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Inexpensive Do It Yourself MP3 Players
Paul pointed us to his
MP3 Player Project. Now I admit, we've seen a lot of them, but this one is basically kit oriented for the do-it-yourselfer. For as little as $140 you can get a box of parts. For a bit more, a fully assembled board. Basically, put it in a box, add RAM, IDE hard drive (up to 80 gigs!) and power it and you have your own MP3 server. Its flash rom upgradable (and based on a core that is GPLd) and just looks uber pimp. I'm really interested to see what folks do with these things. It is ready for cars or homes. All it needs is some creative juice.
From the: C'mon-now,-this-is-just-cool! dept.
/. to be touting some new product to gain the $$ of their readers (like they get commissions or something) but to show you the newest, coolest in geek. Yeah, the Rio costs $99. $140 + extras is probably still not cheap. (unless you have the parts laying around) Granted. But the point is that you, the independent, educated consumer, now has yet another choice in how your music is delivered to you. And by hell, if you want to build the darn thing yourself, get out your soldering iron!
Add to this the fact you're once again rubbing your money in our face, and I'm wondering if you won't rename Slashdot 'News for nouveau riches. Stuff that costs a leg' soon.
I think you're missing the point. The point is not for
It's like a kernel. Sure, it's less time to just use the default that comes with your distro. Or, if you like, download and recompile one. Or write your own. Or rewrite it. It's more the attitude that you can, not so much that you must or should. It's just dang cool to say, "Hey, look: an MP3 player board. Instructions on how to make it. It takes standard computer parts (amazing in itself). WOO!" Nothing less than exciting about that. Three cheers for geeks and all they do.
Keep tinkering, boys. You make the world fun.
Blog,Twitter
based on a core that is GPLd
Now I'm suprised no one yet has asked if it can run Linux. Hoe about getting 20 of these and run a Beowolf cluster?
Everything in this post is false.
Amd just as important is that Rob has co-opted a word that has awful connotations. A pimp is _not_ a good thing. Pimps are users and abuseres. While hacks may be bitchen, radical, rakish or totally gear (gear fab gear fab) they cannot be pimp! A pimp is a despicable thing and we should not seek to cop pimp style. Don't go there.
I intend to do something similar. The reason for me to choose integrated is that pci-cards sticking out will prevent it from fitting in any decent (flat) case.
----------------------------------------------
the pun is mightier than the sword
Search for those 90-degree slot adapters so you can plug in your sound card and have it lay flat, parallel to the motherboard... I'm going to pick one up for my project, but I can't find the link to the site I found that was selling them at the moment. You could use Google, just as easily as I could, but I'm sure I'm lazier than you, sooo... I'll search later, and you can search now if you feel like it. *grin*
(Good thing I hit preview... I was typing 'disk' instead of 'disc'...ick. It's too early to be awake...)
- The CD-R is not re-recordable. MD is.
- You can't fit a CD-R in your pocket to tape shows. Ever seen a pocket-sized CD-R with a mic and a portable power supply? me niether. If you're going to bring a deck, you might as well bring DAT.
3) the minidisc format never really caught on here in the US. it will die in 5 yrs or less, I predict.You predict? Well, that's nice. Do you have any evidence, or are you just a seer?
wish
Vote for freedom!
---
Was at the Best Buy in Appleton, Wisconsin yesterday... they had them in stock too. Perhaps you have to go shopping in the Midwest to find these things? =)
Minidisc is taking off quite well here in the UK. It's far superior to MP3 in terms of audio quality (ATRAC has improved a *LOT*) The players are not much bigger than an MD themselves, and playback time on most is in the 10-20 hour range before batteries need recharging. OK, recording MD's takes a while, but being able to switch MD, and not being limited to an hour of crappy quality music wins every time for me. Until hard disk based MP3 players become small, cheap, and reliable enough, Minidisk is the way to go.
Everyone keeps saying ground-loop isolators will help reduce noise, blah blah blah... I picked one up a while back for my trunk-mounted MP3 system, and it sounded like shit... it put a buzzing into the audio so nasty I swore it was overloading something and was going to blow an amp or something... Did I maybe have a defective part? There's no way in hell you can hook the damn thing up wrong... but here's another solution: Hook a wire up to the case of the player and ground it directly to the car's frame. It usually kills any ground loop trouble you might be having.
I practically cut my teeth on Heathkits. I kind of miss the 'good old days' of electronics you could really build from scratch - not that I'd ever leave VLSI behind.
I have no MP3 collection, but this is almost reason to start one.
The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
of course there's cd-rw!
You can't fit a CD-R in your pocket to tape shows
but you can do that with dat. and you'll have a much better and more reliable tape via dat.
Do you have any evidence, or are you just a seer
well, I've been a very heavy dat user for about 10 yrs now. I have a pro audio (both analog and digital) setup at home and generally follow the industry trends. I've seen MD rise and decline. before the mp3 craze, I would say that MD had a chance. but now, its mostly over. moving parts are passe' - with the next gen of mp3 units (recordables that go to directly to ram) it will totally kill any slight chance that MD has.
and again, you can't copy MD at better than realtime (unless you have very fancy and specialized/costly equip). music is bulk data - and MD is just too slow.
--
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
Well, if you don't mind using Windoze (ick, not the best thing to use for quasi-embedded applications), you can grab WinAMP, the WinAMP on TV plugin, and the IRman plugin, and grab yourself an IRman online for $35 or so last I checked... I always forget where the IRman website is, but I'm sure Google will tell you... I guess WinAMP on TV has a nice little interface that works much better on a TV than any skins you'll find... and the IR reciever is nice, works great... Grab a remote and punch in the buttons.
Um ... it seems as though you guys are overlooking a big issue: Minidiscs are DISCS and must be spinning to play. From our endless experience with portable CD players, we know that this can be a Bad Thing (TM) - skipping and scratching of the discs being the major two issues.
... and I can't wait until memory (ie. the Sony Memory stick-type technology) is cheap enough to fit 100s of songs on it. Of course, by that time we'll probably be getting custom mp3 streams via a wireless connection (ie. Bluetooth?) ... regardless ... :)
I believe that the fact that players like the Rio have no moving parts is a HUGE advantage over their mechanical counterparts.
I know I'm sick of discs
----- rL
I suspect viewpoints such as yours come from projecting one's own sorry life unto others when one knows nothing at all about them.
i mean, i like them and all. they're a cool way for me to hear new things, and listening to it on my computer, the sound ain't bad. but, i'd never want to use it as my main stereo.
when i listen to mixes that people made in their cars and stuff, i often have to ask them to turn it down, or off, because i've spent so much time listening to mp3 music, and i can clearly hear it if it's mp3 sourced. it screeches and gives me a headache really fast. but once a player with at least 128 megs of memory comes out for around $100 (someday...), i'll grab one.
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"don't smoke, don't drink, don't fuck
at least i can fucking think"
Minor Threat
Rechargable batteries would solve the battery issue (Palm V anyone?). And since 16MB of MP3 data holds a lot of music, why would it skip from being tossed around alot? It streams as much of the data into memory as possible, and plays from memory (it has to anyway to decompress the MP3 data). It reads from CD occasionally once it's filled the buffer up. However much that buffer is, it can easily carry the tune while the CD recovers from a skip.
Read my stuff.
Kenwood makes a head unit with mp3 support as well. Aiwa's is ~$300, while Kenwood's is somewhere in the ballpark of $600.
Harvey Keitel is Sport, the greatest white pimp in film history. He's Jodie Foster's pimp that De Niro kills.
-B
I really need to get the pictures of my player up on my site, and I should really get the customized distribution (drives a matrix orbital LCD, controlled by a keypad, I'm working on IR, boots in about 15 seconds on the socket 7 platform it's in now, and generally has worked great for about a year). <plug> :)
Why don't you just set the CD player on front panel of the treadmill?
It skips, badly.
It even has a 10 second anti-skip, but it still skips.
I run fast and heavy, so the treadmill really bounces.
The Cd player kind of works if I hold it, but it's hard to run.
Plus, I occasionally run outside.
The main thing stopping me from playing MP3s is the low quality of the output of my soundcard. They sound ok at a low background level from my PC speakers, but when I hooked it up to the receiver and floor standing speakers of my main sound system, the noise and static is awful.
The only soundcard that I've really seen recommended is the Soundblaster Live with digital output. I have a couple of spare digital inputs, but the Soundblaster is over $100. If this device for $150 gives good audio quality and can be stuck in a box (next to the stereo) with a 72 pin SIMM from a 486 I don't use anymore and a spare hard drive and spare power supply it could be a better choice.
Price of MP3 Player: $140
Price of Selling Slashdot nickname: $102
Total Price: $38
"`Ford, you're turning into a penguin. Stop it.'" -THHGTTG
Moderators, you know you are under my power completely. No matter how much you try to resist, you will be compelled to moderate this post down against your will. In fact, my control of your subconscious, and your subsequent lack of free will, is so complete that you believe that you want to moderate this down! Imagine your horror, if you were to be released from my control, and saw this brilliantly insightful comment that you moderated down! But do not fear, I have no plans to wake you from your trancelike state, for I relish power and dominance, even over weak willed fools. Now, I command you, my obedient slaves, loose your mod points on this post. I suggest the rating "Flamebait". On three ... One, Two,
Bad ass =) Just looked at it and it looks great. Now i need a burner... HELL! =)
If you can't take the blame, submerge it!
I think you're missing the point.
No, I think you're missing the point. There's this thing called humour, and you seem to have totally missed it. Not every comment has to be serious, /. even has a "Funny" moderation category...
Yeah, it's awesome. Only problem with it is it feels kinda cheap... but it's not. Everything works very well, and it's rather sturdy... I've dropped it quite a few times, as well as leaving it in a 120 degree car for many, many days... and it's still goin like nothings ever happened =)
-- Dr. Eldarion --
A modkit for sony portable cd players to play mp3's. I bought an MPTrip/I-Jam/Genica/whatever-your-local-supplier-l abeled-it, and the sound quality is extreme shit. Meanwhile I have a kickass 250$ Sony Discman getting acquainted with the bottom of my junk pile. I wish I could just combine the two and end up with the be-all-end-all crisp loud sharp-bassed solid skip-free low-battery-consumption mp3-cd player.
Or I could just sell the MPTrip to a deaf and dumb fool, use the cash to buy a bunch of blanks, and burn everything as Redbooks. Ugh.
"She left me when I told her I get f%#ked by Bill Gates everyday.."
-Billco, Fnarg.com
A K5-75 won't cut it. Neither will a K5-133. You have to go at least P-75, although I wouldn't use anything 100.
I'll be documenting the entire thing on a web page as the project gets farther along. I have all the materials, and the custom software is 75% written. Should I try to create downloadable plans so anyone can reproduce this thing?
Cheers,
Thad
The Bolachek Journals
it's "dumbfuck" not "mholve"
maybe you should look for a life on e-bay instead of whining
as Lenny Dee says "if you're sore - get lost"
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
"bit rate of Mp3 cannot exceed 196 bit/sec or be less than 32k sampled at 44hz"
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
But roblimo ALWAYS sounds drunk :)
Jeff on the other hand, sounds somewhat normal.. as normal as a slashdot guy CAN be.
It would be cool if it had an LCD interface, or is that for the user to add on their own?
Ok, but I think you'll need a frequency generator. As far as I know (ie: next to nothing), the audio in samples the signal. I don't know if you can supply a constant input.
An anlog joystick, on the contrary is nothing more than tow variable resistors (one for each axe) and a stick to turn them.
Ni!
You predict? Well, that's nice. Do you have any evidence, or are you just a seer?
There is plenty of evidence. Few people think about such things, but media changes take forever to catch on. CD (unknown to most people) were introduced in the early 80s...look how long that took to become mainstream, and that's only because several companies embraced CDs.
Mini Disc won't necessarily die in 5 years, but if it DOESN'T catch on quickly, it will. MD has been around for a long time. Sony tried to push it many years ago, and failed. Then they came back with it, and this time they brought in a few companies (doesn't Philips support it now too?). But, it's still taking a while, and it hasn't caught on. More importantly, it hasn't been supported by the record industry.
MP3 has similar issues -- like the fact that the record industry wouldn't support it if someone was hanging by their balls (unless we get a next-gen CEO in charge of one of the companies). But there is one thing that you might be overlooking: CD-R of MP3s. Panasonic, Philips/Magnavox and Alpine (not out yet, but coming) are all offering CD/MP3 players that play both CDs and MP3s from CDs. The huge plus side on that is the simple fact that there is no required media change.
I've said it already, but a complete media change is not likely to get accepted quickly...if at all. If it a solid percentage of the market doesn't start useing the product within a certain amount of time, it probably won't get accepted at all. Need I remind you that Sony has failed at this before -- remember BETA video? A crystal clear format for video tapes, but it didn't catch on, because it required a special player (those tapes were small, besides). It never caught on, and the main video media is still VHS (sorry DVD people, DVD still only carrys a small percentage of the market -- but it's getting there).
Just my economical background crashing with my technological interests and general observation.
Yep, agree :)
I've been a Minidisc user for close to a year and it's been great for my purposes - it's the nicest portable format available.
I had my little portable recorder for a year, but the big draw came when I decided to replace my car stereo. Although I have a sizable MP3 collection (~35gb), with all my own music ripped, I decided MP3 was not the way to go.
I don't want to have a PC in my boot, or spend loads of cash (and time) on kits like this one, or blow over a grand on an Empeg. I just wanted something that would let me listen to the music that I like in my car (rather than the tedious radio stations) with the minimum of hassle.
Tape - just sucks, frankly
CDR - had the drive already, but not re-recordable, car CD players are notoriously fussy with them, they're fiddly to use in-car (unless you just shove them in the door pocket and let them get scratched after a couple of weeks)
MP3/flash - either wiring up a portable player (been there, done that with my MD - too much hassle for everyday use) or paying at least 150ukp for a unit that sits on the dash and demands feeding with expensive flash cards. No thanks.
MP3/CDR - not available yet, same issues as regular audio CDR (fragility, etc).
MP3/HD - troublesome and expensive to set up, overkill for my needs (daily journey is no more than 1/2hr, longest one-off journey about 6 hours - who needs 2 weeks of music on tap?), concerns about durability (temp, vibrations, etc)
Minidisc - super-durable, recent units have excellent SQ, cheap (Sony units start at 160ukp/$350 in US - a small amount more than their equivalent CD player), available and inexpensive media (I've just bought 20 80min MDs for 0.79 each).
I love MD as a portable format too - flash MP3 players just seem hopelessly tied to PCs, and require you to spend a lot on flash media if you want more than an hour's music. The HD and CDR options aren't really "portable" - I certainly can't carry them about in the way I do with my MD.
I can see the appeal of the flash players - people with large MP3 collections that are organised enough to put new material on it every day. I barely leave myself enough time for a Palm hotsync..
Sure, MD isn't without it's flaws - most people are limited to 1x recording (there are several CD/MD products that will copy faster (eg. MXD-D3), and strong rumours of faster PC links), and the issue of titling. Basically, you don't get titles unless you put them on yourself. However, keyboard inputs and titling projects can help out a lot. At worse (no titles), it's no less usable than CDR.
Another nice bonus - it's a very simple way to capture streaming audio and the like. Rather than messing about with loopback cables+wave recorders, hacked about software, etc, I just plug my MD into the lineout and slide the REC switch.
It's a shame the format's never caught on in the US - in the UK it's steadily growing. All the electrical chains have a decent range of units, many of the mini/micro systems include a MD deck, and blanks are even available in supermarkets..
I don't see it as a competitor for MP3, just an excellent replacement for cassette tape and a superior to formats like CDR. If they bothered to promote it properly, the buying public might see what a good format it is.
--
qube
Now don't flame me with "Didn't you read the article?" I couldn't open the page either because it's slashdotted or my college's ISP is getting laggy again (I definetly will get a chance to view it at home).
Remotely administrated mp3 server box, here we come!
"Ancillary does not mean you get to rule the world." --U.S. Circuit Judge Harry Edwards, speaking to the FCC's lawyer
Price isn't too reasonable but it gets the cool factor. The empeg
It's about time someone actually got round to a decent kit player. One of the electronics magazines in the UK (Electronics and Beyond) has been publishing a series on how to add an lcd to and remove most of the functionality of your home pc but this is far better! And it's not in a huge rack mount case!!!
Maybe I am a little then, from years of obnoxious walkman usage, but I don't hear much of a difference between the CD and the MP3 except in a few cases (Sarah McLachlan springs to mind), where there is more 'air' in the CD. It's not the stereo which is pretty decent NAD separates. Of course, the PC running may well mask out some of the crud.
The point still stands though that I can carry and listen to many more CDs with the MP3/HDD that lugging CD changers or CDs, and when I'm not home, it's likely to be played through either my work PC speakers (pretty crappy), or someone's boombox (not *as* crappy but still...).
"don't fall into the fallacy of believing that Perl can solve social problems. Maybe Perl 6 can, but that's a ways off"
Well, just to toss my $0.02 in, Minidiscs just don't skip... or I never have seen them do it anyway, I've literally dribbled my portable and it didn't skip a beat.
In addition, I think minidiscs (especially the ones in iMac-esque cases) look really cool.
That's the only explanation I can think of for calling $140 + $50 + $250 "inexpensive".
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Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
Yes. In fact if you do a bit of research and look for some SBC PC compatible boards that are really tiny, they have IDE connectors on them, and the only thing you need is for your embedded OS of choice to load a driver to control it.
futang futang!
I'm gonna need something like a 1ru style case, and get a decent sound card that can do digital out, so I can pipe it into the coaxial input of my reciever. That, and It'll need a remote, and buttons on the front w/ a volume control. Anyone have *any* idea how to get a volume knob to tweak software? I've been thinking of hacking up a netwinder for it's size, but I may end up using a small x86 box. 486 or so, since that seems to decode mp3's well enough
da w00t.
da w00t. mtfnpy?
Yeah... He's been hanging out with German gangsta rappers..
Hope that helps,
Adolf
Oh, come on! I'm copping Pimp Style right now! 8P
--K
"I don't know what that means, sir, but it doesn't sound good!"
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These old Sun machines can take 96Mb of RAM and include 16-bit stereo sound cards. They should have (barely) enough CPU to decode and play MP3.
Actually, due to the hardware overhead of uncompressing MP3, I may end up running MP3-to-WAV on a central server with some real CPU power and FastEthernet in it, then streaming the WAV data over switched 10Mb ether to the players.
If you are interested in working on this project, feel free to contact me.
I do not deploy Linux. Ever.
It depends on the board and equipment you choose, which of course is a dependant on cash. You can pay alotta cash for a hard drive from IBM that is about the size of a quarter and can hold Gigs of information, or you could spend a little less and get one of the standard IDE drives. The same goes with the board and what periphials you want on them. The more connectors and devices on the board, it is going to have to get bigger, with the exception of getting a CPU that has things like video instructions on the chip (i.e. Cyrix's MediaGX). You would just need to shop around for embedded solution boards or SBC PC compatible boards and find which you like with a ratio of features (including size)/ price.
Hasues
futang futang!
Man, that is rude.
Come in here, telling us about cool technology WITH an acceptable price, and then not giving a link. That means that I have to pull up Google.
Don't let it happen again.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
I know the CPU has the power to decode the 256, I'm not sure about 320. I would assume it can handle Ogg Vorbis stuff too. but I've not used the on-board sound, I've heard it's not too great, but you can put a PCI sound card in them if you forsake an internal 3.5" Hard drive(you can still have a 2.5" I believe).
- MD is a very small disk which is more stable, and is usually backed up with large amounts of buffer memory (40secs is standard nowadays). That also lets them save battery life - listen to the whirring of a MD player and you'll know it works for 5 secs, rests for 30 and repeats.
If you're into using pogo-stick racing (and want music to listen to while you're at it) then flash is a good idea. For most applications, discs with buffers are fine.
- MDs live in permanent plastic jackets with sturdy shutters. Scratching isn't a problem at all.
I don't think any of the flash memory systems will get significantly cheaper any time soon. Until MP3 players can use small, cheap, re-recordable (MO?) media they'll be stuck as either "cool-light-low-capacity" or "huge-overkill-3-weeks-of-music" devices.
--
qube
No Rob has no friends, he just merely talks to his voices. As far as the cost goes, it will have to be more expensive then say a Rio. This is because those companies have paid for a specialty board for their product because they know exactly what they want for the product. When you buy small boards or embedded ones, first you usually don't buy in quantity, and secondly they are general purpose systems.
Hasues
futang futang!
I would like an mp3 player in the size, shape and style of home audio components. Just stack it in there with your stereo. The emphasis would be on sound quality, so rather than (or in addition to) providing DAC conversion, I would just want an optical digital out cable to stick in the dolby digital receiver. It would, of course, be upgradeable to play new formats, like ogg vorbis. It would have an ethernet card and a high capacity hard drive, smb and/or nfs server so you can just move files on and off with any computer on your home network, and an lcd panel showing artist/title/playing time. Also, a web server could provide an interface to control it remotely from any computer. mmmm....
Vidi, Vici, Veni
Oh yea, I forgot Jodie Foster was in that. I remember that cracker pimp daddy. Equal oppunity in pimp-nation.
"`Ford, you're turning into a penguin. Stop it.'" -THHGTTG
I want an Aiwa CDC-MP3 if I can every find one in stock. I've seen them for $250-$300 but have yet to find them in stock.
For $140 you can practically buy one off the shelf. How much is your time worth?
It's "ROM" not "rom", "ueber" (without the umlaut) is not spelled "uber" and is "pimp" your professional editorial opinion?
1. Use a IDE Sandisk like the iOpener uses for the IDE HD (no moving parts, but might be on small side....maybe this isn't a good idea).
2. If an ATAPI zip works, this may solve the remove the HD thing to load songs.
3. Add a LCD or LED display for displaying ID3 tags(might have to hack the player software if it's not already built in, but it's possible.)
Of course one of my ideas would be to get one of those PC104 motherboard the wearable peoples use and adapt a small lcd to work on it using ncurses based mpg123 front end since X would be sluggish since the highest speed I have seen on these boards has been about 133 MHz (might be higher now tho). I do like the idea of using sandisk type of memory for doing a portable device since it's easier to deal with the vibration probs on those.
Gorkman
$140 seems to be way too much for that... why not buy an old multia, then add ram and netboot it, or if you want, you can add a HD, it's got audio and NIC built in, and if you get the one with internal PCI, you can add a Live! or some other PCI sound card to it. You do still have to write software to control it, but isn't that what do it yourself is all about?
(whoops, the proper url is here... dunno how that extra %3C/a snuck in there...)
By the time I encoded my music selection to MiniDisc, I would have either decided that it was time to listen to something else, or else I would be too old to get my groove on. MiniDiscs are cool and all, but crikey! Real time recording? That's a joke!
Hasues
futang futang!
What I am lacking is a way to control it. I've spent a considerable amount of time researching pc based MP3 players at mp3.com. The form factors are ugly though. With a kit like this you have a lot more leeway (sp?) in how you package it.
What I would be critical about is that he is selling boards that he hasn't even finished coding for yet. What happened to completed projects, but that is life under the GPL from what I have seen.
Here is a mirror of the MP3 Player portion of the site. The links to the on-line store and the non MP3 player material will still take you back to our (very slow) server, but at least you'll be able to browse the info about the player.
Please use this mirror instead of the google cache, because there were a large number of additions to the web pages in the last couple days, including the GPL'd firmware source code.
I hope you find the player interesting, perhaps even uber pimp (whatever that means?)
PJRC: Electronic Projects, 8051 Microcontroller Tools
--
Artix
Your Linux, your init.
I'm not a hardware geek, but it sounds to me like you're picking up computer-generated RF. The noise might go away if you move your computer (class A or class B?) away from your amp.
Given the electronic noisness of a PC box, I often wonder why there aren't more external sound cards. Somebody who knows what they're talking about should step in here.
Just bought one. It's a drive-and-circuit scheme, just like this one, but it comes with a nice case. I can plug the case into my computer and it's a hard drive. Remove it, plug it into simple harness and it's talking to my stereo. Plug it into yet another harness and it's in my car. Cool!
The Neo 35 is described at http://www.ssiamerica.com/ ; and buyable now from Computer Geeks Discount Outlet for $300 (no HD).
The case, frames, and IR remote are really nice. Alas, the instructions are terrible chinglish, the drive must be a bus master, and I havent gotten it to work on my system. I'm hoping I'm just a moron. Your milage will vary.
My portable MP3 player is my CASIO E100. I have 2 x 96MB Sandisk CF Cards. Full. A car/cassette adapter & a set of bud earphones. Not that anyone cares but: Sounds very good, portable & the chicks dig it. Really - its about multi-functional devices.. i would never spend $150 on an mp3 (only) player, my CF cards will work in my digital video camera (when I get the desire to shop for one). My CASIO also playes MPEG4 video... PIC etc etc etc
I'd be forced to agree - Minidisc is much more useful than MP3 for portable music - in car or on the move.
..a mp3 software that I can install on an old
box, use a tv-out card and use a universal remote
and control that thing ?
I have seen a couple, but i just dont remember
them, or i am positive you guys have seen better.
Any recommendations ?
This paid my last vacation, it mi
We have all seen the MP3/CD players like the Mambo-X, the MPTrip, amd the Philips eXpanium. These are far more useful than standalone MP3-only players (despite being bulkier, of course). But what would be really cool is a software implementation, for your PC's CD-ROM drive.
Why, you ask? well, not all PC's have sound cards. Especially at work - my only source of entertainment is the CD player on my PC and it would be keen to have a mass of MP3's (er, ripped from my legitimate collection of CDs ;) to listen to.
Such a software app would have to read the MP3's from the drive, and redirect the audio to the CD-rom's audio output. Some combination of Sonique and Axialis. How difficult is this to do? has it already been done?
we could even hack it to run on Wince and subvert the Auto-PC :)
Don't blame me - I voted for Howard Dean. http://dean2004.blogspot.com
I would rather just fork out the extra money and build one of these
Someday, we'll look back on this, laugh nervously and change the subject.
32 meg of memory
64kbps mp3 encoding
very slow serial transfer
It was way more of a pain to use than it was worth. Cool, but just not for me. Now that I am an mp3 *addict* I want much higher capacity and ease of xfer. I think the price is very reasonable and I *will* own one!
I noticed the site was under a severe case of the slashdot effect. so i searched google for a cahce copy, the site is interesting. http://www.google .com/search?q=cache:www.pjrc.com/tech/mp3/+&hl=en
Offtopic: how i searched.. i went to google.com and then entered the url for the site i wanted the cache for then clicked on the cache url google returned. Pretty easy :)
Consider yourself blessed if you are sneezed on by a dragon and only get wet, it could have been a fireball.
Also, if I'm on a trip chances are I'll have my laptop with me to serve as a base station for my mp3 player. Need new tunes? Just boot it up and upload new selections. I can have 4-5 gigs available that way, even if the player only holds 64 megs.
I also jog/run quite a bit, and I'm afraid I just don't trust mechanical media however buffered to work uninterrupted while being subjected to consistent jarring.
If none of these things bother you though, minidisc probably is the right way to go.
Obasan
If a tree falls in the forest, and kills a mime, does anyone care?
An ex-colleague of mine also was working on something similar. The homepage for his player can be found at http://www.go.to/soundbastard
Or the IDE socket on the right side can also give you a feel for the size of the thing. And those two large round jacks on the lower left side look like audio jacks.
The IDE drive will be large -- you could shop for laptop drives, but then you'd need a converter. [or is this board wired for laptop IDE? the site is slow at the moment so I couldn't see the details pages.]
Has anyone checked out:
http://www.empeg.com/
I'm thinking about buying it.
Yes, but the CD player he referred to, er, reads CDs loaded up with MP3s. 650MB is much more reasonable storage than 32MB. And they work like a normal CD player too. About the same size. As far as ease of transfer, you've got your choice of CD-writing tools. Have at it. :)
Read my stuff.
See empegcar for a slightly more expensive alternative...
Just heard from a friend that he's got one of these 36GB in-dash Linux-running monsters. Gonna have to have a look at it.
[
Hard-disk-based MP3 players have the big advantage of storing obscene amounts of music.
I have an MPMAN, one of those portable MP3 players that hold a piddly 64MB. If you like listening to a lot of music, 64MB is just too small.
CDR/CDRW-based MP3 players are nice, but they only hold, oh, say 10-14 CDs. Not bad, but not a lot. I bought a Genica, but it broke. ;-(
I'm now looking for an hard-disk-based MP3 player. The Creative Nomad jukebox looks good, but is a bit pricey. After my genica experience, I'm leaning away from "cheap, no-name" products, but this PJRC player is somewhat tempting (I like playing with hardware, and I figure I can attach a 10BT LAN interface (not 100BT, unfortunately) plus microcontroller for less than US$100.
Although what I really want is an hard-disk-based *PORTABLE* MP3 player, having a LAN-based one would also be cool.
Side note: Yes, I could build a LAN-based MP3 player out of an old PC, but (1) it would suck up LOTS of unnecessary power (the motherboard alone would eat 30-35W), and (2) it would be huge (even small ATX cases are huge).
Yeah, that's great, but the moving parts mean that it needs more batteries more frequently, and it skips when you're doing something active, e.g. jogging, mountain biking, surfing(?), etc.
--
"A witty saying proves nothing" - Voltaire
I was looking into a Minidisc player one day, and I believe it was a model by Sharp (I can't confirm that) that played mp3's using the MD's to store the mp3 format on it.
It was a player that I really wanted to check out... but never had the money at the time to even purchase it. So the entire motivation of getting out and taking a look at it just went down the drain. But those who like the pros of an MD but don't want to "record" your mp3's into the MD format can check out that play... (I think it was Sharp)...
Can anyone confirm?
Something like ArrayComm's i-BURST is more likely, since it will have the bandwidth and much greater range.
Yesterday it worked; today it is not working; Windows is like that...
Because for three times the cost, you get ten times the music. No CD's to carry around, works better than a CD player (Less skipping).
Erik Z
Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
You are correct in all your assertations.
:)
:)
There is a small market for minidisc, however, outside of the consumer-music mainstream. MD-DATA has made an inroad in the project studio market, with several products (Yamaha in particular) designed for multitrack recording on the MD-DATA.
Tapers have also shown interest in minidisc, mainly because of it's small size and inexpense compared to DAT. If you're doing stealth taping (because the band doesn't allow it) minidisc is a good medium for you.*
Now there's fierce competition in the home recording market, with Zip drive recording, hard disk recording, "budget" ADATs and DA-38s.. I think fostex even makes a machine with a SCSI port, so you can use Zip, Jazz, SCSI HD, or whatever you want. It will be interesting to see if minidisc survives in this market. (I hope it does, because I own a Yamaha MD8).
I agree that minidisc is probably a lost cause for retail music, but Sony has found some interesting ways to keep it alive. Their new MP3 player also plays ATRAC, and the software that comes with it rips to ATRAC, not MP3.
The main reason for my post was the disagreement with the statement "it will die in 5 years or less, I predict"
I think it was the "I predict" that really got to me.
later- wish
* I do not endorse the taping of bands who do not permit it. I believe that bands would gain from permitting it, but if they don't I respect that.
Vote for freedom!
---
I believe this would be a good time to plug Minidisc... Please stand by as I climb on my little soap box and starting raving and ranting..
:)
Minidisc's have been around for years and for now, I believe them superior to portable/personal mp3 units in many ways:
1) 74 or 80 Minutes of media/music for around $2 a disc compared to around $200 for a 64 meg expansion for most mp3 players.
2) You can buy tons of blank minidiscs and record your favorite songs to them and take them on road trips and such. With most non-hard drive mp3 units you have to use a laptop or desktop system with the correct transfer software and accesss to your mp3's when you want to change the songs.
3) Most portable mini-disc units can record (digitally and analog) and playback. Want to go record that live performance of the Backdoor Boys or Britney Arguilera, take your minidisc recorder and a mic with you in your pocket.
4) Most smaller portable minidisc units are around the same size as the popular mp3 units.
5) Edit songs on the fly. Most minidisc units allow editing of the media on the disc. This includes slitting, combining, re-ordering and deleting songs.
There are of course a few down-side of minidisc compared to mp3 but since I'm preaching for minidisc, there's no way I'm going to mention those here..
Check out http://www.minidisc.org for more information..
Thank you, and have a nice day!
I'm not missing the point. I realize humor when I see it. I laughed at the post, really. But there are a lot of posts lately who seem to be arguing the fact that the only reason certain posts are made to /. is for the proliferation of that particular company's merchandise. I don't agree with those opinions, there are good reasons for mentioning items, stories, etc., and although they may involve money aren't centered around trying to sell anything.
I apologize if I tread upon your post by bringing up that side of it, I had just meant to do so for awhile, it ticked me off.
Blog,Twitter
Unless this thing was a whole lot smaller, and had some kind of built-in file transfer (not having to plug it into your windoze box to move mp3s), I wouldn't even bother with it. I've build a player out of an old P133 (a lesser machine could probably handle it) using the software at http://www.mp3sb.org It's capable of remote control, LCD display, and 'net control. Plus if you need to add more files, just open up an FTP session. --Stupid Signature Here--
--Stupid Sig Here--
Actually I took an old Compaq 386 laptop and did the same thing...cept that I used a CD ROM, and a boot disk. Thing was pretty small because Compaq layared the motherboard in the particular model I had. I ran pretty good, but it needed more RAM to really keep up with playing the MP3s extensively..
"Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality." -Jules de Gautier
I wish I didn't have to explain these things, but ah well.
The bootblock just loads the DOS SB drivers and MPXPLAY, a great, visual DOS mp3 player.
The only expensive thing was the 6" LCD screen that accepts PAL signals (driven by a a VGA cable and a DOS util called "vgatv" that), but fortunately for me, I got it for free ($0).
Actually that LCD screen made us think of the whole Car MP3 project in the first place.
I must say, together with the 200W speakers, it just plain rocks.
<grub> Reading
Sounds like you've made one work. Is the sound quality good enough, say, to plug it into my audio system? Secondly, has the CPU enough power to decode high bitrate stuff, y'know, 256 or 320 kbps?
One viagra in the morning before work; I just know I'm gonna be screwed
That would make for some really interesting cable runs when you drive to work
A MP3 device with 80Gb+ that is used for rips of cds you own with the output redirected to your stereo system is only more useful than a Pioneer 100-disk changer... if you are deaf.
.wav player...
.sig
I mean, who would want to downgrade the quality of the cds he paid for. Maybe if it was a
I have nothing against this player (is it really that portable? how much can i carry my 20gig WD ide drive in my backpack without breaking it?) but mp3 is not lossless compression.
Please.
phobos% cat
phobos% cat
cat:
You will have to encode files at least to 256k to get rid of annoying distortion. Don't ever listen to 128k acoustic mp3s with headphones. Its horrible.
Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
For those interested, you can find info about the player here.
Oh, and this is odd: from their page:
Plays MP3 Files from CD, CD-R, CD-RW Media
And later:
Q. Will the Genica player read CD-RW discs?
A. No the unit will not read CD-RW.
They probably mean it only plays MP3 CD-RW's, not music CD-RW's, but it's still odd.
What the hell is that supposed to mean? Have you been hanging out with gangsta rappers or something???
Rob, you're losing touch with your inner geek, it's not even funny... Add to this the fact you're once again rubbing your money in our face, and I'm wondering if you won't rename Slashdot 'News for nouveau riches. Stuff that costs a leg' soon.
It was Sharp, and they supplied software (Voquette?) that would transfer mp3 files to the MD player. However, the software would convert the mp3 files into ATRAC files. One model that ships with this is the MD-MT15VQ, which cost just over USD200. I don't know about others.
go to http://users.belgacom.net/gc247244/q uality.htm if you honestly believe that.
if you've got 80+ GB of space to play with, i'm sure you'd be willing to encode at 256+ Kbps or use vbr.
$140 to do it yourself? And that's just for the circuit board that doesn't yet support the DRAM. You still have to provide a hard drive ($100) a power supply ($20) and the memory ($20). So the actual cost is $300 for a very fragile homemade unit.
Thanks, but no. For now, I keep converting MP3s to CDs and use my $50 Walkman.
Now, as a hobbyist demo, this is cool, but hobby projects aren't done on the basis of cost.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
I read some parts of it. Actually, i read one part, then click on a link to the same page, read another part, and there are contradictions. I don't mean that the author is not serious, but he doesn't seem that much objective. Example: he says that all decoders do the same things, but winamp got artefacts, and right under, there is an update saying that only winamp and 2 other players render perfectly mp3 files.
.sig
Anyways, i do honestly believe that there is a difference (you asked me), but I can be wrong. My computer is not plugged in my best amp (which i use more often), i do listen sometimes to cds on my computer (using the same amp) and for some types of music (crisp ambiant music - eg aphex twin - and classical music) it just doesn't feel the same.
As I said, i don't believe a hard drive is portable (in the same sense as a cassette player and a new discman are).
phobos% cat
phobos% cat
cat:
oops... sorry... my first language is not English, but i still can see many stupid mistakes in the message i have just submitted.
.sig
phobos% cat
phobos% cat
cat:
I give Ogg Vorbis my second highest honour.
(both of which are mangy cats)
--Giving to trolls for the benefit of us all
This would be perfect if you could have a built in NIC that can mount an SMB file system or NFS. Combine that with an LCD, and you've got the perfect interface for your stereo with mp3's without having to keep a klunky computer or expensive laptop around....
Surely the way to go for an inexpensive player is to have a network card in there rather than hd connector? I already have 10G of mp3s in my server at home - it would be cheaper for me to wire up some cat5 rather than buy another hd for that machine.
The point (for me) of MP3 is to be the biggest damn auto-changer there is with no change-over delay. I have a lot of CDs, I dislike searching through them for an odd track, and it's impractical to carry them around. With this device I can carry my whole CD collection with me.
A Pioneer 100-disk changer was about $500-600 last time I checked, and still has a change delay, isn't computer controlled, and couldn't reasonably be called portable.
My current solution is a removable caddy with a 40Gb drive, which is now full halfway though ripping my CDs. This still needs a PC to be useful. Bigger drives are around now, so a portable (as in small boombox) MP3 device with 80Gb+ is not at all unreasonable, and the price is good if that is what you want. It's not a rio competitor.
"don't fall into the fallacy of believing that Perl can solve social problems. Maybe Perl 6 can, but that's a ways off"
What cases will this and a disk fit in? I look forward to the Cases Catalog and Cases Contest Results.
That make me wonder why I don't see more hardware for sale by individuals that rivals the stuff done by big companies, sometimes better.
to avoid drive head contact with the disc platter. I had nice car MP3 setup and the drive never skipped once (we tested the shit out of it on the first ride) let alone any damage. Of course we learned later that motherboards don't take nicely to falling screw drivers. Anyone know where to find cheap LCD screens for car MP3's? I want a thin wide one, with dimenions of a car stereo face plate. Cheers
You can laugh without eating a sandwhich, but you can do both if bring one.
I think I've discovered how you're going to finance the purchase, though.....
I clicked on your nifty link, I'm astounded: you are an entreprenuer of the most prodigous sort!
Not only are you selling your slashdot account, you're getting over $100 for it. Sure it's not stock in VA Linux, but who knew that we all had equity in our slashdot accounts? Now we can all Karma Farm for profit!
One note: you said the +1 bonus kicks in at about 50 in your auction. That may have been true once upon a time, but I have two accounts with +1 and they're not above fifty. Seems to me it kicked in about 25.
Libertarianism is rich wolves and poor sheep playing gambler's ruin for dinner.
Even the samurai
have teddy bears,
and even the teddy bears
Even the samurai
have teddy bears,
and even the teddy bears
get drunk
I remember about 5 years ago a mate was telling be about one of his fellow student's university engineering projects (Helsinki University of Technology, IIRC). It was a cheap Linux based MP3 player for his car. The best bit was the Ethernet connection in his garage...
FatPhil
Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
Why spend 3 times as much when you can get an MP3/CD player for about $130? Works great, and you can use it just like any other portable CD player.
-- Dr. Eldarion --
I remember seeing one a a C-130 carcass at the FAA, a windmill shaped thing that turned a generator.
You would probably have to get your car above 200 mph though to make it worthwhile.
Or you could step down the 12V DC to 6V DC to replace the 4 AA power supply, hell, buy a CD lighter socket power supply, many of those are 6 V.
If you part lying around I could see myself building on of these things
Note, at this time (Aug 31, 2000) the firmware does not yet support the DRAM. This means it will work without a SIMM
"`Ford, you're turning into a penguin. Stop it.'" -THHGTTG
It seems like it would make swapping media a heck of lot easier... if I'm running this thing in an car, I don't wanna go using a HD anyway. CD-ROM or flash would be preferable.
Oops! Another bumpy road - there's $250 down the tubes.. :)
If it ain't broke, it doesn't have enough features yet.
I won't be impressed until someone shows me how to make the fuzzy red guy belt out some Hendrix guitar riffs.
This is one of the coolest and most practical things I think I've ever seen... and man have I got plans for this baby. I think we can generally agree that MP3 quality sound is just fine... and it's high time this technology went mainstream. Now it's a car audio player. You don't need to spend a lot on this people... 80 gigs is nice, but they're giving away 10 gig drives for free these days. I went to all the trouble of archiving my CD collection in MP3 format @ 256 kbps. This is slightly larger then normal, but I like keeping my sound quality a little higher. Now if anyone out there.. even you DJs, can think of a ten gig playlist - even at my sample rate... your better then most. Fact is, 10 gigs will let you play music until the end of time. So there you have your drive, just enough ram to do the job, and a neat little DC adapter for your car (all things aquired at second hand legacy system prices)... what do you have? One of the most secure and convienient car audio players in existance. Who's gonna gyank some wierd ass assembly of circuit cards? Probably not a lot of crimminals are going to have the capacity to even realize what thier stealing... that's to say if they even find where you mount it. A little LCD could easily be run to your dash for management and playback of files... wow... I'm just too excited. You naysayers can get bent. There isen't a CD changer over 10 disks being sold for less then 100 bucks. Add in the features that are a software program away... not happenin' for less then the cost of this do-it-youself MP3 setup. I havent EVEN talked about the P I M P factor. You know women are all about geeks who build unique audio decoders. Get PUMPED! This bad boy has potential.
Some will die in hot persuit in firey auto crashes, Some will die in hot persuit while sifting through my ashes, Some
Why the hell bother with the Empeg when you can play MP3 CDs?!
- A.P.
--
"One World, one Web, one Program" - Microsoft promotional ad
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
- A.P.
--
"One World, one Web, one Program" - Microsoft promotional ad
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
The big problem I see (as a totally-uninformed-about-minidisc user) is that you're having to copy it twice. I just ripped it to mp3 (or grabbed it, or whatever), and now I have to copy it again? Also, how long does it take to copy? One of the nice things about my RIO is that I choose 5-6 songs, toss em on, wait a minute to upload, then go. On the Minidisk, don't you have to wait for it to burn the disc?
Just some random spewage.
"Sometimes a woman is a kind of religion, she can save your soul & set you free from all your sins" - Bad Examples
It runs Debian, as does the server. I custom wrote a graphical interface which is controlled with a nintendo controller via the parallel port. The interface is built using the allegro game programming API and displays the song info, as well as 'pretty' pictures while playing.
The backend is written by querying a MySQL database on the server, then fetching the files off the NFS filesystem. It works amazingly well so far, and I've been able to get some interesting jukeboxing features too (choose 20% of one music genre, 80% of another and let it play).
It's far from polished enough for most people to deal with, but it's fun nonetheless.
I'd like to put up a page with some information about this, as soon as I get some time. I don't know if there is interest in this or not.
I like what I see so far. I want that bus (among other things) working. With a wireless network card in this unit for my car - d/l mp3's overnight from the home pc would be sweet.
W9x:Thanks for the make-work project Bill.
You should fix the link in your .sig. Instead of being http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=rejected, it should be /comments.pl?sid=rejected&commentsort=1 -- that way, you ensure that that the newest comments show up first, regardless of the user's default comment sorting preference.
--
"A witty saying proves nothing" - Voltaire