and weight of teh V with color with full net access for $15 / month (how much data could you really transport with that damned stylus). The US would really do well to get off our collective butts, scrap our analog cell phone network, finish building some of the digital networks, and then allow them to be used for packet-switched data.
I went to the press release with a lot of anticipation. You see, I am one of those poor buggers known as an early investor in PALM stock.
I was hoping this new line would be promising, giving the ole stock price a bit of a jolt ... so I could sell my PALM stock at a modest loss as opposed to the portfolio killer it is right now.
Alas, as most people here has noted ... seems like the same old same old. I guess I'll need to keep drinking generic soda and buying cheap gas. Dinner's Taco Bell again ... ;-)
I really don't understand the motivation behind using a smaller screen. IMO the screen is already as small as it can be without sacrificing usability; I can't imagine shirnking it would make the thing better. I really hope they just resized the screen, making everything smaller. Reducing the resolution of the thing would be silly, IMO.
I guess they are trying to compete with Handspring on cost, but I think they missed the boat. These things look ugly, have smaller screens, and are only marginally better than entry level Visor (I understand the M100 has more RAM). We're supposed to think its that much better?
i'd rather see something more than 160x160 resolution than a smaller size. I mean, they do well with the resolution they got, but I'd like to see a bit more text on the Palm. I mean, look what software engineers did with 320x200 for years.
Me, I carry the Palm V around with me wherever I go... to track appointments and the like. I went with the Palm V and paid the extra $200 because of the small size. Carrying around the Palm III is a bit bulky...
Now, if you need to write a novel... they obviously aren't the best size. But for what many people (including me) use them for, small is better.
-rt-
-rt-
** Evil Canadians are taking over the world. Learn about the conspiracy
Why do so many people still cry for color+wireless+palmVs? Think logically people! Size! Size! Look how big the IIIc is! Look how big the VII is! Now imagine fitting either of those into a V case! Eh? Eh?!
Okay, I had to get that off my chest. As for the new Palms, they look like what they are: low-end machines aimed at the everyday person. Maybe people will buy them for the hipness factor, but they look kind of silly to me. They make me even more smug about my black IIIxe, which I think is one of the better looking machines.
I think Palm is making a mistake in playing Handspring's game with the "iMac" principle of computer design, which seems to be "cheerfully colored case == better!" Frankly, I think I might be embarrassed to whip one of these M100s out on the subway or wherever.
That being said, huzzah for the cover display which shows time, date, and appointments. That is one of the greatest features of the Handscape launcher, which provides tiny windows into two of the major apps. But to be able to see this without even opening and turning the thing on would be quite cool.
-J
Karma: T-rexcellent.
I just dumped my Palm VII and my handspring and got top dollar for them. I will NOT buy another PDA untill the YOPY -kris
RESOLUTION matters a bit more than size to me. More pixels == more information. Bigger size != more pixels (well, not necessarily). Or maybe this isn't true for LCDs?
baldeepYay, another palm that is completely the same as the rest of the palms, but different!
I can't wait until 2010, when palm announces the palm MMMIX, 10 megs of memory, a new screen size and a completely different case, YAY!
Geoff
They seem cute but one of the biggest problems I have with my palm is that the screen is not big enough. A larger format screen would allow more info to be viewd at once. I use it to read books on flights as it is eaiser to hang on to. It would be nice if the LCD was perhaps longer. Cutting the screen by 25% will make it much more diffucult to read. IMHO always.
marv
it is better to light a flame thrower than curse the darkness. -Terry Pratchett Men at Arms
Tried Palm. Just not the same. Tried CE. Puked on my shoes and had to buy new ones. Tried some of the off-brand PDAs with teensy no-name embedded "operating systems" and had a good laugh. After it all, dug out and looked at my MP2100 with its cracked screen and bawled like a baby...
Don't get me wrong... Palms/Visors/&co. are light and cute and run a long time on batteries... But they're also impossible to read, inelegant when it comes to handwriting, low-res, low-powered, and just plain primitive.
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
why can't they use some sturdier glass in those damn screens? you know they cost $100 to replace?
i think that if you pay $100 for the screen the glass should really be tempered. there is structural glass that you can use to hold up roofs. these glass beams can hold like 14 tons. there is bulletproof glass for car windows. stuff that literally doesn't break when you put a shotgun up to it and fire. but the $100 piece of 2" x 2" glass in a palm shatters when bumping into something at 1/100 mph. i smell a rip off. i think palm makes its money in bogus service plans and screen replacements. they really need to put a hardier kind of glass in there and just charge more......
people are amazing. if you look up palm IIIe auctions on ebay right now you'll see the average price they're going for is like $210+.
yes that's right. way over the retail list price. on an auction site.
can anyone explain this to me?
Anyway, with new battery powered palms and a backlit display, I'm sure it'll be easier than ever to
*click*
(Score: -1, inciteful)
i can't read perfectly in my 17 inch monitor will i read perfectly in that new palms? bullshit... damn... i love palm design like palm V that is nice desing this new like a toy... for childrens... i don't like 100%. pocket pc suxx forever.
---- EoF
What's the resolution of those smaller screens?.. If we're shrinking pixels, it could be a good thing, if we're cropping I would think that would cut a bit of the useability out of the Palm.. I use mine to read various new sites through avantgo, and the 160x160 screen is OK for that, but I wouldnt want to go much smaller..
air and light and time and space
I went and looked at the ZDnet page, pretty spiffy, but it looks like the only color we will see on these is from the faceplates. The color model now just pretty much sucks compared to other color PDA's out there. One of my friends at work has an HP WinCE 'device' as they like to call them, and the color looks great on it, id just rather not have WinCE as the OS. Ah well, maybe they will release a nice color palm.. who knows
The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he doesn't exist.
Aren't these things supposed to be small, portable, light, long lasting, etc? What good is it to have those goals then turn out a bigger screen? Friggin sub-notebooks or webpads are what you larger screen guys want. Leave the screens size alone, or even shrink it. Ideally the thing would be one screen the size of a wallet and unbreakable.
I like my Visor, but sometimes, for the sake of portability, I want it to be a bit smaller, either that or I need to buy pants with bigger pockets.
Let me say this again: PORTABILITY is what these things are about. Anything that's a hassle to get carried around doesn't. The grey area between 'carry in/on my pocket/belt'(Palms, pagers) and 'big enough that it requires a bag'(notebooks) is NOT where you want a product to be. Not when it's supposed to be portable.
Fsck cluebie moderators. I'll say what I want, offtopic or not. And fsck having to qualify every bloody statement just
The really cool thing about the size of the current writing area is that it is just big enough for a single letter.
So you write over and over and over again in the same area.
If you are able to get the hang of the writing (I have no difficulty here - 30 wpm adjusted, but I know some people give up because it's "different"), then you don't need to look at the screen very often.
UNLIKE a piece of paper, you can actually write stuff down without looking at the paper. Touch writing, in fact. You can maintain eye contact in a meeting, text you may be copying or whatever. A piece of paper (or anything bigger in fact) requires you to travel continuously from side to side.
Sausage King of Chicago
microsoftword.mp3 - it doesn't care that they're not words...
so i moderated, what's next????
Good luck trying to find something like that in a handheld, there's nothing like that avabialve, at least not comercialy.
Of course, you could roll your own, but it's not going to be easy or cheap.
Interesting -- the new G4 cube is touted as smaller too. I wonder whether we're starting to get infected with the Japanese mania for tiny things? It wouldn't be such a bad thing.
Probably the new tiny palm is going to be a dud, though. There are ergonomic issues with reducing the area. It's a bitch to design software to fit on the screens already. Thickness is a different story. I'd like to see something like the IIIxe with a rechargeable battery. Most of the III series thickness is to accomodate the AAA batteries.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Now I can get a palm without feeling guilty. I mean to spend 449 for a PDA is much. Well now I can get one and have a clear head.
Hmm, if they only made translucent face plates for those palms. They can then strike up a deal with Apple and sell them with their iMacs! :)
how is it that the palm iiie and iiixe are 100 $ apart, but only 6 MB different? the last time i checked, RAM was practically less than 1$:1MB.
"Ask me about Loom"
Disclaimer: I own and adore my Handspring Visor Deluxe.
...
With the M100, Palm is repositioning its entry point. Obviously the cell phone custom-cover idea is carrying over to treat this as yet another consumer electronics device. The features set is pretty much established: you can hit 80% of the market with 20% of the functionality. Make it smaller, put on bright colors, keep the price low, and you've instantly targeted a new demographic.
The Palm has amply proven itself in the business market, and they're clearly not abandoning that with their high-end models. The VIIx (mentioned later in the article, but not pictured) will up the ante for wireless PDAs with more RAM and custom software. Personally I think this is just a lot of experimentation since Bluetooth is going to be the real future in this area, but there is a market for the well-connected businessman or geek.
People are saying things like "gosh, same old Palm, just with colors". Well, yes. It's a proven product that they are now trying to expand the market for. "It's the iMacification of everything". Well, get used to it. Most people don't care about the Megahertz or the Level II cache on their motherboard. The iMac does what they want for a good price and it looks attractive in a den. But the iMac hasn't made towers or big beige boxen disappear, has it? This M100 isn't going to hurt the PDA market at all. In fact, this will be the starter PDA for a lot of people, who will later realize they need wireless modems and web-browsing-on-the-go (or whatever). But a lot more people are willing to experiment at the $150 price point than spend $500+ on yet another electronic toy that turns out to be useless to them.
Also, some people have complained about the wedge at the bottom -- don't forget this is a smaller size case. I haven't used a Palm V... series so I can't comment on how it feels. I do think that it would actually be easier to hold if the bulge were at the top, but maybe that's just me.
As for replacing the IIIe and competing with the Visor, I think they have a good chance. I've bet on Handspring, mainly on the strength of their expansion technology, but the long delays in getting Springboard modules released is getting frustrating (e.g. still no GPS unit; only two games, both golf!). I was also hoping for more movement towards a high-end Visor. I think the M100 is clearly a much stronger competitor than the IIIe ever was, and if it had been out last fall it would have been a more difficult decision for me.
Get ready for the M100 to be under a LOT of Christmas trees.
P.S. M100 is also a nice spiral galaxy, as well as a classic Mercedes Benz sedan
----
lake effect weblog
{Network engineer in Chicago--looking for work!}
I can see the influence of the visor (which IMO is a better product) the colors are very visor like.
I don't know what they are thinking with the bulbous bottom of that thing, The palm III series (I myself own a IIIx) tapers downwards at the bottom and thus it makes it comfortable in your hand.
The V series (which I truly dislike) has this stupid outward taper to the bottom, that digs a little edge into your hand. It also makes the thing harder to hold on to.
Palm makes good organizers, but they are going to be up against some stiff competition with the Visor, its just better designed. (Jeff Hawkins has still got it I guess...) Of course, we all know that the better product does not always win.
It either case it seems that the OS (palm) has already won, its just a debate over the form factor and the peripherals. (The Visor cartiges kick ass over the upgrade slots in a Palm.)
Try to hack my 31337 firewall!
It's nice that they decreased the price, but aside from making an already too small screen smaller, I don't see what innovation this brings? I mean, it'd be nice that new versions meant new stuff...new stuff that doesn't include the "iMac-ification" of every piece of electronics on the market.
Pretty see-through colors don't increase useability. I'd prefer a better res. screen, a larger screen, or a 25 dollar lower price tag over pretty colors; but that's just me.
-Jer
Smaller? Hell no, I already had trouble when I tried using a friend's normally sized Palm -- I'd like a larger display so I can more easily write. (I guess I just have trouble moving the stylus accurately on a small area.) Maybe when something close to a letter- or A4-sized sheet of paper becomes conveniently priced, I'll try this. The pocket-sized form factor just doesn't do it for me.
"How many light bulbs does it take to change a person?" --BMcC-->
...as well as the new entry level models to compete more with Visor (which feature 25% smaller screens, but only a $150 price).
The wording of this is slightly confusing. The new Palms have a 25% smaller screen and a $150 price. The Visors have a full-sized screen and start at $150.
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Sam
All I want is the goddamn IIIe I ordered from Outpost in mid-May. It's still backordered!!!
When I bought it, they said "usually ships in 1-2 days" Try 1-2 months! If I wait long enough, I can cancel my order and get one of these new ones!
spreer
Faster processors by and large mean less battery life. This is why most WinCE decives need to be recharged daily but Palm devices last for weeks before they need new batteries. Also, heat dissipation becomes a factor. I was holding a Cassiopeia(WinCE) and the thing was warm enough to make my palms sweat. Not a good way to avoid dropping the thing.
And what exactly would the extra processing power be used for? Games? Running rc5? So far as I can tell everyone that I work with uses these for simple organization/info tasks which require zilch in terms of CPU power.
Ahh, but one place that it would useful is voice recognition. That would suck up a lot of proccessing cycles. Yes, that would be justify an increase in processor power.
Fsck cluebie moderators. I'll say what I want, offtopic or not. And fsck having to qualify every bloody statement just
I recall seeing in an old computer magazine a company offering shirts with pockets big enough for 8" (or maybe it was just 5.25") floppies, to cure 3.5" envy. If there is demand, they'll build it.
Chris
I've spent way too much on a Palm Pilot IIIe and there ultra-awesome 1980s 14.4 modem -- only to find out that the palm pilot can not possible handle keyboard input while using the modem.
Welcome to the world of HP Jornada already with color screens, and as bad as *Wince* is, it atleast handles some type of crapass multitasking. I can't do anything when I'm surfing the web or wardialing on my pilot but sit there and wait to get to a pc to do something interesting with the horrible data I've gathered.
I missed out hardcore.
Ace
Seems as though these new palms are just buying time. They mimic the style of the new WinCE devices to an extent, bad choice in my opinion, but it seems that Palm is reacting to WinCE without matching them in cpu power and screen quality.
What Palm needs to do:
1) don't discontinue the old styles (remember "new Coke")
2) carefully engineer a new line that includes a faster cpu, more memory and color screen, but retains the form factor, long battery life and efficent OS that made Palm so popular in the first place. Also, stick with a standard peripheral connector so people don't lose their investment in addons if they upgrade.
We know WinCE sucks, but on a 200MHz cpu and 32MB of ram, it has room to suck and still deliver performance.
jcc
I'm so glad that Palm decided to add more memory by increasing RAM from 2 to 8 megabytes. Now it's on the same level as my '95 x486/DX laptop which runs FreeDows, a much inferiour OS to what Palm uses. Great. my 1200 dollar (in Jan, 95) system is kicked by a 500-odd dollar overclocked BookMan(R)!
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Perversely greped and groped by PowerPenguin
You are telling me that they need to shrink the frigging screen to cut the price? I don't believe it. Sounds to me like they are being cheap. Besides that, I am sick of the vertical platform. I want to see a horizontal PDA that isn't a grand. If I wanted to waste a fucking grand, I would buy a cheap ass laptop, not an expensive PDA.
And what the fuck is with this color craze? Maybe Apple and Palm should spend some time actually working on their hardware, and not the fucking colors they use. Sage? How about a processor that achieves a gigaflop without having a bloated price tag!
Time for the Offtopic, Troll, and Flamebait mod tags.
Pax Digitalia
Or the pictures don't do it justice. It might be thinner or smaller than it looks, but that bulgy-curvy bottom looks enormous. And it doesn't look like any existing accessories will fit it. One of the major plusses for the TRGpro is that I can use all the Palm III accessories. Pick a case/interface standard and stick to it Palm.
I was excited when I saw this new article up on /. But, the new Palms look very, very cheap. I hope it's just bad pictures... but they'd have to be very bad!
Refrag
I have a website. It's about Macs.
I intend to get a palm VIIx and use it to read my horoscope online. Nothing like predicting the future by reading palms.
I told you it was a stupid joke.
--Shoeboy